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View Full Version : Who will be the better quarterback? Brady Quinn or Matt Leinart


broncosfan144
07-02-2007, 09:26 PM
Who do you think?

personally im a brady quinn fan so i would pick him

Dam8610
07-02-2007, 09:28 PM
Quinn will definitely have the better oppurtunity early on if LeCharles Bentley returns. Edwards and Winslow II with that OL should be enough for him to put together some good numbers.

Krazyone57
07-02-2007, 09:29 PM
this is a hard one....http://media.bigoo.ws/content/smile/emotion/emotion_12.gif

broncosfan144
07-02-2007, 09:30 PM
yea also i think that quinn has just much better weapons and a new and improved o-line

keylime_5
07-02-2007, 09:41 PM
Leinart will put up better numbers, but Brady Quinn will win 5 super bowls :).

keylime_5
07-02-2007, 09:43 PM
Seriously though if you were to ask me this question before he was a Brown, I probably would say Brady Quinn. He has a strong arm and is a smart QB with all the intangeables. Both Quinn and Leinart have the weapons to succeed, and in a couple years Cleveland and Arizona are going to be 2 of the most explosive offenses in the NFL both similar to Cincinnati's in composure.

JeffSamardzijaIRISH
07-02-2007, 09:43 PM
Quinn will win.

Don Vito
07-02-2007, 09:43 PM
I will take Leinart. Arizona is starting to put a lot into their OL, I think guys like Deuce and Levi Brown will be studs. They may have missed on Leonard Davis, but they certainly are moving their offense in the right direction. Plus when you have Edgerrin James and 2 top 10 WRs in the NFL, not to mention a extremely gifted #3 and some young TEs that all can only help. I like Leinart's chances, I think he will turn into a great NFL QB. Quinn looks like he could have the pieces around him as well, but quite simply I believe Leinart is the better WB. Quinn can definitely be a great NFL player as well, he certainly has the potential.

soybean
07-02-2007, 09:57 PM
well if things keep on going like they have at camp, i won't hold my breath waiting on brady quinn.

jbeans187
07-02-2007, 10:01 PM
yea also i think that quinn has just much better weapons and a new and improved o-line

Better Weapons??? I d take Edge over Lewis, Boldin and Fitz over Edwards, Jurevicius, and K2. The Browns O line will be better but Arizona's is getting better

Acreboy
07-02-2007, 10:13 PM
I think in the end it's Leinart.

Mr. Stiller
07-02-2007, 10:47 PM
I think Leinart because..

1) Leinart has Q and Fitzy... as well as an upgrade in coaching.

2) Divisions... Quinn is on a rough team in a tough division.. Leinarts division isn't exactly known for it's competitiveness the past few years.

Dam8610
07-02-2007, 10:50 PM
I will take Leinart. Arizona is starting to put a lot into their OL, I think guys like Deuce and Levi Brown will be studs. They may have missed on Leonard Davis, but they certainly are moving their offense in the right direction. Plus when you have Edgerrin James and 2 top 10 WRs in the NFL, not to mention a extremely gifted #3 and some young TEs that all can only help. I like Leinart's chances, I think he will turn into a great NFL QB. Quinn looks like he could have the pieces around him as well, but quite simply I believe Leinart is the better WB. Quinn can definitely be a great NFL player as well, he certainly has the potential.

Top 10 is a bit high for both Fitz and Boldin based on production. I'd have Boldin there, but how can you rank Fitz ahead of:

Marvin Harrison
Torry Holt
Steve Smith
Chad Johnson
Anquan Boldin
Andre Johnson
Reggie Wayne
Terrell Owens
Donald Driver
Javon Walker

Based on production, you can't.

Xonraider
07-02-2007, 11:06 PM
I'll say Leinart, I just think he is the better QB

JK17
07-02-2007, 11:27 PM
Top 10 is a bit high for both Fitz and Boldin based on production. I'd have Boldin there, but how can you rank Fitz ahead of:

Marvin Harrison
Torry Holt
Steve Smith
Chad Johnson
Anquan Boldin
Andre Johnson
Reggie Wayne
Terrell Owens
Donald Driver
Javon Walker

Based on production, you can't.

I think you could easily put Fitz over Walker, Driver, and Wayne...he's debatable with some of the others too.

As far as the QBs go, I like Leinart over Quinn. I'm not entirely sold on Quinn as a pro-quarterback (not that I am on Leinart either), and I feel Leinart has better weapons, as well as better overall ability. I'd take Leinart.

doingthisinsteadofwork
07-02-2007, 11:29 PM
Its hard to tell.I like Quinn more but their surrounding casts are about the same.

Flyboy
07-03-2007, 12:25 AM
I'll say Leinart, I just think he is the better QB

Same here.

Dam8610
07-03-2007, 12:27 AM
I think you could easily put Fitz over Walker, Driver, and Wayne...he's debatable with some of the others too.

Based on production? Sorry, but 1 out of 3 seasons doesn't do it for me.

JK17
07-03-2007, 12:44 AM
Based on production? Sorry, but 1 out of 3 seasons doesn't do it for me.

Javon Walker has 2 out of 5 good years, with his second good year not being that much further away from Fitz's, despite playing in three more games.

The other two have been more productive on a strictly stats basis, but have also been in the league much longer. Give Fitz careers their length and I say he surpasses them.

But considering I misread your OP about production alone, if you want to look at only what they have done, and not what they will do, then yes those guys are better, mainly because Fitz has only been around three years, normally the amount of time it takes for a receiver to get used to the NFL, except he was a good WR from the second he stepped on the field. Plus his 103 catch, 1400+ yard 10 TD season is a good deal better then anything Driver has done, and slightly better then what Walker did in his best year (except for TDs).

But if its only what they've done to date, then Fitz loses by default, because he hasn't had as many years to accomplish what the others did.

Dam8610
07-03-2007, 12:55 AM
Javon Walker has 2 out of 5 good years, with his second good year not being that much further away from Fitz's, despite playing in three more games.

He would have 3 consecutive good seasons, but he tore his ACL in the first game of the 2005 season.

The other two have been more productive on a strictly stats basis, but have also been in the league much longer. Give Fitz careers their length and I say he surpasses them.

I'm not saying Fitz isn't a talented receiver, just that he's not Top 10 right now. Could he be? Probably, but he could also pull a Robert Edwards the next time he steps onto the field. Potential is rather overrated on this board, though that shouldn't shock anyone given the nature of this board.

But considering I misread your OP about production alone, if you want to look at only what they have done, and not what they will do, then yes those guys are better, mainly because Fitz has only been around three years, normally the amount of time it takes for a receiver to get used to the NFL, except he was a good WR from the second he stepped on the field. Plus his 103 catch, 1400+ yard 10 TD season is a good deal better then anything Driver has done, and slightly better then what Walker did in his best year (except for TDs).

Like I said, 1 out of 3 seasons doesn't do it for me. When he puts up numbers like his 2005 season on a more consistent basis, I'll be the first to have him in my Top 10 WRs, but right now, he can't be there.

But if its only what they've done to date, then Fitz loses by default, because he hasn't had as many years to accomplish what the others did.

He doesn't lose by default, he loses because he hasn't put up the numbers yet. He could easily be Top 10 in the near future, but it's not a sure thing. You can't take potential so seriously as to let it completely blind you to production.

BigDawg819
07-03-2007, 01:32 AM
Leinart and its not even close.

PACKmanN
07-03-2007, 03:04 AM
Repost this when Brady plays a down. Matt Leinart has much more skills and better players around him. The o-line will be fine with that new o-line coach they got.

Paranoidmoonduck
07-03-2007, 03:25 AM
I'd like to hold off until Quinn at least signs a contract and gets into training camp. That said, right now I think that Leinart is on a drastically better team.

KCJ58
07-03-2007, 03:53 AM
matt leinart cuz he has a better supporting cast

ElectricEye
07-03-2007, 05:45 AM
It's certainly setup in Arizona for Leinart to do well. But I still like Quinn better. I think both are fantastic, but Quinn will be a bit better. He might not have the best numbers out of the two, but I still think he'll end up being better. It's extremely early for all of this though.

bored of education
07-03-2007, 06:36 AM
Leinart. Quinn will have trouble for a few years, esp. on the Browns no matter who the line is composed of

skinzzfan25
07-03-2007, 07:06 AM
Leinart. Grimm knows what he is doing with the O-line, it should hold up for edge and leinart to make plays.

JK17
07-03-2007, 09:26 AM
He would have 3 consecutive good seasons, but he tore his ACL in the first game of the 2005 season.
True, but that's just an assumption your making, just like your assuming Fitz wouldn't have had 2 out of 3 great seasons if he played the 3 games he missed. I mean if you assume Fitz is healthy all 2006, he has 2 out of 3 great seasons, so his missed season is irrelevant.

I'm not saying Fitz isn't a talented receiver, just that he's not Top 10 right now. Could he be? Probably, but he could also pull a Robert Edwards the next time he steps onto the field. Potential is rather overrated on this board, though that shouldn't shock anyone given the nature of this board.
I think its hard for you to say he's not top ten, even based on production. I don't know what your trying to imply by the nature of this board, but I personally don't overrate potential. I think your looking to much into Fitz being potential and not proven. He's not Calvin Johnson, or Robert Meachem, or some unproven rookie. He's a guy who had a good rookie year (58 catches, 780 yards, 8 TDs), an amazing soph year (103 Catches, 1409 yards, 10 TD), and a shortened, but still great third year (69 Catches, 946 yards, 6 TD). Now I think his rookie year, theres no argument was great for a rookie year, and his soph year was outstanding, so the disagreement on being proven must come from his third year. Well, first of all thats still an above average season considering the people he is sharing receptions with, but thats besides the point because its not overwhelming. What is interesting though is that he did it in 13 games, so extrapolating that gives you 85 Catches, 1165 yards, and 7-8 TDs, which I would say is a good season. Now I'm not saying hes hit his ceiling, but to call him just a potential guy is a little bit of a stretch, IMO.

Like I said, 1 out of 3 seasons doesn't do it for me. When he puts up numbers like his 2005 season on a more consistent basis, I'll be the first to have him in my Top 10 WRs, but right now, he can't be there.
I would call that 2, and if you factor in his expected rookie struggling, 3 good/great seasons. None were as great as his 05 season, but the other two are nothing to shrug at either. He's shown he's consistent, look at his ypc for that, its virtually the exact same every year. The only differences between his 05 year and his 04 year was inexperience, which was solved. The only difference between his 05 and 06 year was a couple more catches, assuming he plays the 3 games at an average larry fitzgerald level. You wouldn't consider 85/1165/8 good? Because you did for Driver, Walker, and Wayne.


He doesn't lose by default, he loses because he hasn't put up the numbers yet. He could easily be Top 10 in the near future, but it's not a sure thing. You can't take potential so seriously as to let it completely blind you to production.

Again, I'm not taking potential so seriosuly as to blind production, but your overrating his potential and ignoring what he has already proven. He loses by default because he hasn't had the same amount of seasons to put up those number that the others have. If your solely going to look at production in terms of how many years they've done something better then yes, he's not as good. But if you look at production as the amount they've done in the time they've been in the league, then Fitz beats them all. None of the three I mentioned had as impressive of a season as he did in 2005, ever. None of the three produced so much, so soon as to have two good years, not even giving them a pass on their rookie year, in three seasons. So again, he's proven a lot more then you are giving him credit for.

PoopSandwich
07-03-2007, 11:20 AM
I think Leinart is set to be a really good NFL QB, I still am not sure about Quinn although I wanted him pre-draft day :)

PoopSandwich
07-03-2007, 11:31 AM
I'd like to hold off until Quinn at least signs a contract and gets into training camp. That said, right now I think that Leinart is on a drastically better team.

I don't want to sound like a homer but I am going to when I say this...

What in the world makes you think that?

The Cardinals have an aging running back (so do the Browns) the Cardinals have 2 young stud receivers, which have done more so far than Winslow and Edwards I will give you that, but its not such a different that makes the Cardinals drastically better.

The Browns offensive line is better than Arizona's... They both were smart and drafted offensive linemen, I know some people had Levi Brown ranked higher, well Savage is known for drafting pro-bowlers in the first round, so I would be guessing he drafted the right guy... Add Steinbach and if Bentley can play at 80-90% of his pro-bowl form, the Browns line is much better.

As for the QB play? It is just who you prefer, I was high on Leinart last year and thought he was the best QB in the class... With Fitz and Boldin he should be able to do fine... Quinn needs Edwards to fix his drop problems and run correct routes, and needs Wilson to step up and hope Winslow is healthy, which is too many "ifs" so this is why I think Leinart will at least start off better than Quinn.

Defense, This is where it gets interesting... Bodden is a very good corner if he can stay healthy, which should be the same with Rolle... The Browns have the edge at safety with Sean Jones and a very athletic up comer in Brodney Pool. The linebacker situation for the Browns is very good, at every position we have young talent (Wimbley, Jackson, Davis/Williams, McGinest/Peak) However, our d-line is still very questionable and we will have to see how the players we added do.

I don't know enough about the Cardinals defense, so I would like someone to match it up against the Browns if they don't mind.

broncosfan144
07-03-2007, 03:10 PM
agreed. this is exactly what i was tryin to say

I don't want to sound like a homer but I am going to when I say this...

What in the world makes you think that?

The Cardinals have an aging running back (so do the Browns) the Cardinals have 2 young stud receivers, which have done more so far than Winslow and Edwards I will give you that, but its not such a different that makes the Cardinals drastically better.

The Browns offensive line is better than Arizona's... They both were smart and drafted offensive linemen, I know some people had Levi Brown ranked higher, well Savage is known for drafting pro-bowlers in the first round, so I would be guessing he drafted the right guy... Add Steinbach and if Bentley can play at 80-90% of his pro-bowl form, the Browns line is much better.

As for the QB play? It is just who you prefer, I was high on Leinart last year and thought he was the best QB in the class... With Fitz and Boldin he should be able to do fine... Quinn needs Edwards to fix his drop problems and run correct routes, and needs Wilson to step up and hope Winslow is healthy, which is too many "ifs" so this is why I think Leinart will at least start off better than Quinn.

Defense, This is where it gets interesting... Bodden is a very good corner if he can stay healthy, which should be the same with Rolle... The Browns have the edge at safety with Sean Jones and a very athletic up comer in Brodney Pool. The linebacker situation for the Browns is very good, at every position we have young talent (Wimbley, Jackson, Davis/Williams, McGinest/Peak) However, our d-line is still very questionable and we will have to see how the players we added do.

I don't know enough about the Cardinals defense, so I would like someone to match it up against the Browns if they don't mind.

Paranoidmoonduck
07-03-2007, 04:19 PM
Just simply in terms of development, I think Leinart has the advantage. I see the Cardinals as a team who definitely has the weapons to take the pressure off Leinart right now, and has the tools in place to drastically improve their weaknesses.

I don't really think that Quinn is a worse quarterback, but right now the Browns have a running game that is questionable at best, an inconsistent main target in Edwards, and a security blanket who has had immense trouble staying on the field.

I think that the first few years are the most important to a quarterback's development, and without a veteran to keep Quinn off the field or the support to help him when he inevitably takes his place under center, he could have a tremendously rough first few years.

princefielder28
07-03-2007, 05:07 PM
Leinart has big time composure and he knows how to win big games so when the Cards finally get the playoffs he won't be overwhelmed and he'll have more success thus making him better.

Shiver
07-03-2007, 05:19 PM
Matt Leinart, and I say that with no hesitation.


He has better receivers with two top-10 caliber players.
He has stability with the new coaching staff; whereas Quinn may have a new coach next year.
He was the better college player, more clutch, more accurate, better leadership.
He plays in a warm weather division, in a dome, against weak defenses. The perfect situation to put up great statistics. A.K.A the Peyton Manning factor.

22,895
07-04-2007, 07:26 PM
Leinart easy. Leinart owned him in College and he will definatly own Quinn in the Pros.

Vikes99ej
07-04-2007, 07:50 PM
I'll say Leinart.

VY10
07-04-2007, 08:56 PM
Leinart hands down. I've always felt Brady Quinn was overated.

Shiver
07-04-2007, 09:06 PM
In moments like these I am ecstatic that Severe Punishment was banned. He was the biggest Brady Quinn nut-rider of all time.

Moses
07-04-2007, 09:17 PM
In moments like these I am ecstatic that Severe Punishment was banned. He was the biggest Brady Quinn nut-rider of all time.

Oh, man. He was trying to convince me that Troy Williamson was a prototypical WCO receiver last year.

Shiver
07-04-2007, 09:24 PM
Oh, man. He was trying to convince me that Troy Williamson was a prototypical WCO receiver last year.

Yep, he's gone. eacantdraft is on a 1-week hiatus and zero tolerance, so this is time to be joyful. We are as close to troll free as we ever will be.

Brent
07-04-2007, 09:25 PM
I'll say Leinart, I just think he is the better QB
I feel the same way.

Shiver
07-04-2007, 09:29 PM
I just don't see how anyone can vote for Brady Quinn at this point, maybe someone could enlighten me.

nvot9
07-04-2007, 09:33 PM
This is a very tough question to answer, especially in this stage, with none of them doing anything at the pro level yet, however, based on college careers etc. alone, I would say Quinn. Quinn seems like he's the total package, where as Leinart had a few question marks surrounding him, such as his mobility and arm strength. I will say however, Leinart has proven he can win, where as Quinn has proven just the opposite, so we shall see...this could be like a Peyton Manning Tom Brady kinda thing, one's got extraordinary talent while the other's a true winner.

Shiver
07-04-2007, 09:37 PM
This is a very tough question to answer, especially in this stage, with none of them doing anything at the pro level yet, however, based on college careers etc. alone, I would say Quinn. Quinn seems like he's the total package, where as Leinart had a few question marks surrounding him, such as his mobility and arm strength. I will say however, Leinart has proven he can win, where as Quinn has proven just the opposite, so we shall see...this could be like a Peyton Manning Tom Brady kinda thing, one's got extraordinary talent while the other's a true winner.

Quinn had more question marks than Leinart did. The only thing Leinart didn't have was ideal arm strength. Whereas Quinn has question marks regarding his accuracy, success versus top flight competition, and whether Charlie Weis' offense made him look better than he actually was.

Also Leinart has at least shown potential in the NFL, with a few very good games. It's something at least; in contrast Quinn has done nothing. He also has the better supporting cast and weapons. This is as close to a slam dunk as I can think, but that's just me.

nvot9
07-04-2007, 09:39 PM
Meh, I wouldn't say more question marks, as far as that offense goes, he was pretty dominant, regardless of if it was just because of Weis or not...

wogitalia
07-05-2007, 03:29 AM
I think Leinart will. He really looked like he belonged last year, thats a great start. He has plenty of weapons and his line is looking better.

Quinn has what could be a very solid line and a couple of guys that could be great weapons, but I dont think Quinn is as good a player in the first place.

Sniper
07-05-2007, 03:38 AM
Leinart without a shadow of a doubt. He's been taught by Norm Chow, Steve Sarkisian and Lane Kiffin among others (3 damn good offensive minds). He plays with more talent around him, he's much more accurate, clutch etc... I think Quinn may have a slightly stronger arm but Leinart has really good touch on the ball and he usually makes great decisions. I still think Leinart will be the #1 QB of his class. VY is more exciting with his gamebreaking ability and Cutler has an absolute rocket launcher attached to his arm, but Leinart's poise, accuracy and decision-making make him the #1 QB in his class and definitely better than Quinn.

ks_perfection
07-05-2007, 11:23 AM
I would have chosen Leinart before he was drafted, he's much more accurate, more poised and a good decision maker, Quinn has better arm strength but that is overrated. After seeing Leinart play very well for a rookie I think its a slam dunk choice.

Grizzlegom
07-05-2007, 11:52 AM
i picked leinart because i think he is overall the better player. quinn has a better arm (strength-wise) but ill take leinart in any other category.

CC.SD
07-05-2007, 01:40 PM
It's clearly Leinart. Accuracy over arm strength every time. Nevermind the fact that Leinart is a champion, and Quinn will be seriously injured several times. It's the Browns! The curse is still alive.

LonghornsLegend
07-05-2007, 02:20 PM
dont see how you could go against leinart, he looked really solid last year, and some of his best games he didnt even have fitz playing...his top 3 wr's are arguably the best in the league, and with levi brown and russ grimm taking charge of the o line i think he has all the tools needed around him...

quinn has weapons no doubt, but i dont see him ending up being better then leinart

RedAttack
07-05-2007, 10:53 PM
The Cardinals have an aging running back (so do the Browns)

Edgerrin is 28-29 and has been consistently good over his career. You can even make an argument for the HOF.

Jamal Lewis had a handful of good years and is now coming off a down year and a significant injury.

I really don't see the comparison. I'm sure most people would take Edge.

the Cardinals have 2 young stud receivers, which have done more so far than Winslow and Edwards I will give you that, but its not such a different that makes the Cardinals drastically better.

I really don't see how you can come to that conclusion?

How many pro-bowls have Winslow and Edwards been to? None.

How many 1,000 yd seasons do Winslow and Edwards have? None.

Again, no comparison.

The Browns offensive line is better than Arizona's... They both were smart and drafted offensive linemen, I know some people had Levi Brown ranked higher, well Savage is known for drafting pro-bowlers in the first round, so I would be guessing he drafted the right guy... Add Steinbach and if Bentley can play at 80-90% of his pro-bowl form, the Browns line is much better.

No, only on paper are they better. The Browns line was far worse than Arizona's last year.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol.php

CLE:
Run Blocking: 31st.
Pass Blocking: 26th.

ARI:
Run Blocking: 23rd.
Pass Blocking: 15th.

The Browns have the edge at safety with Sean Jones and a very athletic up comer in Brodney Pool.

I'm afraid it's not even close, Adrian Wilson is one of the best safteys in the NFL. Combined with a solid players in Terrence Holt and Aaron Francisco the Cardinals have the edge here.

The linebacker situation for the Browns is very good, at every position we have young talent (Wimbley, Jackson, Davis/Williams, McGinest/Peak) However, our d-line is still very questionable and we will have to see how the players we added do.

I don't know enough about the Cardinals defense, so I would like someone to match it up against the Browns if they don't mind.

Arizona is moving to the 3-4, so it is difficult to give an accurate and or fair analysis right now.

The Cardinals do have a number of good players on defense like Adrian Wilson, Karlos Dansby, Bertrand Berry, Chike Okeafor, Gerald Hayes, Gabe Watson and Darnell Dockett. They also have a few guys who need to live up to their talent (mainly the corners Antrel Rolle and Eric Green).

So I would give them an 'not applicable' grade right now.

Namy
07-06-2007, 04:20 AM
Too early to tell, but just for fun, I'd put my money on Leinart...

1. Look at the divisions: Brady has Pitt, Balt, and Cincy to go against. Leinart goes up against Seattle, St. Louis, and San Fran.

2. Offensive supporting cast: Brady has Edwards (who is progressing), KWII (also progressing, but not as good as he thinks he is), Lewis who hasnt made a splash since his good years, and a potentially amazing O-Line. Leinart has a poor O-Line (but headed in the right direction), a still very good Edgerrin James, Boldin, and Fitz (two accomplished WRs).

3. Environment: Both players played college football in Cali... Now, Brady will play in cold weather in an outside stadium with harsh winter conditions half the season. Leinart will play in a nice dome half the season with football-friendly Arizonian weather.

4. Leinart just seems to have that "it" factor. He had tremendous poise and leadership at USC and showed flashes of it in the NFL. Quinn has repeatedly failed in big games against great defenses. It will only get harder now...

Sniper
07-06-2007, 05:25 AM
3. Environment: Both players played college football in Cali... Now, Brady will play in cold weather in an outside stadium with harsh winter conditions half the season. Leinart will play in a nice dome half the season with football-friendly Arizonian weather.



Notre Dame is in California? I could have sworn it was in South Bend, Indiana, but that's just me;)

PoopSandwich
07-06-2007, 11:32 AM
Red Attack you make valid points but I based my entire argument on what I think will happen this year...

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
07-06-2007, 11:39 AM
Matt Leinart, and I say that with no hesitation.

He has better receivers with two top-10 caliber players.
He has stability with the new coaching staff; whereas Quinn may have a new coach next year.
He was the better college player, more clutch, more accurate, better leadership.
He plays in a warm weather division, in a dome, against weak defenses. The perfect situation to put up great statistics. A.K.A the Peyton Manning factor.

Those are excellent points. I didn't take into account the stability and weather factors, but still my verdict was the same: Leinart.

Leinart is very accurate, has an underrated arm(He's no Jamarcus obviously, but his arm is definitely good enough to do what he has to), underrated mobility(he isn't a statue, which many seem to think he is), he's just as smart as Quinn, and seems to have an "All I care about is winning" attitude, evidenced by his slights against Texas after the Rose Bowl(Which I tend to agree with. I think USC was a better team but nobody was gonna stop Vince that night).

Quinn is more mobile outside the pocket, and has a bit better of an arm, and is just as smart. He doesn't have the accuracy, or quite as good weapons as Leinart.

Something inside just tells me Leinart will be the better of the two.

Shiver
07-06-2007, 01:36 PM
Those are excellent points. I didn't take into account the stability and weather factors, but still my verdict was the same: Leinart.

Very few people do. I personally think more people should pay attention. There is a reason Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Marc Bulger and Jon Kitna were the top four passers last year. All of them play the majority of their games in dome stadiums. It is no coincidence.

Dam8610
07-06-2007, 02:02 PM
Very few people do. I personally think more people should pay attention. There is a reason Peyton Manning, Drew Brees, Marc Bulger and Jon Kitna were the top four passers last year. All of them play the majority of their games in dome stadiums. It is no coincidence.

They were the Top 4 in terms of yardage. You should know yardage is a terrible measure of performance when used alone.

Shiver
07-06-2007, 02:05 PM
They were the Top 4 in terms of yardage. You should know yardage is a terrible measure of performance when used alone.

It is terrible if you use any one given statistic alone. You could say that about a lot of statistics. The Passer Rating has David Carr as an above average QB last year, for example.

PoopSandwich
07-06-2007, 02:08 PM
It is terrible if you use any one given statistic alone. You could say that about a lot of statistics. The Passer Rating has David Carr as an above average QB last year, for example.

Carr might not be that bad behind a decent o-line with a running game.

Shiver
07-06-2007, 02:10 PM
Carr might not be that bad behind a decent o-line with a running game.

Damon Huard at #2, Mark Brunell at #10, are other examples.

Dam8610
07-06-2007, 02:16 PM
It is terrible if you use any one given statistic alone. You could say that about a lot of statistics. The Passer Rating has David Carr as an above average QB last year, for example.

Then what was the point you were trying to make? Domed stadiums lead to an increase in passing yaradge? Okay, I guess there's a trend there, but it's not like playing in a dome makes any of them better.

PoopSandwich
07-06-2007, 02:23 PM
Damon Huard at #2, Mark Brunell at #10, are other examples.

And very good examples they are, I wouldn't be surprised to see Carr take over for Delhomme eventually if things go as they did last year.

As for Leinart Vs. Quinn, most of it is going to depend on their supporting casts.

Winslow needs to stay healthy and Edwards needs to stop dropping passes, the Cleveland o-line looks good on paper this year, but Jamal Lewis is a big question mark and probably the biggest person to Cleveland's success or failure this year... Browns offense needs to stay on the field longer to keep the defense fresh.

Cardinals don't have as many if's this year but their o-line wasn't upgraded as much as Cleveland's, as they added a starting LT, LG, and could have a returning center that was a pro-bowler. I was very happy with Arizona's and Cleveland's drafts, they both look like teams who could have a bright future, but I really don't think Quinn or Leinart have high bust rates, and that their supporting casts will make them look better or worse than the other one.

keylime_5
07-06-2007, 02:26 PM
No, only on paper are they better. The Browns line was far worse than Arizona's last year.


Okay the Browns offensive line starter will probably be Joe Thomas, Eric Steinbach, LeCharles Bentley?, Hank Fraley, and Ryan Tucker. Everyone of those guys is proven good except Thomas who was a top 3 draft pick. Add in the depth of guys can start on most teams in Kevin Shaffer, Seth McKinney, and Kelly Butler and the Browns THIS year have one of the better O-Lines in the league, far superior to Arizona's this year. We might have to trade Shaffer due to his salary and the limited starting spots.

As far as the safeties go, Adrian Wilson is very good, but you can't take away from Sean Jones who is also one of the best safeties in the game, only one tier behind the Dawkins, Williams, Wilson, Reed category of elite. Brodney Pool might have a breakout year this year and if that happens that puts us over the top as having a better starting safety tandem than Arizona. Terrence Holt and Aaron Francisco are nothing to write home about, I'm sorry. Solid players, but not with the potential of Jones/Pool.

Shiver
07-06-2007, 03:59 PM
Then what was the point you were trying to make? Domed stadiums lead to an increase in passing yaradge? Okay, I guess there's a trend there, but it's not like playing in a dome makes any of them better.

Passing statistics in general. Peyton Manning would still be a great Quarterback in say, New England or Chicago. However, playing in a dome/warm weather for almost all your games is a tremendous advantage. Fantasy football junkies always key in on QB/WRs that play in doors, or in warm weather. It plays a big part, just like a ball park impacts hitters in baseball.

Dam8610
07-06-2007, 04:28 PM
Passing statistics in general. Peyton Manning would still be a great Quarterback in say, New England or Chicago. However, playing in a dome/warm weather for almost all your games is a tremendous advantage. Fantasy football junkies always key in on QB/WRs that play in doors, or in warm weather. It plays a big part, just like a ball park impacts hitters in baseball.

Huh? It didn't seem to affect Brees in any category other than yardage (though attempting 54 more passes in a season than in either of the previous two will tend to have an effect like that), as his TD/INT ratio and completion percentage remained about the same in the past three years. Oddly, the player of the 4 you listed that had an uncharacteristically good season by his standards was not either one of the QBs who had played in outdoor stadiums previously, but Marc Bulger, who saw his TD/INT ratio jump from 1.5/1 over the previous two seasons to 3/1 in 2006. Seems as though system has much more of an effect than ballpark, if ballpark has any kind of impact beyond yardage (or even yardage for that matter).

keylime_5
07-06-2007, 05:26 PM
Brett Favre seems to do better in the cold through his career. But he is obviously the exception not the rule. It's a well known fact that it's harder to throw the ball on Lake Eerie's winds than it is in Tampa Bay.

Paranoidmoonduck
07-06-2007, 06:00 PM
Huh? It didn't seem to affect Brees in any category other than yardage (though attempting 54 more passes in a season than in either of the previous two will tend to have an effect like that), as his TD/INT ratio and completion percentage remained about the same in the past three years.

To be fair, Brees was coming from the most fair climate in pro football outside of a dome in San Diego.

SubNoize
07-06-2007, 07:26 PM
AZ only keeps the roof closed for the first 2 months of the season really, because it's ridiculously hot, past that they keep the roof open so it's similar to playing outdoors anyways. This has nothing to do with why Leinart is and will be the better QB anyways. Leinart is smarter and has a tremendous set of young talent on offense around him, Boldin and Fitz are better than Edwards and Winslow as offensive threats.

Crazy_Chris
07-06-2007, 07:26 PM
Sean Jones who is also one of the best safeties in the game, only one tier behind the Dawkins, Williams, Wilson, Reed category of elite.

I don't understand how you can make that statement. It's absolutly absurd to consider Sean Jones "only one tier behind" the likes of Brian Dawkins, Ed Reed, and Adrian Wilson.

Staubach12
07-06-2007, 09:08 PM
Lets start out with who's the better player as of now. Quinn has the better arm, but really, Leinart has everything else. I like Leinart, and I think he's the better player. The thing about Quinn is he has accuracy problems, and that comes from the strength he displayed at the combine when he put up (I think) 22 reps. Big whoop, however, I believe that he's become too strong. The strength has begun to limit his flexibility, messing with his accuracy. That could be a tough problem to fix. While he doesn't have the mechanics problems, I could see him going down the old Eli manning road, not progressing mch because a lack of accuracy is stunting that growth. Leinart has no accuracy problems. He's great.

As far as situations go... I'll take Leinart. The Browns have the superior defense. However, the coaching is much in favor of Leinart. Leinart can take his offensive-minded head coach and go places. Quinn, on the other hand, has a defensive-minded coach. It's shown quite a bit in the production, as the defense has come a long way, while the offense hasn't become tons better. That could stunt Quinn's growth. Keep in mind that Crennel's job is (supposedly) in jeaprody, too. Both the lines are crummy, and Leinart has a better receiving core by just a hair.

So, in the end Leinart will have the better career. Call me crazy, but I see Eli Manning, not Peyton Manning in Quinn.

Namy
07-07-2007, 06:08 AM
Notre Dame is in California? I could have sworn it was in South Bend, Indiana, but that's just me;)

LMAO. What was i on... my main poitn tho was Quinn will have harsher conditiosn to play in. My bad

keylime_5
07-07-2007, 02:02 PM
I don't understand how you can make that statement. It's absolutly absurd to consider Sean Jones "only one tier behind" the likes of Brian Dawkins, Ed Reed, and Adrian Wilson.

You will if you look who else is in the 2nd tier. The first tier is obviously those in the running for who can be considered the best safety in the game: Brian Dawkins, Ed Reed, Troy Polamalu, Adrian Wilson, Bob Sanders, Sean Taylor, and Roy Williams. Right below them are Kerry Rhodes, Sean Jones, Donte Whitner, Darren Sharper, Mike Huff and the like. Rhodes, Jones, Whitner, and Huff might all someday be in that top tier as they are all very young and only have had 1 great year so far.

PoopSandwich
07-07-2007, 02:08 PM
Roy Williams is so incredibly overrated.

CC.SD
07-07-2007, 02:11 PM
To be fair, Brees was coming from the most fair climate in pro football outside of a dome in San Diego.

Also killer surfing and fish tacos, both of which I enjoyed just a few minutes ago.

keylime_5
07-07-2007, 03:40 PM
Roy Williams is so incredibly overrated.

Well he is a lethal hitter in the secondary that makes WRs not want to go across the middle, which is a very valuable trait for any defense to have. He is strong in run support and good in coverage at reading-reacting even though he is not strong in man coverage. He is still elite, but just a different type of safety.

I get what you mean though, I'd much rather have a Brian Dawkins, Ed Reed, Sean Taylor type who will give you the best of both worlds.

fenikz
07-07-2007, 04:01 PM
lol, if this is for college its not close if its for pro potential its not close

Shere Khan
07-07-2007, 04:34 PM
Seriously though if you were to ask me this question before he was a Brown, I probably would say Brady Quinn. He has a strong arm and is a smart QB with all the intangeables.

You can forget about it if Quinn holds out.
That's gonna be the worst thing to happen to him, IMO.

I like Leinart. Unlike Quinn, he actually won big games for his team in college.

Staubach12
07-07-2007, 06:55 PM
How come no one ever comments on my posts? It's a knowledgable analytical response. Knowing you guys, you'll ignore this too. That's a bum deal...

YAYareaRB
07-07-2007, 07:03 PM
You can forget about it if Quinn holds out.
That's gonna be the worst thing to happen to him, IMO.

I like Leinart. Unlike Quinn, he actually won big games for his team in college.

Well, although he had stellar performances in some of those big games, he was apart of one the best teams in College Football History, only 2nd to 01 Miami

soybean
07-07-2007, 08:38 PM
Well, although he had stellar performances in some of those big games, he was apart of one the best teams in College Football History, only 2nd to 01 Miami

regardless... he came through in the clutch numerous times.

RedAttack
07-07-2007, 09:55 PM
Okay the Browns offensive line starter will probably be Joe Thomas, Eric Steinbach, LeCharles Bentley?, Hank Fraley, and Ryan Tucker. Everyone of those guys is proven good except Thomas who was a top 3 draft pick. Add in the depth of guys can start on most teams in Kevin Shaffer, Seth McKinney, and Kelly Butler and the Browns THIS year have one of the better O-Lines in the league, far superior to Arizona's this year. We might have to trade Shaffer due to his salary and the limited starting spots.

My whole point was about LAST year. On paper, Clevelands line is better and I have never disputed that. But games aren't won on paper.

As far as the safeties go, Adrian Wilson is very good, but you can't take away from Sean Jones who is also one of the best safeties in the game, only one tier behind the Dawkins, Williams, Wilson, Reed category of elite. Brodney Pool might have a breakout year this year and if that happens that puts us over the top as having a better starting safety tandem than Arizona. Terrence Holt and Aaron Francisco are nothing to write home about, I'm sorry. Solid players, but not with the potential of Jones/Pool.

Hang on, Sean Jones has had ONE good year. It's a little bit early to be calling him one of the best safeties in the NFL. If, like Wilson, he can put up those sort of stats over a couple of seasons in a row I would be more inclined to agree. But at the moment? No.

Brodney Pool has been a solid player so far. But I really don't see him as any better than Holt or Francisco. It's a wash at best.

Adrian Wilson still trumps anything the Browns have at saftey. And until that is not the case, then the Cardinals have the advantage here.

keylime_5
07-07-2007, 09:56 PM
You can forget about it if Quinn holds out.
That's gonna be the worst thing to happen to him, IMO.

I like Leinart. Unlike Quinn, he actually won big games for his team in college.

Well Leinart played with Reggie Bush, LenDale White, Steve Smith, Dwayne Jarrett, Mike Williams, Winston Justice, Sam Baker, etc. etc. Brady Quinn's best teamate opted for baseball, and his second best was a 3rd round OT with a lot of ?s. How many times did Peyton beat Florida or win the NC?

If Quinn does hold out it won't be that bad. Crennel will probably get fired midseason and he'll start then with or without a holdout. Quinn won't start week 1 even if he is in camp on time anyway, Anderson or Frye will. Matt Leinart held out last year and he started early too, so I don't think it matters that much if Quinn misses some of TC.

RedAttack
07-07-2007, 10:04 PM
Red Attack you make valid points but I based my entire argument on what I think will happen this year...

Fair enough. Although I'm really not into those sort of projections anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I'm hoping the Browns do break out. But like Arizona, there are a number of question marks.

keylime_5
07-07-2007, 10:07 PM
My whole point was about LAST year. On paper, Clevelands line is better and I have never disputed that. But games aren't won on paper.



Hang on, Sean Jones has had ONE good year. It's a little bit early to be calling him one of the best safeties in the NFL. If, like Wilson, he can put up those sort of stats over a couple of seasons in a row I would be more inclined to agree. But at the moment? No.

Brodney Pool has been a solid player so far. But I really don't see him as any better than Holt or Francisco. It's a wash at best.

Adrian Wilson still trumps anything the Browns have at saftey. And until that is the case, then the Cardinals have the advantage here.

Pool has lots more potential than Holt or Francisco. People are expecting a big breakout year for him since Brian Russell is now in Seattle so Pool can start at FS now fulltime instead of playing CB and S mix. Jones had as many great years as Rhodes and Whitner, but there's no denying that those 3 are terrific young safeties with great careers ahead for them. The combo of Jones and Pool has better potential than Wilson and ? for Arizona. Now if Zona had a guy like Pool then no question, Arizona would be better. But the tandem of Jones/Pool will be a better safety duo this year IMO.

keylime_5
07-07-2007, 10:08 PM
Fair enough. Although I'm really not into those sort of projections anymore.

Don't get me wrong, I'm hoping the Browns do break out. But like Arizona, there are a number of question marks.

We'd have to get really lucky to break out this year. I think Arizona gets 9 wins or so, but 2008 is the Browns' year most likely.

AtariBigby
01-13-2009, 06:56 PM
Top 10 is a bit high for both Fitz and Boldin based on production. I'd have Boldin there, but how can you rank Fitz ahead of:

Marvin Harrison
Torry Holt
Steve Smith
Chad Johnson
Anquan Boldin
Andre Johnson
Reggie Wayne
Terrell Owens
Donald Driver
Javon Walker

Based on production, you can't.

Because it's not always about PAST production. Some people have the ability, maturity to project FORWARD, or to evaluate what talent they see on the field, regardless of the # of catches they had the year before or year before that, etc. This guy was right on about Fitzgerald, as you know see.

Same thing happened to me over a year ago when I told the clown Staubach12 that Greg Jennings was better than WR Roy Williams. He said, no way and he thought because he has a ton of kid-cred that he was right.

Now it's fricking obvious. As I said.

TitanHope
01-13-2009, 07:34 PM
AtariBigby, you do know that this thread was started in July of 2007, right? And that it's currently January of 2009?

If so, how is opinion of a person from 1 and 1/2 years ago relevant today? Do you not think his mind may have changed? A year and a half ago, Randy Moss isn't a Top 3 receiver. Today, he's considered to be at least Top 3.

Larry Fitzgerald just finished his 3rd year in the NFL back in 2007, and his previous season stats were 69 receptions, 946 yards, and 6 TD's. Since then, he's had two consecutive 1,400-yard seasons with double-digit TD's.

Today, Fitz is a Top 10 receiver. In 2007, he wasn't. It wasn't a question of talent or upside. It was about their current rank at that time, and at that time, Fitz hadn't proved what he's done today.

Don't necropost a dead thread by resuming an off topic conversation that had taken place in it. If you want to present the Quinn vs Leinart question, then fine. But be for real man, and don't necropost only to say, "Told ya so!"

Shiver
01-15-2009, 04:22 AM
I called Matt Leinart a bust way back in '06. And he has no excuses, he had freaking Anquan Boldin, Bryant Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald and still sucked.

the_legend_killer
01-15-2009, 07:38 AM
My vote goes to Leinart. Better supporting cast, better coach, and IMO he's going to be a better pro, whenever the time for him to start comes.

illmatic74
01-15-2009, 08:17 AM
I know people have forgot about Leinart since he hasn't played this year. He still has slow feet, limited arm strength and a deliberate delivery.

AtariBigby
01-15-2009, 08:53 AM
AtariBigby, you do know that this thread was started in July of 2007, right? And that it's currently January of 2009?

If so, how is opinion of a person from 1 and 1/2 years ago relevant today? Do you not think his mind may have changed? A year and a half ago, Randy Moss isn't a Top 3 receiver. Today, he's considered to be at least Top 3.

Larry Fitzgerald just finished his 3rd year in the NFL back in 2007, and his previous season stats were 69 receptions, 946 yards, and 6 TD's. Since then, he's had two consecutive 1,400-yard seasons with double-digit TD's.

Today, Fitz is a Top 10 receiver. In 2007, he wasn't. It wasn't a question of talent or upside. It was about their current rank at that time, and at that time, Fitz hadn't proved what he's done today.

Don't necropost a dead thread by resuming an off topic conversation that had taken place in it. If you want to present the Quinn vs Leinart question, then fine. But be for real man, and don't necropost only to say, "Told ya so!"

Here's the problem son:
#1- Matt Leinart is still relevant, good or bad.
#2- The girls like Sniper have an ulcer when new threads are started, which I wanted to do about Leinart, so first I searched Leinart and this was the most recent one with him as the title of the thread
#3- It's actually interesting to see who thought what about Leinart, and about BQ. Some people have the ability, the ballz, to LOOK FORWARD and not just look at what has already happened. I call those people MEN. I call the ones who only go by exactly what has happened and are afraid to project anything different "GIRLS".
#4- We see there are some actual men in here, which makes me proud as a fellow football fan.

NOW, what is going to happen with Matt Leinart and the Arizona Cardinals situation if Kurt Warner continues on next year?
Also, I was so PO'd at Leinart when he chose to stay in school when he WOULD HAVE been the #1 overall pick. And I was so glad when Vince Young single-handedly beat him in the National Championship game.
What a fool Leinart was then, and it's costing him some prime years, as well as he lost out on a lot of money. He also knocked up an EX-GF while still there in SoCal.

I know his arm isn't that rocket arm, but neither was Montana's, Pennington, and some other good ones. The guy has the ability, but does he have the desire?

AtariBigby
01-15-2009, 08:54 AM
I called Matt Leinart a bust way back in '06. And he has no excuses, he had freaking Anquan Boldin, Bryant Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald and still sucked.

Props to you Shiver for having a pair.
I'm sure the choir boys didn't like hearing that back in '06, but you have proved to be right in the almost 3 years since........

Gay Ork Wang
01-15-2009, 08:55 AM
#3- It's actually interesting to see who thought what about Leinart, and about BQ. Some people have the ability, the ballz, to LOOK FORWARD and not just look at what has already happened. I call those people MEN. I call the ones who only go by exactly what has happened and are afraid to project anything different "GIRLS".



sooo all historians are girls? damn your knowledge of the english language is pretty bad

Bucs_Rule
01-15-2009, 09:56 AM
I think Quinn will be a better pro, but Leinart has a much better supporting cast.

People are too hard on Leinart. The guy only started 1 season's worth of games. It usually takes QBs 2-3 years of starting to hit their stride.

Twiddler
01-15-2009, 10:23 AM
Because it's not always about PAST production. Some people have the ability, maturity to project FORWARD, or to evaluate what talent they see on the field, regardless of the # of catches they had the year before or year before that, etc. This guy was right on about Fitzgerald, as you know see.

Same thing happened to me over a year ago when I told the clown Staubach12 that Greg Jennings was better than WR Roy Williams. He said, no way and he thought because he has a ton of kid-cred that he was right.

Now it's fricking obvious. As I said.

Wow, sour grapes much?

And another thing, get off the girl/men thing. Nobody cares. At all.

Gay Ork Wang
01-15-2009, 10:43 AM
its not like they dont admit they were wrong. its not like even one of those were proven.

bantx
01-15-2009, 11:03 AM
Everyone who agrees with Atari is apparently an educated man that has balls the size of grape fruits. And everyone else who doesnt is a middle school girl that knows nothing.

Kurve
01-15-2009, 11:56 AM
Im a huge USC fan and big fan of Matt in college what made him so great in college was that he was very cool and calm in the backfield when he was looking down the field to throw a pass. I think that has hindered his progress in NFL slightly comes off as he doesnt take being QB serious enough thats just my opinion also the NFL has shown his weak spots in his game which was overshadowed by talent in the College level. So as i say this i think Brady is a better quarterback and will be due to his desire to be better he has a drive and it shows in the NFL the people who put the most time to become better tend to become better. Brady also shown that he thrives to be the leader in that team which i think Leinart has yet to show and desire.

Boston
01-15-2009, 12:33 PM
You're going to have to forgive AtariBigby...he's not, what we call, "all there."

DeathbyStat
01-15-2009, 12:38 PM
I liked Leinart alot coming out of college and hated Quinn. But so far both have shown very little but Quinn has shown slightly more

TitanHope
01-15-2009, 03:03 PM
Here's the problem son:
#1- Matt Leinart is still relevant, good or bad.

Uh, I never said he wasn't, and in your post, you never said he was. All you did was quote an old post on WR rankings, and rant about Larry Fitzgerald. Because of that, I told you to stick to the topic if you necropost. If you said, "So it's the end of the season, and after seeing some of Quinn and Leinart, what are ya'lls opinions?" then that's fine. Apparently, being obnoxious, spiteful, and wanting to bring disputes with SNIPER26 from another thread into one that's been dead for a year and a half is more important to you than basic etiquette.

#2- The girls like Sniper have an ulcer when new threads are started, which I wanted to do about Leinart, so first I searched Leinart and this was the most recent one with him as the title of the thread

Oh the irony... A guy calling people names on the internet thinks he's a man. Again, you didn't state a single thing about Leinart. Not one thing. You made a vague principle in your post, which is located in the Leinart/Quinn thread.

#3- It's actually interesting to see who thought what about Leinart, and about BQ. Some people have the ability, the ballz, to LOOK FORWARD and not just look at what has already happened. I call those people MEN. I call the ones who only go by exactly what has happened and are afraid to project anything different "GIRLS".

It doesn't take a man to state an opinion. It takes a keyboard. If you think posting your opinion about a player's potential on the internet means you have balls, then your social life must reallly, really be lacking.

#4- We see there are some actual men in here, which makes me proud as a fellow football fan.

Some people wish to make an educated guess when it comes to predicting a player's success. You ever hear of scientific method? Congrats on thinking you're ballzy, but others kinda want to use their intellect and reasoning skills to form a theory.

You're not a man, AtariBigby. It doesn't take a man to look forward and project a player's future. It takes a person to do that, and when he's wrong, only then when he's accountable for his statements does he show he's a man. But, if you're the type of person who makes a prediction and rubs it in a person's face when once in a blue moon you're correct, then you're nothing but an immature child.

NOW, what is going to happen with Matt Leinart and the Arizona Cardinals situation if Kurt Warner continues on next year?
Also, I was so PO'd at Leinart when he chose to stay in school when he WOULD HAVE been the #1 overall pick. And I was so glad when Vince Young single-handedly beat him in the National Championship game.
What a fool Leinart was then, and it's costing him some prime years, as well as he lost out on a lot of money. He also knocked up an EX-GF while still there in SoCal.

I know his arm isn't that rocket arm, but neither was Montana's, Pennington, and some other good ones. The guy has the ability, but does he have the desire?

Congrats for finally getting on topic. All that "testosterone" must really get ya sidetracked...

Larry
01-15-2009, 05:10 PM
Leinart is a bust along with Vince Young.

PACKmanN
01-15-2009, 05:25 PM
lol, is there an Rodgers vs. Smith threadzzz?

BrownsTown
01-15-2009, 05:32 PM
I wouldn't pass judgement on either. Leinart is stuck behind someone who was in the MVP race for most of the year, Quinn was wrongly stuck behind Anderson, looked good in his starts, then suffered a moderate injury and to avoid risk they shelfed him (once the season was officially over).

Quinn's going to get control of the team next year. I think he'll be a good one. I'm still holding out hope for Leinart.

San Diego Chicken
01-15-2009, 06:40 PM
There is a good chance Quinn will have a very very good year next year if Mangini can provide some stability in the locker room. I liked what I saw from him, and I think in 5 years or so, people will wonder why Russell was picked so much higher, just like people should wonder now why Smith was picked so much higher than Rodgers.

I think there is still a chance for Leinart, he's not a bust just yet. He had a good rookie year, with a bad OL situation, but then ended up in Whisenhunt's doghouse, got hurt, and then lost his job to Warner this season. I wouldn't be surprised if in a year or two, he ends up starting again, whether in Arizona or somewhere else, and does relatively well. But he does need to get his life straightened out and re-dedicate himself to football. I know people focus on his arm strength, but it's really his (lack of) leadership and effort to make himself a better player that has cost him so far.

AtariBigby
01-16-2009, 05:01 PM
When is Leinart's rookie contract up?
Isn't Warner's up after his year?

I think Philly will win this week, but what if AZ gets to or wins the Super Bowl?
Would Warner retire off into the AZ sunset?