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zCaddyz
07-25-2007, 08:37 PM
Where do u guys think we will go Q.B., D.T., W.R.

Canadian_kid16
07-25-2007, 08:42 PM
that all depends on how our season goes...I tihnk we need to upgrade defense somemore IMO...but if ALL of our 23479123490623784 QB's stink, I actually think Colt Brennan MIGHT be a good idea, but I could be completely off base on the system the Bucs run and the system Hawaii runs

etk
07-25-2007, 09:05 PM
A lot of guys think DT in Round One, I say that's a no-no. Let Peterson develop while the underrated Ellis Wyms & Kevin Carter rotate and keep balance.

Here's the possible breakdowns:

Team struggles, no future, etc. Top 10 pick: QB - Brohm, Woodson or whoever emerges from the pack

Mid-range pick. That's where things get interesting. I'm leaning towards the offense right now, with a playmaking WO or developmental LT at the top of my list. Baker's athleticism is intriguing and I think he would be available and a good fit. DeSean Jackson would be a nice weapon, but the WR class could be deep in Rounds 2-3 so value is crucial.

Late 1st round. Hmm...pretty much same story as mid-range, with the slight possibility of picking a semi under-the-radar QB to develop (obviously Gruden would still be our coach).

1st Day Needs: Playmaking receiver, Hovan replacement, Spires replacement, CB youth (depends on Tanard).

Even though I support the idea of taking a good LT early on if available this year, it is not necessarily a need yet because Petitgout should be serviceable for 2-3 years. I'd rather wait for an elite LT in 09 than take someone inconsistent after Round One. Alex Boone or Sam Young, mmm!! Rebuilding wouldn't be such a bad thing...imagine getting Brohm this year and Boone, Young or Andre Smith next year. Now that's a future to get excited about...

Where's -black when you need him to salivate over Brohm (his boy) and Young (local Florida guy)?

StaticGator
07-27-2007, 12:30 PM
A lot of guys think DT in Round One, I say that's a no-no. Let Peterson develop while the underrated Ellis Wyms & Kevin Carter rotate and keep balance.

I really think at best Peterson will be another Wyms type player. This defense needs elite talent on the inside and I just wouldn't bet on someone with Peterson's pedigree turning out to be more than a decent backup.

1st Day Needs: Playmaking receiver, Hovan replacement, Spires replacement, CB youth (depends on Tanard).

Even though I support the idea of taking a good LT early on if available this year, it is not necessarily a need yet because Petitgout should be serviceable for 2-3 years. I'd rather wait for an elite LT in 09 than take someone inconsistent after Round One. Alex Boone or Sam Young, mmm!! Rebuilding wouldn't be such a bad thing...imagine getting Brohm this year and Boone, Young or Andre Smith next year. Now that's a future to get excited about...

Where's -black when you need him to salivate over Brohm (his boy) and Young (local Florida guy)?

Hovan replacement? Nose tackle in this scheme doesn't require elite talent. all you have to do is find an average player to occupy blocks and let the under tackle get loose. There's always Brad Culpepper types available for cheap. Same with Spires. The star defensive end plays on the weakside. The Spires role doesn't require more than 3rd round talent. That's one reason I really wanted the team to get Charles Johnson this past draft.

And I'm with you on Andre Smith, but didn't Alex Boone get abused in the BCS game and so far Sam Young has only played right tackle IIRC and not very well at that.

etk
07-27-2007, 12:53 PM
I really think at best Peterson will be another Wyms type player. This defense needs elite talent on the inside and I just wouldn't bet on someone with Peterson's pedigree turning out to be more than a decent backup.



Hovan replacement? Nose tackle in this scheme doesn't require elite talent. all you have to do is find an average player to occupy blocks and let the under tackle get loose. There's always Brad Culpepper types available for cheap. Same with Spires. The star defensive end plays on the weakside. The Spires role doesn't require more than 3rd round talent. That's one reason I really wanted the team to get Charles Johnson this past draft.

Talking draft>Talking NFL

And I'm with you on Andre Smith, but didn't Alex Boone get abused in the BCS game and so far Sam Young has only played right tackle IIRC and not very well at that.

In the past decade or so we've had Anthony McFarland & Chris Hovan playing NT. We spent a first rounder on McFarland. I agree that we shouldn't spend more than a 3rd on Spires' position, but a good NT Can be valuable in our defense. Boone & Young are both huge & loaded with potential, so we'll see where that potential takes them in the next 2 years. I expect them both to become dominant by then. Your Peterson point is interesting too, and given our track record with drafting on the 2nd day it's a long shot for him to succeed. I still want to see us develop him and try to sign a veteran instead of drafting Dorsey or someone.

StaticGator
07-27-2007, 01:21 PM
In the past decade or so we've had Anthony McFarland & Chris Hovan playing NT. We spent a first rounder on McFarland. I agree that we shouldn't spend more than a 3rd on Spires' position, but a good NT Can be valuable in our defense. Boone & Young are both huge & loaded with potential, so we'll see where that potential takes them in the next 2 years. I expect them both to become dominant by then. Your Peterson point is interesting too, and given our track record with drafting on the 2nd day it's a long shot for him to succeed. I still want to see us develop him and try to sign a veteran instead of drafting Dorsey or someone.

Well, some think Booger was drafted as an insurance policy in case Sapp went off the deep end and he was ultimately given the money to replace Sapp. He was playing nose to get him on the field; it's not what he excelled at. He was supposed to be an under tackle. As for Hovan, he eventually got a nice contract, but he started as a vet minimum player. There are lots of those guys and you can just keep shuffling them in and out each year. A point of attack nose tackle is like a run stuffing middle linebacker, it's not an elite skill set so you can wait until the 3rd or 4th round. It's the pass rushing tackles and cover linebackers that go early. Like last year the Bears had Tommie Harris (1st rounder) at Sapp's position and Ian Scott (4th rounder I think) at the nose. That's the template.

And regarding Peterson, it's not just the Bucs' track record, it's basically a fact defensive tackles are one of the easiest positions to evaluate because as Bill Parcells says there are only so many 300 pounders with quick feet on the planet. They almost always come from a legit SEC, Big XII, Big 10, Miami, FSU type program. Don't expect more than a Chartric Darby role for Peterson.

etk
07-27-2007, 01:46 PM
Well, some think Booger was drafted as an insurance policy in case Sapp went off the deep end and he was ultimately given the money to replace Sapp. He was playing nose to get him on the field; it's not what he excelled at. He was supposed to be an under tackle. As for Hovan, he eventually got a nice contract, but he started as a vet minimum player. There are lots of those guys and you can just keep shuffling them in and out each year. A point of attack nose tackle is like a run stuffing middle linebacker, it's not an elite skill set so you can wait until the 3rd or 4th round. It's the pass rushing tackles and cover linebackers that go early. Like last year the Bears had Tommie Harris (1st rounder) at Sapp's position and Ian Scott (4th rounder I think) at the nose. That's the template.

And regarding Peterson, it's not just the Bucs' track record, it's basically a fact defensive tackles are one of the easiest positions to evaluate because as Bill Parcells says there are only so many 300 pounders with quick feet on the planet. They almost always come from a legit SEC, Big XII, Big 10, Miami, FSU type program. Don't expect more than a Chartric Darby role for Peterson.

I love talking about the draft. Actual football is so boring in comparison. You're right about Booger playing nose, but I still think NT is a position that's definitely worthy of a first day pick.

StaticGator
07-27-2007, 02:06 PM
I love talking about the draft. Actual football is so boring in comparison. You're right about Booger playing nose, but I still think NT is a position that's definitely worthy of a first day pick.

I'll concede it's a position worth a 3rd rounder.

etk
07-27-2007, 02:56 PM
I'll concede it's a position worth a 3rd rounder.

Fair enough. I'm so used to having steady consistent play from the position that I expect nothing less in the future. Why not take one in the 3rd if we think they will bring the same? Same thing goes with "LDE", but I value it 0.1 less.

Tampa 2 4 life
07-27-2007, 04:58 PM
Matt Grothe For 2009!

Also, WR in the first, LDE in the second, Developmental LT in the 3rd.

ks_perfection
07-27-2007, 06:22 PM
BPA aslong as it is an area we aren't set at for the future, so basically anything but HB, RE and G. I'd be willing to make a slight exception for QB though.

etk
07-27-2007, 06:33 PM
Matt Grothe For 2009!

Also, WR in the first, LDE in the second, Developmental LT in the 3rd.

OVERRATED ...

Tampa 2 4 life
07-27-2007, 06:46 PM
OVERRATED ...

You don't just Pass For 2500 yards, Rush for 600, and have a 138 QB rating as a freshman and be overrated. I'm not saying 1st round pick either, 2-4th is where he'll go.

etk
07-27-2007, 06:53 PM
You don't just Pass For 2500 yards, Rush for 600, and have a 138 QB rating as a freshman and be overrated. I'm not saying 1st round pick either, 2-4th is where he'll go.

I know, just trollin, just trollin. You justified yourself, so I'm happy.

Merlin
07-28-2007, 12:01 PM
This is a tough one, a'lot will depend on FA's etc, who knows, maybe even a trade?

We're going to have plenty of Cap space, so untill then, I'll wait and see?

etk
07-28-2007, 12:18 PM
This is a tough one, a'lot will depend on FA's etc, who knows, maybe even a trade?

We're going to have plenty of Cap space, so untill then, I'll wait and see?


It's only a tough one cuz Notre Dame has no Senior eligibile QBs. Which QB do you want us to get this year?

Merlin
07-28-2007, 03:53 PM
It's only a tough one cuz Notre Dame has no Senior eligibile QBs. Which QB do you want us to get this year?

Well, regardless of the ND comment, thats my point, isn't it.....

etk
07-28-2007, 07:30 PM
Well, regardless of the ND comment, thats my point, isn't it.....

There isn't a QB in the draft you really like? I guess we'll have to wait at least 3 years for Clausen.

dbtb135
07-30-2007, 02:22 AM
UT, WR, LT, QB.

I honestly don't know about the QBs. We always seem to miss out on the good prospects (Young, Leinart, Cutler, Manning, Rivers, Roethlisberger, Alex Smith). I'm not entirely sold on Brohm, but maybe he's the guy. I wouldn't want Woodson or Henne or any of those guys in round 1. I'd rather we go with a Desean Jackson or Glenn Dorsey.

etk
07-30-2007, 10:27 AM
We have to look at the potential of us bringing in a new offense. If that does happen, we will probably be in the market for a playmaking signal caller instead of a manager. Andre Woodson, Erik Ainge, Chase Holbrook & Sam Keller are names to look out for. My dark horses are Ryan Perrilloux, Xavier Lee, Hunter Cantwell & Ben Olson (all underclassmen) for the future. If we draft a guy like Matt Ryan I'll kill myself.

StaticGator
07-30-2007, 12:07 PM
We have to look at the potential of us bringing in a new offense. If that does happen, we will probably be in the market for a playmaking signal caller instead of a manager. Andre Woodson, Erik Ainge, Chase Holbrook & Sam Keller are names to look out for. My dark horses are Ryan Perrilloux, Xavier Lee, Hunter Cantwell & Ben Olson (all underclassmen) for the future. If we draft a guy like Matt Ryan I'll kill myself.

Sweet lord no.

etk
07-30-2007, 02:50 PM
Sweet lord no.

I said that in hopes that -black would be here. Who knows, Savior could be a dominant force by 09...

Fresh
07-30-2007, 05:39 PM
It depends where we pick. I think we pick mid range,in a great position to take a dominating defensive tackle that would fit like a glove in our system.

Glenn Dorsey.. the 6'2 298 beast is a pass rushing and run stuffing beast and had 6 sacks and 110 tackles last year. He is a force. I think his stock will drop just like Tommie Harris did because he is way too small to play a 3-4 defense. Frank Okam is the taller and much bigger mammoth that weights 320+ pounds. I like us taking Dorsey at pick 15 in the draft or somewhere around there. Dorsey and Adams will create a nasty young defensive line.. In the 2nd round we could go for Booty,Chad Henne, or Brennan. If Dorsey is gone and Woodson falls like Jason Campbell did we should take him,but the thing is Woodson doesn't fit ideally in the WCO. So Gruden is going to have to adjust just like he did with Simms,so. The QB position is very deep with alot of talent, so we can get a good QB in round 2. Round 3, we need to take a young burner to get the D from coming close to the LOS. I like Harry Douglass from Louisville he has deadly speed. There are alot of young burners in this draft... Petitgout is only 30, I say he has a good 2 years left then we could find a replacement then. 4th round I would take a look at a CB or a NT to replace Hovan...5th round a KR..6th and 7th depth for offensive line..

The thing is Wyms is always injury prone and he never plays a whole season because of his injuries. I am aware that he had 5 sacks last year but he is one dimensional, he can get ran on at times. For Peterson, I don't think he will ever play a snap at UT for us. As for right now Haye is looking better than anyone in TC. So with Carter,Wyms,Haye, I don't think Peterson will have a chance to see the field at UT. So, should get moved to left end where he can come off the edge occasionally and stop the run good.

1. Dorsey
2. Booty(Carroll knows how to coach his QBs) or Sam Keller( Callahan is running another version of the WCO,so he should pickup the playbook quick)
3. Douglas(Fast burner can replace Galloway)



RDE- Gaines Adams UT- Glenn Dorsey NT- Chris Hovan LDE- Greg Peterson

Caddy
07-30-2007, 08:17 PM
I said that in hopes that -black would be here. Who knows, Savior could be a dominant force by 09...

-black hasn't been active for nearly 2 weeks.

etk
07-30-2007, 09:14 PM
I think we pick mid range,in a great position to take a dominating defensive tackle that would fit like a glove in our system.

If Dorsey is gone and Woodson falls like Jason Campbell did we should take him,but the thing is Woodson doesn't fit ideally in the WCO. So Gruden is going to have to adjust just like he did with Simms,so. The QB position is very deep with alot of talent, so we can get a good QB in round 2. Round 3, we need to take a young burner to get the D from coming close to the LOS. I like Harry Douglass from Louisville he has deadly speed. There are alot of young burners in this draft... Petitgout is only 30, I say he has a good 2 years left then we could find a replacement then. 4th round I would take a look at a CB or a NT to replace Hovan...5th round a KR..6th and 7th depth for offensive line..

The thing is Wyms is always injury prone and he never plays a whole season because of his injuries. I am aware that he had 5 sacks last year but he is one dimensional, he can get ran on at times. For Peterson, I don't think he will ever play a snap at UT for us. As for right now Haye is looking better than anyone in TC. So with Carter,Wyms,Haye, I don't think Peterson will have a chance to see the field at UT. So, should get moved to left end where he can come off the edge occasionally and stop the run good.

1. Dorsey
2. Booty(Carroll knows how to coach his QBs) or Sam Keller( Callahan is running another version of the WCO,so he should pickup the playbook quick)
3. Douglas(Fast burner can replace Galloway)



RDE- Gaines Adams UT- Glenn Dorsey NT- Chris Hovan LDE- Greg Peterson

1. I don't...
2. Good argument for Dorsey, but I think Wyms will be effective in a full season this year splitting time with Carter. If that happens we might take a UT later in the draft, or wait a year.
3. Peterson at LE is interesting. I wonder if he's stout enough like Spires is though. Definitely an intriguing possibility nonetheless.
4. You are aware that Gruden and the WCO could be gone after this season, right? I'd recommend a "Plan B" in that case.



-black hasn't been active for nearly 2 weeks.

Damn, he was funny and had the best knowledge of college prospects over almost anyone. The Goodell regime is getting ridiculous here. What happened to freedom of speech and the fun element of forum posting? Guys are getting suspended left right and center.

Canadian_kid16
07-30-2007, 09:37 PM
Damn, he was funny and had the best knowledge of college prospects over almost anyone. The Goodell regime is getting ridiculous here. What happened to freedom of speech and the fun element of forum posting? Guys are getting suspended left right and center.

yeah...I mean JBond wasn't allowing people to talk aobut academics in the college forum adding a Big 10 team...its a little too harsh now

etk
07-30-2007, 10:13 PM
yeah...I mean JBond wasn't allowing people to talk aobut academics in the college forum adding a Big 10 team...its a little too harsh now

http://www.didtheydie.com/morgue/images/adolf_hitler_ns.jpg

Beans
07-30-2007, 11:09 PM
edit: ---------

Fresh
07-31-2007, 12:05 AM
1. I don't...
2. Good argument for Dorsey, but I think Wyms will be effective in a full season this year splitting time with Carter. If that happens we might take a UT later in the draft, or wait a year.
3. Peterson at LE is interesting. I wonder if he's stout enough like Spires is though. Definitely an intriguing possibility nonetheless.
4. You are aware that Gruden and the WCO could be gone after this season, right? I'd recommend a "Plan B" in that case.

Well Mid range, I say he stays. IF we do bad this year,which I don't think will happen just look at our light schedule.. Who will replace Jon Boy? Cowher? Doesn't he like to have the power over everything? And if Jon goes so does Bruce Allen? Letting go Bruce would be a huge mistake as he has done a marvelous job shaping up the team. The one coach I would like if we did bad is Charlie Weis. As for Marty I don't think he would fit here,at all. I just think if a new coach comes, I see the whole staff leave and Kiffin leaving.
Peterson should do fine at LDE- as Greg Spires is 6'1 265, and Greg Peterson is 6'5 and 286 so.

Caddy
07-31-2007, 03:02 AM
Well Mid range, I say he stays. IF we do bad this year,which I don't think will happen just look at our light schedule.. Who will replace Jon Boy? Cowher? Doesn't he like to have the power over everything? And if Jon goes so does Bruce Allen? Letting go Bruce would be a huge mistake as he has done a marvelous job shaping up the team. The one coach I would like if we did bad is Charlie Weis. As for Marty I don't think he would fit here,at all. I just think if a new coach comes, I see the whole staff leave and Kiffin leaving.
Peterson should do fine at LDE- as Greg Spires is 6'1 265, and Greg Peterson is 6'5 and 286 so.

Come on Fresh. You are on a draft website which prides itself on knowledge of player profiles and your only reasoning as to why Peterson would be a good LE is because of his height and weight?

StaticGator
07-31-2007, 07:14 AM
Well Mid range, I say he stays. IF we do bad this year,which I don't think will happen just look at our light schedule.. Who will replace Jon Boy? Cowher? Doesn't he like to have the power over everything? And if Jon goes so does Bruce Allen? Letting go Bruce would be a huge mistake as he has done a marvelous job shaping up the team. The one coach I would like if we did bad is Charlie Weis. As for Marty I don't think he would fit here,at all. I just think if a new coach comes, I see the whole staff leave and Kiffin leaving.
Peterson should do fine at LDE- as Greg Spires is 6'1 265, and Greg Peterson is 6'5 and 286 so.

1. Cowher has been part of way more successful drafting and team building than Allen and Gruden could dream of.

2. Charlie Weis? Seriously?

Fresh
07-31-2007, 09:14 AM
1. Cowher has been part of way more successful drafting and team building than Allen and Gruden could dream of.

2. Charlie Weis? Seriously?



Come on Fresh. You are on a draft website which prides itself on knowledge of player profiles and your only reasoning as to why Peterson would be a good LE is because of his height and weight?

Um,No. Pay attention,read what the guy said, he isn't sure Peterson was stout enough to play LDE. And 286 to 265 is pretty damn stout enough.

1. Yea, if Cowher comes in here,kiss the tampa 2 good buy,so long Kiffin!
2. Yes seriously, if the offense is holding us back and Gruden is gone. I am all for him-as he had some success calling plays with the Patriots winning only 3 rings..

StaticGator
07-31-2007, 10:18 AM
1. Yea, if Cowher comes in here,kiss the tampa 2 good buy,so long Kiffin!
2. Yes seriously, if the offense is holding us back and Gruden is gone. I am all for him-as he had some success calling plays with the Patriots winning only 3 rings..

1. I love Kiffin but he's no spring chicken. I like the Tampa 2 but on top of everything I like results and if running a 3-4 and/or blitzing defense is what it takes, so be it. The Steelers were #9 in total defense in 2003, #1 in 2004, #4 in 2005, and #9 in 2006. You can't deny the talent that has been brought in on Cowher's watch - with 1st rounders like Polamalu, Hampton, Faneca, Burress, and Roethlisberger, and especially the gems from the middle of the draft like Clark Haggns, Joey Porter, and Hines Ward.

2. As for Weis, I'd like to see him quit losing by 20 points to every ranked team he faces before I annoint him anything.

etk
07-31-2007, 10:18 AM
Um,No. Pay attention,read what the guy said, he isn't sure Peterson was stout enough to play LDE. And 286 to 265 is pretty damn stout enough.



stout /staʊt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[stout] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation adjective -er, -est, noun
–adjective
1. bulky in figure; heavily built; corpulent; thickset; fat: She is getting too stout for her dresses.
2. bold, brave, or dauntless: a stout heart; stout fellows.
3. firm; stubborn; resolute: stout resistance.
4. forceful; vigorous: a stout argument; a stout wind.
5. strong of body; hearty; sturdy: stout seamen.
8. strong and thick or heavy: a stout cudgel.

I don't think Peterson is bulky (stout) enough. The LDE prototype is short & fire-hydrant built along with #2-7. Peterson is more lanky and he's a pass-rushing UT; not a run-stopping DE.

Fresh
07-31-2007, 10:35 AM
1. I love Kiffin but he's no spring chicken. I like the Tampa 2 but on top of everything I like results and if running a 3-4 and/or blitzing defense is what it takes, so be it. The Steelers were #9 in total defense in 2003, #1 in 2004, #4 in 2005, and #9 in 2006. You can't deny the talent that has been brought in on Cowher's watch - with 1st rounders like Polamalu, Hampton, Faneca, Burress, and Roethlisberger, and especially the gems from the middle of the draft like Clark Haggns, Joey Porter, and Hines Ward.

2. As for Weis, I'd like to see him quit losing by 20 points to every ranked team he faces before I annoint him anything.
1. You reliaze the Bucs are far from a successful 3-4 defense? The Bucs would have to totally rebuild again,on the D. As the LBs are way too small,and we dnt have big enough NT. I am aware we will run it, but it will only be to confuse opposing teams.

2. Wait,is Weis playing the game? or is he the one coaching his team? Now thats has been established, Weis has proven to be a great offensive genius with the Pats. By the way if you think Weis is the one losing the games you are mistaken,credit that to his great defense.

I don't think Peterson is bulky (stout) enough. The LDE prototype is short & fire-hydrant built along with #2-7. Peterson is more lanky and he's a pass-rushing UT; not a run-stopping DE.

I just don't think Peterson will ever see the field at UT,like I said earlier. And waiting for him to develop into a monster would be a gamble/big mistake as we tried already with Wyms and the other later round picks. If the Bucs desperatly wanted a UT they should have tooken Marcus Thomas instead of Black. We will see what Carter does or what he has left. If Peterson can't be play LDE,than he is nothing more than depth on our team.

etk
07-31-2007, 10:39 AM
1. You reliaze the Bucs are far from a successful 3-4 defense? The Bucs would have to totally rebuild again,on the D. As the LBs are way too small,and we dnt have big enough NT. I am aware we will run it, but it will only be to confuse opposing teams.





Yeah, switching to a 3-4 is not worth the complete rebuilding our defense would require, especially in the front seven.

Fresh
07-31-2007, 10:41 AM
Plus the DEs have to be straight up big as Seymour is a 6'6 310 LB DE. Um, I believe Hovan is lighter than him,at NT.

StaticGator
07-31-2007, 12:02 PM
Greg Spires - 10 years in the league
Kevin Carter - 13 years in the league
Charles Bennett - sucks
Chris Hovan - 8 years in the league
Ryan Sims - sucks
Ellis Wyms - 7 years in the league
Gaines Adams - yet to play a game
Derrick Brooks - 13 years in the league
Jamie Winborn - sucks
Barrett Ruud - 52 tackles in 2 seasons
Quincy Black - yet to play a game
Cato June - 5 years in the league
Ryan Nece - marginal

So of arguably the top 13 players in the Bucs front 7, at least 7 will be gone in a year or two and at best 4 could be considered the team's future. Of those 4, only June looks like a miscast but he signed a 3 year contract with a small signing bonus. He can be gone easily. Adams looks like he could be force at outside linebacker in the Willie McGinest/DeMarcus Ware role and Ruud and Black are both 240+. They should be able to hold up. The Tampa 2 isn't stocked and loaded for the next decade. It needs to be re-built anyways.

etk
07-31-2007, 01:41 PM
Greg Spires - 10 years in the league
Kevin Carter - 13 years in the league
Charles Bennett - sucks
Chris Hovan - 8 years in the league
Ryan Sims - sucks
Ellis Wyms - 7 years in the league
Gaines Adams - yet to play a game
Derrick Brooks - 13 years in the league
Jamie Winborn - sucks
Barrett Ruud - 52 tackles in 2 seasons
Quincy Black - yet to play a game
Cato June - 5 years in the league
Ryan Nece - marginal

So of arguably the top 13 players in the Bucs front 7, at least 7 will be gone in a year or two and at best 4 could be considered the team's future. Of those 4, only June looks like a miscast but he signed a 3 year contract with a small signing bonus. He can be gone easily. Adams looks like he could be force at outside linebacker in the Willie McGinest/DeMarcus Ware role and Ruud and Black are both 240+. They should be able to hold up. The Tampa 2 isn't stocked and loaded for the next decade. It needs to be re-built anyways.

Even if we had the opportunity to switch to the 3-4, why would you want to?
Our defense has been synonymous with the Cover 2 for the past decade and it has been successful. All it takes is the correct personnel to go back to our glory days of the playmaking Tampa 2. Switching to any other defense would be like going to the dark side, and I find it shocking how any Bucs fan fails to appreciate our defense or Monte Kiffin's wizardry. Are you really a Bucs fan or just a professional critic? You hate on everything about our team, it's ridiculous.

StaticGator
07-31-2007, 02:41 PM
Even if we had the opportunity to switch to the 3-4, why would you want to?
Our defense has been synonymous with the Cover 2 for the past decade and it has been successful. All it takes is the correct personnel to go back to our glory days of the playmaking Tampa 2. Switching to any other defense would be like going to the dark side, and I find it shocking how any Bucs fan fails to appreciate our defense or Monte Kiffin's wizardry. Are you really a Bucs fan or just a professional critic? You hate on everything about our team, it's ridiculous.

And 10 years ago the University of Nebraska was synonymous with the wishbone. I like the Tampa 2 just fine, but at the end of the day it's just a means to help win football games. One of many. If ownership were to decide Gruden wasn't winning enough and didn't have the team in position to win in the future and a new coach with a new philosophy was needed, it's just part of doing business. By saying all it takes is the correct personnel to run the Tampa 2 like we used to, you're basically saying we don't have it right now so it confirms my point we haven't made any sort of significant investment to re-tool the Tampa 2 and thus we wouldn't be losing ground to switch to a different alignment. I love Kiffin but coaches and players come and go. Winning is the only constant you strive for. I was born at Bayfront Medical Center so I'm married to the Bucs. Unfortunately they've given me a lot to be critical of. 4-12 last year, 27-37 the last 4 years, and no pro bowlers drafted since 1999. There's not a lot to be excited about.

Caddy
07-31-2007, 04:23 PM
Um,No. Pay attention,read what the guy said, he isn't sure Peterson was stout enough to play LDE. And 286 to 265 is pretty damn stout enough.

1. Yea, if Cowher comes in here,kiss the tampa 2 good buy,so long Kiffin!
2. Yes seriously, if the offense is holding us back and Gruden is gone. I am all for him-as he had some success calling plays with the Patriots winning only 3 rings..

I was talking about what you said Fresh.

dbtb135
07-31-2007, 05:48 PM
Greg Spires - 10 years in the league
Kevin Carter - 13 years in the league
Charles Bennett - sucks
Chris Hovan - 8 years in the league
Ryan Sims - sucks
Ellis Wyms - 7 years in the league
Gaines Adams - yet to play a game
Derrick Brooks - 13 years in the league
Jamie Winborn - sucks
Barrett Ruud - 52 tackles in 2 seasons
Quincy Black - yet to play a game
Cato June - 5 years in the league
Ryan Nece - marginal

So of arguably the top 13 players in the Bucs front 7, at least 7 will be gone in a year or two and at best 4 could be considered the team's future. Of those 4, only June looks like a miscast but he signed a 3 year contract with a small signing bonus. He can be gone easily. Adams looks like he could be force at outside linebacker in the Willie McGinest/DeMarcus Ware role and Ruud and Black are both 240+. They should be able to hold up. The Tampa 2 isn't stocked and loaded for the next decade. It needs to be re-built anyways.

I think it's kind of one-sided for you to put so much stock in the players that Cowher would bring in, yet knock all the kids Monte has brought in because they haven't achieved anything yet. Cowher has a very good track record, but so does the Pittsburgh scouting department. Monte has been no slouch either when it comes to developing talent from the draft.

I mean we have a number of guys in the works for the future of our defense, because we actually put something in this offseason instead of focusing on offense AGAIN. Sabby and Jackson both have a chance to start this season, Black, Ruud, and June could be our starting LBs next season. The staff loves P-Buc too. And then we have Gaines Adams. They can't all be young.

But going to a 3-4, who do we have? Gaines, I agree could play OLB. But you seemingly try to discredit Ruud as saying he has "52 tackles in 2 seasons" as you question our ability to play the 4-3 well in the future, yet you note him as a guy who could play ILB in the 3-4? Ruud isn't the best player when it comes to holding up vs. the run. And Black is 227 according to Bucs.com, and everyone knows his game is speed and coverage abilities. He's far from the ideal 3-4 ILB.

We aren't built for the 3-4. The truth is, we JUST got to rebuilding our defense with the pick of Barrett Ruud and then again in Gaines Adams. To stop, scrap that plan, and go to a 3-4 with ONE player with experience in a 3-4 in Kevin Carter who, as you mentioned, has 13 years under his belt and isn't getting any younger, would absolutely delay any success of the defense.

Caddy
08-01-2007, 02:48 AM
I think it's kind of one-sided for you to put so much stock in the players that Cowher would bring in, yet knock all the kids Monte has brought in because they haven't achieved anything yet. Cowher has a very good track record, but so does the Pittsburgh scouting department. Monte has been no slouch either when it comes to developing talent from the draft.

I mean we have a number of guys in the works for the future of our defense, because we actually put something in this offseason instead of focusing on offense AGAIN. Sabby and Jackson both have a chance to start this season, Black, Ruud, and June could be our starting LBs next season. The staff loves P-Buc too. And then we have Gaines Adams. They can't all be young.

But going to a 3-4, who do we have? Gaines, I agree could play OLB. But you seemingly try to discredit Ruud as saying he has "52 tackles in 2 seasons" as you question our ability to play the 4-3 well in the future, yet you note him as a guy who could play ILB in the 3-4? Ruud isn't the best player when it comes to holding up vs. the run. And Black is 227 according to Bucs.com, and everyone knows his game is speed and coverage abilities. He's far from the ideal 3-4 ILB.

We aren't built for the 3-4. The truth is, we JUST got to rebuilding our defense with the pick of Barrett Ruud and then again in Gaines Adams. To stop, scrap that plan, and go to a 3-4 with ONE player with experience in a 3-4 in Kevin Carter who, as you mentioned, has 13 years under his belt and isn't getting any younger, would absolutely delay any success of the defense.

Good points. Under Kiffin the Buc's will not move to a 3-4. It will be incorporated to our defense but used relatively sparingly.

Bucs4242
08-04-2007, 12:32 PM
Booger was drafted as an UT, to eventually play UT. He only played NT to get him on the field

Hovan does not need a replacement, nor will his replacement come from the first day of the draft

Boone and Sims will be dominant? LOL

zCaddyz
09-08-2007, 10:05 PM
wat u guys think bout this

1 Glen dorsey

zCaddyz
09-08-2007, 10:06 PM
wat u guys think bout this

1 Glen dorsey

2 Mario Manningham "can he enter this year"

3 Mike jenkins that cb for usf u guys where talkin bout

etk
09-09-2007, 12:03 AM
Manningham can enter, but he's not my exactly my favorite receiver prospect. He hasn't proven he can do more than go deep and catch a perfectly placed deep ball, and that won't cut it. Especially not in Gruden's offense, if it still exists. Other than that I'd be fine with that draft. Those are all important needs.

zCaddyz
10-03-2007, 06:17 PM
Adarius Bowman i really havent heard anything on him this year hows he doing, and would yall like to pick him up in the late first round

etk
10-08-2007, 10:00 AM
Adarius Bowman i really havent heard anything on him this year hows he doing, and would yall like to pick him up in the late first round

Bowman is basically a rich man's Stovall. Same kind of size-speed receiver, just more speed and athleticism. He's probably my favorite receiver prospect in this draft, but we don't need 3 big receivers in our offense (Clayton), we need a smaller deep threat to replace Galloway. DeSean Jackson & Harry Douglas are my favorites.

Note: look up Eric Norwood, Soph South Carolina. Best pure LDE prospect I've ever seen. I really like Emanuel Cook as well.

Tampa 2 4 life
10-08-2007, 03:12 PM
Do you guys think if Slaton falls to where we are in the second we should take a shot on him?

etk
10-09-2007, 09:37 PM
Do you guys think if Slaton falls to where we are in the second we should take a shot on him?

LOL I just drafted him in my 2nd attempt at Madden franchise. 90 overall! Obviously real life is different from Madden, and Slaton isn't the best fit for our offense. We need backs with enough size to take a hit and run up the middle, which is the main focus of our running game. Scatbacks like him are really struggling this year anyway. I'd much rather draft Cory Boyd, Jonathan Stewart, Tashard Choice, Ryan Torain, etc.

Tampa 2 4 life
10-15-2007, 03:22 PM
Random Names that are plausible draft choices aafter seeing half the CFB season:
Jacob Hester, RB, LSU
Owen Schmitt, FB, WVU
Donnie Avery, WR, Houston
Andre Caldwell, WR, UF
Chris Ellis, DE, VT
Louis Holmes, DE, Arizona

Caddy
10-15-2007, 05:43 PM
Random Names that are plausible draft choices aafter seeing half the CFB season:
Jacob Hester, RB, LSU
Owen Schmitt, FB, WVU
Donnie Avery, WR, Houston
Andre Caldwell, WR, UF
Chris Ellis, DE, VT
Louis Holmes, DE, Arizona

I'm actually a big fan of the way that Askew is playing so I don't think FB is that great a need. However if the value is there then I'm all for it.

zCaddyz
10-20-2007, 10:18 AM
i was scrollin in tbbb and some1 was talkin bout dennis dixon in the 3rd round u guys think he will be there when we pick

1. sed- d-line hlp
2. dj hall- we need a playmaker after galloway is gone

Tampa 2 4 life
10-30-2007, 08:13 PM
Right now I think our draft looks like:
1. OT Ryan Clady
2. WR Andre Caldwell or someone similar
3. UT or Physical Corner. (Dre Moore comes to mind for UT, Simeon Castille or Trae Williams for CB.)

etk
10-30-2007, 08:52 PM
I agree that OT, WR & CB are our biggest needs, but not in that particular order. It does make a bit of sense to go OT in the first, however, as receivers are always available later on. I'm still thinking more along the lines of...

1. WR DeSean Jackson or Early Doucet. We don't have enough speed at the position and Galloway's role is crucial in the offense so he will need a solid replacement. Either way, playmakers are necessary as we need guys who can separate from the pack.
2/3. OT or CB, in no order. An athletic tackle like Clady or Baker would be perfect, but they will likely be gone. That leaves us with Tony Hills or Chris Williams, with Heath Benedict as another name to consider. I also agree with your CB candidates. Williams & Castille are great tacklers and would fit nicely in our defense. So would Charles Godfrey.

I don't think UT is a need at any point in the draft. We have quality and depth along with potential at the spot. I don't see the need to fix it at the cost of another position.

zCaddyz
10-31-2007, 12:58 AM
i kinda got a feeling that where gonna pick on offence this year, hopes it's a wr

Caddy
10-31-2007, 01:39 AM
i kinda got a feeling that where gonna pick on offence this year, hopes it's a wr

I just hope we don't use a first rounder on a RB, unless Darren McFadden drops which won't happen anyway.

zCaddyz
10-31-2007, 11:18 AM
rb next year if caddy aint cutting it

Caddy
10-31-2007, 04:45 PM
Even if he wasn't 100%, he can still play. I don't understand why people think we need a 1st round RB. We have plenty of guys who can share the load and even if we did draft someone, it could be done in the mid rounds, not the first.

etk
10-31-2007, 07:09 PM
Even if he wasn't 100%, he can still play. I don't understand why people think we need a 1st round RB. We have plenty of guys who can share the load and even if we did draft someone, it could be done in the mid rounds, not the first.

As much of an Earnest Graham fan I am...Jonathan Stewart is too meast to pass up if he's available. If we don't draft a RB that early, Cory Boyd would be our next best bet, or we could draft Kenny Moore to play WR and backup RB.

Tampa 2 4 life
10-31-2007, 07:14 PM
At RB I see us taking Jacob Hester or someone of that ilk.

etk
10-31-2007, 07:17 PM
At RB I see us taking Jacob Hester or someone of that ilk.

Jacob Hester would be magnificent. He could play a few different positions in different packages in our offense, however, so I didn't include him in my discussion. He's a different kind of player compared to the other guys mentioned.

zCaddyz
11-21-2007, 08:18 AM
1. Dre moore-im on his bandwagon now/ or a speedy wr

2.Center-set up our o-line to be great in the next 10 years/ dj hall

dbtb135
11-21-2007, 08:23 PM
The only center I really like is Alex Mack, and I doubt that he's coming out. We can get a decent type prospect like Speiker or someone later, but this really isn't the draft to get a real good center.

Caddy
11-21-2007, 08:55 PM
I don't think center is a huge need at this point. Sure it would be nice to upgrade John Wade. But if there isn't really that great of an option in the draft, having him start another season really wouldn't be that bad.

Tampa 2 4 life
11-21-2007, 09:55 PM
My Current Dream Draft:

1. Clady or Chris Williams
2. Harry Douglas
3. Trae Williams
4. Jacob Hester
Anything beyond would be a crapshoot.

Caddy
11-21-2007, 10:03 PM
I'm a big Douglas fan too. But then again, I'm pretty much a fan of any receiver with a lot of speed to burn.

etk
11-21-2007, 10:48 PM
I'm a big Douglas fan too. But then again, I'm pretty much a fan of any receiver with a lot of speed to burn.

The problem I find with Douglas is I don't think he really projects as a #1 wideout, especially not in our offense. I love him as a prospect but he's more of a dangerous slot receiver than anything. I question whether or not he will be able to release off the LOS as a #1 and I also question his all-around game (slants and outs, etc.). I could probably say the same about any speed receiver in this class, really, but it's just something about that UL offense and his role that irks me.

1. DeSean Jackson: needs to improve route-running, release but dangerous as a WR and PR. Would relieve Mark Jones/any other random waste of salary and free up a roster spot :)
2. Lawrence Jackson/Louis Holmes/Jameel McClain: This pick is the one where value should be the premium consideration. Any number of needs could be addressed, but LDE is my issue because our pass rush sucks, Spires is old, and there's no future or backup present.
3. Charles Godfrey/Simeon Castille: We have a whole night to think about how badly we need a CB. Thank god there are a number of steals that should be available. Godfrey has the stats, skills, and measurables but lacks the hype. Good for us. Castille has average timed speed but can press well and is a good tackler.
4. Jacob Hester: Can't disagree with T24L, Hester's value would be tremendous for our offense. I know I've said it before in more detail, but the possibilities are endless. I wouldn't be opposed to drafting him 1-2 rounds earlier if need be.
IDK if we even have all of our next picks but w/e, I'll give it a shot.
5. OT - Corey Clark: Decent athlete, decent strength, decent prospect.
6. C - Robbie Krutilla: I'm a closet WMU fan, but he's too slow to go any earlier.
7. MLB - Romeo Davis: Classic Tampa 2 MLB, but hasn't really played much or produced much for the U.

Caddy
11-22-2007, 12:32 AM
The problem I find with Douglas is I don't think he really projects as a #1 wideout, especially not in our offense. I love him as a prospect but he's more of a dangerous slot receiver than anything. I question whether or not he will be able to release off the LOS as a #1 and I also question his all-around game (slants and outs, etc.). I could probably say the same about any speed receiver in this class, really, but it's just something about that UL offense and his role that irks me.

1. DeSean Jackson: needs to improve route-running, release but dangerous as a WR and PR. Would relieve Mark Jones/any other random waste of salary and free up a roster spot :)
2. Lawrence Jackson/Louis Holmes/Jameel McClain: This pick is the one where value should be the premium consideration. Any number of needs could be addressed, but LDE is my issue because our pass rush sucks, Spires is old, and there's no future or backup present.
3. Charles Godfrey/Simeon Castille: We have a whole night to think about how badly we need a CB. Thank god there are a number of steals that should be available. Godfrey has the stats, skills, and measurables but lacks the hype. Good for us. Castille has average timed speed but can press well and is a good tackler.
4. Jacob Hester: Can't disagree with T24L, Hester's value would be tremendous for our offense. I know I've said it before in more detail, but the possibilities are endless. I wouldn't be opposed to drafting him 1-2 rounds earlier if need be.
IDK if we even have all of our next picks but w/e, I'll give it a shot.
5. OT - Corey Clark: Decent athlete, decent strength, decent prospect.
6. C - Robbie Krutilla: I'm a closet WMU fan, but he's too slow to go any earlier.
7. MLB - Romeo Davis: Classic Tampa 2 MLB, but hasn't really played much or produced much for the U.

I think that Douglas has the potential to be a number 1, but that potential is definitely limited. He isn't going to be a guy who a QB can rely on every game ala TO, Moss etc. But what he could be is an excellent vertical threat. In my opinion, for him to ultimately be successful, we would also need a legitimate threat opposite him whether it be Stovall or Clayton or Hilliard etc; hopefully Stovall can play this role in the future.

In regards to the LE debate, with Greg White becoming quite a proficient pass rusher, I could see this influencing our draft day decision. If he can continue with his current form (especially his Falcon game form), I could see him as a potential full time starter.

dbtb135
11-22-2007, 01:04 AM
What is with people's love of Hester? Askew is doing a good job with what Hester would do for us. Although, Hester is a much better rusher, he wouldn't get the opportunities here. If we were to get a FB in the draft, I'd want a true FB late, like a Mike Cox. Something to cheaply improve our short yardage chances. In the 4th, we could use someone much more important to the team, like a returner, competing center, or depth on the DL in the mold of an Ellis Wyms.

etk
11-22-2007, 09:24 AM
I think that Douglas has the potential to be a number 1, but that potential is definitely limited. He isn't going to be a guy who a QB can rely on every game ala TO, Moss etc. But what he could be is an excellent vertical threat. In my opinion, for him to ultimately be successful, we would also need a legitimate threat opposite him whether it be Stovall or Clayton or Hilliard etc; hopefully Stovall can play this role in the future.

In regards to the LE debate, with Greg White becoming quite a proficient pass rusher, I could see this influencing our draft day decision. If he can continue with his current form (especially his Falcon game form), I could see him as a potential full time starter.

There have been some similar prospects to Douglas that have failed for the most part in the NFL: Troy Williamson, Roscoe Parrish, Sinorice Moss, etc. Players like that typically have a lot more success in a spread offense as a slotback.

Kevin Carter & Greg Spires are our LDEs. Greg White is our backup RDE, and I'd rather select a true LDE than move White. He's not much of a full time starter anyway, he's a high motor backup.

What is with people's love of Hester? Askew is doing a good job with what Hester would do for us. Although, Hester is a much better rusher, he wouldn't get the opportunities here. If we were to get a FB in the draft, I'd want a true FB late, like a Mike Cox. Something to cheaply improve our short yardage chances. In the 4th, we could use someone much more important to the team, like a returner, competing center, or depth on the DL in the mold of an Ellis Wyms.

If we got Hester:

-he would be our backup RB and free us of Michael Pittman
-he would have the best hands in our backfield
-he would be our best pass blocker
-he would be our short-yardage back behind Askew

Drafting Hester doesn't have anything to do with Askew, nor does it diminish his role. Jacob Hester is just another weapon for our offense, one that can line up in a multitude of positions. I think he would feel very comfortable in our offense. He would be everything but our lead-blocking fullback.

Caddy
11-22-2007, 08:45 PM
There have been some similar prospects to Douglas that have failed for the most part in the NFL: Troy Williamson, Roscoe Parrish, Sinorice Moss, etc. Players like that typically have a lot more success in a spread offense as a slotback.

Kevin Carter & Greg Spires are our LDEs. Greg White is our backup RDE, and I'd rather select a true LDE than move White. He's not much of a full time starter anyway, he's a high motor backup.

I really hope that Greg White gets a lot of playing time for the rest of the season. I think he has a lot of potential and before we go drafting a replacement LE, we find out what we have already.

That obviously doesn't always happen and I would still be happy with him as an impact rusher, but nevertheless, it would be nice if he could be a starter allowing us to use a pick on a different position.

And technically, White is listed as backup LE.

etk
11-22-2007, 10:18 PM
I really hope that Greg White gets a lot of playing time for the rest of the season. I think he has a lot of potential and before we go drafting a replacement LE, we find out what we have already.

That obviously doesn't always happen and I would still be happy with him as an impact rusher, but nevertheless, it would be nice if he could be a starter allowing us to use a pick on a different position.

And technically, White is listed as backup LE.

I agree on everything you said, but even if he does prove himself worthy of extended playing time we still will need more pass rushers and more defensive ends. You really can't get enough of them and the best pass rushing teams have a bunch of guys with different skillsets. He is listed as an LDE but he lines up on the right most of the time and that's where he makes the most impact.

Chucky
11-22-2007, 10:19 PM
If Lawrence Jackson is there in the second round, I think we have to pounce on him right away, He looked like a monster tonight against ASU. Also if Calais somehow drops to us in the first, I think we got to take him.

etk
11-22-2007, 10:21 PM
If Lawrence Jackson is there in the second round, I think we have to pounce on him right away, He looked like a monster tonight against ASU. Also if Calais somehow drops to us in the first, I think we got to take him.

Calais will not drop, but if he did......wow you just got me excited.

Yes Lawrence Jackson was an absolute monster/beast tonight. He made me very proud that I just recently put him in my mini-mock. Getting either of those guys would be a best-case scenario.

Chucky
11-22-2007, 10:22 PM
Calais will not drop, but if he did......wow you just got me excited.

Yes Lawrence Jackson was an absolute monster/beast tonight. He made me very proud that I just recently put him in my mini-mock. Getting either of those guys would be a best-case scenario.

As of write now i see him going somewhere in the mid to late teens, so if for some reason he doesnt have the kind of workouts that are expected then i can see a drop

etk
11-22-2007, 10:23 PM
As of write now i see him going somewhere in the mid to late teens, so if for some reason he doesnt have the kind of workouts that are expected then i can see a drop

There are rumors that he won't declare at all, so anything could happen I guess. I still doubt it though.

Caddy
11-22-2007, 11:30 PM
I agree on everything you said, but even if he does prove himself worthy of extended playing time we still will need more pass rushers and more defensive ends. You really can't get enough of them and the best pass rushing teams have a bunch of guys with different skillsets. He is listed as an LDE but he lines up on the right most of the time and that's where he makes the most impact.

That is true. It is all about value as far as this draft goes. The Buccaneers have needs, but none of them are really glaring need. We should use this felxibility in the draft and try and grab the BPA.

Tampa 2 4 life
11-23-2007, 04:30 PM
There are rumors that he won't declare at all, so anything could happen I guess. I still doubt it though.

That would set up a potentially monstrous DE/3-4 OLB in '09.

etk
11-23-2007, 06:33 PM
That would set up a potentially monstrous DE/3-4 OLB in '09.

If you include Vernon Gholston, Derrick Harvey & (I know I'm forgetting someone), then yeah, you're right.

Tampa 2 4 life
11-23-2007, 07:00 PM
If you include Vernon Gholston, Derrick Harvey & (I know I'm forgetting someone), then yeah, you're right.

You're forgetting
GEORGE SELVIE

etk
11-23-2007, 07:13 PM
You're forgetting
GEORGE SELVIE

He's a sophomore and I don't expect him to declare one bit (Calais easily could've done it last year but came back). I'm forgetting someone else OTHER THAN george selvie you disgusting homer.

Tampa 2 4 life
12-27-2007, 03:09 PM
If Alex Mack comes out, we should take a good hard look at him with our 2nd.

etk
12-27-2007, 04:32 PM
If Alex Mack comes out, we should take a good hard look at him with our 2nd.

I'd rather sign a C than draft one. Experience is everything.

Caddy
12-27-2007, 05:53 PM
We have way bigger needs than C in this draft. John Wade is a decent starter anyway and considering the youth surrounding him, it would be wise to keep him around a little longer.

dbtb135
12-27-2007, 11:10 PM
John Wade is garbage and won't be playing much longer. With no one knowing the progress of Buenning, center is just as big a need as any other position. Though not as pressing or as important as, say, QB. If Mack was there, he'd be great. I really doubt he enters though.

Caddy
12-28-2007, 04:54 AM
John Wade is garbage and won't be playing much longer. With no one knowing the progress of Buenning, center is just as big a need as any other position. Though not as pressing or as important as, say, QB. If Mack was there, he'd be great. I really doubt he enters though.

I really disagree with you about Wade. He is not garbage and is a viable option for the next 2-3 years if the coaching staff feel they should keep him around. I don't think we will see him going anywhere in the short term as his leadership and experience is a welcome asset to an otherwise inexperienced offensive line. Could he be upgraded? Sure. But not ahead of positions such as WR, CB, DT, DE, QB etc etc.

etk
12-28-2007, 10:10 AM
Wade is complete garbage. We need to bring in another big C, one way or another.

amag
12-28-2007, 05:30 PM
this would be my dream draft for the bucs

Sam Baker OT in round 1 - were a LT away from having a very very very solid oline

Jordy Nelson WR round 2 - this guy is flat out amazing, 6'3 220, looks like he runs in the 4.48-4.52 range, caught 122 passes this year and over 1600 yards

Owen Schmitt FB round 3 - This guys is the next alstott he is a freaking animal

the rest of the draft used on defensive players

Caddy
12-28-2007, 05:53 PM
Is anyone else sick of Jordy Nelson? I know I am.

etk
12-28-2007, 06:00 PM
this would be my dream draft for the bucs

Sam Baker OT in round 1 - were a LT away from having a very very very solid oline

Jordy Nelson WR round 2 - this guy is flat out amazing, 6'3 220, looks like he runs in the 4.48-4.52 range, caught 122 passes this year and over 1600 yards

Owen Schmitt FB round 3 - This guys is the next alstott he is a freaking animal

the rest of the draft used on defensive players

That draft sucks. Especially the last 2 picks.

Is anyone else sick of Jordy Nelson? I know I am.

I love the Jordy Nelson talk and debate. I just can't wait for him to bust in the NFL. We'll be scrutinizing his every move like Bush and Young.

Tampa 2 4 life
12-28-2007, 06:12 PM
My Newest Ideal Mock(Only going 4 rounds):

1. DT Frank Okam - Texas
May be a bit of a reach but I love him as a run stuffer in our system.

2. Trae Williams - USF
Obvious need, decent value.

3. Dorien Bryant - Purdue
Reminds me more of Galloway than DJax or the others, runs great routes and isn't afraid to go in traffic.

4. Kendall Langford - Hampton
Sleeper LE prospect who has great size.

Tampa 2 4 life
12-28-2007, 06:14 PM
I love the Jordy Nelson talk and debate. I just can't wait for him to bust in the NFL. We'll be scrutinizing his every move like Bush and Young.

D00D, he's gonna be better than Calvin Johnson, don't you wait.

Caddy
12-28-2007, 06:15 PM
I love the Jordy Nelson talk and debate. I just can't wait for him to bust in the NFL. We'll be scrutinizing his every move like Bush and Young.

It's pretty much just a NFLDC thing. A couple of huge Nelson fan boys influencing everyone else on the forum. It's getting kind of old anyway.

etk
12-28-2007, 06:18 PM
It's pretty much just a NFLDC thing. A couple of huge Nelson fan boys influencing everyone else on the forum. It's getting kind of old anyway.

It's not getting old. At first it was Travis 24 with a bit of help from Babylon against everyone. Now we get the odd n00b to come in and make it even funnier.

Caddy
12-28-2007, 06:19 PM
It's not getting old. At first it was Travis 24 with a bit of help from Babylon against everyone. Now we get the odd n00b to come in and make it even funnier.

I know it's not getting old to them but it is getting really old to me. Don't forget Bored of Education either. Jordyzzzz Nelsonzzz.

etk
12-28-2007, 06:22 PM
Let's just say I wish Nelsonz was in a bowl game this year. We'd have a full Jordyz Nelsonz game day thread to critique his every move, from the huddle to the pass.

Tampa 2 4 life
12-28-2007, 06:24 PM
Should I add Jordy to my mock in the 5th? :P

Caddy
12-28-2007, 06:24 PM
Let's just say I wish Nelsonz was in a bowl game this year. We'd have a full Jordyz Nelsonz game day thread to critique his every move, from the huddle to the pass.

Hopefully he runs poorly in workouts and we can all go back to hyping up deserving players.

etk
12-28-2007, 06:25 PM
C'mon man, you've been a homer for overlooked white guys before. Eric Weddle, Chas Gessner, etc. Why not Jordyzzz?

Tampa 2 4 life
12-28-2007, 06:29 PM
Hopefully he runs poorly in workouts and we can all go back to hyping up deserving players.

Richard Clebert!

EL PASO, Texas - People ask Richard Clebert about the number all the time, just to make sure it's not a typo.

If the 40-yard dash is the official measurement of an athlete's speed, a player's strength is best quantified in the number of times he can bench-press 225 pounds. Before Clebert, USF's record was 36. During the summer, the senior defensive tackle destroyed that mark with 43 reps.

"When I hit 43 last summer, I surprised myself," said Clebert, who will play his final college game Monday in the Sun Bowl against Oregon.

Clebert hopes he isn't done surprising people. He'd like a chance to attend the NFL's official combine workouts in Indianapolis, where each year's draft prospects are poked, prodded and measured. Clebert hasn't been tested on the bench press since he achieved 43, and assistant strength coach Kaz Kazadi told him not to limit himself to that astounding number.

"He told me I'd hit 50 at the combine," Clebert, 22, said. "It was exciting, but I always expect things like that from myself. It's something I can control. It's up to me. If I work hard in the offseason, I can get that done."

Any number in the 40s would catch scouts' attention. The bench-press record at the NFL combine is said to be 43 reps, from offensive lineman Scott Young of BYU, now with the Eagles. The high mark at the most recent combine in February was 42, from N.C. State defensive tackle Tank Tyler, now with the Chiefs.

"He's as strong as all-get-out. He came in strong, but he loves the weight room," strength coach Ronnie McKeefery said of Clebert. "He's naturally gifted, and he's always worked hard in the weight room, but he's really excelled in the last year and a half."

Clebert's dedication goes back to his days at Miami's Edison High, where he could do 25 reps before he got to Tampa. His coach, Corey Bell, told him his height - 6 feet 1 - would be something he'd have to overcome in other areas.

"My strength and my speed were always something I focused on. My high school coach told me I was short, so I had to be better at everything else," said Clebert, who is 3 inches shorter than USF's other starting defensive tackle, Aaron Harris.

Clebert knows better than to judge a player by a single number from a single workout. He remembers his senior year at Edison, when he attended a recruiting combine with his friend and teammate, linebacker Brouce Mompremier, who followed him to USF and also is a starter.

"I told him not to run the 40, because he didn't know how to do it," Clebert said. "At the time, he was like the No. 6 linebacker in the country, blue chip and all. He ran that 40, came over and I said, "What'd you run?' He ran a 4.9. You could see his stock just drop. It doesn't make any sense, but so many people judge people on numbers."

Clebert hopes he can get a closer look from the NFL based on those numbers. Despite an ankle injury that has kept him from playing at full strength in the second half of the season, Clebert has career highs with 32 tackles, including eight for losses. He's been the inside force flushing quarterbacks out to All-American defensive end George Selvie and leads the team with 15 quarterback hurries.

Clebert said his work ethic on the field started in the weight room, where Kazadi and strength coach Ronnie McKeefery have always pushed him, even after he had broken school records.

"Sometimes you'll curl and you'll do 60 pounds," Clebert said. "You look at those 80s and you're like 'Dang, that's heavy. I could do it though.' The coach isn't asking you, so you don't do it. You're still working hard when you have 70 pounds on your arms, but you could do 85. If you're doing 85 on curls, Coach Kazadi would be more like, 'Go get those 120s.'"

Clebert said one of his unreached goals for this season was to block a field goal; his position coach, Dan McCarney, also handles the field-goal block unit and expects the same intensity on special teams as he gets on defense.

"In the offseason, we were blocking so many field goals. I remember one day I blocked three or four," said Clebert, due to graduate in the spring with a degree in communications. "During the year, I was always a centimeter away from blocking, and that was very frustrating."

If Clebert can get to the combine, he wants not only the bench-press record, but also wants the fastest 40 time of any lineman his size; for a 312-pound lineman to get under 4.9 seconds would also be attractive to NFL scouts. His previous best is a 4.93. Coach Jim Leavitt said Clebert needs a breakout game against Oregon to help his chances to showcase his strength with all the scouts watching in Indianapolis.

"He's always been strong, but he's matured a little bit," Leavitt said. "He's an outstanding player, and when he was hurt, you could see how much he was missed. He needs to have a great game in this game if he wants to make that combine. He needs to really tear it up."

Imagine if he hits 50 bench presses with a 4.9 flat 40...Scouts will have to have their jaws picked up off the floor.


/USF Homerism

Caddy
12-28-2007, 07:48 PM
C'mon man, you've been a homer for overlooked white guys before. Eric Weddle, Chas Gessner, etc. Why not Jordyzzz?

Weddle was the only guy I hyped up during the draft process and He actually deserved the 2nd round status I was giving him. Chas Gessner on the other hand was just one of those TC guys who I wanted to give a chance. He played well during TC and Pre-season and unfortunately it just didn't translate to much more than that.

PS Weddle Rules.

etk
12-28-2007, 09:17 PM
Apparently I know nothing about football because I think Brandon Meriweather is better than Weddle. This week NFLDC found a new brand of homer. Not a homer for a team or player they know/like, but a homer for skin color.

Tampa 2 4 life
12-28-2007, 09:20 PM
Apparently I know nothing about football because I think Brandon Meriweather is better than Weddle. This week NFLDC found a new brand of homer. Not a homer for a team or player they know/like, but a homer for skin color.

Hey, if Jordy Nelson was black we'd be calling him TO! Or Michael Clayton :P


PS: We should get Clebert to go after him... ;)

etk
12-28-2007, 09:23 PM
If Jordy Nelson was black we would all just be haters instead of being racist. You can't win with a troll.

Caddy
12-28-2007, 09:47 PM
Apparently I know nothing about football because I think Brandon Meriweather is better than Weddle. This week NFLDC found a new brand of homer. Not a homer for a team or player they know/like, but a homer for skin color.

You like Merriweather, I like Weddle; just an opinion really. I hope you aren't calling me a homer based on skin color.

zCaddyz
12-29-2007, 06:02 PM
Richard Clebert........remember when that aints got that big ol dt who can do backflips or something and only lasted 15 minutes in tc, is he like him or can he do something in the next level

Tampa 2 4 life
12-29-2007, 09:25 PM
Richard Clebert........remember when that aints got that big ol dt who can do backflips or something and only lasted 15 minutes in tc, is he like him or can he do something in the next level

Except that guy never did anything in the college game, this guy has 32 Tackles in 10 games as a Nose Tackle...

etk
01-02-2008, 08:46 AM
You like Merriweather, I like Weddle; just an opinion really. I hope you aren't calling me a homer based on skin color.

You need to read the Draft forums more often. I wasn't talking about you at all.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-02-2008, 12:58 PM
...So Colt Brennan in the 3rd?

Caddy
01-02-2008, 06:30 PM
You need to read the Draft forums more often. I wasn't talking about you at all.

Yeah I did go and read them about a day after your post and fully understood what you were talking about. I was just too lazy to go back and edit my post. My bad for calling you out.

Caddy
01-02-2008, 06:30 PM
...So Colt Brennan in the 3rd?

Tempting, but I think it is totally dependent on who we've drafted and who is available.

etk
01-03-2008, 01:42 PM
Yeah I did go and read them about a day after your post and fully understood what you were talking about. I was just too lazy to go back and edit my post. My bad for calling you out.

No it's my bad for thinking you knew. I see your perspective on how it would be comprehended.

...So Colt Brennan in the 3rd?

Are you kidding? Hell yeah! I still think Brennan is the best QB in the draft. Hawaii's offensive line couldn't block a 3-man rush for 2 seconds, give him a break.

Caddy
01-03-2008, 07:06 PM
No it's my bad for thinking you knew. I see your perspective on how it would be comprehended.



That is one of the many problems with message boards. Sometimes what is being said can become easily misconstrued.

But seriously; does Chas Gessner have a brother? We should draft him. :D

etk
01-03-2008, 11:23 PM
That is one of the many problems with message boards. Sometimes what is being said can become easily misconstrued.

But seriously; does Chas Gessner have a brother? We should draft him. :D

I have a similar build to Chas Gessner. I'm a better gunner than he is too. Draft me in 3 years...I'll even help scout better than Sabby Piscitelli, our future HOF safety.

Caddy
01-04-2008, 12:01 AM
I have a similar build to Chas Gessner. I'm a better gunner than he is too. Draft me in 3 years...I'll even help scout better than Sabby Piscitelli, our future HOF safety.

Hahahaha. Who was it that said Sabby was worth the pick because of his scouting ability again?

etk
01-04-2008, 10:08 AM
Hahahaha. Who was it that said Sabby was worth the pick because of his scouting ability again?

bucpeeeeeeempin. The pimpin 30 year old Bucs fan.

Caddy
01-04-2008, 05:38 PM
bucpeeeeeeempin. The pimpin 30 year old Bucs fan.

Oh yeah. Haven't seen him for a while. He was a distinct example of homerism.

Caddy
01-06-2008, 10:05 PM
Just letting everyone know I changed the title of the thread. That way all discussions relating to team acquisitions can be discussed in one place.

So to start things off; Chad Johnson anyone?

etk
01-06-2008, 10:36 PM
I'm gonna do a thorough offseason write up soon. I'm obviously not in the mood right now but I already have a few things in mind :)

Tampa 2 4 life
01-06-2008, 11:01 PM
Team Mock, because I'm bored:
1. Calais Campbell: If anyone disagrees, etk will make my argument for me.
2. Ray Rice(Thank god there are no Rutgers Homers Reading This): I like him as a Thomas Jones-type back who'd succeed with our line.
3. Trae Williams: Magical.
4. Dorien Bryant: The more I see him the more I like him.
5. Josh Johnson: In case Gruden comes to his senses and realizes Gradkowski is on the roster.
6. Dejuan Tribble: At this rate, he'll actually fall this far.
7. Some throwaway prospect.

zCaddyz
01-06-2008, 11:17 PM
would love to have chad johnson playing for us, what you think we'll have to give up to get him a 1st round pick?

etk
01-06-2008, 11:22 PM
Team Mock, because I'm bored:
1. Calais Campbell: If anyone disagrees, etk will make my argument for me.
2. Ray Rice(Thank god there are no Rutgers Homers Reading This): I like him as a Thomas Jones-type back who'd succeed with our line.
3. Trae Williams: Magical.
4. Dorien Bryant: The more I see him the more I like him.
5. Josh Johnson: In case Gruden comes to his senses and realizes Gradkowski is on the roster.
6. Dejuan Tribble: At this rate, he'll actually fall this far.
7. Some throwaway prospect.

1. I had a good laugh. I'm glad to see someone else hooked on my vision. I get scary thoughts when I think of Campbell on our defense...the things we could do. It reminds me of last year with CJ :(
2. Kinda seems like a poor man's Graham. to me. He hasn't impressed me as a receiver either. I don't mind going RB but Rice isn't my kinda guy.
3. Yeah. I wanna see his 40 time, especially in comparison to Jenkins'. I have a little competition going on in my head.
4. I didn't like him in the bowl game, but I liked him before that.
5. lol. I prefer Paul Smith over Johnson, did you watch him tonight? He throws missiles from 0-25 yards, and reminds me of Garcia with his pocket presence and mobility.
6. That'd be great.
7. That's the kind of attitude that will get you right on board with Gruden & co. Let's just waste all of our late-round picks. Woohoo! Just insert some random USF guy, that should work. Or Evan Moore, Caddy likes him.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-06-2008, 11:30 PM
1. I had a good laugh. I'm glad to see someone else hooked on my vision. I get scary thoughts when I think of Campbell on our defense...the things we could do. It reminds me of last year with CJ :(
2. Kinda seems like a poor man's Graham. to me. He hasn't impressed me as a receiver either. I don't mind going RB but Rice isn't my kinda guy.
3. Yeah. I wanna see his 40 time, especially in comparison to Jenkins'. I have a little competition going on in my head.
4. I didn't like him in the bowl game, but I liked him before that.
5. lol. I prefer Paul Smith over Johnson, did you watch him tonight? He throws missiles from 0-25 yards, and reminds me of Garcia with his pocket presence and mobility.
6. That'd be great.
7. That's the kind of attitude that will get you right on board with Gruden & co. Let's just waste all of our late-round picks. Woohoo! Just insert some random USF guy, that should work. Or Evan Moore, Caddy likes him.

1. Yeah, Hopefully he sucks at the combine so he falls.
2. Shiftier than Graham.
3. Expect their 40s to be close.
4. I was considering JORDYZZZZZZZZZZZ here, actually.
5. Does Paul Smith have a youtube video?
6. Hopefully he'd do better than Zemaitis...
7. I expect Reggie Ball here.

Caddy
01-07-2008, 12:57 AM
Yeah I'll probably do an offseason right up as well. Maybe we should make a thread just so each of us can post our offseason thoughts?

And you may be shocked to hear this etk, but I am really warming to Calais Campbell in the 1st round of the draft. After seeing our almost non-existent defensive line against the Giants we need someone youthful with plenty of potential to develop along with Gaines.

EDIT - Actually I'm going to start drafting my write-up. I'm bored as hell anyway.

etk
01-07-2008, 08:10 AM
The reason for our defensive line struggles against the Giants was not the linemen themselves. It's nearly impossible to pressure a QB who's getting the ball out faster than it gets there. Our underneath coverage just wasn't present for that game, and Manning easily picked us apart on slants and other short routes. QBs have done that to us pretty much all season, but we've managed to come away with turnovers and stops at the key moments. The only time I saw our DLine really struggle was when they ran to our defensive right near the end of drives, when we were tired. Haye just got pushed around, but Hovan and Carter were great against the run.

What did make me want Campbell even more was the sight of Michael Strahan using Trueblood as a rag doll and disrupting everything. I think a 6'8 281 LDE could maybe do that in time, don't you?

No Paul Smith videos on youtube. He'll be at the combine and he'll impress big time. He might have the strongest arm when they get clocked, and he's pretty fast too. He reminds me some of Tony Romo, because of the size and mobility comparison, but he moves around in the pocket like Garcia and throws darts like Mike Vick. His receivers drop at least one ball per series, that's how hard he throws. A guy like that would do great things in our offense because he'd have the freedom to move around and his arm would be key on 3rd down passes across the middle.

Canadian_kid16
01-07-2008, 03:16 PM
I don't see how picking Campbell in the first would be a good move. He's a raw DE who won't make an impact right away, and we have more pressing needs atm, but I am intrigued as to why he would be a good pick for us.

zCaddyz
01-07-2008, 03:28 PM
I wouldn't mind him to take over carters spot, adams on one side campbell on the other because if where gonna stay in the tampa-2 we need a pass-rush, you seen what happend on sunday and when we play elite qb's and they have all day to throw there gonna find them soft spots

Caddy
01-07-2008, 05:28 PM
Either way Eli had way to much time in the pocket on several throws and we need to do something about that in the future.

etk
01-07-2008, 05:38 PM
I don't see how picking Campbell in the first would be a good move. He's a raw DE who won't make an impact right away, and we have more pressing needs atm, but I am intrigued as to why he would be a good pick for us.

Is he a raw defensive end? By definition, yes, but that doesn't mean he won't have an impact right away. Mario Williams was a beast against the run as a rookie, but was always just short of making a big impact in his pass rush. As an experienced sophomore, he blew up. Campbell has the size and athleticism to start and make an immediate impact, but he won't be leading our team in sacks until he learns more pass rush moves and savvy. What rookie is not like that anyway? The problem with our LDE situation is we don't adjust well to a balanced offense. We're built to stop the run on 1st and 2nd, then bring in pass rushers on 3rd. What the Giants did was pass on running downs and we didn't have the right personnel to pressure them. A guy like Campbell is great against the run and pass which will open up options and versatility in our defense. I don't see how LDE isn't a big need either. Carter and Spires are old and they can't get after the QB. We only have two pass rushers right now, and both have one year of serious NFL experience. We need another pass rusher, preferably one who can take over at LDE for the aging Carter/Spires. The only position that looks more pressing right now is WR, but there isn't a bonafide stud in the 1st. CB is also a big need but one we like to look at later in the draft, especially with the depth in this draft. Campbell is one of, if not the, only realistic player for us in the 1st who brings both need and value to the table, all while revolutionizing our defense.

I wouldn't mind him to take over carters spot, adams on one side campbell on the other because if where gonna stay in the tampa-2 we need a pass-rush, you seen what happend on sunday and when we play elite qb's and they have all day to throw there gonna find them soft spots

Yeah, that defense would do bad things. We don't have to play an elite QB to get burned either. Sage Rosenfels, Matt Moore, and other backups have picked apart our defense in the past, mainly because we can't find an answer to the short passing game. Did everyone see Michael Strahan against our short passing offense? That's what we need, and Campbell is our best bet.

zCaddyz
01-08-2008, 10:11 PM
i heard brandon flowers is going to the draft, do you guys think he'll be there when we pick in the second? and if not would it be smart to trade up and get him, i would love to get this guy because he gots long arms, fluid hips, and can lay the wood

etk
01-08-2008, 10:31 PM
i heard brandon flowers is going to the draft, do you guys think he'll be there when we pick in the second? and if not would it be smart to trade up and get him, i would love to get this guy because he gots long arms, fluid hips, and can lay the wood

I didn't know about the long arms, thanks for that. I'd love to get Flowers any way possible. He breaks on the ball very well and he's an animal of a hitter. I feel confident in saying he's a lock to be one of the best Cover 2 corners in the league. He reminds me of Ronde, but bigger, more athletic, and better at hitting.

Caddy
01-08-2008, 11:13 PM
I think he will be a potential suitor for our second round pick. Unfortunately he may have to contend with a decent CB class with plenty of 2nd/3rd round types and players from other positions including DT/DE and WR.

zCaddyz
01-08-2008, 11:32 PM
I saw him in some games he looks like he has long arms not really sure but there good sized

zCaddyz
01-09-2008, 07:49 AM
My dream list in no order

Pat sims-DT
Brandon Flowers-CB
Dj Hall-WR
MM-WR
D.Jackson-WR
Adarius Bowman-WR
Sam Baker-Lt

Caddy
01-09-2008, 07:53 AM
My dream list.

1. Desean Jackson.
2. Desean Jackson.
3. You get the idea.

etk
01-09-2008, 08:50 AM
Well I just typed up a long ass response explaining why Jackson sucks and we shouldn't draft him, what receivers we should draft and my overall big board for the 1st round. ****** got erased by mistake. I'll retype the board but I'm too lazy to reqrite the other stuff.

1. Jonathan Stewart: Probably the best prospect in the draft, and we could get him with our pick. I'd cry if we passed him up no matter who our backs were.
2. Calais Campbell: I might not cry if we passed up Stewart and drafted him.
3. Brandon Flowers: Worth the reach (on stock not value).
4. Charles Godfrey: Same as Flowers, just not as beastly.
5. Pat Sims: NT is a big need IMO.
6. Colt Brennan: QB has moved up a bit on my needs list, especially since Gruden might be gone.
7. Andre Caldwell.
8. Chris Ellis: Solid LDE, not as freakish as Campbell.
9. Phil Loadholt/Michael Oher: OTs with huge potential. We have too many decent OTs and no good ones. I hope they all just get their acts together but we may have to draft one.
10. I had someone in my head to round out the list but forgot his name.

Caddy
01-09-2008, 05:51 PM
Jackson is definitely that kind of player in my opinion. You either love him, or you hate him.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-09-2008, 07:50 PM
So...Any new news on assistants and Gruden?

Caddy
01-09-2008, 07:54 PM
profootballtalk has an interesting article about the Bucs allowing RB coach Art Valero to interview with the Rams.

And I guess that Callahan rumour counts as some form of news too.

In the next month or so we are going to witness a lot of change within the coaching staff and it should be very interesting to watch to say the least.

etk
01-09-2008, 09:28 PM
Jackson is definitely that kind of player in my opinion. You either love him, or you hate him.

If we're gonna draft a one-dimensional deep threat that doesn't fit the offense, it might as well be Mario Manningham now that he's actually declared. I've seen more Michigan games than Cal games, but Manningham looks like a better deep threat than Jackson. If he was a good punt returner as a sophomore he too would be a ridiculously overrated 1st round pick.

Caddy
01-09-2008, 10:04 PM
I think the Buccaneers could easily utilise the skills of a player like Desean Jackson. It's easy to focus on the weaknesses of a player like Desean because naturally he is going to attract criticism because of his suspect durability and size, but you can't deny that he runs relatively crisp routes, has good hands and is one of the quickest players in the draft.

dbtb135
01-10-2008, 01:27 AM
I wouldn't mind him to take over carters spot, adams on one side campbell on the other because if where gonna stay in the tampa-2 we need a pass-rush, you seen what happend on sunday and when we play elite qb's and they have all day to throw there gonna find them soft spots

Didn't need to find soft spots with the cushion we gave them in the 2nd half. Just run 7 yards, turn around. Run 9 yards, turn around. We need to call tighter coverage, we could play that soft zone with 5 guys and give up easy passes. Instead, we drop 7 and still can't stop them. It's such a waste, it's hard to believe that type of mistake was made by one of the best DCs, if not the best, in the NFL.

etk
01-10-2008, 08:41 AM
I think the Buccaneers could easily utilise the skills of a player like Desean Jackson. It's easy to focus on the weaknesses of a player like Desean because naturally he is going to attract criticism because of his suspect durability and size, but you can't deny that he runs relatively crisp routes, has good hands and is one of the quickest players in the draft.

We could easily utilize his skills, but do we want to? We won't be able to draft him any lower than our first pick, and have you taken a look at the WR class we have going right now this year? Scott has 50 guys in his rankings already and there are some guys he hasn't included that are solid as well. There could be as many as 10-15 underclassmen that declare as well. I'd be much happier drafting a WR when the value is right later on rather than reaching on a player with limited NFL potential when we can draft other positions that aren't as deep (HELLO LDE!).

Tampa 2 4 life
01-10-2008, 05:55 PM
Earl Bennett is coming out...

Caddy
01-10-2008, 06:03 PM
You need to realise etk that Desean Jackson is my man crush for this years draft and that sometimes clouds my better judgment (ala Weddle last year).

With the recent influx of junior receivers he might not even declare for the draft.

Caddy
01-10-2008, 07:33 PM
The following coaches have signed new contracts:


Bill Muir - Offensive Line Coach
Richard Bisaccia - Special Teams Coordinator
Richard Mann - Wide Receiver CoachMonte Kiffin has also been offered a new contract.

http://www.pewterreport.com/articles/view/3827

Caddy
01-10-2008, 07:35 PM
Question.

Do people think it is a good idea to separate Draft talk from FA/Salary Cap/Coaching etc talk?

etk
01-10-2008, 08:56 PM
Earl Bennett is coming out...

Good. He's a player I like in the 2nd round.

Question.

Do people think it is a good idea to separate Draft talk from FA/Salary Cap/Coaching etc talk?

No. I like having one big thread that people actually post in, instead of a bunch of little scattered threads. When I feel it's time to do a full write-up I'll make a new thread though :)

Caddy
01-10-2008, 10:34 PM
No. I like having one big thread that people actually post in, instead of a bunch of little scattered threads. When I feel it's time to do a full write-up I'll make a new thread though :)

Haha. I've already written the releases/re-signings part of mine. Only the draft and FA to go.

etk
01-10-2008, 10:52 PM
Haha. I've already written the releases/re-signings part of mine. Only the draft and FA to go.

Sweet. Mine's gonna look more like a positional analysis. That's easier for me because I can incorporate everything.

Caddy
01-11-2008, 05:38 PM
Sweet. Mine's gonna look more like a positional analysis. That's easier for me because I can incorporate everything.

Awesome. Can't wait to see what other people think should happen in Tampa this off-season.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-11-2008, 05:58 PM
I won't be doing mine until the coaching staff gets set.

Caddy
01-11-2008, 11:47 PM
Finished my off-season outlook although I am extremely hesitant to post it. I am not happy at all with my round 4 through 6 picks at all and might wait till after the combine to release it.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-12-2008, 11:44 AM
Finished my off-season outlook although I am extremely hesitant to post it. I am not happy at all with my round 4 through 6 picks at all and might wait till after the combine to release it.

Come on, post it. You can always edit it later.

Caddy
01-13-2008, 02:06 AM
First signings of the offseason:

Cortez Hankton, WR.
Daniel Fells, TE.
Marcus Hamilton, CB.
Marquies Gunn, DE.
Darrell Hunter, CB.
Dennis Roland, OT.
Brian Johnson, OG.

http://buccaneers.com/news/newsdetail.aspx?newsid=6256

Chucky
01-13-2008, 09:03 PM
With our first round pick, there really doesnt seem to be a great fit that fits in with value. Im thinking our first would be best put to use in trading for an elite reciever such as Roy or Ocho. Then Im thinking with the rest of our picks we go defence all the way. Im thinking something like

1.Trade
2. Pat Sims DT(might not be there but what the hell)
3. Patrick Lee CB
4. Either LB or DE, not sure on this one,

etk
01-13-2008, 10:12 PM
With our first round pick, there really doesnt seem to be a great fit that fits in with value.

Probably right, unless Campbell falls or we draft another position that isn't a top need (QB, OT).

Tampa 2 4 life
01-13-2008, 10:29 PM
Probably right, unless Campbell falls or we draft another position that isn't a top need (QB, OT).

Jon Stewart...

Chucky
01-13-2008, 10:32 PM
Jon Stewart...

I realize that Jon Stewart is a great prospect and could be a stud, But i dont think the bucs have the luxury of taking a pick like that. Graham/Caddy/Bennet/ Pittman should be more than enough to get the job done over the next few seasons. Honestly, we have a good chance of doing very well next year, and therefor we need to try and fill our key (fatal) holes through the draft, and that is why a reciever, or a CB, or DL help makes way more sense.

Even after saying this i will contradict myself and say that if brohm is there we should take him. THe cupboard at QB is pretty much bare for the future(**** mccown) and brohm would be able to step in in two years, and deliver

etk
01-13-2008, 10:33 PM
Jon Stewart...

I knew I was forgetting somebody. I need to start looking at past classes to make my "Stewart is the best RB prospect since..." tagline.

I realize that Jon Stewart is a great prospect and could be a stud, But i dont think the bucs have the luxury of taking a pick like that. Graham/Caddy/Bennet/ Pittman should be more than enough to get the job done over the next few seasons. Honestly, we have a good chance of doing very well next year, and therefor we need to try and fill our key (fatal) holes through the draft, and that is why a reciever, or a CB, or DL help makes way more sense.


Think Minnesota and Adrian Peterson. There's 2 different needs at the RB position: you need a RB, and then you need a ridiculous game-changing beast of a RB. Cadillac & Graham are both solid, but Stewart screams top-5 NFL back to me. Very few teams could pass that up, us not being one of them.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-13-2008, 10:38 PM
I realize that Jon Stewart is a great prospect and could be a stud, But i dont think the bucs have the luxury of taking a pick like that. Graham/Caddy/Bennet/ Pittman should be more than enough to get the job done over the next few seasons. Honestly, we have a good chance of doing very well next year, and therefor we need to try and fill our key (fatal) holes through the draft, and that is why a reciever, or a CB, or DL help makes way more sense.

Even after saying this i will contradict myself and say that if brohm is there we should take him. THe cupboard at QB is pretty much bare for the future(**** mccown) and brohm would be able to step in in two years, and deliver

Why do we want a QB who's played two career games at Raymond James, and been blown out both times? :P

I'm starting to agree with etk and am hopping on the Daniel bandwagon. If Grothe stops being such a horrible decision maker we should draft him, though.

Chucky
01-13-2008, 10:42 PM
Think Minnesota and Adrian Peterson. There's 2 different needs at the RB position: you need a RB, and then you need a ridiculous game-changing beast of a RB. Cadillac & Graham are both solid, but Stewart screams top-5 NFL back to me. Very few teams could pass that up, us not being one of them.

Honestly If Healthy (not saying he will be but still)Caddy is that game changing beast of a back(or he almost is). Earnest was one of the best RB's in the game over the stretch of the year(very close to top 5). Firstly, i think it is very dumb to put Stewart in AD's class as an RB. Seconldy as i said we have other holes to fill before spending first rounders on luxuries such as stewart

etk
01-13-2008, 10:48 PM
Why do we want a QB who's played two career games at Raymond James, and been blown out both times? :P

I'm starting to agree with etk and am hopping on the Daniel bandwagon. If Grothe stops being such a horrible decision maker we should draft him, though.
LOL. I like Brohm as a prospect, but he's not a perfect system fit. None of his throws or reads really translate to our offense, so he might just be Chris Simms part deux.

Daniel is probably the driving force for me hatred towards drafting a QB this year. Everything about him screams WCO stud and Gruden loverboy. He's like a billionaire's Gradkowski. He's a great leader and has Matt Ryan-esque pocket presence. He makes NFL-quality reads and makes good decisions within an appropriate time frame. He's been playing at a high level his whole football career, starting at Southlake Carrol (I think). Like Paul Smith & Nate Davis, he can throw a nice fastball, especially to the outside, but unlike Paul Smith, he can actually put touch on the ball. He's not incredibly fast but he moves around well and has decent burst. Next year I'm gonna pay closer attention to his deep ball, because that is the main weakness of Garcia and McCown ATM.

Grothe isn't as sure of a prospect as a Daniel is. He's a project as a passer and he has one more year of eligibility than Daniel, which would mean further risk to our QB future.

Caddy
01-13-2008, 10:52 PM
I agree with Chucky on the whole Jonathan Stewart thing. Sure he would be nice, but I would take the best possible player at any position of relative need over a luxury like Stewart.

etk
01-13-2008, 10:55 PM
I agree with Chucky on the whole Jonathan Stewart thing. Sure he would be nice, but I would take the best possible player at any position of relative need over a luxury like Stewart.

So do you think Adrian Peterson was a luxury for the Minnesota Vikings last year? Stewart would be the steal of the century if we got him at pick 20, plus none of our needs are really that pressing. There are plenty of WRs and CBs available in Rounds 2-3, and our other needs aren't immediate just yet.

Caddy
01-13-2008, 10:59 PM
So do you think Adrian Peterson was a luxury for the Minnesota Vikings last year? Stewart would be the steal of the century if we got him at pick 20, plus none of our needs are really that pressing. There are plenty of WRs and CBs available in Rounds 2-3, and our other needs aren't immediate just yet.

Stewart to the Bucs would be more of a luxury than Peterson to the Vikings. We have 2 established running backs in Caddy and Graham whilst the Vikings only had one established back in Chester Taylor. Unless somehow one of either Graham or Caddy were removed from the roster, I think the chances of drafting a RB in Round 1 are slim to none.

etk
01-13-2008, 11:03 PM
Stewart to the Bucs would be more of a luxury than Peterson to the Vikings. We have 2 established running backs in Caddy and Graham whilst the Vikings only had one established back in Chester Taylor. Unless somehow one of either Graham or Caddy were removed from the roster, I think the chances of drafting a RB in Round 1 are slim to none.

Chester Taylor has a higher salary than either of our backs. I can see us drafting Stewart and trading Caddy for a 2nd-3rd round pick.

Caddy
01-13-2008, 11:33 PM
Chester Taylor has a higher salary than either of our backs. I can see us drafting Stewart and trading Caddy for a 2nd-3rd round pick.

That is true now, but if Graham gets the contract extension he is demanding then that changes the whole situation. If the Buccaneers determine that they don't want to extend his contract, the possibility of bringing in Stewart is possible, although I'd still be hesitant due to the presence of Caddy. I think with top 5 draft pick money invested in Caddy and the potential increased salary of Graham, taking Stewart is too big of a luxury.

etk
01-14-2008, 12:29 PM
Look, we're obviously not gonna draft Stewart, but we should if he's available. He's the kind of athlete you don't wanna pass up, because you will regret it.

Caddy
01-14-2008, 07:02 PM
As a Buc fan you should be used to passing up studs anyway. AKA Steven Jackson for Michael Clayton...

etk
01-14-2008, 07:15 PM
As a Buc fan you should be used to passing up studs anyway. AKA Steven Jackson for Michael Clayton...

I actually really like Clayton. I REALLY wanted Tommie Harris, but he went just before us. I wanted Jackson, Wilfork or DJ Williams (not sure if he was actually available). I was so pissed when we took Clayton, but I've always liked him since he stepped on the field. I blame Gruden for not involving him in our offense enough, but I like Stovall even more and he gets no PT.

Caddy
01-14-2008, 08:18 PM
I actually really like Clayton. I REALLY wanted Tommie Harris, but he went just before us. I wanted Jackson, Wilfork or DJ Williams (not sure if he was actually available). I was so pissed when we took Clayton, but I've always liked him since he stepped on the field. I blame Gruden for not involving him in our offense enough, but I like Stovall even more and he gets no PT.

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Clayton. He brings an intensity to the field that not a lot of receivers in the NFL bring and I think if he just got the ball more he might be able to make a bigger impact. Plus he is a great open field blocker, just ask Kevin Kaesviharn. It's just that Steven Jackson is a whole lot better than Clayton and RB was a potential need during that draft.

etk
01-14-2008, 09:03 PM
I just said I wanted Jackson at the time, but I don't regret us taking Clayton or hold it against Gruden. We have made much worse picks in his tenure.

Caddy
01-14-2008, 10:17 PM
List of players and coaches unsigned for the 08 season.

Unrestricted Free Agents
FB Mike Alstott
TE Anthony Becht
RB Michael Bennett
CB Sammy Davis
TE Keith Heinrich
WR Mark Jones
C Matt Lehr
RB Michael Pittman
TE Jerramy Stevens
LB Jeremiah Trotter
C John Wade

Restricted Free Agents
LB Antoine Cash
DT Jovan Haye
SS Kalvin Pearson

Exclusive Rights Free Agents
LS Andrew Economos
LT Donald Penn
WR Micheal Spurlock
FB Byron Storer
WR Paris Warren
DE Greg White

Coaching Moves
Defensive Coordinator Monte Kiffin - UNSIGNED
Quarterbacks Coach Paul Hackett - UNSIGNED
Senior Asst./Offensive Line Aaron Kromer - UNSIGNED
Asst. Defensive Backs Coach Jimmy Lake - UNSIGNED
Asst. Head Coach/Running Backs Coach Art Valero - LEFT/ST. LOUIS
Offensive Coordinator/Offensive Line Coach Bill Muir - SIGNED
Special Teams Coordinator Richard Bisaccia - SIGNED
Wide Receives Coach Richard Mann - SIGNED

http://www.pewterreport.com/articles/view/3832

etk
01-15-2008, 10:48 AM
List of players and coaches unsigned for the 08 season.

Unrestricted Free Agents
FB Mike Alstott
TE Anthony Becht
RB Michael Bennett
CB Sammy Davis
TE Keith Heinrich
WR Mark Jones
C Matt Lehr
RB Michael Pittman
TE Jerramy Stevens
LB Jeremiah Trotter
C John Wade

Restricted Free Agents
LB Antoine Cash
DT Jovan Haye
SS Kalvin Pearson

Exclusive Rights Free Agents
LS Andrew Economos
LT Donald Penn
WR Micheal Spurlock
FB Byron Storer
WR Paris Warren
DE Greg White

Coaching Moves
Defensive Coordinator Monte Kiffin - UNSIGNED
Quarterbacks Coach Paul Hackett - UNSIGNED
Senior Asst./Offensive Line Aaron Kromer - UNSIGNED
Asst. Defensive Backs Coach Jimmy Lake - UNSIGNED
Asst. Head Coach/Running Backs Coach Art Valero - LEFT/ST. LOUIS
Offensive Coordinator/Offensive Line Coach Bill Muir - SIGNED
Special Teams Coordinator Richard Bisaccia - SIGNED
Wide Receives Coach Richard Mann - SIGNED

http://www.pewterreport.com/articles/view/3832

Bolded players should be re-signed.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-15-2008, 12:01 PM
Bolded players should be re-signed.

...no Paris Warren?

etk
01-15-2008, 12:49 PM
...no Paris Warren?

Never was a big fan of his. I'd rather go after this loaded WR class and possibly look at deep threats in FA.

Caddy
01-15-2008, 03:00 PM
I also think we should bring back Kalvin Pearson, purely for special teams impact.

etk
01-15-2008, 08:33 PM
I also think we should bring back Kalvin Pearson, purely for special teams impact.

I've seen Pearson a few times in serious action...he gets run over in run support and abused in coverage. I know Coach Bisaccia must love him but we need at least 1 reliable backup at safety. Allen is horrible (S and ST), Pearson is nothing but a STer, and Piscitelli is nothing but a future HOF film scout. The only way we can keep Pearson is if we cut Allen.

Caddy
01-15-2008, 10:33 PM
The Buccaneers have had 5 safeties on the roster a fair bit during the course of the season and Pearson has a great impact in that regard. I think he definitely deserves a run in training camp purely for that.

dbtb135
01-16-2008, 11:11 PM
Coaching Moves
Defensive Coordinator Monte Kiffin - UNSIGNED
Senior Asst./Offensive Line Aaron Kromer - UNSIGNED

Offensive Coordinator/Offensive Line Coach Bill Muir - SIGNED
Special Teams Coordinator Richard Bisaccia - SIGNED
Wide Receives Coach Richard Mann - SIGNED

I'm going to be honest, that really sucks. Our best coach, and one of our better assistants unsigned. But our 3 worst are all accounted for. Priorities....

Chucky
01-19-2008, 07:40 PM
What do u guys think of Josh Johnson, Do you think he would be a good fit for the WCO. After watching the shrine game, I would much prefer him over someone like grads as our 3rd QB.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-19-2008, 07:41 PM
What do u guys think of Josh Johnson, Do you think he would be a good fit for the WCO. After watching the shrine game, I would much prefer him over someone like grads as our 3rd QB.

He played in the WCO. I would love him in the 3rd.

Chucky
01-19-2008, 07:43 PM
He played in the WCO. I would love him in the 3rd.

Right now that seems like a little early for him, but I could see him climing that high by draft day. I was gonna say i would want him in the 4th.

yuccaneers
01-20-2008, 12:29 PM
Josh Johnson in the third round would be a perfect fit in Grudens version of the west coast offense, he has great command, vision and football IQ, to go along with good accuracy. He has the "IT" factor that you are born with.

yuccaneers
01-20-2008, 12:43 PM
My thoughts on how the draft and free agency should play out.

With the team need to greatly improve the redzone defense and offense.
Free agent players that the team would be wise to take a look at.

DT Corey Williams - Williams is a player on the rise and has been a force in the middle the last few season. Has quick first step and is a disruptive player.

DE Antwan Odom - After getting a chance to start this season came up pick both playing the run and getting pressure ended the season with 8 sacks

C Jeff Faine - with Wade a free agent it is time the team look to seriously upgrade the center position, even with Buenning making the transition to center no sure bet he can do it.

RB - Mewelde Moore a Michael Pittman clone that can help in the return game, young version

WR Benard Berrian - Galloway is not getting younger

Draft
1. RB Rashard Mendenhall
2. TE Martin Rucker
3. QB Josh Johnson
4. CB Trae Williams
5. C Mike Pollak
6. ILB Ben Moffitt
7. T Sean Sester

etk
01-20-2008, 01:35 PM
Josh Johnson won't last past the 2nd round. He's a rich man's Tarvaris Jackson as a prospect and I absolutely love him. Now I have 3 quarterbacks that I'd be happy to see us draft (Johnson, Brennan, P. Smith). Of course toonster was spot on with his knowledge of Johnson.

I like the FA signings right there, yuccaneers. I like Mendenhall, but I prefer Stewart if he's available. I don't think we will draft a TE this year and I'm not a big fan of the Rucker pick. Alex Smith is stil our guy, Becht is our blocker and Stevens is a solid weapon as we saw late in the season. We will probably sign a UDFA to compete as per usual. The rest of the picks are solid...I don't know much about Sester though. There are 2 huge problems with that offseason...we don't address WR & LDE, arguably our 2 biggest needs.

yuccaneers
01-20-2008, 01:39 PM
Odom at 6'4 280 would address the LDE and Berrian address the WR spot, the reason for Rucker is that Both Becht and Stevens are free agents while the team can find a blocking TE, Stevens is going to be looking for a starting spot. and as you have stated Smith is still the guy

Chucky
01-20-2008, 02:23 PM
Corey Williams is number 1 on my realistic FA Big Board. I think he would fit great and is what we need. i personally am not a fan of RB in the first, i would reather pick up Brohm over a RB

Tampa 2 4 life
01-20-2008, 02:24 PM
Odom at 6'4 280 would address the LDE and Berrian address the WR spot, the reason for Rucker is that Both Becht and Stevens are free agents while the team can find a blocking TE, Stevens is going to be looking for a starting spot. and as you have stated Smith is still the guy

I would say Berrian comes in below Galloway, Hilliard, and Stovall...

etk
01-20-2008, 02:29 PM
Corey Williams is number 1 on my realistic FA Big Board. I think he would fit great and is what we need. i personally am not a fan of RB in the first, i would reather pick up Brohm over a RB

Dude...what's your man crush on Brohm? Did you watch the Shrine game or not? Johnson is a much better fit for our offense, and would be available later in the draft. Then we could go with the best value...Stewart, Campbell, Mendenhall, etc.

Chucky
01-20-2008, 02:46 PM
Dude...what's your man crush on Brohm? Did you watch the Shrine game or not? Johnson is a much better fit for our offense, and would be available later in the draft. Then we could go with the best value...Stewart, Campbell, Mendenhall, etc.

I did watch it, but i think it will ake 2-3 years to develop someone like johnson, and I dont think we have time to do that. I also dont think a RB makes sense for us i nthe first round. I would be happy with Campbell though.

etk
01-20-2008, 03:53 PM
I did watch it, but i think it will ake 2-3 years to develop someone like johnson, and I dont think we have time to do that. I also dont think a RB makes sense for us i nthe first round. I would be happy with Campbell though.

It will take 2-3 years to develop ANYONE (rookies) for our system. Johnson has a strong arm, he's accurate, he can throw hard or put touch on the ball, he makes great decisions, he's experienced in a WCO with good coaching, he moves around well in the pocket and has great footwork, he's fast and a good scrambler nonetheless. Best of all, we could get him in the 2nd round or maybe later.

Brohm will probably take longer to develop as he has less physical tools and experience in a similar offense. He will cost us a first rounder, and who knows if he will even fall to us. I think it's a no-brainer decision for our coaches to make if they want a QB.

We will have to sign a vet short-term when Jeff retires. We will still have McCown as a stop-gap solution until we can develop a guy like Johnson or Chase Daniel, and I think he's good enough for us to compete (no SB though).

Caddy
01-20-2008, 04:48 PM
When all is said and done I think Gruden's stubborn nature will win out and we'll stick with Garcia, McCown, Gradkoski and Simms.

etk
01-20-2008, 05:28 PM
When all is said and done I think Gruden's stubborn nature will win out and we'll stick with Garcia, McCown, Gradkoski and Simms.

I agree, but at this point I have to say that would be an unfortunate mistake. Josh Johnson is the real deal and he would be great value in the 2nd and on, as would Colt Brennan. If we stick with our current rotation, we will continue floating around mediocrity unless McCown really steps his game up. We could wait until next year to draft Chase Daniel or someone else, but then we would be prolonging the development of our future QB. Johnson appears to be our best bet for the long term. I'd like to see us pull an Eagle, close our eyes and snag him, like Philly did with Kevin Kolb.

Caddy
01-20-2008, 07:19 PM
For a 9-7 team we have so many needs it's ridiculous. As far as Johnson goes I agree that he is probably the most suited QB to Gruden's offense in the upcoming draft. At the moment you could quite easily make a case for the Buccaneers to draft a OT, QB, RB, WR, DE, DT and CB in the first 3 rounds which should lead to an exciting draft.

Chucky
01-20-2008, 07:24 PM
For a 9-7 team we have so many needs it's ridiculous. As far as Johnson goes I agree that he is probably the most suited QB to Gruden's offense in the upcoming draft. At the moment you could quite easily make a case for the Buccaneers to draft a OT, QB, RB, WR, DE, DT and CB in the first 3 rounds which should lead to an exciting draft.

I think CB and WR are without a doubt our two top needs.

Then it goes DE and DT. We would just pick for the best value.

followed by OT and then RB.

I have kind of cooled on the thought of drafting an OT in this draft.

etk
01-20-2008, 07:27 PM
I think CB and WR are without a doubt our two top needs.

Then it goes DE and DT. We would just pick for the best value.

followed by OT and then RB.

I have kind of cooled on the thought of drafting an OT in this draft.

I'm not really a big fan of the OTs in this draft. I liked Oher and Loadholt but they returned (OT 09!!!). I think waiting another year gives us more time to evaluate Penn anyway.

Chucky
01-20-2008, 07:28 PM
I'm not really a big fan of the OTs in this draft. I liked Oher and Loadholt but they returned (OT 09!!!). I think waiting another year gives us more time to evaluate Penn anyway.

I agree not to mention that hopefully Petigout can contribute something next year.

etk
01-20-2008, 07:31 PM
I agree not to mention that hopefully Petigout can contribute something next year.

He will be our Day One starter if he's healthy.

Chucky
01-20-2008, 07:31 PM
He will be our Day One starter if he's healthy.

This is weird though, we actually agree on something. Lets cherish the moment

etk
01-20-2008, 07:32 PM
This is weird though, we actually agree on something. Lets cherish the moment

Good. Now just erase the words Woodson and Brohm from your vocabulary.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-20-2008, 07:32 PM
I think we should disguise George Selvie as another player and draft him...

Chucky
01-20-2008, 07:33 PM
Good. Now just erase the words Woodson and Brohm from your vocabulary.

Im actually not a Woodsen fan, but at the time of the forum mock he was a top 10 pick, and getting a top 10 pick fall to you at a position of marginal need, was an opportunity that could not be passed up.

etk
01-20-2008, 07:35 PM
Im actually not a Woodsen fan, but at the time of the forum mock he was a top 10 pick, and getting a top 10 pick fall to you at a position of marginal need, was an opportunity that could not be passed up.

Value is different for every team. That's why each time has different big boards. For the Bucs, Woodson is about a 6th round developmental prospect.

I think we should stuff George Selvie with styrofoam and draft him as our LDE.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-20-2008, 07:38 PM
I think we should stuff George Selvie with styrofoam and draft him as our LDE.

He could easily add another 40 pounds to his frame...

etk
01-20-2008, 07:41 PM
He could easily add another 40 pounds to his frame...

In 3 months. And sue the NFL to let him in after the deadline.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-20-2008, 07:43 PM
In 3 months. And sue the NFL to let him in after the deadline.

He can do it! He has the team's beginning of conditioning date circled on his calendar!

SpinaMan
01-21-2008, 12:55 AM
http://www.sptimes.com/2008/01/20/Bucs/Draft_s_RB_depth_migh.shtml


Which back would you like to draft in the 1st 3 rounds? I'm anxious to see your thoughts.

yuccaneers
01-21-2008, 10:38 AM
The only players that I would draft in the first three rounds as far as RB back is concerned are Mendenhall, Stewart, Johnson, Smith

Tampa 2 4 life
01-21-2008, 10:55 AM
A Combo of Chris Johnson and Earnest Graham could be potentially beastly.

etk
01-21-2008, 12:15 PM
We're not gonna draft a Chris Johnson type if we bring back Bennett, which I think we should. The only back I want in the 1st 3 rounds is Jonathan Stewart, if Calais Campbell is unavailable.

Canadian_kid16
01-21-2008, 02:33 PM
I tinhk with the amount of RB's in this years draft...we should take one in the fifth round or later...As shown this year, its always good to have three or four capable backs, and I really don't like Pittman on our team

etk
01-21-2008, 06:20 PM
I tinhk with the amount of RB's in this years draft...we should take one in the fifth round or later...As shown this year, its always good to have three or four capable backs, and I really don't like Pittman on our team

Agree on everything...

Pittman is a nice vet to have in the locker room, but it's time to go. He provides very little on offense and isn't much of a special teamer.

When I do my write-up after the Senior Bowl I'll explain why Jacob Hester would be a great addition to our team. He's really the only back in the draft that provides a new dimension to our offense and team.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-26-2008, 08:23 PM
Post Senior Bowl Buc-Mock:
1. Calais Campbell
2. Patrick Lee
3. Donnie Avery
4. Jason Jones
5. Kory Lichtensteiger

etk
01-27-2008, 04:55 PM
Post Senior Bowl Buc-Mock:
1. Calais Campbell
2. Patrick Lee
3. Donnie Avery
4. Jason Jones
5. Kory Lichtensteiger

That would be an outstanding draft, wow. All those picks are As in my book, with Lee being the only B. We don't really need 2 DEs, but I love both Campbell & Jones. If we could get Jones in Round 4, I wouldn't hesitate to draft Trevor Laws in the first. That would fill all of our needs very nicely.

Caddy
01-27-2008, 05:14 PM
Do you really think that highly of Laws etk? I think he is a good prospect and he really anchored that ND D-Line, but I would be extremely hesitant to take him in the first round.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-27-2008, 05:20 PM
That would be an outstanding draft, wow. All those picks are As in my book, with Lee being the only B. We don't really need 2 DEs, but I love both Campbell & Jones. If we could get Jones in Round 4, I wouldn't hesitate to draft Trevor Laws in the first. That would fill all of our needs very nicely.

Jason Jones seems more likely to fall to after the Senior Bowl, He looks more like a UT now than a LE because he didn't look very agile, and I think with work he could be a very good UT.

Caddy
01-27-2008, 05:40 PM
Jason Jones seems more likely to fall to after the Senior Bowl, He looks more like a UT now than a LE because he didn't look very agile, and I think with work he could be a very good UT.

With Greg Peterson as our project defensive tackle what would be the point of bringing in a second project?

Tampa 2 4 life
01-27-2008, 05:42 PM
With Greg Peterson as our project defensive tackle what would be the point of bringing in a second project?

Why not take a 4th rounder and put him in our rotation?

Caddy
01-27-2008, 05:43 PM
Why not take a 4th rounder and put him in our rotation?

So the justification is that it's 'only a fourth rounder so it doesn't really matter anyway"? I can understand wanting to bring in a defensive tackle, but I can't justify bringing in another ex-DE to make the transition to under tackle in the pro's.

Tampa 2 4 life
01-27-2008, 05:55 PM
So the justification is that it's 'only a fourth rounder so it doesn't really matter anyway"? I can understand wanting to bring in a defensive tackle, but I can't justify bringing in another ex-DE to make the transition to under tackle in the pro's.

No, I meant that while UT isn't a 1st day need, we could use another one to add to the rotation.

etk
01-27-2008, 11:02 PM
Do you really think that highly of Laws etk? I think he is a good prospect and he really anchored that ND D-Line, but I would be extremely hesitant to take him in the first round.

The only thing stopping Laws from being a top 15 pick right now is him getting a lack of national attention up until now. I'd like to see any draft analyst tell me what makes Glenn Dorsey better than Laws. I think you're falling for draft rankings too much right now, instead of looking at the production/skills ratio. Laws is easily a first-round talent, especially in a draft that's weak at the top. What he's done from the DT position is mind-boggling and jaw-dropping.

Jason Jones seems more likely to fall to after the Senior Bowl, He looks more like a UT now than a LE because he didn't look very agile, and I think with work he could be a very good UT.

Now that I think about it....Jones and Peterson are very similar players in that regard. I think Jones is more of a DE than Peterson is. Jones has nice power moves on the outside and he's more athletic than you give him credit for. He was being tried at OLB after all.

With Greg Peterson as our project defensive tackle what would be the point of bringing in a second project?

One could be an oversized end (Carter), and the other could remain a project. We need more defensive linemen, so any talented prospects would be appreciated, but I agree that it's not the most logical move.

etk
01-27-2008, 11:05 PM
Do you really think that highly of Laws etk? I think he is a good prospect and he really anchored that ND D-Line, but I would be extremely hesitant to take him in the first round.

The only thing stopping Laws from being a top 15 pick right now is him getting a lack of national attention up until now. I'd like to see any draft analyst tell me what makes Glenn Dorsey better than Laws. I think you're falling for draft rankings too much right now, instead of looking at the production/skills ratio. Laws is easily a first-round talent, especially in a draft that's weak at the top. What he's done from the DT position is mind-boggling and jaw-dropping.

Jason Jones seems more likely to fall to after the Senior Bowl, He looks more like a UT now than a LE because he didn't look very agile, and I think with work he could be a very good UT.

Now that I think about it....Jones and Peterson are very similar players in that regard. I think Jones is more of a DE than Peterson is. Jones has nice power moves on the outside and he's more athletic than you give him credit for. He was being tried at OLB after all, where he looked like a capable SLB project in a 3-4.

With Greg Peterson as our project defensive tackle what would be the point of bringing in a second project?

One could be an oversized end (Carter), and the other could remain a project. We need more defensive linemen, so any talented prospects would be appreciated, but I agree that it's not the most logical move.

Caddy
01-28-2008, 01:29 AM
The only thing stopping Laws from being a top 15 pick right now is him getting a lack of national attention up until now. I'd like to see any draft analyst tell me what makes Glenn Dorsey better than Laws. I think you're falling for draft rankings too much right now, instead of looking at the production/skills ratio. Laws is easily a first-round talent, especially in a draft that's weak at the top. What he's done from the DT position is mind-boggling and jaw-dropping.


I don't think I'm falling for the rankings. For the last month or so I've had Laws ranked aroung the 3-7 position which is a lot higher than some rankings including Scott's which has had him outside the top 10. I think he is a very good fit for the style of defense that we will be running for the short/medium term but I wonder about his effectiveness in other defensive schemes which may prevent him from reaching round 1 of the draft. I'd definitely like to see him at the combine before I consider him as a potential first round Buccaneer selection.

I think he would be a nice addition to our rotation, but would definitely rather have him in the 2nd instead of the 1st.

I could however see him making a John McCargo type leap up draft boards and being taken a little earlier than predicted because a team fell in love with him.

BaLLiN
02-11-2008, 10:47 AM
Godfrey, King, or Doucet?

etk
02-11-2008, 02:06 PM
Godfrey, King, or Doucet?

Not sure what the criteria is....but Godfrey easily.

etk
02-15-2008, 10:36 PM
http://www.sportsnetwork.com/default.asp?c=sportsnetwork&page=/nfl/news/ABN4130951.htm

Michael Bennett resigned to a multi year deal.

No Steve Slaton!

Tampa 2 4 life
02-15-2008, 10:37 PM
http://www.sportsnetwork.com/default.asp?c=sportsnetwork&page=/nfl/news/ABN4130951.htm

Michael Bennett resigned to a multi year deal.

No Steve Slaton!

Good. No Felix Jones either(Kiper has us taking him.)

etk
02-15-2008, 10:41 PM
I`m not a fan of Jones either, but at least he`s a good receiver and has nice cuts with decent size. I`m all about Tashard Choice.

Tampa 2 4 life
02-15-2008, 10:42 PM
I`m not a fan of Jones either, but at least he`s a good receiver and has nice cuts with decent size. I`m all about Tashard Choice.

If Rice runs that reported 4.38....

etk
02-15-2008, 10:44 PM
If Rice runs that reported 4.38....

I don`t like Ray Rice...at all. He`s a poor man`s Graham. I`ve probably had at least 10 posts explaining why Rice is not a good prospect.

I`m not buying the 4.38 at all btw. I can`t see him going anywhere under 4.6. Ball State caught him from behind EASILY in the Int`l bowl.

Tampa 2 4 life
02-15-2008, 10:48 PM
I don`t like Ray Rice...at all. He`s a poor man`s Graham. I`ve probably had at least 10 posts explaining why Rice is not a good prospect.

I`m not buying the 4.38 at all btw. I can`t see him going anywhere under 4.6. Ball State caught him from behind EASILY in the Int`l bowl.

Can I say I don't buy a 4.3 for J-Stew because Jenkins caught him from behind with stewart getting an 8 yard headstart? :P

etk
02-15-2008, 10:51 PM
Can I say I don't buy a 4.3 for J-Stew because Jenkins caught him from behind with stewart getting an 8 yard headstart? :P

I don`t either. I think Stewart is a 4.4 guy, but that`s fine for him.

And the USF game was a showcase for his burst so whatever.

Tampa 2 4 life
02-15-2008, 10:57 PM
I don`t either. I think Stewart is a 4.4 guy, but that`s fine for him.

And the USF game was a showcase for his burst so whatever.

It was. It was also a showcase of why you should carry more than 4 LBers on your roster. :(

Caddy
02-15-2008, 11:56 PM
http://www.sportsnetwork.com/default.asp?c=sportsnetwork&page=/nfl/news/ABN4130951.htm

Michael Bennett resigned to a multi year deal.

No Steve Slaton!

Good signing. Can't complain with that at all. He showed some flashes during the season and in limited action can have a small impact on the teams success.

Chucky
02-16-2008, 10:45 AM
Im very happy with the signing, we couldnt use him much last year because he was unable to learn the playbook in such a short amount of time, but with a whole offseason, he should be able to grasp it. I guess this means pittman is more likely gone though

Tampa 2 4 life
02-16-2008, 08:58 PM
Im very happy with the signing, we couldnt use him much last year because he was unable to learn the playbook in such a short amount of time, but with a whole offseason, he should be able to grasp it. I guess this means pittman is more likely gone though

He said he was going to test free Agency.

etk
02-17-2008, 05:00 PM
Im very happy with the signing, we couldnt use him much last year because he was unable to learn the playbook in such a short amount of time, but with a whole offseason, he should be able to grasp it. I guess this means pittman is more likely gone though

Yes, that`s the general consensus among Bucs fans. To go a little bit deeper, I think our coaches struggled to find him touches because they didn`t have time to script plays to suit his skills. In that sense, it was more the fault of our coaches than Bennett. He will be a nice weapon after a full offseason and our coaches really wanted him back, which is a good sign. Unlike most Bucs fans I`m excited for what the RB position has to offer for us next year, especially with a draft pick on board. Maybe we can give Caddy a new test drive late in the season, hopefully with the playoffs clinched.

Tampa 2 4 life
02-18-2008, 11:40 AM
BUCS INTERESTED IN DISCARDED FALCONS

Our friends at PewterReport report that the Tampa Bay Buccaneers likely will be interested in Falcons defensive tackle Rod Coleman and tight end Alge Crumpler, once they are released.

Though the Falcons announced on Friday that Coleman, Crumpler, and others will be cut, the moves have not yet been announced by the league.

Two of Tampa's tight ends -- Anthony Becht and Jerramy Stevens -- are due to become unrestricted free agents on February 29.

Interesting...

Chucky
02-18-2008, 01:46 PM
Interesting...

I like both of those moves, as long as they dont cost too much.

etk
02-18-2008, 05:50 PM
Rod Coleman=too small to play NT, downgrade over Haye.
Crumpler=never been a fan, he's not gonna start over Smith, and he won't take away minutes from Becht because he can't block. His hands also suck. I'd much rather keep Becht & Stevens or draft Kellen Davis or Brad Cottam, etc.

I hate when sites stir up fake rumors like that...like those sites claiming we're gonna go after Culpepper. None of the moves ever make sense nor do they actually happen.

Caddy
02-18-2008, 11:29 PM
Rod Coleman=too small to play NT, downgrade over Haye.
Crumpler=never been a fan, he's not gonna start over Smith, and he won't take away minutes from Becht because he can't block. His hands also suck. I'd much rather keep Becht & Stevens or draft Kellen Davis or Brad Cottam, etc.

I hate when sites stir up fake rumors like that...like those sites claiming we're gonna go after Culpepper. None of the moves ever make sense nor do they actually happen.

Rod Coleman is a very hot/cold player in my opinion and a lot of that has to do with his level of health and/or fitness. When he gets his motor going and is injury free I think he an above average starter at the defensive tackle position and slightly ahead of Haye this stage in Haye's career.

I agree in part with the Crumpler thing. If the Buccaneers still see Alex Smith as the #1 tight end, Crumpler is not going to have an impact because of his blocking skills.

Tampa 2 4 life
02-19-2008, 01:46 PM
We signed Paris Warren to a 1 year, 510k deal.

Caddy
02-19-2008, 09:01 PM
We signed Paris Warren to a 1 year, 510k deal.

Great signing. I loved the kid last year and he was one of my favourite "under dog" guys in TC and Pre-Season. We need to see what he can do and this deal will let us do exactly that.

Caddy
02-19-2008, 10:43 PM
Interesting read about the Bucs interest in Rod Coleman and to a lesser extent, Crumpler.

http://blogs.tampabay.com/bucs/2008/02/bucs-to-contact.html

etk
02-20-2008, 01:54 PM
Depth can't hurt, and we have the cap room to sign Coleman. Just don't expect him to start.

Caddy
02-21-2008, 06:46 PM
Javon Walker; a Buc?

http://blogs.tampabay.com/bucs/2008/02/bucs-talk-trade.html

For a day 2 pick, ie round 4 and later I think it is an awfully tempting move.