PDA

View Full Version : All AFC-North Team


Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 05:37 PM
I saw the AFC East and figured we should get in on the fun.

Offense: 25 Players
QB: Carson Palmer -> Ben Roethlisberger
RB: Willie Parker -> Rudi Johnson
FB: Dan Kreider -> Le'Ron McClain

WR1: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR2: Hines Ward -> Santonio Holmes
WR3: Mark Clayton -> TJ Houshmanzadeh

TE: Todd Heap -> Kellen Winslow -> Heath Miller

LT: Jon Ogden -> Levi Jones
LG: Alan Faneca -> Eric Steinbach
C: LeCharles Bentley -> Eric Ghuiciac
RG: Kendall Simmons -> Ben Grubbs
RT: Willie Anderson -> Adam Terry



Defense: 3-4... 25 Total

LDE: Aaron Smith -> Haloti Ngata
NT: Casey Hampton -> Kelly Gregg
RDE: Trevor Pryce -> Brett Keisel

Utility DL: Justin Smith (Backup both All 3 positions)

ROLB: Terell Suggs -> Kamerion Wimbley
RILB: Bart Scott -> Larry Foote
LILB: Ray Lewis -> James Farrior
LOLB: LaMarr Woodley -> Antwan Barnes (Really no vets in this division)

Utility Backup LB: James Harrison (Perhaps I'll be considered a homer but he would be #3 backup for all LB positions)

CB: Chris McCallister -> Jonathan Joseph
CB: Ike Taylor -> Leigh Bodden
FS: Ed Reed -> Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Sean Jones

Utility DB: DeShea Townsend (CB/S Tweener)

Special Teams: 3

LS: Brad St. Louis
P: Daniel Sepulveda
K: Matt Stover

Coaches:

Head Coach: Brian Billick (Though I prefer a Defensive minded HC... Tomlin is too new, Marvin has no control of his team and Romeo hasn't proved anything in Cleveland yet.)
Defensive Coordinators: Rex Ryan and Dick LeBeau (Find me a better duo of defensive masterminds)
Offensive Coordinator: Bob Bratkowski


Just a couple Homer Comments....

1) Holmes could be in the top 2-3 WR's in this division this season..
2) Arians could prove to be a great coordinator.. our offense is looking good thus far (I Know it's just preseason, but we should've been running this offense as soon as we started Willie Parker)
3) Anthony Smith Might beat out Madieu Williams this or next season behind Ed Reed.


as for the picks. I think I did very well. I wasn't homerly Biased. I made every effort to field the best team for the division.

One change I would make would be to start James Farrior over Bart Scott.. but Scott is the RILB and Farrior is a LILB, which is why he's behind Ray.

I don't like starting Kendall Simmons on this list.. he's a great run blocker but a joke of a pass blocker.. just Grubbs isn't more proven.. and there really wasn't another RG that stuck out from Cincy or Cleveland.



Players Per Team Breakdown:

Baltimore: 17 players + HC and Co-DC
Cincinnati: 10 players + OC
Cleveland: 6 players
Pittsburgh: 19 Players+ Co-DC

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 05:46 PM
I saw the AFC East and figured we should get in on the fun.

Offense: 25 Players
WR1: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR2: Hines Ward -> Santonio Holmes
WR3: Derrick Mason -> TJ Houshmanzadeh

TE: Todd Heap -> Kellen Winslow -> Heath Miller

LT: Jon Ogden -> Levi Jones
LG: Alan Faneca -> Eric Steinbach
C: LeCharles Bentley -> Eric Ghuiciac
RG: Kendall Simmons -> Ben Grubbs
RT: Willie Anderson -> Adam Terry



Defense: 3-4... 25 Total

LDE: Aaron Smith -> Justin Smith
NT: Casey Hampton -> Kelly Gregg
RDE: Haloti Ngata -> Brett Keisel

Utility DL: Trevor Pryce (Backup both DE positions)

ROLB: Terell Suggs -> Kamerion Wimbley
RILB: Bart Scott -> Larry Foote
LILB: Ray Lewis -> James Farrior
LOLB: LaMarr Woodley -> Antwan Barnes (Really no vets in this division)

Utility Backup LB: James Harrison (Perhaps I'll be considered a homer but he would be #3 backup for all LB positions)

CB: Chris McCallister -> Jonathan Joseph
CB: Ike Taylor -> Leigh Bodden
FS: Ed Reed -> Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Sean Jones

Utility DB: DeShea Townsend (CB/S Tweener)

Special Teams: 3

LS: Brad St. Louis
P: Daniel Sepulveda
K: Matt Stover

Coaches:

Head Coach: Brian Billick (Though I prefer a Defensive minded HC... Tomlin is too new, Marvin has no control of his team and Romeo hasn't proved anything in Cleveland yet.)
Defensive Coordinators: Rex Ryan and Dick LeBeau (Find me a better duo of defensive masterminds)
Offensive Coordinator: Bob Bratkowski


Just a couple Homer Comments....

1) Holmes could be in the top 2-3 WR's in this division this season..
2) Arians could prove to be a great coordinator.. our offense is looking good thus far (I Know it's just preseason, but we should've been running this offense as soon as we started Willie Parker)
3) Anthony Smith Might beat out Madieu Williams this or next season behind Ed Reed.


as for the picks. I think I did very well. I wasn't homerly Biased. I made every effort to field the best team for the division.

One change I would make would be to start James Farrior over Bart Scott.. but Scott is the RILB and Farrior is a LILB, which is why he's behind Ray.

I don't like starting Kendall Simmons on this list.. he's a great run blocker but a joke of a pass blocker.. just Grubbs isn't more proven.. and there really wasn't another RG that stuck out from Cincy or Cleveland.


You miserably failed at your attempt to not be a homer. And the sheer fact that you put Bentley on this list makes it totally null and void.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:01 PM
You miserably failed at your attempt to not be a homer. And the sheer fact that you put Bentley on this list makes it totally null and void.

Holmes Played Great.. nearly a 1000 yards in a reserve role minus 4 starts.

Bentley, when healthy is a great C.

Ike Taylor is IMO the 2nd best Corner in the AFCN.

only 4 of the 7 people you bolded are Steelers.

Sepulveda is going to be a damn good punter. Brad St. Louis is Cincy's LS.

Ghuiciac is also Cincy's C.

neko4
08-17-2007, 06:03 PM
You miserably failed at your attempt to not be a homer. And the sheer fact that you put Bentley on this list makes it totally null and void.

Bently could comeback this year

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:04 PM
Bently could comeback this year

In your Opinion does it look like I was overly Homeristic?

DeShea is an older vet, but he would be a solid #5/6 CB and #3 S backup in the division of this team.

neko4
08-17-2007, 06:05 PM
In your Opinion does it look like I was overly Homeristic?

DeShea is an older vet, but he would be a solid #5/6 CB and #3 S backup in the division of this team.

A little, but who doesnt add a little homerism to things like these?

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 06:07 PM
Holmes Played Great.. nearly a 1000 yards in a reserve role minus 4 starts.

Bentley, when healthy is a great C.

Ike Taylor is IMO the 2nd best Corner in the AFCN.

only 4 of the 7 people you bolded are Steelers.

Sepulveda is going to be a damn good punter. Brad St. Louis is Cincy's LS.

Ghuiciac is also Cincy's C.

Bentley hasn't played in over a year so therefore calling him the best is ridiculous, he has to proven himself. Matt Katula is a much better LS and as for Ghuiciac, eh my bad I wasn't aware he was a Bungle. You can hype Sepulveda all you want, right now he's not the best. And don't get me started on that piece of trash Ike Taylor.....

Also Mark Clayton > Holmes

remix 6
08-17-2007, 06:13 PM
QB: Palmer
RB: Parker
FB: Kreider
WR: 85
WR: Housh
WR: Clayton
TE: Winslow
LT: Ogden
LG: Faneca
C: ?
RG: ?
RT: Anderson

3-4
DE: A. Smith
NT: Hampton
DE: Pryce
OLB: Suggs
ILB: Scott
ILB: Lewis
OLB: Wimbley
CB: McAlister
CB: Joseph
S: Polamalu
S: Reed

4-3 D
DE: Suggs
DT: Hampton
DT: Gregg
DE: Pryce > J. Smith
OLB: Wimbley(i know hes a 3-4 guy but couldnt think of anyone else better)
MLB: Lewis
OLB: Scott

themaninblack
08-17-2007, 06:20 PM
lets stop the rumors, the best fb in this division is jeremi johnson. just stop it.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:21 PM
Bentley hasn't played in over a year so therefore calling him the best is ridiculous, he has to proven himself. Matt Katula is a much better LS and as for Ghuiciac, eh my bad I wasn't aware he was a Bungle. You can hype Sepulveda all you want, right now he's not the best. And don't get me started on that piece of trash Ike Taylor.....

Also Mark Clayton > Holmes

I'm gonna have to disagree with that. Santonio put up almost as good numbers last year in half as many games and is poised for a break out year. Basically you called him a homer and defended it by being a homer.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:22 PM
QB: Palmer
RB: Parker
FB: Kreider
WR: 85
WR: Housh
WR: Clayton
TE: Winslow
LT: Ogden
LG: Faneca
C: ?
RG: ?
RT: Anderson

3-4
DE: A. Smith
NT: Hampton
DE: Pryce
OLB: Suggs
ILB: Scott
ILB: Lewis
OLB: Wimbley
CB: McAlister
CB: Joseph
S: Polamalu
S: Reed

4-3 D
DE: Suggs
DT: Hampton
DT: Gregg
DE: Pryce > J. Smith
OLB: Wimbley(i know hes a 3-4 guy but couldnt think of anyone else better)
MLB: Lewis
OLB: Scott

stick to the AFC East, kid.

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 06:29 PM
I'm gonna have to disagree with that. Santonio put up almost as good numbers last year in half as many games and is poised for a break out year. Basically you called him a homer and defended it by being a homer.

Stating the truth is not being a homer:

Clayton - 67 receptions 939 yards 5 touchdowns

Holmes - 49 receptions 824 yards 2 touchdowns

Not to mention that Mark already had his break out year and will continue to improve where as Holmes has to have this supposed break out year.

kalbears13
08-17-2007, 06:34 PM
You said there were not vet LOLB but there's Willie McGinest.

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 06:35 PM
You said there were not vet LOLB but there's Willie McGinest.

Willie certainly qualifies as a vet.......

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:36 PM
Stating the truth is not being a homer:

Clayton - 67 receptions 939 yards 5 touchdowns

Holmes - 49 receptions 824 yards 2 touchdowns

Not to mention that Mark already had his break out year and will continue to improve where as Holmes has to have this supposed break out year.

Well like I said, Holmes put up his stats in fewer games, seeing as how he didn't start until half way through the season.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:36 PM
Stating the truth is not being a homer:

Clayton - 67 receptions 939 yards 5 touchdowns

Holmes - 49 receptions 824 yards 2 touchdowns

Not to mention that Mark already had his break out year and will continue to improve where as Holmes has to have this supposed break out year.

.... Wait a second.

Clayton's break out year is near what Holmes pre-breakout year is.

I don't understand the Logic.

Let me get this straight.

Clayton is better than Holmes, because he had his breakout season..

Holmes was only 115 yards and 3 TD's off, with 9 fewer starts.

Yet Holmes is to have his Breakout season this year, and he's worse than Clayton because Clayton had his "breakout" season and it was barely better than Holmes' Pre-breakout/learning curve/rookie season?

Where is the Logic?

jkpigskin
08-17-2007, 06:42 PM
noticed that the AFC NOrth lost alot of talent in the offseason....
dont agree with some of your choices... and i dont like that taylor is the 2nd best corner but the AFC north is surprisingly week at corner

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:44 PM
noticed that the AFC NOrth lost alot of talent in the offseason....
dont agree with some of your choices... and i dont like that taylor is the 2nd best corner but the AFC north is surprisingly week at corner

Some places there just wasn't a whole lot to choose from..

DL was strong. LB isn't looking bad.

CB is not AFCN strongsuit.. then again that defense would sack the QB every pass play anyways.

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 06:48 PM
Well like I said, Holmes put up his stats in fewer games, seeing as how he didn't start until half way through the season.

Maybe if Holmes would have been more dedicated in training camp last season he would have been the starter last season.

remix 6
08-17-2007, 06:49 PM
stick to the AFC East, kid.

yeah because i think 1 player is better than a Steeler? stop with all the starts and crap

u dont need to be a #1 or #2 WR to put up stats or do well
Holmes played all year..thats all that matters

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:50 PM
Maybe if Holmes would have been more dedicated in training camp last season he would have been the starter last season.

....Because he was not allowed to participate before OSU held its graduation ceremonies?

And Because Bill Cowher was a big supporter in starting Rookies.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:51 PM
Maybe if Holmes would have been more dedicated in training camp last season he would have been the starter last season.

Alright, just give up. I'll have you refer to Mr. Stiller's post on the subject above.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:52 PM
....Because he was not allowed to participate before OSU held its graduation ceremonies?

And Because Bill Cowher was a big supporter in starting Rookies.

was *NOT* a big supporter

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 06:53 PM
Alright, just give up. I'll have you refer to Mr. Stiller's post on the subject above.

Give it up? How about you get a clue about football and come back to reality because Mark Clayton is a better all around receiver then Santonio Holmes.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:53 PM
was *NOT* a big supporter

I was being sarcastic.

Ben Roethlisberger lucked out because of injuries.. Heath Miller because of severe lack of talent.. but hell..

Faneca, Ward, Hampton, Porter... Any of our best players never started in their Rookie season.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:53 PM
yeah because i think 1 player is better than a Steeler? stop with all the starts and crap

u dont need to be a #1 or #2 WR to put up stats or do well
Holmes played all year..thats all that matters

No, because Hines Ward clearly deserves to be in the top 3 WRs in the division.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:54 PM
Give it up? How about you get a clue about football and come back to reality because Mark Clayton is a better all around receiver then Santonio Holmes.

There's not a large enough margin between the two to make that statement as fact.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:54 PM
I was being sarcastic.

Ben Roethlisberger lucked out because of injuries.. Heath Miller because of severe lack of talent.. but hell..

Faneca, Ward, Hampton, Porter... Any of our best players never started in their Rookie season.

I'd add Polamalu to that list.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 06:55 PM
I'd add Polamalu to that list.

I didn't feel like literally naming every player on our team.

steelernation77
08-17-2007, 06:58 PM
I didn't feel like literally naming every player on our team.

I don't blame you.

PalmerToCJ
08-17-2007, 09:18 PM
It is very easy to argue that Jeremi Johnson is the best FB in the division, although I can see a vote for Kreider.

TJ Houshmandzadeh is EASILY the best #2 WR in the division and IMO he's the second best WR overall in the division.

I agree with a lot of the list though. I like Marvin at HC and not Bratkowski at OC, Bratkowski is overrated IMO.

Overall I think you did a good job ranking the Bengals. I liked where you put JJ/Madieu/Ghiaciuc, bravo for giving them some love.

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 09:27 PM
It is very easy to argue that Jeremi Johnson is the best FB in the division, although I can see a vote for Kreider.

TJ Houshmandzadeh is EASILY the best #2 WR in the division and IMO he's the second best WR overall in the division.

I agree with a lot of the list though. I like Marvin at HC and not Bratkowski at OC, Bratkowski is overrated IMO.

Overall I think you did a good job ranking the Bengals. I liked where you put JJ/Madieu/Ghiaciuc, bravo for giving them some love.

Brian Billick is the best Head Coach in the division without question!

PalmerToCJ
08-17-2007, 09:30 PM
Brian Billick is the best Head Coach in the division without question!

Yeah, easily the most successful... I would just personally prefer Marvin, I think him and Ryan would be a deadly combo. We have the worst DC in the league, I think it's not a talent issue but a scheme issue.

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 10:49 PM
Brian Billick is the best Head Coach in the division without question!

Only because..

Bill Cowher retired.

BigDawg819
08-17-2007, 10:50 PM
Only because..

Bill Cowher retired.

Uhhhhhh NO!

Mr. Stiller
08-17-2007, 10:55 PM
Uhhhhhh NO!

....if you Believe Billick is better than Cowher... that says more than anything you've ever posted.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 01:55 AM
I'll have to agree with the Cowher > Billick statement.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 01:56 AM
I'll have to agree with the Cowher > Billick statement.

Nope sorry try again.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 02:01 AM
I actually have to say I CANNOT BELIEVE that Jamal Lewis wasn't first string RB. That SOB can run, especially when he gets to the open field. I mean, he's a lock to get between -1 and 3 yards on a normal carry... Sometimes he can go off and get 5 or 6 if he gets his young, unworn legs moving.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:09 AM
I actually have to say I CANNOT BELIEVE that Jamal Lewis wasn't first string RB. That SOB can run, especially when he gets to the open field. I mean, he's a lock to get between -1 and 3 yards on a normal carry... Sometimes he can go off and get 5 or 6 if he gets his young, unworn legs moving.

Screw Jamal Lewis! With that said, I agree with Willie Parker as the best in the division with Rudi Johnson a very close second. The only reason I put Willie first is the fact that he has that homerun threat any time he touches the ball.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 02:11 AM
I agree completely that Willie is the best RB right now in the division. Rudi is rock solid and is easily the most consistant RB in the division but he's nowhere near the big play guy Parker is.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:15 AM
Why put Woodley ahead of Wimbley? That doesn't make sense. Also, Andra Davis should at least be a backup MLB. Besides that, you were pretty fair with the Browns players, good job.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:17 AM
Why put Woodley ahead of Wimbley? That doesn't make sense. Also, Andra Davis should at least be a backup MLB. Besides that, you were pretty fair with the Browns players, good job.

Its a list of the best players in the AFC North, therefore no Browns players should even be considered.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:21 AM
Its a list of the best players in the AFC North, therefore no Browns players should even be considered.

Ok then. I'm just going to ignore that since anyone who thinks LeCharles Bentley isn't the top center in the division is obviously having life problems.

By the way, Brian Billick sucks. Most overrated coach in the league.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 02:23 AM
Ok then. I'm just going to ignore that since anyone who thinks LeCharles Bentley isn't the top center in the league is obviously having life problems.

How long has it been since he's played? If this was 2 years ago then yeah I completely agree but the guy hasn't played a meaningful game in forever.

I'm not saying he can't be the best in division when healthy but it's hard to act like he's a lock given how long it's been since he's even played.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:25 AM
How long has it been since he's played? If this was 2 years ago then yeah I completely agree but the guy hasn't played a meaningful game in forever.

He missed a year and is coming back this one. It's not like he's been out for a years and years, and who else in the AFC North is close to Bentley, really?

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 02:26 AM
I can't believe you actually believe Billick is better than Cowher.. that is blatant over the top homerism.

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 02:27 AM
Why put Woodley ahead of Wimbley? That doesn't make sense. Also, Andra Davis should at least be a backup MLB. Besides that, you were pretty fair with the Browns players, good job.

I was listing them due to their Natural Positions.

Wimbley is an ROLB.

Woodley is a LOLB.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 02:29 AM
He missed a year and is coming back this one. It's not like he's been out for a years and years, and who else in the AFC North is close to Bentley, really?

I think Ghiaciuc has the potential after a year starting but I do agree that Bentley when healthy is the best, I'm just saying there are some questions involved with his health.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:30 AM
I think Ghiaciuc has the potential after a year starting but I do agree that Bentley when healthy is the best, I'm just saying there are some questions involved with his health.

Even if he's only 80-90% of what he was, he's still the best in the AFC North.

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 02:32 AM
I think Ghiaciuc has the potential after a year starting but I do agree that Bentley when healthy is the best, I'm just saying there are some questions involved with his health.

I didn't think Ghiacuic is ready to start in this situation and yes I used Bentley after his injury.. that just goes to show how Center starved this division is.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:32 AM
I can't believe you actually believe Billick is better than Cowher.. that is blatant over the top homerism.

Steeler fans think he's Jesus Christ, to me he was an overrated coach who was lucky to be with the Steelers because they don't fire coaches. You guys can hate on Coach Billick all you want but plain and simple the man is a genius. He won the Super Bowl in his 2nd year as a head coach, and did it and continues to preach a system of defense first even though he's an offensive guy. Coach gets the most out of his players and his players want to play for him. Not to mention the fact that he's the perfect fit with the city of Baltimore and one of the most classiest guys I've ever had the opportunity to meet and chat with.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:33 AM
Steeler fans think he's Jesus Christ, to me he was an overrated coach who was lucky to be with the Steelers because they don't fire coaches. You guys can hate on Coach Billick all you want but plain and simple the man is a genius. He won the Super Bowl in his 2nd year as a head coach, and did it and continues to preach a system of defense first even though he's an offensive guy. Coach gets the most out of his players and his players want to play for him. Not to mention the fact that he's the perfect fit with the city of Baltimore and one of the most classiest guys I've ever had the opportunity to meet and chat with.

Genius, that is the word that makes me laugh when coupled with Billick. Hey guys, I just opened a bottle of water! I'm a finger genius!

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:35 AM
Genius, that is the word that makes me laugh when coupled with Billick. Hey guys, I just opened a bottle of water! I'm a finger genius!

Like a Cleveland fan would know anything about a good coach....... :rolleyes:

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 02:36 AM
Like a Cleveland fan would know anything about a good coach....... :rolleyes:

Paul Brown?

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:38 AM
Paul Brown?

Ka-pwned. Damn, one character short

PoopSandwich
08-18-2007, 02:45 AM
Offense: 25 Players
QB: Carson Palmer -> Ben Roethlisberger
RB: Willie Parker -> Willis McGahee
FB: Lawerence Vickers - This is my homer pick, but I really expect him to break out.

WR1: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR2: Hines Ward -> TJ
WR3: Santonio Holmes -> Clayton ( I would use these guys as my slot receivers.)

TE: Kellen Winslow Jr.-> Todd Heap -> Heath Miller - Put Winslow and Heap in almost every play with Hines ward and you have a deadly receiving/blocking game... Though Winslow isn't the greatest blocker he can still do alright.

LT: Jon Ogden -> Levi Jones
LG: Alan Faneca -> Eric Steinbach
C: LeCharles Bentley -> Eric Ghuiciac
RG: Kendall Simmons -> Ben Grubbs
RT: Willie Anderson -> Adam Terry

This is fine, I might start Steinbach at RG though.

Defense: 3-4... 25 Total

LDE: Aaron Smith -> Haloti Ngata
NT: Casey Hampton -> Kelly Gregg
RDE: Trevor Pryce -> Brett Keisel

Sure, whatever, Browns don't deserve a d-lineman they all suck.

Utility DL: Justin Smith (Backup both All 3 positions)

ROLB: Terell Suggs -> Woodley
RILB: Bart Scott -> Larry Foote
LILB: Ray Lewis -> James Farrior
LOLB: Kamerion Wimbley -> Peek

Yeah I mixxed up the order, but I don't care, I want my best players playing... I put Peek there because hes a good pass rusher and that will be his job this season, but most of the OLB in our division are pass rushers.

Utility Backup LB: Leon Williams? I don't know, this is a pure homer pick just because he has looked good and can play ILB and OLB.

CB: Chris McCallister -> Jonathan Joseph
CB: Leigh Bodden -> Leon Hall/Eric Wright - Corners aren't the strongest in our division, we will see who steps it up this year between those two, I'm not a believer in Ike
FS: Ed Reed -> Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Sean Jones

Utility DB: DeShea Townsend (CB/S Tweener)

Special Teams: 3

LS: PONTBRIAND BABY.
P: Dave Zastudil
K: Matt Stover
KR: Cribbs
PR: Santonio Holmes

Coaches:

Head Coach: Billick
Defensive Coordinators: Ryan
Offensive Coordinator: Bob Bratkowski


It late so this list may suck I don't know what I'm doing.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:46 AM
Ka-pwned. Damn, one character short

No not really, considering he last coached in what 1963? If thats what your argument is then sorry you lose. Not having a decent coach in over 40 years, mind you none of you arguing this were even a proton in your daddies testicles when he last coached, automatically disqualifies you from any debate about great coaches.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 02:48 AM
No not really, considering he last coached in what 1963? If thats what your argument is then sorry you lose. Not having a decent coach in over 40 years, mind you none of you arguing this were even a proton in your daddies testicles when he last coached, automatically disqualifies you from any debate about great coaches.

Bill Belicheck coached the Browns before he went to New England. Granted he sucked there, but he's a good coach. And they had Marty Schottenheimer who did well there.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:50 AM
Bill Belicheck coached the Browns before he went to New England. Granted he sucked there, but he's a good coach. And they had Marty Schottenheimer who did well there.

Bill sucked there because ownership didn't let him run things his way and Marty well John Elway showed why he sucks and plus he could never win the big one.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:05 AM
I'm gonna take a stab at this as well, although I'm not going to seperate RT and LT, and ROLB and LOLB. On defense I'm going to ignore defensive scheme because that unfairly leaves out the Bengals:

QB: Carson Palmer/Ben Roethliwannahamberger
RB: Fast Willie/Rudi Johnson/Other Willie
FB: Jeremi Johnson
WR: Hines Ward/Braylon Edwards
WR: Chad Johnson/Mark Clayton
WR: Tj Howsyourvanilla/Derrick Mason
TE: Todd Heap/Kellen Winslow/Heath Miller
T: Jonathan Ogden/Adam Terry
G: Alan Faneca/Kendall Simmons
C: LeCharles Bentley/Noone, really
G: Eric Steinbach/Ben Grubbs
T: Willie Anderson/Levi Jones

DE: Haloti Ngata/Justin Smith
NT: Casey Hampton/Kelly Gregg
DE: Aaron Smith/Brett Keisel

OLB: Terrell Suggs/Landon Johnson
MLB: James Farrior/Bart Scott/Larry Foote
MLB: Ray Lewis/Andra Davis/Ahmad Brooks
OLB: Kamerion Wimbley/Lamarr Woodley

CB: Chris McCalister/Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed/Anthony Smith
SS: Troy Polamalu/Sean Jones
CB: Leigh Bodden/Eric Wright

K: Shayne Graham
P: Dave Zastudil
KR: Joshua Cribbs
PR: BJ Sams
LS: Ryan Pontbriand (I had to)

HC: Marvin Lewis
OC: Bob Bratkowski
DC: Rex Ryan

Honorable mention: Offense: Kevin Shaffer, Joe Thomas, Chris Henry, Steve McNair, not Charlie Frye because he sucks, Joe Jurevicious

Honorable mention: Defense: Madieu Williams, Willie McGinest, Odell Thurman if he wasn't a thug, Dawan Landry, Chris Hoke

Honorable mention: Coaching: Todd Grantham, Dick Lebeau

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:06 AM
Bill sucked there because ownership didn't let him run things his way and Marty well John Elway showed why he sucks and plus he could never win the big one.

Wrong, wrong. Bill had too much control. He was the face of the franchise, he even convinced the owner to trade Bernie Kosar and bring in Vinny Interceptaverde. The players hated him but Modell was too damn prideful and wouldn't fire him.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:07 AM
I'm gonna take a stab at this as well, although I'm not going to seperate RT and LT, and ROLB and LOLB. On defense I'm going to ignore defensive scheme because that unfairly leaves out the Bengals:

QB: Carson Palmer/Ben Roethliwannahamberger
RB: Fast Willie/Rudi Johnson/Other Willie
FB: Jeremi Johnson
WR: Hines Ward/Braylon Edwards
WR: Chad Johnson/Mark Clayton
WR: Tj Howsyourvanilla/Derrick Mason
TE: Todd Heap/Kellen Winslow/Heath Miller
T: Jonathan Ogden/Adam Terry
G: Alan Faneca/Kendall Simmons
C: LeCharles Bentley/Noone, really
G: Eric Steinbach/Ben Grubbs
T: Willie Anderson/Levi Jones

DE: Haloti Ngata/Justin Smith
NT: Casey Hampton/Kelly Gregg
DE: Aaron Smith/Brett Keisel

OLB: Terrell Suggs/Landon Johnson
MLB: James Farrior/Larry Foote/Ahmad Brooks
MLB: Ray Lewis/Andra Davis/D'Qwell Jackson
OLB: Kamerion Wimbley/Lamarr Woodley

CB: Chris McCalister/Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed/Anthony Smith
SS: Troy Polamalu/Sean Jones
CB: Leigh Bodden/Eric Wright

K: Shayne Graham
P: Dave Zastudil
KR: Joshua Cribbs
PR: BJ Sams
LS: Ryan Pontbriand (I had to)

HC: Marvin Lewis
OC: Bob Bratkowski
DC: Rex Ryan

Honorable mention: Offense: Kevin Shaffer, Joe Thomas, Chris Henry, Steve McNair, not Charlie Frye because he sucks, Joe Jurevicious

Honorable mention: Defense: Madieu Williams, Willie McGinest, Odell Thurman if he wasn't a thug, Dawan Landry, Chris Hoke

Honorable mention: Coaching: Todd Grantham, Dick Lebeau

No Bart Scott or Matt Stover? Your list sucks big elephant testicles!

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 03:09 AM
I'm gonna take a stab at this as well, although I'm not going to seperate RT and LT, and ROLB and LOLB. On defense I'm going to ignore defensive scheme because that unfairly leaves out the Bengals:

QB: Carson Palmer/Ben Roethliwannahamberger
RB: Fast Willie/Rudi Johnson/Other Willie
FB: Jeremi Johnson
WR: Hines Ward/Braylon Edwards
WR: Chad Johnson/Mark Clayton
WR: Tj Howsyourvanilla/Derrick Mason
TE: Todd Heap/Kellen Winslow/Heath Miller
T: Jonathan Ogden/Adam Terry
G: Alan Faneca/Kendall Simmons
C: LeCharles Bentley/Noone, really
G: Eric Steinbach/Ben Grubbs
T: Willie Anderson/Levi Jones

DE: Haloti Ngata/Justin Smith
NT: Casey Hampton/Kelly Gregg
DE: Aaron Smith/Brett Keisel

OLB: Terrell Suggs/Landon Johnson
MLB: James Farrior/Larry Foote/Ahmad Brooks
MLB: Ray Lewis/Andra Davis/D'Qwell Jackson
OLB: Kamerion Wimbley/Lamarr Woodley

CB: Chris McCalister/Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed/Anthony Smith
SS: Troy Polamalu/Sean Jones
CB: Leigh Bodden/Eric Wright

K: Shayne Graham
P: Dave Zastudil
KR: Joshua Cribbs
PR: BJ Sams
LS: Ryan Pontbriand (I had to)

HC: Marvin Lewis
OC: Bob Bratkowski
DC: Rex Ryan

Honorable mention: Offense: Kevin Shaffer, Joe Thomas, Chris Henry, Steve McNair, not Charlie Frye because he sucks, Joe Jurevicious

Honorable mention: Defense: Madieu Williams, Willie McGinest, Odell Thurman if he wasn't a thug, Dawan Landry, Chris Hoke

Honorable mention: Coaching: Todd Grantham, Dick Lebeau

I'd put Holmes over Mason.. but Great list nonetheless.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:09 AM
No Bart Scott or Matt Stover? Your list sucks big elephant testicles!

Damn man, thanks I forgot about Scott. I'd take Graham over Stover.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:09 AM
Wrong, wrong. Bill had too much control. He was the face of the franchise, he even convinced the owner to trade Bernie Kosar and bring in Vinny Interceptaverde. The players hated him but Modell was too damn prideful and wouldn't fire him.

Not wrong, getting rid of Kosar was the right move and the players sucked anyway and therefore didn't like Bill because god forbid they listen and maybe actually play better........ Cleveland is basically an old folks home for players to go to let their careers die......

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:11 AM
Damn man, thanks I forgot about Scott. I'd take Graham over Stover.

Of course you would, you're a Cleveland fan and would want the kicker who would choke when the game is on the line.

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 03:11 AM
Not wrong, getting rid of Kosar was the right move and the players sucked anyway and therefore didn't like Bill because god forbid they listen and maybe actually play better........ Cleveland is basically an old folks home for players to go to let their careers die......

One could argue that Parcells built the team that Belicheck won with..

But continue to argue just to make yourself feel good.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:11 AM
Not wrong, getting rid of Kosar was the right move and the players sucked anyway and therefore didn't like Bill because god forbid they listen and maybe actually play better........ Cleveland is basically an old folks home for players to go to let their careers die......

Kosar was well loved in Cleveland. I mean, the guy had his choice of where he wanted to go, people don't forget that. He was some bad luck away from 2 super bowls.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:12 AM
One could argue that Parcells built the team that Belicheck won with..

But continue to argue just to make yourself feel good.

What the hell are you talking about? Bill Parcells never did anything with the Cleveland franchise. Maybe you should know what you're talking about before commenting?

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:12 AM
Of course you would, you're a Cleveland fan and would want the kicker who would choke when the game is on the line.

I want a kicker who can actually kick 50+ yards. Graham had a great year last year.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:15 AM
I want a kicker who can actually kick 50+ yards. Graham had a great year last year.

How long was that field goal Stover kicked to beat you last year? 50 yards or so? He's been drilling field goals for probably longer then you've been alive, show some damn respect!

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:16 AM
How long was that field goal Stover kicked to beat you last year? 50 yards or so? He's been drilling field goals for probably longer then you've been alive, show some damn respect!

I do respect him, you give me one kick from 35 yards out and I'd take him over most in the league, but Graham's better with distance.

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 03:18 AM
What the hell are you talking about? Bill Parcells never did anything with the Cleveland franchise. Maybe you should know what you're talking about before commenting?

You made it sound as if Bill was the savior in Cleveland, just his players wouldn't listen.

Perhaps he's just not as good of coach as you act?

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 03:19 AM
Bigdawg,

Seriously man.. grow up. All you do is start whining battles.

I'd hate to see you in a slump year.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 03:24 AM
Bigdawg,

Seriously man.. grow up. All you do is start whining battles.

I'd hate to see you in a slump year.

Sorry maybe I should be a moronic Steeler or Brown homer and post ridiculous nonsense like you? I could start a thread saying how all the Steeler backups are the best in the league, oh wait you already did and got exposed for you moronic insights. No I'll just stick to being an intelligent fan and continue the never ending battle to try and make posters like you actually get a clue.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:26 AM
Sorry maybe I should be a moronic Steeler or Brown homer and post ridiculous nonsense like you? I could start a thread saying how all the Steeler backups are the best in the league, oh wait you already did and got exposed for you moronic insights. No I'll just stick to being an intelligent fan and continue the never ending battle to try and make posters like you actually get a clue.

Ok let's not get all b****y guys, we're all big boys here. Let's just talk about how their both better than the Browns.

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 03:30 AM
Sorry maybe I should be a moronic Steeler or Brown homer and post ridiculous nonsense like you? I could start a thread saying how all the Steeler backups are the best in the league, oh wait you already did and got exposed for you moronic insights. No I'll just stick to being an intelligent fan and continue the never ending battle to try and make posters like you actually get a clue.

maybe we're under appreciated?

You assume that Every ravens player is better than anyone. Or that if someone doesn't share your opinion.. They're wrong. You can't have a wrong opinion.. differing.. maybe but wrong? Just because we don't agree.

You brag about a senseless hit by a rookie OLB on a punter. Yes, your so very much more intelligent and insightful.

Posters like me get a clue. Right. Because I obviously never have a clue what I'm talking about. I don't know anything about football.

You also said that Bill Cowher.. one of the best coaches of all time was overrated. Yet Billick is a better coach?

How many post-season games have you won? Not counting your superbowl season?

How many AFC Championship appearances?

I can sit and manipulate every bit of information, like you do, making it seem like everyone else is an idiot.. but I can do more productive things. I don't have to initiate an argument with every post a rival makes. There's more to life.

Bohleive
08-18-2007, 09:27 AM
Aaron Smith over Ngata is a joke.

keylime_5
08-18-2007, 09:29 AM
QB-Carson Palmer
RB-Willie Parker
FB-Jeremi Johnson
WR-Chad Johnson
WR-Hines Ward
TE-Kellen Winslow
LT-Jonathan Ogden
LG-Alan Faneca
C-Hank Fraley
RG-Bobbie Williams
RT-Willie Anderson

DE-Trevor Pryce
NT-Casey Hampton
DE-Justin Smith
OLB-Terrell Suggs
ILB-Ray Lewis
ILB-Bart Scott
OLB-Kamerion Wimbley
CB-Chris McAlister
CB-Johnathan Joseph
FS-Ed Reed
SS-Troy Polamalu

K-Shayne Graham
P-Dave Zastudil
KR-Joshua Cribbs
PR-BJ Sams

The only ones I really see very debatable are Joseph (who is unproven but in for a great year), and DE other than Pryce. Ngata, Roye if healthy, Keisel and A.Smith can be there. And of course Heap and Winslow are both top 5 in the leauge, but Winslow had a better year last year and wasn't even as healthy as he'll be this year.

PalmerToCJ
08-18-2007, 10:08 AM
I can dig your list keylime... Well done.

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 11:34 AM
I'd take Leigh Bodden over Joseph but that's just me.

Hines
08-18-2007, 11:39 AM
QB-Carson Palmer
RB-Willie Parker
FB-Jeremi Johnson
WR-Chad Johnson
WR-Hines Ward
TE-Kellen Winslow
LT-Jonathan Ogden
LG-Alan Faneca
C-Hank Fraley
RG-Bobbie Williams
RT-Willie Anderson

DE-Trevor Pryce
NT-Casey Hampton
DE-Justin Smith
OLB-Terrell Suggs
ILB-Ray Lewis
ILB-Bart Scott
OLB-Kamerion Wimbley
CB-Chris McAlister
CB-Johnathan Joseph
FS-Ed Reed
SS-Troy Polamalu

K-Shayne Graham
P-Dave Zastudil
KR-Joshua Cribbs
PR-BJ Sams

The only ones I really see very debatable are Joseph (who is unproven but in for a great year), and DE other than Pryce. Ngata, Roye if healthy, Keisel and A.Smith can be there. And of course Heap and Winslow are both top 5 in the leauge, but Winslow had a better year last year and wasn't even as healthy as he'll be this year.

i like this list but the homer in me wants to say that smith is better then pryce and smith...i believe those two are one dementional and smith is an all around player..but thats just me

Mr. Stiller
08-18-2007, 11:46 AM
i like this list but the homer in me wants to say that smith is better then pryce and smith...i believe those two are one dementional and smith is an all around player..but thats just me

I thought Farrior should've made it over Bart Scott.

Hines
08-18-2007, 11:48 AM
I thought Farrior should've made it over Bart Scott.

ya that too but a few years ago when farrior was almost the dpoy thats when i believe he was just a tad second then lewis...but now he imo is getting older and on a decline and i like scott and believe hes a good player who will be better then farrior

PoopSandwich
08-18-2007, 12:59 PM
Its a list of the best players in the AFC North, therefore no Browns players should even be considered.

You say Browns fans and Steelers fans are homers but then you post garbage like this and say that Billick is better than Cowher...

Winslow, Wimbley, Sean Jones all played at a pro-bowl level last year, yet none of them are good enough to make the "All AFC North team" sure...

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 01:36 PM
You say Browns fans and Steelers fans are homers but then you post garbage like this and say that Billick is better than Cowher...

Winslow, Wimbley, Sean Jones all played at a pro-bowl level last year, yet none of them are good enough to make the "All AFC North team" sure...

Bodden is one of the most underrated players in the league, I'm not just saying that as a homer. I mean, even Chad Johnson says so.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 02:51 PM
You say Browns fans and Steelers fans are homers but then you post garbage like this and say that Billick is better than Cowher...

Winslow, Wimbley, Sean Jones all played at a pro-bowl level last year, yet none of them are good enough to make the "All AFC North team" sure...

They're not!

Heap > Winslow Jr

Wimbley did it 1 year and needs to prove he can do it again

Sean Jones, sorry Ed Reed and Troy Polumala are better.

I can buy the Leigh Bodden hype because he is progressing but CMac is the unquestioned #1 CB in the division. After that its muddled between Samari Rolle, Leigh Bodden, Deltha O'Neil, and maybe Ike Taylor.

Face it the Browns suck, this isn't breaking news. Jamal Lewis will continue to be a disappointment, your QB situation is a nightmare, Crennel is on his way out, Bentley hasn't played in almost 2 years, Steinbach has to prove he's the player thats worth that contract and not a bust without being teamed up with Willie Anderson, and Edwards and Winslow Jr. need to shut the hell up and make plays instead of running their damn mouths!

BrownsTown
08-18-2007, 03:23 PM
They're not!

Heap > Winslow Jr

Wimbley did it 1 year and needs to prove he can do it again

Sean Jones, sorry Ed Reed and Troy Polumala are better.

I can buy the Leigh Bodden hype because he is progressing but CMac is the unquestioned #1 CB in the division. After that its muddled between Samari Rolle, Leigh Bodden, Deltha O'Neil, and maybe Ike Taylor.

Face it the Browns suck, this isn't breaking news. Jamal Lewis will continue to be a disappointment, your QB situation is a nightmare, Crennel is on his way out, Bentley hasn't played in almost 2 years, Steinbach has to prove he's the player thats worth that contract and not a bust without being teamed up with Willie Anderson, and Edwards and Winslow Jr. need to shut the hell up and make plays instead of running their damn mouths!

Agreed with the first 3, I think he meant as reserves though.

And I think Leigh Bodden is the clear cut #2, he's young and he's just a great cover corner that nobody hears about because he doesn't get a lot of INTs. Why? Because the guy he covers is almost never open.

And wasn't Steinbach on the opposite side of the line as Anderson?

keylime_5
08-18-2007, 03:55 PM
Yeah, I would've put Bodden on my list, but Joseph I think is gonna have a big year this year even though Bodden is as solid as they come. Two years from now I think Eric Wright and John Joseph are gonna be the best 2 or 2 of the best 3 CBs in the AFC North (I think McAlister will be 32 by then)

steelernation77
08-18-2007, 05:10 PM
Yeah, I would've put Bodden on my list, but Joseph I think is gonna have a big year this year even though Bodden is as solid as they come. Two years from now I think Eric Wright and John Joseph are gonna be the best 2 or 2 of the best 3 CBs in the AFC North (I think McAlister will be 32 by then)

Ike Taylor and Bryant McFadden both have alot of potential.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 05:26 PM
Ike Taylor and Bryant McFadden both have alot of potential to give up the big play.

Fixed it for you!

kalbears13
08-18-2007, 05:30 PM
You can't say LeCharles has been out for almost 2 years when he's only been out for barely 1.

themaninblack
08-18-2007, 05:30 PM
I'd take Leigh Bodden over Joseph but that's just me.

i actually kind of agree with this. but if jonathan joseph had caught half of the "wouldacouldashoulda" interceptions he had right in his grill he probably wouldve been DROY.

themaninblack
08-18-2007, 05:32 PM
And wasn't Steinbach on the opposite side of the line as Anderson?

yes he was. and he's one of the better guards in the league we were sad to see him go.

BigDawg819
08-18-2007, 05:37 PM
You can't say LeCharles has been out for almost 2 years when he's only been out for barely 1.

Let's see 2 off seasons and a full season since he last played in a game, yup thats almost 2 years.

steelernation77
08-18-2007, 06:31 PM
I'm a tool who never has anything worthwhile to contribute so I just make completely ridiculous claims about how the Ravens are faultless and call anyone who disagrees with me a homer.

That's better.

BigDawg819
08-19-2007, 12:06 AM
That's my pathetic fabrication.

You're right it is better.

America
08-19-2007, 01:59 PM
Let's see 2 off seasons and a full season since he last played in a game, yup thats almost 2 years.

They did sign him after the 2005 season, correct? That would be sometime in the spring/summer time of 2006. Because the 2005 season starts in 2005, and ends in 06. So he hurt his knee is training camp 06. He missed the year. Now it is training camp 07. It is only a year.

QB - Carson Palmer
RB - Willie Parker
FB - Dan Krieder
WR - Chad Johnson
WR - Heinz Ward
TE - Todd Heap
LT - Jonathan Ogden
LG - Alan Faneca
C - Hank Fraley
RG - Kendall Simmons
RT - Willie Anderson

*Heap edges out Winslow due to his superiority in the redzone. Fraley takes C because pretty much everyone else is bad or unproven and Bentley is still hurt. Simmons beats out Bobbie Williams because I believe Williams greatly benefits from being next to Anderson whereas Simmons is next to Starks and is a good pass protector.

Top Reserves(3) - Levi Jones, Eric Steinbach, Rudi Johnson.

DE - Trevor Pryce
NT - Casey Hampton
UT - Haloti Ngata
DE - Terrell Suggs
WLB - Bart Scott
MLB - Ray Lewis
SLB - Kamerion Wimbley
CB - Chris McAlister
FS - Ed Reed
SS - Troy Polamalu
CB - Jonathan Joseph

Ngata goes over Smith because Ngata has more potential and versitility that allows for more flexibility by the defense. Reserves were taken for versitility. I'm not sayin they're the next best but each would be good situational players. Brodney Poole is a CB/FS, Johnson, a DL/LB, and Ahmad Brooks is just crazy athletic.

Top Reserves(3) - Brodney Poole, Jarrett Johnson, Ahmad Brooks .

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2007, 02:06 PM
I think the Afc north would be way better off running a 34.

But then imagine Ray Lewis behind ngata and Hampton.

BigDawg819
08-19-2007, 02:10 PM
Ok why all this love for Joseph in a "best" thread when we all know he has the potential to be good but hasn't proven it yet?

BrownsTown
08-19-2007, 02:14 PM
Ok why all this love for Joseph in a "best" thread when we all know he has the potential to be good but hasn't proven it yet?

Yea, I don't think he's done enough to be mentioned with Bodden or Rolle. I'd take Taylor over him if he didn't have a horrible year last year.

America
08-19-2007, 02:28 PM
I think the Afc north would be way better off running a 34.

But then imagine Ray Lewis behind ngata and Hampton.

The 4-3 that I made could easily become a 3-4. That's why I chose some of the players.

BigDawg819
08-19-2007, 02:28 PM
Yea, I don't think he's done enough to be mentioned with Bodden or Rolle. I'd take Taylor over him if he didn't have a horrible year last year.

Exactly, and the lack of mention of Samari is disturbing because he is still a top flight corner in this division. Now if this is a thread about who could be the best in 3-4 years, the CB tandem I would throw up is Leon Hall/Jonathan Joseph.

America
08-19-2007, 02:31 PM
Ok why all this love for Joseph in a "best" thread when we all know he has the potential to be good but hasn't proven it yet?

Jospeh is in the same situation as Ngata. They both had great rookie campaigns and have potential to get a lot better. Joseph doesn't make a lot of picks, but he sticks to receivers and does very well with a minimal pass rush. It's pretty much a toss up with him and Leigh Bodden, I just choose Joseph because Bodden is injured a lot and I couldn't make a fair assessment of his play cause I only have seen him 2 or 3 times.

America
08-19-2007, 02:36 PM
Exactly, and the lack of mention of Samari is disturbing because he is still a top flight corner in this division. Now if this is a thread about who could be the best in 3-4 years, the CB tandem I would throw up is Leon Hall/Jonathan Joseph.

I'm surprised that you think that. I know Reed played out of his zone a lot and that was a cause for a lot of big plays, but Rolle still was beaten too much. He plays with a huge cushion and gave up plenty of yards underneath.

BigDawg819
08-19-2007, 02:40 PM
I'm surprised that you think that. I know Reed played out of his zone a lot and that was a cause for a lot of big plays, but Rolle still was beaten too much. He plays with a huge cushion and gave up plenty of yards underneath.

Rolle played within the defense like he was supposed to and Reed missed his assignments hence the supposed blown coverages on the big plays. Samari is still a good corner and should come out with a monster season to prove it. You can't really blame him for that cushion because thats the design of the scheme, I don't like it but it is what it is.

PalmerToCJ
08-19-2007, 06:00 PM
Joseph started only 8 games and was tied for 6th in pass deflections with 20... That's why he's getting mention. He was an oustanding cover corner, he just needs to learn how to catch.

JoeMontainya
08-20-2007, 02:41 PM
Like a Cleveland fan would know anything about a good coach....... :rolleyes:

Where do you think Paul Brown, Cowher, Billick, and Marty made there marks at?

JoeMontainya
08-20-2007, 02:46 PM
IMO

qb Palmer Big ben
rb Parker rudi
fb Johnson kreider
wr johnson ward
wr houshmanzadah edwards
te winslow heap
lt ogden
lg steinbach
c bentley (better hurt than anyone else healthy :)
rg faneca (normally a LG)
rt anderson

3-4 D
de smith
nt hampton
de ngata
olb wimbley
mlb lewis scott
mlb farrior davis
olb suggs
cb bodden
cb mccallister
fs reed
ss polamolu

k graham
p zastudil

Marvin Lewis can only seem to get the Bengals to win 8 games every year so Im gonna take Billick as my HC now that Cowher is gone.

keylime_5
08-20-2007, 03:09 PM
Where do you think Paul Brown, Cowher, Billick, and Marty made there marks at?

We had Bellichek as our head coach and guys like Nick Saban, Pete Carroll, Kirk Ferentz, Eric Mangini, and a few other good head coaches as assistants too. Billick was from the Vikings I think, I don't believe he was a Brown asst. was he? Or did you mean to type Bellicheck instead of Billick?

That's a lot of head coaches considering the Ravens have only had like 2 head coaches all time, and none are as great as most of the guys Montainya and I just mentioned. And while Billick is a good head coach, he is supposed to be an offensive genius, and Baltimore's offense has sucked every single year he's been in Baltimore.

mikehop05
08-21-2007, 02:35 PM
Offense

QB - Carson - Ben
RB - Willie - Rudi
FB - Kreider - Johnson
WR (#1) - Ocho Cinco - Ward
WR (#2) - Holmes - TJ
TE - Winslow - Heap
LT - Ogden
LG - Faneca
C - no one deserves to be called the best
RG - Simmons
RT - Anderson

Defense 3 - 4

LDE - A. Smith
NT - Casey
RDE - Ngata

OLB - Suggs
ILB - Scott
ILB - Farrior
OLB - Wimberly

CB (all are not great) McCalister
CB - Joseph
S - Reed
S - Polymoly

PK - Stover
P - Sped
KR - Sams

Smooth Criminal
08-21-2007, 02:47 PM
IMO

qb Palmer Big ben
rb Parker rudi
fb Johnson kreider
wr johnson ward
wr houshmanzadah edwards
te winslow heap
lt ogden
lg steinbach
c bentley (better hurt than anyone else healthy :)
rg faneca (normally a LG)
rt anderson

3-4 D
de smith
nt hampton
de ngata
olb wimbley
mlb lewis scott
mlb farrior davis
olb suggs
cb bodden
cb mccallister
fs reed
ss polamolu

k graham
p zastudil

Marvin Lewis can only seem to get the Bengals to win 8 games every year so Im gonna take Billick as my HC now that Cowher is gone.

I like this list other than Bentley can't be put as the center. Unless he is going to play the year he can't be on a list like this.

An all AFC North team would have a killer defense and a pretty good offense to. The line would have some holes but we have alot of good young skill positions.

Smooth Criminal
08-21-2007, 02:50 PM
Where do you think Paul Brown, Cowher, Billick, and Marty made there marks at?

I wouldn't say Cowher or Belichick (I'm assuming thats who you meant because I don't think Billick was ever in Cleveland and the two are easy to mix up) made their marks in Cleveland at all. Sure they both coached their but neither of them made their marks there at all. When people think back on these two coaches they will remember Cowher coaching for the Steelers and Belichick coaching for the Patriots.

You can say that they can trace their roots to Cleveland but they didn't even come close to making their marks there.

Funny thing is you had all these good coaches under your nose and 3 of the 4 you said had the best years other than Cleveland.

fondoffilm
08-22-2007, 09:12 PM
QB: Carson Palmer
RB: Willis McGahee
FB: Jeremi Johnson
WR: Chad Johnson, T.J. Houshmandzadeh
TE: Todd Heap
LT: Levi Jones
LG: Alan Faneca
C: Eric Ghiaciuc
RG: Kendall Simmons
RT: Willie Anderson

DE: Terrell Suggs, Justin Smith
DT: Casey Hampton, Kelly Gregg
SLB: Bart Scott
MLB: Ray Lewis
WLB: Kamerion Wimbley
CB: Chris McAlister, Leigh Bodden
FS: Ed Reed
SS: Troy Polamalu

K: Matt Stover
P: Dave Zastudil

Why not?

HC: Brian Billick
OC: Bob Bratkowski (not many good ones in this division)
DC: Rex Ryan

PalmerToCJ
08-22-2007, 09:16 PM
Willis McGahee is a distant 3rd best RB in the AFCN.

fondoffilm
08-22-2007, 09:43 PM
I respect your opinion, and I personally don't care for the guy, but I think he's the most talented in the division.

BigDawg819
08-22-2007, 10:52 PM
Willis McGahee is a distant 3rd best RB in the AFCN.

I agree and actually I won't even rank him because he hasn't played a game yet in this division.

PalmerToCJ
08-22-2007, 11:02 PM
I respect your opinion, and I personally don't care for the guy, but I think he's the most talented in the division.

I think some people are just biting into the whole hype he had in college followed by a change of scenary. Being 3rd in the AFCN isn't a bad thing considering Willie Parker and Rudi are in it.

What's funny to me is that I think of Rudi as more of a Pittsburgh type RB and Willie seems more like someone the Bengals would have. Rudi is by far the most consistant but at this point if I could have any RB in the division it would be Parker.

1. Willie Parker
2. Rudi Johnson


3. Willis McGahee
.
.
.
.
4. Jamal Lewis

Honestly, I'd rather have Najeh Davenport or a healthy Kenny Irons/Chris Perry over Lewis. I'm still confused how Mike Anderson didn't take over for him last year.

BigDawg819
08-22-2007, 11:04 PM
I think some people are just biting into the whole hype he had in college followed by a change of scenary. Being 3rd in the AFCN isn't a bad thing considering Willie Parker and Rudi are in it.

What's funny to me is that I think of Rudi as more of a Pittsburgh type RB and Willie seems more like someone the Bengals would have. Rudi is by far the most consistant but at this point if I could have any RB in the division it would be Parker.

1. Willie Parker
2. Rudi Johnson


3. Willis McGahee
.
.
.
.
4. Jamal Lewis

Honestly, I'd rather have Najeh Davenport or a healthy Kenny Irons/Chris Perry over Lewis. I'm still confused how Mike Anderson didn't take over for him last year.

You and every intelligent Raven fan.

The Legend
08-23-2007, 08:32 AM
QB: Carson Palmer, Ben Roethlisberger, Steve McNair
RB: Willie Parker, Willis McGahee, Rudi Johnson
FB: Dan Kreider, Jeremi Johnson, Lawrence Vickers

TE: Todd Heap, Kellen Winslow, Heath Miller
LR: Chad Johnson, Hines Ward, Derrick Mason
RR: T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Braylon Edwards, Mark Clayton

LT: Jonathan Ogden, Levi Jones, Marvel Smith
LG: Alan Faneca, Eric Steinbach, Jason Brown
OC: LeCharles Bentley, Eric Ghiaciuc, Chukky Okobi
RG: Kendall Simmons, Bobbie Williams, Seth McKinney
RT: Willie Anderson, Kevin Shaffer, Adam Terry

LE: Trevor Pryce, Aaron Smith, Shaun Smith
NT: Casey Hampton, Haloti Ngata, Ted Washington
RE: Kelly Gregg, Robaire Smith, Brett Keisel

LO: Terrell Suggs, Clark Haggans, Willie McGinest
ML: Ray Lewis, James Farrior, Andra Davis
IL: Bart Scott, D'Qwell Jackson, Ahmad Brooks
RO: Justin Smith, Kamerion Wimbley, Landon Johnson

LC: Chris McAlister, Deltha O'Neal, Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed, Brodney Pool, Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu, Sean Jones, Dawan Landry
RC: Johnathan Joseph, Samari Rolle, Deshea Townsend

K: Matt Stover, Shayne Graham, Phil Dawson
P: Sam Koch, Dave Zastudil, Kyle Larson
KR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman
PR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman

HC: Brian Billick, Marvin Lewis, Romeo Crennel
OC: Bob Bratkowski, Bruce Arians, Rob Chudzinski
DC: Rex Ryan, Dick LeBeau, Todd Grantham

kalbears13
08-23-2007, 09:07 AM
QB: Carson Palmer, Ben Roethlisberger, Steve McNair
RB: Willie Parker, Willis McGahee, Rudi Johnson
FB: Dan Kreider, Jeremi Johnson, Lawrence Vickers

TE: Todd Heap, Kellen Winslow, Heath Miller
LR: Chad Johnson, Hines Ward, Derrick Mason
RR: T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Braylon Edwards, Mark Clayton

LT: Jonathan Ogden, Levi Jones, Marvel Smith
LG: Alan Faneca, Eric Steinbach, Jason Brown
OC: LeCharles Bentley, Eric Ghiaciuc, Chukky Okobi
RG: Kendall Simmons, Bobbie Williams, Seth McKinney
RT: Willie Anderson, Kevin Shaffer, Adam Terry

LE: Trevor Pryce, Aaron Smith, Shaun Smith
NT: Casey Hampton, Haloti Ngata, Ted Washington
RE: Kelly Gregg, Robaire Smith, Brett Keisel

LO: Terrell Suggs, Clark Haggans, Willie McGinest
ML: Ray Lewis, James Farrior, Andra Davis
IL: Bart Scott, D'Qwell Jackson, Ahmad Brooks
RO: Justin Smith, Kamerion Wimbley, Landon Johnson

LC: Chris McAlister, Deltha O'Neal, Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed, Brodney Pool, Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu, Sean Jones, Dawan Landry
RC: Johnathan Joseph, Samari Rolle, Deshea Townsend

K: Matt Stover, Shayne Graham, Phil Dawson
P: Sam Koch, Dave Zastudil, Kyle Larson
KR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman
PR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman

HC: Brian Billick, Marvin Lewis, Romeo Crennel
OC: Bob Bratkowski, Bruce Arians, Rob Chudzinski
DC: Rex Ryan, Dick LeBeau, Todd Grantham

I'm surprised you have someone like Shaun Smith up there(a backup) but don't have Leigh Bodden.

BrownsTown
08-23-2007, 10:29 AM
I'm surprised you have someone like Shaun Smith up there(a backup) but don't have Leigh Bodden.

Yea that was a damn fine list aside from Leigh Bodden missing, he'd be at least 2nd if not starting, and Justin Smith ahead of Kamerion Wimbley.

PalmerToCJ
08-23-2007, 10:40 AM
I don't know how anyone can justify McGahee over Rudi Johnson at this point.

He has NEVER topped 1250 yards rushing... Johnson has run for over 1450 TWICE. McGahee has one year of double digit TD's, Rudi has three in a row.

Deltha O'Neal as of now has no business on a top CB list and isn't Shaun Smith going to be a NT for the Browns anyway?

BrownsTown
08-23-2007, 10:42 AM
I don't know how anyone can justify McGahee over Rudi Johnson at this point.

He has NEVER topped 1250 yards rushing... Johnson has run for over 1450 TWICE. McGahee has one year of double digit TD's, Rudi has three in a row.

Deltha O'Neal as of now has no business on a top CB list and isn't Shaun Smith going to be a NT for the Browns anyway?

No, but he wouldn't even be playing if Roye wasn't injured (who's the person who should be on the list instead of him), abd Robaire Smith is definately not better than Keisel.

Mr. Stiller
08-23-2007, 11:29 AM
QB: Carson Palmer, Ben Roethlisberger, Steve McNair
RB: Willie Parker, Willis McGahee, Rudi Johnson

Johnson over McGahee

FB: Dan Kreider, Jeremi Johnson, Lawrence Vickers

TE: Todd Heap, Kellen Winslow, Heath Miller
LR: Chad Johnson, Hines Ward, Derrick Mason

I'd take Santonio Holmes over Mason.. but thats just personal.

RR: T.J. Houshmandzadeh, Braylon Edwards, Mark Clayton

LT: Jonathan Ogden, Levi Jones, Marvel Smith
LG: Alan Faneca, Eric Steinbach, Jason Brown
OC: LeCharles Bentley, Eric Ghiaciuc, Chukky Okobi

Okobi is likely to be cut for Sean Mahan

RG: Kendall Simmons, Bobbie Williams, Seth McKinney
RT: Willie Anderson, Kevin Shaffer, Adam Terry

LE: Trevor Pryce, Aaron Smith, Shaun Smith
NT: Casey Hampton, Haloti Ngata, Ted Washington
RE: Kelly Gregg, Robaire Smith, Brett Keisel

Kelly Gregg is the NT. Ngata would be #1 at LE, Pryce would be #1 at RE. Smith and Ngata could both make cases for #1 at LE.. Keisel should be over Robaire Smith.

LO: Terrell Suggs, Clark Haggans, Willie McGinest
ML: Ray Lewis, James Farrior, Andra Davis
IL: Bart Scott, D'Qwell Jackson, Ahmad Brooks
RO: Justin Smith, Kamerion Wimbley, Landon Johnson

Justin Smith is more likely a 3-4 DE. Wimbley should be #1.. and I think Farrior would start over Bart Scott.

LC: Chris McAlister, Deltha O'Neal, Ike Taylor
FS: Ed Reed, Brodney Pool, Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu, Sean Jones, Dawan Landry
RC: Johnathan Joseph, Samari Rolle, Deshea Townsend

Leigh Bodden should be on this list but Ike > Deltha

K: Matt Stover, Shayne Graham, Phil Dawson
P: Sam Koch, Dave Zastudil, Kyle Larson
KR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman
PR: B.J. Sams, Joshua Cribbs, Antonio Chatman

HC: Brian Billick, Marvin Lewis, Romeo Crennel
OC: Bob Bratkowski, Bruce Arians, Rob Chudzinski
DC: Rex Ryan, Dick LeBeau, Todd Grantham

NFL2007
08-23-2007, 11:50 AM
I saw the AFC East and figured we should get in on the fun.

Offense: 25 Players
QB: Carson Palmer -> Ben Roethlisberger
RB: Willie Parker -> Rudi Johnson
FB: Dan Kreider -> Le'Ron McClain

WR1: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR2: Hines Ward -> Santonio Holmes
WR3: Mark Clayton -> TJ Houshmanzadeh

TE: Todd Heap -> Kellen Winslow -> Heath Miller

LT: Jon Ogden -> Levi Jones
LG: Alan Faneca -> Eric Steinbach
C: LeCharles Bentley -> Eric Ghuiciac
RG: Kendall Simmons -> Ben Grubbs
RT: Willie Anderson -> Adam Terry



Defense: 3-4... 25 Total

LDE: Aaron Smith -> Haloti Ngata
NT: Casey Hampton -> Kelly Gregg
RDE: Trevor Pryce -> Brett Keisel

Utility DL: Justin Smith (Backup both All 3 positions)

ROLB: Terell Suggs -> Kamerion Wimbley
RILB: Bart Scott -> Larry Foote
LILB: Ray Lewis -> James Farrior
LOLB: LaMarr Woodley -> Antwan Barnes (Really no vets in this division)

Utility Backup LB: James Harrison (Perhaps I'll be considered a homer but he would be #3 backup for all LB positions)

CB: Chris McCallister -> Jonathan Joseph
CB: Ike Taylor -> Leigh Bodden
FS: Ed Reed -> Madieu Williams
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Sean Jones

Utility DB: DeShea Townsend (CB/S Tweener)

Special Teams: 3

LS: Brad St. Louis
P: Daniel Sepulveda
K: Matt Stover

Coaches:

Head Coach: Brian Billick (Though I prefer a Defensive minded HC... Tomlin is too new, Marvin has no control of his team and Romeo hasn't proved anything in Cleveland yet.)
Defensive Coordinators: Rex Ryan and Dick LeBeau (Find me a better duo of defensive masterminds)
Offensive Coordinator: Bob Bratkowski


Just a couple Homer Comments....

1) Holmes could be in the top 2-3 WR's in this division this season..
2) Arians could prove to be a great coordinator.. our offense is looking good thus far (I Know it's just preseason, but we should've been running this offense as soon as we started Willie Parker)
3) Anthony Smith Might beat out Madieu Williams this or next season behind Ed Reed.


as for the picks. I think I did very well. I wasn't homerly Biased. I made every effort to field the best team for the division.

One change I would make would be to start James Farrior over Bart Scott.. but Scott is the RILB and Farrior is a LILB, which is why he's behind Ray.

I don't like starting Kendall Simmons on this list.. he's a great run blocker but a joke of a pass blocker.. just Grubbs isn't more proven.. and there really wasn't another RG that stuck out from Cincy or Cleveland.



Players Per Team Breakdown:

Baltimore: 17 players + HC and Co-DC
Cincinnati: 10 players + OC
Cleveland: 6 players
Pittsburgh: 19 Players+ Co-DC

Based off of this, I would say that the north specializes in offensive line and safety. I think it's dumb to put rookies in there because they haven't played a down of football in the regular season.

BigDawg819
08-23-2007, 03:54 PM
I don't know how anyone can justify McGahee over Rudi Johnson at this point.

He has NEVER topped 1250 yards rushing... Johnson has run for over 1450 TWICE. McGahee has one year of double digit TD's, Rudi has three in a row.

Deltha O'Neal as of now has no business on a top CB list and isn't Shaun Smith going to be a NT for the Browns anyway?

Rudi is just a machine when it comes to production and is miles ahead of Willis. The only reason you put Parker ahead of Rudi is because Pittsburgh has more committment to the running game and Willie is that homerun threat which Rudi isn't as much of one.

PalmerToCJ
08-23-2007, 08:37 PM
Rudi is just a machine when it comes to production and is miles ahead of Willis. The only reason you put Parker ahead of Rudi is because Pittsburgh has more committment to the running game and Willie is that homerun threat which Rudi isn't as much of one.

Yeah I put Parker ahead of him for the exact same reason. Rudi's lack of big runs in the last 2 seasons is his only real flaw, this year he's quicker so hopefully that'll get him some more yards but can't go against Parker at this point.

BigDawg819
08-28-2007, 05:02 PM
Hmmmm Bentley on the PUP list............


I TOLD YOU SO!

PoopSandwich
08-28-2007, 05:40 PM
Hmmmm Bentley on the PUP list............


I TOLD YOU SO!

Wow you must be psychic...

It's pretty obvious that this was going to happen, I myself don't ever expect him to play again.

BigDawg819
08-28-2007, 05:47 PM
Wow you must be psychic...

It's pretty obvious that this was going to happen, I myself don't ever expect him to play again.

That was intended for all the posters who seem to think he's still the player he was in New Orleans, which he isn't and at this point in time is lucky to be alive.