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View Full Version : **WEEK 1: Sunday Night Giants at Dallas**


Turtlepower
09-05-2007, 11:54 PM
Are you guys pumped for the game? I'm just hoping that we go out there and don't look like our heads are caught between our legs.

My biggest fear, oddly enough, is Tiki. He better behave himself or else...

Giantsfan1080
09-06-2007, 12:02 AM
I was waiting for this thread. I think we have a better chance than most people think we do.

Turtlepower
09-06-2007, 12:08 AM
I was waiting for this thread. I think we have a better chance than most people think we do.

I agree. I see the Cowboys as ridiculously overrated. They have a very old and most likely soon to be injured wide receiving group as well as an overachieving QB and a running back (Marion Barber) who is being labeled as a top 5 rb in the league.

Giantsfan1080
09-06-2007, 12:12 AM
I agree. I see the Cowboys as ridiculously overrated. They have a very old and most likely soon to be injured wide receiving group as well as an overachieving QB and a running back (Marion Barber) who is being labeled as a top 5 rb in the league.

Barber isn't being rated as a top 5 RB in the league by anyone. I just think the Giants do best when the media underates them for whatever reason. Spags is going to be very agressive against Romo and I think it migght create about 2 INT's. Eli is very good in the first half of the season and I think he'll be even better this year since he will make a huge jump.

thule
09-06-2007, 12:14 AM
Tutlepower you have a very sheltered view of the cowboys.

most likely soon to be injured....wtf is that?
isn't being an overachiever a good thing?
MB3 top 5 back is laughable. Top 5 tandem maybe.

This will be a great matchup huge implications on the division. Dallas can afford to let the giants steal one let alone at home. If the giants do this is a huge booster in winning the division.

We both play attacking defenses now which should make this game full of game breaking opportunities. Whichever team can stop the run will win this game. If neither team does it will come down to special teams.

Turtlepower
09-06-2007, 12:18 AM
Tutlepower you have a very sheltered view of the cowboys.

most likely soon to be injured....wtf is that?
isn't being an overachiever a good thing?
MB3 top 5 back is laughable. Top 5 tandem maybe.

This will be a great matchup huge implications on the division. Dallas can afford to let the giants steal one let alone at home. If the giants do this is a huge booster in winning the division.

We both play attacking defenses now which should make this game full of game breaking opportunities. Whichever team can stop the run will win this game. If neither team does it will come down to special teams.

Can't you leave me with my Cowboy fan bias in peace. I will admit that most Cowboy fans on this board are pretty open-minded, but I go to school in AZ where there are plenty of bandwagon Cowboy fans who see Marion Barber as the second coming and Tony Romo as the third coming (or other way around). I respect you though for keeping a very unbiased mind on the game. I really do see it as a good game and I do agree that this game will be made on the running game. Good luck and Goodnight. =D

Jughead10
09-06-2007, 07:05 AM
I'm really glad we have the Cowboys week 1. Because honestly, I don't think Phillips has this team preprared nearly as well as Parcells would coming into the season. He runs a soft camp and soft practices and I think that will show late in the game. Some of their LBers have already made comments about being somewhat worried of Jacobs tiring them out. And they already lack depth there.

robert_in_bigd
09-06-2007, 10:55 PM
I agree. I see the Cowboys as ridiculously overrated. They have a very old and most likely soon to be injured wide receiving group as well as an overachieving QB and a running back (Marion Barber) who is being labeled as a top 5 rb in the league.

Wow, Cowboys are "ridiculously" over-rated.

I guess people projecting us Wild Card once again is over-rating us.

What do you expect 6-10? That would justify "ridiculously."

But mroe importantly this is funny coming from a Giants forum with Media HOFers like Eli, Plax, Shockey and Brandon Jacobs.

Talk about over-rated.

robert_in_bigd
09-06-2007, 10:56 PM
I'm really glad we have the Cowboys week 1. Because honestly, I don't think Phillips has this team preprared nearly as well as Parcells would coming into the season. He runs a soft camp and soft practices and I think that will show late in the game. Some of their LBers have already made comments about being somewhat worried of Jacobs tiring them out. And they already lack depth there.

And just as importantly a rookie, wet-behind-the-ears OC.

I don't think they are worried about Jacobs though. Be more worried if his name was Tiki.

Jughead10
09-06-2007, 11:08 PM
And just as importantly a rookie, wet-behind-the-ears OC.

I don't think they are worried about Jacobs though. Be more worried if his name was Tiki.

Tiki isn't as tiring on a defense. You guys only have 8 LBers on a 3-4 team. 2 of which probably won't play. Another who is a terribly inexperienced rookie. Bradie James was already making comments about how he won't be able to catch a breather and how the team should have kept at least 10 LBers.

robert_in_bigd
09-06-2007, 11:14 PM
Tiki isn't as tiring on a defense. You guys only have 8 LBers on a 3-4 team. 2 of which probably won't play. Another who is a terribly inexperienced rookie. Bradie James was already making comments about how he won't be able to catch a breather and how the team should have kept at least 10 LBers.

Well if it is any consolation Bradie James always has excuses. Marcus Spears too.

Still, not concerned.

We will see but I just don't think Jacobs is going to do much Sunday.

To me it is all about how many times Shockey can abuse Roy Williams.

Jughead10
09-06-2007, 11:16 PM
Well if it is any consolation Bradie James always has excuses. Marcus Spears too.

Still, not concerned.

We will see but I just don't think Jacobs is going to do much Sunday.

To me it is all about how many times Shockey can abuse Roy Williams.

Looking at the stat sheet, I agree Jacobs probably won't look like he had a great game. But he is just so punishing. I could see it taking a toll in the 2nd half.

HEISMANHERSCHEL
09-06-2007, 11:50 PM
I'm really glad we have the Cowboys week 1. Because honestly, I don't think Phillips has this team preprared nearly as well as Parcells would coming into the season. He runs a soft camp and soft practices and I think that will show late in the game. Some of their LBers have already made comments about being somewhat worried of Jacobs tiring them out. And they already lack depth there.

Interesting point. I never thought about it, but I kinda agree with you.
And yall need to quite saying things like, "We have a better chance than most people think (post 2)." I dont think anyone sees the giants as a doormat. With your defensive ends, yall could beat anyone on any given day.

But I hope that day is not Sunday. I want to see Eli cry.

Giantsfan1080
09-06-2007, 11:52 PM
Interesting point. I never thought about it, but I kinda agree with you.
And yall need to quite saying things like, "We have a better chance than most people think (post 2)." I dont think anyone sees the giants as a doormat. With your defensive ends, yall could beat anyone on any given day.

But I hope that day is not Sunday. I want to see Eli cry.

We are a 6 point dog at this point. Most people think we are going to finish in the bottom half of the NFL and you guys in the top half. So as I said in Post 2 I think we have a better chance than most people are giving us.

scottyboy
09-07-2007, 06:54 AM
Wow, Cowboys are "ridiculously" over-rated.

I guess people projecting us Wild Card once again is over-rating us.

What do you expect 6-10? That would justify "ridiculously."

But mroe importantly this is funny coming from a Giants forum with Media HOFers like Eli, Plax, Shockey and Brandon Jacobs.

Talk about over-rated.

Media HOF'ers? coming from a team with the ultimate media HOF'er...

giants over-rated? that's why everyone is peggin us for the bottom half of the league...

robert_in_bigd
09-07-2007, 07:43 AM
Looking at the stat sheet, I agree Jacobs probably won't look like he had a great game. But he is just so punishing. I could see it taking a toll in the 2nd half.

Well, that is interesting, because I don't see the Giants having Jacobs in the second quarter unless they abuse Roy is in the first half.

If they don't score 10-14 in the first half the Giants will be down 7-11 points.

Think the Cowboys put up some point in the first half and if the Giants don't keep pace throwing the ball ......

robert_in_bigd
09-07-2007, 07:47 AM
Media HOF'ers? coming from a team with the ultimate media HOF'er...

giants over-rated? that's why everyone is peggin us for the bottom half of the league...

I am not here to defend the Cowboys. For sure Romo's six game Pro-Bowl push was much but ......

Between, Strahan, Eli, Shockey, Plaxico, Jacobs .... dunno which one is more a media HOFer.

With respect to Dallas Team v Giants Team -- I think it on paper there is reason for more positive vibes in Dallas.

Who wins is a function of alot more than paper however.

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 09:00 AM
Right here right now, you gotta give Dallas the edge in winning this game. Theyre at home, they have a better "paper" team than us, and its hard winning on the road in week 1. Especially if the talent levels are similar, in this case, on paper Dallas has more talent than us.

And they have the edge in the lombardi rule. They have a better run blocking unit then our rush defense, and they have a better run defense than our run blocking unit. So Eli is gonna have to really put us on his back and win this game for us if we come out with a W.

We do have a good chance of winning though. Eli tends to play well against the Cowboys, and the one time he went against Phillips scheme he chewed it up. So its not like we don't have a chance. All Im saying is, the odds are slightly in their favor.

Its more important for them to win then us anyway. Its their home game, not ours. If we can win a road divisional game in week 1, that would be great. But if we lose it, Im not gonna lose sleep over it. Unless we get destroyed. Then ill worry a little bit. Its a 16 game season.

Jughead10
09-07-2007, 09:04 AM
And they have the edge in the lombardi rule. They have a better run blocking unit then our rush defense, and they have a better run defense than our run blocking unit. So Eli is gonna have to really put us on his back and win this game for us if we come out with a W.

With Ellis out and Newman possibly not playing or playing injured forcing Williams to stay away from the LOS, I'm not so sure their run defense is better than our run blocking.

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 09:22 AM
With Ellis out and Newman possibly not playing or playing injured forcing Williams to stay away from the LOS, I'm not so sure their run defense is better than our run blocking.

Thats gonna be an interesting matchup. The thing is, our run blocking on the leftside hasn't been that great. And they have Ware on that side, which totally shuts down the run to one side. That makes running the ball tough, because we'll start being predictable running to the right. Diehl isn't sealing the outside real well, and Seaburt is getting pushed backwards too much for my liking.

If our defense gets lit up, we can't wear them down with Jacobs. We'll be forced to start airing it out. Im more worried about our run defense, and defense as a whole coming into this game than the offense. The offense will put up points. But the defense worries me a little.

Jughead10
09-07-2007, 09:35 AM
Thats gonna be an interesting matchup. The thing is, our run blocking on the leftside hasn't been that great. And they have Ware on that side, which totally shuts down the run to one side. That makes running the ball tough, because we'll start being predictable running to the right. Diehl isn't sealing the outside real well, and Seaburt is getting pushed backwards too much for my liking.

If our defense gets lit up, we can't wear them down with Jacobs. We'll be forced to start airing it out. Im more worried about our run defense, and defense as a whole coming into this game than the offense. The offense will put up points. But the defense worries me a little.

Well the right side has always been our strongest side to run too with Snee and McKenzie. That matches up well for their weakness. Spencer has looked awful against the run in the preaseason. It is a concern for them.

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 09:42 AM
Well the right side has always been our strongest side to run too with Snee and McKenzie. That matches up well for their weakness. Spencer has looked awful against the run in the preaseason. It is a concern for them.

Thats true. Hopefully a couple of Roy Williams wiffs will let Jacobs break away too. The thing that concerns me with Jacobs is his slow first step, and his vision. Hopefully he'll hit the right holes and explode through. But thats harder to do against a 3-4. And with Burnett at SILB, that right side is a little light in weight. If he can break past the dline, he can run some guys over.

I want to see Bradshaw get some reps in there. I think he should be our 2 over Droughns.

I wonder if we'll use alot of 3 WR sets against them to spread out their blitzes?

trkaline
09-07-2007, 09:46 AM
I have the Boy's over them, now while I know that is the popular pick I belive that will be the end result. The Cowboys have done nothing ,but improve their defense in the offseason and I belive that will be the difference maker. Also I am curious to see how Romo clicks on his first week one as a starting QB which could go either way. With the retirement of Barber Brandon Jacobs has some big shoes to fill, I like Jacobs though he is a big bruising back.Though im leaning towards a Dallas victory I still would not be surprised if the Giants walk off the field with the W.

Jughead10
09-07-2007, 10:00 AM
Thats true. Hopefully a couple of Roy Williams wiffs will let Jacobs break away too. The thing that concerns me with Jacobs is his slow first step, and his vision. Hopefully he'll hit the right holes and explode through. But thats harder to do against a 3-4. And with Burnett at SILB, that right side is a little light in weight. If he can break past the dline, he can run some guys over.

I want to see Bradshaw get some reps in there. I think he should be our 2 over Droughns.

I wonder if we'll use alot of 3 WR sets against them to spread out their blitzes?

Is Burnett playing? I heard he is injured and has been limited.

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 10:05 AM
Is Burnett playing? I heard he is injured and has been limited.

he'll probably suit up. James is a better run stopper, so Im hoping he's not in the game. I rather go against Burnett. Burnett can't cover Shockey anyway, so its not like he's gonna help so much in coverage over James anyway. But James is a better run stopper. So I rather see Burnett.

scottyboy
09-07-2007, 10:07 AM
I think alot of how our run D does is Osi vs Flozell Adams. Osi's speed will kill Adams against the pass rush, but in the run game? that should be interesting. Also, can Big Barry and and fast freddy eat up space and make Pierce's job easier? it should be interesting.

but after watching Osi during the preseason(especially the jets game) the way he abuse the LT's he's faced is a great sign, especially how much he beat D'Brick. I'm pumped for Osi and not sure how Flozell can handle Chief Osi's speed in the pass rush...

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 10:11 AM
I think alot of how our run D does is Osi vs Flozell Adams. Osi's speed will kill Adams against the pass rush, but in the run game? that should be interesting. Also, can Big Barry and and fast freddy eat up space and make Pierce's job easier? it should be interesting.

but after watching Osi during the preseason(especially the jets game) the way he abuse the LT's he's faced is a great sign, especially how much he beat D'Brick. I'm pumped for Osi and not sure how Flozell can handle Chief Osi's speed in the pass rush...

our exterior offtackle run defense is top notch. Thats not the issue. Im concerned about between the tackles. Can Coffield and Robbins hold up against Gurorde (however you spell it) and big boy? I have a feeling they get pushed backwards, and Pierce will be in trouble.

And Butler has done a horrible job at SS so far. He's wiffing on the run, and he can't tackle or cover. I have no idea why theyre so high on him. So he doesn't provide much help from the 3rd level.

scottyboy
09-07-2007, 10:21 AM
im terrified with butler as well. also, we need to exploit big leonards lack of speed(even for an OL) on counter, tosses and other runs where he may pull. He's new to guard(i think? pretty sure he play LT in zona) so maybe some stunts and odd LB blitzes(especially from Kiwi) could confuse him.

but Kiwi is new to LB and may not be able to read and recognize run plays, we need barry and freddy to get somewhat of a push, or just not get totally mauled, and we need Butler to show why he's starting...

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 10:26 AM
im terrified with butler as well. also, we need to exploit big leonards lack of speed(even for an OL) on counter, tosses and other runs where he may pull. He's new to guard(i think? pretty sure he play LT in zona) so maybe some stunts and odd LB blitzes(especially from Kiwi) could confuse him.

but Kiwi is new to LB and may not be able to read and recognize run plays, we need barry and freddy to get somewhat of a push, or just not get totally mauled, and we need Butler to show why he's starting...

I think theyre primarily a powerblocking unit. Theyre not gonna pull much, theyre just gonna plow forward and run bw the tackles. Unless Julius goes in there, then they might stretch.

Pass rush will be more than fine. They can't block all of our pass rushers. Pass coverage, and run defense is what concerns me. And having a good pass rush doesn't mean squat if we can't stop their run on 1st and 2nd down.

I will say this, our run defense was substantially better with our starters by the end of the PS. And our starting DT duo did a serviceable job. We gotta hope they can stay healthy though, because our backups are trash.

scottyboy
09-07-2007, 10:30 AM
I think theyre primarily a powerblocking unit. Theyre not gonna pull much, theyre just gonna plow forward and run bw the tackles. Unless Julius goes in there, then they might stretch.

Pass rush will be more than fine. They can't block all of our pass rushers. Pass coverage, and run defense is what concerns me. And having a good pass rush doesn't mean squat if we can't stop their run on 1st and 2nd down.

I will say this, our run defense was substantially better with our starters by the end of the PS. And our starting DT duo did a serviceable job. We gotta hope they can stay healthy though, because our backups are trash.

agreed, i really dont wanna think what would happen if we had to start Wily Jo, Manny Wright or Alford for a long stretch of time(although i feel Jay has some potential, a very good pass rushing DT, he'll be very good with Osi rushing in the future...)

bigbluedefense
09-07-2007, 10:32 AM
agreed, i really dont wanna think what would happen if we had to start Wily Jo, Manny Wright or Alford for a long stretch of time(although i feel Jay has some potential, a very good pass rushing DT, he'll be very good with Osi rushing in the future...)

Yeah, I like Alford strictly as a situational pass rusher for this year. He needs to pack on weight to be a fulltime player.

Did he play UT or End in Penn State's defense last year? I don't remember.

Jughead10
09-07-2007, 10:33 AM
Yeah, I like Alford strictly as a situational pass rusher for this year. He needs to pack on weight to be a fulltime player.

Did he play UT or End in Penn State's defense last year? I don't remember.

He must have because the starter at NT for the Colts last night was a rookie from PSU.

robert_in_bigd
09-07-2007, 11:27 AM
Burnett can't cover Shockey anyway, so its not like he's gonna help so much in coverage over James anyway.

BBD, don't be so sure of that.

Not saying shut down, but Burnett in coverage is much better than Roy WIlliams and Bradie James. He also has looked fantastic in his play. IMHO best of the preseason by far (not saying much about value of preseason but ...)

On run defense, I know you like Bradie, but I noticed he seems to lack gap discipline in this system Seems like he is running around trying to "make plays."

(** the new stupid buzz word in Dallas for lack of discipline on D and over commiting**)

Go to the Ahman Green run to see v Texans. Show you exactly what I hate about Bradie and Roy. Also noticed Bradie just taking the wrong gaps on blitzs. Wrong hole, wrong time. With all that -- he is much faster and lighter this year. So it should help him in zone and man coverage.

Honestly, you guys should be running counters, draws and play action to get this Wade D going in one direction and taking it the other way.

Either way, I just see the linebackers and DL playing 100% Testoterone football with zero brains.

If you guys try try to run your base O -- I see issues physically versus our D..

Number 10
09-07-2007, 12:55 PM
Bradie James does lack discipline but that was more of an issue with Tiki running than it will be with BJ. Perhaps Tiki's greatest attribute was his ability to read a defense a find a hole before it existed. Jacobs doesn't have that kinf of instinct, not yet anyway, and James will be able to get after him without discipline and get away with it more than with #21 in the backfield.