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Paul
01-26-2007, 08:10 AM
Which team will get that 6th ring first?

bigmac076
01-26-2007, 08:11 AM
definetly Cowboys, no biased opinions here, :roll:

01-26-2007, 08:19 AM
I went cowboys.

They have the most positions solved to do so.

Pittsburg is kinds startin different which might hurt or help, but alot of key players are older/FA soon.

San Fran has a long way to go still.

eazyb81
01-26-2007, 08:21 AM
Niners, they are a team on the rise.

Mr. Stiller
01-26-2007, 08:29 AM
We have a lot of change going on, but the Cowboys do as well. They have more questions regarding players than the Steelers do. Also we're keeping the 3-4.

JLIS24
01-26-2007, 08:35 AM
New England :lol:

FloridaFootball
01-26-2007, 09:11 AM
Redskins.











I hate my team.. :cry:

jag
01-26-2007, 09:12 AM
I forgot to mention the Jags are preparing for a 6 year run of owning the NFL.

portermvp84
01-26-2007, 09:25 AM
I'm gonna say 49ers they are the team of the future, I don't see Dallas going to the SB any time soon.

NFLBOY
01-26-2007, 09:26 AM
Steelers have more players in place than the other teams. It's just hard to get to the superbowl, let alone win it. Of course playing in the NFC there is a better chance of going because of how pathetic the teams are, just winning it would be very tough. I can't see the niners or the cowboys beating any of the top AFC teams.

IBleedNavyandOrange
01-26-2007, 09:35 AM
Seeing this thread reminds me of how much I hate each of these teams.

And as much as it pains me, I gotta say the 49ers will get there first. Dallas is held together by spit and bailing wire, Pittsburgh has serious problems, and SF is actually re-building and winning games in the process.

Smooth Criminal
01-26-2007, 09:46 AM
Both Dallas and Pittsburgh will have new HCs. Could take some time for them to create a superbowl calibur team.

I don't see San Fran in a superbowl anytime soon either. There just isn't enough talent on that team. Gore completely carried that team this year. They arn't ready for a run.

So my answer is that there won't be one any time soon.

TitleTown088
01-26-2007, 09:57 AM
Packers. They will win three more superbowls before Favre decides to return to the heavens.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 12:48 PM
Well, during the middle of the season I would've said dallas...but now they look like a mess.

Steelers could be, but it all depends on what kind of coach tomlin is. They have alot of pieces already, it depends on if they can get some consistency out of big ben. He seems to play his best football when they keep his passes under 30(1 touchdown, 7 interceptions when he goes over). If they go back to running the ball and relying on that great defense, I think they can get it.

I think the niners have the next best chance. We're well coached, and just need a #1 wide receiver and for smith to mature. That defense, despite it's talent flaws, had an amazing turn around in the second half of last season...if we can get some talent in the front 7, I think we can be dangerous. Nolan seems to have a very good scheme for our secondary, despite what everyone here thinks, its not that bad. Our corners are not that bad. We had our 3 game losing streak when shawntae spencer was injured and had to rely on sammy davis(ask chargers fans about how bad he is). Walt harris was probably one of the better corners in the league this year(11 turnovers created and I know if someone looked up the stats, he probably only gave up 1-2 touchdowns).After the chicago game(when nolan decided to take over the defense since billy davis wasn't getting it done), we gave up ZERO 300 yard passers, and only 2 100 yard receivers, with a pretty abysmal pass rush.

Well, theres alot of factors in there, but I think...as of RIGHT NOW...the steelers have the best chance, followed by the niners and then cowboys. That's as unbiased as I can get, but I still voted for the niners lol.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 12:57 PM
Both Dallas and Pittsburgh will have new HCs. Could take some time for them to create a superbowl calibur team.

I don't see San Fran in a superbowl anytime soon either. There just isn't enough talent on that team. Gore completely carried that team this year. They arn't ready for a run.

So my answer is that there won't be one any time soon.

Defensively, yes...but offensively theres some talent growing here. If we keep norv turner, expect alex smith to have a break out year, vernon davis came on strong towards the end of the year...and our interior offensive line played incredibly well this year. Offensively, we're just missing a right tackle and a wide receiver, although vernon davis could make up. Defenses are easier to fix(especially when you have our cap), than offenses...so i'd say we're in pretty good shape.

NFLBOY
01-26-2007, 01:22 PM
Seeing this thread reminds me of how much I hate each of these teams.

And as much as it pains me, I gotta say the 49ers will get there first. Dallas is held together by spit and bailing wire, Pittsburgh has serious problems, and SF is actually re-building and winning games in the process. How do you figure the Steelers have serious problems? I'd really like to hear this one. The niners have 1 guy and that is Frank Gore. Cowboys are the team that has the most problems. T.O. That is the reason they will not go any time soon.

someone447
01-26-2007, 02:06 PM
Well the Packers have had 6 championships for 63 years, so you guys are a little late. The Bears for 61. So I think this question is moot.

Geo
01-26-2007, 02:36 PM
A few months short of a year ago, I said the 49ers on the Football's Future forums and was subsequently laughed at. Funny that.

Xiomera
01-26-2007, 02:44 PM
49ers . . . they play in a weak division in the weaker conference. It's an easier road to the Super Bowl for them.

eazyb81
01-26-2007, 02:59 PM
Well the Packers have had 6 championships for 63 years, so you guys are a little late. The Bears for 61. So I think this question is moot.

The Packers only have 3 SB championships, which is what this thread is referring to.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 03:19 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 03:30 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

That was when billy davis was our defensive coordinator. The guy's schemes just didn't work and caused defensive players to be caught out of position. Nolan took over the defense after the bears game and we had a complete turn around. And building blocks? How about vernon davis, frank gore, alex smith, our whole offensive line minus kwame harris and a pretty good coaching staff. Like I said in my other post, offensively we're missing a right tackle and a true #1 wide receiver....although, we dont even need that. We could settle with a bunch of really good receivers rather than one great one since we have vernon davis.

eazyb81
01-26-2007, 03:32 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 03:38 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

eazyb81
01-26-2007, 03:42 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

The players you named seem like obvious choices for emerging stars at the time, but I think you held them in higher regard than most because you're a Bears fan. The Niners have emerging young players too, you just don't know enough about them because your not a SF fan.

Spin it however you want, but no one outside of Chicago looked at that 4-12 Bears team in 02 and thought "wow, now THAT's a team on the rise!"

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 03:45 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

The players you named seem like obvious choices for emerging stars at the time, but I think you held them in higher regard than most because you're a Bears fan. The Niners have emerging young players too, you just don't know enough about them because your not a SF fan.

Spin it however you want, but no one outside of Chicago looked at that 4-12 Bears team in 02 and thought "wow, now THAT's a team on the rise!"
The team in '02 was terrible. Everyone from the 2001 13-3 team was injured, old, or just overated. We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor.

Again, I would like to hear where the building blocks on the team are outside of Frank Gore? Their best two defensive players are a year or two away from retiring. After that there is Brandon Moore, who I don't think anyone is going to build a team around.

If you want a team that looks primed to return to their days of yore I give you, sadly, the Green Bay Packers.

eazyb81
01-26-2007, 03:53 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

The players you named seem like obvious choices for emerging stars at the time, but I think you held them in higher regard than most because you're a Bears fan. The Niners have emerging young players too, you just don't know enough about them because your not a SF fan.

Spin it however you want, but no one outside of Chicago looked at that 4-12 Bears team in 02 and thought "wow, now THAT's a team on the rise!"
Again, I would like to hear where the building blocks on the team are outside of Frank Gore? Their best two defensive players are a year or two away from retiring. After that there is Brandon Moore, who I don't think anyone is going to build a team around.


Frank Gore? Alex Smith? Vernon Davis? Manny Lawson? Shawntae Spencer? Whoever they draft at #11 this year? Don't be naive, this team has some young players that have the potential to be stars. They haven't reached their potential thus far, but that's not the point - we're trying to project what could happen in the future.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 04:13 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

The players you named seem like obvious choices for emerging stars at the time, but I think you held them in higher regard than most because you're a Bears fan. The Niners have emerging young players too, you just don't know enough about them because your not a SF fan.

Spin it however you want, but no one outside of Chicago looked at that 4-12 Bears team in 02 and thought "wow, now THAT's a team on the rise!"
Again, I would like to hear where the building blocks on the team are outside of Frank Gore? Their best two defensive players are a year or two away from retiring. After that there is Brandon Moore, who I don't think anyone is going to build a team around.


Frank Gore? Alex Smith? Vernon Davis? Manny Lawson? Shawntae Spencer? Whoever they draft at #11 this year? Don't be naive, this team has some young players that have the potential to be stars. They haven't reached their potential thus far, but that's not the point - we're trying to project what could happen in the future.

I find it funny that he says
The team in '02 was terrible. Everyone from the 2001 13-3 team was injured, old, or just overated. We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor. and then asks us what our building blocks are(btw, he did a great job skipping over my post, because I mentioned the same building blocks). He described our same situation, alex smith is STILL the youngest starting quarterback in the league(22, he was a 21 year old rookie and 20 when he was drafted), frank gores only 23, vernon davis is still just 22, justin smiley is only 25, who was called one of the best guards in the league by tommy harris and gave up ZERO sacks this year). I could go on. I'm not saying we're going to the superbowl next year, but atleast acknowledge that the building blocks are there.

49ersfan_87
01-26-2007, 05:46 PM
The Bears in 2087.

By the way, what's with all the 49'ers noise? Just because they weren't terrible last year doesn't make them a Superbowl contendor anytime soon. What do they really have in terms of building blocks other than Frank Gore and maaaaaaaaybe Alex Smith? When they played the elite teams they still got beat like a drum (see Bears-Chargers). I don't think any team can have realistic Superbowl expectations for the next 3-4 years.

Who would have said the Bears had realistic SB aspirations 3 or 4 years ago? All they had was Urlacher and a bunch of crap. A lot change in a span of 4 years.
Three years ago we had Urlacher, Mike Brown, Olin Kruetz who were all at the very top of their game. We also had emerging young players Lance Briggs, Nathan Vasher, Tommie Harris, and Charles Tillman.

Anybody that didn't see the Bears as a team on the rise in 2003-2004 wasn't paying attention. We would have been much better in 2004 had we not been devestated by injuries. Keep in mind the biggest reason we had losing seasons was Grossman continually going down and being stuck with Chad Hutchison, Kordell Stewart, and the 500 year old Chris Chandler at QB. The team as a whole was very solid, it was just a few positions that were so bad they were holding everyone else back.

I couldn't name one players on the Niners defense besides Walt Harris who we drafted in 1996 that did anything last year. Again, maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see it.

The players you named seem like obvious choices for emerging stars at the time, but I think you held them in higher regard than most because you're a Bears fan. The Niners have emerging young players too, you just don't know enough about them because your not a SF fan.

Spin it however you want, but no one outside of Chicago looked at that 4-12 Bears team in 02 and thought "wow, now THAT's a team on the rise!"
The team in '02 was terrible. Everyone from the 2001 13-3 team was injured, old, or just overated. We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor.

Again, I would like to hear where the building blocks on the team are outside of Frank Gore? Their best two defensive players are a year or two away from retiring. After that there is Brandon Moore, who I don't think anyone is going to build a team around.

If you want a team that looks primed to return to their days of yore I give you, sadly, the Green Bay Packers.

49er building blocks

Alex Smith, QB
Frank Gore, RB
Vernon Davis, TE
Shawntae Spencer, CB
Manny Lawson, OLB
Brandon Moore, ILB (not a beast but solid at what he does)
Justin Smiley, G
David Baas, G
Adam Snyder, T

I dont know if they win 6 first, i was surprised to read that. I hope its true but i dont know.

Anyways, to say they are no building blocks isn't an accurate assesment. There are many. Also some others are guys like brandon williams, parys haralson, delanie walker, and michael robinson. All were pretty raw this year.

As well, some other guys that likely wont start but be good backups are guys like Ronald Fields and Melvin Oliver.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 06:59 PM
What have Vernon Davis, Manny Lawson, or Alex Smith done other than getting drafted really high to prove that they are players to build around? Just being a 1st round pick doesn't cut it.

I really like the Niners running game and their O-line seems like one to build around, but your skill players outside of Smith are underwhelming and when Brandon Moore is your best young defensive player that isn't going to impress anyone, at least not me. Nor is saying, well the player that we're going to draft at #11 as if you already know that player is going to be good. Just assuming that all of your young players are going to develop is a really lame argument. Teams like the Packers and the Jets have many more young players that are already playing well.

Again, just naming players that are young doesn't mean they are good. Parys Haralson? Delanie Walker? Ronald Fields? What the hell?

49ersfan_87
01-26-2007, 07:11 PM
What have Vernon Davis, Manny Lawson, or Alex Smith done other than getting drafted really high to prove that they are players to build around? Just being a 1st round pick doesn't cut it.

I really like the Niners running game and their O-line seems like one to build around, but your skill players outside of Smith are underwhelming and when Brandon Moore is your best young defensive player that isn't going to impress anyone, at least not me. Nor is saying, well the player that we're going to draft at #11 as if you already know that player is going to be good. Just assuming that all of your young players are going to develop is a really lame argument. Teams like the Packers and the Jets have many more young players that are already playing well.

Again, just naming players that are young doesn't mean they are good. Parys Haralson? Delanie Walker? Ronald Fields? What the hell?

I said Potentially for guys like walker, etc. I also said backups, not starters, which was why i made a different list.

They all have talent. Obviously they havent displayed all of it yet. VD displayed some great playmaking skills in several games. Lawson was a beast in coverage but a major dissapointment in pass rush (2.5 sacks..come on, lawson is better than that)
Smith played efficient, and although his stats arent the greatest, very few of his INT's were of mental error. He also went through stages. He played good at times and awful at other times.

I see no reason to see why they are not building blocks. They have talent, and have displayed some of it, but have not been consistent. They could all bust horribly and i could be wrong or they could all be all-pros. But i count them as building blocks because they have only improved with each game.

I also never brought up "the player we will draft at 11". Im not counting that until i see the player we draft in TC.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 07:13 PM
If they are inconsistent how can they improve with each game? That's a complete contradiction.

And I know you didn't, but eazy did. I'm adressing multiple posts.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 07:16 PM
What have Vernon Davis, Manny Lawson, or Alex Smith done other than getting drafted really high to prove that they are players to build around? Just being a 1st round pick doesn't cut it.

I really like the Niners running game and their O-line seems like one to build around, but your skill players outside of Smith are underwhelming and when Brandon Moore is your best young defensive player that isn't going to impress anyone, at least not me. Nor is saying, well the player that we're going to draft at #11 as if you already know that player is going to be good. Just assuming that all of your young players are going to develop is a really lame argument. Teams like the Packers and the Jets have many more young players that are already playing well.

Again, just naming players that are young doesn't mean they are good. Parys Haralson? Delanie Walker? Ronald Fields? What the hell?

I'd really like an explanation of this quote
We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor.

I find it incredibly intriguing. See, it's easy to say in retrospect that you guys were "clearly a few peices away from being a contender". How exactly were you guys a few peices. You had a qb that couldnt stay healthy and didn't show squat, a wide receiving corp that COMBINED for 3 touchdowns and virtually zero running game(although thomas came on strong towards the end, it still didnt look very bright). You're offense in 04 scored as many points as your defense allowed this year. How exactly were you a few pieces away?

Face it, nobody expected the bears to be in the superbowl 2 years from then. Like I said, vernon davis came on strong towards the end of the season and showed flashes of why we drafted him 6th overall. Alex Smith also finished the season strong, leading us to clutch second half victories against the broncos and seahawks. On defense, we have manny lawson whos been amazing in coverage this year. His passrushing skils need a little work but his coverage is solid. Ronald fields was actually one of our better players on the defensive line this year, he was a great run stuffer and the niners like him at defensive end in the 3-4. Shawntae spencer is getting better and better in coverage and we had our 3 game losing streak(right after our 3 game winning streak), when he was injured. Keith lewis was a force this year at safety. He really set the tone in the broncos game by taking a couple personal foul injuries early, but the broncos receivers were shaken up the whole game. I REALLY don't know what else to tell you. If you saw potential in the 04 bears team, I really don't know how you cant see potential in this one.

Its pretty clear you havent watched any niner game this year outside the one where the bears whooped us. And like I said, nolan took over the defense after that game because billy davis(who got fired) was not experienced enough to run a defense. If you watched more of our games, you'd see the potential thats there.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 07:19 PM
If they are inconsistent how can they improve with each game? That's a complete contradiction.

And I know you didn't, but eazy did. I'm adressing multiple posts.

consistency comes with experience. And he's right, most smiths interceptions didn't come because of mental errors, it was usually a tipped pass from a receiver. Even the one in the bears game came because the corner took the ball away from antonio bryant whie he was trying to catch it. You can't blame those on him.

Btw, I'd REALLY like a definition of building blocks because if those aren't building blocks, I DUNNO WHAT IS.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 07:20 PM
What have Vernon Davis, Manny Lawson, or Alex Smith done other than getting drafted really high to prove that they are players to build around? Just being a 1st round pick doesn't cut it.

I really like the Niners running game and their O-line seems like one to build around, but your skill players outside of Smith are underwhelming and when Brandon Moore is your best young defensive player that isn't going to impress anyone, at least not me. Nor is saying, well the player that we're going to draft at #11 as if you already know that player is going to be good. Just assuming that all of your young players are going to develop is a really lame argument. Teams like the Packers and the Jets have many more young players that are already playing well.

Again, just naming players that are young doesn't mean they are good. Parys Haralson? Delanie Walker? Ronald Fields? What the hell?

I'd really like an explanation of this quote
We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor.

I find it incredibly intriguing. See, it's easy to say in retrospect that you guys were "clearly a few peices away from being a contender". How exactly were you guys a few peices. You had a qb that couldnt stay healthy and didn't show squat, a wide receiving corp that COMBINED for 3 touchdowns and virtually no running game(although thomas came on strong towards the end, it still didnt look very bright). You're offense in 04 scored as many points as your defense allowed this year. How exactly were you a few pieces away?

Face it, nobody expected the bears to be in the superbowl 2 years from then. Like I said, vernon davis came on strong towards the end of the season and showed flashes of why we drafted him 6th overall. Alex Smith also finished the season strong, leading us to clutch second half victories against the broncos and seahawks. On defense, we have manny lawson whos been amazing in coverage this year. His passrushing skils need a little work but his coverage is solid. Ronald fields was actually one of our better players on the defensive line this year, he was a great run stuffer and the niners like him at defensive end in the 3-4. Shawntae spencer is getting better and better in coverage and we had our 3 game losing streak(right after our 3 game winning streak), when he was injured. Keith lewis was a force this year at safety. He really set the tone in the broncos game by taking a couple personal foul injuries early, but the broncos receivers were shaken up the whole game. I REALLY don't know what else to tell you. If you saw potential in the 04 bears team, I really don't know how you cant see potential in this one.

Its pretty clear you havent watched any niner game this year outside the one where the bears whooped us. And like I said, nolan took over the defense after that game because billy davis(who got fired) was not experienced enough to run a defense. If you watched more of our games, you'd see the potential thats there.

49ersfan_87
01-26-2007, 07:23 PM
If they are inconsistent how can they improve with each game? That's a complete contradiction.

And I know you didn't, but eazy did. I'm adressing multiple posts.

Because they arent complete players. Examples

Manny Lawson- Excelled in coverage and grew from game 1 to game 16. Grew

Was terrible in pass rushing- Inconsistency

Vernon Davis

Became a great blocker-grew

At times displayed his homerun threat, at other times had problems catching the ball- inconsistency

There are many facets to the game. Its possible to grow and still be inconsistent.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 07:31 PM
Well first off we ran for over 1,300 yards in 2004, so your comment about us having no running game is completely uninformed and flat out wrong.

Our defense was complete in 2004. Everyone said that at the time. Although our statistics weren't dominant that year that was mostly due to a terrible offense and injuries that took their toll late in the year. The problem was at Quarterback, skill positions, and Left Tackle. We fixed those three positions and boom, we're in the playoffs. The players that I had already mentioned were coming into their own and actually making names for themselves. By that time everyone knew who Tillman, Harris, Vasher, and Briggs were. On top of guys that were already established like Urlacher, Kruetz, Mike Brown, and Alex Brown. We also added veterans like John Tait and Adewale Ogunleye who had been successful elsewhere but were still young.

Who do the Niners have that is established outside of Gore? Vernon Davis looked pretty good, but is he your future primariy pass catcher? Are Antonio Bryant and Arnez Battle the answer?

Being "amazing in coverage" doesn't cut it for what needs to be a primier rush-linebacker who is supposed to be the guy you build your defense around (or at least he better be, cause I've yet to get a better name).

The two games you've made reference too (which are really the only ones cause you didn't beat anyone else of note) were a positive sign. Although anyone that really watched the Seahawks game knows that was much more them blowing it than the Niners doing anything special.

Your team is based around running Frank Gore into the ground. Sorry if that doesn't spell future Superbowl contendor to me. The Niners just seem like a catchy team to root for cause they are young and have high draft picks, much like the Cardinals and Lions have been in the past. I just don't see the organizational structure there to be amongst the elite in the next few years. You need elite players to build around, and I don't see 'em.

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 07:34 PM
What have Vernon Davis, Manny Lawson, or Alex Smith done other than getting drafted really high to prove that they are players to build around? Just being a 1st round pick doesn't cut it.

I really like the Niners running game and their O-line seems like one to build around, but your skill players outside of Smith are underwhelming and when Brandon Moore is your best young defensive player that isn't going to impress anyone, at least not me. Nor is saying, well the player that we're going to draft at #11 as if you already know that player is going to be good. Just assuming that all of your young players are going to develop is a really lame argument. Teams like the Packers and the Jets have many more young players that are already playing well.

Again, just naming players that are young doesn't mean they are good. Parys Haralson? Delanie Walker? Ronald Fields? What the hell?

I'd really like an explanation of this quote
We had a tremendous draft in 2003 and a very good one in 2004. Even though we were 12-20 in 2003-2004, we were the youngest team in the league and clearly a few pieces away from a being a contendor.

I find it incredibly intriguing. See, it's easy to say in retrospect that you guys were "clearly a few peices away from being a contender". How exactly were you guys a few peices. You had a qb that couldnt stay healthy and didn't show squat, a wide receiving corp that COMBINED for 3 touchdowns and virtually no running game(although thomas came on strong towards the end, it still didnt look very bright). You're offense in 04 scored as many points as your defense allowed this year. How exactly were you a few pieces away?

Face it, nobody expected the bears to be in the superbowl 2 years from then. Like I said, vernon davis came on strong towards the end of the season and showed flashes of why we drafted him 6th overall. Alex Smith also finished the season strong, leading us to clutch second half victories against the broncos and seahawks. On defense, we have manny lawson whos been amazing in coverage this year. His passrushing skils need a little work but his coverage is solid. Ronald fields was actually one of our better players on the defensive line this year, he was a great run stuffer and the niners like him at defensive end in the 3-4. Shawntae spencer is getting better and better in coverage and we had our 3 game losing streak(right after our 3 game winning streak), when he was injured. Keith lewis was a force this year at safety. He really set the tone in the broncos game by taking a couple personal foul injuries early, but the broncos receivers were shaken up the whole game. I REALLY don't know what else to tell you. If you saw potential in the 04 bears team, I really don't know how you cant see potential in this one.

Its pretty clear you havent watched any niner game this year outside the one where the bears whooped us. And like I said, nolan took over the defense after that game because billy davis(who got fired) was not experienced enough to run a defense. If you watched more of our games, you'd see the potential thats there.
Wanna give me 5 seconds there chief?

bearsfan_51
01-26-2007, 07:37 PM
If they are inconsistent how can they improve with each game? That's a complete contradiction.

And I know you didn't, but eazy did. I'm adressing multiple posts.
Btw, I'd REALLY like a definition of building blocks because if those aren't building blocks, I DUNNO WHAT IS.
Building blocks = Young players that have shown consistant play that borders on dominance at times.

Frank Gore is a building block. Aaron Kampman is a building block. Tommie Harris is a building block (before he got hurt anyway). Shawne Merriman is a building block.

A rookie whose job it is to rush the quarterback that has 2.5 sacks, not a building block. A Quarterback that has 10 more career INT's than TD's, not a building block. A rookie with 20 catches, not a building block.

Again, any of those three COULD be, but to talk about the Niners as if they are already a playoff contendor is way too premature.

49ersfan_87
01-26-2007, 07:44 PM
If they are inconsistent how can they improve with each game? That's a complete contradiction.

And I know you didn't, but eazy did. I'm adressing multiple posts.
Btw, I'd REALLY like a definition of building blocks because if those aren't building blocks, I DUNNO WHAT IS.
Building blocks = Young players that have shown consistant play that borders on dominance at times.

Frank Gore is a building block. Aaron Kampman is a building block. Tommie Harris is a building block (before he got hurt anyway). Shawne Merriman is a building block.

A rookie whose job it is to rush the quarterback that has 2.5 sacks, not a building block. A Quarterback that has 10 more career INT's than TD's, not a building block. A rookie with 20 catches, not a building block.

Again, any of those three COULD be, but to talk about the Niners as if they are already a playoff contendor is way too premature.

Manny Lawson-Rushing the QB was not his primary job. When was it his primary job?whenever he did it, he wasnt good at it, but that was not his primary job.

Alex Smith- dont know what the hell is up with him. I cant make a 100% definitive arguement either way.

Vernon Davis- stats only. He was injured for many games, and was eased back into the offense for other games. He missed 6 games due to injury and in his first game back was eased back into the offense. So 9 games. And he played very well, in several facets of the game. A TE has to block too. He displayed homerun abilities, and was a good blocker. Just needs to grasp the game better.

I dont think SF is a playoff contender. I am flattered by what people here are saying, but i dont think SF makes the playoffs next year.

WeaselBird
01-26-2007, 07:50 PM
Well first off we ran for over 1,300 yards in 2004, so your comment about us having no running game is completely uninformed and flat out wrong.

Our defense was complete in 2004. Everyone said that at the time. Although our statistics weren't dominant that year that was mostly due to a terrible offense and injuries that took their toll late in the year. The problem was at Quarterback, skill positions, and Left Tackle. We fixed those three positions and boom, we're in the playoffs. The players that I had already mentioned were coming into their own and actually making names for themselves. By that time everyone knew who Tillman, Harris, Vasher, and Briggs were. On top of guys that were already established like Urlacher, Kruetz, Mike Brown, and Alex Brown. We also added veterans like John Tait and Adewale Ogunleye who had been successful elsewhere but were still young.

Who do the Niners have that is established outside of Gore? Vernon Davis looked pretty good, but is he your future primariy pass catcher? Are Antonio Bryant and Arnez Battle the answer?

Being "amazing in coverage" doesn't cut it for what needs to be a primier rush-linebacker who is supposed to be the guy you build your defense around (or at least he better be, cause I've yet to get a better name).

The two games you've made reference too (which are really the only ones cause you didn't beat anyone else of note) were a positive sign. Although anyone that really watched the Seahawks game knows that was much more them blowing it than the Niners doing anything special.

Your team is based around running Frank Gore into the ground. Sorry if that doesn't spell future Superbowl contendor to me. The Niners just seem like a catchy team to root for cause they are young and have high draft picks, much like the Cardinals and Lions have been in the past. I just don't see the organizational structure there to be amongst the elite in the next few years. You need elite players to build around, and I don't see 'em.

Yea you guys were such a dominant rushing team that your headcoach decided to draft a runningback right? The niners, who had the #1 pick that year, rushed for 1449 yards that year. Did that mean we had a great running game? Nope, we were still averaging 3.3 yards a carry. Btw, saying "all we needed was a quarterback and skill positions" is ALOT OF NEED. You're basically saying you needed an offense. Our team, this year, just needs another wide receiver to along with antonio bryant(733 yards and 18 something yards per catch) and arnaz battle(60 catches this year as a #2). And, YES, our team is built around the run. We dont run the west coast offense anymore. We run the coryell offense, which focuses around a run and playaction.

And how can you say "Being "amazing in coverage" doesn't cut it for what needs to be a primier rush-linebacker who is supposed to be the guy you build your defense around". That's one of the hardest things for converted linebackers. He's way ahead of where he should be in terms of coverage. We already have TWO peices of the 4 linebackers we need to run a 3-4. We can grab a guy like adalius thomas to cover one more side and draft a guy like patrick willis to play inside with brandon moore. Nolan has a great defensive scheme, he knows how to game plan defensively. Defense is ALOT easier to fix than offense. We've got all the building blocks(which is the whole point of all of this, you said we have none) on offense. This was their first year under norv turner. Alex smith is maturing, frank gores is leading the nfc in rushing, vernon davis is starting to come in to his own....Like you guys were in 04, we're just missing an elite wide receiver and a right tackle. I REALLY don't understand how you can say we don't have building blocks.

PackerFan20
01-26-2007, 09:22 PM
Both Dallas and Pit are getting new coaches so it could take them longer to regroup. Niners have a rising team with a RB who can put up LT like numbers and the NFL's fastest TE.

moc182
01-26-2007, 09:54 PM
San Fran. Going to the playoffs next year, mark it down.

49ersfan_87
01-26-2007, 10:10 PM
I am actually surprised at all the love SF is getting. I suppose as a big fan i tend to be a little over analytical, and instead of looking at the good, i look at the bad. Im not to sure if a lot of love that SF is getting is due to the fact they beat the broncos and seahawks both on the road, but i like the base of talent nolan is assembling. I wont go and say its a team of all-pros, but i like the potential they have shown.

I actually made a thread exactly like this a couple of months back, and picked dallas. Now, months later, i still think dallas. Good QB, good RB combo (although julius jones is the weaker RB), good TE, one of the top young players in the game in demarcus ware. Im not to sure about the steelers because of a new HC and possible new scheme for D in a few years, and SF needs to make the playoffs before i say they have a shot at a SB. So, i voted dallas.

I hope im wrong..