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The Legend
09-27-2007, 10:52 PM
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/2007-09-27-243721704_x.htm

"We once praised people for being tough," Lewis said. "We once praised the Jack Lamberts and the Dick Butkuses and all those guys. Now, in today's game, if you hit somebody too hard you'll get fined. If you just jaw with somebody - you could be friends just talking back and forth in great, spirited competition - then you'll get in trouble.

"Everyone knows that you can throw the ball 50 yards downfield and it will be 50-50 on getting pass interference or roughing the passer," he said. "That's why the game has totally changed from the perspective of the game itself. That's what makes it very difficult for a person, even with my mind-set, who understood old school football.

I agree with everything he has said, its like went from baseball to softball

sadly we all know theres nothing we can do about it but respect the past player and know that old school football is dead

Dolfan2788
09-27-2007, 11:29 PM
I agree with the pass interference. Once the receiver touches the DB its fair game and they can tussle it out for the ball.

I also remember last year when Zach Thomas accidentally hit Coles a little with the helmet, although the vision wasn't entirely conclusive and got fined.

Paranoidmoonduck
09-28-2007, 12:23 AM
I do think that the roughing the passer calls have bordered on ridiculous, but I also think that the average life span and later life complications that afflicted most footballs players from that era that Ray Lewis seems to love so much should be avoided at all reasonable costs.

steelernation77
09-28-2007, 01:01 AM
I feel like the NFL has made some good decisions regarding illegal hits. There's too many consequences from unecessary, vicious hits. I feel like the NFL should get on ESPN and other networks for promoting illegal hits on segments like "jacked up." They should also think about who they're using to promote the league. Guys like Troy P. and Peyton Manning should be focused on, instead of the Owens, Merriman types. On a side note, I really don't like hearing the holy name of Jack Lambert coming out of Ray Ray's mouth. It seems sacrelige.

Shiver
09-28-2007, 02:39 AM
Jacked up ruled.

Geo
09-28-2007, 02:43 AM
I've no interest in anything that comes from Ray Ray's mouth, but I'll say this:

Refs aren't caling offensive pass interference enough, I feel. Even when it's practically blatant.

JK17
09-28-2007, 09:33 AM
I feel like the NFL has made some good decisions regarding illegal hits. There's too many consequences from unecessary, vicious hits. I feel like the NFL should get on ESPN and other networks for promoting illegal hits on segments like "jacked up." They should also think about who they're using to promote the league. Guys like Troy P. and Peyton Manning should be focused on, instead of the Owens, Merriman types. On a side note, I really don't like hearing the holy name of Jack Lambert coming out of Ray Ray's mouth. It seems sacrelige.

First of all, you don't think Troy P. and Manning are focused on to promote the league. Turn on a football game and try to make it through one commercial session without seeing Peyton Manning's face, or Troy Polamalu helping kids. As for Merriman and Owens, they have sketchy pasts that aren't worth promoting (steroids and attitude issues) but neither has done anything this year but be a team player. Besides what does the League do to promote TO? I know Merriman had a commercial, but TO? Those are outside influences, like ESPN, Nike, etc. who promote those guys, what do you want the NFL to do about that?

The United Way commercials though, the player of the year commercials, most things NFL promoted, all focus around guys like Peyton Manning, Troy Polamalu, LT....guys who are role models. They can't dictate what ESPN or Nike broadcasts.

Man_Of_Steel
09-28-2007, 09:53 AM
I totally agree, too many restrictions are being put into football whether it be celebrations or cant touch the wr. Hopefully the next commish (however long it will take) reverts back to old football.

trkaline
09-28-2007, 10:10 AM
Football was created as a brutal, punch-you-in-the-mouth-if-you-can't-handle-it-go-home-and-cry-about-it-game...now it's mostly crying...GO BACK TO REAL FOOTBALL JERKS!!!!!

Twiddler
09-28-2007, 10:20 AM
Football was created as a brutal, punch-you-in-the-mouth-if-you-can't-handle-it-go-home-and-cry-about-it-game...now it's mostly crying...GO BACK TO REAL FOOTBALL JERKS!!!!!

I think Andre Waters would have disagreed.

As for some of the limitations, yeah they can be ridiculous especially the limitations on celebrations and I do think that defensive backs get a little screwed in the pass interference part of the game.

bigbluedefense
09-28-2007, 10:21 AM
Contact is what makes football football. I agree with Ray, theyre getting ridiculous with some of these flags. Offensive players are getting way too much nowadays.

And thats why you see so many jerkoff diva WRs these days.

However, we don't want it to be like the 70s, or half of everyone's rosters would be on IR by week 8. They just need to tone down with some of these ridiculous rules geared towards the offense. Its becoming a bit much.

trkaline
09-28-2007, 10:27 AM
I think Andre Waters would have disagreed.

As for some of the limitations, yeah they can be ridiculous especially the limitations on celebrations and I do think that defensive backs get a little screwed in the pass interference part of the game.

Look, they all know what kind of game it is when they suit up... oldskool football played like that, they had to have other jobs to survive ,these guys are paid millions to sacrifice there bodies for the love of the game and soon the QB's gonna be wearing flags...If your not willing to risk it all for the game why keep paying insane amounts of money???

JK17
09-28-2007, 10:44 AM
Look, they all know what kind of game it is when they suit up... oldskool football played like that, they had to have other jobs to survive ,these guys are paid millions to sacrifice there bodies for the love of the game and soon the QB's gonna be wearing flags...If your not willing to risk it all for the game why keep paying insane amounts of money???

They are in the entertainment industry though, thats why they are getting paid milliosn of dollars. It's not "to sacrifice their bodies for the love of the game". As much as it would be nice if players felt like that, you can't expect someone to sacrifice 20 years of their lives later on due to serious mental and physical debilitations. You should expect them to go all out, all the time, but some of the issues these ex-players from those eras have to deal with far outweighs the fans' desire to see hard hitting action.

That being said, yes, a lot of these rules are getting ridiculous and taking away from football, and the advancements in protection, surgery, etc. for the players make it a completely different era form before. Still, you can't expect these players to risk essentially their lives for the game.

trkaline
09-28-2007, 10:51 AM
They are in the entertainment industry though, thats why they are getting paid milliosn of dollars. It's not "to sacrifice their bodies for the love of the game". As much as it would be nice if players felt like that, you can't expect someone to sacrifice 20 years of their lives later on due to serious mental and physical debilitations. You should expect them to go all out, all the time, but some of the issues these ex-players from those eras have to deal with far outweighs the fans' desire to see hard hitting action.

That being said, yes, a lot of these rules are getting ridiculous and taking away from football, and the advancements in protection, surgery, etc. for the players make it a completely different era form before. Still, you can't expect these players to risk essentially their lives for the game.

I dont really want to see them beaten down and half ******** when they leave.. I over reacted a little bit to make a point. I just want them to let them play football..not completely oldskool but not the nonsense cant hit nobody or touch them without drawing a flag game..if we went back just a couple of years worth of rules i'd be satisfied...

JK17
09-28-2007, 10:53 AM
I dont really want to see them beaten down and half ******** when they leave.. I over reacted a little bit to make a point. I just want them to let them play football..not completely oldskool but not the nonsense cant hit nobody or touch them without drawing a flag game..if we went back just a couple of years worth of rules i'd be satisfied...

I'd agree on that, the roughing the passer calls, as most people agree and have said, are absurd. All it does is further the offense which is so much more marketable to the NFL.

terribletowel39
09-28-2007, 11:04 AM
I think Andre Waters would have disagreed.

As for some of the limitations, yeah they can be ridiculous especially the limitations on celebrations and I do think that defensive backs get a little screwed in the pass interference part of the game.
in all honesty i don't think Waters would have done it any different. He knew the consequences just like everyone else does. I agree with Ray for the most part. I wish most of the ppl were tough enough to play 70's football, but thats just not the case. Like someone said half of the league would be on IR.

senormysterioso
09-28-2007, 11:12 AM
the difference is that in the Lambert/Butkus days maybe one or two guys on the field ran in the 4.4 range and maybe 3-4 were above 260 and now everybody is 260+ and runs a 4.4. Plus the padding is so heavy duty that it's a weapon now. You have to protect these guys any way you can. The pass interference rules are getting rediculous though.

bigbluedefense
09-28-2007, 11:12 AM
in all honesty i don't think Waters would have done it any different. He knew the consequences just like everyone else does. I agree with Ray for the most part. I wish most of the ppl were tough enough to play 70's football, but thats just not the case. Like someone said half of the league would be on IR.

today's body just won't allow it.

Nowadays players are so hellbent on getting their body's perfect, that they get too wound up and tight. Their body's don't give as much, and with the speed of today's collisions, they tear this and that, pull this and that etc.

70s football will never happen again.

steelernation77
09-28-2007, 11:39 AM
First of all, you don't think Troy P. and Manning are focused on to promote the league. Turn on a football game and try to make it through one commercial session without seeing Peyton Manning's face, or Troy Polamalu helping kids. As for Merriman and Owens, they have sketchy pasts that aren't worth promoting (steroids and attitude issues) but neither has done anything this year but be a team player. Besides what does the League do to promote TO? I know Merriman had a commercial, but TO? Those are outside influences, like ESPN, Nike, etc. who promote those guys, what do you want the NFL to do about that?

The United Way commercials though, the player of the year commercials, most things NFL promoted, all focus around guys like Peyton Manning, Troy Polamalu, LT....guys who are role models. They can't dictate what ESPN or Nike broadcasts.

They might be able to put some pressure on what ESPN broadcasts. They don't have to make all game footage available to ESPN, or allow ABC/ESPN to broadcast games.

LonghornsLegend
09-28-2007, 11:44 AM
In defense to todays game, were injuries as series 30 years ago as they were now? I mean you act like the game hasnt changed some, would we still be able to play without facemask and leather helmets still? I think not...also when people keep getting carted off the field or incidents like Kevin Everett happen its going to make the NFL keep its stance...although him getting hurt had nothing to do with a bad hit I think it makes the league stay tough on these issues to try to keep injuries to a minimum...

Twiddler
09-28-2007, 12:17 PM
I dont really want to see them beaten down and half ******** when they leave.. I over reacted a little bit to make a point. I just want them to let them play football..not completely oldskool but not the nonsense cant hit nobody or touch them without drawing a flag game..if we went back just a couple of years worth of rules i'd be satisfied...

I understand that, believe me, I love seeing contact and love football for that reason but I think for how violent this game is now, I'm all for the league trying to protect its players so they can have lives after the game. And like I stated earlier, I do believe that some of the rules are much too protective, just not all.

For the earlier statement that Waters knew the consequences, I agree and disagree with this one. Yes, he most likely was completely aware of the physical problems he could have after years of football. If he was aware of the effect that multiple concussions could have on his after-football life is something that I'm not sold on.

Average OT LB
09-28-2007, 12:58 PM
They might be able to put some pressure on what ESPN broadcasts. They don't have to make all game footage available to ESPN, or allow ABC/ESPN to broadcast games.

the league is always trying to grow.. now that would be extremely counterproductive to not allow espn to show terrell owens or the 'bad guys' ...

instead they can try to do everyting they can - like fine and suspend players.. to prevent action like that.. now havent they done that? could it not be argued that all the rule changes shape the league into a league they dont have to disallow game footage? .. maybe they are trying to limi the bad exposure.. but are going about it a more efficient way- prevention

terribletowel39
09-28-2007, 04:30 PM
today's body just won't allow it.

Nowadays players are so hellbent on getting their body's perfect, that they get too wound up and tight. Their body's don't give as much, and with the speed of today's collisions, they tear this and that, pull this and that etc.

70s football will never happen again.
which is a sad thing because when you look at fiercest hits/big hits footage more than half come from old school football ages.

and to Twiddler, i agree with you that he didnt know the concussions would make him have a 85 year old brain when he was 40 something. but he knew that there was a possibility of major problems. i mean **** when he was playing there were stories about folks that played in the 50-60-70's that had post football injuries and what not. no way to know i guess if these players would have played the same if they were given the knowledge of what would be after they got done.

Twiddler
09-28-2007, 04:53 PM
which is a sad thing because when you look at fiercest hits/big hits footage more than half come from old school football ages.

and to Twiddler, i agree with you that he didnt know the concussions would make him have a 85 year old brain when he was 40 something. but he knew that there was a possibility of major problems. i mean **** when he was playing there were stories about folks that played in the 50-60-70's that had post football injuries and what not. no way to know i guess if these players would have played the same if they were given the knowledge of what would be after they got done.

Oh yeah I agree. Its obvious they knew there was some danger to their heads with how they are living their life but the extent that they understood was probably well short of safe. But who knows.

ks_perfection
09-28-2007, 08:56 PM
the league is always trying to grow.. now that would be extremely counterproductive to not allow espn to show terrell owens or the 'bad guys' ...

instead they can try to do everyting they can - like fine and suspend players.. to prevent action like that.. now havent they done that? could it not be argued that all the rule changes shape the league into a league they dont have to disallow game footage? .. maybe they are trying to limi the bad exposure.. but are going about it a more efficient way- prevention

There not going to get networks to not show footage that they don't want. And its not a good idea to go telling the media that they can't show what drives up there shows ratings; the media is huge in attracting fans and if you try to fight them the media will paint them in a negative light. They'll turn Goodell from looking tough strong leader to a dictator trying to control everything.

scottyboy
09-28-2007, 09:16 PM
screw this lets go back to leather helmets. When you're hurt, throw a slab of meat on it, you'll be fine.

trkaline
09-28-2007, 11:20 PM
That'll be cool

eaglesfan_45
09-28-2007, 11:49 PM
Guys get fined for any big hit now days. You can barely touch the Qaurterback and Cb's are always worried about if their going to be called for the Pass Interferance. The game is being played very cautiously and the fun is being taken out. You can't even celebrate a touchdown anymore. To's spygate celebration thing was funny and he was poking fun at the patriots. One day you'll score the game winning touchdown and all you can do is freaking give the ball to the ref and walk away. Th day that happens I will be a vary sad person.

We should listen to Chad Johnson NFL and make the NFL the National Fun League. Everything Ray Lewis said was right. NFL (National Fun League)