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toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 12:30 PM
A simple quickie, with minimal explanations, as I had figured to do one after this week. Probably more debatable than my last mock. Creating the order took long enough, hence why I probably wonít write as much as I do for some of my other mocks. Parity Ö making draft ordering so much more difficult (unless you just go with the records at the moment)! I was planning on doing one sometime the next two weeks anyways.

1. St. Louis Rams

I did not expect them to be this bad. I thought they had the potential to be good, NFC West title good, if not NFC contender good. That said, I knew the potential for problems existed, particularly on defense. But this Ö this is bad. This is a team that needs the offense to jump out to a lead to protect this defense, and the collapse of the OL hurts that ability. I could see them going on a 2nd half surge to move out of this spot, but as of now, they seem bad.

So Ö whatís the call? I did think trade, but I had a hard time justifying who might move up here. Offensively, do they take someone for the OL this high? That only occurs if Pace has long term problems and Barron loses his luster with them, both things I have not followed up close enough. That said, I have a hard time justifying a Jake Long pick first overall. If not OL, this pick likely goes defense, where DL would get the focus. I was inclined to lean Glenn Dorsey, but at the end of the day, they did spend a 1 on Carriker last year, and 2 1st round DTís in a row, particularly when Dorsey likely wouldnít significantly improve their run D didnít led me away. Iím also not sure if Dorsey can put up the elite numbers to justify a first overall selection, as good as he is. The nod here goes Calais Campbell. Little is aging, and Hall isnít a dominant DE by any means.

St. Louis Rams pick: DE Calais Campbell, the U

2. Buffalo Bills

Iíve got the Bills here, despite an impressive victory. Largely because I just still wonder how good that offense can be, but also because of the injuries. That said, a reason can be made for a bunch of teams to be here. If the Rams pass on Dorsey, then I think Buffalo is in no manís land. Do they go for a QB pick here that might be a reach? Thankfully, Dorsey is around, and he gives them their impact interior player. Had Dorsey gone 1, it might be Campbell here.

Buffalo Bills pick: DT Glenn Dorsey, LSU

3. Atlanta Falcons

As much as they need a triggerman for the future, I think Petrinoís shown this year that he can create a decent passing game with average pieces. Iíd like to slide them down in the draft a bit, but the reason I have them here is because I wonder about that defense, in particularly, the run D, and I donít see Joey Harrington leading them to enough wins. If they are here, though, they would want a workhorse back, and McFadden is arguably BPA in this draft. Too good to pass up, the Falcons go to Arkansas again. I considered dealing them up, but I think they might be content to sit pat with their assets, because if McFadden goes higher, a case could be made for them to take a DL here or a QB.

Atlanta Falcons pick: RB Darren McFadden, Arkansas

4. New York Jets

Itís scary how bad the AFC East is in many respects. Could they make a 2nd half push? Doesnít seem as if the personnel is there for that to occur. They could use a RB or an edge talent. That said, a few years back, talk was heavy on their interest in taking Mario Williams had he fallen. He didnít, and the Jets still need impact DL talent. If Tyson Jackson comes out, I could see him working high up the board in this thin draft at the top, and he might be the impact DL talent that the Jets need. Jake Long certainly would be tempting, but I donít think they can pass on DL talent if they see value. I contemplated a trade, but just wasnít sure who.

New York Jets pick: DL Tyson Jackson, LSU

5. Minnesota Vikings

This is a good team in many respects, just a team without a QB, and I think that bits them at the end of the day. Drafting a QB wonít address their issues, as the guy will need time to develop, but if Tarvaris Jackson isnít the future, that is something they need to address early. Matt Ryan got some consideration here, but at the end of the day, the nod goes to Andreí Woodson. The kid needs work, though, but he has the big time tools to potentially excel at the next level. I think mechanical consistency will correct a lot of his concerns.

Minnesota Vikings pick: QB Andreí Woodson, Kentucky

6. Oakland Raiders

I really like what Lane Kiffin has done this year. That said, I have them here because I wonder about the run D, and at some point, unless they are in playoff contention, you figure theyíll work in Jamarcus Russell. They could use help in a variety of areas. That said, I went the trade route.

Projected Trade:

Carolina gets the 6th overall
Oakland gets the 10th overall and the Raiders 2008 4th rounder, plus a 2nd rounder in 2009

Jake Long is tempting, but I have a hard time seeing him as a fit for that offense thatís worthy of a 6th overall pick. Kenny Phillips is tempting, but do they really go safety this high? Chris Long is a thought here. Sam Baker seems a notch high. As for Carolina, thereís two routes. Option 1 was to say safety. Certainly possible. That said, the nod here is QB, and it goes to QB Matt Ryan. Yes, I think highly enough of Ryan right now to slide him up here, and if the Panthers finish with the 10th overall pick, one would imagine the current regime would be out, and they needed a QB of the future anyways, unless David Carr comes up big for them. With Woodson coming off the board, teams may get itchy about moving up. Iím sure Iíll hear something about this move.

Carolina Panthers f/ Oakland Raiders pick: QB Matt Ryan, Boston College

7. Detroit Lions

You could probably claim hometeam bias here in giving the Bears a better spot than the Lions. And you might be right. But Iíve got more faith in Chicagoís offense stepping up than Detroitís defense, and itís not as if I have the Bears in the playoffs anyways. So Ö the nod likely goes to defense here, unless they surprise with an OL pick. 2 strains of thought for me Ė DE and safety. Tempted to go Chris Long here, who might be Rod Marinelliís type of guy, but Kenny Phillips is too good to pass up here. Third strain of thought was Jake Long Ö but somehow I didnít see it.

Detroit Lions pick: S Kenny Phillips, the U

8. Miami Dolphins

Yeah, Iíll probably be critiqued for this. One, itís debatable if Miami finishes in this spot. They certainly look as if theyíll finish higher, but my thinking was that the defense would shore up a bit, and someone has to win a few games out of that threesome in the AFC East. The second critique is having Jake Long still available. Iím just not sure heís a pro LT for all systems, and Iím just not sold that the Jets take him at 4, so the other question becomes, who moves up for him? Perhaps Dallas. Maybe Oakland is a fit. The Bears could make a move up. Just wasnít sold on those tade scenarios at this moment in time. Longís here, and he could be a LT for Cameron, as I think he might work.

Miami Dolphins pick: OT Jake Long, Michigan

9. Dallas Cowboys f/ Cleveland Browns

I am impressed with what Cleveland has done so far. Just not sure if the talent base is there to finish at a lower spot. Dallas gets this pick, though. Hard to figure out what to do. The DL fit doesnít seem to be there. OL seems an iffy move here, in my mind. RB value doesnít seem to be here. Iím looking at CB or WR. Nod goes to Malcolm Jenkins as potentially the top corner on the board, and someone with the length and size that Wade Phillips might like.

Dallas Cowboys pick: CB Malcolm Jenkins, the Ohio State

10. Oakland Raiders f/ Carolina Panthers

Carolinaís an enigma. The talent is there to be much better, but they donít seem to have the intangibles. With David Carr in there for a bit now, I just donít believe that my preseason NFC South pick can rise up to the occasion. But itís early, so who knows. Oakland moves down and has plenty of options. Whatís the call? Chris Long may be a tempting move for Al Davis, but I think Lane Kiffin can sell him on needing a LT to protect Jamarcus, and Lane knows Sam Baker. Baker could be good in the scheme.

Oakland Raiders pick: OT Sam Baker, Southern California

11. New Orleans Saints

Folks knew the defense would have problems. The OL issues have to be disconcerting. I could see them bouncing back and pushing up, but then again, line issues really hurt a team. If they finish here, what do they look for? I wouldnít rule out any defensive spot besides safety and DE. Offensively, OL is a thought, and maybe they push up for Jake Long if he falls. I just wasnít sold on it. Ellis might be a good fit, as he could give an interior push, while providing another body to work against the run.

New Orleans Saints pick: DT Sedrick Ellis, Southern California

12. Chicago Bears

Bears have certainly looked bad this year, and having them at 12th might be a bit nice, but if they commit to running the ball more and the defense gets healthy, itís not impossible, and it isnít out of the question they surprise and push for a playoff spot in the NFC. That said, Iíve got them here for now, and few would argue. Itíd be hard to fault Angelo for not making a move up for a QB if the draft plays out this way. Dealing to the top 6 for a QB this year is a big risk. Do they go Brian Brohm here? Itís tempting, and maybe personal bias is a factor here, but I go option 2. On a side note, Brohm does have a nice floor, IMO, and that might fit Jerryís MO. My gut feeling says Matt Ryan is the type of QB that Angelo would love, perhaps moreso than any other QB. That said, I go the playing it safe route and

Projected Trade:

Cincinnati Bengals get the 12th overall
Chicago Bears get the 16th overall and the Bengals 2008 3rd rounder

Why Bengals? I could see some debating on the validity of such a move. First off, the nod is to Chris Long. Itís debatable if he reaches them at 16, and my thinking is that Justin Smith is on the tag (correct me if Iím wrong), and while they could use help in a number of places, their DL needs some improvement anyways. Long also adds some fire to the mix. On a side note, I really wonder if Marvin Lewis may be like Tony Dungy in that, heís taken that Bengals group as far as he can, and may need to look for another opportunity. In short, a fresh voice.

Cincinnati Bengals f/ Chicago Bears pick: DE Chris Long, Virginia

13. Houston Texans

I think they are vastly improved, but in a tough division and hence picking here. Tough to figure what route to take. Defensively, you doubt they would take a DL guy. LB and CB are possible. No safety seems to be of value here. Offensively, OL/RB gets consideration. But Ö RB seems a general reach when they could probably find someone in round 2. And just not sold they go OL this high. The nod here goes WR. Jacoby Jones and Kevin Walters are nice, but they arenít impact guys (at least, not yet for Jones). Kelly gives Schaub a target that might fit the profile for what Kubiak might like.

Houston Texans pick: WR Malcolm Kelly, Oklahoma

14. New England Patriots f/ San Francisco 49ers

I think San Francisco is headed in the right direction, but the Alex Smith situation bears watching, the OL seems a bit off this year, and they are in a rapidly improving division. That said, this pick would belong to New England. Whatís the nod? To be honest, not sure if I see a fit that would have the Patriots exercising a pick. Thus, I looked deal, and I came up with

Projected Trade:

Tennessee Titans get the 14th overall
New England Patriots get the 19th overall, the Tennessee Titans 3rd rounder in 2008 and a 4th rounder in 2009

I think New England is always open to moving, and Iím not sure who they would go with here. I think the Titans need to try and find a top WR for Vince Young, and DeSean Jackson is still hanging around.

Tennessee Titans f/ San Francisco 49ers via the New England Patriots: WR DeSean Jackson, California

15. Philadelphia Eagles

I had a hard time placing the NFC East. I really want to place the Eagles 2nd, but Ö everything seems so close, and Iím just so not sure on tis team. That said, if you mix up the order of the NFC East teams after Dallas, I would have no issue with that. But they are here for now. And theyíve done a good job stocking young talent. DTís look fine, and even if a DE moves on, Abiamiri gives them someone for the rotation. Safety could use someone Ö but whoís worth it here? Donít see a LB pick here, and donít really see a OL pick (although I guess that canít be ruled out). WR was a consideration, but at the end of the day, the nod goes to Justin King, who I expect will come out since heís graduating. He could arguably be the top corner, and he would be someone to groom and provide critical depth.

Philadelphia Eagles pick: CB Justin King, Penn State

16. Chicago Bears f/ Cincinnati Bengals

A case could be made for the Bengals to be much higher, but Iíll give Marvin Lewis the benefit of the doubt on fixing that defense enough to make a push. Just not sure I see playoffs. Anyhow, the Bears/Bengals made a trade earlier in this mock, so itís the Bears pick. Whatís the call? I donít want to do it, as Iím not a big fan, but the nod goes to a QB. I canít see Falcons selling out to move up this high, and not sure any other team makes this move (Chiefs come to mind). Iím not sold that Brohm is a mid-first pick.

Chicago Bears pick: QB Brian Brohm, Louisville

17. Kansas City Chiefs

In what I thought was a rebuilding year, the AFC West has slipped that the Chiefs could win the title. Just not sure about that yet, largely on account of not sold on Huard and that OL all year long. But donít rule it out. That said, they are here for now. The Jared Allen situation will be interesting to follow, but the nod goes to OL here, and Clady over Cherilus on account of better upside for Clady, IMO. But it could be Cherilus as well.

Kansas City Chiefs pick: OT Ryan Clady, Boise State

18. New York Giants

As noted, mix the NFC East up after Dallas, and Iíd be fine with it. They are here for now. The nod goes to LB, because they could use a dynamic playmaker. Keith Rivers is still on the board, and for me, heís the top senior OLB, ahead of Connor, and arguably the top LB for me if he puts up top numbers. Weíll have to wait and see A junior LB made a push, but Iíll address that soon.

New York Giants pick: LB Keith Rivers, Southern California

19. New England Patriots f/ Tennessee Titans

I have the Titans on the outside looking in due to a tough division and whether or not the passing game will be enough. Anyhow, a trade was made earlier. So whatís the nod? I gave the longes thought to Gosder Cherilus here. But in the end, with Tedy Bruschi nearing the end, I went LB. Marylandís Erin Henderson could push higher, but if he is here, and he is healthy, he might be an intriguing fit and has the top physical tools.

New England Patriots pick: LB Erin Henderson, Maryland

20. Washington Redskins

Iím thinking the Redskins run game, strong D will give Campbell time to develop, and when Campbell develops, they win enough to get into the playoffs in potentially Gibbs swan swong. I was thinking DE all the way, with Lawrence Jackson at the top of the board. But with Cherilus on the board, and the age of Jansen/Samuels/Kendall, plus the health issues of Jansen/Thomas this past year, I have a hard time passing on Cherilus. Besides, it wouldnít surprise me to see Greg Blache try and convince the FO to trade for someone like Alex Brown.

Washington Redskins pick: OT Gosder Cherilus, Boston College

21. Denver Broncos

I really thought they would be better, but it looks like theyíll be in a tight battle. The run D definitely has holes, but the Travis Henry situation is what slide them down to the outside looking in for now. Initially, I had Brohm falling and a team (Falcons) making the move here, but the Bears snapped him up. So, what now? I had trouble coming up with another trade, so the nod here goes to addressing the Dl. The nod goes to DT, where they could use some help, and Moore anchors against the run well enough, while improving his pass rushing ability, IMO. He also has the physical tools to potentially move up.

Denver Broncos pick: DT Marchondray Moore, Maryland

22. Baltimore Ravens

I think Baltimore does enough to reach the playoffs Ö but just barely. As for the pick, Gholston could be BPA here. I didnít want him to slide Ö but who snaps him up? I know it isnít a glaring need (unless Terrell Suggs is gone), but he might be too good to pass up.

Baltimore Ravens pick: OLB/DE Vernon Gholston, the Ohio State

23. San Diego Chargers

I think the Chargers can make a push, and have them winning the weak AFC West for now. Who do they go for here? Doesnít seem like any particularly great fit. I looked the trade route and came up with

Projected Trade

Minnesota Vikings get the 23rd overall
San Diego Chargers get Minnesotaís 2nd and 3rd rounders in 2008

Just not sure who San Diego would go for. WR was a thought, but they did just draft Craig Davis, and Vincent Jackson is still there. DB? Here? San Diego also lost a pick, so they might look to recoup it, particularly since a good WR can be found. Minnesota has an extra 3rd (Marcus Thomas deal). They added their QB earlier, and they could use a WR, even if Sidney Rice develops. Earl Bennett could be a good fit for this offense, if he chose to come out.

Minnesota Vikings f/ San Diego Chargers pick: WR Earl Bennett, Vanderbilt

24. Seattle Seahawks

I had a tough time with Seattle. I know they are 3-1 Ö but something about the team seems off, and I like the Cardinals better. But the Seahawks are still in the playoffs. So who to go to here? Iím looking offense after all their picks for the defense in recent years, although defense wouldnít surprise me. OL gets a though, but Iím not sure who would make them make such a move. I really want to go RB, but I talk myself out of it, so I go WR. I think Keenan Burton has the good size, enough size, and good body control to move up the boards. Probably a debatable position and player.

Seattle Seahawks pick: WR Keenan Burton, Kentucky

25. Tampa Bay Buccaneers

Much props to this team, as Iíve finally come around. I thought they were improved, but playoffs I wasnít sold about. That said, Iím coming around, as they play hard. A number of options here, but Iím looking more at offense. I want to go WR, but I think solid value can be found later, so I go OT, where Petitgout is a concern. I think Tony Hills could move up the board with his physical potential and might slide in here.

Tampa Bay Buccaneers pick: OT Tony Hills, Texas

26. Arizona Cardinals

I really, really like what they are doing out in the desert. They could go offense, but not sure who works. Thus, looking defense, where corner and an edge player come to mind. I want to go edge, but at the end, I change and head with CB. Indianaís Tracy Porter has had a solid campaign so far and may have the elite tools to move up here. An edge guy can likely be found later.

Arizona Cardinals pick: CB Tracy Porter, Indiana

27. Jacksonville Jaguars

I was unsure about them earlier in the year, but if Garrard is consistent, and the run D tightens up, this team looks awfully tough. What to do here? I want to consider WR Ö but I go with an end in Lawrence Jackson, as I think the valueís too good for them to pass up.

Jacksonville Jaguars pick: DE Lawrence Jackson, Southern California

28. Green Bay Packers

Iím assuming some semblance of a run game will eventually develop, otherwise, I donít see them here. Assuming it does, they become a well-balanced team that could threaten. What to do here? CB/RB come to mind. I go CB for now, with the age of the starters, and the fact that RB value/fit can be found in round 2. Now, if thereís serious off-field concerns about Jenkins (he had that arrest for a fight I think), then Iíd have to switch it up, but he gets my nod for now.

Green Bay Packers pick: CB Michael Jenkins, South Florida

29. Pittsburgh Steelers

The loss to Arizona doesnít diminish the impressive job Tomlin has done so far. I thought OL here, and it is a possibility. But I could see DeMario Pressley working his way back up after coming back, and if Pressley has an impressive end of the season and combine, heíd be awfully tempting here as a decent 3-4 DE option that could move inside in the 4-3 and be a potentially top player.

Pittsburgh Steelers pick: DL DeMario Pressley, North Carolina State

30. San Francisco 49ers f/ Indianapolis Colts

Colts look good Ö but Patriots get the edge for now. That said, itís the Niners pick. What do they do? Smiley seems to be struggling, and OL gets a long, long look. I was tempted to go Heath Benedict here. For now, though, I go with an OLB in Quentin Groves, and with Groves/Willis/Lawson in 2008, they certainly would have a superbly athletic young trio of players.

San Francisco 49ers pick: DE/OLB Quentin Groves, Auburn

31. Dallas Cowboys

They certainly look like the class of the NFC so far. Originally, I had Dreí Moore falling here, and if he is, it would be a great fit with his versatility. WR/DL/OL/RB get the looks here. Iíll go WR for now, although a RB like James Davis is possible.

Dallas Cowboys pick: WR Adarius Bowman, Oklahoma State

32. New England Patriots (Forfeited)

D-Unit
10-05-2007, 12:39 PM
As always.... Classy.


Cowboys picks are fine.

Chucky
10-05-2007, 12:50 PM
Great Write-up, love the Bucs position, LT is definitely a position that the bucs should consider, but im ready to give Penn a chance at this point. I would also consdier Pressley here, even though Javon Haye has exceeded expectations. I would also look at WR here

fenikz
10-05-2007, 12:53 PM
You have a weird big board imo, and for the Cardinals I would rather have Harvey or Groves with the 1st and then address CB in the 2nd with someone like Thomas or Bowman, but you did fill a need so its not that bad

Xonraider
10-05-2007, 12:54 PM
Minimal explanations? Yeah right...

Although I think our offensive line is fine for now, I think Chris Long might get the nod, to get a better DE opposite to Burgess, maybe even Malcom Kelly could be drafted, mainly because we have no true number 1 wide receiver... Curry is good, but no great, and Porter has disappeared (except for the last game)... I wouldn't be surprised with a WR. But I see where you're coming from, Barry Sims isn't getting any younger, and we could use a left tackle in the near future.

Turtlepower
10-05-2007, 01:36 PM
I <3 the Keith Rivers pick. =D

nemesis3394
10-05-2007, 01:39 PM
love the vikings picks especially the trade to get bennett...him and woodson would team up nicely

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 01:59 PM
Let's see -

Cowboys - Thanks and, for me, the picks seem okay, but I don't like them that much. I was messing around with Justin King at number 9 ... but decided that Jenkins seemed a better fit. I wanted to go another route besides Bowman, who I'm not huge on, but couldn't come up with any for now.

Buccaneers - I thought the DT's were playing well enough that Pressley didn't seem necessary. I thought WR, but there's a lot of speed guys that could whet Chucky's appetite later on that I thought it was more worthwhile to go OT there. I like Penn ... but if they have a chance to get a talent like Hills, I think it's a worthwhile gamble.

Vikings - I think Bennett would be a good match for Childress' offense as well.

Giants - Was giving strong consideration to Erin Henderson there as well.

Raiders - I think the big issue for you guys is simple - you want to move forward and win more, but the reality of the situation is, at some point, you have to work in Jamarcus, and relative to the draft, that may entail different priorities in regards to what to do. An end is nice, but a capable end should be there in round 2 (I have Harvey falling out of round 1 ... I think someone falls, could be someone else). WR, to be honest, didn't cross my mind when I did this (not sure why) ... but I'm not sure any of the WR's are top 10 worthy. That said, if the trade down happened, that would make it alright I guess.

Cardinals and fenikz - I really like Tracy Porter's potential draft value a lot, and from that perspective, I think it's more worthwhile to gamble on corner here and find an edge guy later than the other way around. But it could work either way.

I am curious, though, why you think the big board is weird. Outside of the fact that it's early and this isn't my big board ...

QB - I have three guys going ... 4 is possible, but I think it's a fair number. I've got Ryan ahead of Brohm ... which I've had for a bit now (and I'm tempted to drop Brohm a notch) and I think some people have that as well.

RB - Senior class blows (none of whom I find first round worthy right now). I was tempted to move more RB's in, as I did last time ... but this time, I didn't, and it was just McFadden. The nature of the position doesn't make that unreasonable but out of the other juniors

a) Jonathan Stewart - It comes down to time simply. That is, if he comes out. A mid-4.5 time and he'll drop a bit. A 4.4ish number and he's a solid round 1 .. if he comes out. To be honest, I didn't consider him this time, just to change things up.

b) James Davis - Personally, I'm tempted to move him up to the 2 hole anyways. A few more weeks and I may have him solidly in round 1.

Slaton/Rice - Size is an issue.

I really like Felix Jones potential to move up the boards ... but that's also an iffy thing as well.

WR - I went Kelly, Jackson, Bennett, Burton, Bowman. I guess the surprise might be Burton, but I really like what he offers, as he has good enough size/speed ratio and makes plays. Don't really see a top 10 WR in the bunch.

TE - Don't see a first round TE in the bunch.

OT - I went Long/Baker/Clady/Cherilus/Hills. I think that's fair. If the issue is Long at 8, then the question is where he goes before that in this scenario? Jets taking a RT at 4?

Interior OL - DOn't see a day 1 worthy guy yet ... although I leave open the possbility of it happening late.

DT - Dorsey, Ellis, Moore, Pressley. If there's any issues, it's worth Moore and Pressley, but Moore is supposedly a top physical athlete, and I think he's played well enough this year that I can see him moving up. Pressley's always had the tools, and had a decent game back. If he works out well, I could see him move up. I'll be the first to admit I have a tendency to occasionally slide DT's up earlier in the season.

DE - Campbell,T. Jackson, Long, L. Jackson

Edge - Gholston, Groves.

Now, this is where I'd probably hear some complaints, namely, the dropping of Derrick Harvey. Outside of Harvey, who else am I missing, though, that could make a case? Campbell at the top shouldn't be that big of an issue. Perhaps Tyson Jackson ... but I'm not sure why that would be at the potential size/mobility ramifications, along with fit. Long and Lawrence Jackson seem like they are in solid spots. Gholston dropped, without a doubt ... but who snaps him up? I had a tough one figuring that out. Groves slid a tiny bit, but I don't know many that considered him in the top half of the first.

LB - Probably the area that will get the most questions. FIrst off, I'd remind people, it is LB. You have to do something exceptional (performance or times) to really push up in round 1. Henderson is a guy who's a rumored 4.5 time in the 240's. If that's the case, and if he finishes strong, he should garner consideration to push up. Who's not here? Well, to be honest, I left Laurinaitis off. If I considered him, yes, I probably would've found a spot, but it'd still likely be late first (at best, late teens/early twenties). I'm not so sure what's the big deal about Dan Connor. I think he'll be a good player, and I think he's better than Posluszny was as a draft prospect, but is he such a standout prospect to be a first round lock? Perhaps ... maybe he rips off a low 4.6 number as some speculate. If it's closer to 4.7, then you've got a smart, heady 230ish pound LB ... sounds like DeMeco Ryans-ish. Not saying one or the other will happen ... but I don't think it's set. Then there's Rey Maualuga. I think he's a really solid player, but I'm far from sold he's a first round lock. If he burns off an elite time, sure. If not, I see a bigger Lofa Tatupu ... first rounder? Perhaps, but far from a lock. Actually, the one guy I wanted to work in was Beau Bell.

CB - I left of Talib (time), Thomas (something bugs me ... just not sure he's a top level corner in the NFL), Ikegwuonu (had him on last time, before realizing he has off the field issues), Tribble (undersized ... needs a good time ... I think he's more quick than speed, and hence, I think he could be in round 2).

S - Phillips seems like the only first round solid lock S.

Tis early.

Sniper
10-05-2007, 02:00 PM
Really doubting some of these first rounders...For example, Malcolm Kelly, Tracy Porter, DeMario Pressley, Erin Henderson, Marchondray Moore, and Tony Hills. Nice Eagles pick though.

619
10-05-2007, 02:06 PM
matt ryan goin before brian brohm could be possible come draft day but ryan goin at #6 is a bit ridiculous rite now

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 02:08 PM
matt ryan goin before brian brohm could be possible come draft day but ryan goin at #6 is a bit ridiculous rite now

I'm not mocking now ...

619
10-05-2007, 02:09 PM
I'm not mocking now ...

oic your just throwing ideas out there of possible draft situations kinda like a rough draft

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 02:13 PM
Really doubting some of these first rounders...For example, Malcolm Kelly, Tracy Porter, DeMario Pressley, Erin Henderson, Marchondray Moore, and Tony Hills. Nice Eagles pick though.

I certainyl don't expect the mock to be right ... and I made significant changes from mock 1 to mock 2. That said ...

Kelly - Just curious why you doubt him as a first rounder. If he runs the high 4.4/low 4.5 time most expect, that's a pretty good size/speed ratio.

Porter - If he pulls off a 4.3 number as many have reported, he should move up. He's had a solid campaign so far.

Pressley - The issue isn't physical talent, but more consistency and health.

Hills - Ot's have a tendency to go higher at times ... certainly could see him slide down, though.

The MD boys - Both Moore and Henderson are supposed to be top physical specimens. Henderson's been productive, and if he finishes strong, and pulls off a top effort, I don't see why not. He's probably, as of now, a top LB, if not the top LB, iin that class. Moore's more of a guess on my part, but here's a 300+ lb. guy who anchors well against the run, and is improving as a pass rusher. If he puts up top numbers, I could see him move up. Whether or not he would deserve it is a separate question.

At the end, tis early, so we'll have to not only wait and see on production, but wait and see on numbers.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 02:14 PM
oic your just throwing ideas out there of possible draft situations kinda like a rough draft

Honest question ... but what else would a mock draft be if not a rough draft that offers possible draft situations?

Sniper
10-05-2007, 02:24 PM
Kelly - Just curious why you doubt him as a first rounder. If he runs the high 4.4/low 4.5 time most expect, that's a pretty good size/speed ratio.
There's a lot of good receivers this year. Kelly is one of them, but I think a strong draft class moves him down to the second.

Porter - If he pulls off a 4.3 number as many have reported, he should move up. He's had a solid campaign so far.
Isn't he pretty small? And I think Ikegwuonu, Talib, Flowers, and Lowery would go ahead of him/

Pressley - The issue isn't physical talent, but more consistency and health.
Bingo. Alan Branch dropped due to the same questions (not healthy but consistency/stamina)

Hills - Ot's have a tendency to go higher at times ... certainly could see him slide down, though. True story, but I don't see him that high especially if Loadholt comes out.

The MD boys - Both Moore and Henderson are supposed to be top physical specimens. Henderson's been productive, and if he finishes strong, and pulls off a top effort, I don't see why not. He's probably, as of now, a top LB, if not the top LB, iin that class. Moore's more of a guess on my part, but here's a 300+ lb. guy who anchors well against the run, and is improving as a pass rusher. If he puts up top numbers, I could see him move up. Whether or not he would deserve it is a separate question.

I love Henderson, but this is a pretty strong LB class. Moore is iffy.

At the end, tis early, so we'll have to not only wait and see on production, but wait and see on numbers.

Left some comments.

HoopsDemon12
10-05-2007, 02:44 PM
I like the bills pick... but then again only mcfadden would be a bad pick for us at that spot.. well that and an offesive lineman

Paranoidmoonduck
10-05-2007, 03:12 PM
I definitely agree with you on the difficulty of making a draft order these days. I have a few mocks I haven't released yet (because I dislike the way they turned out), and we actually hit on some of the same picks (Ellis to the Saints, Clady to the Chiefs).

I'd love to post a constructive critique of this mock, but I'm having a hard time finding anything to critique. I'm not sure Campbell is having the dominant year that would end in a #1 overall selection, but I do like him over Long and Dorsey in St. Louis' case.

Nice work.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 03:15 PM
Left some comments.

I really don't think there's a lot of good receivers this year.

Porter's what, 5'10", 180. Smallish yes. Not too small, though. Ikegwuonu is a guy I like, but his speed is average and he has off-field concerns right now. Talib's lack of speed is troublesome for his draft prospects, IMO. I like Brandon Flowers, don't love him. Certainly could go ahead of Porter, but I think Porter is more consistent in man coverage right now for my tastes. Personal opinion there, though. As for Dwight Lowery, eh ... dropped him on account of speed.

I don't think this is a strong LB class at all. I think it's rather weak. Lauranities gets pimped, but he's still developing. Maualuga, well, I want to see his times. If he posts top times, then yeah, he's a first rounder. If not, he's a borderline guy for me. I'm not so sure what the big deal is about Connor as a draft prospect. Hardly a first round lock, IMO.

Anyhow, in the end, only time will tell.

NYGibril28
10-05-2007, 03:17 PM
i hate how your "quickies" have three times as much analysis as the commoners detailed draft

Good pick for NYG, I agree

Nerv
10-05-2007, 03:27 PM
Phillips is a stud but I don't really like him to the Lions. Yes bullocks will be coming off an injury and Gerald is still a project but we have better potential at S than most of our defense. LB/CB are needed in the worst kind of way. Long would be nice but with Backus's massive contract we just couldnt afford him. Really, based on the way your order & mock has gone down I don't know who I would want for the Lions, I just dont believe safety is the way to go. I would probably prefer Long to hopefully solidify that dl as one of the leagues best.

Great write up though, always loved your insight.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 03:31 PM
You know ... I really wanted to lean Long there. He seems like the type Rod would fall in love with. Furthermore, if he goes there, they'd probably ask him to even slim down a bit, to perhaps the 260's (if he isn't there already) to maximize his quickness). It's tempting ... I just am not sure if he's worth it up there, and Millen took Calvin last year when many thought that the staff preferred Adams.

I keep on forgetting about Alexander, to be honest. That said, I'm not sure if he's the type that blocks a guy like Phillips, and he could be moved back to CB. I'm just not sure drafting a CB high is the right move for the Lions ... but if a LB works up there, that certainly comes into the picture. That said, I think end is the best choice ... just have to see if Chris Long ends up deserving status that high (or if the Lions pick lower and he's there).

KCJ58
10-05-2007, 04:07 PM
love the rams pick

Vikes99ej
10-05-2007, 04:24 PM
NICE! Peterson, Woodson, and Bennett. That would be one hell of an offense for years to come. I'm assuming Childress is out.

bearsfan_51
10-05-2007, 04:31 PM
I agree with others that your projected order seems a bit screwy, but who knows?

The picks, however, seem very logical. Obviously I would love the Bears scenario, though I wonder if the Bears would actually trade back in the first place with Brohm on the board. A lot depends on how he eventually projects.

neko4
10-05-2007, 04:50 PM
I dont understand at all how Cason isnt in people's mocks anymore and i would like him way more than Jenkins

Scotty D
10-05-2007, 04:51 PM
I'd rather have Jake Long in that spot for the Lions.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 05:35 PM
NICE! Peterson, Woodson, and Bennett. That would be one hell of an offense for years to come. I'm assuming Childress is out.

Dunno ... is he that much on that hot seat? I was actually figuring he was in, as I think Bennett works well for him, and Woodson may be his type of QB relative to his skillset (that said, I do wonder if Ryan is more of a Childress type QB).

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 05:36 PM
I agree with others that your projected order seems a bit screwy, but who knows?

The picks, however, seem very logical. Obviously I would love the Bears scenario, though I wonder if the Bears would actually trade back in the first place with Brohm on the board. A lot depends on how he eventually projects.

Wait ... order of teams ... or order of players.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 05:37 PM
I dont understand at all how Cason isnt in people's mocks anymore and i would like him way more than Jenkins

To be honest, I think the last time I was big on Cason was 2 years ago. I jsut haven't been that big on him ... but I'll be the first to admit he definitely could be in there in the late first/2nd round area, and it may come down to personal preference.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 05:38 PM
I'd rather have Jake Long in that spot for the Lions.

Yeah ... twas a passing thought ... maybe I focused too much on defense.

Vikes99ej
10-05-2007, 05:56 PM
Dunno ... is he that much on that hot seat? I was actually figuring he was in, as I think Bennett works well for him, and Woodson may be his type of QB relative to his skillset (that said, I do wonder if Ryan is more of a Childress type QB).

Yes, he is. People in Minnesota are clamoring for him to get fired.

bearsfan_51
10-05-2007, 07:07 PM
Wait ... order of teams ... or order of players.
Order of teams sorry.

TitanHope
10-05-2007, 07:24 PM
I like the pick of DeSean Jackson for the Titans. The trade is ok as well. I've never been a fan of trading up, but Jackson seems to be too tempting if he fell into the teens.

thebow305
10-05-2007, 08:13 PM
good phins pick

Caddy
10-05-2007, 09:43 PM
Can't fault your Buc pick this early in the season. Petitgout is a question mark and whether he comes back and can play as competitively as he did this year is a major query.

wiscbadgerfootball
10-05-2007, 09:53 PM
nice packers pick, a cornerback is definitely the most logical selection

pickles
10-05-2007, 10:02 PM
I believe the 49ers should take Frank Okam in this position. BY isn't getting any younger even if he looks to play like he is, eventually his age is going to catch up with him. With a Line of Okam DE Franklin NT Douglas DE they shape up to be a strong force.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 10:03 PM
If OKam is a first round worthy pick, sure, it'd be a consideration. I just don't think he's a first round worthy pick.

toonsterwu
10-05-2007, 11:23 PM
The original iteration of this, I guess v.1.5, had the Brohm dropping, and the Broncos swapping with Atlanta to let the Falcons grab Brohm. As for Thomas, I don't think drafting someone like Moore would take away from his future, as they are two different interior players. But certainly, I'm trying to keep an open mind about options. I just don't love the LB options, and there really, IMO, are no safeties after Phillips first round worthy UNLESS Terrell Thomas is considered a safety, which I wonder if he might be a better value at safety than corner.

Sniper
10-06-2007, 12:21 AM
I don't think this is a strong LB class at all. I think it's rather weak. Lauranities gets pimped, but he's still developing. Maualuga, well, I want to see his times. If he posts top times, then yeah, he's a first rounder. If not, he's a borderline guy for me. I'm not so sure what the big deal is about Connor as a draft prospect. Hardly a first round lock, IMO.

Anyhow, in the end, only time will tell.

Agree to disagree my friend. Connor is an excellent all-around LB who does pretty much everything well. My #1 LB right now.

thule
10-06-2007, 01:49 AM
Not bad Dallas picks...I still think it'd be hard to pass on Desean Jackson with Terry Glenn essentially committing career suicide going with the scope.

TO is great, Crayton could be a 2, and hurd is good when on the field...sure we have projects in Stanback and Austin. But we don't have that shifty flag route guy that we use to have in Glenn. Jackson has one of the best stop and go routes in all of college football...that is something Dallas is lacking right now. I like the Jenkins pick but with Reeves really improving and Henry and Newman both looking good I'm not sold on CB with our first pick. Granted if a CB really distances himself from the pack then it is forseeable.

With the second first round pick it is tough to peg. CB definately should have value their if they don't address it with the early pick. Like you said Davis is intriguing. One guy who I'm curious to see your take on is Kentwan Balmer. Seems like an ideal fit for Wade's 3-4. Athletic, with good power. But just not fast enough to play the 6 tech...and not powerful enough to play the 3 tech. I really think if he puts up the numbers that are rumored late first could be a possibility. Or maybe I'm just buying Kipers smoke. I was just curious to hear your views on him.

Ward
10-06-2007, 01:54 AM
someone with the length and size that Wade Phillips might like.

Toonster must have some inside information concerning Wade Phillips...

comahan
10-06-2007, 02:20 AM
im not sure that houston really needs a WR atm. Schaub, and our overall passing game has been very impressive without Andre Johnson and Jacoby Jones. I mean, id take a WR, but im not sure id take one in round 1 with RB and DB being such huge questions right now.

That said, there are literally no safeties worth taking after phillips, as youve mentioned, and no RB's past McFadden entice me that much, so when all is said and done, i suppose WR wouldnt be a bad move here.

Finsfan79
10-06-2007, 05:06 AM
I love the miami pick. I think he would be our Right Tackle for the next decade at least. Carey I feel has been good at left tackle and shall remain there for a long time personally. Long and Carey would be a nice fit together specially if we can snag a guard in the 3rd round.

As you said miami most likely will be picking higher then that. We are a horrible team right now and even if we get better I think we will be picking at the top 3 draft spots.

So either way good chance we get long.

My hope for the draft is trade back snag a RT, OG, S and dline help

WMD
10-06-2007, 06:16 AM
I'd rather have Jake Long in that spot for the Lions.

I think Detroit would be dumb to take a RT at #7. Take either Kenny Phillips or Chris Long there, definitely. Both would be fantastic, great, amazing picks.. I think Chris Long would be more likely because he does seem like a Marinelli type, and unless they want to move our 07 Round 2 pick Gerald Alexander to CB (which I'm sure he's capable of), we've got our safeties set with Daniel Bullocks & Gerald Alexander.. Kenny Phillips would be a great reason to move Gerald to Cornerback, though.

One thing I'm not sure about is why Carolina would trade up to #6 to pick Matt Ryan. With that order, they could sit pretty at #10 and, barring a trade up, have him fall right to them.. Oakland (Russell), Detroit (Stanton), Miami (Beck), Dallas (Romo) are more than likely not in the market at all for a QB. I know you said teams will get itchy, but I don't know.. Doesn't seem right to me.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 08:20 AM
Agree to disagree my friend. Connor is an excellent all-around LB who does pretty much everything well. My #1 LB right now.

I am curious, though, as to where you big board him and why. I don't disagree ... I think he's a guy that does everything well ... and I also think he's better than Posluszny and will be a good pro. But as for his draft value, what is it about him that makes him exceptional for you, as I think that's what you are somewhat implying? He isn't rumored to have elite physical tools for his size. Oh, and where would you big board the rest of the LB's?

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 08:23 AM
I think Detroit would be dumb to take a RT at #7. Take either Kenny Phillips or Chris Long there, definitely. Both would be fantastic, great, amazing picks.. I think Chris Long would be more likely because he does seem like a Marinelli type, and unless they want to move our 07 Round 2 pick Gerald Alexander to CB (which I'm sure he's capable of), we've got our safeties set with Daniel Bullocks & Gerald Alexander.. Kenny Phillips would be a great reason to move Gerald to Cornerback, though.

One thing I'm not sure about is why Carolina would trade up to #6 to pick Matt Ryan. With that order, they could sit pretty at #10 and, barring a trade up, have him fall right to them.. Oakland (Russell), Detroit (Stanton), Miami (Beck), Dallas (Romo) are more than likely not in the market at all for a QB. I know you said teams will get itchy, but I don't know.. Doesn't seem right to me.

I'm mildly surprised that there were a lack of comments on the Carolina move there. That said, I don't disagree that, on paper, it doesn't seem right. I was trying to think somewhat out of the box I guess, because I think we often mock based on pure expectations, and forget that the people involved are, well, people. So, no, there isn't any good explanation as to why Carolina would make that move. Plan B in a trade up would be Kenny Phillips for them, which might make more sense. And by the time I work up the next order, everything will be different. So the short of it was, just throwing something out there because it is October.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 08:25 AM
I love the miami pick. I think he would be our Right Tackle for the next decade at least. Carey I feel has been good at left tackle and shall remain there for a long time personally. Long and Carey would be a nice fit together specially if we can snag a guard in the 3rd round.

As you said miami most likely will be picking higher then that. We are a horrible team right now and even if we get better I think we will be picking at the top 3 draft spots.

So either way good chance we get long.

My hope for the draft is trade back snag a RT, OG, S and dline help

If Miami is drafting higher, what would you think about Tyson Jackson or Calais Campbell? The former seems a better fit. Also, a bit surpried you left out edge help as a component (although maybe that's what you mean by DL ... I guess, because of Capers being there, I tend to separate it in DL (big bodies) and edge help for you guys.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 08:29 AM
im not sure that houston really needs a WR atm. Schaub, and our overall passing game has been very impressive without Andre Johnson and Jacoby Jones. I mean, id take a WR, but im not sure id take one in round 1 with RB and DB being such huge questions right now.

That said, there are literally no safeties worth taking after phillips, as youve mentioned, and no RB's past McFadden entice me that much, so when all is said and done, i suppose WR wouldnt be a bad move here.

I had a lot of problems with Houston. If there are teams that would take Steve Slaton high, it'd be a team with a running scheme like that. That said, I just can't justify Slaton this high at this moment in time for me. I briefly thought LB, which I think might make some sense ... but then again, it seems like the thing that can wait. What about OL? I know it's done well this year ... but it's not as if Ephraim Salaam is a spring chicken. That said, I've got no idea on Spencer has recuperated or Rashad Butler is doing, so I was wary of that move. It doesn't seem like an ideal situation for Houston to be in that area, in all honesty, so I went WR, as it seemed to be a value fit for me, and it seemed to be an area that could use a bigger talent.

Xiomera
10-06-2007, 08:47 AM
7. Detroit Lions

You could probably claim hometeam bias here in giving the Bears a better spot than the Lions. And you might be right. But Iíve got more faith in Chicagoís offense stepping up than Detroitís defense, and itís not as if I have the Bears in the playoffs anyways. So Ö the nod likely goes to defense here, unless they surprise with an OL pick. 2 strains of thought for me Ė DE and safety. Tempted to go Chris Long here, who might be Rod Marinelliís type of guy, but Kenny Phillips is too good to pass up here. Third strain of thought was Jake Long Ö but somehow I didnít see it.

Detroit Lions pick: S Kenny Phillips, the U


Toon, I gotta ask you about this one. For starters, you had Detroit picking lower in the round in your last mock, and that was when they were 2-1 coming off a loss in which they gave up 56 points. I hardly think I would be considered a homer if I said that the Lions won't be picking top 10 again this year. 11-15 range? Very possible. But there are worse teams than Detroit picking lower in the round. It would be quite difficult for Detroit to finish out the year with less than 6 wins, as they already have 3 now.

That aside, this is the same pick as your last mock, and I am not sold on it once again. I love Kenny Phillips, but do you think Detroit would really go Safety again? They have spent a 2nd rounder on Safeties in each of the last two drafts (Daniel Bullocks in '06, Gerald Alexander in '07), and they have Kenoy Kennedy. While none of those guys strike fear in anyone, I just don't see Millen devoting such a high pick on another guy at the position. Unless you believe Alexander to move to Cornerback, I think we'd go in a different direction.

Chris Long seems a better fit to me, though I haven't watched him play much at all in recent years. Sooner of later Marinelli is gonna get that Defensive End he wants, as that is his positional specialty.

Part of me thinks Detroit could pick Jake Long to play RT if Jonathan Scott doesn't prove to be a capable RT for us this year. George Foster is or is about to be benched and he won't return.

Crow
10-06-2007, 09:02 AM
Sam Baker seems to be the trendy pick, and it's not exactly a bad pick by any means. But I do question the need for a tackle so soon, especially when you consider the wizardry of Tom Cable.

On the flip side, Rob Ryan's defense is getting exposed now that teams actually have to play offense against us. We need talent on that side of the ball, especially along the defensive line. Sed Ellis, though a little light, would be a terrific addition.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 09:09 AM
Toonster must have some inside information concerning Wade Phillips...

huh ... I was just basing that off his corners in recent years ...

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 09:14 AM
Not bad Dallas picks...I still think it'd be hard to pass on Desean Jackson with Terry Glenn essentially committing career suicide going with the scope.

TO is great, Crayton could be a 2, and hurd is good when on the field...sure we have projects in Stanback and Austin. But we don't have that shifty flag route guy that we use to have in Glenn. Jackson has one of the best stop and go routes in all of college football...that is something Dallas is lacking right now. I like the Jenkins pick but with Reeves really improving and Henry and Newman both looking good I'm not sold on CB with our first pick. Granted if a CB really distances himself from the pack then it is forseeable.

With the second first round pick it is tough to peg. CB definately should have value their if they don't address it with the early pick. Like you said Davis is intriguing. One guy who I'm curious to see your take on is Kentwan Balmer. Seems like an ideal fit for Wade's 3-4. Athletic, with good power. But just not fast enough to play the 6 tech...and not powerful enough to play the 3 tech. I really think if he puts up the numbers that are rumored late first could be a possibility. Or maybe I'm just buying Kipers smoke. I was just curious to hear your views on him.

It is early in the year, and I haven't been following as much this year. What I know of Balmer I like, but I think I like other guys better than him for a 3-4 front (for example, Maurice Murray). That said, from what I know of Balmer, I find that high. I like his activity, and he has good athleticism for his size, but I'm not sure he's a starting caliber 3-4 end, which is what I'd want out of round 1. He seems a bit more consistent with his technique this year.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 09:25 AM
Toon, I gotta ask you about this one. For starters, you had Detroit picking lower in the round in your last mock, and that was when they were 2-1 coming off a loss in which they gave up 56 points. I hardly think I would be considered a homer if I said that the Lions won't be picking top 10 again this year. 11-15 range? Very possible. But there are worse teams than Detroit picking lower in the round. It would be quite difficult for Detroit to finish out the year with less than 6 wins, as they already have 3 now.

That aside, this is the same pick as your last mock, and I am not sold on it once again. I love Kenny Phillips, but do you think Detroit would really go Safety again? They have spent a 2nd rounder on Safeties in each of the last two drafts (Daniel Bullocks in '06, Gerald Alexander in '07), and they have Kenoy Kennedy. While none of those guys strike fear in anyone, I just don't see Millen devoting such a high pick on another guy at the position. Unless you believe Alexander to move to Cornerback, I think we'd go in a different direction.

Chris Long seems a better fit to me, though I haven't watched him play much at all in recent years. Sooner of later Marinelli is gonna get that Defensive End he wants, as that is his positional specialty.

Part of me thinks Detroit could pick Jake Long to play RT if Jonathan Scott doesn't prove to be a capable RT for us this year. George Foster is or is about to be benched and he won't return.

As for positioning, that is certainly debatable and arguable. I wasn't judging it by current records. At the end of the day, the teams that probably are debtable

Chicago - I admit there might be hometeam bias in ordering there ... but I like the chances of our offense improving (and D getting healthier) than I like the Lions defense stepping up to balance things out

New Orleans - Got the late push ahead due to the fact that, their run D hasn't been as bad as I thought ... and if they get some consistency on offense, they should win a few games, IMO ...

Carolina - I may rethink this one based on how David Carr does down the stretch, but overall, I don't think it's crazy to argue they are more talented

Cleveland and Miami - The closest two (as evidenced by the positions I had them) - the former, well, I really have no idea how they are doing so well (well, yes, I do, just I didn't expect it). A little bit of benefit of the doubt there I guess. As for Miami, my thinking was more that, someone has to win some games in the AFC East ... but it could be a situation where they split with each other and lose the rest ...

but hey, order could be very different by the end of monday ...

As for the pick ...

maybe I should note that my original iteration had Carolina dealing up to take Kenny Phillips, and Detroit then subsequently adding Chris Long

WHen both became available on a redo ... I had a tough time there ... I don't like the Phillips pick ... but I have a hard time justifying Long at that spot right now ... and Phillips is arguably BPA there if he comes out ...

I'm just not sold on OL there ... but that may change ...

Ideally, if an end is able to secure a close rating, I think that's the route I'd prefer ... maybe even a LB as well ...

ATLDirtyBirds
10-06-2007, 10:36 AM
I love the McFadden pick for Atlanta. If Joey Harrington can atleast play decent QB throughout the remainder, I could very well see us picking up McFadden, and then taking a QB in 2 or 3.

draftguru151
10-06-2007, 11:09 AM
huh ... I was just basing that off his corners in recent years ...

Not sure but I think Ward might have taken the length and size comment a totally different way than it was intended.

Shane P. Hallam
10-06-2007, 11:28 AM
You are the tit of the tat as always Toon.

As for Pittsburgh, DT is a possibility, though I still think we have the pieces in place with Smith and Hampton to have the DT in 4-3, and DE in 3-4 covered. I think we either pick up another tweener or I'm starting to lean toward WR. We saw when Ward is out/gone how thin the Steelers are at WR, and it is a good draft to go after someone. Just a thought.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 11:48 AM
You are the tit of the tat as always Toon.

As for Pittsburgh, DT is a possibility, though I still think we have the pieces in place with Smith and Hampton to have the DT in 4-3, and DE in 3-4 covered. I think we either pick up another tweener or I'm starting to lean toward WR. We saw when Ward is out/gone how thin the Steelers are at WR, and it is a good draft to go after someone. Just a thought.

It definitely is good positioning to go for WR if the Steelers do well ... as good WR value is probably late round 1/early round 2 ... I think Smith/Hampton are solid in the 4-3, but not the ideal prototypes for what Tomlin may want, and hence why I gave Pressley thought down there, but that's a gamble itself as it depends on how well he bounces back and how he works out ... I think, drafting that late, I could see them dealing down ... I think WR, big back, OL could all be thoughts ...

derza222
10-06-2007, 12:33 PM
If Tyson Jackson rises as you anticipate I'd love the selection as we need serious help on the defensive line. Obviously you think he's a good fit in the 3-4. If I'm correct he is a pretty solid pass-rusher, though numbers have been down this year. I assume he's good against the run and is able to take up blockers? Also I agree with your thought process completely there, as far as DL makes more sense than RT there and a trade down would be considered if we could find a partner.

JPF
10-06-2007, 01:05 PM
Panthers pick really doesn't make sense. We have much bigger needs than a QB of the future. I can see us taking a QB on day one, but when both of your starting Tackles are free agents and you trade up to the 6th pick with Jake Long sitting there....

Shane P. Hallam
10-06-2007, 03:57 PM
It definitely is good positioning to go for WR if the Steelers do well ... as good WR value is probably late round 1/early round 2 ... I think Smith/Hampton are solid in the 4-3, but not the ideal prototypes for what Tomlin may want, and hence why I gave Pressley thought down there, but that's a gamble itself as it depends on how well he bounces back and how he works out ... I think, drafting that late, I could see them dealing down ... I think WR, big back, OL could all be thoughts ...

Right, if O-Line value is right, but it usually isn't. WR is one of those things I'm not sure if we'll really think we need or not, but the whole has become apparent as Ward is now injury prone.

I def. think DT could be a way to go, or anywhere else on the front 7.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 05:50 PM
Panthers pick really doesn't make sense. We have much bigger needs than a QB of the future. I can see us taking a QB on day one, but when both of your starting Tackles are free agents and you trade up to the 6th pick with Jake Long sitting there....

I figured that the Panthers pick wouldn't resonate well. My original thought was Kenny Phillips there. Some things to clear out first:

As of now, I think Matt Ryan is one of the top 2 QB's. I'm starting to wonder if I should slide him into the top spot, ahead of Woodson. There's an intangible gutsy factor. Thus, value wise, I do think it's okay.

So, as to why I made the pick (and not Long or Phillips) -

1. I was trying to frame it in the perspective of "being in the moment". That is, for all the trades we try to predict, sometimes the ones that happen aren't the ones that predict because, at the end of the day, everyone's human. Once one QB goes off the board, if another one is graded closely and we aren't in the top 5 anymore, I could see a team making a push

2. I was thinking that, if the Panthers finish in that position, regime change will occur. Which likely means that, a QB of the future will have to be drafted at some point.

3. Why not Safety or Long? One, because I think, if 2 happens, a QB of the future gets prioritized over safety. As for why not Long ... I'm just not sold that he's a LT in the pros, and I think there's perfectly good RT's to be found in rounds 2 and 3. But that's certainly debatable (whether or not Long is a LT). Under the current scheme, I don't think he works as your LT. Without knowing a specific scheme (assuming 2 happens), I had to go on general perspectives.

4. I fully admit that my mocks are always tinted with some of my own biases on players, but I do try to be as fair as possible. At the end of the day, if regime change happens, I think most organizations prioritize a QB of the future ahead of a tackle ... so that was my thought process. If the Panthers do finish that poorly, I could see an overhaul of sorts happening with personnel as well, to accomodate a new regime, and the shelf-life of Delhomme is coming to a close soon. But, depending on where they finish, my thoughts could change significantly.

I guess the short of it is, if you finish that poorly, I expect rebuilding to begin, rather than retooling (and drafting an OT seems more retooling if you don't match it with a young QB). That said, we'll see how this week, and the next week goes. The order isn't going to be like that, so where the Panthers finish will dictate a lot of things.

toonsterwu
10-06-2007, 05:51 PM
Right, if O-Line value is right, but it usually isn't. WR is one of those things I'm not sure if we'll really think we need or not, but the whole has become apparent as Ward is now injury prone.

I def. think DT could be a way to go, or anywhere else on the front 7.

I dunno if I mentioned this in the writeup, but I was thinking Heath Benedict there for awhile, as a guy who could start inside, but if a guy is needed outside, he could be moved there.

BamaFalcon59
10-07-2007, 03:57 AM
Love the Falcons pick.

Bills2083
10-07-2007, 09:06 AM
Many other people dont like their pick, but I like ours

BaLLiN
10-07-2007, 03:43 PM
Good Giants pick

JPF
10-07-2007, 09:03 PM
I figured that the Panthers pick wouldn't resonate well. My original thought was Kenny Phillips there. Some things to clear out first:


I see your point, but it's not like we'd have to do a total rebuild (which sounds like the point you're making). Most of what we'd need to do is retool.

A QB of the future can come in 2009 or in Rd 2 or 3 in 08, but if we do it in rd 1, we have no left tackle.

Smooth Criminal
10-07-2007, 09:11 PM
Only problem I have with the Steelers pick is that Keisel, Hoke, and Smith have all recently signed extensions. We really don't need to spend a 1st rounder on the dline as of now.

Esspecially when Faneca will be gone after this season. LG needs to be adressed because there is simply no one behind Faneca ready to take the job. Plus the Steelers should be able to land the #1 guard prospect that late in the first round which is great value.

smittyjs
10-07-2007, 11:26 PM
Jackson is a nice pick for us and i could live with that trade....

Yung Flippa
10-07-2007, 11:48 PM
The Ravens would probably consider taking Cason or another top Corner. But if they do take a hybrid, it would probably be Groves or Blake.

Xiomera
10-08-2007, 07:03 AM
Nevermind my whole rant about the Lions draft position toonster. My team royally blew it Sunday. We will be picking top 10 once more.

JPF
10-08-2007, 07:18 PM
In light of Delhomme having Tommy John surgery, I withdraw my objection to the Panthers pick of Matt Ryan.

aNYtitan
10-08-2007, 09:05 PM
I could live with the Titans trade especially for DeSean Jackson. Since the Titans don't have many needs, the top needs can be addressed in the first and second(WR, TE, ILB)