PDA

View Full Version : 2011 Chicago Bears General Discussion


Pages : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 [25] 26

sweetness34
10-04-2011, 03:05 PM
This team is so damn disorganized. We get into a nice rhythm only to shoot ourselves in the foot whether it be penalties, turnovers, dropped passes, missed blocks, overthrows, missed tackles, missed INT's, etc.

This team is just frustrating as hell to watch. Last week vs Green Bay there were plays to be made in the passing game and we failed to execute simple fundamental football.

I believe the talent is there to be a good team, but we cannot execute consistently to save our lives.

Offensively, one week Martz calls 50 passing plays as his QB gets killed (with no run game). The next week he calls 50 more pass plays but players fail to either catch the ball or hit open receivers (again with no run game). Two days ago we rape Carolina on the ground, but our passing game looks like ****.

Defensively, why does it take a rocket scientist to see that sitting back against Rodgers may not be a great idea when we can't generate a pass rush? Why didn't we blitz him more and try to knock the crap out of him? Sure we may give up some big plays, but Rodgers wasn't the same in the NFC Championship Game after Peppers blasted him.

So I pose this question; who is more to blame? Coaches or players?

BeerBaron
10-04-2011, 03:20 PM
Scariest thing for me: We're 31st in total defense right now. That kills me. The Bears are always about defense...

regoob2
10-06-2011, 01:10 PM
Scariest thing for me: We're 31st in total defense right now. That kills me. The Bears are always about defense...
Yards mean nothing.

BeerBaron
10-06-2011, 01:13 PM
20th in points allowed isn't all that much better...

regoob2
10-06-2011, 02:31 PM
20th in points allowed isn't all that much better...
It's 11 spots better. We've played some of the best offenses in the NFL.

BeerBaron
10-06-2011, 02:40 PM
It's 11 spots better. We've played some of the best offenses in the NFL.

I don't accept this as an excuse. We have a defensive oriented head coach and a defense oriented GM, our defense should be better than this.

regoob2
10-06-2011, 05:28 PM
I don't accept this as an excuse. We have a defensive oriented head coach and a defense oriented GM, our defense should be better than this.
We've played 4 games.

Monomach
10-10-2011, 11:01 PM
So is everyone ready to stop acting like I'm an asshole for the things I said about our offseason?

I normally wouldn't post like this, but I seem to recall some "I can't wait to bump this and make you look like an idiot" posts directed my way.

Still room on the Jamarcus Webb hate bandwagon. Who wants a seat?

MidwayMonster31
10-10-2011, 11:27 PM
God ******* damnit.

SFbear
10-11-2011, 12:01 AM
Nobody did more than the Bears in augmenting their Offensive Line this offseason...They just need time to gel...Its about consistency...Still plenty of football left...We're close...Just going have to play harder...Frank Omiyale is a good football player...and we'll go from there.

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 06:13 AM
Nobody did more than the Bears in augmenting their Offensive Line this offseason...They just need time to gel...Its about consistency...Still plenty of football left...We're close...Just going have to play harder...Frank Omiyale is a good football player...and we'll go from there.

So SFbear is actually Jerry Angelo. Good to know.

SFbear
10-11-2011, 09:11 AM
So SFbear is actually Jerry Angelo. Good to know.

"I am going to treat it as an aberration,'' [Me] on the defensive meltdown.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/football/bears/ct-spt-1011-bears-haugh-chicago--20111011,0,5320812.column

We've been giving up huge plays all year but clearly the Lions game was some sort of anomaly. Nothing to see here. Move along folks.

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 09:13 AM
The sad thing is we have some winnable games left that may allow JA to save himself. Vikings twice, Chiefs, Broncos and Seahawks are definitely winnable.

7-9 might not get this staff **** canned the way I'd like to see. I'm exhausted of this team in it's current state...We need some changes. I just hope we don't end up hiring someone worse...

JBCX
10-11-2011, 09:15 AM
Why is the Bears' Cover-2 giving up more big plays than last year? Is it the quality of the safeties? Are the pass-rushers getting plder?

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 09:17 AM
Why is the Bears' Cover-2 giving up more big plays than last year? Is it the quality of the safeties? Are the pass-rushers getting plder?

Chris Harris is the slowest safety ever and I'm pretty sure Brandon Merriweather is mentally ********. That's a big part of it.

The pass rush not getting there also isn't helping.

jrdrylie
10-11-2011, 09:25 AM
Nobody did more than the Bears in augmenting their Offensive Line this offseason...They just need time to gel...Its about consistency...Still plenty of football left...We're close...Just going have to play harder...Frank Omiyale is a good football player...and we'll go from there.

What?!?! We drafted a right tackle and spent a ton of money on a center who for some reason in backing up an inept Lance Louis and an ancient Robert Garza. Please let this be sarcasm. Frank Omiyale is a good football player? Dumber words have never been spoken. It's about consistency? The Bears line is the most consistent in the league. They are consistently ****.

JBCX
10-11-2011, 10:13 AM
Chris Harris is the slowest safety ever and I'm pretty sure Brandon Merriweather is mentally ********. That's a big part of it.

The pass rush not getting there also isn't helping.

What happened to that safety they drafted in 2010? Major Wright? I thought he looked good as a rookie last year and might have been the best rookie safety of that class.

bearsfan_51
10-11-2011, 10:14 AM
Calm down, he's obviously joking.

I agree that this team is probably a 7-8 win operation, and that's probably not enough to have the total purge that is necessary.

It's not that Angelo and Lovie are awful at their jobs. I think Angelo is still a fantastic evaluator of defensive talent, even if he's slipped a bit in recent years, and his two biggest moves (Cutler, Peppers) were both ballsy and fantastic.

I've always been less enamored with Lovie. I think he's smart enough to be a solid defensive coordinator or head coach in college, but lacks the natural cerebralness to be an NFL head coach (he's also a total nepotist, which infuriates me to no end). That said, he's got a solid W/L record, and he can at least engender the loyalty of his players, whatever that's worth.

The problem is that we've been trying this since 2004, and we're going in the wrong direction. This isn't college football where it's ok to have the same coach for 20-30 years; sometimes change for the sake of change is a good thing.

bearsfan_51
10-11-2011, 10:15 AM
What happened to that safety they drafted in 2010? Major Wright? I thought he looked good as a rookie last year and might have been the best rookie safety of that class.
He's currently injured.

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 11:03 AM
Calm down, he's obviously joking.

I agree that this team is probably a 7-8 win operation, and that's probably not enough to have the total purge that is necessary.

It's not that Angelo and Lovie are awful at their jobs. I think Angelo is still a fantastic evaluator of defensive talent, even if he's slipped a bit in recent years, and his two biggest moves (Cutler, Peppers) were both ballsy and fantastic.

I've always been less enamored with Lovie. I think he's smart enough to be a solid defensive coordinator or head coach in college, but lacks the natural cerebralness to be an NFL head coach (he's also a total nepotist, which infuriates me to no end). That said, he's got a solid W/L record, and he can at least engender the loyalty of his players, whatever that's worth.

The problem is that we've been trying this since 2004, and we're going in the wrong direction. This isn't college football where it's ok to have the same coach for 20-30 years; sometimes change for the sake of change is a good thing.

And this is not even mentioning Mike Martz who needs to go. He's been a complete failure at every stop post-Rams.

And even when he was with the Rams, he had HoF caliber talent at LT, RB and two WRs. Plus Kurt Warner.

Anyone one of us could have been made to look like an offensive genius with that kind of talent.

TheMorningZoo
10-11-2011, 11:37 AM
I feel bad for you guys. You have to have one of the worst Offensive Lines I have seen ever! It reminds me of the beating David Carr took when he came into the league with the Texans.

Too bad Carimi got injured, guy is a stud-need to really address the O-Line in the Offseason.

As mentioned, Martz hasn't really done anything since the glory days of the Rams. It also didn't make much sense getting rid of Olsen (I know he isn't TE friendly, but come on?)

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 02:49 PM
Two of the Bears players (J’Marcus Webb and Frank Omiyale) have more false starts than 12 teams.

Worthless.

bigbluedefense
10-11-2011, 03:16 PM
Is Frank Omiyale the "Crappy Guard" you guys kept talking about? Just a guess of mine, I'm pretty sure he was. He has to be. I mean...that dude was awful.

Was it him?

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 03:23 PM
Is Frank Omiyale the "Crappy Guard" you guys kept talking about? Just a guess of mine, I'm pretty sure he was. He has to be. I mean...that dude was awful.

Was it him?

Yeah, it was him. We signed him and he proceeded to be the worst run blocking guard ever. He'd just get immediately stood up and knocked on his ass.

Then he moved to right tackle...where he was even worse.

Then, last year, after Chris Williams got hurt, he moved to left tackle where he was barely passable, mostly because if there is one position on the o-line where you can get away with being soft, it's LT.

And this we move Webb there...and Webb is awful. Carimi gets hurt, so Omiyele is back at RT.

BTW, if we cut J'Marcus Webb right now, no other team in the NFL would sign him. Now or ever. His career would be over. And he's OUR left tackle...

MidwayMonster31
10-11-2011, 03:31 PM
I'm sure some other team would take a shot at Webb thanks to his physical tools. If someone with a power scheme would keep him on the bench for two or three years (like the Bears were supposed to) and groom him to be a right tackle, he might have done okay.

BeerBaron
10-11-2011, 03:38 PM
I'm sure some other team would take a shot at Webb thanks to his physical tools. If someone with a power scheme would keep him on the bench for two or three years (like the Bears were supposed to) and groom him to be a right tackle, he might have done okay.

He's not even a powerful player. On more than one occassional last night he got driven right back by guys he has 50 pounds on. Plus, he gets in these little hand fights that end up looking like a game of patty cake.

SFbear
10-12-2011, 09:10 AM
Calm down, he's obviously joking.

I agree that this team is probably a 7-8 win operation, and that's probably not enough to have the total purge that is necessary.

It's not that Angelo and Lovie are awful at their jobs. I think Angelo is still a fantastic evaluator of defensive talent, even if he's slipped a bit in recent years, and his two biggest moves (Cutler, Peppers) were both ballsy and fantastic.

I've always been less enamored with Lovie. I think he's smart enough to be a solid defensive coordinator or head coach in college, but lacks the natural cerebralness to be an NFL head coach (he's also a total nepotist, which infuriates me to no end). That said, he's got a solid W/L record, and he can at least engender the loyalty of his players, whatever that's worth.

The problem is that we've been trying this since 2004, and we're going in the wrong direction. This isn't college football where it's ok to have the same coach for 20-30 years; sometimes change for the sake of change is a good thing.

A couple years ago I would have agreed with you about Angelo but I don't think he has drafted an impact defensive player since Daniel Manning in 2005 draft. Maybe Henry Melton. With so many disappointing picks in the first three rounds like Bazuin, Okwo, Marcus Harrison, Jarron Gilbert, Steltz, Major Wright (maybe even Paea) and I don't see much difference in his ability evaluate talent for either side of the ball. Make no mistake, this defense has had to look to FA for infusions of talent and even there our record has been pretty spotty(Archuletta, Darwin Walker, Meriweather, etc.).

Combined with the complete and utter failure on the offensive side of ball and I don't really see what Angelo brings to the table anymore. We are a bad drafting team. Plain and simple. Having the top drafting team in the league in Green Bay right next door certainly provides a stark contrast.

You hit the nail on the head with Lovie though. He does well with players but hiring his BFFs for coordinators is alarming. I think people give too much credit to Marinelli considering the defense didn't take the next step under his watch until we got Peppers but whatever. At least Angelo gave Martz a thumbs down before finally relenting. Lovie's in game coaching appears to be getting worse if that is even possible.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2011, 09:24 AM
We haven't found any defensive superstars, no, but we haven't exactly dedicated that many resources to it either. Bazuin was the 62nd pick in the draft, and everyone else you mentioned was taken in the 3rd round or later (Wright and Paea are too young). As much as draftnicks like to salivate over those rounds on this board, the expectation is that you're drafting busts or special teams guys. It would have been nice for at least one of those guys to pan out, but I don't think it's that big of a deal.

The real issue is that we've had to continually waste 1st round picks on offensive guys to cover for the offensive guys that didn't work out in the first place. Cutler replaced Grossman. Forte replaced Benson. We still don't have a LT worth a ****, etc.

BeerBaron
10-12-2011, 09:39 AM
I absolutely disagree that 2nd and 3rd rounders are throwaway picks. Those guys should absolutely be making impacts within 2-3 years.\

"Drafting busts or special teams players" is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. You make it sound like it's pure luck to hit on anyone outside of the first round, which is completely wrong.

In fact, I'd even argue that hitting on guys in that 2nd-3rd round range, even into the middle rounds, is what can take a team from good to great.

The teams who've been most successful in the past decade tend to acquire a handful of truly elite players, then use those "throwaway" picks, as you put them, to surround them with role and niche players to create solid teams.

We've done neither of those things (acquiring elite players in the draft and filling out the rest of the lineup with solid players) well in recent years.

Jerry Angelo has hit on job saving opportunities by trading for Cutler (who should never have been available in the first place if his former team hadn't been stupid beyond belief) and signing Peppers last year.

But now the defensive talent around those guys is getting worse, as is the offensive talent around Cutler. The blame for that is squarely on Jerry Angelo failing to acquire players who are even mediocre. Guys like Gilbert, Okwo, Bazuin, etc. out of the league within 2-3 years.

This team has gone to hell quickly, and it is due primarily to the failure of Jerry Angelo. Without resorting to extreme examples (Matt Millen, Josh McDaniels) it's difficult to find guys who would actually be worse than Angelo is right now.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2011, 10:29 AM
First of all, we're talking about one second round pick. One. And it was at the very end of the second round. All but one of Jerry's failures were in the 3rd round and down.

Find the number of 3rd-5th round players to make even one pro-bowl. My guess is that the % is less than 10%.

Which is odd, because for as stupid as my statement apparently was, you subsequently agreed with it when you also noted that the elite players on a team generally come from the first two rounds. Sure, there are exceptions, but for every one exception you come up with, I'll give you ten guys who were role players or total failures.

In regards to your Angelo statement, we've been an above .500 team for the past 3-4 years, so you could start with about half the league.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2011, 10:35 AM
Also, I never used half of the words you said I used. Strawman.

BeerBaron
10-12-2011, 10:48 AM
I think "throwaway" picks was the only part I made up.

And I'm not saying that every 3rd round pick should be a pro bowler. You probably are right in that it's less than 10%. But you can get a solid contributor there.

When the Patriots won that string of Superbowls, who did they send to the pro bowl? Brady, Ty Law...maybe Bruschi once or twice...not many at any rate. But they won because they surrounded those guys non-first round picks, undrafted players and castoffs from other teams. They didn't have to play great, but they were plugged in and played average around the elite players.

We're not getting that. Nick Roach is not very good next to Urlacher and Briggs. Our DT situation is messy. Idonije and Tillman are solid most of the time. Our safeties and other corners are typically horrible however.

On offense we have Forte and.....Sanzenbacher? Knox hasn't continued to develop, Hester would ideally be a #3 receiver at most and we traded our only TE because the offensive coordinator got tired of using him.

Our offensive line is an abomination. Webb, Omiyele, Chris Williams (a failed JA first rounder) all horrible. HORRIBLE. It's squarely in the "worst things I've seen in football" category.

We're a horrible, horrible team right now. Our defense is bottom of the league material (despite having a defensive minded HC and GM with tendencies to lean towards defense) and our offense outside of Forte devolves quickly into "whatever Cutler can must after escaping from pressure." If he escapes from pressure...

We need a fresh start. We have a few parts and pieces to build around but currently, no glue to hold them together. A new GM with fresh ideas and a new coach who might actually adjust schemes when it becomes clear the current ones aren't working would be incredible.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2011, 11:43 AM
So we're not the Patriots. I agree.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2011, 11:47 AM
Also, I never said Jerry shouldn't be fired, I even said in the original post that he should be fired. All I'm saying is that his failure to turn 3rd-5th round guys for the last few years into quality starters is the least of our problems.

The reason why our defense sucks has more to do with our inability to spend high picks on defensive players the last five years because Jerry has continually struck out with offensive players. You can't keep plugging holes in the secondary with 5th round guys and street free agents and expect to be successful.

Unless you're Bill Bellicheck, and nobody else is.

bearfan
10-13-2011, 10:18 AM
Im going to agree with BB on this one, a team that can effectively use their mid round picks is going to be a good team. While it is not as easy as hitting on 1st/2nd rounders, a team cannot soley rely on two picks a year to fill the holes on a team. Even if they never start, maybe they develop into a solid backup who is capable of holding their own when a starter goes down. Or as BB said, maybe they just fill a role on the team.

With JA, he has missed on so many players who meet this criteria (Minus Melton, Bennett, and I'll throw Wolfe in bc he was ST).

Looking back at the draft we can see so many players that would have helped this team. I'm not talking about hindsight looking back, I'm talking about those picks where we are hoping to draft X player (ie Quincy Black, Doug Free, SOME OL). Angelo just misses on them, instead trying to find his diamond in the rough...It's not working.

JBCX
10-14-2011, 01:58 PM
Would Jerry Angelo be better served going defense in the first round this year, or sticking to the "we must improve our offensive line" tactic?

I'm thinking that maybe JA will be tempted to draft a DE or CB in the first round if he feels that the value is just too good.

bearsfan_51
10-14-2011, 10:50 PM
Im going to agree with BB on this one, a team that can effectively use their mid round picks is going to be a good team. While it is not as easy as hitting on 1st/2nd rounders, a team cannot soley rely on two picks a year to fill the holes on a team. Even if they never start, maybe they develop into a solid backup who is capable of holding their own when a starter goes down. Or as BB said, maybe they just fill a role on the team.
That's great, except it's still not what I said.

I said that when you look at the reasons this team is on the serious decline, the main reason is not because we've failed in rounds 3-5, it's because we've failed in rounds 1-2.

In the time that Angelo has been GM we've spent:

-3 first round picks on quarterbacks
-1 first round and 1 second round picks on runningbacks
-3 first round picks on offensive linemen

Out of those eight picks, we've found 2 good players. We could have been using those other six picks to make our team a hell of a lot better than anything we possibly could have done in the 4th or 5th round.

You give me 6 first round picks and I'll give you 15 picks in the fourth round, and I bet I'll get more than you do.

sweetness34
10-15-2011, 01:03 PM
That's great, except it's still not what I said.

I said that when you look at the reasons this team is on the serious decline, the main reason is not because we've failed in rounds 3-5, it's because we've failed in rounds 1-2.

In the time that Angelo has been GM we've spent:

-3 first round picks on quarterbacks
-1 first round and 1 second round picks on runningbacks
-3 first round picks on offensive linemen

Out of those seven picks, we've found 2 good players. We could have been using those other five picks to make our team a hell of a lot better than anything we possibly could have done in the 4th or 5th round.

You give me 5 first round picks and I'll give you 15 picks in the fourth round, and I bet I'll get more than you do.

Exactly. Here's what Angelo has done in the 1st and 2nd rounds since he's been GM:

2002 - Marc Colombo (1st), No 2nd Round Pick
2003 - Michael Haynes, Rex Grossman (1st), Charles Tillman (2nd)
2004 - Tommie Harris (1st), Tank Johnson (2nd)
2005 - Cedric Benson (1st), Mark Bradley (2nd)
2006 - Danieal Manning, Devin Hester (2nd)
2007 - Greg Olsen (1st), Dan Bazuin (2nd)
2008 - Chris Williams (1st), Matt Forte (2nd)
2009 - None (Jay Cutler Trade)
2010 - None (Jay Cutler, Gaines Adams Trade)
2011 - Gabe Carimi (1st), Stephen Paea (2nd)

It's a mixed bag of results. Matt Forte, Jay Cutler, Charles Tillman and Devin Hester have been impact acquisitions via draft/trade. Michael Haynes, Dan Bazuin, Chris Williams, Gaines Adams trade, Tank Johnson, Cedric Benson and Mark Bradley can be considered busts. Marc Colombo and Tommie Harris were a bit of bad luck. Colombo was doing very well until his knee injury and Tommie was the best DT in the league until his knees went to ****.

I think Carimi is going to end up being a very nice pick, but the jury is still out on Paea.

Overall, Jerry hasn't been a bad GM, but I also don't believe he's been a good one either. He's attained average results and therefore I consider him to be an average GM.

But as 51 said the glaring weakness in his drafting has been the first two rounds. He hasn't selected impact players consistently early and that has really hurt us.

Gay Ork Wang
10-15-2011, 10:02 PM
out of all of those only 7 guys remain with the team, 5 from the last 4 years.

iowatreat54
10-17-2011, 11:39 AM
http://espn.go.com/chicago/nfl/story/_/id/7114232/source-benched-chicago-bears-db-chris-harris-wants-trade

We would be more than happy to Chris, if only we could find someone that actually wants you...

BeerBaron
10-17-2011, 12:17 PM
****, we might have to give up a pick so someone else will take him off our hands. Who wants the slowest safety in the league, really?

bearsfan_51
10-17-2011, 03:18 PM
It's a bit confusing why he couldn't play special teams, however. He's not fast, but he can hit.

jrdrylie
10-21-2011, 10:47 AM
It's a bit confusing why he couldn't play special teams, however. He's not fast, but he can hit.

Chris Harris seems like one of those guys who thinks he is too good for special teams. Usually you have young guys and career special teamers on kicks and punts, not former starters.

bearsfan_51
10-22-2011, 11:21 AM
Olin Kruetz quits on the Saints. What a *****.

bearsfan_51
10-23-2011, 04:58 PM
If the season ended today we'd be in the playoffs, for whatever that's worth.

Gay Ork Wang
10-24-2011, 03:33 AM
if the Lions lose against Greenbay, we are 1 win away to tying their record, which is nice!

regoob2
10-24-2011, 09:23 AM
Chris Harris seems like one of those guys who thinks he is too good for special teams. Usually you have young guys and career special teamers on kicks and punts, not former starters.
Where does that assumption come from? Harris has always been a team first guy. I assume the team felt he wasnt healthy enough to play last week. He didnt look like himself in that game.

bearfan
10-25-2011, 10:08 AM
I finally figured out my frustration with the Bears.

We have the potential every year to be a good team (I say potential bc we have some just average players starting for us/below average). Somehow we find ways to win games.

BUT this team is not built like an elite team that could go to the Super Bowl based on sheer domination.

We're stuck between mediocre and good and it doesn't look to change.

#firejerry

jrdrylie
10-25-2011, 03:32 PM
I finally figured out my frustration with the Bears.

We have the potential every year to be a good team (I say potential bc we have some just average players starting for us/below average). Somehow we find ways to win games.

BUT this team is not built like an elite team that could go to the Super Bowl based on sheer domination.

We're stuck between mediocre and good and it doesn't look to change.

#firejerry

If the season ended today, the Bears would be the six seed. I think they end up 10-6, and with wins over Atlanta and Tampa, that should be good enough to make the playoffs. If they make the playoffs, Jerry and Lovie will almost certainly be back.

bearfan
10-25-2011, 04:35 PM
If the season ended today, the Bears would be the six seed. I think they end up 10-6, and with wins over Atlanta and Tampa, that should be good enough to make the playoffs. If they make the playoffs, Jerry and Lovie will almost certainly be back.

Yes clearly that is the problem. Lovie I have no issue with right now, it is Jerry for providing a roster which will never be able to beat really good teams.

I have no doubt that because of our schedule that we will have a winning record, but I feel like that is going to be the extent of it.

sweetness34
10-25-2011, 05:18 PM
They're both the problem. Jerry is the problem for getting Cutler killed on a weekly basis by not surrounding him with a better OL. Lovie is also the problem because he has no ******* idea what he's doing offensively. It takes all hell breaking loose from the media/fans for him to go to Martz and say, 'run the ******* ball more you idiot.'

They're both clueless and stubborn. Well okay, Angelo isn't clueless. He's just an arrogant prick who thinks he has the right answer all the time even when he's wrong. Lovie on the other hand is terrible at in game coaching and can't adjust to save his life.

xspikex
10-26-2011, 05:44 PM
Looks like alot of people around here want's to get rid of both Lovie and Jerry. I'm not sure, it all depends on what coach we bring in instead. I'm sure how ever that we have to get rid of Martz, he doesn't have the personel to run his system and he takes forever to adjust.

So who are your ideal man for the HC position, and why? And do you have any good names for either OC or DC, because if Lovies gone, Martz and Marinelli is gone to.

regoob2
10-26-2011, 08:53 PM
I have no problem with getting rid of Martz but not everyone. Did we have a top 5 pick last season or were we 1 game away from the Super Bowl?

jrdrylie
10-27-2011, 08:52 AM
The Bears have released Chris Harris. I think somebody picks him up even though he is old and slow.

http://twitter.com/#!/ChrisHarrisNFL/status/129552333976768512

BeerBaron
10-27-2011, 08:54 AM
Yeah, if a playoff contending team loses a starter and wants a vet who can fill in, they may look to Harris.

He just seems to lack burst anymore. It may be worsened by the fact he's recovering from an injury, but he was never the fastest guy to begin with.

Remember the Packers playoff game last year? He was rushed back from an injury for that and several of Green Bay's big passing plays on their touchdown drives came at Harris' expense. Then we pulled him and put Major Wright in. Their offense didn't score another point in that game. (Raji added the pick 6 though.)

xspikex
10-27-2011, 10:30 AM
I have no problem with getting rid of Martz but not everyone. Did we have a top 5 pick last season or were we 1 game away from the Super Bowl?

That's exactly what I mean, if we're gonna bring in a new HC it should be someone really good, not just change for the sake of change.

bearsfan_51
10-27-2011, 10:31 AM
That's exactly what I mean, if we're gonna bring in a new HC it should be someone really good, not just change for the sake of change.
Good point. I was in favor of bringing in someone bad.

sweetness34
10-27-2011, 10:33 AM
I have no problem with getting rid of Martz but not everyone. Did we have a top 5 pick last season or were we 1 game away from the Super Bowl?

Did we win that game? Nope, and the biggest reason why was because Lovie decided to side with Martz on bringing Todd Collins in before Caleb Hanie.

Lovie isn't a terrible coach by any means, but he isn't a very good one either. He's middle of the road (as indicated by his record). Same with Angelo. He's found some gems via draft/free agency (Hester, Forte, Briggs, Cutler, Peppers), but he's also **** the bed (Omiyale, Merriwether, Bazuin, Adams (RIP), Wolfe, Dvoracek, Benson, Manu, C. Williams, etc).

I think it's great that we got to the NFC Championship Game last year. I enjoyed the season, but we failed to win that game and win the Super Bowl. Therefore it's a failed season and I keep going back to that decision to bring in Collins for 3 series when the Packers offense was shut down by our defense. Hanie did throw two picks, but he also threw two touchdowns and was leading us on a drive that could have tied the game and sent it to overtime.

xspikex
10-27-2011, 02:59 PM
Good point. I was in favor of bringing in someone bad.

I think you know what I meant. It's easy to cry about getting rid of Lovie, but who can we get instead?
If there is a real chance for a guy like Bill Cowher I'm all for it. I just don't want us to end up like Jacksonville, firing a Coughlin after a couple of bad seasons, and ending up with Jack Del Rio.

I really wanted Shanahan after the Broncos let him go, he had a great report with Cutler in Denver and had something like 2 losing seasons in 14 years on the job there.

ArkyRamsFan
10-28-2011, 04:47 PM
Rams fan here. I have a question for Bears fans: How is Stephen Paea doing for ya'll. I really wanted the Rams to pick him but our "brain trust" had other ideas...

Is he playing much and what do you think of his future?

Thanks in advance.

jrdrylie
10-28-2011, 05:01 PM
Rams fan here. I have a question for Bears fans: How is Stephen Paea doing for ya'll. I really wanted the Rams to pick him but our "brain trust" had other ideas...

Is he playing much and what do you think of his future?

Thanks in advance.

I haven't really heard his name much. He's only played 2 games but he did get a sack.

BeerBaron
10-28-2011, 05:35 PM
Yeah, he's had no real impact. Not playing much though. I think he was probably slated to be the first DT off the bench but Okoye swiped it from him and hasn't been bad.

regoob2
10-30-2011, 08:51 AM
Did we win that game? Nope, and the biggest reason why was because Lovie decided to side with Martz on bringing Todd Collins in before Caleb Hanie.

Lovie isn't a terrible coach by any means, but he isn't a very good one either. He's middle of the road (as indicated by his record). Same with Angelo. He's found some gems via draft/free agency (Hester, Forte, Briggs, Cutler, Peppers), but he's also **** the bed (Omiyale, Merriwether, Bazuin, Adams (RIP), Wolfe, Dvoracek, Benson, Manu, C. Williams, etc).

I think it's great that we got to the NFC Championship Game last year. I enjoyed the season, but we failed to win that game and win the Super Bowl. Therefore it's a failed season and I keep going back to that decision to bring in Collins for 3 series when the Packers offense was shut down by our defense. Hanie did throw two picks, but he also threw two touchdowns and was leading us on a drive that could have tied the game and sent it to overtime.
We lost that game because they were a better football team. Even if Hanie was our #2 did you expect us to win?

regoob2
10-30-2011, 08:54 AM
Rams fan here. I have a question for Bears fans: How is Stephen Paea doing for ya'll. I really wanted the Rams to pick him but our "brain trust" had other ideas...

Is he playing much and what do you think of his future?

Thanks in advance.He didnt play in the first couple games. His technique needed to be worked on and were deep at DT. He has played in a rotation like all our DTs this season but he has played very well. His athleticism really shows up on the field. He will likely be our starting NT by the end of the season.

sweetness34
10-30-2011, 03:16 PM
We lost that game because they were a better football team. Even if Hanie was our #2 did you expect us to win?

Who knows, but I would have liked to have seen what he could do in the 3 series that Collins was in there. Hanie at least gave us a chance to win.

The fact that Collins was even given a chance in that game was a telling sign of Lovie's incompetence as a coach. I understand that he's a defensive guy, but how did he not see that Hanie is the better option? Need we forget that Collins also looked horrid against Carolina when Jay was out with a concussion? It's not like Lovie was giving Collins his first opportunity.

I also disagree that Green Bay was the better football team, but that is semantics. They won, therefore they were better that day across the board (including coaching).

Lovie is not a bad coach, but he's certainly not a good one either. He relates well with players, he keeps everything in house and he runs a good defensive system with the right personnel. However, he is not a good game coach, he fails to adjust because he's stubborn and he's a reactive coach instead of proactive. He waits until after Jay gets killed in both the New Orleans and Detroit game to tell Martz to run the ball more instead of addressing it during the game.

Personally, I believe we have the talent to be better than we are. The inconsistency of this team falls on coaching and lack of preparation. How do we go from dominating the Falcons to getting blasted against the Saints in one week? How do we look like garbage in all 3 phases against Detroit and then dominate all 3 phases against the Vikings 6 days later?

Lovie is and will always be an average head coach. It's debatable who is more to blame, he or Angelo, but both need to go (along with their buddy Ted Phillips). The real solution is turning the organization upside down starting from the top, but that won't happen unless Virginia either gives up the team or passes away. The entire organization is a joke.

bearsfan_51
10-30-2011, 03:21 PM
Hanie did not give us a chance to win.

bearsfan_51
10-30-2011, 03:21 PM
Also, Green Bay is way more talented than we are.

bearsfan_51
10-30-2011, 03:23 PM
I mean, honestly sweetness, most of what you're saying makes no sense.

-We are more talented than the Superbowl Champs, and we should fire our GM.

-We are a totally mediocre organization that is a joke.

sweetness34
10-30-2011, 04:49 PM
I mean, honestly sweetness, most of what you're saying makes no sense.

-We are more talented than the Superbowl Champs, and we should fire our GM.

-We are a totally mediocre organization that is a joke.

When did I ever say we were more talented than the Packers? I said on par with them (if you include all 3 phases). And how did Hanie not give us a shot in that game? He was leading us on a drive that would have tied the game. With Collins in there we never sniff tying up the game.

I guess my point is that it's mind numbingly frustrating to see the inconsistency of this team and I believe that falls on coaching (and the GM who hired the coach). Or maybe it's just that our players aren't as good as they appear to be some weeks (Atlanta and Minnesota).

Angelo has had his fair share of gems and good pickups, but he's also solely responsible for letting the offensive line and receivers go to ****, which in turn has made Cutler regress as a QB.

The lack of consistency is what irritates me though, which I put on coaching/talent development.

bearsfan_51
10-31-2011, 02:11 PM
If you honestly feel that Angelo has assembled a team as talented as the Superbowl Champs, I don't see how you can say with any credibility that he should also be fired.

J-Mike88
10-31-2011, 02:43 PM
You guys have a great game next Monday Night vs the Eagles.
You shut them down last year when they came in red hot.

If Peppers, Urlacher, and Briggs are still healthy, I expect another great battle.

I dislike Philly and their fans are crappy. I respect Bears fans and like the city.
I might be rooting for you guys.

What do you expect? Should be a heavy dose of Matt Forte.

bearsfan_51
10-31-2011, 03:07 PM
I like Philly. But I've only seen about 5% of it, and it was probably the nicest 5%.

jrdrylie
10-31-2011, 03:12 PM
What do you expect? Should be a heavy dose of Matt Forte.

Forte better touch the ball 30 times in this game.

jrdrylie
11-02-2011, 01:02 PM
http://eye-on-football.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/22475988/33081146

More anger from Forte about not being paid. I know they are probably scared off by Chris Johnson and DeAngelo Williams sucking after getting their deals, but they need to get this done. Maybe they plan on franchising him, but that still costs over $7 million. I'm all for a 4-year deal for between $30-35 million.

bearsfan_51
11-02-2011, 02:03 PM
They can franchise him two years in a row for 16 million dollars. He's asking for more guaranteed money than that.

If he's unhappy, he should talk with the NFLPA for allowing the franchise tag to still exist. It's stupid to offer a runningback more guaranteed money than you can keep him for two years at.

regoob2
11-03-2011, 05:29 PM
I have no problem paying Forte top potential money just not top guaranteed money.

bearsfan_51
11-05-2011, 10:35 AM
Here are our Free Agents after this season, who do we bring back?

-Matt Forte (obvious franchise)
-Israel Idonije
-Earl Bennett
-Zack Bowman
-Roberto Garza
-Corey Graham
-Caleb Hanie
-Brian Iwuh
-Brandon Merriweather (obviously gone)
-Amobi Okoye
-Craig Steltz
-Roy Williams

Man that's a ton of guys. Good thing almost all of them are backups.

BeerBaron
11-05-2011, 10:54 AM
I would like to keep Idonije. And Graham is a great special teams player. There's a chance we retain Hanie...hopefully he knows the system by now.

bearsfan_51
11-05-2011, 11:02 AM
I'd like to bring Okoye back. I think he fits the system.

regoob2
11-06-2011, 09:03 AM
Forte needs to be brought back and paid. Like I said earlier I wouldnt give him crazy guaranteed money but im fine with a top 5 RB potential money.

Idonije shouldnt be a starter but he has backup and STs value.

Bennett is a good slot/underneath receiver. I doubt any team will offer him a big contract with his injures and lack of big production but were thin and WR so we cant afford to lose him.

Bowman is a backup who will likely never crack the starting lineup so I see no need to bring him back. We need to bring in CBs with starting potential.

Garza is on his last legs and with how well Spencer is playing at RG Id prefer to keep him there. We need to bring in a new starting C. I could see us bring back Garza on a 1 year deal though depending on FA and the draft.

Graham is a great STer but it depends on how much money he wants. If its a near min contract then I would be fine with bringing him back.

Hanie will likely be our #3 next season but I dont want us spending any more draft picks on QBs so I would be fine with bring him back for min money but if that doesnt happen an UDFA QB will do fine.

Iwuh will likely accept min money.

Merriweather is gone.

Okoye has played well in his situational role and should be resigned.

Steltz should be resigned since were thin at S after releasing Chris Harris and likely losing Merriweather. I dont want to spend a pick on a backup S.

Williams needs to be replaced. We really need to improve our WRs.

bearsfan_51
11-06-2011, 09:38 AM
Someone will pay Idonije starter money. We've already been paying him 2-3 million per year.

Someone will give Hanie solid money too. If we're going to bring him back we'll have to pay him like a high-priced backup, not a #3 (we're paying him 1.2 million as a restricted free agent)

jrdrylie
11-07-2011, 03:18 PM
Forte will be franchised. I hope he doesn't hold out.

Idonije will not be brought back. I wish he would, but I agree with BF_51 that he'll get a large paycheck from somebody. I think the same can be said for Bennett. If we can get him for dirt cheap, I'm all for resigning him. Otherwise, I think they can find similar value in round 4 or 5 of the draft.

Roberto Garza, Roy Williams, Craig Steltz, Bowman, and Brandon Merriweather can walk. I don't care about any of them.

I'd like to see Hanie brought back. But if not, no big deal. If Cutler goes down, the team will be screwed no matter who the back up is so no need to give Hanie a bunch of money.

We should be able to retain Graham for pretty cheap. Hopefully we can do the same for Okoye.

Gay Ork Wang
11-07-2011, 08:40 PM
Id keep Steltz for ST money. Toub needs familiar people

MidwayMonster31
11-08-2011, 12:02 AM
I think that was far and away the best job done by the offensive line all year. Spaeth has been a real nice pick up for us.

bearsfan_51
11-08-2011, 10:17 AM
Bears sign Garza to a 2-year extension. Looks like Chris Spencer was always brought in to be a guard.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
11-08-2011, 10:47 AM
For ***** sake.

bearsfan_51
11-08-2011, 10:59 AM
I'm indifferent to it. The money is negligible, so that's no issue. He's not the best center in the league, but he's not the worst. I'm not aware of the market for centers/guards next year, but I'm sure it's not great.

And, quite frankly, we need to really start focusing on defense in the next draft. We've spent a ton of picks the last few years trying to fix the offense and it's come at the expense of the defense. Paea needs to step up and be a starter, but we also need to determine if Melton is starter-caliber, and if not, draft someone who is. We need to begin seriously thinking about Urlacher's clock, and we could always use an upgrade over Tim Jennings.

JBCX
11-08-2011, 01:01 PM
I think that was far and away the best job done by the offensive line all year. Spaeth has been a real nice pick up for us.

Of course, they will probably immediately revert back to form against the Lions and allow Cutler to be plastered all over Soldier Field.

jrdrylie
11-08-2011, 01:25 PM
Of course, they will probably immediately revert back to form against the Lions and allow Cutler to be plastered all over Soldier Field.

A big part of the problem the offensive line had against Detroit in the last game was all the noise. Just the fact that the game is in Chicago this time leads me to believe the offensive line will be exponentially better.

MidwayMonster31
11-08-2011, 02:33 PM
A big part of the problem the offensive line had against Detroit in the last game was all the noise. Just the fact that the game is in Chicago this time leads me to believe the offensive line will be exponentially better.I actually thought that was going to be a big problem last night, even if was an outdoor stadium. They handled it pretty well, I also think they need to keep moving the pocket against Detroit.

sweetness34
11-08-2011, 04:41 PM
Of course, they will probably immediately revert back to form against the Lions and allow Cutler to be plastered all over Soldier Field.

Did someone in the Bears organization piss in your Cheerios?

bearsfan_51
11-08-2011, 10:15 PM
Pretty confident in our ability to make the playoffs barring injury. Atlanta might be as weak up front (offense and defense) as we are.

Gay Ork Wang
11-13-2011, 07:25 AM
apparently Carimi has to have knee surgery and might be placed on IR

bearsfan_51
11-19-2011, 09:39 PM
Carimi was indeed placed on IR. Bummer.

MidwayMonster31
11-20-2011, 06:30 PM
That's a shame. Fortunately Louis is doing a pretty good job at RT. Edwin Williams also had a pretty solid game today. Those mini-rollouts are also working pretty well.

dabears10
11-20-2011, 08:36 PM
Not good news,
http://twitter.com/#!/vxmcclure23/status/138441921818411009

Cutler with a Broken Thumb

BeerBaron
11-20-2011, 08:37 PM
Supposedly Roethlisberger played through the same injury, so hopefully he won't miss time.

dabears10
11-20-2011, 09:12 PM
Supposedly Roethlisberger played through the same injury, so hopefully he won't miss time.

It all depends on if he gets surgery or not. Has anyone heard if it is his Throwing Hand or his off hand?

BeerBaron
11-20-2011, 09:13 PM
It's his throwing hand. Injured on the INT return when he was blocked into the ground.

He stayed in the game though and went on to complete 2 more passes. I'm hoping it's not too serious. Like I said, Roethlisberger played through something similar.

If not....well god help us all.

BeerBaron
11-20-2011, 10:05 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/20/jay-cutler-expected-to-miss-6-8-weeks/

Ugh. Ugh. It's such a gut shot as a contending team for this to happen. This is just ****** all the way around.

Gay Ork Wang
11-21-2011, 02:00 AM
well at least not definitely out for the season. yet. I can see us do okay and squeeze into the playoffs if caleb plays serviceable. ST and D need to step up just like yesterday

bearsfan_51
11-21-2011, 07:48 PM
Turd Ferguson

BeerBaron
11-29-2011, 03:34 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/11/29/mike-martz-rumored-to-have-interest-in-arizona-state-job/

Not sure what to think.

jrdrylie
11-30-2011, 01:58 PM
Jay Cutler is engaged to Kristin Cavallari again.

MidwayMonster31
12-04-2011, 03:24 PM
That...is...a...problem
WHAT THE ****!!!!!!!!!

BeerBaron
12-04-2011, 03:25 PM
Well. I think our season died with Forte today.

Gay Ork Wang
12-05-2011, 06:17 AM
Cut Roy Williams. Now. Hanie did okay when we started to call roll outs and ****

MidwayMonster31
12-05-2011, 01:35 PM
I agree, in the rare instances where Hanie actually had a pocket to work with, he was staring down targets a bit too much for my liking. I think the Bears need to move the pocket if they are going to have any chance against Denver. If Miller plays next week, it could get ugly for Hanie.

BeerBaron
12-11-2011, 11:48 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/11/report-persistent-chatter-jerry-angelo-could-retire/

bearsfan_51
12-11-2011, 01:59 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/11/report-persistent-chatter-jerry-angelo-could-retire/

Quoting a comment in the article:

The Bear fansí hatred of Angelo, Smith, and especially Martz is puzzling. Exactly how many NFC championship games and Super Bowls did that franchise go to since the mid 80′s when the so called franchise messiah, Mike Ditka, squandered one of the greatest defensive rosters of all time? I donít think it was any, or am I missing something.

Also, exactly when has the franchise had anything approaching a good offense or top 10 QB play? I donít even think you can say thatís ever happened in the modern era, but Bear fans are ready to run Martz out of town, too?

Maybe youíre clamouring for those Dave Wanstedt, Dick Jauron days. Or maybe you should realize your franchise history, the cheap family who owns your team that will never pay top dollar for a GM or coach, and realize that you have one of the better tandems in football going right now under those circumstances. conly get worse.

5 playoff runs and a Super Bowl appearance in 8 years with the likes of Rex Grossman and Kyle Orton as your QB isnít that shabby.

That about sums it up for me. #IrememberWanstedt

Gay Ork Wang
12-11-2011, 04:33 PM
http://twitter.com/ZachZaidman/status/145941249310982144

bearsfan_51
12-11-2011, 04:53 PM
Put Hester at QB and run the wildcat.

MidwayMonster31
12-15-2011, 07:40 PM
**** this season.

descendency
12-19-2011, 06:28 AM
0Zi0xiIiUBw

MidwayMonster31
12-19-2011, 12:24 PM
Willie Gault's super bowl ring found in an LA jewelery store
http://news.yahoo.com/la-police-stolen-chicago-bear-super-bowl-ring-200710391--spt.html?bouchon=602,il

J-Mike88
12-19-2011, 02:29 PM
0Zi0xiIiUBw
That's fricking hilarious!
Who has these musical abilities... I love those parodies.
I remember one about 6 years ago mocking Farve, comparing him to Charlie Frye, sounded similar to this one.

ChiFan24
12-20-2011, 01:13 AM
Vincent Jackson anyone?

Gay Ork Wang
12-20-2011, 01:49 AM
I want Cutler.

MidwayMonster31
12-20-2011, 01:53 AM
After all this, none of us better complain about Cutler again. I don't think that's a big problem here anyway.

Docta
12-23-2011, 06:59 PM
Zach Bowman will start over Tim Jennings for the last 2 weeks. They finally realized that he's not a #2 CB. Hopefully they'll draft a CB this year.

bearfan
12-24-2011, 02:26 PM
Zach Bowman will start over Tim Jennings for the last 2 weeks. They finally realized that he's not a #2 CB. Hopefully they'll draft a CB this year.

I don't think that Jennings has done a bad job at all. He can tackle, and aside from an occasional slip up...he has done pretty well IMO.

MidwayMonster31
12-25-2011, 11:56 PM
Zach Bowman will start over Tim Jennings for the last 2 weeks. They finally realized that he's not a #2 CB. Hopefully they'll draft a CB this year.This sure worked out well. I'm ready to draft a CB early. Gilmore or Hayward can work.

bearfan
01-01-2012, 02:50 PM
How about the sheer stupidity of Lovie Smith? When this game means nothing he is not using this as a try out for some guys who havent gotten any time this year. Enderle should be starting...how often do rookies/young guys like that get an opportunity to play? This is the perfect opportunity. Urlacher just got injured...why is he playing?

Makes me mad that we're trying to win this game so badly when it means nothing. Give some young guys a chance to show you what they have got.

princefielder28
01-03-2012, 09:14 AM
Jerry Angelo is out

BeerBaron
01-03-2012, 09:52 AM
It's interesting. Makes me wonder if/when any coaches follow him. I'm indifferent to this for right now...

Someone had to take the fall for starting 7-3 then ending 8-8. Hurt QB or not, that just isn't acceptable in the NFL. My money would have been on Martz, so Angelo is a little bit of a surprise.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
01-03-2012, 10:06 AM
Cutler is just THAT sick. I'm still so mad we traded him, and no amount of Tebowmania, even if he learns to somehow complete more than half of his passes on a regular basis, will ever fix that.

LeIvkvsVAyc

Look at that ****.
1) Rolling out with eyes deep downfield
2) toughness. Stepping into the throw knowing you're about to get popped
3) Arm strength. Was that 60 yards? On a rope.
4) Accuracy. 60+ yards right into the breadbasket of a double covered Javon Walker. In stride.

Cutler may not be the best QB in the league, but ****, I could watch him throw all ****** day. **** McDaniels. And it turns out Cassell sucks ass, so double **** you, McDaniels.

bearsfan_51
01-03-2012, 10:55 AM
Jerry Angelo is out
Lovie had better follow.

BeerBaron
01-03-2012, 10:58 AM
Lovie had better follow.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/03/bears-announce-lovie-smith-will-stay/

Nope.

My prediction right after hearing it was that Lovie would stay and Ruskell would be promoted to GM. A cheap, predictable McCaskey move.

bearsfan_51
01-03-2012, 11:01 AM
They may bring Lovie back next year, but his tenure will be short as well. As the article you linked states, these arranged marriages rarely last long.

That said, there's no reason to fire Jerry and not Lovie; it's just wasting a year of needed rebuilding.

We should be deciding what coach we'll have, so that we can draft for that defensive scheme.

BeerBaron
01-03-2012, 11:02 AM
I agree, but this is what we've got. Promoting Ruskell would probably cause a little less friction between HC and GM than hiring a brand new GM would.

Still, for either guy, it'd be make or break next year. We don't need another JA/Jauron situation.

bearsfan_51
01-03-2012, 11:12 AM
I have no faith in this organization going forward. The main reason why I've always liked Angelo is that at least he's a football guy. The McCaskey's are inbred aristocrats who operate the Bears as a profit-making venture and know nothing about football. Ted Phillips is a mid-level bureaucrat who was able to suck ass enough to be continually promoted to the top.

Every year I become less interested in what the Bears are doing, and more interested in college football. I fear this team will fall back to the 90s level of awfulness.

BeerBaron
01-03-2012, 11:14 AM
I have no faith in this organization going forward. The main reason why I've always liked Angelo is that at least he's a football guy. The McCaskey's are inbred aristocrats who operate the Bears as a profit-making venture and know nothing about football. Ted Phillips is a mid-level bureaucrat who was able to suck ass enough to be continually promoted to the top.

Every year I become less interested in what the Bears are doing, and more interested in college football.

That must be difficult as a Minnesota fan...

Overall though, I don't disagree. Jerry has been on a downward spiral in the last few years, and his ass was saved by Cutler becoming available (franchise QBs in their prime simply should not be traded...ever...thank you McD!) and last year by signing Peppers and getting VERY lucky that we had no serious injuries.

I don't think there was a big difference in this team between the last two years, but anytime your top two offensive players get hurt, there's going to be trouble.

bearsfan_51
01-03-2012, 11:19 AM
Being a Minnesota fan isn't easy, but at least in college football it's easier to rationalize the short-comings of my team due to limitations in recruiting and money. Every season we already start with 3-4 losses, so it's the other 8-9 games I care about.

The Bears have no excuses other than incompetency and greed.

MidwayMonster31
01-03-2012, 03:26 PM
Martz out also (Per Dan Pompei).
I really hope the same thing that happened in 09 with the offense doesn't happen again.

BeerBaron
01-03-2012, 03:47 PM
Martz out also (Per Dan Pompei).
I really hope the same thing that happened in 09 with the offense doesn't happen again.

I have a feeling that it may. What worthwhile offensive coordinator candidate is going to want to come into a team in flux, with a head coach on the hot seat? If you dont' succeed immediately, you'll be out within a year.

Exact same circumstances Martz entered under, and exact same circumstance we're in now.

If you've ever called plays at any level of football, please submit your resume to the Chicago Bears.

Gay Ork Wang
01-03-2012, 04:21 PM
How about the sheer stupidity of Lovie Smith? When this game means nothing he is not using this as a try out for some guys who havent gotten any time this year. Enderle should be starting...how often do rookies/young guys like that get an opportunity to play? This is the perfect opportunity. Urlacher just got injured...why is he playing?

Makes me mad that we're trying to win this game so badly when it means nothing. Give some young guys a chance to show you what they have got.
Enderle shouldnt have started. There is no reason to believe he is even going to be on the roster next year. He was martz' project and i cant see how he should warrant a look when we even wanted McCown over him and Hanie was outplaying him in practice.

Reggie McKenzie - director of football operations for the Packers - is a old friend of Lovies and might be a candidate for GM

bearfan
01-03-2012, 07:50 PM
Enderle shouldnt have started. There is no reason to believe he is even going to be on the roster next year. He was martz' project and i cant see how he should warrant a look when we even wanted McCown over him and Hanie was outplaying him in practice.

Reggie McKenzie - director of football operations for the Packers - is a old friend of Lovies and might be a candidate for GM

I guess I can't be too upset now, since Jerry was fired. Still, even though it was a late draft pick, at that point it was worth a shot. Now it is yet another wasted pick.

Nice to the second part.

Gay Ork Wang
01-03-2012, 10:19 PM
i mean it was a really late round pick. You cant really waste them, you can only struck gold with them, thats how i see it

MidwayMonster31
01-03-2012, 10:29 PM
It was worth the gamble. It was a #3 QB anyway.
Austin Davis or Chandler Harnish might be worth a shot.

bearfan
01-04-2012, 02:50 AM
To each his own.

I would have liked them to play him, there was no point in not doing so. If he was drafted only to be discarded after being on the team all year, then they should have drafted someone who they thought would have a shot staying with the team.

In addition, as a fan I wanted a higher draft pick, and he probably would have given us the best chance at that!

Gay Ork Wang
01-04-2012, 09:44 AM
well hindsight is 20/20. If they thought it was more important to figure out if McCown is worthy of an extension then to see what enderle can do, you can kinda tell how much they know of enderle. I mean you haven seen enderle a bit. they did. While i do understand the "i want every draft pick to work out", him making the team was already a miracle. If we dont want to see him play it means we dont trust him. Coaches see more of players and there is a lot mroe that can determine you are going to suck than leting you try a game in regular season. What if he could hardly complete a pass against the practice squad or 2nd team? why would you bother?

im perfectly happy at us trying to see if McCown is a worthy backup. Hanie clearly wasnt

SFbear
01-06-2012, 10:57 AM
Tice to OC. Was probably inevitable but timing is weird.

BeerBaron
01-06-2012, 11:09 AM
Maybe at least he'll strive for more balance and to protect Cutler better. Gotta find the positives, right?

SFbear
01-06-2012, 11:20 AM
Maybe at least he'll strive for more balance and to protect Cutler better. Gotta find the positives, right?

He's going to be responsible for the running game and they'll bring in a QB/passing game coach. Other than Chris Williams inability to figure out who to block at the second level, I've really liked our execution in the running game so I like continuity there. Passing game I figure if we get him some better blocking, upgrade receiver and Cutler will do what he do.

My guess is that promises were made to Tice behind the scenes during Martzian reign of terror and Tice gave the org an ultimatum. Who knows though. Just weird timing.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
01-06-2012, 12:11 PM
Kinda tired of his name being thrown out there but I'll do it anyway: What if Jeremy Bates is the "passing game" coach?

Any chance of that, I'd be much more enthusiastic about all this.

Monomach
01-06-2012, 01:09 PM
I don't understand the firing of JA. Well, not like this, anyway.

The new GM doesn't get to choose the coach, the QB, or the coordinators...meaning he's forced into both the offensive and defensive systems, even if he doesn't believe in them.

If you're going to hire a puppet GM with no power to correct the mistakes, why not just strip JA of his power and keep him? Why not go down to Brookfield and pick up a monkey to put at that desk?

No GM worthy of being a GM will want the job.

This all smells like setting it up for Ruskell to take over, and that's no change at all.

MidwayMonster31
01-06-2012, 01:26 PM
uuuuuuuugggggggggghhhhhhhhh. I know this should come as no surprise, but uuuuuuuugggggggggghhhhhhhhh.

BeerBaron
01-09-2012, 07:06 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/03/bears-announce-lovie-smith-will-stay/

Nope.

My prediction right after hearing it was that Lovie would stay and Ruskell would be promoted to GM. A cheap, predictable McCaskey move.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/09/bears-may-stay-in-house-hire-tim-ruskell-as-g-m/

Not official yet, but sounding likely. Totally called it.

SFbear
01-09-2012, 10:02 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/09/bears-may-stay-in-house-hire-tim-ruskell-as-g-m/

Not official yet, but sounding likely. Totally called it.

Well the article is just speculation but no doubt Ruskell is plan B, just like Martz was during our OC search. It would be a PR disaster but what I've read is that Lovie is pushing for Ruskell behind the scenes just like he did Martz.

What I don't understand is how Lovie gets no blame for the Martz fiasco. He brings in his BFF against the protests of Angelo and lets Martz ego go unchecked until midseason two years in a row. Yet afterwards, Lovie walks away with even more power in the organization and is looking at a full out coup if his choice at GM gets hired by default. History tells us that giving Lovie more power is almost always a mistake.

What I've read about the GM search is they're taking it very slowly and that they're narrowing down a list of 15 candidates down to 3-5 by the end of the week. They've had zero interviews so far and only sent out a request for DeCosta which was denied. They're probably looking at a lot of orgs that are still in the playoffs.

stl705
01-10-2012, 07:00 PM
I don't understand the firing of JA. Well, not like this, anyway.

The new GM doesn't get to choose the coach, the QB, or the coordinators...meaning he's forced into both the offensive and defensive systems, even if he doesn't believe in them.

If you're going to hire a puppet GM with no power to correct the mistakes, why not just strip JA of his power and keep him? Why not go down to Brookfield and pick up a monkey to put at that desk?

No GM worthy of being a GM will want the job.

This all smells like setting it up for Ruskell to take over, and that's no change at all.

I don't buy this theory at all... Sure, if the cabinets were bare, and we had a bad coach, but let's give Lovie some credit. He is clearly a top 10 coach in the league imo. He's had a top 10 defense about every year since he's been here. Was well on his way to another possible NFC championship game before his starting QB and RB got hurt (he doesn't get to choose backups).

Unless Jeff Fisher or Bill Cowher is walking through the door, any other head coach would be a downgrade for this team.

This team has a lot of talent, enough to get back to being a superbowl contender like they were before the injuries. Why should a GM have to have "his guy"??? Does every GM in the league have his "own guy"?

I swear this is the most annoying and overused term in football and has nothing to do with anything (unless a team has NOTHING for talent or coaches). Lovie isn't the person drafting. Lovie is the guy who has led this team to how many wins? How many playoff wins? How many division titles? How many wins against our arch-rival Packers? Get real bandwagon fans, Lovie Smith is not, and never was the problem!

Whoever the new GM is has enough control to be able to pick "his own guy" for OC. We don't need a head coach or DC, our defense is and has been one of the best in the league, even with piss poor drafting by Angelo. I'm sick and tired of these bandwagon Bears fans lambasting Lovie Smith, even though he has one of the best records in football since he came here!

All I hope is that our new GM is competent to draft. Angelo has been riding the Peanut Tillman/Briggs coattails regarding drafts. He drafts about one solid player per year and a half. This is terrible and clearly wasn't getting it done by looking at our secondary, O-line for the most part, and backups. I'm not saying all our backups are going to light the league by fire, but still, you've gotta have a better track record in the draft. The draft is how teams win championships.

The system is not the problem, it was our drafting. Sorry about my rant, but I hate when people say GMs have to have "their guy". Do they not have a wife or partner or something? No S/O so they have to choose another significant other coaching their football teams? Comon, this Bears team is a damn good one, and has been. Let's get a competent GM who can use what we already have.

The best cooks in the world don't need "their ingrediants". They know how to work with what they have!

Monomach
01-13-2012, 01:53 PM
He's had a top 10 defense about every year since he's been here. Not really. In points allowed, it's finished:

13th
1st
3rd
16th
16th
21st
4th
14th

Lovie's defense has finished in the bottom half of the league just as often as the top 10. Combine that with his obvious mistakes regarding timeout/challenge usage and his huge boner for the bend, bend some more, and then finally break at the end of the game defense, he's clearly not top ten.

This team has a lot of talent, enough to get back to being a superbowl contender like they were before the injuries.They were not a super bowl contender before the injuries. They were pretty good looking, but clearly a tier down from the top teams. They could have won it with luck, but that's true for any team. They were the 3rd-best team in the division both before and after the injuries.

Why should a GM have to have "his guy"??? Does every GM in the league have his "own guy"? The good ones do. The good ones don't voluntarily walk into a situation in which they're handcuffed in every way.

Lovie isn't the person drafting. Yeah, sometimes he is. Sometimes he's the guy picking free agents and trade targets, too. See Dan Bazuin, Adam Archuleta, etc.

Lovie is the guy who has led this team to how many wins? How many playoff wins? How many division titles? How many wins against our arch-rival Packers? Get real bandwagon fans, Lovie Smith is not, and never was the problem!This is like saying Sexy Rexy "led" the team to the super bowl.

Whoever the new GM is has enough control to be able to pick "his own guy" for OC. Looks like you're behind the times. The OC has already been chosen. The new GM gets to pick nothing.

We don't need a head coach or DC, our defense is and has been one of the best in the league, even with piss poor drafting by Angelo. I'm sick and tired of these bandwagon Bears fans lambasting Lovie Smith, even though he has one of the best records in football since he came here!Sure. One of the best. And one of the worst. And one of the most average. It's been inconsistent as can be.

All I hope is that our new GM is competent to draft. Angelo has been riding the Peanut Tillman/Briggs coattails regarding drafts. He drafts about one solid player per year and a half. This is terrible and clearly wasn't getting it done by looking at our secondary, O-line for the most part, and backups. I'm not saying all our backups are going to light the league by fire, but still, you've gotta have a better track record in the draft. The draft is how teams win championships.I'm not going to argue that. Jerry Angelo was clearly a subpar talent evaluator and drafter...but Lovie's input has been just as bad.

The system is not the problem, it was our drafting. Sorry about my rant, but I hate when people say GMs have to have "their guy". Do they not have a wife or partner or something? No S/O so they have to choose another significant other coaching their football teams? Comon, this Bears team is a damn good one, and has been. Let's get a competent GM who can use what we already have. This is really seeing things through navy and orange glasses here. The "system" has been pretty average. Can we not all name at least half a dozen games in which the system was the problem, especially regarding that prevent garbage at the end of games that were already well in hand?

The best cooks in the world don't need "their ingrediants". They know how to work with what they have!
The best cooks in the world cook what they know. They're all specialists, just like the guys we think of as good GMs and coaches. You don't see Rick Bayless serving up French, Italian, or Chinese food, right? Did you really think that top candidates like Eric Decosta or Reggie McKenzie were going to be willing to come here and continue with the Tampa 2 and every coaching job already filled? Hell, McKenzie was supposed to be a friend of Lovie and he didn't even want to interview here. He went right to a team that gave him total control, immediately fired a head coach that only had the job for one year, said he's changing the defense to a 3-4, and is rumored to be getting rid of the QB they just traded their future for.

Let's say you're a top-notch, in demand interior carpenter. You like working with Snap-on hand tools, Milwaukee power tools, and hardwoods. You're offered a job that lets you have all of that and you're offered a job that forces you to work with whatever tools you can get at Wal-mart and a big pile of knotty pine. They both pay the same and they're both going on at the same time, so you can only take one. Are you taking the Wal-mart tools and garbage wood because you know you can do it or are you taking the one where no one is restricting you and you get to operate in your comfort zone?

We're getting Tim Ruskell by default. If you thought JA's draft history was bad, wait'll you get a load of that joker. He makes JA look like a guy who earned a 10 year extension.

bearsfan_51
01-13-2012, 02:08 PM
This is why I never wanted to get rid of Jerry. He's the only guy in the front office who knows anything about football. The rest are either inbreds who did nothing but be born to a rich lady, or kissasses who have realized they can get ahead in life by attaching themselves to said inbreds.

This organization isn't even worth following, let alone giving money to.

stl705
01-14-2012, 09:19 AM
Not really. In points allowed, it's finished:

13th
1st
3rd
16th
16th
21st
4th
14th

Lovie's defense has finished in the bottom half of the league just as often as the top 10. Combine that with his obvious mistakes regarding timeout/challenge usage and his huge boner for the bend, bend some more, and then finally break at the end of the game defense, he's clearly not top ten.

They were not a super bowl contender before the injuries. They were pretty good looking, but clearly a tier down from the top teams. They could have won it with luck, but that's true for any team. They were the 3rd-best team in the division both before and after the injuries.

The good ones do. The good ones don't voluntarily walk into a situation in which they're handcuffed in every way.

Yeah, sometimes he is. Sometimes he's the guy picking free agents and trade targets, too. See Dan Bazuin, Adam Archuleta, etc.

This is like saying Sexy Rexy "led" the team to the super bowl.

Looks like you're behind the times. The OC has already been chosen. The new GM gets to pick nothing.

Sure. One of the best. And one of the worst. And one of the most average. It's been inconsistent as can be.

I'm not going to argue that. Jerry Angelo was clearly a subpar talent evaluator and drafter...but Lovie's input has been just as bad.

This is really seeing things through navy and orange glasses here. The "system" has been pretty average. Can we not all name at least half a dozen games in which the system was the problem, especially regarding that prevent garbage at the end of games that were already well in hand?


The best cooks in the world cook what they know. They're all specialists, just like the guys we think of as good GMs and coaches. You don't see Rick Bayless serving up French, Italian, or Chinese food, right? Did you really think that top candidates like Eric Decosta or Reggie McKenzie were going to be willing to come here and continue with the Tampa 2 and every coaching job already filled? Hell, McKenzie was supposed to be a friend of Lovie and he didn't even want to interview here. He went right to a team that gave him total control, immediately fired a head coach that only had the job for one year, said he's changing the defense to a 3-4, and is rumored to be getting rid of the QB they just traded their future for.

Let's say you're a top-notch, in demand interior carpenter. You like working with Snap-on hand tools, Milwaukee power tools, and hardwoods. You're offered a job that lets you have all of that and you're offered a job that forces you to work with whatever tools you can get at Wal-mart and a big pile of knotty pine. They both pay the same and they're both going on at the same time, so you can only take one. Are you taking the Wal-mart tools and garbage wood because you know you can do it or are you taking the one where no one is restricting you and you get to operate in your comfort zone?

We're getting Tim Ruskell by default. If you thought JA's draft history was bad, wait'll you get a load of that joker. He makes JA look like a guy who earned a 10 year extension.



1.) I disagree with the numbers... Our offense has been so bad over the years, the defense has been on the field more than it should, resulting in the lower rankings. I think this is pretty self-explanatory. Do you really believe we had the 14th ranked D this year? Because it sure as hell looked like a top 10 defense to me and I would be willing to bet offenses around the league would agree. It didn't help we had NO offense for the last 6 games or whatever without Cutler and Forte. The Bears held opposing offenses to 24 or less points 11 times. Keep in mind they played the Packers twice and Saints another time. I'd say that's pretty good in this league. They kept opponents to 20 points or less 8 times. They also kept opposing offenses under 14 points 6 times. That's a damn good defense considering some of the offenses we have played this year (packers, saints, lions).

2.) I also disagree that we were not SB contenders. The Bears were looking as good as any team outside the packers at the time of the injury. It's not how you start, its how you finish and the Bears were finally putting their offense together at the right time before Cutler and Forte got hurt. Look at the Giants this year? I would say they are SB contenders, but if you said that 6 weeks ago, people would laugh.

3.) Lovie may have had an opinion, but let's be real here; there are very few coaches in the NFL who make the decisions. If there were, there would be less of a need for GMs. Angelo was calling the shots, in both FA and the draft. I agree lovie had more of an opinion with FA, but it was Angelo's decision.

4.) Lovie Smith and the Defense/Special teams led the Bears to the SB imo. Obviously the players should get more credit, but why don't the most talented teams win the SB every year?

5.) The new GM does have control over who is OC. Just because they stay in-house doesn't mean the GM/Ruskell isn't calling the shots... Tice has done a decent job, do you see any better OC's on the market because I don't... Unless you're a fan of the amazing Bucs or Dolphins offense this year?

6.) Keep on hating, but like I said, in recent history (90s and beyond) before Lovie Smith; how many playoff wins did the Bears have? How about how many wins against the Packers did the Bears have? Maybe that's a bad comparison given we had Wandstead, but Lovie is a good coach and the players realize it. There's a reason you never hear grumblings from the players out of Chicago. I'm pretty sure they have a better idea of how good their coach is than a fan sitting on the coach, who only watches film on gameday.. Don't ya think? Or are you a successfully retired NFL GM?

7.) I agree most all head coaches should have only a little input through the draft... Very little.

8.) I have full confidence that if I gave Bobby Flay, or Emeral Lagosse (sp?), or another world-class chef a list of ingrediants, they would be able to blow my taste-buds away. That's like saying Tom Thibideau of the Bulls has no clue about offense because he has historically been a defensive coach. Some of those cooks may be better, and may like thier specialty cuisine.. but it's stupid to think they have no idea what they would do with some random ingrediants. If your mom's a great cook and her specialty is meatloaf, does that mean she cannot cook great pasta?

9.) The Bears still have good players. Some may be aging, but I'll take a group of Urlacher, Briggs, Tillman, Peppers, Forte, Cutler, Garza, and possibly Carimi over a lot of NFL team's "ingrediants".

10.) You may be right about Ruskell, but he did put a Superbowl team on the field with the Seahawks a lil while back... and damn near won it if it wasn't for the worst officiating in the history of the SB.

11.) On good GMs or coahes having "their guy".. The Patriots offense has looked pretty damn good with 3 different OCs..... Their current one Mcdaniels has been like 6-37 or something like that(after his hot start in Denver) and has had some of the worst offenses in the league after the Patriots.

stl705
01-14-2012, 09:20 AM
sorry double post.

Bearsfan123
01-14-2012, 03:04 PM
Okay if Dwayne Bowe makes it to Free Agency the Bears should jump on that. Agree?

SFbear
01-14-2012, 03:29 PM
Okay if Dwayne Bowe makes it to Free Agency the Bears should jump on that. Agree?

Bowe, Vincent Jackson, or Marques Colston I feel like should be high priorities. From what Tice has been saying in interviews, a #1 receiver is a top need on offense. They might wait until the draft to see if one of the top 3 WRs drops to 19 but the FA pool is also pretty good this year. I think Vjax would be the best due to his ability to stretch the field but he is one strike away from a one year suspension.

In the GM search the short list is Jimmy Raye(Chargers), Marc Ross(Giants), Phil Emery(Chiefs), Jason Licht(Patriots) and Ruskell. Raye has already interviewed and I think he is the favorite right now. Chargers's drafts from 2000-2007 when he was in charge of college personnel were fantastic but who knows how much credit he deserves.

stl705
01-14-2012, 04:13 PM
I would love to get Bowe, Colston, and Jackson; in that order.

If we could get Bowe, a good corner, then get a WR in rd. 1, i'd be happy.

Or get a great Corner in FA, then try to get Michael Floyd in the draft.

Docta
01-15-2012, 08:50 PM
At #19, I think the only top tier WRs we'd be able to get are Wright or Jeffery, and there are more quality CBs in this draft than there were last year.

MidwayMonster31
01-16-2012, 01:35 PM
If Floyd isn't there at 19, I think D-Line might be the way to go. Fletcher Cox, Whitney Mercilus or Melvin Ingram would work. Going corner in the second round should be a good idea. I also like Brian Quick for receiver. The other teams have shown that a great passing attack can get you to the postseason, but 2 of the 3 bad defenses in the divisionals got knocked off.

MidwayMonster31
01-19-2012, 10:24 AM
Bob Bostad hired as Offensive line coach
http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-bears-huddle/2012/01/report-bears-to-hire-bob-bostad-as-offensive-line-coach/

bearsfan_51
01-19-2012, 01:38 PM
Bostad was the man at Wisconsin. Great hire.

MidwayMonster31
01-21-2012, 12:37 PM
Emery is the early favorite for GM.
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/01/21/emery-seen-as-favorite-for-bears-g-m-job/

Bearsfan123
01-22-2012, 12:03 PM
We should sign Mario Williams. Put him with Peppers, it would be a thing of beauty.


I just looked over the possible free agents. Sorry, that idea just makes me smile.

BeerBaron
01-22-2012, 12:07 PM
I think everyone and their brother is going to be going after Mario.

Carl Nicks of the Saints would be my favorite signing. He and a healthy Carimi on the right side of that line...mmmm...just try and stop our runs behind it.

MidwayMonster31
01-23-2012, 10:14 AM
I like the idea of Nicks, but I get the feeling they're going to spend big money on a receiver, and probably get their hands on Vincent Jackson. I don't have much of a problem with that. I would also like a backup tackle who can actually play when called upon.
I would also like to see what Kellen Davis can do if they let him loose. Good luck finding anyone to match up with him.

sweetness34
01-23-2012, 03:06 PM
As much as I hated on Lovie he had that team rolling before the injuries. To say that we weren't contenders is foolish. The top two seeds lost to the Giants.

We also saw how important special teams were and that's a big strength of ours.

We weren't dominant in any one phase, but we were dangerous in all 3.

It's not necessarily the most talented team that wins in the playoffs. It's the team playing the best football. It sucks not being able to know how far we could've gone this year, but oh well.

bearfan
01-27-2012, 02:12 AM
Looks like the GM search is between Emery and Licht. Who do you guys prefer?

MidwayMonster31
01-27-2012, 11:28 AM
I think both men can be the kind of hardass this organization needs.
Emery has coaching and scouting experience, but Licht knows how to handle personnel better and also can scout. Licht might rub people the wrong way, but I would go with him.

bearsfan_51
01-27-2012, 11:59 AM
Emery is a typical conservative hire, which means that's what the Bears will do. They want someone they can control and who will go along with Lovie.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
01-28-2012, 02:40 PM
So there ya have it. It's Emery.

Moving past the wompy-ness of it all, I think we can fully expect a WR in round one now.

bearsfan_51
01-28-2012, 02:53 PM
This hire sucks.

bearfan
01-28-2012, 07:23 PM
None too thrilled. I wanted Licht

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
01-29-2012, 11:19 AM
I said moving past it, damn it!

bearsfan_51
01-29-2012, 12:59 PM
Dan Pompei endorses Emery. That goes a long way with me.

MidwayMonster31
01-30-2012, 07:37 PM
Emery's presser was awfully boring and very little was actually said. As long as he brings in good players and doesn't take **** from Lovie, he should be fine.

bearfan
01-30-2012, 09:32 PM
He wants to bring in the "patriots scouting system"...I'm feeling a little better about him. Sounds like a hard worker, hopefully his attitude trickles down.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
02-07-2012, 04:09 PM
Kinda tired of his name being thrown out there but I'll do it anyway: What if Jeremy Bates is the "passing game" coach?

Any chance of that, I'd be much more enthusiastic about all this.

:D Right?! I'm pretty ******* jazzed about this. It's like we're...trying...Freaky!

SFbear
02-07-2012, 05:12 PM
:D Right?! I'm pretty ******* jazzed about this. It's like we're...trying...Freaky!

Well, I wanted him as OC before we went with Martz but his career is not looking so hot after failing out of Seattle. Looks like he's just the QB coach and they're making Tice full OC. Not sure what he can really bring to the table but his familiarity to Cutler is a plus.

Gay Ork Wang
02-07-2012, 05:25 PM
Im estatic that we signed Jeremy Bates.

MidwayMonster31
02-08-2012, 12:09 AM
I approve, at least there's some continuity in this offense. I think they'll do a good job of playing to Cutler's strengths. Tice will still be the OC, but it will be more of a collective effort (ie Tice calling Bates' plays). Now let's get Cutler some weapons (includes paying Forte).

Hurricane Ditka
02-08-2012, 12:51 AM
I have to say I was pretty happy to hear that Bates was the hire. Bates and Tice will taylor this offense to what Jay does best. The things we started doing when we were hot, I think theres gonna be a lot more of that. Cutler is going to have the system to succeed, Emery needs to get him the firepower.

Gay Ork Wang
03-06-2012, 04:03 AM
bears were apparently really gunning for Cliff Avril as a FA. the other main target seems to be Vjax. I love it.

BeerBaron
03-06-2012, 05:54 AM
Avril was tagged unfortunately. I'll still gladly take Jackson though.

Gay Ork Wang
03-06-2012, 06:40 AM
yea i know. apparently some bears already expected him to be a teammate

Vaughn McClure (@vxmcclure23) said on Twitter that, before he was tagged, Avril was to be one of the Bears' top targets, and that "Even some Bears thought there was a strong possibility Avril was going to be a teammate next season."

McClure isn't as prolific as some other beat writers, but it seems like he has some really good ins and when he says something, it almost always is true.

Gay Ork Wang
03-13-2012, 04:58 AM
http://www.csnchicago.com/football-chicago-bears/bears-talk/Sources-Bears-favorite-to-land-DE-Mario-?blockID=668360&feedID=661

Apparently we are favorites to land Mario

regoob2
03-13-2012, 09:17 AM
Today could be a great day for us.........

BeerBaron
03-13-2012, 09:18 AM
My hope remain tempered. Quality free agents just seem so few that if we miss out on the couple of big ones that we could use, we either get nothing or overpay for guys who don't deserve it.

MidwayMonster31
03-13-2012, 03:56 PM
Brandon Marshall is now in the fold. For the two third round picks.

BeerBaron
03-13-2012, 04:13 PM
Brandon Marshall is now in the fold. For the two third round picks.

Not even both of this years. One this year and one next year.

I greatly enjoy this move.

BeerBaron
03-13-2012, 04:23 PM
Looks like Jason Campbell will be heading our way too. Good, solid backup.

regoob2
03-13-2012, 04:30 PM
This is a great day! :D

Gay Ork Wang
03-13-2012, 06:16 PM
I like you Emery

regoob2
03-13-2012, 07:41 PM
I LOVE you Emery^^^^^^^^^^

BeerBaron
03-13-2012, 07:42 PM
Campbell in officially on a 1 year deal. Good solid move.

Now I would like the rumors about John Carlson to also come true. Jeremy Mincey too.

MidwayMonster31
03-13-2012, 07:49 PM
I approve of the Campbell signing. At least we get a more established guy as a backup. I would also approve of the Mincey signing. He would be a great fit for our scheme. By providing depth, that gives us flexibility to get more talent in the draft, regardless of position, also guys won't get rushed into roles they are not ready for.

bearsfan_51
03-14-2012, 08:05 PM
So we had, what, 24 million?

9.3 million for Marshall
7.7 million for Forte
3.5 million for Campbell
1.26 million for Khalil Bell
1 million for Costanzo

New contracts for Kellen Davis, Tim Jennings, Eric Weems.

That money goes away fast.

regoob2
03-14-2012, 08:13 PM
So we had, what, 24 million?

9.3 million for Marshall
7.7 million for Forte
3.5 million for Campbell
1.26 million for Khalil Bell
1 million for Costanzo

New contracts for Kellen Davis, Tim Jennings, Eric Weems.

That money goes away fast.I thought we were closer to $30 mil.

bearsfan_51
03-14-2012, 08:14 PM
Maybe we were after all of the cuts. I don't pay as close attention as I once did.

bigbluedefense
03-14-2012, 08:46 PM
Now that Mario Williams is pretty much gone, I wonder if you guys go after Dwight Freeney.

regoob2
03-14-2012, 08:48 PM
Maybe we were after all of the cuts. I don't pay as close attention as I once did.I heard around $25 mil after the cuts and after Forte. (Ballpark)

BeerBaron
03-14-2012, 08:48 PM
Now that Mario Williams is pretty much gone, I wonder if you guys go after Dwight Freeney.

If he's not too expensive, I think I'd rather bring in John Abraham than give anything up in trade for Freeney.

Worst case scenario...we hopefully just bring back Idonije and draft someone.

regoob2
03-14-2012, 08:49 PM
Now that Mario Williams is pretty much gone, I wonder if you guys go after Dwight Freeney.

If he's cut I hope so. I dont think we can fit in a $14 mil cap #.

bearsfan_51
03-14-2012, 08:51 PM
DE is easily our biggest need now, but I'd probably rather see us sign a cheaper vet, and/or use an early pick on one.

bearsfan_51
03-14-2012, 11:09 PM
2 years- 6 mil for Davis.

That's quite a bit for a guy with 28 career catches, but I do like Davis as an all-around athlete.

The Bears are really opening up the books for Emery.

Hurricane Ditka
03-15-2012, 12:56 AM
More than a quarter of his catches have been touchdowns. Maybe Tice will be able to figure out a way to use his athleticism. Marshall and Davis will make for some huge red zone mismatches.

Seeing as Emery has been a career draft guy, I'm anxious to see what he has up his sleeves come draft day.

MidwayMonster31
03-15-2012, 01:09 AM
Davis did a great job blocking last season. I want to see what he can do when they let him loose. I think these moves are letting Emery be flexible on draft weekend, where he won't have to reach to fill needs. Right now, Mercilus would make the most sense with 19, but trading back doesn't seem like a bad idea.

Bearsfan123
03-15-2012, 02:59 PM
So what's our depth chart at WR now?
1- Brandon Marshall
2- Earl Bennet
3/4- Eric Weems/ Devin Hester
Johnny Knox still is hurt....

MidwayMonster31
03-16-2012, 01:33 PM
Weems should not be seeing the field on offense. He is a special teams guy. I would like to add one more receiver who can be a big play guy. Bennett can work as a 3.

bearsfan_51
03-16-2012, 02:08 PM
Knox is a big play guy, assuming he can get healthy. Knox or Bennett shouldn't be anyone's #1, but they are fine as a 2/3 combination.

BeerBaron
03-16-2012, 02:10 PM
Knox was very nearly paralyzed. I'm not expecting all that much from him when he first gets back. Anything he can provide will be a bonus, but I don't think we should count on him.

Bearsfan123
03-17-2012, 11:18 AM
So we currently have 6 receivers.
Brandon Marshall
Earl Bennett
Devin Hester
Eric Weems
Dane Sanzenbacher
Johnny Knox

So does this mean that we basically aren't looking at receivers in the draft anymore?

EDIT: Oh yeah, and any chance we go after Wimbley? Or we no longer got the cash?

bearsfan_51
03-17-2012, 05:18 PM
I doubt we go after Wimbley since we resigned Idonije. My guess is that we draft his replacement.

I also don't think Sanzenbacher is long for the NFL. He's a nice story and hard worker, but there's a reason he wasn't drafted, and I don't think he adds much on special teams.

Monomach
03-21-2012, 03:00 PM
Call me crazy, but I'm ready to spend our first rounder on Mike Wallace.

-#1 Brandon Marshall
-#2 Mike Wallace
-Earl Bennett in the slot
-Hester/Sanzenbacher/Knox (if not on IR) to round out the roster

I don't really count Weems as a WR.

Can't double cover both Marshall and Wallace, right?

bearsfan_51
03-21-2012, 03:09 PM
Makes sense, but the franchise isn't going to put that much money into the WR position. Baby steps.

regoob2
03-21-2012, 03:13 PM
Call me crazy, but I'm ready to spend our first rounder on Mike Wallace.

-#1 Brandon Marshall
-#2 Mike Wallace
-Earl Bennett in the slot
-Hester/Sanzenbacher/Knox (if not on IR) to round out the roster

I don't really count Weems as a WR.

Can't double cover both Marshall and Wallace, right?

We cant afford him. The great thing about first round picks now is the nothing contract that comes with them.

Bearsfan123
03-28-2012, 10:45 PM
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1123673-chicago-bears-what-does-addition-of-devin-thomas-mean

That is frustrating. Why sign a guy who couldn't play receiver for ANYONE else just to be a ST player when we could draft someone just as good. Now we assuredly WONT be drafting any receiver because the roster is full. I don't like how Emery is just throwing around cash at nothing players. 3 ST players (Weems, that LBer, and now Thomas), really Emery? And he hasn't resigned Okoye yet either. He is beginning to piss me off.

Hurricane Ditka
03-29-2012, 01:01 AM
So much of what the Bears want to do is dependent on having lights out special teams. Lets not forgot Sam Hurd is locked up, and Corey Graham and Zach Bowman signed elsewhere. Maybe Emery would rather his draft picks make other meaningful contributions and is filling the special teams holes through free agency?

bearsfan_51
03-29-2012, 01:05 AM
Throwing around cash? It's a one-year contract....

It's not even a sure thing he makes the team.

Hurricane Ditka
03-29-2012, 01:35 AM
I think he'll make the team. Weems, Costanzo, and Thomas will soften the blow of losing Knox(probably), Hurd, Graham and Bowman on special teams. I still think a receiver gets taken in the second or third.

regoob2
03-29-2012, 09:19 AM
Knox will likely be on the PUP list and Sanz can be cut.

Bearsfan123
03-29-2012, 04:21 PM
I'd be fine with the signings if they weren't all at a position of weakness already. We now have 3 receivers we dress for the singular reason of Special teams. Hester, Weems, and Thomas. Hester will get snaps at WR only because of his contract. He's sub par there and everyone knows it. He couldn't find any corners, another position we need warm bodies that are good special teams players?

My complaint isn't simply that he is bringing in ST only players, it's that he is loading a position that is of great offensive importance with the bulk of them. He inherited Hester, I get it. Fan favorite, record holder, deep burner. Not much else to him. Then he signs Weems for three years, who is supposedly just as bad at the WR position. Okay, he was looking for a guy to hold up Knox's position, I don't like it, but okay. But then he throws another ST guy in there in Thomas. He has cluttered the position with guys who should be 4th and 5th on WR depth charts and they are stuck in positions where they will be getting playing time there.

I'm a huge special teams fan, but I think it's ridiculous to load one position up like this leaving it as a liability for what the position is supposed to actually do, aka run routes and catch the ball. Maybe Knox will end up on IR and Hester will get a small lingering injury that will make Weems very important. IDK, I just dont like seeing our already bad WR position getting worse depth instead of better.

EDIT: And I don't see how we can even conceive of drafting a receiver. Marshall, Bennet, Hester, Weems, Thomas. That's if we cut Komar, Sanzenbacher, and place Johnny Knox on IR. That's a lot of receivers.

Well anyway. Im glad this forum is alive again. Bears fans don't post enough. I'd rather argue than have silence.

Docta
03-29-2012, 04:39 PM
I think he'll make the team. Weems, Costanzo, and Thomas will soften the blow of losing Knox(probably), Hurd, Graham and Bowman on special teams. I still think a receiver gets taken in the second or third.
EDIT: Nevermind. Misread your post.

bearsfan_51
03-29-2012, 04:49 PM
That's what he said (read it again)

Gay Ork Wang
03-29-2012, 06:45 PM
signing them now doesnt mean we keep them on the roster.

Bearsfan123
03-29-2012, 06:52 PM
signing them now doesnt mean we keep them on the roster.

You think we will cut Weems from a 3 year deal? I doubt it. Thomas, maybe, but not Weems. I was surprised, in the FA thread the Devin Thomas move gained a lot of love. Well anyway, now that WR is almost off the table. We really only have a few first round choices. DE, OT, OG, CB. Right now my big board goes something like this,

Michael Floyd-I can still wish can't I?
Whitney Mercilus
Melvin Ingram
Jonathan Martin
C Glenn
Dre Kirkpatrick

Oh yeah, anyone else keep going back and watching Brandon Marshall highlight vids and getting really excited?

Docta
03-30-2012, 01:12 AM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/03/29/bears-believe-in-their-current-offensive-linemen/

I doubt they'll take one in the first now. If they don't end up with some in the later rounds, Campbell better start getting ready to start soon. Releasing Omiyale was one of their best moves of the offseason though.

And you can't forget that Rodgers lead the league in sacks the same year that they won the SB.

Monomach
03-30-2012, 11:49 AM
And you can't forget that Rodgers lead the league in sacks the same year that they won the SB.

Cutler led the league in sacks taken with 52. Rodgers had the 13th-most with 31. Second place only had 40, so having a crappy line has been pretty special for Jay.

I think you're thinking of sacks the QB was personally responsible for. Rodgers led the league with 13.5, meaning his line was only responsible for 17.5 sacks all season...so...that's an argument for building the O-line rather than ignoring it.

Docta
03-30-2012, 03:12 PM
Cutler led the league in sacks taken with 52. Rodgers had the 13th-most with 31. Second place only had 40, so having a crappy line has been pretty special for Jay.

I think you're thinking of sacks the QB was personally responsible for. Rodgers led the league with 13.5, meaning his line was only responsible for 17.5 sacks all season...so...that's an argument for building the O-line rather than ignoring it.
I meant 2 years ago, not this past year.

Monomach
03-31-2012, 06:50 PM
I meant 2 years ago, not this past year.

Those stats I posted are from two years ago, when the Pack beat the Bears on their way to the Super Bowl. We're talking about the same year. Cutler didn't come anywhere near leading the league in sacks this past year. He was knocked out too early.

Docta
04-01-2012, 07:59 PM
Ah, it was 2009. I knew he lead the league some time ago. I'm not that good with years..

Monomach
04-28-2012, 10:54 PM
Went looking through the list of what's left over among veteran UFAs. Found five guys I really think we should take a look at who would cost next to nothing to sign.

RB Jackie Battle +5.4
Offers: special teams play, plus plus pass blocking, no fumbling
Analysis: Battle is a pretty average back that can serve as part of a committee in the event of a Matt Forte holdout. His pass blocking can't be overstated. It's among the best in the league.
Would take the roster spot of: Matt Forte, if he holds out; Armando Allen or Harvey Unga if he doesn't.

DT Gary Gibson +12.8
Offers: pressure up the middle as part of a rotation
Analysis: He got quite a lot of pressure last year as part of a DT rotation in St. Louis...but nothing in the years prior. One year wonder?
Would take the roster spot of: No one. Amobi Okoye is already gone.

DE Matt Roth +8.2
Offers: high motor, good run defense, consistent pressure
Analysis: Roth has always gotten a lot of pressure, causing quarterback disruptions, but it hasn't always resulted in sacks on the stat sheet. The lack of sacks and his season-ending concussion last year seem to be keeping him from the starting job he deserves. Could serve as low-cost, high-upside insurance against Shea McClellin's play.
Would take the roster spot of: Thaddeus Gibson (back to practice squad, cut, whatever).

OG Jake Scott +13.3
Offers: plus plus pass protection, veteran experience, durability
Analysis: The Titans are moving on because Scott's run blocking just isn't there any more. It's not weak; it's nearly non-existent. On the other hand, he still grades out as a top-five pass blocker.
Would take the roster spot of: Ricky Henry (back to practice squad).

OG Montrae Holland +5.9
Offers: above average all-around play, veteran experience
Analysis: Had surgery to repair a torn biceps back in December. Was reported that he would be ready for OTAs.
Would take the roster spot of: Reggie Stephens (back to practice squad).

Bears FA signings to date:
RB Matt Forte +18.1
RB Michael Bush +11.1
CB Tim Jennings +7.4
SS Craig Steltz +4.8
QB Jason Campbell +3.7
RB Kahlil Bell +0.5
TE Kellen Davis +0.2
DE Israel Idonije 0.0
WR Devin Thomas -0.1
CB Jonathan Wilhite -1.7
WR Eric Weems -2.8
QB Josh McCown -4.5
CB Kelvin Hayden -8.0
OG Chilo Rachal -8.1
LB Geno Hayes -11.9

That +/- number next to everyone's name is their profootballfocus.com overall grade for 2012. Take it or leave it, as you will. Sometimes it's deceptive, sometimes it's a pretty good indicator of how they did. You just have to know what's behind it i.e. Jake Scott actually had a negative score in run blocking, but was an amazing pass blocker, so that +13.3 should not be taken to mean that you're getting a really good all-around guard if you sign him. For those curious, every member of our offensive line had a negative grade other than Edwin Williams.

ChiFan24
05-01-2012, 08:39 AM
Why don't we just bring back Anthony Adams for the vet minimum? Obviously you'd prefer a 3 tech, but Toe and Paea could both handle it when Melton is off the field. Idonije too.

Monomach
05-01-2012, 01:19 PM
Why don't we just bring back Anthony Adams for the vet minimum? Obviously you'd prefer a 3 tech, but Toe and Paea could both handle it when Melton is off the field. Idonije too.

They didn't bring back Adams because he's finished. He wasn't set to make too much this year. His value was tied directly to his ability to stop the run, which was pretty bad last year. That's why they cut his snaps and eventually released him. He only played in two of the last six games despite being 100% healthy.

ChiFan24
05-01-2012, 03:13 PM
That's when we had a glut at DT. Now we're pretty thin. Maybe Adams isn't the best choice on the market (I don't really know much about Gibson), but we absolutely need to add a rotational guy that can handle ~15 snaps a game, and we can't afford to pay him too much. I don't think Adams is so bad that he wouldn't be worth the minimum.

bearfan
05-21-2012, 02:03 PM
What do you guys think of the Forte contract situation?

IMO running backs are not worth between 8.5-10million/year, which is what Forte is looking for. I love Forte, think he is a great RB, but he is 27 and I don't think that we should give him a long term contract.

I'd keep the franchise tag on him this year and maybe next year, but wouldn't sign him to a long term. RBs are a dime a dozen, so I hope that this year Bush can show the team that Forte isn't the only option thus eliminating his high contract demands.

iowatreat54
05-21-2012, 02:15 PM
No one knows the whole story, but Forte has now supposedly been offerred two pretty good and fair deals since the beginning of last season, and scoffed at both. I generally hate the McCaskeys and the Bears usual FO, but if the reported offers are anywhere close to true, Forte is an idiot for not accepting.

I'm hoping he can come back healthy, have a good season, but not great, and realizes that he is not a once in a generation back like a healthy AD.

jrdrylie
05-21-2012, 02:16 PM
What do you guys think of the Forte contract situation?

IMO running backs are not worth between 8.5-10million/year, which is what Forte is looking for. I love Forte, think he is a great RB, but he is 27 and I don't think that we should give him a long term contract.

I'd keep the franchise tag on him this year and maybe next year, but wouldn't sign him to a long term. RBs are a dime a dozen, so I hope that this year Bush can show the team that Forte isn't the only option thus eliminating his high contract demands.

LeSean McCoy just got $20 million guaranteed. Unfortunately, Forte probably is going to want something similar to that. The problem is the McCoy is just as good as Forte (possibly even a little better) and is four years younger. Forte (and all the people who are saying the Bears need to pay him) need to shut up. He was offered a long term deal that had over $10 million guaranteed. He chose not to sign it.

bearsfan_51
05-21-2012, 02:33 PM
20 million guaranteed is pretty reasonable for Forte. I think they would do that. I agree with treat that in this instance, I think Forte is foolishly looking more towards Peterson and Chris Johnson money.

MidwayMonster31
05-21-2012, 06:39 PM
I thought the offer they gave last year was pretty reasonable.

bearsfan_51
05-21-2012, 07:52 PM
There's no reason Forte should accept less than 16-17 mil guaranteed. He could make that in two years under the franchise tag and then hit the market again.

Gay Ork Wang
05-21-2012, 08:27 PM
depends. if he thinks its more likely that he will get hurt badly this season, gettign 14 guaranteed now might not look that bad.

bearsfan_51
05-21-2012, 09:06 PM
C'mon. Think about it. The only way it makes ANY sense to take 14 mil would be if you thought there was at least a 50% chance you would have a career ending injury. That's silly.

He's right to ask for 20 million. I'm not sure the Bears will give it to him, but he'd be silly to take less.

Gay Ork Wang
05-21-2012, 09:08 PM
C'mon. Think about it. The only way it makes ANY sense to take 14 mil would be if you thought there was at least a 50% chance you would have a career ending injury. That's silly.

He's right to ask for 20 million. I'm not sure the Bears will give it to him, but he'd be silly to take less.
wouldnt an injury that would greatly hurt his value be enough to consider signing something that gives you a little less with a lot less risk?

bearsfan_51
05-21-2012, 09:10 PM
Forte will make 7.7 this year under the franchise tag.

Let's say he has an injury that forces him onto the IR, and makes him something of an injury concern, but one that is still expected to play in 2013. You're saying that someone won't give him 6.3 guaranteed? Of course they would.

Monomach
05-22-2012, 04:11 PM
I was really hoping that we'd get a second rounder in this past draft for him.

I preferred signing one more back, building on what we already have behind Forte (the makings of a good committee) and spending the leftover money on two of the more under-the-radar good offensive linemen.

I don't even want to tie up 7.7 mildo on a running back, let alone 10 or 11.

Gay Ork Wang
05-22-2012, 05:55 PM
Forte will make 7.7 this year under the franchise tag.

Let's say he has an injury that forces him onto the IR, and makes him something of an injury concern, but one that is still expected to play in 2013. You're saying that someone won't give him 6.3 guaranteed? Of course they would.
yea but only the guaranteed, that doesnt include the rest of the contract does it?

bearsfan_51
05-22-2012, 07:11 PM
yea but only the guaranteed, that doesnt include the rest of the contract does it?
The rest of the contract is worthless anyway if he gets hurt.

Gay Ork Wang
05-22-2012, 07:13 PM
The rest of the contract is worthless anyway if he gets hurt.
fair point.

Docta
05-22-2012, 08:09 PM
I was really hoping that we'd get a second rounder in this past draft for him.

I preferred signing one more back, building on what we already have behind Forte (the makings of a good committee) and spending the leftover money on two of the more under-the-radar good offensive linemen.

I don't even want to tie up 7.7 mildo on a running back, let alone 10 or 11.
A 2nd in next year's draft will probably be more valuable. Maybe the Lions or Bengals would budge. The Lions already get a close-up look on him, and their RBs are already injury scares.

bearsfan_51
05-22-2012, 08:16 PM
No way should we trade Forte to the Lions. I'm totally down with trading him, but not within the division.

If I was the Bears, I wouldn't sign Forte to more than 20 mil guaranteed, and if I was Forte I wouldn't take less.

It's a tricky situation, and my guess is that he simply plays with the tag this year and we'll see where things sit a year from now. There's really no pressure on the Bears end to extend him.