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View Full Version : Why do people have KC taking a QB?


KCStud
11-08-2007, 01:42 PM
Don't understand that when Brodie hasn't even taken the field yet. He has looked good when he has had the chance. KC desperately needs OL help badly. An OT like Loadholt, Cherilus, Baker, Oher(based on talent alone) or Clady look to be the best choices for the team

princefielder28
11-08-2007, 01:47 PM
I agree.....I don't think KC will invest their first rounder in a QB given management's stance with Brodie

Teams that may be investing first round picks on a QB: Atlanta Falcons, Minnesota Vikings, Chicago Bears, Carolina Panthers, Baltimore Ravens, and you never know about Tampa Bay

And I don't think Jacksonville goes after a QB, at least in Round 1, because Garrard has played solid when healthy and they were winning.

Scotty D
11-08-2007, 01:51 PM
I think they can easily upgrade the QB position. I don't see Croyle becoming anything more than servicable, and its not like they have a lot invested in him.

princefielder28
11-08-2007, 02:11 PM
I think they can easily upgrade the QB position. I don't see Croyle becoming anything more than servicable, and its not like they have a lot invested in him.

The Front Office has their eyes set on him as the future though and they invested with LJ at RB long term and spent their first rounder last year on Dwayne Bowe so it is time to start addressing the OL where there have been numerous departures over the last several years.

LionSmack
11-08-2007, 02:38 PM
Front offices have been known to change their minds. Especially when it comes to guys like huard or croyle who don't have huge contracts with huge cap hits if they are kicked to the curb.

I agree the Chiefs would be better off addressing their OL, but I don't think you can say QB is impossible with as much conviction as you think.

Cashmoney
11-08-2007, 02:52 PM
why address o-line in the first when you can do it in the second and third? this is one of the deeper OT classes in a while, especially if a few of the juniors come out.

BPhilb
11-08-2007, 04:20 PM
why address o-line in the first when you can do it in the second and third? this is one of the deeper OT classes in a while, especially if a few of the juniors come out.

We are also needing CB's in those rounds as it's possible that both Law and Surtain are not back next season. We still could use another DT for the rotation and possibly at DE if it appears that we don't get to keep Jared Allen. We also need to draft another WR to replace Kennison. I don't see any way we draft a QB early. If Croyle is brutal next year it will reflect in the record anyway and we could then draft a QB from the top of the 2009 draft which is probably the better way to go any how.

Babylon
11-08-2007, 06:19 PM
Don't understand that when Brodie hasn't even taken the field yet. He has looked good when he has had the chance. KC desperately needs OL help badly. An OT like Loadholt, Cherilus, Baker, Oher(based on talent alone) or Clady look to be the best choices for the team

My guess is right now the Chiefs dont know which direction they want to go in. As for "people" they know less.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-08-2007, 08:19 PM
Because, despite Huard's struggles, the coaching staff obviously doesn't feel he's ready. Because he's looked like crap in the preseason. Because Herm Edwards could very well prefer to have his own quarterback for his stay in Kansas City, not one the management seems to be desperately hoping turns into a viable starter.

I don't necessarily think it's the most likely selection, but if they go elsewhere I believe it'll be to get a better player, not because they have great faith in Croyle. I'd be shocked if the Chiefs don't draft a single quarterback next April.

asmitty45
11-08-2007, 08:39 PM
KC would be much better off going OLine or DLine.

villagewarrior
11-08-2007, 08:49 PM
While I think the Chiefs should go offensive line in the first this draft, I wouldn't be disappointed if they took a quarterback because I'm less then enthralled with Brodie. I think the Chiefs are making a massive mistake not playing him right now though, they need to find out what they have in Croyle.

Crow
11-08-2007, 10:54 PM
Croyle looked pretty bad when I watched him. And the fact that he couldn't unseat a struggling Damon Huard is pretty telling, I believe.

San Diego Chicken
11-08-2007, 11:22 PM
Croyle looked pretty bad when I watched him. And the fact that he couldn't unseat a struggling Damon Huard is pretty telling, I believe.

That is the situation. KC gave Croyle every opportunity to win the starting job, but he couldn't get it done. If anyone watched HBO's Hard Knocks, Herm Edwards and KC's QB coach felt like they should go with Croyle at first, but he struggled in camp and in the preseason games.

Besides, Croyle was only a third round pick. You really don't expect much more than backup quality at that point anyway. I say bring in a more talented quarterback. There will be a better QB in either of the first two rounds of the draft.

Scotty D
11-08-2007, 11:23 PM
That is the situation. KC gave Croyle every opportunity to win the starting job, but he couldn't get it done. If anyone watched HBO's Hard Knocks, Herm Edwards and KC's QB coach felt like they should go with Croyle at first, but he struggled in camp and in the preseason games.

Besides, Croyle was only a third round pick. You really don't expect much more than backup quality at that point anyway. I say bring in a more talented quarterback. There will be a better QB in either of the first two rounds of the draft.

I agree completly. You can get a guy with a higher ceiling and skill set easily. They still should give him a shot though.

Crow
11-08-2007, 11:37 PM
I said the same thing about Andrew Walter, who I was far more impressed with than I am with Croyle.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:04 PM
why address o-line in the first when you can do it in the second and third? this is one of the deeper OT classes in a while, especially if a few of the juniors come out.

Because our offensive line sucks. The majority of elite left tackles are 1st round picks. Therefore, a 1st round pick at tackle would be a good idea. Then, we could probably use another pick or two on the offensive line in the later rounds.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:06 PM
I said the same thing about Andrew Walter, who I was far more impressed with than I am with Croyle.

And that's why your not a scout or involved with football.

Until Croyle has been given a chance to prove himself then there is absolutely no reason to consider drafting another QB.

Also, keep in mind that Croyle was playing without LJ, Bowe, Damion McIntosh, as well as Tony Gonzalez (for the most part). His preseason play is really not a good indicator of what kind of player he is.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:07 PM
We are also needing CB's in those rounds as it's possible that both Law and Surtain are not back next season. We still could use another DT for the rotation and possibly at DE if it appears that we don't get to keep Jared Allen. We also need to draft another WR to replace Kennison. I don't see any way we draft a QB early. If Croyle is brutal next year it will reflect in the record anyway and we could then draft a QB from the top of the 2009 draft which is probably the better way to go any how.

Carl Peterson has said the Chiefs are not losing Jared Allen. End of story.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:10 PM
That is the situation. KC gave Croyle every opportunity to win the starting job, but he couldn't get it done. If anyone watched HBO's Hard Knocks, Herm Edwards and KC's QB coach felt like they should go with Croyle at first, but he struggled in camp and in the preseason games.

Besides, Croyle was only a third round pick. You really don't expect much more than backup quality at that point anyway. I say bring in a more talented quarterback. There will be a better QB in either of the first two rounds of the draft.

No, he didn't struggle in camp. He was actually the most impressive QB on our roster during training camp. Yes, he did struggle in preseason. But keep in mind he was playing without our starting LT, RB, WR, and our starting TE for most of the time. Also, he dealt with numerous drops as well as an offensive line that could not protect him.

Look at your own team. Philip Rivers has played horribly during the regular season. Should you guys be looking for another quarterback now?

Croyle is still going to get a chance to start this season. He might play as soon as some point of this weeks game. And Herm Edwards has said that once Croyle is in he is in for good.

nobodyinparticular
11-09-2007, 02:11 PM
Hello Andrew Walter circa 2005-2006.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:15 PM
I agree completly. You can get a guy with a higher ceiling and skill set easily. They still should give him a shot though.

Higher skill set? Have you seen Croyle's arm? He has a pretty damn good skill set.

Oh, I forgot the rule that starting quarterbacks have to be 1st round picks. Brady, Bulger, Hasselbeck, Garrard, Schaub, Romo, Garcia, Warner, Anderson, Delhomme, etc. must just be exceptions to the rule.

Hell, just look at Cleveland. Brady Quinn would seem to be the one with the higher ceiling but who is the one who is leading his team to victories? Derek Anderson. And he was only a 6th round pick. And what a surprise, this is his 3rd season. How dare it take him that long to develop into a quality quarterback. And how dare Croyle not be ready to be a star in only his second season. And how dare David Garrard and Tony Romo take 4 or 5 years to develop into good quarterbacks.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:16 PM
Hello Andrew Walter circa 2005-2006.

The difference is our team has an eye for talent and can actually draft. Walter was doomed from the beginning in Oakland. Russell probably is too.

I see no reason for the Walter/Croyle comparisons. I just don't see it.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:18 PM
Croyle looked pretty bad when I watched him. And the fact that he couldn't unseat a struggling Damon Huard is pretty telling, I believe.

The fact is, Damon Huard gave us the best chance to win at the beginning of the season simply based on what he did last year. But he isn't playing like he did last year. The change will come soon.

Did you watch him in the regular season? Because in two appearances he has driven the team down the field on long drives, one of which ended in a touchdown and the other ended in a fumble by Michael Bennett.

Damon Huard looked pretty bad last preseason and then he came in and had a 98 QB rating. Believe it or not, it is possible for a player to play like crap in the preseason but be a totally different player in the regular season.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:19 PM
KC would be much better off going OLine or DLine.

Our DLine is pretty good. We need DLine depth but a 1st round pick is not needed.

nobodyinparticular
11-09-2007, 02:21 PM
The difference is our team has an eye for talent and can actually draft. Walter was doomed from the beginning in Oakland. Russell probably is too.

I see no reason for the Walter/Croyle comparisons. I just don't see it.

Take a look at everything that Raider fans were saying between Dec 2005 and Aug/Sept 2006. Replace the name Walter with Croyle and you'll see the exact comparison.

I like how your team has drafted its way to so many playoff wins in the last 15 years. Oh... Wait...

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:22 PM
Because, despite Huard's struggles, the coaching staff obviously doesn't feel he's ready. Because he's looked like crap in the preseason. Because Herm Edwards could very well prefer to have his own quarterback for his stay in Kansas City, not one the management seems to be desperately hoping turns into a viable starter.

I don't necessarily think it's the most likely selection, but if they go elsewhere I believe it'll be to get a better player, not because they have great faith in Croyle. I'd be shocked if the Chiefs don't draft a single quarterback next April.

Brodie Croyle was Herman Edwards' draft pick, in case you didn't realize. Croyle is Herm's guy. Croyle is Herm's own quarterback.Not sure where you got the idea that he wasn't.

I guarantee the Chiefs are not using a 1st day pick on a quarterback next year. The only reason to draft one would be for depth, not to look for a future starter.

kmartin575
11-09-2007, 02:24 PM
Take a look at everything that Raider fans were saying between Dec 2005 and Aug/Sept 2006. Replace the name Walter with Croyle and you'll see the exact comparison.

I like how your team has drafted its way to so many playoff wins in the last 15 years. Oh... Wait...

9 straight.
29 out of the last 37.

Does it really matter that Raiders and Chiefs fans were saying some of the same things? No, it really doesn't. Brodie Croyle and Andrew Walter are nothing alike. No comparison. Croyle isn't the immovable statue in the pocket that Walter is.

619
11-09-2007, 02:27 PM
brodie croyle isnt special and will never be anything more than a serviceable QB..in the preseason it was his starting job to lose and he actually did

nobodyinparticular
11-09-2007, 02:28 PM
9 straight.
29 out of the last 37.

Does it really matter that Raiders and Chiefs fans were saying some of the same things? No, it really doesn't. Brodie Croyle and Andrew Walter are nothing alike. No comparison. Croyle isn't the immovable statue in the pocket that Walter is.

Nine straight? I'm pretty sure you mean 5. As in the number of Super Bowls the Raiders have been to since the last time the Chiefs were in one. Or is it 3, as in the number of Super Bowls the Raiders have won since the Chiefs last won. Or is it 3x, as in the factor of how many more Lombardi Trophies the Raiders have over the Chiefs?

Sniper
11-09-2007, 02:41 PM
why address o-line in the first when you can do it in the second and third? this is one of the deeper OT classes in a while, especially if a few of the juniors come out.

Because good O lines can make a QB look better than he is.

San Diego Chicken
11-09-2007, 05:28 PM
No, he didn't struggle in camp. He was actually the most impressive QB on our roster during training camp. Yes, he did struggle in preseason. But keep in mind he was playing without our starting LT, RB, WR, and our starting TE for most of the time. Also, he dealt with numerous drops as well as an offensive line that could not protect him.

Look at your own team. Philip Rivers has played horribly during the regular season. Should you guys be looking for another quarterback now?

Croyle is still going to get a chance to start this season. He might play as soon as some point of this weeks game. And Herm Edwards has said that once Croyle is in he is in for good.


Philip Rivers has been inconsistent, but his passer rating is still a respectable 82.9, and his career passer rating is 88.0, which is above average for an NFL QB. The biggest difference between Rivers and Croyle, is that Rivers was drafted 4th overall in a loaded draft, at that point you expect to get a good starting QB in the NFL. When you draft a player in the third, you may hold some hope that he can start, but history says you're getting a backup quality player in the third round.

Splat
11-09-2007, 06:41 PM
As long as the Carl Peterson is GM the Chiefs will not draft a QB in the first round I would bet money we go OL in the first round unless we do some shopping in FA.

Splat
11-09-2007, 06:43 PM
why address o-line in the first when you can do it in the second and third? this is one of the deeper OT classes in a while, especially if a few of the juniors come out.

All five starters are atleast 30 years old they need a huge youth movement in that area I would not be shocked to see them go OL with two of there first three picks which is what they should have done this year. I loved the D-Bo pick but they reached in round two with Tank Mcbride they did not take an OL player till round six.

neko4
11-09-2007, 07:11 PM
Turk McBride, but Tank Tyler
Both have done okay i heard. Tank doing much better though apparently

thebow305
11-09-2007, 08:50 PM
Because there are stupid people in the world. Just thought I'd add that in there.

Crow
11-10-2007, 01:42 AM
And that's why your not a scout or involved with football.

Until Croyle has been given a chance to prove himself then there is absolutely no reason to consider drafting another QB.
Again, I said the same thing.

Also, keep in mind that Croyle was playing without LJ, Bowe, Damion McIntosh, as well as Tony Gonzalez (for the most part). His preseason play is really not a good indicator of what kind of player he is.

Nor was the 2006 debacle a fair assessment of Walter's ability. But...

doingthisinsteadofwork
11-10-2007, 01:47 AM
Does it really matter that Raiders and Chiefs fans were saying some of the same things? No, it really doesn't. Brodie Croyle and Andrew Walter are nothing alike. No comparison. Croyle isn't the immovable statue in the pocket that Walter is.
Yeah hes not a statue but hes 10x more injury prone than Walter is.

Wyndham
11-10-2007, 06:30 AM
Croyle looked pretty bad when I watched him.

Uhh... when was that?

Croyle's only thrown 17 passes this season but his passer rating is 104.5, largely against a Jacksonville defense that was trying its hardest to prevent a shutout.

In college he was a decent QB.

I'd love to see your breakdown on Croyle's performance.

Wyndham
11-10-2007, 06:34 AM
I guarantee the Chiefs are not using a 1st day pick on a quarterback next year.

Bullsnot.

If the best player on the board is a quarterback, the Chiefs will take him, whether it's one of the big three slipping in the middle of the first round or a guy like Chad Henne in the middle of the third.

If they like another player more, they'll go with him. Croyle has shown flashes but he hasn't proven anything and they have nothing invested in him.

Splat
11-10-2007, 08:13 AM
Turk McBride, but Tank Tyler
Both have done okay i heard. Tank doing much better though apparently

Not really they are both ok depth but neither has really done much I feel Tank will be a good player in time but I'm not high on Turk at all waste of a pick IMO. I would much rather have went OL in round two I still can't believe they didn't bring in some youth on the line.

Staubach12
11-10-2007, 03:59 PM
Croyle wcan't play because he doesn't have the ability to stay healthy, it's as simple as that. He's really going to have to prove something before he can be put in that QBOTF role.

Splat
11-10-2007, 05:17 PM
Croyle wcan't play because he doesn't have the ability to stay healthy, it's as simple as that. He's really going to have to prove something before he can be put in that QBOTF role.

If we had the line we had a few years ago I think he would have been a great fit I have not gave up on him but I'm not as high on him as I once was. I think it is to early to tell what kinda player he will be but like you said he is just to small to think he can be a full time starter behind a line like we have.

bored of education
11-18-2007, 06:42 PM
ummmmm

i dont think KC uses a draft pick on a Qb

USAF Chief
11-18-2007, 09:19 PM
At this point, I don't see KC using the 1st round pick on a QB. Croyle has the intangibles and needs some coaching (i.e not throwing off his back foot and stepping into his throws) but what he really needs is a solid Offensive Coordinator and QB Coach to jumpstart his development.

He may or may not be the answer at the position but he can surely be servicable for a year or two while we fill holes of greater need right now.

We are at an advantage that we have a young guy who we can play and if he blows up and becomes a surefire starter then great, we hit the jackpot. On the flipside, if he struggles and is not what we are looking for then we only invested a 3rd round pick and can cut ties without a huge problem.

It's win/win for us.

kmartin575
11-18-2007, 11:33 PM
He sure as hell looked pretty damn good today. He put up better stats than Peyton Manning in his first career start. He was definitely the most impressive of the 3 AFC West QB's who played today.

Again, I reiterate. The Chiefs are not using a high draft pick on a QB next season. No need to. Croyle is our QB. Now it's time to find the offensive line to protect him.

Matthew Jones
11-19-2007, 05:48 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if the Chiefs didn't take a first day quarterback, but I would be very surprised if they didn't add one on the second day to play around with. It's not going to necessarily put Croyle's job in jeopardy but it's always good to pick up at least one quarterback each draft. The Packers were known for doing that about ten years ago and they had Aaron Brooks, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselbeck, Jake Delhomme, etc. on roster backing up Favre. Look at the Falcons - take Matt Schaub at the end of the third, show just enough of him to give teams the impression that he could perhaps be a starter, get the big pay off. Even though I'm sure they would have preferred to keep him now, what I'm trying to say is that quarterbacks are extremely valuable and to not have more than one decent option on your roster is a bad idea.

villagewarrior
11-19-2007, 09:51 AM
I wouldn't be surprised if the Chiefs didn't take a first day quarterback, but I would be very surprised if they didn't add one on the second day to play around with. It's not going to necessarily put Croyle's job in jeopardy but it's always good to pick up at least one quarterback each draft. The Packers were known for doing that about ten years ago and they had Aaron Brooks, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselbeck, Jake Delhomme, etc. on roster backing up Favre. Look at the Falcons - take Matt Schaub at the end of the third, show just enough of him to give teams the impression that he could perhaps be a starter, get the big pay off. Even though I'm sure they would have preferred to keep him now, what I'm trying to say is that quarterbacks are extremely valuable and to not have more than one decent option on your roster is a bad idea.

I agree, although they do have a rookie signal caller as a third stringer, Tyler Thigpen I believe is the name that the coaching staff is really high on as well, so I'd be surprised if higher than a 7th was used on a QB.

kmartin575
11-19-2007, 10:03 AM
If we had the line we had a few years ago I think he would have been a great fit I have not gave up on him but I'm not as high on him as I once was. I think it is to early to tell what kinda player he will be but like you said he is just to small to think he can be a full time starter behind a line like we have.

After watching that game in Indy I am surprised any Chiefs fan can not be high on him right now.

asmitty45
11-19-2007, 10:21 AM
Croyle is going to be given another year. KC has other areas to fill that are much more important than QB.