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Aftermath
11-25-2007, 11:13 PM
How far behind Dorsey is Ellis as a prospect? And how would he translate to the NFL?

bored of education
11-25-2007, 11:13 PM
I think he will be a fine NFL player.

elcapitan
11-25-2007, 11:17 PM
I think he will be a fine NFL player.

Agreed. I think he would thrive as an under tackle in a 4-3

BucSappy
11-25-2007, 11:18 PM
Dorsey is a top 3 talent. Ellis is a top 10 talent. So not that far behind, but a little bit.

He translates well to the NFL in the right scheme.

Todd McShay in his latest mock draft has the Jets taking him at #5 overall. I totally disagree with this I think he is a really bad fit in a 3-4 scheme. He needs to be in the three technique on a Cover 2 defense to maximize his talent.

bored of education
11-25-2007, 11:25 PM
n/m nothing here

MidwayMonster31
11-26-2007, 12:26 AM
Cover 2 would be the best fit for him, but I see a 4-3 team drafting him earlier, like Carolina or Cincinnati. He can definitely get to the quarterback, but does not fit a 3-4.

BucSappy
11-26-2007, 12:39 AM
Cover 2 would be the best fit for him, but I see a 4-3 team drafting him earlier, like Carolina or Cincinnati. He can definitely get to the quarterback, but does not fit a 3-4.

He's a bad fit in Carolina. They don't use a Cover 2 defense and they prefer bigger DTs (more like 2 nose tackles).

MidwayMonster31
11-26-2007, 10:55 AM
He's a bad fit in Carolina. They don't use a Cover 2 defense and they prefer bigger DTs (more like 2 nose tackles).For Carolina, is John Fox still their head coach in April? If not, then Ellis is a possibility because of scheme changes.

Crow
11-26-2007, 01:51 PM
I'm a D-line guy, so maybe I'm biased. But I definitely think Ellis belongs in the top 5 next to Long and Dorsey. DTs under 300 pounds aren't a fit for every scheme, but he's got the skill to make teams look stupid for passing on him.

d34ng3l021
11-26-2007, 02:03 PM
I really like him, and think he is a better VALUE than Dorsey. Dorsey will probably be picked top5, and Ellis top10 - top15 but wont be too behind Dorsey as a pro.

Turtlepower
11-26-2007, 02:05 PM
I really like him, and think he is a better VALUE than Dorsey. Dorsey will probably be picked top5, and Ellis top10 - top15 but wont be too behind Dorsey as a pro.

I agree with you. It might be controversial, but I think that Sendrick Ellis will be better in the NFL than Glenn Dorsey.

keylime_5
11-26-2007, 02:20 PM
I think some teams would prefer Long over Dorsey. Long's stock is insanely high right now and Dorsey's has leveled out as a top 5, maybe top 3 lock. Long could be the #1 overall pick (especially if Miami sticks with a 3-4 and doesn't change to a 4-3). Ellis is gaining on Dorsey though, he is a beast.

bearsfan_51
11-26-2007, 02:28 PM
He's a bad fit in Carolina. They don't use a Cover 2 defense and they prefer bigger DTs (more like 2 nose tackles).
Tampa 2, not Cover 2. Every defense uses the cover 2, which has nothing to do with the defensive line.

Wyndham
11-26-2007, 06:17 PM
Better prospect than Amobi Okoye with more upside (age isn't everything).

I'll be more than happy if the Chiefs take him.

Babylon
11-26-2007, 06:34 PM
I agree with you. It might be controversial, but I think that Sendrick Ellis will be better in the NFL than Glenn Dorsey.

I agree, i think that Ellis gives a more consistant effort. Dorsey is a heck of a football player but i would not use the word elite

no love
11-26-2007, 08:03 PM
He is a beast who can dominate games in the same right as Dorsey. Ultimately, the only thing that will separate the two will be drive and work ethic.

Unlike other posters I don't see him as limited to only a 4-3 DT. He is more than capable of playing 3-4 end if they use him correctly. If they use him to strictly two-gap he will get worn down and exposed. But if they use him on plenty of stunts, slants he will be disruptive.

Aftermath
01-26-2008, 04:48 PM
Ok, so after the Senior Bowl practices and up to this part in the game, whats the chance that Ellis drops to the Bengals at 9?

619
01-26-2008, 04:52 PM
Ok, so after the Senior Bowl practices and up to this part in the game, whats the chance that Ellis drops to the Bengals at 9?

He likely wont fall out of the top 5. Theres no question he closed the gap significantly to the point where its really Dorsey 1a and Ellis 1b.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 04:52 PM
I think he is a better fit in Miami than Glenn Dorsey. With Dorsey I see a under tackle in a 4-3 with the possibility of playing a little noze. Sedrick Ellis I think can play in the 4-3 UT or NT, or 3-4 NT.

I think he is a top-5 lock considering his weigh in and athleticism. I think every top 5 team (Miami, Saint Louis, Oakland, Atlanta, and Kansas City) all look at him, with St. Louis, Oakland, and Atlanta staring hard.

Geo
01-26-2008, 04:56 PM
This just in: Ellis is good.

Tampa 2, not Cover 2. Every defense uses the cover 2, which has nothing to do with the defensive line.
Say it fifty more times bud, and maybe some will finally get it.

bored of education
01-26-2008, 04:58 PM
Personally, like I said several times Id take Ellis over Dorsey!

619
01-26-2008, 05:02 PM
Mike Mayock now has Ellis as his top DT.

Pit Bull #53
01-26-2008, 05:10 PM
Mike Mayock now has Ellis as his top DT.

He also said he has them basically 1a and 1b because he thinks they are two completely different players despite having similar builds. Says Ellis is a 34 nose in a slanting, twisting front and Dorsey is a 3 technique in a 43.

d34ng3l021
01-26-2008, 05:17 PM
Dorsey is a perfect 4-3 under tackle. Great pass rushing ability, but isnt a one trick pony. Does a good job against the run, but is nothing amazing against it.

Ellis is a good 4-3 nose tackle. Has ideal size at 310, but also has great burst and ability to rush the passer. You wont mistake him for Pat Williams or Grady Jackson, but he will do a solid job of taking up space.

The only thing about the 3-4 I know is that though Dorsey may fit in the 3-4 as a DE, you would be sacrificing his 3 tech.

Aftermath
01-26-2008, 05:51 PM
Ok, so which top d-line prospects may be there at the 9 spot?

Sorry for so many questions guys and thanks.

theogt
01-26-2008, 05:52 PM
I'd rate him higher than Dorsey. He's much quicker and seems just as strong. Plus he won't have the injury history.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 05:53 PM
I think Derrick Harvey or Vernon Gholston could be there. I think Harvey grades out near Gholston but doubt he fits in a 4-3.

Phillip Merling has a chance of rising.

The guy I think rises is Pat Sims from Auburn, but I have him in the 12-20 range.

theogt
01-26-2008, 05:55 PM
I think Derrick Harvey or Vernon Gholston could be there. I think Harvey grades out near Gholston but doubt he fits in a 4-3.

Phillip Merling has a chance of rising.

The guy I think rises is Pat Sims from Auburn, but I have him in the 12-20 range.The 4-3 is the only thing Harvey fits.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-26-2008, 06:01 PM
I'd rate him higher than Dorsey. He's much quicker and seems just as strong. Plus he won't have the injury history.
he broke his ankle and had a knee injury in 06.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 06:03 PM
Ellis will be gone in the first 3 picks. Quote me on it, whatever. He will not get past Oakland, Atlanta, Miami, or Saint Louis.

fenikz
01-26-2008, 06:07 PM
I still think Ellis is the better DT and come draft day, I wouldn't be surprised at all of Dorsey slipped a bit due to injury concerns and with the tremendous work outs Ellis has been having

darnik44two
01-26-2008, 06:13 PM
With the first pick in the 2008 NFL Draft The Miami Dolphins select, defensive tackle Sedrick Ellis, University of Southern California.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 06:18 PM
I would not doubt it.

I think 32 teams in the NFL are wanting Sedrick Ellis right now.

bored of education
01-26-2008, 06:21 PM
Ellis could play nose/DT/DE/Wr. he is a straight up BEAST! I had him as my number 2 on my big board overall. He might just be number one.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 06:23 PM
Ellis could play nose/DT/DE/Wr. he is a straight up BEAST! I had him as my number 2 on my big board overall. He might just be number one.

Haha, I noticed you took Andre' Woodson out of your signature and inserted Josh Johnson.

bored of education
01-26-2008, 06:25 PM
Haha, I noticed you took Andre' Woodson out of your signature and inserted Josh Johnson.


I did that after the East West Shrine game..and today makes me not want to put Woodson on any list.

darnik44two
01-26-2008, 06:25 PM
My new top 10...

1. Sedrick Ellis
2. Darren McFadden
3. Glenn Dorsey
4. Jake Long
5. Chris Long
6. Vernon Gholston
7. Jonathan Stewart
8. Matt Ryan
9. Keith Rivers
10. Ryan Clady

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 06:28 PM
Not sure if I can see a 3-4 NT going number one overall though. Not sure if Parcells would give NT that kind of value.

keylime_5
01-26-2008, 06:33 PM
Ellis could play in a 3-4 at NT conceivably, but that would be a waste considering he is best at penetrating and collapsing the pocket. Why would anyone spend a top 5 pick on a guy who is basically a 43 penetrating disrupter at DT to play NT and just pick up double teams and absorb blockers? Not gonna happen. Same thing with Dorsey if someone wanted him as a 3-4 DE. They would totally better off with Chris Long which is his natural position and a spot he is much better at than a cover 2 DT like Glenn Dorsey who would be about as effective of a playmaker at DE in a 34 as Warren Sapp was (not very).

darnik44two
01-26-2008, 06:35 PM
Not sure if I can see a 3-4 NT going number one overall though. Not sure if Parcells would give NT that kind of value.

They are so hard to find and so important to a 3-4 scheme. Casey Hampton has quietly made the Steelers defense what they are against the run year after year.

619
01-26-2008, 06:37 PM
My new top 10...

1. Sedrick Ellis
2. Darren McFadden
3. Glenn Dorsey
4. Jake Long
5. Chris Long
6. Vernon Gholston
7. Jonathan Stewart
8. Matt Ryan
9. Keith Rivers
10. Ryan Clady

For the most part it looks really good but I just cant see McFadden anywhere but #1 still.

CaliPanthers420
01-26-2008, 06:43 PM
Its funny how everybody is on Ellis's nuts now but the guy has been doing this kind of stuff for awhile now at USC. Pac 10 teams game plan against the guy throwing multiple blockers at him. I didnt need the Senior Bowl to tell me Ellis is gonna be a beast in the NFL.

bored of education
01-26-2008, 06:44 PM
Its funny how everybody is on Ellis's nuts now but the guy has been doing this kind of stuff for awhile now at USC. Pac 10 teams game plan against the guy throwing multiple blockers at him. I didnt need the Senior Bowl to tell me Ellis is gonna be a beast in the NFL.

i have always thought he was a top 5 draft pick. Look up my posts, find them for yourself.

BamaFalcon59
01-26-2008, 06:46 PM
Its funny how everybody is on Ellis's nuts now but the guy has been doing this kind of stuff for awhile now at USC. Pac 10 teams game plan against the guy throwing multiple blockers at him. I didnt need the Senior Bowl to tell me Ellis is gonna be a beast in the NFL.

Well, besides the amazing Senior Bowl and Senior Bowl practices his weigh in did a ton for him. From 285 to 308. He is now a legit canidate for 4-3 NT and 3-4 NT. Not sure if people saw that before.

619
01-26-2008, 06:49 PM
Its funny how everybody is on Ellis's nuts now but the guy has been doing this kind of stuff for awhile now at USC. Pac 10 teams game plan against the guy throwing multiple blockers at him. I didnt need the Senior Bowl to tell me Ellis is gonna be a beast in the NFL.

Most knew he was going to be a great player as he was a projected first round player the entire season it is just now he has elevated himself to elite status with an unbelievable Senior Bowl week. It happens every year to a few guys at the top.

CaliPanthers420
01-26-2008, 07:05 PM
Yea, I see where you guys are coming from and I dont doubt that people thought highly of him in the begining.

darnik44two
01-26-2008, 07:32 PM
Its funny how everybody is on Ellis's nuts now but the guy has been doing this kind of stuff for awhile now at USC. Pac 10 teams game plan against the guy throwing multiple blockers at him. I didnt need the Senior Bowl to tell me Ellis is gonna be a beast in the NFL.

I've had him in the top 5 for awhile now and the top 10 all year. I just needed an up close and personal look like The Senior Bowl practices to move him ahead of Dorsey. Two weeks ago I had a bunch of Jets fans complaining about me giving them Ellis as a NT in a mock draft. Bet they would take him now.

iloxygenil
01-26-2008, 07:36 PM
I think if he's on the board for Atlanta that he may edge out Jake Long for the Falcons...

LonghornsLegend
01-26-2008, 07:38 PM
Both guys are going to be good, but I think they are so similiar if you are in the top 3 picks and want a DT, id move down a few picks and take whichever guy lasted...

I think both guys can end up being elite, Tommie Harris level in a few years, but I like Ellis more with less injuries, and a higher motor...maybe its a guess in the dark but if I had to guess id say Ellis will have a longer and more productive career then dorsey(sound familiar ;) ), I can see Dorsey at an elite level for a few years but I can also see injuries catching up to him faster then Ellis, but both DT's will be gone before pick 9 thats probably a lock

d34ng3l021
01-26-2008, 07:41 PM
Damn his stock is rising like crazy. I am working on a mock, and yesterday I had Ellis at 5 to the Falcons and McFadden at 3 to the Raiders. I might have to switch that around now.

Mr. Stiller
01-27-2008, 02:26 AM
i have always thought he was a top 5 draft pick. Look up my posts, find them for yourself.

I have said it time and time again, Ellis is the best DT in this draft and will be a very very damn good NT.

More Versatile, more powerful and more difficult to stop. I see him top 4. I can't see him making it past both Atlanta and Oakland.

Personally, he's taken over my #1 spot for Miami if they can't trade down.

toonsterwu
01-27-2008, 06:07 AM
After a night to think about it, I think Glenn Dorsey is still my preferred DT. I think Ellis has locked up a top 10 spot and is a potential top 5 spot, and potentially is a top 5 value.

For all the talk about Ellis and Miami, and he would be a better fit than Dorsey for Miami, a bigger question that needs to be asked is, is it worth it. Does it make more sense for them to go Ellis early or to fill another need and target someone else for NT later, say an Ahtyba Rubin. Does it make sense for them to spend huge money on Ellis to fill the NT role? I mean ... the money is insane, and as valuable as NT's are, and they arguably are the most critical component to a 3-4, can you afford to spend said money on a guy to, at the very simplest, take up space and be the immovable object? Add in the durability and weight concerns with Ellis, and I'm just not sold. All that said, nothing would surprise me in this draft, though, and I expect plenty of "surprises".

oldLibid21
01-27-2008, 09:59 AM
Ellis is a close second in DT behind Dorsey. I'd draft him with the fourth or fifth overall pick. He's shown what he can do in the Senior Bowl, and I think he's going Top 5.

Thunder&Lightning
01-27-2008, 11:16 AM
Im questioning if ellis is better than dorsey right now after the senior bowl.

BroadwayJoe10
02-01-2008, 03:05 PM
In light of the recent mock and seeing ellis go to #6 overall to the jets, I was wondering if the impact he would have as a NT is that much greater compared to Ahytba Rubin??

Like toonster said earlier, does it makes sense to pay Ellis roughly 8 million a year to essentially be "the immovable object." Would it make more sense to grab vernon gholston and possibly reach for Rubin in the top of the second? It comes down to Ellis + lesser OLB or Gholston + Rubin??

Oaktown1981
02-02-2008, 03:47 AM
If the Raiders lose the coin flip to the Falcons I think Ellis will be a Raider.

sportsnerd23
02-02-2008, 09:50 AM
Ellis has a chance at being their at the nine spot, but at the rate that he is rising, he probably won't be.

iloxygenil
02-02-2008, 10:03 AM
If you guys lose the coin flip to us, expect Ellis to be a Falcon...you wont have the chance to pick him up. With our new head coach being one who used to be a defensive lineman, and with his emphasis on controlling the line of scrimmage on both offense and defense, I think that Ellis will win out that battle between Ellis and Long and we'll be selecting one of those 2 players...if both are gone, then I think we'll take a gamble on run DMC...or trade down if at all possible.

GDWTheSickness
02-02-2008, 02:24 PM
in the right situation he will shine. Ellis imo will shine in a variety of schemes

iloxygenil
02-02-2008, 02:29 PM
I think Dorsey is dominant when healthy, he's strong as an ox...

Ellis though for the Falcons I think is a better fit. Dorsey's play this season was marred severely by that injury.

eazyb81
04-24-2008, 02:54 PM
A lot of Ellis love in this thread.

Am I the only one concerned with his short arm length? Add in the questions about his weight, and I'm not 100% sold he can be a consistent force in the pro game.

For some reason he reminds me more of Damione Lewis than Tommie Harris or Warren Sapp.

Someone tell me why I'm wrong.

d34ng3l021
04-24-2008, 03:16 PM
Ellis will be gone in the first 3 picks. Quote me on it, whatever. He will not get past Oakland, Atlanta, Miami, or Saint Louis.

lol. good luck with that.

BamaFalcon59
04-24-2008, 04:20 PM
lol. good luck with that.

Well, now it seems stupid. But considering how things are shaping up, I could definitely see us making a stupid move and grabbing him.

Remember, I said that after his insane Senior Bowl.

holt_bruce81
04-24-2008, 04:48 PM
The thing that concerns me with Ellis is his lack of height, but I have already stated that in other threads. There are only 6 DTs in the nfl that are under 6'1 and only like 3 of them are successful.

d34ng3l021
04-24-2008, 04:51 PM
thats why you dont make predictions after the senior bowl when considering the draft. lol.

SouthernComfort
04-24-2008, 05:15 PM
The thing that concerns me with Ellis is his lack of height, but I have already stated that in other threads. There are only 6 DTs in the nfl that are under 6'1 and only like 3 of them are successful.
So that's a 50% success rate...

Any idea what the success rate is for guys over 6'1''? I'd venture to say less than 50% considering the amount of DTs in the league.

The fact that Ellis is below average height and he is still considered an elite prospect makes me believe he has what it takes to make it in the NFL. He is built like a tank with a low center of gravity that gives him a strong sense of balance.

DragonFireKai
04-24-2008, 05:18 PM
So that's a 50% success rate...

Any idea what the success rate is for guys over 6'1''? I'd venture to say less than 50% considering the amount of DTs in the league.

The fact that Ellis is below average height and he is still considered an elite prospect makes me believe he has what it takes to make it in the NFL. He is built like a tank with a low center of gravity that gives him a strong sense of balance.

He's real similar to Mike Patterson.

San Diego Chicken
04-24-2008, 05:36 PM
If the Rams pick Dorsey at #2, Ellis could still go #3, #4 or #5 if he's high enough on those team's boards. N.O. and Cincy will be calling too. The Falcons don't seem to be in love with Ryan, and if Ellis is higher on their board, you never know...