PDA

View Full Version : My View of the team


BlindSite
01-04-2008, 02:18 AM
No matter what Fox’s short comings, and no matter what has happened in the past, John Fox at the end of the day knows football, and knows how to win.

While he’s only had 2 winning seasons out of six with the Panthers his first losing season was as a result of a poor team that he inherited from an inept staff. His next two were clearly due to injury, as in both years the team was last and second last in the league for players missing starts.

While it’s the front office’s job to build depth, there’s very few back ups around the league who can play up to the level of starters. Even if they can there’s no team in the NFL who can field a team of back ups and consistently win games. Let alone go on a six game tear.

In the years Fox and Co commanded stable defensive and offensive units John Fox has done two things, reached an NFC Championship game and almost won a Superbowl.

In 2004 the team almost again got into the playoff mix after losing 22 starters from either side of the ball and finishing the year with a 6th string running back.

This year the problems on both sides of the ball cannot be blamed solely on John Fox or for that matter his assistant coaching staff.

To begin with, losing Jake Delhomme, a player who when last healthy made the probowl hurt the team more than was shown by the team’s 7-9 record.

Delhomme is the team’s leader; he’s a large part of why Steve Smith is dominant and a big part of why the defence used to win us (the fans) championships. Without Delhomme the passing game clearly faltered, Steve Smith was definitely shackled and teams overtly ignored the pass gearing up solely to stop the run removing all possibility of offensive balance.

David Carr cost the team more than one contest through deplorable play and uncertainty from week to week between who would be slinging passes between he and Testaverde undoubtedly hindered team cohesion and preparation.

The uncertainty and inability on offense filtered down to a depleted defense. The Carolina Defense during its most successful years had two discernable defensive signal callers’ middle linebacker Dan Morgan and safety Mike Minter. The loss of those two players left a very young and inexperienced (though talented) nucleus of players to run a complicated defensive scheme.

Without these players changing assignments at the line and correcting players out of position the defensive woes were only exacerbated.

A combination of inexperience at back up defensive end, and the starter’s inability to get pressure this year lead to a major problem stopping passing games. This lack of pressure made it far more difficult for the secondary, already missing their veteran leader to stop wide receivers.

The defense, already with its woes got little time on the bench due to the offense’s propensity to go three and out on most drives.

Despite all these problems the Carolina Panthers coaching staff still got terrific play out of players like Chris Harris (an offseason addition), Matt Moore (another offseason addition), Kris Jenkins, Richard Marshall, Thomas Davis, Jon Beason (rookie), Jordan Gross, DeAngelo Williams, Jeff King among others at certain times.

The team still came with in reach of a .500 record. Had Delhomme, or even rookie Matt Moore started the latter thirteen games of the season the team’s record would undoubtedly look very different this time of the year.

It is for this reason that a rash decision shouldn’t be made at this juncture to remove John Fox and or Marty Hurney from office. There are still problems at wide receiver, on the offensive line and in the defensive secondary. But, realistically no other free general manager, director of scouting or retired personnel mogul would be able to do a better job this offseason with our current staff than Marty Hurney and no former assistant or semi retired coach would do a better job in 2008 than Fox.

The staffs deserve another chance, as does for that matter, Julius Peppers. The focus from here (as fans) should be on the draft and free agent pool. The front office’s focus should be on finding stable young leaders on both sides of the ball within house and adding youth in needed areas through the draft. The Panthers do not need an overhaul in any area. They do need intelligent, considered progression, which isn’t going to happen with a coaching change.

619
01-04-2008, 02:33 AM
The team should give young talented offensive playmakers like Deangelo Williams and Dwayne Jarrett a much larger role in the offense next season.

BlindSite
01-04-2008, 05:43 AM
I agree. I don't like the tendency at times to lean on the vets or established players, if it ain't working throw caution to the wind for a few plays. Try something.

joercky
01-04-2008, 09:21 AM
Amen to that brother.

jdb1972
01-04-2008, 11:58 AM
There's not really any question in my mind that in a perfect world, Fox and Hurney would both be relieved of their duties. Fox for his alternating stubbornness, predictability, and passivity; Hurney for the cap mess we're about to start finding ourselves in.

And yet it's that very same cap mess that makes me think they might as well stay around. It's not like things are going to be measurably better with a brand new coach and GM when you have almost the fewest players under contract and almost the highest cap number for 2008. It is what it is. Might as well let the guys who made the mess do some of the mopping up.

ShutDwn
01-04-2008, 01:08 PM
While they were big time contributors, how does Mike Minter and Dan Morgan effect us having the second to work pass rush in the league?

I have to give them a big time F, sorry guys but you have Julius Peppers. While this statement has become overrated, it is there fault. It is their job to make guys play to their potential, and if they can't get him to excel, then they are failing.

Only coach I give an A to is Tim Lewis, who should be getting Sal Sunseri's and Trgovac's pay check. Lewis brought a noticeably HUGE difference to our secondary. Also props to the linebackers, Davis showed how he can play, and Diggs stepped up as well.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2008, 01:36 PM
I dont think the coaching staff can be blamed for Peppers sucking this year. That falls on Peppers himself

Fox's largest problem is the amount of control he has. He shouldn't be given full reign on personnel decisions. The injury excuse is dry. This is what, the third season he's had to use it? I seem to recall arguing with BlindSite BEFORE THE YEAR that it seemed to be less random bad luck, and more of a constant every season. Either through acquiring/keeping injury prone players or just overall poor conditioning we seem to have injury problems ever year.

Also, I refuse to use Dan Morgan as an excuse to anything. He should have been released two years ago

My solution? Fire Hurney and bring in a hardass GM who won't let Fox do whatever he wants. John Fox is a good coach when he has the talent necessary. The problem is his own loyalty problems prevent that talent from being on the team or on the field.

jdb1972
01-04-2008, 01:49 PM
I dont think the coaching staff can be blamed for Peppers sucking this year. That falls on Peppers himself.
From what I've heard, there were medical reasons for his play this year.

Yeah, he denied it was sickness. If what I was told is correct, he was technically truthful with that answer. Not sickness, but the medicine used to treat the sickness. Non-chronic condition, shouldn't be an issue next year.

Or somebody could be blowing smoke. Dunno. I believe what I was told, but there's no way to prove it. Anyway, I'm not worried about him for next year.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2008, 04:50 PM
regardless, my point still stands

when someone completely falls off a cliff like Peppers did, the coaching staff is not to blame

jdb1972
01-04-2008, 06:01 PM
Actually, if he was wiped due to the side effects from medicine and they put him on the field anyway, yeah, they have to shoulder some of the blame. Particularly if it makes you keep your 3rd round pick inactive in doing so.

Not their fault he stunk, just their fault in how they reacted to it.

ShutDwn
01-04-2008, 09:50 PM
regardless, my point still stands

when someone completely falls off a cliff like Peppers did, the coaching staff is not to blame

If we are going to pay him like we do, the team should be doing everything to make him earn it. It sounds good to say the coaches shouldn't be held reliable, because they really shouldn't, if he is going to suck they shouldn't get in trouble. But he is getting a lot of money, and the coaches should make sure that the team is getting their moneys worth.

The injury excuse has now been used over and over. NEWS FLASH to John Fox, every team has injuries to important players. Doesn't stop good coaches from winning, doesn't stop the Patriots from beating the Eagles in the Superbowl with Troy Brown and rookie Randall *** at CB covering Terrell Owens.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-05-2008, 03:24 PM
Actually, if he was wiped due to the side effects from medicine and they put him on the field anyway, yeah, they have to shoulder some of the blame. Particularly if it makes you keep your 3rd round pick inactive in doing so.

Not their fault he stunk, just their fault in how they reacted to it.

from what Ive seen of Johnson he's more of a run defender than a pressure guy so I dont think it wouldve mattered much. Does suck they didnt get more of a look on him if they knew Peppers wasnt giving them anything, though. Not defending them on that, just saying the "you have Julius Peppers" quote isnt saying much. Whatever was wrong with him is out of their hands. If he was really sick or whatever, it falls back to the injury excuse which again I am tired of too. Not absolving the coaching staff of blame by any stretch, just saying I dont blame them for peppers sucking

ShutDwn
01-05-2008, 04:12 PM
from what Ive seen of Johnson he's more of a run defender than a pressure guy so I dont think it wouldve mattered much. Does suck they didnt get more of a look on him if they knew Peppers wasnt giving them anything, though. Not defending them on that, just saying the "you have Julius Peppers" quote isnt saying much. Whatever was wrong with him is out of their hands. If he was really sick or whatever, it falls back to the injury excuse which again I am tired of too. Not absolving the coaching staff of blame by any stretch, just saying I dont blame them for peppers sucking

Honestly, I'm tired of our players just missing entire years and no one knows why. Colbert supposedly was hurt, but really he just forgot how to play and sucks now. Lucas is taking stupid supplements and screws his shoulder up, but no one knows about this till the middle of the season. Gamble played like he is drunk last year.Peppers has some problem nobody knows details about. Peppers should have been put on IR in the middle of the season and we should have brought in tons of different guys to get some kind of pass rush. Peppers still got payed like a probowler regardless if he did well.