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View Full Version : Ray Rice = Overrated


CARDIAC CAT 7
01-08-2008, 09:50 PM
Anyone who thinks that Ray Rice is a franchise back is completly out of it or is a huge homer. He just needs to hope his 40 is decent so he stays Day 1. If Ray Rice is going to get 2 threads made by homers, these other guys deserve threads too.
1. Darren McFadden , Top 5
2. Rashard Mendenhall , Top 15
3. Jonathan Stewart , Top 15
4. Felix Jones , 1st Round (Not sure if he can be a franchise back)
5. Steve Slaton , Late 1st-Early 2nd(Stock is highest it can possibly be)
6. Chris Johnson , Late 1st- Early 2nd
7. Jamaal Charles , 2nd Round
8. Mike Hart , 2nd Round
9. Kevin Smith , 2nd Round
10. James Davis , 2nd Round-3rd Round
11. Ray Rice , 3rd Round

kingjames
01-08-2008, 09:53 PM
Ray Rice = Emmitt Smith.

Not saying he last for that many years or plays for such a good OL but he reminds me of him. Gets off long enuff runs in spite of his lack of top end speed.

GET LOOSE
01-08-2008, 09:54 PM
I disagree. I am not saying he is a franchise back but think he will be great in a 2 back system...ex like Jones-Drew and Barber

Turtlepower
01-08-2008, 09:55 PM
I really think that he is not overrated. He is pegged to go in the third round and your rankings aren't half bad. I think most people just forget how deep the draft class is at RB before posting their rankings. The only differences I would make are Chris Johnson, Mike Hart, and Kevin Smith. I think Chris Johnson is a pretty good scat back, but not much more. As for Mike Hart and Kevin Smith, those two and Ray Rice are strong, smart, slow runners who have excellent vision. I really don't see huge differences with any of those three.

Turtlepower
01-08-2008, 09:55 PM
Ray Rice = Emmitt Smith.

Not saying he last for that many years or plays for such a good OL but he reminds me of him. Gets off long enuff runs in spite of his lack of top end speed.

I'm going to just say WOW to that comparison. At least Ray Rice has a better vocabulary. =D

BroadwayJoe10
01-08-2008, 10:01 PM
I'm going to just say WOW to that comparison. At least Ray Rice has a better vocabulary. =D

Better vocab than emmitt smith?? haha i hope you're kidding, because even though Mr. Smith may not be the best person to have as your scrabble partner he sure is a better speaker than ray ray. However, i do kinda like the comparison, but maybe curis martin? Good vision, not elite speed, but certainly knows how to follow his blockers.

kingjames
01-08-2008, 10:02 PM
I'm going to just say WOW to that comparison. At least Ray Rice has a better vocabulary. =D

I remember when Jimmy Johnson picked him coming out of Florida he said how unimpressed he was with his speed and quickness but when he saw the tape he could not believe how many long runs this allegedly slow back got ......

Ray Rice is allegedly slow but he seems to get big chunks of yards running behind an OK line in a program with a bad QB and sketchy WRs. He also runs well in big games.

Let also say this, I think he is faster than Hart with similar top end instincts. I also think he will be a better pro than Mendenhall and McFadden. Don't like their running styles and I hate McFadden's body type.

Overall, I think Stewart is the best pro-style back --speed, size, instincts and versatility.

But, just my opinions and I know they are not shared by many.

GET LOOSE
01-08-2008, 10:04 PM
Curtis Martin is a good comparison. Martin is and will be for ever my favorite player and i do like Ray Ray as well

etk
01-08-2008, 10:27 PM
Ray Rice is allegedly slow but he seems to get big chunks of yards running behind an OK line in a program with a bad QB and sketchy WRs. He also runs well in big games.

Let also say this, I think he is faster than Hart with similar top end instincts. I also think he will be a better pro than Mendenhall and McFadden. Don't like their running styles and I hate McFadden's body type.

Overall, I think Stewart is the best pro-style back --speed, size, instincts and versatility.

But, just my opinions and I know they are not shared by many.

HAHAHA. OK line? Sosa, Fladell, Davis, Zuttah... that's 2 great athletes and 2 huge guys, all great run blockers and all strong candidates to be drafted. Teel is not a bad QB. He throws deep balls very nicely which is always the perfect complement to a pounder like Rice. Sketchy WRs? Britt looks like a stud while Underwood and Carter are also solid and good deep threats. Last year they had Clark Harris at TE too. His supporting cast has done nothing but help him succeed in the Big East.

He's probably a bit faster than Hart, but I think Hart is a better prospect. Better pro than Mendenhall and McFadden? I think you went a bit far there.

I definitely agree on Stewart, but you got too far ahead of yourself with McFadden and Mendenhall. Their running styles will be less effective at the next level but they'll still be solid backs.

Its Ya Boy
01-09-2008, 04:50 AM
it was his best choice to come out, hes only gonna get more carries and he isnt gonna win a National Title. I see him as Marion Barber role in the NFL. 3rd down solid backup, but best used as a back up.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-09-2008, 05:01 AM
I'm not sure where his stock ends up or what he runs, but I really like Ray Rice as a prospect. I've seen the comparison of Carnell Williams on this forum, and I honestly really like it. Ray seems to have a terrific grasp on the position and despite not being particularly heavy has a very good build for the position.

He isn't quite the prospect that Williams was, but with a solid offseason I could see him as the #3 or #4 runner on a lot of people's boards.

Iamcanadian
01-09-2008, 05:21 AM
I really think that he is not overrated. He is pegged to go in the third round and your rankings aren't half bad. I think most people just forget how deep the draft class is at RB before posting their rankings. The only differences I would make are Chris Johnson, Mike Hart, and Kevin Smith. I think Chris Johnson is a pretty good scat back, but not much more. As for Mike Hart and Kevin Smith, those two and Ray Rice are strong, smart, slow runners who have excellent vision. I really don't see huge differences with any of those three.

Very good assessment. I'd say Rice and Smith will have to put up decent 40's to advance up the ladder. I don't think Hart has the speed.

Buffalo M
01-09-2008, 05:28 AM
Anyone who thinks that Ray Rice is a franchise back is completly out of it or is a huge homer. He just needs to hope his 40 is decent so he stays Day 1. If Ray Rice is going to get 2 threads made by homers, these other guys deserve threads too.
1. Darren McFadden , Top 5
2. Rashard Mendenhall , Top 15
3. Jonathan Stewart , Top 15
4. Felix Jones , 1st Round (Not sure if he can be a franchise back)
5. Steve Slaton , Late 1st-Early 2nd(Stock is highest it can possibly be)
6. Chris Johnson , Late 1st- Early 2nd
7. Jamaal Charles , 2nd Round
8. Mike Hart , 2nd Round
9. Kevin Smith , 2nd Round
10. James Davis , 2nd Round-3rd Round
11. Ray Rice , 3rd Round



That's pretty fair. I might move Charles up a bit but your ratings are solid.

Travis 24
01-09-2008, 06:09 AM
Anyone who thinks that Ray Rice is a franchise back is completly out of it or is a huge homer. He just needs to hope his 40 is decent so he stays Day 1. If Ray Rice is going to get 2 threads made by homers, these other guys deserve threads too.
1. Darren McFadden , Top 5
2. Rashard Mendenhall , Top 15
3. Jonathan Stewart , Top 15
4. Felix Jones , 1st Round (Not sure if he can be a franchise back)
5. Steve Slaton , Late 1st-Early 2nd(Stock is highest it can possibly be)
6. Chris Johnson , Late 1st- Early 2nd
7. Jamaal Charles , 2nd Round
8. Mike Hart , 2nd Round
9. Kevin Smith , 2nd Round
10. James Davis , 2nd Round-3rd Round
11. Ray Rice , 3rd Round

Kevin Smith?...James Davis?........Mike Hart??? You have to be kidding. You suck ass at rating backs.

Jughead10
01-09-2008, 08:31 AM
40 times are so damn overrated for RBs, it is almost comical. Any team who who needs a RB in round 2 or 3 and passes on Ray because of his 40 times will regret it. Ray lacks top end or breakaway speed. Thats fine. How many times a season does an NFL RB find himself behind the entire defense and has to use this "breakaway speed".

Ahmad Bradshaw ran a 4.6 I think at the combine. Besides his character concerns, his knock was lack of breakaway speed. Yet I saw him out run the entire Buffalo defense in week 16.

Ray Rice is just a football player. Has better vision than most RBs in this draft. And thats probably because of his lack pure speed. Has a low center of gravitiy and pushes defenders backwards. Remind me of Priest Holmes. If he stays healthy, he will be a very productive NFL back.

As for those rankings, there is no way Slaton, Hart, and Davis are better. Some others are questionable. People overrate size and speed for a RB so much.

Jughead10
01-09-2008, 08:44 AM
5. Steve Slaton , Late 1st-Early 2nd(Stock is highest it can possibly be)


I actually think Slaton's stock right now is at the lowest it could possibly be. Lazy, fumbler, who plays in a read option offense. Speed which has always been his greatest aspect of his game, is not where it was his freshmen or sophmore year. Not used to running many NFL style plays.

etk
01-09-2008, 08:52 AM
I actually think Slaton's stock right now is at the lowest it could possibly be. Lazy, fumbler, who plays in a read option offense. Speed which has always been his greatest aspect of his game, is not where it was his freshmen or sophmore year. Not used to running many NFL style plays.

I think Slaton will be a huge bust in the NFL. He's the only highly-rated back I have ranked below Ray Rice. Him and maybe Kevin Smith.

Jughead10
01-09-2008, 08:57 AM
I think Slaton will be a huge bust in the NFL. He's the only highly-rated back I have ranked below Ray Rice. Him and maybe Kevin Smith.

I also I agree that he will be bust. I seem to be in minority but I'm not sold on McFadden being this great prospect either. Then again I was one of the few who absolutely hated Reggie Bush as a pro back since his sophmore year in college. But many more seemed to have jumped on that bus. The best back in this draft is Stewart in my opinion. I'm not sold on a lot of the RBs in this draft. I don't think they are really a great crop. Just big in quanity in my opinion.

Now if you are looking to get a CB in this draft, that is a different story as I think there is a ton of quanity and quality at that position.

kwilk103
01-09-2008, 09:03 AM
slatons not even coming out

and i've heard him and rod werent on the greatest terms---reason why he got 23 carries combined vs pitt and usf---no he wasnt hurt those game

etk
01-09-2008, 09:05 AM
I also I agree that he will be bust. I seem to be in minority but I'm not sold on McFadden being this great prospect either. Then again I was one of the few who absolutely hated Reggie Bush as a pro back since his sophmore year in college. But many more seemed to have jumped on that bus. The best back in this draft is Stewart in my opinion.

+rep. lol. Stewart has the power and explosiveness to not only pick up consistent yardage but also get big runs. I think he's easily a better prospect than McFadden. McFadden will need big holes to run through and won't be as effective when he hits a wall. He's a better prospect than Bush, though, because he has more of a downhill running style.

Sportsfan486
01-09-2008, 09:33 AM
I actually think Slaton's stock right now is at the lowest it could possibly be. Lazy, fumbler, who plays in a read option offense. Speed which has always been his greatest aspect of his game, is not where it was his freshmen or sophmore year. Not used to running many NFL style plays.

Yeah, if Slaton came out this year he'd be looking at the 3rd round AT BEST. Since the first three games of this year he's been wholely unimpressive in that run-heavy WVU offense and the last two games for him have been HORRIBLE.

He needs another year to prove injuries messed him up this year and he's still a baller.

Jonny
01-09-2008, 10:43 AM
I think Rice is the 6th or 7th best back this year.

josh07039
01-09-2008, 11:09 AM
Anyone that says Slaton is a better pro prospect that Rice is just flat-out wrong. Slaton is fast, thats it. He has no bulk, no power, no durability. He's not even in a pro style offense. He's in a gimmick offense that boosts his stats.

Rice is short, but I wouldn't call him undersized. When you stand next to the guy you can just see how much of a tank he is. You look at a tall guy like Brandon Jacobs(granted he is an extreme example) and he get injured all the time because he takes big shots all the time. Rice just knocks guys over like Thomas Jones or Priest Holmes. Height and 40 time are so overrated for running backs. Bottom Line-Can he play? The answer is yes.

CARDIAC CAT 7
01-09-2008, 02:16 PM
Its not that I dont like Ray Rice, I think he could really help a team in a two-back system. I dont think his style with a combo of his size could last 20 carries a game seasons. Mendenhall, McFadden, Stewart, F. Jones, and maybe even C. Johnson and K. Smith could be backs that get over 20 touches a game. As for Slaton, he would be stupid to stay all that going to happen next year is he will split carries maybe even have less carries than Noel Devine (whos clearly a better prospect), with less carries comes the durability ?'s and is he really that good ?'s. Him spending more time in college is just going to put more doubt in scouts mind. Slaton is like a poor mans Reggie Bush, if Reggie can go Top 5 , Slaton can go Top 50.

josh07039
01-09-2008, 02:32 PM
Bush going top 5 means nothing in terms of Slaton. Bush was seen by many as that electrifying, potentially once in generation type talent. Slaton's durability concerns are worse because he got injured in college very frequently and his production wasn't even close to Bush's. Additionally, Bush went to USC and won a heisman creating a great amount of hype. Finally, Bush hasn't been a remarkable runningback in the NFL, he has been a good weapon, but not a great running back.Slaton may suffer because of that.

AdropOFvenom
01-09-2008, 03:29 PM
Its not that I dont like Ray Rice, I think he could really help a team in a two-back system. I dont think his style with a combo of his size could last 20 carries a game seasons. Mendenhall, McFadden, Stewart, F. Jones, and maybe even C. Johnson and K. Smith could be backs that get over 20 touches a game. As for Slaton, he would be stupid to stay all that going to happen next year is he will split carries maybe even have less carries than Noel Devine (whos clearly a better prospect), with less carries comes the durability ?'s and is he really that good ?'s. Him spending more time in college is just going to put more doubt in scouts mind. Slaton is like a poor mans Reggie Bush, if Reggie can go Top 5 , Slaton can go Top 50.

Huh? If there's one thing that Ray Rice has proven throughout his time at Rutgers is that he's a workhorse who can carry the load. He's the type who gets stronger as the game goes along.

And Sorry man, Slaton isn't going in the First 3 rounds if he declares at this point. Not with the depth in this runningback class, his not playing in an NFL-style Offense, and his piss poor season.

PS: The Poor Mans Bush is Devine, not Slaton.

D-Unit
01-09-2008, 03:58 PM
Huh? If there's one thing that Ray Rice has proven throughout his time at Rutgers is that he's a workhorse who can carry the load. He's the type who gets stronger as the game goes along.

And Sorry man, Slaton isn't going in the First 3 rounds if he declares at this point. Not with the depth in this runningback class, his not playing in an NFL-style Offense, and his piss poor season.

PS: The Poor Mans Bush is Devine, not Slaton.
ADrop??? How'd you find this place?

Hit the nail on the head with that comment about Rice.

CARDIAC CAT 7
01-09-2008, 04:02 PM
Huh? If there's one thing that Ray Rice has proven throughout his time at Rutgers is that he's a workhorse who can carry the load. He's the type who gets stronger as the game goes along.

And Sorry man, Slaton isn't going in the First 3 rounds if he declares at this point. Not with the depth in this runningback class, his not playing in an NFL-style Offense, and his piss poor season.

PS: The Poor Mans Bush is Devine, not Slaton.

How is Noel Devine like Reggie Bush??? Noel Devine is a pure running back he not only can make you miss he can run you over and hes only going to get stronger as the seasons go. Reggie Bush is the type of guy you put in space, you run sweeps and tosses and even split him wide. Im not so sure Noel Devine being split out wide would be the best way to use him??? I was trying to refrence that Slaton would have to be used similar to Reggie Bush in the NFL because he is a player who plays better in space and probably would be one of the Top 3 recieving backs in the Draft.

Travis 24
01-09-2008, 04:08 PM
How funny would it be if Ray Rice broke Emmitt Smith's all time rushing record... : )

BamaFalcon59
01-09-2008, 04:20 PM
I remember when Jimmy Johnson picked him coming out of Florida he said how unimpressed he was with his speed and quickness but when he saw the tape he could not believe how many long runs this allegedly slow back got ......

Ray Rice is allegedly slow but he seems to get big chunks of yards running behind an OK line in a program with a bad QB and sketchy WRs. He also runs well in big games.

Let also say this, I think he is faster than Hart with similar top end instincts. I also think he will be a better pro than Mendenhall and McFadden. Don't like their running styles and I hate McFadden's body type.

.


I agree on this. While Ray Rice might time the same as Mike Hart I think Ray Rice obviously has better playmaking ability.

etk
01-09-2008, 04:25 PM
How funny would it be if Ray Rice broke Emmitt Smith's all time rushing record... : )

I think seeing pigs flying across the sky would be pretty funny.

BamaFalcon59
01-09-2008, 04:26 PM
Also, I really like the Priest Holmes comparison.

sweetd20
01-09-2008, 04:58 PM
I love when players are called bust or sure things before they ever step fot on a football field. Ray isn't as big as Gore (many thought he was a backup at best) but I doubt he runs a 40 as slow as Frank. Ray has great vision, can cut and get to top speed quickly and that is what makes a running back successful over a career. Will he be a franchise RB who knows wait and see but minus his stature he has the tools.

He will be run down more often than not and have those long runs stopped from being TDs, but he won't be the first. He has to earn the right to be in this category but Emmitt and Barry were constantly brought down on runs after they got past the secondary. Maybe a better RB to compare him to is Curtis Martin. Curtis wasn't a big back and wasn't going to win a lot of races but he got it done. He knew how to read a defense, see the hole or cutback lane, and hit it.

To get back to Barry, he knew he didn't have the elite speed and said so himself. He said he worked his tail off to put up a good time at the combine. After that he went back to his normal speed and found himself being caught from behind. After looking at all the film and figuring how many yards he lost he put in an intense offseason came back and put up a 2000 yard season. Break away speed is a bonus not a must for a NFL RB to have a good career.

Jonny
01-09-2008, 05:08 PM
Size isn't important. It's running style. Slaton, who I always thought as overrated, is not a feature back in the pros. Rice runs like Brandon Jacobs though. He LOVES contact. That might mean he'll have a shorter career, but he's going to make the most of it.

bigbluedefense
01-09-2008, 05:26 PM
i love it. let his stock fall as much as possible.

that way we can draft him in the 3rd round and keep him in Jersey where he belongs.

scottyboy
01-09-2008, 05:52 PM
i love it. let his stock fall as much as possible.

that way we can draft him in the 3rd round and keep him in Jersey where he belongs.

BBD FOR HOF!!!!!!!!

I agree with Adrop(sorry if I got your name wrong or whatevs.) Rice gets stronger and stronger as the game goes on. His stamina is incredible. He keeps going, and going, and going. His vision is crazy good along with his balance and cut backs.

I personally think his size will help him. It did in college; hide behind the big OL until a hole opens up, and when it does, sneak through it and hit it hard

princefielder28
01-09-2008, 06:19 PM
5 years down the road

1. Jonathan Stewart
2. Rashard Mendenhall
3. Darren McFadden

I agree with what etk and Jughead10 have said about Darren McFadden and how he'll translate into the NFL. I think he'll be a wonderful back but Stewart and Mendenhall will be above him when we get down the road.

Thunder&Lightning
01-09-2008, 08:57 PM
hahhaha i was looking for a scottyboy post

GET LOOSE
01-09-2008, 10:25 PM
Ray Rice will be a great pick-up in the 2nd or 3rd round for a team. i think he will have good success in a 2 back system like drew-jones is doing. not cause his stamina but he would be great right along a fast back

Forenci
01-10-2008, 12:00 AM
Eh, I've always been a firm believer that straight line speed isn't nearly important as acceleration and burst are at the next level (NFL in this case). A good example of this is Maurice Jones-Drew. Sure, he has good speed too, but the way he accelerates through openings and gets to the next level of defenders is superb.

I too am not a Slaton fan. I just never really found anything appealing about his play. Speed, which again, overrated to a certain degree, is his primary was of picking up yardage. Not to mention the thing that bothers me most about him is how he generally always gets banged up in the games you need him the most.

I really like Ray Rice. I'm not sure where the original poster got the idea he's a franchise back from. I don't recall many people saying that about him. I do think he'll be successful in the NFL though. I just like his personality, and how he runs using his vision and burst. A really good cut back runner. Reminds me of Tiki Barber in some ways. Rice as some pretty underrated hands and much like Tiki, and he cuts his runs back extremely well.

I see him as the type of player who can be in a 2 back system as well as a guy who could contribute on special teams.

Sniper
01-10-2008, 08:01 AM
Kevin Smith?...James Davis?........Mike Hart??? You have to be kidding. You suck ass at rating backs.

You're really good at accumulating negative rep.

Actually all three of those backs are probably better picks than Rice. Actually the difference between Rice and Hart is splitting hairs, essentially.

Sniper
01-10-2008, 08:03 AM
How is Noel Devine like Reggie Bush??? Noel Devine is a pure running back he not only can make you miss he can run you over and hes only going to get stronger as the seasons go. Reggie Bush is the type of guy you put in space, you run sweeps and tosses and even split him wide. Im not so sure Noel Devine being split out wide would be the best way to use him??? I was trying to refrence that Slaton would have to be used similar to Reggie Bush in the NFL because he is a player who plays better in space and probably would be one of the Top 3 recieving backs in the Draft.

RUN YOU OVER? Are you ******* kidding me? Noel Devine is 5'7, 160 on a good day.

Jughead10
01-10-2008, 08:04 AM
You're really good at accumulating negative rep.

Actually all three of those backs are probably better picks than Rice. Actually the difference between Rice and Hart is splitting hairs, essentially.

I really think Mike Hart is going to be an awful pro. I really can't put my finger exactly on it. Ray just runs with more power and burst.

Sniper
01-10-2008, 08:06 AM
I really think Mike Hart is going to be an awful pro. I really can't put my finger exactly on it. Ray just runs with more power and burst.

Eh Mike will be a good 3rd down back. Even my homerism can't stop me from saying he will be a good pro. But with his ball security and pass protection skills, I think he will always have a spot as a third down back.

Can we merge all of this Ray Rice stuff into one thread? This is the ninth thread about him.

Jughead10
01-10-2008, 08:09 AM
Eh Mike will be a good 3rd down back. Even my homerism can't stop me from saying he will be a good pro. But with his ball security and pass protection skills, I think he will always have a spot as a third down back.

Can we merge all of this Ray Rice stuff into one thread? This is the ninth thread about him.

Fine. We can have one for Ray and one thread for his mom. Anyone else think Ray and his mom should take over the Chunkey Soup ads like McNabb and mama McNabb?

Sniper
01-10-2008, 08:11 AM
Fine. We can have one for Ray and one thread for his mom. Anyone else think Ray and his mom should take over the Chunkey Soup ads like McNabb and mama McNabb?

Oh she's got Momma McNabb potential for sure. She's a feisty midget

etk
01-10-2008, 08:28 AM
RUN YOU OVER? Are you ******* kidding me? Noel Devine is 5'7, 160 on a good day.

Size isn't everything. Devine has the best balance of any back since Barry Sanders. He probably couldn't run over anyone in the NFL other than CBs but he can take a hit and keep running.

kwilk103
01-10-2008, 08:44 AM
yea, watch the highlights from the maryland game

guy grabs his facemask, turns his head and he still keeps goin

plus, he says hes getting up to 190lbs over the summer---talkin about devine