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J-Mike88
09-06-2010, 12:37 AM
I think more of our guys were claimed than any other team. It looks like it.
And 4 teams put a claim in on Kregg Lumpkin.

Most of the cuts I am fine with, but Spencer Havner defies logic and wisdom. I don't think he's regressed from what we saw him do last year, in real games, as a first-year, raw tight end. I could go on all day about that one move in particular, but won't.

And I don't see what the solution has been to our putrid special teams. I hear lip service all the time, but so far we haven't seen it ever on the field.

Again, I judge the product by the on-field work, and the CBs and STs have yet to show competence. I hope I'm wrong about those areas because to go to a Super Bowl, they have to be better.

Sportsfan486
09-06-2010, 12:41 AM
How can he not understand that? There's a reason those players were cut. Good teams don't pick up other teams' garbage.

That's not really how it works out; some players just don't fit a team's scheme or fit in with the chemistry or deal with injuries and don't get a fair shake. We have a glaring need at CB and it's a fact that some of the CBs that got cut are better than our CBs beyond Williams and there were definitely better punt and kick returners cut, so it's definitely hard to understand not going after ANYONE and just saying "nah dude, I know you guys think you saw us dropping punts and stuff but you don't know what you're talking about, we're awesome at special teams." Which, sadly, isn't far off what TT said.

And TT claimed the team didn't even put in a claim, so regardless of the order we didn't even try.

johbur
09-06-2010, 02:36 AM
I'm not sure why Chery didn't make the practice squad. Yeah, he had some problems with the ball, but he also showed as the best returner since Rossum, which incidentally is the last time the Packers had a kickoff return for a TD.

Three UDFA surprising, along with Crabtree and the punter make five undrafted players. Glad to see Crabtree stick as he reportedly is the hardest working TE, but Havner had more versatility and could have been that swing ninth LB.

Lumpkin didn't look like anything more than just another LB, and with Kuhn as the #3 HB as well as his Teams and FB capacity, I like the RB group. Those FBs and TEs should also help on special teams units, particularly when against a team with one FB and two TEs you'd think.

I would have rather kept Toribio over Harrell, but Harrell is the DE and not NY like Toribio. Harrell also looked like just a guy, but I did see him actually make a play in pre-season.

I was also glad to see Breno on the PS and not headed off to the Vikes.

All-in-all, the roster looks pretty solid, though if TT would trade for a real CB it'd look a lot better.

GB12
09-06-2010, 03:00 AM
That's not really how it works out; some players just don't fit a team's scheme or fit in with the chemistry or deal with injuries and don't get a fair shake.
Yes there are a few cases like that, but for the most part it's trash. There's no one that was cut that I was really interested in.
I'm not sure why Chery didn't make the practice squad. Yeah, he had some problems with the ball, but he also showed as the best returner since Rossum, which incidentally is the last time the Packers had a kickoff return for a TD.
No he wasn't. Hell, Will Blackmon was a better returner. Chery had that one good return that went for a touchdown. Other than that he showed nothing. There's no reason to keep him on the practice squad. If he was a good enough returner he would have made the team, but he wasn't and keeping him on the practice squad doesn't do us any good. Once you get to the NFL level it's pretty much you can return or you can't. Jason Chery doesn't have it so he was cut.

Also it wasn't a kickoff return it was a punt return that went for the touchdown, which Will Blackmon has done three times - in the regular season.

BloodBrother
09-06-2010, 03:37 AM
Yup. Remember how bad Derrick Martin was last year when he was brought to the team after training camp? Dude played in the 3-4 in Baltimore but he still had to learn stuff on the fly in GB. It was brutal seeing him blowing assignments vs the Vikes that first matchup, etc. While the CB depth is just meh, those guys have been with the team all camp, and that counts for something. Communication between everybody should be in sync and the amount of blown assignments should be reduced considering that.

jackalope
09-06-2010, 10:47 AM
Runningback James Johnson is the eighth guy signed to Green Bay's practice squad.

http://www.nfl.com/players/jamesjohnson/careerstats?id=JOH321946

TitleTown088
09-06-2010, 11:30 AM
Thompson sees no holes anywhere on roster. Stays put with roster at all positions.

Greg_A_Bedard:
While not surprising, I don't understand how the Packers couldn't find one player worth claiming across the league. Not a one? [via Twitter]

jasonjwilde: That was the most contentious press conference I've ever seen from Ted Thompson. [via Twitter]

Those reporters are just ticked Ted didn't take they crappy questions in the press conference today.

TitleTown088
09-06-2010, 02:21 PM
Apparently Tramon and Greg jennings are going to handle PR duties with Jordy and Jackson on KR

Sportsfan486
09-06-2010, 02:45 PM
Apparently Tramon and Greg jennings are going to handle PR duties with Jordy and Jackson on KR

Fantastic. Two of our most important players returning punts. That sounds like a good idea. Just make freaking Nelson do it. He might never get a long return but he'll never screw it up and if he gets injured, well, who cares? (Note: I'm in no way suggesting Tramon is one of our BEST players, simply that if he were to get injured our already shabby CB group would go to hell.)

TitleTown088
09-06-2010, 02:56 PM
Fantastic. Two of our most important players returning punts. That sounds like a good idea. Just make freaking Nelson do it. He might never get a long return but he'll never screw it up and if he gets injured, well, who cares? (Note: I'm in no way suggesting Tramon is one of our BEST players, simply that if he were to get injured our already shabby CB group would go to hell.)


Shabby CB group?
Shallow? Yes. Shabby? Not at all.

PackerLegend
09-06-2010, 03:30 PM
While I am surprised Havner was cut its not the end of the world. Apparently the coaches like the potential in Crabtree and Quarless more which I can see. Lee's a better blocker and used to be able to catch but he wont need to much anyways. Sure he was versatile and could play LB in a pinch but really thats why we have backups who spend all day playing there. If we needed Havner to play LB because we were that thin... were in trouble. I actually dont hate Nelson at KR he isnt spectacular but he does a pretty good job I thought. Tramon is a good PR but its scary because we really cant afford to lose him. I really wish we would have added CB depth along time ago and adding some now wouldn't do much because they have alot of learning to do.

Sportsfan486
09-06-2010, 03:32 PM
Shabby CB group?
Shallow? Yes. Shabby? Not at all.

Sorry, I was referring to the CBs after Tramon being shabby (as in if he were to get injured returning punts, one of those shabby backup CBs would become a starter/nickel.) I just worded it oddly. Hah.

And I like Shields but he's just too raw at this point.

Sportsfan486
09-06-2010, 06:35 PM
On a different note, has anyone else been really pleased with Flynn this offseason? I feel like if Rodgers went down there'd be a possibility of us just barely making the playoffs with Flynn at the helm, which is very different than what I thought the last two years.

Mr.Regular
09-06-2010, 06:43 PM
Im surprised we let go of Havner, but I suppose it makes sense.
Fins the obvious starter. If he goes down, the only other player Id be comfortable filling in as a permanent starter is Lee. Quarless showed a lot, he had to make the team.
So it came down to Havner or Crabtree. Crabtree probably wouldn't have been able to sneak onto the PS, and his blocking has been superb. Could develop into a great compliment with Finley/Quarless. Thatd be a sick future trio of TE's. Havner isn't really a long term guy.
We keep Havner, he'd probably stick around another season or two on the bottom of the depth chart, and after Lee leaves, we'd be left with no primary blocking TE, and have to burn another draft pick possibly. Crabtree could be that guy.

J-Mike88
09-06-2010, 08:43 PM
Don't forget:

In two games against Minnesota, one against Pittsburgh and the playoff loss to Arizona, quarterbacks Brett Favre, Ben Roethlisberger and Kurt Warner combined to throw 15 touchdown passes and 0 interceptions.

They completed 99 of 138 passes (71.7%) for 1,397 yards and combined for an average passer rating of 140.3. I think that's 349 yards per game.

Mileage like that is not a fluke.
Can Capers fix it, does he have enough cover ability on the roster to solve it?
The answer to this remains to be seen....

I was selling Sam Shields 3-4 weeks ago. Some of you weren't buying. Can we all buy him now as our nickelback for the first 6 weeks?
God I hope so....A big pass rush can make them all look good back there.

BloodBrother
09-07-2010, 01:29 AM
Count me as one who did NOT like the news of Tramon and Jennings possibly returning punts. Just what we need, 2 important players on the team fielding punts and being sitting ducks for a 3rd string LBer to take him out. Tramon would be good as a returner, but they can't afford to place him back there. The secondary is thin, and there is no telling how effective Harris will be when he returns

I really hope that doesn't end up being the case

J-Mike88
09-07-2010, 09:07 AM
Count me as one who did NOT like the news of Tramon and Jennings possibly returning punts. Just what we need, 2 important players on the team fielding punts and being sitting ducks for a 3rd string LBer to take him out. Tramon would be good as a returner, but they can't afford to place him back there. The secondary is thin, and there is no telling how effective Harris will be when he returns

I really hope that doesn't end up being the case
Count me in there too. I don't like it. I remember being so worried for Woodson when he returned punts. That's a wickedly dangerous job, as Will Blackmon will remind us of.

Look, even Devin Hester was taken off the return unit when they decided to make him into a WR, which was good news for us. He's lethal as a PR/KR, not so much so as a WR. But that decision alone tells you how dangerous they view the PR & KR position with regards to health.

I want a Dante Hall or Desmond Howard back there: a guy good at returning period. If we can carry just a long snapper who does nothing else, why not a KR/PR specialist? Do we really need 7 TE's & FB's?

J-Mike88
09-07-2010, 10:32 AM
CBS Sports' Pat Kirwin's look at the NFC North 2010
ePqISfZ7w0U

J-Mike88
09-07-2010, 12:15 PM
http://packersinsider.com/2010/09/packers-bring-in-pro-bowl-kr-clifton-smith/

Packers solidify Return game?
Pro Bowler added?

Here are some reactions from Bucs nation on their move to release Smith on Sunday:


Hate to see Peanut go. Yes they have other returners, but they aren't as good. (unless Peanut is too injured) I actually prefer the returner be just a returner. Focusing too much time on another position usually dampens their return skills.

Look at Devin Hester. Was the best/ most dynamic return man in the game. Now he is just a very mediocre receiver and returner. 11 kick returns for touchdowns in 2006/07 and zero the last two years.

his is a MISTAKE! Where is the stinkin' loyalty to any player on this team? You don't cut a Pro Bowl caliber guy just because he had a slow start in preseason. Yet another big foul up from a too young and inexperienced "Jr. GM". From the stupid re-signing last year of Clayton when other teams wanted him in free agency to the unceremonious dismissal of one of the greatest LB's to ever play the game in Derrick Brooks. Now we lose a fan favorite, special teams depth and a PROVEN dynamic punt/kick return in "Peanut"!
There had to be some sort of trade option in there somewhere for a former Pro Bowl Returner.
I wish the Bucs could have retained Smith. I still tink Preston Parker could've easily been snuck onto the practice squad and I'm sure Smith is far more explosive as a return man.
They risked this possibility when they subjected Smith, the smallest player on the team, to running up the middle behind a confused screen-door OLine last year. Looks like the Bucs have decided to shun ValRita's advice and supplement their roster with "cast-offs" from other teams. Umm... our Kregg Lumpkin is one guy they signed.

BloodBrother
09-07-2010, 12:49 PM
hopefully he sticks, and does well. Get Tramon/Jennings names out of the conversation for returns, period

Sportsfan486
09-07-2010, 01:34 PM
hopefully he sticks, and does well. Get Tramon/Jennings names out of the conversation for returns, period

Wait, we actually brought in a player to fill a void? ....Holy ****.

Also, that NFC North preview was one of the dumbest things I've ever watched. They said we had the same tackles as when we played the Vikings last year or that we might have a rookie starting. Huh???

jackalope
09-07-2010, 04:38 PM
I like the move, but hopefully it doesn't cost us a fullback (Quinn). McDonald is probably the most expendable guy on the roster right now.

BloodBrother
09-07-2010, 06:01 PM
It isn't a done deal. He was worked out by the Packers today, and apparently had a visit with the Dolphins to. Packers also worked out Jags former S Gerald Alexander, who was actually a starter for them last year

http://blogs.greenbaypressgazette.com/blogs/gpg/insider/2010/09/07/packers-work-out-two-players-today/

Smith is a real good returner, his only issue is injuries, however. Anyway, with the latest tweets he has made, it seems like he may be heading to Miami

https://twitter.com/CliftonSmith22

TitleTown088
09-07-2010, 06:08 PM
No deal was made, he is visiting Miami as well I think.

BloodBrother
09-07-2010, 06:20 PM
GB Press-Gazette writer Rob Demovsky says he doesn't expect the Pack to sign Smith. Guess Smith suffered 2 concussions last season(2nd one ending his season) and that is what has scared them off

J-Mike88
09-07-2010, 06:34 PM
The Packers wanted him, that's why they set up a visit. But Miami wanted him too, and $ became an issue. And so is the climate.

# CliftonSmith22

Is always love first money second.. But when you are out in the cold with a family because of that state of mind some things gave to change! 10 minutes ago via Echofon

* Reply
* Retweet

# Clifton Smith Jr. CliftonSmith22

Let me clear something up GB never offered me anything but a workout and I do play for money the money never takes away how much I love this

PackerLegend
09-07-2010, 07:59 PM
Everyone should know by now that Ted is just a big tease.

BloodBrother
09-07-2010, 10:52 PM
Packers never offered him a contract. Guess the concussions were a main concern for them. Damn, am not happy about Tramon as the PR, but it looks like that is going to be the case now

J-Mike88
09-08-2010, 08:18 AM
Packers never offered him a contract. Guess the concussions were a main concern for them. Damn, am not happy about Tramon as the PR, but it looks like that is going to be the case nowI read somewhere last night that the Vikings are gonna use Bernard Berrian as their PR.
That's more risky, with them only having 4 WRs on their roster, with Sidney Rice out for at least half the year.

Still, I'm disappointed that TT wasn't able to sign Clifton Smith. Sometimes he butchers things like this. But sometimes, the player has no intention of playing in Green Bay and instead tried to leverage himself using us, and ends up going to a better destination in terms of city/location.

umphrey
09-08-2010, 04:08 PM
In the last year or so a lot of players have liked Green Bay, want to come hear, and don't want to leave, so it seems. Especially hard workers, football players not party guys, players who want a ring. When a guy chooses somewhere like New York or whatever over GB I always remember that...it makes me question a little bit about their attitude towards football.

With Aaron Rodgers any offensive player is going to want to come here because they know receivers will get catches, backs won't ever see stacked boxes, and lineman will get noticed blocking for a top QB. If they just care about money maybe they'd be smart and take a small pay cut to play here instead of Oakland for example, knowing they can put up double the numbers and get a much bigger contract later.

umphrey
09-08-2010, 04:13 PM
I love how people are sleeping on our OL so much this year. Entering last year we had 4 starters and the backups were garbage. Barbre was a joke. This year we have 8 starters. We could start any combination of these guys and our line would be better than the start of last year:

LT: Clifton, Bulaga, Lang
LG: Colledge, Bulaga, Lang, Spitz
C: Wells, Spitz
RG: Sitton, Lang, Spitz
RT: Tauscher, Lang

Although I assume Lang probably isn't working on 4 line positions. I don't really know what their plans are for him but he proved he can start a couple spots, including LT, the toughest.

One of the best in the league - from top to bottom. Starters, wouldn't be in the top 10. Very good group of pass blockers though. Unfortunately probably bottom third in run blocking.

jackalope
09-08-2010, 05:18 PM
In the last year or so a lot of players have liked Green Bay, want to come hear, and don't want to leave, so it seems. Especially hard workers, football players not party guys, players who want a ring. When a guy chooses somewhere like New York or whatever over GB I always remember that...it makes me question a little bit about their attitude towards football.

With Aaron Rodgers any offensive player is going to want to come here because they know receivers will get catches, backs won't ever see stacked boxes, and lineman will get noticed blocking for a top QB. If they just care about money maybe they'd be smart and take a small pay cut to play here instead of Oakland for example, knowing they can put up double the numbers and get a much bigger contract later.

To give the guy the benefit of the doubt, if was living in Tampa and had the choice of going to Miami or Green Bay, I would probably go with Miami.

I do think Green Bay appeals to a certain type of player. There are also a lot of guys who get drafted, are probably apprehensive, and end up wanting to spend the rest of their career in Green Bay. That's another one of the reasons that a commitment to building through the draft is our best bet.

TitleTown088
09-09-2010, 12:17 PM
Woodson extended.

tjsunstein
09-09-2010, 12:26 PM
Woodson extended.
Much needed since we suck at drafted CB lately.

senormysterioso
09-09-2010, 12:32 PM
that's awesome, hopefully this keeps him in GB the rest of his career.

BloodBrother
09-09-2010, 01:04 PM
2 yr extension, reports Schefter. Nothing on the amount yet, though

sounds good though, he's definitely earned it

umphrey
09-09-2010, 04:18 PM
To give the guy the benefit of the doubt, if was living in Tampa and had the choice of going to Miami or Green Bay, I would probably go with Miami.

I do think Green Bay appeals to a certain type of player. There are also a lot of guys who get drafted, are probably apprehensive, and end up wanting to spend the rest of their career in Green Bay. That's another one of the reasons that a commitment to building through the draft is our best bet.

Yeah I agree there are lots of factors that play into a decision. It's just that right now, Green Bay is such a great place to play if you love football, want to win, be surrounded by great people, etc. In my mind, it brings up the possibility that in some cases players we chased after that chose somewhere more cushy or glamorous may not have the focus on football, or maybe less mature than what we look for in a player.

Guys like Antonio Cromartie who have something like 8 kids with 6 women won't want to come here - good. Guys like Jermichael Finley who was a young father but has grown into a devoted family man who strives to be the best there is, they will have GB on the top of their list - excellent.

J-Mike88
09-09-2010, 11:29 PM
Thanks Saints!

Nice defense by both teams tonight.
Favre misses Sidney Rice so bad. I love it.

BTW, if we block Jared Allen as well as the Saints do, I like our chances of scoring a lot more than 14 points on the Vikes.

cuzifelt1ikeit
09-10-2010, 12:58 AM
Yeah I agree there are lots of factors that play into a decision. It's just that right now, Green Bay is such a great place to play if you love football, want to win, be surrounded by great people, etc. In my mind, it brings up the possibility that in some cases players we chased after that chose somewhere more cushy or glamorous may not have the focus on football, or maybe less mature than what we look for in a player.

Guys like Antonio Cromartie who have something like 8 kids with 6 women won't want to come here - good. Guys like Jermichael Finley who was a young father but has grown into a devoted family man who strives to be the best there is, they will have GB on the top of their list - excellent.

if anything cromartie needs to be in a town like green bay to stop him from having kids. besides green bay is kind of in a central location. he might be closer to his kids then he is in san diego and new york. if he can remember where they live that is

J-Mike88
09-10-2010, 01:10 PM
Cromartie is a guy that can cover, there's no question about that.
But he can't tackle me, and he's an embarrassment of a person. I wanted him to help our guys cover, but don't mind not having to cheer for a lowlife like him.

Nice role model he is.

umphrey
09-10-2010, 04:22 PM
Interesting hypothetical:

What if Justin Harrell absolutely beasts it this season? Plays every bit as good as a #16 pick, plays a lot of snaps and is healthy the entire year. Do we sign him, and for how much? We wouldn't want to let him go, but how could we ink another contract for a decent amount with his injury history?

J-Mike88
09-10-2010, 04:43 PM
Interesting hypothetical:

What if Justin Harrell absolutely beasts it this season? Plays every bit as good as a #16 pick, plays a lot of snaps and is healthy the entire year. Do we sign him, and for how much? We wouldn't want to let him go, but how could we ink another contract for a decent amount with his injury history?
Is his contract up after this season, or is there one more year?

And how beastly?
Ever heard of "buy low, sell high"?

If he validates that #16 pick, I'd definitely take anyone's 1st round pick in the next draft for him. Cash him in!

PackerLegend
09-10-2010, 07:15 PM
Everyone always hates on Green Bay (City). Woodson didn't want to come here either, thank god he did... but anyways guys should just talk to him. He hated the idea of coming here but now couldn't be happier.

cuzifelt1ikeit
09-11-2010, 01:48 AM
Cromartie is a guy that can cover, there's no question about that.
But he can't tackle me, and he's an embarrassment of a person. I wanted him to help our guys cover, but don't mind not having to cheer for a lowlife like him.

Nice role model he is.

tell us how you really feel. i dont know how he gets considered a lowlife, hes comparable to someone who idolizes jeffery dahmer? can he not tackle? sure he cant. if hes the one making the tackle on the running back something just isnt right to me anyway. probably saw brandon jacobs reel vs woodson and got the chills.

tjsunstein
09-11-2010, 02:18 AM
So hyped for this game on Sunday. Watching it with a bunch of Eagles' fans wearing my white Aaron Rodgers jersey of course.

How many hours?!

J-Mike88
09-11-2010, 08:32 AM
So hyped for this game on Sunday. Watching it with a bunch of Eagles' fans wearing my white Aaron Rodgers jersey of course.

How many hours?!
WOW! the Mountaineers.....

What are your thoughts on Pat White as a return man? Kicks and/or punts.

I know he initially resisted attempts to move him away from QB. But now he should be desperate to stay in the NFL.

I don't want Jennings returning punts. And I don't want Jordy returning kicks.

White seems to have the ability to be a great guy there, if his mind can accept and embrace the idea. That guy was electric with the ball in his hands like Slaton was, and like Josh Cribbs was in college.

princefielder28
09-12-2010, 11:36 AM
The Packers "My Wish" is on ESPN right now

BloodBrother
09-12-2010, 07:24 PM
Interesting hypothetical:

What if Justin Harrell absolutely beasts it this season? Plays every bit as good as a #16 pick, plays a lot of snaps and is healthy the entire year. Do we sign him, and for how much? We wouldn't want to let him go, but how could we ink another contract for a decent amount with his injury history?



And just like that, he probably tore his ACL(at least he thinks so)

RobDemovsky: #Packers DE Justin Harrell thinks he tore his ACL. Will get an MRI tomorrow to be sure.

BloodBrother
09-12-2010, 07:38 PM
Damn, Jenkins has a broken hand, and will be wearing a club on it all season. Hope that doesn't affect his tackling too much. Sucks to hear, anyway

Harrell, as expected, has a significant knee injury

Grant has ankle sprain

that was the injury report from McCarthy after the game

BloodBrother
09-12-2010, 09:32 PM
Update: Jenkins said he has multiple fractures in his hand. Damn, man. He still looked good out there when he came back but it still sucks to know that he'll be in a cast/club for a good portion of the season

Sportsfan486
09-12-2010, 09:46 PM
Update: Jenkins said he has multiple fractures in his hand. Damn, man. He still looked good out there when he came back but it still sucks to know that he'll be in a cast/club for a good portion of the season

Yikes.

Fortunately, I really don't think it'll affect his play. It's basically a legal weapon and there have been cases of defensive players having really good seasons with the cast, especially when they don't have to worry about trying to catch balls. Just think about the difference between trying to grab a RBs leg versus hitting it with a hard cast, it's actual rather effective (get your brother to put on 5 or six pairs of socks and whack him in the ankle with a padded weight-bar to get a good idea. :p ) Or if an OLman grabs him and he can whack them with his cast; **** hurts. And I'm sure they'll slap on the hardest cast that's legal.

Also, I was really excited about Raji's play today. He looked good out there. AND ZOMBO GOT A SACK (although they scored the next play which was very sad.)

Tramon looked really good in coverage. Shields has potential, he just watches the QB too much and gets busted by pivots/fakes.

Burnett missed some tackles which was disappointing and Brad Jones was no where to be seen.

I also hate that we're putting our weak CB depth to the test with Tramon back returning punts but he really is a good returner. I wouldn't be shocked if he took one or two to the house this year. Nelson is very solid as a kick returner. And Crosby was back to rookie form.

Definitely some positives from this game. Considering we played a poor game overall and it wasn't really close from our first field goal until 3:00 left in the game, that's not bad, and without Vick it never would have gotten that close.

I want to say next week is a gimme but we did lose to freaking Tampa Bay last year (who, granted, was better than the Bills are this year but still horrible.)

umphrey
09-12-2010, 10:13 PM
Cast is definitely a bummer for Jenkins. Can't use that hand to shed blockers or push them around, and can't use his hands to grab the QBs jersey or legs or whatever which is how the big guys get sacks most of the time.

I was still glad to hear it was a hand injury though and not the calf injury he's had. As long as his torso and legs are healthy he'll be moving around at 100% and it's not a nagging injury, it's just there and he'll learn to play with it.

umphrey
09-12-2010, 10:37 PM
Interesting that Clay Matthews said he didn't feel physically football ready and could have played better. I think he's referring to coming out of the game a few times because he was gassed.

Interesting that Aaron Rodgers said that this was the worst game he's ever played.

TitleTown088
09-12-2010, 10:41 PM
Well it is kind of hard to be in football shape when you have to sit out nearly a month.

roughrider30
09-12-2010, 10:43 PM
Definitely a frustrating game, but that was kind of what I expected coming into the game. It does seem as though our D-Line and CB depth might become a factor if we have any more injuries. There were still definitely some pluses from the game though.

-They out played phily for 3 of the 4 quarters of the game. (Lets hope they can start winning all 4 quarters in future games). I thought the D showed a lot holding up late despite being worn out from chasing Vick all over the field with little depth. It seemed like they were able to collapse the pocket quite a bit, but just couldn't quite reach Vick like they could with Kolb.

- I loved the play were Raji broke right through the line for the sack. He looked like a beast on a few plays, which is something we will need with Jolly out and Jenkins already a little banged up. Matthews was obviously a force out there today, but Jones is really gonna have to show he can get some pressure too. I loved the fact they are bringing Matthews in from different spots of the field. It seemed like he was very effective when he lined up in the middle.

-Tramon looked very solid today. This is going to be crucial all season, even with Harris back. I thought Shields looked very lost out there at times. It's definitely expected out of him, but this could be a problem if teams start targeting him which they probably will.

All in all I thought it was a solid, ugly game. They found a way to pull out a tough win on the road in the first game of the season. There's gonna be a few mistakes made on the first game, and in the end we are 1-0.

I really hope they don't overlook the Bills, although I don't think they will put up much of a fight. Just hoping for a solid game with no injuries.

johbur
09-12-2010, 10:58 PM
Ugly win, with the injuries. Grant, Jenkins, Collins. Harrell = WTF were they thinking keeping him over Toribio or Havner? Harrell is a bum and is the Mr. Glass of the NFL.

Loved seeing Matthews show that he just doesn't need training camp. If he stays healthy, he has eventual DPOY written all over him. Shedding those two blockers and sticking Vick with the arm tackle on 4-1 to end the game even better than the sacks. He needs to know when to take it easy on a QB having a bad day like Kolb, as knocking him out game the Iggles a chance...

Great FB day. Loved how the Dallas game ended. TD! Nope, holding. Game over. Bliss.

J-Mike88
09-13-2010, 08:20 AM
I've been all over Harrell since his name was annouced as our pick at that podium.

But I'm very sad to see the big fella's season end like this so soon. He had finally been able to show some flashes of why GM Ted took him, and was going to be a force helping collapse the pocket. We need some depth on the DL doing that.

No more of this sight:
http://prod.static.packers.clubs.nfl.com/assets/images/imported/GB/photos/clubimages/2010/09-September/ap100912076005--nfl_medium_540_360.jpg

J-Mike88
09-13-2010, 08:22 AM
Great FB day. Loved how the Dallas game ended. TD! Nope, holding. Game over. Bliss.
AMEN!!
And don't forget how the first half ended with the stupidest play I have seen in the NFL in years!
And I live in Dallas, what a day today will be listening to the 3 sportstalk radio stations all day long for me.

PackerLegend
09-13-2010, 09:43 AM
Guys still hating on Jordyzzz at KR? I know he didnt break one all the way but he sure seems to find a way to get around the 35 atleast most times. I know it was 1 week but ive seem him return in the past and always thought he did a pretty good job. Not spectacular but idk i like him.

umphrey
09-13-2010, 11:59 AM
I was getting depressed thinking about Harrell during my morning shower. He finally plays knowing it's his last chance and his back is holding up, he's probably feeling good, then he tears his ACL. He just had a kid as well. For him this means instead of making a modestly good salary and getting on the field regularly as long as you are healthy and work hard, now he has another 12 months of rehab, has to move, has to find someone willing to pay him the league minimum, play his ass off and stay healthy just to make the roster, and get really lucky to ever get a decent payday.

TitleTown088
09-13-2010, 12:54 PM
Man, that game was tough in terms of injuries.

Good thing the Packers play vs Buffalo this week.

BloodBrother
09-13-2010, 01:19 PM
That week 10 bye is looking like it will take ages to get here. Sucks to see the Pack suffer 3 big injuries in game 1 of the season. Jenkins will continue to play, but 2 hands are better than one, and who knows how long that cast will be on. Broke multiple bones in that hand. Harrell is out for the year again, and that hurts the Dline depth. And now, Grant's ankle injury is starting to worry me, especially when McCarthy is quoted as saying today that it was a "significant ankle injury" and that more tests will be needed. It sounds like he'll be out not just this week, but for multiple weeks

I hope that this is the last game they have any big injuries. Anything else from here on out need to be standard nicks/bruises and nothing more severe! *crosses fingers*

Sportsfan486
09-13-2010, 01:32 PM
For him this means instead of making a modestly good salary .

I lol'd at this. I would take a ******* hacksaw to my ACL if it meant I got the "modest" salary he was getting. Just sayin. :)

PackerLegend
09-13-2010, 01:41 PM
Harrell isnt really that big of a deal. I loved have loved to finally see the guy do his thing but its pretty tough when your made of glass. We have survived without him for what 3 seasons already so its whatever. Did we place someone on the practice squad to take his place? Club or no club atleast Jenkins can still play, we desperately need him. Hopefully Grant can get back soon. He just gashed the Eagles for 3 pretty good runs finally gets going and has an unfortunate injury.

The Eagles didnt fare much better. Their starting C, FB are out for the season and they got 2 concussions along with some other nicked up players.

PackerLegend
09-13-2010, 01:44 PM
I lol'd at this. I would take a ******* hacksaw to my ACL if it meant I got the "modest" salary he was getting. Just sayin. :)

Not only that but the guy didnt have to work for any of it. He just kept on getting a check for doing nothing. My apologies he kept the bench warm.

BloodBrother
09-13-2010, 01:46 PM
Oh, I'm not worried too much about Jenkins effectiveness. At least he can still PLAY...but I hope that he can get that cast off at some point this year. Harrell, we can survive without him, but he did help the team. Kept the starters fresh, and actually lookd pretty decent out there. They'll need to add another Dlineman(who probably won't be as good as Harrell) for more depth

I'm moreso worried about Grant's injury. I think it's being classified as a Grade II ankle sprain, but that isn't confirmed. They can survive without him for the next few weeks, but I hope this isn't something that lingers or keeps him out for too long. They'll need him, especially during that middle portion of the schedule when they face the Vikes, Cowboys, Jets, etc

BloodBrother
09-13-2010, 01:53 PM
Well, the Dline depth is back to 6, as the Packers are apparently bringing Jarius Wynn back.

Mr.Regular
09-13-2010, 01:55 PM
Team didn't play that well overall, Rodgers was off, and we had a bunch of injuries.
Good news is we got the win, and it's only week 1. If there was a 'good' week to get hit with the injury bug it was now. We've got an easy game ahead of us, and a fairly easy stretch after that, and lot's of time before it's really crunch time.

PS I've been hard on JordyzzZz1 at KR for a while now. I was wrong. He looked very good...much more elusive and agile than Im used to seeing. Glad to be (looking) wrong on that one.

GB12
09-13-2010, 02:32 PM
Grant is out for next week. Still unsure past that.

Sportsfan486
09-13-2010, 03:20 PM
Grant is out for next week. Still unsure past that.

It sounded like McCarthy was more concerned than Grant. Grant basically said "I slapped some ice on it and it was okay but they figured we should slap on a boot just to be safe."

So it doesn't really sound like a huge deal. Probably a moderate sprain; if it was a severe sprain he wouldn't sound so nonchalant about it.

And that's good, I like Wynn much more than Harrell anyway so an improvement, imo.

TitleTown088
09-13-2010, 03:58 PM
Well, the Dline depth is back to 6, as the Packers are apparently bringing Jarius Wynn back.

Can't complain about that. Rather obvious move to make.

umphrey
09-13-2010, 04:59 PM
PS I've been hard on JordyzzZz1 at KR for a while now. I was wrong. He looked very good...much more elusive and agile than Im used to seeing. Glad to be (looking) wrong on that one.

I think we just saw an example of how important blocking is on a return.

The injuries suck, but there is a bright side. No one is gone for the season, except Harrell, but everyone saw that coming anyway, he was 5th out of 6 anyway. Grant sounds like 4 weeks to me. Not a big deal IMO because Brandon Jackson was running well and we can get him some playing time while our schedule is easy, get Grant back when the Vikings, Cowboys, etc come up. Worst thing about it is 1 RB on the roster right now. Cullen Jenkins, should be still playing at 80%-90% which is a plus on the roster, and he could be closer to 95%-98% come playoffs.

If you were prepared for Harrell to get hurt like me, we didn't take much of a hit. Since Harrell wasn't going to make it 16 games anyways we can move forward right now instead of later. Then, it's just a question of how we fill a roster spot at RB.

J-Mike88
09-13-2010, 05:12 PM
That Grant injury is worse than McCarthy is leading on.
I'll bet anyone Grant misses closer to 6 gamess than just 1 game.

On that note:
Here is what I could find for RB's on practice squads currently. Anyone here that you guys like?

Ian's Johnson - Arizona
Dimitri Nance - Atlanta
Curtis Steele - Baltimore
Joique Bell - Buffalo
Josh Vaughan - Carolina
Andre Anderson - Cleveland
Lonyae Miller - Dallas
Bruce Hall - Denver
Chris Ogbonnaya - Houston
Javarris James - New England
Brandon Minor - New Orleans
Charles Scott - NY Giants
Chauncey Washington - NY Jets
Martell Mallett - Philadelphia
Chris Henry - Seattle
Herb Donaldson - Tennessee
Ryan Torain - Washington

Also, some say Buffalo would be open to trading Marshawn Lynch. But is Marshawn more than we want to bite off at this time? Remember how many people wanted him so badly in the 2007 draft when they took him before us and left us with Harrell instead, so then TT got the unheard of Ryan Grant?
Lotta ironies there.

DeAngelo Williams has one year left on his contract. I wonder if Carolina would deal him. They like Mike Goodson, and I thought they also had Tyrell Sutton.

BloodBrother
09-13-2010, 05:25 PM
It's being called a Grade II sprain, which takes usually 4-6 weeks. I think he misses the rest of this month tbh. THey can afford that though, with the teams they got coming up on their schedule

senormysterioso
09-13-2010, 05:27 PM
Also, some say Buffalo would be open to trading Marshawn Lynch. But is Marshawn more than we want to bite off at this time? Remember how many people wanted him so badly in the 2007 draft when they took him before us and left us with Harrell instead, so then TT got the unheard of Ryan Grant?
Lotta ironies there.

DeAngelo Williams has one year left on his contract. I wonder if Carolina would deal him. They like Mike Goodson, and I thought they also had Tyrell Sutton.

I love Williams...he's a great player. I doubt the Panthers would even entertain offers. Apparently, a hand full of teams tried to get Sutton from them but they weren't interested.

Sportsfan486
09-13-2010, 05:31 PM
That Grant injury is worse than McCarthy is leading on.
I'll bet anyone Grant misses closer to 6 gamess than just 1 game.

On that note:
Here is what I could find for RB's on practice squads currently. Anyone here that you guys like?

Ian's Johnson - Arizona
Dimitri Nance - Atlanta
Curtis Steele - Baltimore
Joique Bell - Buffalo
Josh Vaughan - Carolina
Andre Anderson - Cleveland
Lonyae Miller - Dallas
Bruce Hall - Denver
Chris Ogbonnaya - Houston
Javarris James - New England
Brandon Minor - New Orleans
Charles Scott - NY Giants
Chauncey Washington - NY Jets
Martell Mallett - Philadelphia
Chris Henry - Seattle
Herb Donaldson - Tennessee
Ryan Torain - Washington

Also, some say Buffalo would be open to trading Marshawn Lynch. But is Marshawn more than we want to bite off at this time? Remember how many people wanted him so badly in the 2007 draft when they took him before us and left us with Harrell instead, so then TT got the unheard of Ryan Grant?
Lotta ironies there.

DeAngelo Williams has one year left on his contract. I wonder if Carolina would deal him. They like Mike Goodson, and I thought they also had Tyrell Sutton.

Torain was playing really well and a surprise not to make the active roster. It'd be nice to go for him.
Kuhn really can act as a HB for us, so I'm not terribly concerned about the depth; I don't share the same hope for Jackson as some on here, though, I think he's slow and unimpressive.

jackalope
09-13-2010, 06:10 PM
We have a runningback on our practice squad, so I would expect us to bring him up before someone else.

J-Mike88
09-13-2010, 06:57 PM
Coach Trgovac said that he would support the star-crossed Justin Harrell fully in an attempt to come back from a second season on injured reserve. Harrell has had two back surgeries and played in just 14 games since being drafted in the first round in 2007.

"I really mentally want to work hard with this kid," Trgovac said. "He's been through a lot. If he was just taking the money and running that would be one thing. But he's totally the opposite of that. I'm going to stay positive with him. He can be a really good football player."

umphrey
09-13-2010, 08:06 PM
We almost have to add a running back. Lord help us if we have to put Kuhn back there. It's pretty easy to find just a guy to throw in the backfield. Look at all the decent looking RBs we cut over the years. I don't know who gets cut though. That's what I'm most worried about - who do we lose? Hopefully stick CJ Wilson or Nick McDonald on the PS for a few weeks and hope no one claims him. I don't think either are active anyway. Don't let Quinn Johnson or Tom Crabtree go to another team though please.

Another thought is maybe we can trade Jarrett Bush or Donald Lee or some vet for an on-the-bubble last string RB on another team

BloodBrother
09-13-2010, 09:03 PM
Actually, if they go to add a RB, just cut one of the DB's. They are going to have to get rid of one anyway when Harris comes back, so why not just do it now and put a RB on the squad

GB12
09-14-2010, 12:54 AM
Cut Nick McDonald. He is most definitely the 53rd man on the roster and shouldn't even be that.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 02:44 AM
http://media.jsonline.com/images/ryan91310.jpg

Daaaaamn. He will miss a few games, but from that pic, it looks like Grant and the Packers definitely dodged a bullet. Quite lucky he didn't fracture anything

tjsunstein
09-14-2010, 12:36 PM
Still, Matthews left the game annoyed at himself about an interception he dropped.
"Trust me, that won't happen again," Matthews said after Sunday's game. "I'd give up a few sacks for that."

"Vick's an exceptional athlete," Matthews said. "He was moving around out there, making plays. I've been saying, the real story is, who's going to start for Philly next week?"


Gotta love his work ethic and confidence. Poking a little fun at the Eagles, too. He's the one that concussed Kolb.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 12:51 PM
http://media.jsonline.com/images/ryan91310.jpg

Daaaaamn. He will miss a few games, but from that pic, it looks like Grant and the Packers definitely dodged a bullet. Quite lucky he didn't fracture anything


Sigh, guess the Packers didn't dodge a bullet. Glazer is reporting that Grant is done for the year.

this is reaaaaaally bad

tjsunstein
09-14-2010, 12:55 PM
This isn't good at all.


Though he's been a picture of health until this week, Grant's Green Bay career is now at a crossroads. Turning 28 in December, Grant has escalators in his contract that the Packers likely won't want to pay in 2011. He'll have to restructure to stay on

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 12:57 PM
Reports that he has a torn ligament that holds 2 bones in the ankle and would need surgery to repair, which is season ending.

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 01:30 PM
Wow. If I was to rank players we could least afford to lose it'd go something like
1. Rodgers
2. Woodson
3. Grant
****. ******* **** ******* ****.

This is bad. TT needs to make a trade for someone. Too many platoons for someone not to be on the block. Dallas and Buffalo both have 3 backs that are probably better than Jackson; someone has to be for sale.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 01:40 PM
RT @RobDemovsky: Two sources have told me the #Packers plan to sign RB Dimitri Nance, a rookie who has been on the #Falcons practice squad.



Please don't tell me this is their answer? Sign this guy for depth as they make Jackson the full-time starter. Jackson is fine for these next few games, but I don't think he can be trusted as a feature back for a full season. I really hope this isn't the route they go, but knowing how Thompson operates, I think this is actually what we are about to see

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 01:41 PM
Please don't tell me this is their answer? Sign this guy for depth as they make Jackson the full-time starter. Jackson is fine for these next few games, but I don't think he can be trusted as a feature back for a full season. I really hope this isn't the route they go, but knowing how Thompson operates, I think this is actually what we are about to see

I will bet you the keys to my 2009 Mustang and my condo that's exactly what TT has in mind.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 01:45 PM
We'll find out in a few weeks. I think they are FINE the rest of the month, maybe audition to see how Jackson does. If he isn't exactly cutting it, I would hope they make a play for a Lynch/Jackson or Choice or somebody else on a team who is deep at RB

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 01:48 PM
We'll find out in a few weeks. I think they are FINE the rest of the month, maybe audition to see how Jackson does. If he isn't exactly cutting it, I would hope they make a play for a Lynch/Jackson or Choice or somebody else on a team who is deep at RB

Do you think Choice would be an improvement? I'm kind of on the fence with that. Lynch or Jackson definitely would be, though, and you have to think the Bills would part with one for a draft pick since they just got Spiller and need all the picks they can get to rebuild. Jackson would be amazing (he could even be a better fit than Grant) but I'd be cool with Lynch, too.

Mr.Regular
09-14-2010, 01:48 PM
Panic mode yet?
Come on TT pull some magic out of your ass, we need a RB bad. You've done it before.

GB12
09-14-2010, 02:10 PM
God damn ************ son of a ******* *****. Damn that sucks.

PackerLegend
09-14-2010, 02:39 PM
Well you heard McCarthy before saying he trusts Jackson could be a feature back if needed. I think we have all learned by now TT is not going to bring in who you think. Remember Grant was an UDFA who hadnt even played a regular season game for the Giants when we got him. Look how that turned out. I think we need to give him a chance before we panic we have had decent luck finding RBs. Plus it starts at the o-line.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 02:59 PM
Not panic mode. Packers have a favorable schedule for the next few weeks. I think they give Jackson another shot here, and if he isn't impressing/doing well, I can see them making a play for one of the BUF RB's or one from somebody else

Pisses me off that Starks has been out this entire time...dude would have been the PERFECT replacement. Hopefully he is able to return when he is eligible...but even if so, he won't be ready. He missed all of training camp. Talk about a prime opportunity for him and it went down the drain

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 03:26 PM
Ryan Grant speaks via twitter:

Guess everyone has heard the news..frustrating, disappointing, all the normal emotions..there was a chance with surgery that I come back this season, but I would miss too many weeks and put the team in a bind roster wise. It was more severe than initially thought during game..but I just have to move forward and get it right. Anyone who knows me, understands that my spirits WILL stay high..and I will return even better, stronger.. That's how I operate. But know that NOTHING has changed from the packs goal this year.The whole backfield will step up.that's guaranteed. I know the capabilities. Thanks again for all the support from everyone..much appreciated....it's tough but this is part of the game

So, with surgery, there was a chance he could return late in the season, but since they only had 1 real RB now on the roster, they had to place him on IR to make room to add another one

Uh, you telling me they couldn't have ditched a FB or a TE like Donald Lee? If there is any chance for him to return, I think you take that chance. Now, that isnt' even an option since he is on IR

drowe
09-14-2010, 03:34 PM
Guess I'm the only one that isn't worried about this. I've never been high on Grant. He doesn't bring anything special to the table. Not a home run threat. Not explosive. Not hard to bring down. Not a thread as a receiever. Defenses just never needed to account for him. But, he was always reliable and didn't fumble, so, he got to be a feature back for 4 years in a high powered offense, which, in turn, led to some impressive stats.

He is replaceable. Put anybody back there. See if there's one time in the next 15 weeks that you watch a play and think "Grant would've broke that...Grant would've caught that...Grant would've got that extra yard."

Sucks for him.

But, really, between him and Ahman Green, this is the first time the Packers RB position has been in flux for the better part of a decade. Kinda exciting.

J-Mike88
09-14-2010, 04:04 PM
Guess I'm the only one that isn't worried about this. I've never been high on Grant. He doesn't bring anything special to the table. Not a home run threat. Not explosive.
That's what some people say, but they ignore the 30, 40 yard TDs he had.
Seems like everyone expects RBs to be strong, have speed like Chris Johnson or Jammal Charles, and to not fumble.

Grant flat-out produced for us and was a positive attribute. For 2.5 seasons.

Now, that being said, RB is not a hard position to replace if everything else around them is as good as what we got.

GB12
09-14-2010, 05:10 PM
Grant receives far too much hate and nowhere near enough credit.

EvilMonkey
09-14-2010, 05:10 PM
I think Jackson could handle the position just fine. There isn't many teams out there that have a #2 RB that can step in and handle a full load, but I honestly think Jackson can and I think the Packers think he can too only keeping 2 RB to start the season. He can catch the football and is very valuable as a blocker picking up blitzes.

He won't be up to Grant's caliber, but honestly if the blocking is there up front, he'll do just fine. I love Grant because he's just so consistent, but let's face it, he's good when the line is good and doesn't create that much by himself. If Jackson can get rid of the happy feet he had behind the line of scrimmage as a rookie and just be decisive and hit the hole hard, which it looks like he has when he's played the last 2 years, I think he'll be fine as long as the line is fine.

Now if anything happens to Jackson? yeesh.....

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 05:28 PM
People consistently underrate Grant. He takes what's there, doesn't fumble, pass blocks, and yet still has the ability to take over games (as was mentioned, people forget the big games he's had and stretches where he looked like a top 5 back.)

Jackson is our guy now.
Pros: Better pass-catcher, better/equal pass blocker, hopefully hungry to prove himself.
Cons: Dances too much, I question if he's got the same burst as Grant, has had some good games but mostly been unimpressive in his chances, likely to put the ball on the ground more.

I think this increases the load on Rodgers but he's getting a better receiving option and I feel like he can handle it. Jackson might actually benefit from teams focusing much more on the pass now and I wouldn't be surprised to see a similar YPC and TD as Grant; just because of easier runs.

I liked Jackson a lot when we drafted him and he's improved these last two seasons after looking below-mediocre. We'll see. We've proven our offensive scheme can create easy runs and make mediocre/bad backs look decent. I'm not even sure if bringing in a bad character guy like Lynch really improves us; our offense has good chemistry and good team players, do we want to screw that up?

Also, Kuhn is just beastly pounding the ball and it'll be nice to see him get some more carries.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 05:35 PM
I wouldn't say Jackson is more likely to put the ball on the ground. In the preseason the RB's had a bit of a fumbling issue, but honestly, Jackson has been about as sure handed as Grant has been. That is one thing I like about both of the guys. Neither is gonna fumble a lot

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 05:36 PM
I wouldn't say Jackson is more likely to put the ball on the ground. In the preseason the RB's had a bit of a fumbling issue, but honestly, Jackson has been about as sure handed as Grant has been. That is one thing I like about both of the guys. Neither is gonna fumble a lot

Yeah, you might be right. I'm just so scared. :(

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 05:51 PM
I'm just bummed that the Pack had 3 injuries(2 season enders) in the FIRST game of the season. That is such a huge kick to he balls, no matter what. You expect injuries every year, but damn, first game, as a fan, just stoked for football to be back(high expectations to) and that happens

But, they have a nice early part of the schedule, so I'm not worrying yet. I fear for what will happen when we have JAckson going up against the Vikes/Cowboys/Jets, etc, though

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 05:53 PM
I'm just bummed that the Pack had 3 injuries(2 season enders) in the FIRST game of the season. That is such a huge kick to he balls, no matter what. You expect injuries every year, but damn, first game, as a fan, just stoked for football to be back(high expectations to) and that happens

But, they have a nice early part of the schedule, so I'm not worrying yet. I fear for what will happen when we have JAckson going up against the Vikes/Cowboys/Jets, etc, though

Meh, we weren't likely to run that much against those stout run Ds anyway. All three teams are weak(est) in the secondary.

roughrider30
09-14-2010, 06:34 PM
Awful awful news about Grant. This is definitely an injury that couldn't happen this year. I like Jackson a lot, and I think he could do fine as the #1. However, I feel he is the kind of RB that would need a good complementary back to flourish as a #1.

I really don't know what to expect out of Nance. Not sure what to think about this move, but I guess we should be used to this out of TT. He passed on several options (none great obviously) to get this guy, so I guess we will have faith in TT again. After all, we had no idea who Grant was when we traded for him. ;)

princefielder28
09-14-2010, 06:55 PM
For those who 'hate' on Grant, I think this will be a scenario where we don't realize how much we'll miss someone until they're gone and I think Grant's absence will be evident once we get into the tough part of our schedule

GB12
09-14-2010, 06:58 PM
For those who 'hate' on Grant, I think this will be a scenario where we don't realize how much we'll miss someone until they're gone and I think Grant's absence will be evident once we get into the tough part of our schedule

That'd kind of be nice for people to finally realize that, but god I hope we'll be able to get by.

BloodBrother
09-14-2010, 07:13 PM
Some fans just ask for too much. The hate that people have on Grant is because he isn't "flashy" etc. I have always appreciated what he has brought to the team. He really saved their season in 2007 coming out of nowhere. 08 he had a down year, but so did the entire team. 2009 he was very solid, averaging 4.5 ypc and had 11 rushing TD's. I mean, look at a team like the Pats, I'm sure they'd have loved to have Grant the last few years instead of using 4-5 different backs they seem to rotate in every game

Packers aren't a run first team, and havent been for awhile. They get their explosive plays via the deep ball, not from the run game...that's just a bonus if they break off one. We use the run game to keep defenses honest, move the chains and get the team into favorable 3rd downs

Sportsfan486
09-14-2010, 07:27 PM
Packers aren't a run first team, and havent been for awhile. They get their explosive plays via the deep ball, not from the run game...that's just a bonus if they break off one. We use the run game to keep defenses honest, move the chains and get the team into favorable 3rd downs

This is true. It'll be interesting to see how we change up our offense. I just don't see us having the same success if we go out there and act like Jackson is Grant (which is precisely what I expect to happen.)

At least we have the advantage that Jackson adds a bit to the passing game; we need to take advantage of that and come out passing and then use the run when they only have 6 or 7 in the box, then utilize play action. Some really successful teams have done so with a great passing attack and mediocre (or worse) running backs.

J-Mike88
09-14-2010, 07:31 PM
I think Jackson could handle the position just fine. There isn't many teams out there that have a #2 RB that can step in and handle a full load, but I honestly think Jackson can and I think the Packers think he can too only keeping 2 RB to start the season. He can catch the football and is very valuable as a blocker picking up blitzes.

He won't be up to Grant's caliber, but honestly if the blocking is there up front, he'll do just fine. I love Grant because he's just so consistent, but let's face it, he's good when the line is good and doesn't create that much by himself. If Jackson can get rid of the happy feet he had behind the line of scrimmage as a rookie and just be decisive and hit the hole hard, which it looks like he has when he's played the last 2 years, I think he'll be fine as long as the line is fine.

Now if anything happens to Jackson? yeesh.....
You know damn well it will. It's just a matter of time, unfortunately.

Zycho32
09-14-2010, 09:01 PM
The prospect of a 3-FB running game should something happen to Jackson is quite the strange wrinkle. Overall, the main thing that would change is a lot less outside running and more upfield running, but it also introduces a new dimension; imagine three FBs on the field at once, and you don't know who is going to get the ball and who is going to punch some linebackers in the mouth at the point of attack. It's like unearthing the Ancient T-Formation!

It's a shame it can't be paired with an OL better suited for smashmouth blocking.

Sportsfan486
09-15-2010, 12:55 AM
ESPN now has us at #2 in the power rankings despite losing our star RB and DL for the season and having a starting DE in a cast presumably for quite a while. I get that the game was a rout until Vick came in but really? Our vaunted passing offense looks bad, we get destroyed by Vick, and lose our star RB with a bad backup and we're #2? Bull.

J-Mike88
09-15-2010, 11:22 AM
ESPN now has us at #2 in the power rankings despite losing our star RB and DL for the season and having a starting DE in a cast presumably for quite a while. I get that the game was a rout until Vick came in but really? Our vaunted passing offense looks bad, we get destroyed by Vick, and lose our star RB with a bad backup and we're #2? Bull.
I love Grant, but that is the easiest position to replace, plus Jackson isn't much of a stepdown. Some say he's a step up. I don't know about that, but I just hope he doesn't get hurt too soon.

Our pass defense looked better, but how much of that was because of bad QB-play throwing the football? Can't tell yet.

Matthews is a beast, and thank Brett Favre for him because we needed that draft pick to obtain Matthews.

umphrey
09-15-2010, 11:43 AM
I'm really not worried about losing Grant. TBH I was more concerned when I thought he was going to idle on the roster for a month and then come back at 75%. Brandon Jackson looks like just as good a runner. Grant had 0 fumbles on carries last year though - we'll miss that big time. Grant wouldn't have repeated that anyway, can't really set the bar there for anyone. Jackson will actually let us run the ball more, IMO, as long as he's healthy. He's more of a consistent runner. He should have less negative carries, although he can't outrun anyone in the secondary. Math term - lower standard deviation. More runs of 3-6 yards and less runs of <1 or >10. My biggest concern is that he can hold up to the wear and tear. He couldn't his rookie year, although that's a terrible sample to look at, at this point, and since then he's never played a lot of snaps in a game. He's been very healthy though, not getting injured in practice or limited playing time like a lot of other guys.

PackerLegend
09-15-2010, 11:45 AM
ESPN now has us at #2 in the power rankings despite losing our star RB and DL for the season and having a starting DE in a cast presumably for quite a while. I get that the game was a rout until Vick came in but really? Our vaunted passing offense looks bad, we get destroyed by Vick, and lose our star RB with a bad backup and we're #2? Bull.

Since when do power rankings even matter?

Star RB? He was good and consistent but hes not AD or CJ. I like the guy alot and will miss him but im not all that concerned yet.

DL out for the season? Harrell?? seriously lol

DE in a cast... It hurts but the bottom line is the guys still going to play 110% even with 1 hand.


Way to over react on the passing offense. It was 1 game sheesh.
Have we ever done well against Vick? no and we wont be the only ones having trouble trying to run the guy down.

princefielder28
09-15-2010, 11:49 AM
You guys are kidding yourselves if you believe Brandon Jackson is anywhere near the runner that Ryan Grant is/was. Over the past three seasons Grant has been one of the league's best and most consistent running the ball and while he isn't one of the top tier guys, his absence will hurt this offense and team.

drowe
09-15-2010, 11:56 AM
You guys are kidding yourselves if you believe Brandon Jackson is anywhere near the runner that Ryan Grant is/was. Over the past three seasons Grant has been one of the league's best and most consistent running the ball and while he isn't one of the top tier guys, his absence will hurt this offense and team.

Ryan Grant has been near the top of the league in stats only. And, ANY RB that was a feature RB in a high powered offense would be in the same position.


It's not like we're trying to replace Chris Johnson here. Grant didn't have an elite skill set. He was above average in many aspects of the game. He was reliable and didn't fumble.

But, just look at the Eagles game;
-When we needed a yard or 2, Kuhn excelled.
-When Grant came out, we didn't miss a beat with Brandon Jackson.
-And, it's not like we relied on Grant to break runs and spark the offense. He is secondary to the passing game.


And, really, let's look at this historically:
-1996/1997-Edgar Bennett out, Dorsey Levens in. Anybody know the difference beside a different jersey #?
-So, we'll plug Brandon Jackson in there. And, Dimitri Nance, a dude we pulled off the back end of another team's roster. Worst case scenario; he'll end up replacing Ryan Grant...a guy we pulled off the back end of another team's roster.

umphrey
09-15-2010, 12:19 PM
You guys are kidding yourselves if you believe Brandon Jackson is anywhere near the runner that Ryan Grant is/was. Over the past three seasons Grant has been one of the league's best and most consistent running the ball and while he isn't one of the top tier guys, his absence will hurt this offense and team.

Besides not fumbling and being really durable, he's clearly outside the top 16 RBs, probably in the 20s. So now that he's hurt we move from a guy that was maybe #23 to a guy that's maybe #35 which is not a big difference when we're talking running backs. Grant was nothing special. He never created yards that weren't there. You couldn't put him into another teams offense and see a noticeable upgrade in the running game. It really sucks that we only kept 2 running backs now though. I'd feel so much better if we had Lumpkin.

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 02:17 PM
NFL made a stat change and Clay has been credited with 3 sacks in last week's game. Stud.

drowe
09-15-2010, 02:21 PM
NFL made a stat change and Clay has been credited with 3 sacks in last week's game. Stud.

ah, wonder if that was for when Matthews tackled Vick for a small loss on 4th and 1....?

there was one other situation where he tackled Vick for a loss on what seemed to be a clear designed running play.


but, good for Clay. He had one of the best games by any Packer linebacker in the last decade.

J-Mike88
09-15-2010, 02:24 PM
Besides not fumbling and being really durable, he's clearly outside the top 16 RBs, probably in the 20s.
In the 20's?
What, in terms of 40-yard times? Glamour? Dreadlocks?
Sure.
You want Jerious Norwood because he's faster?

Or is Kevin Smith better because he was drafted higher?
Matt Forte?

The NFL is about production, and to the people who think Grant's top-10 production for 2 1/2 years was all a product of the system, well come back to us in 15 games and let's see if the next guy matches what Grant did last year. I mean what he produced, which was better than all but about 7 or 8 backs in the NFL, if that.

J-Mike88
09-15-2010, 02:26 PM
Good article today from the National Football Post, Andrew Brandt:

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Randys-rant-was-almost-a-Packer-twice.html

The strange ranting of Randy Moss this week takes me back to the weekend of the 2007 Draft; much of it spent trying to sign Moss. It was a brief but intense negotiation that fueled some fire with Brett Favre when, for the first of two times, the Packers couldn’t agree with Moss on a contract.

Moss for sale

The Raiders bold experiment with Moss – they had traded Napoleon Harris and the 7th pick in the 2005 Draft for him – ended after two seasons when Moss could be had for a mid-round pick. Ted Thompson surprisingly had some interest, having been impressed with the way Moss handled himself at a charity event that he happened to be at in Texas. And Brett, of course, was extremely jazzed about the idea.

Now there were two parts to the deal to make it happen. First, there had to be agreement with the Raiders on draft pick compensation. We were offering a fifth-round pick and the Patriots later came up with a fourth. That, however, was the not the key to the deal.

One-year deal breaker

Moss was scheduled to make $9.75 million for 2007 and $11.25 million in 2008. Those amounts may well have been $100 million and $200 million; he was not making what was on the contract. We needed to bring in Moss, coming off a year with a pedestrian 43 receptions, at a more reasonable number with upside. The Patriots were also showing interest.

I negotiated with Moss’s agent while the recruiting from the alpha dogs – Brett and Tom Brady -- intensified. Moss was getting texts and calls throughout the weekend from both Favre and Brady both imploring him to come and form a powerhouse duo.

The offers from both teams were very similar for 2007, both around $3 million with additional incentives. Our proposal allowed Moss to make more than the Patriots proposal, although we had significant money tied to 45-man active roster bonuses, protecting us from injury if he could not play.

Our offer, however, required a second year in 2008. Moss and his agents were adamant that he wanted only a one-year deal. Having lost market value from his Raider experience, Moss would agree to a massive pay reduction for 2007 but wanted to hit the open market in 2008 coming off what he expected to be a big season.

The feeling in our discussions was that we did not want to rent Randy for a year only to have him shop to highest bidder in a few months trying to recoup some of his lost earnings in 2007. We discussed different ideas, but in the end we were insistent on a two-year deal. While we haggled about an appropriate roster bonus to activate the second year of the deal, the Patriots relented on the length and agreed to a one-year deal. That was it; he was going with Brady.

Mississippi burning

Brett was livid. The rest of the weekend I was fielding calls from Bus Cook about what went wrong in trying to sign Randy. Ted did not want to deal with Bus, so I listened patiently to their rancor and tried to explain our position.

I truly empathized with Brett. He had befriended and admired Randy for years and the two of them had dreamed of playing together. Here was an opportunity for us to make it a reality. But ultimately, we stood on our principles requiring more than a one-year commitment.

I told Brett to trust what we had at the position; that Greg Jennings would be a star in a couple years. He said he didn’t have a couple of years. Brett offered to give up some of his salary for the following season – although that was his last season with the Packers (see below) -- to bring in Randy. I told that was much appreciated but we would never take his money away from him to sign another player.

Brett was forever wanting a more aggressive attitude by the front office toward player acquisition than the present regime. My constant message that our method of drafting and developing talent rather than acquiring proven commodities only served to infuriate him and his resentment of a general manager that showed him none of the compassion and welcomed input of previous regimes.

Patriot games

Fast forward to 2008. After a wonderful year for the Patriots, catching 98 balls for 1493 yards and 23 touchdowns, Moss was a free agent as he designed, now with interest from several teams to cash in on his one-year deal. And cash in he did, re-signing with the Patriots for a three-year, $27 million deal with over $14 million guaranteed.

And guess what team showed some decent interest again in 2008? Yes, the Packers (along with the Eagles and Cowboys). But again, despite getting Brett's hopes up again, the Packers bowed out of the bidding (I had left the Packers at that point but heard the anger and frustration from Brett’s camp). Moss re-signed with the Patriots on March 3rd. Favre retired from the Packers on March 4th. Coincidence?

Whither Randy?

Now Moss is coming to the end of that deal with deafening silence from the Patriots about re-signing for the third time. A lot can change between now and March, but it appears he has had his run wit the team, and it’s been a successful and lucrative one. And one that found the Packers in second place for his services twice.

GB12
09-15-2010, 02:38 PM
Besides not fumbling and being really durable, he's clearly outside the top 16 RBs, probably in the 20s. So now that he's hurt we move from a guy that was maybe #23 to a guy that's maybe #35 which is not a big difference when we're talking running backs. Grant was nothing special. He never created yards that weren't there. You couldn't put him into another teams offense and see a noticeable upgrade in the running game. It really sucks that we only kept 2 running backs now though. I'd feel so much better if we had Lumpkin.
Why the **** do people refuse to give Ryan Grant any credit at all? 23rd? No ******* way.

Chris Johnson
Adrian Peterson
Steven Jackson
Ray Rice
Frank Gore
Maurice Jones-Drew
Michael Turner
Deangelo Williams

Those are the guys that are better than Ryan Grant

Rashard Mendenhall
Jamaal Charles
Jonathan Stewart

Those are the guys that are just behind/even to Ryan Grant

Ryan Grant is a top 12 back, no matter how much this forum wants to hate him.

GB12
09-15-2010, 03:08 PM
Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers was asked Wednesday what he would say to the Packers if they asked for his opinion about a possible deal for disgruntled Bills running back Marshawn Lynch, Rodgers' former Cal teammate.

"Bring him on," Rodgers said, without hesitation.

Not even with his character knocks?

"He's a great player," Rodgers said of Lynch. "And any character issues the team might see, I think in a situation like that, and I think you've seen that with other players across the league, when you give a guy a change of scenery and a guy like that who feels he might have something to prove, and surround him with two guys, (Desmond) Bishop and myself who played with him...I think that can only help him feel comfortable and see a lot of production."

Rodgers said the Packers have not asked him about Lynch, and that Rodgers and Lynch have not spoken.Let's do it

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 05:20 PM
I agree that they should look into it, but I think they can afford to wait it out a bit. Give Jackson the rest of this month's match-ups, and then re-evaluate

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 05:29 PM
Let's do it


The Bills Beat has learned that at least two teams have contacted the Bills regarding the services of Marshawn Lynch during the past 48 hours.

The Green Bay Packers and the San Diego Chargers have both contacted the Bills regarding Lynch's services.

http://thebillsbeat.com/Buffalo_Bills_News_Detail.aspx?article=84

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 05:40 PM
Oh damn. Count me in. a Bjax/Lynch/Kuhn trio would work just fine

forgot that Lynch is only 24 years old

GB12
09-15-2010, 05:43 PM
http://thebillsbeat.com/Buffalo_Bills_News_Detail.aspx?article=84

Right now Nix should be looking at shoring up the offensive line. The current starting five looked horrible in the season opener and if they don't improve the Bills will have trouble winning any games this year.
Jason Spitz and a draft pick; get it done.

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 05:47 PM
How about Jamon Meredith, Brian Brohm and a 5th round pick

we already gave them 2 guys, lets give them the pick now to finish it lol

jackalope
09-15-2010, 05:54 PM
With as badly as I wanted Lynch in 2007, I would definitely get some satisfaction out of trading for him now. Get him cheap, work him in slowly behind Jackson, and he could be a nice asset in the later end of the season. Should be interesting with Buffalo in town the weekend.

Mr.Regular
09-15-2010, 05:58 PM
Yes lets do it. That article says a 2nd round pick is the asking price, that seems pretty damn pricey to me, but I hope TT can work out some sort of conditional package for him. Marshawn could perform well in our system.

jackalope
09-15-2010, 06:01 PM
2nd round pick does seem pricey. I would not be willing to do that deal.

GB12
09-15-2010, 06:05 PM
There's no way they're getting a second round pick. No one was going for that before the draft, they certainly won't now. I'm guessing a 4th and a player is what they'll get.

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 06:23 PM
I'd give them nothing more than a 4th...straight up. If they want a player in the deal, then I downgrade it to a 5th + player

J-Mike88
09-15-2010, 07:31 PM
I heard that during the draft, they were willing to settle for a 5th rounder for Marshawn as soon as they took Spiller at #9.

I don't like wacky people, but he's so good for a cheap price you'd be crazy to pass up a chance to get him.

It could end up like getting Ahman Green in his 2nd season for Freddy Vinson, what a steal that was and an anchor at RB for us for years.

The only reason I might understand why TT and MM wouldn't do something like this is out of loyalty towards Grant going forward. I suspect the GM thinks drastic measures aren't needed yet at this position, and he may be right.

I still feel a lot better about our RB situation than I do our CB position, to be honest.

J-Mike88
09-15-2010, 07:43 PM
Some rumors circulating that there might be an AJ Hawk for Marshawn Lynch deal in place already, but ironically the two teams of course play against each other this week so the deal would wait a week. Very bizarre.

Apparently, this is AJ Hawk's residence. Not sure if anyone lives in that area and can confirm this. http://www.trulia.com/property/photos/3027998779-460-N-Olden-Gln-De-Pere-WI-54115

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 07:47 PM
Jason Spitz and a draft pick; get it done.

I thought about Spitz too, but he's the only other center on the roster. His swing value is pretty nice.

The bills do need Lb help too. Bishop or Hawk?

GB12
09-15-2010, 07:51 PM
I thought about Spitz too, but he's the only other center on the roster.

And that's why you don't keep keep Nick McDonald over Evan Dietrich-Smith.

Well that and Dietrich-Smith was just flat out better.

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 07:55 PM
Rumors are heating up on a Hawk for Lynch trade... People are saying the bills consider Lynch not available for trade... Who knows. Speculation.

http://packersnews.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20100915/PKR01/100915144/Linebacker-Hawk-would-be-open-to-trade-agent-says

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 07:59 PM
Isn't Hawk due for a pretty good chunk of money next year? No way the Packers will want that sort of cash strapped to a guy who only plays in base(and wasn't on the field at all last week)

Bills just lost Poslzunsky(did I get that right?) for a minimum of 2, maybe 3 weeks. If it is Hawk for Lynch straight up, I don't think I have a problem with it. Hawk has already basically been phased out.

GB12
09-15-2010, 08:02 PM
Isn't Hawk due for a pretty good chunk of money next year? No way the Packers will want that sort of cash strapped to a guy who only plays in base(and wasn't on the field at all last week)

Bills just lost Poslzunsky(did I get that right?) for a minimum of 2, maybe 3 weeks. If it is Hawk for Lynch straight up, I don't think I have a problem with it. Hawk has already basically been phased out.

What are you talking about? Hawk started and played on Sunday.

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 08:04 PM
What are you talking about? Hawk started and played on Sunday.

You serious? Hawk only played Special teams on Sunday because the Packers played nickel and dime packages all game.


hawk's due something like 10 mil next year, packers would move him if the price is right.

GB12
09-15-2010, 08:06 PM
He still started and played. He didn't play much because he's not in those packages, but it's not like he didn't play at all as he claimed.

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 08:08 PM
He still started and played. He didn't play much because he's not in those packages, but it's not like he didn't play at all as he claimed.

You don't pay a guy that much to play special teams though.

princefielder28
09-15-2010, 08:08 PM
Apparently, this is AJ Hawk's residence. Not sure if anyone lives in that area and can confirm this. http://www.trulia.com/property/photos/3027998779-460-N-Olden-Gln-De-Pere-WI-54115

I thought AJ lived by the Thornberry Golf Course but I could very well be wrong

TitleTown088
09-15-2010, 08:25 PM
Bedard is saying "sources" are telling him Lynch isn't available for what it's worth.

NFL Network's Jason La Canfora says Marshawn Lynch is not available too.

BloodBrother
09-15-2010, 08:47 PM
He still started and played. He didn't play much because he's not in those packages, but it's not like he didn't play at all as he claimed.

Yeah, woops. Miss-worded that. I knew he played, but he didn't play much

Bedard is saying "sources" are telling him Lynch isn't available for what it's worth.

NFL Network's Jason La Canfora says Marshawn Lynch is not available too.


Yup. Saw that to. They don't want to overwork Spiller. Bummer. Things can change quickly, however

mellojello
09-15-2010, 09:23 PM
Beastmode in GB is > AD in Minn

Whatever it takes, Packers need to make it happen.

J-Mike88
09-16-2010, 10:03 AM
Bedard is saying "sources" are telling him Lynch isn't available for what it's worth.

NFL Network's Jason La Canfora says Marshawn Lynch is not available too.
Most likely because there's already a deal in place between Green Bay & Buffalo, but the crazy fact that they play each other this week holds it up a bit.

Also, there were denials after denials when there were all those unconfirmed rumors floating around back in 2007 about Randy Moss going to Green Bay. Turns out there was obviously a lot of substance to those rumors.

I have the odds of Lynch coming to Green Bay at close to 50%. Again, as with almost-Moss and almost-Tony Gonzalez, things can fall apart at the end because TT will always stay true to his principles. That's probably a good thing in the long run, but sometimes is a bit short-sighted. This will be interesting how it plays out.

Watch Jackson explode for 150 yards and 2 TDs this week !
Hopefully we bottle Lynch up to nothing. But don't hurt him,

drowe
09-16-2010, 11:34 AM
Some rumors circulating that there might be an AJ Hawk for Marshawn Lynch deal in place already, but ironically the two teams of course play against each other this week so the deal would wait a week. Very bizarre.

Apparently, this is AJ Hawk's residence. Not sure if anyone lives in that area and can confirm this. http://www.trulia.com/property/photos/3027998779-460-N-Olden-Gln-De-Pere-WI-54115

Nope. AJ Hawk lives in Thornberry.

umphrey
09-16-2010, 04:07 PM
I'd be so psyched if we got Lynch. I think Brandon Jackson will do fine, but Lynch would be a big positive on an already dangerous offense.

tjsunstein
09-16-2010, 08:40 PM
Finley vs. Whitner


Jermichael Finley: 6-foot-5, 247 pounds
Donte Whitner: 5-foot-10, 208 pounds

Mr.Regular
09-16-2010, 08:57 PM
So so either of the Hawk/Lynch rumours have teeth to them?
Usually where theres smoke there's fire.
Id trade Hawk in a heartbeat for a decent pick. He's gone next year anyway and he'll barely play in our defense this year so might as well get something for him.

J-Mike88
09-17-2010, 06:46 AM
So so either of the Hawk/Lynch rumours have teeth to them?
Usually where theres smoke there's fire.
I got a feeling......
the only problem is it doesn't mean the trade will actually occur.
There was smoke about Randy Moss coming to Green Bay in 2007, and it fizzled out. The rumors there were true, but again, TT just didn't get it done in the end.

Same thing a year later with Tony Gonzalez. That was a real deal being discussed and briefly agreed to. Rumors were just rumors then, but you're right, that smoke meant there was fire behind the scenes.

I'm sure there has been serious negotiations between these two teams. I'd bet on that.

I hope we beat the Bills about 45-0 though and make that GM more desperate and embarassed than ever. Stupidly run team. Already had 2 good RBs but no QB, a bad OL and bad front 7 on D, so who do they draft high? Another RB who is only a 10-carry a game guy.

cvv84
09-17-2010, 09:46 AM
So so either of the Hawk/Lynch rumours have teeth to them?
Usually where theres smoke there's fire.
Id trade Hawk in a heartbeat for a decent pick. He's gone next year anyway and he'll barely play in our defense this year so might as well get something for him.

Their salaries don't match up enough to make a trade plausable. Hawk is due $10 million next year compared to the $1.14 million that Lynch would make. The already strapped for cash Bills aren't going to take on $9 million.

Also we only played 1 game which we used the nickel package for the majority of so theres still plenty of games left for Hawk to play. He's going to be very tough to move so I wouldn't count on him going anywhere.

PackerLegend
09-17-2010, 11:36 AM
I hope Hawk is traded he isnt going to be around much longer anyways.

umphrey
09-17-2010, 01:07 PM
So so either of the Hawk/Lynch rumours have teeth to them?
Usually where theres smoke there's fire.
Id trade Hawk in a heartbeat for a decent pick. He's gone next year anyway and he'll barely play in our defense this year so might as well get something for him.

I'm usually pessimistic about these things but I don't care what people are saying, Hawk is on the trading block, Lynch is on the trading block, Green Bay wants Lynch, Buffalo wants Hawk. However they have to resolve the money issue. Hawk has to get a new contract. Green Bay will set a price for Lynch and won't bend too much, so Buffalo has to have a low enough asking price. Green Bay is going to take into account that bringing in Lynch is not going to sit well with Jackson this year and Grant in the future - If Lynch gets into trouble they could end up with 3 disgruntled RBs instead of 2 happy ones next year.

I'll give it like a 20% chance. I think it mostly depends on how they can work out Hawks contract/salary and there is going to be at least a draft pick in there somewhere, which is going to be really hard to negotiate. If Buffalo has to pay Hawk a lot of cash they would probably want a high draft pick, kind of like buying Hawk and a pick. Green Bay won't like that at all.

umphrey
09-17-2010, 01:31 PM
Underwood is practicing, probably ready week 3 or 4. I'd much rather have him in nickel than Shields. Shields with help, or in a carefully planned zone would be better probably, but the way we used out nickel against the Eagles Underwood would be a much better play. He has a lot of flaws but at least he'll stick closer to his guy than Shields can and he's probably a better tackler on the edge too.

Unless I missed a Pat Lee injury, he must have just fallen off the face of the earth, because he must be pretty terrible that he can't even get into the discussion with Shields and we are counting on Underwood coming back and playing ASAP.

J-Mike88
09-17-2010, 01:57 PM
Unless I missed a Pat Lee injury, he must have just fallen off the face of the earth, because he must be pretty terrible that he can't even get into the discussion with Shields and we are counting on Underwood coming back and playing ASAP.
Now we all finally see it.
In the spring, we heard how he was going to all of a sudden become a good CB. Those are the things, like Barbre last year and Breno this year, that we have to see to believe.

Pat Lee was never a good cover corner at Auburn. He was barely draftable in my opinion. He rarely had to defend the pass much, only had a lot of playing time one year, and he didn't show any ball skills then. The SEC, with Tebow and McFadden and Felix Jones, Knowshon Moreno, etc. were run-first teams, not like the pass-happy Big 12.

There wasn't as much film on Lee playing the ball, and playing it well, to justify him ever being taken that damn high.

TT has done a great job overall, but whoever his CB scout is has failed miserably in his 6 years here. We have no good draft picks at that position since TT has been running the show.

Undrafted Sam I am appears to be the one with the most potential to become good. But he still has a long, long ways to go to get there. But I already like him better than Underwood.

johbur
09-18-2010, 03:41 AM
That's the thing about TT having ten picks per draft, a lot of those players are no longer with the team. I think he's done a great job retooling the talent and building an offense. His offenive line scout is not good, though. College is replaceable. Spitz is not starting. Giacomini is PS. Barbre is cut. Moll was traded away. Juice didn't last. The guards situation languished until Sitton. Wells was a Sherman player. Lang hasn't shown anything yet, but I'm hopeful. Bulaga is about it as far as guys with lots of promise, and it shows OL should have been addressed earlier than TT has been addressing it in rounds.
CB another weakness that hasn't been adequately addressed, along with the special teams. There was the article on this in the JS.
What he has hit on is the offensive skill players and he's found some good defenders.

TitleTown088
09-18-2010, 03:58 PM
That's the thing about TT having ten picks per draft, a lot of those players are no longer with the team.

Yeah, but that's also because you can only keep a certain number of players. The number of Ted Thompson drafts picks that are on an NFL roster after leaving Green Bay is a very high % and that speaks volumes.

J-Mike88
09-19-2010, 07:36 AM
We think, we hope, that this Packers team is Super Bowl material. That we can agree on.

I believe that we need to crush teams like the Bills. I don't want to see any lackluster s*** out there. I don't want slow starts. Don't want our defense to allow the Bills any momentum. I don't want to be trailing at all, or barely ahead 5 minutes into the 2nd quarter.

Looking back to our last Championship team, the 1996 Packers, we kicked crappy team's asses. We crushed mediocre teams.

We started that year 8-1, and that included the first 3 games of the year with these scores:

34-3 @ Tampa Bay
39-13 vs Philly
42-10 vs San Diego

Then we had our annual f*** up at the Metrodome and lost. But the next week, we got right back and won:

31-10 @ Seattle
37-6 @ Chicago

We finished the season scoring at least 30 points in our final 6 games, and winning all of them by a minimum of 14 points, which was the Super Bowl. That was the closest game we had since a week 14 comfy 28-17 win over the Bears on December 1st.

GB12
09-19-2010, 03:28 PM
Packers 2-0, Vikings 0-2

And that ****** had 3 INTs plus a fumble

Take some time to enjoy that.


Sure the Bears are 2-0 as well, but we'll take care of that next week.

umphrey
09-19-2010, 03:57 PM
I'd say there's not much question us and the Saints are the top 2 NFC teams right now. Bears look like a legitimate threat inside our division though. I don't see the Vikings just going away even with the way Favre is playing and the Giants could make a statement tonight.

Playing in Chicago on Monday Night next week is going to be a huge game. Peppers is going to test our OL and our defense is going to test Cutler.

GB12
09-19-2010, 04:12 PM
I think the Vikings will go away. Hell they have a shot at starting out 1-5. With how bad Minnesota has been and how much of a fight Detroit's been putting up they could even lose to the Lions next week. I don't really expect them to be this bad all year, but they've dug themselves quite a hole at 0-2 and will have a hard time getting out of it with the teams coming up on their schedule. I doubt they completely fall off the face of the earth and finish 4-12, but there's no reason they should finish ahead of us.

Mr.Regular
09-19-2010, 04:39 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YmMNpbFjp0

PS Clay Matthews is downright nasty. What a beast. Thompson was a genius to find him.

BloodBrother
09-19-2010, 04:58 PM
Bears still don't look like a threat to me. LOL at the Vikings, though. I fully expect them to overpay big time for V-jax now, after 2 pitiful offensive performances

Favre has a QB rating of about 56 after 2 games! Love it

umphrey
09-19-2010, 06:13 PM
Wooooow Bulaga might have (sort of) taken the LT job away from Clifton. Word is his knee is swelling and he's been getting beat so they put in Bulaga because Clifton wasn't performing due to injury. McCarthy isn't saying much but he definitely isn't saying Clifton is our starting LT. We got soooooo lucky Bulaga lasted as long as he did on draft day IMO. He looked good out there today.

It might be McCarthy politely giving Clifton an excuse for being a backup or it might be Clifton showing his age and playing on old knees that aren't ever going to be healthy enough to be a starter.

umphrey
09-19-2010, 06:31 PM
Sam Shields and Morgan Burnett deserve some credit as well. Shields with that big hit and stop on the 3rd and 5 and good coverage all game. Every single week he's gotten better. Morgan Burnett had that amazing strip interception that kind of got overlooked because the game was turning into a blowout. He played good coverage all game though from what I saw, not much of a presence in the run though, not sure if we're asking him to be or not.

BloodBrother
09-19-2010, 07:41 PM
Yeah, Burnett did not look great in the run d. Whiffed some tackles. LOL I guess its the #42. Sharper was the same way

but he made an impact by forcing a turnover. Good to see Brad Jones and Raji RETURN to the game after they briefly left with knee injuries

Also, I think Bulaga is going to be the LT from here on out.

umphrey
09-19-2010, 08:07 PM
Yeah, Burnett did not look great in the run d. Whiffed some tackles. LOL I guess its the #42. Sharper was the same way

I've seen him wiff BAD a few times but I've also seen him lay some hits and cut through blockers. It's inconsistency with him. I have 100% confidence that he'll round out his game and start making most of those tackles. I hope he does it by week 6 instead of year 3 though.

BloodBrother
09-19-2010, 08:11 PM
It's frustrating to see, but he IS a rookie so you expect growing pains. I'm stoked about HOPEFULLY getting Neal back for next week. Big divisional game next week

J-Mike88
09-19-2010, 09:49 PM
Bulaga against Peppers scares me next week. A lot to be honest.
Maybe it's the fact that I watched last year's game of Iowa vs Michigan where Brandon Graham was too much for Bulaga. Peppers is years ahead of Graham.

I'd prefer a healthy Clifton. And let's chip the hell out of Peppers. Frustrate him.

I know we are better than the Bears. But the game could go either way.
Remember we were lucky to beat them last year week one in Green Bay.
And they played tough at home late last year handing the Vikings a rare loss. And that was before Peppers, and with Urlacher out. And damn, Devin Hester looked like a real wide receiver today. I expect the Vegas line to be pretty close on this one.

There's always a surprise team that starts out 3-0, 4-0. I sure hope it isn't Da Bears, but it could be. This is an early must-win game because the division title is big goal #1.

Bearsfan123
09-19-2010, 11:19 PM
Bulaga against Peppers scares me next week. A lot to be honest.
Maybe it's the fact that I watched last year's game of Iowa vs Michigan where Brandon Graham was too much for Bulaga. Peppers is years ahead of Graham.

I'd prefer a healthy Clifton. And let's chip the hell out of Peppers. Frustrate him.

I know we are better than the Bears. But the game could go either way.
Remember we were lucky to beat them last year week one in Green Bay.
And they played tough at home late last year handing the Vikings a rare loss. And that was before Peppers, and with Urlacher out. And damn, Devin Hester looked like a real wide receiver today. I expect the Vegas line to be pretty close on this one.

There's always a surprise team that starts out 3-0, 4-0. I sure hope it isn't Da Bears, but it could be. This is an early must-win game because the division title is big goal #1.


Very well put.

Just stopping by, came in to say it should be a fun game next week. I am praying for Jay Cutler's life versus Clay Matthews who has been scary beastly in the first two weeks. (Anyone check him for steroids, guy is going nuts!) Anyway it should be a good game, I'm hoping da Bears come out on top but it should fun to watch.

BloodBrother
09-20-2010, 12:03 AM
Good news is Cutler went the entire game today without throwing an INT. That means he is due for a few gifts next monday!

It is early in the year, but any divisional game is a big one, especially when that team has the same record as you do. It is officially BEARS week. I'm already ready for next monday

roughrider30
09-20-2010, 12:05 AM
Bulaga against Peppers scares me next week. A lot to be honest.
Maybe it's the fact that I watched last year's game of Iowa vs Michigan where Brandon Graham was too much for Bulaga. Peppers is years ahead of Graham.

I'd prefer a healthy Clifton. And let's chip the hell out of Peppers. Frustrate him.

I know we are better than the Bears. But the game could go either way.
Remember we were lucky to beat them last year week one in Green Bay.
And they played tough at home late last year handing the Vikings a rare loss. And that was before Peppers, and with Urlacher out. And damn, Devin Hester looked like a real wide receiver today. I expect the Vegas line to be pretty close on this one.

There's always a surprise team that starts out 3-0, 4-0. I sure hope it isn't Da Bears, but it could be. This is an early must-win game because the division title is big goal #1.

Wasn't this one of Bulaga's first games back from injury?

I'm not trying to say that was the only reason, but I would also assume he's grown quite a bit as a player since last October. I would believe if you put Bulaga on Graham again, Bulaga would win this time. Obviously, I am not trying to compare Peppers and Graham I would definitely say I'm worried about the match-up too. He is not exactly the guy you want someone making his first start against, but I think it's possible he can be kept in check. Especially if, like you mentioned, they chip and double him early and often. From how it sounds there wont be a healthy Clifton out there and from how he looked today injured, Bulaga has to be the way to go.

PackerLegend
09-20-2010, 02:01 AM
Not only do we got to wait an extra day but we also have to beat the Bears at their house. :D

Is it Monday yet?

umphrey
09-20-2010, 11:37 AM
The media has been trashing our running game against the Bills. It wasn't spectacular but it was pretty good vs. the Bills IMO. We had a solid YPC around 4 and the play action was working all day. That's what it's supposed to do in our offense, not eat up 40 carries like on some teams. IIRC Grant never got more than 20 carries or so the last 2 years. A couple times when he did it was a huge, noticeable deviation from our offense, you could tell the other team spent all week working on the pass O so McCarthy said screw it lets run the ball up the middle.

I miss Grant though. He was a good, no nonsense, reliable runner. I hope we get someone. Lynch is supposedly available for a starting OL. I don't want to mess with our depth there, even someone like Clifton or Spitz, I kind of feel like they are necessary parts of the roster we put together in preseason and it would be very risky to get rid of them.

princefielder28
09-20-2010, 11:44 AM
no, our running game does suck without Grant...it's pretty obvious we really have no potential for a big run and Jackson looks so slow out of his cuts...Kuhn is our best option right now because he's the one that make the YPC look respectable

drowe
09-20-2010, 11:51 AM
no, our running game does suck without Grant...it's pretty obvious we really have no potential for a big run and Jackson looks so slow out of his cuts...Kuhn is our best option right now because he's the one that make the YPC look respectable

but, did we really have potential for a big run with Grant?

I don't think so. he could hit a big hole, the same way any half capable NFL RB could. but, you'd never define Ryan Grant as a home run threat.

The RB by committee did what was asked of them.

umphrey
09-20-2010, 11:54 AM
When I saw the play action working so well it was hard to say our running game wasn't doing it's job. We get home run passes off our running game way more often than most other teams get home plays of any kind.

princefielder28
09-20-2010, 11:59 AM
but, did we really have potential for a big run with Grant?

I don't think so. he could hit a big hole, the same way any half capable NFL RB could. but, you'd never define Ryan Grant as a home run threat.

The RB by committee did what was asked of them.

I wouldn't call him a homer threat compared to other big time backs in the league but compared to the players on our roster right now he's Ryan Braun compared to Joe Inglett

PackerLegend
09-20-2010, 12:11 PM
Jackson looked like poop this game. He spends to much time bouncing around. I can't believe we used Kuhn as much as we did. The guy isn't a RB. I like giving him the ball right up the middle if we need a yard or so but otherwise no.

J-Mike88
09-20-2010, 01:49 PM
The Bills are a bad football team.
Don't judge a game against them too much.

Remember, the critics said Ryan Grant was too slow and not explosive enough.

Sportsfan486
09-20-2010, 02:34 PM
The Bills are a bad football team.
Don't judge a game against them too much.

Remember, the critics said Ryan Grant was too slow and not explosive enough.

Grant may be fairly slow for a starting RB and not all that explosive but he is something Jackson is not. Decisive. How many times do you see Grant dance? He is the proto-typical north-south runner. We need to make a trade. Jackson is awful. There are RBs to be had, we need to go after one (but won't.)

Bears are 2-0 (because TD receptions aren't always TD receptions) and coming off a huge win. However, the Cowboys had a horrible defensive gameplan for the game (they went 5+ DBs 11 times in the game and it's a fact that Cutler fails against that many DBs) and played one of their classic we're-so-good-we-don't-need-to-show-up games.

Our pass rush should destroy their weak line (Matthews 9 sacks after 3 games? Haha.) and you'd have to assume our ball-hawking secondary is going to get some picks. The biggest question marks are which Rodgers is going to show up, how we fare against Peppers, and if we get burned by their speedster WRs. A win would put us in the driver's seat in the division, a loss wouldn't be crippling but it'd raise questions.

GB12
09-20-2010, 02:37 PM
"We'll evaluate Chad (medical). When we get him to the point when he's ready to go, he'll go. He's our starter"

umphrey
09-20-2010, 04:14 PM
Anyone want Brandon Jacobs? If the Giants are willing to give him away for peanuts, which is probably true, I'd take him. Whatever, he's overrated, he's not a great fit, but he's way better than Dimitri.

GB12
09-20-2010, 05:08 PM
I don't want anything to do with Brandon Jacobs.

Sportsfan486
09-20-2010, 05:12 PM
Anyone want Brandon Jacobs? If the Giants are willing to give him away for peanuts, which is probably true, I'd take him. Whatever, he's overrated, he's not a great fit, but he's way better than Dimitri.

He's probably underrated right now. He's a bad fit. He's way better than Jackson. I'd love him. He would accomplish what we need (consistently gain 2-3 yards, pound in short yardage.) Huge upgrade and probably available pretty cheap (5th or 6th rounder.)

Makes too much sense to happen.

princefielder28
09-20-2010, 07:58 PM
Makes too much cents to happen.

Yes, Jacobs make far too much money and is so awful of a football player that he would not help our team at all...Kuhn is a far better option for us

Sportsfan486
09-20-2010, 09:43 PM
Yes, Jacobs make far too much money and is so awful of a football player that he would not help our team at all...Kuhn is a far better option for us

Who cares how much money he makes? And how is he an awful player? His last couple of years have had injury issues but before that he was beastly, top 10 RB with back to back 10+ TD, 1k+ yard, 5.0 avg years.

EvilMonkey
09-20-2010, 09:51 PM
Who cares how much money he makes?

Ted Thompson

Sportsfan486
09-20-2010, 10:56 PM
Ted Thompson

/sigh. I just don't want to see a potential Super Bowl season derailed because Brandon Jackson is our RB. I wish we'd get someone. SOMEONE!

PackerLegend
09-21-2010, 12:00 AM
We did, we got Dimitri Nance! :D

Bargain bin price, TT's favorite.

J-Mike88
09-22-2010, 06:48 AM
I wanted to see more of Nance last week. He should have had more carries that Kuhn got, IMO.

Running plays aren't that complicated to learn. Just getting the handoff is the key. That's where vision come sinto play with the ZBS. See daylight, hit it.

Go Packers, and go Lions this week!

J-Mike88
09-24-2010, 07:24 PM
Great article on CLAY MATTHEWS:
http://packersinsider.com/2010/09/nfl-quarterbacks-cant-hide-from-the-clay/

Also, just watched Ahman Green rip off 9 & then 12 on his first 2 carries for Omaha in the UFL. It's on now live on HDnet on channel 306.

Jeff Garcia is the QB.
Garcia would be the best QB on the Bills, Browns, and Panthers right now, as well as some other teams.
Ahman is still good enough to play in the NFL.

TD pass for Garcia right now....

umphrey
09-27-2010, 04:07 PM
I forgot about James Starks. He comes off the PUP in a few weeks. Not a huge fan (I think he'll get hurt too much) but if he comes back healthy he might make a significant impact and give us some of what we lost in Grant.

TitleTown088
09-28-2010, 08:34 PM
An NFL source said Monday night that the Bills, who had rebuffed not only the Packers’ advances but any team’s inquiries about the availability of the 2007 first-round draft pick, have put out word that they will at least start listening to offers for Lynch. Whether the Packers will – or will try to – trade for Lynch before the Oct. 19 trade deadline remains to be seen.

Multiple reports in recent weeks have said that the Packers inquired about Lynch’s availability, and the source confirmed Monday night that the team had indeed contacted the Bills about him, even before Lynch ran 17 times for 64 yards against the Packers last week


http://espnmilwaukee.com/includes/news_items/40/news_items_more.php?id=4434&section_id=40

Favre4ever
09-28-2010, 10:10 PM
If the Packers want to win this year, they need Lynch. Or try to trade for a RB on a team loaded with RBs like Buffalo or Carolina. On defense, they should be ok once all the injuries come back. Pickett and Raji are playing way too much and Shields is starting to get exposed. Neal, Underwood, Harris, Bigby and B. Jones would help a lot.

J-Mike88
09-29-2010, 12:21 AM
If the Packers want to win this year, they need Lynch. Or try to trade for a RB on a team loaded with RBs like Buffalo or Carolina. On defense, they should be ok once all the injuries come back. Pickett and Raji are playing way too much and Shields is starting to get exposed. Neal, Underwood, Harris, Bigby and B. Jones would help a lot.
That's a great point, and for sure so is Cullen Jenkins.

I was hoping for more big plays from Raji though.

GB12
09-29-2010, 12:27 AM
He's a NT; he's doing his job, quite well too. And it's not like he hasn't gotten any pressure either.

umphrey
09-29-2010, 12:39 PM
Raji has been playing excellent. He gets double teamed a lot and still collapses the pocket on passing plays and forces the running back outside on rushing plays. If he gets a 1 on 1 he's usually driving his guy back into the quarterback. He was doing that for the entire first half of that game that shall not be mentioned, but in the second half Cutler was getting rid of the ball quicker. Maybe in the first half the lineman were just trying to get to Cutler but then after he ran for 3 first downs they were told to stay in their gaps and keep him in front of them. Him and Jenkins have been our best DL. Pickett has been OK, just average though.

senormysterioso
09-29-2010, 12:56 PM
I think it's clear that our nose tackle of the future is Josh Sitton.

J-Mike88
09-29-2010, 02:51 PM
Raji has been decent, but maybe I am expecting too much..... I want John Randle, or even Jay Ratlif getting to QBs.

Jakey
09-29-2010, 03:08 PM
Made a CM3 sig if anyone wants it! Feel free...

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd22/Jakey70/CM32.jpg

umphrey
09-29-2010, 03:09 PM
Well I don't know why you would expect Raji to play like a 4-3 DT/DE. Randle almost played linebacker ffs. As for Ratliff, well, he's 30-40 pounds lighter, plays nose tackle like it's a pass rushing position, and he still has 0 sacks compared to Raji's 1 this year.

cvv84
09-29-2010, 03:36 PM
Raji has been playing excellent. He gets double teamed a lot and still collapses the pocket on passing plays and forces the running back outside on rushing plays. If he gets a 1 on 1 he's usually driving his guy back into the quarterback. He was doing that for the entire first half of that game that shall not be mentioned, but in the second half Cutler was getting rid of the ball quicker. Maybe in the first half the lineman were just trying to get to Cutler but then after he ran for 3 first downs they were told to stay in their gaps and keep him in front of them. Him and Jenkins have been our best DL. Pickett has been OK, just average though.

Agreed, Raji has been playing very well and will only continue to get better once he gets fully acclimated to the NT position.

BloodBrother
09-29-2010, 05:08 PM
Some news and notes:

- Mike Neal was a full participant today at practice, but again, the real test is to see how his body responds to consecutive days.

- By far most interesting thing out of MM's presser is that he is naming Frank Zombo the starting ROLB as of today. He also said he had a team meeting with the team today talking about the importance of availibility and being able to practice. Jones just has been nicked up too much

- Interesting tidbit on Marshawn Lynch

NFL Network's Mike Lombardi predicted on Around the League Wednesday that the Bills will "pull the pin" and deal Marshawn Lynch before the October 19 trade deadline.
Lombardi, a former NFL general manager, has a good feel for situations like this. He concedes that the Bills will require a quality draft pick, but it sounds like a deal could get done for something like a conditional fourth-rounder that would escalate based on playing time and performance. Green Bay is the most hotly rumored landing spot, but other teams will suffer running back injuries before mid-to-late October and could enter the mix.

speculation again, but man, I'd do that easily

Boston
09-29-2010, 07:03 PM
That's a great point, and for sure so is Cullen Jenkins.

I was hoping for more big plays from Raji though.

Biig plays from a NT? Do you even understand football?

J-Mike88
09-29-2010, 08:41 PM
Biig plays from a NT? Do you even understand football?
Oh really? Ever heard of Jay Ratliff, or John Randle?

This was the reason they moved the great run-stuffing NT Pickett out to DE.
They didn't do it because Raji would be better plugging the run. In fact, we know our run defense might suffer a bit because of this move, and early results show that it has.

They did it because they believe Raji has as much pass rush ability as a guy like Ratliff.

In case you didn't notice, our interior pass rush was horrible last year which was the reason they drafted Mike Neal as well.

I don't expect Raji to get 10 sacks a year, but I think he's capable of getting 8 or so, and more importantly continue to flush the QB outta the pocket. I think he's done okay so far but I truly feel he has a lot more to give and will improve a lot in this area..... but remember, Cutler was the only decent pure passer we've played yet.

McNabb, Henne, Favre, Sanchez, Romo, and Matt Ryan await after we get the crappy Lions next.

princefielder28
09-29-2010, 08:50 PM
Ratliff lines up at NT but he's responsibilities are far different than what Raji is asked to do in our defense...and don't bring up a Hall of Famer to prove a point in your argument haha

GB12
09-29-2010, 09:08 PM
Oh really? Ever heard of Jay Ratliff, or John Randle?

This was the reason they moved the great run-stuffing NT Pickett out to DE.
They didn't do it because Raji would be better plugging the run. In fact, we know our run defense might suffer a bit because of this move, and early results show that it has.

They did it because they believe Raji has as much pass rush ability as a guy like Ratliff.

In case you didn't notice, our interior pass rush was horrible last year which was the reason they drafted Mike Neal as well.

I don't expect Raji to get 10 sacks a year, but I think he's capable of getting 8 or so, and more importantly continue to flush the QB outta the pocket. I think he's done okay so far but I truly feel he has a lot more to give and will improve a lot in this area..... but remember, Cutler was the only decent pure passer we've played yet.

McNabb, Henne, Favre, Sanchez, Romo, and Matt Ryan await after we get the crappy Lions next.

As others have already explained, you are comparing players with completely different responsibilities. John Randle was a 4-3 DT and DE. Why you're even bringing him up, I have no idea. Jay Ratliff is a 3-4 NT, so you're not as far off on this one, but he's still not a comparable player. The 3-4 system in Dallas is much different than the one we run. The NT is asked to be more of a penetrator in Parcells' defense. Whether Raji is as good of a pass rusher or not doesn't matter, they don't have the same responsibilities. Raji's primary duty is still to eat up blockers and stop the run. One of the reasons he was such a good NT prospect is because he can provide that interior pass rush when the time comes, but that's not the main focus for him.

J-Mike88
09-30-2010, 02:17 PM
Ratliff lines up at NT but he's responsibilities are far different than what Raji is asked to do in our defense...and don't bring up a Hall of Famer to prove a point in your argument haha
I thought about that too... what's interesting is that HOF player was undrafted, while our Raji was the #9 overall pick because, like many analysts said, he possessed rare ability to penetrate for his size, and the first guy I thought about penetrating from the interior was John Randle. That guy was always after Favre in the mid 90's. A beast.

Look, duties aside, psycho package aside, 2 DTs aside, I think Raji will be a lot better in a year or two... but I'd just like to speed up that process. I think he's capable of being a terror for QBs in the pocket there.

I can't wait for Mike Neal to bodycrush some QBs. Is this the week?

BloodBrother
09-30-2010, 02:52 PM
McCarthy just said that he is doubtful about Chillar playing this Sunday, because of his injured shoulder

oh yeah, Sam Shields injured his calf today in practice, not sure about the severity of it. Ugh, this team is piling up waaaaay too many injuries so early into the season

umphrey
09-30-2010, 03:50 PM
McCarthy is telling bitches to stop whining and playing the guys that actually practice

umphrey
09-30-2010, 04:00 PM
At least Zombo is willing to "take it on the chin" lol

BloodBrother
09-30-2010, 04:52 PM
ya that was a funny quote. Neal was a full participant today fwiw. Real test of course is now to see how he responds on friday. Anxious to see him in the Dline rotation

cvv84
09-30-2010, 10:34 PM
If you're down/disapointed with Raji all I have to say is alot of the mocks had us taking either Andre Smith, Eugene Monroe, or Brian Orapko. Smith is stuck as a backup battling his weight instead of defenders, Monroe has been solid but far from playing like a top 10 pick, and drafting Orapko would've meant that Clay wouldn't be a Packer.

I bet the Chiefs would love to Raji instead of Tyson Jackson. While Jackson is stuck playing DE, Raji has shown the versitility to play both DE and NT.

And like GB12 said, our defense calls for the NT to take up 2 blockers so guys like Clay can make the play. Just take a look at the Steelers and Casey Hampton because thats how our defense opperates.

TitleTown088
09-30-2010, 11:45 PM
Disappointed with Raji? He played good and exceptional in the Eagles game.

cvv84
10-01-2010, 06:33 AM
Disappointed with Raji? He played good and exceptional in the Eagles game.

To 99.7% of Packers fans this is a question that was never asked to themselves. But you know...

J-Mike88
10-01-2010, 02:31 PM
Packers Notes:


NFL Network LIONS @ PACKERS preview (http://www.nfl.com/videos/green-bay-packers/09000d5d81af5f39/Week-4-Lions-vs-Packers-Preview)


I'm still pissed off at a couple of the penalty calls last week, and non-calls on the Bears, particularly the Hester punt return. On this video (http://www.nfl.com/videos/green-bay-packers/09000d5d81ae5d32/D-Bears-62-yd-punt-return-TD), pay close attention to the block on AJ Hawk by some Bear guy who just pops in on the screen. He clearly hits Hawk behind the side, which if we make the block is a clear flag. This happens at the :57 second mark on the lower-left corner. You have to pause it. It's not as clear as it is on my DVR. Also, not as bad, you can kind of see #52 kind of initially nudge Quarless, #81, from behind the side at first... then he gets him from the side. Those are 2 blocks that we always get called penalties for on our special teams.

I remember before some people asking McCarthy if our "reputation" hurt us in the eyes of the officials.



Sam Shields is questionable for Sunday, and Brandon Chillar is most likely out. We will see more of Desmond Bishop.

Also, Greg Bedard is leaving the JSonline team in 3 weeks for Boston, the Globe.

BloodBrother
10-01-2010, 02:51 PM
Actually, Shields is now ruled as Doubtful

Friday practice report: No Chillar, Shields
Posted by Rob Demovsky October 1st, 2010, 11:16 am

Linebacker Brandon Chillar (shoulder) and cornerbck Sam Shields (calf) both sat out of practice today and are in danger of missing Sunday’s game against the Lions.

Chillar was injured in Monday’s loss at Chicago, while Shields dropped out of practice yesterday.

Left tackle Chad Clifton (knee) appeared to be a limited participant during the portion that was open to reporters.

The Packers will be on the field until about 12:30 p.m. The full injury report will follow.

UPDATE (12:40 p.m.): Chillar has been ruled OUT this week. Here’s the full injury report:

Brandon Chillar, LB Shoulder Did Not Participate Out

Chad Clifton, T Knee Limited Participation Probable

Nick Collins, S Knee Full Participation Probable

Cullen Jenkins, DE Hand Full Participation Probable

Brad Jones, LB Knee Full Participation Probable

Derrick Martin, S Ankle Did Not Participate Probable

Mike Neal, DE Side/Rib Full Participation Questionable

Charlie Peprah, S Quadricep Limited Participation Questionable

Brady Poppinga, LB Hamstring Limited Participation Questionable

Sam Shields, CB Calf (Not Listed) Did Not Participate Doubtful

Charles Woodson, CB Toe Full Participation Probable

http://blogs.greenbaypressgazette.com/blogs/gpg/insider/2010/10/01/friday-practice-report-no-chillar-shields/

J-Mike88
10-01-2010, 05:33 PM
F***.

When did little Sam get hurt in the first place? Was it a play in the game Monday night, or a practice this week?

McCARTHY TODAY:
-Well, we have a couple options (replacing Shields). We have Brandon Underwood, also Patrick Lee has worked in there, and also Jarrett Bush. We’ll discuss that today and finalize that for our meetings tomorrow.

-We’ve played nickel with A.J., and also have the ability to play with Bishop, and that’s constant throughout all of our sub groups

-(Where’s Mike Neal at now that he’s gone through these practices?)
I talked to Mike Trgovac before practice, and he thought he definitely made progress through yesterday. He did practice today, so that’s really the process I go through after today’s press conference. I have a chance to meet with the trainers, and we’ll talk about it with all the coordinators in our game management meeting. I’m hopeful he came through the practice clean.

J-Mike88
10-02-2010, 12:06 AM
Cullen Jenkins is pissed off at Packer management

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/packers/104189808.html

"It's almost like maybe a slap in the face," Jenkins said Friday. "I'm not the type of player that causes a big scene or goes out and displays his unhappiness. You just kind of feel like you're not in the plans, like they just don't see you as a valuable enough player."

.....he has demonstrated the ability to play right end in a 3-4, end or three-technique tackle in a 4-3 and either tackle on passing downs. His versatility would make him attractive to all 32 teams, not to mention the fact he has the interior pass-rushing ability that all teams covet.

In September, Arizona gave defensive tackle Darnell Dockett a four-year extension even though he had two years left on his contract. The deal included $30 million guaranteed and reportedly was worth $48 million in new money.

"I look at some of the things that have been going on," said Jenkins. "I even looked at Darnell Dockett. We've been playing the same amount of years. I think he has one more sack than I do over our careers."

A friend of Jenkins described him as angry and upset about the team not recognizing his worth and failing to make him a genuine offer months ago.

princefielder28
10-02-2010, 09:49 AM
I can't blame Cullen for his anger...he has been a solid player for us and is a key to our success in the 3-4 and to not be recognized for his hard work and good play is certainly a slap in the face...from a management standpoint they wanna see how Mike Neal plays before they invest money in a veteran long term

PackerLegend
10-02-2010, 10:13 AM
I understand that Jenkins does deserve more, im just sick of players in general always crying about needing more money when they already have millions.

Can't believe we are worried how bad we will miss Sam Shields an UDFA. Not many teams have an UDFA that they cant really afford to lose. This game is one were it shouldn't really matter with Shaun Hill at QB.

cvv84
10-02-2010, 10:21 AM
I understand that Jenkins does deserve more, im just sick of players in general always crying about needing more money when they already have millions.

Can't believe we are worried how bad we will miss Sam Shields an UDFA. Not many teams have an UDFA that they cant really afford to lose. This game is one were it shouldn't really matter with Shaun Hill at QB.

Probably because of this: Green Bay Packers likely to sub in Jarrett Bush for a doubtful Sam Shields against Detroit Lions (http://packersnews.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20101001/PKR01/101001129/Notebook-Bush-likely-to-sub-for-a-doubtful-Shields-)


As for Jenkins, we have a ton of younger guys who need to be re-signed as well. I'd love to keep Jenkins but not in the price range of what Darnell Dockett got.

PackerLegend
10-02-2010, 01:45 PM
Yea I know. What I was trying to get across is it shows we have absolutely no depth in the secondary. Its pretty bad when he have to heavily rely on a first year UDFA who spent 1 year playing the position in college. The only good thing is this week we should be ok going against the Staffordless Lions.

cuzifelt1ikeit
10-02-2010, 03:07 PM
I understand that Jenkins does deserve more, im just sick of players in general always crying about needing more money when they already have millions.

Can't believe we are worried how bad we will miss Sam Shields an UDFA. Not many teams have an UDFA that they cant really afford to lose. This game is one were it shouldn't really matter with Shaun Hill at QB.

hes not crying for millions though. he just wants to secure his future in green bay. his contract is up after this year.. not like he has 2 years left and he wants more dough

TitleTown088
10-02-2010, 03:43 PM
Y we have absolutely no depth in the secondary.

At safety maybe. I don't think you're going to find too many teams that are completely satisfied with their CB depth, but The Packers cornerbacks don't worry me too much this year to be honest. Especially considering Harris could back mid season, Tramon playing very well, and what looks to be an improved pass rush.

PackerLegend
10-02-2010, 04:29 PM
It will be nice to have Harris back but realistically what can we expect? He is coming off a major knee injury and last time I checked he wasn't getting any younger. We haven't exactly faced top flight passing offenses either. Im just worried and I really hope Im wrong but I could easily see our secondary getting torched at some point this season. We can apply pretty good pressure but a few times during that Bears game there was no pressure at all.

umphrey
10-02-2010, 04:40 PM
I'm excited to see what Underwood does in a game and I'm glad it isn't against a game where we really have to count on him.

I don't really see what Jenkins is so upset about. He's a lock to get resigned IMO but complaining about it tends to get our management more apathetic about it. I'd pay him whatever he wants. He is extremely important to our defense, even if Mike Neal turns out to be awesome, we still would be a lot better with Jenkins. Any team would be better with Jenkins. Hypothetically, the worst fit for him would be the Colts, who would still love to have him play defensive tackle to go with Mathis and Freeney. We better not let him get to free agency because we would have to bid against 31 other teams.

GB12
10-02-2010, 04:46 PM
The thing is, Harris will be an upgrade. Where that upgrade happens remains to be seen based on how he comes back, but will improve our secondary. Even with his age and coming off an injury he's for sure going to be better than Jarrett Bush and Pat Lee. Unless he's really taken a huge fall you can add Brandon Underwood and Sam Shields to that list too. Trammon Williams will keep his starting job I'm sure, but Harris should take the nickel. Then that push Shields back to where he'll only be playing zone or matching up against 4th and 5th WRs. Getting Harris back will be a big boost to our defense.

umphrey
10-02-2010, 05:03 PM
Last year:
1) Woodson
2) Tramon
3) Jarrett Bush
4) street free agents

This year
1) Woodson
2) Tramon
3) Harris
4) Shields
5) Underwood
6) Lee
7) Bush

This is why I wasn't upset about not upgrading our secondary. The guy who was forced into nickel last year is on the bubble of getting cut once Harris comes back.

J-Mike88
10-03-2010, 07:19 AM
Hopefully Jenkins gets his deal.... he's been a warrior for us. When he tore his pec 2 years ago at Tampa Bay, that ended that season.

I know TT and MM think very highly about Cullen, and I expect he'll get a new deal.

But our payroll this year is 6th in the league already.
According to National Football League contract figures, the Packers presently rank sixth in the NFL in team salary at $138.5 million. One prominent agent said that the Packers might not have the cash to re-sign Jenkins

J-Mike88
10-03-2010, 04:18 PM
Former Packer Missile Chuck Cecil makes some news

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5644551
Titans assistant makes obscene gesture

Titans defensive coordinator Chuck Cecil expressed his anger at officials during Tennessee's game with Denver with an obscene gesture.

Television cameras caught Cecil using his right hand to make the gesture when officials flagged his defense for a neutral zone infraction during the second quarter. The penalty gave Denver first-and-goal, and Kyle Orton tossed a 2-yard touchdown pass on the next play for a 7-0 lead.

Last year, Titans owner Bud Adams was fined $250,000 by the NFL for making the same gesture. Adams made the gesture repeatedly from his owner's box and on the field celebrating a win over Buffalo last November.

umphrey
10-03-2010, 04:29 PM
Injuries are very very bad this year, but at least there is hope. Let me know if I miss anybody:

Dinged up:
Brad Jones (knee)
Charles Woodson (toe)
Morgan Burnett (not sure, got X-Rays I think)
Nick Collins (knee, I think)
Brandon Underwood (shoulder)
Sam Shields (calf)
Charlie Peprah (quad)
Brandon Chillar (shoulder)
Nick Barnett (not sure)
Brady Poppinga (hammy)
Cullen Jenkins (hand)
Mike Neal (ribs)
Chad Clifton (knees)

On PUP:
Al Harris
Atari Bigby
James Starks

IR:
Justin Harrell
Ryan Grant

It shouldn't be much of a surprise that our defense is playing so poorly. At least they are keeping us in games but they have to get better. 15 injuries on defense right now, astounding. If we can stay competitive for a few games, 14 of those guys are going to be healthy for the second half of the season. We are going to need some luck escaping new injuries though. Losing any starter on defense right now would be a huge blow because our depth is stretched so thin already, we would either have to play a backup who is at maybe 75% or go to the bottom of the depth chart.

J-Mike88
10-03-2010, 11:28 PM
This **** sport is more violent and hazardous every year.
These guys get bigger, stronger, faster, more violent every year.

I also talked to a scout last week who said that some players are being encouraged to miss more time as part of a negotiation tactic with the league, by the NFLPA. Of course no proof, but we all know that there are tough negotiations ahead, especially with health of the players.

Peter King talked about it a bit tonight on NBC.

Way to go Giants by the way! Thank you Justin Tuck and Osi Umenyiora.

BloodBrother
10-04-2010, 02:13 AM
The problem with Barnett was his wrist. Apparently it wasn't anything since he came back moments later after x-rays

Good news on Burnett was that he wasn't on crutches in the locker room and seemed OK...but the mri will reveal the truth.

TitleTown088
10-04-2010, 09:35 AM
Tramon is playing so dang good this season. Hopefully he can keep it up.

cvv84
10-04-2010, 01:11 PM
Kick me in the balls, Morgan Burnett done for the season.

bigboiajhawk
10-04-2010, 01:12 PM
Haven't been on here in a really long time...But I must say, I am happy with 3-1. The thing that excites me most about this team is that we really haven't played our best football. I think that our offense will catch fire one of these weeks and we will start to play the way we are supposed to; I would much rather have the packers get hot at the end of the season than come out of the gates firing and then suck at the end. All we need is 6 or seven more wins and we are in the playoffs, and for the most part that is all we can ask for.

We lose Morgan Burnett for the year, that sucks, but hey maybe Bigby will finally play well when he comes back after week 6.

BloodBrother
10-04-2010, 01:26 PM
F*ckin A, man. It's only week 5 and already we have lost 3 guys for the season. This freakin blows


the defense just continues to take hits. Not good. An already thin secondary just got even thinner. Ugh. No telling what Bigby/Harris can do when they return, as they'll have been out for quite some time. The offense needs to get it going, because I don't trust this D going forward

princefielder28
10-04-2010, 02:30 PM
When Harris comes back, you'd have to think Woodson will slide safety...best solution to getting our top DBs on the field

BloodBrother
10-04-2010, 02:48 PM
Oh, more good news, Chillar's shoulder injury may be more serious than first thought. He is getting more tests done and there is a possibility that his season could be over

there goes our best coverage LBer if this ends up being true. Can you imagine Hawk/Bishop trying to cover TE's? Good lord

http://blogs.greenbaypressgazette.com/blogs/gpg/insider/2010/10/04/chillars-injury-could-be-serious/

GB12
10-04-2010, 02:54 PM
When Harris comes back, you'd have to think Woodson will slide safety...best solution to getting our top DBs on the field

Absolutely not. I know we did it for a while a couple years ago, but I'd be completely against it. Harris comes back the same time Bigby does. Start Collins and Bigby at safety and Woodson and Harris/Williams at corner with the other as the nickel.

princefielder28
10-04-2010, 03:04 PM
Absolutely not. I know we did it for a while a couple years ago, but I'd be completely against it. Harris comes back the same time Bigby does. Start Collins and Bigby at safety and Woodson and Harris/Williams at corner with the other as the nickel.

We have the ability to line up Woodson at safety, slide in Harris to a starting role when he gets back, and you would prefer to put a piece of garbage like Bigby on the field instead of Harris!? Now I've been critical of Harris and his declining play but his veteran presence and ability is still far greater and more valuable than what Bigby brings to the table. I'm not the biggest fan of moving Woodson to safety either, but at the end of the day it comes down to putting the best players on the field to win yourself football games, and Woodson to safety/Harris at CB provides you with that.

umphrey
10-04-2010, 03:23 PM
Safety/cornerback is splitting hairs in this defense. We line up in nickel something north of 70% of the time so Harris, Woodson, Bigby, Collins, Tramon will all be on the field at the same time most plays. Woodson plays like a safety already where he'll cover the inside receiver or tight end and blitz from the position. Personally I hate that strategy. If you're going to blitz a DB then blitz Bigby or Shields or Burnett or Bush - they all have pretty much the same pass rushing skills anyway, but none of them can cover like Woodson.

The Packers are treating yesterday like it was a horrible loss and I love it. The superbowl talk has been very positive for this team. The Cowboys and the Vikings had the same hype but they were the teams that thought they could stroll through the regular season then flip a switch in the playoffs. The Packers approach every game like a must win and they aren't satisfied with a less than perfect performance. They could make excuses, the 14 injuries they have on defense right now, but they aren't. They are dedicating themselves to elevating their play.

TitleTown088
10-04-2010, 04:47 PM
Screw injuries.