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jason96r
02-09-2008, 12:45 PM
I've become pretty intrigued with Derrick Harvey as a 1st rd pick lately. I know Scott does not have a scouting report up yet and have read some others and he seems to be the ideal RE for a cover 2, but I have very little experience in watching him play. I know he only has 2 years of very good production, but what intrigues the most is he only started to play football his junior year in highschool according to one report I read. I just figure getting him into an NFL program to gain some strength and hopefully retain his speed. Then have him get coached up so he can learn better technique. Because plain and simple Harvey can get at the QB and that is definitely what the Lions need.

Addict
02-09-2008, 12:48 PM
eh.... good for you?

Bootland27
02-09-2008, 12:56 PM
Strengths:

Overall, he's a better prospect than Jarvis Moss (who was selected in the first round by Denver in 2007). He can play the 4-3 rush end or even bulk up to play the 3-4 end (he has the frame to handle it). He has a good first step and can quickly gain the edge agaisnt the tackles. He can drop his shoulder to turn the corner and get to the QB. He has an impressive wingspan and can still be disruptive even when he's unable to get to the QB. As a run defender, he's not particularly stout at the LOS, but he shows good ability to track the RB down the line and has good pursuit skills.

Weaknesses

Like most players coming out of college, he'll need to continue to add functional strength for the next level. He'll need to be stronger at the point of attack against the run. He has trouble disengaging from blocks once he's tied up. While he's quick, he lacks the elite explosiveness that Jarvis Moss possessed at Florida. He's gotten by with speed and athleticism at Florida, but in the NFL he'll need to develop some more pass-rush moves and learn to use his hands better.

asmitty45
02-12-2008, 03:28 PM
I'm not too into Harvey at 15, could be great but I think we have much more pressing needs in the first.

unless we can grab another 1st (#22, please god) when we can take him and another player (Stewart/Mendenhall, DCR etc)

wingboy2999
02-12-2008, 03:29 PM
I'm not so sure Harvey will be there honestly.

Iamcanadian
02-13-2008, 09:08 AM
I'm not so sure Harvey will be there honestly.

I also think we will be very lucky if Harvey is still on the board at #15. A lot of gurus have him going top 12. He's perfect for a Cover 2 team as a DE or a 3-4 team as an OLB so there will be a lot of competition for his services and I think he's gone before we pick.

ESimsfan87
02-13-2008, 09:46 AM
As noted by my sig, I'm very on board with Harvey becoming a Lion. He may not be the total package DE that Chris Long is, but he is so much better at getting to the QB than any other DE we have or could acquire. Fingers crossed in late April...

jason96r
02-13-2008, 11:54 AM
I actually really like Quentin Groves also. He is really fast and can definitely get at the QB too. I would love to have 2 1st and go QB and pass rushing DE with the 2 1st.

wingboy2999
02-13-2008, 12:38 PM
There is options in Round 1 or Round 2. It really is how everything falls come draft day. But yes, I think D is our #1 need so we gotta address it. If we end up trading Roy then we can take a RB with whatever pick we get for him.

ironman4579
02-13-2008, 01:29 PM
Personally, I am not a fan of Harvey. Could someone explain to me why people are high on this guy? Everyone says he's a great pass rusher, and gets to the QB so well, but he's never had double digit sacks in a season. Last year he had 8 sacks, and I think 3 of those came against a DII team. He's tall, but not really that big. He's not overly strong, or fast. He's not all that great against the run. I just don't see the love that Harvey gets being justified.

EDIT:Florida actually credits him with 11 sacks as a soph, but I was going by Scott's stats. Regardless, I don't see anything that makes me want him at 15.

Addict
02-13-2008, 01:45 PM
Personally, I am not a fan of Harvey. Could someone explain to me why people are high on this guy? Everyone says he's a great pass rusher, and gets to the QB so well, but he's never had double digit sacks in a season. Last year he had 8 sacks, and I think 3 of those came against a DII team. He's tall, but not really that big. He's not overly strong, or fast. He's not all that great against the run. I just don't see the love that Harvey gets being justified.

It's all about pressure, we need pressure. Lots of it.

ironman4579
02-13-2008, 01:57 PM
It's all about pressure, we need pressure. Lots of it.

I agree we need pressure, but how much pressure does Harvey bring? He was only credited with 3 QBH's this year as well(although the QBH stat is always messed up. I've seen games with the QB under pressure the whole game and no one gets credited with a QBH at all). He got great pressure in the NCG, but it seemed like that was mostly against OSU's RT, not LT. He did basically nothing against Jake Long, the guy that people seem to think won't be able to play LT at the next level(although I completely disagree). He did almost nothing against Chris Williams this year either. To me he's a guy living off the NCG against OSU right now. I just don't see anything about this guy that says "We must have this guy at #15."

Addict
02-13-2008, 02:00 PM
I agree we need pressure, but how much pressure does Harvey bring? He was only credited with 3 QBH's this year as well(although the QBH stat is always messed up. I've seen games with the QB under pressure the whole game and no one gets credited with a QBH at all). He got great pressure in the NCG, but it seemed like that was mostly against OSU's RT, not LT. He did basically nothing against Jake Long, the guy that people seem to think won't be able to play LT at the next level(although I completely disagree). He did almost nothing against Chris Williams this year either. To me he's a guy living off the NCG against OSU right now. I just don't see anything about this guy that says "We must have this guy at #15."

I agree the hype of him being a must-have player is a bit too much. Almost like we don't have any other holes to fill.

ESimsfan87
02-13-2008, 10:46 PM
Well quick question to the Harvey doubters: Do you really think that Jared DeVries or Hawaii Five-O are going to be able to shore up that spot that Kalimba so diligently held down? My answer: hell no. The Giants showed just how much of an importance a pass rush needs to be placed on a defense. I guarantee you that despite the superb season the Colts had the year before that they would have won it had they not had Dwight Freeney. Everything we do in this stupid Tampa 2 is predicated around the pass rush. Dewayne White is adept at stopping the run which kinda makes up for not having an efficient olb behind him. (E Sims was on the other side). He may not be the 15th best player overall, but he is the best pure pass rusher in the draft and one that fits well into our defensive schemes.

ESimsfan87
02-13-2008, 10:47 PM
I meant to say the Colts wouldn't have won it without Dwight Freeney, my bad...

ironman4579
02-13-2008, 11:27 PM
Well quick question to the Harvey doubters: Do you really think that Jared DeVries or Hawaii Five-O are going to be able to shore up that spot that Kalimba so diligently held down? My answer: hell no. The Giants showed just how much of an importance a pass rush needs to be placed on a defense. I guarantee you that despite the superb season the Colts had the year before that they would have won it had they not had Dwight Freeney. Everything we do in this stupid Tampa 2 is predicated around the pass rush. Dewayne White is adept at stopping the run which kinda makes up for not having an efficient olb behind him. (E Sims was on the other side). He may not be the 15th best player overall, but he is the best pure pass rusher in the draft and one that fits well into our defensive schemes.

No, I do not think the players we currently have for that position are the best players out there. But I don't think you reach for a guy because he fills a need. That's how you get wasted picks that don't produce up to their draft slots. Aside from that, you don't take a guy in the first round because he's the best at something in a certain draft. Aside from the fact I think Gholston is a superior pass rusher anyway, simply being the best in one draft class doesn't mean that he's actually good at it. I keep seeing people saying he's the best pure pass rusher, but I certainly don't see him actually being a great pass rusher in college, let alone the NFL, and so far, no one has provided any evidence to support this position.

As a side note, everyone keeps saying they want him because he's the best pure pass rusher, he provides pressure, we need pressure, the cover 2 needs pressure, etc. I know all that. That's not the question I'm asking, and has nothing to do with why I don't like him at 15, or really even higher than 25. I'm asking what makes him a top 15 or top 20, or like Scott has him, top 10 player? Does he have great size, or great athleticism for his size? No. Does he have great speed? I don't think so. Great production? Again no. So what is it?

Addict
02-14-2008, 02:35 AM
http://www.harborsales.net/images/Double_Large.jpg

Addict
02-14-2008, 02:36 AM
Well quick question to the Harvey doubters: Do you really think that Jared DeVries or Hawaii Five-O are going to be able to shore up that spot that Kalimba so diligently held down? My answer: hell no. The Giants showed just how much of an importance a pass rush needs to be placed on a defense. I guarantee you that despite the superb season the Colts had the year before that they would have won it had they not had Dwight Freeney. Everything we do in this stupid Tampa 2 is predicated around the pass rush. Dewayne White is adept at stopping the run which kinda makes up for not having an efficient olb behind him. (E Sims was on the other side). He may not be the 15th best player overall, but he is the best pure pass rusher in the draft and one that fits well into our defensive schemes.

Teams with one or two holes should draft need, teams with no holes should draft talent. Teams like the Lions, who have a talent defficiency, need to get some talent in. Essentially we could go BPA and still fill holes with the best possible players.

What would you like more, a killer RB, solid linebacker and good cover 2 corner, who lock down their respective postitions for years to come, or a pick who is essentially a reach who would still keep the position in doubt.

Not saying Harvey would be a reach at 15, but I don't think that, with our lack of real talent on both sides of the ball, we can afford need picks, which usually results in stop-gap solutions.

ESimsfan87
02-14-2008, 09:15 AM
It's allright guys we'll just agree to disagree...That's what makes this forum great.

ironman4579
02-14-2008, 10:07 AM
It's allright guys we'll just agree to disagree...That's what makes this forum great.

Exactly, you're welcome to your opinion. I personally don't see Harvey as a top 15 player. If we traded back and got him later in the first, like in the 20, I wouldn't be too upset. Honestly, we do need pressure in our defense, and I won't deny that Harvey would likely be an upgrade. I just think that there's other players and positions at 15 that we could address that still fill a need and are better players, and I feel Harvey is severely ovverrated right now.

Iamcanadian
02-14-2008, 10:26 AM
Well, Scott isn't the only one saying Harvey is a top prospect, Mike Mayock has him right behind Gholston as #3 DE on his rankings. Harvey has outstanding speed for a DE and can definitely get after the QB. A lot of teams chose to challenge Florida on the ground attacking their young DT's and LB's somewhat limiting Harvey's sack totals.
In all likelyhood he'll be gone before we draft at #15 anyways making this discussion moot. He's definitely considered a better prospect than Moss, a Florida DE who was drafted #17 last year by Denver so he will be drafted in the 10-15 group. We still have the combine and pro days ahead of us and we'll learn more about his measurables after that process, but I still think he would be an excellent prospect for us at #15. At #15, you aren't going to get an elite player, they are all going to have some warts on them that can be picked apart but the fact remains that unless we improve our pass rush, our defense will continue to stink, period.

ironman4579
02-14-2008, 10:45 AM
Well, Scott isn't the only one saying Harvey is a top prospect, Mike Mayock has him right behind Gholston as #3 DE on his rankings. Harvey has outstanding speed for a DE and can definitely get after the QB. A lot of teams chose to challenge Florida on the ground attacking their young DT's and LB's somewhat limiting Harvey's sack totals.
In all likelyhood he'll be gone before we draft at #15 anyways making this discussion moot. He's definitely considered a better prospect than Moss, a Florida DE who was drafted #17 last year by Denver so he will be drafted in the 10-15 group. We still have the combine and pro days ahead of us and we'll learn more about his measurables after that process, but I still think he would be an excellent prospect for us at #15. At #15, you aren't going to get an elite player, they are all going to have some warts on them that can be picked apart but the fact remains that unless we improve our pass rush, our defense will continue to stink, period.

I knew IAC would come in on this one. Thanks for your opinion, I always respect what you have to say. I agree with you that he is ranked highly by basically every "guru" out there, and I certainly won't claim to know more than them, or hell, even most people on this board. I never thought Harvey looked all that fast for his size, and he really seemed (to me at least) to struggle against NFL calibre OT's in college. He seemed to be a little inconsistent this year, recording no sacks in 8 games. And 3 of his sacks came against powerhouses Western Kentucky and Ole Miss. I realize we despately need to improve our pass rush. I'm just not sure how much Harvey actually does that. But again, it's personal opinion. I'm not a fan of Harvey's. Obviously many more are. I guess we'll see come workouts and draft day what goes down.

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-14-2008, 12:54 PM
I'd rather obtain Justin Smith in free agency than get Derrick Harvey. Who knows how Harvey is against the run. Plus he is far from a proven commodity. Harvey is living off that National Championship game, where he beat down the Right Tackle for Ohio State not Boone. Harvey didn' really have a great year in Florida either because this year everyone was focusing on him instead of having to deal with him and Jarvis Moss.

Justin Smith is more of a jack of all trades. He's not a great pass rusher, but he's a good pass rusher. And he's good against the run, which we need instead of getting a pure pass rusher. Pretty much an Aaron Kampman type with better measurables than Kampman. And I know teams have to double team him and he can still produce with a double team on him. Justin Smith would be worth the contract if it means we get a legitimate known commodity plus have a young developing Ikaika.

Scotty D
02-14-2008, 03:57 PM
Justin Smith would be a good pick up. I actually think he gets a contract similar to the one that White got last year. Stacy Andrews from the Bengals is another guy we should throw money at. He emerged at RT for teh Bengals when Anderson went down.

jason96r
02-15-2008, 12:50 PM
I agree I really hope the Lions sign Justin Smith. We could then pick up Tommy Blake late because if he pulls his head out he could be one of those late round studs the Lions never get.

Addict
02-15-2008, 12:52 PM
I agree I really hope the Lions sign Justin Smith. We could then pick up Tommy Blake late because if he pulls his head out he could be one of those late round studs the Lions never get.

well if we never get a late round stud it's hard to imagine him going to us, isn't it?

Justin Smith isn't a good fit in the cover 2

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-15-2008, 04:45 PM
I'm getting sick of the Cover 2. Or maybe just the way the Lions run it. Probably the latter. Plus having to settle for crappier players that fit the system.

Its fully of crappy corners who can't cover and are slow (thus they play zone), and pint sized LBs and DE's. Plus you sit back and wait for everyone to make a mistake. Bad idea, especially against good QBs. Unless everyone is playing perfectly or you have Bob Sanders/Brian Urlacher, then it doesn't work.

If Marinelli can't do it this year, I want an aggressive defense.

detroit4life
02-15-2008, 08:18 PM
I'm getting sick of the Cover 2. Or maybe just the way the Lions run it. Probably the latter. Plus having to settle for crappier players that fit the system.

Its fully of crappy corners who can't cover and are slow (thus they play zone), and pint sized LBs and DE's. Plus you sit back and wait for everyone to make a mistake. Bad idea, especially against good QBs. Unless everyone is playing perfectly or you have Bob Sanders/Brian Urlacher, then it doesn't work.

If Marinelli can't do it this year, I want an aggressive defense.

realize that the longer we build for this defense the less likely we'll go to an agressive defense. We cant finally get all the players for a cover two and then scrap it and have a bunch of players can't play another system. Your looking at another 3 years of rebuilding. You cant give up on the cover two yet because we dont have the personel yet to play the cover 2. Once we get the right players the cover 2 gets easy. You just need to give it another year. Right now we're lacking a DE and CBs. We have our safetys and Sims is playing great right now. If we can get a true pass rushing DE and a CB or two that actually fit our system this defense will do some good stuff. Look at when we were winnign our defense was pretty aggressive as it was. They forced a lot of turnovers and that was because they were getting some good pressure. If we get another DE to add to that and the CBs that fit our defense is looking pretty good. Also a MLB....

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-16-2008, 06:37 AM
Well Millen isn't doing a very good job of adding Cover 2 players then. He pretty much experimented with the players he drafted in Bailey,Lehman,Stanely Wilson,Keith Smith etc(who were thought to be Cover 2 guys). Bailey is a pretty good Cover 2 fit and all last season I read how Wilson fit the system. But both obviously didn't work out. Fernando Bryant is our number 1 corner and he doesn't really fit the bill of a Cover 2 corner. Travis Fisher fits the Cover 2 corner but he's terrible. I just don't see someone like Godfrey or Cason putting this secondary over the top. Is Redding a Cover 2 fit or just someone who played well in a contract year?

DE we added White from Tampa which works but Ikaika and DeVries I wouldn't consider Cover 2 Des. Marinelli thought Kalimba was a Cover 2 guy when he started here because he obviously had a say in resigning him and obviously that experiment failed.

I agree its too late to scrap it, but we're already trying to add a MLB,SLB,DE, and 2 CBs, which is almost like rebuilding a whole D. And if we trade Rogers, add DT to that list. This offseason is huge for our D.

I agree we were a little more aggressive earlier in the year,but that was against bad/inexperienced QBS and teams without a running game. When we played against good teams with a good running game and good QB, we went into that Cover 2 shell and waited to get picked apart.

Addict
02-16-2008, 07:06 AM
Well Millen isn't doing a very good job of adding Cover 2 players then.



first there's this, then this:



He pretty much experimented with the players he drafted in Bailey,Lehman,Stanely Wilson,Keith Smith etc(who were thought to be Cover 2 guys). Bailey is a pretty good Cover 2 fit and all last season I read how Wilson fit the system. But both obviously didn't work out. Fernando Bryant is our number 1 corner and he doesn't really fit the bill of a Cover 2 corner. Travis Fisher fits the Cover 2 corner but he's terrible. I just don't see someone like Godfrey or Cason putting this secondary over the top. Is Redding a Cover 2 fit or just someone who played well in a contract year?

DE we added White from Tampa which works but Ikaika and DeVries I wouldn't consider Cover 2 Des. Marinelli thought Kalimba was a Cover 2 guy when he started here because he obviously had a say in resigning him and obviously that experiment failed.


then this... suddenly all the additions are either good fits or seemed good fits at the time.. I don't see your point really. IAF was brougt in to play DT I believe, and DeVries we've had for years and he's pre-Marinelli I think.




I agree its too late to scrap it, but we're already trying to add a MLB,SLB,DE, and 2 CBs, which is almost like rebuilding a whole D. And if we trade Rogers, add DT to that list. This offseason is huge for our D.
I agree we were a little more aggressive earlier in the year,but that was against bad/inexperienced QBS and teams without a running game. When we played against good teams with a good running game and good QB, we went into that Cover 2 shell and waited to get picked apart.

here's where you start making sense.

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-16-2008, 10:46 AM
The key phrase is they "seemed" to fit the Cover 2, according to Marinelli/Millen. Marinelli and Millen thought they fit going from year 1 to year 2. They were either wrong on their assessment of "fitting" or the players are so bad that they don't play well in the schemes they fit in. Bailey,Lehman,Wilson,Keith Smith, Kennoy Kennedy,Travis Fisher,Fernando Bryant, Kalimba Edwards, Paris Lenon. A huge chunk of the defense. On the other hand, Bly didn't "fit" but had better production than any of our corners this year.

Ikaika/Bullocks/Alexander are to be determined. Bullocks twin brother plays in a defense that doesn't run a Cover 2. Ikaika is more of a base end. He could become a DT but why draft DT when we already have Redding/Rogers. Rogers pretty much will fit any scheme because he has talent, even though its wasted half the time. Redding had one good year and has a good attitude. White fits but cant' play consistently for an entire year. And Sims is the only perfect fit that also plays well.

I guess I'm sick of settling with players that don't have talent but fit the Cover2. And I don't understand the philosophy behind the defense when we play good QBs that know how to exploit the Cover 2 to just sit back and wait for them to pick us apart. If the front 4 isn't working, create pressure another way.

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-16-2008, 12:08 PM
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/aqib-talib?id=1302

Talib can support the run and is better suited to play zone. Scott says he doesn't fit a Cover 2. Who should I believe?

jason96r
02-16-2008, 06:32 PM
I really like Brandon Flowers.

detroit4life
02-16-2008, 06:37 PM
i like cason and chevis jackson a lot both would be great for our defense

Iamcanadian
02-17-2008, 12:50 AM
The key phrase is they "seemed" to fit the Cover 2, according to Marinelli/Millen. Marinelli and Millen thought they fit going from year 1 to year 2. They were either wrong on their assessment of "fitting" or the players are so bad that they don't play well in the schemes they fit in. Bailey,Lehman,Wilson,Keith Smith, Kennoy Kennedy,Travis Fisher,Fernando Bryant, Kalimba Edwards, Paris Lenon. A huge chunk of the defense. On the other hand, Bly didn't "fit" but had better production than any of our corners this year.

Ikaika/Bullocks/Alexander are to be determined. Bullocks twin brother plays in a defense that doesn't run a Cover 2. Ikaika is more of a base end. He could become a DT but why draft DT when we already have Redding/Rogers. Rogers pretty much will fit any scheme because he has talent, even though its wasted half the time. Redding had one good year and has a good attitude. White fits but cant' play consistently for an entire year. And Sims is the only perfect fit that also plays well.

I guess I'm sick of settling with players that don't have talent but fit the Cover2. And I don't understand the philosophy behind the defense when we play good QBs that know how to exploit the Cover 2 to just sit back and wait for them to pick us apart. If the front 4 isn't working, create pressure another way.

I think it is a huge mistake to blame Marinelli for his defense. I really think the blame lies with Millen and ends there. Other teams find decent Cover 2 players every draft but Millen is lucky if he adds one if that. People keep saying that Marinelli has a huge imput into the draft, I don't buy it. I think Millen did in the past and continues to draft players he believes in whether the HC likes it or not. Marinelli is just not the type of guy who complains about the man who gave him a shot. I do think Millen took impute from Martz but I just don't see Marinelli stamp on last year's draft at all. If one thing stands out in Millen's career as a drafter, it is that he calls the shots and HC's just have to accept what he provides which hasn't amounted to much.
As for the Cover 2 itself, it is a very solid defense if you have the personnel to run it which we aren't close to having. So far Marinelli has come out of the last draft as the forgotten man. Millen left him high and dry when he selected first Johnson and then Stanton with our early picks. Martz had his ear and now we are talking about trading Williams while another Cover 2 team drafted defense right after us and made the playoffs.
We are going to draft defense this year, at least I hope so but when the guy in control has drafted WR's 4 times in round 1, who the -ell knows what to expect. I sure don't and I doubt Marinelli has a clue either.

Maybe Next Year Millen2
02-17-2008, 10:41 AM
I think it is a huge mistake to blame Marinelli for his defense. I really think the blame lies with Millen and ends there. Other teams find decent Cover 2 players every draft but Millen is lucky if he adds one if that. People keep saying that Marinelli has a huge imput into the draft, I don't buy it. I think Millen did in the past and continues to draft players he believes in whether the HC likes it or not. Marinelli is just not the type of guy who complains about the man who gave him a shot. I do think Millen took impute from Martz but I just don't see Marinelli stamp on last year's draft at all. If one thing stands out in Millen's career as a drafter, it is that he calls the shots and HC's just have to accept what he provides which hasn't amounted to much.
As for the Cover 2 itself, it is a very solid defense if you have the personnel to run it which we aren't close to having. So far Marinelli has come out of the last draft as the forgotten man. Millen left him high and dry when he selected first Johnson and then Stanton with our early picks. Martz had his ear and now we are talking about trading Williams while another Cover 2 team drafted defense right after us and made the playoffs.
We are going to draft defense this year, at least I hope so but when the guy in control has drafted WR's 4 times in round 1, who the -ell knows what to expect. I sure don't and I doubt Marinelli has a clue either.

I agree it all boils down to Millen sticking with some of his guys like Keith Smith,Bailey,Lehman,Wilson, Kalimba Edwards, Kennoy Kennedy. I really do think Marinelli has a lot of input though and Marinelli thought he could coach these guys up and that they fit the Cover 2. That obviousy didn't work, which just makes 2007 a wasted year because we have to rebuild so much with many new players. If the defense needed like 2 players to make it work I wouldn't mind, but we need 5-6.

Sims,Bullocks,Ikaika, and Alexander are all Marinelli guys. Bullocks injury was unfortuante and the jury is still out on Bullocks,Ikaika and Alexander(who had an ok season). Plus the fact that we spent some money on DeWayne White probably helped Millen/Martz go for CJ instead of Gaines Adams. A lot is riding on these guys for Marinelli this year. They need to step back up big time except for Sims who just has to continue what he is doing. But even if they do, one guy seems like it can cause the entire defense to fall apart.

The Cover 2 is solid against bad QBs. Whenver we faced a team with a veteran QB and a running game it was awful and we just stuck with the awful game plan because that is all the coaches know. It seems like with this system if you have one player that doesn't fit or is terrible, the entire defense suffers. You can't mask the play of terrible players like in other systems. For instance Chicago this year lost Tank Johnson. Their entire defense suffered even though they have Urlacher,Briggs,Ogunleye,Harris(who was injured some),Tillman etc. Plus the fact that you pretty much settle for less talented players IMO. Corners that aren't speedy or have any man cover skills and LBs that are small are just the opposite of what that positions job descriptions should be.

And as for Calvin Johnson, if the reason we got Calvin is just to replace Roy, that is incredbile stupidity. You don't draft a WR just to replace a good WR who is in his prime. If Roy was 32 years old, I could see that, but he's in his prime. The reason we got Calvin was because he was BPA by far and it would take incredible pressure off of Roy and open up the running game and red zone offense. With both of those players, we can focus on the running game because we can run 2 WR sets with Roy and Calvin and still be successful through the air. Having Dan Campbell back with a full back for KJ and Duckett should make us a better running team. Roy and Calvin are also big WR that can block. I can't see Furrey or McDonald blocking anyone.