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jetsfan0099
03-18-2008, 10:12 AM
Could Keith Rivers be a great ILB in the 3-4??? The Jets are privately working him out, so It got me thinking, maybe he would be our 1st round selection, hes the top LB in this draft, and we now have a hole at ILB with Vilma gone. Would Rivers be a good ILB to pair up with David Harris??

TACKLE
03-18-2008, 10:19 AM
Yes.

He's got the size and ability to shed blocks that you look foor in a 3-4 ILB. It would probably help if he gained 5-10lbs because ILB's need to be big. Because of his speed, Rivers would play MIKE(weakside ILB) and Harris would play MAC(strongside ILB)

IndyColtScout
03-18-2008, 10:40 AM
I agree, Yes.

Rivers is going #6 or #7. IMO the Jets take DRC at #6 and the Pats take Rivers at #7. I personally don't see why the Jets would need to draft Rivers. The Jets already have their starting LB core IMO in Thomas & Pace (outside) and Harris and whomever they choose from Barton, Kassell, Hobson (inside). I don't see why the Jets would want to add another ISLB.

The Pats however could really use Rivers.

jetsfan0099
03-18-2008, 11:42 AM
I agree, Yes.

Rivers is going #6 or #7. IMO the Jets take DRC at #6 and the Pats take Rivers at #7. I personally don't see why the Jets would need to draft Rivers. The Jets already have their starting LB core IMO in Thomas & Pace (outside) and Harris and whomever they choose from Barton, Kassell, Hobson (inside). I don't see why the Jets would want to add another ISLB.

The Pats however could really use Rivers.

Hobson is a UFA, and is not coming back. And Kassell is mainly a back up/ ST player, he isn't capable of starting. Barton is a pretty good player, but is 30, so the need for depth is there. I agree that is early to take a ILB, probably should get a guy later, especially already having a stud in David Harris. But I'm just looking at possibilties. I can see Rivers on the Pats. They need a CB really badly though, but they will probably sign Ty Law, that can buy them time I guess to take a CB later.

bigbluedefense
03-18-2008, 12:08 PM
what are you guys talkin about? theres no way in hell Rivers is a 3-4 ILB.

IndyColtScout
03-18-2008, 12:16 PM
Why is there no way in hell? Rivers can get off blocks, he eats space, he's got speed, and his frame has room to add weight.

Not saying he's a perfect fit, but for a team like NE that runs a hybrid D, he would be perfect.

Larry121283
03-18-2008, 12:19 PM
I think he could be.

I don't know if that would be his best position, but I think he could fit into a 34 defense.

terribletowel39
03-18-2008, 12:26 PM
I'm more inclined to agree with BBD. But while he isn't a good fit, he probably could play it. Just would waste a lot of his abilities. It would be a waste of a pick at the 10-15 range if that were the intentions of use. It's the same reason Miami won't be picking up Dorsey, he doesn't fit in the 34. He could do it, just would be a waste.

nikkayeah
03-18-2008, 12:27 PM
rivers can't shed blocks

Paranoidmoonduck
03-18-2008, 12:31 PM
Could he do it? Yes. However, it is probably the least ideal position for the guy, and he's definitely not a good enough fit to be worth a top 10 pick (if a 3-4 ILB ever is worth such a pick).

I'm fairly sure whoever drafts him will use him as a 4-3 OLB.

bigbluedefense
03-18-2008, 12:35 PM
I'm more inclined to agree with BBD. But while he isn't a good fit, he probably could play it. Just would waste a lot of his abilities. It would be a waste of a pick at the 10-15 range if that were the intentions of use. It's the same reason Miami won't be picking up Dorsey, he doesn't fit in the 34. He could do it, just would be a waste.

yeah thats how i feel about it, although i think he'd be a below avg ILB in the 3-4.

hes a star 4-3 WILL, thats what he'll play.

Burns336
03-18-2008, 01:51 PM
in a 3-4 he would have to have a role like Donnie Edwards did when he played on the Chargers under Wade Phillips.

A Perfect Score
03-18-2008, 02:24 PM
it makes no sense to put him there its a waste of his talents. Rivers has trouble at the POA, that has always been one of the knocks on him. Hes a star will. why mess with that. If it aint broken, dont fix it.

even if he did play in a 3-4, it would not be in one like bill bilichek or mangini run. If you recall, guyslike vraebel and thomas (both 270 lbs) have played ILB for bill, and then bruschi and seau are not small guys either. Rivers just doesnt fit the system. ANd mangini just traded his star LB, vilma, to the saints because he didnt fit his system. Hmmm, a slightly undersized LB with excellent speed but who struggles at teh POA...sounds familiar?

toonsterwu
03-18-2008, 02:56 PM
Really a side note, but I can see Tampa 2 teams consider Rivers for the MIKE position.

Can he play 3-4 ILB? Sure. I can see him developing as he matures and becoming perhaps James Farrior like, but the chances are still greater that he's only average as a 3-4 ILB.

Rivers might be the hardest individual player to slot. The first inclination I have with him is at 9, but that's if both DT's are off the board. New Orleans is a long thought ... but I'm just not inclined to see it. The next team would be Detroit, but the board would have to be seriously devoid of OL/RB/DL options. Prior to the small signings, I would've pondered Houston, but that seems unlikely now. Philly's been bandied about, but I don't see it.

A team probably surprises and nabs him earlier, but I can see a scenario where he plummets to the 20's.

DraftKidWonder
03-18-2008, 04:29 PM
I made kind of a joke mock draft where N.Y. traded down to 9 and they picked him up as a play side ILB. I think he could play that position well and help improve that defense against the run and dropback in the pass.

no love
03-18-2008, 07:23 PM
Why is there no way in hell? Rivers can get off blocks, he eats space, he's got speed, and his frame has room to add weight.

Not saying he's a perfect fit, but for a team like NE that runs a hybrid D, he would be perfect.

If it's such a hybrid D, why on earth did you get rid of Vilma, who was a star 4-3 mlb before they implemented their 34.

Bradyjackson12
03-18-2008, 08:19 PM
Rivers is a lot better in coverage than Vilma and plays a more physical game. Right now I think that Rivers is a better 4-3 OLB but he has the size and the blitzing ability to play in a scheme like new englang. He played a kind of blitzing end at USC. For those who are saying that he's undersized, i'm not saying that he's the biggest LB ever but he's 6-2 and 240, last time I've check, Bruschi is 6-1 250. Bulk him up 5 to 10 pounds and he'll be bigger.

eaglesalltheway
03-19-2008, 01:15 PM
what are you guys talkin about? theres no way in hell Rivers is a 3-4 ILB.

Its about time someone said something intelligent...

Big_Pete
03-19-2008, 05:42 PM
If you are looking for a 3-4 ILB, there are alot of guys who are much better fits.
(eg: Dan Connor, Curtis Lofton, Philip Wheeler, Jerod Mayo, Erin Henderson, Beau Bell, Jonathan Goff etc)

Also teams looking for 3-4 ILBs, generally don't draft them in the first round.

I think Keith Rivers is pretty much a pure 4-3 WLB; he is better playing in space and does not do well in heavy traffic.

I think even a Tampa 2 MLB is not an ideal fit for Rivers.

Why try and make Rivers something he is not? If you want a LB who uses speed and athleticism to make plays in the open field, then Rivers is certainly your man. If you want any other LB position, there are other guys who are better fits.

Billingsley26
03-20-2008, 12:35 AM
yeah thats how i feel about it, although i think he'd be a below avg ILB in the 3-4.

hes a star 4-3 WILL, thats what he'll play.

Yes sir. Agree 100%. No on the 3-4 ILB. Heck, Id call it a long shot to play MIKE in the 4-3. He is a through and through OLB whether a 3-4 or 4-3. He just doesnt have those qualities for a 3-4 ILB.

If you want to know what I mean by qualities, check J Leman. To me, he screams out 3-4 ILB.

TNPatsFan
03-20-2008, 09:06 PM
I'm a Pats fan and fan of Rivers. I think he's going to be this year's Patrick Willis, and basically become a star LB even in his rookie year. So of course I've been trying to come up with a good reason why the Pats should draft him. I've seen him projected a lot as an ILB for 3-4 teams but I don't see it. I see him as an OLB. Now we know the Pats like BIG LB's (McGinest was 275, Vrabel is around 270), but I think Rivers could play Rosie Colvin's spot. Colvin was 6-3, 250, so not that much bigger than Rivers. Colvin was better in coverage and occasional blitzes. He wasn't the relentless pass rusher and run stuffer that Vrabel is. That's why they played him on Richard Seymour's side, because Seymour would take up 2 blockers, leaving more room for Rosie to work against the run. Am I way off base or couldn't Rivers play that spot? I think he'd be great there, and the Pats could sure use his speed.

Big_Pete
03-24-2008, 06:29 PM
I'm a Pats fan and fan of Rivers. I think he's going to be this year's Patrick Willis, and basically become a star LB even in his rookie year. So of course I've been trying to come up with a good reason why the Pats should draft him. I've seen him projected a lot as an ILB for 3-4 teams but I don't see it. I see him as an OLB. Now we know the Pats like BIG LB's (McGinest was 275, Vrabel is around 270), but I think Rivers could play Rosie Colvin's spot. Colvin was 6-3, 250, so not that much bigger than Rivers. Colvin was better in coverage and occasional blitzes. He wasn't the relentless pass rusher and run stuffer that Vrabel is. That's why they played him on Richard Seymour's side, because Seymour would take up 2 blockers, leaving more room for Rosie to work against the run. Am I way off base or couldn't Rivers play that spot? I think he'd be great there, and the Pats could sure use his speed.


I don't see Rivers as being a great fit for the Pats; I think Chris Long, Vernon Gholston, Jared Mayo, Curtis Lofton, Dan Connor, Cliff Avril, Quentin Groves and Philip Wheeler are better fits for the Patriots system

bigbluedefense
03-24-2008, 06:31 PM
put it this way: Can he do it? Probably.

you can also steer your car with your feet. it doesn't make it a good idea.

thats how i look at it.

sprawwl
03-29-2008, 04:38 PM
For those who are saying that he's undersized, i'm not saying that he's the biggest LB ever but he's 6-2 and 240, last time I've check, Bruschi is 6-1 250. Bulk him up 5 to 10 pounds and he'll be bigger.

No joke that if he gains weight he'll be bigger.

My feeling on him is that he has the potential to be Dan Morgan sans injuries; he's fast and a pretty good tackler, but not real good at fighting through blocks. Not gonna be real good in the 3-4, where the ILB are essentially hybrid DL types.

Dam8610
03-30-2008, 09:13 AM
I always thought of Rivers as a 4-3 WILL, and I wouldn't think a 3-4 team would invest so heavily into a MIKE as the #6 or 7 pick. I'd think both of those teams would love to see Vernon Gholston on the board at their pick, but beyond that or the most unlikely scenario of Chris Long being on the board, those teams will probably go different directions with their early picks. If I'm the Jets and I want a 3-4 MIKE, I grab Jerod Mayo or Curtis Lofton in round 2. If I'm the Pats and I want a 3-4 MIKE, I grab Lofton or Phillip Wheeler in round 2 if I can get them, though I think they'd want an edge talent, and someone like Shawn Crable sticks out to me.

Dam8610
03-30-2008, 09:18 AM
New Orleans is a long thought ... but I'm just not inclined to see it.

Why not, especially if the board falls to where both DTs and the top CB are gone? I like Dan Morgan as a talent, but health and position change are two major concerns to me. Rivers would give them two young stud 4-3 LBs that they could build that LB corps around and it would likely be the best value for them. It just seems to make a ton of sense.

ATLDirtyBirds
03-30-2008, 09:30 AM
I wouldn't do it. When you have talent like Rivers he probably could though. The way I see it, he's MUCH more in the mold of a star 4-3 OLB.

Flyboy
03-30-2008, 10:22 AM
Why not, especially if the board falls to where both DTs and the top CB are gone? I like Dan Morgan as a talent, but health and position change are two major concerns to me. Rivers would give them two young stud 4-3 LBs that they could build that LB corps around and it would likely be the best value for them. It just seems to make a ton of sense.

We're definitely interested in Rivers. If Ellis/Dorsey are both gone or somehow we're not able to trade up for one, then I could easily see Rivers being the pick.

keylime_5
03-30-2008, 12:01 PM
If you are looking for a 3-4 ILB, there are alot of guys who are much better fits.
(eg: Dan Connor, Curtis Lofton, Philip Wheeler, Jerod Mayo, Erin Henderson, Beau Bell, Jonathan Goff etc)

Also teams looking for 3-4 ILBs, generally don't draft them in the first round.

I think Keith Rivers is pretty much a pure 4-3 WLB; he is better playing in space and does not do well in heavy traffic.

I think even a Tampa 2 MLB is not an ideal fit for Rivers.

Why try and make Rivers something he is not? If you want a LB who uses speed and athleticism to make plays in the open field, then Rivers is certainly your man. If you want any other LB position, there are other guys who are better fits.

Keith is about 100x better a fit at ILB in a 3-4 than Connor. Connor is by far best suited for the 4-3, and can play all 3 spots there though he's better off as a WLB. Keith would be a great fit at either ILB spot in a 3-4 and can also play any of the 3 spots in a 4-3, kinda like what most really good athletic 3-4 ILBs do ala Ray Lewis and the like.

fenikz
04-02-2008, 05:59 PM
Kind of a different subject but I didn't think it deserved it's own thread, do you think that Rivers could play 3-4 OLB in a scheme like Arizona's hybrid?

Because a lot of people have the top 3 corners gone by pick 16 and that is about where Rivers' value is now, plus the other two positions of need for us are CB and RB which this draft is very deep in

SimonRath
04-02-2008, 06:01 PM
No joke that if he gains weight he'll be bigger.


hahahaha funny stuff

katnip
04-03-2008, 05:08 PM
Yea. He could put up numbers like Patrick Willis IMO on the Pat's D.