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DawgBone
03-27-2008, 06:58 PM
LSU really outplayed OSU in the national championship game and was clearly the better team. But most exsperts cited team speed for the reason they won. I hate this SEC myth and found some of the LSU combine numbers of their draft eligible players and they dont seem so fast?

Chevis Jackson CB - 4.58 - 4.57
Jonathan Zenon CB - 4.54 - 4.62
Jacob Hester RB - 4.62
Ali Highsmith LB - 4.87 - 4.72
Glenn Dorsey DT - 5.13 - 5.12
Early Doucet WR - 4.59 - 4.64
Matt Flynn QB - 4.8

These times are considered average at best and most are considered to not even be fast enough to play in the NFL.

Vernon Gholston is basically the same speed as their skill position players.

YAYareaRB
03-28-2008, 11:50 AM
It's one thing to have good timed speed but to play fast in a whole other thing.

Turtlepower
03-28-2008, 11:51 AM
Look at combine numbers all you like, but game film is the true measure of teams.

yourfavestoner
03-28-2008, 02:14 PM
Point? Watch the tape of either of the last two National Championship games and tell me which team looked faster.

Hell, both Earl Everrett of Florida and Ali Highsmith of LSU ran in the 4.8s and they seemed like the fastest guys on the field against tOSU.

I'm glad all these Big 10 players run so fast in a straight line though.

keylime_5
03-28-2008, 02:44 PM
Ohio State had just as much speed as LSU. Heck, on defense we had more team speed than they did. LSU won b/c they were a better and more experienced team with a more than 1 dimensional offense and a defense that was much better coached. Ohio State's defensive tackles weren't very good in that game either, nor was the safety play.

YAYareaRB
03-28-2008, 02:55 PM
I thought the only real speed Ohio State showed was Beanie Wells or Malcolm Jenkins.

etk
03-28-2008, 02:59 PM
Thanks DawgBone, for making a point I made 3 months ago. The SEC is a great conference but not because their speed is so superior to other conferences, and LSU is a clear example of this. LSU was a very big and physical team from top to bottom, and they show how speed is overrated in college football.

neko4
03-28-2008, 03:17 PM
4.6 for a FB is pretty good, btw.
But theyre alot faster than there 40s say anyway

YAYareaRB
03-28-2008, 03:21 PM
Thanks DawgBone, for making a point I made 3 months ago. The SEC is a great conference but not because their speed is so superior to other conferences, and LSU is a clear example of this. LSU was a very big and physical team from top to bottom, and they show how speed is overrated in college football.

Check.. Timed Speed is overrated in College Football, or any Football for that matter.

gstock05
03-30-2008, 09:10 PM
A team can be coached to play "faster" if they run different offenses, react faster to the ball, and have room to run for 5 yards every carry because the defensive tackles keep getting blown 4 feet off the line.

islandboy843
03-30-2008, 09:17 PM
I think its more reaction and instincts then speed.

Like Lofa Tatupu said:

Would you rather have a 4.3 guy running crazy or a 4.5 guy who know where the ball is gonig.

Or something like that.

etk
03-30-2008, 09:17 PM
4.6 for a FB is pretty good, btw.
But theyre alot faster than there 40s say anyway

Hester played RB as a Senior and he will play RB in the NFL. 4.6 is fine for a RB and great for a FB.


Check.. Timed Speed is overrated in College Football, or any Football for that matter.

Fine...point taken. It's not like Hester, the DLine or the DBs - Jones play fast anyway though. I'll take a physically imposing team like LSU over a track team (hmm....***tors) any day, but players like Holliday, Byrd, Highsmith (IDC about his 40 time) and Jones help even things out.

etk
03-30-2008, 09:21 PM
I think its more reaction and instincts then speed.

Like Lofa Tatupu said:

Would you rather have a 4.3 guy running crazy or a 4.5 guy who know where the ball is gonig.

Or something like that.

Hmm....good quote. I'm not sure if I'd take Rey Maualaga (insane closing speed) or Tatupu (instincts are unreal because he studies opponents so well).

As Mayock was saying at the Senior Bowl....Keith Rivers flies all over the field but Dan Connor makes the same amount of plays because he diagnoses plays quickly and knows pursuit angles well. Then there are players that combine the two, like Derrick Brooks.

keylime_5
03-31-2008, 09:18 AM
This thing was beaten to death on about every OSU board like 2 years ago, but that Tatupu quote sums it up. Watch the Florida game and it becomes clear how the read/react by OSU's defense and how confused they look made it a lot easier for Florida, but I don't wanna go there- that was a sad day.

504 to ATL
04-01-2008, 04:15 PM
I did not know that a short yardage/between the tackles guy(Hester) needed to be extremely fast. Nor a non option QB.

Ali was weak in coverage due to his lack of speed that was clearly evident. Chevis' lack of speed never cost him though since his bump technique was very well pulled off, and Ohio State never threw deep but once.

keylime_5
04-01-2008, 04:27 PM
Ohio State threw deep about 5 times that game, the only time any WR got seperation deep was Robiskie in the endzone on a ball that he bobbled (it was tipped first though, so not that much seperation). But Ray Small not getting open was 100% due to his bad route running and ball skills and 0% to do with his speed. Small was a 4.35 guy being covered by a 4.6 guy, there's more to football than running straight lines.

etk
04-01-2008, 05:08 PM
OSU tried to go deep a lot after LSU built a solid lead, but Jackson and Zenon had top-notch coverage and Robiskie wasn't getting separation. Then the coverage sacks started piling up and everyone gave up on Boeckman for it. Boeckman understands ball security and I think he will bounce back this year with that experience under his belt.

YAYareaRB
04-01-2008, 08:23 PM
On the National Championship, I think tOSU gave up on the run way too easy. I mean, they were behind but Beanie was just beginning to heat up and well.. I dunno, I couldn't really tell the future at the time but I was scared of his gamebreaking ability.

etk pretty much summed it up a couple post back. Having a physical team really does pay off. At my school, my coach really stresses foot work as much as speed, maybe even more.

keylime_5
04-01-2008, 08:57 PM
Giving up 28 or 25 unanswered points kinda made the how well you could run the ball or not a very moot point. And it's not like we abandoned the run, we came out running in the second half but the defense still didn't execute very well and never stopped them until it was too late. It's like etk said, but it's not like I haven't seen this debate or these points over 2 1/2 months ago, water under the bridge. The one good thing out of that game was Beanie, I can't wait to watch what he's gonna do this year. If he had 1600+ yds. and 14 or however many TDs in 2007 and a near 6.0 ypc while hurt with a much less experienced team around him imagine what he'll do healthy in 2008 with a more explosive offense around him.

YAYareaRB
04-01-2008, 09:16 PM
tOSU will definitely be my pick for one of the spots in NC. Wayyyy too much talent coming back to be out of it. But I also Florida going back in. OH YYYYEAH

etk
04-01-2008, 09:19 PM
tOSU will definitely be my pick for one of the spots in NC. Wayyyy too much talent coming back to be out of it. But I also Florida going back in. OH YYYYEAH

You forgot Point A as to why OSU will be in the NC.....the Big 10. The only conference where you can fall asleep the whole season and not wake up until the 2nd half of the NC when you're getting spanked by a team from a good conference. Seriously though....OSU will always be handicapped by not only their conference opponents but also the huge gap between their last game and bowl game.

keylime_5
04-01-2008, 09:27 PM
I don't think the layoff is really that big a deal at all, the tackling wasn't bad against LSU (save for that Doucet TD in the 4th qtr) which is about all you lose by a layoff. Yeah, the big ten has been down the past 2 or 3 years, but we play USC this year and next and then Miami in 2010 and 11 and we do have a home and home with Tennessee in 2018 (after Tressel will probably be retired, heh) so it's not like our OOC schedule will be like it was in 2007 very often at all. The problem is certailny not the talent considering the number of draft picks we've put up under Tressel, it's been the little things. Our defense was decent in 2006 but got lit up by Florida and Michigan, and in 2007 our defense was very good but the DTs were soft and inexperienced and JL/Freeman are great but no Hawk/Carpenter. Hopefully the defense can put it together this year and we can take home the big crystal ball for a change.

YAYareaRB
04-02-2008, 12:05 AM
Oh **** you play SC? That's pretty crazy. My hats off to Tressell, he wants to make a statement next season.

504 to ATL
04-02-2008, 09:14 PM
No one knows what to expect fro USC either this coming year. Their "core" of leaders is gone, sure they have immense talent waiting in the wings but who knows if they can piece it all together.