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sweetness34
04-28-2008, 07:20 PM
Only 364 more days! :D

It's kinda hard to predict what needs we'll have but we could use some more OL help next year, possibly a QB, some more DL depth...And possibly some WR's again depending on who steps up and who doesn't.

Obviously grabbing a guy like Oher would be awesome, or a guy like Crabtree but that would mean a bad year and I don't want that. Looks like a pretty good OL class next year on paper with some depth which is good.

QB wise it looks kinda weak right now unless the Jr's like Tebow, Stafford, Sanchez, etc declare.

dabears10
04-28-2008, 07:40 PM
On Board for the Dan Lefevor Bandwagon. Yeah, he probably won't be a top pick or anything I just like to watch him play, and he probably will not declare. But besides that he's Dan Lefevor.

bearfan
04-28-2008, 08:14 PM
Who needs Forte clap clap clapclap clap!
KoShown Moreno clap clap clapclap clap!

regoob2
04-28-2008, 09:14 PM
Heyward-Bay in the 1st and Mark Sanchez in the 2nd. I like Sanchez.

devinhester=R.O.Y 2006
04-28-2008, 09:57 PM
On Board for the Dan Lefevor Bandwagon. Yeah, he probably won't be a top pick or anything I just like to watch him play, and he probably will not declare. But besides that he's Dan Lefevor.

I like LeFevour. I actually played basketball against him in high school.

skeet3r
04-29-2008, 02:26 PM
I like LeFevour. I actually played basketball against him in high school.
Where'd you go to High School? I play High School football against him...

devinhester=R.O.Y 2006
04-29-2008, 02:42 PM
Where'd you go to High School? I play High School football against him...

I played basketball against him when I was at Holy Cross High School as a sophomore. Then my school switched conferences from the East Suburban Catholic Conference to the Chicago Catholic League. Unfortunately a year later my school closed. I graduated from Guerin High School back in June of 2005.

Bearsfan123
04-29-2008, 02:59 PM
1st rd: Courtney Greene Safety
2nd rd: OG or T
3rd: QB

Bearsfan123
08-13-2008, 06:27 PM
Redone:

Trade Down from 7th overall to 24th acquiring 56th overall and 2nd rder next year. (Fair deal, no, but I think the Bears would come out the better for it)
24th: Duke Robinson G- Gives us a legitimate guard to take over for Garza if Beekman does well on the left side. Should give our running game some oomph.

39th:Courtney Greene S- No im not giving this up. We need a good safety and sadly we keep trying to fill it in the 4th or fifth rds. Yes we are good on the second day with defensive guys but we shouldnt rely on it. Case and point Mike Brown and Brandon McGowan are our starters. Both are injury prone and unless Kevin Payne stays healthy and is a revelation we will have no one with experience left. Then our scheme will be screwed.

56th- Rudy Carpenter QB- After seeing him in another mock ive become attached to this idea. Carpenter is fiery, emotional, and competitive. Something we have lacked at the QB position in awhile. His attitude kinda reminds me of Favre or McMahan. Injury concerns allow him to fall here more so than anything else IMO.

71st-Xavier Fulton OT- Okay my homer pick. I want JA to show willingness to upgrade the trenches. He can be groomed behind Tait for a year or two and then take over the right tackle spot.

Now ill address some things that Im sure will pass through most Bears fans minds.
1- Where is the Wide Receiver? We have committed a ton of money to Hester to be a great WR, now this year (the 08 season) he isnt going to get a fair chance with our bad o-line (which also makes the running game paltry) and weak qb play, so I am suggesting we give him 2 years before we make our move for another WR in the first 3 rds. That is unless a huge value falls to us. (Bey in the second for an example)

2 Why not QB earlier? Frankly the QB crop is rather weak. A bunch of second tier prospects with maybe 2 studs in Bradford and Stafford. I'm betting only one comes out leaving us with little options for an earlier pick. Plus as I said earlier I love Carpenter's emotion.

3. Terrible trade for us in value! Yes I realize this. We are essentially losing 300 points of value, but a top ten pick makes alot of money. This class looks to be heavy in tackles and ILBs and frankly we cant afford to pick a MLB top 10 with Urlacher still here and we just picked a guy in Williams this past draft to be our LT of the future so no player worth the pick for us. At runningback I think we have TJ version2 in Forte so Im happy with that. So we trade down, dont quite get value but we do get 2 guys who should be stalwarts for us for years. Plus the next years second gives us a good trade chip if necessary.

Smokey Joe
08-13-2008, 07:42 PM
If we don't get a top signal caller like Stafford, I would then prefer us to go after some more OLine help. In Scott's mock, he has us going with Heyward-Bay, but I would much rather go with Andre Smith. Sure, we spent a top 15 pick last on the OLine, but it still needs help. And a good OLine makes everyone on the team better.

Hopefully Williams would return next year and play LT, then we put Smith at LG, and possibly even eventually replace Tait at RT.

Bearsfan123
08-13-2008, 07:45 PM
im all for upgrading the o-line but two top 15 picks on it? Even I find that a bit extreme.

bearsfan_51
08-13-2008, 07:48 PM
http://nutupgators.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/superteabow.jpg

Forgive them Tebow, for they know not what they do.

Smokey Joe
08-13-2008, 07:57 PM
im all for upgrading the o-line but two top 15 picks on it? Even I find that a bit extreme.
The O-Line is the only position on the field that can make everyone on the team better. A good OLine gives the QB time to throw and keeps him healthy, and because of that, it leads to receivers getting open. A good OLine opens up holes for a decent RB and turns them into an All-Pro. A good OLine gives an offense the ability to sustain long drives and keep the D rested.

Some say QB is the most important position, but that's ********. Oline is easily the most important position as they have the ability to turn decent players into all-pros.

Smokey Joe
08-13-2008, 07:58 PM
http://nutupgators.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/superteabow.jpg

Forgive them Tebow, for they know not what they do.

If Tebow is as godly as you say he is, he won't be around for when the Bears pick...

And Tebow is extremely overrated. If he couldn't run, he wouldn't be considered a 1st day prospect, IMO.

bearsfan_51
08-13-2008, 08:00 PM
You could say the same thing about Randall Cunningham and Vince Young. I'm not sure when being able to run became a bad thing for a quarterback.

I think Tebow has become extremely underrated by people that want to be in the know by bashing him. Let's talk about Stafford who has a 26/23 TD/INT ratio and a 54.5% completion percentage. He's a top prospect why?


And the Bears are going to suck next year. We probably won't have a top 5 pick, but nothing would suprise me.

Smokey Joe
08-13-2008, 08:03 PM
You could say the same thing about Randall Cunningham and Vince Young. I'm not sure when being able to run became a bad thing for a quarterback.

I think Tebow has become extremely underrated by people that want to be in the know by bashing him. Let's talk about Stafford who has a 26/23 TD/INT ratio and a 54.5% completion percentage. He's a top prospect why?


And the Bears are going to suck next year. We probably won't have a top 5 pick, but nothing would suprise me.
You just like him because he's "dreamy." Admit it!

Bearsfan123
08-13-2008, 08:05 PM
http://nutupgators.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/superteabow.jpg

Forgive them Tebow, for they know not what they do.


*shudder* I plan on taking this "joke" head on! I actually watched some of his highlight tapes and I came away unimpressed for pro potential. The man is a player at the college level but in the pros I think he is not gonna translate. His arm strength is good, and he is a strong fast runner. Ill even admit his motion is better than Vy's is. BUT, his accuracy is severely lacking. With this thought in my mind, I cannot fathom why the Bears could consider him. For his athleticism is not Vy's level, and his running style does not suit the pro's either.

Hes from the same school as a certain QB that most of Chicago no longer likes. He is short like that same QB. Both played out of the shotgun alot. Tebow is a better player, but all of those Florida connections to Grossman are for the worse. I dont think JA could even take a chance on him.


PLEASE I BEG THEE, NO JOKES ABOUT TEBOW!! PLEEEEEAAASSEE!!


thank you come again. ^_^

Bearsfan123
08-13-2008, 08:09 PM
The O-Line is the only position on the field that can make everyone on the team better. A good OLine gives the QB time to throw and keeps him healthy, and because of that, it leads to receivers getting open. A good OLine opens up holes for a decent RB and turns them into an All-Pro. A good OLine gives an offense the ability to sustain long drives and keep the D rested.

Some say QB is the most important position, but that's ********. Oline is easily the most important position as they have the ability to turn decent players into all-pros.

Thats cool and I agree, but I think thats too much money to invest on two guys that if they dont pan out we would be screwed for years. Id rather minimize the risk by trading down getting a guy who may not have the overall ceiling that the first had but comes with less risk. Now im not saying trading down is always the answer but in this fictional case I feel its the best option.

bearsfan_51
08-13-2008, 08:15 PM
Just as a side note, I absolutely hate the "so and so went to ___ college" argument. It makes absolutely zero sense. Tim Tebow and Rex Grossman have absolutely nothing in common. It's not even the same playing style, offensive scheme, home state, etc.

And we need a quarterback. We NEEEEEED a quarterback. Tebow could just take the ball and run it up the middle and that'd be an improvement over what we have now.

Smokey Joe
08-13-2008, 08:25 PM
It's tough to take someone seriously when they have Carlos Gomez as their sig...

Bearsfan123
08-13-2008, 08:28 PM
Just as a side note, I absolutely hate the "so and so went to ___ college" argument. It makes absolutely zero sense. Tim Tebow and Rex Grossman have absolutely nothing in common. It's not even the same playing style, offensive scheme, home state, etc.

And we need a quarterback. We NEEEEEED a quarterback. Tebow could just take the ball and run it up the middle and that'd be an improvement over what we have now.

You are absolutely right. It does not make a difference to the players. But if you look from a general public view, we took another guy whos short, plays alot out of the shotgun, and is from Florida. It just looks bad. Its like if after the Curtis Enis fiasco we had gone back and drafted another 1st rd runningback out of Penn State it would look bad.

MidwayMonster31
08-13-2008, 08:37 PM
I agree that we have to get a quarterback, what else is new? I think Tebow is very talented, his work ethic and character about as great as it gets. The problem is that he still has a long (http://walterfootball.com/tebow.php) way to go as a pocket-passer. I am not confident that the Bears are capable of developing a quarterback, period.
Supposedly, Hunter Cantwell has the best stuff (arm strength, mechanics, accuracy, etc.) out of the quarterbacks, but he is unproven.
I think Cullen Harper can have himself a very good year at Clemson and move into the first round. It may require trading down to get the best value out of him. He has good accuracy, leadership and work ethic. He is also one of the most polished quarterbacks. His arm strength is not spectacular, but it is good enough.

bearsfan_51
08-13-2008, 09:49 PM
If the Bears are not capable of developing a quarterback then we'll never have one. Every quarterback needs developing from college.

And he's 6'3", that's not really short.

I'm quite the fan of Walter btw, and he agrees with me. The other guy is an idiot, for multiple reasons.

bearfan
08-13-2008, 10:04 PM
I saw that Scott gave us a WR...while it is a need, I think we need to look at developing our offensive line. I like what the analysis for the Steelers was, them always having a good line...hence drafting a OG in the 2009 mock draft. I hope that JA can take their gameplan *unless we are high enough to draft stafford*. The game is won and lost in the trenches, and if JA thinks we can win with Tait aging, and weak OG, I see us losing for a while.

SFbear
08-13-2008, 10:45 PM
Unless we have a new GM next year, lets just stay away from an offensive pick in the first round. Lets just pick up a pass rusher and call it a round.

MidwayMonster31
08-14-2008, 12:15 AM
I agree with everything you said, 51. I am more frustrated with their approach towards the quarterback position, in general. No quarterback is going to come out of college right away and never make mistakes. They still need coaching, just better coaching than what the Bears have had.

bearsfan_51
08-14-2008, 02:53 AM
I should also note as a rather obvious comment that if Orton/Grossman don't work out this year then Ron Turner is going to get canned. I think Angelo and Lovie still have another year left in them, but it's hard to say what type of offensive system we'd be running or who we're capable of taking on.

I just don't think philosophically it makes a lot of sense to draft a 1st round receiver when you don't have **** for a quarterback. The Dolphins did that and now they're starting Chad Pennington. I'd go right tackle before receiver, or maybe even a defensive end. Ogunleye's contract runs out in 2009 and Alex and Anderson have their question marks as starters.

bearsfan_51
08-14-2008, 02:55 AM
I agree with everything you said, 51. I am more frustrated with their approach towards the quarterback position, in general. No quarterback is going to come out of college right away and never make mistakes. They still need coaching, just better coaching than what the Bears have had.

I'm willing to bite the mistakes. Or sign a guy like Kurt Warner to hold the line for a year while we groom.

Bearsfan123
08-14-2008, 09:45 AM
Orton is signed for this year and next year if Im not mistaken. I like how the Raiders handled their QB situation. You let him sit for most of the first year, then finally give him some starts near the end. I also agree with 51 in that a first round receiver, without at least a QB you think will be throwing to them, is useless.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
08-14-2008, 07:44 PM
1) I agree w/ the people in favor of taking Tebow. This is an incredibly weak QB class and Tebow has big upside and is no bigger of a risk than Stafford. You gotta love the irony in Jerry Angelo finally deciding to grab a first round QB in a class where it's extremely weak.

2) I don't understand the notion of people not wanting to draft another OT early, because we drafted Chris Williams this year. You guys are aware that Williams is likely not going to play this year, right? He is an absolute unknown at this point and it would be stupid to automatically pencil him in next year as a starting tackle, IMO.

If we're going to be as bad as I think we are I am hoping for Oher. If Chris Williams is a LT -- Oher can be a mauler on the right side. Or even better trading down and getting Andre Smith who could play guard and then RT when Tait's gas tank is empty.

w/ Oher:

LT - Williams/Oher
RT -Oher/Williams
LG - Anyone, but Beekman
RG - Garza
C - Kreutz

w/ Andre Smith:

LT - Williams
LG - Andre Smith
C - Kreutz
RG - Garza
RT - Tait

Smith makes more sense, because Oher is going to get paid LT $$. But, I'd much rather roll the dice with Oher.

Smokey Joe
08-14-2008, 08:30 PM
OLine is easily the most important position in football, and I'd rather see us spending money there and at QB then anywhere else. Just think about this, a great oline turns bad players into decent players, decent players into good players, good players into great players, and great players into HOF'ers.

I'd much rather see us take a stud OLine prospect like Andre Smith in the 1st and someone like Cullen Harper or Hunter Cantwell in the 2nd then to see us take Tebow in the 1st and a questionable OLine prospect in the 2nd.

However, I think Stafford offers more potential then Tebow, and would prefer him greatly. After all, last year was Stafford's first year as the no.1 starter at QB and he did very good. I, and many others, see him having a big year.

MidwayMonster31
08-14-2008, 09:21 PM
If we do get a high pick, I would like to see a trade down. Something that Jerry Angelo is very adept at. I want a quarterback and a guard with those 2 picks, regardless of order.

awfullyquiet
08-14-2008, 10:51 PM
I can definitely see turner getting canned, and for some godawful reason, i don't know why pep hamilton is the QB coach. I never have.

bearsfan_51
08-14-2008, 11:08 PM
I think this QB class is stronger than the 2008 crop.

Matt Ryan
Joe Flacco
Brian Brohm
Chad Henne

Tim Tebow
Matt Stafford
Cullen Harper
Curtis Painter
Hunter Cantwell

Now, that's obviously dependent upon Tebow and Stafford coming out, but on paper I like this class a lot better. I think Ryan is in the same class as Harper personally.

bearsfan_51
08-14-2008, 11:10 PM
As for the o-line, it really depends on where we are picking. I don't think I'd spend a top 10 pick on a right tackle or a guard. That's really quarterback territory for me assuming there's something worth having. If there's not I'd probably go for an elite pass rusher.

After that? By all means. We could certainly use another upgrade.

Bearsfan123
08-15-2008, 02:30 AM
O-line is the way to go, but not a top 10 pick worthy. Id rather trade down and get a guy like Duke Robinson and pick up another second rounder than select Andre Smith and have only one pick left on the first day.

regoob2
08-16-2008, 06:22 PM
O-line is the way to go, but not a top 10 pick worthy. Id rather trade down and get a guy like Duke Robinson and pick up another second rounder than select Andre Smith and have only one pick left on the first day.If we're in the top 10 which I absolutely think we will possibly top 5 I'd want Michael Johnson if Stafford stays and Harper isn't worth the pick. We can go bpa seeing how we suck and we need anything we can get.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
08-16-2008, 09:54 PM
After what we saw from the OL tonight - I hope no one would be against drafting a LG or RT in the top 10.

regoob2
08-16-2008, 09:56 PM
After what we saw from the OL tonight - I hope no one would be against drafting a LG or RT in the top 10.What OG or RT is worth a top 5 or 10 pick?

BUSTKUNTLAWL
08-16-2008, 09:57 PM
What OG or RT is worth a top 5 or 10 pick?

Andre Smith

Gay Ork Wang
08-16-2008, 09:59 PM
how about a new offense?

regoob2
08-16-2008, 10:02 PM
Andre SmithI'd prefer to wait til rd 2 for Loadholt, Herman Johnson. That's just to early for a RT imo.

regoob2
08-16-2008, 10:04 PM
how about a new offense?
I hope an O coordinator will be available.

Bearsfan123
08-17-2008, 12:33 AM
After tonights performance...

With the 1st pick in the 2009 NFL draft the Chicago Bears select Matthew Stafford QB Georgia.

EDIT:With the 33rd pick in the NFL draft the Chicago Bears select Phil Loadholt OT

Smokey Joe
08-17-2008, 01:42 AM
With our D and special teams, I think we can expect anywhere from 6-8 wins. However, our O is going to be as bad as ever.

Bearsfan123
08-17-2008, 10:01 AM
Smokey where do you get 8 wins as possible? Our schedule is harsh, and our O-line is the worst it has ever been. Edit: Six I would have seen possible, but last night's game proved to me that our O-line is so bad it is probably the worst in the league. We cannot run block for anything, pass blocking is just as bad. The defense is gonna be more prone to injuries due to the amount of time they are gonna be on the field. The special teams probably will not repeat last years production. Frankly I just dont see how we get more than 4-5 wins.

9/7 @ COLTS, 7:15 PM
9/14 @ PANTHERS, Noon
9/21 VS. BUCCANEERS, Noon
9/28 VS. EAGLES, 7:15 PM
10/5 @ LIONS, Noon
10/12 @ FALCONS, Noon
10/19 VS. VIKINGS, Noon
11/2 VS. LIONS, Noon
11/9 VS. TITANS, Noon
11/16 @ PACKERS, Noon
11/23 @ RAMS, Noon
11/30 @ VIKINGS, 7:15 PM
12/7 VS. JAGUARS, Noon
12/11 VS. SAINTS, 7:15 PM
12/22 VS. PACKERS, 7:30 PM
12/28 @ TEXANS, Noon

Bearsfan123
08-24-2008, 02:05 AM
Heres a question for the rest of you, if we are not bad enough to get an elite quarterback, (Stafford, Bradford as of now), would this be a better solution than reaching for a guy thats more likely second tier? This way allows us to put talent in place around the elite QB we should be able to get the next year.http://www.bullz-eye.com/stalter/2007/0629.htm I thought this article was good.

This= Trading down, getting extra picks and building our O-line. if we are in the 5-7 range. Trade down to the 14-19 range with phi (with Carolina's pick cuz I think Philly is gonna be damn good). Picking up philly's second rounder, fifth rounder and next years third as well. Select Duke Robinson the best Guard in the class. Then in the early second grab a Tackle (one of the guys to fall out of the first) like Alex Boone. Late second help our D with one of the safeties, Patrick Chung, Courtney Greene, Nic Harris one should be there. Early third grab maybe a WR, or a DE. Then in the 4th bring in a developmental QB in Dan LeFevour or Rudy Carpenter. So we get a QB to sit for a year, then bring in an elite QB to take the reins from KO.

Race for the Heisman
08-24-2008, 09:58 AM
Heres a question for the rest of you, if we are not bad enough to get an elite quarterback, (Stafford, Bradford as of now), would this be a better solution than reaching for a guy thats more likely second tier? This way allows us to put talent in place around the elite QB we should be able to get the next year.http://www.bullz-eye.com/stalter/2007/0629.htm I thought this article was good.

This= Trading down, getting extra picks and building our O-line. if we are in the 5-7 range. Trade down to the 14-19 range with phi (with Carolina's pick cuz I think Philly is gonna be damn good). Picking up philly's second rounder, fifth rounder and next years third as well. Select Duke Robinson the best Guard in the class. Then in the early second grab a Tackle (one of the guys to fall out of the first) like Alex Boone. Late second help our D with one of the safeties, Patrick Chung, Courtney Greene, Nic Harris one should be there. Early third grab maybe a WR, or a DE. Then in the 4th bring in a developmental QB in Dan LeFevour or Rudy Carpenter. So we get a QB to sit for a year, then bring in an elite QB to take the reins from KO.

Given the likely strength of the draft next year, I'd be okay with it. With no real consensus quarterback (although that could change) and a bevy of decent offensive linemen, it's actually not unlike last year's draft. My only worry is the evaluation of offensive talent by our front office. I'm not saying they can't pick good players, I just expect defensive picks to have a greater probability of panning out well. The Chief's went purely for the trenches, while Atlanta got their quarterback amidst addressing other needs. Obviously Chicago won't turn out exactly like either of them, but given the similarity of each team's scenarios, it will be interesting to see which team profits more from their choices.

bearfan
08-24-2008, 10:43 AM
If Orton doesnt pan out as a solid QB, and we miss out on one of the top QBs, we better draft offensive linemen. Tait is getting old, and I would like to see another tackle, but im not sure if that should be a 2nd round need since Tait isnt retiring after this year.

SFbear
08-24-2008, 03:49 PM
http://www.suntimes.com/sports/football/bears/1124028,williams082408.article

"Bears knew first-round pick Williams had herniated disc at draft time"

This is pretty infuriating.

BeerBaron
08-24-2008, 04:12 PM
If Orton doesnt pan out as a solid QB, and we miss out on one of the top QBs, we better draft offensive linemen. Tait is getting old, and I would like to see another tackle, but im not sure if that should be a 2nd round need since Tait isnt retiring after this year.

I would hope thats the plan at least. If Williams misses all this year, we would essentially be going into the following year with two rookies if we drafted another one, but our line can def. use it.

I may be mistaken but if the starting lineup goes St. Clair - Metcalf - Kreutz - Garza - Tait they will all be either at or over 30 I think...or at the very least damn damn close to it....

Thats not something I really want to see...

Smokey Joe
08-24-2008, 07:26 PM
If we pick in the 6-10 range, I really like whoever's idea it was of trading down with the eagles. For reference sake, lets say we pick 8th, the Panthers pick 18, and the Eagles 25... all three are realistic spots for the teams. The Eagles have the Panthers 1st round pick, and they might be interested in trading up for either an OLineman like Smith or safety William Moore (who I think will be a top 10 pick).

If a trade were to occur, we would likely get back the Panthers 1st, Eagles 2nd, Eagles 5th or 6th, and a future 3rd. I think the person who came up with this idea originally posted something similar to that. Plus, we will likely be getting a 3rd round comp. pick for loosing Berrian and not signing any big free agents, as well as a 6th or 7th rounder for Griese. However, my plan would be a bit different...

1-18) QB Cullen Harper, Clemson
2-08) OG Trevor Canfield, Cincinnati
2-25) WR Brandon Gibson, Washington St.
3-08) SS Nic Harris, Oklahoma
3-CP) OL Max Unger, Oregon

If we are picking at 8, odds are we didn't have a pretty season and quarterback is still a need. And at 8, there really wouldn't be a QB worth that spot. However, at 18, Cullen Harper might very well be worth the pick. He isn't the flashiest QB out there, but he is someone who could quite possibly lead a team for several years. Let him sit for a year or so before taking over for Orton.

In the 2nd round, we get a 1st round talent in Canfield who drops a bit due to some personality concerns. As we all know, Angelo isn't afraid to take players early who have some character concerns. As well as him, we get a solid receiver prospect in Gibson.

In the 3rd, we get a safety from Angelo's favorite school, Oklahoma. I really like Harris, but I see him dropping due to a low 40 time. As well as him, we get a very solid and versitile lineman in Max Unger. He can play all 5 spots on the line, and while he probably won't have any amazing physical numbers, he's a football player.

If we suck this year and pick 8, that (as of now), would be an ideal draft for me.

Bearsfan123
08-25-2008, 03:38 PM
I dont believe Unger would last that long. Cullen Harper, I just dont like taking him because we need a QB, is his value really that high? Love the Nic Harris pick though. Canfield and Gibson I dont know.

awfullyquiet
08-25-2008, 05:24 PM
I dont believe Unger would last that long. Cullen Harper, I just dont like taking him because we need a QB, is his value really that high? Love the Nic Harris pick though. Canfield and Gibson I dont know.

Really. The more i look at it, the more futile the bears quarterback situation will be. Next year? Skip Cullum Harper (mostly because i think he's slightly overrated right now, let alone after a so-so clemson season), go for the next purdue power in painter. Painter becomes only slightly better than orton. We're stuck in the same route for years to come.

Best Case Scenario: Texas parts with Sage. Zona parts with Warner. We CANNOT draft a quarterback. I cannot state that enough. the bears. i repeat the chicago bears, failure at quarterback since... five games in 2006, and before that, say, 18 years. cannot develop quarterbacks. put in a veteran qb. jeff garcia. it doesn't matter the system as long as the quarterback can quarterback.

BeerBaron
08-25-2008, 06:57 PM
Really. The more i look at it, the more futile the bears quarterback situation will be. Next year? Skip Cullum Harper (mostly because i think he's slightly overrated right now, let alone after a so-so clemson season), go for the next purdue power in painter. Painter becomes only slightly better than orton. We're stuck in the same route for years to come.

Best Case Scenario: Texas parts with Sage. Zona parts with Warner. We CANNOT draft a quarterback. I cannot state that enough. the bears. i repeat the chicago bears, failure at quarterback since... five games in 2006, and before that, say, 18 years. cannot develop quarterbacks. put in a veteran qb. jeff garcia. it doesn't matter the system as long as the quarterback can quarterback.

its true. sad but true.......

Seems like we always just need 1 guy who can kind of get it done. Doesn't even have to be great. We can go 10-5 under a rookie QB when the rest of the team has its **** together. We can make for a deep playoff run with Jim freaking Miller at QB.......right.........

seems like we just need to keep the rest of the team great and just find someone who's not a **** up (Rexy) to hold down the fort at the QB spot.

Anyone we draft really doesn't work out.....

VoteLynnSwan
08-25-2008, 11:07 PM
if you can put together a dominant offensive line... anyone would look pretty good behind it. That is really the route that we ought to take, we need to draft and develop a really good run blocking offensive line so that we don't need to rely on the quarterback.

awfullyquiet
08-26-2008, 02:56 AM
if you can put together a dominant offensive line... anyone would look pretty good behind it. That is really the route that we ought to take, we need to draft and develop a really good run blocking offensive line so that we don't need to rely on the quarterback.

but that's only half of it. they'll stack 9 in the box like they'll do against minny this year (watch it happen).

if we have a mediocre passing attack. and a good to better than good rush. and our defense (how we think it should be, not what it really is right now)? we're playoff contenders year in year out. what we do need is... hell. i'd take a decent teams backup out from them.

we should have gotten quinn gray. we still might be able to snag a one charlie batch...

i think, i actuall know, those are probably the only two 'decent' qb's... jeff garcia too. but he doesn't count.

VoteLynnSwan
08-26-2008, 11:31 AM
but that's only half of it. they'll stack 9 in the box like they'll do against minny this year (watch it happen).

if we have a mediocre passing attack. and a good to better than good rush. and our defense (how we think it should be, not what it really is right now)? we're playoff contenders year in year out. what we do need is... hell. i'd take a decent teams backup out from them.

we should have gotten quinn gray. we still might be able to snag a one charlie batch...

i think, i actuall know, those are probably the only two 'decent' qb's... jeff garcia too. but he doesn't count.

i'd try to get someone with at least some upside... Charlie Batch is WAYYY too old.

the problem is... as our team stands right now, we have an awful offense, and a defense that has to this point underperformed. It won't really matter how good our defense is since our offense is so bad since the D will be on the field the entire game.

The point i was trying to make is that we cannot draft a quarterback early next year before we address the offensive line issue. No quarterback would even be remotely successful behind our clusterfuck of an offensive line. If we truly want to develop a quarterback of our own, we're gonna need to give him all the protection he can get so he doesn't end up laying on the ground like Rex Grossman at the beginning of his career, and so he doesn't end up running backwards throwing interceptions off his back foot at the end of his career.

Smokey Joe
09-08-2008, 11:38 PM
After last night I feel we need to bring in an impact safety. My ideal draft after last night (with us picking between 16-22):

1. William Moore, S
2. Alex Boone, OT
3. Tiquan Underwood, WR
3. (Comp. via Berrian) Antoine Caldwell, C/OG
4. Rudy Carpenter, QB

pellepelle_10
09-09-2008, 04:06 AM
After last night I feel we need to bring in an impact safety. My ideal draft after last night (with us picking between 16-22):

1. William Moore, S
2. Alex Boone, OT
3. Tiquan Underwood, WR
3. (Comp. via Berrian) Antoine Caldwell, C/OG
4. Rudy Carpenter, QB

Rudy Carpenter will be a very good option. I have a feeling Quinn or Anderson from Cleveland will be good options however they may command several picks etc, etc to pry them away.

Tiquan Underwood is a very good player and so is his teammate Kenny Britt who stands at 6'4" 200lbs. Both guys could have bright futures in the NFL.

As much as I'd like to see some solid additions on defense in the top rnds our need for offensive playmakers specifically at WR and QB remain a problem. Youth now at the O-Line may be a good option. Hopefully we don't have bad luck with more top tier lineman going down for the count (Colombo and now Williams).

Race for the Heisman
09-09-2008, 06:48 AM
After last night I feel we need to bring in an impact safety. My ideal draft after last night (with us picking between 16-22):

1. William Moore, S
2. Alex Boone, OT
3. Tiquan Underwood, WR
3. (Comp. via Berrian) Antoine Caldwell, C/OG
4. Rudy Carpenter, QB

I would love that. I think the difference between our defense with or without Mike Brown and the disparity between the Colts with/without Bob Sanders shows that a team running that system needs an elite safety who can be the fourth linebacker as well as cover deep. I like Moore over Mays at this point. Although Mays has the athletic potential to be amazing, I think the Bears really need to make their picks count next year, and Moore is the safer pick. The division rivals have been doing better for themselves (even Detroit in my eyes, at least in the last draft, although that really has yet to be determined), and Chicago needs to match them for production from the draft.

The Bears should just find out which receiver the Packers would want and take him. They've hit good players in the last 3 three drafts, assuming Nelson pans out.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 09:32 AM
Late second help our D with one of the safeties, Patrick Chung, Courtney Greene, Nic Harris one should be there. Early third grab maybe a WR, or a DE. Then in the 4th bring in a developmental QB in Dan LeFevour or Rudy Carpenter. So we get a QB to sit for a year, then bring in an elite QB to take the reins from KO.

Oh yeah, I feel good about myself now. The great Smokey, said we needed a top safety and I've been calling for one since last year. What do people think of Chung or Greene? (I love Moore but I would rather grab O-line if we can get a mid-round pick whether that be through trade down or just earning one)

BeerBaron
09-09-2008, 10:41 AM
A top young safety would be real nice, but if theres an immediate starter on the o-line or possibly even a WR available, I would hope we still go that direction in the first.

JA isn't a huge fan of WR's but we could really use one who can make some plays. Right now, everyone outside of Hester at the WR spot seems just like bodies who get in position and reel in the catch. Nothing spectacular there....Hopefully Hester develops and does some good this year but I'd still like an actual WR to make an impact.

If we manage to do decently this season and end up with a pick in the 2nd half of the first round, I would seriously look at what Guards are available. Interior lineman rarely go in the first but those that have in recent memory have worked out very well and if get Chris Williams back and going, a stud young Guard to play next to him would be real real nice to add.

awfullyquiet
09-09-2008, 11:52 AM
A top young safety would be real nice, but if theres an immediate starter on the o-line or possibly even a WR available, I would hope we still go that direction in the first.

JA isn't a huge fan of WR's but we could really use one who can make some plays. Right now, everyone outside of Hester at the WR spot seems just like bodies who get in position and reel in the catch. Nothing spectacular there....Hopefully Hester develops and does some good this year but I'd still like an actual WR to make an impact.

If we manage to do decently this season and end up with a pick in the 2nd half of the first round, I would seriously look at what Guards are available. Interior lineman rarely go in the first but those that have in recent memory have worked out very well and if get Chris Williams back and going, a stud young Guard to play next to him would be real real nice to add.

Completely Agree. Completely Agree 100%. Crap. That's funny.

As far as stud safeties, I believe JA doesn't have to find one in the first round. I'd rather spend another year bolstering our O-Line, finding a right tackle, or another good left tackle. A WR would be nice, but i don't see it likely... And lest we talk about QB's...

BeerBaron
09-09-2008, 12:32 PM
Completely Agree. Completely Agree 100%. Crap. That's funny.

As far as stud safeties, I believe JA doesn't have to find one in the first round. I'd rather spend another year bolstering our O-Line, finding a right tackle, or another good left tackle. A WR would be nice, but i don't see it likely... And lest we talk about QB's...

Right, I mean Payne played alright there the other night and as long as the rest of the stars on defense are healthy, we can get by on a guy who is just playing alright.

We can probably get by on that hopefully and find a safety in the mid rounds, maybe even the 2nd next year who can be our future there.

regoob2
09-09-2008, 12:49 PM
We are actually deep at safety. FS: Brown, Steltz, Manning. SS: Payne, Mcgowan. We have 5 safeties on the roster. I dont think safety is a first day need. QB, WR, RT, OG, DE.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 02:31 PM
I think Safety is a second round need. My idea still is either 1st rd QB or O-lineman preferably Guard. Than second round safety, and as of right now, guys like Chung, Greene, and Nic Harris seem to be in that area.

FS Brown is injury prone and we never know if/when he'll go out. We need a replacement ASAP.
SS Payne I like him and think we should give him a chance.

Steltz-I didnt like the pick and dont think he will work out. Im not counting on him being anything more than Adam Archuletta (Bears version) 2.0

Manning-I think his value as a return man can gain us back a 5th rounder 4th if we're lucky. A team like Indy who doesnt have a guy like him might be willing to take him on especially since they are good at plugging guys into their system. Frankly to me he isnt physical enough to play safety and doesnt have the instincts to play nickel GOODBYE!

McGowan: Being used with the first team D at Nickel. I still like him, a good guy to have on the team. Should definately keep around. But his Safety position was usurped by a second year player so he's probably a career backup.

So we have 2 guys I think we should jettison, 1 starter who annually gets hurt, and another starter who is a 2nd year guy but has sustained a serious injury last year. If an impact safety is there in the second, grab him!

EDIT: I do NOT advocate taking a safety in the first. I think the talent of this year's crop goes deep into the second round. I feel 1 of the top 5 safeties should be their. (I did at one point advocate 1st rd safety, now I do not feel that way)

Gay Ork Wang
09-09-2008, 02:54 PM
After last night I feel we need to bring in an impact safety. My ideal draft after last night (with us picking between 16-22):

1. William Moore, S
2. Alex Boone, OT
3. Tiquan Underwood, WR
3. (Comp. via Berrian) Antoine Caldwell, C/OG
4. Rudy Carpenter, QB
Never ever get ur hopes up :P

regoob2
09-09-2008, 03:14 PM
I think Safety is a second round need. My idea still is either 1st rd QB or O-lineman preferably Guard. Than second round safety, and as of right now, guys like Chung, Greene, and Nic Harris seem to be in that area.

FS Brown is injury prone and we never know if/when he'll go out. We need a replacement ASAP.
SS Payne I like him and think we should give him a chance.

Steltz-I didnt like the pick and dont think he will work out. Im not counting on him being anything more than Adam Archuletta (Bears version) 2.0

Manning-I think his value as a return man can gain us back a 5th rounder 4th if we're lucky. A team like Indy who doesnt have a guy like him might be willing to take him on especially since they are good at plugging guys into their system. Frankly to me he isnt physical enough to play safety and doesnt have the instincts to play nickel GOODBYE!

McGowan: Being used with the first team D at Nickel. I still like him, a good guy to have on the team. Should definately keep around. But his Safety position was usurped by a second year player so he's probably a career backup.

So we have 2 guys I think we should jettison, 1 starter who annually gets hurt, and another starter who is a 2nd year guy but has sustained a serious injury last year. If an impact safety is there in the second, grab him!

EDIT: I do NOT advocate taking a safety in the first. I think the talent of this year's crop goes deep into the second round. I feel 1 of the top 5 safeties should be their. (I did at one point advocate 1st rd safety, now I do not feel that way)I do agree that the safeties we have aren't the best but we need much bigger holes at much more important positions.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 08:32 PM
What positions would you consider, "more important?" Safety has been our D's achilles heel whenever Brown goes down and we have no one IMO behind him worth his salt. Beyond that Brown is also getting old. We need a starter there and fast.

WR?-I wouldnt call this more important especially since Defense is our calling card.
QB- I would but frankly I only take one(In our first two picks) if Stafford or Bradford falls to us. Or a guy with a first round grade falls to us.
O-line-I still think its our 1st rd pick. (And if we can trade down and get more picks while getting a guy like Herman Johnson, Im all for it) And although I'd like more than one O-lineman I doubt its our 1st two picks.
RB-We all like Forte, and if Jones can run well why not keep him?

bearsfan_51
09-09-2008, 08:35 PM
Rudy Carpenter's pocket presence is awful. Unless he rectifies that this season I have no interest in him before the 3rd or 4th round.

I still think defensive end is a sleeper position to keep an eye on, although safety would make a lot of sense if we were in the 15-20 range and missed out on a top-notch QB.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 08:41 PM
Rudy Carpenter's pocket presence is awful. Unless he rectifies that this season I have no interest in him before the 3rd or 4th round.

I still think defensive end is a sleeper position to keep an eye on, although safety would make a lot of sense if we were in the 15-20 range and missed out on a top-notch QB.

DE was also my 3rd rd pick. I was thinking Maurice Evans was a senior at Penn St. Thought with his suspension we could of gotten a steal, *sigh* too bad.

And most people here have Carpenter coming to us in the 4th. Well the two times Ive seen it anyway.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 09:11 PM
Bears trade down scenario.

12th overall send to Philadelphia for the 21st overall (originally Carolina's) and their 2nd rounder (28th) and 5th rounder. We get a 4th round comp pick for Berrian.

21st-Duke Robinson G- Yes, i love the idea of getting a guard. Another guy thats possible is Phil Loadholt.

44th-Patrick Chung S Oregon- I'm not sure who is better between him Courtney Greene, and Kam Chancellor. So I chose the guy who I remember hearing about last year.

60th-Alex Boone OT-Being at TOSU the team that underachieves and doesnt go back to the NC game, he slips a bit down boards. He is pegged as a RT. Good for us that is what we are looking for.

3rd rd pick-Aaron Kelly WR- After jettisoning Marcus Monk, we really dont have that big receiver. We really dont need one due to our TEs but its still nice to have that jump ball guy on the field.

4th rd- Rudy Carpenter QB- We grab a developmental QB. He has alot of upside. He also has a ton of heart. I think he can become a good starter if he learns to get rid of the ball sooner.

4th Comp-Will Davis DE Illinois- A solid pass rusher for our stable. Doesnt have the measurables but is very disruptive.

bearsfan_51
09-09-2008, 09:34 PM
I'm a big fan of Greg Hardy from Ole Miss if he comes out.

I'd put DE about 3rd as well on most likely scenarios in the 1st round behind Quarterback and O-line. I certainly think it's more likely than wide receiver and probably safety as well.

bearfan
09-09-2008, 10:01 PM
no DE before round 4 or 5 please! We have depth up the wazoo, with Brown, Ogun, Anderson, Idonije, and now that Harrison is playing both. Ideal draft would be OT/OG round 1, S round 2, another OL somewhere in there, and a developmental QB depending on how the team likes Hanie.

And Im not high on this WR class. Add the fact that I think we have enough developmental WRs in Hester, Bennett, Bradley. They all are talented, and have potential, but need to develop. We should let them do so instead of adding more to the mix.

Also no CB for same reason.

bearsfan_51
09-09-2008, 10:12 PM
Harrison was playing DE because we had them backed up against the goal line, if he's a serious longterm plan at DE I'll eat my hat.

We have depth yes, but we don't have an elite DE for a Tampa 2 defense. We make up for that to some degree with Tommie, but if we have the chance to get a top DE I think this would be a good time to get one with a lot of other areas locked up.

O-Gun is over 30 and 2009 will be the last year of his contract.

Alex Brown is a marginal starter, and never gets enough sacks, which is why the Bears benched him in the first place.

Mark Anderson was about as tough as a slinkey against the run last year, and didn't do much in the pass rush either. Might be a bit of a one year wonder.

There are certain areas where we can afford to be mediocre at and still win, defensive end is definately not one of those. It's always a concern in the draft.

Bearsfan123
09-09-2008, 10:26 PM
Yeah but i think we can get a good player for us in the third. A 1st round pick on a DE? I just dont think its necessary for us. Anderson has another year or two before I say bust.

Bruce Banner
09-09-2008, 10:32 PM
Be glad you have Warren Sapp Lite. The hardest piece of the Tampa 2 to find. The rest can fall into place easily enough.

Smokey Joe
09-10-2008, 07:34 AM
QUARTERBACK:
If we pick in the 16-22 range, we have likely missed out on the top QB's of the draft. However, I think that Orton is good enough to be a good stop gap for 2-3 or more years until we find that someone at QB (whether it be Hanie, a draftee, or FA). So, if we are decent this year, QB gets bumped down to a middle round need for a developmental guy.

RUNNINGBACK:
Two words, Matt Forte. This is not a need as it looks like we finally have our guy at RB for years to come. I also wouldn't mind bringing back Kevin Jones next year to keep the 1-2 punch.

RECIEVERS:
We have our 3 TE's set. However, our wideouts leave a lot to be desired. This could be a pontential pick in one of the top 3 rounds. However, I don't see us going 1st day for a WR due to the fact of the development time it takes for them. Perhaps we make a splash in free agency and sign a big time receiver? I doubt it would happen, but Roy Williams would be sweet to have.

OLINE:
LT can be crossed off and I actually like Buenning and Beekman on the inside, and Garza is still alright at RG. Plus, Kreutz and Tait each have at least 1 year left. Call me crazy, but I could very well see our starting 5 linemen next year all coming from this year's team. I'd say OG is more of a mid round need right now with RT being our highest priority in the draft. Tait is a FA after 09 and has considerably slowed down. This could be a first day pick. Center is also a mid round need as Kreutz has slowed down.

DLINE:
Tommie, Harrison, and DD are looking like the real deal at DT. Plus, we got Indonije there. I'd say DT is not a need. DE could be a sleeper pick with Wale being a FA after 09, but we still might plan on keeping him around. I'd say DE could be a surprise 1st round pick if that is where the value points to, but if not, I'd say it'd be more of a mid-late round pick as of now.

LINEBACKERS:
Simply not a need.

DEFENSIVEBACKS:
CB isn't a need, but safety is. Mike Brown isn't his old self anymore and is still an injury risk, and none of Manning, Steltz, Payne, or McGowan are anything special. If we pick in the 16-22 range, I'd say this is definitely a 1st round need, or at least 1st day need. With the addition of an elite safety, we could possibly return this D back to elite status.

NEEDS IN ORDER (according to me): QB (only if elite QB is on the board, if not this becomes a mid-round need), S, OL, WR, DE

Bearsfan123
09-10-2008, 08:48 AM
Good write up Smokey. Id slightly disagree but at this point its a "to each his own," thing.

Bearsfan123
09-10-2008, 07:03 PM
EDIT: OKAY IM BACK!

1st round Big Board!

1 Matt Stafford QB
2 Sam Bradford QB
3 Michael Oher OT
4 Eugene Monroe OT
5 Andre Smith OL
6 Michael Crabtree WR

^ Top 15 guys

7 Duke Robinson G
8 Phil Loadholt RT-Potential filled
9 William (formerly put as Michael) Moore S
10 Alex Boone RT
11 Herman Johnson G
12 Taylor Mays S

Race for the Heisman
09-10-2008, 09:19 PM
EDIT: OKAY IM BACK!

1st round Big Board!

1 Matt Stafford QB
2 Sam Bradford QB
3 Michael Oher OT
4 Eugene Monroe OT
5 Andre Smith OL
6 Michael Crabtree WR

^ Top 15 guys

7 Duke Robinson G
8 Phil Loadholt RT-Potential filled
9 Michael Moore S
10 Alex Boone RT
11 Herman Johnson G
12 Taylor Mays S

You mean William?

BeerBaron
09-10-2008, 09:22 PM
You mean William?

yeah, last thing we need is Michael Moore out trying to cover, lol

Smokey Joe
09-11-2008, 07:19 AM
If we draft Michael Moore, I hope it is so we can throw rotten tomatoes at him, not for him to line up next to Mike Brown.

Bearsfan123
09-11-2008, 03:06 PM
lol yes William Moore sorry.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-12-2008, 06:48 PM
William Moore is really over rated in my opinion. I would be absolutely sick to my stomach if Jerry used a first on him. He looks really stiff in coverage and he's not a guy that is going to kill you going over the middle.

I watched entire Illinois-Missouri game and he had multiple shots to just kill a receiver and whiffed twice. Arrelious Benn in particular just shrugged him off like he was a mosquito. Benn made Moore look really bad on that play. I know this was only one game and I admit I have only seen Moore play a few other times, but I don't even think he is a first round prospect. It looks like he is getting the Kenny Phillips hype as a top 15 pick early, but he is going to slide when people actually get a better look.

I just posted a comment in the other draft forum about Scott's latest mock.

I must say I am steadily jumping on the Tebow bandwagon. He actually showed a lot in that Miami game. There was a play on 3rd and long where a defensive lineman grabbed him, he spun off, and threw a 25 yard pass knowing he was going to get seriously thumped. And he did big time, but didn't care. There was another throw early in the game he made off his backfoot (lol..) to hit the TE in the back of the end zone that was also really impressive.

I had doubts about a team taking a chance on Tebow in the first round, but now I have little to no doubt a team will take him in the top 15. Whether he is worth that is up for discussion, but someone is going to take him around that slot.

As I have been saying for a while I am all over the Andre Smith bandwagon. He has been dominant since he walked onto campus at Alabama. For some reason people believe this guy is only a RT or OG. I do not see that at all and think he could play the left side and handle it really well. He could come in as a rookie play LG and then slide over to RT when Tait contract expires the next year & if Williams flames out he can even slide to LT. I don't see a better fit in this draft than Andre Smith.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-12-2008, 06:59 PM
LT can be crossed off and I actually like Buenning and Beekman on the inside, and Garza is still alright at RG. Plus, Kreutz and Tait each have at least 1 year left. Call me crazy, but I could very well see our starting 5 linemen next year all coming from this year's team. I'd say OG is more of a mid round need right now with RT being our highest priority in the draft. Tait is a FA after 09 and has considerably slowed down. This could be a first day pick. Center is also a mid round need as Kreutz has slowed down.

Ouch.. I don't even know where to begin with this one.

I, for one have been real critical of Garza, but then I look at the clown we have playing LG and have to turn my attention away from Mr. Garza.

Beekman gets absolutely no push in the run game and is pretty much worthless out there. If he is starting next year we have serious problems with our interior line.

Beekman is not an NFL starting caliber OG. It's that simple.

And how are you sold on Buenning.. No one has seen him since his injury and he wasn't good enough to crack the starting lineup.

I am 100% on board for a draft that goes as follows:

Round 1 - Andre Smith - OT - Alabama
Round 2 - Herman Johnson - OG - LSU

Send Tait home a year early & there is your young interior lineman we have been missing.

'09

LT - Chris Williams
LG - Herman Johnson
C - Olin Kreutz
RG - Roberto Garza
RT - Andre Smith

That would be my dream draft. Yeah, no QB or WR, but fix the line first and then add the skill positions, because they won't be worth damn as it stands with what we have to work with on the offensive line.

bearsfan_51
09-12-2008, 09:51 PM
Round 1 - Andre Smith - OT - Alabama
Round 2 - Herman Johnson - OG - LSU
Has someone been reading another certain draft website?

Anyway, I'd be happy with Smith-Johnson, but I'm also a huge Tebow fan, so I think that would be a great pick as well. A mobile QB can improve pass protection just as much as an offensive lineman can. Just look at Tony Romo.

I'm not nearly as critical of Beekman as you are, but I do think he's better suited at center. He's just not very big.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-12-2008, 10:10 PM
Has someone been reading another certain draft website?

Anyway, I'd be happy with Smith-Johnson, but I'm also a huge Tebow fan, so I think that would be a great pick as well. A mobile QB can improve pass protection just as much as an offensive lineman can. Just look at Tony Romo.

I'm not nearly as critical of Beekman as you are, but I do think he's better suited at center. He's just not very big.

What site is that? I am confused. Did Scott's last mock have us taking Smith & Johnson or something?

I believe our biggest needs are RT & LG.

Duke Robinson is likely going to be a first rounder and deservedly so. I think Herman Johnson is the #2 OG in the draft and could be available in the early-mid second.

Herman would be an excellent fit in the power running game and we need someone next to Chris Williams who is a big time run blocker, because it's going to take some time for Williams to develop in that area.

I mean look at this guy:

http://pictopia.com/perl/get_image?provider_id=426&size=550x550_mb&ptp_photo_id=1712946

Tell me you wouldn't love this guy

Race for the Heisman
09-12-2008, 10:16 PM
http://pictopia.com/perl/get_image?provider_id=426&size=550x550_mb&ptp_photo_id=1712946

Tell me you wouldn't love this guy

Dunno, usually I'd prefer guards to be a bit lower. Not saying he isn't a good prospect, but it would be a small concern for me.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-12-2008, 10:20 PM
Dunno, usually I'd prefer guards to be a bit lower. Not saying he isn't a good prospect, but it would be a small concern for me.

Two of the better guards in football - Leonard Davis & Eric Steinbach are both 6'6.

Bearsfan123
09-13-2008, 12:34 AM
I am 100% on board for a draft that goes as follows:

Round 1 - Andre Smith - OT - Alabama
Round 2 - Herman Johnson - OG - LSU

Send Tait home a year early & there is your young interior lineman we have been missing.



Didn't Smith get hurt? Is he okay?

As to sending Tait home, I dont like that idea, let him finish out his contract, A for loyalty's sake, and B to let the rookie learn behind a vet. I doubt Johnson falls to us in the second, unless we are in the top ten of the second round (which is still very possible). Yes we dont know how Buenning will do, but he is still young, and a possibility. Garza has started to look his age, id rather have us take Smith and put him at RG, then shift over to tackle for Tait.

I was bored here is my 7 round mini bears mock

we are at 12.
We trade down with the Iggles for 28th overall 60th overall, and their next years third.

At 28- Alex Boone RT Ohio State- A strong tackle who will take over for Tait when his contract runs out.

44-Patrick Chung S Oregon- Our safety of the future. A need to replace Mike Brown who probably ended up on IR at some point, most unfortunately.

60th-Max Unger OL Oregon- We pick up the versatile, G/C/T in Unger. Lucky he fell this far, we snagged him instead of a true G due to his versatility and experience. (Read, so we can plug him wherever we begin to suck at)

3rd rd-(I have to stop numbering due to comp picks)-Marlon Lucky RB Nebraska- We bring him in to replace Kevin Jones who signs a contract elsewhere, so he can start. ;_;

4th rd- Will Davis DE Illinois- The homer in me made me choose one Illinois player. BUT he is good. He can learn from Ogun and be in the rotation until it is his time to shine.

4th rd comp (Berrian)-John Gill DT Northwestern-I nearly forgot about this so it was a late throw in. We continue to add to our formidible D-line with this local boy. He has some pass rushing numbers but I dont actually know much about him. I thought about receiver but i think it would just be a waste of a pick. Another mid-rounder thrown in with all the others used on receiver.

5th rd- Rudy Carpenter QB Arizona State- Scott's rankings have him low, so i figure he should last until here. I love his fiery attitude, and his never die style so he will be our third QB behind Orton, and Hanie. It should be noted that the small investment should be worth the risk.

6th-Nick Hennesy OT Colgate (like the toothpaste?)- He is rated pretty highly by Scott but the level of competition he faced must come into play. So we take a flyer here to see if he can develop into anything. Again a small investment with possible big gain.

7th- Brandon Ore RB- We snag him before he can hit UDFA, his poor attitude got him kicked off the VT team, but he is talented. We will give him a shot and who knows, maybe he will get his head on straight, its boom or bust but a 7th round pick should always have some upside.

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 01:36 AM
I really doubt with Jones' injury past that he'll ever be considered a starting back in the NFL again.

I think the real question is if the Bears will commit anything to him longterm, even at a low cost. To some degree it may depend on how they feel about Wolfe as a alternative option.

I was thinking about making a dream mock, but it's just too early for that.

So instead I offer this picture of Tim Tebow for your enjoyment:

http://images.dawgsports.com/images/admin/Tim_Tebow_v_LSU.jpg

Bruce Banner
09-13-2008, 03:09 AM
http://images.dawgsports.com/images/admin/Tim_Tebow_v_LSU.jpg

Do the Bears need a fullback?

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 10:38 AM
A fullback that can play quarterback yes.

By the way, it's people with such ridiculous opinions of Tebow like you that make me act like such a Tebow homer. I really could care less about Florida, but I find the anti-Tebow bias on the blogs disgustingly overdone. The guy can play quarterback.

regoob2
09-13-2008, 11:40 AM
A fullback that can play quarterback yes.

By the way, it's people with such ridiculous opinions of Tebow like you that make me act like such a Tebow homer. I really could care less about Florida, but I find the anti-Tebow bias on the blogs disgustingly overdone. The guy can play quarterback.
He can play QB but do you think he will be worth a top 5-10 pick? If he came out this year I don't.

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 11:44 AM
He can play QB but do you think he will be worth a top 5-10 pick? If he came out this year I don't.
I think it's too early to say if he'll be worth it, in part because I haven't had the chance to see guys like Crabtree and others play, but I do think it's pretty safe to say that if he came out today he'd be in the discussion, and people that think he'll be a 4th round pick are just talking out of their ass.

regoob2
09-13-2008, 11:49 AM
I think it's too early to say if he'll be worth it, in part because I haven't had the chance to see guys like Crabtree and others play, but I do think it's pretty safe to say that if he came out today he'd be in the discussion, and people that think he'll be a 4th round pick are just talking out of their ass.He'll go in the first when he comes out but I don't think that we have the staff right now to get the most out of his abilities and his bust factor is higher than any other QB. If he took a Rodgers/Quinn fall that maybe.

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 12:05 PM
He'll go in the first when he comes out but I don't think that we have the staff right now to get the most out of his abilities and his bust factor is higher than any other QB. If he took a Rodgers/Quinn fall that maybe.
Actually I think what we do as a football team is perfect for Tebow's skill set. I think at worst Tebow is another Vince Young type. The Titans win with Young despite having almost nothing at wide receiver, and really not even attempting to pass the ball down the field. Sound familiar?

I think at best, like Scott said, he's another Steve Young. Either way, no matter who we draft at QB I would expect them to start Orton for another year and give the guy time to groom, as they should.

bearfan
09-13-2008, 12:45 PM
Actually I think what we do as a football team is perfect for Tebow's skill set. I think at worst Tebow is another Vince Young type. The Titans win despite Young and having almost nothing at wide receiver, and really not even attempting to pass the ball down the field. Sound familiar?


Edited that for you. You cant help your team win when you throw a 1:2 TD:INT ratio

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 12:51 PM
Yeah, you actually can. Passing touchdowns are just part of the equation for a quarterback. I'm not saying that Young is great, but when people compare Tebow to Alex Smith I don't think they really get what Tebow is about in the NFL. The added mobility and leadership skills are a boon.

Anyway, I expect Tebow to be a better NFL quarterback than Young, but I would take Vince Young on this team any day of the week assuming his mental issues check out.

bearfan
09-13-2008, 01:44 PM
Well I was more pointing out his 17ints last year compared to his 9Tds. You can win, but if your QB throws an INT a game, it definantly hurts your chances of winning. I dont know enough about Tebow to really assess him, but everything I have read makes me weary of him. I dont think the organization would take another Florida QB, despite being under different regimes.

Race for the Heisman
09-13-2008, 03:14 PM
I don't agree with 'at worst he is Vince Young.' Tebow will have to be a better passer than Vince Young in order to give you the same production, because Vince is a much better runner.

bearsfan_51
09-13-2008, 03:37 PM
I don't agree with 'at worst he is Vince Young.' Tebow will have to be a better passer than Vince Young in order to give you the same production, because Vince is a much better runner.

Based on what? Vince Young ran a 4.58, Tebow can match and possibly beat that. Vince had better rushing stats in college, but they also ran the ball more, and faced inferior competition.

I will say this though, Tebow will obviously have to change his running style, because he's not going to be able to knock into people at the pros. But Steve Young had the same type of falling all over the place style that Tebow did, so I have no doubt he can adjust.

Smokey Joe
09-14-2008, 07:40 PM
Hey 51, if Tebow turns into Steve Young, I'll buy ya a coke.

Smokey Joe
09-14-2008, 09:03 PM
Okay, I know it is way too early to do this, but I can't help myself... here is a very early projection for what my ideal offseason would be, based on how I think we are going to do this season (between 8 and 10 wins):

FREE AGENCY:
-Sign WR Roy Williams
No matter who our QB is, they need someone to throw to. I am fairly sure that Williams will void out of his contract and become a free agent. He will cost a lot, but it would be well worth it to get one of the top WR's in the league.

-Sign QB Kurt Warner
I like Kyle Orton as a game manager/fill in type, but I doubt any team will win a lot of games on his arm. Kurt Warner is an old man, but he is still plays at a high level and could be a very solid stop gap for 1-2 seasons while we still look for our franchise QB.

-Re-sign John St. Clair
This is a no-brainer. St. Clair doesn't do anything fancy, but he is a very versitile backup and a decent starter. He can compete for a starting job somewhere on the line and provide solid depth. Should be rather easy to bring back.

-Re-sign Brandon Lloyd
If he keeps up his play from the first 2 games, we'd be nuts not to bring him back. He's not going to be an elite target, but so far he has shown a great ability to adjusting for the ball. Like St. Clair, he should be easily retained.

-Let Kevin Jones go
I personally would love to keep him, but he has no intentions of staying here past this year, especially now that Forte has emerged as the guy. He hired Rosenhaus and can't wait for his payday.

-Let Rex Grossman go
Provides virtually nothing to team at this point.

-Let Fred Miller go
The only reason he is here right now is because of injuries.

-McClover and Roach are optional
Both are solid players, but are not crucial to team. Would like to have them both back, but not going to lose any sleed over if they leave.

-Marty Booker and Anthony Adams: possible cap cuts
Marty almost got cut before the season, and Harris, Harrison, Idonije, and Dvoracek are emerging as one of the best DT rotations in football, making Adams expandable.

DRAFT (picking between 16-22, only doing first 5 rounds):
1.) OG Duke Robinson, Oklahoma
-After watching today's game, we need more push up the middle, and who is better to add then the big man Duke Robinson? I like Beekman, but Robinson and Williams can form a dominate duo on the left side. Beekman then competes at RG with Buening and Garza, and perhaps eventually replaces Kreutz.

2.) OT Alex Boone, Ohio
-In the long run, it hurt us that we didn't build the OLine through the draft. Well, lets fix it now. Alex Boone provides us with John Tait's replacement next year at RT, if not sooner.

3.) WR Demetrius Byrd, LSU
-Will he fall here? I doubt it, but I would love if we could get him. He would potentially provide us with the speed threat to team up with Roy Williams. If Byrd isn't here, we could go with someone like Sammie Stroughter.

3-COMP. f/Berrian) SLB/DE Clay Matthews, Southern Cal.
-Now this is where it gets controversial. LB isn't a need for us, but I love this guy. He is one of the smartest players on the field, and no one has more heart then him. He provides us with a backup to Hunter, and he becomes a special teams ace.

4.) RB Tyrell Sutton, Northwestern
-Runningback? Yes, runningback. I love Forte, but with Jones likely not returning, I'm not comfortable with Wolfe and Peterson as the backups. I gotta give the nod to my man Sutton, or as I like to call him, the next Brian Westbrook. Yeah, he's short like Wolfe, but he is stronger and stockier then Wolfe and runs with a hella lot more power.

5.) FB Brannan Southerland, Georgia
-Fullback? Oh yes! McKie is okay and all, but he could be improved on. Brannan is one hell of a lead blocker, runs harder, can catch just as good, and is likely faster as well. I wasn't going to go with him, but after I watched this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VhmOJ8kpF8) video, I had to put him in here. If we want a dominate run game, we need someone who can clear a hole like that for us.

PROJECTED STARTERS:
OFFENSE
WR - Roy Williams
TE - Dez Clark
RT - John Tait
RG - Roberto Garza
OC - Olin Kreutz
LG - Duke Robinson
LT - Chris Williams
QB - Kurt Warner
FB* - Brannan Southerland
SLOT* - Devin Hester/Greg Olsen
WR - Rashied Davis/Brandon Lloyd

DEFENSE & SPECIAL TEAMS - Pretty much the same as this year.

Man, I gotta stop playing Madden...

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-14-2008, 10:58 PM
I am against any off-season plan where we bring in another stop gap measure at Quarterback.

I am pretty sure Kurt Warner would look absolutely hideous with these weapons.

Bearsfan123
09-14-2008, 11:59 PM
I like that plan, beyond the Warner thing. And i would like a QB in that draft. Carpenter is still my home boy. ^_^

We would essentially be starting two rookies on the same side with Williams, and Robinson.

Bearsfan123
09-15-2008, 12:09 AM
I agree that QB is our biggest need but I'm just saying that WR is another huge need. I was just saying how people think that S is a bigger need than WR. We have probably the slowest WR core in all of football.

I dragged this from the Panthers game thread. I still think Safety is a bigger need than WR. Even though Hester has shown me nothing to deserve his contract, he does deserve more time than one year to show it.

But mainly for the reason of Mike Brown's injury history. He hasnt finished a season in what 5 years? And when he goes out our D goes to crap. id like to find his eventual replacement so that when he goes down our D doesnt fall apart. I would have shown a picture of Mike Brown getting carted off, but I dont know how to post pictures, and am too lazy to go find out.

Smokey Joe
09-15-2008, 10:26 PM
Oh, and I should add to my wishlist: Fire Ron Turner and hire Lane Kiffin as our OC.

Smokey Joe
09-15-2008, 10:31 PM
I am against any off-season plan where we bring in another stop gap measure at Quarterback.

I am pretty sure Kurt Warner would look absolutely hideous with these weapons.
I as well would like to find that long term answer, but I don't see one dropping into our laps. Unless we pick high enough to get Stafford (which I doubt, we are better then a top 5 team), have Tebow fall to us and gamble on him (another scenario I don't see happening), or we make a trade for Carson Palmer (think the other scenario's unlikely? This wouldn't even happen in Madden), there is just no long term answer.

Kurt Warner would be better then any QB we have on our roster right now, and if we can give him some protection and a weapon like Roy Williams, he can produce. In the meantime, we either hope Hanie is the next Tony Romo, or draft either Mark Sanchez or Sam Bradford in the 1st round next year.

regoob2
09-15-2008, 10:38 PM
I dragged this from the Panthers game thread. I still think Safety is a bigger need than WR. Even though Hester has shown me nothing to deserve his contract, he does deserve more time than one year to show it.

But mainly for the reason of Mike Brown's injury history. He hasnt finished a season in what 5 years? And when he goes out our D goes to crap. id like to find his eventual replacement so that when he goes down our D doesnt fall apart. I would have shown a picture of Mike Brown getting carted off, but I dont know how to post pictures, and am too lazy to go find out.
We have capable S on the roster in McGowan and Payne and we have Steltz who is a good fit at FS and D. Manning who is garbage but still has starting experience. S is the least important position on our team(other than FB, maybe SLB). Our #1 receiver is Davis who would be a decent slot receiver on any other team and Lloyd who wouldn't see the field in 4 wide sets on most teams. No one is ever gonna buy the pass or play action if we dont have a capable WR. Every team we go against knows that they dont have to double anyone because our WRs are gonna make every secondary look like pro bowlers.

Bearsfan123
09-15-2008, 11:10 PM
We have capable S on the roster in McGowan and Payne and we have Steltz who is a good fit at FS and D. Manning who is garbage but still has starting experience. S is the least important position on our team(other than FB, maybe SLB). Our #1 receiver is Davis who would be a decent slot receiver on any other team and Lloyd who wouldn't see the field in 4 wide sets on most teams. No one is ever gonna buy the pass or play action if we dont have a capable WR. Every team we go against knows that they dont have to double anyone because our WRs are gonna make every secondary look like pro bowlers.

You say the position is one of the least important? Talk to me when Brown goes down. And I am all for trying to sign Roy Williams to be our #1 guy. You have to understand I am not advocating a 1st round safety over a 1st rd receiver, no I am advocating a 2nd round safety over a second round receiver. Unless a great talent like a Bey or Crabtree fall to us in the second, that safety is probably going to be better value, and a more impact player.

I already said I do not like Steltz, McGowan is solid but is not starting material IMO, and Manning has busted at safety, again JMO. Those guys cannot fill Brown's shoes, we have seen that. I want to bring in a guy who has better potential to. A Chung, or Hamlin, or Chancellor, or Greene, somebody who has press clippings, hype, and experience playing the position. Payne, I love. I think he will man his position for a long time, Brown is a great player but immenseley injury prone, McGowan is our starting Nickel but beyond them IMO we have nothing.

Cribbs>Hester
09-16-2008, 01:34 AM
You should take a page out of the New England/Cleveland playbook and trade draft picks for proven NFL caliber players instead of drafting complete unknowns that are more probable to bust than boom. Especially on offense for Chicago(Forte looks good though)

Trade your 2nd for Chad Ocho Cinco
Trade your 3rd for Derek Anderson

1st round draft Eugene Monroe

QB Derek Anderson
RB Matt Forte
FB
WR Chad Ocho Cino
WR
TE Greg Olsen/Desmond Clark
LT Eugene Monroe
LG
C Olin Kruetz
RG
RT Chris Williams

That has the makings of a great offense to compliment a great defense.

Gay Ork Wang
09-16-2008, 09:15 AM
if we can actually get Ocho Cinco for a 2nd id do it in a heartbeat.

And we would never put C.Williams at RT. His biggest problem is the Run Blocking and he was a LT Prototype

awfullyquiet
09-16-2008, 11:59 AM
Brown is a great player but immenseley injury prone, McGowan is our starting Nickel but beyond them IMO we have nothing.

He hasn't been injured yet!

He's been injured with 'long term' injuries more. I hate to say he's 'injury prone' because most of his injuries are completely unrelated.

He has the possibility of being injury free this year (duh), but, we need someone with 75% of his skill behind him, and right now, that requires time.

Hurricane Ditka
09-16-2008, 02:11 PM
http://images.dawgsports.com/images/admin/Tim_Tebow_v_LSU.jpg[/img]

This equals win.

regoob2
09-16-2008, 02:34 PM
You should take a page out of the New England/Cleveland playbook and trade draft picks for proven NFL caliber players instead of drafting complete unknowns that are more probable to bust than boom. Especially on offense for Chicago(Forte looks good though)

Trade your 2nd for Chad Ocho Cinco
Trade your 3rd for Derek Anderson

1st round draft Eugene Monroe

QB Derek Anderson
RB Matt Forte
FB
WR Chad Ocho Cino
WR
TE Greg Olsen/Desmond Clark
LT Eugene Monroe
LG
C Olin Kruetz
RG
RT Chris Williams

That has the makings of a great offense to compliment a great defense.
The Bengals turned down 2 1sts for Chad, and Derek would probably need a 1st also.

BeerBaron
09-16-2008, 02:48 PM
The Bengals turned down 2 1sts for Chad, and Derek would probably need a 1st also.

Aye. I don't want either anyway.....Chad's just not worth the headaches imo. I'd rather try and develop/sign some lower level (and quieter) guys to fill our WR spots. We look to have a good back in Forte and some good TE's to throw to. the Receivers just need to be bodies who get in the right position for all we need them for right now.

A stud playmaking WR would be great, but at what cost? I'd rather keep focusing on rebuilding the o-line with high draft picks while taking receivers and maybe a QB in the mid rounds to try and develop them as best we can.

Bearsfan123
09-16-2008, 02:50 PM
He hasn't been injured yet!

He's been injured with 'long term' injuries more. I hate to say he's 'injury prone' because most of his injuries are completely unrelated.

He has the possibility of being injury free this year (duh), but, we need someone with 75% of his skill behind him, and right now, that requires time.

We have said the same thing the past two years! He hasn't stayed healthy in four years, he has had a ton of bad luck, but it still isn't a good strategy to say that a guy who has been hurt four years in a row, is suddenly going to stop getting hurt. It does have to do with how we use him, but regardless it is time to try and bring in someone that can take the beating assigned to his position and play it well. No rookie could step in for Mike Brown, he is one of our leaders on defense, and one of our best players, and i dont expect them to.

I want a guy who has talent, to step in behind Mike Brown, learn from him, and IF he goes down, to replace him in the lineup without a dramatic drop off in PRODUCTION. Leadership wise, you have to leave that to the vets, but I want a guy who can step in and help with the production part.

I am debating for a second tier safety, or a first tier guy if he drops to the second round over a second tier receiver. I am only saying this because this year is pretty deep at safety and weak at WR if it was reversed I would reverse my argument. The top two tiers of safety in this years class are better than the top two tiers of the WR class with the exception of Crabtree most likely. My argument for the need is based on this year's senior and most likely to declare junior classes. Waiting another year to me is a bad idea based on how reliant we are on Brown. It is time to draft his eventual replacement, and this year is perfect for it.

BeerBaron
09-16-2008, 02:56 PM
I'd personally wait until the 3rd round with the depth of safety class this year. IF we're picking somewhere in the middle of the first like last year, I'd like to find a future RT or elite G there, and then get whichever we missed in the 2nd round if possible.

Both could be guys with an immediate impact depending on Tait's future and would go a long way in rebuilding our offense for the future

Bearsfan123
09-16-2008, 03:05 PM
I'd personally wait until the 3rd round with the depth of safety class this year. IF we're picking somewhere in the middle of the first like last year, I'd like to find a future RT or elite G there, and then get whichever we missed in the 2nd round if possible.

Both could be guys with an immediate impact depending on Tait's future and would go a long way in rebuilding our offense for the future


I like that idea alot, so I think trading down is the best option. It was to me originally, and again it still seems to be the best way to go. that 25th-32nd place. But i still say that first 2nd rounder should go to that 2nd tier safety.

IE.

15 trade down to 27

27th-Herman Johnson OG
47-Kam Chancellor S
59-Alex Boone RT

EDIT: It also has to do with the fact that I dont see Angelo going O-line, O-line. But throw in a guy in between, and maybe then he does.

regoob2
09-16-2008, 03:40 PM
My new sig looks as followed
1. Sam Bradford QB (QB of the future, smart, accurate, size, good arm)
2. Percy Harvin WR (He'll likely fall like Desean Jackson, light yrs better than Hester in the passing game)
3. Trevor Canfield OG (Off the field problems drop him a bit)
4. Alex Boone RT (conditional 3rd from Berrian, He wont be a day 1 pick)

awfullyquiet
09-16-2008, 06:23 PM
I likeeeee harvin. I think he's got the smarts to actually be okay in our system. He'd be great elsewhere. Okay here.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-20-2008, 07:31 PM
Harvin is going to be a much better pro than Maclin, imo.. Maclin has awful hands and is really skinny. Harvin has put on some decent bulk since arriving at Florida he could really fill out nicely. Although, he is a huge douche bag.

If we were slotted at say #10 I'd like to see a trade down 5-7 spots and picking up Robinson and another early 2nd to possibly grab Harvin or one of the safety prospects that will fall.

I don't see Mays, Moore, & Rolle all getting drafted in the first. Some pretty serious flaws with all of them.

Mays - All the physical tools, but has yet to put it together and produce.
Rolle - Hasn't really produced and is riding high on a lot of High School hype.
Moore - Looks awfully stiff in coverage and isn't an intimidating hitter.

Race for the Heisman
09-21-2008, 04:14 PM
Obviously if you have the chance to grab an elite signal caller you do it, but a lot of us fans are in favor of prioritizing offensive line, safety, and wide receiver over quarterback. If it pans out such that this happens, I would still hope the team selects a quarterback late. I know the team picked up Hanie and seems satisfied with him, but I think someone like Graham Harrell could be a steal in the fifth or so, and it has become increasingly more trendy to take a guy late and work with him, so that the investment is not huge but the potential payoff is still good. Doing this every three years or so keeps competition at the quarterback spot and opens up potential trades as well. In summation, although I like Hanie, I'd still want to see the Bears draft a quarterback next year, even if it is not as a top pick.

bearsfan_51
09-21-2008, 04:18 PM
We're going to have to draft a quarterback regardless, since Grossman obviously isn't coming back.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 04:19 PM
Obviously if you have the chance to grab an elite signal caller you do it, but a lot of us fans are in favor of prioritizing offensive line, safety, and wide receiver over quarterback. If it pans out such that this happens, I would still hope the team selects a quarterback late. I know the team picked up Hanie and seems satisfied with him, but I think someone like Graham Harrell could be a steal in the fifth or so, and it has become increasingly more trendy to take a guy late and work with him, so that the investment is not huge but the potential payoff is still good. Doing this every three years or so keeps competition at the quarterback spot and opens up potential trades as well. In summation, although I like Hanie, I'd still want to see the Bears draft a quarterback next year, even if it is not as a top pick.

thats all understandable and i'm totally for going QB in the 3rd or later I'd say...

I know they rarely work out there but theres such a small investment that it doesn't matter if we have to go through a few.

plus, using our 1st and 2nd on say, getting younger/better on the o-line will help anyone we try out at QB

Smokey Joe
09-21-2008, 05:35 PM
We're going to have to draft a quarterback regardless, since Grossman obviously isn't coming back.
Yeah, but I don't want to see us draft somebody for the sake of drafting somebody. We won't be so bad where we pick in the top 5 (or 3) and have a shot at Stafford, and I just don't see Angelo and Lovie (assuming they are still with the Bears come April, which they will likely be) going with Tebow. And even if we pick in the mid teens (which seems like a good projection after seeing this team play), Tebow still might go top 10.

If we come into week 14 or 15 and are out of the playoffs, I'd like to see Hanie start. If impresses, we might just have found something going into 09/10. If not, I would prefer getting someone like Warner to be a stop gap for a year or two and then in the 2010 draft get either Sanchez or Bradford (I don't see either of them coming out this year).

Gay Ork Wang
09-21-2008, 05:36 PM
put Hanie in!!!

bearsfan_51
09-21-2008, 06:59 PM
You're talking about Kurt Warner as if that's a reasonable option at this point. Lay off the Madden.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-21-2008, 07:18 PM
I am at the stage where I have zero faith in the offense as a whole & really no optimism for our QB situation. It's really frustrating to watch every Sunday knowing Orton is going to be managing the game throwing screen passes and dunking. I woke up today & realized it was Sunday, but was not amped at all like I usually am for a game. I don't know if this makes me a bad fan or not, but man it is tough watching this team.

At the very least when Rex was starting there was a little hope, because he was young and had some talent. But, again, that ship has been sailed. I want a first round QB. I don't even give a sh!t who it is at this point. Just someone who we can be optimistic about.

I am excited about Forte though and feel the offense can be built around him. Like shown today he has pretty good hands, vision, & is a very good runner. The mismatches he can create by flanking out into the slot/outside is likely going to be the key to this offense this year & 3-4 years from now.

Tebow or Stafford -- for the love of god.

1st - Tim Tebow - QB - Florida
2nd - Herman Johnson - OG - LSU

LT - Chris Williams
LG - Herman Johnson
C - Olin Kreutz
RG - Roberto Garza
RT - John Tait

QB - Tebow
RB - Forte

WRs - Here lies the problem.. Will the FO go after Roy Williams or Lee Evans? Probably not.

It's either have no QB, no OL, or no WRs due to the fact that our FO isn't going to go out and give out a big contract to a FA that can really help us.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 07:21 PM
Herman Johnson won't last until midway through round 2. And I'd rather not be trying to break in a rookie QB (or at least be developing him for the future) when the best we got along most of the o-line are aging veterans and a rookie who isn't healthy....

I'd rather wait on a QB and get that o-line looking respectable headed into the future. Even a below average QB could look adequate if he has a chance to throw behind good blocking.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-21-2008, 07:23 PM
The sooner we break in a rookie QB the faster he develops.

We don't have time to wait for a 3rd-4th round guy to develop.. More often than not they are not the answer and you waste time & pass on players who could really help.

This defense does not have a HUGE window anymore and it is going to suck pretty bad if we cannot establish an offense while this defense is still very good.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 07:25 PM
The sooner we break in a rookie QB the faster he develops.

We don't have time to wait for a 3rd-4th round guy to develop.. More often than not they are not the answer and you waste time & pass on players who could really help.

This defense does not have a HUGE window anymore and it is going to suck pretty bad if we cannot establish an offense while this defense is still very good.

but its not going to do a lick of good to be developing behind a line that can't give him time to throw or adequate receivers to throw to.

i'd rather invest heavily in those things because theres slightly less risk than going all out for a franchise QB who can't stay on his feet or have great targets.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-21-2008, 07:27 PM
but its not going to do a lick of good to be developing behind a line that can't give him time to throw or adequate receivers to throw to.

i'd rather invest heavily in those things because theres slightly less risk than going all out for a franchise QB who can't stay on his feet or have great targets.

The problem with our line currently is John St Clair and Josh Beekman.

Tebow would have this to work with his rookie year:

LT - Chris Williams
LG - Herman Johnson
C - Olin Kreutz
RG - Roberto Garza
RT - John Tait

That is a solid OL assuming Williams can pass protect like he is supposed to.

In 2010 you find a RT.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 07:30 PM
The problem with our line currently is John St Clair and Josh Beekman.

Tebow would have this to work with his rookie year:

LT - Chris Williams
LG - Herman Johnson
C - Olin Kreutz
RG - Roberto Garza
RT - John Tait

That is a solid OL assuming Williams can pass protect like he is supposed to.

In 2010 you find a RT.

we wouldn't have herman johnson if we took tebow in the first. the amount of trading around required to make that happen is just too much to hope for...

plus, if tebow comes out, he will have to have proven himself enough to be a very high (top 10) draft pick. If he fails to do that this year, then he can stay at florida for another year and try and win a national title. come out as a senior and go wherever he goes then

so if he comes out this year, i think he will have to be projected pretty darn high. higher than we might be able to get him at

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-21-2008, 07:34 PM
we wouldn't have herman johnson if we took tebow in the first. the amount of trading around required to make that happen is just too much to hope for...

plus, if tebow comes out, he will have to have proven himself enough to be a very high (top 10) draft pick. If he fails to do that this year, then he can stay at florida for another year and try and win a national title. come out as a senior and go wherever he goes then

so if he comes out this year, i think he will have to be projected pretty darn high. higher than we might be able to get him at

I think we're going to be selecting around 8-10.

I don't think it's that far fetched to assume Tebow will be there or that Herman Johnson will last until #40. Chilo Rachal went in a similar spot last year & although I think Herman Johnson is a better prospect - they will end up being selected in similar spots. That is usually where the 2nd OG comes off the board.

In 2007 -- Aaron Sears went #35 & Justin Blalock went #39. The 2nd & 3rd guard prospects in the draft.

In 2006 -- The 2nd Guard came off the board at #41 - Deuce Lutui.

Again, I don't see how Herman falling to around #40 is far fetched at all. Do you think he is a first rounder? I certainly do not.

Smokey Joe
09-21-2008, 07:40 PM
The problem with our line currently is John St Clair and Josh Beekman.

Tebow would have this to work with his rookie year:

LT - Chris Williams
LG - Herman Johnson
C - Olin Kreutz
RG - Roberto Garza
RT - John Tait

That is a solid OL assuming Williams can pass protect like he is supposed to.

In 2010 you find a RT.
Way to seriously underestime the problem with our OLine. In fact, I'd say the leftside of the line has vastly out preformed the right side. Tait and Garza have been down right awful this year.

Smokey Joe
09-21-2008, 07:42 PM
Also, I think we will be picking 16 with a record of 8-8.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 07:42 PM
Way to seriously underestime the problem with our OLine. In fact, I'd say the leftside of the line has vastly out preformed the right side. Tait and Garza have been down right awful this year.

looks better than say...

LT: Williams
LG: Beekman
C: Kreutz
RG: Johnson
RT: Tait

Beekmans doing well enough for now as a stop gap, but I think he may be our future C as we can probably do better looking for a LG

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-21-2008, 07:44 PM
Way to seriously underestime the problem with our OLine. In fact, I'd say the leftside of the line has vastly out preformed the right side. Tait and Garza have been down right awful this year.

There is absolutely no push in the run game on the left side.

The right side of this OL is manageable.. The left side is just a disaster and everyone knows it.

Smokey Joe
09-21-2008, 07:44 PM
We need an upgrade at LG, but I wouldn't mind Beekman at RG.

MidwayMonster31
09-21-2008, 08:33 PM
Getting Duke Robinson in the first round would be nice. If we go 8-8 and pick 16th, that would be a perfect spot for him. Quarterback is another option. But with the way that Stafford is playing, he should be a top 5 pick. Tebow may or may not be there and Harper is hurt now. So there might not be any quarterbacks worth drafting at 16. I also don't like the depth in this class. Depending on Harper's shoulder, I would go with Robinson then Harper.

BeerBaron
09-21-2008, 08:43 PM
Getting Duke Robinson in the first round would be nice. If we go 8-8 and pick 16th, that would be a perfect spot for him. Quarterback is another option. But with the way that Stafford is playing, he should be a top 5 pick. Tebow may or may not be there and Harper is hurt now. So there might not be any quarterbacks worth drafting at 16. I also don't like the depth in this class. Depending on Harper's shoulder, I would go with Robinson then Harper.

agreed on all accounts. i'm really hoping that if we pick in the latter half of the first round (or so) that we go Robinson.

interior lineman don't often go that high but those that do usually work out well. plus it'd be one of the few positions on this team where a rookie could come in and start right away.

Smokey Joe
09-21-2008, 11:22 PM
If we pick at 16, I could see Andre Smith still possibly being available. It just seems to me that huge linemen like him always slip a bit.

regoob2
09-22-2008, 05:09 PM
So if there is no QB available which is likely I think we should look at a DE. Our pass rush was horrible. If Michael Johnson is available we should be considered. QB or WR if available but after that I think and elite DE would be great.

BeerBaron
09-22-2008, 05:24 PM
So if there is no QB available which is likely I think we should look at a DE. Our pass rush was horrible. If Michael Johnson is available we should be considered. QB or WR if available but after that I think and elite DE would be great.

eh. i'm still riding the o-line bus until the wheels come off....

let JA uncover some of his late round gems for defensive players. Manning and Bazuin didn't work out, neither did okwo...but maybe if he waits until a few rounds later, lol

i also don't think Tommie Harris is quite playing like Tommie Harris either. In what limited games i've been able to see, he just hasn't been himself it seems. That also contributes quite a bit to our lack of a pass rush i'm sure

Race for the Heisman
09-22-2008, 07:10 PM
If you're talking about winning before the window closes then it would be pointless to even try for that with a rookie quarterback. The window is in part dependent on collective health of Urlacher and Mike Brown. That safety spot makes the Tampa 2 click and Urlacher has been a perennial All-Pro player, but I don't know how much longer either player will last. If it is all or nothing it has to be next year, maybe even the year after that.

In short, if the team wants to beat the window, it needs to spend like the Jets did. Get a quarterback. If there isn't one in free agency, trade for one. If Derek Anderson is all there is (Troy Smith for the homer pick!) then you have to gamble on him. Have to, as in it is necessary, because no rookie will win the big one behind this line. On that subject, upgrade the line with at least one, preferably two established mid/upper tier starters and get a true number one receiver. Otherwise take steps to replace Urlacher and Brown now or forget them a focus on building a legitimate offense, at the expense of the defense if necessary. You can't have your pie and it eat too, the league doesn't work like that.

BeerBaron
09-22-2008, 07:30 PM
If you're talking about winning before the window closes then it would be pointless to even try for that with a rookie quarterback. The window is in part dependent on collective health of Urlacher and Mike Brown. That safety spot makes the Tampa 2 click and Urlacher has been a perennial All-Pro player, but I don't know how much longer either player will last. If it is all or nothing it has to be next year, maybe even the year after that.

In short, if the team wants to beat the window, it needs to spend like the Jets did. Get a quarterback. If there isn't one in free agency, trade for one. If Derek Anderson is all there is (Troy Smith for the homer pick!) then you have to gamble on him. Have to, as in it is necessary, because no rookie will win the big one behind this line. On that subject, upgrade the line with at least one, preferably two established mid/upper tier starters and get a true number one receiver. Otherwise take steps to replace Urlacher and Brown now or forget them a focus on building a legitimate offense, at the expense of the defense if necessary. You can't have your pie and it eat too, the league doesn't work like that.

Good on all points though I wouldn't go near that Derek Anderson name at all whatsoever.... Cribbs>Hester is always lurking to start trouble and I really don't need there to be fuel for his fire laying around our forum, lol

So DA doesn't look like a good option....

Shot from out of nowhere, if Cincy doesn't turn things around and wants to do a total rebuild job next offseason, I'd see if there was any way to finagle Carson Palmer from them. Maybe our first for Carson and their 2nd....

Use the 2 seconds on a LG and a RT, grab some depth at the DE or S spots in the other rounds......yeah.

Probably never going to happen but that would kick ass if it did, at least in my opinion

Bearsfan123
09-22-2008, 07:37 PM
Good on all points though I wouldn't go near that Derek Anderson name at all whatsoever.... Cribbs>Hester is always lurking to start trouble and I really don't need there to be fuel for his fire laying around our forum, lol

So DA doesn't look like a good option....

Shot from out of nowhere, if Cincy doesn't turn things around and wants to do a total rebuild job next offseason, I'd see if there was any way to finagle Carson Palmer from them. Maybe our first for Carson and their 2nd....

Use the 2 seconds on a LG and a RT, grab some depth at the DE or S spots in the other rounds......yeah.

Probably never going to happen but that would kick ass if it did, at least in my opinion


I went to their board about three weeks ago and asked if they thought Carson wanted to leave. What I got was a resounding, dont let him leave ever. And on the side note one guy brought up the Bears trading for him and they said it would probably take multiple firsts.

regoob2
09-22-2008, 07:38 PM
Good on all points though I wouldn't go near that Derek Anderson name at all whatsoever.... Cribbs>Hester is always lurking to start trouble and I really don't need there to be fuel for his fire laying around our forum, lol

So DA doesn't look like a good option....

Shot from out of nowhere, if Cincy doesn't turn things around and wants to do a total rebuild job next offseason, I'd see if there was any way to finagle Carson Palmer from them. Maybe our first for Carson and their 2nd....

Use the 2 seconds on a LG and a RT, grab some depth at the DE or S spots in the other rounds......yeah.

Probably never going to happen but that would kick ass if it did, at least in my opinion
**** id give them our 1st and 2nd this year and our 1st next for Palmer. How many years does he have left on his contract?

BeerBaron
09-22-2008, 07:53 PM
I went to their board about three weeks ago and asked if they thought Carson wanted to leave. What I got was a resounding, dont let him leave ever. And on the side note one guy brought up the Bears trading for him and they said it would probably take multiple firsts.

**** id give them our 1st and 2nd this year and our 1st next for Palmer. How many years does he have left on his contract?

it would take "multiple firsts" right up until he decides to chew out the organization for building a terrible defense and drafting all of these turds who get into trouble.

The price sharply drops for guys who trash talk their teams and try and demand their way out of town. All they got for Corey Dillon was a 2nd and he still had a few years worth of gas in the tank and helped the Pats win....2 superbowls? Maybe just one...but still.

And I know RB's are a little different than QB's but Dillon was about the only bright spot that franchise had for years and years and years and years.....

And yes, they did deny CJ this past offseason but they thought they could still have a respectable team and turn things around. Didn't want to break that up...

Now that they're 0-3, having any kind of half decent season seems out of the question so a shakeup might be in the works and if Carson isn't too happy.....hmm....

Now all that said, there isn't a ******* snowballs chance in hell we get Carson for what I said, lol. But its so fun to dream ain't it?

Bearsfan123
09-22-2008, 08:17 PM
I was bored so here is my 2nd or 3rd (of many) offseason plan to return to glory!

1-Fire Ron Turner, bring in Lane Kiffin as OC. I would love to fire Lovie, but with this hire it tells Lovie if he doesnt improve we can promote from the inside with the young Kiffin. Lovie gets one last chance, Ron Turner struck out.

2- The organization shows a commitment to excellence by bringing in a big name FA. Roy Williams WR- A. He is weakening a division rival. B. He can make the "circus" catch look easy. He will be our #1 with a chance to show everyone that "Megatron" isn't the best WR in the North.

3-Get rid of wasted space. Guys to release/cut/trade/get rid of: Grossman, Metcalf, Manning, Booker, and Bradley. They have wasted our time, and need to just go somewhere else. Also release Anthony Adams but that is just because he deserves a fair shot and he wont get it here. Get what we can in return but mainly its addition by subtraction.

4-Resign the useful guys: Kevin Jones Rb- He is being under utilized right now but when we get to see him we will see a hard running rb who can help pickup the tough yards. Brandon Lloyd WR-He has been playing really well for us these first two games, he deserves to stay.

5-The draft.
We are at 14 due to our 7-9 season. We trade down to 22. And pick up an extra 2nd round pick.

22- We praise the Lord for Duke Robinson fell to our laps. Duke Robinson OG. He helps our O-line at either G position strengthening our running game. JA cries knowing that he is caving to public pressure.

46-Patrick Chung S- Angelo smiles as he tries to backup one of the most valuable parts of our D with a capable S. Learning from Mike Brown should help him immensely.

54-Jamon Meredith OT- I copped out, I went back and forth between Harper and Meredith but I put Meredith. We need a RT to groom behind Tait for a year and here is a perfect spot to get him. We get another good value.

Race for the Heisman
09-22-2008, 08:23 PM
Good on all points though I wouldn't go near that Derek Anderson name at all whatsoever.... Cribbs>Hester is always lurking to start trouble and I really don't need there to be fuel for his fire laying around our forum, lol

So DA doesn't look like a good option....

Shot from out of nowhere, if Cincy doesn't turn things around and wants to do a total rebuild job next offseason, I'd see if there was any way to finagle Carson Palmer from them. Maybe our first for Carson and their 2nd....

Use the 2 seconds on a LG and a RT, grab some depth at the DE or S spots in the other rounds......yeah.

Probably never going to happen but that would kick ass if it did, at least in my opinion

I would bust a nut if we got Carson, but it will never happen. As for Derek Anderson, I totally agree, I was just making a point.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-22-2008, 08:50 PM
If you're talking about winning before the window closes then it would be pointless to even try for that with a rookie quarterback. The window is in part dependent on collective health of Urlacher and Mike Brown. That safety spot makes the Tampa 2 click and Urlacher has been a perennial All-Pro player, but I don't know how much longer either player will last. If it is all or nothing it has to be next year, maybe even the year after that.

In short, if the team wants to beat the window, it needs to spend like the Jets did. Get a quarterback. If there isn't one in free agency, trade for one. If Derek Anderson is all there is (Troy Smith for the homer pick!) then you have to gamble on him. Have to, as in it is necessary, because no rookie will win the big one behind this line. On that subject, upgrade the line with at least one, preferably two established mid/upper tier starters and get a true number one receiver. Otherwise take steps to replace Urlacher and Brown now or forget them a focus on building a legitimate offense, at the expense of the defense if necessary. You can't have your pie and it eat too, the league doesn't work like that.

Derek Anderson is about to get benched.

You do not settle for a scrub like Anderson. He is awful.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-22-2008, 08:53 PM
The Bengals would trade every single player on that team before they traded Carson Palmer.. It is a ridiculous pipe dream.

The FO is pretty pissed at Chad & wouldn't trade him, because he is so marketable. You really believe they are going to trade Carson or would even entertain offers?

Not to mention the offer you mentioned.. Cinci is going to be picking just outside of the top 5 most likely. We give them around #15 or so and they give us Carson & #37-#40? Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?

Smokey Joe
09-22-2008, 09:02 PM
I was bored so here is my 2nd or 3rd (of many) offseason plan to return to glory!

1-Fire Ron Turner, bring in Lane Kiffin as OC. I would love to fire Lovie, but with this hire it tells Lovie if he doesnt improve we can promote from the inside with the young Kiffin. Lovie gets one last chance, Ron Turner struck out.

2- The organization shows a commitment to excellence by bringing in a big name FA. Roy Williams WR- A. He is weakening a division rival. B. He can make the "circus" catch look easy. He will be our #1 with a chance to show everyone that "Megatron" isn't the best WR in the North.

3-Get rid of wasted space. Guys to release/cut/trade/get rid of: Grossman, Metcalf, Manning, Booker, and Bradley. They have wasted our time, and need to just go somewhere else. Also release Anthony Adams but that is just because he deserves a fair shot and he wont get it here. Get what we can in return but mainly its addition by subtraction.

4-Resign the useful guys: Kevin Jones Rb- He is being under utilized right now but when we get to see him we will see a hard running rb who can help pickup the tough yards. Brandon Lloyd WR-He has been playing really well for us these first two games, he deserves to stay.

5-The draft.
We are at 14 due to our 7-9 season. We trade down to 22. And pick up an extra 2nd round pick.

22- We praise the Lord for Duke Robinson fell to our laps. Duke Robinson OG. He helps our O-line at either G position strengthening our running game. JA cries knowing that he is caving to public pressure.

46-Patrick Chung S- Angelo smiles as he tries to backup one of the most valuable parts of our D with a capable S. Learning from Mike Brown should help him immensely.

54-Jamon Meredith OT- I copped out, I went back and forth between Harper and Meredith but I put Meredith. We need a RT to groom behind Tait for a year and here is a perfect spot to get him. We get another good value.
Just a couple things to point out...

-I find it amusing that you still want to get rid of Manning after basically his best game as a pro, and even if he will never be a great starter, he still provides a lot to this team, and has shown to be a dynamic return man as well.

-The only way we should/would cut Anthony Adams is if we desperately need the money or he begins to cry about PT and wants out. Cutting him for the sake of cutting him would be stupid as he provides very good depth.

-I'd love to bring back Kevin Jones as well, but that ain't happening. There's a reason why he hired Rosenhaus as his agent just a couple weeks ago, he's looking for his big payday. And as long as he stays healthy and shows some flashes this year, some team will pay him. Plus, he isn't stupid, he wants to play and he sees that's gonna be tough with Forte in town.

-I love the Roy Williams signing, and I am the one who started the bandwagon for him here. I also love the idea of bringing in Kiffin, finally a brilliant young offensive mind who could even step up as HC is Lovie doesn't do the job. As an incentive to come here, I'd also make him the assistant HC and allow him to hire/fire any offensive coaches he wanted to. However, if we finally get a competent offense, no matter who the OC, I have no problem with Lovie and Babich.

-As for the draft, that would be fantastic. However, I highly, highly doubt Meredith is there at 54. The Chung pick already is a bit wishful, but the Meredith pick is extremely wishful. I love Duke Robinson as well.

BeerBaron
09-22-2008, 09:03 PM
The Bengals would trade every single player on that team before they traded Carson Palmer.. It is a ridiculous pipe dream.

The FO is pretty pissed at Chad & wouldn't trade him, because he is so marketable. You really believe they are going to trade Carson or would even entertain offers?

Not to mention the offer you mentioned.. Cinci is going to be picking just outside of the top 5 most likely. We give them around #15 or so and they give us Carson & #37-#40? Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?

yeah, i pointed out its unrealisticness later on, but its fun to hope.

and if they really wanted to do a total rebuild job...like, coach, key players....everything. everything. then maybe we could pry Carson away.

He would have to be disgruntled though. Be all like "Yo, I'm wasting my time here if we're rebuilding under a new regime. **** you guys. I want to play for someone better."

Are we a lot better? not really.....but our D can still hold its own and Forte looks like a keeper at RB. Maybe Carson can develop some chemistry with Olsen and maybe Hester will be healthy and playing WR some more.....Maybe we could even <gasp> sign a real WR too.

crazy? yes......but if someone told you at the end of last regular season that Favre would be playing for the Jets for a mid round pick, you would have thought they were crazy too.

Pissed off Carson Palmer > KO or any rookie we could get

Smokey Joe
09-22-2008, 09:06 PM
The Bengals would trade every single player on that team before they traded Carson Palmer.. It is a ridiculous pipe dream.

The FO is pretty pissed at Chad & wouldn't trade him, because he is so marketable. You really believe they are going to trade Carson or would even entertain offers?

Not to mention the offer you mentioned.. Cinci is going to be picking just outside of the top 5 most likely. We give them around #15 or so and they give us Carson & #37-#40? Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds?
If Carson doesn't want to be traded, then there is no way the Bengals do trade him. However, when a player doesn't want to be on a team anymore and will just become a distraction, then a trade becomes much more realistic. It'd cost a ton, but if Palmer decided to demand a trade, it's very well possible he could be traded. Basically, it's not outside of the realm of possibility as you put it.

Bearsfan123
09-23-2008, 12:01 AM
Just a couple things to point out...

-I find it amusing that you still want to get rid of Manning after basically his best game as a pro, and even if he will never be a great starter, he still provides a lot to this team, and has shown to be a dynamic return man as well.

-The only way we should/would cut Anthony Adams is if we desperately need the money or he begins to cry about PT and wants out. Cutting him for the sake of cutting him would be stupid as he provides very good depth.

-I'd love to bring back Kevin Jones as well, but that ain't happening. There's a reason why he hired Rosenhaus as his agent just a couple weeks ago, he's looking for his big payday. And as long as he stays healthy and shows some flashes this year, some team will pay him. Plus, he isn't stupid, he wants to play and he sees that's gonna be tough with Forte in town.

-I love the Roy Williams signing, and I am the one who started the bandwagon for him here. I also love the idea of bringing in Kiffin, finally a brilliant young offensive mind who could even step up as HC is Lovie doesn't do the job. As an incentive to come here, I'd also make him the assistant HC and allow him to hire/fire any offensive coaches he wanted to. However, if we finally get a competent offense, no matter who the OC, I have no problem with Lovie and Babich.

-As for the draft, that would be fantastic. However, I highly, highly doubt Meredith is there at 54. The Chung pick already is a bit wishful, but the Meredith pick is extremely wishful. I love Duke Robinson as well.

1- Manning had value as a returner before IMO, now it is just getting validated. We have Hester, no need for 2 specialists, trade him while he still has value. I dont think he is particularly good as the nickel either.

2.Starters: Tommie, Dusty Bench: Harrison, Idonije. PS Toenia(I think) Adams can go. Not because of lack of ability, its just our depth is good there. I wouldnt mind keeping him, but if another player has better value than I think he could be cut.

3.KJ hasn't really even played much. We need to use him more. Yeah you are probably right, he probably wont come back, but if he keeps getting used this sparingly I wouldn't blame him. This one will definately be changed next go round.

4. Yes, I agreed WHOLEHEARTEDLY with both those ideas. I havent been very fortuitous in finding contract lengths (alright I admit i went looking for like ten minutes) but beyond that we need a #1 guy, and a good OC. Good idea with the assistant HC thing, I like.

5. I havent heard alot beyond that Chung is a good pro-prospect. I think only 2 safeties go in the first round, and I think the pedigree of a guy like Kam Chancellor may push him ahead of Chung. Meredith, well yeah, Ill change that to Boone. Duke Robinson I've been calling for awhile.

Im sorry though, I meant to make a 7 rder but I kinda got stuck and was like meh, 2 rounds are enough for now. Ill do better next time.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-23-2008, 03:15 AM
I agree about Kiffin. He would be a nice OC.

I understand safety is important, but we have drafted so many defensive backs and have so many holes on offense I cannot be on board with a safety in round two. Unless it is Mays, Rolle, or Moore.

QB, LG, & WR are bigger needs in my opinion.

BeerBaron
09-23-2008, 10:01 AM
I agree about Kiffin. He would be a nice OC.

I understand safety is important, but we have drafted so many defensive backs and have so many holes on offense I cannot be on board with a safety in round two. Unless it is Mays, Rolle, or Moore.

QB, LG, & WR are bigger needs in my opinion.

I would take WR out. There is not a chance in hell that we find a #1 WR in rounds 3, 4.....we need to stop with that. Its not working. Bennett was fine last year but now we've got more than enough #3 and #4 type receivers on this team. If we want a real target there, we need to sign or trade for someone who is already established.

So yeah, its a need, but we're not going to find it in the draft where we would be looking....

awfullyquiet
09-23-2008, 02:02 PM
I feel bad... When you all were talking roy williams. i was like. DEAR GOD NOT THE SAFETY

awfullyquiet
09-23-2008, 02:09 PM
3-Get rid of wasted space. Guys to release/cut/trade/get rid of: Grossman, Metcalf, Manning, Booker, and Bradley. They have wasted our time, and need to just go somewhere else. Also release Anthony Adams but that is just because he deserves a fair shot and he wont get it here. Get what we can in return but mainly its addition by subtraction.

5-The draft.
We are at 14 due to our 7-9 season. We trade down to 22. And pick up an extra 2nd round pick.

22- We praise the Lord for Duke Robinson fell to our laps. Duke Robinson OG. He helps our O-line at either G position strengthening our running game. JA cries knowing that he is caving to public pressure.

46-Patrick Chung S- Angelo smiles as he tries to backup one of the most valuable parts of our D with a capable S. Learning from Mike Brown should help him immensely.

54-Jamon Meredith OT- I copped out, I went back and forth between Harper and Meredith but I put Meredith. We need a RT to groom behind Tait for a year and here is a perfect spot to get him. We get another good value.

Okay. Suppose Orton goes down anywyere next year. Grossman cut... are you ready to let Hanie take the wheel? I for one am not... If you're talking about a rebuilding process. I think, naturally, grossman should be here... Name a backup quarterback that you could get to replace grossman next year? Meh. Not many who would be as good as him. (i know, laughable, but he knows the system, and can throw sorta)...

I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree though, trade danieal manning. STAT. i don't care how. or why. But do it and do it ASAP. Someone will find value in him. and if we get a 3rd round for him. I'd consider it a win.

regoob2
09-23-2008, 04:37 PM
I think Manning has played a lot better in the nickel role. I doubt anyone would give us more than a 5th for him though.

bearsfan_51
09-23-2008, 05:16 PM
A 3rd rounder? Hahahaha.....come the **** on...

Bearsfan123
09-23-2008, 10:58 PM
Okay. Suppose Orton goes down anywyere next year. Grossman cut... are you ready to let Hanie take the wheel? I for one am not... If you're talking about a rebuilding process. I think, naturally, grossman should be here... Name a backup quarterback that you could get to replace grossman next year? Meh. Not many who would be as good as him. (i know, laughable, but he knows the system, and can throw sorta)...

I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree though, trade danieal manning. STAT. i don't care how. or why. But do it and do it ASAP. Someone will find value in him. and if we get a 3rd round for him. I'd consider it a win.

I would rather take my chances with Hanie than see the same old Grossman routine. The fans won't support him, he is getting booed everytime he touches the field. Just let him go. He needs a fresh start. Hanie has shown a bit in pre-season, I think hes fine as a backup.

regoob2
09-24-2008, 01:07 AM
We should draft Michael Johnson DE GT and sign Brian Dawkins in FA.

DE- Michael Johnson
NT- Dvoracek
UT- Harris
DE- Ogun
SLB- Hunter
MLB- Urlacher
WLB- Briggs
CB- Vasher
FS- Brown
SS- Dawkins
CB- Tillman

That would be sick. Our O is gonna suck anyway so what the ****.

Smokey Joe
09-24-2008, 06:35 AM
Michael Johnson is soft as hell.

BeerBaron
09-24-2008, 09:00 AM
30 something year old Brian Dawkins.......

Maybe if we're going all out to try and win it once before the window on the defense closes, but if we're trying to keep building up our team then I say no.

regoob2
09-24-2008, 02:17 PM
Michael Johnson is soft as hell.Are DE arent that physical, and Johnson has an explosive first step which is one of the most important things for a DE to have.

30 something year old Brian Dawkins.......

Maybe if we're going all out to try and win it once before the window on the defense closes, but if we're trying to keep building up our team then I say no.
I would love to see Dawkins and Brown back there together it think that would be awesome. Dawkins still has plenty left in the tank and he would be playing zone coverage a majority of the time so if he loses a step it wouldnt be the end of the world.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-24-2008, 05:12 PM
It is absolutely mind boggling to me that people can be half-way serious about drafting a defensive player in the first round.

awfullyquiet
09-24-2008, 05:24 PM
It is absolutely mind boggling to me that people can be half-way serious about drafting a defensive player in the first round.

Welcome to the Bears side of this. Everyone's nuts.

My thing is, and i'm pretty ****** sure on it is... if we have an offense that moves the ball and keeps the defense on the sidelines... our defense is fine. If we need a line that will do it. And we need to spend the money to get the line working to protect our defense.

I don't know, maybe it's just me, but the best defense is a good offense.

MidwayMonster31
09-24-2008, 05:51 PM
There are two main problems I see with the defense, the first one is they do not make adjustments properly. The second one is that they are on the field for too damn long and get worn out at the end of the game.
AwfullyQuiet's right, if the offense can keep sustaining drives and keep the defense from doing all of the work, then they can win more. That is why I am for Duke Robinson.

regoob2
09-24-2008, 07:38 PM
It is absolutely mind boggling to me that people can be half-way serious about drafting a defensive player in the first round.Any offensive player we take has a 90% chance of busting though.

bearsfan_51
09-24-2008, 07:53 PM
It is absolutely mind boggling to me that people can be half-way serious about drafting a defensive player in the first round.

Really? You must have missed the fact that Brian Griese threw for over 400 yards against us with Ike Hilliard as his main target.

Oh and he wasn't sacked once.

Oh and our defense was terrible last year.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-24-2008, 11:05 PM
Really? You must have missed the fact that Brian Griese threw for over 400 yards against us with Ike Hilliard as his main target.

Oh and he wasn't sacked once.

Oh and our defense was terrible last year.

We have absolutely no talent on the offensive side of the ball. It is pathetic.

Besides Forte, Kreutz, our TEs & possibly Chris Williams we have nothing on the offensive side. Vasher, Tillman, Briggs, Harris, Urlacher, Alex Brown, are all locked up for the future on defense.

The defense held TB to 2.6 yards per carry & forced 4 turnovers.

If the offense wasn't 4-15 on third down and actually put it in the endzone, the Bears win off the defense's turnovers.

Are you seriously saying that drafting a DE or Safety would be a good choice? It should not even be considered in the first round.

k0ng
09-24-2008, 11:47 PM
I'd sign a stud WR in the offseason and go OT/OG in the first round personally. The 2nd round wouldn't be a bad place to look at S or DE though.

Oh and btw, does anyone find it funny Bradley was released today? I bet he was pissed about not being on the field and davis dropping that ball. He was probably running his mouth...just my theory.

SFbear
09-25-2008, 12:03 AM
We have absolutely no talent on the offensive side of the ball. It is pathetic.

Besides Forte, Kreutz, our TEs & possibly Chris Williams we have nothing on the offensive side. Vasher, Tillman, Briggs, Harris, Urlacher, Alex Brown, are all locked up for the future on defense.

The defense held TB to 2.6 yards per carry & forced 4 turnovers.

If the offense wasn't 4-15 on third down and actually put it in the endzone, the Bears win off the defense's turnovers.

Are you seriously saying that drafting a DE or Safety would be a good choice? It should not even be considered in the first round.

I would say our prioritized options for the first pick would go
1.QB - unless Hanie comes in and lights it up
2.OT/OG
3.Trade down
4. DE
5. S

with the assumption that we picked up a WR in FA. Roy Williams and Anquan Boldin (in my dreams) come to mind.

regoob2
09-25-2008, 12:09 AM
1.QB
2. WR
3. BPA OL or DE

RT or OG can be had in round 2 or later.

awfullyquiet
09-25-2008, 12:11 AM
Oh and our defense was terrible last year.

Our defense was hellaciously injured this year. You know this.

It was a perfect storm of injuries, it doesn't matter how good your defense is, when you're without 4-5 starters on your defense at any given time. especially your starting corners. you're screwed. it doesn't matter how good your backups are, they're backups to play with your starters in case. not ready to be starters yet. and certainly not 5 of them.

pellepelle_10
09-25-2008, 04:54 AM
I'd sign a stud WR in the offseason and go OT/OG in the first round personally. The 2nd round wouldn't be a bad place to look at S or DE though.

Oh and btw, does anyone find it funny Bradley was released today? I bet he was pissed about not being on the field and davis dropping that ball. He was probably running his mouth...just my theory.

Anquan Boldin anyone?

pellepelle_10
09-25-2008, 04:59 AM
I would say our prioritized options for the first pick would go
1.QB - unless Hanie comes in and lights it up
2.OT/OG
3.Trade down
4. DE
5. S

with the assumption that we picked up a WR in FA. Roy Williams and Anquan Boldin (in my dreams) come to mind.

Wouldn't be a bad option. QB is definatelly a priority. I know many people may frown at Derek Anderson but I think he can remain a good qb in this league. Braylon and many others have been dropping balls right and left. If he's benched for the season we may be able to snag him for a marginal price. Boldin would be my #1 choice at WR simply because he's a beast. Roy has never had 1 full productive season. While his size is great he never stays healthy.

O-Line will remain a need for youth and we can never go wrong getting a QB. I wouldn't mind seeing a LB replace HH who has failed for seasons on covering TE's. I guess this is what we can expect for a situational 3rd LB. I'd like to see more comp at the position personally.

BeerBaron
09-25-2008, 07:57 AM
Boldin still has 3 years to go under his current contract and theres no way the cards let him out of it for nothing.

regoob2
09-25-2008, 09:57 AM
I was just thinking about this. I know people were talking about is going OL with our first 2 picks, but would we ever consider doing it with our first 3? I was just looking at a mock draft and we went Andre Smith in round 1 and I agreed with the pick cause there was no one else really worth the pick at that point. What if OL happens to be BPA by a good sized margin in all 3 rounds? What I saw was:
1st. Andre Smith RT
2nd. Herman Johnson RG
3rd. Trevor Canfield LG

That would make a really really good future OL, plug in Chris Williams and all we would need is to find Kreutz' long term replacement. Beekman and Garza arent starting quality OGs and Tait has slipped and we need his replacement.

awfullyquiet
09-25-2008, 09:59 AM
That would make a really really good future OL, plug in Chris Williams and all we would need is to find Kreutz' long term replacement.

Beeeeekman.

I'd pick roy over q. just because i don't think the bears are willing to spend the dough on that... besides. Roy comes from a place where expectations are low as far as QB's go.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-28-2008, 01:30 AM
Did anyone see that 400 lber playing NT for Alabama tonight? Sweet mother of god! Throw him next to Tommie & we will be able to stop the run!

Terrence Cody (spelling?) is his name.. He is a WHALE!

BeerBaron
09-28-2008, 09:55 AM
Did anyone see that 400 lber playing NT for Alabama tonight? Sweet mother of god! Throw him next to Tommie & we will be able to stop the run!

Terrence Cody (spelling?) is his name.. He is a WHALE!

nah, i think he's a future 3-4 NT along the lines of Vince Wilfork. I'm hoping Dusty or Marcus Harrison can keep that job and do well there.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
09-28-2008, 02:22 PM
nah, i think he's a future 3-4 NT along the lines of Vince Wilfork. I'm hoping Dusty or Marcus Harrison can keep that job and do well there.

I agree he is a NT in a 3-4, but I am always for adding 400 lb freak shows.

Smokey Joe
10-12-2008, 04:33 PM
man, we have a lot of holes. We need a go-to WR, at least one mauler on the OLine, a DE who can create a pass rush (Anderson needs to be cut/traded), and probably another safety (Payne is meh and Brown has lost more than a step).

Hopefully we can fill at least on of these holes via free agency.

Gay Ork Wang
10-12-2008, 04:36 PM
I feel like our holes at the moment are:

1. OL Mauler
2. DE
3. Secondary Depth
4. WR

bearfan
10-12-2008, 05:10 PM
I would put it in this order:

1) OL - obvious need.
2) WR - need a go to guy, not developmental WRs, or guys from the garbage heap.
3) DE - what has happened to our guys?!
4) Secondary. - yeah.

BeerBaron
10-12-2008, 05:17 PM
LG to be most specific on the o-line front. a RT of the future would certainly be nice too.

and a DE to get after the passer. we really need to find someone.....any pressure that i saw us get today came up the middle or on blitzes.

Gay Ork Wang
10-12-2008, 05:18 PM
I feel like with that many WRs and Orton passing the ball around we can survive. No pass rush, no way.

regoob2
10-12-2008, 06:49 PM
It all depends on whos available.
OG, WR, DE, QB, RT in that order.

Gay Ork Wang
10-12-2008, 06:55 PM
why do people think WR is a bigger need then DE?

bearsfan_51
10-12-2008, 06:59 PM
Yeah I really don't understand that at all either. It's like some of you forget what makes this team tick.

Geo
10-12-2008, 07:03 PM
I don't get why people are talking up WR for the Bears period. It's not a need. Hester and Bennett are the future, as is Greg Olsen, they just need to develop. Plus some veteran place-holders who can be servicable in the meantime.

Now if they get a chance to get Michael Crabtree, sure, he's worth it. But the key to the offense is running the ball.

I'd be more concerned with safety, and apparently defensive end now as 51 and some others are stating. Is Mark Anderson a no-show? He looked so promising as a rookie ...

bearsfan_51
10-12-2008, 07:10 PM
It doesn't even seem like Anderson is even playing much, although I didn't get to watch the game today.

I actually like Kevin Payne, but I don't think Mike Brown can be relied on as the longterm answer at FS and Danieal Manning is quite simply a pansy.

bearsfan_51
10-12-2008, 07:11 PM
By the way, what is it with Tillman and Vasher ALWAYS getting hurt? I mean ALLLLWAYS getting hurt. I can understand Tommie because it's the same knee over and over, but these guys have to leave almost every game for one reason or another.

BeerBaron
10-12-2008, 07:14 PM
yeah, they always seem to have something wrong with them. it gets a little annoying.....

Smokey Joe
10-12-2008, 07:18 PM
I'm thinking that a good projection for our draft slot would be the 21-22 area...

Now, 51 and the Bears suckage on Pass D have convinced me that DE is a bigger need than I though. Personally, I would love to get Brian Orakpo and he might be around in the 21-22 range. However, if Orakpo keeps up his dominate season and has a great combine (which he will, he's a workout warrior), I could see him jumping all the way to the top 10. However, for right now, I'll keep him in that late teens, early 20's range.

Okay, we pick with the 21st pick and take Orakpo. Then, how about we trade our 2nd and 3rd round picks to move up to the early part of round 2 and take someone like Duke Robinson? I could see Duke falling to the early part of round 2 due to him being a guard and now his recent problems causing him to get benched for a bit.

BeerBaron
10-12-2008, 07:21 PM
I think Robinson is still my ideal first round pick if he's worth it. I having the left side of our line built out of first rounders would do wonders for our run game and also keeping KO on his feet.

DE is the 2nd need in my mind then. Can we find someone in the 2nd or 3rd round though? i'm not sure.....we could probably hold off on the guard and go for a DE in the first, but i'm not sure yet.

Smokey Joe
10-12-2008, 07:25 PM
After Orakpo, Johnson, Selvie (more of a 3-4 DE anyway), and Hardy, there isn't much in the pass rushing DE department, IMO.

BeerBaron
10-12-2008, 07:27 PM
After Orakpo, Johnson, Selvie (more of a 3-4 DE anyway), and Hardy, there isn't much in the pass rushing DE department, IMO.

Seems like we'd need a high-ish first rounder for any of those anyway...

Maybe we can convince Terrell Suggs to come aboard in the offseason, lol. bout a snowballs chance in hell of that happening.....

Geo
10-12-2008, 07:30 PM
I don't recall how often it was before '07, but the last two years it's definitely been an issue it seems. At least I would agree with that.

It's just a part of the defensive scheme imo, that more is asked of the defense backs from a physical standpoint. You're bound to see guys dinged up, I think. Even the young back-ups.

And in the Bears' case, it wouldn't surprise me if they play more man than any other Tampa 2 defense. And to ask that of a younger player, than two skilled guys like Tillman and Vasher who can mix it up, can lead to some mistakes I'm sure. I don't know if that in particular reared its head today, however.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
10-12-2008, 07:38 PM
By the way, what is it with Tillman and Vasher ALWAYS getting hurt? I mean ALLLLWAYS getting hurt. I can understand Tommie because it's the same knee over and over, but these guys have to leave almost every game for one reason or another.

Hasn't this shoulder issue for Tillman been on-going since forever? I remember in the Carolina playoff game years ago this was a huge issue. I have tried to block out Tillman getting his ass pillaged in that game, but I remember a play where Smith took the ball out of Peanut's hands, because he had a bum shoulder.

Kreutz was absolutely all over Beekman today for whatever reasons. Most likely botched assignments. Early in the game, I saw at least 2-3 times where Kreutz was steaming screaming and pointing at him.

Next week vs Minnesota is an important game for the division. I'd have to believe the Bears will be favored since the Vikings were lucky to win against the Lions today.

Bearsfan123
10-12-2008, 07:50 PM
My next version Mock.

1. 19 trade down with Iggles to 24 with their 3rd rd pick.

24-Greg Hardy DE- He lights up the combine and has production but Orakpo, Selvie and Jackson get picked ahead of him.

Trade up: 51 and 88 to 38 overall: Herman Johnson OG: A run on O-lineman cause the Bears to panic a bit and trade up. We miss out on the top OTs but get one of the top OGs. A mauler who can help our power running game.

83-Michael Hamlin S- We catch a break when he falls to us in the third.

115-123-Chase Daniel QB- We grab a great leader that may develop nicely for us.

Cond4th-Andrew Gardner OT- We grab a RT for the future in the 4th.

5th-Derek Walker DE- We bolster the position further with the local Illini.

6th-Sherrod Martin CB

7th-Ryan McDonald OL

Geo
10-12-2008, 08:01 PM
Is it that the Bears aren't getting pressure on 3rd and longs? Because a pass rush specialist, if you want to call if that, could be the key. As was the case with Anderson as a rookie, who the Bears drafted in the 5th round I believe it was.

For example: the Colts drafted Robert Mathis in the early 6th years ago and Marcus Howard in the late 5th this past April, although Howard hasn't played yet because of the need for some DL to help out against the run. Although obviously having the blue-chipper in Freeney helps set up a lot of things.

Plus, if age and/or contract status is also a concern for Brown and/or Ogunleye, that could further push for a move.

MidwayMonster31
10-12-2008, 09:10 PM
With the way that Orton has been playing. Quarterback is not our biggest problem. Those third downs were a problem because of no pass rush. There should be some good pass-rushing defensive ends that are coming out this year.

regoob2
10-12-2008, 09:17 PM
why do people think WR is a bigger need then DE?
Because we dont have any playmakers or guys that can beat single coverage.

BeerBaron
10-12-2008, 09:58 PM
Because we dont have any playmakers or guys that can beat single coverage.

doesn't mean a damn thing when the QB can't get time to throw or we can't get the other team's offense off the field thanks to a lack of a pass rush.

give Hester and Olsen more time for development. I was impressed by them today, and i think we've got something special given a little more time.

seriously, the offense wasn't actually the biggest problem today......

awfullyquiet
10-12-2008, 10:28 PM
doesn't mean a damn thing when the QB can't get time to throw or we can't get the other team's offense off the field thanks to a lack of a pass rush.

give Hester and Olsen more time for development. I was impressed by them today, and i think we've got something special given a little more time.

seriously, the offense wasn't actually the biggest problem today......

Agreed.

I think they're hitting the stride finally. Turning the corner from mediocre to pretty okay.

Every time we take a project Tackle though, we've gotten burned. No one has looked remotely close to good no matter what round we take them. And this has been a constant problem i believe.

regoob2
10-12-2008, 10:32 PM
doesn't mean a damn thing when the QB can't get time to throw or we can't get the other team's offense off the field thanks to a lack of a pass rush.

give Hester and Olsen more time for development. I was impressed by them today, and i think we've got something special given a little more time.

seriously, the offense wasn't actually the biggest problem today......
Orton had plenty of time to throw today. The line played fine. WR is still a huge need. Id prefer OL help over WR help but WR is still a major need.

Bearsfan123
10-12-2008, 11:32 PM
Orton had plenty of time to throw today. The line played fine. WR is still a huge need. Id prefer OL help over WR help but WR is still a major need.

Not really, he was pressured into quite a bit of throws. And the line also got no push in the run game. So no the line did not play fine.

WR is still a huge need, but Hester is getting paid huge money to be a WR so i personally feel he should be given this year and most of next year to prove us right or wrong. Then no matter what, grab Arrelious Benn in the first rd in 10. ^_^

But what did everyone think of my mock?

Monomach
10-12-2008, 11:38 PM
Agreed.
Every time we take a project Tackle though, we've gotten burned. No one has looked remotely close to good no matter what round we take them. And this has been a constant problem i believe.

Agreed. Our next right tackle needs to be a mostly finished product.

bearsfan_51
10-13-2008, 12:03 AM
I'm just not a fan of taking a receiver in the 1st round. I wanted Braylon Edwards back in 2004 and Santonio Holmes the year after (both, tragically, taken the exact pick before), but those are outliers and I think we'd be better off looking for something in the 2nd-4th round.

I'm all over the Greg Hardy train, but I'm not sure he'll be available where we are. I also like Hermann Johnson in the 2nd more than Duke in the 1st (of course these are relative positions of course).

bearsfan_51
10-13-2008, 12:04 AM
You may be right about Tillman BUST, now that I think about it does always seem to be a shoulder issue.

Bruce Banner
10-13-2008, 12:52 AM
The Bears have to go BPA. I don't see a hole that would require settling for the best player at a certain position if there is better talent available at a different position.

MidwayMonster31
10-13-2008, 01:13 AM
Since Tillman has had multiple shoulder problems, would we have to draft another cornerback? Graham did a decent job today, but not having Vasher also hurt. I think drafting Macho Harris in the second round would be too early for a cornerback, considering the other problems the Bears have.
The mid-rounds would make sense to get a corner. DeAndre Wright would be a decent option if he's there in the third or fourth round.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
10-13-2008, 01:26 AM
We definitely will not be taking a CB in the first two rounds.

Gay Ork Wang
10-13-2008, 04:50 AM
Angelo is always great in finding nice CBs in the late round. Graham and McBride are alright, we def need more depth, but first day CB is out of the question.

@regoob2: Yes we need a playmaker. But its not like we need a playmaker to win. We are a run first team, we have 2 big targets in our TEs and Lloyd did a great job so far this season. Hester seems to get better every game he starts and Forte is a really nice receiver out of the backfield. Orton distributes the ball nice and has a lot of #2 and #3 targets. There is no need for a WR in the first 2 rounds unless its a total monster. The Bears have been always winning with their running game and the defense. The Defense has hardly gotten any pressure without blitzing and that is usually the key for our defense. There should be no question about DE and OG above WR

BeerBaron
10-13-2008, 09:35 AM
Maybe we should go after some CB depth after reading this:

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/football/bears/1217261,CST-SPT-bside13.article

we were one more injury in the secondary away from playing Hester and Davis back there. wow.

Bearsfan123
10-13-2008, 09:50 AM
it was just unlucky. McBride will be coming back. Manning will be coming back. In two to three weeks we should be close to full strength again.

regoob2
10-13-2008, 10:12 AM
Not really, he was pressured into quite a bit of throws. And the line also got no push in the run game. So no the line did not play fine.

WR is still a huge need, but Hester is getting paid huge money to be a WR so i personally feel he should be given this year and most of next year to prove us right or wrong. Then no matter what, grab Arrelious Benn in the first rd in 10. ^_^

But what did everyone think of my mock?
Every QB is going to get pressured. That should be expected. He knows the crap he has hunched in front of him. They played better than expected except for Tait.

Bearsfan123
10-13-2008, 10:40 AM
Every QB is going to get pressured. That should be expected. He knows the crap he has hunched in front of him. They played better than expected except for Tait.

Matt Ryan didnt. Last year Tom Brady didnt until damn near the super bowl. Most of the time Orton was getting a guy pushed nearly on top of him.

Smokey Joe
10-13-2008, 08:43 PM
CB is far from a need for us. Hamilton needs to go, but I firmly believe that Tillman, Vasher, Graham, and McBride give us the best combination of corners in the league, plus, I think Bowman can turn into a pretty good one himself. Us having 3 of the 4 hurt is pretty simply bad luck.

awfullyquiet
10-14-2008, 12:12 PM
CB is far from a need for us. Hamilton needs to go, but I firmly believe that Tillman, Vasher, Graham, and McBride give us the best combination of corners in the league, plus, I think Bowman can turn into a pretty good one himself. Us having 3 of the 4 hurt is pretty simply bad luck.

See: Last Year.

regoob2
10-16-2008, 05:28 PM
Oh ya I updated my sig again for our first 4 picks.
1. Crabtree- complete WR not complete prospect, 4.5 speed will hurt.
2. I think Michael Johnson can and probably should fall to round 2 but I love his upside.
3. Canfield is a beast and a perfect LG. Off the field concerns drop him.
4. Bonne is a RT who is inconsistent but is very strong and if he locks on game over.

bearsfan_51
10-16-2008, 10:10 PM
Michael Johnson isn't going to fall to the 2nd round.

BeerBaron
10-16-2008, 11:57 PM
Michael Johnson isn't going to fall to the 2nd round.

especially not to the second half of the second round which i would say we are on pace of.

pellepelle_10
10-17-2008, 02:50 AM
For those who think WR should be our top priority who do you have on your list as top guys to get? Just curious?

Gay Ork Wang
10-17-2008, 04:40 AM
I still dont get how WR should be our top priority

bearfan
10-17-2008, 06:28 AM
We went into the season w/ our draft needs looking like this (or at least mine):
1) QB
2) OL
3) WR

Now since Orton has played respectively, and the OL while not great has been at least solid most the time in pass protection I would like to see Crabtree. Thats the only RD1 reciever I want. No Harvin or Macklin, little fast guys that need development, we had guys/have guys: Bradley, Hester, Bennett. If its not Crabtree, then I auto focus at the OL.

1) Crabtree
1b) Robinson/BPA at OL
2) BPA at WR or S
3) BPA WR or OL

BeerBaron
10-17-2008, 06:54 AM
If WR, then I hope its a big WR with some #1 potential. Right now, I don't think we have anyone with any size at the position.

Hester: 5'11 190
Davis: 5'9 187
Bennett: 6'0 203
Booker: 6'0 205
Lloyd: 6'0 194

To have one bigger guy who could get off a press at the line and maybe catch something over the middle without getting blasted would be nice....

But I still don't think WR should be our biggest priority. Only if theres no worthwhile guards or defensive ends should we really look there imo. And even then, only Crabtree or DHB would really interest me, and i'm not trusting them to both still be around if we're picking in the 15-25 range.....

Gay Ork Wang
10-17-2008, 06:58 AM
We went into the season w/ our draft needs looking like this (or at least mine):
1) QB
2) OL
3) WR

Now since Orton has played respectively, and the OL while not great has been at least solid most the time in pass protection I would like to see Crabtree. Thats the only RD1 reciever I want. No Harvin or Macklin, little fast guys that need development, we had guys/have guys: Bradley, Hester, Bennett. If its not Crabtree, then I auto focus at the OL.

1) Crabtree
1b) Robinson/BPA at OL
2) BPA at WR or S
3) BPA WR or OL
it should be OL, DE, QB and then WR at this moment

Bearsfan123
10-17-2008, 09:24 AM
it should be OL, DE, QB and then WR at this moment

I agree, but as of right now, in mock drafts at least, Greg Hardy keeps falling past us and frankly I would rather take a #1 defensive end than reach for a less talented G. Especially since it seems Duke is losing mid-1st rd steam stock wise.

my team needs board:

1st-OL (RT,G)
2nd-DE
3rd-S
4th-OL (RT,G)
5th-QB
6th-WR
7th-RB (Complimentary Back)
8th-CB
9th-OL (Depth)
10th-FB

This board reflects to me what positions need upgrades and or depth and is in order of importance to me. Unfortunately, like any mediocre team, one draft will not fill every need. If we are very lucky, we will fill our O-line holes, get a quality D-end, and pick up some complimentary back in the late rounds. That is if we are extraordinarily lucky.

Gay Ork Wang
10-17-2008, 10:00 AM
id rater go OL, DE, WR, S.

Remember we prolly have 2 3rd rounders or 4th rounders because of Berrian

BeerBaron
10-17-2008, 01:23 PM
id rater go OL, DE, WR, S.

Remember we prolly have 2 3rd rounders or 4th rounders because of Berrian

yeah, we need Berrian to do well (against everyone but us) and have the rest of the Vikings suck....that would guarantee us a 3rd rounder, lol.

I'm trying to think of what over big FA's there were who could get their old teams 3rd rounders over Berrian

regoob2
10-17-2008, 09:29 PM
If were picking somewhere around 15 or so I would hate to go OG that early. I like Duke as much as the next guy but that is really early. It's a bit early for RT also but I dont see at least right now a RT worth that pick. Oher, Monroe and Smith will be long gone. I would hate to pass up on a Crabtree or DHB to get an OG. This should be a deep class at OG and OT, we can get both later. The Michael Johnson pick is more of a prayer.

regoob2
10-17-2008, 09:30 PM
For those who think WR should be our top priority who do you have on your list as top guys to get? Just curious?Crabtree and DHB are the only 2 I have with a first round grade.

regoob2
10-17-2008, 09:32 PM
I still dont get how WR should be our top priorityI dont think it's our top priority either but I dont see a RT or QB worth the pick and OG is deep. I also would prefer if we didnt go DE in round 1. I think/hope our DEs can turn it back on.

Edit sorry for the triple post.

BeerBaron
10-17-2008, 09:37 PM
Crabtree and DHB are the only 2 I have with a first round grade.

really? to us you mean right?

because if maclin and harvin were to declare, i think they'd go in the first for having same crazy potential plus having the return ability to help out a team right now.

regoob2
10-17-2008, 09:41 PM
really? to us you mean right?

because if maclin and harvin were to declare, i think they'd go in the first for having same crazy potential plus having the return ability to help out a team right now.I think both could go late in round 1. I wouldnt want either on the Bears in round 1 so ya. I think Maclin is slightly overrated and would be a terrible fit on our team.

bearfan
10-18-2008, 12:08 AM
it should be OL, DE, QB and then WR at this moment

You would put QB above WR? Orton is playing well up to this point, and if he keeps improving I think that someone other than Lloyd and Hester will be needed at WR.

Gay Ork Wang
10-18-2008, 04:30 AM
well its basically a tossup with QB and WR

bearsfan_51
10-18-2008, 02:09 PM
Can anyone honestly make the case that the lack of a playmaking wide receiver is the biggest thing keeping us from winning games? I just think there are numerous places we could look that are much more likely to happen, and much more likely to improve the team's chances of winning.

Bruce Banner
10-18-2008, 02:11 PM
Can anyone honestly make the case that the lack of a playmaking wide receiver is the biggest thing keeping us from winning games? I just think there are numerous places we could look that are much more likely to happen, and much more likely to improve the team's chances of winning.

Buccaneers are winning games with worse receivers so I'd say you are right.

The Bears are very similar to the Bucs. Bad QBs (that show up some weeks), good RB, same defensive scheme, terrible receivers, etc.

BeerBaron
10-18-2008, 02:42 PM
Buccaneers are winning games with worse receivers so I'd say you are right.

The Bears are very similar to the Bucs. Bad QBs (that show up some weeks), good RB, same defensive scheme, terrible receivers, etc.

i don't even think our WR's are really that terrible. Hester is still learning the position but has made a few good plays and shows promise, and Lloyd, Booker and Davis have all stepped up when needed one time or another. As long as we keep getting something out of one of them each week, we'll keep doing well enough to win I believe.

If we would go receiver, I'd hope it would be someone with some size. I don't remember if it was here or in the general discussion thread, but I posted the height and weight of all of our WR's and none are over 6'0..... a little size out there would be nice to have.