The Return of Touchdown, Interception, and Yards Jesus.

[Tampa 2 4 life]

ESPN's Chris Mortensen is reporting that Favre has told Green Bay Packers head coach Mike McCarthy that he has thought about playing this year. Although Favre's comeback talk is apparently in its preliminary stages, Mortensen also reports that Favre's family is encouraging him to play.

Oh boy, this should be good.

[Duster]

He's not coming back, at least not with the Packers.

[LonghornsLegend]

Then what was the point of announcing his retirement so soon if he obviously wasn't sure yet, why even rush to make that decision?

[Brent]

Give up ESPN, no one cares. I am so sick of hearing about him.

[Bruce Banner]

Aaron Rodgers, gun meet head.

[yo123]

I tired of this "will he won't he" ********. Just make a damn decision.

[Duster]

Then what was the point of announcing his retirement so soon if he obviously wasn't sure yet, why even rush to make that decision?

It helped the Packers make decisions about what they would do in the off-season...

[Im_a_Romosexual]

Let It Go! ****

[Dr. Gonzo]

As a Vikings fan I hope Favre keeps playing with the heads of Packer fans everywhere. Give them false hope and continue to crush them. Hell, I don't even care if he comes back. I would love to see the Vikings D-Line send him back into retirement week 1.

[Geo]

It surprised me when he retired, because I thought he would definitely play this season after last year.

It would surprise me - not as much - if he comes back, after his retirement presser (although maybe it wasn't his idea in the first place).

[Duster]

As a Vikings fan I hope Favre keeps playing with the heads of Packer fans everywhere. Give them false hope and continue to crush them. Hell, I don't even care if he comes back. I would love to see the Vikings D-Line send him back into retirement week 1.

Like last year when the sacked him once all season, compared to the Packers rocking the Vikings QB eight times?

[yo123]

Like last year when the sacked him once all season, compared to the Packers rocking the Vikings QB eight times?


http://www.delawareonline.com/blogs/uploaded_images/JaredAllen-705268.jpg

[Duster]

http://www.delawareonline.com/blogs/uploaded_images/JaredAllen-705268.jpg

One player isn't going to change the disgraceful team the Vikings have put on the field the past few seasons, especially when that player is an idiot off-the-field and he's going to the land of the party boat.

[Gay Ork Wang]

yea right, he was only the leader in sacks despite missing two games and playing on an atrocious team. He wont make the Pass rush and the Pass defense better...wtf are u talking about?

[d34ng3l021]

Jared Allen playing next to Kevin and Pat Williams? Uh...Who do you stop?

[Duster]

yea right, he was only the leader in sacks despite missing two games and playing on an atrocious team. He wont make the Pass rush and the Pass defense better...wtf are u talking about?

Oh, he'll improve the team but I doubt the Vikings "make Favre retired after week 1". That team was spanked by the Packers last year and adding a few pieces isn't going to change that.

[Gay Ork Wang]

Oh, he'll improve the team but I doubt the Vikings "make Favre retired after week 1". That team was spanked by the Packers last year and adding a few pieces isn't going to change that.
dude there is sth in this world, maybe you havent heard of it, but its called:

exaggeration

v. ex·ag·ger·at·ed, ex·ag·ger·at·ing, ex·ag·ger·ates
v.tr.
1. To represent as greater than is actually the case; overstate: exaggerate the size of the enemy force; exaggerated his own role in the episode.
2. To enlarge or increase to an abnormal degree: thick lenses that exaggerated the size of her eyes.

[Bruce Banner]

On ESPN they were talking about the possiblity of Favre playing for the Vikings if he gets reinstated and then released.
Favre + 08 Vikings = Lombardi

[yo123]

Oh, he'll improve the team but I doubt the Vikings "make Favre retired after week 1". That team was spanked by the Packers last year and adding a few pieces isn't going to change that.


It's not just what we did. It's who the Packers lost. Without Favre, you are an 8-8 team.

[Duster]

It's not just what we did. It's who the Packers lost. Without Favre, you are an 8-8 team.

Packers are still a better team top to bottom than the Vikings, even without Favre. Add in the fact that Rodgers is likely going to be better than Jackson, and I can't see the Vikings staying in the race for the NFC North with the Packers.

[Turtlepower]

It's not just what we did. It's who the Packers lost. Without Favre, you are an 8-8 team.

Just ignore ignorant people when they post.

Anyway, if Favre does come back, just think of that QB depth chart. It is insane!!!!

[GB12]

One player isn't going to change the disgraceful team the Vikings have put on the field the past few seasons, especially when that player is an idiot off-the-field and he's going to the land of the party boat.
This guy is obviously off, however; ever since the Vikings made that trade Vikings fans have been acting like they're the Patriots. Very annoying.

[yo123]

Packers are still a better team top to bottom than the Vikings, even without Favre.


Thats just false.

[yo123]

This guy is obviously off, however; ever since the Vikings made that trade Vikings fans have been acting like they're the Patriots. Very annoying.



Not really. I hate the hype we are getting. I don't think we are a Super Bowl team. I think we can get to the playoffs and win one or two games, but we still have too many holes. I do however think we are the team to beat in the division.

[Duster]

Thats just false.

How are the Vikings better? Did you watch them play last season? AD and a good defence were all they had. The Packers had an elite offence, defence, and special teams.

[Crickett]

Thats just false.

Really?

RB
OL
WR/TE
DL
LB
DB
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Please, point to one and tell me where the Packers are weak.

[Duster]

Not really. I hate the hype we are getting. I don't think we are a Super Bowl team. I think we can get to the playoffs and win one or two games, but we still have too many holes. I do however think we are the team to beat in the division.

This reminds me of Cards fans who thought they were a playoff team every season because of a handful of players they acquired. A team that could only be described as bad last year is suddenly the team to beat in the division? Over last year's youngest team that went to the NFC Conference championship? Yes, Favre is a loss but that offence is still leagues better than what the Vikings are going to put on the field.

[yo123]

How are the Vikings better? Did you watch them play last season? AD and a good defence were all they had. The Packers had an elite offence, defence, and special teams.



If you honestly think they still have an elite offense without Favre your kidding yourself.

AD himself makes it a pretty solid offense, and T-Jack made solid improvements throughout the season. The offense doesn't need to be great if you have the kind of talent we have on D.

[yo123]

This reminds me of Cards fans who thought they were a playoff team every season because of a handful of players they acquired. A team that could only be described as bad last year is suddenly the team to beat in the division? Over last year's youngest team that went to the NFC Conference championship? Yes, Favre is a loss but that offence is still leagues better than what the Vikings are going to put on the field.


We were one game away from the playoffs last year, that's hardly "bad." I don't see how the addition of one of the best pass rushers in the game can't put us over the top, when that was the only thing holding us back from being a top 3 defense.

[Turtlepower]

Packers are still a better team top to bottom than the Vikings, even without Favre.

QB - Even (Yeah Jackson sucks, but no one on the Packers are proven in the least bit)
RB - Vikings (All-Day)
WR - Packers (With 4 #1 WRs on their roster, they are sure to have the best passing game in the league =D)
OL - Even (Chad Clifton is one of the league's underrated LTs and the Packers pass blocking is top-notch. It is even just because of how sick the the run-blocking is for the Vikings)
DL - Vikings (The best 4-3 DL now that Strahan retired)
LB - Packers (Quality on all fronts here)
DB - Packers (The Packers sport two quality CBs, but if Al Harris plays like he did in the NFC Championship game, their secondary will struggle. The Vikings have some very nice youth in Griffin and McCauley, but they really need consistency for their secondary to be better than the Packers.)

Ok, quick run down on my comparisons of the 2 teams. They are actually fairly even when you compare the teams, so I wouldn't be surprised if the Vikings finish with a better record than the Packers.

[bored of education]

Brodie Croylez >>>>>>>> Favrez

[MetSox17]

This is one of the reasons why i think ESPN is a huge crock of sh*t. I hate them.

[Duster]

If you honestly think they still have an elite offense without Favre your kidding yourself.

AD himself makes it a pretty solid offense, and T-Jack made solid improvements throughout the season. The offense doesn't need to be great if you have the kind of talent we have on D.

They looked pretty good with Rodgers at the helm in the Dallas game. All Rodgers needs to do is throw short passes and not make mistakes, just like Favre did all last season.

You're right, AD is a great player and if healthy gives some offence some legitimacy. Unfortunately, Jackson is probably the worst starting quarterback in the league, the offensive line can't pass block, and the receivers are mediocre at best. Not sure how that translates to being the "team to beat", but OK.

Green Bay's defence is just as good, if not better than the Vikings.

[Bruce Banner]

Really?

RB
OL
WR/TE
DL
LB
DB
K
P


Please, point to one and tell me where the Packers are weak.
WeakER. No one ever said they were weak at positions, someone said they were better top to bottom than the Vikings.
We are comparing the two teams not analyzing one team.

[Duster]

We were one game away from the playoffs last year, that's hardly "bad." I don't see how the addition of one of the best pass rushers in the game can't put us over the top, when that was the only thing holding us back from being a top 3 defense.

Your pass rush was not holding you back. Your offense was. Until that passing game works, the Vikings are terrible and will continue to miss the playoffs.

[Turtlepower]

Your pass rush was not holding you back. Your offense was. Until that passing game works, the Vikings are terrible and will continue to miss the playoffs.

Bernard Berrian will help tremendously in the passing game. Plus, JDB will have some time to shine this year!!!! (jk)

[Bruce Banner]

DL - Vikings (The best 4-3 DL now that Strahan retired)
LB - Packers (Quality on all fronts here)
DB - Packers (The Packers sport two quality CBs, but if Al Harris plays like he did in the NFC Championship game, their secondary will struggle. The Vikings have some very nice youth in Griffin and McCauley, but they really need consistency for their secondary to be better than the Packers.)


Instead of looking at certain sections of an offense and defense how about you analyze them as a whole.
The Vikings D > Packers D, despite what you have typed above.

[yo123]

Your pass rush was not holding you back. Your offense was. Until that passing game works, the Vikings are terrible and will continue to miss the playoffs.



I said it was holding back our defense, do you even read what I'm typing? No matter how you feel about the Vikings, we aren't terrible, even your fellow Packer fans will tell you that. You are just a giant homer if you honestly think that.

[Duster]

Bernard Berrian will help tremendously in the passing game. Plus, JDB will have some time to shine this year!!!! (jk)

Berrian is a nice deep threat but I'm not sold Jackson can get him the ball, considering he has trouble simply taking a 3-step drop. He looks like a high school quarterback out there. No fundamentals at all.

[Turtlepower]

Instead of looking at certain sections of an offense and defense how about you analyze them as a whole.
The Vikings D > Packers D, despite what you have typed above.

The Vikings D-line is much better than the Packers, but as a whole, the Packers are a better defense. They have more depth and aren't necessarily weak at any 1 position. The Vikings have the opportunity to be a better defense this year with all of the youth they have in the secondary, but at this moment, the Packers have the nod.

[Duster]

Instead of looking at certain sections of an offense and defense how about you analyze them as a whole.
The Vikings D > Packers D, despite what you have typed above.

Not last year, that's for sure. Packers were one of the elite units in the league, Vikings were middle of the pack at best.

[yo123]

Not last year, that's for sure. Packers were one of the elite units in the league, Vikings were middle of the pack at best.



We aren't talking about last year. We're talking about this year. We weren't elite because of our lack of a pass rush, which we now have.

[Bruce Banner]

The pass rush dictates a defense. (see Giants/Pats SB)
The Vikings have by far the best 4 man front pass rush.

[Duster]

I said it was holding back our defense, do you even read what I'm typing? No matter how you feel about the Vikings, we aren't terrible, even your fellow Packer fans will tell you that. You are just a giant homer if you honestly think that.

Vikings only won games last year based on the strength of AD. He was far important to your few successes than Favre was to Green Bay's. Green Bay is a proven championship contender, the Vikings are a team hoping that all of their pieces work out and they can earn a playoff birth. Everything is rosey for teams like the Vikings in July but it will all change when reality hits around October.

[Crickett]

WeakER. No one ever said they were weak at positions, someone said they were better top to bottom than the Vikings.
We are comparing the two teams not analyzing one team.

Sorry, I quoted the wrong post.

It's not just what we did. It's who the Packers lost. Without Favre, you are an 8-8 team.

If the Packers are a .500 team without a hall of fame one of the greatest of all time quarterbacks behind center, they need to have some sort of glaring weakness on their roster somewhere. I want to know where that is. Okay, since I know they don't actually have one, I'd actually like to know where yo thinks it is. So I can laugh.


Btw, "unproven" and "proven to be bad" doesn't make two QB situations even.

[Duster]

We aren't talking about last year. We're talking about this year. We weren't elite because of our lack of a pass rush, which we now have.

So the Vikings might be as good as the Packers defensively, are almost assuredly worse offensively, and are unproven overall yet they are the favourites to win the division?

[yo123]

Sorry, I quoted the wrong post.



If the Packers are a .500 team without a hall of fame one of the greatest of all time quarterbacks behind center, they need to have some sort of glaring weakness on their roster somewhere. I want to know where that is. Okay, since I know they don't actually have one, I'd actually like to know where yo thinks it is. So I can laugh.


Btw, "unproven" and "proven to be bad" doesn't make two QB situations even.


As of now you have a weakness on offense. What has Aaron Rodgers proven? Nothing. No, one game does not count. Is Ryan Grant for real? I tend to think so, but Packers fans seem a little too convinced after one half of a season.

[Bruce Banner]

So the Vikings might be as good as the Packers defensively, are almost assuredly worse offensively, and are unproven overall yet they are the favourites to win the division?

They are better defensively. If Tavaris Jackson kept them off the field for more than 2 minutes at a time last year you would have seen that.

But yeah, Paper champs as of now.

[Crickett]

As of now you have a weakness on offense. What has Aaron Rodgers proven? Nothing. No, one game does not count.

And thats going to be enough with the surrounding cast to cost the Packers five games?

Oh, and why doesn't the one game where we actually got to see Aaron Rodgers play count?

[Dr. Gonzo]

This guy is obviously off, however; ever since the Vikings made that trade Vikings fans have been acting like they're the Patriots. Very annoying.

What the hell are you talking about. All Vikings fans claim is he will make the defense much better. It is Packer fans who act like blind homers and claim they will win the Superbowl every year.

[Burns336]

Really?

RB
OL
WR/TE
DL
LB
DB
K
P


Please, point to one and tell me where the Packers are weak.

DB -- Charles Woodson and Al Harris were among the worst in the league on yards per completion... However they will continue to be overhyped as one of the best CB tandems in the league.

[Burns336]

They looked pretty good with Rodgers at the helm in the Dallas game. All Rodgers needs to do is throw short passes and not make mistakes, just like Favre did all last season.

You're right, AD is a great player and if healthy gives some offence some legitimacy. Unfortunately, Jackson is probably the worst starting quarterback in the league, the offensive line can't pass block, and the receivers are mediocre at best. Not sure how that translates to being the "team to beat", but OK.

Green Bay's defence is just as good, if not better than the Vikings.

Biggest myth of last season. Dallas had a game plan for Favre (which was working to perfection) and weren't prepared for his mobility. Furthermore, if you go back and watch the game, Greg Jennings and Donald Driver would receive little 5 yards passes and turn them into huge YAC on Dallas' loser secondary players (Jacque Reeves, Nate Jones) AND the Packers comeback almost never materialized but T.O. literally gave the biggest gift interception of the season to Al Harris instead of scoring the dagger in the heart TD to seal the game.

[PackerLegend]

DB -- Charles Woodson and Al Harris were among the worst in the league on yards per completion... However they will continue to be overhyped as one of the best CB tandems in the league.

I would like to see the stats on this to back it up... instead of you just throwning random stuff out there with nothing to prove it.

[Burns336]

I would like to see the stats on this to back it up... instead of you just throwning random stuff out there with nothing to prove it.

ESPN insider article posted by KC Joyner. Anyone on here with Insider will confirm this. It was one of the more recent articles he has posted. I also saw a website where the chart was poster, Ill see if I can still find it...

http://dcfanatic.com/2008/06/07/kc-joyner-says-secondary-wasnt-that-bad-last-year.aspx

One of the worst as far as Yards per attempt in the league. So while the defense may be good, there is some merit to the argument that these guys aren't all they are cracked up to be. A strong pass rush can hide a lot of things.

this was specifically said about Al Harris -- "Al Harris/Charles Woodson: Harris landed a starting spot in the Pro Bowl, and Woodson had a lot of support for a Hawaii trip as well, but their combined totals placed them 27th in this category. Most of that showing was the result of Harris' 9.7 YPA, a number that begs the question as to why he was given that starting Pro Bowl spot in the first place."

So maybe woodson is Ok and I've heard many packer fans say he is the better of the two, which should be the case given how severely overhyped al harris is.

[PackerLegend]

Biggest myth of last season. Dallas had a game plan for Favre (which was working to perfection) and weren't prepared for his mobility. Furthermore, if you go back and watch the game, Greg Jennings and Donald Driver would receive little 5 yards passes and turn them into huge YAC on Dallas' loser secondary players (Jacque Reeves, Nate Jones) AND the Packers comeback almost never materialized but T.O. literally gave the biggest gift interception of the season to Al Harris instead of scoring the dagger in the heart TD to seal the game.

A gift?? Do you remember earlier in the game when Al ripped the ball right out of T.O's arms and stayed in bounds. Yet for no reason or a very bad reason at that the refs gave the Cowboys a gift and let them keep the ball.

[EvilMonkey]

What the hell are you talking about. All Vikings fans claim is he will make the defense much better. It is Packer fans who act like blind homers and claim they will win the Superbowl every year.

um, where was I during all this blind homerism??? I dont remember anyone on here claiming super bowl bound the year after we went 4-12. I also didnt see many Packer fans claiming Super Bowl before last season. I havent seen anyone predicting an Aaron Rodgers Super Bowl run this year. Did we think we would win the Super Bowl in years of Favre's prime? Yes, and I can see how that can be seen as homerism i guess but it's not like we didnt have good teams or anything, but I havent seen that many Packer super bowl picks the last few years. Yeah, there is homerism for every team and it's gonna seem like we're being huge homers, sorry if we went like 15 years without a losing record and had high expectations every year, but dont try to portray the Packer fans as bigger homers than any other teams in the league.

Now on to my homerish prediction for the pack this year. Everyone is expecting this huge drop-off just cuz Favre is gone. I'm not that worried about it mainly because of Mike McCarthy. The guy was able to get Aaron Brooks to put up big numbers when he was his OC. Rich Gannon credits him for a lot of his success when he was in KC and McCarthy was there. And frankly, the guy reeled in Brett Favre and made him a great QB again. I dont think Aaron Rodgers will be an MVP or anything but he's learned from McCarthy for a long time, knows the offense, knows the team, and should be able to do a nice job. He's not gonna be out there throwing bombs or anything, the offense is a lot of quick, calculated routes with the WRs making plays after the catch. Add in a nice running game with Ryan Grant and I see no reason why Rodgers cant come in and lead this team back to the playoffs. That being said, I also dont see any reason why the Vikes cant make the playoffs either and rate the teams as pretty even, but I give the Packers the edge mainly due to the fact that Mike McCarthy made Aaron Brooks into a good QB and on that fact I'm hoping Rodgers will be fine.

Finally, to get back on point with this stupid Favre article. To me it just seems so convenient for ESPN that this comes out when most of the Packers front office is on vacation and cant dispute the report and we know Favre isnt gonna talk to anyone so it gets to be on Sportcenter, NFL Live and all over their website for the entire weekend. Kudos, ESPN for finding something interesting to focus on the next few days.

[TitleTown088]

Oh yeah ol' boy.

[SunDevil450]

Its nice to think that the vikings have a chance to win with their additions but the packers have made some noise of their own. I don't know if anyone has head of him on this board. http://lombardiave.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/nelson1.jpg

[EvilMonkey]

Biggest myth of last season. Dallas had a game plan for Favre (which was working to perfection) and weren't prepared for his mobility. Furthermore, if you go back and watch the game, Greg Jennings and Donald Driver would receive little 5 yards passes and turn them into huge YAC on Dallas' loser secondary players (Jacque Reeves, Nate Jones) AND the Packers comeback almost never materialized but T.O. literally gave the biggest gift interception of the season to Al Harris instead of scoring the dagger in the heart TD to seal the game.

if you watch any other Packer games, the short little passes were by far the most important part of our offense last year. Rodgers running the offense like that wasn't any different than if Favre was in there if he would have stuck to the offense instead of pressing and throwing a bunch of bombs like he did. Dallas's gameplan wasnt working that great, you guys just had a great pass rush and favre just went back to his old style of chucking the ball up instead of dumping it off for the safe play and letting the WRs make plays, which Rodgers did later on. Thinking the offense that Favre was running was OUR gameplan for that game and any other game was the biggest myth of last season.

[umphrey]

What the hell are you talking about. All Vikings fans claim is he will make the defense much better. It is Packer fans who act like blind homers and claim they will win the Superbowl every year.

You must be joking. Going into last year the most optimistic Packers fans hoped for 10 wins. Going into next year you'd be hard pressed to find a Packer fan predicting we'd repeat a 13 win season.

People hate on the Packers because of Aaron Rodgers. The only thing you can say bad about him is that you know almost nothing about him as an NFL player. Last year our receivers and OL made our offense run. Favre had some pretty bad seasons by his standards and then last year he was awesome. It wasn't because 38 is the magical age, our offense has weapons all over and great game planning.

Not to say who the better player is, but Rodgers is a better fit for our offense and a better athlete.

The one game Rodgers played in, he did better than any single game Jackson had in his entire career, and it was against a very good defense.

We've seen a lot of T Jack, and despite a pretty good offense around him he's really held back the offense.

The Vikings have a pretty good defense but people depend on Allen too much. He's not going to take their poor pass rush to elite status on his shoulders alone.

The Packers were a field goal away from the superbowl, the Vikings were a game away from the playoffs. That's a pretty big divide to just assume is going to flip flop.

[Burns336]

A gift?? Do you remember earlier in the game when Al ripped the ball right out of T.O's arms and stayed in bounds. Yet for no reason or a very bad reason at that the refs gave the Cowboys a gift and let them keep the ball.

Big difference. It was a sure Touchdown that Owens had with no one around him and he literally lobbed the ball to harris who was standing 5 yards away. That is a 7 point swing.

The earlier rip was debatable because the refs may have blown the whistle prematurely which is why T.O. let go of the ball. We cant know if Harris ripped it from him or if he let go, although that should have been packer ball. Still there was no difference in points on that play.

[Burns336]

if you watch any other Packer games, the short little passes were by far the most important part of our offense last year. Rodgers running the offense like that wasn't any different than if Favre was in there if he would have stuck to the offense instead of pressing and throwing a bunch of bombs like he did. Dallas's gameplan wasnt working that great, you guys just had a great pass rush and favre just went back to his old style of chucking the ball up instead of dumping it off for the safe play and letting the WRs make plays, which Rodgers did later on. Thinking the offense that Favre was running was OUR gameplan for that game and any other game was the biggest myth of last season.

Dallas gameplan wasn't working that great? you must be joking. That game was on its way to the biggest beat down of the season before Favre got injured. It wasn't even as bad as it could have been. D Ware sacked Favre and forced a fumble but was INCORRECTLY called offsides.

[GB12]

Big difference. It was a sure Touchdown that Owens had with no one around him and he literally lobbed the ball to harris who was standing 5 yards away. That is a 7 point swing.

The earlier rip was debatable because the refs may have blown the whistle prematurely which is why T.O. let go of the ball. We cant know if Harris ripped it from him or if he let go, although that should have been packer ball. Still there was no difference in points on that play.Well that's a stupid thing to say. Sure there was no direct difference in points on that play, but it could/would have drastically changed that game.

[TitleTown088]

But an NFL source said Wednesday afternoon that Favre -- or Cook on his behalf -- actually contacted the Packers "within the past few weeks" about returning, and when the Packers made it clear that they have moved on, Favre asked for his release. The Packers refused.

If the packers decide not to put him on the roster, he'll essentially become a Free Agent assuming he decides to come back and they don't release, trade, or want him back.

This has the makings of something very very ugly if Packers' management dosen't want him back... I pray nothing like that happens.

[Burns336]

Well that's a stupid thing to say. Sure there was no direct difference in points on that play, but it could/would have drastically changed that game.

Maybe? How could you know? It most likely would have led to Favre turning the ball over a little earlier than he did based on how the first half went.

[Burns336]

This has the makings of something very very ugly if Packers' management dosen't want him back... I pray nothing like that happens.

They should bring back Favre to groom Brohm for next season. Best option IMO. Rodgers is a *** hippie.

[Dr. Gonzo]

If Favre wants to come back you let him back. Picking Rodgers over Favre would be incredible stupid. My dream is for the Packers to not want Favre and to have the Vikings sign him just to shove it in the fudgepackers face.

[703SKINS202]

my bro played golf with aaron rodgers in san diego and said he was cool as s

[umphrey]

I'm 99.99% positive Favre won't play for anyone but the Packers again. He's not broke people. At this point his biggest priority is reputation.

[619]

Where are the Bears and Lions fans hiding??

[TitleTown088]

Also.... He needs to come back to personally slay the Madden curse.

[Burns336]

Where are the Bears and Lions fans hiding??

There is such things as Lions fans?

[GB12]

Maybe? How could you know? It most likely would have led to Favre turning the ball over a little earlier than he did based on how the first half went.
Well there'd be less urgency to score which would be more likely to lead to him not chucking up those poor throws than doing it sooner. Not saying that we would have for sure won that game if the call was right or anything like that, but it definitely had a huge effect on the game. Really I don't want to argue this game anymore. We have enough after the game finished and the end result was really meaningless as the Cowboys didn't get to the Conference Championship anyways.

[Burns336]

Well there'd be less urgency to score which would be more likely to lead to him not chucking up those poor throws than doing it sooner. Not saying that we would have for sure won that game if the call was right or anything like that, but it definitely had a huge effect on the game. Really I don't want to argue this game anymore. We have enough after the game finished and the end result was really meaningless as the Cowboys didn't get to the Conference Championship anyways.

This is true. My whole season was a ******* wash. Super bowl or die every year.

[the_legend_killer]

Maybe Favre just wants to drum up some buzz for Green Bay as ESPN's "Titletown"..........

[JF4]

The one problem I have will all the Packer haters in this thread is them saying Favre made our offense last year.

Anyone who actually watched Packers games last year would know that Favre's success was just as much a product of the system and the players around him as it was physical ability. The rest of the offense flourished around him and he was left to make simple, short throws, with time in the pocket, and he gave the receivers chances for YAC.

Rodgers' transition to the starting job will be much simpler than most backup QB's, and his stats will definately own Tavaris Jackson's. Favre was not the reason our offense had success last year, with such a good core of players lining up beside him, a good run game, and short WR routes many QB's could've had success in Green Bay's offense last year.

[GB12]

The one problem I have will all the Packer haters in this thread is them saying Favre made our offense last year.

Anyone who actually watched Packers games last year would know that Favre's success was just as much a product of the system and the players around him as it was physical ability. The rest of the offense flourished around him and he was left to make simple, short throws, with time in the pocket, and he gave the receivers chances for YAC.

Rodgers' transition to the starting job will be much simpler than most backup QB's, and his stats will definately own Tavaris Jackson's. Favre was not the reason our offense had success last year, with such a good core of players lining up beside him, a good run game, and short WR routes many QB's could've had success in Green Bay's offense last year.
Good post, but then it also seems like you are giving too little credit to Favre. A lot of QBs could have had success, but not a lot of QBs could have had as much success that Favre did. Aaron Rodgers should absolutely have success in this system, but he won't be Brett Favre.

[Burns336]

The one problem I have will all the Packer haters in this thread is them saying Favre made our offense last year.

Anyone who actually watched Packers games last year would know that Favre's success was just as much a product of the system and the players around him as it was physical ability. The rest of the offense flourished around him and he was left to make simple, short throws, with time in the pocket, and he gave the receivers chances for YAC.

Rodgers' transition to the starting job will be much simpler than most backup QB's, and his stats will definately own Tavaris Jackson's. Favre was not the reason our offense had success last year, with such a good core of players lining up beside him, a good run game, and short WR routes many QB's could've had success in Green Bay's offense last year.

This is a good strategy I guess... Favre retires and no one wants to admit that the team is going to take a hit, so instead the fans rally around the notion that Favre was a "product of the system" and the savior Hippie Rodgers should easily plug right into that system. PS -- Don't worry about the fact that he was injured more on the Bench than Favre was during his whole career (He played in real games too!)

[JF4]

This is a good strategy I guess... Favre retires and no one wants to admit that the team is going to take a hit, so instead the fans rally around the notion that Favre was a "product of the system" and the savior Hippie Rodgers should easily plug right into that system. PS -- Don't worry about the fact that he was injured more on the Bench than Favre was during his whole career (He played in real games too!)

You're funny. I'm sure you saw all the Packer's games the last 3 years, so you must know exactly what you're talking about.


And to GB12, you're probably right. I just wanted to make the point that if Favre doesn't have the right system and players around him he can't produce like he used to. We all saw him 2 and 3 years ago when he racked up a ridiculous amount of pics and how much he struggled.

[Burns336]

You're funny. I'm sure you saw all the Packer's games the last 3 years, so you must know exactly what you're talking about.


And to GB12, you're probably right. I just wanted to make the point that if Favre doesn't have the right system and players around him he can't produce like he used to. We all saw him 2 and 3 years ago when he racked up a ridiculous amount of pics and how much he struggled.

You're right. I haven't. Thank God. But when someone is considered one of the GOAT and you try to say he was just a system player, something doesn't add up. I tend to think its more your logic and less of Favre being in a system that allowed him to excel.

[Duster]

You're right. I haven't. Thank God. But when someone is considered one of the GOAT and you try to say he was just a system player, something doesn't add up. I tend to think its more your logic and less of Favre being in a system that allowed him to excel.

Favre definitely benefited from the system last season. Why do you think he had such a big resurgence?

Nobody is saying that Favre isn't a great QB. He is. But Rodgers has a better arm than Favre did last year, is more mobile, has been learning the system for 3 years, and was a highly-touted prospect. Every report on him has been positive. He's looked great in practice week in and week out and the few times he's got on the field he's looked good. There's really no reason to be anything but optimistic about Aaron. Will he be Favre? No, of course not, but he'll almost certainly be better than Tavaris Jackson and the Packers will almost certainly win the NFC North again.

[JF4]

You're right. I haven't. Thank God. But when someone is considered one of the GOAT and you try to say he was just a system player, something doesn't add up. I tend to think its more your logic and less of Favre being in a system that allowed him to excel.

I'm so hurt by your comment. Here's actual backup to what I say, unlike your outrageous claims of someone being a *** hippie.

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/7307/favre2dp2.png

Notice the terrible stats the first two years, than the stats of last year.

And just in case you wanted to know why he is considered one of the GOAT it's because he did this in the prime of his career.

http://img392.imageshack.us/img392/4747/favre3hn3.png

Sorry for the big pictures, I don't want to resize them

[Geo]

If I could move this thread to the NFC North forum, please believe I would. Cripes.

[GB12]

I'm so hurt by your comment. Here's actual backup to what I say, unlike your outrageous claims of someone being a *** hippie.

Notice the terrible stats the first two years, than the stats of last year.

And just in case you wanted to know why he is considered one of the GOAT it's because he did this in the prime of his career.

Sorry for the big pictures, I don't want to resize them

I have a completely different view on this subject. It isn't so much of Favre being bad for a couple years and McCarthy bringing him back. Maybe that's true to a small degree, but I don't buy into it that much. The big difference is the talent he was surrounded by. He was surrounded by crap in 2005. Injuries killed that team. We had lost so many WRs, RBs, and other offensive players that he was playing with rejected free agents that no one else wanted. Rod Gardner was a starting WR for us after being picked up mid season. 2006 we added more talent and Favre and the team both got better. Last year we surrounded him with a good supporting cast and he was back to how he was prior to '05. I can go further in depth and have on this subject many times before, but I'm working on a post that replys to the actual subject of the thread and would like to get back to that.

[GB12]

If I could move this thread to the NFC North forum, please believe I would. Cripes.
Why? It is certainly deserving of a thread seeing as ESPN feels a need to spend the whole day (and probably week) on this topic. I don't see what moving it there would do. If people don't want to read it don't open the thread.

[PACKmanN]

http://www.delawareonline.com/blogs/uploaded_images/JaredAllen-705268.jpg

the same player who only got half a sack on Favre....

[EvilMonkey]

Dallas gameplan wasn't working that great? you must be joking. That game was on its way to the biggest beat down of the season before Favre got injured. It wasn't even as bad as it could have been. D Ware sacked Favre and forced a fumble but was INCORRECTLY called offsides.

not joking... I'm not denying it wasnt gonna be a huge blowout, just arguing the fact that it wasnt gonna be a huge blowout cuz of some awesome gameplan, it was because Favre was playing with his head up his butt and chucking up bombs instead of working the offense which Rodgers proved worked later on. Again, not arguing like results of the game would be different or anything, just saying gameplan wasnt the reason we got smoked.

[mqtirishfan]

They are better defensively. If Tavaris Jackson kept them off the field for more than 2 minutes at a time last year you would have seen that.


Yes, the 15 less seconds that T-Jax ate up really made the difference between the Colts defensive stats and the Vikings.

[yourfavestoner]

This reminds me of Cards fans who thought they were a playoff team every season because of a handful of players they acquired. A team that could only be described as bad last year is suddenly the team to beat in the division? Over last year's youngest team that went to the NFC Conference championship? Yes, Favre is a loss but that offence is still leagues better than what the Vikings are going to put on the field.

Dude, Packer fans used to be notorious on this board for being the biggest offseason homers. Everyone, and I literally mean everyone, hated them because they were so adamant about how they'd win their division, were a much better team than everyone else in the division, etc, even though they ******* sucked. So don't get too crazy on these optimistic Viking fans...they're doing the same thing Packer fans have been doing the past three years.

[BlindSite]

Favre should just walk away. If he has to be in football so bad, bring him in as a QB assistant coach or something.

[GB12]

you should know better than that. by the same logic, if i post thread after endless thread on the packers board about how crappy your team is, you equally shouldn't have a problem. or if we opened the site to spammers and even encouraged them to post across boards, instead of just on off-topic. etc. "if you don't like it, don't read it" is *not* justification for anything.
Not really what I was trying to say. This is one thread and it is big news especially for the time we are at in the offseason. It is something that is getting a crazy amount of attention from ESPN and this board seems to be intersted in judging by the length of the thread already. I just don't see what moving it to the NFC North forum would do.

[GB12]

i'm just suggesting that, if it continues to be packers vs. vikings about favre's impact on the viking's "super bowl" chances (or whatever they're deluding themselves with), then it will cease to have any real connection with the topic and thus *will* be appropriate fodder for the nfc north board. obviously, i'd tend to agree for now, but we did create the team/division boards just for pissing matches like this looks like it may become.
Yeah, I see what you're saying with that. I was trying to get away from that direction and have been working on a post with my thoughts on the topic.

[GB12]

I have made 4 posts in this thread, but I realize that I haven't really commented on the topic, so here it is.

At this point I'm kind of hoping that it is just the same crap ESPN feeds to fill up air space (STRONG possibility). This creates a mess with the Packers.

We have Aaron Rodgers who has waited years to get his chance. He would have been ready last year, hell even two years ago and if it wasn't for a future hall of famer in front of him he would be. Had it been say Jon Kitna or Jeff Garcia as the veteran "grooming him" and holding to spot until he's ready he'd have been a starter for a while already. It's very unfair to Aaron even for him to wait this long was unfair. He has handled it perfectly and has been a team player about it to this point, but if Favre does come back I'd have to believe he'd lose it. No one could blame him either, there'd be something wrong with him if he didn't. He has paid his dues and was told he is finally going to be the starter with the news of Favre retiring. So this whole offseason he has been preparing to be the guy and believing he would be. To just take that away like that would crush him.

Then we drafted Brian Brohm in the second round. We'd be pushing him back to third string and cut Matt Flynn. I don't think there'd ever be a more stacked QB position when you have 1. Hall of famer 2. first rounder 3. second rounder. In fact that's too good of depth, you'd have to move one of them. Which puts us in an awful position. With Aaron Rodgers already pissed off from Favre returning it'd have to be him. Well now we're basically screwed. Potential trading partners would know that we have to move him and we'd have no leverage. The best we could get would be a 4th, maybe late 3rd off him. That'd mean that we spent a first round pick on a QB, never let him start a game, and then shipped him off for a 4th rounder. How bad would that be?

It would create problems in the locker room. That is if it hasn't already. How would you feel if you were say Greg Jennings. I'm sure he'd love for Brett Favre to come back, but at the same time he has to support Aaron Rodgers. Then if the talk of this gets more serious you have the split of players backing Favre vs players backing Rodgers. That could disastorous. Say this gets to the point where the front office has to decide if they are going to take him back or release him. Some players will voice their opinions if it gets that close. Say Donald Driver, Chad Clifton, and Donald Lee speak out saying they want Favre. The front office chooses to go with Rodgers. Now there is serious problems in the huddle and the organization as a whole.

Of course a lot of this is hypothetical, but nothing is a stretch of what could actually happen.

If that's not problem enough if this is true and he is serious about coming back there is the decission that has to be made of what to do.

Option 1: Take him back. Face the challenges of some of the things I've stated earlier.

Option 2: Refuse to take him back. Piss off the majority of your fan base and Favre himself. Maybe he takes it personally and doesn't even attend the retiring of his jersey. That'd be a tough thing to live with for Ted Thompson. He'd be one of the most hated men in the state (although I wouldn't agree with that). The reason I don't give the option of him going to another team is because I don't think there's a chance of that happening. Both the organization and Favre would have to agree to his release and the chances of that are slim. Then you have to think of where he'd go. If we were going to grant his release there's no way in hell we'd do it without him agreeing to not go to Minnesota or Chicago. Minnesota is who would be the most likely suitor for him but no way it'd happen. Outside of the Vikings there isn't really a team that's a match. Teams that are serious playoff contenders already have QBs and Favre doesn't want to come back to play for a loser.

No matter what choice Ted Thompson would make he'd lose. There's no easy solution if he is indeed serious about coming back.

Ok, now say we settle on option 1. We trade Aaron for a 4th round pick to San Fransisco ('05 draft redo!). Favre gives us one more year; we win the division but don't win the Superbowl. He retires for real after next year; but not without going through this **** again thanks to ESPN. Aaron Rodgers goes on to be a probowler as a 49er. Now what? We'd have Brohm so we hopefully wouldn't be completely screwed, but that's certainly a bad situation to be in.

Say we go with option 2 we spend the whole year wondering if we could have won the Superbowl if we let Favre back. Regardless of how well Rodgers does in most fan's eyes it won't be good enough.

Now say the least likely thing does for some reason happen and he goes on and signs with the Jets. New York goes on to win the Superbowl thanks to a Favre led offense. Ted Thompson would have to leave the country if that happened.

I guess the point in this is that whether this was truely something said by Favre and he intends to play or just some more BS from ESPN it has created a monster for Packers management. Whatever decession they go with don't be too hard on them because they're in a hard place here.

Really I can't decide for the life of me what I would do or what I think they would do. It'd be pretty damn hard to pass up another opportunity at a Superbowl, but taking such a gamble on throwing away a player that you've put so much into in Aaron Rodgers is quite a risk to take.

[Boston]

Do we really need this thread? ESPN does whatever the **** they can to get a story that people may be interested in, including this. And to the people that are telling Favre to make a decison already, **** off, he did, and since he was one of the GOAT, still could/can play, and loves the game, ESPN will milk him for stories every ******* chance they get. It's pathetic.

[badgerbacker]

Favre has said it isn't a story. His agent says he's retired. The Packers "have no reaction". He isn't coming back. Stop trying to make this a story.

Of course he's going to miss football and he'll 'get the itch' to play, but he made his decision and he is going to stick with it. This kind of crap makes me mad.

[PACKmanN]

This is a good strategy I guess... Favre retires and no one wants to admit that the team is going to take a hit, so instead the fans rally around the notion that Favre was a "product of the system" and the savior Hippie Rodgers should easily plug right into that system. PS -- Don't worry about the fact that he was injured more on the Bench than Favre was during his whole career (He played in real games too!)

You comment on Rodgers' injuries when you know nothing. Our coach said that if Rodgers was the starter he wouldn't have been put on the IR, due to the fact that we had Favre as our qb, and he had a history of not missing any games, the team decide to put Rodgers on the IR.

Also on the product of the system thing, our HC said that we will run a system, and Favre would have to play within it, even FOX addressed it, stop living under a rock.

[TitleTown088]

Retired quarterback Brett Favre responded quickly to an ESPN report about a possible return to play for the Green Bay Packers by saying, "It's all rumor."

When queried about a possible media firestorm, Favre text messaged, "No reason for it."

Put to rest now?

[badgerbacker]

This just in: Brett Favre was spotted playing catch with a young boy. Is he conducting his own minicamp so that he can come back from retirement?!?

[broth223]

Here's my take

On Aaron Rogers

The Facts:
- There has been a long history of players following Vet QBs becoming very good players after a few years (ie Steve Young, Tom Brady, Tony Romo, Jeff Garcia)

- None of these players were chosen in the first day let alone the first round of the NFL Draft.

- Since 1990 (I'm sure I could go further but I think going back 18 years is good enough) There has been 1 first round QB to not play 16 games in his first 3 seasons (cumulatively) other than Aaron Rogers and yet still start one full season that player is Chad Pennington.

- There is no extreme bias against first year QBs making the playoffs (first round players).

The Conjecture:

- I've said it before and I'll say it again the drafting of Brian Brohm shows a clear lack of confidence ini Aaron Rogers or at least in his ability to stay healthy. I can't even definitively say Aaron Rogers is the best QB on his team.


On Vikings vs Packers who is better

The Facts:
- There is no telling who is better it is a futile argument each team has weaknesses that can be exploited by the other.

- Jarad Allan is one player.

- Jarad Allen is one player who lead the league in sacks last year without Pat Williams sitting next to him.

The Conjecture:
- They are even without Favre. Unproven doesn't mean the same as bad but I wouldn't put my money on either QB being better than the Median.

[BlindSite]

I don't think it does to be honest. I think if I was building a team Id want my starter, a vet backup and a young developmental guy.

Schaub was great trade bait and has he stuck in atlanta would now be a good starter.

Favre was the same deal, as was hasselbeck as was aaron rogers (though he's a bag of ass).

Delhomme is another guy who was a backup.

Say rogers goes out, lights it up for a year or two and gets injured brohm comes in closes out the season and does well. In the offseason GB could find great draft picks in an exchange for him. If he gets a career ending injury then they've got insurance.

A 2nd round pick on a team with no major weaknesses is a good way to invest in the future which is what I see the pick as.

[Boston]

Here's my take

On Aaron Rogers

The Facts:
- There has been a long history of players following Vet QBs becoming very good players after a few years (ie Steve Young, Tom Brady, Tony Romo, Jeff Garcia)

- None of these players were chosen in the first day let alone the first round of the NFL Draft.

- Since 1990 (I'm sure I could go further but I think going back 18 years is good enough) There has been 1 first round QB to not play 16 games in his first 3 seasons (cumulatively) other than Aaron Rogers and yet still start one full season that player is Chad Pennington.

- There is no extreme bias against first year QBs making the playoffs (first round players).

The Conjecture:

- I've said it before and I'll say it again the drafting of Brian Brohm shows a clear lack of confidence ini Aaron Rogers or at least in his ability to stay healthy. I can't even definitively say Aaron Rogers is the best QB on his team.


On Vikings vs Packers who is better

The Facts:
- There is no telling who is better it is a futile argument each team has weaknesses that can be exploited by the other.

- Jarad Allan is one player.

- Jarad Allen is one player who lead the league in sacks last year without Pat Williams sitting next to him.

The Conjecture:
- They are even without Favre. Unproven doesn't mean the same as bad but I wouldn't put my money on either QB being better than the Median.

I'm sorry, are you lost?

[scottyboy]

you know why I love Strahan? Because he didn't and won't **** with the entire Giants fan base.

That and espn hates the Giants and the Patriots, Packers, Cowboys and Bucs clearly all lost the games and the Giants didn't win them..

ok but back on topic, he's not coming back, he won't. But we all know this rumor won't die until Brett does. In 2058.

[Turtlepower]

you know why I love Strahan? Because he didn't and won't **** with the entire Giants fan base.

He did hold-out the entire preseason last year and threatened to retire. I love him, but he isn't the best example here...

[scottyboy]

He did hold-out the entire preseason last year and threatened to retire. I love him, but he isn't the best example here...

well to all you Giants fans not in the loop. I knew he was coming back the whole time, but maybe because my aunt is his personal assistant! ;)

that and I'm pretty sure he dropped hints to the team last year he was coming back. But we won't hear of him coming back. For the next 50 years.

[GB12]

He did hold-out the entire preseason last year and threatened to retire. I love him, but he isn't the best example here...
Yeah, Strahan actually did worse than Favre. The media just didn't give it 1/10th of the attention.

[neko4]

Everything Favre does is magnified a thousand-million-billion-trillion-gazillion times

[Boston]

Yeah, Strahan actually did worse than Favre. The media just didn't give it 1/10th of the attention.

Yeah, people hate Favre for the same reasons they hate ESPN. Coincidence? You really think Favre starts rumors like this?

[neko4]

Yeah, people hate Favre for the same reasons they hate ESPN. Coincidence? You really think Favre starts rumors like this?
Ofcourse he does!

He wakes up every morning and says to himself, "Im purposly going to **** with the brains of my many fans just because im an *******!"

Seriously people the guy just gave up one of the things he loves most in life and I doubt its an easy time for him.

You guys dont think Michael Strahan doesnt wanna come back?
Or Warren Sapp?
Or anybody else who retired this year?

[scottyboy]

Ofcourse he does!

He wakes up every morning and says to himself, "Im purposly going to **** with the brains of my many fans just because im an *******!"

Seriously people the guy just gave up one of the things he loves most in life and I doubt its an easy time for him.

You guys dont think Michael Strahan doesnt wanna come back?
Or Warren Sapp?
Or anybody else who retired this year?

oh espn is just ******* *** with it, we know that. But honestly, this is what? the 3rd? 4th year there's been a "will he retire, or won't he?" and the "ZOMG will he stay retired??"

of course Stray and Sapp and Ogden will miss the game but they didn't do the whole waiting game as much as Favre has.

Then again Strahan is fine with a tv gig and that 10 table ring on his fingaaaaaa!

[Boston]

oh espn is just ******* *** with it, we know that. But honestly, this is what? the 3rd? 4th year there's been a "will he retire, or won't he?" and the "ZOMG will he stay retired??"

of course Stray and Sapp and Ogden will miss the game but they didn't do the whole waiting game as much as Favre has.

Then again Strahan is fine with a tv gig and that 10 table ring on his fingaaaaaa!

And, like I said before, nobody would have a problem with the waiting game if it wasn't for those stupid ***** over at ESPN.

[scottyboy]

And, like I said before, nobody would have a problem with the waiting game if it wasn't for those stupid ***** over at ESPN.

oh totally understood. ESPN slobber all over certain players/teams.

Red Sox, Yankees, Favre, Tiger, the Patriots etc.

srsly, with ALL the Favre stuff on espn, you'd think they hired John Madden

[neko4]

I really dont think everyone completly understands what Favre is going through. Football is basically all he has done his whole life.

Imagine a crackhead trying to give up crack. Except the crackhead is Brett Favre and the crack is football. I mean this in a fairly serious way.

[yourfavestoner]

well to all you Giants fans not in the loop. I knew he was coming back the whole time, but maybe because my aunt is his personal assistant! ;)

that and I'm pretty sure he dropped hints to the team last year he was coming back. But we won't hear of him coming back. For the next 50 years.

Come on, Brett is going to die in 2012 just like everyone else ;)

[M.O.T.H.]

BP should find a way to get him. Nothing like having an old Romo run the show. :)

By the sound of everything I heard today, he really wants to come back and his family is pushing him to do so. Could be rumor, could be a little truth there. In either case, I couldnt really picture him playing elsewhere but, I dont think the Packers will be taking him back either. Maybe Atlanta but, I just dont know. It doesnt seem likely.

[neko4]

Why wouldnt we take him back?

[badgerbacker]

The only reason we wouldn't take him back is because he's not coming back. If he wanted to, though, we would take him.

[GB12]

Why wouldnt we take him back?

The only reason we wouldn't take him back is because he's not coming back. If he wanted to, though, we would take him.
http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1123832&postcount=95

[neko4]

http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1123832&postcount=95
I have thought the same things too. And that post is like a worst-case (but also most likely) scenario.

[M.O.T.H.]

They seem like they've moved on. Aaron isnt getting any younger and Brohm was drafted w/ a high pick. Yes, Favre is a legend and has done amazing things for Green Bay but, Aaron deserves his shot and it looks like they are ready to move on into the next era. Favre cant play forever and he really has no one to blame but himself if he does want to come back now. I honestly think he's done anyway...so, it's probably going to be a non issue but, a Favre return could cause some problems in the locker room. The Rodgers situation really hasnt been handled properly from the get go and this would just make things worse.

[neko4]

I still dont think it was fair to Favre for the organization to draft a QB in the '05 draft. I know we were looking to the future, but at the time it seemed like Ted Thompson said F.U. Brett Favre we're moving on. Clearly its worked out pretty well, but at the time I think Favre felt betrayed.

[GB12]

I still dont think it was fair to Favre for the organization to draft a QB in the '05 draft. I know we were looking to the future, but at the time it seemed like Ted Thompson said F.U. Brett Favre we're moving on. Clearly its worked out pretty well, but at the time I think Favre felt betrayed.
Disagree completely on that. Drafting Aaron Rodgers was 100% the right move at the time. A top QB prospect fell into our laps and Favre could have easily retired after that season. We'd have been crazy to pass up that opportunity.

[EvilMonkey]

http://www.sunherald.com/newsupdates/story/663221.html

all rumor, hopefully we can move on until the start of training camp when another story like this will pop up......

[broth223]

I don't think it does to be honest. I think if I was building a team Id want my starter, a vet backup and a young developmental guy.

Schaub was great trade bait and has he stuck in atlanta would now be a good starter.

Favre was the same deal, as was hasselbeck as was aaron rogers (though he's a bag of ass).

Delhomme is another guy who was a backup.

Say rogers goes out, lights it up for a year or two and gets injured brohm comes in closes out the season and does well. In the offseason GB could find great draft picks in an exchange for him. If he gets a career ending injury then they've got insurance.

A 2nd round pick on a team with no major weaknesses is a good way to invest in the future which is what I see the pick as.

The Matt Schaub and Brian Brohm situations are very very different. Michael Vick was an established starter by time Schaub was drafted Aaron Rogers hasn't played a full season's worth of games in his NFL career.

Yeah many QBs start as backups for their first year or even their first 2 years in the league ( as far as high round draft choices go)

[Boston]

Can we lock this yet?

[neko4]

Can we lock this yet?
God, im so confused right now. Please lock it.

[PackerLegend]

I dont want Favre back... No one held a gun to his head and said retire. By retiring he has already said he isnt exactly 100% committed to everything, thats why he retired. Favre is great but this would likely be his last year and then next year we are in the same boat only with a pissed off Rodgers. Rodgers can take us to a SB, hell Sexy Rexy and Trent Dilfer have went there. Rodgers deserves this chance and ill risk it because Favre doesnt guarantee SB, then it'd be a wasted year with a mad Rodgers

Stop saying Brohm was drafted because the Packers dont trust Aaron Rodgers or worried about injuries. The can happen to anyone. Brohm was drafted because after Favre retired who was behind Rodgers? 0, nada, nothing Craig Nall but he was never resigned. So the Packers get great value and a good high potential young QB instead of say D. Culpepper. If Rodgers succeeds expect Brohm to be traded like Matt Schaub, if Rodgers fails we already have someone learning who would be ready if needed. Yup makes no sense to me

[eaglesfan_45]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPI9Jzgdk_g
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb1DcB-zGSU

"Breaking News:
Brett Farve seems to be sending secret messages through commercials. Will he make a comeback? Lets go to John Clayton for the awnser."

[neko4]

One of the absolute worst songs/raps ever

[broth223]

I dont want Favre back... No one held a gun to his head and said retire. By retiring he has already said he isnt exactly 100% committed to everything, thats why he retired. Favre is great but this would likely be his last year and then next year we are in the same boat only with a pissed off Rodgers. Rodgers can take us to a SB, hell Sexy Rexy and Trent Dilfer have went there. Rodgers deserves this chance and ill risk it because Favre doesnt guarantee SB, then it'd be a wasted year with a mad Rodgers

I agree it is best for the Packers for Brett to stay gone.

Stop saying Brohm was drafted because the Packers dont trust Aaron Rodgers or worried about injuries. The can happen to anyone. Brohm was drafted because after Favre retired who was behind Rodgers? 0, nada, nothing Craig Nall but he was never resigned. So the Packers get great value and a good high potential young QB instead of say D. Culpepper. If Rodgers succeeds expect Brohm to be traded like Matt Schaub, if Rodgers fails we already have someone learning who would be ready if needed. Yup makes no sense to me

Had they drafted JDB, Kevin O'Connel. Josh Johnson or Colt Brennen. I'd be right there with you it doesn't mean a thing. But when you select a very NFL ready QB. when you have a very unproven QB it doesn't sing confidence. In spite of what some Packer Fans may thing the Pack isn't perfect. There were players at that position that could have helped the team. I guess I'm saying you don't draft a long term backup QB in the 2nd round unless you are buying an insurance policy against something and not a freak accident.

[umphrey]

Favre could tell one of his golfing buddies that "football would still be fun to play professionally" and it would make ESPN's front page

[PackerLegend]

I can see your point but you call Brohm a very NFL ready QB and Rodgers unproven. Those should be flipped, forget the experts no rookie QB is ready to be thrown in the fire right away.... it screams failure. Rodgers has learned this offense and has shown improvement every year for the last 3 years and we have very little reason not to believe in him. Brohm fits into this offense well and maybe some think it says the Packers dont trust Aaron Rodgers but either way Aaron Rodgers has already been giving the starting job for 2008. Its a business and Rodgers understands jobs are won and TT is taking who he feels are the best players. Does TT take a QB thats not suppose to be as good as Brohm because he doesn't want to hurt Aaron Rodgers feelings? No TT takes people who he feels are the best regardless of the position and situation. Look at Justin Harrell, Jordy Nelson, Brian Brohm and he makes many more so called "questionable" picks like Greg Jennings over Chad Jackson.

[Mr.Regular]

my head is going to explode

[PACKmanN]

Here's my take

On Aaron Rogers

The Facts:
- There has been a long history of players following Vet QBs becoming very good players after a few years (ie Steve Young, Tom Brady, Tony Romo, Jeff Garcia)

- None of these players were chosen in the first day let alone the first round of the NFL Draft.

- Since 1990 (I'm sure I could go further but I think going back 18 years is good enough) There has been 1 first round QB to not play 16 games in his first 3 seasons (cumulatively) other than Aaron Rogers and yet still start one full season that player is Chad Pennington.

- There is no extreme bias against first year QBs making the playoffs (first round players).

The Conjecture:

[/B]- I've said it before and I'll say it again the drafting of Brian Brohm shows a clear lack of confidence ini Aaron Rogers or at least in his ability to stay healthy. I can't even definitively say Aaron Rogers is the best QB on his team.


[B]On Vikings vs Packers who is better

The Facts:
- There is no telling who is better it is a futile argument each team has weaknesses that can be exploited by the other.

- Jarad Allan is one player.

- Jarad Allen is one player who lead the league in sacks last year without Pat Williams sitting next to him.

The Conjecture:
- They are even without Favre. Unproven doesn't mean the same as bad but I wouldn't put my money on either QB being better than the Median.

How? What does it matter if it was a vet or rookie? Brohm and the team has said this is Rodgers' team, plus Brohm is injury prone in College so I don't think if they have little confidence in Rodgers they would draft another injury prone qb.

[Burns336]

Can we get back to the overrated DB's? Or did I kill that already?

[princefielder28]

Go Pack Go!

[PackerLegend]

Can we get back to the overrated DB's? Or did I kill that already?

No you are right... Al And Charles gave up enormous amounts of catches, yards and td's every game. Thats why the Packers lost so many games and gave up tons of points......or not. If your looking at our secondary pick apart our nickel and dime CB's and let your TE run wild because those were our problems last year.

[umphrey]

Or argue our scheme, because in the role they play, Al and Charles are some of the best in the biz.

Find a corner who can cover Plax or Owens 1 on 1. There aren't many, if one even exists.

[broth223]

How? What does it matter if it was a vet or rookie? Brohm and the team has said this is Rodgers' team, plus Brohm is injury prone in College so I don't think if they have little confidence in Rodgers they would draft another injury prone qb.

I'm not going to go through the whole argument again but the jist is that no one drafts a long term backup QB in the second round. Great value yeah sure but I'm saying there is a reason bigger than just BPA and freak accident insurence.

Difference between a rookie and a vet. An old vet is more of a mentor (See Vinny Testiverde, Trent Dilfer, Culpepper, Billy Volek) They won't be around long term 3-4 years tops you draft a Rookie he's staying a long time. Oh you can trade him later but the thing with a Schaub style trade is he's going to have to play. I think Schaub played 12 games in 2 years if you are expecting Rogers to be healthy and good then the trade just won't work.

[broth223]

I can see your point but you call Brohm a very NFL ready QB and Rodgers unproven. Those should be flipped, forget the experts no rookie QB is ready to be thrown in the fire right away.... it screams failure. Rodgers has learned this offense and has shown improvement every year for the last 3 years and we have very little reason not to believe in him. Brohm fits into this offense well and maybe some think it says the Packers dont trust Aaron Rodgers but either way Aaron Rodgers has already been giving the starting job for 2008. Its a business and Rodgers understands jobs are won and TT is taking who he feels are the best players. Does TT take a QB thats not suppose to be as good as Brohm because he doesn't want to hurt Aaron Rodgers feelings? No TT takes people who he feels are the best regardless of the position and situation. Look at Justin Harrell, Jordy Nelson, Brian Brohm and he makes many more so called "questionable" picks like Greg Jennings over Chad Jackson.

You make many good points specially at the beginning and you're right I'd say Rogers is more ready than Brohm but my initial point remains that that you don't take a long term backup in the 2nd round. One thing I must say though is that there is no substitute for on field experience.

[Geo]

Here's the thing imo (and I stress the last part):

Favre can sill play. Oh definitely, he can still play. Giving it some thought, start to finish, there's serious argument that Favre was the best quarterback in the NFC last regular season. Until Eli ascended into the second-best quarterback in the NFL behnd his older brother, that is.

But I think last year was the first time we saw the cold get to Brett Favre. Especially the game against the Bears and the playoff game against the Giants. But mybe too much is being made and that's not the case, the Bears game was meaningless record-wise I believe and that Giants game was absolutely bitter cold to everyone on the field (Coughlin looked like a lawn gnome for reals).

Still, given the Packers are who they are and play where they play, that would be a serious concern to keep in the back of your head if he were to come back.

You know, I wonder if the Packers would release him on the requirement that he sign with an AFC team. Namely the team I have foremost in mind: the Miami Dolphins. Their receivers aren't bread-winners right now, they need Favre to make them look better than they currently are. He could play in the South/warm climate, without having the burden of legacy near-choking him when he just wants to enjoy playing the game as long as he can. I think too much is made about his age, it is just a number, each case is different and Favre is a rare breed for sure.

[Geo]

btw, I can't help but picture/hear Tracy Morgan saying this title whenever I see it on the screen. :p

[neko4]

I thought Coughlin was gonna get sick after the game. He looked horrible.

[yourfavestoner]

http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/getty/2008/09000d5d8061fcbf_gallery_600.jpg
Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.....

[princefielder28]

His face looks like my old baseball glove

[Gay Ork Wang]

This just in: Brett Favre was spotted playing catch with a young boy. Is he conducting his own minicamp so that he can come back from retirement?!?
OMGZ HE IS GOING TO PLAY MLB!

[BaLLiN]

Give up ESPN, no one cares. I am so sick of hearing about him.

i know really. they have nothing else better to talk about than a legend who is done.

[Breaker]

Farve return, the madden curse lives, and order will be once again, restored.

[Bruce Banner]

Perhaps Favre is using this retirement schtick to circumvent his obligation (and expectation) to be at the voluntary workouts and such. I understand these things would get old after 17 years but it could be used as evidence by someone claiming he isn't fully dedicated if he comes back.

[Duster]

Perhaps Favre is using this retirement schtick to circumvent his obligation (and expectation) to be at the voluntary workouts and such. I understand these things would get old after 17 years but it could be used as evidence by someone claiming he isn't fully dedicated if he comes back.

Except he hasn't been to them in quite a few years anyways...

Guys like Woodson and Harris usually don't go either.

[Bruce Banner]

Except he hasn't been to them in quite a few years anyways...

Guys like Woodson and Harris usually don't go either.

hence his "schtick".

[Brent]

Favre could tell one of his golfing buddies that "football would still be fun to play professionally" and it would make ESPN's front page
Yeah, things such as this are why I stopped watching ESPN with the exception of coverage of actual sporting events. It's gotten out of hand, they're like those 24-hour news networks. They have to fill the airwaves with something because they make the time slots for it. So, if turning hearsay and rumor into fact is what they have to do, then they will. Odds are he just wants attention or ESPN is desperate, possibly both.

"Oh wait, this just in, Brett Favre shot a hog on his property. We'll get reaction from our analysts. Does he still have that killer instinct in him? Let's send it over to our panel!"

[xooberon]

PFT 'reporting' Favre wants to return to football with.......


the Carolina Panthers.
LINK (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2008/07/03/cooks-privately-says-favre-wants-to-be-a-panther/)

lol

[BlindSite]

If PFT even knew where carolina was on a map it would be a miracle.

[PACKmanN]

I don't believe this. First, the Panthers don't have the cap to even think of having Favre, and second, the Panthers don't own a first round pick so I doubt they want to trade away their other picks, and I doubt they would trade their young talent.