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View Full Version : Which Prospect will slip in 09


Big_Pete
07-08-2008, 08:40 PM
Which Prospects do you think will slip further than expected in the 2009 draft? particularly once the juniors declare.

holt_bruce81
07-08-2008, 08:52 PM
Taylor Mays- Everything sees the potential, but what if he has just another average season and the "great combine" like everyone expects him to have, doesn't happen?

619
07-08-2008, 08:56 PM
DHB. First round talent however play on the field will not match the hype.

DragonFireKai
07-08-2008, 09:01 PM
Alex Boone will slip to the second day, as will Max Unger.

Primetime21
07-08-2008, 09:14 PM
Ian Johnson, even with a relatively weak RB class Johnsons average measurable and inflated due to cast/system/competition will send him to maybe 3rd but most likely 4th.

doingthisinsteadofwork
07-08-2008, 09:19 PM
Michael Oher: I dont think he can be the dominant LT most people think he is at the NFL level.

eaglesfan_45
07-08-2008, 09:20 PM
Fili Moala will fall to the 2nd round to a 3-4 team to play DE. The athleticism isn't there. Ha has stiff in the hips and doesn't have much balance or flexibility. His motor is very inconsistent. He lacks explosion when the ball is snapped. His production is simply average, especially considering he was on the same line of Lawrence Jackson and Sedrick Ellis. He has an unimpressive overall skill set IMO.

SenorGato
07-08-2008, 09:28 PM
Tim Tebow.

Caddy
07-08-2008, 09:30 PM
I think Chase Daniel will slip. I don't have him as a first round prospect at the moment any way, but unless he has an amazing season, I see him dropping well into the second day.

brat316
07-08-2008, 09:33 PM
Alex Boone will slip to the second day, as will Max Unger.

Really I thought he would at least be a second rounder

eaglesfan_45
07-08-2008, 09:39 PM
James Laurinitis (sp?) will fall to at least the late 1st round, I see a Paul Poslunzy (sp?) and Dan Conner type drop for him.

eaglesfan_45
07-08-2008, 09:43 PM
Prospect that will rise?

easily William Moore S out of Missouri, he is a Brian Dawkins clone. He is a playmaker in secondary. He is great in coverage and just as good against the run. I have no doubt he will surpass Taylor Mays and Myron Rolle on draft day.

Prospect that will fall?
Taylor Mays, Myron Rolle and Nic Harris. Right now from what I read, they are liabilities in coverage. They are going to remind too many people of Roy Williams.

scottyboy
07-08-2008, 09:45 PM
ok, first off, we have NO CLUE which juniors will declare. And how can you say who's an upper prospect this year? How do you know some QB or someone will emerge come the 09 season? How do you define a true slip? Kenny Philips' top 15 projection last year to Giants at 31, or Eric Henderson(LB MAryland) from wetdream to teams in round 2(fans reactions) to undrafted?

eaglesfan_45
07-08-2008, 09:47 PM
ok, first off, we have NO CLUE which juniors will declare. And how can you say who's an upper prospect this year? How do you know some QB or someone will emerge come the 09 season? How do you define a true slip? Kenny Philips top 15 projection last year to Giants at 31, or Eric Henderson(LB MAryland) from wetdream to teams in round 2(fans reactions) to undrafted?

they're just having fun Scotty.

The idea is to try and predict who will suffer a Kenny Phillips or Calias Campell type fall.

scottyboy
07-08-2008, 09:49 PM
they're just having fun Scotty.

The idea is to try and predict who will suffer a Kenny Phillips or Calias Campell type fall.

Oh i know, but I was just curious. Those aren't big falls though, there are big falls like Henderson or minor ones like Philips.

Brent
07-08-2008, 09:49 PM
I'll say Michael Crabtree. Defenses playing Tech are going to be all over him.

BaLLiN
07-08-2008, 10:24 PM
Malcolm Jenkins anyone?

JT Jag
07-08-2008, 10:25 PM
Tim Tebow.I'd be willing to wager 20 bucks with anyone on this forum that Tebow won't declare.

BigJohn98
07-08-2008, 10:38 PM
People, Tebow isn't declaring! Why is it so hard to comprehend that?

DragonFireKai
07-08-2008, 10:57 PM
Really I thought he would at least be a second rounder

Which one?

eaglesfan_45
07-08-2008, 11:13 PM
Phil Loadholt will fall to the 2nd Round, he is strictly a NFL RT. His footwork isn't great, and his pass protection is average. He reminds me of George Foster.

brat316
07-08-2008, 11:24 PM
Which one?

OSU one LT

DragonFireKai
07-08-2008, 11:47 PM
OSU one LT

Boone's too stiff laterally. He's going to look good through the season, but he's going to get embarassed at the Senior Bowl, and his stock isn't high enough to allow him to skip it without some major repercussions.

Sniper
07-09-2008, 12:06 AM
I'll say Michael Crabtree. Defenses playing Tech are going to be all over him.

They were all over his **** last year. Doesn't look like it made much of a difference.

thule
07-09-2008, 01:09 AM
I'll second Malcolm Jenkins....last year right at the deadline his stock was falling....questions were coming up about his speed...and a lot of people were questioning his ability to play against elite WR talents....he played so much flex at OSU the tape on a regular basis had some people wondering if he was another Antrel Rolle....I'm going to be he isn't a top 20 pick....at a premium position going into the offseason as the #1 at your position that's a pretty big fall.

DragonFireKai
07-09-2008, 01:17 AM
They were all over his **** last year. Doesn't look like it made much of a difference.

But only after the fourth game or so. This time they'll be on him the whole season, so he'll probably only be 200 yards and 4 TDs ahead of number 2.

wicket
07-09-2008, 01:24 AM
But only after the fourth game or so. This time they'll be on him the whole season, so he'll probably only be 200 yards and 4 TDs ahead of number 2.

And that would be a disgracefully bad year obviously ;)

brat316
07-09-2008, 01:37 AM
But only after the fourth game or so. This time they'll be on him the whole season, so he'll probably only be 200 yards and 4 TDs ahead of number 2.

whos number 2

DeathbyStat
07-09-2008, 08:37 AM
Not that he was going very high anyway but I think Derrick Williams could go in the between the fourth and six round.

a much better athlete than a football player but could add some value in the return game

Mr. Carter
07-09-2008, 08:43 AM
People, Tebow isn't declaring! Why is it so hard to comprehend that?

A bit early to make that declaration I would say...

DragonFireKai
07-09-2008, 10:10 AM
whos number 2

We don't know yet, but I'll be a homer and say Sammie Stroughter.

ATLDirtyBirds
07-09-2008, 11:50 AM
I'll say Michael Crabtree. Defenses playing Tech are going to be all over him.


I don't think that matters when we talk about Crabtree.

Turtlepower
07-09-2008, 11:54 AM
As people said before, it has to be Malcolm Jenkins. Usually Seniors who flirt with declaring during their Junior season have a major stock fall. I think he will be great in the NFL, but his speed is questionable at this point.

princefielder28
07-09-2008, 12:12 PM
i'm gonna say Curtis Painter

Jonny
07-09-2008, 12:18 PM
Loadholdt, Animal Jr. (most overrated player in the draft), Selvie

edit: oh yeah Painter too, but I already consider him a day 2 prospect at best

princefielder28
07-09-2008, 12:19 PM
Loadholdt, Animal Jr. (most overrated player in the draft), Selvie

edit: oh yeah Painter too, but I already consider him a day 2 prospect at best

I don't consider Painter a big time prospect, but several draft "gurus" have him as a first rounder and possibly top senior QB

keylime_5
07-09-2008, 01:34 PM
As people said before, it has to be Malcolm Jenkins. Usually Seniors who flirt with declaring during their Junior season have a major stock fall. I think he will be great in the NFL, but his speed is questionable at this point.

The man runs between 4.35 and 4.45 and he is one of our fastest players, speed is not the thing with Malcolm. If he struggles in man coverage this year some teams might look at him as a safety. He has played almost exclusively zone so far and excelled at it. He should be a top 10 pick.

vidae
07-09-2008, 01:49 PM
Tim Tebow.

Agreed. I just don't like him as much as some of the others do.

BigJohn98
07-09-2008, 02:34 PM
A bit early to make that declaration I would say...

He's not leaving. He loves the college life, and I believe he wants to get his degree. I live in Gator land, so I hear a lot about them.

Sniper
07-09-2008, 03:25 PM
If he struggles in man coverage this year some teams might look at him as a safety.

We won't get to see him in man coverage because OSU plays zone 95% of the time.

Turtlepower
07-09-2008, 03:26 PM
We won't get to see him in man coverage because OSU plays zone 95% of the time.

Which is why Malcolm Jenkins looks hella slow on game tape.

Big_Pete
07-09-2008, 05:52 PM
If Taylor Mays, Marion Rolle and Kam Chancellor declare (as I expect), then Nic Harris, Courtney Greene, Patrick Chung, Michael Hamlin and Kevin Ellison will slip alot futher than they should

Primetime21
07-09-2008, 05:56 PM
If Taylor Mays, Marion Rolle and Kam Chancellor declare (as I expect), then Nic Harris, Courtney Greene, Patrick Chung, Michael Hamlin and Kevin Ellison will slip alot futher than they should

Patrick Chung I can see slipping even though I love him as a player.

Burns336
07-10-2008, 03:37 PM
The man runs between 4.35 and 4.45 and he is one of our fastest players, speed is not the thing with Malcolm. If he struggles in man coverage this year some teams might look at him as a safety. He has played almost exclusively zone so far and excelled at it. He should be a top 10 pick.

Depends if a cover-2 team is in the top 10.

doingthisinsteadofwork
07-10-2008, 04:22 PM
If Taylor Mays, Marion Rolle and Kam Chancellor declare (as I expect), then Nic Harris, Courtney Greene, Patrick Chung, Michael Hamlin and Kevin Ellison will slip alot futher than they should
His name is Myron and Id have most of those guys if not all of those guys ahead of him.

Sniper
07-10-2008, 04:26 PM
Depends if a cover-2 team is in the top 10.

You don't draft Cover 2 corners in the top 10.

Big_Pete
07-10-2008, 05:45 PM
His name is Myron and Id have most of those guys if not all of those guys ahead of him.

my bad - doh!

Ar you saying you expect Myron Rolle to be availble in the 3rd round?

T.Smith
07-10-2008, 06:04 PM
We won't get to see him in man coverage because OSU plays zone 95% of the time.

I'd say more along the lines of 70%, but OSU will be playing a ton of man to man this year by all coaching and player accounts thus far.

bored of education
07-10-2008, 06:19 PM
Loadholt i would say. right now mid to late 1st will end up in the 3rd 4th

Solomon
07-11-2008, 09:29 AM
There's lots of guys I think will drop a bit.

Travis Beckum - very productive college TE but at least 25 lbs too small to play that position in the pros and doesn't quite have the speed or quickness to make the transition to WR.

Michael Johnson - great athleticism and potential but he hasn't been able to get enough snaps to prove that he's a great prospect. This year is his chance to shine but if he doesn't dominate and a slew of underclassmen pass rushers come out (Hardy, Evans, Middleton, Selvie, English, Norwood, Jarmon, Sapp) he could drop into the late second or early third round.

Fili Moala - also very athletic but my knocks on him are similiar as the ones by a poster on him earlier in this thread.

James Laurinaitis - I don't expect a huge drop from him but right now I've seen many publications call him a top 10 player, my guess is that he'll end up a late first to a mid second rounder.

Addict
07-11-2008, 09:49 AM
ehhhh who's the top QB?

princefielder28
07-11-2008, 09:55 AM
ehhhh who's the top QB?

For me so far....

1. Cullen Harper, CLEMSON
2. Chase Holbrook, NEW MEXICO STATE
3. Chase Daniel, MIZZOU
4. Rudy Carpenter, ARIZONA STATE
5. Curtis Painter, PURDUE
6. Todd Boeckman, OHIO STATE
7. Hunter Cantwell, LOUISVILLE
8. Liam Coen, UMASS
9. Mike Teel, RUTGERS
10. Chase clement, RICE

jnew76
07-11-2008, 02:49 PM
Phil Loadholt will fall to the 2nd Round, he is strictly a NFL RT. His footwork isn't great, and his pass protection is average. He reminds me of George Foster.

I agree with this... I think he is definitely a RT in the NFL. Dominant due to size in college, but lack of quickness and footwork will limit him to Good RT or very average to below average LT.

keylime_5
07-11-2008, 03:25 PM
Depends if a cover-2 team is in the top 10.

He would be just as good a fit in any other scheme - long arms, very fast and very strong and big, can tackle, and has great ball skills (some thought he'd be a WR in college if not safety or corner). Best cornerback prospect since Pacman.

Splat
07-11-2008, 05:36 PM
I'm going to say Chase Daniel do to his size but I'm rooting for him.

yourfavestoner
07-11-2008, 07:35 PM
A bit early to make that declaration I would say...

Not really...anyone who keeps up with the UF program can pretty much guarantee this. His UF alum Jesus Freak parents won't let him get stars in his eyes and bolt for the NFL just because of the money.

Percy Harvin and Brandon Spikes are pretty much locks to declare, though.

Turtlepower
07-11-2008, 07:36 PM
I'm going to say Chase Daniel do to his size but I'm rooting for him.

He was never that high of a prospect...

Brent
07-11-2008, 07:53 PM
For me so far....

1. Cullen Harper, CLEMSON
2. Chase Holbrook, NEW MEXICO STATE
3. Chase Daniel, MIZZOU
4. Rudy Carpenter, ARIZONA STATE
5. Curtis Painter, PURDUE
6. Todd Boeckman, OHIO STATE
7. Hunter Cantwell, LOUISVILLE
8. Liam Coen, UMASS
9. Mike Teel, RUTGERS
10. Chase clement, RICE
Cullen? Really? I am not criticizing I am just surprised. I didnt realize people thought that highly of him. Personally, I am pretty high on Holbrook (saw him live when he was at SE Louisiana), Carpenter and Painter.

LonghornsLegend
07-12-2008, 04:45 AM
He would be just as good a fit in any other scheme - long arms, very fast and very strong and big, can tackle, and has great ball skills (some thought he'd be a WR in college if not safety or corner). Best cornerback prospect since Pacman.

Your right, how silly of us, little did we know all this time Malcolm Jenkins is the perfect prospect and player and has no questions about him in any shape or form.

Thanks for clearing it up though.

Scotty D
07-12-2008, 07:10 AM
Terrance Taylor will not go as high as people are projecting.

keylime_5
07-12-2008, 10:24 AM
Your right, how silly of us, little did we know all this time Malcolm Jenkins is the perfect prospect and player and has no questions about him in any shape or form.

Thanks for clearing it up though.

He's not just a cover 2 corner is all. That's ridiculous.

PossumBoy9
07-12-2008, 10:45 AM
He was never that high of a prospect...

Yeah, how much could Daniel really "fall"?

eaglesfan_45
08-04-2008, 11:49 PM
OK, here I go-

Fili Moala- the guy is not that good, simple as that. Career back-up at this point or starter for a terrible team. I don't not like him, the athleticism isn't there. He has stiff in the hips and doesn't have much balance or flexibility. His motor is very inconsistent. He lacks explosion when the ball is snapped and plays to high. His production is simply average, especially considering he was on the same line of Lawrence Jackson and Sedrick Ellis. He has an unimpressive overall skill set IMO.

Darrius Heyward-Bey- He is to inconsistent. He needs to get more physical and is a horrible blocker. He catches with his body in traffic. He can use alot of help in route running. Not very productive, only 3 TDs last season.

Tyson Jackson- Calias Campell V.2

Taylor Mays- Taylor Mays size makes him such an intriguing prospect. The combination of being 6'4, 225 and an estimated 40 time of 4.4, makes him scary. Even though he has incredible size and speed, he needs to work on his technique a lot if he is going to be a star. He can't really turn with receivers and you will see him stumble when he goes to turn his hips. Mays likes to go for big hits, but he needs to learn to wrap up if he is going to rack up tackling numbers in the NFL. Backpedaling, Change of Direction, Toughness, Technique, and Tackling are all question marks.

Malcolm Jenkins- Antrelle Rolle 2.0 (not really a bad thing) meaning is best in a cover 2 or as a FS

And of course the guys who dosn't need an explanation..... Myron Rolle and Tim Tebow. (If you want I can give you one)

Guys Who Will Rise to take their places IMO:

Jeff Owens, Kenny Britt, Lawrence Wilson, William Moore, Mike Mickens, Kam Chancellor and Cullen Harper

Punisher
08-05-2008, 01:11 AM
Your analysis of Fili Moala gave me a huge grimace there Eaglesfan_45. Lack of motor and explosion? Did you ever stop to think the reason Fili didn't put up big numbers is because he played around that talent? Hell, Sed Ellis didn't put up big numbers until last year.

BRAVEHEART
08-05-2008, 02:03 AM
Risers:
Jamere Holland RS So,WR , UO

Reggie Carter Jr,LB, UCLA

Dan LeFeveur Jr,QB, CMU

Rusty Smith Jr,QB, FAU

Marlon Lucky SR, RB, Neb

Eric Norwood Jr, LB/DE, SCAR

Fallers:

Lesean mcCoy RS So , Rb, PITT (yes he's good...but he wont match last seasons success)

Matthew Stafford Jr, QB, UGA

Cullen Harper Jr, QB, Clem (what's so special about him? His stats look good, but I'm not buying him.)

Alex Boone Sr, LT, tOSU (the USC game will make or break him)

James Laurinaitis Sr,LB, tOSU (see above)

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 06:56 AM
Your analysis of Fili Moala gave me a huge grimace there Eaglesfan_45. Lack of motor and explosion? Did you ever stop to think the reason Fili didn't put up big numbers is because he played around that talent? Hell, Sed Ellis didn't put up big numbers until last year.

That will happen sometimes when dealing with this kid. I agree with you if that with a lot of talent around you, that takes away from a lot of opportunities to make plays. I think a better way to figure out a players stats would be to find out all of the things they did (Tackles, TFL, Sack, Hurries, PBU, INT etc.) with the opportunities they had. More of a ratio or percentage sort of thing. I'm just using this as a hypothietical, but say Moala had only 30 tackles, 8 TFLs, 3 sacks, etc, but if he only had say 200 plays he was on the field, but only 50 opportunities to make those plays due to the talent around him, that is a good playmaking ratio, especially for a DT. I know that is a basic example, and those stats are nowhere near what they probably are, I just tried to use a basic example to ease the ability to understand what i was aiming for. Its the same way with a LB who is the only really good player on his team, since everyone else is getting their butt kicked, that puts the LB in position to make more plays thus improving his stats. I don't know if this even makes sense to everyone, but I really wish their was a way to find out how a player does when they have the opportunity to make a play.

StrongSide97
08-05-2008, 07:16 AM
Tyson Jackson-He obviously has the size, but his play last year didn't match up with it, nor do I think it will this year. I hope I'm wrong, because I love defensive ends like him that the size of the offensive tackle they are bull rushing. I just don't see it from him though. He often showed a weak motor and inconsistency last season.

Brian Cushing-Not that he is a Top 10 pick right now, but Cushing is oft injured and I'm having a feeling that the steroid allegations will come out somehow because he has been a target for the past two seasons about them. One way or the other, he slips.

William Moore-For all of you who are infatuated with him, this is just to piss you off, but seriously....I'm just kidding, but seriously.

CJSchneider
08-05-2008, 07:22 AM
I remember last year when Brian Brohm was listed number 2 and Andre Woodson was listed number 3 on this site. With that being said, I think the prospect who falls the most will be a QB.

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 07:22 AM
On William Moore: Blasphemy! Stop spreading the propoganda! Seriously though, if he would fall off the map, he could fall, but that is the only way it happens IMO. It would be very difficult for him to have a horrible season, barring injury.

Mr. Stiller
08-05-2008, 08:34 AM
I see Jeremy Perry, Phil Loadholt slipping.

Perry I like as a OG/C prospect and reminds me a lot of Dermontti Dawson. The problem is his leg has and could really really drop him.

BamaFalcon59
08-05-2008, 09:17 AM
Fili Moala and Tyson Jackson are two guys I think will fall.

keylime_5
08-05-2008, 10:51 AM
Malcolm Jenkins to Antrel Rolle comparisons are pretty good, but does that make him a faller? Rolle went 8th overall. Jenkins is more of a pure cover corner than Rolle was too.

I think Crabtree has more than a decent chance to fall below where he's being pegged right now. I see him more as a top 15 pick than a top 5 pick at this point.

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 10:58 AM
Its hard to say someoen in the top 15 falls, but when you go form top 5 to 14th or 15th it is just enough to call it a fall, IMO.

keylime_5
08-05-2008, 11:58 AM
He's not gonna be a Calvin Johnson or Braylon Edwards type prospect...but if either of those two didn't go top 5 then it would've definitely been a big slip. If Crabtree is expected to go top 5 and he ends up in the 10-15 range it will still be a slip even if it's not a huge one.

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 12:16 PM
Defintiely, thats pretty much what i was saying.

SKim172
08-05-2008, 12:58 PM
Think generally you're gonna see lowered value placed on safeties. It seems to be a growing trend - as other positions become more valued, safety seems to take the biggest fall.

Chase Holbrook is gonna fall - he's probably a mid-rounder as is, will slip even further. Just not high on the guy - struggled against very average teams. As will Curtis Painter and all the QBs in the senior class in general, probably. Cullen Harper needs to snap out of it and come out the gates on fire if he wants to prove himself #1.

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 01:26 PM
The argument could be made in the exact opposite direction. With the value on TE and RBs who are recevieing threats, having good coverage Safeties is just as important, as a matter of fact, I remember hearing form Mike Mayock that the average first safety being picked up has steadily increased over the last few years, along with TE. That and safeties are being taken earlier as a whole, not just the top ones. This also goes with TEs as well

eaglesfan_45
08-05-2008, 02:04 PM
When you see Micheal Crabtree think of Larry Fitzgerald prospect wise. The only real knock is his speed.

BuddyCHRIST
08-05-2008, 02:12 PM
Think generally you're gonna see lowered value placed on safeties. It seems to be a growing trend - as other positions become more valued, safety seems to take the biggest fall.

Chase Holbrook is gonna fall - he's probably a mid-rounder as is, will slip even further. Just not high on the guy - struggled against very average teams. As will Curtis Painter and all the QBs in the senior class in general, probably. Cullen Harper needs to snap out of it and come out the gates on fire if he wants to prove himself #1.

I actually think values on safeties are rising, with great safety prospects being picked in the top 10 regularly. Something that use to be unheard of. Especially with the way great safeties play now and day and the way they affect defenses (all the great defenses have great safeties). There's always a plethora of safeties who struggle in coverage and they will fall but the rare all around safeties are being drafted as high as ever.

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 02:23 PM
Thats pretty much what I'ver been saying, and if you go over draft results, you will see it as well. Both of the safety positions have been valued higher in the draft as TEs who are big-time receiving threats have caused the necessity for great Safeties.

eaglesfan_45
08-05-2008, 10:55 PM
Your analysis of Fili Moala gave me a huge grimace there Eaglesfan_45. Lack of motor and explosion? Did you ever stop to think the reason Fili didn't put up big numbers is because he played around that talent? Hell, Sed Ellis didn't put up big numbers until last year.

Sedrick Ellis is MUCH better than Fili Moala.

But, what your trying to tell me is that when you oget better talent around you, you put up worse stats? I'll have to agree in some cases. However, on the lines, its a different story. Heres my example, Jared Allen. Jared Allen just went to the Viking and is expected to have a giant year because of the BETTER talent around him. In Fili's case when your lining up with future pros day in and day out you should at least be freeded up on occasion.

When your lining up with Sedrick Ellis, Lawrence Jackson, Kyle Moore, and Everson Griffin you should be freeded up quite alot. Lets face it, he's not exactly the best player out of those guys so its not like he's drawing double teams.

thebow305
08-05-2008, 11:54 PM
I'll say Loadholt and Laurinaitis.