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CJSchneider
08-05-2008, 02:00 PM
I messaged nobodyinparticular about making this and this was his answer;

"I'm going out of town in a few hours and I won't have internet access for well over 3 weeks. The next time I know I'll have access to the internet is the first of September.

Since you've shown such interest in the Power Rankings polls, I was wondering if you would like to put them up. If so, that would be great, but if not then we'll forever be stuck at #19.

Have a great day. I'll catch you later."

So, I hope I make him proud.

32. Atlanta Falcons
31. Miami Dolphins
30. San Francisco 49ers
29. Kansas City Chiefs
28. Detroit Lions
27. Oakland Raiders
26. Denver Broncos
25. St. Louis Rams
24. Baltimore Ravens
23. New York Jets
22. Chicago Bears
21. Cincinnati Bengals
20. Carolina Panthers
19. Arizona Cardinals

Addict
08-05-2008, 02:02 PM
helping you hope!

You forgot to make the poll :O

CJSchneider
08-05-2008, 02:06 PM
Didn't forget, it posts the thread, then you make the poll.

ShortSqueeze
08-05-2008, 02:08 PM
I'll go with the Titans. That offense is a big mystery right now and I'm not sold the defense will be able to keep them in games again.

ALD
08-05-2008, 02:11 PM
I voted for the texans, but the titans and bucs are very close.

Addict
08-05-2008, 02:14 PM
Didn't forget, it posts the thread, then you make the poll.

forgive me for my ignorance, CJSchneider-san *bows*

CJSchneider
08-05-2008, 02:19 PM
http://windowmanager.blogspot.com/PaiMei.jpeg

You are forgiven, but you must place this "L" on your forhead.

keylime_5
08-05-2008, 02:42 PM
I vote for Bills, but the Texans were tempting. We seem to have moved out of the bad and below average teams into the mediocre and maybe good teams.

KCJ58
08-05-2008, 02:46 PM
you might want to post this on the 1st post

32. Atlanta Falcons
31. Miami Dolphins
30. San Francisco 49ers
29. Kansas City Chiefs
28. Detroit Lions
27. Oakland Raiders
26. Denver Broncos
25. St. Louis Rams
24. Baltimore Ravens
23. New York Jets
22. Chicago Bears
21. Cincinnati Bengals
20. Carolina Panthers
19. Arizona Cardinals

princefielder28
08-05-2008, 02:46 PM
Titans and their lack of offense

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 02:49 PM
I went with the texans, but the Skins were close IMO.
Edit: Yes, even with Jesus Brennan

cdub11
08-05-2008, 02:51 PM
texans for me, lack of run game and they just dont excite me much

yo123
08-05-2008, 02:55 PM
I'll go with the Texans.

MetSox17
08-05-2008, 03:03 PM
I went with the Titans. I don't think their offense is gonna put up much of a fight

eaglesalltheway
08-05-2008, 03:05 PM
The defense wll be what saves them, if anything.

MetSox17
08-05-2008, 03:08 PM
And i'm sure Rob Bironas will save them too.

I mean, no.

They'll be lucky to win 7 games this year.

CJSchneider
08-05-2008, 03:16 PM
you might want to post this on the 1st post

32. Atlanta Falcons
31. Miami Dolphins
30. San Francisco 49ers
29. Kansas City Chiefs
28. Detroit Lions
27. Oakland Raiders
26. Denver Broncos
25. St. Louis Rams
24. Baltimore Ravens
23. New York Jets
22. Chicago Bears
21. Cincinnati Bengals
20. Carolina Panthers
19. Arizona Cardinals

Edited. Thanks.

ALD
08-05-2008, 03:22 PM
Just wondering but why are people voting for the bills over teams like Tennessee and Houston? The Bills finally have a big guy who can bring down a jump ball to open things up for their small speedsters, they have a top 10 oline and running attack lead by a top 15 back and a great compliment to him in Fred Jackson. With Stroud there to solidify their interior run defense and health the D should again become top 15 and I just don't see them doing any worse than the 8-8 they were last season, despite being the most injured team in the NFL.

MetSox17
08-05-2008, 03:25 PM
Just wondering but why are people voting for the bills over teams like Tennessee and Houston? The Bills finally have a big guy who can bring down a jump ball to open things up for their small speedsters, they have a top 10 oline and running attack lead by a top 15 back and a great compliment to him in Fred Jackson. With Stroud there to solidify their interior run defense and health the D should again become top 15 and I just don't see them doing any worse than the 8-8 they were last season, despite being the most injured team in the NFL.

I don't think the defense is gonna be as good as you're making it seem. I've voted for them and the Titans in the past few polls actually. Their QB situation is not very envious. Trent Edwards is talented, but he's still half a rookie. James Hardy isn't gonna come in and have an impact right away, so their passing game won't be great. I like the running game, but that's about it on that side of the ball.

The secondary is still very young, and needs development. Who's starting opposite McGee (who isn't that great either)? Is Ko starting at FS? What's the pass-rush gonna be like?

yo123
08-05-2008, 03:25 PM
I went with the Titans. I don't think their offense is gonna put up much of a fight



They do have a very good offensive line and they had the fifth best running game in the league last year. With a D as good as they have I think that puts them past the Bills and Texans.

MetSox17
08-05-2008, 03:30 PM
They do have a very good offensive line and they had the fifth best running game in the league last year. With a D as good as they have I think that puts them past the Bills and Texans.

I honestly don't think their defense is all that great. I'm not too fond of the secondary, mainly the CB's.

jballa838
08-05-2008, 04:39 PM
Titans have an old defense, a bad run game, a QB who is overrated and can't throw to save his life, and zero talented recievers. /exaggeration
but still Carolina and Buffalo and Houston are all better. Carolina has firepower and an aging but solid D, Buffalo has a good defense, a great running back, some WR talent, and a semi decent QB. Houston has a better defense then they get credit for and has a formidable offense, plus they won 8 games in the AFC North, which is by far the toughest conference in the NFL.

Brent
08-05-2008, 04:43 PM
Like I have said in the past 2-3 of these threads, the Titans are not very good. There is VY, White and Crumpler, for offensive threats. And their defense is not very good. They should have been on the list several spots ago.

ALD
08-05-2008, 07:35 PM
I don't think the defense is gonna be as good as you're making it seem. I've voted for them and the Titans in the past few polls actually. Their QB situation is not very envious. Trent Edwards is talented, but he's still half a rookie. James Hardy isn't gonna come in and have an impact right away, so their passing game won't be great. I like the running game, but that's about it on that side of the ball.

The secondary is still very young, and needs development. Who's starting opposite McGee (who isn't that great either)? Is Ko starting at FS? What's the pass-rush gonna be like?

Just wondering how much of Trent Edwards you watched last season? I know he was a rookie but he was one of the most impressive rookie QBs I've seen. He made quick decisions, moved very well in the pocket to buy time and was very careful and accurate with the ball. I have a lot of confidence in him succeeding, especially if Turk opens the passing game up a little more. Plus you can't ignore what a quality oline and running game can do for a young QB.

Hardy doesn't even need to be good to have a big impact on the passing attack. The simple fact that he's over 5' and can jump changes the whole dynamic of that passing game, playing buffalo you used to never have to worry about someone actually coming down with a jumpball, now teams do, that'll be huge in terms of changing the spacing for the other receivers, which is why I expect Hardy to have very tame numbers outside the redzone, but for Evans to explode.

You know who started in their secondary last year? A converted WR, Wilson, and 23 pound Jabari Greer. Having Ko back to start next to Whitner and having a corner who isn't thinner than my left leg will mean a significant upgrade. Add to that the increased depth due to so many different guys getting PT due to injuries and performing, again 8-8 with the most season ending injuries and games missed by starters, the D should be around middle of the pack.

The Pass rush is still in need of a stud, but they were productive last season and McCargo should have even more of impact as a pass rusher now that Stroud's there to eat up double teams. It's not as good as my gmen, but it's solid and the bills have a bunch of high motor guys to rotate and keep people fresh.

Plus they should be able to blitz their LBs more unless they get murdered by injuries again.

OzTitan
08-05-2008, 07:58 PM
So, dare I ask, what logic exactly dictates the Texans are a better team than the Titans? Or the Bills for that matter? Is this the "NFLDC Preseason on paper rankings" or something? The Titans had a top OL, a good run game and a top 5 defense last year. Why do they deserve to be put behind a team that has barely beaten them in their franchise history? Is it really because they're not flashy enough? I'm so glad they actually play the games.

SuperMcGee
08-05-2008, 08:35 PM
Just wondering how much of Trent Edwards you watched last season? I know he was a rookie but he was one of the most impressive rookie QBs I've seen. He made quick decisions, moved very well in the pocket to buy time and was very careful and accurate with the ball. I have a lot of confidence in him succeeding, especially if Turk opens the passing game up a little more. Plus you can't ignore what a quality oline and running game can do for a young QB.

Hardy doesn't even need to be good to have a big impact on the passing attack. The simple fact that he's over 5' and can jump changes the whole dynamic of that passing game, playing buffalo you used to never have to worry about someone actually coming down with a jumpball, now teams do, that'll be huge in terms of changing the spacing for the other receivers, which is why I expect Hardy to have very tame numbers outside the redzone, but for Evans to explode.

You know who started in their secondary last year? A converted WR, Wilson, and 23 pound Jabari Greer. Having Ko back to start next to Whitner and having a corner who isn't thinner than my left leg will mean a significant upgrade. Add to that the increased depth due to so many different guys getting PT due to injuries and performing, again 8-8 with the most season ending injuries and games missed by starters, the D should be around middle of the pack.

The Pass rush is still in need of a stud, but they were productive last season and McCargo should have even more of impact as a pass rusher now that Stroud's there to eat up double teams. It's not as good as my gmen, but it's solid and the bills have a bunch of high motor guys to rotate and keep people fresh.

Plus they should be able to blitz their LBs more unless they get murdered by injuries again.

My only issues are that we were 7-9, not 8-8, last year, and that Jabari Greer is probably still going to start, and he's not that bad. Some trouble tackling and he got abused by Moss, yes, but he's not the worst option. George Wilson was bleh, he was good for not blowing gimme interceptions. Ko should be a big improvement. Hopefully with Stroud (who has been looking very good) and Posluszny in there, Crowell won't have to make every tackle, that's what I'm excited for. That and Lynch/Jackson, of course.
I can't fault people for voting us now, mostly just because of Edwards. There's too much yet to be seen with him. But I've been saying Houston for a little while now, and really think they should drop before us.

ALD
08-05-2008, 10:31 PM
My only issues are that we were 7-9, not 8-8, last year, and that Jabari Greer is probably still going to start, and he's not that bad. Some trouble tackling and he got abused by Moss, yes, but he's not the worst option. George Wilson was bleh, he was good for not blowing gimme interceptions. Ko should be a big improvement. Hopefully with Stroud (who has been looking very good) and Posluszny in there, Crowell won't have to make every tackle, that's what I'm excited for. That and Lynch/Jackson, of course.
I can't fault people for voting us now, mostly just because of Edwards. There's too much yet to be seen with him. But I've been saying Houston for a little while now, and really think they should drop before us.

Greer's fine except he lacks any type of strength to go up against more physical receivers

With Stroud and Puz the d should be a lot better at stuffing the run.

As for Edwards I don't mind people doubting, as there's a lot of reasons to do so, but I was incredibly impressed watching him, for a rookie he waas remarkably calm and collected.

brat316
08-05-2008, 10:59 PM
next thread or two you got to put Steelers on there

Staubach12
08-05-2008, 11:03 PM
I still say Tamp Bay.

OzTitan
08-05-2008, 11:37 PM
I really don't know how anyone can vote outside of Buffalo or Houston, honestly. Neither deserve to be ranked better than any of the other teams listed.

jballa838
08-05-2008, 11:53 PM
I really don't know how anyone can vote outside of Buffalo or Houston, honestly. Neither deserve to be ranked better than any of the other teams listed.
Marshawn Lynch > Tennessee's entire team.

neko4
08-06-2008, 12:14 AM
I like what the Texans are doing, theyre on the way up, but right now they arent better than Tennessee.
Offensivly there isnt much there outside of Andre Johnson. On defense they have a lot of good young players like Williams, Okoye and Ryans.
If they can get another good pass rusher on that Dline it will make their pitiful, possibly Dunta Robinson-less secondary look average.

OzTitan
08-06-2008, 12:31 AM
I like what the Texans are doing too, I just take exception to the free rides some teams get if they push all the right off season buttons. I like teams to earn respect before they make jumps on my board, and I don't think the Texans have earnt the right to be ranked above the Titans. I think people are just getting caught up the their rising stock, and the Titans lowering stock (for whatever reason that is). The Titans had a slightly tougher or just as tough schedule last year, they played better football over 16 games beating them twice, and it's not like the Texans had a killer offseason on paper, so color me very, very confused as to why it seems most of NFLDC think they are the better team. I can tolerate those who think the Titans will finish last in the South but this is a little far, to put it bluntly.

Cribbs>Hester
08-06-2008, 12:34 AM
Marshawn Lynch > Tennessee's entire team.

Marshawn Lynch > The entire NFL(including Adrian Peterson, he's just a diesel and needed more time to get warmed up).

Geo
08-06-2008, 12:46 AM
I really don't know how anyone can vote outside of Buffalo or Houston, honestly. Neither deserve to be ranked better than any of the other teams listed.
I wouldn't agree, as to me the Bills have a better defense and a better runningback than the Bucs, and Houston has a better offense (don't underestimate that unit, trust me) and better front seven than the Bucs. I honestly don't fear a single player on Tampa's roster, Brooks and Barber are in their twilight.

I would rank the Cardinals, Bengals, and Bears ahead of the Bucs. Except for safeties, the Bears' defense run circles around Tampa's defense at the remaining three levels (DL, LB, CB). It's amazing to me how an incredibly injury-striken season for the Bears' defense can make people forget that.

I'd consider including Baltimore too if they could give Troy Smith a competent offensive line, because their defense when healthy is superior to the Bucs. I'm sure this will piss off some Bucs fans and they'll rush to bring up stats from last year, but I really don't care about the stats from last year when I see with my own eyes that the situation is such that Tanard Jackson is the player I'd be most concerned with.

OzTitan
08-06-2008, 12:52 AM
I think that's why you bunch them closely, but to put theory ahead of reality? I'm not a fan myself. This is probably the first time the Texans have been considered a 10-20 team by most people ever, but I need something more than on paper speculation to list them ahead of teams that are a little more proven.

The Buccs are borderline due to some age concerns, so I think that can justify some teams ahead of them but at this point, 18 and 17 should be between the Bills and Texans IMO. I have my opinions on how I think the season will go down too, but when it comes to ranking teams I think a more logical and reasonable approach is better suited than wild prediction.

The Juice
08-06-2008, 07:47 AM
Here's an interesting article on team records last season:

http://www.footballsfuture.com/nfl/2008/predicting.html

Just goes to show what a difference a couple bounces can make.

OzTitan
08-06-2008, 08:35 AM
Pretty typical. That article first goes to say a "2 net close wins" team is 11%more likely to get a worse record the next season than a "3 net close wins" team, and yet the Jaguars (a 2 net close wins team) can repeat a 11 win season apparently, but the Titans (a 3 net close wins team) will win 6 or 7 games. He then suggests he likes the Jaguars style for this to happen, which is basically the same as the Titans, completely ignoring their D.

Secondly, the author fails to acknowledge a pattern. The more net close wins, the less chance the team will have a worse record the next season, at least that's what his data suggests. That tells me something - perhaps it is the team's style of football, not so much "luck", that is at play when you start getting 3 or more "net close wins". Say, a run first team with a good D with a coach who gets a woody for having a late field goal lead (in case you didn't realize, I just described the Titans). The only lucky break the Titans had last season was not having to play the Colts starters in week 17 - every other win was basically just a case of good defense not letting the other offense score more.

CJSchneider
08-06-2008, 08:46 AM
Great article, but I could summarize it in one sentence spoken in my best John Madden voice. "If you're really good, you can only go down and if you're really bad, you can only get better an - an - an - an Brett Favre is in my opinion uhhh... the best quarter back that I've ever seen."

Bucs147
08-06-2008, 09:00 AM
I wouldn't agree, as to me the Bills have a better defense and a better runningback than the Bucs, and Houston has a better offense (don't underestimate that unit, trust me) and better front seven than the Bucs.

:eek:

Except for the DL, the Bucs are better at the remaining positions (LB, CB, S). Plus, the Bills DL isn't very good either.

I can understand that you think that Bills are better than Tampa Bay, but to say that they have a better D is pretty foolish.


Except for safeties, the Bears' defense run circles around Tampa's defense at the remaining three levels (DL, LB, CB). It's amazing to me how an incredibly injury-striken season for the Bears' defense can make people forget that.

I agree that the Bears D is better than the Bucs one, but Tampa Bay is way better in offense. Except for maybe Kreutz, the Bears OL simply sucks while the Bucs have a pretty good one. Garcia is better than Grossman. Graham/Dunn/Williams are better than any of the Bears RBs. Both WR squad sucks, but the Bucs have Joey Galloway. At least, the Bears have a terrific TE combinaison, but that's it.

I really don't care about the stats from last year when I see with my own eyes that the situation is such that Tanard Jackson is the player I'd be most concerned with.

True, the Bucs don't have any franchise defensive player as for now. But they have a lot of good players at each spot. Barret Ruud, Ronde Barber, Jermaine Phillips, Tanard Jackson, Cato June, Jovan Haye, Derrick Brooks and Gaines Adams/Greg White are all very good players. Plus, Monte Kiffin is their DC. This is a top 10 defense.

They look like Jags D. Both need to add Pass Rush to become a dominant defense. But they are still very good squad. For the poll, I think that Buffalo, Houston, Washington and Tennessee are weaker team than the Bucs.

By the way, I think that Barrett Ruud, Jermaine Phillips, Ronde Barber and maybe Derrick Brooks or Cato June are better than Tanard Jackson today. However, T-Jax will probably become a regular Pro-Bowler in a few years.

ChezPower4
08-06-2008, 04:03 PM
Bills, young QB and the defense is still up in the air

BlindSite
08-06-2008, 06:00 PM
The Titans can't be this low after their record and how they played last year.

diabsoule
08-06-2008, 06:10 PM
The Titans can't be this low after their record and how they played last year.

That's what I'm thinking.

BeerBaron
08-06-2008, 07:39 PM
Texans < Titans < Bills imo

StrongSide97
08-06-2008, 08:10 PM
I would say the final three teams are Buffalo, Houston and Green Bay.

Now that Green Bay is without Favre, I think they are bound to struggle. At least for Aaron Rodger's first season as the full-time starter. They're not going to go 6-10 or anything, I just don't see a winning season, let alone playoffs for the Packers.

The Texans aren't a bad team, they are just in a really good division. When you have three teams that are capable of playoff births, then being in last place at 7-9 isn't a horrible deal. Gary Kubiak has proven to be a good coach so far, and I think he gets the Texans at 8-8 this season.

I have to give my vote to the Bills. There is still a concern at quarterback. They know who they want to start, but he still has to prove that he is the man to go with. I'm expecting the defense to be inconsistent this season, especially at the defensive line.

My vote is for the Bills

BeerBaron
08-06-2008, 08:15 PM
I would say the final three teams are Buffalo, Houston and Green Bay.

Now that Green Bay is without Favre, I think they are bound to struggle. At least for Aaron Rodger's first season as the full-time starter. They're not going to go 6-10 or anything, I just don't see a winning season, let alone playoffs for the Packers.

The Texans aren't a bad team, they are just in a really good division. When you have three teams that are capable of playoff births, then being in last place at 7-9 isn't a horrible deal. Gary Kubiak has proven to be a good coach so far, and I think he gets the Texans at 8-8 this season.

I have to give my vote to the Bills. There is still a concern at quarterback. They know who they want to start, but he still has to prove that he is the man to go with. I'm expecting the defense to be inconsistent this season, especially at the defensive line.

My vote is for the Bills

I disagree....I think if you match up the Bills to the Texans, the Bills still come out on top. I think Schaub and Edwards actually balance out given the amount of actual starting experience each has and the fact that both missed time with injuries last year. Plus I like Lynch more than anyone the Texans will have running the ball, and I like the Bills receiving corps as a whole better than the Texans. The only spot on offense the Texans have an advantage imo on offense is at TE with Daniels.

On defense, the Bills will be getting a lot of guys back from injuries, especially linebackers. Demeco is a beast but off the top of my head, I can't name for sure who the Texans other starters will be. In terms of the secondaries, I favor the Bills a little more. I like their safeties...prolly about even at CB unless Dunta Robinson is back healthy for the Texans. Texas do have the advantage at DL but I don't think its by too terribly much....

IceKubes
08-06-2008, 10:56 PM
I disagree....I think if you match up the Bills to the Texans, the Bills still come out on top. I think Schaub and Edwards actually balance out given the amount of actual starting experience each has and the fact that both missed time with injuries last year. Plus I like Lynch more than anyone the Texans will have running the ball, and I like the Bills receiving corps as a whole better than the Texans. The only spot on offense the Texans have an advantage imo on offense is at TE with Daniels.

On defense, the Bills will be getting a lot of guys back from injuries, especially linebackers. Demeco is a beast but off the top of my head, I can't name for sure who the Texans other starters will be. In terms of the secondaries, I favor the Bills a little more. I like their safeties...prolly about even at CB unless Dunta Robinson is back healthy for the Texans. Texas do have the advantage at DL but I don't think its by too terribly much....

I gotta disagree with your assessment of the Bills vs. Texans offense. I think Schaub or even Rosenfels if anything happens to Schaub will put up significantly better numbers than Edwards next year. Schaub had over 10% on his completion percentage compared to Edwards as well as 1.7 more yards per attempt. I understand Edwards was a rook but I think Schaub is going to improve quite a bit in his second year as a starter as well.

As far as the wide receiver corps go unless Hardy really makes a big time impact as a rookie I don't see how the Bills are any better than the Texans here. Andre is better than Evans, Kevin Walter quietly caught 65 balls last year as a second option in his first year as a starter and Andre Davis was a great third option. Jacoby Jones should get better and I don't see Josh Reed, Roscoe Parrish and the other Bills receivers doing any better than their Texan counterparts.

Lynch is definitely better than anyone the Texans have at RB but I think the Texans are going to run the ball a lot better than they did last year because of Alex Gibbs and the fact that there will be some speed at the position. Pretty much the top three or four options for the Texans are RB are better than Ron Dayne so even after the inevitable injuries there should be improvement.

The defenses are wild cards for both teams and I'm not really going to give the edge to either but the Texans scored about 120 more points last year than the Bills. Both teams are excellent on special teams. I voted Bills and my next vote would go to the Texans. As much as I wanted to vote for the Titans out of spite I can't until we prove it on the field.

ALD
08-06-2008, 11:05 PM
I gotta disagree with your assessment of the Bills vs. Texans offense. I think Schaub or even Rosenfels if anything happens to Schaub will put up significantly better numbers than Edwards next year. Schaub had over 10% on his completion percentage compared to Edwards as well as 1.7 more yards per attempt. I understand Edwards was a rook but I think Schaub is going to improve quite a bit in his second year as a starter as well.

As far as the wide receiver corps go unless Hardy really makes a big time impact as a rookie I don't see how the Bills are any better than the Texans here. Andre is better than Evans, Kevin Walter quietly caught 65 balls last year as a second option in his first year as a starter and Andre Davis was a great third option. Jacoby Jones should get better and I don't see Josh Reed, Roscoe Parrish and the other Bills receivers doing any better than their Texan counterparts.

Lynch is definitely better than anyone the Texans have at RB but I think the Texans are going to run the ball a lot better than they did last year because of Alex Gibbs and the fact that there will be some speed at the position. Pretty much the top three or four options for the Texans are RB are better than Ron Dayne so even after the inevitable injuries there should be improvement.

The defenses are wild cards for both teams and I'm not really going to give the edge to either but the Texans scored about 120 more points last year than the Bills. Both teams are excellent on special teams. I voted Bills and my next vote would go to the Texans. As much as I wanted to vote for the Titans out of spite I can't until we prove it on the field.

As I've said before Hardy doesn't even need to play all that well to have a huge impact on the spacing other receivers get, simply the threat of somebody coming down with a jumpball is going to change things for the other guys.

While I agree Schaub is a better QB right now than Edwards, you are ignoring the huge impact that buffalo's far superior oline and running game are going to have on the kid. Last season Edwards showed poise, quick decision-making, a quick release and good pocket presence, so I don't expect him to lose many games and that'll be his primary job this season. Schaub is going to have to be the center piece of that offense if they plan on making noise this season.

Texans are good on special teams, but the bills are the best in the NFL.

As you've said the defenses are a toss up, but the bills had a ridiculous amount of injuries last year and kept on finding guys who'd step in and produce, so I like their depth more.

IceKubes
08-06-2008, 11:19 PM
As I've said before Hardy doesn't even need to play all that well to have a huge impact on the spacing other receivers get, simply the threat of somebody coming down with a jumpball is going to change things for the other guys.

While I agree Schaub is a better QB right now than Edwards, you are ignoring the huge impact that buffalo's far superior oline and running game are going to have on the kid. Last season Edwards showed poise, quick decision-making, a quick release and good pocket presence, so I don't expect him to lose many games and that'll be his primary job this season. Schaub is going to have to be the center piece of that offense if they plan on making noise this season.

Texans are good on special teams, but the bills are the best in the NFL.

As you've said the defenses are a toss up, but the bills had a ridiculous amount of injuries last year and kept on finding guys who'd step in and produce, so I like their depth more.

Even with Peters Buffalo does not have a "far superior" o-line. Buffalo rushed for 1800 yards at 4.0 per pop. They scored 8 TDs on the ground and gave up 26 sacks. Houston rushed for 1586 yards at 3.8 yards per rush. They scored 12 TDs on the ground and gave up 22 sacks. Buffalo had Marshawn Lynch and Houston had Ron Dayne. Bottom line is still Houston scored about 380 points last year opposed to Buffalo's 252. With the addition of Gibbs and a couple new starters on the O-line I expect the Texans offense to be significantly better than the Bills this season.

BeerBaron
08-06-2008, 11:21 PM
As I've said before Hardy doesn't even need to play all that well to have a huge impact on the spacing other receivers get, simply the threat of somebody coming down with a jumpball is going to change things for the other guys.

While I agree Schaub is a better QB right now than Edwards, you are ignoring the huge impact that buffalo's far superior oline and running game are going to have on the kid. Last season Edwards showed poise, quick decision-making, a quick release and good pocket presence, so I don't expect him to lose many games and that'll be his primary job this season. Schaub is going to have to be the center piece of that offense if they plan on making noise this season.

Texans are good on special teams, but the bills are the best in the NFL.

As you've said the defenses are a toss up, but the bills had a ridiculous amount of injuries last year and kept on finding guys who'd step in and produce, so I like their depth more.

true that all.

And to the guy before you, lets think about this, Schaub and Edwards both only started a portion of the games last season due to injuries. Schaub has more years of experience but most of that was riding the bench, and I like the Bills supporting cast more. They each have #1's in Andre and Evans, but then I'll take Parrish and Hardy over any other Texans receiver. As previously stated, all Hardy has to do to have a successful rookie campaign is bring down some jump balls in the end zone.

And I really think that Lynch + Bills o-line >>> Any Texans runner + Texans o-line. The closeness of all the other positions on the teams means that still puts the Bills over the top IMO

IceKubes
08-06-2008, 11:35 PM
true that all.

And to the guy before you, lets think about this, Schaub and Edwards both only started a portion of the games last season due to injuries. Schaub has more years of experience but most of that was riding the bench, and I like the Bills supporting cast more. They each have #1's in Andre and Evans, but then I'll take Parrish and Hardy over any other Texans receiver. As previously stated, all Hardy has to do to have a successful rookie campaign is bring down some jump balls in the end zone.

And I really think that Lynch + Bills o-line >>> Any Texans runner + Texans o-line. The closeness of all the other positions on the teams means that still puts the Bills over the top IMO

Fair enough but I will say that I believe if at the end of the year the Bills have a better record than the Texans or are considered a better team etc. it will be because their defense stepped up. I really don't think there is any chance that the Bills offense is more productive next year than the Texans. I'll even go out on a limb a little bit and predict that the Texans run game as a whole will be more productive than the Bills. I'm not hating on the Bills either, I see a lot of similarities in the two teams, I just think that on offense the Texans are currently at where the Bills want to be in a couple years.

TACKLE
08-06-2008, 11:44 PM
texans for me, lack of run game and they just dont excite me much

Alex Gibbs is their O-Line coach. Lack of run game won't be a problem no matter who they have at RB. I'll be surprised if they don't have one of the Top 5-10 rushing games in the league.

ALD
08-07-2008, 11:22 AM
Fair enough but I will say that I believe if at the end of the year the Bills have a better record than the Texans or are considered a better team etc. it will be because their defense stepped up. I really don't think there is any chance that the Bills offense is more productive next year than the Texans. I'll even go out on a limb a little bit and predict that the Texans run game as a whole will be more productive than the Bills. I'm not hating on the Bills either, I see a lot of similarities in the two teams, I just think that on offense the Texans are currently at where the Bills want to be in a couple years.

I'll take pretty much any bet that the Bills rushing attack rakes up more yards and TDs than the Texans, the Bills Oline is a lot better and they have better RBs. You can't really use stats to judge the bills from last year, they had so many injuries and Started the season with JP Losman at QB, basically admitting that they wouldn't be a threat to pass the ball.

Honestly if the bills are where the texans are now in 2 years they'll have gotten worse. The Texans really only have the bills at QB and TE, and QB might be a different story after this season, everywhere else the bills have more talent and their Oline has already gelled whereas houston's got a rookie LT coming in.

PLus the Bills have simply exceptional special teams, meaning they win the field position battle almost every time and that also is a lot of help to a young QB who's still trying not to do too much.

This is just comparing them from a talent stand point, add in schedules and the divisions their in and extremely comfortable saying the bills have a much better shot at the playoffs than the texans.

CJSchneider
08-07-2008, 11:22 AM
This is too close for me to close up and move on just yet.

BeerBaron
08-07-2008, 11:24 AM
This is too close for me to close up and move on just yet.

I think this might be to the point where it starts to bog down because most of the people who vote have already voted.

You could start a new one with just the Texans and Bills since they're the top 2 atm. Make all the Texans voters rehash their votes at least.

ALD
08-07-2008, 11:25 AM
I think this might be to the point where it starts to bog down because most of the people who vote have already voted.

You could start a new one with just the Texans and Bills since they're the top 2 atm. Make all the Texans voters rehash their votes at least.

Maybe the Texans, Titans and Bills since those are clearly the top 3 choices this go around.

BeerBaron
08-07-2008, 11:29 AM
Maybe the Texans, Titans and Bills since those are clearly the top 3 choices this go around.

What I think I would honestly do then is just fill the next 3 real quick by just putting in the Texans, Bills and Titans. kill 3 birds with one stone since they are all a sizeable distance ahead of the others

IceKubes
08-07-2008, 12:52 PM
I'll take pretty much any bet that the Bills rushing attack rakes up more yards and TDs than the Texans, the Bills Oline is a lot better and they have better RBs. You can't really use stats to judge the bills from last year, they had so many injuries and Started the season with JP Losman at QB, basically admitting that they wouldn't be a threat to pass the ball.

Honestly if the bills are where the texans are now in 2 years they'll have gotten worse. The Texans really only have the bills at QB and TE, and QB might be a different story after this season, everywhere else the bills have more talent and their Oline has already gelled whereas houston's got a rookie LT coming in.

PLus the Bills have simply exceptional special teams, meaning they win the field position battle almost every time and that also is a lot of help to a young QB who's still trying not to do too much.

This is just comparing them from a talent stand point, add in schedules and the divisions their in and extremely comfortable saying the bills have a much better shot at the playoffs than the texans.

The Texans had just as many injuries as the Bills had last year including missing Andre Johnson for 7 games which hurt our offense significantly. I'm pretty sure that they had an equal amount of players put on IR so both teams technically led the league in that category. I don't watch the Bills play so the only real way I can judge them are by the numbers. From what you have said about the Texans I'm pretty sure you didn't watch any/much to them last year. Edwards is a good looking young QB but it takes more than 1 year in the NFL for a quarterback to come into his own.

As far as the offense comparisons go I do not think you necessarily overrating the Bills starters but you are definitely almost criminally underrating everyone on the Texans offense. With Andre Johnson healthy last season that was an elite offense and would have put up more than 400 points for the year. Even without him and without the starting QB and RB they came close. Yes there will be a rookie starting left tackle in all likelihood but hes replacing Ephraim Salaam so I don't expect any drop off and honestly he probably slightly outperforms him this year.

Bottom line is that Buffalo put up 15.75pts per game and Houston put up 23.68pts. There is reason to expect improvement from both, not just the Bills, and theres no way that gap is closed this year imo(and will you really be complaining if in two years your offense is putting up about 24 points per game?) You guys may have an easier schedule/division and like I said, if you make the playoffs or do better than the Texans it will be because your defense stepped up and your offense improved enough. As long as Kubiak is the head coach down here the offense is going to run smoothly.