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View Full Version : 4th Annual NFLDC Preseason Rankings: #6


CJSchneider
08-18-2008, 06:51 AM
32. Atlanta Falcons
31. Miami Dolphins
30. San Francisco 49ers
29. Kansas City Chiefs
28. Detroit Lions
27. Oakland Raiders
26. Denver Broncos
25. St. Louis Rams
24. Baltimore Ravens
23. New York Jets
22. Chicago Bears
21. Cincinnati Bengals
20. Carolina Panthers
19. Arizona Cardinals
18. Houston Texans
17. Buffalo Bills
16. Tennessee Titans
15. Tampa Bay Buccaneers
14. Washington Redskins
13. Seattle Seahawks
12. Philadelphia Eagles
11. Green Bay Packers
10. Minnesota Vikings
9. New Orleans Saints
8. Cleveland Browns
7. Pittsburg Steelers


Sorry Steelers fans, that must have been rough. Who will be the next team off the board?

Gay Ork Wang
08-18-2008, 06:56 AM
Cowboys, i believe they will choke in the playoffs like always

CJSchneider
08-18-2008, 07:02 AM
I will agree with the fact that the cowboys are a group of "chokers", but I just remember how lucky the G-men were last year. I don't think they will get the same breaks this year.

Addict
08-18-2008, 07:14 AM
I'm going with the Jags on this one. They edge out the Giants.

Cribbs>Hester
08-18-2008, 07:32 AM
Jacksonville are you kidding me? The improved on their only weakspot by drafting two very stout pass rushers. It will only help every aspect of their defense as well. The running game is not going to faulter and the QB simply does not risk turnover. Jacksonville will pound the run, stop the run and win the turnover battle every time. New York Giants need to go...

eaglesalltheway
08-18-2008, 07:33 AM
Giants, they just don't have what these others do on paper.

Caddy
08-18-2008, 08:04 AM
The next two picks are pretty obvious (Jacks and NY). After that it gets pretty interesting.

Smooth Criminal
08-18-2008, 08:36 AM
Easy pick here with NYG. Jacksonville has a great defense and run game and Garrard is a efficient QB.

Eli and the Giants are to inconsistent for my liking.

Addict
08-18-2008, 08:39 AM
The next two picks are pretty obvious (Jacks and NY). After that it gets pretty interesting.

IMO, it's gonna be

6: Jags/Giants
5: Jags/Giants
4: Cowboys
3. Colts
2: Patriots
1: Chargers

but I'm guessing the Pats will go #1. top 4 is close. But in the end I think SD has the most rounded team.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:41 AM
did you guys know being good on paper doesn't always equall success? the Giants are outstanding where football games are won, but since we don't have the ZOMGZ amazing skill position players or an elite QB, we suck.

and don't give me the "luck" ********. We played well when it counted. Real men and teams make their own luck. We won when it counted.

cj, what "breaks"? having our TE and startingSLB out for the postseason? Bein without our 3rd RB(who did well and got carries last year). Having Corey Webster almost hand Dallas the game by dropping an INT that was literally thron to him? tell me these breaks of which you speak.

Addict
08-18-2008, 08:48 AM
did you guys know being good on paper doesn't always equall success? the Giants are outstanding where football games are won, but since we don't have the ZOMGZ amazing skill position players or an elite QB, we suck.

and don't give me the "luck" ********. We played well when it counted. Real men and teams make their own luck. We won when it counted.

cj, what "breaks"? having our TE and startingSLB out for the postseason? Bein without our 3rd RB(who did well and got carries last year). Having Corey Webster almost hand Dallas the game by dropping an INT that was literally thron to him? tell me these breaks of which you speak.

just relax. Yeah the Giants did well last year, but that doen't mean they're the #1 team just by virtue of winning the SB. It just doesn't work that way. Them repeating is unlikely and the fact their vicotry is generally considered a small miracle does show how the odds were at that point.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:53 AM
just relax. Yeah the Giants did well last year, but that doen't mean they're the #1 team just by virtue of winning the SB. It just doesn't work that way. Them repeating is unlikely and the fact their vicotry is generally considered a small miracle does show how the odds were at that point.

i'm always relaxed :D

I know, and we probably should go within the next 2 or 3 polls, but the hate we get IS pretty crazy.

LonghornsLegend
08-18-2008, 09:22 AM
I know, and we probably should go within the next 2 or 3 polls, but the hate we get IS pretty crazy.

It's not even close to what the Cowboys get, nowhere near it...Just like I have a hard time believing you think were the worst team on that list, even though the only players we lost sucked, and we made valuable additions.


And honestly, we are pretty much going on best team on paper right now, thats all we have to go off of at this point.

BeerBaron
08-18-2008, 09:25 AM
Time for the Giants....they had a nice little run and maybe got the boost that comes from winning the superbowl but I'm wary of letting them become a top 5 elite team right now

CJSchneider
08-18-2008, 09:29 AM
cj, what "breaks"? having our TE and startingSLB out for the postseason? Bein without our 3rd RB(who did well and got carries last year). Having Corey Webster almost hand Dallas the game by dropping an INT that was literally thron to him? tell me these breaks of which you speak.

Go back and watch the G.B. vs N.Y. playoff game and tell me that lady luck did NOT smile on you that day. Im not saying you didn't capitalize on those breaks, but they were there IMO.

keylime_5
08-18-2008, 09:38 AM
Could've went with SD or NYG, I picked the Giants. Definitely not NE,DAL, IND, or JAC yet.

Twiddler
08-18-2008, 10:07 AM
It's the Giants, I'm just not feeling it this year for them. I think too many things fell in line for them to make the Super Bowl run last year. Still a good team, but not #6 overall.

P.S. Scottyboy, please leave my post alone. I don't feel like getting into an argument over the Giants, really, I don't. This is just my opinion and I have every right to have it. Please, leave it alone.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 10:46 AM
Go back and watch the G.B. vs N.Y. playoff game and tell me that lady luck did NOT smile on you that day. Im not saying you didn't capitalize on those breaks, but they were there IMO.

you mean the 2 missed FG's by Tynes? You mean Webster falling down and sucking letting Driver get the huge TD? I just don't get it. Sure we got lucky recovering RW's fumble, but that's about it...

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 10:47 AM
It's not even close to what the Cowboys get, nowhere near it...Just like I have a hard time believing you think were the worst team on that list, even though the only players we lost sucked, and we made valuable additions.


And honestly, we are pretty much going on best team on paper right now, thats all we have to go off of at this point.

win a playoff game, and I'll pity you for the hate you get...

I meant to vote for SD, but oh well, you guys aren't getting voted off here anyway

Michigan
08-18-2008, 11:22 AM
Out of the 6 remaining teams, I think San Diego is the most likely to choke in the playoffs.

CC.SD
08-18-2008, 11:22 AM
I'm going Jags, but it's not cause of any particular hate; I just don't think they are quite dynamic enough on offense between Garrard playing it safe and a sub-par receiving corps. Obviously I love their running game and D (their back end still has something to prove though) but I just can't sign off on a team that isn't scary at all through the air as a Top 5 team.

diabsoule
08-18-2008, 11:42 AM
I voted Jacksonville. I think they have way way too many question marks than the Giants, although the G-Men have their fair share.

keylime_5
08-18-2008, 11:53 AM
Well the Jags were probably the 2nd best team in the league towards the end of last year other than new England, let's see if they can carry it on into 2008. Okay, 3rd best team, New York won the super bowl.

LonghornsLegend
08-18-2008, 12:10 PM
win a playoff game, and I'll pity you for the hate you get...

I meant to vote for SD, but oh well, you guys aren't getting voted off here anyway

That argument is useless and lame, I know your young but the NFL hasn't been around for 7 years, its been alot longer, and fail to mention that majority of the drought happened after Aikman retired and we were looking for a future QB...Unless you think Peyton came into the NFL tearing it up his first 2 playoff experiences I don't see your point.


Your whole argument seems to be that the Giants won the super bowl again, so that must make them the best team this year...I don't think its a long shot for them to win and I certianly don't 'hate' the Giants, but for all your claiming the Giants get 'hated on', I'd like for you to explain how Dallas is the worst team on this list, other then the fact that you despise Dallas.

CC.SD
08-18-2008, 12:38 PM
Well the Jags were probably the 2nd best team in the league towards the end of last year other than new England, let's see if they can carry it on into 2008. Okay, 3rd best team, New York won the super bowl.

The Bolts won 8 in a row down the stretch before losing to 17-0 NE, in the 4th quarter, without LT/Gates/most of Rivers. Just sayin.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 12:58 PM
That argument is useless and lame, I know your young but the NFL hasn't been around for 7 years, its been alot longer, and fail to mention that majority of the drought happened after Aikman retired and we were looking for a future QB...Unless you think Peyton came into the NFL tearing it up his first 2 playoff experiences I don't see your point.


Your whole argument seems to be that the Giants won the super bowl again, so that must make them the best team this year...I don't think its a long shot for them to win and I certianly don't 'hate' the Giants, but for all your claiming the Giants get 'hated on', I'd like for you to explain how Dallas is the worst team on this list, other then the fact that you despise Dallas.

the Cowboys locker room is going to be a mess. I'm not alone(if you've read some of the "truths" threads) thinking Dallas won't be as amazing, dominant, or even as good asmany are predicting or depicting.

You deserve some of this so called "hate" Dallas is getting. How many times do you expect everyone to drool over your talent, have you lose in the playoffs and still have you pegged as the best team the next year? It's happened basically 2 years in a row with MANY people having you the no doubt favorite in the NFC. I don't know where you're getting the idea everyone's "hating" on you as they are the Giants.

Plus, the whole Dallas cockiness factor, TO, Romo, "americas team" will lead to hate.

And don't give me the young crap. You haven't won in the playoffs in what, a decade?

Addict
08-18-2008, 01:22 PM
yeeee-haaaaah

homer bash fest!

Dam8610
08-18-2008, 01:23 PM
Jacksonville are you kidding me? The improved on their only weakspot by drafting two very stout pass rushers. It will only help every aspect of their defense as well. The running game is not going to faulter and the QB simply does not risk turnover. Jacksonville will pound the run, stop the run and win the turnover battle every time. New York Giants need to go...

One of which (the "very stout pass rushers") isn't in camp and runs as fast as Peyton Manning. Then there's the hole left by Marcus Stroud, it's not as huge as it might've been in years past, but it's still pretty big. Then there's the lack of a true #2 WR, let alone a #1. Then there's the transition of Brian Williams, as well as the unknown that is Drayton Florence's performance. Then there's the loss of C Brad Meester for a long period of time. The Giants just won a title and return most of that team, it should be rated a top 5 team in the NFL.

Dam8610
08-18-2008, 01:27 PM
Time for the Giants....they had a nice little run and maybe got the boost that comes from winning the superbowl but I'm wary of letting them become a top 5 elite team right now

Top 5 and elite aren't necessarily synonymous, especially in today's NFL.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 01:42 PM
yeeee-haaaaah

homer bash fest!

haha perhaps, that's what your thread is for.

I willadmit, I'm probably wrong. The giants do probably deserve to now or within the next 2 or 3. I believe Dallas is a good team, but a rocky start could very easily lead to turmoil there.

then again, they could also easily win 12+ games.

I for one don't have faith in SD, and would perhaps vote them here...

diabsoule
08-18-2008, 01:51 PM
I think the G-Men won this one.... I don't see the Jags catching up to them.

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 02:14 PM
I honestly can't believe that NY made it this far. They are more in the 9-11 range imo.

As for Jacksonville....I really am having a hard time understanding all the love they get here. I would put Pittsburgh above them, without a doubt, and I would also consider having the GB, Minny, and Philly (along with Jax, my personal 6-9 teams) trio above them as well. Hell, Cleveland has nearly as much of a stake to claim as they do. I like how everyone is harping on Dallas' lack of playoff success, but the Jags haven't done much better. The playoff win they had last season was marginal and controversial at best, and they hadn't won jack before that. I just feel like they are being overrated. For a team without a single good WR on their roster, along with no proven pass rusher, I just don't think they can hang with the big boys of the league.

Which is not to say I don't like them, or that I don't think they COULD be a top 5 team. I just don't think they have done enough to warrant the ranking.


I still don't get how the Packers are not even considered to be a top 10 team. They were terrific last year, and it wasnt only because of Brett Favre. They were legitimately good defensively on every level. They had an emerging RB who looks to have star quality. Their WR corps is maybe the most underrated in the league. I guess it might all be for naught if Aaron Rodgers sucks ass, but we've seen enough to be sure that he'll be at least average. If he is (at least average), then I see no less than 11 wins for them.

yourfavestoner
08-18-2008, 02:33 PM
As a Jags fan, I'm voting for the Jaguars. We had a nice season last year, but at this point, probably don't deserve to be ranked higher than any of the teams still left. At this point, you can make a pretty compelling argument for or against any of the teams left.

I still don't know how people say the Steelers are better than us, though, when we've beaten them, like, 5 times in a row now...

bigbluedefense
08-18-2008, 02:40 PM
Honestly, and don't get me wrong i like the Jaguars, but i have no idea how theyve warranted so much offseason hype. To the point where theyre ranked by many as the 4th best team in the league?

Really? how?

yes they bolstered their pass rush, but they still have some question marks on that team. on paper, theyre probably the least impressive team left on this list.

now granted, i for one hate on paper comparisons, but if we're gonna do them, we might as well not deviate from it. i don't see how they can be ranked so high by so many. prove it first.

same goes with Dallas. prove it first. i personally think that Dallas has just as good of a chance as anybody, in fact, its fair to make them the favorites out of the NFC, but i also felt very confident in the Giants last year. I still predicted 8-8 for the Giants last year. Why? Bc you have to prove it first.

Dallas hasn't proved it yet. Prove it before you pencil yourself into the SB. According to Dallas players, don't even play the season. Theyre already in the SB. Its good to be confident, but also understand the bulletin board material it provides every one else. If Dallas doesn't win a playoff game this year, i don't want to hear anything about them next year.

eaglesfan_45
08-18-2008, 02:43 PM
I'm going to change my tune right now-

Giants > Jaguars

The Jaguars are learning a new system that takes a while to learn (ask the Redskins) and they really struggled with it against the Dolphins of all teams. I like the Jaguars but I really just don't see it this year.

bigbluedefense
08-18-2008, 02:52 PM
just reading through this thread real quickly, im not buying the Dallas drop off though.

Even if they do drop off, theyre still making the playoffs. Theyre too explosive on offense for it not to happen.

They really have 3 major concerns coming into this season.

1. health (same as everyone, but this team lacks depth at key positions, if they get hurt in the wrong position, the season becomes very different).
2. dline - let's be honest, that dline isn't very good. Ratliff is a solid NT, but better at DE, and Canty while solid, ive personally felt was overrated. Behind those 2, they have some serious depth issues.
3. safety situation - we all know they have CBs, but theres a serious problem at safety. Hamlin is a great safety, but more of a SS than a FS. their SS situation is just as terrible as the Giants. All it takes is one duck on the field to lose the game. I have the same concern for the Giants (our SS).

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 02:56 PM
I honestly can't believe that NY made it this far. They are more in the 9-11 range imo.

As for Jacksonville....I really am having a hard time understanding all the love they get here. I would put Pittsburgh above them, without a doubt, and I would also consider having the GB, Minny, and Philly (along with Jax, my personal 6-9 teams) trio above them as well. Hell, Cleveland has nearly as much of a stake to claim as they do. I like how everyone is harping on Dallas' lack of playoff success, but the Jags haven't done much better. The playoff win they had last season was marginal and controversial at best, and they hadn't won jack before that. I just feel like they are being overrated. For a team without a single good WR on their roster, along with no proven pass rusher, I just don't think they can hang with the big boys of the league.

Which is not to say I don't like them, or that I don't think they COULD be a top 5 team. I just don't think they have done enough to warrant the ranking.


I still don't get how the Packers are not even considered to be a top 10 team. They were terrific last year, and it wasnt only because of Brett Favre. They were legitimately good defensively on every level. They had an emerging RB who looks to have star quality. Their WR corps is maybe the most underrated in the league. I guess it might all be for naught if Aaron Rodgers sucks ass, but we've seen enough to be sure that he'll be at least average. If he is (at least average), then I see no less than 11 wins for them.

so you think a team that just lost is HOF QB and is going into the season with a guy who's never started before should be higher than the defending Super Bowl champs?

*sigh*

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 02:56 PM
Honestly, and don't get me wrong i like the Jaguars, but i have no idea how theyve warranted so much offseason hype. To the point where theyre ranked by many as the 4th best team in the league?

Really? how?

yes they bolstered their pass rush, but they still have some question marks on that team. on paper, theyre probably the least impressive team left on this list.

now granted, i for one hate on paper comparisons, but if we're gonna do them, we might as well not deviate from it. i don't see how they can be ranked so high by so many. prove it first.

same goes with Dallas. prove it first. i personally think that Dallas has just as good of a chance as anybody, in fact, its fair to make them the favorites out of the NFC, but i also felt very confident in the Giants last year. I still predicted 8-8 for the Giants last year. Why? Bc you have to prove it first.

Dallas hasn't proved it yet. Prove it before you pencil yourself into the SB. According to Dallas players, don't even play the season. Theyre already in the SB. Its good to be confident, but also understand the bulletin board material it provides every one else. If Dallas doesn't win a playoff game this year, i don't want to hear anything about them next year.


I think we should clarify something.

Are we talking about respect, or are we talking about future performance? Because, in all honesty, "proving it" has very little to do with what is going to happen in the future.

If I was a New England fan in July of 2001 and I decided that I was going to start smack talking my ass off on a board like this one, and I told everyone that my team was going to dominate the league for the next 4 seasons and become the team of the decade; or that we had a HOF QB on the roster who was going to put all other QBs in the history of the league to shame yadda yadda yadda (you get the point)....would that make me delusional?

No, that would make me prophetic, and all the people that told me I was wrong and was going to be shown a fool would have to eat crow from my ass for years to come, no?

What's the point?

The point is that what is going to happen is going to happen. When we talk about how good a team is and how we think it will perform in the coming days, months, and years, it is because of the quality of football players it has on the roster. THAT is ultimately what decides how good a football team is, not the trophies in the case or the rings on the fingers. Football players. When I talk about a team and what I expect out of them during the upcoming season, that's what matters to me, because THAT is what decides games: not the outcomes of previous games, but the quality of players a team has on it.





Now, if we're talking about respect, or bragging rights, or wtfever we're talking about, fine. I agree with your thesis. Show me, and then I'll respect you. Sure. Great.

But respect is lost and earned every year, and all the respect in the world won't buy you a "W" when the team across from you is simply better at the game of football.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 02:57 PM
same goes with Dallas. prove it first. i personally think that Dallas has just as good of a chance as anybody, in fact, its fair to make them the favorites out of the NFC, but i also felt very confident in the Giants last year. I still predicted 8-8 for the Giants last year. Why? Bc you have to prove it first.

Dallas hasn't proved it yet. Prove it before you pencil yourself into the SB. According to Dallas players, don't even play the season. Theyre already in the SB. Its good to be confident, but also understand the bulletin board material it provides every one else. If Dallas doesn't win a playoff game this year, i don't want to hear anything about them next year.

this is my only argument against Dallas. I feel exactly the same way.

that and with that locker room, a rocky start could be disasterous for that team.

Hines
08-18-2008, 03:00 PM
For god ******* sake, its PITTSBURGH. But I voted for the Giants because I believe they are solid, but not a top 5 team IMO.

Number 10
08-18-2008, 03:04 PM
No quarrels with the Giants get voted here, although I'm much more skeptical about the Jags.

You'll hear me say it every time I talk about a comparison between teams...and I think it's all about the strength in the trenches. The Jags defensive line loses Stroud and McCray and are hoping a couple of rooks can step up big time without hitting the end of season wall most rookie D-linemen hit. Offensively their line is less than dominant, but good enough to get the job done.

The Giants on the other hand still have a top 5 at worst pass rush in the NFL and an offensive line that hosts 3 pro-bowl alternates and has been together for 3+ years now.

There is no right answer here but neither team made themselves that much better this offseason and the Giants are coming off a Super Bowl victory. That has to count for something, even to the biggest of haters.

bigbluedefense
08-18-2008, 03:05 PM
I think we should clarify something.

Are we talking about respect, or are we talking about future performance? Because, in all honesty, "proving it" has very little to do with what is going to happen in the future.

If I was a New England fan in July of 2001 and I decided that I was going to start smack talking my ass off on a board like this one, and I told everyone that my team was going to dominate the league for the next 4 seasons and become the team of the decade; or that we had a HOF QB on the roster who was going to put all other QBs in the history of the league to shame yadda yadda yadda (you get the point)....would that make me delusional?

No, that would make me prophetic, and all the people that told me I was wrong and was going to be shown a fool would have to eat crow from my ass for years to come, no?

What's the point?

The point is that what is going to happen is going to happen. When we talk about how good a team is and how we think it will perform in the coming days, months, and years, it is because of the quality of football players it has on the roster. THAT is ultimately what decides how good a football team is, not the trophies in the case or the rings on the fingers. Football players. When I talk about a team and what I expect out of them during the upcoming season, that's what matters to me, because THAT is what decides games: not the outcomes of previous games, but the quality of players a team has on it.





Now, if we're talking about respect, or bragging rights, or wtfever we're talking about, fine. I agree with your thesis. Show me, and then I'll respect you. Sure. Great.

But respect is lost and earned every year, and all the respect in the world won't buy you a "W" when the team across from you is simply better at the game of football.

i hear you on that. rankings and respect do kind of go hand in hand if you think about it.

its not just about the players though. i learned that during last season, its so much more than that. which is why i respect the Pats dynasty more than any other dynasty we've seen. in today's game, its so much more than that bc of the near equal level of talent across the board. coaching, lockerroom chemistry, players, luck, leadership, they all equate into a great season. its not just about talent.

thats why Zach Thomas was so huge for you guys.

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 03:05 PM
so you think a team that just lost is HOF QB and is going into the season with a guy who's never started before should be higher than the defending Super Bowl champs?

*sigh*

I just think that GB has a better team. Worst case scenario is that Rodgers is exactly what Eli has been for the last 3 years: inconsistent and maddening, sometimes spectacular, but mostly good enough to get by with a good cast around him. I think its fair to assume at least that from him.

Beyond that, I see the Pack as being better at nearly every other position on the team. OL is roughly equal (based on last season, but the early troubles they've had in the preseason could make me change my tune if they're not resolved soon), but they have better TEs, better WRs, as good or better DL all around (more solid in the middle, and making up in run defense what they lack in pass rush), better LBs, better DBs. Giants have a better RB corps, but I like the Pack's #1 RB better than I like Jacobs, so that evens it out there.

I just think the Packers are a really good team. I think the Giants are pretty good, as well, just not as good as the Pack.

Will you explain to me how a Lombardi in the trophy case should impact their record? Did it grant the Steelers a few wins in 2006? What about the Pats in 2002? Or the Ravens in 2001? Or the Pats in 2005? Need I go on?

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 03:18 PM
i hear you on that. rankings and respect do kind of go hand in hand if you think about it.

its not just about the players though. i learned that during last season, its so much more than that. which is why i respect the Pats dynasty more than any other dynasty we've seen. in today's game, its so much more than that bc of the near equal level of talent across the board. coaching, lockerroom chemistry, players, luck, leadership, they all equate into a great season. its not just about talent.

thats why Zach Thomas was so huge for you guys.

That's worth considering, I agree, but I don't think its the bankable entity you make it out to be.

For example, the Pats were just as cohesive and unselfish in 2005 as in 03 and 04, and yet it didn't stop them from getting pounded several times that year, or prevent them from getting whipped by Denver in the playoffs.

Similarly, of all the teams that the Pats have fielded, I'm pretty sure that most people would say that 2007 was the best version....and yet it failed to win the Super Bowl.

Now, that might play into your point, being that the most talented, the most dominant and most electrifying team they have ever had ultimately failed where their other teams succeeded. So, it must be these intangibles at work, right?

Wrong. And here's why:

Humans.


We're humans, and our behaviour will always be unpredictable. All manner of things are brought into play when a team of 53 guys gets together and plays 53 other guys in the elements. Sometimes, its just a matter of an unlikely outcome hitting at a crucial moment. Like a special teams player who barely made the team coming up with the greatest catch in Super Bowl history to topple the only 16-0 team ever. Things happen.

I don't think we should confuse intangibles like chemistry, intelligence, instincts and cohesion with simple unlikely outcomes.

And even with all those immeasurable qualities behind you, at the end of the day you still better be able to play the game. When I look at the Giants, I really do see another version of the 2002 Pats.

That's just the way it looks from where I'm standing.

bigbluedefense
08-18-2008, 03:34 PM
That's worth considering, I agree, but I don't think its the bankable entity you make it out to be.

For example, the Pats were just as cohesive and unselfish in 2005 as in 03 and 04, and yet it didn't stop them from getting pounded several times that year, or prevent them from getting whipped by Denver in the playoffs.

Similarly, of all the teams that the Pats have fielded, I'm pretty sure that most people would say that 2007 was the best version....and yet it failed to win the Super Bowl.

Now, that might play into your point, being that the most talented, the most dominant and most electrifying team they have ever had ultimately failed where their other teams succeeded. So, it must be these intangibles at work, right?

Wrong. And here's why:

Humans.


We're humans, and our behaviour will always be unpredictable. All manner of things are brought into play when a team of 53 guys gets together and plays 53 other guys in the elements. Sometimes, its just a matter of an unlikely outcome hitting at a crucial moment. Like a special teams player who barely made the team coming up with the greatest catch in Super Bowl history to topple the only 16-0 team ever. Things happen.

I don't think we should confuse intangibles like chemistry, intelligence, instincts and cohesion with simple unlikely outcomes.

And even with all those immeasurable qualities behind you, at the end of the day you still better be able to play the game. When I look at the Giants, I really do see another version of the 2002 Pats.

That's just the way it looks from where I'm standing.

its never a sure thing, but i do believe that we can measure intangibles in some way.

lets go back to the luck thing for a second (just as an example). while i do believe to win it all you need a lot of luck on your side, i also believe the old football saying "you make your own luck". example, the game against the Chargers 2 years ago when the Pats stripped the ball after SD picked off Brady for what seemed to be the icing on the cake for the Chargers. That wasn't luck, that was skill, skill that resulted from a player who was conditioned to have awareness on the field at all times, especially in bad times, and do the right thing on that play. Contrarily, SD, a team not experienced or conditioned into being great in those situations, makes the error. That wasn't a lucky play, that was a great heads up play that NE earned. They know how to make the right play at the right time. And thats a learned behavior. they made their own luck.

its true, luck can be a conditioned entity. i think its conditioned through practice, practice of winning close games. the pats are the "luckiest" team in the league the past 6 years or so, theyre also the best team in the league at winning the close game. some teams are better in those situations than others, and i think we can make an educated guess as to who those teams are based on prior experiences, so its not entirely random like human nature will lead you to believe.

that comes from experience, smarts, mental toughness, and of course talent. but in general, you can say that the mentally tough teams are better at handling adversity than the teams with too many personalities. and that ties in with the Pats, and their preference for leadership, smarts and a blue collar attitude over measurables.

of course talent supercedes any other variable in the equation, but once we get into this area of rankings, when teams are so even its difficult to separate them, i think looking at these nonequatable variables is something to consider.

im not saying its a certain variable that is always right, but it does have its merits to it.

i really like your point on human nature, that is also true.

sorry for the rambling lol.

EDIT: And as for this year's Pats team, the problem was they became what they were accustomed to beating: an arrogant team. Even then, look back at that SB, and see what they did in clutch situations. Brady brings them down the field for what should have been the game winning drive, but was overshadowed by Eli's drive. Even then, Brady almost hits Moss for a bomb pass TD on 3rd down in the final seconds of the game, a play that should have never even been remotely possible, they almost pulled off the impossible. Which is why this entity is not 100% concrete, but still can give us somewhat predictable assumptions of the future.

Addict
08-18-2008, 03:45 PM
Jags are making a comeback!

yourfavestoner
08-18-2008, 04:56 PM
You guys know that I'm not a homer, so I'd really like to stress the point that losing Marcus Stroud isn't the big blow that people are making it out to be. He's missed 12 games over the past two seasons and was never the same after messing his ankles up. Truth be told, the defense (especially the run defense) has been much better during the times that Stroud was out and when Rob Meier was in.

And BBD, you're spot on concerning the Giants' SS position. Sammy Knight is solid against the run and has good instincts in coverage, but he really, really, really struggles against athletic tight ends, which is going to be a huge problem in the NFC East.

Cribbs>Hester
08-18-2008, 05:11 PM
You guys know that I'm not a homer, so I'd really like to stress the point that losing Marcus Stroud isn't the big blow that people are making it out to be. He's missed 12 games over the past two seasons and was never the same after messing his ankles up. Truth be told, the defense (especially the run defense) has been much better during the times that Stroud was out and when Rob Meier was in.

And BBD, you're spot on concerning the Giants' SS position. Sammy Knight is solid against the run and has good instincts in coverage, but he really, really, really struggles against athletic tight ends, which is going to be a huge problem in the NFC East.

and hasn't Tony McDaniel been looking very good this summer? I've been a fan of his for awhile and I remember reading something about him being very hard to block this training camp.

Also WTF is Derrick Harvey going to get his butt signed, and is Mike Peterson finally going to stay healthy?

princefielder28
08-18-2008, 05:37 PM
The G-Men have lasted long enough...time to vote for the NFL's best

yourfavestoner
08-18-2008, 05:43 PM
and hasn't Tony McDaniel been looking very good this summer? I've been a fan of his for awhile and I remember reading something about him being very hard to block this training camp.

Also WTF is Derrick Harvey going to get his butt signed, and is Mike Peterson finally going to stay healthy?

I can't say because I haven't seen it firsthand, but from what I've read, Tony McDaniel has been damn near unblockable. He is literally Marcus Stroud's cloned brother. He'll be a big part of the rotation. How much he plays will be entirely up to him and how disciplined he is with his technique.

And Harvey is going to sign sooner or later. The reason why he hasn't gotten signed can pretty much be attributed to the New York Jets. They signed Gholston to a 56% increase over last year's number six pick (an absolutely insane raise), effectively raising the price and cost for all the draft picks under him. Meanwhile, the Jags have been adamant in their stance of slotting Harvey to a contract of around 10% higher than last year's number eight draft pick. What Harvey doesn't realize is that the longer he holds out, the more money he is going to lose, because he isn't going to hit as many escalators and incentives in his contract.

Smooth Criminal
08-18-2008, 05:45 PM
Scariest part of this thread to me, the Steelers play every team left. They landed the most brutal schedule I've ever seen.

Smooth Criminal
08-18-2008, 05:46 PM
The only person that makes money from a holdout is the agent.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 05:58 PM
The G-Men have lasted long enough...time to vote for the NFL's best

i agree it's probably time for us to go, but aren't the NFL's best the champs? just wondering...

Geo
08-18-2008, 06:01 PM
The Giants work best as underdogs anyways. :p

Twiddler
08-18-2008, 06:02 PM
i agree it's probably time for us to go, but aren't the NFL's best the champs? just wondering...

You won the Super Bowl LAST YEAR. I repeat, LAST YEAR. As of this year, you haven't proven anything yet. Sorry man, just give it up. What you guys did last year was awesome and I really respected your team overall but quit it already.

keylime_5
08-18-2008, 06:07 PM
Agreed about Jax, Meier is an unknown to most of the nation compared to Stroud but he is a very good player and makes that D-Line still very good. Even with Harvey holding out they have Groves to improve that pass rush, and with Florence in at corner they now have Brian Williams at SS - a role that he should excel at, at least in covering TEs and receivers downfield.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 06:08 PM
You won the Super Bowl LAST YEAR. I repeat, LAST YEAR. As of this year, you haven't proven anything yet. Sorry man, just give it up. What you guys did last year was awesome and I really respected your team overall but quit it already.

aren't we the champs, the best, until someone de-thrones us?

and geo, I know. **** it, lets just put the Giants at 20 something like last year! ;)

Twiddler
08-18-2008, 06:16 PM
aren't we the champs, the best, until someone de-thrones us?

and geo, I know. **** it, lets just put the Giants at 20 something like last year! ;)

If that makes you feel all better inside then yeah, you're the champs! But really, nobody cares that you guys won it last year. This is a new year and nothing that happened last year will help you win games this year. And lets be honest, you weren't even the best last year so that really won't help you in being the best this year.

yourfavestoner
08-18-2008, 06:19 PM
If what you did yesterday still looks good, then it means you haven't done **** today.

yodabear
08-18-2008, 06:23 PM
6. Giants
5. Jags
4. Colts
3. Pats
2. Cowboys
1. Chargers

Thats how I have it, GOOD ******* DAY!

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 06:24 PM
If what you did yesterday still looks good, then it means you haven't done **** today.

oh i know, we shouldn't move on. I know we belong getting voted here, but pf28 said "onto the NFL's best" I'm pretty sure we are the best, since nobody's dethroned us. but whatevz.

yodabear
08-18-2008, 06:26 PM
BTW, I think the Steelers are #3, but oh well......but with the teams remaining I think thats the way it shall be.

Twiddler
08-18-2008, 06:32 PM
I'm pretty sure we are the best, since nobody's dethroned us. but whatevz.

Are you serious?

The Unseen
08-18-2008, 06:38 PM
Jags seem to be consensus #5. that's coo.

I agree that we have too many questions to be #5. Not to mention the division. The Texans scare me a bit, and it's hard to envision two Top 5 teams in the same division. There has to be atleast some separation.

BTW, word on the street (meaning Pete Prisco) is that Harvey signs by tomorrow.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 06:38 PM
Are you serious?

are we not the defending champions? Do we not still have the title of "NFL Champs" as of now? We are still the reigning champs(champions means "the best") and will be until Super Bowl 43.

does that make us the most talented team for this upcoming season? no. But we're still "the champs" until de-throned come next february(or january, whatever)

Does that mean we should automatically be #1 here? not at all.

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 07:06 PM
Ever heard of the term "an empty title"?




Use where applicable.

CC.SD
08-18-2008, 07:21 PM
Agreed about Jax, Meier is an unknown to most of the nation compared to Stroud but he is a very good player and makes that D-Line still very good. Even with Harvey holding out they have Groves to improve that pass rush, and with Florence in at corner they now have Brian Williams at SS - a role that he should excel at, at least in covering TEs and receivers downfield.

Florence is no upgrade. Honestly the guy makes a ton of mental mistakes and most of Charger fandom wasn't exactly sorry to see him go. I do like the idea of Williams at SS though, I like his style of play, from what little I've seen of him.

Also, there is a difference people, between putting together a 2008 power list (aka, no Giants in the top 5) and saying their title is "empty." WTF? I think if you beat an 18-0 team in the Super Bowl, your title is pretty much eternal.

DMWSackMachine
08-18-2008, 07:43 PM
Um, not if you understand what is meant by that statement in the first place.

The term "an empty title" is used to refer to someone who is in a position of deference/power/prestige but who doesn't enjoy the real world, actual effects that the term would imply. In this case "reigning world champions"--which would normally suggest the highest quality ______ that the industry has to offer--only means that they did something really special in the past, and does not suggest the current status of "world's best team at the game of football".

Get it that time?

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 07:47 PM
Um, not if you understand what is meant by that statement in the first place.

The term "an empty title" is used to refer to someone who is in a position of deference/power/prestige but who doesn't enjoy the real world, actual effects that the term would imply. In this case "reigning world champions"--which would normally suggest the highest quality ______ that the industry has to offer--only means that they did something really special in the past, and does not suggest the current status of "world's best team at the game of football".

Get it that time?

well whatever you think is fine. I've said the Giants belong here in the next vote or so; but are currently the champs until dethroned...

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 07:48 PM
are we not the defending champions? Do we not still have the title of "NFL Champs" as of now? We are still the reigning champs(champions means "the best") and will be until Super Bowl 43.

does that make us the most talented team for this upcoming season? no. But we're still "the champs" until de-throned come next february(or january, whatever)

Does that mean we should automatically be #1 here? not at all.

You have the title of NFL Champs by default, seeing as there is still a year to be played out before the vacancy is filled in.

Using your logic, the Giants can go 0-16, and a week before the Superbowl is played, they'll technically still be the reigning "champs", and by your definition, "champs" means best, so would you still be the best team in the league?

You won it last year. It's history now. Like someone said earlier, the Giants winning it last year will have about as little of an impact as possible on this years outcome, aside from playoff experience. That's it.

diabsoule
08-18-2008, 07:48 PM
I think we can move on to whose 4th best since it's obvious the Jags will take the 5th spot.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 07:53 PM
You have the title of NFL Champs by default, seeing as there is still a year to be played out before the vacancy is filled in.

Using your logic, the Giants can go 0-16, and a week before the Superbowl is played, they'll technically still be the reigning "champs", and by your definition, "champs" means best, so would you still be the best team in the league?

You won it last year. It's history now. Like someone said earlier, the Giants winning it last year will have about as little of an impact as possible on this years outcome, aside from playoff experience. That's it.

that playoff experience is pretty important.

It also built Eli's confidence up astronomically.

BUT we will still be "the champs" until the next Super Bowl is won. The best are the winners, that's how I view it, and how I always have. The best team next year will be crowned in super bowl 43.

THe Giants belong here. This is where we belong, talent wise. Is that settled? The champs debate doesn't belong here, lets just move to #4

and you can't talk about super bowls, you killed my super bowl draft...

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 07:55 PM
that playoff experience is pretty important.

It also built Eli's confidence up astronomically.

BUT we will still be "the champs" until the next Super Bowl is won. The best are the winners, that's how I view it, and how I always have. The best team next year will be crowned in super bowl 43.

THe Giants belong here. This is where we belong, talent wise. Is that settled? The champs debate doesn't belong here, lets just move to #4

and you can't talk about super bowls, you killed my super bowl draft...

You still didn't answer my question.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 07:58 PM
You still didn't answer my question.

we wouldn't be the best in terms of talent, but we'd be the reigning champs and titled and be the best, yes

but 0-16? come on, now you're just grasping at straws with hypothetical

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:07 PM
we wouldn't be the best in terms of talent, but we'd be the reigning champs and titled and be the best, yes

but 0-16? come on, now you're just grasping at straws with hypothetical

I explained it that way to point out the fact that your statement of Giants=Champs, Champs=Best, therefore Giants=Best is wrong.

It's logically incorrect.

LonghornsLegend
08-18-2008, 08:09 PM
the Cowboys locker room is going to be a mess. I'm not alone(if you've read some of the "truths" threads) thinking Dallas won't be as amazing, dominant, or even as good asmany are predicting or depicting.

You deserve some of this so called "hate" Dallas is getting. How many times do you expect everyone to drool over your talent, have you lose in the playoffs and still have you pegged as the best team the next year? It's happened basically 2 years in a row with MANY people having you the no doubt favorite in the NFC. I don't know where you're getting the idea everyone's "hating" on you as they are the Giants.

Plus, the whole Dallas cockiness factor, TO, Romo, "americas team" will lead to hate.

And don't give me the young crap. You haven't won in the playoffs in what, a decade?



Again, if you don't have anything relevant to say other then "the Cowboys locker room is going to be a mess" then its better to not even post that crap, I don't have a problem with the Giants but you can't even talk about another NFC east team without being biased, its painfully obvious all the way through this thread.


So I'm guessing the addition of Zach Thomas and Felix Jones is going to tear the locker room apart huh? The one that was torn apart last year huh? Please don't tell me Adam Jones because how bad of a locker room cancer was he in Tenn?


We made a few key upgrades this season, the fact that you say things that cannot be backed up by anything relevant like "the locker room will be a mess" tells me you need something to throw out in the dark so you can always be 'right'...We all understand now the Giants are zzzsuperzzz, they won the super bowl with Eli so since he's coming back obviously that means he will win it again, and all the other NFC east teams just don't stack up to the Giants.


And for the record, don't assume I think my team should be #1 on paper, for the record:

1. New England
2. Indianapolis
3. San Diego
4. Dallas


But that doesn't bother me as much as you see, because this is just a pre-season ranking, and its sad that it gets you this fired up...The main reason for the Giants run was not getting enough respect, and being the under dog all playoffs, so why do you care so much that your team gets "respected"? Who cares, don't get any respect and win another one, isn't that better then praising you all year and then losing at the end of the year?

jballa838
08-18-2008, 08:09 PM
Way I see the top 6:
6. NYG - Secondary, OLine are not as elite as needed to be higher.
5. Jacksonville - Have hardly any deep pass game, but they don't need it because they are the best at what they do.
4. Dallas Cowboys: WR Corps is thinning, run game will take a hit, and defensively are good not great. Secondary, QB, and OLine are top notch.
3. Indianapolis Colts: Harrison may be running out of steam, no Freeney will hurt, but defense is great and everyone of their players fit their scheme.
2. New England Patriots: See what everyone said going into last year. Older Defense, lack of Stallworth hurts a lot IMO, as does loss of Asante Samuel, top 3 corner in the league.
1. San Diego SuperChargers: Top RB and TE in the league hands down. Rivers is more than managable at the QB spot and Line is spectacular. Lorenzo Neal is one of the best FBs in the game, and their defense is the best D in the league, hands down.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:15 PM
Again, if you don't have anything relevant to say other then "the Cowboys locker room is going to be a mess" then its better to not even post that crap, I don't have a problem with the Giants but you can't even talk about another NFC east team without being biased, its painfully obvious all the way through this thread.


So I'm guessing the addition of Zach Thomas and Felix Jones is going to tear the locker room apart huh? The one that was torn apart last year huh? Please don't tell me Adam Jones because how bad of a locker room cancer was he in Tenn?


We made a few key upgrades this season, the fact that you say things that cannot be backed up by anything relevant like "the locker room will be a mess" tells me you need something to throw out in the dark so you can always be 'right'...We all understand now the Giants are zzzsuperzzz, they won the super bowl with Eli so since he's coming back obviously that means he will win it again, and all the other NFC east teams just don't stack up to the Giants.


And for the record, don't assume I think my team should be #1 on paper, for the record:

1. New England
2. Indianapolis
3. San Diego
4. Dallas


But that doesn't bother me as much as you see, because this is just a pre-season ranking, and its sad that it gets you this fired up...The main reason for the Giants run was not getting enough respect, and being the under dog all playoffs, so why do you care so much that your team gets "respected"? Who cares, don't get any respect and win another one, isn't that better then praising you all year and then losing at the end of the year?

well let's see:

1: Who's your number 2 wr? Glenn? hmmm big mouth butter hand Crayton? nice
2: As big and good as your OL is, a quick pass rush will hurt them. Flozell is excellent, but again, pretty quickly too
3: You still have Roy Williams. If he starts, it's like a negative on your D
4: let's see you guys and Romo like, win a playoff game before you guys talk **** and go all "woe is us, we're hated so much"
5: and yes, i think felix jones hurts your locker room. are you ******* kidding me? come on, that's just ridiculous. of course not.

and when did I say the Giants are so much better than te NFC East? te cowboys are the most talented team in the division and will most likely win the division. So i don't know where you'e getting this...

I aleady stated I intended to vote for the Chargers...

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:17 PM
jballa, I agree with you except I think you hav SD way too high, but that's for another day

the only thing:The Giants OL is top 5 and most likely our 2nd biggest strength(to DL ofcourse)

LonghornsLegend
08-18-2008, 08:21 PM
well let's see:

1: Who's your number 2 wr? Glenn? hmmm big mouth butter hand Crayton? nice
2: As big and good as your OL is, a quick pass rush will hurt them. Flozell is excellent, but again, pretty quickly too
3: You still have Roy Williams. If he starts, it's like a negative on your D
4: let's see you guys and Romo like, win a playoff game before you guys talk **** and go all "woe is us, we're hated so much"
5: and yes, i think felix jones hurts your locker room. are you ******* kidding me? come on, that's just ridiculous. of course not.

and when did I say the Giants are so much better than te NFC East? te cowboys are the most talented team in the division and will most likely win the division. So i don't know where you'e getting this...

I aleady stated I intended to vote for the Chargers...



1. The fact that you have to ask shows that you don't know anything about any other team other then the Giants...I guess if you don't know who he is then he must suck :rolleyes:


4. I don't even know what that means, or what your trying to say...You have cried for respect like 6 different times in this thread alone, and I've lost count over how many times its been since the season ended.


5. I'm still waiting for who we brought in thats going to cause this team to implode, which you keep failing to mention...Or maybe you know something nobody else knows, don't use 'well such and such said it in a 10 truths thread' because I'm wanting to know what YOU think...So please, who did we bring in thats going to cause our locker room to be a mess, take all the time you need make something up.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:24 PM
I can cry for repect, we're the reigning champs. You criedfor respect, you haven't won a playoff game in a decade...

the locker room? with TO, Pacman, Crayton etc? the cowboys are a loud cocky team, it's a fact. do you know what happens to loud, cocky teams when they lose? I'm just saying, a rocky start could be disasterous.
and who is your #2 WR, please enlighten me...

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:29 PM
I can cry for repect, we're the reigning champs. You criedfor respect, you haven't won a playoff game in a decade...

the locker room? with TO, Pacman, Crayton etc? the cowboys are a loud cocky team, it's a fact. do you know what happens to loud, cocky teams when they lose? I'm just saying, a rocky start could be disasterous.
and who is your #2 WR, please enlighten me...

LOL, since when has any Cowboys fan in here cried for respect?

The only silly argument you all can make is "Romo can't win a playoff game!". Hey, guess what, he just finished his first year as a starter. Who comes in halfway through the season and damn near beats the team that should have gone to the Superbowl that year? Our top two WR's last year were hurt and we upgraded our secondary tremendously. Where was this amazing sack machine during the regular season where you sacked Romo, what, once or twice?

The people that claim the locker room will crumble know little to nothing about the team and shouldn't be using ideas that are purely fictional and hypothetical as fact against the them.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:30 PM
It's not even close to what the Cowboys get, nowhere near it...Just like I have a hard time believing you think were the worst team on that list, even though the only players we lost sucked, and we made valuable additions.


And honestly, we are pretty much going on best team on paper right now, thats all we have to go off of at this point.

here ya go metsox...this is the sole reason i got started on the cowboys and there "respect"

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:32 PM
here ya go metsox...this is the sole reason i got started on the cowboys and there "respect"

He's just pointing out the fact that the only people on our team that we have lost were positions that were greatly improved. We were 13-3 last year with Jacques Reeves starting most of the year, same with Julia Jones and Akin Ayodole. Other than those, we're bringing the same team back, so why are we all of a sudden gonna become that much worse, or implode?

Roy Williams isn't gonna be as big a hurt to our defense as everyone and their mother is screaming he will.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:35 PM
He's just pointing out the fact that the only people on our team that we have lost were positions that were greatly improved. We were 13-3 last year with Jacques Reeves starting most of the year, same with Julia Jones and Akin Ayodole. Other than those, we're bringing the same team back, so why are we all of a sudden gonna become that much worse, or implode?

Roy Williams isn't gonna be as big a hurt to our defense as everyone and their mother is screaming he will.

"it's not even close to the hate we get"

sounds like crying for respect to me haha, but twist the words however you want...

and Roy Willims sucks, he just does. Please realize this, kthxbye

LonghornsLegend
08-18-2008, 08:41 PM
here ya go metsox...this is the sole reason i got started on the cowboys and there "respect"

So me saying the Giants don't get anywhere near the amount of hate the Giants get, is me crying for respect for the Cowboys? Ok man, you should read some of your post over the past few months, thats self explanatory.


And please don't bring up Roy Williams like Cowboys fans think he is so awesome, I haven't said a good thing about him in years, but his role decreased this upcoming year more so then last year, and obviously we were fine with him.


The first name out of your mouth when I asked you about a locker room cancer was TO, yea ok...I won't even respond to that because there is no intelligent conversation going on here...Can't wait for TO and Crayton to destroy our locker room, they were such a distraction last year how will we ever go on :rolleyes: You have fun with the Giants lovefest.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:44 PM
So me saying the Giants don't get anywhere near the amount of hate the Giants get, is me crying for respect for the Cowboys? Ok man, you should read some of your post over the past few months, thats self explanatory.


And please don't bring up Roy Williams like Cowboys fans think he is so awesome, I haven't said a good thing about him in years, but his role decreased this upcoming year more so then last year, and obviously we were fine with him.


The first name out of your mouth when I asked you about a locker room cancer was TO, yea ok...I won't even respond to that because there is no intelligent conversation going on here...Can't wait for TO and Crayton to destroy our locker room, they were such a distraction last year how will we ever go on :rolleyes: You have fun with the Giants lovefest.

hey, if TO and Crayton wanna give us more bulletin board material this season, god bless 'em

and metsox just told me stop talking about how bad Roy is... soooo there's a little inconsistancy there

let's just see how the season plays out


and I know who the Cowboys #2 WR is, yet you said I don't know anything about our team... i dont know what to say to that. It's crayton, who I said, and obv Hurd and my monmouth boy Miles arent ready for that spot

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:45 PM
"it's not even close to the hate we get"

sounds like crying for respect to me haha, but twist the words however you want...

and Roy Willims sucks, he just does. Please realize this, kthxbye

Here's the difference.

Here's you: "Wahh, we're the champs, we get no respect!"

L.L: "People hate on us way more than people hate on the Giants".

Your posts whine about how the Giants never get respect despite being the NFL Champions of this past season, while L.L is just pointing out the fact that the Cowboys get hate from every angle and from everyone imaginable, just for being so popular. How in the hell is that asking for respect?

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:48 PM
and metsox just told me stop talking about how bad Roy is... soooo there's a little inconsistancy there

And please don't bring up Roy Williams like Cowboys fans think he is so awesome, I haven't said a good thing about him in years, but his role decreased this upcoming year more so then last year, and obviously we were fine with him.

Roy Williams isn't gonna be as big a hurt to our defense as everyone and their mother is screaming he will.


How is there any inconsistencies there? If anything, he was just reiterating what i had just mentioned.

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:49 PM
Here's the difference.

Here's you: "Wahh, we're the champs, we get no respect!"

L.L: "People hate on us way more than people hate on the Giants".

Your posts whine about how the Giants never get respect despite being the NFL Champions of this past season, while L.L is just pointing out the fact that the Cowboys get hate from every angle and from everyone imaginable, just for being so popular. How in the hell is that asking for respect?

haha fine, if that's how you depict me, so be it. I'm out of tears, crying about this, so I need some help...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNO6On7cK1M

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:51 PM
haha fine, if that's how you depict me, so be it. I'm out of tears, crying about this, so I need some help...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNO6On7cK1M

I'm not depicting you as anything, but just interpreting your posts as how i feel they are meant to be.

Do you deny me saying that you constantly claim the Giants have a huge lack of respect within the posters of this site and/or the media?

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:51 PM
I'm not depicting you as anything, but just interpreting your posts as how i feel they are meant to be.

Do you deny me saying that you constantly claim the Giants have a huge lack of respect within the posters of this site and/or the media?

not at all, and its 100% true. I won't deny the truth

keylime_5
08-18-2008, 08:53 PM
I think we can move on to whose 4th best since it's obvious the Jags will take the 5th spot.

But what if all the people who voted for New York in this poll want to vote for San Diego in the next poll? Like.....me. I think we need another poll.

MetSox17
08-18-2008, 08:54 PM
not at all, and its 100% true. I won't deny the truth

So if what i have been mentioning was true, why would you feel insulted and take the route you did in resolving your frustrations?

scottyboy
08-18-2008, 08:55 PM
So if what i have been mentioning was true, why would you feel insulted and take the route you did in resolving your frustrations?

who ever said I was frustrated? I don't get mad over the interwebz