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View Full Version : 4th Annual NFLDC Preseason Rankings #3


diabsoule
08-19-2008, 12:38 PM
32. Atlanta Falcons
31. Miami Dolphins
30. San Francisco 49ers
29. Kansas City Chiefs
28. Detroit Lions
27. Oakland Raiders
26. Denver Broncos
25. St. Louis Rams
24. Baltimore Ravens
23. New York Jets
22. Chicago Bears
21. Cincinnati Bengals
20. Carolina Panthers
19. Arizona Cardinals
18. Houston Texans
17. Buffalo Bills
16. Tennessee Titans
15. Tampa Bay Buccaneers
14. Washington Redskins
13. Seattle Seahawks
12. Philadelphia Eagles
11. Green Bay Packers
10. Minnesota Vikings
9. New Orleans Saints
8. Cleveland Browns
7. Pittsburgh Steelers
6. New York Giants
5. Jacksonville Jaguars
4. Dallas Cowboys

Number four has been decided. Who will be number 3?

Splat
08-19-2008, 12:46 PM
I'm going with Indy but its hard the main reason is since they all ready have a few guys banged up and their Div is the best of the 3.

TACKLE
08-19-2008, 12:52 PM
I voted Indy.

They'll be solid but I still don't see them as an elite team in '08. With Peyton possibly missing the one or two of the the first regualr season games and playing in the NFC South, I can't see them being better than the Pats and Chargers.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 12:59 PM
Chargers here. Tomlinson is aging, Gates's health is in question, and Rivers is unquestionably the worst starting QB of these 3 teams. Defensively, they're tough to run on, but both of the other two teams left have shown they can pass on this defense, and they're weak at safety.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 01:02 PM
I'm going with Indy but its hard the main reason is since they all ready have a few guys banged up and their Div is the best of the 3.

Sanders and Freeney practiced today, Marvin has played the last two preseason games, and Manning is potentially a go next week.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 01:04 PM
Has to be Indy here. Huge questions on offense about Harrison and Manning injuries. Sanders and Freeney have also missed time this offseason. I don't see this team as the complete unit it once was.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 01:06 PM
Has to be Indy here. Huge questions on offense about Harrison and Manning injuries. Sanders and Freeney have also missed time this offseason. I don't see this team as the complete unit it once was.

Again, Sanders and Freeney practiced today, Harrison has been back (and looking good), and Manning is a potential go for next week.

awfullyquiet
08-19-2008, 01:11 PM
Chargers here. Tomlinson is aging, Gates's health is in question, and Rivers is unquestionably the worst starting QB of these 3 teams. Defensively, they're tough to run on, but both of the other two teams left have shown they can pass on this defense, and they're weak at safety.

Weak at safety?

Really?

Not to sound ridiculous, but their DB's aren't any worse. Cromartie, Jammer, Cason, Weddle, Hart...

They pick off tons, sure, they're slightly worse at safety, but they're better in the pass rush department and corners.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 01:11 PM
Again, Sanders and Freeney practiced today, Harrison has been back (and looking good), and Manning is a potential go for next week.


I dont think Harrison will be able to go the whole season. Hes getting up there in age and I can't see him going a whole year.

Freeney and Sanders are huge parts to the defense. If either go down this defense just isnt the same.

Manning hasn't practiced yet and thats not good. He needs to get on the field and play before the season or the offense won't be completely ready to go.

Lots of questions on this roster. Chargers and Pats are much more complete teams.

Gay Ork Wang
08-19-2008, 01:14 PM
I went pats. Defense will break and I think (hope) Tom Brady hurts his ankle

awfullyquiet
08-19-2008, 01:22 PM
Manning hasn't practiced yet and thats not good. He needs to get on the field and play before the season or the offense won't be completely ready to go.

Eh. That's not true. Who is he fielding on the offensive side of the field that he hasn't played with for 2+ years? Wayne? Harrison? Clark? Addai? His O-Line?

He'll step in, and nothing will change. That's the indy way

Geo
08-19-2008, 01:23 PM
Patriots offense and coaching gets them in the Top 3, but no further than #3 given their age and secondary imo.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 01:25 PM
I dont think Harrison will be able to go the whole season. Hes getting up there in age and I can't see him going a whole year.

Marvin's style doesn't lend itself to big hits, and it was a freak play that caused his injury in the first place. The bursa sac I believe was what was causing him the problem, and I think it's gone now, so there's no reason he couldn't go a full season.

Freeney and Sanders are huge parts to the defense. If either go down this defense just isnt the same.

Which is why there were and are so cautious with those two players. That said, Freeney isn't much of a risk to go down again. Lisfranc injuries are rare, and don't recur often. Bob made it through all of last season with little in the way of health issues, and while he's had problems in the past, he should be able to stay on the field most of the time.

Manning hasn't practiced yet and thats not good. He needs to get on the field and play before the season or the offense won't be completely ready to go.

This offense has been the same for 10 years, the type of consistency Manning has had with the Colts is rare, and it will help him to be able to come back and not miss a beat. He knows this offense better than most people know anything, so I think he'll be fine. Sorgi is doing an adequate job of getting the other starters ready in the preseason.

Lots of questions on this roster. Chargers and Pats are much more complete teams.

The Chargers have questions all over their offense and the Pats have questions all over their defense, not to mention Brady's foot injury. The only real question the Colts have at this point is "Will Peyton Manning be able to Play Week 1?", and thus far, the answer coming from everyone in the know is a tentative yes.

Geo
08-19-2008, 01:30 PM
btw, I'd find it really funny if after all this talk about Peyton and zomg his knee, that he enters the regular season healthier than Brady.

Nevermind that Rivers tore his ACL this past January. How did the top three teams come into this with injured QBs??? :p

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 01:35 PM
Weak at safety?

Really?

Not to sound ridiculous, but their DB's aren't any worse. Cromartie, Jammer, Cason, Weddle, Hart...

They pick off tons, sure, they're slightly worse at safety, but they're better in the pass rush department and corners.

Clinton Hart and Eric Weddle aren't exactly going to strike fear in anything. I'm not saying their DBs are any worse than they were last year, but last year, they got passed all over by both the Colts and Pats, so among these three teams, that could be argued as a weak point.

LonghornsLegend
08-19-2008, 01:38 PM
I don't want to hear about "oh Harrison is healthy, he practiced and looked good", ok how about lets see him take a hit first before jumping the gun on him being able to play 16 games, practicing hardly means he can finish the season.


Wasn't he practicing for the last month or longer of the regular season only to not play? I am not buying his healthy until he takes a good shot during a real game, until then its just coach talk, the same 'coach talk' that said he was ready to play probably 5 weeks in a row to end the regular season...With that said, Indy needs to be more concerned with that run defense, they are getting gashed once again on the ground, thats far more important then Manning's health.


I voted Indy for that reason, the Chargers are better on D, and traditionally put up a great defensive fight vs New England, after seeing how they played last year with Volek, Sproles, a hurt Gates, and almost beat New England, its probably their time to take the next step...If they could give New England that type of fight without being at full strength, I like their chances.


Also Freeney is returning from a Lis franc injury, nobody needs to be acting like everything is all good and he's going to be back to normal, everyone wants to believe the off-season hype and the good reports because everything is positive at this point in time, but you need to see some of these guys play first...I'm more concerned about the healthy of Freeney then i am Gates, and for bringing up Rivers he has already played a game to this point, and looked good.

bsaza2358
08-19-2008, 01:40 PM
For me, it came down to QB play. I think Brady is the healthiest of the 3 QB's, plus he has Randy Moss. I trust Manning's experience and weapons before I want to be in on Rivers. Rivers had a late ACL repair surgery, plus his major weapons both had surgeries on their legs. Even though I think the SD D is the best, I think that QB play wins close games under 4 minutes. Voted for SD at #3.

awfullyquiet
08-19-2008, 01:41 PM
Clinton Hart and Eric Weddle aren't exactly going to strike fear in anything. I'm not saying their DBs are any worse than they were last year, but last year, they got passed all over by both the Colts and Pats, so among these three teams, that could be argued as a weak point.

but, EVERYONE tries to pass on the bolts. because they can't run against them.

Hart and Weddle are average. the DB's are better this year. People will fear Cromartie (finally), and that will improve the safeties...

Because, we all know it's a fluid system. the corners get better, it makes the safeties look better.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 01:42 PM
Harrison will never be the reciever he was 2 years ago. Age and injuries won't allow him to reach that level again.

Manning has to play. Thats all there is to it. If Manning doesn't get into any of the preseason games I can't see him being ready for the opener. You have to get that look at a live defense and get into sync with your offense. Something that can't be done just in practice.

Freeney and Sanders absolutley have to stay healthy or the defense will fall apart.

SD and NE also have questions with injuries but I think their defenses are better than Indys. Neither team relies on their QB and passing game nearly as much as the Colts do.

Without the injuries, I'd still vote Colts. They just have the least complete team of the 3 left.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 01:48 PM
I don't want to hear about "oh Harrison is healthy, he practiced and looked good", ok how about lets see him take a hit first before jumping the gun on him being able to play 16 games, practicing hardly means he can finish the season.

You mean like the suplex he took against Carolina, after which he promptly hopped back up? Just checking...

Wasn't he practicing for the last month or longer of the regular season only to not play?

No. As I recall, he didn't practice until near the playoff game. He was out of game shape at the time of the playoff game, but he's looked good in preseason playing time thus far.

I am not buying his healthy until he takes a good shot during a real game, until then its just coach talk, the same 'coach talk' that said he was ready to play probably 5 weeks in a row to end the regular season...

Does preseason action count as a real game? Like I said, he got suplexed against Carolina, only to spring back up with no problem.

With that said, Indy needs to be more concerned with that run defense, they are getting gashed once again on the ground, thats far more important then Manning's health.

Didn't that happen when the Colts were without Bob Sanders in 2006? Just checking again...

I voted Indy for that reason, the Chargers are better on D, and traditionally put up a great defensive fight vs New England, after seeing how they played last year with Volek, Sproles, a hurt Gates, and almost beat New England, its probably their time to take the next step...If they could give New England that type of fight without being at full strength, I like their chances.

They played with Volek, Turner, and a hobbled Gates against the Colts and won because the Colts couldn't generate a pass rush. Tomlinson and Rivers played against the Pats, and they lost because the Pats had a pass rush.

Also Freeney is returning from a Lis franc injury, nobody needs to be acting like everything is all good and he's going to be back to normal, everyone wants to believe the off-season hype and the good reports because everything is positive at this point in time, but you need to see some of these guys play first...I'm more concerned about the healthy of Freeney then i am Gates, and for bringing up Rivers he has already played a game to this point, and looked good.

I'd be more concerned about the health of Freeney if the Colts didn't bring in 3 pass rushers this offseason, but they did. Obviously Freeney is still a key part, but he's going to start the season rotating into and out of the game until the team feels comfortable with him starting and taking the majority of the snaps. As for Gates, who do the Chargers have behind him if he can't get it done this year? If that happens, teams will be putting 8 in the box against the Chargers frequently.

UKfan
08-19-2008, 01:52 PM
I'm an IND fan, and unfortunately I am going to have to go with the Colts. With the DT situation the way it is, I think our run D will suffer a lot.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 01:56 PM
Tomlinson had only 2 carries in the AFC championship if I remember correctly.

princefielder28
08-19-2008, 02:00 PM
New England's decimated secondary and lack of depth upfront concerns me. I think age is finally gonna catch up with this team and they will be fortunate if they have a first round bye.

B-Dawk
08-19-2008, 02:01 PM
this is gonna be tough, pretty split. i went with indy as i think they will have the worst regular season record here. Although i wouldnt be surprised, and actually expect them to make the superbowl

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 02:01 PM
Harrison will never be the reciever he was 2 years ago. Age and injuries won't allow him to reach that level again.

How many times have I seen a statement like this about Marvin? Too many, yet all Marvin has done year in and year out is go out, produce, and get to Pro Bowls (when healthy). Marvin's routes have looked just as crisp in the preseason as they ever have, I see no reason why he can't go out and do it again.

Manning has to play. Thats all there is to it. If Manning doesn't get into any of the preseason games I can't see him being ready for the opener. You have to get that look at a live defense and get into sync with your offense. Something that can't be done just in practice.

Again, he's a potential go next week, meaning he'd get into the last preseason game. Even if he doesn't, I don't see it affecting Manning too much. This is an offense he's been running for 10 years, he'll be fine without the 10 preseason series he normally gets. The main thing Manning needs is to get his timing with his receivers down, and that's something that can be done in practice.

Freeney and Sanders absolutley have to stay healthy or the defense will fall apart.

Sanders, yes, but the Colts addressed their lack of pass rush sans Freeney issue in the offseason. That's not to say he's not an important player, because he'll draw double teams on reputation alone, but there are other pass rushers on the roster now.

SD and NE also have questions with injuries but I think their defenses are better than Indys. Neither team relies on their QB and passing game nearly as much as the Colts do.

Whose defense allowed the fewest points in the NFL last season while missing one of its two best players for half of the season?

Without the injuries, I'd still vote Colts. They just have the least complete team of the 3 left.

How so? They have, at worst, the 2nd best offense of the three teams remaining, and as long as Bob Sanders is healthy, arguably the best defense of the three teams remaining.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 02:02 PM
I'd love to see that happen but I've seen NE start games with players like Chad Brown at Cb and make due. They have a good system on defense.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 02:02 PM
WOW! 10-10-9? This is easily the closest vote yet.

Geo
08-19-2008, 02:04 PM
Harrison is fighting age, no denying that. He's dealt with injuries the last two years.

Thankfully the Colts receiving core is deeper and more talented than its ever been.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 02:04 PM
this is gonna be tough, pretty split. i went with indy as i think they will have the worst regular season record here. Although i wouldnt be surprised, and actually expect them to make the superbowl

I can accept that. :D

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 02:06 PM
I'd say they have the 2nd best offense behind NE and the 2nd best defense behind SD.

Believe it or not Harrison isn't going to be a probowl reciever forever. I dont think Harrison can handle another complete season.

None of the pass rushers the Colts added are nearly as good as Freeney. Without Freeney the pass rush drops off.

Smooth Criminal
08-19-2008, 02:07 PM
This is going to be a hell of a close vote because you can make a solid argument for any team to place 1-3 here.

All of these teams have potential to be great, but there are risks involved in all 3 as well.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 02:13 PM
I'd say they have the 2nd best offense behind NE and the 2nd best defense behind SD.

Both of those points are arguable. With a healthy Bob Sanders, the Colts have ranked 2nd and 1st in points allowed in the NFL. The 2005 Bears are the only team to allow fewer points than the Colts defense with a healthy Bob Sanders. As for the offense, I think the Colts have improved while the Patriots have dropped off, but they did set all kinds of records last year, so it's tough to argue against them.

Believe it or not Harrison isn't going to be a probowl reciever forever. I dont think Harrison can handle another complete season.

I don't expect him to be a Pro Bowl caliber receiver forever. That said, he's looking like vintage Marvin so far. If he can produce at the level of a Colts #2 WR/redzone target, the Colts offense will be amazing this year.

None of the pass rushers the Colts added are nearly as good as Freeney. Without Freeney the pass rush drops off.

I never said they were, but there's still the ability to generate a pass rush on the roster on the off chance that Freeney does go down this year. That said, watch out for Marcus Howard, he could have a Mark Anderson 2006 type of season.

CC.SD
08-19-2008, 02:43 PM
I'm not going to do any extensive lobbying in this thread. Homer or not, my order is still as follows:

3. Colts
2. Patriots
1. Chargers

and honestly it's tough to put the Pats ahead of the colts with that secondary.

For the record, I'd love to see teams put 8 in the box against the Chargers this year to defend the "aging" LT. Chambers and Jackson...that's a helluva combo when it comes to big play ability. Throw in Gates, who is running and cutting in camp, a first round slot receiver in Buster davis, and a plethora of dumpoff options (I'm looking at you, Jacob Hester) +Ladainian himself... Ooooweeeeee it's gonna be exciting.

Haters can keep doubting but the Chargers defense has gamechangers all over the place (Merriman, Phillips, Castillo, Jammer+Cromartie, JAMAL WILLIAMS, and this year everyone can get to know Eric Weddle, and the offense is, ya know, the Charger O. No knock on the other teams, I just don't see any team stopping SD this year.

Cue the doubting.

Geo
08-19-2008, 02:54 PM
Jackson and Chambers did more in the postseason last year because Gates wasn't on the field getting the majority of targets. We'll see if either of those two will produce at that same level when Gates returns in full health.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 02:55 PM
I'm not going to do any extensive lobbying in this thread. Homer or not, my order is still as follows:

3. Colts
2. Patriots
1. Chargers

and honestly it's tough to put the Pats ahead of the colts with that secondary.

For the record, I'd love to see teams put 8 in the box against the Chargers this year to defend the "aging" LT. Chambers and Jackson...that's a helluva combo when it comes to big play ability. Throw in Gates, who is running and cutting in camp, a first round slot receiver in Buster davis, and a plethora of dumpoff options (I'm looking at you, Jacob Hester) +Ladainian himself... Ooooweeeeee it's gonna be exciting.

Haters can keep doubting but the Chargers defense has gamechangers all over the place (Merriman, Phillips, Castillo, Jammer+Cromartie, JAMAL WILLIAMS, and this year everyone can get to know Eric Weddle, and the offense is, ya know, the Charger O. No knock on the other teams, I just don't see any team stopping SD this year.

Cue the doubting.

With 6 Peyton Manning INTs, 2 Darren Sproles TD returns, and no receivers to defend outside of Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark, you were a chip shot FG away from losing in the regular season. That should be a blowout.

With no pass rush from the Colts and 2 deflections that fell right into Charger hands, you were a Kenton Keith bobble away from losing in the postseason.

The Colts have a lot deeper pass rush and a lot more sure handed RBs this season, and it's looking like the kick coverage units have improved.

diabsoule
08-19-2008, 03:15 PM
I voted New England.

Their defense just isn't anything to write home about at all. They lost their best cornerback and replaced him with Fernando Bryant. Like bf_51 has pointed out a few times, they have become increasingly cocky with their drafts and I think it's about to bite them in the ass.

They can't just rely on their offense to win games for them. You have to have your defense step up too and with the retirement home rejects they have playing linebacker and safety I don't think they will get it done this year.

If Bruschi falls and breaks a hip this year don't say I didn't call it.

CC.SD
08-19-2008, 03:16 PM
With 6 Peyton Manning INTs, 2 Darren Sproles TD returns, and no receivers to defend outside of Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark, you were a chip shot FG away from losing in the regular season. That should be a blowout.

With no pass rush from the Colts and 2 deflections that fell right into Charger hands, you were a Kenton Keith bobble away from losing in the postseason.

The Colts have a lot deeper pass rush and a lot more sure handed RBs this season, and it's looking like the kick coverage units have improved.

Woulda shoulda coulda. I've heard a million reasons why the Colts should have beaten the Bolts any of the last 3 times.

imo of course, all your excuses do not compare to missing Ladainian Tomlinson and having critically injured Gates and Rivers. Right down the line, those are the 3 best Charger players, and yet the Colts lost at home.

The bolts were a mess during the regular season and everyone knows that; the playoffs were when they finally started playing up to their talent level, and unfortunately that was when injuries struck the hardest as well.

Geo, of course Jackson and Chambes won't each put up 100 yards and a touchdown per game with Gates back in the lineup. But you should know better than anyone how impossible to defend an offense is when there are three guys who can all take over a game running routes. Not to mention it opens up the field a whole lot for a guy who just might be the greatest running back to ever lace em up. The context of these polls is who will be the best team in 2008; who we beat in the past and how we did it doesn't matter. I still think this Charger team is just now figuring out how to be constantly explosive and will make be an Extremely difficult team to play come January, especially if they get homefield.

Dam8610
08-19-2008, 05:28 PM
Woulda shoulda coulda. I've heard a million reasons why the Colts should have beaten the Bolts any of the last 3 times.

I wasn't saying the Colts should've won, I was simply saying it took about a billion breaks for the Chargers to win the first game by 2, and anyone can win a game when their QB has 5+ seconds to throw every time, like both QBs did in the second game.

imo of course, all your excuses do not compare to missing Ladainian Tomlinson and having critically injured Gates and Rivers. Right down the line, those are the 3 best Charger players, and yet the Colts lost at home.

No they're not. Rivers doesn't even make the Top 5 for most important Chargers. Dwight Freeney was out for the Colts, and Robert Mathis was 50% at best, so the Colts had zero pass rush. In case you didn't notice, your QBs were making their reads, eating lunch, watching the other playoff game in its entirety, going to the bathroom, surfing the web, then making a throw. On every down. Anyone could complete passes given the kind of time they had. Fortunately, the Colts made sure that they're not going to be in that situation again this offseason.

ninerfan
08-19-2008, 10:27 PM
WOW this was tough but ultimately I had to go with the Colts