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Bengals78
08-22-2008, 03:53 PM
Just curious to see who you guys see as your top 5 prospects you want the Bengals to look at next year come round 1 and you're gonna be keeping an eye on them this college season.
Mine:
1. Rey Maualuga ILB
2. George Selvie DE/OLB
3. Phil Loadholt OT
4. Alex Mack/Jonathon Lugis C
5. Knowshon Moreno RB

Sleeper guys and homerism
1. Dicky Lyons Jr. WR
2. Tyler Roehl RB
3. Terrill Byrd DT
4. Maurice Crum Jr ILB
5. Kenny Mainor DE

PalmerToCJ
08-22-2008, 09:21 PM
I'm not much into college football but I'm going to be watching Lauranitis (sp) and Maualaga. We need a MLB of the future so freakin' bad.

Bengals78
08-22-2008, 10:08 PM
Im not a big Lauranitis fan. I like Rey a lot though. I really hope we look at some oline spots.

Bengalsrocket
08-22-2008, 10:43 PM
Our top 5 needs in my opinion:

1) DT. If we're going to continue with the 4-3 defense we need a guy next to Peko. If we switch to a 3-4 defense we need to get rid of Peko because I don't think he's big enough.

2) MLB. We've sort of solidified our secondary over the last couple of years if everything works out. The biggest problem for us is our front 7 and our run defense. If DT is the biggest problem for us, then MLB is definitely second.

3) RT. If the rumors of us losing Stacy Andrews are true, and Willie doesn't own a time machine - then we basically have no future there. I'm sure one of our current players could move to RT, but then that just leaves a hole in another spot.

4) RB. I know every year we usually draft a RB, and if everyone was healthy it probably wouldn't be that big of a deal. But Rudi and Kenny are getting old, and seem less and less reliable. And even if Chris Perry is healthy all year it doesn't mean he won't get injured later. I have high hopes for Dorsey to become a complimentary back for us, but thats still a long shot. Past him it seems we only have James Johnson, who looked decent in a scrimmage but then terrible in a preseason game.

5) DE. hopefully a healthy Odom does for us what he did in Tennessee, but we all know his strength was augmented by Haynesworth and Vandenbosch. And simply put, we don't have that kind of talent on our D-line. Geathers is a solid player, but I doubt he makes a pro-bowl anytime soon. Our depth at D-line always seems to have tons of potential but it never pans out. I'd like to see us draft a real DE stud out of college and not just some guy who has lots of potential.

At some point the draft we'll need to address center, FB and corner, but I don't think they're as pressing of needs as the above 5.

Anyways, I don't follow college very much outside of going to a UC game here and there so I cannot comment on who we need, but I certainly know what we need :)

Bengals78
08-22-2008, 11:04 PM
I know Willie doesnt own one but im 95% sure Carson is working on one...

StripedWalrus
08-23-2008, 12:36 PM
Our top 5 needs in my opinion:

1) DT. If we're going to continue with the 4-3 defense we need a guy next to Peko. If we switch to a 3-4 defense we need to get rid of Peko because I don't think he's big enough.

2) MLB. We've sort of solidified our secondary over the last couple of years if everything works out. The biggest problem for us is our front 7 and our run defense. If DT is the biggest problem for us, then MLB is definitely second.

3) RT. If the rumors of us losing Stacy Andrews are true, and Willie doesn't own a time machine - then we basically have no future there. I'm sure one of our current players could move to RT, but then that just leaves a hole in another spot.

4) RB. I know every year we usually draft a RB, and if everyone was healthy it probably wouldn't be that big of a deal. But Rudi and Kenny are getting old, and seem less and less reliable. And even if Chris Perry is healthy all year it doesn't mean he won't get injured later. I have high hopes for Dorsey to become a complimentary back for us, but thats still a long shot. Past him it seems we only have James Johnson, who looked decent in a scrimmage but then terrible in a preseason game.

5) DE. hopefully a healthy Odom does for us what he did in Tennessee, but we all know his strength was augmented by Haynesworth and Vandenbosch. And simply put, we don't have that kind of talent on our D-line. Geathers is a solid player, but I doubt he makes a pro-bowl anytime soon. Our depth at D-line always seems to have tons of potential but it never pans out. I'd like to see us draft a real DE stud out of college and not just some guy who has lots of potential.

At some point the draft we'll need to address center, FB and corner, but I don't think they're as pressing of needs as the above 5.

Anyways, I don't follow college very much outside of going to a UC game here and there so I cannot comment on who we need, but I certainly know what we need :)

Starting from number 5 on this list....

DE - I know that news sites and anything and everything is saying the Bengals will need to be looking at DE next season...I wanna ask why? We have Odom and Geathers...and the way Geathers has been looking I see no reason why he isnt going to make the Pro Bowl. I think he can. If you want to make the DE's better than get a high Quality DT. THen the line will do tremendous things.

RB- Chris Perry is going to be a Feature back. He is going to be healthy this year and he is going to put the whole "Bengals can't run" into the ground. He is going to be awesome! Now...alot of teams are doing dual backs now...the reason is to keep the main back fresh for as many years as possible. I say we could get another back...but not early. I dont see a need to go in the first round because Perry will be dynamic this year.

RT - yea we are going to have to get one. But drafting an RT in the first is kinda funky. LT's are first round stuff...but who knows. We will need one...because we all know Andrews wont be staying.

Gunna group MLB and DT together. WE NEED BOTH! So which do we get in the first round? I am thinking of where we will be picking in the draft that a top MLB is what we will most likely get. Which alone will boost our production. So what should we do in the draft?

our priority #1 is

DT & MLB are the #1

Oline and CB are #2 (we will be needing a nickel back)

RB is #3

Bengalsrocket
08-23-2008, 01:20 PM
Starting from number 5 on this list....

DE - I know that news sites and anything and everything is saying the Bengals will need to be looking at DE next season...I wanna ask why? We have Odom and Geathers...and the way Geathers has been looking I see no reason why he isnt going to make the Pro Bowl. I think he can. If you want to make the DE's better than get a high Quality DT. THen the line will do tremendous things.

RB- Chris Perry is going to be a Feature back. He is going to be healthy this year and he is going to put the whole "Bengals can't run" into the ground. He is going to be awesome! Now...alot of teams are doing dual backs now...the reason is to keep the main back fresh for as many years as possible. I say we could get another back...but not early. I dont see a need to go in the first round because Perry will be dynamic this year.

RT - yea we are going to have to get one. But drafting an RT in the first is kinda funky. LT's are first round stuff...but who knows. We will need one...because we all know Andrews wont be staying.

Gunna group MLB and DT together. WE NEED BOTH! So which do we get in the first round? I am thinking of where we will be picking in the draft that a top MLB is what we will most likely get. Which alone will boost our production. So what should we do in the draft?

our priority #1 is

DT & MLB are the #1

Oline and CB are #2 (we will be needing a nickel back)

RB is #3

Well we can keep DE off the list if it would be more appealing to you. I personally think Odom and Geathers are both solid players, but neither of them are the pass rushing talent we need yet (yet being the keyword, because they have a year to prove me wrong before the 09 draft).

Even if you think Perry is the next best thing to run for us, how can trust his health? I'd be extremely mad if Perry was awesome all through out 08, then gets injured in 09 and we're back to no running game. I'm not suggesting we blow our 1st round pick on a RB (which is why its 4th on my list of priorities) but I wouldn't be upset with a mid-late second round pick or any third round pick.

I put RT at 3rd priority hoping we'd spend a 2nd or 3rd round pick, not necessarily a 1st. I think its pretty obvious the fans are not happy with our current center and our future at RT, and both need to be addressed at some point in the draft. If its easier for us to draft a center, since they usually don't get picked that early, and then kick one of our depth players out to RT (maybe Anothony Collins?) then thats fine too.

as far as MLB and DT go, this year we need to be aggressive for the best one we can get. I'm extremely happy with Keith Rivers, more so than if we had drafted Sedrick Ellis I think. But lets face it, we sat back and let the saints jump us for him - we cannot let that happen this year if the best player for our system is just a few picks away.

Also, does anyone have any info on next year's likely free agents? We have to many urgent needs to address them all in the draft. If we could get a good MLB or DT from FA it would make our draft decision that much easier.

StripedWalrus
08-23-2008, 02:15 PM
I havnt heard anything from Dorsey and Ellis. So I am extremely glad we got Rivers.

I think I have heard that the RB class wont be that great this year. I dont know if that is true...if it is...then we wont find anything in the 2nd...atleast nothing worth it.

Chris Perry will be the next greatest thing, and he will stay healthy. I mean seriously...how can you trust the health of any player ever????? Any player can go down any second. Carson went down bad in the playoffs...but were people saying we should draft a QB in the first? no. INjuries happen...and good players can bounce back from them. Perry will bounce back, and he will have a great year.

We may also have to look at WR this coming year again..

PalmerToCJ
08-23-2008, 02:21 PM
We absolutely 100% more than anything in the world need a future at MLB. At DT at least there's hope in Sims/Shirley, at MLB there's nothing. That's my reasoning for putting MLB first in what we need.

Unless you think Corey Mays is the heir apparent...

Geo
08-23-2008, 03:00 PM
Any thought to Rivers playing MLB?

StripedWalrus
08-23-2008, 04:31 PM
Rivers is natural at OLB and he is playing so great at OLB that I wouldnt want to move him. Jones is playing MLB right now...he isnt the greatest in the world...but he is smart and has drive at least. We need a long term fix. If we did move Rivers to MLB, we would need a OLB to replace him.

themaninblack
08-23-2008, 06:11 PM
Rivers could do it but I think it would be somewhat of a waste. We do need to draft one and it should be on day one this draft.

Bengals78
08-23-2008, 09:56 PM
Well judging by tonites game, we should be in line for Maualuga come next April. Pick him up and in Rd 2 possibly Alex Boone or next best OT. And IMO look at Terrill Byrd in the later rounds at a DT. He is an explosive DT who can provide inside rush. last season, 56 tackles, 17 tackles for loss, 8 sacks.

StripedWalrus
08-23-2008, 11:14 PM
I hope we dont play like that during the regular season...the oline was terrible.

themaninblack
08-24-2008, 09:22 PM
Well judging by tonites game, we should be in line for Maualuga come next April. Pick him up and in Rd 2 possibly Alex Boone or next best OT. And IMO look at Terrill Byrd in the later rounds at a DT. He is an explosive DT who can provide inside rush. last season, 56 tackles, 17 tackles for loss, 8 sacks.

I played against Byrd. He's a stud but he's undersized. They have him listed at 290 but I'm willing to bet he's about 10lbs less than that. Still would be worth taking a flyer on because he's very athletic and stronger than an oxe. Could be a nice addition to the rotation in the pass rush department.

Bengals78
08-31-2008, 01:52 PM
Okay, so its labor day weekend and im bored, so im gonna do a quick mock of how our 09 draft could look.

Round 1: Rey Maualuga ILB USC
Big hitter with great instincts who could really make an impact immediately along with former teammate Keith Rivers.

Round 2: Arian Foster RB Tennessee
Provides much needed depth at RB with the cut of Rudi. Chris Perry when healthy is great but he cannot carry the load and Kenny Watson and crew arent the best other options.

Round 3: Fenuki Tupou T Oregon
Depth at tackle is weak now without Willie and the resigning of Stacey Andrews unknown. OLine is a must and we need to shore it up this next offseason.

Round 4: Antoine Caldwell C Alabama
Big solid center who would almost automatically be an upgrade over our current group of centers. He is poised to have a great senior year.

Round 5: Terrill Byrd DT Cincinnati
DT with solid burst and good quickness, and can help get penetration in the middle and provide the inside pass rush we covet so much.

Round 6: D.J. Clark CB Idaho St
Big soild CB (6-2, 200) who could potentially work his way into the nickle spot after the release of Deltha and the David Jones experiment.

Round 7: Kenny Mainor DE Troy
If he is available late round, he would definitely be worth the risk. Coming from Troy, he is an undersized but speedy DE. Sound familiar? Osi and DeMarcus. Not saying is that kind of talent but you never just know.

PalmerToCJ
08-31-2008, 02:18 PM
I like that one... I think the needs go like this:

1. MLB - We have NO ONE for our future at MLB. You absolutely must have a solid MLB in my opinion to really guide your defense, we have no one like that. Lauranitis or Maualaga would be a home run.

2. RB - Watson is old, DeDe has fumblitis and isn't a feature back. Perry is, well, an injury risk. If anything he stays healthy and you have two good RB's. I think they can find a solid one in the 2nd-4th range.

3. OL - Either go with a Center or draft a guy that's versatile and can play both guard and tackle (see Whitworth and Andrews).

4. DT - We just drafted two young guys there, Peko is solid and locked up so it's not urgent IMO. Really hinges on progression of Shirley, after this year you have to think Thornton is done. It's either Sims or a FA next year, we still lack depth at DT.

5. OLB - Jeanty is an injury risk, Brandon Johnson is our only solid backup. We need depth and playmakers at LB in general.

Bengals78
08-31-2008, 02:27 PM
I agree with the needs.
I tend to think OL and RB are more like 2a and 2b.
With OLB I was thinking more a long the lines of a converted DE since we are transitioning into the hybrid 4-3 3-4 defense.
Jason Williams from Western Illinois is a speedy OLB who could be a late rounder

themaninblack
08-31-2008, 08:54 PM
Wonder if we could move Brandon Johnson or Jeanty into the middle? Johnson has proven he's a versatile enough athlete. Jeanty is a thumper who could excel in the middle given the opp.

PalmerToCJ
08-31-2008, 11:02 PM
The thing is, if Jeanty goes to the middle who takes SLB? I'd just assume draft a MLB and leave Jeanty where he's used to.

I'd like to see Brandon Johnson on the field, Mays won't cut it if Jones gets hurt.

Man our LB situation is not good...

StripedWalrus
09-01-2008, 12:12 AM
Rivers Completes 1/3rd of our Linebacker corp...we just gotta get the other 2/3rds. Just think if Odell wasnt an idiot and Pollack didnt get hurt. Think of the devastation they would cause.

Imagine the defense...a young strong defense...that would crush others offense.

Its a shame...the Bengals roster is starting to look like swiss cheese. We have doubt at the oline, WR, RB, Dline, Linebackers, Safeties, and to an extent the CB's...

I say our situation is the same though. Go for a Linebacker in the first. I say we should look at the oline in the second.

themaninblack
09-01-2008, 11:49 AM
The thing is, if Jeanty goes to the middle who takes SLB? I'd just assume draft a MLB and leave Jeanty where he's used to.

I'd like to see Brandon Johnson on the field, Mays won't cut it if Jones gets hurt.

Man our LB situation is not good...

If Jeanty goes middle we'd put BJ at SLB. He has been seeing a lot of time this preseason there anyway.

And I also think we are in need of one more starting caliber LB not two. I like what I have seen from Jeanty and Brandon Johnson n if they can prove it during this season I'd be pretty confident in our LB corps. We do need a middle linebacker in the worst way though.

I am starting to like the cuts more and more as the days go by. The only one that I really hate is Willie.

StripedWalrus
09-01-2008, 12:37 PM
If Jeanty goes middle we'd put BJ at SLB. He has been seeing a lot of time this preseason there anyway.

And I also think we are in need of one more starting caliber LB not two. I like what I have seen from Jeanty and Brandon Johnson n if they can prove it during this season I'd be pretty confident in our LB corps. We do need a middle linebacker in the worst way though.

I am starting to like the cuts more and more as the days go by. The only one that I really hate is Willie.

The willie cut hits the heart...thats why I think everyone is like..."what happened" WIllie was here through all the bad times just like us...and we related to that...it is sad to see him go, but maybe it was for the best...I hope he doesnt end up with the steelers.

twizbuck
09-16-2008, 07:28 PM
Just curious to see who you guys see as your top 5 prospects you want the Bengals to look at next year come round 1 and you're gonna be keeping an eye on them this college season.
Mine:
1. Rey Maualuga ILB
2. George Selvie DE/OLB
3. Phil Loadholt OT
4. Alex Mack/Jonathon Lugis C
5. Knowshon Moreno RB

Sleeper guys and homerism
1. Dicky Lyons Jr. WR
2. Tyler Roehl RB
3. Terrill Byrd DT
4. Maurice Crum Jr ILB
5. Kenny Mainor DE

Well, seeing as we should have a high pick...

1. Rey Maualuga, MLB
2. Aaron Curry, SLB (at least I believe he projects there)
3. Knowshon Moreno, RB
4. Beanie Wells, RB
5. Eugene Monroe, OT

In the second:

1. Alex Mack, C
2. Jonathan Lugis, C
3. Max Unger, OL
4. Marcus Freeman, WLB (puts Rivers on the strong side)
5. Ricky Jean-Francois, DL

themaninblack
09-16-2008, 08:39 PM
Rivers does not need to be on the strong side. He is a prototypical WLB.

I really think we need to get Alex Mack. I'm not all that high on Luigs.

twizbuck
09-16-2008, 08:41 PM
Rivers does not need to be on the strong side. He is a prototypical WLB.

I really think we need to get Alex Mack. I'm not all that high on Luigs.

Don't think he needs to be, but if we were to pick up Freeman, I think Rivers would still be good for us on the strong side while allowing Freeman to excell on the weak side. All that was meant to imply.

themaninblack
09-16-2008, 08:52 PM
Would be a waste of Rivers' talents IMO but I get what you mean.

twizbuck
09-17-2008, 12:28 AM
Would be a waste of Rivers' talents IMO but I get what you mean.

Really, Freeman could work out as a strong side LB in the pros as well imo, but I'm no expert and all of them say he's a WLB. Ah well.

BengalMedic
09-17-2008, 07:01 AM
There are so many different directions this team can go in it's crazy. MLB, RB, and OT could all be round one picks. Holy crap do we have holes to fill and who knows what the status of our FA's is going to be.

Could we please get someone who can return of f*cking kickoff or punt please ??

Bengals78
09-17-2008, 08:56 AM
I have two scenarios I have become fond of:
Round One:
Rey Rey
Round Two:
James Davis/Arian Foster

Round One:
Knowshon Moreno
Round Two:
Jasper Brinkley

twizbuck
09-18-2008, 11:05 AM
I have two scenarios I have become fond of:
Round One:
Rey Rey
Round Two:
James Davis/Arian Foster

Round One:
Knowshon Moreno
Round Two:
Jasper Brinkley

If we get Davis and not Foster then ok. Personally though I can't see us avoiding the O-line the first day.

PalmerToCJ
09-18-2008, 01:25 PM
I want a LB first round, pretty much all I want.

I don't see why we should go for a first round RB, they can be had in the 2nd/3rd round and still be plenty productive.

We need a MLB of the future so bad I can't see straight. Once we get a very solid MLB, there's not much to stop us from having a damn good defense.

twizbuck
09-18-2008, 08:57 PM
I want a LB first round, pretty much all I want.

I don't see why we should go for a first round RB, they can be had in the 2nd/3rd round and still be plenty productive.

We need a MLB of the future so bad I can't see straight. Once we get a very solid MLB, there's not much to stop us from having a damn good defense.

I wouldn't mind us waiting til the 4th or 5th, there's some good potential RB's sitting in those rounds right now. I just wanna see some OL and LB picks.

twizbuck
09-18-2008, 09:03 PM
There's actually two late round RB's that interest me: Rashard Jennings from Liberty, and Javarris Williams of Tennessee State.

BengalMedic
09-19-2008, 06:26 AM
I want a MLB so bad I can't stand it. If I have to watch Dhani get turned into another rookie QB's B*TCH, I think I will vomit. The thing is, I'm curious how long they are going to wait to get some of our young DT's some playing time ?? Sims, Shirley, and Harris all need to get their reps. I don't want to see them getting their first action the first game of next year. If Thronton leaves (please God) we will need at least one more DT later on.

themaninblack
09-19-2008, 08:56 AM
They def need to keep Thornton if the price is right just cuz he's such a great locker room presence and role model for the younger players. I do agree, however, that they need to rotate the new guys in some. I would especially like to see Shirley in there a little bit since Sims seems to be nicked up.

BengalMedic
09-19-2008, 09:11 AM
Thornton costs to much for what we are getting in return. Hell, if presence and role models are the concern, Willie should still be here... (I know you aren't arguing that point though) If we can get him at a reduced price, ok. If not, he's just not worth it as he brings very little to the middle of the D-line IMO...

What happened to Harris anyway ?? He was a beast at Miami and has bounced around a few teams.
These youngsters need to get in there !!!

lost33cause
09-22-2008, 02:32 PM
They def need to keep Thornton if the price is right just cuz he's such a great locker room presence and role model for the younger players. I do agree, however, that they need to rotate the new guys in some. I would especially like to see Shirley in there a little bit since Sims seems to be nicked up.

I can't disagree with you more when it comes to Thornton.

I agree with our DT's other than the drafting another one part. Even if we draft one he won't see time next year.

lost33cause
09-22-2008, 05:04 PM
I think we will be in the top 10 this year, it sucks but that's what it looks like.

I think we need to drop Levi Jones. He's just dropped off bigtime and shouls not be on the team. He can be moody as well and wants traded whenever he's unhappy. On that note we then need to do something with the line. I think we have some flexibility there though. If we do drop Levi, not resign Stacey, and also get rid of Guysuck like I want then we have 3 positions that need filled.

LT: Whitworth or a draft pick
LG:Whitworth or a draft pick
C: Depends greatly if there is value for a Center where we pick obviously, and keep guysuck as a backup.
RG: Bobbie Williams
RT: Collins

Where do you think Collins best position is? He's only at about 317 lbs last I checked, does he have value as a pulling guard? I almost think Whit's best position would be RT and not LT. Do you think Guysuck has value as a pulling Guard or no? Wasn't he actually a Guard in college? I doubt we overpay for a FA OL either.

P.S.
I know this post is a little scattered but there are so many questions there along the line and so many possibilities as well.

themaninblack
09-22-2008, 05:31 PM
I don't know a ton about Collins but he I think his best position is probably LT though I could be way off on that. Regardless, He is definitely a tackle. I'd like to put him in at Left if Levi doesn't step his game up, keep Whit at LG, Guychick/Draft Pick at Center, Williams at RG, and hopefully Stacey at RT.

If we don't resign Stacey I think we should move Whit to RT and draft a LG such as Duke Robinson.

themaninblack
09-22-2008, 05:44 PM
We can't have enough good people on this team. That said, I did explain that it would need to be at the right price(meaning he would have to take a paycut). I'd rather keep him than DJax at this point. Everyone jumps all over JT's ass when in reality he is a decent player. He did not come quite as advertised but that is the nature of the beast in the NFL.

hobbes2053
09-22-2008, 10:19 PM
We can't have enough good people on this team. That said, I did explain that it would need to be at the right price(meaning he would have to take a paycut). I'd rather keep him than DJax at this point. Everyone jumps all over JT's ass when in reality he is a decent player. He did not come quite as advertised but that is the nature of the beast in the NFL.

The fact that he doesn't perform as he did in Tennessee, isn't even that much of a problem. He is such a positive role model for the younger players on the team, which is one thing we need more of. The team especially needs to get its players, young and old alike, on the right track and have them focus solely on football. We cannot afford to have any more off field incidents and I'm not saying that we will. But the fact is that Thorton fills that "leadership" role, even if it is off the field. That is where his true value is.

lost33cause
09-23-2008, 07:48 AM
I'm sorry but I still disagree with you. Why can't you have good players also be the role models? I don't want him on the team taking a roster spot from someone who can play on the field better than him. He has done nothing on the field to make me think otherwise since he's been here. He should have been cut this year but he has the coaches son thing going for him or something. Peko can mentor just as much as JT can. This is no longer a team of criminals and it's not like JT did anything to say he kept players out of trouble anyway. I want players learning the right way to make a team and not the JT way.

Right way: play your ass off on the field and make plays
Wrong way: act as a mentor to young player but suck on the field

Next year we will have Sims, Peko, and Shirley who should all be ready to play. That leaves one spot and it should be anybody other than JT. I'd prefer we get a Haynseworth but we know how likely that is.

themaninblack
09-23-2008, 09:07 AM
Thats the thing we still don't have someone to take a roster spot from him. He's a proven solid veteran and until some of these younger guys step up and prove they can even get on the field its hard to let him go. I would be all for letting him go if Sims and/or Shirley can make some plays this year but I'm pretty sure I saw Orien Harris on the field last week and have yet to see either of those two.

lost33cause
09-23-2008, 12:52 PM
League minimum salary for 10 year vet is 820k/yr
League minimum salary for a 1 year vet 360kk/yr

Thornton is probably going to want more than the minimum.
You will get the same production from Orien Harris as you do Thornton given the playing time.

I hope this discussion is a mute point because I actually want Haynseworth brought in :)

Peko, Shirley, Sims, and Haynseworth rotating at DT would be nice.

P.S. Shirley is a raw rookie who won't do much this year, we know that and knew that coming in, no surprise. Sims had turf toe and we'll start to see him more and more I think.

themaninblack
09-23-2008, 05:29 PM
Just offer him that minimum then. If he doesn't want it fine let him go. I also have a hard time believing Orien Harris is going to give you the same production when he's been on what 4-5 teams since being drafted?

If Haynesworth happened it would matter who played DT next to him. IMO he's the best defensive player in the NFL when he wants to be. Last year he shoulda been DPOY instead of Bob Sanders.

lost33cause
09-24-2008, 07:15 AM
Why do you guys think our only weakness on the line is Center? Levi has gone way down hill and Stacey will be gone because he's simply not worth the money.

hobbes2053
09-24-2008, 08:00 AM
Currently, every OL position is strong except for center. Ghiaciuc brings the whole OL down because he cant make the right calls or block. Regardless of how far Levi has gone downhill, he's still a halfway decent LT. He can manage, but the sh*tty play we get from Ghiaciuc ruins everything. I'd love to see a premier center (i.e., Alex Mack) come in and take Ghiaciuc's spot right of the bat next year.

Bengals78
10-06-2008, 07:10 PM
This is my current big board based on need and who I think would best help us and depending on when we draft

Round 1
1.) Rey Maualuga ILB USC
2.) Michael Oher OT Ole Miss
3a.) Aaron Curry OLB Wake
3b.) Alex Mack C Cal
4.) Brian Orakapo DE Texas
5.) Knowshon Moreno RB
6.) Chris Wells RB OSU
7.) Duke Robinson OG Oklahoma
8.) Tyson Jackson DE LSU
9.) Dannell Ellerbe ILB UGA
10.) Darrius Heyward-Bey WR Maryland


Round 2
1a.) Clint Sintim OLB Virginia
1b.) Jonathon Luigs C Arkansas
2.) Fenuki Tupou OT Oregon
3.) Jasper Brinkley ILB SC
4.) Andre Brown RB NCST
5.) Josh Mauga ILB Nevada

themaninblack
10-06-2008, 09:26 PM
Why do you guys think our only weakness on the line is Center? Levi has gone way down hill and Stacey will be gone because he's simply not worth the money.

Levi had a bad game but he's still a good player and he has been fine ever since as far as I have seen. I do agree he needs to go but I wouldn't say hes a complete weakness.

Bengals78
10-06-2008, 10:05 PM
Levi hasnt been the same since his injury. Given more time I think he will be back. Stacey will be gone and Collins will step up. Or we draft Oher

PalmerToCJ
10-06-2008, 10:29 PM
While Levi is nowhere near the elite LT he once was, I think he's at least adequate... Not to mention we've got him signed for a few more years (i think anyway). That female we have at center is dragging us down hard. I miss Rich Braham so much.

In terms of needs I'd like to see us go...
1. MLB
2. C
3. RB

I think Dhani is doing fine but he's a dinosaur that'll need to be replaced eventually. Every good defense just about has a good MLB directing things. A good center makes us way better on offense IMO. If Collins develops he can shift things around on the line. Given how bad they've been I think they have to re-sign Andrews.

rickscott
10-07-2008, 08:19 AM
A new Center drafted will be a step down from a 4 yr veteran in Guichac IMO. Braham was far from a polished Center when we got him. He was drafted by Philly as a Guard and cut and we made him into a Center. I know Guichac has had problems, but I still think he'll be ok. With that said, I would not be against taking one in Rd 2 if one of the top 2 are still there. We also have Kyle Cook and Dan Santucci on the roster/prac. squad so they must like them too. I want a LT in Rd 1

StripedWalrus
10-07-2008, 08:27 AM
A new Center drafted will be a step down from a 4 yr veteran in Guichac IMO. Braham was far from a polished Center when we got him. He was drafted by Philly as a Guard and cut and we made him into a Center. I know Guichac has had problems, but I still think he'll be ok. With that said, I would not be against taking one in Rd 2 if one of the top 2 are still there. We also have Kyle Cook and Dan Santucci on the roster/prac. squad so they must like them too. I want a LT in Rd 1

wow....ummm no...a new Center would not be a step down from Guichac. have you watched him play this season? If they recorded OL stats for how many times you get knocked down and someone gets by you, Guichac would lead the league.

BengalMedic
10-07-2008, 09:52 AM
A better question, although a laughable one might be to ask who could we possibly target in free agency ??

If we could add even ONE impact free agent, our draft could take on a different approach. This is not saying these players would leave their current team and then there is always getting tagged to consider, but you get my point.

I'm sure with the philosophy of building through the draft, it makes adding a big name, big dollar contract less likely, but for how young this team is, it sure couldn't hurt...

That being said, who the hell would want to come to this team ??

Mr.Regular
10-07-2008, 01:35 PM
So I was playing around with some mock draft scenarios, and I was stumped as to who to give Cincy if they had the #1 overall pick. I was thinking Oher, and maybe Rey... but Im not completely sure. You guys know your team better than I do so what do you think?

Bengals78
10-07-2008, 02:31 PM
If it is #1 overall I would have to lean towards Oher. Unless Rey has a stellar combine I would have to lean towards Oher in that scenario...or trade down for a few more picks.

Bengals78
10-07-2008, 02:33 PM
That being said, who the hell would want to come to this team ??

Someone who realizes that this team, as bad as they are now, has a young & hungry defense who has held its own with some really good teams. And an offense that is on the verge of clicking, just an OLineman away.
If a DT stud came on board and we draft a C and MLB we could contend for the division IMO.

StripedWalrus
10-07-2008, 04:39 PM
I would like to see the Bengals trade one of our old receivers...tj or cj...possibly get a late 1st round for them. Then we can draft our MLB with our first pick and then take a C later in the 1st. Or possibly go LT and C... All possibilities. I think we should trade TJ though and get something for him. I hear SF is interested in him.

Bengals78
10-07-2008, 05:15 PM
Id offer them Chad and resign TJ. He has proven he is more important to the team than Chad. Groom Simpson or Caldwell to take over.

hobbes2053
10-07-2008, 05:24 PM
If Maualuga is available when we pick, we have to take him. End of story. He is easily one of the best, if not the best, MLB in this draft and with him and Rivers together again, we will destroy people. Not say that C/OT isn't important, but MLB is our greatest need by far. After MLB, C is probably the biggest spot to fill. Ghiaciuc is just plain awful and needs to go.

rickscott
10-07-2008, 10:09 PM
wow....ummm no...a new Center would not be a step down from Guichac. have you watched him play this season? If they recorded OL stats for how many times you get knocked down and someone gets by you, Guichac would lead the league.

I know he's looked bad at times, but show me a rookie Center that comes in and starts and I'll show you the about 1 every 5 yrs. For that reason, I say we stick with EG BUT as I mentioned, if we could get Luigs or Mack in Rd 2, I would love to do so.

hobbes2053
10-07-2008, 10:27 PM
I know he's looked bad at times, but show me a rookie Center that comes in and starts and I'll show you the about 1 every 5 yrs. For that reason, I say we stick with EG BUT as I mentioned, if we could get Luigs or Mack in Rd 2, I would love to do so.

By "times" do you mean "most of the time" or "always?" Granted he has done better in the last 2 games than earlier than in the season, but he still blows. Please god, give us Alex Mack.

Bengals78
10-07-2008, 11:30 PM
I know he's looked bad at times, but show me a rookie Center that comes in and starts and I'll show you the about 1 every 5 yrs. For that reason, I say we stick with EG BUT as I mentioned, if we could get Luigs or Mack in Rd 2, I would love to do so.

Id take my chances with someone who could at least hold their own. Give me a guy who might f' up but does it going 100 MPH than some one who likes looking at the pretty clouds everyother play

Bengalsrocket
10-08-2008, 12:48 AM
CJ is a better receiver than Housh, hands down. But assuming we'd get either receiver's actual value in a trade I'd rather see CJ go (and no, I don't hate him or anything - its just that we don't really have any receivers as physical as Housh on the depth chart).

BengalMedic
10-08-2008, 10:44 AM
Someone who realizes that this team, as bad as they are now, has a young & hungry defense who has held its own with some really good teams. And an offense that is on the verge of clicking, just an OLineman away.
If a DT stud came on board and we draft a C and MLB we could contend for the division IMO.

I don't mean from a "potential" standpoint here. I agree the defense is coming on, but I still won't be on their nuts just yet. This team hasn't had a good, check that, mediocre D-line in over 10 years. The offense has a ton of questions that I think are oversimplified by using the standby of the O-line. I'm not saying the O-line doesn't need a couple new guys, but that is just "part" of it. The running game blows (I want to see more Benson). The WR's aren't cutting it. Palmer even when he has time has looked a little off. While I will admit the o-line plays into all of that, there's more to it than what ESPN likes to comment on.

What I was referring to is the ownership of this team. I guess I should have clarified and said: Who the hell would want to play for Mike Brown ??

Say what you will, the guy is an assclown and nobody can say anything to change my opinion on that...

Bengalsrocket
10-08-2008, 07:42 PM
I don't mean from a "potential" standpoint here. I agree the defense is coming on, but I still won't be on their nuts just yet. This team hasn't had a good, check that, mediocre D-line in over 10 years. The offense has a ton of questions that I think are oversimplified by using the standby of the O-line. I'm not saying the O-line doesn't need a couple new guys, but that is just "part" of it. The running game blows (I want to see more Benson). The WR's aren't cutting it. Palmer even when he has time has looked a little off. While I will admit the o-line plays into all of that, there's more to it than what ESPN likes to comment on.

What I was referring to is the ownership of this team. I guess I should have clarified and said: Who the hell would want to play for Mike Brown ??

Say what you will, the guy is an assclown and nobody can say anything to change my opinion on that...

I think there are a lot of owners who are assclowns and people still play for them (and no, I'm not just talking about Al Davis). There are plenty of organizations that haven't won anything significant recently that still have plenty of good players.

People are blaming Mike Brown "to much" in recent history and its a little mind boggling. I'm not saying he's not at fault, but hey he didn't lose the game against Dallas last week. He didn't hurt Palmer the week before when we played an 0-3 team. He didn't kick a game winning field goal against us in OT when we lost against the giants. He didn't control the weather in week 2 when the titans slaughtered us. And lastly he wasn't the one who posted a career low passer rating (somwhere in the 30's) in week 1 either.

We have a team capable of winning. And while Mike Brown might be part of the reason we haven't won a game this season, a lot of lies on the coaching staff and the players.

For me it's just to easy of an excuse to put it all on Mike.

hobbes2053
10-08-2008, 10:13 PM
Mike Brown ultimately controls what does and doesn't happen to this franchise. (i.e., who we pick up via free agency/draft, trades, etc.) No, he didn't lose all those games, but he also doesn't help by being a financial tightass all the time. There are plenty of owners who will do anything to see their team win [hopefully the SB] and Mike Brown is not one of those owners. He is in this strictly for the monetary gain he gets by simply owning the team, not to win. If he wanted to win, he would be more willing to spend to get what we need in order to do so (i.e., a GM, stud players, etc.)

BengalMedic
10-09-2008, 12:39 PM
Mike Brown is a greedy f*ck who is more worried about his bottomline than ANYTHING else. Football is a hobby to him. Last time I checked we haven't won a playoff game in more years than I care to recall. Mike Brown deserves more blame than most put on him.

Everyone talks about how crazy Al Davis is, but Oakland has at least WON a Superbowl. Mike Brown NEVER gets bashed in the media and is no better in my estimation. I just choose not to make apologies for a guy getting very rich off this team and its fans with ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO SHOW FOR HIS EFFORTS.

Hell, even a BLIND squirrel finds a nut every now and then...

Bengals78
10-09-2008, 09:15 PM
Trying to get this back to a draft oriented talk......

Top players for us by position (needed positions):

RB - Knowshon Moreno - Personally, I was thinking Chris Wells but with Benson joining the team and Perry's fumble issues, I am leaning more towards the explosive back who will make more BIG PLAYS.

ILB - Rey Maualuga - Top 5 senior player easily. Big hitter and a good tackler. JL doesnt really fit our defense unless we switch to a Tampa 2 which is unlikely.

OT - Andre Smith - I like him more than Oher but not many others do. I see him as a true mauler and could be a leader down the road. He could step in at RT and start right away IMO. He could even learn LT if we keep Levi for now and want to phase Smith in.

DE - Tyson Jackson - I know he projects as a 3-4 DE but I think he could be very helpful since we are trying to run a hybrid defense and he could slide inside on certain downs and then out for the 3-4 look if need be.

C - Alex Mack - Smart, powerful off the line and can hold his own against bigger blockers. Everything Guycheck isnt. Enough said?

OLB - Aaron Curry - Best OLB in the class. He could compliment Rivers on the other side very well and we might end up with the best OLB combo. I wasn't sure here because I also think Clint Sintim is very very good but has bad team syndrome.

StripedWalrus
10-10-2008, 04:05 PM
Trying to get this back to a draft oriented talk......

Top players for us by position (needed positions):

RB - Knowshon Moreno - Personally, I was thinking Chris Wells but with Benson joining the team and Perry's fumble issues, I am leaning more towards the explosive back who will make more BIG PLAYS.

ILB - Rey Maualuga - Top 5 senior player easily. Big hitter and a good tackler. JL doesnt really fit our defense unless we switch to a Tampa 2 which is unlikely.

OT - Andre Smith - I like him more than Oher but not many others do. I see him as a true mauler and could be a leader down the road. He could step in at RT and start right away IMO. He could even learn LT if we keep Levi for now and want to phase Smith in.

DE - Tyson Jackson - I know he projects as a 3-4 DE but I think he could be very helpful since we are trying to run a hybrid defense and he could slide inside on certain downs and then out for the 3-4 look if need be.

C - Alex Mack - Smart, powerful off the line and can hold his own against bigger blockers. Everything Guycheck isnt. Enough said?

OLB - Aaron Curry - Best OLB in the class. He could compliment Rivers on the other side very well and we might end up with the best OLB combo. I wasn't sure here because I also think Clint Sintim is very very good but has bad team syndrome.

Aaron Curry is a beast and I think could help the team alot.

Alex Mack will be a late 1st early 2nd prospect right now...hopefully he becomes an early second adn we are able to get him

I see no reason why we would spend a 1st round pick on a 3-4 DE unless we were switching to a 3-4.

Smith has more potential than Oher, but Oher is better now.

Maulagualaalallalala would be able to step up immediately and be an improvement for our team at MLB.

Moreno will be a good back, but I dont want us to spend a top 10 pick on a Runningback when we have bigger problems. A good trench can make a crappy running game better.

Bengals78
10-10-2008, 05:20 PM
Depending on how the rest of the season goes, I would go with Smith over Oher. Mainly because Smith can help us 2 ways, he could move in to the Guard spot and Whitworth could move out to tackle, who didnt look too bad when he did play there. Or as I would prefer it, he plays tackle and Whitworth stays at G. He gives us more flexibility like when we had Steiny.

hobbes2053
10-10-2008, 06:51 PM
Best possible scenario IMO:
1. Maualuga/Oher/Smith
2. Mack/Brinkley

StripedWalrus
10-10-2008, 11:16 PM
Best possible scenario IMO:
1. Maualuga/Oher/Smith
2. Mack/Brinkley

Yea I am praying on Mack in the second right now.

hobbes2053
10-11-2008, 04:42 AM
Me too. If we keep going down the road we're going, we could possibly get Rey Rey and Mack, if he stays on the board 'til the 2nd. That would be ideal of course.

Bengals78
10-11-2008, 09:26 AM
Although if we dont get Mack Lugis or Caldwell wouldnt be bad either. Havent seen much of Lugis this year but Caldwell is dominating with Smith at Bama

rickscott
10-13-2008, 12:11 AM
USC's Rey Maualuga;, I've heard before that the guy is not the ideal brains of the defense...I don't want another stud athlete like Ahmad Brooks that can't comprehend what he 's doing. lI hope we go OT in Rd 1

Bengals78
10-13-2008, 12:40 AM
See, with Ndukwe on the field he doesnt need to be the brains, he is very "football smart" imo. He can lay lumber and is improving in coverage. If we go OT I want Smith, but a top 5 pick might be too high for him but not Rey. Id say trade back...but thats a smart football decision which means Mike Brown will denounce it and spit at it.

themaninblack
10-13-2008, 01:52 AM
Eh, I'm starting to question Rey-Rey the more I see him play. He's about as one dimensional as they come IMO and I think more value could be had later. I also kind of see him as an ILB in a 3-4 moreso than a MLB in a 4-3 in the NFL. I don't like Laurinitis either so RD1 could just be BPA.

BengalMedic
10-14-2008, 08:57 AM
In doing a little research (I know it's still early on) I'm not sold on ANY of the middle linebackers. Rey and "Little Animal" are the top two, but neither has been dominating. I would go with Rey over Laurinaitis. After those two, I don't think it's worth your time. Everyone else "appears" to be in the mold of a Caleb Miller type (to small)...

If they don't go OT in the 1st, they will need to shift some people around, namely Whitworth and then get Collins in there like NOW...

That being said, I wouldn't mind it playing out around something like this for the first two:
1st-Michael Oher (OT)
2nd- Jonathan Luigs (C)

After that, it's a toss up. You have players like Tyson Jackson (DE) out of LSU. I also think a Guard like Kraig Urbik out of Wisconsin in the top of the 4th would be very wise.

I also would like to see a move to trade Chad, TJ, or whomever to get another 2nd rounder. The RB's leave some to be desired after Beanie and Knowshaun.

themaninblack
10-14-2008, 11:30 AM
BTW, My top offensive lineman right now is Andre Smith. I bet he could play LT in the pros too. I would love to see us get him in the first but IDK if his stock will get that high.

Mr. Stiller
10-14-2008, 11:46 AM
BTW, My top offensive lineman right now is Andre Smith. I bet he could play LT in the pros too. I would love to see us get him in the first but IDK if his stock will get that high.

is Levi Jones really playing that bad?

I was going to assume you guys go DE or DT in round 1.

Should see if you can get a 1st rounder or even a 2nd at this point for Chad Johnson.

hobbes2053
10-14-2008, 11:57 AM
I would go with Rey over Laurinaitis. After those two, I don't think it's worth your time. Everyone else "appears" to be in the mold of a Caleb Miller type (to small)...

Brinkley is nowhere near too small. We could go after OT in the first and snag him in the early 2nd, if he stays on the board that long. Or we could trade back and get more picks, which would be well worth it.

Bengals78
10-14-2008, 01:36 PM
Throw any idea of trading picks away now. You know brown wont do that. Period.
I do not want Laurinitis on our team. He is not what we need in a ILB. He is better suited for cover 2.
As for going OT in rd 1, I think Smith is the best OT if he comes out. He could play either tackle.

Bengals78
10-14-2008, 01:39 PM
is Levi Jones really playing that bad?

I was going to assume you guys go DE or DT in round 1.

Should see if you can get a 1st rounder or even a 2nd at this point for Chad Johnson.

I dont think there will be a top 5 DT this year. Maybe DE in Brian Orakpo but other than that Im not a fan of any of the other DE or DT that high.

I would love to trade Chad. Anyone have the Titans number?

hobbes2053
10-14-2008, 02:15 PM
I dont think there will be a top 5 DT this year. Maybe DE in Brian Orakpo but other than that Im not a fan of any of the other DE or DT that high.

I would love to trade Chad. Anyone have the Titans number?

We don't need to be looking at DT/DE before the 4th anyway. We've got to get a MLB, C, LT before we can even consider DT/DE.

BengalMedic
10-15-2008, 07:26 AM
Must have missed Brinkley's size. 6'2, 275lbs is a big boy.

That being said, he has two years of JUCO and only played in 4 games last year due to a right knee sprain that required surgery. So far this season he is 3rd on his team with 32 tackles and 1 sack.

I'll have to watch him play some...

hobbes2053
10-15-2008, 09:29 AM
Must have missed Brinkley's size. 6'2, 275lbs is a big boy.

That being said, he has two years of JUCO and only played in 4 games last year due to a right knee sprain that required surgery. So far this season he is 3rd on his team with 32 tackles and 1 sack.

I'll have to watch him play some...

He is a big boy and he's a thumper, which is always a good thing. Not to mention he plays in the SEC, so he can't be all that bad lol

themaninblack
10-15-2008, 11:12 AM
is Levi Jones really playing that bad?

I was going to assume you guys go DE or DT in round 1.

Should see if you can get a 1st rounder or even a 2nd at this point for Chad Johnson.

Well Levi had one bad game and he has made it clear he does not want to be here. He has not been in top form in quite some time either. I wouldn't say he's "BAD" but he's just not his former self and not wanting to be here prolly has something to do with that.

I don't see a DE or a DT being drafted very early. We've got a good one in Domata Peko and we got two young guys who we drafted last year that they seem to like. Pat Sims finally got some good PT last week and looked pretty darn impressive to me. That said, I don't think we would pass on a top DL if there is one to be had. LB is probably the more pressing concern at this point.

StripedWalrus
10-15-2008, 12:47 PM
Well Levi had one bad game and he has made it clear he does not want to be here. He has not been in top form in quite some time either. I wouldn't say he's "BAD" but he's just not his former self and not wanting to be here prolly has something to do with that.

I don't see a DE or a DT being drafted very early. We've got a good one in Domata Peko and we got two young guys who we drafted last year that they seem to like. Pat Sims finally got some good PT last week and looked pretty darn impressive to me. That said, I don't think we would pass on a top DL if there is one to be had. LB is probably the more pressing concern at this point.

As high as it looks we are going to pick, I dont see a DT worth it. I dont think there is a DE worth it either. What I would like to see is a trade back...as it looks we have a 1-5 pick this year...maybe someone will jump up to get it? We trade back get a 1st and 2nd...if we trade back into the 20's...maybe we can land Alex Mack...or possibly Aaron Curry (is he strong side?) or Rey-rey if we trade into the teens or late single digits.

hobbes2053
10-15-2008, 01:01 PM
A trade back would be good esp. if we get more picks out of it. But that might mean more money Mr. Brown has to shell out which means there's no way of it happening. I really hate that man.

Bengals78
10-15-2008, 02:11 PM
As high as it looks we are going to pick, I dont see a DT worth it. I dont think there is a DE worth it either. What I would like to see is a trade back...as it looks we have a 1-5 pick this year...maybe someone will jump up to get it? We trade back get a 1st and 2nd...if we trade back into the 20's...maybe we can land Alex Mack...or possibly Aaron Curry (is he strong side?) or Rey-rey if we trade into the teens or late single digits.

We will not trade as long as Brown is owner.

themaninblack
10-15-2008, 05:46 PM
At the position we are drafting (top 5) we should just go BPA with maybe one exception being QB. It's hard to trade a pick when you are that high in the order.

Bengals78
10-15-2008, 07:35 PM
Yeah. I would be all for BPA. Andre Smith would probably be the guy then if ReyRey doesnt have the best combime.
I wouldnt complain about Curry or Orakpo if we some how get outta top 5

themaninblack
10-15-2008, 10:46 PM
Well its a long way off so we'll see how it shakes out. Hopefully we get Andre Smith but theres a bunch of guys who could be there that can help us. I'm real big on Aaron Curry as well.

Bengals78
10-16-2008, 12:13 AM
My dream draft:
Trade Chad predraft for around what Dallas gave for Roy. (Lets say a first, 2nd) and it becomes a mid first

Round 1:
a. Rey Maualuga ILB USC
b. Andre Smith OT Alabama
Round 2:
a.Clint Sintim OLB Virginia
b. Antoine Caldwell C Alabama
Round 3:
Will Davis DE Illinois
Round 4:
Terrill Byrd DT Cincinnati
Round 5:
Al Afalava S Oregon
Round 6:
John Parker Wilson QB Alabama
Round 7:
Kevin Huber P Cincinnati

UDFA:
Tony Dixon RB UK

rickscott
10-16-2008, 04:05 PM
Those are good picks from the Bearcats. Too bad we didn't use one on Brent Celek last year for a TE.

Bengals78
10-16-2008, 04:44 PM
Terrill is beast. He is good at busting up the middle and getting inside pressure. He could help us on passing downs big time.
I think he would take the spot of a Fanene as an inside guy on 4-3 downs and outside on 3-4 downs

themaninblack
10-16-2008, 06:30 PM
From what I've heard, Terrill is VERY lazy. Last thing we need on this team plus I don't really think were going to draft a DT at all. Really depends on what they see out of Shirley though because if they saw the same thing we saw out of Sims I think they are pretty happy with his future.

Bengals78
10-16-2008, 09:49 PM
Yeah thats just a Homer pick

Bengals78
10-18-2008, 10:15 PM
After watching the past 2 weeks, Ive decided we need to trade Chad, pick up a first rd pick and get Orkapo in stripes. That is all.

hobbes2053
10-19-2008, 11:18 PM
Orakpo reminds me a lot of DeMarcus Ware for some reason. He would be a great addition to the defense.

themaninblack
10-19-2008, 11:35 PM
I dont know if Orakpo would work in our scheme. Seems like more of a 3-4 OLB to me but we could be going in that direction so who knows. Seems like more of a workout warrior to me as well.

StripedWalrus
10-20-2008, 02:46 AM
After watching the past 2 weeks, Ive decided we need to trade Chad, pick up a first rd pick and get Orkapo in stripes. That is all.

not sure about Orakapo...but def trade chad...

hobbes2053
10-20-2008, 08:55 AM
Seems like more of a workout warrior to me as well.

There's no questioning his work ethic. He seems like a very versatile player so maybe he could fit into our system. An area he could help us in defensively is pass rush. He's great at creating pressure.

BengalMedic
10-20-2008, 11:18 AM
Best OT in the top of the first
Best Center in the top of the second
Spikes, MLB from Florida with pick from trading Chad in the second
Best Guard in the top of the third

Anything else after that would be icing...

StripedWalrus
10-20-2008, 12:27 PM
Best OT in the top of the first
Best Center in the top of the second
Spikes, MLB from Florida with pick from trading Chad in the second
Best Guard in the top of the third

Anything else after that would be icing...

I would hope we could more than a second for chad...if Williams was worth a 1 3rd and 6th.

hobbes2053
10-20-2008, 12:56 PM
I would hope we could more than a second for chad...if Williams was worth a 1 3rd and 6th.

Chad is easily worth more than a mid-to-late 2nd. But I guess that all depends on who wants him..

Bengals78
10-20-2008, 01:46 PM
Best OT in the top of the first
Best Center in the top of the second
Spikes, MLB from Florida with pick from trading Chad in the second
Best Guard in the top of the third

Anything else after that would be icing...

No to the MLB from florida. I wanted the last 2 LBs from florida and we see how they turned out. I'm not falling for them again...Brinkley over Spikes.
If the value for Orakpo is there, we should take him.

Bengals78
10-21-2008, 03:20 PM
My dream draft updated: (explanations too!)
Trade Chad predraft for around what Dallas gave for Roy. (Lets say a first, 2nd) and it becomes a mid first

Round 1:
a. Brian Orakpo DE/OLB Texas - Such a freak athlete he can play either position. Can rush the QB AND play the run very well. He dominated Loadholt through much of the game. He was constantly after Daniel in the Mizzou game. Non-Stop motor, from most video Ive seen he is a very smart man. I never saw him get penalties.

b. Andre Smith OT Alabama - What hasnt been said? The guy has shut most doubters mouths about not playing LT in the pros. Solid pass pro and incredible run mauler, not blocker, mauler. Him and Whitworth on the Left side could prove most intriguing...

Round 2:
a.Clint Sintim OLB Virginia - He has been playing very very well for a team that has struggled a lot but has turned it around. He is very talented and should prove to be a big up grade over Jeanty who is a good talent as a back up IMO.

b. Antoine Caldwell C Alabama - Along side with Smith, he has been a terror for DLine coaches clearing the left side of the line and opening huge holes. BIG time upgrade over Guywhofallsovereverysnap.

Round 3:
Kory Sheets RB Purdue - Having a very good year this year and showed moments of extreme burst and strength. Could provide depth at an unsure position for us. Benson looks good but Perry is iffy until he can hold onto the rock.

Round 4:
Terrill Byrd DT Cincinnati - Very good at getting inside pressure. Could provide needed depth and talent at the position. I like Sims, Peko but havent seen Shirley enough and we dont have much else. Orien Harris but nothing to write home about.

Round 5:
Maurice Crum, Jr. MLB Notre Dame - Solid linebacker who would provide an immediate update at MLB depth. He is a very smart player who could be serviceable player until we can find our true big time MLB.

Round 6:
Kenny Mainor DE Troy - Could play OLB for us in 3-4 packages or DE on passing downs. He is from the school that produced pass rush extrodinaires in DeMarcus Ware and Osi. Lightning strike thrice?

Round 7:
Kevin Huber P Cincinnati - Larson has been subpar at best and hasnt impressed much lately.

UDFA:
Tony Dixon RB UK - Talented back who could be solid in the pros if given a chance with the right system.

themaninblack
10-21-2008, 05:43 PM
After looking into Orakpo some more, I am very impressed with him. He can definitely play end in a 4-3.

Bengals78
10-21-2008, 06:01 PM
Rey Rey or Orakpo? Any votes?
Im still undecided. I havent seen enough of Rey play

hobbes2053
10-21-2008, 08:00 PM
Part of me would rather take Orakpo over Maualuga simply because of what he could add to the pass rush. We desperately need a MLB, but you can't go wrong with a great athlete such as Orakpo on the end. Not to mention, he is a freak athlete, on the field and in the weight room. And from what I've been hearing, Maualuga isn't as complete of a player as we may have thought. Not that he's not good, but some areas of his game could be improved upon.

As of right now, I think I would rather have Orakpo. We could possibly get Brinkley in the 2nd to fill the void at MLB?

themaninblack
10-21-2008, 08:39 PM
I wouldn't be mad if we got Rey but I am definitely not very high on him. I'd take Orakpo over Maualuga in a second.

Bengals78
10-21-2008, 10:11 PM
Ok then, Ima gonna change the draft I made. When is Ray Lewis a FA? I know he has mentioned in the past about working with Marvin again

PalmerToCJ
10-22-2008, 04:45 PM
Scott has us taking Wells, I would barf if that happened. Give me someone to rush the passer or actually block for our RB's first.

I'm on the Orakpo bandwagon.

Bengals78
10-22-2008, 04:53 PM
Thats a terrible call on Scott's part. Though I usually agree with him I cant this time. Our RB's arent that bad, but our OLINE is. We wouldnt pass on Orakpo, Rey or Oher for Chris Wells. Another RB with injury concerns? PASS.

hobbes2053
10-22-2008, 05:04 PM
I'm on the Orakpo bandwagon.

You and me both. He could add so much to our defense (pass rush) and would take some of the pressure off of the 2nd and 3rd level players. As it is now, we have virtually no pass rush, making it that much easier for teams to be effective against our young defense. Orakpo could for us what Ware is for the Cowboys or what Williams is for the Texans. He would be a goldmine for us IMO.

themaninblack
10-22-2008, 06:11 PM
I am not a fan of Beanie Wells at all. I am not opposed to a running back so long as they are not named Beanie.

PalmerToCJ
10-22-2008, 08:17 PM
Given where we'll be drafting and the talent at RB I'm completely against a RB round 1.

Our biggest needs are EASILY...

-Getting to the passer
-Blocking for the RB

If we could get a premiere pass rusher in the 1st and a Center in round 2 I'd be pretty happy. Then go OT in the 3rd and work from there.

Bengals78
10-22-2008, 10:17 PM
Depth at OT/C are much greater than DE in this Draft

hobbes2053
10-23-2008, 12:31 AM
Given where we'll be drafting and the talent at RB I'm completely against a RB round 1.

Our biggest needs are EASILY...

-Getting to the passer
-Blocking for the RB

If we could get a premiere pass rusher in the 1st and a Center in round 2 I'd be pretty happy. Then go OT in the 3rd and work from there.

Agree with everything said here. We can't completely abandon trying to improve the defense.

StripedWalrus
10-23-2008, 03:27 AM
Agree with everything said here. We can't completely abandon trying to improve the defense.

The Titans are playing well and they dont have an offense...so defense can win it for you!

Bengals78
10-23-2008, 07:37 AM
The Titans are playing well and they dont have an offense...so defense can win it for you!

See: Ravens, 2000 Baltimore

Bengals78
10-23-2008, 08:30 AM
http://bceagles.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/lapham_rich00.html

The future at tackle for us? lol.
Dave's nephew is looking good from what I hear. Unfortunately he is only a Soph.

Bengalsrocket
10-23-2008, 12:38 PM
See: Ravens, 2000 Baltimore

Both the titans and the Ravens have / had good running games with offense lines that were good enough to give their game managing QB enough time to find the open man.

StripedWalrus
10-23-2008, 02:42 PM
See: Ravens, 2000 Baltimore

or the 2002 Buccaneers.

Bengals78
10-23-2008, 05:49 PM
So many great examples of what a great defense gets you.

Mr. Stiller
10-23-2008, 06:14 PM
Agree with everything said here. We can't completely abandon trying to improve the defense.

If I was Your GM... I'd look hard at going: (2-T is a Chad Johnson Trade)


1) Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas ~6'4 260lbs

Elite Edge player that will allow you to finally apply QB Pressure from Both Sides.

2) Evander Hood, DT, Missouri ~ 6'3 295lbs

I haven't seen Sims so this may be a Miss on my part, but, Hood is one of the most athletic DT's in the NCAA and can apply inside Pressure meanwhile is capable of figuring out the play quickly, and is a force against the run. Peko/Shirley being the Run Stuffing NT's while you have a cycle of Hood/Sims to apply interior pressure.

2-t) Antoine Caldwell, C/G, Alabama ~ 6'3 310lbs

Gives you a mauler C to replace Ghuiciac with. He's excellent in Pass pro and I haven't seen someone not moved by him.

3) Max Unger, OL, Oregon ~6'5 305lbs

This is a depth First pick. Unger prefers Center, but he can play LT, LG, C, RG, RT... Giving you guys a 6th man off the bench and a possible RG.. or he could play C and have Caldwell play RG. Either way you'd strengthen the interior exponentially.

4) Scott McKillop, ILB, Pittsburgh ~ 6'2 240lbs

IMO He would be perfect for your system. He sifts through Garbage exceptionally well, he won't wow you or post eye popping #'s. But he will stop the run and provide solid zone coverage in the pass game. With Rivers on the Weakside, McKillop in the Middle and could Sign a FA for SLB or Move Blackstock over there.

5) Josh Mauga, ILB/OLB, Nevada ~ 6'2 245lbs


Has the size to play inside or @ SLB and the speed to play all 3 LB positions. He plays MLB and SLB for Nevada.. He's an excellent blitzer, and with 4.6 speed has the ability to cover most TE's in the league. Another young gun to put in your defense and start to improve your defense.

6) Anthony Hill, TE, NC State ~ 6'5 270

He has been a bit injury prone, but the guy when healthy is one of the best Pass catching TE's in the NCAA. Coming from a Steelers fan I realize how effective the TE is in Gashing the Steelers Defense. Struggling with K2, Heap every so often, etc.. It's almost a known that Cincy hasn't had a passcatching TE in a long time. Coats was an excellent TE->FB guy but right now I don't see that guy (Utecht is a solid #2). Hill is a physical Mauler in the run game, but he is excellent from 0-12 yards from Scrimmage and finds the hole.

7) Eric VandenHeuvel, OT, Wisconsin ~ 6'8 330lbs

His protection won't wow you initially but he is showing progress by leaps and bounds. Raw Mauler who could possibly play LT in 2-4 years, but is likely better suited as a future RT.


In 2010... Aim for:

Adam Ulatoski, Sam Young, Arrelious Benn, Dez Bryant, or a Ballhawkin Safety in Round 1.

Bengals78
10-23-2008, 08:36 PM
We wont go DT in round two this year. We have 2 really young guys in Sims and Shirley and Sims has looked really good so far. Other wise I like it.

PalmerToCJ
10-23-2008, 09:04 PM
Odom's contract makes me unsure on if we'd take a DE or not. He got a big deal and he'd only be one year into it but something has to be done about the pass rush and DE is the spot that needs addressed.

I'd love to trade CJ for a 2nd rounder. Then you go DE/MLB/OT in the first... Then OC/OL/MLB with the second round picks.

I don't see them going DT at all. Peko is a man, Sims has shown potential and Shirley hasn't been able to develop. I say they go the usual route of signing an old dinosaur to backup DT. I'd say DE would only be a round 1 deal going after an elite guy, maybe a pass rush specialist in the 3rd or 4th.

hobbes2053
10-23-2008, 11:07 PM
I like what you've drawn up for us Mr. Stiller. I do doubt (like many others) that we go DT early, or at all, because we are seeing progress from the new guys. I really want to see Shirley develop - he could be a huge presence inside. Overall though, I would love to see the majority of those picks.

PalmerToCJ
10-23-2008, 11:55 PM
Stiller is as good as anyone on here that's not a Bengals fan at picking out our needs and laying out a good draft.

That one is spectacular less the DT (say we don't trade CJ and just take a C it's perfect). Unger sounds like a guy we'd take, they love versatile guys on the Oline.

Man we need a Center...

StripedWalrus
10-24-2008, 12:45 AM
It really sucks that the consensus is CJ is only worth a 2... I wish we could get a 1 out of him...would be nice.

hobbes2053
10-24-2008, 01:32 AM
We might have been able to last year but with his numbers being so low I doubt anyone gives up a 1 for CJ :(

Mr. Stiller
10-24-2008, 02:40 AM
We wont go DT in round two this year. We have 2 really young guys in Sims and Shirley and Sims has looked really good so far. Other wise I like it.

I can see that, I'll be honest I haven't watched many Bengal games (Other than Pitt and NYG)..

Sims shows potential. I just am Worried that Shirley hasn't matured and You know he did drive a car into a House while intoxicated. I'm just not sure he's a definite long term investment.


Odom's contract makes me unsure on if we'd take a DE or not. He got a big deal and he'd only be one year into it but something has to be done about the pass rush and DE is the spot that needs addressed.

I like Odom, but he's really nothing with a dominant presence next to him. He's a solid 4-5 Sack guy that's really more suited to stop the run (Justin Smith?).. but I can't see why you can't draft a guy like Orakpo in the first (I have no idea where you guys end up, I'm guessing between 6-12 because I can't see you going winless the whole season).

Geathers is an unheralded and underrated SDE and I like the guy, but he can't even be effective if there's no pass rush across from him. Worst case scenario year 1, Orakpo sits as he gets acclimated and is your 2nd/3rd down Rusher or Nickel DE.

I'd love to trade CJ for a 2nd rounder. Then you go DE/MLB/OT in the first... Then OC/OL/MLB with the second round picks.

I can't see there being 31 teams and not one bites on that (Minnesota comes to mind) for atleast a 2nd rounder. Granted Moss didn't get that much and was a hair younger.. With a good system he has shown to be a productive player and getting a 2nd from Minny would've been a good deal (Not to mention the Ocho Cinco Purple Uni sales).

I don't see them going DT at all. Peko is a man, Sims has shown potential and Shirley hasn't been able to develop. I say they go the usual route of signing an old dinosaur to backup DT. I'd say DE would only be a round 1 deal going after an elite guy, maybe a pass rush specialist in the 3rd or 4th.

You don't have to explain Peko to me. He's definitely one guy I'd love to have on the Steelers. Sims has shown potential, but even if/when he's ready it wouldn't be bad to get another guy to try in a rotation. Sims could Play NT on passing downs and Hood could play UT on passing downs giving you serious interior pressure. Maybe I see it as BPA. I like Sims, I just think Hood is off the charts and underrated. I See him as a bigger, Stronger, faster and overall better Version of Trevor Laws. I was very high on Laws for you.

And I explained my concern for Shirley.



I like what you've drawn up for us Mr. Stiller. I do doubt (like many others) that we go DT early, or at all, because we are seeing progress from the new guys. I really want to see Shirley develop - he could be a huge presence inside. Overall though, I would love to see the majority of those picks.

In that case I wouldn't think it insane to see you jump for maybe Brian Robiskie, Clint Sintim(SLB/Nickel Rusher), Travis Beckum. Beckum is an interesting Pick for you. Not big enough to play TE, but is as reliable as they come and would give you a 6'3 240lbs (Try to get him to 225-230) Top notch receiving option.


I was a Huge fan of Shirley the last 2 years until he just snapped and then I found out that he had that DUI. Something is wrong there. Makes me think of Tommy Blake. Except Blake turned to God and Shirley to Drinking and Driving.





I'm debating who would be the most value there.


Sintim who could play SLB, Nickel Passrusher/blitzer
Beckum who could play some H-back/WR Role (Kind of a Smaller slower K2)
Brian Robiskie Reliable #2 to TJ.

themaninblack
10-24-2008, 08:23 AM
I kinda wanna give Shirley the benefit of the doubt at this point though I have little reason to do that. I heard when he first got here they took him on a tour of the city and they went to see Chris Henry to show him what happens when you don't do things the right way. They then proceeded to take him to John Thornton's house to show him what can happen if he can stay out of trouble and fulfill his potential. Seems like a good way to do things and he has been fine by all accounts thus far. I really hope he develops because he could be a real game changer at DT.

Though, with our luck he'll probably stab somebody.

CincinnatiBengals15
10-26-2008, 01:58 AM
Anybody else think we should trade chad and keep TJ and give him the contract he deserves

The fact that TJ is still trying even though offense sucks and Chad is out there crying and complaining like i am and not trying anymore

StripedWalrus
10-26-2008, 02:00 AM
Anybody else think we should trade chad and keep TJ and give him the contract he deserves

The fact that TJ is still trying even though offense sucks and Chad is out there crying and complaining like i am and not trying anymore

There are already posts all over the Bengals section about trading Chad or TJ...take a look and read instead of spouting all night.

CincinnatiBengals15
10-26-2008, 02:03 AM
There are already posts all over the Bengals section about trading Chad or TJ...take a look and read instead of spouting all night.

Sorry but Ohio State lost tonight so i have not been in a good mood and bengals still are sucking and dont do anything about it

Bengals78
10-26-2008, 12:34 PM
Sorry but Ohio State lost tonight so i have not been in a good mood and bengals still are sucking and dont do anything about it

Then go cry in the college football forum

Bengalsrocket
10-26-2008, 09:39 PM
Why do people think Chad isn't trying?

themaninblack
10-26-2008, 09:48 PM
Ya I don't really get that impression when I watch him. I think that shoulder injury is playing a big part in his lack of success. That said, I wouldn't mind seeing him go.

CincinnatiBengals15
10-26-2008, 11:34 PM
How about this Mock Draft

1st Round-New Owner
2nd Round-New Head Coach
3rd Round-New Offensive Coor.
4th Round-New Defensive Coor.
5th Round-New OL Coach
6th Round-New DL Coach
7th Round-Center

PalmerToCJ
10-26-2008, 11:38 PM
How about this Mock Draft

1st Round-New Owner
2nd Round-New Head Coach
3rd Round-New Offensive Coor.
4th Round-New Defensive Coor.
5th Round-New OL Coach
6th Round-New DL Coach
7th Round-Center

I understand your criticism but lets try to be a little more constructive. And for the record, if we got a new owner that draft would be made for me.

I've missed the last two games. One I was in the middle of nowhere and couldn't get much for reception/electricity and today my sister had a damn wedding so I only saw it on stattracker. I'll make the general assumption that Ghiaciuc still sucks and I'm pretty comfortable about it.

twizbuck
11-03-2008, 08:53 PM
I want to post a mock I wrote up and have been mulling around for awhile:

"So before I mentioned (http://boards.bengals.com/showthread.php?t=33627) that we probably won't look for a LT because of current personnel at the position and the money invested, as well as Mike Brown himself. Well, I'm starting to think that maybe we just shouldn't look for one. Here's why: we already have a talented LG that can play LT in Whit, and likely can play it well. We still need a Center, and if we move Whit, we can pick up a very good Guard prospect later on, leaving the first round pick for a skill position. I did make a mock a few days ago (http://boards.bengals.com/showthread.php?t=33794), but this one has a bit of a different look and a much different flavor. Here's the mock I'm currently mulling around:

Round 1: Chris "Beanie" Wells, RB, The Ohio State
Round 2: Jonathan Lugis, C, Arkansas
Round 3: Brandon Carter, OG, Texas Tech
Round 3 (comp): Jason Phillips, MLB, Texas Christian
Round 4: Connor Barwin, DE/TE, Cincinnati
Round 5: Mark Parson, CB, Ohio
Round 6: Eric Kettani, FB, Navy
Round 7: Chris Evans, OLB, Auburn

Here's what I'm thinking: Chris Wells gives us a very strong tandem game with Benson. Now, neither one is a change of pace kind of guy, because they're both all-around type backs with strength, burst, and vision, plus Beanie brings a big home run threat despite not being a real fast back. Those two, plus a talent FB in Eric Kettani who's a legit rush threat, would make for a very nice backfield.

We obviously still need a Center so we pick up one with lots of talent and ability in Lugis early in the second, and in the third we pick up our new LG, Brandon Carter. This guy is huge, quick, aggressive, and loves to run block but can also pass block as he plays in a system where they love to throw at any given time. He's a Junior, so he may not come out unless he's a first day guy, but I've also been told by a few TTech fans that if they do win the Big XII this year, Carter is likely to go while he's a hot commodity. This is what our starting O-line would look like if we were to move Whit to LT:

LT: Whitworth
LG: Carter
C: Lugis (once he's ready)
RG: Williams
RT: Collins (we get rid of Andrews or just put him on the bench as he makes it painfully obvious he doesn't want to be here)

To me, that's looking real good. That's a relatively young line with lots of talent.

Then we move into the comp picks, and nab a MLB who, with time, could be a steal in Jason Phillips. He certainly won't be ready during his first season, but Jones has been a pleasant suprise and could be a good mentor for him. Looking into the 4th we nab a hard working, versatile local guy in Barwin. I love versatility and hard working attitudes, and he's nothing short of either attribute. If he doesn't work out as a rotational guy at DE, we can give him looks at TE. Not there either? Look at him as a LB. Heck, we could have him in rotation on both sides of the ball if his potential maxes out.

In the 5th we pick up Mark Parson, who can be a great NB option, and can return kicks with Caldwell, once Caldwell is healthy. He tends to get a little over his head though, (muffed kicks, poor coverage decisions) but in a limited NB role he should be just fine. In the 6th Kettani is a phenominal late pickup. A FB coming out of an option offense, he's a strong run threat and can get us those tough short yards as well as a few yards on a first or second down run with his good burst for his size, and is a very good lead blocker. In the 7th we get a special teams/backup LB talent in Evans that's a backup on one of the top defenses in the nation this year in CFB, but has been key in filling in for guys with injury. Without him they wouldn't be as good as they have been.

So, that's what I'm looking at going into this draft at this moment. It's just a thought, and not really something I'm ready to run with yet, but if it's something with strong potential I think it's a very good option to run with."

Link - http://boards.bengals.com/showthread.php?t=34095

Bengals78
11-03-2008, 10:18 PM
No RB in round 1.

twizbuck
11-03-2008, 10:55 PM
No RB in round 1.

Insightful.

Bengals78
11-03-2008, 11:20 PM
Why would we? We cant say Benson is the long term answer but he is looking good so far. OLine is more important than RB at this point. Especially one named Beanie Wells. He is not what we need in a RB. If Benson stays, he is a grinder like Wells. We need a home run big play threat not another grinder. Bettis/Parker. White/Johnson. You have your grinder and your big play guy.
OT, MLB or BPA that suits a need (DE, OLB before RB)

hobbes2053
11-04-2008, 12:26 AM
Im meh with the mock. Nothing really special on there. IF we take an RB in the 1st, I'll shoot myself. Our biggest needs as of now (in no particular order): C, MLB, OT, DE, RB

CincinnatiBengals15
11-04-2008, 12:35 AM
What i would like to see the bengals do in draft

1st-Brian Orakpo DE Texas
I know the bengals gave Odom a big contract but i think he is more of situtation passer rusher this pick would move him or geathers out the starting line up and make one of them a situtation passer

2nd-Anotoine Caldwell C Alabama
I think Alabama has the best OL in the country and i think one big resason is this guy right here and we defentley need a C i can see this guy coming in and maybe starting right off the bat or starting sometime in the season

3rd-Ian Johnson RB Boise State
I have also been a fan of this epecially after the Fiesta Bowl i think he is smart player and tough runner and he does not turn the ball over that ofter something we need after seeing the Chris Perry Fumble everygame he started we could re-sign benson but i still think we need a young RB

4th-Corey Smith OLB/DE Cincinnati
I think he is one of the sleepers of the draft after seeing what he has done this year i really like him i think he could put on some more weight but i could see him as a decent backup and 3rd passer rushering LB

5th-Jacob Lacey CB Oklahoma State
I think we could use some more depth at CB postion gives us a another young guy to work into the CB roation and i could see this being a very good special teamer

6th-Terril Byrd DT Cincinnati
I see Thorton gone after this year and drafting Sims and Shirley last year we dont really have a pressing need for a DT epecially since Sims is coming along faster then most people thought i just see this guy working into DT roation and being a solid back up


7th-Jamario O' Neal S Ohio State
Pretty much a Special Teamer and Jackson will probley gone after the year gives us anthoer young S to work in epecially after all the injuries we have had to S this year

twizbuck
11-04-2008, 12:58 AM
Why would we? We cant say Benson is the long term answer but he is looking good so far. OLine is more important than RB at this point. Especially one named Beanie Wells. He is not what we need in a RB. If Benson stays, he is a grinder like Wells. We need a home run big play threat not another grinder. Bettis/Parker. White/Johnson. You have your grinder and your big play guy.
OT, MLB or BPA that suits a need (DE, OLB before RB)

If you don't believe Beanie and Knowshon are big play guys then there's a problem. They're legit threats. Also, they'd be the starter, not Benson.

Im meh with the mock. Nothing really special on there. IF we take an RB in the 1st, I'll shoot myself. Our biggest needs as of now (in no particular order): C, MLB, OT, DE, RB

Nothing special? I do believe all of those players are very special ones indeed. Then again, I'm not one for just celebrating the big names.

I do agree we need a Center first, but we can't pick one first. Johnson may be availible at DE when we pick as it seems like every team that should be drafting top 10 will need a DE, but with what we have tied into Odom and Geathers I don't see it happening. OT is a need but it's solved inside the team, and also we do have a lot tied into Levi and Andrews, so drafting yet another with Collins and Whitworth already on the roster would appear to be a waste with the office.

Not to mention I have no love for Laurinaitis or Maualuga and would be extremely disappointed if we drafted either in the first...

BengalMedic
11-04-2008, 07:28 AM
Yep, just say NO to a running back in the first. To much money tied up in that pick when talent can be had later on. O-line is still the best way to spend that top 5 money in the first and while Whitworth MAY be solid at LT, there is a reason he has been playing guard.

Also put me in the camp that thinks 3 rookies that start and transplanting your guard to tackle equals another year of Carson running for his life and he doesn't do that well, so look for more broken noses.

I do like the Luigs pick and think either him or Alex Mack would be MORE than welcomed in stripes next year. I would also like to see LB addressed earlier than the 7th for our second LB pick of the draft.

I'm not trying to pick it apart because it is still to early to tell what's going to happen, who's going to get traded, and which players are going to leave college early. I enjoy mock drafts though and think they are fun.

Bengalsrocket
11-04-2008, 08:39 AM
I dislike the mentality that you can get good RB talent in the late rounds. Yes, you can do that. But you can get good talent for any position in the late rounds if you draft well. And while colleges seem to produce running back as easily as rabbits mate, I have a hard time thinking that a pick like Adrian Peterson or LaDainian Tomlinson were not worth their respective draft spots.

However, I think that we have more pressing needs than RB. We need a center and MLB far more than a RB, and while RB is still a need, picking up an average running back in the later rounds would be sufficient for now.

Bengals78
11-04-2008, 11:02 AM
If you don't believe Beanie and Knowshon are big play guys then there's a problem. They're legit threats. Also, they'd be the starter, not Benson.



I never even mentioned Moreno in my post. Knowshon is a big playmaker, I think he will be in the NFL. Wells, IMO, is not gonna have the break away speed to be a homerun threat in the NFL.

Bengals78
11-04-2008, 11:17 AM
I do agree we need a Center first, but we can't pick one first. Johnson may be availible at DE when we pick as it seems like every team that should be drafting top 10 will need a DE, but with what we have tied into Odom and Geathers I don't see it happening. OT is a need but it's solved inside the team, and also we do have a lot tied into Levi and Andrews, so drafting yet another with Collins and Whitworth already on the roster would appear to be a waste with the office.

Not to mention I have no love for Laurinaitis or Maualuga and would be extremely disappointed if we drafted either in the first...

If we draft Michael Johnson, I will cry. He is not worth a top 10 pick. Im not sold on him being top 20 at this point. If we go DE in round one his name better be Brian Orakpo.

Whitworth needs to stay at guard. He is best suited there and he did get eaten alive by speed rushers when he was at LT last year. We cannot afford another year of Carson with broken noses and being blindsided.

As for the two MLB's...James is overrated and needs to be in the right system to succeed in the NFL. Cover 2. Think Bears, Bucs and Colts.
Rey, is raw but still has the talent to be amazing. With Zimmer as DC, I think his potential could be tapped and he would be an instant up grade over anything we could throw out there now.

1. Andre Smith OT Bama
2. Jasper Brinkley ILB SC
3. Eric Wood C UL
4. Stryker Sulak DE Mizzou
5. Kory Sheets RB Purdue
6. Ian Campbell OLB KState
7. Thomas Morstead P SMU

hobbes2053
11-04-2008, 12:13 PM
If we draft Michael Johnson, I will cry. He is not worth a top 10 pick. Im not sold on him being top 20 at this point. If we go DE in round one his name better be Brian Orakpo.

...

1. Andre Smith OT Bama
2. Jasper Brinkley ILB SC
3. Eric Wood C UL
4. Stryker Sulak DE Mizzou
5. Kory Sheets RB Purdue
6. Ian Campbell OLB KState
7. Thomas Morstead P SMU

The only DE I'd be satisfied with is Orakpo. Simply put, he's a goddamn freak.

Solid mock right there. The picks that stick out to me are Brinkley and Sheets, both of which I could see fitting in quite nicely.

Bengals78
11-04-2008, 01:03 PM
Sheets is finally having another good year and I think he will be a solid player in the NFL. RB Depth: Benson, Sheets, 3rd Down: Perry.

As for DE if we go DE on day one, it better be Orakpo. I like Stryker on day two.
Im really interested to see where Campbell falls, I like him and think he could go higher, a lot higher.

themaninblack
11-04-2008, 05:57 PM
Eric Wood would be a nice center to draft. Local kid who is a mauler in the run game and solid in pass pro.

rickscott
11-05-2008, 08:19 AM
" I have a hard time thinking that a pick like Adrian Peterson or LaDainian Tomlinson were not worth their respective draft spots."

If our Offensive line is not straightened out and strengthened to be able to provide excellent protection for our "franchise" and finally put some guys in place that can run block, a high pick of a RB would be nothing more than some guy running into the backs of our Guards and Tackles. Build from your lines out. This club hasn't been even adequate at run blocking for about 3 years. Gotta correct that problem . Beanie Wells and Moreno have shown themselves to be only adequate at times this year and Wells has shown some immaturity too. I don't believe either one of them is an LT or a AP. Draft an OT and a C in rds 1-2

Bengals78
11-05-2008, 09:05 AM
C is not a highly valued draft position, so if we do not get a top Center, we shouldnt jump the gun and draft one for the sake of drafting. There is a lot of depth at C this year and if Eric Wood could fall to the 3rd, we take him then and fix another position with value in round 2. I agree with drafting an OT in round one if one of value is there.

Bengalsrocket
11-05-2008, 09:51 AM
" I have a hard time thinking that a pick like Adrian Peterson or LaDainian Tomlinson were not worth their respective draft spots."

If our Offensive line is not straightened out and strengthened to be able to provide excellent protection for our "franchise" and finally put some guys in place that can run block, a high pick of a RB would be nothing more than some guy running into the backs of our Guards and Tackles. Build from your lines out. This club hasn't been even adequate at run blocking for about 3 years. Gotta correct that problem . Beanie Wells and Moreno have shown themselves to be only adequate at times this year and Wells has shown some immaturity too. I don't believe either one of them is an LT or a AP. Draft an OT and a C in rds 1-2

Just read my whole post, jeez. I already admitted that RB wasn't our greatest need, and that I don't want one early out of this draft.

Bengals78
11-05-2008, 10:08 AM
RB talent can be found in the mid rounds. We can wait until then. We need to shore up the Oline and get a MLB in the first three.
OT C MLB but in that order necessarily

themaninblack
11-05-2008, 11:00 AM
Ya I agree that RB should not be picked very early and our biggest focuses should be OL and MLB. We could also go DE early if a big time player falls into our laps.

Bengals78
11-05-2008, 12:08 PM
If there is no OT of value at our pick and same with MLB, I would not be opposed to drafting Brian Orakpo and Brian Orakpo only at DE.

hobbes2053
11-05-2008, 12:09 PM
RB talent can be found in the mid rounds. We can wait until then. We need to shore up the Oline and get a MLB in the first three.
OT C MLB but in that order necessarily

We shouldn't even be thinking about RB until the 3rd, at the very earliest. Kory Sheets is looking more and more appealing to me, knowing that he won't be picked up 'til later.

We could also go DE early if a big time player falls into our laps.

Orakpo?

Bengals78
11-05-2008, 02:05 PM
It better be Orakpo. If the name Michael Johnson comes up...

rickscott
11-05-2008, 05:44 PM
Just read my whole post, jeez. I already admitted that RB wasn't our greatest need, and that I don't want one early out of this draft.
I know but we are seeing lots of mocks with us taking Wells and I just wanted to point out that I think it would be crazy.

themaninblack
11-05-2008, 06:01 PM
I would avoid Beanie Wells like the plague. I just do not see it in this guy.

Bengals78
11-05-2008, 06:03 PM
yeah. I dont want Beanie at all. Just not what we need in the first round.

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 12:41 AM
yeah. I dont want Beanie at all. Just not what we need in the first round.

...or ever :D and that's coming from a Buckeye fan lol.

PalmerToCJ
11-06-2008, 12:49 AM
I don't feel that Beanie is in that elite RB class that goes top 3. OT/DE/MLB seems like the pick at this point.

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 02:40 AM
I don't feel that Beanie is in that elite RB class that goes top 3. OT/DE/MLB seems like the pick at this point.

God I hope so. Anything else would be preposterous.

BengalMedic
11-06-2008, 07:34 AM
I know Orakpo was carried off the field in the texas Tech game with a knee injury and I haven't seen any reports on the outcome. Anyone have info on that ?? That would be a shame if it was serious...

Bengals78
11-06-2008, 07:59 AM
I heard his leg was severed but has grown back due to his freakishness.

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 10:12 AM
http://www.*************.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=33734&draftyear=2009&genpos=DE

11/03/08 - Texas lost its top pass-rushing specialist, DE Brian Orakpo, with a strained knee he suffered in the third quarter at Texas Tech. Orakpo, who entered the game with 8.5 sacks, did not return and was replaced by Henry Melton.

That was all I could find about the injury. Hopefully he's not broken.

PalmerToCJ
11-06-2008, 11:52 AM
God I hope so. Anything else would be preposterous.

Haha yeah I guess that was a Mr. Obvious statement by me.

I'd like to see...

1. OT
2. MLB
3. C

I think in terms of value to be had it's great for all of those positions. A bulk of the elite OT's are very early picks, you can find a VERY productive MLB in the 2nd round and there should be good centers on the board round 3.

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 02:51 PM
Brinkely is very appelaing to me at MLB. Big thumper type player from the always tought SEC. He could bring a lot to our young defense.

Bengals78
11-06-2008, 03:05 PM
Brinkleys biggest knock will be his weight and his speed. I think he can work through it at the pros. It is not a big enough deterrent for me to say not to take him in rd 2 if he is there.

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 03:43 PM
Speed and weight can always be improved upon. At least he's not semi-******** like Ahmad :(

ChezPower4
11-06-2008, 07:37 PM
Brinkely is very appelaing to me at MLB. Big thumper type player from the always tought SEC. He could bring a lot to our young defense.

I think that the NFL fits Brinkely's style of play very well and I don't think that his speed will be that much of an issue. He's like you said a down hill thumper and should be a great linebacker against the run. My main concern with him is can he cover in the NFL due to some of his athletic shortcomings?

PalmerToCJ
11-06-2008, 08:56 PM
You know I hadn't been looking into the 2nd round and later prospects much but I looked at Scott's rankings at MLB and I was interested by Brinkley as well. I don't watch a ton of college football but I've seen one or two SC games and the guy makes plays. I'd be interested in him for sure.

Bengals78
11-06-2008, 09:10 PM
He played really really well against Georgia this year. He can lay lumber and he showed pretty good bursts of speed. He just needs to lose a little weight to stay on top of NFL TEs and such ,

hobbes2053
11-06-2008, 09:37 PM
I can see him losing some weight going into the combine in hopes of eliminating the doubters/getting picked higher. I just feel that he would fit right in with our defense. If he really devotes himself, he could be a real leader and possibly have the impact that Odell did in his rookie campaign.

PalmerToCJ
11-06-2008, 11:22 PM
I can see him losing some weight going into the combine in hopes of eliminating the doubters/getting picked higher. I just feel that he would fit right in with our defense. If he really devotes himself, he could be a real leader and possibly have the impact that Odell did in his rookie campaign.

Exactly why I am all about a round 2 MLB. You always see impact rookie LB's from the 2nd round ala our old buddy Odell.

Bengals78
11-07-2008, 10:04 AM
Ryans in Houston was a second rounder. There is a lot of talent out there.

PalmerToCJ
11-11-2008, 12:33 PM
Scott's newest mock has us taking Beanie... BARF!

I'll go insane if we take him with our top 5 pick.

themaninblack
11-11-2008, 06:24 PM
I would do the same. Avoid Beanie Wells like the plague!

hobbes2053
11-11-2008, 10:38 PM
...or any early RB for that matter.

Bengals78
11-12-2008, 02:01 PM
Im working up a mock for the League and for us I have us taking Orakpo and Brinkley. What do you all say?

PalmerToCJ
11-12-2008, 04:39 PM
...or any early RB for that matter.

Given who's there, no doubt. OT/DE/LB and don't look back. Granted, given the money they'll be owed I'm sure whoever we draft will be holding out this time next year lol.

hobbes2053
11-12-2008, 07:08 PM
Im working up a mock for the League and for us I have us taking Orakpo and Brinkley. What do you all say?

Go for it! That would be awesome IMO.

Bengalsrocket
11-12-2008, 07:11 PM
If we take DE, what do we do with Geathers and Odom?

Bengals78
11-12-2008, 07:16 PM
Well Geathers hasnt produced in the past 2 years. Maybe he could be our situational rusher. Orakpo/Odom start. Geathers/Orakpo on passing downs.

Or if we do start to play more 3-4, Geathers could learn OLB for that. He played it a little last year and didnt come off as completely lost.

twizbuck
11-13-2008, 11:44 AM
I'd be very frustrated if we went DE first round... I'm willing to give Geathers and Odom more time once we get the DT spot situated. Sims has been looking great.

BengalMedic
11-13-2008, 12:59 PM
Put me down for thinking it's hard to bust Geathers chops to much considering he played out of position almost all of last season and hasn't had much support from the interior of the D-line.

PalmerToCJ
11-13-2008, 01:22 PM
I think taking a DE just depends. If Sims is near the monster he was last game for the rest of the year, it makes our DE's look better and I think you don't have to take a pass rushing guy. I mean, you could really see the impact of actually having a DT collapse the pocket had on Odom/Geathers pass rush capabilities... It makes both of them look better.

If the pass rush doesn't pick up, it's easily our biggest struggle on defense at this point and something a good defense needs to have so I'm not against going DE. I'm hoping Sims picks it up and we can go MLB or OT in the first.

Anything but freaking Beanie.

Bengals78
11-13-2008, 02:05 PM
If we go Wells in round one...I quit football.

Menardo75
11-13-2008, 02:20 PM
Could someone rank me a list of the Bengals needs I am trying to put a mock together, and I figured you all knew more than me.

twizbuck
11-13-2008, 03:18 PM
Could someone rank me a list of the Bengals needs I am trying to put a mock together, and I figured you all knew more than me.

Mine:

1. C
2. SLB
3. OT
4. RB
5. MLB
6. CB
7. FB

I don't think we have needs at other positions.

twizbuck
11-13-2008, 03:47 PM
So I've come up with three different draft scenarios that I'd be pretty happy with, I'd just like feedback on each, though I've already posted the first one before:

Round 1: Chris "Beanie" Wells, RB, The Ohio State
Round 2: Jonathan Lugis, C, Arkansas
Round 3: Brandon Carter, OG, Texas Tech
Round 3 (comp): Jason Phillips, MLB, Texas Christian
Round 4: Connor Barwin, DE/TE, Cincinnati
Round 5: Mark Parson, CB, Ohio
Round 6: Eric Kettani, FB, Navy
Round 7: Chris Evans, OLB, Auburn

Round 1: Aaron Curry, SLB, Wake Forest
Round 2: Shonn Greene, RB, Iowa
Round 3: Antoine Caldwell, C, Alabama
Round 3 (comp): Jason Phillips, MLB, Texas Christian
Round 4: Pannel Egboh, DL, Stanford
Round 5: Mark Parson, CB, Ohio
Round 6: Eric Kettani, FB, Navy
Round 7: Rich Ohrnbeger, OG, Penn State

Round 1: Michael Oher, OT, Ole Miss
Round 2: Clint Sintim, LB, Virginia
Round 3: Eric Wood, C, Louisville
Round 3 (comp): Jason Phillips, MLB, Texas Christian
Round 4: Javarris Williams, RB, Tennessee State
Round 5: Mark Parson, CB, Ohio
Round 6: Eric Kettani, FB, Navy
Round 7: Kirston Pittman, DE, LSU

Bengals78
11-13-2008, 04:05 PM
The first two are not what we need. We do NOT need a running back on the first day. He would be useless without an OLine. We need our first 3 picks to go Defense and Oline. No RB before round four this year.

Bengals78
11-13-2008, 04:21 PM
My three best options:

Round 1: Andre Smith - OT Bama
Round 2: Jasper Brinkley - MLB South Carolina
Round 3: Antione Caldwell - C Bama
Round 4: Ian Campbell - OLB Kstate
Round 5: Kory Sheets - RB Purdue
Round 6: BPA
Round 7: BPA

Draft Andre to start ASAP at either RT or LT. Brinkley steps in at MLB Caldwell at C. Campbell is an intriguing OLB Prospect to me. He had a stellar year and Ive been waiting to see if he can bring it back and maybe at the next level with some more solid teammates he can. Sheets provides some solid depth at RB if we resign Benson.


Round 1: Rey Maualuga - MLB USC
Round 2: Herman Johnson - OG LSU
Round 3: Antione Caldwell - C Bama
Round 4: Ian Campbell - OLB Kstate
Round 5: Tony Dixon - RB UK
Round 6: BPA
Round 7: BPA

Move Whitworth to Tackle and draft Johnson to step in at guard. He played with Whit at LSU. Rey steps in and leads the D. Dixon provides explosiveness in the backfield hopefully without ball control issues.



Round 1: Andre Smith - OT Bama
Round 2: Jasper Brinkley - MLB South Carolina
Round 3: Antione Caldwell - C Bama
Round 4: Cedric Dockery - OG Texas
Round 5: Kenny Mainor - DE Troy
Round 6: BPA
Round 7: BPA

Draft Dockery to sit a year behind Williams and Whit if we draft Smith. Then Move Smith to LT when Levi is gone, Whit to RT and Dockery to LG. Mainor is an intriguing prospect to me who comes from the same school as Osi and DWare. Hidden talent?

hobbes2053
11-13-2008, 06:01 PM
The first two are not what we need. We do NOT need a running back on the first day. He would be useless without an OLine. We need our first 3 picks to go Defense and Oline. No RB before round four this year.

Truth.

Decent mocks. Not to wild about the 2nd, but still decent.

BengalMedic
11-14-2008, 10:58 AM
Mine:
1. OT
2. C
3. MLB
4. CB
5. OLB
6. RB
7. MLB

Menardo75
11-14-2008, 02:02 PM
So RB is for sure out then?

hobbes2053
11-14-2008, 04:36 PM
So RB is for sure out then?

For the 1st round? Most definitely. If we go RB before the 4th, I'll puke.

PalmerToCJ
11-14-2008, 08:23 PM
For the 1st round? Most definitely. If we go RB before the 4th, I'll puke.

I'll hold your hair but I'll be doing the same thing.

Menardo75
11-15-2008, 01:35 AM
I'll hold both of yours how's that?

themaninblack
11-15-2008, 05:22 PM
Pretty sure this will happen if we draft a RB early:
aRn5-LQCg2s

Bengals78
11-15-2008, 06:42 PM
Well that or Mike Brown wont be the owner anymore....
when was the last time we had a good martyr in town? lol jk

hobbes2053
11-15-2008, 07:32 PM
Pretty sure this will happen if we draft a RB early:
aRn5-LQCg2s

like this guy as well:
http://www.break.com/index/ipecac.html

Bengals78
11-15-2008, 08:32 PM
except we dont get the potential of gaining 1000 bucks. Unless you sell your tickets.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 12:56 AM
I'm not sure what you guys are seeing in our RB's that make you ok with them... as of now, I'm still going with Beanie first but I've changed my philosophy a bit after him:

1: Beanie Wells, RB, The Ohio State
2: Brandon Spikes, MLB, Florida/Darry Beckwith, MLB, Louisiana State (hoping Spikes slides but I do like Beckwith)
3: Antoine Caldwell, C, Alabama
3 (comp): Andy Levitre, OL, Oregon State
4: Pannel Egboh, DL, Stanford
5: Mark Parson, CB, Ohio
6: Eric Kettani, FB, Navy
7: Marcus Thigpen, RB, Indiana

I still don't believe we'll draft a new franchise LT. I don't believe that Mike Brown will even think to go that way. However, instead of going Center in the 2nd, we can pick up our new MLB to move Dhani to SLB for probably his last couple seasons and allow Jeanty to provide excellent depth with Johnson. Spikes hopefully, but probably Beckwith as I would think any team drafting ahead of us would nab him in the 2nd round if Spikes is there.

So moving down to third we get excellent value in Caldwell, then Levitre with a 3rd round comp that I'm thinking we should get to provide depth along the whole line. Egboh's battling injuries so he'll probably slide to the early 4th and he'll be great DL depth, then Parson becomes our new Nickel. Kettani brings a rushing and receiving threat from the FB spot as well as strong blocking, and Thigpen is a speed back and potential return threat.

BengalMedic
11-17-2008, 09:54 AM
If we don't address the Center position in the second when you have the ability to take one of the top two at the position, I will add to the PUKE factor with taking a RB in the first. Quite possibly our most glaring need to simply overlook. Value and need ?? Just do it and move on to the next pick !!!

Bengals78
11-17-2008, 11:57 AM
Us drafting a RB in the first round is like buying the keys to a 1967 Shelby GT but not the car. Without HOLES to run through we cannot run therefore OL > RB. The OLine is far more important than the RB. Denver proved this for years. If we can solidify the OLine (new center and new T) we can then look at RB or continue with our current set to see how they do.
Did anyone else notice Levi Jones was on the ground after almost every play?

BengalMedic
11-17-2008, 01:20 PM
Agreed about Denver. Seems like regardless of who they plugged in behind that line, they were running for better than 1000 yards that season.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 02:05 PM
Us drafting a RB in the first round is like buying the keys to a 1967 Shelby GT but not the car. Without HOLES to run through we cannot run therefore OL > RB. The OLine is far more important than the RB. Denver proved this for years. If we can solidify the OLine (new center and new T) we can then look at RB or continue with our current set to see how they do.
Did anyone else notice Levi Jones was on the ground after almost every play?

"I still don't believe we'll draft a new franchise LT. I don't believe that Mike Brown will even think to go that way."

Heck, the man who's site we post on agrees with that. Mike Brown has obviously never cared about attitude, but he does care about where his money is invested.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 02:07 PM
If we don't address the Center position in the second when you have the ability to take one of the top two at the position, I will add to the PUKE factor with taking a RB in the first. Quite possibly our most glaring need to simply overlook. Value and need ?? Just do it and move on to the next pick !!!

Ok, so if we can take a Center in Antoine Caldwell, who has potential for miles and is already a pretty good Center as it is now, in the 3rd, and can get our brand new impact starting MLB for the next several years, you wouldn't do so? Even if we drafted Mack he wouldn't start immediately anyway, why not go with someone who has strong abilities already with immense potential since he's going to be taking time to develop, and get an immediate impact at another position of need?

Bengals78
11-17-2008, 02:08 PM
You know just because Scott runs the site doesnt mean is the know all. I respect him and think he is an amazing scout and such however I think he is dead wrong there.

http://www.whodeyrevolution.com/

if he knows whats good for him...

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 02:12 PM
You know just because Scott runs the site doesnt mean is the know all. I respect him and think he is an amazing scout and such however I think he is dead wrong there.

http://www.whodeyrevolution.com/

if he knows whats good for him...

It's an example. I'm not the only one who believes this. The RB spot can have a huge impact on your game solely based on personnel. We've seen this every single year.

Bengals78
11-17-2008, 02:18 PM
Or it could be the offensive line. Since Braham retired, Steiny left, and Willie's injuries before he left we have had 0 running game. Unless we draft Barry Sanders' reincarnate, we have no right to draft a RB.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 02:21 PM
Or it could be the offensive line. Since Braham retired, Steiny left, and Willie's injuries before he left we have had 0 running game. Unless we draft Barry Sanders' reincarnate, we have no right to draft a RB.

It is in part the O-line. But what did Benson do his first game? Made this line look good. We give this line an impact RB who can make his own plays like a Beanie Wells or Knowshon Moreno, then it'll take pressure off of the line in the run game, and drafting our new Center will go a long way to helping as well. Hopefully we pick up a vet Center in the offseason to help our rookie Center develop.

Now, if we don't draft a Beanie in the first as Knowshon's ranking in the mid first right now, I really hope we draft Shonn Greene or Rashad Jennings in the second, otherwise I don't think we should even bother drafting one who's not coming in to replace Perry and become our new speed back. However right now I only think this will happen if we take Laurinaitis or Maualuga in the first.

Bengals78
11-17-2008, 02:38 PM
OK so if Benson can make them look good. WHY NOT LET BENSON play?
We get a stud OT in Andre Smith and a good center in rd 3, and Benson doesnt perform next year, we can draft a RB then. Moreno is not a lock to come out. Beanie is still only a Jr too. You build a team from the Oline out. We have enough at the skill positions.
It is more than the run game too. The passing game needs help. Is it our two pro-bowl receivers? Is it our stud QB who struggled last year before he got hurt this year? Or is it our OLine also has pass protection issues.
Oline fixes run problems and pass problems.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 02:57 PM
OK so if Benson can make them look good. WHY NOT LET BENSON play?
We get a stud OT in Andre Smith and a good center in rd 3, and Benson doesnt perform next year, we can draft a RB then. Moreno is not a lock to come out. Beanie is still only a Jr too. You build a team from the Oline out. We have enough at the skill positions.
It is more than the run game too. The passing game needs help. Is it our two pro-bowl receivers? Is it our stud QB who struggled last year before he got hurt this year? Or is it our OLine also has pass protection issues.
Oline fixes run problems and pass problems.

Because he was just another example. I don't believe he's the future nor should we completely invest in him. He really wasn't even decent last game, but behind him we have no one anyway and this is really a tandem back league, so on that premise alone a RB in the first day should be looked at.

I'm not sure why you're not understanding that I agree with you about the O-line, but I don't believe that we'll draft a new LT.

Bengals78
11-17-2008, 03:08 PM
And I dont think we will draft another RB who is an inside guy if youre calling for a tandem backfield. We should do what the titans and the giants and the cowboys...etc use. An inside runner (Benson) and a big play guy (Not Beanie).

But it should not be in round one. The fans will revolt.

hobbes2053
11-17-2008, 08:27 PM
OK so if Benson can make them look good. WHY NOT LET BENSON play?
We get a stud OT in Andre Smith and a good center in rd 3, and Benson doesnt perform next year, we can draft a RB then. Moreno is not a lock to come out. Beanie is still only a Jr too. You build a team from the Oline out. We have enough at the skill positions.
It is more than the run game too. The passing game needs help. Is it our two pro-bowl receivers? Is it our stud QB who struggled last year before he got hurt this year? Or is it our OLine also has pass protection issues.
Oline fixes run problems and pass problems.

78, you speaketh the truth. I'd be much happier if we went for OT, MLB, and C on the first day. An RB who does stand out that we could get in the 4th (or thereabouts) is Korey Sheets out of Purdue. He would compliment Benson well and give us a semi-decent RB tandem with Perry being a 3rd down guy.

OL is most definitely more important than RB. Benson was a sick RB at Texas and with a good line in front of him, he might be able to return to that form. Plus, like 78 mentions, the OL effects both the run game as well as the pass game.

PalmerToCJ
11-17-2008, 09:26 PM
And I dont think we will draft another RB who is an inside guy if youre calling for a tandem backfield. We should do what the titans and the giants and the cowboys...etc use. An inside runner (Benson) and a big play guy (Not Beanie).

But it should not be in round one. The fans will revolt.

BINGO!

The best part about this board is for some weird reason all of us Bengals fans are always on about the same page... It's weird really.

First they need a line to run behind, second they need a line to run behind, third they need a competent passing game and third we need someone to run.

For next season, I'm plenty fine with Benson/Perry/(3rd-4th round draft pick).

In hindsight, had Kenny Irons not been injured I would be thrilled with that pick while at the time I was PO'd.

twizbuck
11-17-2008, 11:29 PM
78, you speaketh the truth. I'd be much happier if we went for OT, MLB, and C on the first day. An RB who does stand out that we could get in the 4th (or thereabouts) is Korey Sheets out of Purdue. He would compliment Benson well and give us a semi-decent RB tandem with Perry being a 3rd down guy.

OL is most definitely more important than RB. Benson was a sick RB at Texas and with a good line in front of him, he might be able to return to that form. Plus, like 78 mentions, the OL effects both the run game as well as the pass game.

And I dont think we will draft another RB who is an inside guy if youre calling for a tandem backfield. We should do what the titans and the giants and the cowboys...etc use. An inside runner (Benson) and a big play guy (Not Beanie).

But it should not be in round one. The fans will revolt.

BINGO!

The best part about this board is for some weird reason all of us Bengals fans are always on about the same page... It's weird really.

First they need a line to run behind, second they need a line to run behind, third they need a competent passing game and third we need someone to run.

For next season, I'm plenty fine with Benson/Perry/(3rd-4th round draft pick).

In hindsight, had Kenny Irons not been injured I would be thrilled with that pick while at the time I was PO'd.

Well, I give up. The reasons for what I was saying were completely overlooked.

hobbes2053
11-18-2008, 12:22 AM
Well, I give up. The reasons for what I was saying were completely overlooked.

Not overlooked. Just not right. You are correct in saying that we need a RB. But it is for sure not our greatest need. Unless you have a Jim Brown, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, etc. back there behind our current OL, you won't have a very good running game. Our biggest need is easily OT and C. And we have to get a stud MLB. The current status of our needs in order of importance leaves RB at 4th at best, and I'm not so sure it's that big of a problem.

BengalMedic
11-18-2008, 08:05 AM
Here's my thing... Can we use a running back ?? Yes, of course we NEED one. I also see us picking up an additional 2nd with either a trade of players or trading down in the first. That being said, we would still be able to address RB within the first three rounds. I would have NO problem seeing 4 picks in the first 3 rounds go something like, OT, Center, MLB, and RB. In that order would be fine with me as well.

Hell, suprise the sh*t out of EVERY Bengals fan and go get us Jacobs during free agency !!!

I just think that money should be spent on a lineman that will be here to solidify that line for many years. Quite frankly, outside of a franchise type QB (see Carson) the only other places top 5 money should be spent is on the lines.

I will conceed that there are a few different directions to go in with regards to the draft and which player is taken, but any of those directions that leads to a RB with our first pick should be diverted...

thenewfeature06
11-18-2008, 08:20 AM
lol if they get jacobs they need a line and there good...but in my mock i have cincinnatti grabbing beanie in the first and OT Jason Smith from Baylor

Bengals78
11-18-2008, 09:55 AM
IF we do go after Jacobs in FA, we absolutely have to go OT and C in the first 3 rounds.
Through MLB in there somewhere and maybe a pass rush specialist with our comp pick and we should be good.

hobbes2053
11-18-2008, 11:43 AM
IF we do go after Jacobs in FA, we absolutely have to go OT and C in the first 3 rounds.
Through MLB in there somewhere and maybe a pass rush specialist with our comp pick and we should be good.

I think we have to go OT, MLB, C in the first 3 rounds regardless. If we get Jacobs (which is highly unlikely because our owner is Mike Brown), I will s**t myself. That would be disgustingly amazing.

Aftermath
11-18-2008, 08:23 PM
What if Collins plays outstanding starting now?

I dont think we would need a Tackle in round 1 if he shows incredible promise.

Bengals78
11-18-2008, 10:08 PM
What if Collins plays outstanding starting now?

I dont think we would need a Tackle in round 1 if he shows incredible promise.

Thats a BIG if though. If he showed so much promise, you would almost have to assume he would have been put in over Kooistra last week at Tackle

rickscott
11-19-2008, 07:34 AM
Adding Jacobs and Brown would make our draft like desert. We could really concentrate on a lot of smaller needs besides an OT. Get those 2 in free agency and you can pretty much devote rounds 2-7 to LBs and CBs and D-linemen

themaninblack
11-19-2008, 10:33 AM
Thats a BIG if though. If he showed so much promise, you would almost have to assume he would have been put in over Kooistra last week at Tackle

He was actually inactive last week because the team decided to have a backup Center instead of another T/G.

Bengals78
11-19-2008, 11:25 AM
Why didnt we put the back up C in?

hobbes2053
11-19-2008, 12:10 PM
Adding Jacobs and Brown would make our draft like desert. We could really concentrate on a lot of smaller needs besides an OT. Get those 2 in free agency and you can pretty much devote rounds 2-7 to LBs and CBs and D-linemen

We're going to need a center in the draft no matter what.

keylime_5
11-19-2008, 12:34 PM
lol if they get jacobs they need a line and there good...but in my mock i have cincinnatti grabbing beanie in the first and OT Jason Smith from Baylor

Smith is gonna be a top 20 pick I can tell you that.

Bengals78
11-19-2008, 06:23 PM
Smith is gonna be a top 20 pick I can tell you that.

I have him as my 3-4 OT now. He will be gone top 15 if he performs at the combine.

Aftermath
11-21-2008, 04:59 PM
What if Collins plays outstanding starting now?

I dont think we would need a Tackle in round 1 if he shows incredible promise.

So after Collins' outstanding game against a DPOY candidate, do we still take a LT with a top 5 pick?

I think not.

We need push on that front 4, im calling for Mr. Orakpo.

hobbes2053
11-21-2008, 05:05 PM
So after Collins' outstanding game against a DPOY candidate, do we still take a LT with a top 5 pick?

I think not.

We need push on that front 4, im calling for Mr. Orakpo.

See my thoughts in the Week 12: Pittsburgh thread. Exactly the same.

Bengals78
11-21-2008, 05:49 PM
Ok so lets say Collins continues to impress. IF he does,
Dream Offseason (semi-realistic i.e. no Jacobs):

Trade Chad (Figure, late 1st maybe or 2nd and something)
Trade Levi (He is still under contract correct? so why just dump salary for nothin? maybe a 3rd or 4th?)
Dump Andrews so he can go to where he wants to be.
Resign TJ to a nice healthy contract.
Sign Collins cheap now.

Draft:
Round 1a: Brian Orakpo DE Texas
We need pass rush like no other. We can't get to the QB to save our lives at this point. Orakpo is an everydown DE. He plays hard and plays fast. An Orakpo/Odom end duo sounds nice.

Round 1b: Alex Mack C Cal
DUH. The guy we claim to be a center now is gone. Hooray for a run game.

Round 2: Jasper Brinkley ILB SC
Dhani has been playing well lately and I think Jasper will fit into Zim's defense superbly once he spends a year under Jones learning.

Round 3: Cedric Dockery G Texas
Good blocker who will be a solid player for us. Williams isnt getting younger and he fits well into my plans later....

Round 3 (comp): Kory Sheets RB Purdue
Solid runner who we could count on to help carry the load. Has had a very good senior campaign and could be a steal if he is here.

Round 4a: Jordan Shipley WR Texas
Solid at everything. Runs clean routes. Gets open. Returns kicks. Could be a great addition to the offense. Especially with our new young guns being slow to stay healthy.

Round 4b:Brandon Underwood CB Cincinnati
With JJ back on IR, we could use some extra depth at CB for the future. Underwood is a solid prospect.

Round 5: Ian Campbell OLB Kansas St
We need some depth at OLB. Brandon Johnson has been better than I had hoped. And I want to see Campbell push him and I think he could.

Round 6: BPA
I like Tony Dixon around here. Or maybe a FB.

Round 7: BPA
Look for more ST help.

Then we should look like this come week 1:
Offense
QB: Carson (Duh)
RB: Benson/Sheets, Perry
FB: Coats
TE: Utecht, Kelly
WR: TJ, Caldwell, Shipley, Simpson & Holt
LT: Collins, Kooistra
LG: Dockery, Livings
C: Mack
RG: Williams, Livings
RT: Whitworth, Kooistra

Defense
DE: Odom, Orakpo/Geathers, Rucker, Henderson
DT: Sims, Peko, Shirley, Orien Harris
SLB: Brandon Johnson, Jeanty, Campbell
ILB: Jones, Brinkley
WLB: Rivers, Blackstock, Campbell
CB: JJ, Hall, Jones, Underwood, Castille
FS: White, Crocker
SS: Ndukwe, Crocker, Hebert

hobbes2053
11-21-2008, 06:14 PM
I read the first four picks and almost **** myself. That would be so amazing, words cannot describe.

Bengals78
11-21-2008, 06:21 PM
it all hinges on dumping the Ocho.
I have no quarrels with it. He could net us a late 1st IMO. A team like Chicago or maybe Tennessee....

hobbes2053
11-21-2008, 06:36 PM
I'm really looking for us to takre Orakpo in the first now that we've seen what Collins can do. Granted it was only one game, but it was against a very good defense, in a tough environment, etc. If we could some how manage to get Orakpo and Brinkley, I think we would have potentially one of the top defenses, almost instantly.

I would prefer to get Mack over Lugis for some reason. Mack is a brain and that is extremely helpful, especially at the center position.

Bengals78
11-21-2008, 06:49 PM
Yes it is. There is a reason Kevin Mawae is in charge of the Players Union

Bengals78
11-21-2008, 07:59 PM
I have a few things to add to the offseason:
Fire Brat.
Hire a new OC. (Maybe try to get Ken Anderson? Art Shell up to anything?Turner Gill?)
Hire a GM. Maybe a former player or something along those lines. (Munoz?)