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Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 12:51 PM
2 Years for Odell Thurman ~ Missed Drug Test + DUI
1 Year for Pacman ~ Array of crimes never convicted for.
4 Games for Jared Allen ~ 2 DUI's
4 Games for Darryl Blackstock ~ Performance Enhancing Drugs
0 Games for Matt Jones ~ Busted on Cocaine Possession.

and 2 things that irritated me off recently.

1) Ward getting Fined $5k for "Unnecessary Roughness" against Baltimore. He was never flagged and yet he's getting fined?

2) Roughing the Passer. It's ridiculous that looking at the QB warrants a flag anymore.

3) Criticism of the Refs. If you criticize the refs, it's a fine, but refs rarely get what they deserve. Docked pay, suspension etc.

Consistency of Calls. It seems if you hit certain QB's in the motion of throwing the ball it's a PF, others, you can mug, and it's not.

(For the ward deal: http://www.postgazette.com/pg/08283/918588-66.stm )

Lastly, can anyone comprehend how 2 DUI's = Performance Enhancing drugs?

He could have severely mamed or killed someone twice, and gets the same suspension as if he took some HGH, which would only affect him?

Well I guess if he cut Cocaine in his car he wouldn't have seen a suspension.

Bengalsrocket
10-09-2008, 12:55 PM
I don't think the league is currently a joke, but you're right; it is headed in that direction.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 12:58 PM
I don't think the league is currently a joke, but you're right; it is headed in that direction.

Well it may not be a complete joke, but it's been on a severely downhill slope.

Turtlepower
10-09-2008, 12:59 PM
Seriously, you wouldn't be bitching about what is going on if it didn't start to partially effect your own team.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:03 PM
Seriously, you wouldn't be bitching about what is going on if it didn't start to partially effect your own team.

hmm?

Yeah I'm a bit miffed at the deal with the reffing? Sure.

So because it partially affects my team (And all teams across the league) I shouldn't be allow to comment on it? Faulty logic.

Secondly, None of our players were suspended by the league.

All I'm asking for is some damn consistency.

You're telling me that the suspensions, fines and Reffing seems consistent throughout the league?

Fining someone blindly. Giving someone taking Performance Enhancers, and 2 DUI's the same sentence... Giving someone cutting Cocaine in their car no sentence....

yeah I can see how I'm being just a blind homer here. Great call.

awfullyquiet
10-09-2008, 01:06 PM
Lastly, can anyone comprehend how 2 DUI's = Performance Enhancing drugs?


I think both should get you kicked out of the league forever anyway.

All it takes is one person to do this, and then everyone sits the **** up and says. I'm not going there. People have to get the banhammer in the near future. I don't care how good they are. If you're a drunk driver, you don't deserve to play in the NFL, if you have FELONY CONVICTIONS, you do not deserve to play in the NFL. If you use PED's you should be suspended on first offense and then banned anytime after that.

The league wants its players to keep their noses clean (no pun intended), in some regards, it's completely fine that they suspend anyone they feel like, if it puts players into the mindset i have to watch what i'm doing outside of work and not get into trouble that will automatically get caught in public. That's their perogative.

Now, as far as the inability to do things with any sort of... well. rhyme or reason. i don't like that.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:09 PM
I think both should get you kicked out of the league forever anyway.

All it takes is one person to do this, and then everyone sits the **** up and says. I'm not going there. People have to get the banhammer in the near future. I don't care how good they are. If you're a drunk driver, you don't deserve to play in the NFL, if you have FELONY CONVICTIONS, you do not deserve to play in the NFL. If you use PED's you should be suspended on first offense and then banned anytime after that.

The league wants its players to keep their noses clean (no pun intended), in some regards, it's completely fine that they suspend anyone they feel like, if it puts players into the mindset i have to watch what i'm doing outside of work and not get into trouble that will automatically get caught in public. That's their perogative.

Now, as far as the inability to do things with any sort of... well. rhyme or reason. i don't like that.

Thats my point.

I can't see how missing 1 drug test + 1 DUI put Thurman out of the league for 2 years (The end of his very promising Career) at the same Time. 2 DUI's gets you a slap on the wrist.

Same for Pacman, not a fan because he is a bonehead, but, he has no reason to have been suspended if you're not suspending Jones? he was never convicted... but still got the ban hammer... why isn't Jones?

iowatreat54
10-09-2008, 01:09 PM
what he's saying is that if no one on your team had gotten in trouble for anything, you wouldn't be making this thread or complaining about the overall "joke" status that the league is in

idk about you personally, but most of the comments in recent threads would never exist had the poster's team not get screwed out of 1 call in the series of a season...prior to that one call, most of us could care less how it effected other teams

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 01:14 PM
Number 1): Refs are only humans. They cant see everything. So if i hit a guy and no one sees it, is it alright for me to get away with it? no.

2) I dont get what u want to say with it.

3) Why is this a joke? I mean seriously, u dont talk back to a ref, in any sport its a flag or a card. Its not like they earn a ******** and can be fined. They are there to control the game and are paid to do so. If a ref cant stop ******* up he will be fired. No need to fine them.

Lastly, can anyone comprehend how 2 DUI's = Performance Enhancing drugs?

The DUI's were kinda a while back, but I kinda agree that that wasnt enough. but Performance Enhancing drugs are totally forbidden and it's alright imo to suspend him. He is destroying the game with it. The DUI's is not affecting the game but really affecting the image of the league, if u get a DUI its not the leagues responsiblity. thats what courts and the law are for. but Goddell decides to suspend them additionally to that. Just because the two things have the same span of suspension doesn't mean he thinks DUI's are just as bad as HGH.

and for the Consistency of Calls: Give the refs a break. Its incredibly hard to judge such things. They are most in the blink of an eye and if u just blinked once u could miss a load. Its not like they dont want to make the right decision but refs are humans and cant be right everytime

Turtlepower
10-09-2008, 01:15 PM
hmm?

Yeah I'm a bit miffed at the deal with the reffing? Sure.

So because it partially affects my team (And all teams across the league) I shouldn't be allow to comment on it? Faulty logic.

Secondly, None of our players were suspended by the league.

All I'm asking for is some damn consistency.

You're telling me that the suspensions, fines and Reffing seems consistent throughout the league?

Fining someone blindly. Giving someone taking Performance Enhancers, and 2 DUI's the same sentence... Giving someone cutting Cocaine in their car no sentence....

yeah I can see how I'm being just a blind homer here. Great call.

What I am getting at is that the NFL was running fine until your team got some bad calls. Seriously, I don't understand where all of this "The NFL is going downhill" garbage is coming form. You have to impose fines sometimes for questioning the refs or else it will lead to a slippery slope. As far as the fining and suspensions for different involvements with the law, yes there does need to be more oversight on this matter. It is still in its infancy, so just give it a few years for things to be settled out. Players need to learn that it is a luxury to get a DUI and come back to work with only a few weeks of suspension. Many jobs might fire you for a DUI and make it very difficult to get another job.

And to your point of fining or suspending refs for mishaps, what would be the point? You can't fine them similar to players because they don't make nearly as much to compensate. Suspending them won't do any good because suspension doesn't lead to a better ref. I think that criticism of refs have gotten out of hand mostly due to everyone at home being able to see multiple angles of plays that it is impossible for refs to see. It seems that refs are supposed to be perfect at their jobs, but us as a society are exempt from that perfection in our professions.

nrk
10-09-2008, 01:17 PM
what he's saying is that if no one on your team had gotten in trouble for anything, you wouldn't be making this thread or complaining about the overall "joke" status that the league is in

idk about you personally, but most of the comments in recent threads would never exist had the poster's team not get screwed out of 1 call in the series of a season...prior to that one call, most of us could care less how it effected other teams

And he isn't even complaining about it. He mentions Hines Ward, but is obviously complaining about the consistency of führer Goodell.

iowatreat54
10-09-2008, 01:24 PM
And he isn't even complaining about it. He mentions Hines Ward, but is obviously complaining about the consistency of führer Goodell.

right, but as with most posters on this board, I have to think had Hines not gotten in any trouble whatsoever, this thread wouldn't even be made because there would be no connection to a Pittsburgh fan

I may be wrong, I don't mean to assume anything about the original poster, I'm just making a generalization of the threads criticizing the NFL and refs, where had the creator's favorite team not been effected then they wouldn't be complaining

Smooth Criminal
10-09-2008, 01:39 PM
The Steelers really arnt effected. Who gives a damn that Ward got fined? Not me. As long as it doesnt effect the game I could care less if Ward loses 5000.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 01:40 PM
The Steelers really arnt effected. Who gives a damn that Ward got fined? Not me. As long as it doesnt effect the game I could care less if Ward loses 5000.
he obviously did cause he pointed it out

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:41 PM
right, but as with most posters on this board, I have to think had Hines not gotten in any trouble whatsoever, this thread wouldn't even be made because there would be no connection to a Pittsburgh fan

I may be wrong, I don't mean to assume anything about the original poster, I'm just making a generalization of the threads criticizing the NFL and refs, where had the creator's favorite team not been effected then they wouldn't be complaining

You can take that generalization further.

Would most of the posters be asking "Who's the top 10" or "Who's the best" if it didn't somehow involve a player on their team?

I've been getting sick of the suspension deal for the better part of a year now, there was even a thread a while back.

The Ward thing kinda was the straw to break the camel's back, so to speak. The fact remains that the consistency isn't there.

Maybe fining/suspending the refs isn't in order... by why can't players/teams/fans be critical of them?

and lastly, Ignore the ward comment (Being fined for something they won't tell him).

Are the other points that have no relations to the Steelers true? Maybe Ignore my name, think my post out, then critique first.. instead of seeing "So and so said this about something and it's partially about their team".

The "Homer" label has gotten way out of hand on this site. Can't post anything involving your team.. or you're a homer. Sheesh.

TitleTown088
10-09-2008, 01:41 PM
You complain, yet, you're on an internet message board discussing it because you enjoy it so. See the Irony?

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:42 PM
he obviously did cause he pointed it out

My only point is, how can they fine someone for a play that wasn't flagged, and yet, don't point out what the exact play he was fined for?

But continue to ignore the other points just so you can continue to follow me around and call me a homer.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:42 PM
You complain, yet, you're on an internet message board discussing it because you enjoy it so. See the Irony?

Not really. Not sure how you're trying to make that work.

Smooth Criminal
10-09-2008, 01:43 PM
he obviously did cause he pointed it out

haha true. I dont get why fans ***** about their players getting fined. Who really cares? Not like we even know what play it was on to judge it for ourselves.

But I can agree with most of the thread that the rules have been very inconsistent for a year or so. Esspecially on holding calls and roughing the passer.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 01:44 PM
My only point is, how can they fine someone for a play that wasn't flagged, and yet, don't point out what the exact play he was fined for?

But continue to ignore the other points just so you can continue to follow me around and call me a homer.
i ******* posted a big paragraph but nevermind, live in your world

iowatreat54
10-09-2008, 01:44 PM
I agree with you on poster involvement if it didn't have anything to do with their team, and I don't mean to generalize you into the stereotype that I mentioned, but for the most part that is the case

and it is different between a "top 10 WRs" and complaining about rules or judgements...one is saying "My WR is better than yours" the other is complaining because your team was effected, whereas if your team was never involved in said dispute, then the majority of the time you wouldn't care because it doesn't effect you in anyway

again, I know it isn't you personally, but fans in general could care less if they don't have to complain about how their team is effected

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:47 PM
I agree with you on poster involvement if it didn't have anything to do with their team, and I don't mean to generalize you into the stereotype that I mentioned, but for the most part that is the case

and it is different between a "top 10 WRs" and complaining about rules or judgements...one is saying "My WR is better than yours" the other is complaining because your team was effected, whereas if your team was never involved in said dispute, then the majority of the time you wouldn't care because it doesn't effect you in anyway

again, I know it isn't you personally, but fans in general could care less if they don't have to complain about how their team is effected

My point was merely:

Here's Goodell's Track record... no consistency.
Suspensions: No Consistency.
Fines: No consistency.

The guy just seemingly makes stuff up as he goes.

I love all facets of the game.

I pay attention to the administrative side (FO/League). I study the draft... and I watch the players and games. I download what games I miss and try to watch as much as possible.

That said. The Roughing the Passer/Holding calls have been insanely pathetic the last 2 or so years. I would add the Stipulation that I think Ben Roethlisberger gets smashed far more often than any other QB and never a flag, but then again, I'm sure my point would be negated. I've seen quite a few QB's never draw a flag regardless the hit. I've seen several draw flags all the time, regardless the hit.

I was decently surprised the lack of Flags for hitting Brady in the superbowl.

That said... The suspension decisions are mind boggling.

Turtlepower
10-09-2008, 01:48 PM
My point was merely:

Here's Goodell's Track record... no consistency.
Suspensions: No Consistency.
Fines: No consistency.

The guy just seemingly makes stuff up as he goes.

You can't have consistency at the beginning because there is such a little amount to be used as precedent. In a few years, there will be consistency because there will be history to back up what different offenses call for.

iowatreat54
10-09-2008, 01:49 PM
My point was merely:

Here's Goodell's Track record... no consistency.
Suspensions: No Consistency.
Fines: No consistency.

The guy just seemingly makes stuff up as he goes.

that's a fair assessment

I'm just venting frustration from comments over reffing and I guess in effect complaints of how the league handles things, which while they may be inconsistent and seem unfair, the majority of the time fans would care less if nothing was happening to their team/players in both cases

TitleTown088
10-09-2008, 01:50 PM
Not really. Not sure how you're trying to make that work.

Really. You complain it's becoming a joke, yet you still follow it so closely you have made nearly 6,000 posts on a forum that deals directly with the NFL. You're caught in the web stiller.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 01:54 PM
Handing out Suspensions are not as easy to compare as other things. If you are looking for consistency, its kinda hard to see something like that after 1 year

Shane P. Hallam
10-09-2008, 01:56 PM
Popular + Ridiculous = More ratings.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:56 PM
Really. You complain it's becoming a joke, yet you still follow it so closely you have made nearly 6,000 posts on a forum that deals directly with the NFL. You're caught in the web stiller.

So, because I complain about the administration side, I can't enjoy the entertainment side?

Damn I thought I was on a forum to discuss Idea's and opinions. I guess i can only discuss others idea's and opinions. Sorry. Carry on.

and thirdly. I'm pretty sure this forum deals more directly with a subset of the NFL, the Draft. To which I'm very interested in following. None of the stuff I've pointed out has any relation to the draft or it's players.

But good job owning me there :)

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 01:59 PM
Handing out Suspensions are not as easy to compare as other things. If you are looking for consistency, its kinda hard to see something like that after 1 year

Even so. When you look at it, there is no fine line or ANY consistency. Granted it's been 1 year but still.

I don't even want to play the race side of it but seriously.


Missed drug Test + DUI = Ruined Career (out 2 seasons)
Being accused of crimes = 1 season
Convicted of 2 DUI's = 4 games
Cutting Cocaine up in your car = 0 games
Taking PED's to make you a better player = 4 games.

to me, DUI's should be taken very seriously as your not only putting yourself in danger, you're putting others in danger.

But I guess if Leonard Little is still playing, they shouldn't suspend for DUI's.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 02:04 PM
yes, but DUI dont really effect ur NFL play. its just the image. Goddell elects to suspend them. its not like he suspends one guy with DUI and one guy with a DUI doesnt

FlyingElvis
10-09-2008, 02:08 PM
Epic


Homerism or not if Ward gets fined it should be clear what he got fined for.

Goodell has little consistency but, like others have pointed out, it is the early stages of "Player Conduct" infractions and his overall Image Enhancing process. Once these things have been going on for a few years there will be more consistency. At the very least the NFLPA will start challenging the punishments based on precedence from previous instances.

To say the DUI suspension = HGH use suspension means Goodell sees them as equal infractions in the eyes of the NFL or society as a whole is foolish. One is a violation of a defined rule with defined penalties (performance enhancers) and the other falls under the newly instituted (albeit poorly defined) "Player Conduct" rule.

But holy shnikies people, jumping down the OP's throat calling the entire thread homerism seems a bit unwarranted and extreme.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 02:10 PM
yes, but DUI dont really effect ur NFL play. its just the image. Goddell elects to suspend them. its not like he suspends one guy with DUI and one guy with a DUI doesnt

Ok, You get fined for making a slash the throat sign.

The NFL is all about image.

You think most peoples jobs are going to keep them on with DUI's?

You're argument is the worst I heard. You're saying they shouldn't be suspended for DUI's because it has no effect on their play?

You suspend a guy with 1 DUI to 2 years. another to 4 games and someone busted for Cocaine to no games.

Atleast Alochol is legal.

Smooth Criminal
10-09-2008, 02:13 PM
DUI isn't legal even if alcohol is.

I'm expecting Jones to get suspended at some point for the Coke.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 02:16 PM
why dont u take the job of goddell then? u seem to have it all planned out and be alot better than him.

Im not saying that shouldnt suspend DUI guys, but rather that he elects to suspend them because of the image. If u take steroids or something, u will change the way u play and well it effects u, the guys that are playing and all those fans that are watching the game.

DUI and Performance enhancing substances are two different things. Goddell is not saying DUIs are as bad as those PES because he gives both of them the same time of suspension...

georgiafan
10-09-2008, 02:17 PM
There defitnetly needs to be a set of rules this case by case stuff doesn't seem fair.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 02:18 PM
There defitnetly needs to be a set of rules this case by case stuff doesn't seem fair.
Why? its the same stuff if u are arrested. Everything u do is case by case.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:00 PM
Why? its the same stuff if u are arrested. Everything u do is case by case.

If he's only suspending for Image. Why does it matter on a case by case basis?

He's obviously not "The Law" and they still have to atone to the local courts.


Which is why there is no reason for it to be handled case by case.

DUI = Set amount of time
2 DUIs = Set amount of time x4

It's not that hard to figure out.

Doesn't stop people from doing stuff if they feel that Good 'ol Goodell will let them off easy.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:01 PM
why dont u take the job of goddell then? u seem to have it all planned out and be alot better than him.

Im not saying that shouldnt suspend DUI guys, but rather that he elects to suspend them because of the image. If u take steroids or something, u will change the way u play and well it effects u, the guys that are playing and all those fans that are watching the game.

DUI and Performance enhancing substances are two different things. Goddell is not saying DUIs are as bad as those PES because he gives both of them the same time of suspension...

I would certainly have no issue taking his job. If it were offered, I'd take it. Since I don't have the opportunity I don't think I shouldn't be able to criticize it.

Just because I'm not the president of the USA doesn't mean I can't criticize his actions.

It seems like you don't really have an argument, more that you just want to argue my points.

Burns336
10-09-2008, 03:09 PM
What were the circumstances behind Allens DUI?

Honestly, some of the DUI **** is overblown. Are you telling me there is a difference between how an NFL player can drive if he is .08 or .1?

I mean, if he was staggering drunk that is ********, but if he was like 25-35 minutes away from blowing below the legal limit, I personally don't think its that bad.

A lot of people get so "**** this guy he should die for DUI!!!" on these boards without looking into what actually happened.

I think the degree should be taken into account. Maybe it was a ******** dui.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:11 PM
What were the circumstances behind Allens DUI?

Honestly, some of the DUI **** is overblown. Are you telling me there is a difference between how an NFL player can drive if he is .08 or .1?

I mean, if he was staggering drunk that is ********, but if he was like 25-35 minutes away from blowing below the legal limit, I personally don't think its that bad.

A lot of people get so "**** this guy he should die for DUI!!!" on these boards without looking into what actually happened.

I think the degree should be taken into account. Maybe it was a ******** dui.

I don't think you should be driving at a certain point. What that point is? When you lose the ability.

at the same time, the severity of DUI is pointless in this argument.

If it's Illegal, it's illegal. There's not differing severities of the same offense.

I don't think you can technically make any argument that taking Steroids should be on the level of DUI's.

DMWSackMachine
10-09-2008, 03:11 PM
I love the direction the league is going in. These kids need to realize that they are among the privileged few in the the world. Most guys on this message board would give away twenty years of their life to have the opportunity that these guys have, and if they can't keep themselves free and clear of the extra curricular stuff, stay out of trouble with the law, and abide the rules of the game, they should be punished.

You could argue all day long about severity of punishment, and what warrants what, but we are in a new era, and Goodell is just beginning to flesh out his policies on these matters. There isn't much of a track record for discipline, so of course there will be a large disparity at times between offenses, as his regime begins to hone the system they want in place.

I love it.

Absolutely not a joke.

ChezPower4
10-09-2008, 03:14 PM
What were the circumstances behind Allens DUI?

Honestly, some of the DUI **** is overblown. Are you telling me there is a difference between how an NFL player can drive if he is .08 or .1?

I mean, if he was staggering drunk that is ********, but if he was like 25-35 minutes away from blowing below the legal limit, I personally don't think its that bad.

A lot of people get so "**** this guy he should die for DUI!!!" on these boards without looking into what actually happened.

I think the degree should be taken into account. Maybe it was a ******** dui.

He's still breaking the law though. I agree with you some people can blow a
.08 and drive just fine. He's a high profile guy and when high profile players get into trouble no matter what it is ESPN and the media are going to make a big deal about. I can't even remember that last ESPN reported what a player blew when they were aressted for a DUI.

awfullyquiet
10-09-2008, 03:18 PM
Popular + Ridiculous = More ratings.

This isn't laguna beach...

oh wait. it is.

brat316
10-09-2008, 03:30 PM
I am still waiting on the cocaine suspension. Its cocaine and you don't get suspended. Yet you get caught with Marijuana in your system, Travis Henry got suspended.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:31 PM
I am still waiting on the cocaine suspension. Its cocaine and you don't get suspended. Yet you get caught with Marijuana in your system, Travis Henry got suspended.

Stop arguing with Logic, that'll get you flamed!

brat316
10-09-2008, 03:32 PM
Stop arguing with Logic, that'll get you flamed!

Excellent some guys has recently been trying to catch up to my rep count. I must defend it.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 03:36 PM
we all are argueing with logic, u cant argue without logic...

Geo
10-09-2008, 03:37 PM
I didn't see the James Harrison hit until now, and I don't understand why he was flagged for that. He didn't even hit him in the head, as far as I saw. Terrible call by the ref there imo.

Gus Frerotte took a similar (harder though) shot on MNF from Will Smith, there correctly wasn't a flag for it.

Sniper
10-09-2008, 03:38 PM
You're argument is the worst I heard.

Your use of your vs. you're is the worst I've seen ;)

But DUIs are stupid. It doesn't matter if it affects your play. It affects the lives of others.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:44 PM
we all are argueing with logic, u cant argue without logic...

Disagree. You can argue without logic.

Well, Actually I agree. You always argue with logic. Just faulty logic

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:44 PM
Your use of your vs. you're is the worst I've seen ;)

But DUIs are stupid. It doesn't matter if it affects your play. It affects the lives of others.

When I'm going really fast I tend to screw up the You're and Yours. I'm at my mom's business right now updating 7 computers right now... Ugh never enough time in a day.

awfullyquiet
10-09-2008, 03:45 PM
When I'm going really fast I tend to screw up the You're and Yours. I'm at my mom's business right now updating 7 computers right now... Ugh never enough time in a day.

Whine about it.

Either way. If you don't like the league. Quit watching.

brat316
10-09-2008, 03:47 PM
Your use of your vs. you're is the worst I've seen ;)

But DUIs are stupid. It doesn't matter if it affects your play. It affects the lives of others.

Cocaine might effect ur play.

brat316
10-09-2008, 03:48 PM
Whine about it.

Either way. If you don't like the league. Quit watching.

NO he could write and angry letter to the NFL. A very angry letter.

Sniper
10-09-2008, 03:48 PM
Cocaine might effect ur play.

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/PHO/AAGZ060_8x10-Action~Lawrence-Taylor-Posters.jpg

awfullyquiet
10-09-2008, 03:49 PM
NO he could write and angry letter to the NFL. A very angry letter.

NO U.

kidding. The difference between him and goodell is. well. i know jack kennedy. i served with jack kennedy, and you sir, are no jack kennedy.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 03:53 PM
Whine about it.

Either way. If you don't like the league. Quit watching.

Then every poster on this site should quit watching because they've "Whined or Bitched" about it in same shape way or form.

If you guys don't like criticism don't be on a forum that openly shares idea's an criticism.

Why don't you actually inject into a conversation instead of posting something stupid like this?

awfullyquiet
10-09-2008, 03:54 PM
Then every poster on this site should quit watching because they've "Whined or Bitched" about it in same shape way or form.

If you guys don't like criticism don't be on a forum that openly shares idea's an criticism.

Why don't you actually inject into a conversation instead of posting something stupid like this?

I did. Plenty.

I also think you're being obstinate, and henceforth will act like you are.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 03:58 PM
No one bitched about the league going down the gutter or becoming a joke...but you

brat316
10-09-2008, 04:00 PM
http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/PHO/AAGZ060_8x10-Action~Lawrence-Taylor-Posters.jpg

Cocaine is a hell of a drug he he he...

Sniper
10-09-2008, 04:01 PM
idea's

http://www.crocblades.com/img/products/1120.jpg

E-Stab to the jaw!

Of course everyone is going to *****. We just don't need full threads about bitching to *****.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 04:03 PM
I didn't know posting a thread on the inconsistency of Suspensions would cause so much hate.

Sorry thought I'd get intelligent argument from some of you, didn't realize some of you would come .. unarmed.

Gay Ork Wang
10-09-2008, 04:25 PM
I didn't know posting a thread on the inconsistency of Suspensions would cause so much hate.

Sorry thought I'd get intelligent argument from some of you, didn't realize some of you would come .. unarmed.
u got some, then u proceeded with bad ones so everyone just stopped and got down to ur level

Xonraider
10-09-2008, 04:42 PM
Lastly, can anyone comprehend how 2 DUI's = Performance Enhancing drugs?

He could have severely mamed or killed someone twice, and gets the same suspension as if he took some HGH, which would only affect him?

Well I guess if he cut Cocaine in his car he wouldn't have seen a suspension.

I'm not in any way, shape or form trying to justify the punishment since I don't like the consistency (or lack there of) but performance enhancers might affect your family and the people around you depending on the side effects. They also affect the people on the field. If this drug makes him stronger, then he puts others in the field at risk that they wouldn't have if he didn't have that drug in his system. Just a thought.

Twiddler
10-09-2008, 05:33 PM
I didn't know posting a thread on the inconsistency of Suspensions would cause so much hate.

Sorry thought I'd get intelligent argument from some of you, didn't realize some of you would come .. unarmed.

You received some intelligent responses, however you managed to ignore them completely or continue on with what you've been saying the entire thread. Plus, stop being such a tool in the way you respond. You may not be right about everything, so just try and take other people's opinions into account when you respond.

Burns336
10-09-2008, 06:48 PM
My point about the severity of the DUI was that maybe it was a 4 game suspension because the DUI was viewed as a "weak" conviction or something.

Maybe he blew a .09 and they didn't really want to ruin his life over .01.

No, I don't think its ok to break the law, and yes I think they should be penalized, which he was -- but I think it should be on a case by case basis instead of automatically giving a guy a certain number of games based off of the crime. Also, remember people who get nailed for DUI face penalties not only within the NFL, but in real life. These guys aren't just facing a suspension from the NFL -- they face the consequences just like the rest of us outside.

Obviously steroids are a little different because enhancing your performance is cheating the game. Also, Only the NFL can hold you accountable for testing dirty for steroids. There is no federal law which subjects us all to take Steroid tests. In this case, the league is the sole administer of punishment and probably comes down harder because players will not be punished outside of the game.

The Unseen
10-09-2008, 06:51 PM
Unless I'm missing something, Matt Jones has yet to be suspended. Last I heard, he may be suspended 1-2 games soon.

ChezPower4
10-09-2008, 08:21 PM
Unless I'm missing something, Matt Jones has yet to be suspended. Last I heard, he may be suspended 1-2 games soon.

Hope so cuz his trail was a joke, all he got was a slap on the wrist. As long as he goes to his drug classes and passes drug tests for a year ( i think) their going to drop his felony charge.

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 09:24 PM
You received some intelligent responses, however you managed to ignore them completely or continue on with what you've been saying the entire thread. Plus, stop being such a tool in the way you respond. You may not be right about everything, so just try and take other people's opinions into account when you respond.

I did, and I pointed my thoughts out.

The only time I was being a "tool" is when I had some poster following me around in every post providing no facts and just being like "You're a whiner.." or "I don't agree cause I said so."

Mr. Stiller
10-09-2008, 09:26 PM
My point about the severity of the DUI was that maybe it was a 4 game suspension because the DUI was viewed as a "weak" conviction or something.

Maybe he blew a .09 and they didn't really want to ruin his life over .01.

No, I don't think its ok to break the law, and yes I think they should be penalized, which he was -- but I think it should be on a case by case basis instead of automatically giving a guy a certain number of games based off of the crime. Also, remember people who get nailed for DUI face penalties not only within the NFL, but in real life. These guys aren't just facing a suspension from the NFL -- they face the consequences just like the rest of us outside.

Obviously steroids are a little different because enhancing your performance is cheating the game. Also, Only the NFL can hold you accountable for testing dirty for steroids. There is no federal law which subjects us all to take Steroid tests. In this case, the league is the sole administer of punishment and probably comes down harder because players will not be punished outside of the game.

I'm pretty sure most states have a no tolerance for over the .08 Limit. But the NFL Should?

I doubt 2 DUI's (3 in his lifetime) should warrant a 4 game suspension considering the details..

I don't care if he blows .09, thats against the law.. considered a DUI.

I read somewhere the they pulled him over because he was swerving into oncoming traffic.

To me that just doesn't sound like he blew a hair over ".08" but more like he was intoxicated and stupid enough he could've taken a life.

MarioPalmer
10-09-2008, 11:30 PM
It may seem out of control but compared to the Paul Taglibue (spelling?) era it's much better, at least Goddell is actually putting fear into some of these guys and making some of them think twice about doing stupid crap, but also the league is made up of 1000+ players and only a hand full make dumb mistakes so at least Roger is trying to put a stop to it as best as he can. You have to remeber these guys are the only ones who can perform at this level at a consistent rate so there will always be a spot on a roster for them and they will always get a 2nd, 3rd, 4th etc. chance. It's the nature of pro sports.

As for the ref calls I agree, but once again, this game is reffed by the human eye and humans make mistakes, just be happy that at least they have replay, watch a baseball game and see somthing completely outragous, and try to tell me you don't almost choke on anger when you see your team get burned by an obvious blown call....lol

awfullyquiet
10-10-2008, 12:03 AM
I did, and I pointed my thoughts out.

The only time I was being a "tool" is when I had some poster following me around in every post providing no facts and just being like "You're a whiner.." or "I don't agree cause I said so."

Um. No. I told you to quit whining in response to your posts BEFORE that post.

I don't just tell you to quit whining for no reason. Saying 'i'm stressed out because i update computers' isn't reasons for ridiculous 'tool-ish' posts trying to contrive any facet to your argument.

neko4
10-10-2008, 05:19 AM
The NFL needs a Hamurabi's code.

Mr. Stiller
10-10-2008, 05:43 AM
Um. No. I told you to quit whining in response to your posts BEFORE that post.

I don't just tell you to quit whining for no reason. Saying 'i'm stressed out because i update computers' isn't reasons for ridiculous 'tool-ish' posts trying to contrive any facet to your argument.

No, the whole post about me fixing computers was in regards to my grammatical error between your and you're. Nothing more or less.

The Unseen
10-10-2008, 07:21 AM
The NFL needs a Hamurabi's code.

You mean it doesn't already?

CJSchneider
10-10-2008, 09:37 AM
3) Criticism of the Refs. If you criticize the refs, it's a fine, but refs rarely get what they deserve. Docked pay, suspension etc.

Consistency of Calls. It seems if you hit certain QB's in the motion of throwing the ball it's a PF, others, you can mug, and it's not.

(For the ward deal: http://www.postgazette.com/pg/08283/918588-66.stm )


I'm not too happy about these two.

If you are a ref, you should be open to just as much criticism of your performance as the players. Now, I'm sure that a great deal goes on in the leauge office behind closed doors regarding ref performance, but to tell coaches and players that public criticism of the refs is off-limits is a crock.
As a coach, if you blow a call because you were out of position or because you let something other then the rules sway your decision, I'm gonna let you have it.

I also have a problem with allowing holding and other crap (as long as that player didn't have a chance to make a tackle) and yet you fart next to the QB and you get a 15 yard penalty.

Mr. Stiller
10-10-2008, 10:00 AM
I'm not too happy about these two.

If you are a ref, you should be open to just as much criticism of your performance as the players. Now, I'm sure that a great deal goes on in the leauge office behind closed doors regarding ref performance, but to tell coaches and players that public criticism of the refs is off-limits is a crock.
As a coach, if you blow a call because you were out of position or because you let something other then the rules sway your decision, I'm gonna let you have it.

I also have a problem with allowing holding and other crap (as long as that player didn't have a chance to make a tackle) and yet you fart next to the QB and you get a 15 yard penalty.

Here's something interesting about fines...

CLARK FINED $7,500 FOR HELMET-TO-HELMET HIT
Posted by Mike Florio on October 9, 2008, 6:28 p.m.

Steelers safety Ryan Clark told ESPN Radio 1250 in Pittsburgh on Thursday that he has been fined $7,500 for a helmet-to-helmet hit on Jags receiver Matt Jones during Sunday night’s victory at Jacksonville.

Clark made the disclosure during the Paulsen, Logan & Crow show.

We’ve recently heard that the fines that are publicly reported represent only about 10 percent of the total fines levied by the league.

PFT.. Wasn't Helmet to Helmet.. but the bolded part is interesting.

Brent
10-10-2008, 10:59 AM
What were the circumstances behind Allens DUI?
DUI is a way for tickets and arrests to be made even if someone isnt legally drunk. You can take allergy medicine and get a DUI because it's Driving Under the Influence. My roommate was arrested for a DUI when he hadn't even consumed any alcohol or drugs (he did contest it and got off, also the PD had to pay his court fees... long story). So, I think it's necessary to take DUI's case by case. With a DUI, they don't have to give you a field sobriety test, he did have to take a breathalyzer at the station but obviously he was 0.0%.

CJSchneider
10-10-2008, 12:02 PM
Here's something interesting about fines...

CLARK FINED $7,500 FOR HELMET-TO-HELMET HIT
Posted by Mike Florio on October 9, 2008, 6:28 p.m.

Steelers safety Ryan Clark told ESPN Radio 1250 in Pittsburgh on Thursday that he has been fined $7,500 for a helmet-to-helmet hit on Jags receiver Matt Jones during Sunday night’s victory at Jacksonville.

Clark made the disclosure during the Paulsen, Logan & Crow show.

We’ve recently heard that the fines that are publicly reported represent only about 10 percent of the total fines levied by the league.

PFT.. Wasn't Helmet to Helmet.. but the bolded part is interesting.

I believe that, you get fined by the leauge if you walk out on to field with your jersey not tucked in or your socks up (no joke).

brat316
10-10-2008, 12:04 PM
I believe that, you get fined by the leauge if you walk out on to field with your jersey not tucked in or your socks up (no joke).

yeah, remember Portis got fined for that. What about durning the game when your shirt comes out, or ur socks goes down

FlyingElvis
10-10-2008, 12:26 PM
If you are a ref, you should be open to just as much criticism of your performance as the players. Now, I'm sure that a great deal goes on in the leauge office behind closed doors regarding ref performance, but to tell coaches and players that public criticism of the refs is off-limits is a crock.

As a coach, if you blow a call because you were out of position or because you let something other then the rules sway your decision, I'm gonna let you have it.


This misses the point. As fans we are allowed to complain about coaches, players and refs. The media has this same priviledge.

Coaches and players, on the other hand, are not allowed to do so PUBLICLY. The league has a method in place that allows complaints about officiating or anything else league related (see: Davis, Al - accusing the Patriots of tampering.) The league does not like players, coaches or refs complaining to the media.

Also missing the point - when was the last time you EVER heard a ref go to the media and complain about a coach or player?

Burns336
10-10-2008, 01:56 PM
DUI is a way for tickets and arrests to be made even if someone isnt legally drunk. You can take allergy medicine and get a DUI because it's Driving Under the Influence. My roommate was arrested for a DUI when he hadn't even consumed any alcohol or drugs (he did contest it and got off, also the PD had to pay his court fees... long story). So, I think it's necessary to take DUI's case by case. With a DUI, they don't have to give you a field sobriety test, he did have to take a breathalyzer at the station but obviously he was 0.0%.

I agree, I had some pills for back pain. It didn't say anything on the bottle like "Dont drive, or dont operate heavy machinery" and I went to pick up some friends from the airport.

We got pulled over because of some bs. Basically, I live right at the main "Bar Scene" in San Diego and there are always people just walking across the middle of the road from bar to bar and I almost hit one of them. Either way, the cops pulled me over and gave me a complete field sobriety test and was on the verge of giving me a DUI because my pupils were reacting funny to the flash light test but luckily they finally decided I was ok.

Point is I could have DUI right now for doing almost nothing wrong.

The circumstances behind it are very important to consider.

ChezPower4
10-10-2008, 03:19 PM
I agree, I had some pills for back pain. It didn't say anything on the bottle like "Dont drive, or dont operate heavy machinery" and I went to pick up some friends from the airport.

We got pulled over because of some bs. Basically, I live right at the main "Bar Scene" in San Diego and there are always people just walking across the middle of the road from bar to bar and I almost hit one of them. Either way, the cops pulled me over and gave me a complete field sobriety test and was on the verge of giving me a DUI because my pupils were reacting funny to the flash light test but luckily they finally decided I was ok.

Point is I could have DUI right now for doing almost nothing wrong.

The circumstances behind it are very important to consider.

I hate field sobriety tests, i think that they're not very accurate. You can fail some of those when your stone sober. Breathalyzer tests and blood tests are the way to go. It happens all the time here in Idaho, someone will fail a couple field tests and then when they blow their under the limit.

MetSox17
10-10-2008, 05:41 PM
How the hell was Adrian Wilson's hit on Trent Edwards dirty enough that he got a 25,000 dollar fine? It looked completely legitimate to me.

Mr. Stiller
10-10-2008, 05:43 PM
How the hell was Adrian Wilson's hit on Trent Edwards dirty enough that he got a 25,000 dollar fine? It looked completely legitimate to me.

Ryan Clarks hit on Matt Jones was determined to be "Helmet to Helmet" and he got a 7.5K Fine.

Clark led with his shoulder.

They still haven't fined Shaun Rogers for Cheapshotting Roethlisberger.

Smooth Criminal
10-10-2008, 05:46 PM
Hit on the QB will always cost you extra compared to other players. Which is again ********.

brat316
10-10-2008, 06:04 PM
How about Wilson's hit on Edwards. He got fined 20K for something stupid.

MetSox17
10-10-2008, 09:40 PM
How the hell was Adrian Wilson's hit on Trent Edwards dirty enough that he got a 25,000 dollar fine? It looked completely legitimate to me.

How about Wilson's hit on Edwards. He got fined 20K for something stupid.

Seriously? It was two posts up.

Bruce Banner
10-10-2008, 09:41 PM
Pacman Jones should be out of the league.

and yes the league is a joke in regards to their reluctance to use correct (permanent) punishment.

ChezPower4
10-10-2008, 09:51 PM
Pacman Jones should be out of the league.

and yes the league is a joke in regards to their reluctance to use correct (permanent) punishment.

If this fight doesn't push him over the egde, he'll no doubt mess up again and then he'll get kicked out of the league.

Bruce Banner
10-10-2008, 10:00 PM
This is exactly why I came to this club. ALL OVER ME! Thanks Javon! I hope no one beats your ass on the way out.

http://media.lvrj.com/images/2780533.jpg

Next career choice?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/images/08/17/p1_jones.jpg

Bosanac01
10-10-2008, 10:09 PM
The league's future is not looking too bright as well. So many college players are getting in trouble. UGA suspended like 8 players this year on seperate violations. Heck, 3 days ago they dismissed two guys from the team.

Bruce Banner
10-10-2008, 10:16 PM
The league's future is not looking too bright as well. So many college players are getting in trouble. UGA suspended like 8 players this year on seperate violations. Heck, 3 days ago they dismissed two guys from the team.

Well, if I had grown men coming to my house begging and pleading for me to come to their team, my mentality on life would be slightly dysfunctional. That and having the entire town doing whatever I want wouldn't help.

No one wins from this process.

Bosanac01
10-10-2008, 10:21 PM
Well, if I had grown men coming to my house begging and pleading for me to come to their team, my mentality on life would be slightly dysfunctional. That and having the entire town doing whatever I want wouldn't help.

No one wins from this process.

Only the special ones get in trouble. There are student-athletes who do great in school and are smart enough to know what is right and what is wrong.

Bruce Banner
10-10-2008, 10:23 PM
Only the special ones get in trouble. There are student-athletes who do great in school and are smart enough to know what is right and what is wrong.

Of course there are success stories but usually those athletes are actually qualified to get into the school....these misfits' academic level of success, or lack thereof, is overlooked because they are physical freaks.

ChezPower4
10-10-2008, 11:19 PM
Of course there are success stories but usually athletes are actually qualified to get into the school....these misfits' academic level of success, or lack thereof, is overlooked because they are physical freaks.

Sadly it think that this happens way to much. Also add in the fact that they have no one standing over them tell them what to do or not to do.

Brent
10-11-2008, 12:53 AM
I hate field sobriety tests, i think that they're not very accurate. You can fail some of those when your stone sober. Breathalyzer tests and blood tests are the way to go. It happens all the time here in Idaho, someone will fail a couple field tests and then when they blow their under the limit.
Well that is the thing with field sobriety testing, if you dont meet the officer's "standards" or whatever, he can say you failed. If you are sober and etc, just keep saying "breathalyze me" over and over and it will be on the tape and then challenge the arrest.

Caddy
10-11-2008, 01:52 AM
The problem I have with players getting busted for committing crimes which realistically the NFL has no jurisdiction over ie DUI's. I think the NFL is well within its rites to penalize players who bring the game into disrepute this way, but I just don't think there is a way to compare a criminal act with something that occurs during or effecting a performance.

#1chiefs_fan
10-11-2008, 03:36 PM
i know this kind of off-topic but why are players getting fined for everything like celebrating. The two eagles players get fined for a celebration that wasnt even flagged in the game or ronnie brown and vernon carey td celebration. I dont know whats wrong with having a little fun while playing the game. I think they should revise the rule somewhat.

Brent
10-11-2008, 03:39 PM
i know this kind of off-topic but why are players getting fined for everything like celebrating. The two eagles players get fined for a celebration that wasnt even flagged in the game or ronnie brown and vernon carey td celebration. I dont know whats wrong with having a little fun while playing the game. I think they should revise the rule somewhat.

What's the joke? No Fun League?

Sniper
10-11-2008, 03:48 PM
What's the joke? No Fun League?

No Fun League isn't a joke. This, however, is a joke.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3637802

CJSchneider
10-11-2008, 05:47 PM
And this...

Dolphins do the Cupid-Shuffle (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Roger-Goodell-is-not-amused-by-the-Cupid-Shuffle?urn=nfl,114200)

Maybe they should have done the "Stanky Leg."