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bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:01 AM
i don't usually do these, i know we have some regulars who do it every week and i don't want to step on anyone's toes, but i just wanna discuss some things. I don't post as much as I used to so I figure once in awhile is ok. I apologize in advance to the guys who do this every week, Im not tryin to step on your toes.


-Am I the only one who thinks Jeff Triplett is by far the worst ref in the league? I can't stand this guy. He's terrible. He made some terrible calls for both teams yesterday, and there are always an inordinate amount of penalties called when he refs a game. Especially a nationally televised one. I remember a sportswriter saying once (don't remember who), that Jeff Triplett just loves getting his face on TV, and wants to get as much facetime as he can get. I wouldn't doubt it. Why does his crew always call so many penalties? And why is his crew and himself wrong half the time? Even Madden said once last night (not exact quote) "only Jeff Triplette can make that call"

So I guess Madden feels the same way.

-Kerry Collins is the real deal. He's proven in the past that with a good defense and a solid run game he can be a very good game manager who can make plays when you need him to. All the doubters, I never understood why its unfathomable to believe that Collins can get it done in the playoffs. Why not? He's already proven in his career that he can. Collins is a winner when put in a good situation. He's in a good situation right now. And he's clutch. Yes. I said it. Clutch. He's made plenty of clutch plays for the Titans. His stint in Oakland was what it was: who can succeed there anyway?

As for the Titans, everyone compares them to the 2000 Ravens. I strongly disagree. We have short term memory as fans. This titans defense is good, but its not nearly as good as that Ravens defense. In fact, I personally believe that Pittsburgh is the best defense in the league, and they have the best front 7 in football, not Tennesee.

A more accurate comparison would actually be the 2000 Giants. People forget, the 2000 Giants had the 2nd best defense in the league that year. Strahan that year was very comparable to Haynesworth on that dline. Both defenses are built the exact same way. Even the offenses were similar. The 2000 Giants had a dominant run game, led by Tiki (Chris Johnson) and a disappointing pudgester in Dayne (White: although White is lightyears ahead of Dayne). The passing game consisted of short passes to move the chains, with an occasional deep ball (by the same qb none the less). Same TE by committee approach. To me, the Titans are a mirror image of the 2000 Giants.

-Ive been one of LDT's biggest crtics this season, but I have to admit, its not all his fault. Their FB is absolutely terrible. I never seen a FB whiff more than the one they have. The holes are there, but the LDT of today doesn't hit them with the same speed or cutting ability that the one we used to know did. The holes aren't as big as they used to be, but the old LDT squeeks through those cutback lanes. He doesn't do that anymore. It could be his toe, and we could blame it on the injury. But he's an old RB now, and has been injured for the past 1.5 years. Can we use injuries as an excuse at this point in his career? Chances are he'll always be a little banged up from now on.

But forget the running game for a second. What made LDT great was his duel threat nature. He's still a great pass catcher. But Norv Turner with his Air Coryell has for the most part, taken away his abilities in the pass game. They are very uncreative with how they use him in the pass game. He can be so much more dangerous than he is, they just use him terribly.

-Ive read a lot about the Matt Cassell hype, and I wanted to comment on it but never had the time, so I'll say my thoughts here. Matt Cassell is not Tom Brady and will never be Tom Brady.

I know some ppl want to say that Brady was similar when developing, but thats just not true. First and foremost, even when Brady was developing, his deep ball was much better than Cassell's. Cassell's deep ball is downright atrocious.

Secondly, people want to compare their similar dink and dunk game managing styles. But let's compare the teams for a second. Matt Cassell is operating with talent that Brady wished he had when he was developing. This is the same exact team that was the most explosive offense in NFL history. Thats what Cassell has to work with. Brady had a pathetic offense around him when he was developing. Who would stretch the field when brady was young to begin with? Troy Brown? Please. And remember he didn't even have a credible RB until 2 years later. The Pats RB the first 2 seasons of the Brady era wouldn't even start for 28 of the 32 teams in the league. So not only did Brady have similar if not better numbers than Cassell, he did it with infinitely inferior talent.

3rdly (if thats a word), Brady started in his 2nd season in the league. This is Cassel's 4th year in the league. He had plenty of time to sit and develop like Rodgers did, even with the lack of experience in college. Brady had to learn at a much faster rate. And speaking of experience, Brady was a proven winner the few times he was given a chance in college. Cassel didnt even play.

I know everyone wants to discredit Brady as much as they can, and a lot of people hate the guy, but let's be real. Brady is the ****. Cassel is not. Whoever throws a bunch of money at this guy in the offseason is making a terrible mistake. A lot of back up qbs can do decent with that explosive offense, having been in the system for 4 years. Cassel is not special.

-I honestly believe, that if Bill Cowher was still coaching the Steelers, they would be the best team in the NFL. The offensive design of this team under Tomlin is terrible. With that defense, they should pound the rock 50 times a game like Cowher did, and make Ben a game manager. Ben is a great game manager, let him be that. Whats wrong with being a game manager? I never understood that. Its all about winning, Ben is at his best when he's a game manager, let him do what he does. He's not the type of qb that can spread you out and score 30 points on you. He's not. And the team isn't built to do that anyway.

Where are the screen passes? PA passes? 3 step drops? The Steelers have a terrible offensive system that doesn't compliment their defense at all. This team should be a lot better than it is. Cowher knew what Ben was, and used him the right way. Tomlin is trying to make him into something he's not. Its not about fancy points, its about winning. Just win. Tomlin needs to go back to Cowher power. If they do that, this is a SB team. Their defense is ridiculous. They have more talent collectively then they ever did. Coaching is holding this team back. For all the praise Tomlin gets...i don't see it.

-You know who needs more love? Darrell Docket. This guy is amazing. He's the best 3-4 linemen in the league (apologies to Aaron Smith), and he's so versatile its ridiculous. He's a monster, he has the speed and pass rushing ability of a 4-3 DE, the strength of a 3-4 NT, and can play any position on the dline in both a 3-4 and 4-3. Justin Tuck and Haynesworth get all the popularity for their versatility, but this guy is just as good if not more versatile. Its a shame he doesn't get the attention he deserves.

-We all know that Ware and Merriman are the 2 best rushbackers in the league, but both Harrison and Woodley are slowly and surely entering the same level as those 2 guys. Both of Pittsburgh's rushbackers are amazing and can do it all. What a sick defense. Add in a blitzing Timmons at ILB, who is almost a rushbacker in his own right, and its impossible to block this front 7 up front or predict who's coming and when theyre coming. I can't say enough about this Pittsburgh defense. Its just freakin awesome. Thats the only word I can use to describe it. Its just awesome.

-I don't get Philly. I really don't. Before the start of the season, I was more affraid of Philly then any other team in the NFC, including the Cowboys. But this team is just an enigma to me. The only thing I can think of is the fact that McNabb and Andy Reid collectively are chokers. Thats my only explanation. McNabb is more talk than substance these days. And stop blogging McNabb. Just shut up and get it done.

-As odd as it sounds, the Jets might be the most complete team in the AFC. And an interesting fact: the Jets coming into this week have the 3rd most sacks in the league. And this is without bust to be Vernon Gholston seeing any playing time. If they can just motivate that guy and get his worthless ass to do something that defense could be special. And if they continue to commit to the ground game, who knows what could happen.

I lack faith in Brett Favre as a playoff quarterback though.

-Jason Taylor is proving to be a worthless pick up for the Skins. He hasn't improved their pass rush by any stretch, and if he's on the field on 1st and 2nd down, he's a liability in the run game. Teams will run offtackle on him if he's on the field on any other play other than 3rd and long all season long.

-Roy Williams should be Dallas's #1 WR, not TO. He just looks a lot more explosive and dangerous out there. TO is still a dominant WR, but he's starting to regress a tiny bit. Roy is the future at WR on that team.

-I loved the 2 TE sets they used with Bennet and Witten out there. That could be a very dangerous duo. The Cowboys have so much explosion on offense its not even funny. I was actually shocked they only scored 14 points. The oline isn't what it used to be, but they should still score more than 14 points. And give Choice more touches. He's a good player.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 10:05 AM
Is everything off your chest now? : P

Turtlepower
11-17-2008, 10:09 AM
Interesting comparison to the 2000 Giants. It makes sense except that was such a heartbreaking team. =(

terribletowel39
11-17-2008, 10:11 AM
:( Unfortunately I agree with you. Tomlin needs to take over the playcalling and get back to Steelers ball. Bruce Arians is a Mike Martz wannabe. I think Ben threw it 41 times yesterday. That is special ed. Should not be like that.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:12 AM
Interesting comparison to the 2000 Giants. It makes sense except that was such a heartbreaking team. =(

don't remind me </3

Is everything off your chest now? : P

theres actually a lot more, i just can't remember it all at once :p

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:13 AM
:( Unfortunately I agree with you. Tomlin needs to take over the playcalling and get back to Steelers ball. Bruce Arians is a Mike Martz wannabe. I think Ben threw it 41 times yesterday. That is special ed. Should not be like that.

and i credit Ben for having great numbers yesterday, but the bottomline is they only scored 11 points. 2 off of a safety. against a defense thats been very average this year. at home. thats unacceptable. they need to get back to their roots. this team is good enough to make the SB. but theyre gonna need a dramatic makeover on offense to get there.

Turtlepower
11-17-2008, 10:17 AM
I still think the Steelers need a better power back to compliment with Willie Parker. I wonder if they might go after Jacobs in the offseason if we don't resign him.

CJSchneider
11-17-2008, 10:20 AM
Good read.

terribletowel39
11-17-2008, 10:20 AM
I still think the Steelers need a better power back to compliment with Willie Parker. I wonder if they might go after Jacobs in the offseason if we don't resign him.
Firstly, yall would be silly not to resign him. Secondly, if yall don't and we get him. I would probably O on everyone near me when news has reached my ears.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 10:22 AM
don't remind me </3



theres actually a lot more, i just can't remember it all at once :p

Haha. On another note, more I see of Bradshaw the more I like him. His vision and agility is truly something special.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:24 AM
Haha. On another note, more I see of Bradshaw the more I like him. His vision and agility is truly something special.

his balance is what makes him special. i think he's a special player waiting to explode on the scene. ive always said i rather give him touches than Derrick Ward.

and im officially sold on Jacobs. I hope we can resign him, and have him and Bradshaw as our 1,2 punch for years to come.

Resigning Corey Webster is our 1st offseason priority though. He's playing at an incredibly high level. Top 5 in the league.

Turtlepower
11-17-2008, 10:24 AM
Firstly, yall would be silly not to resign him. Secondly, if yall don't and we get him. I would probably O on everyone near me when news has reached my ears.

I love Jacobs and I love the way he plays the game, but I just can't think we'd invest the kind of money he wants when we have more important contracts (Eli and Webster).

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:25 AM
I still think the Steelers need a better power back to compliment with Willie Parker. I wonder if they might go after Jacobs in the offseason if we don't resign him.

they have Moore who is good in my eyes, and they just drafted Mendenhall. Theyre not getting Jacobs. No way.

as far as talent on that team, theyre pretty much loaded at every position except oline. they should just draft olinemen after olinemen in this draft. they have everything else they need to succeed. that team is loaded with talent.

i honestly think their oline isn't nearly as bad as it looks either. a combination of too much passing with Ben holding the ball way too long makes them look much worse than they really are.

Turtlepower
11-17-2008, 10:27 AM
they have Moore who is good in my eyes, and they just drafted Mendenhall. Theyre not getting Jacobs. No way.

as far as talent on that team, theyre pretty much loaded at every position except oline. they should just draft olinemen after olinemen in this draft. they have everything else they need to succeed. that team is loaded with talent.

i honestly think their oline isn't nearly as bad as it looks either. a combination of too much passing with Ben holding the ball way too long makes them look much worse than they really are.

I never was a huge Mendehall fan and I think that Moore is just serviceable, but maybe I'm being a little too harsh.

As far as us resigning Jacobs, I just feel that it is much more important to extend Webster and Eli and that won't leave us with much money left.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:30 AM
I never was a huge Mendehall fan and I think that Moore is just serviceable, but maybe I'm being a little too harsh.

As far as us resigning Jacobs, I just feel that it is much more important to extend Webster and Eli and that won't leave us with much money left.

Id love to keep all of them, but i don't see how we can do it financially. Order of course goes Eli, then Corey, then Jacobs, then Ward.

Butler is a FA, he's as good as gone.

Obviously Eli is staying, theres no way in blue hell he's going anywhere. But I hope we keep Corey. He's in my eyes, is our most important FA to keep (outside of Eli of course). They have to resign him.

We can live without Jacobs, but id prefer to keep him if possible. He brings a physicality and smashmouth attitude to our offense that you can't measure with film, or stats.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 10:30 AM
his balance is what makes him special. i think he's a special player waiting to explode on the scene. ive always said i rather give him touches than Derrick Ward.

and im officially sold on Jacobs. I hope we can resign him, and have him and Bradshaw as our 1,2 punch for years to come.

Resigning Corey Webster is our 1st offseason priority though. He's playing at an incredibly high level. Top 5 in the league.

I am not a Jacobs fan. I do think he has improved with his agility, but alot of his runs he is untouched and that's our offensive line's doing. Watch the majority of Ward AND more importantly Bradshaw's runs. They make more things happen for their runs. That play Bradshaw ran was doomed again! Reminded me of the Bills game last season. He cut it back, with his head upfield, so he used his vision, found a hole, and broke tackles.

I like the physical element Jacobs brings, but alot of his runs he never gets touched. That goes to the offensive line. Still none the less he has improved big time. But never was a fan of Jacobs. I'd rather see more Ward and Bradshaw personally. I don't want us breaking the bank to re-sign Jacobs.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:33 AM
I am not a Jacobs fan. I do think he has improved with his agility, but alot of his runs he is untouched and that's our offensive line's doing. Watch the majority of Ward AND more importantly Bradshaw's runs. They make more things happen for their runs. That play Bradshaw ran was doomed again! Reminded me of the Bills game last season. He cut it back, with his head upfield, so he used his vision, found a hole, and broke tackles.

I like the physical element Jacobs brings, but alot of his runs he never gets touched. That goes to the offensive line. Still none the less he has improved big time. But never was a fan of Jacobs. I'd rather see more Ward and Bradshaw personally. I don't want us breaking the bank to re-sign Jacobs.

our run game is all about our oline. we can have anyone run back there similar to Denver in their prime. but also remember, a lot of times, when Jacobs gets a full head of steam, he doesn't get touched bc ppl don't WANT to touch him. Ive seen plenty of times people could get an arm on him and try to slow him down, but they just don't do it. Bc they know theyll get their arm ripped off. He's good. He's not the greatest RB since sliced bread, but he fits our team perfectly. Id prefer to keep him and compliment him with Bradshaw. I wouldn't mind losing Ward.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:34 AM
anyway come on guys, i didn't mention anything about the Giants on purpose, and all we're doing is talking about the Giants lol. we'll discuss the Gmen at our team board.

SeanTaylorRIP
11-17-2008, 10:43 AM
People don't realize that Demetric Evans is better than Jason Taylor on all 3 downs. Taylor is a joke against the run on first and second and he is honestly our worst pass rusher behind Chris Wilson and Evans. Evans at least has good hands, swim moves, and strength to pass rush, Taylor is constantly handled one on one, even on 3rd and longs. He is stoned at the LOS 90% of the time.

Turtlepower
11-17-2008, 10:46 AM
I hate the Tom Brady to Matt Cassell connections as well. Cassell has so much more to work with than Tom Brady. I love how the same people who argue against Pro Bowls always use Pro Bowl as a stat to say how good a player was. Troy Brown did have a couple fine seasons, but Randy Moss just broke the NFL record for TDs. Come on now.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 10:46 AM
People don't realize that Demetric Evans is better than Jason Taylor on all 3 downs. Taylor is a joke against the run on first and second and he is honestly our worst pass rusher behind Chris Wilson and Evans. Evans at least has good hands, swim moves, and strength to pass rush, Taylor is constantly handled one on one, even on 3rd and longs. He is stoned at the LOS 90% of the time.

ive felt all season that your defense was better without him compared to with him.

AlexDown
11-17-2008, 11:22 AM
This week will be a big test for the Jets to actually see where they stand. I see the Jets as a slightly above average team, with the ability to definitely play above that.

With the exception of the Titans, there are so many teams within one or 2 games of the Jets. There still is no where near a guarantee of them making playoffs. 7-3 is a great start however. The last every other previous years they made playoffs they took advantage of an easy schedule. As long as they continue to do this, they have a good shot at playoffs. They have already taken 1 from each team in the AFC East, which is HUGE. The divisional games for the rest of the season are big.

I'm not worried about Favre in the playoffs. Jet fans should not feel comfortable sitting at 7-3, because there can be a bunch of AFC teams, AFC East teams sitting at 7-4 by the end of week 12. Playoffs are no where near a lock for the Jets.

SaintsFanForLife
11-17-2008, 11:32 AM
I agree Jason Taylor has not done anything. He does not look like the all pro vet that he was with the phins.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-17-2008, 11:39 AM
Neg rep, no mention of the Broncos, who are 2 games up in the AFC west after calmly marching past the Falcons.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 11:40 AM
Taylor can still be salvaged as a situational 3rd down pass rusher. Maybe the injury is still lagging, which is holding him back.


The Jets, theyre an enigma like the Eagles. It wouldn't shock me to see them not make the playoffs, it also wouldn't shock me to see them make a serious push in the playoffs. Another Jekyll and Hyde team.

fenikz
11-17-2008, 11:47 AM
Thank you for recognizing Darnell Dockett, I honestly believe he was the best DT in the league last year as you said he is so versatile, has has played 3-4 DE, 4-3 UT & DE and even drops back into coverage on some of Pendergast's exotic blitz packages

ElectricEye
11-17-2008, 11:55 AM
Thank you for the the reality check on Cassel. I can keep my sanity now.

yodabear
11-17-2008, 11:56 AM
This write up is lacking a guarantee of a Rams come back which is happening. Cardinals fans like fenikz should watch out here we come. BEARS WON'T KNOW WHAT HIT THEM!

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 12:04 PM
Neg rep, no mention of the Broncos, who are 2 games up in the AFC west after calmly marching past the Falcons.

Can they hold up though? No running backs, no defense, conventional wisdom says they let up sooner or later. Even with a 2 game lead, i wouldn't call it comfortable yet. We have 6 more games. SD can still catch them.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 12:05 PM
This write up is lacking a guarantee of a Rams come back which is happening. Cardinals fans like fenikz should watch out here we come. BEARS WON'T KNOW WHAT HIT THEM!

Thanks for thinking Brian Leonard's overhyped ass could actually play FB for you and cutting a very good FB in Madison Hedgecock. We really appreciate his effort out there for us.

Dam8610
11-17-2008, 12:18 PM
As long as Walt Coleman has a job as an NFL ref, Jeff Tripplett can't be the worst in the NFL.

LonghornsLegend
11-17-2008, 12:18 PM
-Roy Williams should be Dallas's #1 WR, not TO. He just looks a lot more explosive and dangerous out there. TO is still a dominant WR, but he's starting to regress a tiny bit. Roy is the future at WR on that team.

-I loved the 2 TE sets they used with Bennet and Witten out there. That could be a very dangerous duo. The Cowboys have so much explosion on offense its not even funny. I was actually shocked they only scored 14 points. The oline isn't what it used to be, but they should still score more than 14 points. And give Choice more touches. He's a good player.


The first point was the exact same point I made in the gameday thread, pretty much word for word...You can tell when he catches the ball how much more explosive he is then TO, and maybe I was in denial about TO losing a step until I saw Roy on the same field...But for now it's fine, Roy will eat single coverage against the #2 corner up, and when teams make the change, TO should enjoy the latter part of his career not being the focal point of the defense.


The 2nd note alot of Cowboys fans liked the set as well, I believe it's the first time I've seen it, but Witten and Bennett are such great blockers it needs to stay implemented into our system.


Garrett has made some blunders, but he drew up a nice gameplan, got TO going into motion alot and brought out some new looks...I just hope forcing the ball to TO doesn't hurt us in the long run, Roy has got to get more looks down the stretch.

Ward
11-17-2008, 12:21 PM
-Roy Williams should be Dallas's #1 WR, not TO. He just looks a lot more explosive and dangerous out there. TO is still a dominant WR, but he's starting to regress a tiny bit. Roy is the future at WR on that team.

-I loved the 2 TE sets they used with Bennet and Witten out there. That could be a very dangerous duo. The Cowboys have so much explosion on offense its not even funny. I was actually shocked they only scored 14 points. The oline isn't what it used to be, but they should still score more than 14 points. And give Choice more touches. He's a good player.

You answered yourself on that first one, Roy Williams will be the #1. But why mess with T.O. at this point when he's been so good thus far? They're both on the field, and that's honestly all I care about.

Once Parcells exited, I figured that was all we would see of the 2 TE offense they were getting Fasano prepped for, and then they drafted Bennett who I thought would be a huge project. I think it speaks volumes of the coaches opinions on the lower tier receivers on the team. I can get jazzed for an offense that features Owens, Williams, Barber, Witten, and the athletic specimen that is Martellus Bennett as it's playmakers.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 12:24 PM
To compound on your points guys, I think Roy Williams is very dangerous in man coverage with quick slants. You can just see how explosive and strong he is when he runs that route.

They should continue to use TO as the wheres waldo, moving him around, but I think his motions should be used not necessarily to free him up, but to free up Roy in his single coverages.

Imagine a 4 WR set with 3 + 1 set up, with Roy, TO, and Witten as the 3 on one side? How do you cover that?

yodabear
11-17-2008, 12:30 PM
Thanks for thinking Brian Leonard's overhyped ass could actually play FB for you and cutting a very good FB in Madison Hedgecock. We really appreciate his effort out there for us.

ur welcome....we expect a party!

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 12:31 PM
To compound on your points guys, I think Roy Williams is very dangerous in man coverage with quick slants. You can just see how explosive and strong he is when he runs that route.

They should continue to use TO as the wheres waldo, moving him around, but I think his motions should be used not necessarily to free him up, but to free up Roy in his single coverages.

Imagine a 4 WR set with 3 + 1 set up, with Roy, TO, and Witten as the 3 on one side? How do you cover that?

Get in the dime and run a hybrid coverage. Have the 2 safties bracket # 1 on their respective side, and have the LB either blitz, or spot drop and play deep 1/3. It's not hard drawing it up, it all depends on what the concept of the play is that Garrett would run and the pressure by the front 4 for the defense.

LonghornsLegend
11-17-2008, 12:35 PM
Right now it's basically TO freeing up Roy, but I can see that changing pretty soon, but if Bennett can become consistent and Austin keeps progressing then it's pick your poison...Let's see how Garrett does vs some tough defenses Pittsburgh and Baltimore later on, because he still needs to learn how to get everyone involved consistently.


As much as I like TO he still drops too many easy balls, the one pass he dropped he was open on, and the ball that was jarred loose for a pick, I have been watching guys like Larry Fitzgerald & Anquan Boldin the past few weeks and if those guys have a pass thrown their way they catch it...Gets old hearing TO complain about looks but you can't trust him completely to make a play, but if things stay how they are I expect Roy to start stringing together some productive games because you can't leave a #2 corner on an island with him.


But I don't want to turn this into a Cowboy thread, I agree 100% on Philly though, that team is too talented, and they are in pretty much every game late in the 4th quarter then McNabb and/or Reid find a way to blow it either with playcalling, clock management, or a silly turnover.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 12:40 PM
Get in the dime and run a hybrid coverage. Have the 2 safties bracket # 1 on their respective side, and have the LB either blitz, or spot drop and play deep 1/3. It's not hard drawing it up, it all depends on what the concept of the play is that Garrett would run and the pressure by the front 4 for the defense.

great players eat zone coverage up for breakfast. combine great players with a great qb, and they win that battle more often then they lose it.


its easy to draw up a play that will work on them in theory, but the reality is, the only chance you really have of stopping an offense like that is consistent pressure. if you don't have the horses to get after the qb against an offense like that, youre dead in the water for the most part. give them time to gel, that offense is just starting to warm up.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 12:50 PM
great players eat zone coverage up for breakfast. combine great players with a great qb, and they win that battle more often then they lose it.


its easy to draw up a play that will work on them in theory, but the reality is, the only chance you really have of stopping an offense like that is consistent pressure. if you don't have the horses to get after the qb against an offense like that, youre dead in the water for the most part. give them time to gel, that offense is just starting to warm up.

It depends on the defense though. I am on the offensive side of the ball, so I am playing devil's advocate here, but good teams with equally good personnel will execute it just like it's meant to be. That's part of the chess match. If that was the case no one would play zone.

Not to mention you are playing all different techniques in terms of bail techinque and giving them a man look and going to zone or vice versa.

Another factor is you're assuming that Romo in this example will have all the time to make that throw for it be successful. How do you know he gets that time? What if the defense does their HW and gets their protection down, and blitzes accordingly so that he can't go for the long ball but has to go for the short route.

So many variables there are. The stuff your talking about our offensive staff and defensive staff would go back and forth on the grease board. This is what we do in our free time after we have practice set up. Our offense would draw a formation and do what you said, and our defense would counter. One thing I learned is everything has an equal to stop it.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 12:54 PM
It depends on the defense though. I am on the offensive side of the ball, so I am playing devil's advocate here, but good teams with equally good personnel will execute it just like it's meant to be. That's part of the chess match. If that was the case no one would play zone.

Not to mention you are playing all different techniques in terms of bail techinque and giving them a man look and going to zone or vice versa.

Another factor is you're assuming that Romo in this example will have all the time to make that throw for it be successful. How do you know he gets that time? What if the defense does their HW and gets their protection down, and blitzes accordingly so that he can't go for the long ball but has to go for the short route.

So many variables there are. The stuff your talking about our offensive staff and defensive staff would go back and forth on the grease board. This is what we do in our free time after we have practice set up. Our offense would draw a formation and do what you said, and our defense would counter. One thing I learned is everything has an equal to stop it.

i know i know. damn you always gotta make it so complicated lmaoo. :p

i can only think of maybe 6 defenses that have the personnel to stop that offense. i don't even know if you can "stop" it, moreso slow it down.

M.O.T.H.
11-17-2008, 12:55 PM
Choice is a good player but, as soon as Felix comes back, Choice will once again be strictly a ST player. He wasnt drafted to be apart of some three-headed monster or anything. Took Garrett forever to start giving Felix the ball...I wouldnt count on Choice getting many, if any carries when Felix comes back. Garrett better give Felix the damn ball, though.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 12:58 PM
i know i know. damn you always gotta make it so complicated lmaoo. :p

i can only think of maybe 6 defenses that have the personnel to stop that offense. i don't even know if you can "stop" it, moreso slow it down.

LOL. My job is to cut out all the BS when it comes to football. Like unstoppable sets and other BS stuff you tend to see every now and then. Also football is complicated which alot of people don't talk about. If it's a Trips right or 3 X 1 formation, then most likely it's going to be a 7 step drop or perhaps a 3-5 step drop out of gun. So now the pass protection has to fit that # of drop. So the defense will either run what I said, or if they lack the personnel they will just blitz. So screw it, we want to get to Romo, or the QB at step 3 or step 2.

If the cowboys were that good they'd go 16-0. If the Pats were that good they'd go 16 and... o wait.. Well they'd go 19-0! lol. But you get what I am saying. Everything has a balance, which makes this game so good.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 01:06 PM
LOL. My job is to cut out all the BS when it comes to football. Like unstoppable sets and other BS stuff you tend to see every now and then. Also football is complicated which alot of people don't talk about. If it's a Trips right or 3 X 1 formation, then most likely it's going to be a 7 step drop or perhaps a 3-5 step drop out of gun. So now the pass protection has to fit that # of drop. So the defense will either run what I said, or if they lack the personnel they will just blitz. So screw it, we want to get to Romo, or the QB at step 3 or step 2.

If the cowboys were that good they'd go 16-0. If the Pats were that good they'd go 16 and... o wait.. Well they'd go 19-0! lol. But you get what I am saying. Everything has a balance, which makes this game so good.

when i was watching that offense yesterday, just being the football dork that i am, i was thinking of ways to "stop" it. and honestly, your best bet is just attacking the protection schemes.

their protection can be had, that oline is not on the same level it was last year, and if you can stretch them with stunts and fire gaps, and use some blitzes to compound on that, you can create pressure. then just hope your coverage integrity is good enough to hold up.

also do some disguising to go along with that. thats really the best way to attack them.

Washington is very good at disguising coverages. you should check out their defense some time Shock. Its almost the opposite of ours. Almost exclusive 4 man rushes, and its heavily built on disguising coverages. those safeties are so good, you gotta check it out.

they really try to set you up. its not even just the playcall, its how they set up playcalls. theyll purposely show you one thing one play, with the intent of showing you the same look later in the game, baiting you to make an audible, but then at the hike that "look" becomes totally different, attack the audible that they were hoping youd audible too. its pretty neat.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 01:07 PM
Choice is a good player but, as soon as Felix comes back, Choice will once again be strictly a ST player. He wasnt drafted to be apart of some three-headed monster or anything. Took Garrett forever to start giving Felix the ball...I wouldnt count on Choice getting many, if any carries when Felix comes back. Garrett better give Felix the damn ball, though.

One knock on Garrett...he can't mix it up. If he's gonna run, he does it like 10 times in a row. Then he'll pass 10 times in a row.

Barber wanted sweeps, so he gives him like 8 sweeps in a row. The guy can't mix it up. Its like he has a one track mind.

M.O.T.H.
11-17-2008, 01:10 PM
One knock on Garrett...he can't mix it up. If he's gonna run, he does it like 10 times in a row. Then he'll pass 10 times in a row.

Barber wanted sweeps, so he gives him like 8 sweeps in a row. The guy can't mix it up. Its like he has a one track mind.

Garrett has a horrible football IQ. I actually thought he came up w/ a decent gameplan for a change this week but, most of the time it's the same garbage. You are certainly correct in your assesment. He goes from one extreme to the next...either we're passing 40 times per game or riding Barber into the ground. He doesnt know how to call a balanced game...as soon as he is named HC, we need to move on to a veteran playcaller because, he honestly doesnt know what he is doing. Once again, good job this week but, it doesnt make up for all the terrible games he has called.

SchizophrenicBatman
11-17-2008, 01:14 PM
Mewelde Moore has long been one of the most underrated backs in the NFL. No Minnesota, he's not Adrian Peterson, but he's a fringe-serviceable starter. The Steelers would be fine if they just gave him 25 carries a game to get the ball out of Ben's overrated-hold the ball for 5 minutes-ass

Race for the Heisman
11-17-2008, 01:32 PM
I don't really feel like making a new thread for it, but can we all feel comfortable saying Ted Ginn is not a bust now? He might not be worth the ninth overall pick yet, but he's getting closer to it. He's hand a handful of touchdown returns called back for stupid holding calls because simply no one can catch him once he hits stride. His having an impact, not as a stretch the field guy but as a player making possession-type catches and doing slants and underneath routes. I think Pennington is unjustifiably criticized for having a 'noodle' arm, but imagine what Ginn could do in a superior offense. Like I said, maybe not worth the ninth overall yet, but he's not a bust and he's getting closer to living up to his draft slot.

PACKmanN
11-17-2008, 01:57 PM
I think another comparison would be the 1997 Packers team to this years Titans.

Sniper
11-17-2008, 02:02 PM
I don't get Philly. I really don't. Before the start of the season, I was more affraid of Philly then any other team in the NFC, including the Cowboys. But this team is just an enigma to me. The only thing I can think of is the fact that McNabb and Andy Reid collectively are chokers. Thats my only explanation. McNabb is more talk than substance these days. And stop blogging McNabb. Just shut up and get it done.

So you mean throwing 76% of the time and only giving your best player 17 touches IS NOT a good idea?

Sniper
11-17-2008, 02:07 PM
I don't really feel like making a new thread for it, but can we all feel comfortable saying Ted Ginn is not a bust now? He might not be worth the ninth overall pick yet, but he's getting closer to it. He's hand a handful of touchdown returns called back for stupid holding calls because simply no one can catch him once he hits stride. His having an impact, not as a stretch the field guy but as a player making possession-type catches and doing slants and underneath routes. I think Pennington is unjustifiably criticized for having a 'noodle' arm, but imagine what Ginn could do in a superior offense. Like I said, maybe not worth the ninth overall yet, but he's not a bust and he's getting closer to living up to his draft slot.

No one's a bust until three seasons...minimum.

You know who's better than Ginn? Steve Breaston. At 1/100000000000000000th the price.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-17-2008, 02:08 PM
when i was watching that offense yesterday, just being the football dork that i am, i was thinking of ways to "stop" it. and honestly, your best bet is just attacking the protection schemes.

their protection can be had, that oline is not on the same level it was last year, and if you can stretch them with stunts and fire gaps, and use some blitzes to compound on that, you can create pressure. then just hope your coverage integrity is good enough to hold up.

also do some disguising to go along with that. thats really the best way to attack them.

Washington is very good at disguising coverages. you should check out their defense some time Shock. Its almost the opposite of ours. Almost exclusive 4 man rushes, and its heavily built on disguising coverages. those safeties are so good, you gotta check it out.

they really try to set you up. its not even just the playcall, its how they set up playcalls. theyll purposely show you one thing one play, with the intent of showing you the same look later in the game, baiting you to make an audible, but then at the hike that "look" becomes totally different, attack the audible that they were hoping youd audible too. its pretty neat.


Yeah protection is the way I'd go about it if I was a defensive guy. This for any team at all levels. I was helping out scouting for the HS I went to. They needed another eye so they gave me film on the opposing team. I broke down both the offense and the defense for the other team.

Offense:

I broke down their formations they used, and went through their running game and wrote down all the different concepts they used. Then when it came to passing I started with protections. I noticed the guy had a 3 and a 5 step drop, so then I went to their protection and realized they used a wedge protection with 2 backs in a split set, and both rushed to the middle like it was a punt protection. In the quick game, they had a split backfield, and both backs went to their respective side, and got the end man on the LOs or EMLOS. and the qb basically catch step and throw to a WR running a slant or hitch or basically short route.

So my point is if that is done for a simple HS game, then Pro coaches are using cutups by the scouting department for the pro games. You would first look at how many step drops Romo takes, and then disect the protections, and do that for all their passing. Then install a defensive gameplan based on that. It can be done, it's alot of work, and not easy, but good coaches and a good staff do that to prepare. So I would rely on that to disrupt the scenerio you gave. Any offense and any defense has a weakness to beat them. It's all about solving the puzzle and finding the way. That's why I love breaking down film. The answer to the puzzle is right there. You do your best to find the answer, if you ever do, and then implement it. Then it's up to the players.

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 02:16 PM
I still think the Steelers need a better power back to compliment with Willie Parker. I wonder if they might go after Jacobs in the offseason if we don't resign him.


That would seem nice...But they just drafted Mendenhall, and have Moore. The Steelers NEED to get some OL this offseason.

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 02:17 PM
:( Unfortunately I agree with you. Tomlin needs to take over the playcalling and get back to Steelers ball. Bruce Arians is a Mike Martz wannabe. I think Ben threw it 41 times yesterday. That is special ed. Should not be like that.

Arians should be given the Old Yeller Treatment.

MetSox17
11-17-2008, 02:17 PM
Yeah, i'd really just laugh if the Steelers went after Jacobs with the intention of keeping Willie Parker on the roster as well.

Geo
11-17-2008, 02:31 PM
Nice write-up, BBD. Some of my thoughts:

- There needs to be a change in Philadelphia. There must be a change ... and I'd keep Reid over McNabb. I've never liked McNabb, and he's only gotten worse in recent years as he opens his stupid idiot mouth instead of getting things done on the field. The best player on the offense and the team is Westbrook and it's not even close, that tells you about McNabb. Time to start the Kevin Kolb era imo, and with the huge demand for quarterbacks in the league, the best part is that the Iggles can likely get another first round pick for a consecutive year out of trading McNabb.

McNabb hasn't lead this team to the playoffs since 2004, no way in heck do I give him 2006 because the team was .500 at best until Garcia came in and Westbrook rightfuly took over the show. I don't think Philly makes the playoffs this year, so that's four consecutive years McNabb can't lead his team to the playoffs. Dump that loser.

Oh and Donovan? It's not because you're black. It's because you're not good enough.


- I wasn't impressed with Dallas last night, not one single iota. I came away disappointed, including games preceding last night's SNF game, in the Washington Redskins offense. Come on, do something. Maybe Clinton Portis has to do everything, but Jason Campbell is okay. However they are not getting it done, and last night was pathetic.

To be fair, before the season I felt Campbell would really take off once Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly developed so I suppose I fell for the bait of their early season success.

If somehow Washington makes the playoffs, chances are they get bounced the first weekend like last year, because of their offense or lack thereof.


- Speaking of other offenses that can't point a finger at their defenses this week: San Diego (10 pts) and Minnesota (13 pts). 10 pts Chargers? They were lucky the Steelers left so many points on the field thanks to their own ineptitude, but 10 points is not going to get it done. Even though the Steelers only scored 18 ... err, that is, "11" points.


- On that note: I'm not sure this isn't the worst officiating the NFL has seen yet. Ugh.

Although Steelers and their fans bitching about the flags holds no weight whatsoever, because the Steelers and the Cowboys too both commit too many penalties week after week.


- Farewell Orlando Pace, welcome Andre Smith.


- Jake Delhomme, you're awful right now. Terrible against the Raiders and against Detroit at home. The team needs him to do a 180 immediately, because the upcoming schedule won't be as forgiving:

at Atlanta, at Green Bay, Tamp Bay at home for MNF, Denver at home (okay this is another homecoming), at New York Giants, and finally at New Orleans.

Giantsfan1080
11-17-2008, 02:35 PM
Nice write-up, BBD. Some of my thoughts:

- There needs to be a change in Philadelphia. There must be a change ... and I'd keep Reid over McNabb. I've never liked McNabb, and he's only gotten worse in recent years as he opens his stupid idiot mouth instead of getting things done on the field. The best player on the offense and the team is Westbrook and it's not even close, that tells you about McNabb. Time to start the Kevin Kolb era imo, and with the huge demand for quarterbacks in the league, the best part is that the Iggles can likely get another first round pick for a consecutive year out of trading McNabb.

McNabb hasn't lead this team to the playoffs since 2004, no way in heck do I give him 2006 because the team was .500 at best until Garcia came in and Westbrook rightfuly took over the show. I don't think Philly makes the playoffs this year, so that's four consecutive years McNabb can't lead his team to the playoffs. Dump that loser.

Oh and Donovan? It's not because you're black. It's because you're not good enough.


- I wasn't impressed with Dallas last night, not one single iota. I came away disappointed, including games preceding last night's SNF game, in the Washington Redskins offense. Come on, do something. Maybe Clinton Portis has to do everything, but Jason Campbell is okay. However they are not getting it done, and last night was pathetic.

To be fair, before the season I felt Campbell would really take off once Devin Thomas and Malcolm Kelly developed so I suppose I fell for the bait of their early season success.

If somehow Washington makes the playoffs, chances are they get bounced the first weekend like last year, because of their offense or lack thereof.


- Speaking of other offenses that can't point a finger at their defenses this week: San Diego (10 pts) and Minnesota (13 pts). 10 pts Chargers? They were lucky the Steelers left so many points on the field thanks to their own ineptitude, but 10 points is not going to get it done. Even though the Steelers only scored 18 ... err, that is, "11" points.


- On that note: I'm not sure this isn't the worst officiating the NFL has seen yet. Ugh.

Although Steelers and their fans bitching about the flags holds no weight whatsoever, because the Steelers and the Cowboys too both commit too many penalties week after week.


- Farewell Orlando Pace, welcome Andre Smith.


- Jake Delhomme, you're awful right now. Terrible against the Raiders and against Detroit at home. The team needs him to do a 180 immediately, because the upcoming schedule won't be as forgiving:

at Atlanta, at Green Bay, Tamp Bay at home for MNF, Denver at home (okay this is another homecoming), at New York Giants, and finally at New Orleans.

Reid and McNabb both need to go. You said it yourself that Westbrook is their best player yet he only gets 16 carries. It's on Reid to get his best player the ball more than that.

Geo
11-17-2008, 02:36 PM
I think Reid will further emphasize Westbrook and another back to spell Westy, once Kolb finally takes over.

If he doesn't, it's probably best to move on from him too.

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 02:43 PM
Although Steelers and their fans bitching about the flags holds no weight whatsoever, because the Steelers and the Cowboys too both commit too many penalties week after week.




Could not agree with you more...Cowboys and steelers...while both hurt immensely by injuries....kill themselves with dumb penalties

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 02:43 PM
Ive said for a long time now, Andy Reid is the reason why the Eagles are great. He is also the reason why they'll never win a SB with him as their HC.


So its a double edged sword. Do you roll the dice and hope that one day the Reid regime will get over the hump? Or do you try a whole new regime and gamble on it either failing, not living up to the Reid regime, or maybe doing what Reid couldn't do?

Its a tough situation for the Eagles.

Giantsfan1080
11-17-2008, 02:50 PM
Ive said for a long time now, Andy Reid is the reason why the Eagles are great. He is also the reason why they'll never win a SB with him as their HC.


So its a double edged sword. Do you roll the dice and hope that one day the Reid regime will get over the hump? Or do you try a whole new regime and gamble on it either failing, not living up to the Reid regime, or maybe doing what Reid couldn't do?

Its a tough situation for the Eagles.

If they fire Reid we could probably say goodbye to Spags even though Johnson is there.

Geo
11-17-2008, 02:52 PM
You don't think the Iggles should give Reid at least one season, if not two seasons, with/for Kevin Kolb? That's his QB and give the kid a chance before potentially a drastic change, I think.

He made a pretty good move getting an '09 1st plus and '08 2nd for their '08 1st round pick in a trade, and then getting DeSean Jackson in the 2nd.

I'm not sure bringing in Hall of Fame coach Mike Holmgren would necessarily improve the situation. Now Mike Shanahan? Hmm ...

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 02:54 PM
If they fire Reid we could probably say goodbye to Spags even though Johnson is there.

doubt it.

Spags wouldn't go over Johnson like that. If anything, they promote Johnson to HC if he wants it.

Or they hire a diff offensive mind with the stipulation that Johnson remains in charge of the defense, Ditka and Buddy Ryan style.

Giantsfan1080
11-17-2008, 02:57 PM
doubt it.

Spags wouldn't go over Johnson like that. If anything, they promote Johnson to HC if he wants it.

Or they hire a diff offensive mind with the stipulation that Johnson remains in charge of the defense, Ditka and Buddy Ryan style.

I think if Johnson wanted to be a head coach he would have left years ago to do so.

M.O.T.H.
11-17-2008, 03:00 PM
I disagree when it comes to the Cowboy game. This is what they needed...it was a tough gritty game. I couldnt help but walk away from it impressed. Romo looked pretty damn sharp in the 2nd half for having a broken digit, missing multiple weeks, and playing in his first game w/ Roy. The offense certainly wasnt really in synch but, that will come once they get to work together more....I was happy w/ their performance. Tony was moving around like himself and smiling a whole lot. A totally different Qb then we've seen this year. (Depressed pocket passer) Garrett's playcalling was another plus...wasnt brilliant or anything but, he mixed in some new things. Moved T.O. around more...he did a much better job. And then we have the defense that looked excellent at times during the game. It wasnt perfect but, it was a step in the right direction. There is a lot to like out of this one. I like where we going from this point. The biggest thing for me though was seeing Romo actually look like Tony Romo. This guy has been missing this season. His pinkie should be getting better by the week...the offense will continue to gel, and the defense will hopefully continue to play with a sense of urgency and toughness that they showed last night. This very well could be the turning point.

Geo
11-17-2008, 03:00 PM
Johnson is too old to be a HC now, unfortunate but probably true.

The one exception might be Dick LeBeau, he didn't succeed in Cincinnati but come on, who could as long as the problem stems from the top.

If I had a 3-4 team and needed a head coach, I would seriously consider LeBeau. Give the man a good GM and OC and see what he can do in his second stint.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 03:06 PM
Johnson is too old to be a HC now, unfortunate but probably true.

The one exception might be Dick LeBeau, he didn't succeed in Cincinnati but come on, who could as long as the problem stems from the top.

If I had a 3-4 team and needed a head coach, I would seriously consider LeBeau. Give the man a good GM and OC and see what he can do in his second stint.

isn't LeBeau even older though?

I shed a tear everytime i think about Spags leaving the Giants. I know we can't stop it from happening either :(

diabsoule
11-17-2008, 03:11 PM
-Am I the only one who thinks Jeff Triplett is by far the worst ref in the league? I can't stand this guy. He's terrible. He made some terrible calls for both teams yesterday, and there are always an inordinate amount of penalties called when he refs a game. Especially a nationally televised one. I remember a sportswriter saying once (don't remember who), that Jeff Triplett just loves getting his face on TV, and wants to get as much facetime as he can get. I wouldn't doubt it. Why does his crew always call so many penalties? And why is his crew and himself wrong half the time? Even Madden said once last night (not exact quote) "only Jeff Triplette can make that call"

So I guess Madden feels the same way.

I think he's on the top tier clamoring for the king of crappy refs. Him and Ed Hochuli. After watching the Saints/Vikings game where Hochuli proved his worthlessness, I am not putting him up there with the worst of the worst in refdom.



-Kerry Collins is the real deal. He's proven in the past that with a good defense and a solid run game he can be a very good game manager who can make plays when you need him to. All the doubters, I never understood why its unfathomable to believe that Collins can get it done in the playoffs. Why not? He's already proven in his career that he can. Collins is a winner when put in a good situation. He's in a good situation right now. And he's clutch. Yes. I said it. Clutch. He's made plenty of clutch plays for the Titans. His stint in Oakland was what it was: who can succeed there anyway?

As for the Titans, everyone compares them to the 2000 Ravens. I strongly disagree. We have short term memory as fans. This titans defense is good, but its not nearly as good as that Ravens defense. In fact, I personally believe that Pittsburgh is the best defense in the league, and they have the best front 7 in football, not Tennesee.

A more accurate comparison would actually be the 2000 Giants. People forget, the 2000 Giants had the 2nd best defense in the league that year. Strahan that year was very comparable to Haynesworth on that dline. Both defenses are built the exact same way. Even the offenses were similar. The 2000 Giants had a dominant run game, led by Tiki (Chris Johnson) and a disappointing pudgester in Dayne (White: although White is lightyears ahead of Dayne). The passing game consisted of short passes to move the chains, with an occasional deep ball (by the same qb none the less). Same TE by committee approach. To me, the Titans are a mirror image of the 2000 Giants.

Hit the nail exactly on the head. After a few games, I thought Collins was the real deal. I think he's exactly what this offense needed; A complete game manager. If they had an explosive WR then this offense would be completely and utterly dangerous.

I agree completely with your 2000 Giants assessment. I've questioned the Ravens comparison just because that Ravens D was nasty. A comparison I've heard for this year's Titans was the 2002 Bucs. Game manager QB, a speedster (Michael Pittman) and a bruiser (Mike Alstott) at RB, and a great D. The only difference is that TB had Keyshawn Johnson and Keenan McCardell at WR which is infinitely better than Justin Gage & Co.

Right now, I think it's going to be Tennessee vs. NY Giants in the SB. Those two teams just seem to be leaps and bounds better than the other teams in their respective conferences.

-Ive read a lot about the Matt Cassell hype, and I wanted to comment on it but never had the time, so I'll say my thoughts here. Matt Cassell is not Tom Brady and will never be Tom Brady.

I know some ppl want to say that Brady was similar when developing, but thats just not true. First and foremost, even when Brady was developing, his deep ball was much better than Cassell's. Cassell's deep ball is downright atrocious.

Secondly, people want to compare their similar dink and dunk game managing styles. But let's compare the teams for a second. Matt Cassell is operating with talent that Brady wished he had when he was developing. This is the same exact team that was the most explosive offense in NFL history. Thats what Cassell has to work with. Brady had a pathetic offense around him when he was developing. Who would stretch the field when brady was young to begin with? Troy Brown? Please. And remember he didn't even have a credible RB until 2 years later. The Pats RB the first 2 seasons of the Brady era wouldn't even start for 28 of the 32 teams in the league. So not only did Brady have similar if not better numbers than Cassell, he did it with infinitely inferior talent.

3rdly (if thats a word), Brady started in his 2nd season in the league. This is Cassel's 4th year in the league. He had plenty of time to sit and develop like Rodgers did, even with the lack of experience in college. Brady had to learn at a much faster rate. And speaking of experience, Brady was a proven winner the few times he was given a chance in college. Cassel didnt even play.

I know everyone wants to discredit Brady as much as they can, and a lot of people hate the guy, but let's be real. Brady is the ****. Cassel is not. Whoever throws a bunch of money at this guy in the offseason is making a terrible mistake. A lot of back up qbs can do decent with that explosive offense, having been in the system for 4 years. Cassel is not special.

I agree, but I do think that Cassell can be a starting QB in this league. Put him in an offense where he only has to throw a few deep balls, has a solid TE option, and a great running game and he'll keep you competitive if not win a game or two by himself. I think there are several destinations for him where he could prove very effective: Minnesota, Arizona, possibly NY Jets.

-I honestly believe, that if Bill Cowher was still coaching the Steelers, they would be the best team in the NFL. The offensive design of this team under Tomlin is terrible. With that defense, they should pound the rock 50 times a game like Cowher did, and make Ben a game manager. Ben is a great game manager, let him be that. Whats wrong with being a game manager? I never understood that. Its all about winning, Ben is at his best when he's a game manager, let him do what he does. He's not the type of qb that can spread you out and score 30 points on you. He's not. And the team isn't built to do that anyway.

Where are the screen passes? PA passes? 3 step drops? The Steelers have a terrible offensive system that doesn't compliment their defense at all. This team should be a lot better than it is. Cowher knew what Ben was, and used him the right way. Tomlin is trying to make him into something he's not. Its not about fancy points, its about winning. Just win. Tomlin needs to go back to Cowher power. If they do that, this is a SB team. Their defense is ridiculous. They have more talent collectively then they ever did. Coaching is holding this team back. For all the praise Tomlin gets...i don't see it.

That's true, but who are you going to feed the rock to 50+ times a game? A dinged up Willie Parker? Mewelde Moore? I think what Pittsburgh is trying to do is play to their strengths right now which happen to be their WR's. Until Parker gets back to 100% then they won't be able to pound, pound, pound.

I do agree, though, that Cowher would have at least one more win than Tomlin. And I also fail to see where all the love for Tomlin is coming from. He hasn't done anything as far as I'm concerned. Dick LeBeau has them winning games.


-I don't get Philly. I really don't. Before the start of the season, I was more affraid of Philly then any other team in the NFC, including the Cowboys. But this team is just an enigma to me. The only thing I can think of is the fact that McNabb and Andy Reid collectively are chokers. Thats my only explanation. McNabb is more talk than substance these days. And stop blogging McNabb. Just shut up and get it done.

I think it's time for both McNabb and Reid to go. McNabb isn't the QB he used to be and I think Reid's family issues are too much. Bring in some new blood and get this franchise back on track. If you tie the Cincinnati Bengals then something is broken.

-As odd as it sounds, the Jets might be the most complete team in the AFC. And an interesting fact: the Jets coming into this week have the 3rd most sacks in the league. And this is without bust to be Vernon Gholston seeing any playing time. If they can just motivate that guy and get his worthless ass to do something that defense could be special. And if they continue to commit to the ground game, who knows what could happen.

I lack faith in Brett Favre as a playoff quarterback though.

No matter how well the Jets are playing, and they are playing very well, Favre is a liability in the playoffs. Going against a Tennessee or Pittsburgh, hell, even a Baltimore defense it's going to be rough. I still think Kellen Clemens is the future of the team and wasn't given a fair enough chance.

diabsoule
11-17-2008, 03:13 PM
isn't LeBeau even older though?

I shed a tear everytime i think about Spags leaving the Giants. I know we can't stop it from happening either :(

I wish the Saints would be in the market for a HC either this year or next. The Sean Payton experiment is starting to fall apart at the seams, which I knew would happen, and think a defensive minded person (like Spags) or even a hard-nosed kick 'em in the mouth type of guy like Russ Grimm would do wonders for New Orleans.

terribletowel39
11-17-2008, 03:14 PM
Yea but LeBeau is a bad ass. He doesn't look or act 71.

Going back and looking at his wiki page. It baffles me why he isn't in the HoF yet. Ridiculous.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 03:41 PM
I wish the Saints would be in the market for a HC either this year or next. The Sean Payton experiment is starting to fall apart at the seams, which I knew would happen, and think a defensive minded person (like Spags) or even a hard-nosed kick 'em in the mouth type of guy like Russ Grimm would do wonders for New Orleans.

I think Peyton can be a good coach. He just has no clue about defense, and he needs to give up playcalling. Also needs a power runner to go with his offense.

as you know, ive been a big advocate of the Tampa 2 in NO.

Geo
11-17-2008, 03:45 PM
Also needs a power runner to go with his offense.
I told you that offense is better suited for a bruiser. Nice to see you finally agreed.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 03:49 PM
I told you that offense is better suited for a bruiser. Nice to see you finally agreed.

Bush is still a disappointment at RB though. even though ive lightened my stance on that, its still not a valid excuse for him.

Geo
11-17-2008, 03:59 PM
I can't believe you're still on that hang-up. Give Bush some zone-blocking with an athletic OL and let him go, not draws behind a poor run-blocking line. Houston actually was his best fit, but he missed out.

It wouldn't surprise me if more than 50% of his receptions originated behind the LOS, the Saints don't even get him the ball down the field.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 04:05 PM
maan, do we really want to turn this into another Reggie Bush thread?

yeah he's not being used as well as he could be. but a lot of it is on him too.

diabsoule
11-17-2008, 04:11 PM
I think Peyton can be a good coach. He just has no clue about defense, and he needs to give up playcalling. Also needs a power runner to go with his offense.

as you know, ive been a big advocate of the Tampa 2 in NO.

I've been thinking of a few of those things too. Payton needs to give up play calling. We need another RB, one that is a bruiser and can get those tough yards that Reggie Bush can't. We need to utilize Reggie better. No more wheel routes or flare outs. Get him the ball in space. Motion him out wide and let him burn the secondary.

Payton has no clue on defense and neither does Gary Gibbs. We need to bring in a strong D Coordinator to get this defense in shape. We need an aggressive, attacking, DC. I'm all for bringing Raheem Morris in from TB and making him the DC. Convert to a Cover 2 and let's go. We have the personnel for it.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 04:13 PM
I've been thinking of a few of those things too. Payton needs to give up play calling. We need another RB, one that is a bruiser and can get those tough yards that Reggie Bush can't. We need to utilize Reggie better. No more wheel routes or flare outs. Get him the ball in space. Motion him out wide and let him burn the secondary.

Payton has no clue on defense and neither does Gary Gibbs. We need to bring in a strong D Coordinator to get this defense in shape. We need an aggressive, attacking, DC. I'm all for bringing Raheem Morris in from TB and making him the DC. Convert to a Cover 2 and let's go. We have the personnel for it.

or at the very least, a man oriented Tampa 2 like Chicago runs.

im a huge Porter fan. ive soured on Grant though. he looks so out of shape. whats up with that?

Ward
11-17-2008, 04:36 PM
maan, do we really want to turn this into another Reggie Bush thread?

It's either that or let it go back to being the Cowboys thread it was turning into. Pick your poison sir.

Gay Ork Wang
11-17-2008, 04:38 PM
or at the very least, a man oriented Tampa 2 like Chicago runs.

im a huge Porter fan. ive soured on Grant though. he looks so out of shape. whats up with that?
Chicago sucks.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-17-2008, 04:43 PM
It's either that or let it go back to being the Cowboys thread it was turning into. Pick your poison sir.

Denver Broncos Denver Broncos Denver Broncos Denver Broncos.

Thread saved.

Geo
11-17-2008, 04:51 PM
I'm rooting for them to win the West.

Mr. Stiller
11-17-2008, 05:06 PM
-I honestly believe, that if Bill Cowher was still coaching the Steelers, they would be the best team in the NFL. The offensive design of this team under Tomlin is terrible. With that defense, they should pound the rock 50 times a game like Cowher did, and make Ben a game manager. Ben is a great game manager, let him be that. Whats wrong with being a game manager? I never understood that. Its all about winning, Ben is at his best when he's a game manager, let him do what he does. He's not the type of qb that can spread you out and score 30 points on you. He's not. And the team isn't built to do that anyway.

I'm on the fence on this one. Bill Cowher had it put in to Arians Contract that he's the OC. Tomlin is in the exact mold Cowher was. A Positions coach for a few years, 1 year of DC, come in, learn the game. Granted, Cowher didn't have this loaded of a team, or Dick LeBeau. However his pantry of talent wasn't empty either...We don't have a "Jerome Bettis" for what Tomlin wants his offensive style.. If Cowher has Arians as OC... I don't know that he reigns him in any and honestly.. If Cowher fired him to take over... I still remember the season where he fired Sherman and was OC and it was outright terrible.

And as for this team.. If Cowher is here I doubt we get Timmons, Woodley, Spaeth or ***.. After watching his drafts and teams for so long.. those guys just aren't "Cowher" guys.

Which is why I think we took Rashard Mendenhall, I'm expecting a 4 headed attack next year. Rashard/Parker split the first/second downs (65/35 .. 60-40) Mendenhall splits 3rd downs with Moore.... And Gary Russell as the Short Yardage Back. I could even see them bringing a guy in as a late rounder/UDFA to Challenge Russell in that role.

One of the beat writers wrote it as... "Mike Tomlin is basically Bill Cowher, Bruce Arians thinks he's Mike Martz and Ben Roethlisberger thinks he's Peyton Manning."

I agree that Ben is not the Brady/Manning QB. He reminds me of Aikman. Now I feel that Aikman is overrated in a sense that the guy was never really "Dominant". But I feel that Ben is between Aikman and Elway. He has the efficiency of Aikman and almost a similar playstyle of Elway.

The Rushing game needs to get open because Ben has thrived his entire career on making efficient big plays off the Play Action..


Where are the screen passes? PA passes? 3 step drops?

Well to be fair..

Kendall Simmons (One of our best pulling and screen guards) was lost for the season (And possibly career).

Marvel Smith is likely going to be out the season with more back injuries.

Rashard Mendenhall is out for the season with a broken shoulder.

Alan Faneca left.. While he's not the pass blocker Kemo is, he did recognize the stunt, which Kemo is failing to do.

Heath Miller is also out right now.

And We lost Willie Parker for something like 3-4 games.

But after watching the San Diego game... I want to see more of that offense. It seems like it's starting to click.
WR's dropping less passes.
Ben making better decisions and using the check downs....
Parker showing the speed, explosion and agility to make the edge and escape tackles, not to mention his uncanny power for a 205lb back.
Finally getting Gary Russell to show he can make the Short yardage plays.
Finally including a TE in the gameplan (I'm really miffed they haven't used Heath Miller, the guy is pro-bowl caliber and one of the best in the AFC, they just misuse him).

The game yesterday (Even though Ben threw 40ish times) Was Steeler football in the traditional sense.

The Steelers have a terrible offensive system that doesn't compliment their defense at all. This team should be a lot better than it is. Cowher knew what Ben was, and used him the right way. Tomlin is trying to make him into something he's not. Its not about fancy points, its about winning. Just win. Tomlin needs to go back to Cowher power. If they do that, this is a SB team. Their defense is ridiculous. They have more talent collectively then they ever did. Coaching is holding this team back. For all the praise Tomlin gets...i don't see it.

Again, It's not Tomlin. Tomlin is letting his coordinators make the calls.. But he stated as of the Indy game he's going to be more included in the offensive playcalling. And I think he did a heck of a job against SD.

Roethlisberger was 31/41 for 308yards.. 75.6% Completion.. 96.4 Rating
Parker was 25/115, Russell 2 3rd and 1 situations (2/10).
Ward was 11/124, Holmes 5 for 63, Spaeth 6/55, Moore 5/33

With the Weather getting bad, and the worst of our schedule out of the way (With Really Dallas, Baltimore and Tennessee remaining).. I could see this team really pick it up.



-We all know that Ware and Merriman are the 2 best rushbackers in the league, but both Harrison and Woodley are slowly and surely entering the same level as those 2 guys. Both of Pittsburgh's rushbackers are amazing and can do it all. What a sick defense. Add in a blitzing Timmons at ILB, who is almost a rushbacker in his own right, and its impossible to block this front 7 up front or predict who's coming and when theyre coming. I can't say enough about this Pittsburgh defense. Its just freakin awesome. Thats the only word I can use to describe it. Its just awesome.

I love LeBeau's scheme. The only penalty those jokes in white/black stripes called yesterday was a False Start on the Chargers RT. Why? Harrison AND Woodley were lined up over him.

Timmons is making strides, but what is hurting his opportunities is depth. He's the top backup at all 4 LB positions. Next year we'll have Fox, Humpal, Davis and Harrison (Arnold) fighting for PT.

The only issue I see with Harrison (And I know it happens to a lot of defenders) Is that his height benefits and screws him. With his amazing strength his low stature allows him to get under the OT, but on the same token, also allows the OT to engulf him and basically hold him every play. Harrison usually gets out of most of them, but I haven't seen him get 1 holding call this season.

I think possibly the most impressive part of Pittsburghs defense this season is that..

Casey Hampton, Brett Kiesel, LaMarr Woodley, Ryan Clark, Bryant McFadden, DeShea Townsend have all missed games.. Quite a few overlapping and we're still holding teams through the season a full 7.1 points below their season averages.

I still contend that James Harrison is a top 5 defensive player in the league and should challenge for the DPOTY award.

Geo
11-17-2008, 05:11 PM
Bruce Arians was the Colts' QB coach for Peyton his first three years or so. I actually see a good deal of the Colts in what the Steelers try to do on offense.

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 05:14 PM
Bruce Arians was the Colts' QB coach for Peyton his first three years or so. I actually see a good deal of the Colts in what the Steelers try to do on offense.

Which is the problem. Steelers can't pass protect...They need to get back to RUNNING THE BALL. Arians system would work if Ben had time to throw. Until the Oline improves, they should utilize Parker and Moore...and more of Miller/spaeth.

Geo
11-17-2008, 05:17 PM
I'll add that Santonio Holmes was abusing Antonio Cromartie at times yesterday, in the battle of 2006 first round picks.

And then Cromartie might have gotten hurt on the final kickoff return. Any word on him, anyone know?

Mr. Stiller
11-17-2008, 05:32 PM
That would seem nice...But they just drafted Mendenhall, and have Moore. The Steelers NEED to get some OL this offseason.

There's only 3 Decent OL this offseason..

Vernon Carey of Miami and Parcells can't let him go.

Jordan Gross = $$$$$$$

Marc Colombo...

Steelers have Parker, Mendenhall, Moore and Gary Russell(who should be seeing more SYB Opportunities).


We have:

Max Starks, LT
Trai Essex, LT/LG
Marvel Smith, LT
Chris Kemoeatu, LG
Bryant McFadden, CB

as free agents this coming season.

McFadden has to be the priority because he has been a monster this year before breaking his arm.

Kemo has to be signed because we have no other guards.. Simmons career is likely over(Achilles Tear) and Stapleton is likely our future center.

Willie Colon has the look of a pro-bowl RG but a mediocre RT.. He doesn't have the pure strength of Larry Allen, but he has an incredibly similar playstyle and is effective.

right now:

LT? ~ Kemoeatu ~ Hartwig ~ Colon ~ RT?

Is what we're looking at.

I'm guessing:

Max Starks re-signs for 2-4 years at 4-5M Per.. and we draft a guy in the first to be the future LT (Monroe, Okung preferably).

We need CB Depth (Townsend is terrible),
DE Depth (Kirschke is 34/35, Smith is 32, Hampton/Hoke are 31 and Keisel is 30..)
OLB Depth (Bruce Davis is training for cycling on the weakside, but we have no one behind Woodley)..
S depth (Anthony Smith hasn't taken the next step yet, and Tyrone Carter needs replaced)..

Which is why I could see us going

1) Russell Okung, LT, Oklahoma State*
2) Macho Harris, CB/FS, Virginia Tech
3) Andy Levitre, OG/C, Oregon State (Challenge Stapleton for Center in a year)
3Comp(Faneca)) Dorell Scott, NT/DE, Clemson
4) Larry English, DE/OLB, Northern Illinois
5) Garrett Reynolds, RT, North Carolina
6) DeMonte Bolden, DE, Tennessee
7Trade(Mahan)) Lee Robinson, ILB, Alcorn State
7) Mark Parson, CB, Ohio

I think that could set us up for a heck of a run...

Yeah, i'd really just laugh if the Steelers went after Jacobs with the intention of keeping Willie Parker on the roster as well.

Even if we wanted to.. we couldn't, with 0 OT's (Tony Hills?) on the Roster, and only $12M In cap space.. Ward will likely have to restructure and we need to just sign our own guys back.

Mr. Stiller
11-17-2008, 05:35 PM
Could not agree with you more...Cowboys and steelers...while both hurt immensely by injuries....kill themselves with dumb penalties

I really would've had no issues with the Penalties that were committed by Pittsburgh if the Refs would've called at least the "Illegal Contact" as Holding as Cromartie Clearly pulled him with his jersey.. twice.

Ryon Bingham Punching Stapletons face (The play he was injured on).
http://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/getty/2008/09000d5d80c8ac6e_gallery_600.jpg

Or 1 hold on McNeil that was more obvious than any of Wards 2 Holding penalties or the McHugh penalty to Negate Parkers TD.

Or the really joke of a "Pass Interference" that gave SD The ball on the 1.

WR runs into the DB, Ball is clearly uncatchable.. and the refs flag that? But for Defensive?

Then they call Cromarties Holding as "Illegal Contact" because Ben was outside the pocket once? I never read in the rules when Holding became Illegal contact when the QB exits the pocket.

We Committed penalties, they committed penalties, only we were really flagged for them.

Gay Ork Wang
11-17-2008, 05:36 PM
what did ever happen to the steelers team board

Sniper
11-17-2008, 06:09 PM
Nice write-up, BBD. Some of my thoughts:

- There needs to be a change in Philadelphia. There must be a change ... and I'd keep Reid over McNabb. I've never liked McNabb, and he's only gotten worse in recent years as he opens his stupid idiot mouth instead of getting things done on the field. The best player on the offense and the team is Westbrook and it's not even close, that tells you about McNabb. Time to start the Kevin Kolb era imo, and with the huge demand for quarterbacks in the league, the best part is that the Iggles can likely get another first round pick for a consecutive year out of trading McNabb.

McNabb hasn't lead this team to the playoffs since 2004, no way in heck do I give him 2006 because the team was .500 at best until Garcia came in and Westbrook rightfuly took over the show. I don't think Philly makes the playoffs this year, so that's four consecutive years McNabb can't lead his team to the playoffs. Dump that loser.

Oh and Donovan? It's not because you're black. It's because you're not good enough.

Get the **** out of here. I'd get rid of Reid 1,000,000 times before I got rid of Donovan. Not because I'm that big of a McNabb guy, but because Reid sucks. And do you really think teams are going to give a first for McNabb? Get real.

MetSox17
11-17-2008, 06:27 PM
Get the **** out of here. I'd get rid of Reid 1,000,000 times before I got rid of Donovan. Not because I'm that big of a McNabb guy, but because Reid sucks. And do you really think teams are going to give a first for McNabb? Get real.

*Looks at author of OP*

Therein lies your problem, sir.

Sniper
11-17-2008, 06:31 PM
*Looks at author of OP*

Therein lies your problem, sir.

'Tis true. 'Tis true.

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 06:38 PM
*Looks at author of OP*

Therein lies your problem, sir.

i think you got a crush on me son

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 06:39 PM
oh and Packer fans, did Hawk play MIKE?

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 06:40 PM
oh and Packer fans, did Hawk play MIKE?

He did get switched with the loss of Barnett

bigbluedefense
11-17-2008, 06:41 PM
He did get switched with the loss of Barnett

how did he look?

captainjack27
11-17-2008, 06:44 PM
how did he look?

He wasn't too bad from what I saw, but the way the bears played against them ANYONE could have looked good.

Geo
11-17-2008, 07:07 PM
And do you really think teams are going to give a first for McNabb? Get real.
Maybe a late first, but you're right, a 2nd and maybe another pick is more likely.

Mr. Stiller
11-17-2008, 08:46 PM
what did ever happen to the steelers team board

Wow, of all the teams that talked in here you have to pick the Steelers out... Way to not be biased.

diabsoule
11-18-2008, 01:06 AM
or at the very least, a man oriented Tampa 2 like Chicago runs.

im a huge Porter fan. ive soured on Grant though. he looks so out of shape. whats up with that?

He got awarded a big contract and has grown fat and lazy because of it. I used to be a big Grant fan but now, I'm on the fence. The same with Will Smith. He's become easier to neutralize and hasn't shown the desire to get the quarterback.

However, I think a lot of this has to do with scheme, which falls on Gary Gibbs. Sure, we need another DT to play alongside Sedrick Ellis, who looks like he could shape into a stud sooner than later. But DT isn't down on my big board this year due to the overwhelming need for us to draft a S. Actually, I think we need to draft two safeties since I'm not a fan of Roman Harper, never was really. He's effective as a run stopper but has dismal cover skills.

What I'd like to see the Saints do is draft William Moore or Taylor Mays in the first, then Michael Hamlin, David Bruton, or someone in that mold that could man the other S position. DT would then be my next priority, but that's if we don't address that need in FA.

The long and the short is this. We have talent on D but the passive, prudent mentality of our defensive coordinator has trickled into the players mindset. We're not playing with intensity or aggressiveness, which needs to change and that right soon. I have a list of potential DC that I hope the Saints bring in to interview. I won't mention who, since this isn't the Saints thread and this diatribe has gone on for long enough, but the problem with the Saints starts and ends on defense.

giantsfan
11-18-2008, 08:25 AM
He got awarded a big contract and has grown fat and lazy because of it. I used to be a big Grant fan but now, I'm on the fence. The same with Will Smith. He's become easier to neutralize and hasn't shown the desire to get the quarterback.

However, I think a lot of this has to do with scheme, which falls on Gary Gibbs. Sure, we need another DT to play alongside Sedrick Ellis, who looks like he could shape into a stud sooner than later. But DT isn't down on my big board this year due to the overwhelming need for us to draft a S. Actually, I think we need to draft two safeties since I'm not a fan of Roman Harper, never was really. He's effective as a run stopper but has dismal cover skills.

What I'd like to see the Saints do is draft William Moore or Taylor Mays in the first, then Michael Hamlin, David Bruton, or someone in that mold that could man the other S position. DT would then be my next priority, but that's if we don't address that need in FA.

The long and the short is this. We have talent on D but the passive, prudent mentality of our defensive coordinator has trickled into the players mindset. We're not playing with intensity or aggressiveness, which needs to change and that right soon. I have a list of potential DC that I hope the Saints bring in to interview. I won't mention who, since this isn't the Saints thread and this diatribe has gone on for long enough, but the problem with the Saints starts and ends on defense.

I really don't like their play calling on either end. Defensively they need to be far more aggressive and offensively they need Payton to wise up and stop trying to be the next Gruden or Billick.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 08:30 AM
i think you got a crush on me son

I think he meant Geo. Don't quote me on that.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 08:31 AM
Maybe a late first, but you're right, a 2nd and maybe another pick is more likely.

For an injury-prone QB well on the wrong side of 30? Um, I'll take a fourth.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 08:42 AM
Trent Cole is starting to catch fire. he was lacking for a lil while.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 08:47 AM
Trent Cole is starting to catch fire. he was lacking for a lil while.

I'm shocked that he doesn't lead the team in sacks. I'm even more shocked that Darren Howard (!!!!%!$15&!&!???!?!) is leading the team with 8 sacks.

Oh, and BBD, I know you're a big Stewart Bradley guy. 76 tackles, 1 sack, 7 TFL, 1 FF, 1 PD.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 08:50 AM
I'm shocked that he doesn't lead the team in sacks. I'm even more shocked that Darren Howard (!!!!%!$15&!&!???!?!) is leading the team with 8 sacks.

Oh, and BBD, I know you're a big Stewart Bradley guy. 76 tackles, 1 sack, 7 TFL, 1 FF, 1 PD.

Stewart Bradley is the man.

Cole probably has more "almost sacks" than any DE in the league by far. He missed out on like at least 5 of em.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 08:56 AM
Stewart Bradley is the man.

So sayeth my girlfriend. She won't stop staring at him.

Cole probably has more "almost sacks" than any DE in the league by far. He missed out on like at least 5 of em.

It's maddening. Then again, so is the whole team.

BBD, let me ask you this. Say you're the Eagles, and you plan on "blowing up" the team and starting over. Who do you get rid of? Obviously Reid and McNabb, and let Dawkins retire. Then who?

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 09:00 AM
So sayeth my girlfriend. She won't stop staring at him.



It's maddening. Then again, so is the whole team.

BBD, let me ask you this. Say you're the Eagles, and you plan on "blowing up" the team and starting over. Who do you get rid of? Obviously Reid and McNabb, and let Dawkins retire. Then who?

in terms of personnel, there isn't much to blow up. the talent is there to go to the SB. perhaps the OTs? but theyre still good, if its not broken don't fix it right?

LJ Smith has to go. Selick is better anyway. Id let go of that worthless RB from Penn State (forgetting his name), Lorenzo Booker, get a power running back, put Baskett in the starting lineup, and go after Boldin. Thats pretty much it.

The team is there already, no need to blow anything up. Just maybe a slight makeover.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 09:11 AM
in terms of personnel, there isn't much to blow up. the talent is there to go to the SB. perhaps the OTs? but theyre still good, if its not broken don't fix it right?

The OTs have been very good this year. If they were better in the run game, I'd qualify them as excellent, but they've been very good. That said, they is old, yo.

LJ Smith has to go.

I completely agree. Giving him the franchise tag when he is the worst starting TE in the NFC Beast was a completely ridiculous move. I guess they thought they could squeeze another year out of McNabb and it'd help having his favorite target, but it didn't work out that way. Smith can't catch, can't block, and consistently bitches for the ball more. Then when he gets it, he drops it.

Selick is better anyway.

Celek, and yes he is.

Id let go of that worthless RB from Penn State (forgetting his name)

They moved him to FB, and then cut him like three weeks ago.

Lorenzo Booker

Another colossal failure.

get a power running back

Been asking for one since, I don't know, 1891. Still waiting.

put Baskett in the starting lineup

And then bench Curtis!!!!! I don't know if Baskett is consistent starter material though. He somehow always makes huge plays, but he's not consistent.

and go after Boldin.

I thought it was dumb that they were so against giving up an '09 first rounder when they have two. You know they're gonna trade one for a bag of footballs and a seventh round pick. But I like the idea. He's not a FA yet though.

The defense has been very good this year. The only change I'd make on D is getting a true 4-3 SAM backer, because Gocong sucks. You could keep Gocong as a situational pass rusher, but he's more suited for a 3-4 OLB spot. Dawkins will probably retire (:(), but I think Demps could play the FS in this scheme. I'd also like to cut Sean Considine.

On offense, two new OL will be needed. Herremans could probably slide out to LT if the team wants to draft a guard (if the tackle value isn't there), but either way, they need two OT/one OT and one OG. Kevin Curtis is not a #1 receiver, and whoever thought he was and thought it was a good idea to give him 36 mill for 6 years is brain-dead. If they somehow got Q, they could put Q at the 1, Baskett at the 2 (by title only, since he can't play the slot) and have Curtis and Jackson roam the slots. I think Jason Avant needs more looks. He's an excellent third down option, but doesn't play nearly enough.

Oh, and David Akers needs to GTFO.

Geo
11-18-2008, 09:13 AM
I'd like to add:

- Braylon Edwards is terrible. Even when he does catches the ball on occassion, he can't hold onto it firmly. Marvin Harrison is old, what the heck is this guy's excuse?

Stevie Breaston is easily the best Michigan receiver in the league right now.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 09:15 AM
I'd like to add:

- Braylon Edwards is terrible. Stevie Breaston is easily the best Michigan receiver in the league right now.

You shut your mouth when you're talking to me! That's blasphemous.

Edwards last night: 8 snagaroos, 104 yardskis.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 09:16 AM
Breaston is a good slot guy, but I doubt he'll ever be anything better. He was good at Michigan when he wasn't asked to be The Man. He sucked as a primary target.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 09:17 AM
Even when he does catches the ball on occassion, he can't hold onto it firmly. Marvin Harrison is old, what the heck is this guy's excuse?



He forgets his 5 hour energy shots before the game.

Geo
11-18-2008, 09:18 AM
Edwards had at least 16 targets, if not more. And most if not all of those receptions is thanks to convenient zone coverage by the Bills. Even then, the ball is moving around in his hands. Take a look next time.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 09:19 AM
Sniper, what you think of Housh?

I say if you can't get Boldin, Housh should definitely be available.

Sniper
11-18-2008, 09:19 AM
And most if not all of those receptions is thanks to convenient zone coverage by the Bills.

Because no one can match up 1 vs. 1 with Braylon! Well, except his hands.

Dam8610
11-18-2008, 11:07 AM
Stewart Bradley is the man.

Cole probably has more "almost sacks" than any DE in the league by far. He missed out on like at least 5 of em.

Dwight Freeney has 19 pressures. The Eagles website doesn't keep track of pressures.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 11:07 AM
Dwight Freeney has 19 pressures. The Eagles website doesn't keep track of pressures.

how is freeney looking this year?

Sniper
11-18-2008, 11:07 AM
Sniper, what you think of Housh?

I say if you can't get Boldin, Housh should definitely be available.

Yes to Houshamazillie. CHAMPIONSHIP!

Dam8610
11-18-2008, 11:11 AM
how is freeney looking this year?

Great, when he's not being held. He has 4 sacks the last 2 games, and 3 of them couldn't have come at more opportune times. He had one against the Steelers on their final drive of the game, one against the Texans that turned a redzone trip into a FG (4 point sack IMO), and one against the Texans on their final drive of the game.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 11:13 AM
Great, when he's not being held. He has 4 sacks the last 2 games, and 3 of them couldn't have come at more opportune times. He had one against the Steelers on their final drive of the game, one against the Texans that turned a redzone trip into a FG (4 point sack IMO), and one against the Texans on their final drive of the game.

i heard rumors the Colts might cut Sanders at the end of the year. whats your thoughts on that? agree? disagree?

he's something like 10 mill against the cap.

Ward
11-18-2008, 11:18 AM
The defense has been very good this year. The only change I'd make on D is getting a true 4-3 SAM backer, because Gocong sucks. You could keep Gocong as a situational pass rusher, but he's more suited for a 3-4 OLB spot. Dawkins will probably retire (:(), but I think Demps could play the FS in this scheme. I'd also like to cut Sean Considine.

I really liked Gocong coming out... as a 3-4 OLB. The guy played in a 3 point stance in college in a super aggressive scheme and was extremely productive. I saw him in person for a playoff game @ Texas State and he was one of the best on the field that had arguably 3 or 4 NFL caliber players. So it was surprising to me (and I guess now David Pollack is a good comparison) that they would try to take him from that and make him stand as a SOLB in a 4-3. The guy had potential... but you're sort of taking away what makes him great. He and Pollack both IMO should have been 3-4 OLBs.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-18-2008, 11:20 AM
Has Freeney been hurt this year or has he been playing all the games so far?

Dam8610
11-18-2008, 11:24 AM
i heard rumors the Colts might cut Sanders at the end of the year. whats your thoughts on that? agree? disagree?

he's something like 10 mill against the cap.

Well, I don't think Polian is ********, and injury prone or not, there's no denying how much better Bob makes this defense (it was fairly evident this past Sunday). As for his cap situation, if you believe coltscap.net, Bob is a ~$7 million cap hit next year, and will have $10 million in guarantees left on his contract. I would strongly disagree with releasing Bob, and I doubt the Colts would do it at a $3 million loss (or even a $2 million gain spreading the hit over 2 years). If they did let him hit the FA market, some team would be all over him. Talent is always going to have a spot in the NFL.

Geo
11-18-2008, 11:27 AM
Sanders isn't going anywhere. Disregard the frothing idiocy saying otherwise.

Freeney has recovered well from his Lisfranc injury of a year ago. The Colts are rotating Josh Thomas with him as normal, but obviously he's played the lions' share of defensive plays in every game.

But please stop talking about the Colts.

Dam8610
11-18-2008, 11:29 AM
Has Freeney been hurt this year or has he been playing all the games so far?

He's played every game, there have been a lot of times where he hasn't showed much on the stat sheet because he's been doubled a lot, plus there were some odd interpretations of holding early in the year (Freeney said he went to a ref asking why he wasn't calling holding, and according to him the ref said the only way he was going to call holding was if he felt Freeney would make an impact on the play if the holding wasn't there). He's having a pretty solid season, though, with 7 sacks, 19 pressures, and 3 FF.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-18-2008, 11:56 AM
He's played every game, there have been a lot of times where he hasn't showed much on the stat sheet because he's been doubled a lot, plus there were some odd interpretations of holding early in the year (Freeney said he went to a ref asking why he wasn't calling holding, and according to him the ref said the only way he was going to call holding was if he felt Freeney would make an impact on the play if the holding wasn't there). He's having a pretty solid season, though, with 7 sacks, 19 pressures, and 3 FF.


Yeah true, Freeney was never a complete DE. For a pass rushing specialist that's a good season so far. It's good to see him back from injury.

Geo
11-18-2008, 12:15 PM
I thought Freeney was playing the run too much in the first half against Houston actually, Rosenfels was killing the team on bootleg passes.

bigbluedefense
11-18-2008, 12:24 PM
i always wondered what Freeney would do as a 3-4 rushbacker.

that would be a site to see.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-18-2008, 12:43 PM
I thought Freeney was playing the run too much in the first half against Houston actually, Rosenfels was killing the team on bootleg passes.

Playing the run, and actually making tackles are two different things. All DEs are going to play run when they read their keys and act accordingly. The thing is if they can disengage make a play.

Yeah, that's what I would do if I was facing a team with good pass rushers. I'd move the pocket with bootleg, sprint protection, and rollout protection. Keep your guys guessing. Plus bootleg works well with bread and butter running plays.

captainjack27
11-18-2008, 12:49 PM
I'd like to add:

- Braylon Edwards is terrible. Even when he does catches the ball on occassion, he can't hold onto it firmly. Marvin Harrison is old, what the heck is this guy's excuse?

Stevie Breaston is easily the best Michigan receiver in the league right now.


I have to disagree here. Sorry, but A LOT of people would look good in the slot in Arizona's system. Despite Edwards having bad hands, He did make a pro bowl nad had 16 tds last year, with Derek Anderson at the helm. That is last year, but no way can I say Breaston>Edwards.

Dam8610
11-18-2008, 01:11 PM
Yeah true, Freeney was never a complete DE. For a pass rushing specialist that's a good season so far. It's good to see him back from injury.

Freeney actually holds his own against the run when he's not being called upon to try to run by the opposing team's LT and try to pressure the QB at pretty much all costs. Watching him completely abandon playing the run at times, it has to be the coaching telling him to do it, especially when you consider their philosophy at times has been "stop the run on the way to the QB". The Jaguars ran for 375 yards on the Colts in 2006 running draws to Freeney's gap pretty much the whole game. Why? Because the coaching staff had him playing 7 technique and trying to loop past the LT every play (the fact that Gilbert Gardner was left to cover the gap didn't help matters either). I'd consider it a player flaw if it didn't happen so often. Also note that that same year in the playoffs, one of the adjustments the coaching staff made on defense was to have the DEs play more gap control type assignments rather than abandoning gaps and attacking the QB. These days Freeney doesn't seem to have that assignment nearly as much, especially on likely run downs, and teams haven't exactly had success running to the left side against the Colts, although you could say that's because all they have to do is run up the gut, considering how poor the DT play has been this year. All-in-all, though, I think the whole "Freeney can't play the run" thing is overblown. The Colts run defense has fluctuated over the past few seasons based on the quality of DT play they've gotten, really.

Geo
11-18-2008, 01:12 PM
Playing the run, and actually making tackles are two different things. All DEs are going to play run when they read their keys and act accordingly. The thing is if they can disengage make a play.
There's a reason teams don't ever run wide left against the Colts. Their chances are much better up the middle or to inside tackle to the right, which was pretty much the case for Houston as I recall.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-18-2008, 02:47 PM
There's a reason teams don't ever run wide left against the Colts. Their chances are much better up the middle or to inside tackle to the right, which was pretty much the case for Houston as I recall.

I don't doubt that. I was just speaking in general for his career. 37 career tackles season high is still pretty damn weak. That to me says that for all his talent to get to the QB, he still can't properly disengage off of the various types of run blocks by the OL, to make a play consistently game in and game out. I was just wondering if he was playing all season because 18 tackles is damn low!

Geo
11-18-2008, 02:56 PM
So much of the (run) defense is funneled to the WLB, the MLB, and the SS. Those guys are going to get the tackle numbers for sure. Just shy on the second tier come the CBs and the FS, then the third tier of the SLB (might be second tier) and the def linemen if they can make plays down the line/field, which Mathis and Freeney occassionally do. I suppose I could put it that way, although it's more fluid than how I described it.

Maybe Freeney could be a better run-stopper in a more traditional defense, who knows. I think he does a solid job, thankfully the coaches have cut down a bit on having him rush too wide from 7 tech as Dam noted. And the one thing I've liked is that he's gone inside a little more the last few weeks, bull-rushed every so often. It's good for him to mix it up a bit.

MetSox17
11-18-2008, 05:07 PM
i think you got a crush on me son

Lol it's cute that you think the world revolves around you, but that was not a reference to your post.