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View Full Version : So what's the scouting report on Andre Smith?


lost33cause
11-26-2008, 10:31 AM
I'm a Bengals fan and a lot of Mock's have us taking him so I'm curious as to what his stregths and weaknesses are?

Is he a mauler?
Is he better at pass protection than run blocking?
Is he better run blocking than pass protection?
Can he step in and start right away?
Can he play RT as well as LT?
Is he better suited for one or the other?
Can he live on an island at LT with little to no help and take care of the Dwight Freeney's of the world?

I would love a mauler at LT or RT who can do as good run blocking as pass protection because our running game is horrid and has been(I know it's mainly because of the C position but thats a seperate thread). We have a need at both but more so at RT with the emergence of Anthony Collins(if he shows the rest of the year) and the departure of Stacey Andrews at the end of the season.


Thanks in advance.

georgiafan
11-26-2008, 11:26 AM
I would call him a mauler who's run blocking is ahead of his pass blocking.

Smokey Joe
11-26-2008, 11:28 AM
he's a beast, and he can play anywhere on the line at a high level, except C.

Matthew Jones
11-26-2008, 11:29 AM
Yes, no, yes, yes, yes, no, and I don't think any rookies really can, but maybe eventually, in order.

fenikz
11-26-2008, 11:38 AM
Is he a mauler? yes
Is he better at pass protection than run blocking? no
Is he better run blocking than pass protection? yes
Can he step in and start right away? yes
Can he play RT as well as LT? yes
Is he better suited for one or the other? no
Can he live on an island at LT with little to no help and take care of the Dwight Freeney's of the world? eventually

Babylon
11-26-2008, 12:42 PM
Sure top 5 pick, height may be a factor but not enough to make a differance. Question is the order of the tackles selected after him, i think that is debatable.

Iamcanadian
11-26-2008, 05:10 PM
He looks like the best LT prospect since Pace or Ogden. His run blocking is ahead of his pass blocking because Alabama likes to run the ball a lot. However even at 6"3" to 6"4", 340lbs. he is extremely light on his feet with superb quickness. I think he will be extremely effective either run blocking or pass blocking once he adjusts to the pro game.
Teams can waste him by playing him at RT or OG but I don't think too many are that foolish.

BeerBaron
11-26-2008, 05:19 PM
Is he a mauler? Emphatic yes
Is he better at pass protection than run blocking? No, but he's not terrible
Is he better run blocking than pass protection? Yes
Can he step in and start right away? Yes
Can he play RT as well as LT? Absolutely yes
Is he better suited for one or the other? Not really, though I think he could be an incredible mauling RT if need be
Can he live on an island at LT with little to no help and take care of the Dwight Freeney's of the world? I don't think any rookie really can but he'd be better than most


In the short term, to a team like the Bengals who could leave Levi Jones at LT, Smith could prove to be a beastly short term RT with his strength while he learns the pro-game for a long term move at LT.

I still feel in my gut that the Bengals should probably try and take the best defensive player available though....even if it means reaching a bit for someone like Orakpo, its the defense that has been their greatest problem the past several years.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-26-2008, 05:34 PM
I still can't figure out how a guy with legs as massive as Smith's looks so light on his feet.

Andre Smith definitely has some rough patches in his game. He kicks out really well, but he relies a bit too much on his first punch to nullify pass rushers. He doesn't do the hand to hand battle quite as well as some of the other top offensive tackle prospects we've seen, but that inital punch knocks almost every college defender off balance immediately, and he is quick to capitalize on that. In the run game, there's not a whole lot of nitpicking. He gets low and just drives his man way outside the play. He can pull outside on stretch plays, he can block at the second level (although he's not very controlled when he does), and he's a very willing cut blocker.

I do think he can play LT in the NFL. He's not too slow to the edge. He's definitely strong enough. It goes without saying that he could handle the right side as well, but a guy with this kind of talent should be given a serious shot on the left side. He reminds me a bit of Walter Jones, who gave up 6 sacks in each of the first three full seasons he played and a took a little while to figure out the battle against pass rushers.

I think he's the best draft eligible player in the nation.

STARHEATHER
11-26-2008, 10:37 PM
im probably in the great minority, but i dont like hi nearly as much as others. i still believe hes a potential top 10 talent. has played very well. good blocker, good athlete. plenty of bulk. but he lacks top end tackle traits. hes shorter than prtotype by quite a bit and he may even be shorter than advertised. i think he can play lt, but i dont see greatness. i love him as a guard. i think he fits that position better and could be an nfl star. at lt he could have some problems. arm reach and height look to below far below top tier nfl level and that scares me to draft a tackle high that has some non nfl T traits. hes agreat prospect. i just wouldnt use the #1 pick on a guy i knew had physical traits that were below nfl top tier. and height and arm reach are important tackle traits

Paranoidmoonduck
11-26-2008, 11:38 PM
Height is only important as much as it pertains to arm length. I can't see any other reason that the 2 or 2.5 inch difference between Smith and someone like Monroe would play much of a difference. In fact, being shorter lends itself to leverage more readily.

And while arm length is important, it's a bit overblown. People jumped all over Gallery for having short arms, but his failing went far beyond that, and I don't hear anyone still arguing that Joe Thomas' arms are too short for a tackle.

STARHEATHER
11-27-2008, 12:09 AM
most of the top end tackles are taller longer types. you can say it doesnt matter, but im going to be skeptical about any player who doesnt look like the other guys. hes not anything like clady or long thomas or any of the recent tackles. i dont know if this is true he may ust suck but rumor has robert gallery couldnt play T because he lacked certain traits. im ust not going to use a top 5 pick on a dude who doesnt look like the other dudes dominating the position. i ust dont see many lt id compare andre smith to. unless the position is getting shorter but i dont see that as the next step in the evolution of the position. i see that as regression. they have to be somebody unless theyre the next level in the evolution. i ust dont see evolution going backwards and hes going to be a great one at that position. he ust doesnt look like the other guys

illmatic74
11-27-2008, 12:15 AM
most of the top end tackles are taller longer types. you can say it doesnt matter, but im going to be skeptical about any player who doesnt look like the other guys. hes not anything like clady or long thomas or any of the recent tackles. i dont know if this is true he may ust suck but rumor has robert gallery couldnt play T because he lacked certain traits. im ust not going to use a top 5 pick on a dude who doesnt look like the other dudes dominating the position. i ust dont see many lt id compare andre smith to. unless the position is getting shorter but i dont see that as the next step in the evolution of the position. i see that as regression. they have to be somebody unless theyre the next level in the evolution. i ust dont see evolution going backwards and hes going to be a great one at that position. he ust doesnt look like the other guysHe is very similar to Jason Peters

RaiderNation
11-27-2008, 01:07 AM
http://www.sundaymorningqb.com/2008/7/2/563314/two-children-injured-man-b
Two children were injured Tuesday, one seriously, as Alabama tackle Andre Smith emerged from hibernation to begin his annual summer forage for food...

Read this article, it will show you who Andre Smith really is.....

Funny read, but for real he is my top prospect this year and I think we will be a top 3 LT in this league til the day he retires.

Iamcanadian
11-27-2008, 06:39 AM
im probably in the great minority, but i dont like hi nearly as much as others. i still believe hes a potential top 10 talent. has played very well. good blocker, good athlete. plenty of bulk. but he lacks top end tackle traits. hes shorter than prtotype by quite a bit and he may even be shorter than advertised. i think he can play lt, but i dont see greatness. i love him as a guard. i think he fits that position better and could be an nfl star. at lt he could have some problems. arm reach and height look to below far below top tier nfl level and that scares me to draft a tackle high that has some non nfl T traits. hes agreat prospect. i just wouldnt use the #1 pick on a guy i knew had physical traits that were below nfl top tier. and height and arm reach are important tackle traits

Well, I haven't see any report that he has short arms. Where did that come from ? If true, it would make me very nervous about drafting him in the top 5. However, considering all the talk about how good he is, it would seem to me that his arm length is fine, it is just his height and weight that is a bit of a concern. I've never seen anybody mention short arms.

AkiliSmith
11-27-2008, 08:20 AM
Well, I haven't see any report that he has short arms. Where did that come from ? If true, it would make me very nervous about drafting him in the top 5. However, considering all the talk about how good he is, it would seem to me that his arm length is fine, it is just his height and weight that is a bit of a concern. I've never seen anybody mention short arms.
Starheather makes things up

STARHEATHER
11-27-2008, 10:54 AM
well if you look at him. hes not gangly like one would like to see. im not saying the guys not a player. im just saying that he lacks topnfl T traits. abd a player who lacks certain top end traits for whatver position is always going to be a risk. ason peters was a mid rd pick. youre talking about investing 40 mil guaranteed and the first overall pick on a player who lacks traits. its just not the way id go at that position in the draft especially with several other solid T prospects available several with better traits than smith.

Saints-Tigers
11-27-2008, 11:01 AM
He doesn't fit the eyeball test for a LT, but damn he's a manbeast.

STARHEATHER
11-27-2008, 11:14 AM
so you can understand the skepticism of this guy being the best player available or even the best tackle available. he doesnt look the part

Monomach
11-27-2008, 12:02 PM
In other NFL threads, everyone said that they'd never seen a measurement. Heather appears to be making a big, big, big assumption.

6'4" is actually the average height of an NFL tackle. I'm not going to call a guy a huge risk because he's of average height. His arms don't look stumpy to the eyeball; he appears normally-proportioned to me.

http://i33.tinypic.com/sy1fuu.jpg

If they end up being half of an inch shorter than the NFL prototype, it's not going to matter. The guy's about as graceful as a ballet dancer. He can move. I'm not sure I'd believe whatever number we end up hearing, anyway. The info that comes out varies for each player.

I've seen measurements for Joe Thomas of 32 1/2" and 33 1/4". Joe Thomas looks fine on the field. He has good footwork...but not as good as Smith's. Gallery's were reported as 32 1/4" or 32 1/2", and he was 6' 7". The average length for an NFL tackle? 33 15/16". Shane Olivea has 31 1/2" arms. He was pretty damned good until he failed drug tests and got injured.

Who do you want on your team?
a) a 6'4" OT with fantastic footwork, excellent lateral speed, and 33" arms
or
b) a 6'7" OT with average footwork, average lateral speed, and 34 1/2" arms?

I'll take player a every time. Like he can't slide his feet over fast enough to catch the speedy DEs that "Mr. Brick Wall, ideal sized NFL Tackle" player B can?

What's the worst-case scenario for Andre Smith? He somehow fails at LT in the NFL and becomes one of the best RTs in the league? Someone'd run behind this guy for 1600 yards.

illmatic74
11-27-2008, 01:17 PM
so you can understand the skepticism of this guy being the best player available or even the best tackle available. he doesnt look the partThis is Football not body building.

SenorGato
11-27-2008, 01:57 PM
im probably in the great minority, but i dont like hi nearly as much as others. i still believe hes a potential top 10 talent. has played very well. good blocker, good athlete. plenty of bulk. but he lacks top end tackle traits. hes shorter than prtotype by quite a bit and he may even be shorter than advertised. i think he can play lt, but i dont see greatness. i love him as a guard. i think he fits that position better and could be an nfl star. at lt he could have some problems. arm reach and height look to below far below top tier nfl level and that scares me to draft a tackle high that has some non nfl T traits. hes agreat prospect. i just wouldnt use the #1 pick on a guy i knew had physical traits that were below nfl top tier. and height and arm reach are important tackle traits

+1

It's nothing against Smith or anything...he's Shawn Andrews/Steve Hutchinson as a G prospect... but I don't think he offers the same kind of upside at LT. I think Oher is the best LT in this draft...if people are impressed by Smith's feet they should really watch Oher.

Olympia Martin
11-27-2008, 03:35 PM
The thing about Andre Smith with me is, if you dont like him at LT for reasons suggested within this topic, so have to like him at OG. I think as a OG he is the best OG prospect I have seen in years. He could project to LG like a Steve Hutchinson in the NFL. Just unbelievable mauling LG. I see no way that he falls beyond the top 10. Personally I would select him no lower than #2 at this point. Worst case scenario the team that drafts him sees him struggle at LT and moves him inside to guard where he is a probowler for 8 years. His floor as far as bust potential is pratically non-existent. I think he is a cant miss tackle or guard, take your pick.

SenorGato
11-27-2008, 04:15 PM
Doesn't sound too different from Gallery either...Gallery was considered the best LT prospect since Pace IIRC.

Zyro_1014
11-27-2008, 04:24 PM
I think the guy is going to be special wherever he plays

Whenever you watch Bama play, he changes the game. Anytime they are struggling or need a big play they run right behind the big man and he doesnt let them down very much. He would be a great guard but tackles are much more valuable.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-27-2008, 05:22 PM
Doesn't sound too different from Gallery either...Gallery was considered the best LT prospect since Pace IIRC.

So whoever is good enough to be compared to Pace is automatically going to fail?

SenorGato
11-27-2008, 06:02 PM
So whoever is good enough to be compared to Pace is automatically going to fail?

How do you even draw that conclusion?

It's just a little chunk for everyone to toss around in their minds. It's not like theres no legit worries about Smith's long term ability at LT.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-27-2008, 06:24 PM
My point is that, physically, there's no real reason to compare Andre Smith to Robert Gallery. The line you drew between involved them being considered good enough tackle prospects to be compared to Orlando Pace, then inferred that should cause concern considering Gallery's struggles.

Why don't you actually state what concerns you have about Smith?

SenorGato
11-27-2008, 08:03 PM
My point is that, physically, there's no real reason to compare Andre Smith to Robert Gallery. The line you drew between involved them being considered good enough tackle prospects to be compared to Orlando Pace, then inferred that should cause concern considering Gallery's struggles.

Why don't you actually state what concerns you have about Smith?

The same basic ones that get thrown out just because he's Andre Smith. Arm length, height, ability to stay in shape, and the ability to lock down NFL speed rushers.

I mean when you really think about it, whats the difference between an elite NFL LT and an elite NFL G (tangibly) really come down to? Height, length and feet. Smith has the foot work, but height and length are questionable.

I think he'll go as a T anyway because theres no reason to move him until he shows he can't do it. He's still an elite talent as an O-lineman in general.

I just don't think he's undoubtedly the #1 prospect in the nation at LT. He's not anymore polished than Oher is. In fact, he's less polished as a pass blocker. Plus he's shorter.

STARHEATHER
11-27-2008, 10:02 PM
he looks like a great guard and potential struggler at tackle. hes a good player, worthy of a possible pick in the top 10 but i think to christen a guy who doesnt have the physcial properties of a top tier nfl lt worthy of the first overall or the best player in this draft it goes against the evolution.

ElectricEye
11-27-2008, 10:11 PM
http://www.sundaymorningqb.com/2008/7/2/563314/two-children-injured-man-b


Read this article, it will show you who Andre Smith really is.....

Funny read, but for real he is my top prospect this year and I think we will be a top 3 LT in this league til the day he retires.

That was great.

It's kinda funny. They liken to him a bear...and he really does look like a dancing bear out there at times. He's agile and he absolutely mauls people. He's not the typical NFL prototype for a tackle, but he's a unique athlete in his own right that changes games. Excellent in pass protection and you can forget it in run blocking. He's really making an impact for Alabama. Very rare you can see a tackle change games as much as he does at the college level.

SenorGato
11-27-2008, 10:35 PM
If Smith comes out and he actually is 6'4...then I'm thinking Jason Peters. Jason Peters when he's on his game is an elite LT, so I hope no one sees making this comparison as a knock.

6'3 or less and he's a G.

ElectricEye
11-27-2008, 10:53 PM
Eh, I just don't see what height has to do with his actual abilities as a tackle. He might not be 6'8, but he's got enough length to pull it off. The reason the NFL doesn't have many 6'4 tackles is because not many of those guys are capable of playing the position, not because they can't.

Iamcanadian
11-27-2008, 10:57 PM
Doesn't sound too different from Gallery either...Gallery was considered the best LT prospect since Pace IIRC.

You won't find a GM in pro football that doesn't know the draft is a crapshoot. Nobody is free from busting. Every player is a gamble. We are talking about prospects here not sure things. There are no sure things.
Smith dominates everybody who plays across from him since he was a freshmen. He is just, even more consistant this year. He sticks out like a sore thumb on every offensive down and you cannot help but notice how dominating he is. To be honest, John Hannah was the last OLmen who I saw this dominating. Oher and Monroe are not in his class.
And please enough with the short arms. The guy who mentioned it had no confirmation and until I see it mentioned by some pro sights I'm not taking that comment seriously.
As for him not fitting the mold of other great LT's beside the great feet and superb strength, I once questioned Jones-Drew because of his height but if you have all the rest 1/2 inch isn't going to matter.

RaiderNation
11-27-2008, 10:59 PM
I really think people overrate height. Being 6'4 doesnt mean you have longer arms then some1 shorter than you. I remember Kevin Durrant has 7'6 wingspan and hes 6'10. Most all LT in the league are 6'5. One inch wont make a big difference.

ElectricEye
11-27-2008, 11:02 PM
I really think people overrate height. Being 6'4 doesnt mean you have longer arms then some1 shorter than you. I remember Kevin Durrant has 7'6 wingspan and hes 6'10. Most all LT in the league are 6'5. One inch wont make a big difference.

Most of the guys we see with all the hype are 6'6+ though. I think that's the issue at hand. Andre Smith is dominating people at 6'4 and getting a lot of credit for it. I don't think people are used to that.

Bengals78
11-27-2008, 11:21 PM
Most of the guys we see with all the hype are 6'6+ though. I think that's the issue at hand. Andre Smith is dominating people at 6'4 and getting a lot of credit for it. I don't think people are used to that.

People get nervous about talking up a guy who doesnt have the outstanding measurables because its not as "cool". If you watch footwork, technique and sheer strength/aggression, I would bet Smith would be in top 5 for all of them. People dont like it because he isnt 6-7 and running a sub 5.00 40. He does the little things right, and it shows. He absolutely dominates the run game. His rookie year, he could easily start at RT for a team to groom for LT.

ElectricEye
11-27-2008, 11:40 PM
I don't really think measurables mean much for a tackle. I mean, height and weight are big...but there's really not a way to gauge much else and that's not even a good indicator how how good they are. Andre Smith is athletic, big and technically sound...not to mention he plays like he wants to kill you. That's not something you get from linemen very often.

SenorGato
11-28-2008, 12:14 AM
I don't really think measurables mean much for a tackle. I mean, height and weight are big...but there's really not a way to gauge much else and that's not even a good indicator how how good they are. Andre Smith is athletic, big and technically sound...not to mention he plays like he wants to kill you. That's not something you get from linemen very often.

Thats something you can say about every elite NFL offensive linemen now and before...it's really not an insult at all to the guy to think he just might project better at G.

If anything, it's a compliment to his potential versatility, and just how good he is as a prospect. It's not like "oh, if he can't play T its the end of the world" it's "if he can't play it, he's an elite G."

I don't get the big deal behind questioning his ability to stay at LT. It's really not the end of the world for him. And I definitely don't think it's crazy to question it's his number 1 LT status in this draft. Or maybe I'm just a prototype guy.