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Xiomera
03-05-2007, 05:01 PM
Which year of the Millen era has proven to be the best draft year?

2001 - Jeff Backus, Dominic Raiola, Shaun Rogers, Scotty Anderson, Mike McMahon, Jason Glenn

2002 - Joey Harrington, Kalimba Edwards, Andre Goodman, John Taylor, John Owens, Chris Cash, Luke Staley, Matt Murphy, Victor Rogers

2003 - Charles Rogers, Boss Bailey, Cory Redding, Artose Pinner, Terrence Holt, James Davis, Davis Kircus, Ben Johnson, Blue Adams, Brandon Drumm, Travis Anglin

2004 - Roy Williams, Kevin Jones, Teddy Lehman, Keith Smith, Alex Lewis, Kelly Butler

2005 - Mike Williams, Shaun Cody, Stanley Wilson, Dan Orlovsky, Bill Swancutt, Jonathan Goddard

2006 - Ernie Sims, Daniel Bullocks, Brian Calhoun, Jonathan Scott, Dee McCann, Fred Matua, Anthony Cannon


Source: http://www.nfl.com/draft/history/teams/DET

Thoughts?

Xiomera
03-05-2007, 05:04 PM
I rank them as follows:

1. 2004
2. 2001
3. 2006
4. 2003
5. 2005
6. 2002

Scotty D
03-05-2007, 05:06 PM
I like 2001. 3 contributors to our current team. Shaun Rogers is one of the best in the league, and Raiola turned it on last year. Backus is servicable. 2004 is a close second though.

Xiomera
03-05-2007, 05:32 PM
Current Lions starters by year:

2001 (3), 2002 (1), 2003 (2), 2004 (2 or 3?), 2005 (1), 2006 (2 or 3?)

Iamcanadian
03-07-2007, 07:38 AM
So far in 6 years, Millen has produced 2 real stars for this football team, Roy Williams and Shauh Rogers, so using the term 'best draft' in connection with Millen is rather silly. Somebody has to start for Detroit but that doesn't make them good draft pickes. In total, Millen has clearly shown, he hasn't a clue about judging peoples character in choosing HC's or players. He is completely useless in the interview process as he cannot tell anything about a player's committment to excellence and is way too impressed by their college stats. The solid organizations have GM's and HC's who can really discern in the interview process a player's desire to be great. Millen is just completely lost in this process.

TacticaLion
03-07-2007, 10:23 AM
So far in 6 years, Millen has produced 2 real stars for this football team, Roy Williams and Shauh Rogers, so using the term 'best draft' in connection with Millen is rather silly. Somebody has to start for Detroit but that doesn't make them good draft pickes. In total, Millen has clearly shown, he hasn't a clue about judging peoples character in choosing HC's or players. He is completely useless in the interview process as he cannot tell anything about a player's committment to excellence and is way too impressed by their college stats. The solid organizations have GM's and HC's who can really discern in the interview process a player's desire to be great. Millen is just completely lost in this process.Not everyone can and should be a "star" on a winning team. You need your stars and you need your solid players. I think Backus, Raiola, Redding, Sims, Bullocks, Wilson and KJones can be looked at as solid players... and are solid picks.

You shouldn't judge a draft by how many superstars the draft yields... but how the draft benefits the team and improves the positions on that team.

Mythos
03-07-2007, 07:23 PM
So far in 6 years, Millen has produced 2 real stars for this football team, Roy Williams and Shauh Rogers, so using the term 'best draft' in connection with Millen is rather silly. Somebody has to start for Detroit but that doesn't make them good draft pickes. In total, Millen has clearly shown, he hasn't a clue about judging peoples character in choosing HC's or players. He is completely useless in the interview process as he cannot tell anything about a player's committment to excellence and is way too impressed by their college stats. The solid organizations have GM's and HC's who can really discern in the interview process a player's desire to be great. Millen is just completely lost in this process.

I think the main reason they've had so many busts (draft + free agency) has to be the environment. Their players just don't develop. I don't think it's possible for somebody to be that bad of an evaluator and miss with the frequency he has.

As far as personnel, I think what's killed the Lions more than anything has been the o-line. The two tackles Millen inherited, Gibson and McDougle, are total busts. I believe Gibson is out of the league and McDougle is on his heels. Millen hasn't done much better. He let Hartings and Compton walk and I believe both have Super bowl rings as starters. His attempts at plugging the left guard spot have been terrible.

TacticaLion
03-07-2007, 07:43 PM
I think the main reason they've had so many busts (draft + free agency) has to be the environment. Their players just don't develop. I don't think it's possible for somebody to be that bad of an evaluator and miss with the frequency he has.

As far as personnel, I think what's killed the Lions more than anything has been the o-line. The two tackles Millen inherited, Gibson and McDougle, are total busts. I believe Gibson is out of the league and McDougle is on his heels. Millen hasn't done much better. He let Hartings and Compton walk and I believe both have Super bowl rings as starters. His attempts at plugging the left guard spot have been terrible.The Detroit mindset is a BIG reason as to why many have failed. The OLine problems haven't helped... at all... which is probably the second reason as to why the team has performed this poorly.

If you think about the picks Millen has made... the team SHOULD be successful right now. The Lions SHOULD have a great OLine, a great QB, the top WRs, a talented RB and a solid defense. Most of those picks have failed (due to the mindset and OLine struggles) which is why Detroit is where it is right now.

familyguy555
03-07-2007, 08:08 PM
01 or 04 but probally 04. we got rogers and raiola

detroit4life
03-07-2007, 08:46 PM
i say 2004 with roy KJ and lehman (hopefully he comes back to his old form) but 2001 was a good year with three starters all on the Oline. 2006 is too early to judge but could nd up being a good draft.

MaxV
03-10-2007, 10:17 AM
The 2004 draft for you guys acctually looks GREAT.

All of those guys are still on the roster and contributing, right?

TacticaLion
03-10-2007, 10:33 AM
The 2004 draft for you guys acctually looks GREAT.

All of those guys are still on the roster and contributing, right?

Lehman experienced that injury, Butler was cut last year and i'm not sure how much Smith has played.

detroit4life
03-10-2007, 05:40 PM
2004 was his best draft 2006 is good but way to early to judge.

TacticaLion
03-10-2007, 05:49 PM
2004 was his best draft 2006 is good but way to early to judge.2007 could easily be the best one yet... a lotta potential for this one.

neko4
03-10-2007, 05:51 PM
01 and 06 were pretty good but 04 takes the cake

Xiomera
03-10-2007, 06:37 PM
Here's to hoping 2007 beats them all in the long run!

TacticaLion
03-10-2007, 07:36 PM
Here's to hoping 2007 beats them all in the long run!And short run...

I think it will.

detroit4life
03-10-2007, 11:03 PM
Here's to hoping 2007 beats them all in the long run!

we can only hope so

Iamcanadian
03-11-2007, 03:41 PM
The Detroit mindset is a BIG reason as to why many have failed. The OLine problems haven't helped... at all... which is probably the second reason as to why the team has performed this poorly.

If you think about the picks Millen has made... the team SHOULD be successful right now. The Lions SHOULD have a great OLine, a great QB, the top WRs, a talented RB and a solid defense. Most of those picks have failed (due to the mindset and OLine struggles) which is why Detroit is where it is right now.

I cannot agree with you here. Harrington got a real shot in Miami and they dumped him and nobody is rushing in to pick up the pieces. C. Rogers cannot even get a serious bite at an NFL job. Mike Williams practically never got off the bench. These guys are riddled with character problems and Millen just didn't have the ability to judge them in the interview process. Blaming the atmosphere in Detroit is just sweeping the problem under the rug. Cincy has a terrible decade of flops before they brought in Lewis and drafted Carson Palmer. The Detroit scouting department is a joke and Millen at a draft table is even worse.
Indy was a last place team when they drafted Payton, New Orleans was a terrible place to play until they signed Brees and brought in Bush. Arizona was another ugly franchise until they drafted Leinart. Franchises and atmospheres can change overnight if the owner is capable, hires a solid GM who in turn hires a solid HC and assistants. We know Ford hasn't a clue, he hired Millen who is just as inept and the jury is still out on Marinelli who was very lucky to win 3 games in his rookie year.
Football players who have real inner strength to become very solid players leave the miserable team that drafted them and go on to have sometimes great careers. Football players who have no inner strength just disappear without so much as a whimper. That's not atmosphere, that's drafting incompetent players.

P-L
03-11-2007, 04:06 PM
If Lehman and Jones ever get healthy than 2004 wil be his best draft by a wide margin.

TacticaLion
03-11-2007, 04:47 PM
I cannot agree with you here. Harrington got a real shot in Miami and they dumped him and nobody is rushing in to pick up the pieces. C. Rogers cannot even get a serious bite at an NFL job. Mike Williams practically never got off the bench. These guys are riddled with character problems and Millen just didn't have the ability to judge them in the interview process. Blaming the atmosphere in Detroit is just sweeping the problem under the rug. Cincy has a terrible decade of flops before they brought in Lewis and drafted Carson Palmer. The Detroit scouting department is a joke and Millen at a draft table is even worse.
Indy was a last place team when they drafted Payton, New Orleans was a terrible place to play until they signed Brees and brought in Bush. Arizona was another ugly franchise until they drafted Leinart. Franchises and atmospheres can change overnight if the owner is capable, hires a solid GM who in turn hires a solid HC and assistants. We know Ford hasn't a clue, he hired Millen who is just as inept and the jury is still out on Marinelli who was very lucky to win 3 games in his rookie year.
Football players who have real inner strength to become very solid players leave the miserable team that drafted them and go on to have sometimes great careers. Football players who have no inner strength just disappear without so much as a whimper. That's not atmosphere, that's drafting incompetent players.It has GOT to be a mixture of both... it just has to.

Harrington could succeed with an incredible OLine... CRog was said to be the "next great thing" and a "sure pick" in the draft... and MWilliams was said to be a great player (although he was still an unnnecessary pick). Any of those players could've succeeded in the right situation... but it just so happens that Detroit had absolutely NO OLine, CRog got hurt, and laziness/Martz kept MWilliams on the bench.

My point: it's more than just the players. Detroit was (and, some say is) a horrible team and a brutal environment for those players to play in. It was a losing atmosphere, and that's hard for any player.

Marinelli is turning that around, which is why I feel he's a great coach for us. He's bringing in hard-working, high motor/character players to turn this team around... which is exactly what we need.

49ersfan_87
03-11-2007, 05:41 PM
Do all of you guys want millen fired, or do you think he could turn it around?

Personally, i like 01 draft. Raoila, Backus, Rogers, three good trench players.

Scotty D
03-11-2007, 05:42 PM
Do all of you guys want millen fired, or do you think he could turn it around?

Personally, i like 01 draft. Raoila, Backus, Rogers, three good trench players.

I think he can turn it around. I loved last years draft except the Calhoun pick.

TacticaLion
03-11-2007, 05:43 PM
Do all of you guys want millen fired, or do you think he could turn it around?

Personally, i like 01 draft. Raoila, Backus, Rogers, three good trench players.I don't really want him fired... but I could care less at this point. He's given us Marinelli, who I think is outstanding, and Marinelli proved last year that he has SOME say in the draft process.

As long as they have a solid draft, Millen can stay (IMO). If the team is making improvements, they'll win more games... it isnt ALL his fault.

49ersfan_87
03-11-2007, 05:45 PM
I don't really want him fired... but I could care less at this point. He's given us Marinelli, who I think is outstanding, and Marinelli proved last year that he has SOME say in the draft process.

As long as they have a solid draft, Millen can stay (IMO). If the team is making improvements, they'll win more games... it isnt ALL his fault.

Im really rooting for you guys. The losing this franchise has gone through this decade has been ridicolous. I hope the lions can turn it around, along with other losing franchises (raiders, browns, etc)

TacticaLion
03-11-2007, 05:53 PM
Im really rooting for you guys. The losing this franchise has gone through this decade has been ridicolous. I hope the lions can turn it around, along with other losing franchises (raiders, browns, etc)I know what I say will be taken as "homerism", but, depending on how they draft, I feel the Lions can definately have a great year. Last year was the first under the new offensive and defensive schemes... and both showed promise. The OLine should be MUCH better (and, at least has more depth than last year), the defense, if healthy, will be improved (with a line of White - Redding - Rogers - Edwards/Rookie) and we've brought in Bell/Duckett to help the running game.

If we have a great draft, this could be a very good year for us. Thanks for the post.

Iamcanadian
03-12-2007, 08:01 AM
Do all of you guys want millen fired, or do you think he could turn it around?

Personally, i like 01 draft. Raoila, Backus, Rogers, three good trench players.


I saw on NFL.com where they interviewed another team's GM and asked him if anybody will ever break Millen's record for ineptitude, 24-72. The other GM said the record will never be broken because, no owner would ever permit his GM to retain his job with the losing totals Millen has rung up, he'd have been fired long before that. That's an average of 4 wins a season over a 6 year period and in the 6th year we were lucky to win 3 games. That equates to going backwards as a GM not forward.
New Orleans and Buffalo got 4 or 5 starters out of last year's draft, anybody here see us getting 4 or 5 starters from Millen last year. Not even close!
We are the only team in pro football with in reality 2 HC's, 1 in charge of the defense(Marinelli) and 1 in charge of the offense(Martz). Marinelli has absolutely no say in our offense and no say in the personnel who play for Martz, that is Martz's call alone. This organization designed by Millen produced 3 wins, 2 less than Mooch produced with inferior talent. With this organizational structure I cannot see any hope for real improvement and the man who designed it needs to be fired yesterday. We cannot fire our owner who untimately put this mess into action but we can fire the GM.
Do you realize how hard it is to have a 6 year , 24 win record, that's so hard to accomplish it equates to being a dynesty in reverse, and some of you think this guy deserves to keep his job. That is so mind boggling. I think I can guarantee you that if Millen retains his job, the only thing he might accomplish is breaking his 6 year record for loses., maybe 23-73. That's our future folks if Millen lasts that long. NO HC CAN ACCOMPLISH ANYTHING UNDER MILLEN, MILLEN"S INEPTITUDE WILL UNDERMINE ANYTHING A DECENT COACH COULD ACCOMPLISH.

TacticaLion
03-12-2007, 08:09 AM
I saw on NFL.com where they interviewed another team's GM and asked him if anybody will ever break Millen's record for ineptitude, 24-72. The other GM said the record will never be broken because, no owner would ever permit his GM to retain his job with the losing totals Millen has rung up, he'd have been fired long before that. That's an average of 4 wins a season over a 6 year period and in the 6th year we were lucky to win 3 games. That equates to going backwards as a GM not forward.
New Orleans and Buffalo got 4 or 5 starters out of last year's draft, anybody here see us getting 4 or 5 starters from Millen last year. Not even close!
We are the only team in pro football with in reality 2 HC's, 1 in charge of the defense(Marinelli) and 1 in charge of the offense(Martz). Marinelli has absolutely no say in our offense and no say in the personnel who play for Martz, that is Martz's call alone. This organization designed by Millen produced 3 wins, 2 less than Mooch produced with inferior talent. With this organizational structure I cannot see any hope for real improvement and the man who designed it needs to be fired yesterday. We cannot fire our owner who untimately put this mess into action but we can fire the GM.
Do you realize how hard it is to have a 6 year , 24 win record, that's so hard to accomplish it equates to being a dynesty in reverse, and some of you think this guy deserves to keep his job. That is so mind boggling. I think I can guarantee you that if Millen retains his job, the only thing he might accomplish is breaking his 6 year record for loses., maybe 23-73. That's our future folks if Millen lasts that long. NO HC CAN ACCOMPLISH ANYTHING UNDER MILLEN, MILLEN"S INEPTITUDE WILL UNDERMINE ANYTHING A DECENT COACH COULD ACCOMPLISH.This year will prove it.