Top 3-4 OLBs

[Babylon]

Brian Orakpo and Larry English i have as DEs. Compare your favs based on some of their combine numbers.

Everett Brown, 6-2 256lbs. 26"vert. 4.73 40. 9-6 jump.

Brian Cushing, 6-3 243lbs. 35" vert. 4.71 40. 10-0 jump.

Clay Matthews, 6-3 240lbs. 35" vert. 4.67 40. 10-1 jump

Aaron Maybin, 6-3 249lbs. 38" vert. 4.89 40. 10.4 jump

Connor Barwin, 6-4 256lbs. 40" vert. 4.66 40. 10-8 jump

[TitleTown088]

Is Maybin's 40 time really that important? His vert and jump are more important for initial burst to the QB.

[Babylon]

Is Maybin's 40 time really that important? His vert and jump are more important for initial burst to the QB.

Getting to the QB i think you're right implying it's not a problem. In coverage i would be a little more concerned.

[Menardo75]

Getting to the QB i think you're right implying it's not a problem. In coverage i would be a little more concerned.

Your OLB's are mostly gonna be in zone though.

[thule]

Cody Brown is really flying under the radar for some reason...he was top 10 lb in every drill and would be a nice addition in the 2nd-3rd round

[phlysac]

Brian Orakpo and Larry English i have as DEs. Compare your favs based on some of their combine numbers.

Everett Brown, 6-2 256lbs. 26"vert. 4.73 40. 9-6 jump.

Brian Cushing, 6-3 243lbs. 35" vert. 4.71 40. 10-0 jump.

Clay Matthews, 6-3 240lbs. 35" vert. 4.67 40. 10-1 jump

Aaron Maybin, 6-3 249lbs. 38" vert. 4.89 40. 10.4 jump

Connor Barwin, 6-4 256lbs. 40" vert. 4.66 40. 10-8 jump

I, personally don't like Cushing or Mathews as 3-4 OLBs. I still like Orakpo and English. With the athleticism he showed today, I think you'd have to include Lawrence Sidbury into the discussion.

If I were GM and ranking these players as 3-4 OLB's I'd rank them as follows...

1. Brian Orakpo
2. Everette Brown
3. Larry English
4. Aaron Maybin
5. Lawrence Sidbury
6. Connor Barwin

[Menardo75]

I, personally don't like Cushing or Mathews as 3-4 OLBs. I still like Orakpo and English. With the athleticism he showed today, I think you'd have to include Lawrence Sidbury into the discussion.

If I were GM and ranking these players as 3-4 OLB's I'd rank them as follows...

1. Brian Orakpo
2. Everette Brown
3. Larry English
4. Aaron Maybin
5. Lawrence Sidbury
6. Connor Barwin

I am about opposite. I think Cushing, and Matthews' ideal fits are as 3-4 OLB's. I think Larry English could be a very good one too. Orakpo I really don't see as a great 3-4 OLB.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

Is Sintim not considered a 34 OLB since he isn't a collegiate DE?

[Menardo75]

Is Sintim not considered a 34 OLB since he isn't a collegiate DE?

After watching him at the senior bowl his ideal fit is probably at 3-4 OLB.

[JFLO]

I actually like Brian Cushing in a 3-4, but not as a OLB, I don't think he has the speed you look for off the edge to consistently get at the quarterback. He's got unbelievable athleticism and strength, but I don't know if he can adapt the talent to get off the LOS at that elite speed.

One person that I'm intrigued with his Connor Barwin. He's played with his hand down throughout his tenure at Cincy and it will be interesting to see if he can transition as a 3-4 rushback. He certainly has the physical tools to do it, but I will be interested to see if he can soak in the game to go through with it.

I'm still a big Everette Brown fan, I think he has shown so many ways of getting to the quarterback while I frequently just see Orakpo using the bull rush to get to the ball carrier. It works because of his freakish strength, but there are stronger offensive tackles in the NFL, so he'll struggle at first.

I'm skeptical with all the skepticism of Aaron Maybin. I think you have to give the guy a break, he put on nearly 15-20 pounds and people are expecting him to run a 4.5-4.6 at the combine. I say wait until his Pro Day, then he'll wow some people. I'm still concerned with his ways of getting to the quarterback and predicted consistency at the next level though.

I think Larry English will have to go to the right team in order to succeed. I feel if he is drafted by New England or Miami or even Chicago, then he could succeed, but anywhere else, then it's a possibility that his best football days are behind him.

1. Everette Brown
2. Brian Orakpo
3. Larry English
4. Connor Barwin
5. Aaron Maybin

[phlysac]

I am about opposite. I think Cushing, and Matthews' ideal fits are as 3-4 OLB's.

They are both TINY for 3-4 OLB. I'm not trying to argue with you though. Convince me... why do you think they are great fits? I think they both project better to the inside in a 3-4 scheme because of their size and the fact that they are both very physical. I think they both have pass rush ability but not in a typical 3-4 WILL sense.

[CantStopGregJones]

1. Connor Barwin
2. Brian Orakpo
3. Aaron Maybin
4. Clay Matthews
5. Larry English

Trash:
Everette Brown
Clint Sintim

[phlysac]

1. Connor Barwin
2. Brian Orakpo
3. Aaron Maybin
4. Clay Matthews
5. Larry English

Trash:
Everette Brown
Clint Sintim

care to elaborate?

[SenorGato]

I actually like Brian Cushing in a 3-4, but not as a OLB, I don't think he has the speed you look for off the edge to consistently get at the quarterback. He's got unbelievable athleticism and strength, but I don't know if he can adapt the talent to get off the LOS at that elite speed.

One person that I'm intrigued with his Connor Barwin. He's played with his hand down throughout his tenure at Cincy and it will be interesting to see if he can transition as a 3-4 rushback. He certainly has the physical tools to do it, but I will be interested to see if he can soak in the game to go through with it.

I'm still a big Everette Brown fan, I think he has shown so many ways of getting to the quarterback while I frequently just see Orakpo using the bull rush to get to the ball carrier. It works because of his freakish strength, but there are stronger offensive tackles in the NFL, so he'll struggle at first.

I'm skeptical with all the skepticism of Aaron Maybin. I think you have to give the guy a break, he put on nearly 15-20 pounds and people are expecting him to run a 4.5-4.6 at the combine. I say wait until his Pro Day, then he'll wow some people. I'm still concerned with his ways of getting to the quarterback and predicted consistency at the next level though.

I think Larry English will have to go to the right team in order to succeed. I feel if he is drafted by New England or Miami or even Chicago, then he could succeed, but anywhere else, then it's a possibility that his best football days are behind him.

1. Everette Brown
2. Brian Orakpo
3. Larry English
4. Connor Barwin
5. Aaron Maybin

QFT.

Sidbury is right behind...and I'd put Sintim 3rd...then Barwin...then Maybin.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

I don't think English is a 34 OLB anymore, I do think he will be a kick ass DE.

[Babylon]

I don't think English is a 34 OLB anymore, I do think he will be a kick ass DE.

I like him there also, same with Orakpo, dont see him playing in space.

[SenorGato]

I like Orakpo and English (especially Orakpo) *better* as 4-3 DEs, but I think they'd good OLBs with patience.

[phlysac]

I don't think English is a 34 OLB anymore, I do think he will be a kick ass DE.

I like him there also, same with Orakpo, dont see him playing in space.

I agree but I think that if they're utilized properly and the D-Coordinator schemes to their strengths I think they can both be very effective as 3-4 Rush OLB's. I guess the best example would be how Dick LeBeau utilizes James Harrison and LaMarr Woodley. Both of them are tremendously strong with solid technique who lack elite athleticism to excel in space. LeBeau makes sure to disguise them in a way that they are rarely put in a situation to have to be on an island in coverage.

[JFLO]

Orakpo certainly has the tools to play as a 3-4 rushback, but he has to develop the game. I agree with the previous statements, it's going to take time to develop, which I don't think would take that long at all. I just hope that he doesn't think he's going to be able to bull rush offensive tackles in the NFL, because he's going to be waiting for a mean surprise. He has to find different ways to get to the quarterback, or else...

[CantStopGregJones]

care to elaborate?

what do you want to know?

[Shane P. Hallam]

Who some later round guys you like?

I think Cody Brown could be successful as a 3-4 OLB in the right system.

[Texas Homer]

Orakpo/Maybin/Matthews would be BEASTS in Miami's Defense.

[nepg]

Is Maybin's 40 time really that important? His vert and jump are more important for initial burst to the QB.

Maybin isn't going to be able to start for anyone right away, so he's going to have to play special teams. Special teams are actually where the 40-yard dash is extremely relevant... So, ya, I'd say his 40 time is definitely important.
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[JFLO]

Who some later round guys you like?

I think Cody Brown could be successful as a 3-4 OLB in the right system.

I liked Brandon Williams from Texas Tech for awhile, but he didn't have such a great workout today and showed his vulnerability when it comes to speed.

Other than that, I'm not really high on anyone else. There is always one gem in the late rounds though.

[PACKmanN]

Who some later round guys you like?

I think Cody Brown could be successful as a 3-4 OLB in the right system.

I was about to mention the guy. Wow, looks like he is flying under the radar.

edit:
1. Everette Brown
2. Larry English
3. Clint Sintim
4. Aaron Maybin
5. Brain Cushing

[phlysac]

what do you want to know?

Your opinions on the players other than just rankings, but most importantly you called both Everette Brown and Clint Sintim "trash". That is a harsh opinion and I was hoping you'd give your reasons for feeling so strongly.

['cuse-213]

what do you want to know?

What you had for ******* breakfast...

[THav916]

1. Brian Orakpo
2. Aaron Maybin
3. Lawrence Sidbury
4. Clay Mathews
5. Everette Brown
6. Clint Sintim
7. Connor Barwin
8. Larry English

['cuse-213]

This draft has a ton of potential at this position. You dont find many positions where 8 guys could start their rookie year.

[goonie61]

Am i the only one that is surprised by Everrette Brown's overall combine performance? He ran slower than expected, and did not display the quickness he shows on the field. Did he have bad technique for these drills or what?

[keylime_5]

I still have to say right now:
1-E.Brown
1b/very close 2-B.Orakpo
3-Maybin
4-English
5-Matthews
6-Barwin
7-Sintim

not to mention Cushing who could play all over in a 3-4. Matthews and Cushing though, like someone said above, I don't like so much at 3-4 OLB.

[Jakey]

Larry English is Lamarr Woodley 2.0...that is 'THE HIGHEST' praise a man can get from me. His game reminds me of Woodleys in every possible way. If i was looking for a 3-4 OLB in the 1st round, i'd trade back, pick up some extra picks and draft English at the bottom half of the round. WIN WIN.

[phlysac]

Larry English is Lamarr Woodley 2.0...that is 'THE HIGHEST' praise a man can get from me. His game reminds me of Woodleys in every possible way. If i was looking for a 3-4 OLB in the 1st round, i'd trade back, pick up some extra picks and draft English at the bottom half of the round. WIN WIN.

That is what I see when I watch him on tape. A player that has success rushing from both sides, relying on strength and technique to win his battles, not relying on speed. If he is put into a situation where his D-Coordinator protects him from being singled out in coverage (a la Dick LaBeaus usage of Woodley and Harrison) he could be a tremendously disruptive force to the oppositions passing game. Another thing that makes him special is his ability to set the edge that is so important in the 3-4. Many of the top 3-4 prospects have questions regarding their ability to play the run. I don't have that question of English.

[Menardo75]

They are both TINY for 3-4 OLB. I'm not trying to argue with you though. Convince me... why do you think they are great fits? I think they both project better to the inside in a 3-4 scheme because of their size and the fact that they are both very physical. I think they both have pass rush ability but not in a typical 3-4 WILL sense.

Cush is perfect size, has pass rush skills, and can cover. Bascially that's why.

[RWills]

Am i the only one that is surprised by Everrette Brown's overall combine performance? He ran slower than expected, and did not display the quickness he shows on the field. Did he have bad technique for these drills or what?

No, I agree completely, its not the speed that concenerns me, he is showing me a big lack of explosion with a horrible vertical and a OL type of broad jump. I am expecting 36" vert not 26" plus being at 6'1.5" instead of the listed 6'4 hurts more

thats why I am not to concern with Maybin's 40 time. I care about his 10/20 and he had great broad and vert jumps showing explosion off the edge.

[RWills]

Sidbury I like, he has somehting to prove and has been on it since the East/West shrine game where they had his name spelled wrong on his jersey.

Very long arms, needs to get stronger. My question is how was his drop backs and COD, didnt get to see him.

[Babylon]

No, I agree completely, its not the speed that concenerns me, he is showing me a big lack of explosion with a horrible vertical and a OL type of broad jump. I am expecting 36" vert not 26" plus being at 6'1.5" instead of the listed 6'4 hurts more

thats why I am not to concern with Maybin's 40 time. I care about his 10/20 and he had great broad and vert jumps showing explosion off the edge.

Everett Brown is another guy who is pretty much bullet proof n this draft. Not sure if it's because he went to Florida St or what but he would really have to stumble (more than the combine) to not be a high pick.

[Mr. Stiller]

Who some later round guys you like?

I think Cody Brown could be successful as a 3-4 OLB in the right system.

I like Philip Hunt as a developmental late round SOLB.

Julius Williams, Cody Browns bookend is a guy i'm eyeing up heavily. Less publicity but,

31 Tackles, 12 TFL's 7 sacks. Not to shabby. 6'2 266lbs 4.6 speed.

Jamaal Westerman, after being one of the better DE's his soph/Jr. year has almost seemingly faded into obscurity, but, He was one of the better power/speed blended passrushers I saw during those years. His Soph/Jr. year I would've taken him over Selvie.

[PossibleCabbage]

I'm really, really down on Brown after his pitiful performance in the vertical leap (measures explosiveness in first step) yesterday. He only measured a 31.5" in the vert (less than defensive tackle/3-4 End Jarron Gilbert's 35.5"), which basically confirms what I feared about him. Brown is the sort of guy who will blast right to the QB, provided nobody makes any effort to block him. Otherwise, he's going to be a guy that gets blocked by TEs his whole career (like he did, at times, in college). Basically Jamal Reynolds 2.0.

Especially compared to other guys:
Orakpo: 39.5"
Maybin: 38"
Johnson: 38.5"
Barwin: 40.5"
English: 36.0"

Properly motivated (a big issue for Johnson), all of those guys will be able to rush the passer on Sundays. If I'm a 3-4 team, I take Brown off of my board for the first round.

[phlysac]

You'd let a combine number take a player completely off of your board??? So much for game tape, I guess.

[Babylon]

You'd let a combine number take a player completely off of your board??? So much for game tape, I guess.

I think he said for the 1st round.

[PossibleCabbage]

You'd let a combine number take a player completely off of your board??? So much for game tape, I guess.

No it's something I've noticed on game tape, which the combine confirmed as a flaw in his game. Watch the FSU-Wisconsin bowl game tape, for example. Brown was effectively blocked by a TE essentially the entire game. Now this is the Badgers we're talking about, and they some big physical TEs, but it's not as though the NFL won't feature a great number of TEs and offensive Tackles who will be better blockers than whoever the Cardinal and White have at TE.

He's basically going to need to change his training regimen to develop a lot more lower body strength, since as it stands he's not going to have an effective bull-rush move in the NFL, and if you're talking about a guy who might be a top 10 pick, you want him to have other moves than "run right past the guy who is too slow to block you." That may happen a lot in college which allows you to get a lot of sacks, but it's not going to happen very much in the NFL. Right now, at the very least, he's behind Maybin and Orakpo in terms of "high picks for 3-4 OLBs", at least on my board. If it comes down to "Larry English vs. Everette Brown" for a 3-4 team in need of an OLB later in the draft, that's a tricky choice.

I don't have a really solid board right now, but if you pushed me on it in terms of 3-4 OLBs, I have Brown below Orakpo, Maybin, Sintim, and English. He's down there with Cushing, Matthews, and Barwin and I don't have him high in that tier. Again, just my opinion, and I still need to digest a lot of information from the combine still.

But the vertical leap is the most effective combine number for a pass rusher in the NFL. It doesn't usually matter how fast a pass rusher can run across half the field, but it does matter how quickly and with how much power a player can get from stance to first step. The vert is the most direct measurement of this. Brown has a very fast first step, which he used to run around people in college, but he does not have a powerful first step, which is why he was so easily blocked at times.

That being said, sometimes these workout numbers are simply misleading because people had bad days. Terrell Suggs had a very unimpressive workout at the combine, and he turned out to do pretty well. But count me as down on Brown.

[Chio151]

I'm really, really down on Brown after his pitiful performance in the vertical leap (measures explosiveness in first step) yesterday. He only measured a 31.5" in the vert (less than defensive tackle/3-4 End Jarron Gilbert's 35.5"), which basically confirms what I feared about him. Brown is the sort of guy who will blast right to the QB, provided nobody makes any effort to block him. Otherwise, he's going to be a guy that gets blocked by TEs his whole career (like he did, at times, in college). Basically Jamal Reynolds 2.0.
.

EXACTLY.

His whole highlight package reminded me of Reynolds. I would not touch him in the first two rounds.


Orakpo
English
Maybin
Matthews
Cush
Barwin
Sintim
Sidbury

then

Brown.

[CantStopGregJones]

Your opinions on the players other than just rankings, but most importantly you called both Everette Brown and Clint Sintim "trash". That is a harsh opinion and I was hoping you'd give your reasons for feeling so strongly.

You're not being specific, so why should I?

Sintim is garbage in coeverage and he's not an elite pass rusher.

Everette Brown is by far the worst wrap up tackler in the draft. He has 2 moves and that is it, hell not even that 1) speed rush and 2) spin move(his spin is ridiculous I'll give him that). When he learns how to play with leverage, recognize plays, defende the run, and oh I don't know tackle someone then I'll think about putting him on my team....as a backup.

[JFLO]

You're not being specific, so why should I?

Sintim is garbage in coeverage and he's not an elite pass rusher.

Everette Brown is by far the worst wrap up tackler in the draft. He has 2 moves and that is it, hell not even that 1) speed rush and 2) spin move(his spin is ridiculous I'll give him that). When he learns how to play with leverage, recognize plays, defende the run, and oh I don't know tackle someone then I'll think about putting him on my team....as a backup.

That is an awful example of knowing what your talking about...have you seen one game or tape of Everette Brown? His agility alone gives him more than two pass rush moves. He recognizes run plays very well and the only one who might might do that better would be Orakpo or Cushing. He's strong and plays with leverage consistently. It may not be strength like Orakpo, but he still displays decent strength to get to the quarterback. Not to mention he had 26 reps, which was like 2nd or 3rd among defensive ends at the combine.

[Malaka]

I don't know why everyone is so low on Connor Barwin. That man is a beast. I would easily take him over Maybin, and Maybin is considered a 1st round pick. Connor is physically a freak, with 4.6 40, 41 Inch vert, and I remember he did quite well on the bench I don't remember exactly. He has the production, he just lacks experience because last year was his first year playing DE, that means he has so much potential at that position if someone brings it out of him, with a good coach I can put money Barwin will be the best 3-4 OLB out of this draft class.

I also like Larry English as OLB in Shawn Merriman mold, but he can also be a DE in the NFL, because 6'2 275 is in no way small. As for Brian Orakpo I like him more as 4-3 DE, though a bit small he has excellent strength to make up for that, and he can be excellent as an RE.

I really do not know what to make of Everrette Brown's poor combine performance as before I thought of him as the top 3-4 OLB, but I am a little confused on the rankings. Same with Maybin, although I never liked Maybin as much, I didn't hate on him nearly as much as others.

[Babylon]

I don't know why everyone is so low on Connor Barwin. That man is a beast. I would easily take him over Maybin, and Maybin is considered a 1st round pick. Connor is physically a freak, with 4.6 40, 41 Inch vert, and I remember he did quite well on the bench I don't remember exactly. He has the production, he just lacks experience because last year was his first year playing DE, that means he has so much potential at that position if someone brings it out of him, with a good coach I can put money Barwin will be the best 3-4 OLB out of this draft class.

I also like Larry English as OLB in Shawn Merriman mold, but he can also be a DE in the NFL, because 6'2 275 is in no way small. As for Brian Orakpo I like him more as 4-3 DE, though a bit small he has excellent strength to make up for that, and he can be excellent as an RE.

I really do not know what to make of Everrette Brown's poor combine performance as before I thought of him as the top 3-4 OLB, but I am a little confused on the rankings. Same with Maybin, although I never liked Maybin as much, I didn't hate on him nearly as much as others.

Barwin i believe had 21 reps so he needs to get a bit more upper body strength, otherwise he was off the charts for a DE. Compared to LBs he would have been at the top of that list too.

Not sure what to make of Everett Brown either, isnt big enough it would seem to play DE so he's probably an OLB. His combine was decent but in terms of draft status i think he should be a late 1st to early 2nd round pick but guys get slotted early and it's not likely he'll drop that far.

Maybin is an athlete who should have stayed in school. His 40 time was low but he looked good running it for what that's worth. I think reported high 4.6s that he was running prior to the combine is what he'll run at his pro day. There's a player or two i would take on the outside before him but he should be a late 1st that will go higher based on reputation and hype.