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Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:12 PM
Per Adam Schefter, Patriots are trading Mike Vrabel to the Chiefs pending a physical.

New Englandís Pro Bowl linebacker Mike Vrabel is in Kansas City undergoing a physical so that he can then be traded to the Chiefs. General manager Scott Pioli is reaching out to bring in a player familiar with his system, and New England is a willing trade partner.

http://blogs.nfl.com/category/adam-schefter/

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 02:15 PM
Wow, that is surprising, but then again, not so much considering he's a FA next year.

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:15 PM
My thoughts on this are mixed. On the one hand, it makes sense from a performance perspective - Mike Vrabel didn't really get it done on the field last year and even in the season where he had 12.5 sacks (2007), most of those were coverage/garbage sacks where he either had six years to get to the quarterback or it was well-designed by Belichick so that he had a clear path for the sack. He's also 33 years old and won't get any better.

I'm still sad to see him go, though. This makes New England's need for a linebacker even worse, and it reminds me of when Willie McGinest left although I think I was more sad to see McGinest go. He was a real leader in the locker room, by some accounts, Mike Vrabel is one of the most unpopular Patriots, believe it or not. Congratulations to the Chiefs on getting a nice player, though. Good luck to Vrabel as well.

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 02:17 PM
I hear ya, Vrabel is one of my favorite guys. Maybe if they can swing a 2nd or 3rd out of KC they feel this year's OLB core is deep enough to replace him, or maybe they have alot of faith in Crable.

**This does shave 3mil off the cap.

D-Unit
02-27-2009, 02:20 PM
Another smart move by the Pats. To get anything for Vrabel at this point is good. He was totally washed up last year, imo.

vidae
02-27-2009, 02:21 PM
Do you honestly believe Vrabel is worth a 2nd or a 3rd? Come on.

It better be a 5th or lower.

bored of education
02-27-2009, 02:23 PM
5th rounder maybe.

Basileus777
02-27-2009, 02:23 PM
If it's a late round pick for a player who can play in the 3-4 and provide veteran leadership it's a decent move. Which is what I expect it is, it seems like a financial move by the Pats.

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 02:24 PM
Do you honestly believe Vrabel is worth a 2nd or a 3rd? Come on.

It better be a 5th or lower.

No, but if it is a 5th or lower, I'd be pissed personally, he would've provided quality depth if nothing else. a 3rd-4th is what I'm hoping for, would be thrilled if its a 2nd.

bored of education
02-27-2009, 02:25 PM
No, but if it is a 5th or lower, I'd be pissed personally, he would've provided quality depth if nothing else. a 3rd-4th is what I'm hoping for, would be thrilled if its a 2nd.

a 2nd lol go play in traffic

vidae
02-27-2009, 02:26 PM
No, but if it is a 5th or lower, I'd be pissed personally, he would've provided quality depth if nothing else. a 3rd-4th is what I'm hoping for, would be thrilled if its a 2nd.

If the Chiefs give up a 2nd or a 3rd when we're a 2-14 team, that would be RIDICULOUS, especially for a 33 year old LB who has a few years left.

I'd still be pretty pissed if it was a 4th. Pioli is no idiot, as you should well know. I expect it to be a 5th or lower.

bored of education
02-27-2009, 02:27 PM
I'dtake Vrable, Seymour and Cassel for number 3 overall :D

ThePudge
02-27-2009, 02:27 PM
Mike Vrabel's play has certainly diminished in recent years, but man, what a clean beard.

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:27 PM
Basically think of it this way:

- Patriots likely would have released Vrabel
- Vrabel would be courted by Eric Mangini
- Belichick does not like Mangini
- Pioli runs Chiefs, a very young team
- Pioli needs 3-4 pieces and veteran leadership
- Belichick likes Pioli
- Trade for a 4th-5th
- ???
- Profit!

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:29 PM
Also, the Patriots just lost long snapper Lonie Paxton to the Broncos. Shoot.

Splat
02-27-2009, 02:40 PM
It will be at most a 4th and even that would be to much hoping for a 5th or later.

stephenson86
02-27-2009, 02:42 PM
the pats are the smartest team around

Splat
02-27-2009, 02:50 PM
I'm sure this is crap so I don't even know why I'm posting it but a few other boards are saying Cassel might some how be involved in this trade any one else heard any thing?

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:52 PM
I'm sure this is crap so I don't even know why I'm posting it but a few other boards are saying Cassel might some how be involved in this trade any one else heard any thing?

I've heard the same but it's just rumors right now. The source is supposedly pretty good though. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the Chiefs traded for Cassel.

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 02:52 PM
Wouldn't surprise me if they packaged Cassel and Vrabel to sweeten the deal for KC. for their 2nd and another pick.

vidae
02-27-2009, 02:52 PM
I'm sure this is crap so I don't even know why I'm posting it but a few other boards are saying Cassel might some how be involved in this trade any one else heard any thing?

Haven't heard it and can't find anything online about it. I sure hope it isn't true.

bored of education
02-27-2009, 02:53 PM
If Cassel ends up in KC, I am killing myself. BOOK IT!

vidae
02-27-2009, 02:53 PM
If Cassel ends up in KC, I am killing myself. BOOK IT!

I'm right behind you my friend!

bored of education
02-27-2009, 02:54 PM
I'm right behind you my friend!

I am not picking up that donut you threw in front of me then ;)

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 02:57 PM
If Cassel ends up in KC, I am killing myself. BOOK IT!

My friend told me they were talking about this on the radio:

"we get TB's first, TB gets cassel, KC gets Vrable and other stuff"

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 02:59 PM
My friend told me they were talking about this on the radio:

"we get TB's first, TB gets cassel, KC gets Vrable and other stuff"

Tampa seems a likely destination, would love TBs First for Cassell, didn't they trade their 2nd and 3rd away though?

Seems a bit much to trade your 1st 2nd and 3rd rounders away in a day.

Sveen
02-27-2009, 03:08 PM
Patriots beat writer Mike Reiss wonders if Mike Vrabel's trade could be part of a larger deal including Matt Cassel.

http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2009/02/mike_vrabel_ana.html

vidae
02-27-2009, 03:11 PM
We get Vrabel and "other stuff"? What is this other stuff!

BlindSite
02-27-2009, 03:13 PM
Not a bad move, I still think KC is insane for moving to a 34 at least they're putting some pieces of the defense together.

bored of education
02-27-2009, 03:15 PM
my boy texted me VY to KC :( i hope he is joking

Splat
02-27-2009, 03:15 PM
my boy texted me VY to KC

Haha ya right...

nepg
02-27-2009, 04:01 PM
It's probably a 4th... The Chiefs are desperate for someone to bring them into a 3-4 (they have nothing), and Vrabel is perfect for them. The guy is still good, but with the other linebackers hurt most of the year, he didn't have anyone to help him produce.

He can do everything you need a 3-4 LB (O or I) to do.

The Pats could have still used him, and this is a bit of a surprise. The Pats would not have traded him unless they got good value.
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nepg
02-27-2009, 04:02 PM
Tampa seems a likely destination, would love TBs First for Cassell, didn't they trade their 2nd and 3rd away though?

Seems a bit much to trade your 1st 2nd and 3rd rounders away in a day.

Tampa traded their 2nd and 2010 5th for Winslow (reportedly)...
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Babylon
02-27-2009, 04:20 PM
Not a bad move, I still think KC is insane for moving to a 34 at least they're putting some pieces of the defense together.


They did so well with the 4-3.

Babylon
02-27-2009, 04:21 PM
Tampa traded their 2nd and 2010 5th for Winslow (reportedly)...


Winslow and Jeremy Stevens should be quite the pair.

Wrathman
02-27-2009, 04:23 PM
Winslow and Jeremy Stevens should be quite the pair.

Stevens is a free agent. I can't see him returning now.

Splat
02-27-2009, 05:12 PM
You know I was thinking this is a trade between BB and SP we might never no the full details of the trade lol.

Bigburt63
02-27-2009, 05:18 PM
haha very true...get used to not knowing anything about the team with Pioli in town

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 06:11 PM
Starting to hear whispers of a Cassell+Vrabel to KC for #3 Overall and a mid pick.

proshoota25
02-27-2009, 06:14 PM
Starting to hear whispers of a Cassell+Vrabel to KC for #3 Overall and a mid pick.

your joking right? lol

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 06:20 PM
No I read it online and heard it on the espn radio.

Splat
02-27-2009, 06:22 PM
I have heard some of the same things I don't believe the Chiefs first round pick would be part of any deal unless we swap first round picks as well.

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 06:26 PM
I have heard some of the same things I don't believe the Chiefs first round pick would be part of any deal unless we swap first round picks as well.

I'd think so too, makes me wonder if the Pats are targeting Curry.

Don Vito
02-27-2009, 06:28 PM
Curry+Mayo woudl be ridiculous. Throw in Crable, Woods, and the rest of the young guys would make for a hell of a young LB corps.

Nalej
02-27-2009, 06:31 PM
I love the pats... but this isn't very BB-ish.
There's something here we're not seeing. Something they haven't shared.
What if Curry ISN'T there at 3? Then what?

PoopSandwich
02-27-2009, 06:39 PM
I love the pats... but this isn't very BB-ish.
There's something here we're not seeing. Something they haven't shared.
What if Curry ISN'T there at 3? Then what?

Trade down and acquire extra picks, get Crabtree, draft a pass rusher, etc.

Splat
02-27-2009, 06:43 PM
Trade down and acquire extra picks, get Crabtree, draft a pass rusher, etc.

Crab could very well go 4th or 5th moving down one or two spots won't get you much I still feel Cassel may end up in KC I just don't think it will involve the 3rd pick in the draft.

nepg
02-27-2009, 06:53 PM
This might not be done until draft day if the #3 is involved...unless the Pats like a few different guys and/or think they can trade back and get more picks. #23 is a good pick for the Chiefs as they'll be in position to get Tyson Jackson, who should be their real #1 target.
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vidae
02-27-2009, 06:59 PM
Starting to hear whispers of a Cassell+Vrabel to KC for #3 Overall and a mid pick.

That'd be the worst trade EVER. Cassel and Vrabel aren't worth the 3rd pick. This is getting out of hand.

Also, where are you hearing these "whispers"? Can I see some documentation on that?

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 07:32 PM
That'd be the worst trade EVER. Cassel and Vrabel aren't worth the 3rd pick. This is getting out of hand.

Also, where are you hearing these "whispers"? Can I see some documentation on that?

http://blogs.nbcsports.com/home/archives/2009/02/quiet-on-the-patskc-front-coul.html

Also heard earlier on ESPN Radio. Then again, I've heard about the Bucs possibility there as well. Either way, I think Cassell is traded pretty soon.

vidae
02-27-2009, 07:40 PM
In no way is Vrabel and Cassel worth 3rd overall. That's just stupid.

Splat
02-27-2009, 07:46 PM
Its really going to be Brady and Vrabel to the Chiefs for our first round pick and NE keeps Cassel as their QBOTF the Cassel talk is just a smoke screen you heard it here first... :)

BradysKnee
02-27-2009, 07:50 PM
Its really going to be Brady and Vrabel to the Chiefs for our first round pick and NE keeps Cassel as their QBOTF the Cassel talk is just a smoke screen you heard it here first... :)

You're out of your mind lol. Maybe Brady+Vrabel for All of KC's draft picks this year, even then I'd be uneasy about it. lol.

Matthew Jones
02-27-2009, 08:17 PM
Cassel could be worth #3 if you look at it from the perspective of:

- Matt Ryan was #3 overall and was instrumental in Atlanta going from #3 to the playoffs

- If you keep the pick, you're essentially paying the same amount of money for Aaron Curry or Brian Orakpo or Mark Sanchez.

That said, I don't want the #3 pick, I'd rather get the value elsewhere.

vidae
02-27-2009, 08:50 PM
You'd also have to think Cassel was a franchise QB and not just the product of a stacked team like the Patriots.

Most QBs would look solid behind that line and throwing to Welker and Moss.

HellonEarth84
02-27-2009, 09:25 PM
Cassell + Vrabel for KC 1st. Teams swap draft picks in 5th round.

Pats could do anything with that pick. Aaron Curry, Brian Orakpo, trade down and still pick up Everette Brown + a 3rd rounder.

Would love to see this happen

vidae
02-27-2009, 09:44 PM
I still don't get why you think that's a good deal for the Chiefs. You move up in the 5th and you get the 3rd overall pick and we get a 33 year old linebacker (who will be 34 before the season starts) and Cassel?

Give me a break.

senormysterioso
02-27-2009, 10:06 PM
It's all contingent on whether or not you like Cassel better than the prospects available. If the Chiefs think they need a quarterback and don't like Sanchez or even Stafford for that matter and they like Cassel why not use their pick to get Cassel. Cassel is only a few years older and has a year of experience starting in the NFL under his belt. He has as much potential as either of those guys and, arguably, a lower risk of busting. People value draft picks way, way too highly. I like what the bucaneers seem to be doing this year, they don't really like the prospects available so their using their picks to get players that they like.

wogitalia
02-27-2009, 10:14 PM
I see nothing wrong with the trade. Cassell is as good a prospect as Sanchez, if the Chiefs think that they need a QB, then why not get him and pick up a decent veteran on the other side as well.

I don't like when people say a guy is a product of the system. So what if the Pats have a good OL and receivers, shouldn't that be the aim of every offense? Is it really a good idea to try and rely on a QB if you dont have a line? Is there a QB out there that has done well behind a line that is awful or bad. Teams like Minny, Chicago, Detroit, Raiders and Chiefs all put their QBs in to bad positions and then wonder why they struggle so much. Chiefs have the makings of a solid line, they have a great TE, very good young WR, if they can pick up a couple more linemen they are well on their way to having a line every bit as talented as the Pats.

GO_Chiefs
02-27-2009, 10:46 PM
I'd bring a sign saying BRING BACK KING CARL! if hey pull that dumb move.

vidae
02-27-2009, 11:40 PM
Of course being a product of the system you're in should factor. Every team should want to have the same kind of OL and weapons that the Pats do, but many teams don't.

It's all about how the individual views Cassel. I don't see him as a franchise QB. I think there is a lot more upside to a Stafford or even a Sanchez. If we were to draft Sanchez or Stafford at 3 overall they could sit a year and learn the offense, learn the pro game. If we trade for Cassel he is going to start and right now I'm not sure who would be successful with our offense.

Menardo75
02-28-2009, 01:36 AM
I really hope that trade rumor is just a rumor. The Cheifs are another good draft or two away from returning to the top of the division.

Burger
02-28-2009, 02:04 AM
Why would Belichek hate Mangini? Mangini is one of Belichek's best coordinators.

adschofield
02-28-2009, 02:11 AM
Whoa, whoa...Hold the horses...

I heard earlier in the day that it would be a 6th or 7th for Vrabel straight up...but there are more and more signs pointing to some package deal for Cassel. The supposed trade would go down like this:

KC Gets:
Pat's 1st
Vrabel
Cassel

Pats get:
KC's 1st and Third

And then maybe a late round swap of picks.

At least, that's the word on the street :D

Splat
02-28-2009, 08:35 AM
KC Gets:
Pat's 1st
Vrabel
Cassel

Pats get:
KC's 1st and Third
:D

No Thanks.

nepg
02-28-2009, 09:34 AM
Of course being a product of the system you're in should factor. Every team should want to have the same kind of OL and weapons that the Pats do, but many teams don't.

It's all about how the individual views Cassel. I don't see him as a franchise QB. I think there is a lot more upside to a Stafford or even a Sanchez. If we were to draft Sanchez or Stafford at 3 overall they could sit a year and learn the offense, learn the pro game. If we trade for Cassel he is going to start and right now I'm not sure who would be successful with our offense.

The Chiefs are a couple tweaks along the OL and another receiving option away from having a damn good offense if they had a good QB. Cassel's a really good fit. I hope the Chiefs get him. He's a leader, has the proper demeanor for a franchise QB, reads defenses, goes through progressions, has all the physical tools, and is renowned for his work ethic.

Tony G & Bowe isn't far off from Welker & Moss...
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T-RICH49
02-28-2009, 09:52 AM
Its really going to be Brady and Vrabel to the Chiefs for our first round pick and NE keeps Cassel as their QBOTF the Cassel talk is just a smoke screen you heard it here first... :)

yes and have him bring Gisele too :D

T-RICH49
02-28-2009, 09:54 AM
Of course being a product of the system you're in should factor. Every team should want to have the same kind of OL and weapons that the Pats do, but many teams don't.

It's all about how the individual views Cassel. I don't see him as a franchise QB. I think there is a lot more upside to a Stafford or even a Sanchez. If we were to draft Sanchez or Stafford at 3 overall they could sit a year and learn the offense, learn the pro game. If we trade for Cassel he is going to start and right now I'm not sure who would be successful with our offense.

I would disagree with this.Matt Cassel had some success at the NFL level I would take him over a rookie

eazyb81
02-28-2009, 09:57 AM
Hopefully this means people on this site will finally stop arguing with me when I say KC is moving to a 3-4. It's f'n obvious considering Pioli has never been with an organization that did not run a 3-4, but I'm this move should put the argument to rest.

Splat
02-28-2009, 09:57 AM
In no way is Vrabel and Cassel worth 3rd overall. That's just stupid.

I agree now if we swap first round picks as well then maybe I could see but I still would be a little up set.

I'm not a Cassel hater I do feel he could be a solid starter but if you draft a guy top 3 you are going to want a little more then solid.

T-RICH49
02-28-2009, 09:59 AM
I agree now if we swap first round picks as well then maybe I could see but I still would be a little up set.

I'm not a Cassel hater I do feel he could be a solid starter but if you draft a guy top 3 you are going to want a little more then solid.

I wonder if it could be a conditional 2nd for '10 that based on preformance can go to a 1st

nepg
02-28-2009, 10:09 AM
I think the proper value for Cassel is a mid first and a later or 2010 pick or an early-to-mid-2nd round pick and a conditional 2010 pick that could become a first rounder.

But, as far as the main topic of the thread goes...hopefully Mike Vrabel will come in with a clear mind and great attitude. He can help the Chiefs form a winner and be a good stop-gap at both ILB and OLB as the Chiefs work themselves into a 3-4 base.

Chiefs fans will love him. He's Jared Allen without the DUI's - personality-wise.
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Bigburt63
02-28-2009, 11:13 AM
With Pioli on one end and Belichick on the other I'm surprised they even announced that Vrable was traded. I would've expected it to be "An undisclosed Patriots player was traded to the Chiefs for an Undisclosed draft pick." It woudl be months before we would find out who had been traded and for what

TAMBA is HUNGRY!!!!
02-28-2009, 11:38 AM
I love this trade, as long as its a 5th of less. We need someone on that D who is a winner and knows what it takes on the field and in the meetings to successfully run a 3-4.

And if we can get Cassel, we need to get him. I don't even know if NE would want our #3 pick even if we offered it. The $ is outrageous for these top picks.

We may have to give up our 2nd and a conditional next year. This is probably better for NE. I would rather swap 1st's than give up that early second.

McBain
02-28-2009, 02:07 PM
Basically think of it this way:

- Patriots likely would have released Vrabel
- Vrabel would be courted by Eric Mangini
- Belichick does not like Mangini
- Pioli runs Chiefs, a very young team
- Pioli needs 3-4 pieces and veteran leadership
- Belichick likes Pioli
- Trade for a 4th-5th
- ???
- Profit!

Think of it this way.

-belichick is satan
-belichick uses his satanic charm to convince pioli to go the chiefs
-the chiefs become the patriots farm team
-belichick sends aging veterens for high picks.
-has a double securing a young nucleus of players to dominate the nfl
-belichick and pioli come out of the closet and rule the nfl hand in hand

I'm thinking i'll turn it into an illustrated childrens book.