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CroomDawgs
04-12-2009, 01:12 PM
According to the National Football Post's Michael Lombardi, the Browns have offers on the table for both Brady Quinn and Braylon Edwards and will likely move both players.

One team has reportedly made a standing offer of a first-round pick for Quinn, which the Browns will likely accept. They also have a package of at least a first-round pick on the table for Braylon Edwards, and Lombardi expects him to be dealt sometime this offseason. It's clear now that the Browns are in full-blown rebuilding mode after Phil Savage left the roster in shambles

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/2009/04/browns-looking-to-make-a-splash/

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/Headlines.aspx?sport=NFL&hl=142250

I'm guessing Edwards will be a Giant or Eagle, but Quinn should be an interesting story this summer

Shane P. Hallam
04-12-2009, 01:14 PM
What team would pony up a first round pick for Quinn? I'd guess either the Lions at 20 or Jets at 17.

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 01:16 PM
Wow. 3 first rounders for the Browns. Let's up Kokinis knows how to draft for the Brownies' sake.

Matthew Jones
04-12-2009, 01:17 PM
My guess for Quinn would be the Broncos (#18) or Vikings (#22.) Edwards, I think the Giants will get.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 01:17 PM
Ya I just saw this, good stuff if we get another receiver alongside of Crab.

CroomDawgs
04-12-2009, 01:18 PM
I'm thinking the Eagles are the team that wants Edwards since they have two first rounders, and I'm gonna say the Jets for Quinn. WOuldn't be suprised though if it's the redskins

D-Unit
04-12-2009, 01:20 PM
My guess is Tampa looking at Quinn. Hopefully, the Eagles, Redskins or Giants get Braylon.

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 01:20 PM
The 18th pick seems like a lot for Quinn. But then again Josh McDaniels has already proved himself to be a bit of a fool.

ChiFan24
04-12-2009, 01:24 PM
What team would pony up a first round pick for Quinn? I'd guess either the Lions at 20 or Jets at 17.

He was a steal at #22 two years ago, I don't see why his value should be much lower than that. If I'm the Jets, I trade the pick for Quinn instead of taking Josh Freeman, and if I'm Detroit, I go with Brady Quinn/Jason Smith over Matthew Stafford/William Beatty (or whoever else).

WMD
04-12-2009, 01:26 PM
Wonder where Quinn will land.. Detroit, Minnesota, Denver, or the Jets..

My guess would be the Jets.

Strongside
04-12-2009, 01:27 PM
This means I can cheer for Quinn now :)

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 01:30 PM
He was a steal at #22 two years ago, I don't see why his value should be much lower than that.

Was he? According to whom? Scott?

He's been in the league for two years and has yet to do anything. I am by no means saying the kid is a bust. But it's safe to say the luster has come off at least a bit.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 01:30 PM
Mike Lombardi is a hack.

I'll believe it when I see it.

Monomach
04-12-2009, 01:31 PM
Brad Childress really needs to get on the phone.

WMD
04-12-2009, 01:31 PM
Come to think of it.. didn't the Vikings offer two First Rounders for Brady Quinn near the trade deadline? If they could get him 'just' for #22, I don't see why they wouldn't do that..

Smooth Criminal
04-12-2009, 01:32 PM
It'll be interesting to see if the Browns go after another QB rather than just go with Anderson. Reports came out about the Browns wanting Sanchez, I can see them going after him in the draft.

Browns are very interesting this offseason with Mangini running the show. Likely gonna hurt them next year but the future is most definately on his shoulders now.

jj45
04-12-2009, 01:34 PM
I think he is going to detroit

jj45
04-12-2009, 01:35 PM
I think he is going to detroit and I would love to see edwards in chicago but for a second round pick

WMD
04-12-2009, 01:38 PM
Yeah I wonder if the Browns trade Brady and Braylon, where they'll go at #5.. Sanchez, Crabtree, Orakpo?

I think the smart route would be Sanchez #5, and then going for WR and a Pass Rusher with their other Round One picks.

They already have two 2nd Rounders too.. could be a very nice draft for the Browns.

Bucs_Rule
04-12-2009, 01:41 PM
Was he? According to whom? Scott?

He's been in the league for two years and has yet to do anything. I am by no means saying the kid is a bust. But it's safe to say the luster has come off at least a bit.

I that is a plus. When teams draft a QB they are torn between sitting to develop him and the pressure to start him. With Quinn he has already sat 2 years so you definitely feel he's ready to start.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 01:42 PM
I'm going to be pissed if Mangini trades Braylon to Hoodie.

Brodeur
04-12-2009, 01:45 PM
Come to think of it.. didn't the Vikings offer two First Rounders for Brady Quinn near the trade deadline? If they could get him 'just' for #22, I don't see why they wouldn't do that..

They did not have Sage Rosenfels at the trade deadline.

WMD
04-12-2009, 01:47 PM
They did not have Sage Rosenfels at the trade deadline.
Damn. Good call.. I guess that takes them out of the running. Unless they were gonna have Sage play RT?

Sveen
04-12-2009, 01:54 PM
I'm guessing Quinn to the Broncos and Edwards to the Giants.

Brodeur
04-12-2009, 01:54 PM
Damn. Good call.. I guess that takes them out of the running. Unless they were gonna have Sage play RT?

Maybe they'll have Quinn play RT.

CroomDawgs
04-12-2009, 02:01 PM
I'm going to be pissed if Mangini trades Braylon to Hoodie.


Wouldn't be suprised in the least. Moss, Braylon, and Welker for Brady would be unfair.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:05 PM
I'm guessing Quinn to the Broncos and Edwards to the Giants.

I'm 100% sure Quinn will not go to DEN. Why give up a 1st round pick for a less accomplished QB than Orton (who now has potential all decade LT in Clady and #15/#19/Caldwell/Stokley)

Orton and DEN's QB situation is fine.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:07 PM
Wouldn't be suprised in the least. Moss, Braylon, and Welker for Brady would be unfair.

Worst part is NE could trade their 1st round pick, and they still got enough picks left over for a great draft.

I really do think Braylon to NE would be just deadly for the rest of the league especially with a healthy Maroney coming back and the addition of Fred Taylor. Seriously, Brady having those types of weapons should be illegal. Braylon could help them so much that I might have to predict them going 19-0.

BUSTKUNTLAWL
04-12-2009, 02:08 PM
I'm 100% sure Quinn will not go to DEN. Why give up a 1st round pick for a less accomplished QB than Orton (who now has potential all decade LT in Clady and #15/#19/Caldwell/Stokley)

Orton and DEN's QB situation is fine.

LMAO

I can't believe people actually believe this.

Orton is not the future and has very little potential.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:10 PM
LMAO

I can't believe people actually believe this.

Orton is not the future and has very little potential.

I don't care, think what you want thats fine.

But there is no way that trading a 1st for Quinn improved DEN's QB situation at all.

Mr. Hero
04-12-2009, 02:12 PM
LMAO

I can't believe people actually believe this.

Orton is not the future and has very little potential.

With Denver's oline and Weapons he should be good enough if they can rebuild that D. My gut is telling me Braylon is going to be a giant and Quinn a Jet or a Lion.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:12 PM
LMAO

I can't believe people actually believe this.

Orton is not the future and has very little potential.

You overrate potential.

Ravens won a SB with Trent Dilfer. What kind of potential is that?

An NFL team is more than one position. If you surround a guy with weapons, his game will improve.

I'm not saying Orton is all-pro. I'm saying he will provide them with a starting QB this year. Orton only has one year left on his deal. If he sucks, DEN lets him walk and can choose a QB with one of their TWO 1st rounder next season.

Why can't you see the logic?

BUSTKUNTLAWL
04-12-2009, 02:14 PM
I don't care, think what you want thats fine.

But there is no way that trading a 1st for Quinn improved DEN's QB situation at all.

I have a hard time believing Quinn is not better than Orton, so, yeah it would be an improvement.

coordinator0
04-12-2009, 02:14 PM
You overrate potential.

Ravens won a SB with Trent Dilfer. What kind of potential is that?

An NFL team is more than one position. If you surround a guy with weapons, his game will improve.

I'm not saying Orton is all-pro. I'm saying he will provide them with a starting QB this year. Orton only has one year left on his deal. If he sucks, DEN lets him walk and can choose a QB with one of their TWO 1st rounder next season.

Why can't you see the logic?

Because their aren't many good QB's next year either. Bradford is the only one that looks like a first round guy, but beyond him there's not much.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:17 PM
Because their aren't many good QB's next year either. Bradford is the only one that looks like a first round guy, but beyond him there's not much.

There is also the chance of a trade for a QB next season, signing a QB (DEN has one of the highest amount of cap room), Orton possibly succeeds, McDaniels takes a low round QB this year for next year.... So many other more likely scenarios than DEN trading a 1st for a less accomplished QB than Orton. That scenario is so bad, and I'm telling you DEN will not go that route.

Mr. Hero
04-12-2009, 02:18 PM
Because their aren't many good QB's next year either. Bradford is the only one that looks like a first round guy, but beyond him there's not much.

Haven't watch Snead and Ole Miss operate much have you?

BUSTKUNTLAWL
04-12-2009, 02:22 PM
You overrate potential.

Ravens won a SB with Trent Dilfer. What kind of potential is that?

An NFL team is more than one position. If you surround a guy with weapons, his game will improve.

I'm not saying Orton is all-pro. I'm saying he will provide them with a starting QB this year. Orton only has one year left on his deal. If he sucks, DEN lets him walk and can choose a QB with one of their TWO 1st rounder next season.

Why can't you see the logic?

Okay, let me know when Denver has one of the best defenses in the NFL.

http://pervegalit.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/ben-stein.jpg

I've watched every single throw Orton has ever made in the NFL. He's a very average to below average NFL QB even with those weapons.

If Denver doesn't get Bradford next year then what? Snead is the second best QB in that class it looks like and I doubt people are sold on him as a first rounder. It doesn't look like a promising QB group and they might not be able to trade up for Bradford and could screw themselves. Their QB situation is far from fine. Could they manage with Orton for a year? Sure. The Bears have shuffled junk QBs around for years. The Bears had Grossman/Griese/Orton a few years ago. 3 back up QBs doesn't mean the situation is fine.

Denver is going to be awful next year. Mostly because of their defense, but Orton will be a strong reason as well.

I love how all of a sudden Orton has potential to do good things. Not really. He cannot throw the ball down the field and just isn't a good player. Will his numbers look a little better, because of Denver's offense? Probably, but he's still the same below average QB.

I will not be surprised to see Simms starting for Denver by week 4. Hell, he may win that job in camp.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:29 PM
Okay, let me know when Denver has one of the best defenses in the NFL.

http://pervegalit.files.wordpress.com/2008/03/ben-stein.jpg

I've watched every single throw Orton has ever made in the NFL. He's a very average to below average NFL QB even with those weapons.

If Denver doesn't get Bradford next year then what? Snead is the second best QB in that class it looks like and I doubt people are sold on him as a first rounder. It doesn't look like a promising QB group and they might not be able to trade up for Bradford and could screw themselves. Their QB situation is far from fine. Could they manage with Orton for a year? Sure. The Bears have shuffled junk QBs around for years. The Bears had Grossman/Griese/Orton a few years ago. 3 back up QBs doesn't mean the situation is fine.

Denver is going to be awful next year. Mostly because of their defense, but Orton will be a strong reason as well.

I love how all of a sudden Orton has potential to do good things. Not really. He cannot throw the ball down the field and just isn't a good player. Will his numbers look a little better, because of Denver's offense? Probably, but he's still the same below average QB.

I will not be surprised to see Simms starting for Denver by week 4. Hell, he may win that job in camp.

My point about BAL wasn't defense. Over your head.

NFL is about more than the QB. It's about team.

Orton was never a great QB. No one thinks he is great. No one is saying he is great.

Just like Dilfer, Orton is average. Guess what? Average QB's with good O-Line's and solid weapons around them can put up good numbers.

Need some examples? Kurt Warner in his first season with the STL Rams. Do I really need to say more? No one, absolutely no one would have even called Warner an average QB. NO ONE!

Another prime time example: Rich Gannon with the Oakland Raiders. Dude was terrible until someone put a good supporting casts and a smart HC around him.

Another example: Tommy freakin Maddox. Complete loser and huge bust. He goes to PIT for a few seasons, has a good supporting cast and HC, and actually halfway redeems his career at the end (until Rashen Mathis brought him back down to earth).

Trent Green and the KC Chiefs w/ Holmes, Kennison, Gonzo, etc... Green wasn't ever really considered a great one.

Again, think what you want about the whole situation. We are allowed to disagree. I just think you underestimate Orton's ability when he has the types of weapons DEN has along the OL and at WR.

coordinator0
04-12-2009, 02:30 PM
Haven't watch Snead and Ole Miss operate much have you?

I've seen them play, but i still have my doubts about him going in the first. He would be my #2 QB though.

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 02:37 PM
I hope Edwards is coming to the Giants. For the right price of course.


As for Quinn, I think its dumb to let go of him. He's not getting paid all that much, and Derek Andersen is far from a guarantee at qb, so why not let Quinn show what he's made of?

As for possible destinations, I think the Vikings would make sense.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
04-12-2009, 02:44 PM
My point about BAL wasn't defense. Over your head.

NFL is about more than the QB. It's about team.

Orton was never a great QB. No one thinks he is great. No one is saying he is great.

Just like Dilfer, Orton is average. Guess what? Average QB's with good O-Line's and solid weapons around them can put up good numbers.

Need some examples? Kurt Warner in his first season with the STL Rams. Do I really need to say more? No one, absolutely no one would have even called Warner an average QB. NO ONE!

Another prime time example: Rich Gannon with the Oakland Raiders. Dude was terrible until someone put a good supporting casts and a smart HC around him.

Another example: Tommy freakin Maddox. Complete loser and huge bust. He goes to PIT for a few seasons, has a good supporting cast and HC, and actually halfway redeems his career at the end (until Rashen Mathis brought him back down to earth).

Again, think what you want about the whole situation. We are allowed to disagree. I just think you underestimate Orton's ability when he has the types of weapons DEN has along the OL and at WR.

1. Warner was just unproven.
2. We do not have anything resembling the overall team the Greatest Show on Turf had. I'm pretty sure they were the 4th overall defense that year too.

Tommy Maddox, again had a good defense and running game. Two things lacking in Denver.

Rich Gannon was a big time veteran guy. They might have struck gold there, but I'm fairly confident in saying Orton is not gold. We know what he can do. And leading this Denver team to 5 or more wins ain't one of them.

NIN1984
04-12-2009, 02:45 PM
I could see the Bucs being interested in Quinn...

Young solid O-line,a few good RBs, Bryant and Winslow are nice targets and Jeff Jagodzinski calling the plays. I think Quinn would be a real nice fit, it could be an exciting young offense.

vidae
04-12-2009, 02:47 PM
I can sort of see trading Edwards but not Quinn. I think that'd be a big mistake on their part. You have your franchise LT, keep your franchise QB in the fold and draft offensive playmakers around him. Crabtree could be there at 5 and by trading Edwards you'll get a few more picks to pick up some other quality offensive guys.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 02:49 PM
1. Warner was just unproven.
2. We do not have anything resembling the overall team the Greatest Show on Turf had. I'm pretty sure they were the 4th overall defense that year too.

Tommy Maddox, again had a good defense and running game. Two things lacking in Denver.

Rich Gannon was a big time veteran guy. They might have struck gold there, but I'm fairly confident in saying Orton is not gold. We know what he can do. And leading this Denver team to 5 or more wins ain't one of them.

But that doesn't all fall on Orton.

I really do believe that DEN will have a very productive offense. Again, the teams failure next year will probably fall on the D.

The point of me bringing all these QB's up though is this: If you surround a guy like Orton with Clady, Marshall, Royal, some capable RB's, a good offensive coach then offensively they will be fine. If you want him to lead you to the SB, you have to build the D and find a way to sustain the offensive success. Orton can get you there, but he has to have a great surrounding casts. Don't get too down on yourself Bronco's fan because I think there is a light at the end of the tunnel even with a guy like Orton.

Me Likey Rookies
04-12-2009, 02:50 PM
Please Quinn to the Bucs
Please Quinn to the Bucs
Please Quinn to the Bucs

Damn leftwich signing means this is unlikely

StorminNorman
04-12-2009, 02:51 PM
Because their aren't many good QB's next year either. Bradford is the only one that looks like a first round guy, but beyond him there's not much.

I worry about Bradford's ability to transition to a Pro Offense. I don't like a QB that has relied on coaches to call his audibles.

Staubach12
04-12-2009, 02:51 PM
Was he? According to whom? Scott?

He's been in the league for two years and has yet to do anything. I am by no means saying the kid is a bust. But it's safe to say the luster has come off at least a bit.

He's been developing for two years. Where are you going to find a QB THAT developed with THOSE tools and THAT college career with the 22nd pick in this or any other draft?

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 02:57 PM
He's been developing for two years. Where are you going to find a QB THAT developed with THOSE tools and THAT college career with the 22nd pick in this or any other draft?

Brady Quinn has tools?

Brodeur
04-12-2009, 03:02 PM
Brady Quinn has tools?

Well, he is a tool, so that counts.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 03:14 PM
If the Browns trade Brady Quinn it will be the worst move they could make.

Nalej
04-12-2009, 03:50 PM
Worst part is NE could trade their 1st round pick, and they still got enough picks left over for a great draft.

I really do think Braylon to NE would be just deadly for the rest of the league especially with a healthy Maroney coming back and the addition of Fred Taylor. Seriously, Brady having those types of weapons should be illegal. Braylon could help them so much that I might have to predict them going 19-0.


As a Pats fan- I'd love for that to happen but I highly doubt it.

Bigburt63
04-12-2009, 03:51 PM
As a Pats fan- I'd love for that to happen but I highly doubt it.

Beat me to it. I doubt Mangini and BB would work with eachother, plus I think they would rather use that 1st round pick on defense.

Chief49er
04-12-2009, 04:16 PM
http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa61/edgiles4/brady_quinn_crotch.jpg

Quinn likes his friends.

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 04:18 PM
Eric Mangini is going to fail in Cleveland.

If he gets rid of Winslow, Edwards, and Quinn, what does this fool plan to do on offense?


He needs to keep Edwards and Quinn, and rebuild that defense starting with Raji.

Chief49er
04-12-2009, 04:20 PM
Eric Mangini is going to fail in Cleveland.

If he gets rid of Winslow, Edwards, and Quinn, what does this fool plan to do on offense?


He needs to keep Edwards and Quinn, and rebuild that defense starting with Raji.

I agree it doesn't make sense to get rid of your youngest talent..

wtf is he doing?

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:24 PM
Eric Mangini is going to fail in Cleveland.

If he gets rid of Winslow, Edwards, and Quinn, what does this fool plan to do on offense?


He needs to keep Edwards and Quinn, and rebuild that defense starting with Raji.

You started out so well... yes, we need to keep Quinn and keep Edwards (at least one more year), but drafting Raji? Why?

Shaun Rogers is a fantastic nose tackle, and despite absurd speculation, he isn't going anywhere. The problem between he and the team was resolved and he's working out with the team and has been for about a month.

Mike Lombardi, for whatever reason, hates Brady Quinn. Anytime he talks about him, he mentions that he basically thinks Quinn sucks. And most of his reporting has been nothing but guessing and assumptions.

Unless these other teams are telling Hack Lombardi about trading framework, he's not getting it from the Browns organization which has been extremely tight lipped thus far as illustrated by the Kellen Winslow trade.

ironman4579
04-12-2009, 04:24 PM
Brady Quinn has tools?

Yea, these two:

http://talleywhackers.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/bradyquinn.jpg

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 04:24 PM
I agree it doesn't make sense to get rid of your youngest talent..

wtf is he doing?

Mangini is terrible at adapting to players currently on his roster. He did the same thing in NY when he ruined Vilma and got rid of John Abraham.

He's going to pretty much replace every part of that team with his own players. The only untouchable player I can see is Joe Thomas.


I liked him as a coach in some ways, but his overcoaching really is annoying. He tries to outsmart you on every play, instead of keeping it simple and doing the obvious common sense move.

He, like every other Bellichick disciple, will probably not work out.

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 04:28 PM
You started out so well... yes, we need to keep Quinn and keep Edwards (at least one more year), but drafting Raji? Why?

Shaun Rogers is a fantastic nose tackle, and despite absurd speculation, he isn't going anywhere. The problem between he and the team was resolved and he's working out with the team and has been for about a month.

Mike Lombardi, for whatever reason, hates Brady Quinn. Anytime he talks about him, he mentions that he basically thinks Quinn sucks. And most of his reporting has been nothing but guessing and assumptions.

Unless these other teams are telling Hack Lombardi about trading framework, he's not getting it from the Browns organization which has been extremely tight lipped thus far as illustrated by the Kellen Winslow trade.

Shaun Rogers at the very least, is on the decline with age. He's good for now, but you want a 3-4 NT for the next 8 years. Not the next 2. Considering how priceless it is to have a dominant NT, I think Raji is a no brainer.

Plus, you can pull a Ngata and start him at DE while Rogers is still productive, then move him inside to NT when its time. The Browns need all the help they can get in that front 3 anyway.

Also consider, Rogers is not a 3 down player anymore. And Raji has questions regarding how many snaps he can take in the NFL. Imagine having both, and having a NT rotation of both those guys? It would cure a lot of woes on that defense.


As for Quinn, Im just commenting on the speculation. You're probably right since you know much more about the situation than I do.

Addict
04-12-2009, 04:30 PM
If the Browns trade Brady Quinn it will be the worst move they could make.

I was thinking the same thing. What is it with new head coaches and QB's this offseason?

Really I thought and stil think Quinn is going to do well in the NFL, the Browns are going to end up regretting this.

The_Dude
04-12-2009, 04:31 PM
As for possible destinations, I think the Vikings would make sense.

Which is why he will not end up here.

Everyone seems to forget that we have an egotistical douchebag as a Head Coach... Quinn will not be coming to MN. The Little General believes that he can win with Sage. End of story.

I'm putting my $ on Quinn in Detroit.

PACKmanN
04-12-2009, 04:33 PM
Eric Mangini is going to fail in Cleveland.

If he gets rid of Winslow, Edwards, and Quinn, what does this fool plan to do on offense?


He needs to keep Edwards and Quinn, and rebuild that defense starting with Raji.

no, no they don't. :)

http://www.fansedge.com/Images/Product/33-94/33-94762-F.jpg
http://cache.deadspin.com/assets/resources/2007/04/justinharrell44.jpg

Does he really want to come to the NFC North ;)

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:37 PM
Shaun Rogers at the very least, is on the decline with age. He's good for now, but you want a 3-4 NT for the next 8 years. Not the next 2. Considering how priceless it is to have a dominant NT, I think Raji is a no brainer.

Plus, you can pull a Ngata and start him at DE while Rogers is still productive, then move him inside to NT when its time. The Browns need all the help they can get in that front 3 anyway.

Also consider, Rogers is not a 3 down player anymore. And Raji has questions regarding how many snaps he can take in the NFL. Imagine having both, and having a NT rotation of both those guys? It would cure a lot of woes on that defense.


As for Quinn, Im just commenting on the speculation. You're probably right since you know much more about the situation than I do.

If this is Haloti Ngata, I might agree with you, but Raji is a 6'1" 330-340lb guy. He might well be the shortest and heaviest 3-4 End in the league. He's not as athletic as Ngata either. I don't think there's a 330+ defensive guy who doesn't have conditioning issues.

If Rogers at 29 is old, then Casey Hampton and Jamal Williams are ancient. Good nose tackles seem to last and while they may want to find the eventual replacement sometime soon, not with 5th pick overall. Personally, I like Athyba Rubin who was picked in round 6 last year. He made significant strides over last season. He went from absolutely clueless to a pretty good fill in when Rogers was out.

My big board for the Browns:
1. Aaron Curry, LB Wake Forest
2. Trade Down
3. Michael Crabtree, WR Texas Tech (In this scenario, I think keeping Braylon for at least one more year is key)

Brent
04-12-2009, 04:40 PM
The Little General believes that he can win with Sage. End of story.
See, I thought he was convinced that Tavaris Jackson was good enough to win with. Oh right, not every QB his divine fingers touch is going to end up like McNabb.

Mr. Hero
04-12-2009, 04:43 PM
See, I thought he was convinced that Tavaris Jackson was good enough to win with. Oh right, not every QB his divine fingers touch is going to end up like McNabb.

I still think Tarvaris is has the ability to be a good QB. He was playing well to end the season, I think if only he had a better coach and the team kept building around him he could succeed, frankly I wouldn't be surprised for their new coach next season to play TJ over Sage. And find him to be the more successful and less turnover prone option.

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 04:46 PM
If this is Haloti Ngata, I might agree with you, but Raji is a 6'1" 330-340lb guy. He might well be the shortest and heaviest 3-4 End in the league. He's not as athletic as Ngata either. I don't think there's a 330+ defensive guy who doesn't have conditioning issues.

If Rogers at 29 is old, then Casey Hampton and Jamal Williams are ancient. Good nose tackles seem to last and while they may want to find the eventual replacement sometime soon, not with 5th pick overall. Personally, I like Athyba Rubin who was picked in round 6 last year. He made significant strides over last season. He went from absolutely clueless to a pretty good fill in when Rogers was out.

My big board for the Browns:
1. Aaron Curry, LB Wake Forest
2. Trade Down
3. Michael Crabtree, WR Texas Tech (In this scenario, I think keeping Braylon for at least one more year is key)

Hampton and Williams are ancient though. Look at how they're breaking down. I think Rogers has 3 years max left, especially since he's not as fit as Hampton or Williams. Finding a dominant NT is so hard, I just think when you have the opportunity to get one you go for it.

The Browns really could go in a # of directions, but Id rebuild the defense first and foremost.

Somse
04-12-2009, 04:47 PM
I still think Tarvaris is has the ability to be a good QB. He was playing well to end the season, I think if only he had a better coach and the team kept building around him he could succeed, frankly I wouldn't be surprised for their new coach next season to play TJ over Sage. And find him to be the more successful and less turnover prone option.

I don't know who you've been watching, but Tarvaris Jackson is one of the worst quarterbacks I've ever seen as a starter in the NFL.

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 04:47 PM
I still think Tarvaris is has the ability to be a good QB. He was playing well to end the season, I think if only he had a better coach and the team kept building around him he could succeed, frankly I wouldn't be surprised for their new coach next season to play TJ over Sage. And find him to be the more successful and less turnover prone option.
It's this type of logic that the lead the Bears to waste 4 years on Rex Grossman.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 04:47 PM
Beat me to it. I doubt Mangini and BB would work with eachother, plus I think they would rather use that 1st round pick on defense.

Ummm, Pioli and Hoodie just made a deal for Cassel. And at the same time McHoodie and Hoodie tried to swing the same deal.

Why wouldn't Mangini and Hoodie work together if NE had interest?

NE has three 2nd round picks and the rest of the draft to improve the D. That's plenty of picks.

If NE has a chance to get Braylon, Hoodie has to strike and offer #23. It would make you guys too sick.

Brent
04-12-2009, 04:47 PM
I still think Tarvaris is has the ability to be a good QB. He was playing well to end the season, I think if only he had a better coach and the team kept building around him he could succeed, frankly I wouldn't be surprised for their new coach next season to play TJ over Sage. And find him to be the more successful and less turnover prone option.
He was doing okay at the end of last year but he wasnt being asked to win games, rather, he was being asked not to lose the games. Sure, when you have the Vikes' running game, you don't have to ask your QB to do much but, if I were a Vikings fan, I would not like the idea of either Sage or TJ as my starting QB.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 04:48 PM
If the Browns trade Brady Quinn it will be the worst move they could make.

You underestimate Lord Derek Anderson and his laser rocket arm and is the best scrambler since mike vick.

Brent
04-12-2009, 04:49 PM
Why wouldn't Mangini and Hoodie work together if NE had interest?
Because Bill Belichick and Mangini hate each other.

MidwayMonster31
04-12-2009, 04:50 PM
I don't understand what the hell they're doing by trying to trade all of their building blocks. I could understand trading Winslow since he had all sorts of issues with the Browns and their management. With Stallworth in trouble with the law, that should make the Browns want to hang on to Edwards even more. Trading Quinn would be one of the dumbest things that they could possibly do. They would run the risk of alienating their fans, and if Anderson has the same kind of year that he did last year, then they put themselves back into the toilet for no good reason. As for Rogers, he is not a 3 down player anymore, but Rubin should be able to step in this year.
I agree with bigbluedefense that Mangini cannot adapt to different players. Part of the reason that they hired Mangini in the first place was because they wanted to maintain a 3-4 defense. Now, he's trying to change the offense. If the Browns do pull these trades off, they better hope Bradford declares next year.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 04:51 PM
Because Bill Belichick and Mangini hate each other.

Oh yeah, I kind of forget about that.

I thought that was over though?

Addict
04-12-2009, 04:51 PM
I don't understand what the hell they're doing by trying to trade all of their building blocks. I could understand trading Winslow since he had all sorts of issues with the Browns and their management. With Stallworth in trouble with the law, that should make the Browns want to hang on to Edwards even more. Trading Quinn would be one of the dumbest things that they could possibly do. They would run the risk of alienating their fans, and if Anderson has the same kind of year that he did last year, then they put themselves back into the toilet for no good reason.
I agree with bigbluedefense that Mangini cannot adapt to different players. Part of the reason that they hired Mangini in the first place was because they wanted to maintain a 3-4 defense. Now, he's trying to change the offense. If the Browns do pull these trades off, they better hope Bradford declares next year.

Mangini thinks he's living in Pokémonland. BROWN, SELFDESTRUCT!

The Dynasty
04-12-2009, 04:51 PM
He was doing okay at the end of last year but he wasnt being asked to win games, rather, he was being asked not to lose the games. Sure, when you have the Vikes' running game, you don't have to ask your QB to do much but, if I were a Vikings fan, I would not like the idea of either Sage or TJ as my starting QB.

I can probably say that all the viking fans on this board don't want them to be starting but we know better to get our hopes up to see Childress go out and trade for Quinn, Cutler, and Cassel this off season. So we just realize and become content with what we have and hope for the best..I doubt its the vikings trying to trade for quinn because I know Speilman likes his draft picks and trading the first round draft pick in two years in a row is unlikely for him. If it is the Vikings than we will have a stable QB for years..but Im not getting my hopes up.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 04:51 PM
Midway, for every issue that Winslow had in Cleveland Braylon has just as many, not to mention the fans pretty much hate the guy.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 04:52 PM
You underestimate Lord Derek Anderson and his laser rocket arm and is the best scrambler since mike vick.

I don't think I've seen Derek Anderson scramble since his first appearance where he scrambled for like 20 something yards.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:52 PM
Winslow was traded because of his knee, not the management. Even when Winslow left, he thought he was well treated in Cleveland.

The Browns did a ton for Winslow. After his motorcycle accident, they could have basically taken back his entire bonus. They did not.

This is a giant misconception.

derza222
04-12-2009, 04:52 PM
I don't think the Jets trading #17 for Quinn would make much sense given Tannenbaum had the opportunity to draft him and passed on him for Darrelle Revis that year. Unless they really don't like the value there or somehow their opinion of Quinn has changed (which I doubt) it just doesn't seem likely they'll trade a first for him now after passing on him in the draft a couple years ago.

MidwayMonster31
04-12-2009, 04:53 PM
Midway, for every issue that Winslow had in Cleveland Braylon has just as many, not to mention the fans pretty much hate the guy.That's pretty understandable.

SimonRath
04-12-2009, 04:55 PM
why dont they keep Quinn an trade Anderson?
or does no one want Anderson?
i dont keep track of the browns..

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 04:55 PM
I know MIN just sent HOU a pick, but could MIN package Sage & #22 for Quinn?

That would give CLE another 1st & a quality backup, MIN gets a starting QB and eliminates the threat of having to cut JD Booty.

I think that trade makes sense, but I'm not sure about MIN cause they did just trade for Sage.

Bigburt63
04-12-2009, 04:55 PM
Oh yeah, I kind of forget about that.

I thought that was over though?

I don't think that will ever be over. BB and Pioli actually really like eachother, same goes for BB and McDaniels ( I assume McDaniels and Piloi still like eachother as well, but I haven't read anything about that). Don't get me wrong, I'd love Braylon on the Pats, but I don't think it will happen.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:55 PM
Midway, for every issue that Winslow had in Cleveland Braylon has just as many, not to mention the fans pretty much hate the guy.

I disagree.

Edwards never did tricks on a motorcycle, permanently affecting his career.

And if Edwards produces anywhere near the level he did in '07, the fans will love him. Saying they hate him is pretty ridiculous.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 04:55 PM
Midway, for every issue that Winslow had in Cleveland Braylon has just as many, not to mention the fans pretty much hate the guy.

I wouldn't say all the fans hate him. I still like him (it could be that I have a Braylon jersey and I don't want to have to get another one).

And all this stuff about Brady Quinn not throwing downfield. He can throw it down field he just hasn't felt the need to force it. I think once he gets comfortable he will be able to throw the deep pass. Maybe not like Derek's lazor beamz but they will still be decent.

Mr. Hero
04-12-2009, 04:56 PM
He was doing okay at the end of last year but he wasnt being asked to win games, rather, he was being asked not to lose the games. Sure, when you have the Vikes' running game, you don't have to ask your QB to do much but, if I were a Vikings fan, I would not like the idea of either Sage or TJ as my starting QB.

You answered it yourself, with AD your passing game doesn't have to do much. If he just built on his play from the end of the season while developing better chemistry with berrian and got better play from Rice that passing game would be able to keep team's honest which would be enough for AD to run wild.

jackalope
04-12-2009, 04:57 PM
I don't really understand why Cleveland feels the need to get rid of Quinn.

I find it interesting that last year the Browns didn't have a pick until the 4th round. This year, they could potentially have 3 picks in the first.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 04:57 PM
why dont they keep Quinn an trade Anderson?
or does no one want Anderson?
i dont keep track of the browns..

I think it has to do with contract. If Quinn is a bust they still have to bite the buller for 3+ years. With Anderson he only has two years left if that, if he sucks this year they can either bench him and make him a backup or possibly outright cut him without taking a massive cap hit.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 04:57 PM
why dont they keep Quinn an trade Anderson?
or does no one want Anderson?
i dont keep track of the browns..

No one wants DA because he's so inconsistent.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:57 PM
why dont they keep Quinn an trade Anderson?
or does no one want Anderson?
i dont keep track of the browns..

Trading Anderson and keeping Quinn would be ideal. But I don't know if anyone wants Derek Anderson. Look no further than on here. I have never seen anyone express the slightest interest in acquiring Derek Anderson.

I think everything being done in this offseason process is in an effort to get Anderson value, so they can move him.

Somse
04-12-2009, 04:57 PM
Winslow was traded because of his knee, not the management. Even when Winslow left, he thought he was well treated in Cleveland.

The Browns did a ton for Winslow. After his motorcycle accident, they could have basically taken back his entire bonus. They did not.

This is a giant misconception.

He thought he was well-treated in Cleveland?

A big reason I'm upset right now has to do with" the staph infection, Winslow told the Plain Dealer after Sunday's loss to the Washington Redskins at FedEx Field. "I heard from [Coach] Romeo Crennel, and I heard from my position coach [Alfredo Roberts] when I was in the Clinic. I heard from my teammates. But I never heard from the main man--Phil Savage--and that really disappoints me. Sometimes I don't even feel a part of this team.

"I feel I've done a lot for this team, played through a lot of pain and given it my all. I just thought there'd be a little more, 'How are you doing?' by him."

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 04:58 PM
I think it has to do with contract. If Quinn is a bust they still have to bite the buller for 3+ years. With Anderson he only has two years left if that, if he sucks this year they can either bench him and make him a backup or possibly outright cut him without taking a massive cap hit.

Quinn's contract is almost entirely based on incentives attached to playing time. The guy makes like $2 million per year on the bench.

Addict
04-12-2009, 04:59 PM
Trading Anderson and keeping Quinn would be ideal. But I don't know if anyone wants Derek Anderson. Look no further than on here. I have never seen anyone express the slightest interest in acquiring Derek Anderson.

I think everything being done in this offseason process is in an effort to get Anderson value, so they can move him.

Nobody wants Anderson, so they trade Quinn? That doesn't make any sense at all.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 05:00 PM
He thought he was well-treated in Cleveland?

Watch his press conference when he got to Tampa.

The Browns could have taken his entire bonus after that accident and they did not.

The staph infection was a small blip in his career in Cleveland.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 05:01 PM
Quinn's contract is almost entirely based on incentives attached to playing time. The guy makes like $2 million per year on the bench.

But doesn't he have 3 or 4 years left on his rookie deal. 1st rounders tend to sign 5 or 6 year deals.

I believe Anderson only has this season and next season left on his deal. Next season might even be an option.

Point is, they can find their future franchise QB much faster by trading Quinn if Mangini has decided Quinn is not the guy. Anderson can be kept as a backup for just one season compared to Quinn possibly being a backup for 3+ seasons. I could be wrong.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 05:02 PM
Nobody wants Anderson, so they trade Quinn? That doesn't make any sense at all.

It could be all a ploy to get Anderson's value up. Mangini and Kokinis seem to be really good at keeping things on the down low. The Winslow trade was a huge surprise. I feel like everything they tell the public has a reason. If they say Anderson and Quinn are going to compete they're basically saying they're pretty much at the same level. If Quinn gets a 1st or something then Anderson should get something around there.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 05:03 PM
Nobody wants Anderson, so they trade Quinn? That doesn't make any sense at all.

No, they sell the idea that Anderson COULD be their starter, which would somehow convince other teams that he must be decent.

Personally, I think the whole thing is stupid.

I will be very surprised if Quinn is dealt. He fits what Mangini wants to do very well; smart decisions, ball control, poise.

Anderson doesn't.

Addict
04-12-2009, 05:06 PM
It could be all a ploy to get Anderson's value up. Mangini and Kokinis seem to be really good at keeping things on the down low. The Winslow trade was a huge surprise. I feel like everything they tell the public has a reason. If they say Anderson and Quinn are going to compete they're basically saying they're pretty much at the same level. If Quinn gets a 1st or something then Anderson should get something around there.

No, they sell the idea that Anderson COULD be their starter, which would somehow convince other teams that he must be decent.

Personally, I think the whole thing is stupid.

I will be very surprised if Quinn is dealt. He fits what Mangini wants to do very well; smart decisions, ball control, poise.

Anderson doesn't.

Seriously you guys. If you two can figure this out (by which I mean no disrespect), don't you think this entire ploy is a litte too see-through for NFL GM's? If this is some ploy to nudge up Anderson's value it's something that could end up blowing up in Mangini's face.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 05:11 PM
I disagree.

Edwards never did tricks on a motorcycle, permanently affecting his career.

And if Edwards produces anywhere near the level he did in '07, the fans will love him. Saying they hate him is pretty ridiculous.

It's not ridiculous at all considering every single Browns fan I know does not like him.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 05:12 PM
He thought he was well-treated in Cleveland?

So because he didn't get along with Phil Savage on one incident that makes you think that the times he said he loved it here and liked the organization was just bs?

Somse
04-12-2009, 05:30 PM
So because he didn't get along with Phil Savage on one incident that makes you think that the times he said he loved it here and liked the organization was just bs?

I think there were definitely issues between Winslow and the Browns organization. Did those issues contribute to him being traded? Absolutely, in my opinion.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 05:33 PM
I think there were definitely issues between Winslow and the Browns organization. Did those issues contribute to him being traded? Absolutely, in my opinion.

Considering the fact that other than the owner, the Browns organization is completely different makes that opinion invalid.

He was traded because of his knee and the Bucs made a huge mistake with that contract.

The_Dude
04-12-2009, 05:44 PM
He was doing okay at the end of last year but he wasnt being asked to win games, rather, he was being asked not to lose the games. Sure, when you have the Vikes' running game, you don't have to ask your QB to do much but, if I were a Vikings fan, I would not like the idea of either Sage or TJ as my starting QB.

See sig quote below....

Somse
04-12-2009, 05:45 PM
Considering the fact that other than the owner, the Browns organization is completely different makes that opinion invalid.

He was traded because of his knee and the Bucs made a huge mistake with that contract.

You think they did a complete upheaval of the entire Browns organization? I would bet that much of the organization is the same, despite the regime change.

He also apparently demanded a trade or considered demanding a trade after the staph infection incident. He said he loved his time with the Browns and then mentioned the players he liked playing with. I never heard him say anything about the organization or management.

Did the new regime have a problem with him? Who knows...

But clearly there was tension between Winslow and the Browns and I think that contributed to the decision to trade him. It was time for him to get a fresh start somewhere else.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 05:49 PM
You think they did a complete upheaval of the entire Browns organization? I would bet that much of the organization is the same, despite the regime change.

He also apparently demanded a trade or considered demanding a trade after the staph infection incident. He said he loved his time with the Browns and then mentioned the players he liked playing with. I never heard him say anything about the organization or management.

Did the new regime have a problem with him? Who knows...

But clearly there was tension between Winslow and the Browns and I think that contributed to the decision to trade him. It was time for him to get a fresh start somewhere else.

You can keep on believing that, despite the obvious flaws in your argument.

He was traded because he is playing on borrowed time... his knee is basically shot. I will be very surprised if Winslow is not retired before that contract runs out. He was reduced to pushing off to get open and got a number of offensive pass interference penalties.

But you're right... it must be the organization, which is almost completely different that must have been the reason.

Somse
04-12-2009, 05:53 PM
You can keep on believing that, despite the obvious flaws in your argument.

He was traded because he is playing on borrowed time... his knee is basically shot. I will be very surprised if Winslow is not retired before that contract runs out. He was reduced to pushing off to get open and got a number of offensive pass interference penalties.

But you're right... it must be the organization, which is almost completely different that must have been the reason.

I said it was part of the reason, not the only reason.

Who other than Savage was fired?

thetedginnshow
04-12-2009, 05:54 PM
I'd say New York and Tampa.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 05:57 PM
I said it was part of the reason, not the only reason.

Who other than Savage was fired?

Crennell, his entire staff, Savage, Trip McCracken, most if not all of the scouting department.

I think the only guys that were retained were the money guys, so basically no one that would deal with Winslow.

Somse
04-12-2009, 06:01 PM
Crennell, his entire staff, Savage, Trip McCracken, most if not all of the scouting department.

I think the only guys that were retained were the money guys, so basically no one that would deal with Winslow.

Source?....

j05son
04-12-2009, 06:01 PM
I think it has to do with contract. If Quinn is a bust they still have to bite the buller for 3+ years. With Anderson he only has two years left if that, if he sucks this year they can either bench him and make him a backup or possibly outright cut him without taking a massive cap hit.

Nope.

Quinn is scheduled to make $655,000 in base salary this season. He has the opportunity to add $11,000,000 to it by taking 70% of the snaps in the '09 season.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 06:10 PM
Source?....

Only 4 of the 16 coaches weren't brought in, in 2009. The Tight End Coach, Strength and Conditioning Coach, Quarterback Coach and Assitant Strength and Conditioning Coach.

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/coaches.php

I don't know about the FO but here it is...

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/team/frontoffice.php

j05son
04-12-2009, 06:11 PM
Source?....

Kokinis = http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9385

Mangini = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_owner_lerner_says_mangi.html

Staff = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_finalize_hiring_of_coor.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_talk_to_uscs_smith_for.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_interview_bryan_cox.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/02/04/browns.ap/index.html
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9409

Scouts = http://www.news-herald.com/articles/2009/02/06/sports/nh449685.txt

LOL @ asking for a source on an entire staff change.

BRAVEHEART
04-12-2009, 06:15 PM
I think Quinn gets dealt to the Broncos.

wonderbredd24
04-12-2009, 06:17 PM
Kokinis = http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9385

Mangini = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_owner_lerner_says_mangi.html

Staff = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_finalize_hiring_of_coor.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_talk_to_uscs_smith_for.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_interview_bryan_cox.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/02/04/browns.ap/index.html
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9409

Scouts = http://www.news-herald.com/articles/2009/02/06/sports/nh449685.txt

LOL @ asking for a source on an entire staff change.

Probably gonna need a source in regards to Winslow's knee being shot too

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 06:18 PM
Probably gonna need a source in regards to Winslow's knee being shot too

Ya and there might be a conspiracy theory if he was traded or not.

Somse
04-12-2009, 06:20 PM
Kokinis = http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9385

Mangini = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_owner_lerner_says_mangi.html

Staff = http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_finalize_hiring_of_coor.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_talk_to_uscs_smith_for.html
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2009/01/browns_interview_bryan_cox.html
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/02/04/browns.ap/index.html
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=9409

Scouts = http://www.news-herald.com/articles/2009/02/06/sports/nh449685.txt

LOL @ asking for a source on an entire staff change.

Exactly. TWO People from the front-office changed.

All the same college scouts. All the same pro personnel. It's by in large the same organization as a year ago with the exception of Savage and his cap specialist. Same owner, same front-office executives.

Changing a GM doesn't necessarily repair relationships between players and teams.

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 06:23 PM
Why would Kellen Winslow give a **** who the college scouts are?

bigbluedefense
04-12-2009, 06:23 PM
Why would Kellen Winslow give a **** who the college scouts are?

i was thinking the exact same thing.


especially since you know....obviously they thought highly of him since he got drafted by the team and all...

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 06:26 PM
i was thinking the exact same thing.


especially since you know....obviously they thought highly of him since he got drafted by the team and all...

They also traded up for him. He had the same OC as the coach he had at the University of Miami and they had a good relationship. (btw, I just looked up Rob Chudzinski and he has the same birthday as me. I know, go me.)

Somse
04-12-2009, 06:33 PM
Why would Kellen Winslow give a **** who the college scouts are?

I just put that in because the other guy falsely claimed they fired almost all of the scouts, which was completely untrue.

My point is that the Browns did not overhaul the front office staff. They changed GMs. That doesn't necessarily repair whatever issues the Browns and Winslow had.

3pac
04-12-2009, 06:45 PM
You people generalize waaaay too much. Just because something or some things happened in the past doesn't mean it won't happen now.

The Bears traded a lot for Jay Cutler and made a FA splash. How often have they done something like that? Um, never. There's a first time for everything.

I'm not saying Quinn will go to the Vikings or whatever, but it's really foolish to say he won't purely on the principle that it "doesn't fit what they've done in the past." Honestly, I think the idea of him going to the Broncos is pretty realistic seeing as how McDaniels, rumor has it, was trying to trade for him anyway.

But whatever, we'll find out soon enough if he relocates or not. Until then, stop making grandiose statements based on nothing.

Flippityskip91
04-12-2009, 06:58 PM
I just put that in because the other guy falsely claimed they fired almost all of the scouts, which was completely untrue.

My point is that the Browns did not overhaul the front office staff. They changed GMs. That doesn't necessarily repair whatever issues the Browns and Winslow had.

Lerner pretty much cleaned the place out of anyone who had anything to do with Savage...and that was the guy Winslow had the problem with.

Anyways, in regards to the thread...trading either player right now doesn't help the Browns, especially trading Quinn. If they wanna trade Edwards, it needs to happen next offseason after they've tagged him. His value right now is too low, and it's a contract year so he's in for a rebound. If they want to win anytime in the next 5 years, they need to commit to Quinn and build around him. IF they do trade him, then I would have to assume they'll be drafting Sanchez because having Anderson as the only long-term option would be PR death, fans would stop coming.

Vikes99ej
04-12-2009, 07:13 PM
Jesus Christ Vikings jump on this

LonghornsLegend
04-12-2009, 07:17 PM
Nope.

Quinn is scheduled to make $655,000 in base salary this season. He has the opportunity to add $11,000,000 to it by taking 70% of the snaps in the '09 season.

He's really scheduled to make 11 mil if he is the starter? That's a pretty insane contract.

Crazy_Chris
04-12-2009, 07:17 PM
Jesus Christ Vikings jump on this

I second this notion...

Haha S.P.(wherever he is now) is going be going absolutly nuts once he hears that Quinn is on the Block.

Go_Eagles77
04-12-2009, 07:28 PM
I would love it if Braylon was traded to the eagles, but I'm afraid the FO is too content with our current group. They are probably in better shape at WR than the giants, so I think the giants will be more willing to give up more for him, despite our 2 1st round picks and 12 picks total.

BrownsTown
04-12-2009, 07:32 PM
*Uncontrollable sobbing*

jth1331
04-12-2009, 08:34 PM
The Broncos will not trade for Quinn, otherwise they would've gotten in on a 3 way deal to begin with.
Why trade for Orton, and then trade for another QB?
Not going to happen.

The_Dude
04-12-2009, 08:38 PM
I would be thrilled if the Vikes would pull this off.

I'd be waaaaaaaaaayyyyy more confident in him than Sage or TJ.

This makes too much sense for it to actually happen.

Smokey Joe
04-12-2009, 08:39 PM
BT, don't feel too bad, this makes sense for the new coaching staff and FO to do. Think about it, would you want the new staff to try and win with players that don't fit what they are looking to do and push back the rebuilding process, OR start the rebuilding process right now and plug in players that fit what they are looking to do? You guys won't be competing (most likely) for a Superbowl within the next couple years either way, so as a fan, I'd much prefer the rebuilding to start now. However, the only problem is that you guys love Brady, right?

As for the destinations, lets start with Quinn first... Who would be willing to give up a 1st for him? Jets, Bucs, Vikings, Lions, and Broncos. There are a couple other teams that might be looking for a QB (Jags, Redskins, 49ers, Seahawks, Panthers), but they either pick too high to trade a 1st for Quinn, don't have a 1st, or if they trade for a QB, they want a proven guy. So lets just focus on the Jets, Bucs, Vikings, Lions and Broncos now (this order will be from what I see as least likely to most):


Lions: I think they are set at Stafford at no. 1. Might make sense, but I get the feeling Stafford is the guy for Detroit.
Broncos: I just don't see it. I think they will hold off on a QB for a year or two. They got Orton and Simms, two guys who are good fits for what McDaniels like to do. They got solid weapons, but right now, they need to focus on D. Also, from everything I have read and heard is that they are actually fairly high on Orton and he is the reason why a deal got done. Plus, I don't see Quinn being traded within in the AFC.
Bucs: Definite possibility. They need a QB, but after the Leftwich signing, maybe they are leaning towards bringing in a rookie to develop behind him? I also don't think Quinn is Morris' or Jags guy for QB (I think they are targeting Josh Freeman, Morris has been practically drooling over him from reports I have read).
Jets: Definite possibility. They need a QB big time. Pick 17 a bit too much though??? I get the feeling that Ryan is gonna focus on D and build that D first. They got some intriguing young guys as well. And like I said earlier, I think the Browns would prefer to trade out of the AFC and into the NFC. Plus, maybe the fact it is the Jets might play a part in it.
Vikings: This is who I think we'll get Quinn, if he is dealt. Part of the reason why could be added pressure from the big splash the Bears made with Cutler. Quinn seems to fit that offense, and he'd be in an absolute perfect situation. They did trade for Sage Rosenfels, but he isn't really a long term solution, and it's not even a sure thing if he was brought into start. Maybe they could also package either Jackson or JDB in the deal and get a 4th or 5th back in return to make up for the pick they gave up for Sage. Plus, as we saw last year, the Vikings aren't afraid to trade draft picks for players. Also, if the Vikings do grab him and the Lions draft Stafford, think how good the NFC North's QB could potentially be... damn, it could turn into a fun conference and QB battle to watch for the next 10+ years.____________________________________________ _________________

Now lets look at where Braylon could be headed. I see only really 3 teams that might be interested in trading a 1st for him. The Ravens, Eagles, and Giants. Personally, I'll eliminate the Ravens right now. Edwards does not seem to be a Harbaugh guy at all, hell, neither does Boldin (if he's put on the block). I also don't see the Eagles. They seem pretty content with their current bunch, and might be willing to instead let a draft pick develop and hope Curtis and Brown stay healthy while Jackson continues to get better. This just wouldn't seem like the type of move the Eagles would make.

That leaves the Giants, and this seems like almost a slamdunk to me. The Giants need a WR now that Plax is gone, and they have the draft picks to get a deal done. They have been rumored to be aggressively pursuing Edwards, and it's even been rumored that Edwards would love to go the New York (via his good friend Winslow). Also, being in a balanced offense with a stable QB situation, and a change of scenery might be the thing that Edwards needs to finally breakout. This seems almost like a match made in heaven.

And while we are on the subject of WR's, I have a feeling the Cards will cave and give Q all the money he wants.

IndyColtScout
04-12-2009, 08:45 PM
Nope.

Quinn is scheduled to make $655,000 in base salary this season. He has the opportunity to add $11,000,000 to it by taking 70% of the snaps in the '09 season.

I'm not worried about the money, I'm talking length of contract.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 08:51 PM
I really don't see Brady Quinn going to the Jets. Why would Mangini want to possibly help the organization that fired him?

I think it will be hard for the Giants to come to terms with the Browns since they already tried making a trade and it didn't happen.

marshallb
04-12-2009, 08:52 PM
Jesus Christ Vikings jump on this

Hell yea, he'd be so much better than what we have now. If we could just grab a RT in the 2nd, a CB like Macho Harris in the 3rd, and a WR like Mike Wallace in the 5th and a couple of special teamers in the 7th, I'd be so ******* happy. We'd have to be considered among the Super Bowl favorites then.

kalbears13
04-12-2009, 08:58 PM
Hell yea, he'd be so much better than what we have now. If we could just grab a RT in the 2nd, a CB like Macho Harris in the 3rd, and a WR like Mike Wallace in the 5th and a couple of special teamers in the 7th, I'd be so ******* happy. We'd have to be considered among the Super Bowl favorites then.

Brady Quinn won't be traded, but if he does...whichever team Brady Quinn is traded to will instantly become my second favorite team (unless it's the Broncos) and then they'll win the Super Bowl and Mangini/Kokinis will look like an idiot.

bearsfan_51
04-12-2009, 09:08 PM
Hell yea, he'd be so much better than what we have now. If we could just grab a RT in the 2nd, a CB like Macho Harris in the 3rd, and a WR like Mike Wallace in the 5th and a couple of special teamers in the 7th, I'd be so ******* happy. We'd have to be considered among the Super Bowl favorites then.

Are you serious? Brady Quinn hasn't done **** in the NFL.

the decider13
04-12-2009, 09:10 PM
I really don't see the Broncos in the running for Quinn at all, why would Orton be a key to the deal and then go and trade for Quinn. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

ironman4579
04-12-2009, 09:41 PM
That leaves the Giants, and this seems like almost a slamdunk to me. The Giants need a WR now that Plax is gone, and they have the draft picks to get a deal done. They have been rumored to be aggressively pursuing Edwards, and it's even been rumored that Edwards would love to go the New York (via his good friend Winslow). Also, being in a balanced offense with a stable QB situation, and a change of scenery might be the thing that Edwards needs to finally breakout. This seems almost like a match made in heaven.

And while we are on the subject of WR's, I have a feeling the Cards will cave and give Q all the money he wants.

You don't think he broke out in 2007? Staying consistent is another story, but I'd say '07 was a breakout year.

Smokey Joe
04-12-2009, 09:53 PM
You don't think he broke out in 2007? Staying consistent is another story, but I'd say '07 was a breakout year.
Oh, he no doubt had a fantastic year in 07... but when I say breakout, I mean becomming one of the top receivers in this league and consistently putting up good-great numbers.

SimonRath
04-12-2009, 09:53 PM
Are you serious? Brady Quinn hasn't done **** in the NFL.

hes better then the QB's the Vikings have now in my opinion

scottyboy
04-12-2009, 09:55 PM
i don't know why there are a lot of Giants fans who don't want Edwards. I'd give 29 and a low pick or 45 and a low pick. It makes too much sense...we'll see what happens though

(trade 2nd and 5th for Edwards, draft Britt, never lose ever again)

ironman4579
04-12-2009, 09:57 PM
i don't know why there are a lot of Giants fans who don't want Edwards. I'd give 29 and a low pick or 45 and a low pick. It makes too much sense...we'll see what happens though

(trade 2nd and 5th for Edwards, draft Britt, never lose ever again)

You know you're a closet Michigan fan Scotty. Join our ranks!

Crickett
04-12-2009, 10:31 PM
i don't know why there are a lot of Giants fans who don't want Edwards

Because who really needs a #1 receiver? I'm sure replacing Amani Toomer or David Diehl is much more important than replacing Plaxico Burress.

Menardo75
04-12-2009, 10:37 PM
Edwards to the Giants seems like a lock to me. I am betting if Quinn gets dealt then he will go to Tampa with K2.

The Legend
04-12-2009, 10:40 PM
Jaguars could be in the hunt for Quinn & Edwards

Menardo75
04-12-2009, 10:56 PM
Nevermind forgot the Bucs just got Leftwich today I really don't know where Brady will end up.

Brent
04-12-2009, 11:27 PM
Nevermind forgot the Bucs just got Leftwich today I really don't know where Brady will end up.
They seem content going into the season with Luke McCown.

SenorGato
04-12-2009, 11:39 PM
The Jets would love either one.

I hope we steal Edwards while everyone thinks we're going after Quinn.

PoopSandwich
04-12-2009, 11:43 PM
Edwards should go to Tampa for a first round pick and a third and K2/BE can re-unite.

RaiderNation
04-13-2009, 12:49 AM
I see Quinn saying put in Cleveland and Edwards to NYG or Eagles

Diehard
04-13-2009, 01:21 AM
I really don't see the Broncos in the running for Quinn at all, why would Orton be a key to the deal and then go and trade for Quinn. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Agreed. From what BMarsh has been saying, it seems Orton has made a positive impression on the locker room and that things are beginning to settle down after the Cutler mayhem.

I think we'll draft a QB to groom, probably in the mid-late rounds, given that the 3rd string spot is now open (cya *******).

BlindSite
04-13-2009, 02:24 AM
Edwards I wouldn't be surprised if he went just about anywhere really, New York Giants seems like a decent landing spot.

Quinn is a weird one.

Lets go down the list Obvious no:

Buffalo
New England
Miami
Baltimore
Cincinnati
Cleveland (duh)
Pittsburgh
Indianapolis
Houston
Denver
Kansas
Oakland
San Diego
Dallas
Giants
Philly
Washington
Chicago
Green bay
Atlanta
New Orleans
St Louis
Seattle

Possibilities:
Jets - Obviously they need a future, and a present (realistically) at the QB position and Quinn could play in the system.

Jacksonville - David Garrard is a 31 year old game manager who only managed 15 TDs last year. The WR position is falling apart in jacksonville, so it's unlikely he'll be any better this year either. The team hasn't had a franchise guy... ever really (maybe Brunell) and they need some youth.

Tennessee - Kerry Collins is on the downside of his career and it's no secret that the offense went through the running game last year. While I don't think they're done with the Vince Young experiment sending him to the browns or elsewhere in a three way trade and getting Quinn might do both the franchise and the two young QBs a world of good.

Detroit - Obvious need and obvious ammo to get him.

Minnesota - I doubt they'd trade for him after acquiring Rosenfels and investing a lot of time in Tavaris Jackson. Realistically having three draft picks spend in four years on one position isn't something the team will want. Still he'd be an instant upgrade.

Tampa - Reunite Winslow with Quinn and give them a starting Qb who could help grow what is a young and emerging offense. There's a lot of youth at skill positions and QB needs to be addressed. Leftwich was signed because he's the best of a bad bunch of FA Qbs.

Carolina - Delhomme is heading toward the end of his career regardless of whether or not you believe his 6 turnover meltdown will impact the team's long term aspirations at the position. Matt Moore has shown a lot of promise and Fox loves McCown as a backup, but Davidson the Panthers OC, is a former browns staffer and the new QB coach in carolina coached Quinn the last two years. Fox and Weiss are also pretty close friends and Fox was reportedly very interested in Quinn coming out a few years ago. While Carolina doesn't have a first this year, they do have Peppers who wants out of Carolina.

San Francisco - Obvious need, though I doubt the 10th overall is what they'd like to spend.

Arizona - Kurt Warner wants another run at a title but he's publically questioned playing the game too much longer and his short deal speaks volumes of his future as the Cardinals QB. Whisenhunt has Leinart but it remains to be seen if he's ever going to have the light come on, or if he'll be able to start in a year's time when he'll likely need to. This situation is eerily reminiscent of the one in Tennessee, vet starter who's only got at most 2 seasons in the tank and young guys no one expects to step up after that period.

DiG
04-13-2009, 07:26 AM
Lets go down the list Obvious no:
Washington


Out of curiosity why is Washington an obvious no if they were so busy in the Cutler trade?

BaLLiN
04-13-2009, 09:50 AM
For Braylon, i think the eagles are probably the ones that should try to get him and could win, but i dont see it happening for them.

I know they want McNabb to stay and trading for him would give him a #1 option, but i feel like they are confident with Jackson, Curtis, Avant, and Baskett; i mean enough not to bring in a guy like braylon whos dragged alot of controversy about the trade and isnt reliable.

The giants however should be really desperate IMO, but they are saying they dont have interest anymore (which sounds like smokescreen) and in the position we're in in the first we would reach for a WR, or would have to trade up.

Other than those two teams, a different landing destination would really surprise me.

awfullyquiet
04-13-2009, 09:53 AM
Out of curiosity why is Washington an obvious no if they were so busy in the Cutler trade?

because snyder just likes his hand in the cookie jar at all times.

TimD
04-13-2009, 10:00 AM
The Jets would love either one.

I hope we steal Edwards while everyone thinks we're going after Quinn.

Haha i was thinking the same thing. We have a great chance for both players

Smokey Joe
04-13-2009, 10:06 AM
Out of curiosity why is Washington an obvious no if they were so busy in the Cutler trade?
I figure because it seems like the Redskins want an upgrade over Campbell and a proven NFL QB. Is Quinn really an upgrade over Campbell? I think they'd just be much more inclined to hope Campbell takes his play to the next step next year.

Brent
04-13-2009, 10:12 AM
Pssh, we all know that Colt Brennan is going to take that team to the Super Bowl.

Addict
04-13-2009, 10:17 AM
Pssh, we all know that Colt Brennan is going to take that team to the Super Bowl.

you jinxed it now!

BaLLiN
04-13-2009, 10:33 AM
if braylon were to come to NY giants do you think he'd take #17?

mqtirishfan
04-13-2009, 10:40 AM
if braylon were to come to NY giants do you think he'd take #17?

Why wouldn't he?

Strawdog
04-13-2009, 10:58 AM
you jinxed it now!

Colt is unjinxable.

sweetness34
04-13-2009, 11:50 AM
Is Cleveland just not sold on Quinn? Because I think it's pretty ******* stupid to trade him away, he did show some good things before his injury and I like his pro potential down the road, moreso than I do Russel.

Mr.Regular
04-13-2009, 12:03 PM
Detroit, Minnesota, New York Jets, and Washington would be the most obvious suitors for Quinn IMO. Of that I think Detroit is settled on Stafford and Minnesota for some reason is content with Sage and Jackson (eww).

So Id bet on the Jets and Washington

noondog
04-13-2009, 12:12 PM
Count me in as one of those who would take Quinn and Jason Smith over Stafford and Beatty. That would make my year.

killxswitch
04-13-2009, 12:21 PM
Count me in as one of those who would take Quinn and Jason Smith over Stafford and Beatty. That would make my year.

That would be a pretty sweet start to '09. The Browns would be dumb to trade Quinn away though. He seems like he should be a real bargain. Hopefully his best playing years aren't wasted while the Browns screw around with the roster.

DiG
04-13-2009, 12:41 PM
Pssh, we all know that Colt Brennan is going to take that team to the Super Bowl.

that deserves +rep everyday for a week. :bow:

Brent
04-13-2009, 05:16 PM
that deserves +rep everyday for a week. :bow:
I love Colt Brennan. The fact that he went to a QB who wants to groom him, in Zorn, makes me think he has a potentially great future.

LookItsAlDavis
04-13-2009, 05:31 PM
Was anyone else surprised he fell as far as he did last year? I was thinking he was a 3rd rounder.

bearsfan_51
04-13-2009, 05:37 PM
Is Cleveland just not sold on Quinn? Because I think it's pretty ******* stupid to trade him away, he did show some good things before his injury and I like his pro potential down the road, moreso than I do Russel.
Like what?

I'm also not sure if you liking him is reason enough for them to not do it.

kalbears13
04-13-2009, 05:42 PM
Like what?

I'm also not sure if you liking him is reason enough for them to not do it.

He was 23/35 for 239 yards and 2 TD's and 0 INTs against Denver in a losing effort. Then they won against Buffalo but he was 14/36 for 185 and 0 TD's and 0 INT's. But he was also injured in that game and tried playing through the injury the next game and did poorly.

jkpigskin
04-13-2009, 05:46 PM
For the browns sake, I would not trade quinn straight up for a 1st rounder... He's already had a year of sitting and watching and a half season of play experience... by trading him away and maybe drafting a QB would put them back 2 years. I for one do not believe in derek anderson

for the ravens sake, go ahead and do it... i would not mind the ravens playing a team with a bunch of rookies

Brodeur
04-13-2009, 05:50 PM
He was 23/35 for 239 yards and 2 TD's and 0 INTs against Denver in a losing effort. Then they won against Buffalo but he was 14/36 for 185 and 0 TD's and 0 INT's. But he was also injured in that game and tried playing through the injury the next game and did poorly.

Having a good game against a pee wee defense is nothing to brag about, and the latter game is pretty damn awful.

kalbears13
04-13-2009, 05:57 PM
Having a good game against a pee wee defense is nothing to brag about, and the latter game is pretty damn awful.

He broke his finger that game. What do you expect? It was also his second regular season game playing in other than his cameo in the last 5 minutes of the first half last year against the 49ers, what do you expect?

jj45
04-13-2009, 06:01 PM
if braylon were to come to NY giants do you think he'd take #17?

Of course he would
If sanchez goes to broncos he will wear #6 even though culter had it


Do u think the brown would take a 2nd and 3 next year for edwards

Bigburt63
04-13-2009, 06:08 PM
Of course he would
If sanchez goes to broncos he will wear #6 even though culter had it


Do u think the brown would take a 2nd and 3 next year for edwards

It's going to take at least a 1st to get Edwards.

BlindSite
04-13-2009, 06:24 PM
He broke his finger that game. What do you expect? It was also his second regular season game playing in other than his cameo in the last 5 minutes of the first half last year against the 49ers, what do you expect?

I agree, given the playing time he's had he's shown us that he can play in the NFL, he just got hurt. Trading him now sounds more like an initiative for Mangini to build the team differently than it does there's something inherently wrong with Quinn.

Thumper
04-13-2009, 07:27 PM
I really like Quinn and the game he started last year, I was impressed and I think he will be a good QB.

Eric Mangini is no longer Man genius. WTF is he doing? You're trading away your teams 3 best offensive players (ex. Joe Thomas and Steinbach). You really expect to succeed? There is the draft but really how much impact to expect a rookie to have? A very small percentage of rookies actually come in and make a significant impact. Mangini I hope for your sake you don't do this because I guarantee that you will lose your job within 2 seasons if you do.

The Legend
04-13-2009, 07:32 PM
Broncos 12 & 18 for both of them.

Bigburt63
04-13-2009, 08:03 PM
Broncos 12 & 18 for both of them.

That would make their offense just ridiculous, but it would have to be to score more points than that porous defense is going to allow, especially when it is switching schemes.

bigbluedefense
04-14-2009, 12:42 PM
can something happen already?


don't tickle my balls 2 weeks before the draft.

The Dynasty
04-14-2009, 12:46 PM
can something happen already?


don't tickle my balls 2 weeks before the draft.

Well according to this report

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=jc-giantspursueedwards041409&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

The Giants are expected to land Edwards before the draft.

Flyboy
04-14-2009, 12:50 PM
don't tickle my balls 2 weeks before the draft.

Hahahahaha. Oh. Good ol' ball tickling.

Menardo75
04-14-2009, 01:17 PM
Hahahahaha. Oh. Good ol' ball tickling.

That's considered sexual harrassment in some states.

Geo
04-14-2009, 01:17 PM
I think a deal gets done between the G-Men and Browns for Edwards. Makes sense for both parties.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 01:29 PM
I think a deal gets done between the G-Men and Browns for Edwards. Makes sense for both parties.

Why does it make sense for the Browns?

Edwards is in the last year of his contract, coming off his worst season as a pro.

The Browns can and should keep him for this year. If he has a big year like in '07, they can extend him or franchise him and get more out of the deal.

Flippityskip91
04-14-2009, 01:31 PM
Why does it make sense for the Browns?

Edwards is in the last year of his contract, coming off his worst season as a pro.

The Browns can and should keep him for this year. If he has a big year like in '07, they can extend him or franchise him and get more out of the deal.

Yes yes yes...I don't know why nobody else understands this argument. It's exactly how I feel about the situation.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 01:36 PM
If all else fails, I'm sure the Browns can call up the Philadelphia Eagles and see what they'd like to offer. I imagine the Browns could at least get one of their 1sts and then the Giants have to deal with Edwards twice a year.

Hopefully it goes better than it did on MNF

The Dynasty
04-14-2009, 01:40 PM
Why does it make sense for the Browns?

Edwards is in the last year of his contract, coming off his worst season as a pro.

The Browns can and should keep him for this year. If he has a big year like in '07, they can extend him or franchise him and get more out of the deal.

The key word in that sentence is IF. He could also play like he did last year and that 1st rounder that is on the table now could fall to a 2nd or 3rd. It would be smart for them to take a deal now and get something for him.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 01:45 PM
The key word in that sentence is IF. He could also play like he did last year and that 1st rounder that is on the table now could fall to a 2nd or 3rd. It would be smart for them to take a deal now and get something for him.

Even if his production is the same as this year, that's still 900 yards and a couple TDs.

Flippityskip91
04-14-2009, 02:08 PM
The key word in that sentence is IF. He could also play like he did last year and that 1st rounder that is on the table now could fall to a 2nd or 3rd. It would be smart for them to take a deal now and get something for him.

Not unless they're attempting to win the 1st pick of next years draft. You can only trade away so much before you cripple yourself, and we don't have the players to compensate for losing 2 of our 3 best offensive players.

Let Edwards and Mangini take their trial run together, and then decide whether or not to keep him. We see guys in contract years explode all the time. When Edwards focuses, aka 2007, he is absurd. He'll be focused on making more money than anyone else, and he knows what he needs to do.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 03:08 PM
The Giants:
recieve- Braylon Edwards

Explanation: The giants need a final piece to form a solid roster for another superbowl run. Plax messed up his chance at another title, or maybe even playing again.

The Browns:
recieve-1st round (#29) 4th round (#129)

Explanation: The Browns are bringing in a new cast, Wimbley is a "bust" apparently already, their linebacking core is average, most of their defense could be improved. Jamal wont last much longer, they only have one good recieving threat left and a decent slot reciever. By trading away Braylon they take away a player who has slacked off and shown he didnt really care about the organization.

Lokie
04-14-2009, 03:10 PM
The Giants:
recieve- Braylon Edwards

Explanation: The giants need a final piece to form a solid roster for another superbowl run. Plax messed up his chance at another title, or maybe even playing again.

The Browns:
recieve-1st round (#29) 4th round (#129)



Personally as a Browns fan i would rather have the Giants first round pick and D. Hixon or M. Manningham

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 03:11 PM
The Giants:
recieve- Braylon Edwards

Explanation: The giants need a final piece to form a solid roster for another superbowl run. Plax messed up his chance at another title, or maybe even playing again.

The Browns:
recieve-1st round (#29) 4th round (#129)

Explanation: The Browns are bringing in a new cast, Wimbley is a "bust" apparently already, their linebacking core is average, most of their defense could be improved. Jamal wont last much longer, they only have one good recieving threat left and a decent slot reciever. By trading away Braylon they take away a player who has slacked off and shown he didnt really care about the organization.

Pass.

Basically a 2nd and a 5th... as good as that sounds... thanks, but no thanks

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 03:13 PM
Personally as a Browns fan i would rather have the Giants first round pick and D. Hixon or M. Manningham

Yea... the competition between Hixon/Manningham, Steptoe, and Hubbard for the 3rd WR spot would be one for the ages.

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 03:14 PM
Pass.

Basically a 2nd and a 5th... as good as that sounds... thanks, but no thanks

I don't want the 30th pick and a 5th round for Braylon either. I'd rather draft Crabtree and keep Edwards to see if his attitude/play changes and there is always the option of franchise tagging him or giving him a new contract if he kicks ass.

Kase1
04-14-2009, 03:15 PM
If we (Giants) get Braylon Ill drive to Cleveland and pick his wahzoo up!!!!


We NEED him on the Giants!!!!

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 03:48 PM
If we (Giants) get Braylon Ill drive to Cleveland and pick his wahzoo up!!!!


We NEED him on the Giants!!!!

I'll drive him there for a 1st and a second.

Braylon is a great guy, people rip him so much around here, he lives on the golf course I work at and I've talked to him a couple times and wished him luck. Never once has he blown someone off that I have seen.

Also, he respects the Steelers and their ability, that was something I got out of a talk I had with him. Kid I work with is a Steelers fan and was saying how much crap he gets for being a Steelers fan around here and sayin how people always say Pittsburgh sucks... Braylon just said "We and the fans have no room to talk right now, we need to beat them first."

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 03:50 PM
I don't want the 30th pick and a 5th round for Braylon either. I'd rather draft Crabtree and keep Edwards to see if his attitude/play changes and there is always the option of franchise tagging him or giving him a new contract if he kicks ass.

its the 29th and 129 which is not close to a 5th because of the comp picks. I dont understand why your banking on him doing better on the browns, with winslow gone that would make him the only target for opposing teams to cover, instead of keeping him, getting two picks to replace him in a small rebuild instead of holding on to hope that he actually begins to care about the browns.

1a. (trade down probably pick up a second and maybe 4th from jets) Rey Maualuga
1b. Darius Heyward-Bey
2a. Alphonso Smith
2b. Larry English
2c. LeSean McCoy
4. (trade up with 6th into 3rd) Ramses Barden
4b. James Casey
4c. Kyle Moore

Now honestly, tell me your not happy with that.
you get the best ILB, a project WR with great speed and deep threat (anderson's known for), a playmaking corner, 3-4 OLB pass rusher, great inside running very young RB with good cutback ability. Small School redzone WR, a pass catching TE, and a 3-4 DE.

AlexDown
04-14-2009, 03:51 PM
I'll drive him there for a 1st and a second.

Not going to happen.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 03:53 PM
The Daily News calls Cleveland "eager to make a deal." The Giants have ten draft picks and the Browns are expected to command at least first- and third-rounders. Cleveland also may ask for Mathias Kiwanuka, who would play outside linebacker in Eric Mangini's 3-4. The Giants do not want to part with Kiwi, but may counter with one or two of their young receivers

Perhaps Mangini isn't as stupid as people would like to make him out to be

Brent
04-14-2009, 03:55 PM
I don't want the 30th pick and a 5th round for Braylon either. I'd rather draft Crabtree and keep Edwards to see if his attitude/play changes and there is always the option of franchise tagging him or giving him a new contract if he kicks ass.
Not to mention he could be traded before the deadline.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 03:58 PM
Perhaps Mangini isn't as stupid as people would like to make him out to be

1st and 4th possibly a conditional (4th or 5th) in 2010 but its not going to be much more than that.

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 03:59 PM
its the 29th and 129 which is not close to a 5th because of the comp picks. I dont understand why your banking on him doing better on the browns, with winslow gone that would make him the only target for opposing teams to cover, instead of keeping him, getting two picks to replace him in a small rebuild instead of holding on to hope that he actually begins to care about the browns.



I said if we draft Crabtree and keep Edwards I would be happy to keep Edwards another year. It's a contract year for him, almost all players play their ass off in a contract year.

As far as the 29th and 129th pick in the draft, that still sucks compared to what his value should be.

There is no way Edwards is worth Robo/Nicks and a 5th round pick, which is the best receiver you would most likely get with that 29th pick. Winslow was a 2nd and 5th because of his knee and the fact that he gets hurt alot.

There is no sense in Cleveland letting Braylon go for basically just a first round pick, there needs to be a third rounder or better in there to make it even worth while for us.

Oh and Ray Malaluga is not better than Aaron Curry (I believe Curry would play ILB for the Browns.)

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 04:09 PM
1st and 4th possibly a conditional (4th or 5th) in 2010 but its not going to be much more than that.

Ok, so we'll keep him or see if the Eagles are more interested.

The misconception is that the Browns need to deal Edwards. If the Giants don't meet the Browns asking price, they can hold onto him without issue.

He's going to play his ass off for his next contract... you can count on that.

LizardState
04-14-2009, 04:22 PM
Eric Mangini is no longer Man genius. WTF is he doing? You're trading away your teams 3 best offensive players (ex. Joe Thomas and Steinbach). You really expect to succeed? There is the draft but really how much impact to expect a rookie to have? A very small percentage of rookies actually come in and make a significant impact. Mangini I hope for your sake you don't do this because I guarantee that you will lose your job within 2 seasons if you do.

Clayton on ESPN Live today confirmed that the Giants were interested in dealing for Braylon Edwards & both he & Quinn could be gone this month.

I agree with Thumper here, Mangini is inexplicably trading the Browns talent core away if he does this. When he coached the Jets they spent like $140M for FAs brought in, then he brought in a way over the hill Favre who threw away entire games for them, cost Mangini his job. Maybe he's going on another shopping spree this yr for the Browns if their draftees don't fill the holes he's created, & again you're right, depending on the position I can't see impact rookies turning them around on either side of the ball.

He's doing it again -- what was Einstein's definition of insanity, doing the same thing the same way over & over again & expecting different results?

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 04:23 PM
i almost hope now you keep him and he has a bad year, Braylon is not a pro bowl caliber WR right now, couple that with a desire not to play for the browns (he doesnt seem to care about your organization) and a case of the dropsies, yes id say mid twenties is about right.

The Cowboys will give up a first-round pick in 2009, plus a third- and sixth-rounder that year for Williams and a seventh-round pick in '10.

thats the dallas-detroit trade

Dallas gave
#20(850) + #82(180) + #192(14.6)=1044.6

Detroit gave
#210(7.4)
Roy Williams

1044.6-7.4= 1037.2

Giants
give: #29(640) + #129(43) = 643


Braylon(643)
Roy(1037.2)

now realize that they did that during the season, and dallas was very very very more desperate. Now if you include a conditional which could add possibly 130 more value. Dallas gave up too much, and that kind of value cant be expected to be given up just because one team was that desperate DURING THE SEASON.

vikes_28
04-14-2009, 04:23 PM
how about brady quinn to the vikings for chester taylor and a third...

/sarcasm.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 04:26 PM
i almost hope now you keep him and he has a bad year, Braylon is not a pro bowl caliber WR right now, couple that with a desire not to play for the browns (he doesnt seem to care about your organization) and a case of the dropsies, yes id say mid twenties is about right.


thats the dallas-detroit trade

Dallas gave
#20(850) + #82(180) + #192(14.6)=1044.6

Detroit gave
#210(7.4)
Roy Williams

1044.6-7.4= 1037.2

Giants
give: #29(640) + #129(43) = 643


Braylon(643)
Roy(1037.2)

now realize that they did that during the season, and dallas was very very very more desperate. Now if you include a conditional which could add possibly 130 more value. Dallas gave up too much, and that kind of value cant be expected to be given up just because one team was that desperate DURING THE SEASON.

It's a contract year. If Mangini takes a dump in his cereal, Braylon is still going to bust his ass to get a big paycheck elsewhere.

And while we're at it, Braylon is a better receiver than Roy Williams and the stats support it.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 04:37 PM
It's a contract year. If Mangini takes a dump in his cereal, Braylon is still going to bust his ass to get a big paycheck elsewhere.

And while we're at it, Braylon is a better receiver than Roy Williams and the stats support it.

that doesnt make any fricken sense, and really? When has Williams had a better QB? you cant prove it, theyre too similar.

Is he going to bust his ass to get franchise tagged? i guarantee you if he gets tagged after having a decent season he'll request a trade.

It could get better but there is a higher potential it could get worse, but bottom line if you draft crabtree itll still wont allow him to get off double teams. Couple that with a decreasing run game and not such a great defense he wont have much opportunity, that will give way to him not taking it seriously AGAIN. then what will his trade value?

Thumper
04-14-2009, 04:40 PM
I don't know about Braylon as an Eagle. The Eagles are happy with DeSean Jackson at #1 and I think they've shown where their priorities lie. The Eagles have flat out ignored Housh so they obviously don't regard WR as a big need. The Eagles are gunning for an OT and are looking REALLY hard at Eugene Monroe and Andre Smith. If they don't fall the Eagles will likely pull the trigger on Jason Peters. LT >>>> WR in the Eagles eyes.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 04:44 PM
that doesnt make any fricken sense, and really? When has Williams had a better QB? you cant prove it, theyre too similar.

Is he going to bust his ass to get franchise tagged? i guarantee you if he gets tagged after having a decent season he'll request a trade.

It could get better but there is a higher potential it could get worse, but bottom line if you draft crabtree itll still wont allow him to get off double teams. Couple that with a decreasing run game and not such a great defense he wont have much opportunity, that will give way to him not taking it seriously AGAIN. then what will his trade value?

Ok, if he wants out while tagged after having a great year, we get more for him than we would this year. Or they could get an extension done beforehand. In either scenario, the Browns end up in total control. I fail to see the downside here.

Despite having a bad defense and no running game, Edwards still managed to light up the Giants for 5 catches, 154 yards and a TD on MNF

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 04:46 PM
I don't know about Braylon as an Eagle. The Eagles are happy with DeSean Jackson at #1 and I think they've shown where their priorities lie. The Eagles have flat out ignored Housh so they obviously don't regard WR as a big need. The Eagles are gunning for an OT and are looking REALLY hard at Eugene Monroe and Andre Smith. If they don't fall the Eagles will likely pull the trigger on Jason Peters. LT >>>> WR in the Eagles eyes.

Braylon is very similar to TO in terms of skill set and what he does for an offense.

When the Eagles had TO, they were in the Superbowl. With Braylon, Jackson, and Avant and Westbrook, the Eagles could make another serious run.

Thumper
04-14-2009, 04:51 PM
Braylon is very similar to TO in terms of skill set and what he does for an offense.

When the Eagles had TO, they were in the Superbowl. With Braylon, Jackson, and Avant and Westbrook, the Eagles could make another serious run.

Yeah but also during those runs the Eagles arguably had the best line in the NFC. Andy follows the system of building a team from the inside out and he believes he already has his weapon in DeSean Jackson.

TO is not Braylon Edwards. Physically they have similar attributes and they both drop a lot of balls but TO works harder, runs better routes and plays with more heart. I hate TO but I will never accuse him of not working and playing hard.

I like Braylon but... The Eagles probably don't.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 04:52 PM
Ok, if he wants out while tagged after having a great year, we get more for him than we would this year. Or they could get an extension done beforehand. In either scenario, the Browns end up in total control. I fail to see the downside here.

Despite having a bad defense and no running game, Edwards still managed to light up the Giants for 5 catches, 154 yards and a TD on MNF

when a player requests a trade and holds out, their trade value plummets, it doesnt go up. And yes he did have a really good game against aaron ross (groin injury) on single coverage. He wont be seeing that next year being the only target.

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 04:54 PM
when a player requests a trade and holds out, their trade value plummets, it doesnt go up. And yes he did have a really good game against aaron ross (groin injury) on single coverage. He wont be seeing that next year being the only target.

Holding out? Yes. Holding out would also hurt the contract he'd be getting, which is why he would not do it. Requesting a trade? Hmmm... would not appear that way as illustrated by Jay Cutler and others.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 05:16 PM
Holding out? Yes. Holding out would also hurt the contract he'd be getting, which is why he would not do it. Requesting a trade? Hmmm... would not appear that way as illustrated by Jay Cutler and others.

Jay Cutler is pretty much a franchise QB.

Braylon is pretty much just a struggling #1 reciever in a bad situation. If he holds out instead of signing a contract and then signs a franchise tag tenure his value is still off.

Remember what happened with DeAngelo Hall? he had a great season before he got traded, he had one little incident and asked to be traded. and what was it a 2nd? yeah

wonderbredd24
04-14-2009, 05:27 PM
Jay Cutler is pretty much a franchise QB.

Braylon is pretty much just a struggling #1 reciever in a bad situation. If he holds out instead of signing a contract and then signs a franchise tag tenure his value is still off.

Remember what happened with DeAngelo Hall? he had a great season before he got traded, he had one little incident and asked to be traded. and what was it a 2nd? yeah

Braylon Edwards struggled his way to 900 yards and has averaged over 1,000 yards for the past 3 seasons with 25 TDs. His numbers stack up very well with any of the young receivers playing in the NFL.

Chad Johnson, for all of his troubles, could have netted the Bengals 2 1st round picks 2 years ago, and still might get them 1 at this point.

The Giants, Eagles, or anyone else will meet the Browns asking price on Edwards or they will keep him and either move him next year or extend. He's going to play better than he did this season and his value is going to go up. Sorry, but that's the reality of the situation. Come up with whatever idiotic scenario you want for why his value is going to go down, but short of catastrophic injury, it ain't happening.

Let's just agree on this... you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about when it comes to this topic.

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 05:53 PM
Ballin what you seem to be missing is that the Browns don't need to trade Edwards to the Giants or at all...

Honestly, look at our situation.

1. Edwards
2. Patten
3. Steptoe

Seriously...

You think the Browns NEED to get rid of Edwards? Do you think you would trade Edwards away with that receiving core for the 29th pick and a irrelevant later round pick? I wouldn't.

If I were the Giants I would give up a first and third possibly even a second for this guy, you are picking extremely late in each round and need a #1 receiver extremely bad. No one you are going to get at 29 will be better and considering it's not an even trade at that point you are going to have to throw in something bigger.

I guarantee Braylon nets AT LEAST a first and third in value.

Oh yeah, one more thing... If Braylon sucks so much why do you want him so bad?

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 06:29 PM
what you two dont get is that IMO, my opinion, not fact, my opinion; Braylon will decline if he stays with you for three reasons. Controversy and unwillingness to play for the browns and or Mangini and being doubled every play.

If you trade for more picks you gain more players, a great way to rebuild is through the draft, another thing is i highly doubt Mangini is going to want to set up a plan where he might lose his job being fired from the jets. He has one Line built, the other isnt at all, and the LBs arent great.

Trading down and bringing in players with high character and getting the team unified is what im talking about.

Sure you could wait a year, my thing is that two 4ths and a 1st is worth it from a rebuilding standpoint.

The fact that you guys expect a first and a 2nd is ridiculous, a first and a 3rd i can see, but the conditional pick could be a 3rd, so christ read what i say.

Braylon is a good player, he was a bum last year, showed up in bad shape after a dumb injury, he didnt seem to care about your team. Would Mangini honestly want to keep that?

bottom line a 1st 4th and conditional would do it.

Edit:
an eagles fan even told you that the front office wouldnt make a trade for him, which makes sense because i dont remember the last time eagles traded for a reciever, or traded up for one either.

I dont think he sucks bad, never said that, you dont read. I said he doesnt care about your organization, which is pretty apparent, he wasnt fit which explains his dropoff but also he wont have a great running game or recievers around him to take double teams off of him.

The Dynasty
04-14-2009, 06:32 PM
Profootballtalk.com hears that a Braylon Edwards trade to the Giants is unlikely, despite two reports to the contrary.

PFT suggests both sides are "posturing," with Cleveland leaking rumors to drive up Edwards' market, and New York holding out "until the Browns drop their asking price" and Edwards his contract demands. The Browns are said to be asking for Mathias Kiwanuka. Edwards wants to be paid $10M a year. Source: profootballtalk.com

Sources tell Newsday's Tom Rock that no Braylon Edwards-to-Giants trade is imminent and nothing should be expected "in the next few days."
Another day, another Braylon Edwards trade rumor blows over. Rock does acknowledge that the Browns and Giants are in active talks but says New York is not the "mystery" team with a first-round pick on the table for Edwards.
Source: Newsday

I saw this on rotoworld.com thought i was worthy to post.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 06:36 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=jc-giantspursueedwards041409&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/giants/2009/04/giants-back-in-hunt-for-braylo.html

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/04/14/giants-braylon-marriage-not-coming/

those state the opposite lol

BrownsTown
04-14-2009, 06:55 PM
I don't see Quinn and Edwards moving before draft day. More likely is the Browns waiting to see which of Sanchez/Crabtree will be available and trade one of them based on that.

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 06:59 PM
I dont think he sucks bad, never said that, you dont read..

I can only read so much of stuff I don't agree with, and based on your comments about Braylon they are pretty negative on how he didn't play that good isn't worth very much blah blah blah.

It would be like me saying Mathias Kiwanuka isnt a good tackler doesnt have good value and really isnt that important but me wanting to trade for him.

scottyboy
04-14-2009, 07:07 PM
good thing the Giants aren't idiots and won't give up a 1st and 3rd or Kiwi...

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 08:07 PM
I can only read so much of stuff I don't agree with, and based on your comments about Braylon they are pretty negative on how he didn't play that good isn't worth very much blah blah blah.

It would be like me saying Mathias Kiwanuka isnt a good tackler doesnt have good value and really isnt that important but me wanting to trade for him.

i said he didnt have a great year, he wasnt in shape due to the foot injury. The only negativity was his attitude.

Kiwanuka isnt a great tackler he's just a very athletic passrusher. He's what you guys wanted in wimbley basically so..

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 08:08 PM
good thing the Giants aren't idiots and won't give up a 1st and 3rd or Kiwi...

thank you, finally scotty

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 08:15 PM
i said he didnt have a great year, he wasnt in shape due to the foot injury. The only negativity was his attitude.

Kiwanuka isnt a great tackler he's just a very athletic passrusher. He's what Romeo Crennel wanted in wimbley basically so..

We will see man, I dont mean to sound like a jerk in this argument at all so don't take anything personal. If there's a trade and we get a first and 5th you can say told ya so.

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 09:28 PM
We will see man, I dont mean to sound like a jerk in this argument at all so don't take anything personal. If there's a trade and we get a first and 5th you can say told ya so.

im not going to say that, if that happens itd just be ridiculously bad for you guys.

a first and a 4th is a balanced deal, maybe a conditional next year (4th or 5th) but thatd be pretty much even IMO

yeats
04-14-2009, 09:30 PM
the browns should get rid of quinn, this whole qb battle nonsense is gonna mess with the eventual starter. trade one, get something out of it and move on. doesnt matter though, they'll have a top 3 pick next year.

usually when a team is the same color as your ****, they arent gonna be too good

BaLLiN
04-14-2009, 09:39 PM
usually when a team is the same color as your ****, they arent gonna be too good

lol well put, i wouldnt want my **** to come out orange

kalbears13
04-14-2009, 10:19 PM
the browns should get rid of quinn, this whole qb battle nonsense is gonna mess with the eventual starter. trade one, get something out of it and move on. doesnt matter though, they'll have a top 3 pick next year.

usually when a team is the same color as your ****, they arent gonna be too good

Why not trade Derek Anderson?

I'm okay with somebody saying the Browns will have a top 3 pick if you use solid reasoning. But when you use the color of the jerseys it kind of kills your argument. Especially since the "Cleveland Browns jerseys looking like ****" joke is not original at all.

yeats
04-14-2009, 10:32 PM
Why not trade Derek Anderson?

I'm okay with somebody saying the Browns will have a top 3 pick if you use solid reasoning. But when you use the color of the jerseys it kind of kills your argument. Especially since the "Cleveland Browns jerseys looking like ****" joke is not original at all.

1. they're trading away their main core of players.
2. this will lead to a lot of rookies stepping in and playing.
3. they cant stop the run
4. their best player is pissed off (shaun rogers)
5. two unproven qb's (andersons 2007 seasonw as overrated)
6. no running game
7. plus they have a new coaching staff, the players have to adapt to everything.
8. absolutely zero pass rush
9. no receivers, besides butterfingers

also what value will you get for anderson and his 08 season, nothing.
i could keep going but this gets old

PoopSandwich
04-14-2009, 10:44 PM
1. they're trading away their main core of players.

You mean Kellen Winslow was the whole core?

2. this will lead to a lot of rookies stepping in and playing. Thats always a good thing...

3. they cant stop the run
So they can't get a draft pick for Anderson?

4. their best player WAS pissed off (shaun rogers)

5. two unproven qb's (andersons 2007 seasonw as overrated)

2007 season overrated? No... maybe he outperformed himself but he isn't as bad as it looked in 2008.

6. no running game

Once again you could trade Anderson and get a draft pick to get a RB if you want or use one of our 3 picks in the top 50 for it...

7. plus they have a new coaching staff, the players have to adapt to everything.

And Anderson doesn't have to adapt to this? I mean come on your argument is supposed to be Quinn vs. Anderson

8. absolutely zero pass rush

Cool, so you trade away what could be a better QB to keep "Anderson who is overrated"

9. no receivers, besides butterfingers

Once again, wtf does this have to do with quinn/anderson

also what value will you get for anderson and his 08 season, nothing.
i could keep going but this gets old

I am sure Anderson could fetch a mid to late second round pick or early third...

If Quinn is gonna be good why the hell would you trade him?

I am pro-anderson, but I still don't understand the logic of someone who thinks that Quinn is better saying to trade him...

Its basically saying "We have a garbage backup at this spot but we will trade him to get a player to fill another need, leaving a hole at that spot.

Lokie
04-14-2009, 11:28 PM
1. they're trading away their main core of players.
I don't know that Winslow was the main core. To be honest I don't even consider Edwards to be part of our main core. Either way within the next 2 years I don't think Edwards is a Brown.

If the Browns start trade Joe Thomas, Shaun Rodgers, Josh Cribbs, Eric Steinbach, and Eric Wright, yeah I'll agree they have traded away the core. Even if the Browns trade Quinn (which I doubt) and Edwards it will be in no way or shape trading away the core of the team.

2. this will lead to a lot of rookies stepping in and playing.
Who says? If we trade Quinn Anderson would be the foreseeable QB and we can both agree he isn't a rookie. At WR, depending on the trade we could get a WR back who is experienced, honestly, though I would prefer Crabtree. To be honest I don't think you can find many teams that wouldn't want Crabtree on the field. If we draft linebackers we already have David Bowens, D'Qwell Jackson, Kamerion Wimbley, and Eric Barton..hardly a rookie group. If we draft a Secondary player with have experience there too. To be honest it really isn't that rare for 3-4 rookies per team to get a bunch of playing time. To be honest at this point can you guarantee that the Browns will be playing more rookies than any other team?
3. they cant stop the run
Yep completely agree with this, but if we get draft picks for Quinn and Edwards wouldn't this potentially help this situation.
4. their best player is pissed off (shaun rogers)
To be honest Rogers is coming to the voluntary workouts and has been told to play at whatever weight got him to the pro-bowl. IMO I think this situation has blown over.
5. two unproven qb's (andersons 2007 seasonw as overrated)
2 is better than 1 guess ;) Miami and Atlanta had questions about their QB situation before the draft too.
6. no running game
Really a team that rushes for no yards....That's gotta be a record...Jamal Lewis still had over a 1000 yards last year for your information while playing with 4 different starting QB's two of which with 3rd/Emergency QBs. To be honest we have one of in not the best LT in the game right now and starting LG isn't that bad either. If we can draft a center (maybe Mack in round 2) I see the O-line being the strength of the team.
7. plus they have a new coaching staff, the players have to adapt to everything.
So does 5 or 6 other teams.
8. absolutely zero pass rush
Agreed but with a new defensive coordinator and if we draft someone like Orakpo...etc our pass rush could significantly improve..No where to go but up right
9. no receivers, besides butterfingers
If Edwards is focused (a big if) and we draft Crabtree we could have a deadly set of pass catchers.

To me personally the value of Anderson is no higher than a 3rd but most likely a 4th-6th.

Honestly you can't honestly believe judging a team before the draft is in anyway accurate...Christ who would thought that Miami, Zona, and Falcons would be picking in the 20's or later? I bet you no one thought Seattle would have a top 5 pick either. At least let the draft pass before you start judging teams.

wicket
04-15-2009, 08:54 AM
I just read that the 49ers offered their first rounder for quinn. I cant give any links or something like that but it is on the ND rivals board.
Dont know what to think of it out of a browns perspective. From the niners its prolly a better move than hoping that sanchez falls to you in the draft.

3pac
04-15-2009, 08:57 AM
I just read that the 49ers offered their first rounder for quinn. I cant give any links or something like that but it is on the ND rivals board.
Dont know what to think of it out of a browns perspective. From the niners its prolly a better move than hoping that sanchez falls to you in the draft.

Oh man, I hope this happens. I love Quinn, I love the direction the 49ers are going in, and I'd love to see Quinn carry on the great tradition of amazing 49er quarterbacks. Awesommmmmmmmmmmmmmmme.

wonderbredd24
04-15-2009, 09:09 AM
I just read that the 49ers offered their first rounder for quinn. I cant give any links or something like that but it is on the ND rivals board.
Dont know what to think of it out of a browns perspective. From the niners its prolly a better move than hoping that sanchez falls to you in the draft.

Unless the Browns are content to start Derek Anderson (I really hope not), they'd effectively be trading Quinn for Sanchez straight up, which is incredibly stupid if you ask me.

Quinn has a better contract and already 2 years in the league.

3pac
04-15-2009, 09:13 AM
I just read that the 49ers offered their first rounder for quinn. I cant give any links or something like that but it is on the ND rivals board.
Dont know what to think of it out of a browns perspective. From the niners its prolly a better move than hoping that sanchez falls to you in the draft.


Also, just to help your credibility, the ND Rivals board got it from ESPN Insider. So this isn't just some silly fan speculation.

Chief49er
04-15-2009, 10:28 AM
Also, just to help your credibility, the ND Rivals board got it from ESPN Insider. So this isn't just some silly fan speculation.

That was all a stupid rumor, the 49ers already shot down that idea.

ironman4579
04-15-2009, 10:33 AM
1. they're trading away their main core of players.
I don't know that Winslow was the main core. To be honest I don't even consider Edwards to be part of our main core. Either way within the next 2 years I don't think Edwards is a Brown.

If the Browns start trade Joe Thomas, Shaun Rodgers, Josh Cribbs, Eric Steinbach, and Eric Wright, yeah I'll agree they have traded away the core. Even if the Browns trade Quinn (which I doubt) and Edwards it will be in no way or shape trading away the core of the team.

2. this will lead to a lot of rookies stepping in and playing.
Who says? If we trade Quinn Anderson would be the foreseeable QB and we can both agree he isn't a rookie. At WR, depending on the trade we could get a WR back who is experienced, honestly, though I would prefer Crabtree. To be honest I don't think you can find many teams that wouldn't want Crabtree on the field. If we draft linebackers we already have David Bowens, D'Qwell Jackson, Kamerion Wimbley, and Eric Barton..hardly a rookie group. If we draft a Secondary player with have experience there too. To be honest it really isn't that rare for 3-4 rookies per team to get a bunch of playing time. To be honest at this point can you guarantee that the Browns will be playing more rookies than any other team?
3. they cant stop the run
Yep completely agree with this, but if we get draft picks for Quinn and Edwards wouldn't this potentially help this situation.
4. their best player is pissed off (shaun rogers)
To be honest Rogers is coming to the voluntary workouts and has been told to play at whatever weight got him to the pro-bowl. IMO I think this situation has blown over.
5. two unproven qb's (andersons 2007 seasonw as overrated)
2 is better than 1 guess ;) Miami and Atlanta had questions about their QB situation before the draft too.
6. no running game
Really a team that rushes for no yards....That's gotta be a record...Jamal Lewis still had over a 1000 yards last year for your information while playing with 4 different starting QB's two of which with 3rd/Emergency QBs. To be honest we have one of in not the best LT in the game right now and starting LG isn't that bad either. If we can draft a center (maybe Mack in round 2) I see the O-line being the strength of the team.
7. plus they have a new coaching staff, the players have to adapt to everything.
So does 5 or 6 other teams.
8. absolutely zero pass rush
Agreed but with a new defensive coordinator and if we draft someone like Orakpo...etc our pass rush could significantly improve..No where to go but up right
9. no receivers, besides butterfingers
If Edwards is focused (a big if) and we draft Crabtree we could have a deadly set of pass catchers.

To me personally the value of Anderson is no higher than a 3rd but most likely a 4th-6th.

Honestly you can't honestly believe judging a team before the draft is in anyway accurate...Christ who would thought that Miami, Zona, and Falcons would be picking in the 20's or later? I bet you no one thought Seattle would have a top 5 pick either. At least let the draft pass before you start judging teams.

It kind of makes me laugh that you don't consider Winslow or Edwards core players, yet have Eric Wright (who has been good, but not great and inconsistent), and Josh Cribbs (great return man, nothing else) as core players. It's really quite funny actually.

3pac
04-15-2009, 10:42 AM
That was all a stupid rumor, the 49ers already shot down that idea.

Well duh, why would they want to telegraph that? That means nothing. Not to mention that their FO has been incredibly tight lipped this offseason. I'm not saying it'll happen, but that's not much evidence to say it won't.

fear the elf
04-15-2009, 10:48 AM
It kind of makes me laugh that you don't consider Winslow or Edwards core players, yet have Eric Wright (who has been good, but not great and inconsistent), and Josh Cribbs (great return man, nothing else) as core players. It's really quite funny actually.
i don't think it's that ridiculous. i wouldn't include eric wright in the list, but cribbs i would count as core. i consider core as something you can build around and a big part of that is attitude. cribbs wants to be a brown, plus he is pretty much a special teams ace, being a great kickoff and punt returner along with being one of the best coverage guys in the league.

as far as edwards and winslow being core guys... again, i half agree. winslow wasn't someone to build around b/c as many browns fans have said, he was/is playing on borrowed time with that knee and his attitude was questionable as far as wanting to be here (although i would never question his heart), but with edwards, he is still young and a top lvl wr if he can get back to 07 form. i think he is feeling unwanted right now, but he has shown a desire to be a part of the browns, just look at the charity work he was doing for cleveland before this past year. there would just need to be some repair of the relationship between him and the fans.

BaLLiN
04-15-2009, 10:54 AM
the best thing for you guys would be to trade down.

wonderbredd24
04-15-2009, 10:56 AM
the best thing for you guys would be to trade down.

Short of getting Curry at 5, trading down is ideal whether it's a team trading up for Crabtree, Raji, or Sanchez

Flippityskip91
04-15-2009, 10:59 AM
Short of getting Curry at 5, trading down is ideal whether it's a team trading up for Crabtree, Raji, or Sanchez

Tradin down would make it the best day ever! However, I just don't see anyone moving up to 5...unless we're going to take less value to move down, and I'm not big on losing value when it comes to the draft.

BaLLiN
04-15-2009, 11:00 AM
Short of getting Curry at 5, trading down is ideal whether it's a team trading up for Crabtree, Raji, or Sanchez

idk why but i feel like the jets would for either crabs or sanchez. netting you a 2nd and 4th comensation. then if you make the braylon trade, this is what you could land.

1a. (trade down probably pick up a second and maybe 4th from jets) Rey Maualuga
1b. Darius Heyward-Bey
2a. Alphonso Smith
2b. Larry English
2c. LeSean McCoy
4. (trade up with 6th into 3rd) Ramses Barden
4b. James Casey
4c. Kyle Moore

ironman4579
04-15-2009, 11:47 AM
i don't think it's that ridiculous. i wouldn't include eric wright in the list, but cribbs i would count as core. i consider core as something you can build around and a big part of that is attitude. cribbs wants to be a brown, plus he is pretty much a special teams ace, being a great kickoff and punt returner along with being one of the best coverage guys in the league.

as far as edwards and winslow being core guys... again, i half agree. winslow wasn't someone to build around b/c as many browns fans have said, he was/is playing on borrowed time with that knee and his attitude was questionable as far as wanting to be here (although i would never question his heart), but with edwards, he is still young and a top lvl wr if he can get back to 07 form. i think he is feeling unwanted right now, but he has shown a desire to be a part of the browns, just look at the charity work he was doing for cleveland before this past year. there would just need to be some repair of the relationship between him and the fans.

Meh, I consider core guys as guys that you can build around, as well as guys who want to be there and be leaders. I'm not sure I consider a special teams ace a guy you can build around. I agree that Winslow was on borrowed time. My point was actually not that Cribbs and Wright weren't core guys. It was that calling those guys core guys but not Edwards and, to a lesser extent because of the injuries, Winslow, sounds somewhat silly.

Lokie
04-15-2009, 12:07 PM
Edwards isn't a core guy, cause he doesn't want to be in Cleveland. Core guys are people who wan to be in Cleveland and have the talent to be good-great players.

Winslow wasn't a core guy as his knees wore torn up and he was a problem child.

ironman4579
04-15-2009, 12:15 PM
Edwards isn't a core guy, cause he doesn't want to be in Cleveland. Core guys are people who wan to be in Cleveland and have the talent to be good-great players.

Winslow wasn't a core guy as his knees wore torn up and he was a problem child.

Then I really wouldn't consider Cribbs a core guy. Yes, he's a very good, maybe great special teamer, but he'd never going to be a #1 receiver or a guy that makes any significant impact other than on special teams.

I'd also say that at this point, you have no clue whether Cribbs, Wright, Thomas etc want to be in Cleveland. Just because they've never publically said anything doesn't mean they won't bolt as soon as they hit free agency.