San Francisco 49ers Discussion

[Brent]

2009- Raye concerns me, but I can see how they are trying to go back to the way of Norv Turner. I guess we will have to wait and see. Let's hope he will actually stay for a few years if he is successful.
I'm pretty sure he's past the age of being a head coach somewhere, which is good.

[Menardo75]

I'm pretty sure he's past the age of being a head coach somewhere, which is good.

I think our defense will be great, but I have this feeling we won't have Manusky for much longer if that happens :(

[YAYareaRB]

But yes, on paper, if i'm correct in assuming this is your thought... they are both running quarterbacks in non pro style offenses and one plays in the SEC and the other the MAC.

Not necessarily.. Just wanted to find your point of view although the fact that they are eerily similar did cross my mind. Other than that.. Now this statement is arguable, the MAC has produced some very good QBs, maybe better than SEC??? Maybe???

[Brent]

My three favorite QBs for 2010 are all MAC QBs: Tim Hiller, Dan LeFevour and Daniel Raudabaugh (my HS QB).

[YAYareaRB]

Drafting football players instead of workout warriors will lead to a better team and more success.

If there's any doubt to this, please see: Raiders, Oakland

Do the names Vernon Davis and Manny Lawson come to mind?

[YAYareaRB]

My three favorite QBs for 2010 are all MAC QBs: Tim Hiller, Dan LeFevour and Daniel Raudabaugh (my HS QB).

Not to go unmentioned is Ohio's QB Franshaw "Boo" Jackson, who did an excellent job last season.

[Menardo75]

Not to go unmentioned is Ohio's QB Franshaw "Boo" Jackson, who did an excellent job last season.

BOO FTW!!!

[Brent]

Not to go unmentioned is Ohio's QB Franshaw "Boo" Jackson, who did an excellent job last season.
He's barely 6 foot.

[YAYareaRB]

Yeah Boo's the man!

[Brent]

Give me the previously mentioned three over him.

[YAYareaRB]

Give me the previously mentioned three over him.

No one was really arguing that. But statistically Hiller and LeFevour are a far ahead of Rad and Boo. The only thing I think Rad would have over Boo is height.

[Brent]

The only thing I think Rad would have over Boo is height.
and my adoration!

[abaddon41_80]

Do the names Vernon Davis and Manny Lawson come to mind?

IIRC, weren't Davis and Lawson both very productive in college?

[Menardo75]

IIRC, weren't Davis and Lawson both very productive in college?

I know that Vernon was. He had something like 76 catches his last year. I am not sure about Manny.

[Brent]

Manny Lawson, during his senior season had 58 tackles (33 solos), 21 pressures, four pass deflections, a blocked kick, 10.5 sacks and 19.5 stops for loss, according to Wikipedia. Seems productive to me.

[chapo123]

i know its early but this is an early mock for 2010

1. trent williams - ot
1. Mark Herzlich - olb
2. Dan LeFevour - qb
3. nate allen - fs

[dan77733]

I love all the Nolan bashing. Granted, I was saying it since day one but im happy to see that you guys finally realized that he was horrible and didnt know what the hell he was doing.

And please dont remind me of us drafting Balmer over Phillips.

[Brent]

And please dont remind me of us drafting Balmer over Phillips.
You and me both, Dan.

[rainbeaukid2]

i think my personal ideal draft for next year would include something like the following

1a. Taylor Mays/Eric Berry S
-would finally give us a playmaker at safety that hasn't been there in years, i think merton hanks was our last good FS

1b. OT
-don't know of any big prospects yet but it totally depends on how smith holds up

2. Terrence Cody DT
-would finally give us someone that can actually play NT in the 3-4

and i think that i would cream my pants if the niners got dez bryant next year although that would probably take a first/early second. imagine the playmakers on that offense. all of this is also made with the assumption that someone does at least half decent at QB this year

[Borat]

i know its early but this is an early mock for 2010

1. trent williams - ot
1. Mark Herzlich - olb
2. Dan LeFevour - qb
3. nate allen - fs

I absolutely love Mark Herzlich. Just a badass playmaker from the OLB position. Would love to add him to the D.

[txparkes49x]

Dan LeFevour!!! for the niners im on the wagon.

[Menardo75]

i think my personal ideal draft for next year would include something like the following

1a. Taylor Mays/Eric Berry S
-would finally give us a playmaker at safety that hasn't been there in years, i think merton hanks was our last good FS

1b. OT
-don't know of any big prospects yet but it totally depends on how smith holds up

2. Terrence Cody DT
-would finally give us someone that can actually play NT in the 3-4

and i think that i would cream my pants if the niners got dez bryant next year although that would probably take a first/early second. imagine the playmakers on that offense. all of this is also made with the assumption that someone does at least half decent at QB this year

I really don't think we need anymore receivers. I would cry of joy if we got Trent Williams.

[LizardState]

i think my personal ideal draft for next year would include something like the following

1a. Taylor Mays/Eric Berry S
-would finally give us a playmaker at safety that hasn't been there in years, i think merton hanks was our last good FS

1b. OT
-don't know of any big prospects yet but it totally depends on how smith holds up

2. Terrence Cody DT
-would finally give us someone that can actually play NT in the 3-4

The 9ers could pkg. their 2 no. 1s next yr. to move up to get Mays or Berry, the way everybody's all gaga over either of them, one of them could be the top player taken.

Call me a Crimson Tide homer, guilty as charged, but I don't think Mount Cody will last to the 2nd rd. if he keeps his weight under control (ideal playing weight in the 340s) & stays healthy. About 10-11 3-4 teams will be lining up for his services. Personally I would love to see him in Dallas or SF

[ninerbowl6]

I know that Vernon was. He had something like 76 catches his last year. I am not sure about Manny.

Vernon had 47 catches his senior year....Maryland does not throw the ball a lot so his production was pretty average....

[Madirishman]

The 9ers could pkg. their 2 no. 1s next yr. to move up to get Mays or Berry, the way everybody's all gaga over either of them, one of them could be the top player taken.

I doubt that a top 3 or 4 team will select and pay a S that much money, as even the best paid safeties aren't paid as much as the elite corners. They both could go 5 or 6 at the earliest, regardless of talent and hype. That's good news for the Niners as they aren't going to have a Top 5 pick. Maybe a Top 10 when Carolina tanks though =)~

[Madirishman]

Niners offically sign LB Harris. Decent production for backup last year in SD.

http://www.nfl.com/players/marquesharris/profile?id=HAR477095

[CJSchneider]

The 9ers could pkg. their 2 no. 1s next yr. to move up to get Mays or Berry, the way everybody's all gaga over either of them, one of them could be the top player taken.


I think the odds are greater of Mays having an average to slightly above year and slipping at tad bit are better then him studding it out again and ending up in the top 5. We may be in the perfect area to have him fall right in our laps.

[chapo123]

I absolutely love Mark Herzlich. Just a badass playmaker from the OLB position. Would love to add him to the D.

i saw a clip on him online...he's quite the trash talker. the mean streak helps as well.

[chapo123]

scotty mac:
i'm going to get a lot of critism here but i feel like he stratgey in the draft is very inconsitent compared to what he says they are looking for. has he gone on record yet and said anything why he didn't take a ot? de? oher was sitting there late in the 20's...why not package a 2nd & 4th to take him? some of his picks the last few seasons to me haven't panned out.

[Brent]

scotty mac:
i'm going to get a lot of critism here but i feel like he stratgey in the draft is very inconsitent compared to what he says they are looking for. has he gone on record yet and said anything why he didn't take a ot? de? oher was sitting there late in the 20's...why not package a 2nd & 4th to take him? some of his picks the last few seasons to me haven't panned out.
It seems his philosophy is look in FA for needs and BPA in the draft.

[Madirishman]

I'm hoping Cody Wallace pans out. He was the surprise pick to me in last year's draft in the 4th when there was a lot of talent left on the board. He's one guy that will be a head scratcher if he can't contribute.

[king2am]

scotty mac:
i'm going to get a lot of critism here but i feel like he stratgey in the draft is very inconsitent compared to what he says they are looking for. has he gone on record yet and said anything why he didn't take a ot? de? oher was sitting there late in the 20's...why not package a 2nd & 4th to take him? some of his picks the last few seasons to me haven't panned out.

Actually, I don't know if i've ever heard him say we're targetting such and such position. I only hear him say "we're looking to draft good football players". So, by that vague statement, he can't ever really be wrong by not going in a position that we feel is a need.

As far as moving up to get Oher, it all depends on our board at the time. For instance, we moved up to get Staley because our FO only graded 21 or so players with a first round grade. They saw him slip, and decided to go get him. I imagine we still had a number of players with similar grades to Oher and that's why we felt comfortable standing pat. But then, like they said, the players they were targetting went off the board shortly before we picked, Alphonso Smith, Ron Brace, Eben Britton maybe?

And I personally believe Mac sticks to his board, so if he doesn't like it, then he trades out. If he needs it, he trades up. But like I said, I would imagine a number of guys had a similar grade to Oher, or maybe we were okay with keeping picks, hoping Britton would fall.

But as far as what he says vs. what he does, I don't think he's inconsisent. I think he's too vague to be inconsistent, but to be fair, I think all general managers and coaches are like that. Exception: Mike Singletary

[YAYareaRB]

You know it's very possible to draft Eric Berry AND Taylor Mays.

[Madirishman]

It might be worth giving Carolina their 1st Round pick back.

Peppers a no-show at Panthers camp
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4121570

They drafted Brown to replace him. He is a special player, that is a proven Pro Bowler. If the Niners are looking to upgrade OLB, keeping Parys as a situational pass rusher, then Peppers is the way to go. They have the cap room and the ammo to trade, so why not make the move?

[abaddon41_80]

It might be worth giving Carolina their 1st Round pick back.

Peppers a no-show at Panthers camp
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4121570

They drafted Brown to replace him. He is a special player, that is a proven Pro Bowler. If the Niners are looking to upgrade OLB, keeping Parys as a situational pass rusher, then Peppers is the way to go. They have the cap room and the ammo to trade, so why not make the move?

Peppers-Spikes-Willis-Lawson = best starting linebacker corps in the league, imo

[YAYareaRB]

Uhhhhh.. I have a little problem. We knock OSACKpo for not being able to cover TEs and RBs yet we haven't seen Peppers do it. I'm not saying he's not capable of doing so I'm just saying.

[CJSchneider]

It seems his philosophy is look in FA for needs and BPA in the draft.

That works great...if you are playing Madden Football.

[Brent]

That works great...if you are playing Madden Football.
FA starters: Nate Clements, Justin Smith, Walt Harris, Takeo Spikes, Michael Lewis, Issac Bruce, Shaun Hill, Marvel Smith.

Seems to work.

You know it's very possible to draft Eric Berry AND Taylor Mays.
HY-03vYYAjA

[YAYareaRB]

We DO need another Corner though.

New Corner - Eric Berry - Taylor Mays - Nate Clements

Forgive the bulge in my pants.

[Madirishman]

Uhhhhh.. I have a little problem. We knock OSACKpo for not being able to cover TEs and RBs yet we haven't seen Peppers do it. I'm not saying he's not capable of doing so I'm just saying.

Bro, Peppers and O-Sack-po aren't even on the same planet when it comes to talent. I know you love him (and I was very high on him as well) but Orakpo has a long way to go to compare to Peppers.

Peppers is a extremely rare talent - A workout warrior that CAN play football as well at a very high level and has been consistently dominant throughout his career. He is a game changer and therefore he is easily worth a chunk of cash and a first round pick in a trade. He has played in coverage, and because of his speed and rare athletic ability for a player his size (remember he played Basketball at UNC as well), I think he would be a DOMINANT OLB and would demand double teams constantly. He's a home run player if he can be landed.

[king2am]

That is a STEAL in my opinion. We'd be getting Peppers for a 2nd and 4th.

[stl9erfan]

Mike Sando is incapable of talking about any thing other than how great Seattle is.

He really does seem to be biased in that direction doesn't he? I think the best thing for him (and all of us) would be if they really sucked hardcore for the next few years so we could stop hearing about this dynasty that never was.

[Madirishman]

I think he's worth a 5 or 6 year deal averaging around 10-12 Mil per year. I'm NOT big on trading a high pick AND signing him to a deal beating Haynesworth's contract (which he may want). I only hope that he would take elite money for a pass rusher and be happy, while being welcomed to a team that desperately needs him to rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB.

With the current situation (His contract killing the Panthers cap, them drafting a possible replacement, their need to get a higher draft pick back, etc.) this isn't a pipe dream. It's a real scenario that I would LOVE to see play out.

[king2am]

nice article on Scotty Mac

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news;_ylt=Aqj.JWG4r9Si56aZGyRwbbBDubYF?slug=ms-trippintuesday042809&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

[chapo123]

Actually, I don't know if i've ever heard him say we're targetting such and such position. I only hear him say "we're looking to draft good football players". So, by that vague statement, he can't ever really be wrong by not going in a position that we feel is a need.

As far as moving up to get Oher, it all depends on our board at the time. For instance, we moved up to get Staley because our FO only graded 21 or so players with a first round grade. They saw him slip, and decided to go get him. I imagine we still had a number of players with similar grades to Oher and that's why we felt comfortable standing pat. But then, like they said, the players they were targetting went off the board shortly before we picked, Alphonso Smith, Ron Brace, Eben Britton maybe?

And I personally believe Mac sticks to his board, so if he doesn't like it, then he trades out. If he needs it, he trades up. But like I said, I would imagine a number of guys had a similar grade to Oher, or maybe we were okay with keeping picks, hoping Britton would fall.

But as far as what he says vs. what he does, I don't think he's inconsisent. I think he's too vague to be inconsistent, but to be fair, I think all general managers and coaches are like that. Exception: Mike Singletary

see my issue is not so much what he believes in but it could be his tunnel vision. once his mind is set on 1 guy its been sold to the coaching staff. the crabtree pick to me was his boldest move to date to me. oher / britton/ darius butler / clint simtim / everette brown made tons of sense in the 2nd to me.

[Borat]

I think he's worth a 5 or 6 year deal averaging around 10-12 Mil per year. I'm NOT big on trading a high pick AND signing him to a deal beating Haynesworth's contract (which he may want). I only hope that he would take elite money for a pass rusher and be happy, while being welcomed to a team that desperately needs him to rush the passer as a 3-4 OLB.

With the current situation (His contract killing the Panthers cap, them drafting a possible replacement, their need to get a higher draft pick back, etc.) this isn't a pipe dream. It's a real scenario that I would LOVE to see play out.

OK, I soooo wanted to sit here and say, "yes, this is a pipe dream," but one thing sticks out which is telling me that there is a real possibility of acquiring Peppers. It's the fact that we dealt the 2nd AND the 4th in that deal for the future first. Normally, a mid-2nd is worth a future first straight up. Nobody can actually trade for Peppers until he signs his tender. So it could be possible that we dealt the 2nd AND 4th picks in exchange for Peppers and the future 1st is kind of like collateral while the contract details are worked out. Then we send the 1st back in trade for Peppers once everything is worked out. It's probably a long shot, but it would make sense.

[Madirishman]

OK, I soooo wanted to sit here and say, "yes, this is a pipe dream," but one thing sticks out which is telling me that there is a real possibility of acquiring Peppers. It's the fact that we dealt the 2nd AND the 4th in that deal for the future first. Normally, a mid-2nd is worth a future first straight up. Nobody can actually trade for Peppers until he signs his tender. So it could be possible that we dealt the 2nd AND 4th picks in exchange for Peppers and the future 1st is kind of like collateral while the contract details are worked out. Then we send the 1st back in trade for Peppers once everything is worked out. It's probably a long shot, but it would make sense.

So you're sayin there's a chance?! :)

[Brent]

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/021998.html

Cal linebacker Worrell Williams was at camp today on a try-out basis. Williams, however, is hurt and did not work out. No word yet on the injury.
I know how some of you love Worrell.

[Brent]

So you're sayin there's a chance?! :)
KX5jNnDMfxA

Had to be done.

[49ersfan_87]

I don't think we will make a play for Peppers. He's 29 and is brand new to the 3-4 after playing the 4-3 for so long. Plus he's going to want a gigantic contract and i wonder how motivated he will be after he gets paid. Not to mention this whole thing started from a opinion provided by Matt Barrows.

[Brent]

I don't think we will make a play for Peppers. He's 29 and is brand new to the 3-4 after playing the 4-3 for so long. Plus he's going to want a gigantic contract and i wonder how motivated he will be after he gets paid. Not to mention this whole thing started from a opinion provided by Matt Barrows.
This.

If we were running a 4-3, I would be all for Peppers. However, Scot hasn't bothered to inquire and I dont think he should. I would not be a fan of them trading for Peppers.

[abaddon41_80]

http://www.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/49ers/archives/021998.html


I know how some of you love Worrell.

I was just about to post that

[Madirishman]

Brent the dream killer. :P

[Brent]

Brent the dream killer. :P
I like to look at the evidence, and form a decision. I just dont like the idea of trading a lot and then having to give up more cap space.

[FG4prez]

Vernon had 47 catches his senior year....Maryland does not throw the ball a lot so his production was pretty average....

vernon led the ACC ın recıevıng wıth 851 yds recıevıng and 51 receptıons. that was ın hıs junıor year after whıch he came out. sam holllenback had the most pass yards ın the acc that year wıth 2600 or somethıng.

[FG4prez]

the pıcks all depend on the qb sıtuatıon. ıf we see some success thıs year wıth smıth or hıll, then my top 4 would be
mays
hardy
thompson
cody

[YAYareaRB]

Also.. Doesn't he want to be on a winning team? Or was it more of a scheme thing?

[Menardo75]

I really hope it works out.

[Menardo75]

I really doubt we would trade for Peppers doesn't seem like Scotty Mac's style.

I saw that Brian Ballsack on NFLN gave us a D for our draft lol wow.

[FG4prez]

a D ıs rough. we dıd pass up some good players ın the second but when you look at the 3rd rd there really wasnt a ton of players that were avaılable that would knock your socks off.
If coffee doesnt work out, ıd be all about jahvıd best the rb from cal ın the 2nd next year. talk about change of pace.
SI.com has us takıng mays and jevan snead ın the fırst. ı lıke ıt

[Larry]

I just see something special in Jevan Snead. If he's available with one of our picks I hope we take him.

[farfromforgotten]

a D ıs rough. we dıd pass up some good players ın the second

The player we get in the 1st round next year will be a better prospect than anyone who was left at our 2nd round selection this year. Next years draft looks pretty amazing when you look at the list of players who are projected as first round picks. I'll say it again - the trade was awesome.

[farfromforgotten]

If we were running a 4-3, I would be all for Peppers. However, Scot hasn't bothered to inquire and I dont think he should. I would not be a fan of them trading for Peppers.

I love Peppers, but I wouldnt want us to trade for him either. I want to see the team continue to get younger and I want to see who is available at both of our 1st round picks in next years draft.

[Menardo75]

He acts like we have so many needs all over the place. He even said that we needed all of our draft picks to start right away lol ridiculous.

[CJSchneider]

I just see something special in Jevan Snead. If he's available with one of our picks I hope we take him.

Snead is projecting to be a first rounder by many so far. I for one am not ready to say we need to take another QB in the first round. I have stood up for Hill for the last 7 months and he deserves a shot at proving himself from the on-set of a season.

[LonghornsLegend]

OK Niner fans, can I get some Glenn Coffee insight.


Some people seem to think he's just a "back-up" and a guy to spell Gore a few times a game, I was under the impression that you don't spend a 3rd rounder on a guy to just be a pure back-up, especially when you guys needed other positions, why not just take Jennings late if that's all you wanted?


Also he was drafted before guys Andre Brown who had some very impressive workouts so I figured the coaching staff loved what Coffee did in the SEC and wants to implement more of a 2-back thing.


Has Singletary or the OC came out and said exactly what they have planned on him, or is it all speculation right now?

[Menardo75]

All they have really said is they want a complete back to spell Gore. By complete a guy hat contributes in the running game, blocking, and playing special teams. That is all we know to this point.

[Menardo75]

Yeah why is there all this QB talk for next years draft now? Can we wait until the next season is over?

[Borat]

OK Niner fans, can I get some Glenn Coffee insight.


Some people seem to think he's just a "back-up" and a guy to spell Gore a few times a game, I was under the impression that you don't spend a 3rd rounder on a guy to just be a pure back-up, especially when you guys needed other positions, why not just take Jennings late if that's all you wanted?


Also he was drafted before guys Andre Brown who had some very impressive workouts so I figured the coaching staff loved what Coffee did in the SEC and wants to implement more of a 2-back thing.


Has Singletary or the OC came out and said exactly what they have planned on him, or is it all speculation right now?

Yep. I brought this up when we took Coffee in the 3rd. I think it was a very questionable move to take another RB that early. Of course, everyone blasted me for saying it, so I guess you and me are in the minority. I just think there were more pressing areas of concern on this team to be addressed before getting an RB that could spell Gore for a few series a game.

[farfromforgotten]

Also he was drafted before guys Andre Brown who had some very impressive workouts so I figured the coaching staff loved what Coffee did in the SEC and wants to implement more of a 2-back thing.

I think Gore and Coffee will be more of a 1A and 1B RB combo instead of Gore being A and Coffee being B. Coffee seems to be a pretty complete back w/ running, recieving, and blocking skills. Wasnt Gore also a 3rd round pick for us a few years ago?

I think if we were just going to draft someone to spell Gore or have a change of pace back we would have went with one of the bigger RBs available.

This is all just speculation on my part.

[Brent]

I think Gore and Coffee will be more of a 1A and 1B RB combo instead of Gore being A and Coffee being B. Coffee seems to be a pretty complete back w/ running, recieving, and blocking skills. Wasnt Gore also a 3rd round pick for us a few years ago?

I think if we were just going to draft someone to spell Gore or have a change of pace back we would have went with one of the bigger RBs available.

This is all just speculation on my part.
I second this. I dont believe he's a back up either. I wouldnt be shocked to see him get like 8-10 carries a game, at least.

[Brent]

Yeah why is there all this QB talk for next years draft now? Can we wait until the next season is over?
In that Yahoo article about Scot he said something along the lines of how Scot might start doing what they used to in Green Bay where they take a QB in every draft (usually late round) just to see if they can strike gold. Who knows.

[CJSchneider]

In that Yahoo article about Scot he said something along the lines of how Scot might start doing what they used to in Green Bay where they take a QB in every draft (usually late round) just to see if they can strike gold. Who knows.

Yeah because we all know how well that worked for them, LOL.

[Brent]

Yeah because we all know how well that worked for them, LOL.
Steve Beuerlein, Mark Brunell, Kurt Warner, Aaron Brooks... yeah, bad choices.

[king2am]

Steve Beuerlein, Mark Brunell, Kurt Warner, Aaron Brooks... yeah, bad choices.

Matt Hasselbeck

[thediggler3030]

I think Gore and Coffee will be more of a 1A and 1B RB combo instead of Gore being A and Coffee being B. Coffee seems to be a pretty complete back w/ running, recieving, and blocking skills. Wasnt Gore also a 3rd round pick for us a few years ago?

I think if we were just going to draft someone to spell Gore or have a change of pace back we would have went with one of the bigger RBs available.

This is all just speculation on my part.

Agreed.

That's why I get annoyed when people complain that we selected a back up Rb instead of taking a passrusher or OT.

If anything an OLB or OT would have been back ups. Coffee was selected to play this year. Had we waited until round 5 to get an RB to spell Gore, they prolly wouldn't have been good enough to crack the lineup this year.

I trust in McCloughan's ability to scout RBs. No one should doubt the man who selected Frank Gore!

[stl9erfan]

What I like most about the Coffee pick is that I feel like he has a very high floor, so to speak. I think people are right when they say our running back situation is going to be more of a 1A-1B tandem, with Gore getting maybe 15-20 carries per game and Coffee getting 10-15, and I think that when you're picking a RB who you need to be that second guy right away, it's smart to get one who should, at the very least, be a solid pro if never a star.

And I'm not saying Coffee won't be a star-- I think he could be very, very good. But with his physical style and the way he just hits the holes fast, I think at worst we're looking at a solid young player.

[Brent]

I just want to see Coffee run some fools over.

[CJSchneider]

Besides Rodgers, how many wins did those guys get G.B.?

Steve Beuerlein was drafted by the Raiders in 87 (#110) over all.
Mark Brunell was a 5th and was eventually traded for a 3rd and a 5th.
Kurt Warner was released outright
Matt Hasselbeck was traded along with G.B.'s first (17th overall)
and seventh-round draft picks, to the Seahawks for their first (10th overall) and third-round draft picks.

Yeah, they struck gold, then put it in someone else's bank.

[Brent]

Besides Rodgers, how many wins did those guys get G.B.?

Steve Beuerlein was drafted by the Raiders in 87 (#110) over all.
Mark Brunell was a 5th and was eventually traded for a 3rd and a 5th.
Kurt Warner was released outright
Matt Hasselbeck was traded along with G.B.'s first (17th overall)
and seventh-round draft picks, to the Seahawks for their first (10th overall) and third-round draft picks.

Yeah, they struck gold, then put it in someone else's bank.
Yes, CJ but if you get a return on your late round picks, what's the harm? Keep in mind that they were on the bench behind Favre.

[thediggler3030]

Besides Rodgers, how many wins did those guys get G.B.?

Steve Beuerlein was drafted by the Raiders in 87 (#110) over all.
Mark Brunell was a 5th and was eventually traded for a 3rd and a 5th.
Kurt Warner was released outright
Matt Hasselbeck was traded along with G.B.'s first (17th overall)
and seventh-round draft picks, to the Seahawks for their first (10th overall) and third-round draft picks.

Yeah, they struck gold, then put it in someone else's bank.

The point was to take late round QBs. Not necessarily to let them go as GB did.

[edgrenade]

What I like most about the Coffee pick is that I feel like he has a very high floor, so to speak. I think people are right when they say our running back situation is going to be more of a 1A-1B tandem, with Gore getting maybe 15-20 carries per game and Coffee getting 10-15, and I think that when you're picking a RB who you need to be that second guy right away, it's smart to get one who should, at the very least, be a solid pro if never a star.

And I'm not saying Coffee won't be a star-- I think he could be very, very good. But with his physical style and the way he just hits the holes fast, I think at worst we're looking at a solid young player.

i hope you mean high ceiling...

[stl9erfan]

CJ, they probably would've gotten more value for them had they been QB'd by a non-Favre, mortal QB, who might have, you know, missed a game every now and again with an injury. Not only would those guys have been able to help the Packers maybe win a couple of games, but they probably also would've shown off their trade value a little bit more.

[stl9erfan]

i hope you mean high ceiling...

nope, i mean high floor. if a player's ceiling is the best he could possibly be and then by "floor" i mean worst case scenario. basically, i think at worst he's a solid nfl contributor. i.e., i don't think he'll bust.

[CJSchneider]

Yes, CJ but if you get a return on your late round picks, what's the harm? Keep in mind that they were on the bench behind Favre.

CJ, they probably would've gotten more value for them had they been QB'd by a non-Favre, mortal QB, who might have, you know, missed a game every now and again with an injury. Not only would those guys have been able to help the Packers maybe win a couple of games, but they probably also would've shown off their trade value a little bit more.

That was my point entirely. It's not as if they found a replacement to their starter.

[king2am]

That was my point entirely. It's not as if they found a replacement to their starter.

Well, if you have a starter that you're comfortable with, I don't know if anyone would be drafting to replace him. Would you?

No, the idea is to draft someone that could step in if your starter, god forbid, goes down. So through the years they hit on a number of solid quarterbacks, realized that Favre was going to play till he was 100, and saw the best value for their quarterbacks in trades.

So, your point is, the only time you should draft a quarterback is to replace your starter? I don't honestly believe that's what you mean, but that's what it sounds like. And if it's not, does that mean you can only draft a quarterback in the early rounds? Because you certainly scoffed at the idea of trying to 'strike gold' in the later rounds.

I guess i'm unsure where your stance is.

[CJSchneider]

I'm in no way saying that the only time you draft a QB is to replace the starter or that they didn't strike gold. They obviously did, and with Favre under center...well, if he had gotten hurt they probably would have just welded him back together. Given how good those other picks ended up being, I'm arguing that they didn't get full value on the trade in.

[king2am]

I'm arguing that they didn't get full value on the trade in.

Got it now. I'd agree, especially with Hasselbeck. But at least with trading those guys, they controlled where they went.

[CJSchneider]

I'll agree to some extent with that, despite Warner beating Green Bay in the play-offs in 02. Hind-site is always 20-20 though.

[CJSchneider]

Who is ready for mini-camp photos? (http://www.49ers.com/photos/index.php?level=collection&id=37)

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Good Alex Smith interview by Lowell Cohn:
http://blog.pressdemocrat.com/cohn/2009/05/alex-smith-talks-about-the-new-alex-smith.html

Smith: For me it's not blowing what this is out of proportion. It's playing quarterback. I'm going to do what I can to manage the game. I'm going to come out here every day and work my ass off. I'm going to bust my ass and I'm going to know this position better than anyone else. And when I'm out there when that guy's open I'm going to hit him. And when he's not then I'm going to get rid of the ball. I'm not going to sit here and dwell on completion percentage and QB rating and things like that which I did. I can tell you so much gets made out of freaking QB rating in this league. It's in your head. Like that freaking matters in the big picture. I'm here to try and put this team in a position to win and be accountable to my teammates. I haven't been accountable in two years now.


Cohn: How good a quarterback are you now and do you have an idea of how good you can be?

Smith: I'm trying to raise the bar, trying to raise my own personal bar and at the same time trying to help the 49er team raise the bar and that bar is commitment, it is play, it is my potential and I'm trying to raise all that and trying to achieve it. I know what I want to get to, the player I want to become it definitely is in my head. It's a motivator. I know I can play in this league right now. I know I can be successful. I know I can be a great player. That is in my head, no question. It has to be.

Cohn: You used the adjective great. Is that where your horizon is?

Smith: Yes. Yes. No question. I think without a doubt, it's something I firmly believe. It's just a matter of time. I'm going to make it happen,

I hope he can carry this attitude onto the field.

[Brent]

Those new helmets make my so happy. I love the new uniforms.

Really hoping this guy can turn his short career around:
http://www.49ers.com/photos/images/2009_minicamp/rookie_minicamp_saturday/jaymoore.jpg


Same with this fool...
http://www.49ers.com/photos/images/2009_minicamp/rookie_minicamp_saturday/alexsmith.jpg

[Brent]

You know what it sounds like, as I read what Alex says? It sounds like he's growing up. It's crazy to think he's barely older than I am. I could never imagine all that pressure he had put on him since he was drafted.

[CJSchneider]

I actually miss the insignia on the side of the helmet. I guess it's going to have to grow on me.

[Brent]

I actually miss the insignia on the side of the helmet. I guess it's going to have to grow on me.
the insignia is going to be there, they just dont bother with the stickers this early in the year

http://www.49ers.com/photos/images/2009_draft/uniform_unveiling___draft_party/newhelmets.jpg

[CJSchneider]

What? No training camp "Stick" marks!

[Menardo75]

I really like all of that sounds like there is some fire there finally.

[Madirishman]

What? No training camp "Stick" marks!

I believe the rookies have them.

[Madirishman]

That's why it was worth keeping him around. You could tell that he had a good skill set coming out of college, but from what I've seen, he lacks that "born leader" factor, and may not even be an "A Type" personality player. If guys don't see you as a leader, they don't play as hard; they don't make the extra effort.

I hope he can convince his teammates that he's a leader and will take charge in the huddle. which is something that Shaun Hill has on him right now. The team plays harder for Shaun cause they see him as more of a leader.

[king2am]

He's definitely more mature now. I mean, he'll be 25 in three days, he was still just a kid trying to play a man's game. I really believe Shaun has earned the right to be the quarterback, but I aslo believe that Alex can be a pro bowl quarterback.

[Madirishman]

We'll see what happens. Shaun is definitely more proven at this point but Alex still has more upside, especially due to his athletic ability and youth.

[farfromforgotten]

Best of luck to Alex. Though, I'm more interested in seeing it on the field than I am hearing about it.

[Borat]

Smells like the same ****, just a different year.

[Brent]

No one had the new stickers on their helmets during minicamp, I imagine because the uniforms are so new that they are waiting for all the stuff to arrive to the equipment staff. Besides, it's not really necessary until the preseason.

[Madirishman]

In recent years, they haven't had the stickers on the helmets in mini camps either. It's kind of like the mentality that they have to "earn" their logo. I like the idea and is one of the things that Nolan did that I thought was a real positive.

[Brent]

Funny you two should say that and then Maiocco has this blog posting http://blog.pressdemocrat.com/49ers/2009/05/no-excuses-the-simple-answer-why-alex-smith-has-not-produced.html

[Madirishman]

From that blog:

I saw more receiving ability from rookie tight end Bear Pascoe in two practices than I saw from Billy Bajema, the man he's replacing, in four seasons. Pascoe first duty with the 49ers is to be a blocking specialist. Depending on what happens down the road with Vernon Davis, he might be the every-down guy in a year or two.

I like this. A true all-around TE. He's a fan favorite waiting to happen.

[Menardo75]

It's already happened for me.

[CJSchneider]

For the record, Menardo and I picked him in the final forum mock. Looks like we can spot a winner when we see one.

[YAYareaRB]

All Bear has to do now is just nail a couple of people into the turf and he'll definitely be a fan favorite.

[Brent]

Looking at people's 2010 mocks and various people's prediction of their team's record, not many people think we're going to beat them. Hell, I even saw a Lion's fan who has us pegged as a win, when they're playing us at home!

[HawkeyeFan]

As a Rams fan this kills me, but I'm scared of you guys next year. Arizona and Seattle don't scare me, but you guys do..

WHY!?!?

[Brent]

Until I see them play a game, I remain skeptical that we'll do better than 7-9 but I certainly hope they exceed those expectations.

[HawkeyeFan]

Predictions for the NFC West:
San Fran 10 - 6
St. Louis 9 - 7 (Wildcard)
Arizona 7 - 9
Seattle 4 - 12

[locseti]

I actually miss the insignia on the side of the helmet. I guess it's going to have to grow on me.

That was funny, the Niners definitely have a shot at the West this year.

[CJSchneider]

All Bear has to do now is just nail a couple of people into the turf and he'll definitely be a fan favorite.

Oh, it's gonna happen!

[farfromforgotten]

As a Rams fan this kills me, but I'm scared of you guys next year. Arizona and Seattle don't scare me, but you guys do..

WHY!?!?

lol. I wouldnt be too worried until you actually see us on the field. Give us 3 or 4 games and we'll see if your fear is well founded or if this will just be another disappointing year for us.

I think we are headed in the right direction though, as usual, a lot will be riding on what kind of play we get from the QB position. Oh, and I consider anything worse than 9-7 to be a disappointing season.

[Menardo75]

Of course it is :)

[Menardo75]

Predictions for the NFC West:
San Fran 10 - 6
St. Louis 9 - 7 (Wildcard)
Arizona 7 - 9
Seattle 4 - 12

I like this guy.

[HawkeyeFan]

I like this guy.
It's just an honest assessment.

- Potentially good QB
- Great Running Back
- Unlimited potential in the recieving core.
- Good tight end
- Decent Offensive Line
- Decent Defensive Line
- Great LB core
- Good Defensive Backfield.

That'll make a fine 10 - 6 team, in 2010, we could be talking potentially a Super Bowl.

[Madirishman]

Damn, I'm ready for the season to start!

[Madirishman]

It's just an honest assessment.

- Potentially good QB
- Great Running Back
- Unlimited potential in the recieving core.
- Good tight end
- Decent Offensive Line
- Decent Defensive Line
- Great LB core
- Good Defensive Backfield.

That'll make a fine 10 - 6 team, in 2010, we could be talking potentially a Super Bowl.

Cash your Niners chips in while your stock is high my good man! Or switch your sig and we'll take you in (so long as you keep up with these great predictions). Thanks for the input. :)

[Menardo75]

It's just an honest assessment.

- Potentially good QB
- Great Running Back
- Unlimited potential in the recieving core.
- Good tight end
- Decent Offensive Line
- Decent Defensive Line
- Great LB core
- Good Defensive Backfield.

That'll make a fine 10 - 6 team, in 2010, we could be talking potentially a Super Bowl.

I really like this guy.

[Menardo75]

I was before the draft even came.

[Borat]

Hahah. Yeah, if HawkeyeFan keeps dropping Super Bowl aspirations on us, he can hang out in here anytime he wants.

[YAYareaRB]

I was ready to start this season when JTO was named the starter.

[YAYareaRB]

HawkeyeFan you have a Niner Hood Pass..

[CJSchneider]

I see what you did there. :)

[CJSchneider]

http://www.virginmedia.com/images/darth-vader-400x300.jpg

Join us HawkeyeFan.

[YAYareaRB]

I see what you did there. :)

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/100/299004021_06710e2c2e.jpg

[CJSchneider]

As I bust out laughing, my wife asks me wtf is so funny. She looks over my shoulder, sees that images and shakes her head in disgust.
She's sooooooooooo immature.

[HawkeyeFan]

Haha, thanks guys.

I don't know why everyone else dogs on you, they're all on the Cardinals nest. Psh, they'll have Super Bowl hangover.

[YAYareaRB]

As I bust out laughing, my wife asks me wtf is so funny. She looks over my shoulder, sees that images and shakes her head in disgust.
She's sooooooooooo immature.

hahaha obviously! :p

[YAYareaRB]

Your sig is sick as well.

But I think it's the whole Shaun Hill thing. EVERYONE else OBVIOUSLY has franchise QB and since Shaun Hill doesn't put up great numbers and our QB's have had 5 OC's in 5 years, we have no chance.. ever.

[HawkeyeFan]

Your sig is sick as well.

But I think it's the whole Shaun Hill thing. EVERYONE else OBVIOUSLY has franchise QB and since Shaun Hill doesn't put up great numbers and our QB's have had 5 OC's in 5 years, we have no chance.. ever.
Not necessarily. Shaun Hill started playing Week 8? And he had 13 TDs and 8 interceptions and 2,046 yards. That's not bad, add on 8 more games that's 26 Touchdowns and 16 interceptions with 4,100 yards. That's not bad. And now you add Crabtree, and improved Offensive Line, it's going really help him out. And not every team needs a Franchise Quarterback to win in this league, you guys have a Franchise Running Back, that's good enough.

Look where the Titans finished, not in the Super Bowl but it was destined to be there year, with Kerry Collins, who is FAR from a Franchise Quarterback, the Cardinals, with Warner, who isn't a Franchise QB any more. Even the Falcons, yeah, Ryan is better than Hill, but Gore is better than Turner. And I believe the 49rs have more talent than Atlanta, and you guys have to play a weaker division (Arizona, us, and Seattle) twice a year, that's atleast 4 or 5 wins (except us :)), it shouldn't be a complete problem to win 5 or 6 more games for you.

Thanks for the sig compliment!

[Borat]

Dammit Hawkeye, you're making it difficult for me to hate the Rams ;)

[YAYareaRB]

Dammit Hawkeye, you're making it difficult for me to hate the Rams ;)

nfrillman used to grind my gears!

[HawkeyeFan]

Dammit Hawkeye, you're making it difficult for me to hate the Rams ;)
Honesty is key to success. I'm just being honest :)

And I don't hate any teams in our division, unless it's game day.

[YAYareaRB]

I must say.. I hate the Seahawks

[HawkeyeFan]

I must say.. I hate the Seahawks
Damn, I'm officially a hyprocrite, I hate Seattle with a passion.

[Brent]

We all hate the seagulls.

[dan77733]

I know everyone here hates T.O. but since everyone here also hates the Seahawks, think back to 2002 when T.O. signed the football with a sharpie after scoring a TD and giving the ball to his agent.

That was awesome.

[Menardo75]

I really hate the Seahawks since everyone in my area is a Seahawk fan, and they are all annoying.

[abaddon41_80]

I'm gone for a day and come back to a Rams-49ers love fest? I am extremely disappointed in all of you. Rams suck, Go Niners!

j/k

[YAYareaRB]

I hate SEATTLE. I hated the Sonics, I hate the Seahawks, I hate UW, except for my best friend who starts MLB for them.

[CJSchneider]

I like Washington State's mascot only because that was my HS mascot.

[Brent]

You know, I never hated the Seahawks until they joined the NFC when they rearranged the teams. Before that, they were lovable losers.

[YAYareaRB]

I really hate them because this season and gpngc

[goonie61]

I also hate the Seahawks. But I love TO!! c'mon he is a baller??

And there is no way the Rams have a winning record this year

[FG4prez]

players discuss the hill
http://www.49ers.com/pressbox/news_detail.php?PRKey=5286&section=PR%20News

[CJSchneider]

God I love Coach Singletary!

Edit: You know we have the only active coach in the HOF!

[Brent]

was that a Juggernaut ***** reference?

[Brent]

I'll agree to some extent with that, despite Warner beating Green Bay in the play-offs in 02. Hind-site is always 20-20 though.
That's kind of the thing in this, though. How did they know that those guys were going to be as good as they thought or whatever? They had no idea how long Favre was going to play at that level so they brought in back ups. Realized that they could get value and just take another guy, and did it.

[Brent]

players discuss the hill
http://www.49ers.com/pressbox/news_detail.php?PRKey=5286&section=PR%20News

"So this is definitely the hardest offseason program I’ve been through."
-Justin Smith

I love that.

[CJSchneider]

Coach Singletary wakes up in the morning and pisses excellence.

[Brent]

Coach Singletary wakes up in the morning and pisses excellence.
Reading about that hill makes me want to do football conditioning drills again haha.

[YAYareaRB]

I bet its nothing to the sand hill we used to run in HS.

[CJSchneider]

Thus my statement and original implication - Yes, they struck gold, but it didn't make it into their bank.

[CJSchneider]

I bet its nothing to the sand hill we used to run in HS.

Ft. Knox, KY - "Agony and Misery" > all.

[HawkeyeFan]

Is this not the best match up to watch next season?

http://assets.espn.go.com/photo/2008/0616/nfl_g_sjax_580.jpg

vs

http://static.nfl.com/static/content/catch_all/nfl_image/Patrick-Willis-250x250.jpg

[Brent]

Ft. Knox, KY - "Agony and Misery" > all.
Pics or it isnt real!

[dan77733]

I read an interview Jerry Rice had a while back and it said that he would run on a mountain that was two and a half miles uphill and that with the exception of Owens, there was no one that ever completed running up the hill.

I know the Rice part is true but is the T.O. part true or just bullcrap?

[TitleTown088]

Coach Singletary wakes up in the morning and pisses excellence.

I feel like there's a joke to be had in there somewhere...


This may be a stupid thought but...I was thinking of the 90's rivalry between our two storied franchises. I'd like to recreate that rivalry on this board somehow. No idea yet, but I want to do something so I can personally get you SOBs back for Jerry's non-fumble.

[Brent]

This may be a stupid thought but...I was thinking of the 90's rivalry between our two storied franchises. I'd like to recreate that rivalry on this board somehow. No idea yet, but I want to do something so I can personally get you SOBs back for Jerry's non-fumble.
It was an 80's rivalry, as we were beating you guys on the way to Super Bowls.

Remember?

DKl1vrFzJ6o

You know, everyone thought they were a finesse team that couldnt handle the cold so they beat the **** out of the Bears?

[TitleTown088]

It was an 80's rivalry, as we were beating you guys on the way to Super Bowls.

Remember?

DKl1vrFzJ6o

You know, everyone thought they were a finesse team that couldnt handle the cold so they beat the **** out of the Bears?
What in the hell are you talking about? The Bears? Have you been drinking?

[Borat]

What in the hell are you talking about? The Bears? Have you been drinking?

Brent, he's a Green Bay fan.

And no, we really didn't have much of a rivalry. You pretty much beat our ass most games. We should have won that Monday Nighter though. BS whiteboy Don Beebe was down dammit!

[TitleTown088]

Brent confused me for a bear fan? I'm thoroughly and genuinely embarrassed. I have failed at life.

It was a mini rivalry. Lord Favre was just too hot to handle. Don't even talk to me about being down, Jerry was the one who was NOT down!

[Brent]

Brent, he's a Green Bay fan.
I'm aware. I'm being a jackass.

[Borat]

Brent confused me for a bear fan? I'm thoroughly and genuinely embarrassed. I have failed at life.

It was a mini rivalry. Lord Favre was just too hot to handle. Don't even talk to me about being down, Jerry was the one who was NOT down!

Yeah, we got away with that one for sure.

I remember being super wasted that Monday night though and me and my boys just demolished a bunch of furniture after we lost. I had Jager-rage. Even broke some chick's dishes.

[TitleTown088]

Yeah, we got away with that one for sure.

I remember being super wasted that Monday night though and me and my boys just demolished a bunch of furniture after we lost. I had Jager-rage. Even broke some chick's dishes.
Haha, riot.


It wasn't about Rodney King...

[Brent]

IzThn8pkpC0

"OWENS! OWENS! OWENS! OWENS! OWENS!"

[TitleTown088]

Exactly. That BS play never should have happened, Bro Montana.

[Brent]

Thanks to those 90's games, I still harbor the most insatiable hate for Brett Favre. Like, to the point where I cant hear him speak, see his face or hear someone talk about him, without wanting to punch the wall. And all this talk about him these past two-three off-seasons is enough to cause an aneurysm.

[TitleTown088]

I still love him but I shouldn't be complaining about calls in games. It's poor sports and I hate when others do it.

[Brent]

I still love him but I shouldn't be complaining about calls in games. It's poor sports and I hate when others do it.
I would love nothing more (assuming he's playing for the Vikings) for Patrick Willis to de-cleat him this season, like he did to Brad Smith last season.

[Borat]

I hated playing GB in the 90s. You guys almost always dominated our defense. And we had the No. 1 D one of those years and you still punked us. At least we got some good wins in against Dallas.

[CJSchneider]

I would love nothing more (assuming he's playing for the Vikings) for Patrick Willis to de-cleat him this season, like he did to Brad Smith last season.

Watching him de-cleat anyone is full of win though :)

[Madirishman]

LMAO - Some good quotes fellas.

"Jager rage" and "Singletary....pisses excellence" are great!

[dan77733]

I hated playing GB in the 90s. You guys almost always dominated our defense. And we had the No. 1 D one of those years and you still punked us. At least we got some good wins in against Dallas.

Me too. I still remember when GB needed a 3rd down conversion and EVERY time, I would say cover Freeman in the slot over the middle, they wouldnt and just guess what happened. Every damn time, Favre and Freeman would run that play even when you knew it was coming and we never stopped them. UGH.

I hated the Packers more than I hated the Cowboys back then.

[YAYareaRB]

Courtesy of Prowler's sig:

Lions 2009 Record 5-11, 4-4 Home
Projected Victims(week):
Vikings(2), Redskins(3), St. Louis(8), Cleveland(11), @49ers(16)

I would think they would be the last team calling other teams victims lol

[Madirishman]

The Lions 2nd year RB Kevin Smith just predicted they'd make the playoffs!

PLAYOFFS?!? PLAYOFFS?!?!? YOU KIDDIN ME?!?!

[Borat]

Well, when you're looking at the future schedule, any time you see a team that isn't a powerhouse, you're going to figure that will be a win for your team. That's just human nature really. I ain't worried about Detroit. We dominate them.

[Brent]

**** the preseason predictions. Games count on the field. Just reminds me of Steven "2500 yds All Purpose" Jackson and Jon "Playoffs" Kitna.

[TitleTown088]

I hated playing GB in the 90s. You guys almost always dominated our defense. And we had the No. 1 D one of those years and you still punked us. At least we got some good wins in against Dallas.
Didn't the Packers have the #1 ranked D in 96 and 97?

[CJSchneider]

PLAYOFFS?!? PLAYOFFS?!?!? YOU KIDDIN ME?!?!

p3-eavMSBnk

[Menardo75]

1 @ Arizona 4:15 PM L
2 Seattle 4:05 PM W
3 @ Minnesota 1:00 PM W
4 St. Louis 4:15 PM L
5 Atlanta 4:05 PM W
7 @ Houston 1:00 PM L
8 @ Indianapolis 1:00 PM L
9 Tennessee 4:15 PM W
10 Chicago 8:20 PM W
11 @ Green Bay 1:00 PM L
12 Jacksonville 4:05 PM W
13 @ Seattle 4:15 PM W
14 Arizona 8:30 PM W
15 @ Philadelphia 1:00 PM W
16 Detroit 4:05 PM W
17 @ St. Louis 1:00PM L


10-6

[Madirishman]

1 @ Arizona 4:15 PM L
2 Seattle 4:05 PM W
3 @ Minnesota 1:00 PM W
4 St. Louis 4:15 PM L
5 Atlanta 4:05 PM W
7 @ Houston 1:00 PM L
8 @ Indianapolis 1:00 PM L
9 Tennessee 4:15 PM W
10 Chicago 8:20 PM W
11 @ Green Bay 1:00 PM L
12 Jacksonville 4:05 PM W
13 @ Seattle 4:15 PM W
14 Arizona 8:30 PM W
15 @ Philadelphia 1:00 PM W
16 Detroit 4:05 PM W
17 @ St. Louis 1:00PM L


10-6

You think the Niners will lose to the Rams twice but will beat Philly on the road?! Interesting.

[YAYareaRB]

Yeah I definitely don't see the rams beating us once.

[Menardo75]

You think the Niners will lose to the Rams twice but will beat Philly on the road?! Interesting.

Ever since Singletary has come on the staff the rotation has gone, sweep the Rams split with the Cards swept by Seahawks, sweep Seahawks split with the Rams swept by Cards, and the rotation just keeps going through. So it's our turn this year to sweep Seattle, and have the Rams sweep us.

[YAYareaRB]

I say we sweep Seattle and sweep the Cardinals BOTH!

[JFLO]

1 @ Arizona 4:15 PM Loss
2 Seattle 4:05 PM Win
3 @ Minnesota 1:00 PM Loss
4 St. Louis 4:15 PM Win
5 Atlanta 4:05 PM Loss
7 @ Houston 1:00 PM Loss
8 @ Indianapolis 1:00 PM Loss
9 Tennessee 4:15 PM Win
10 Chicago 8:20 PM Win
11 @ Green Bay 1:00 PM Loss
12 Jacksonville 4:05 PM Win
13 @ Seattle 4:15 PM Loss
14 Arizona 8:30 PM Loss
15 @ Philadelphia 1:00 PM Loss
16 Detroit 4:05 PM Win
17 @ St. Louis 1:00PM Win

I got 7-9

[Brent]

I expect 7-10 wins but, at this point, dont know who against any more.

[Madirishman]

I expect 7-10 wins but, at this point, dont know who against any more.

I second this. Anything out of that range would be a huge surprise or disappointment.

[LizardState]

That's why it was worth keeping him around. You could tell that he had a good skill set coming out of college, but from what I've seen, he lacks that "born leader" factor, and may not even be an "A Type" personality player. If guys don't see you as a leader, they don't play as hard; they don't make the extra effort.

I hope he can convince his teammates that he's a leader and will take charge in the huddle. which is something that Shaun Hill has on him right now. The team plays harder for Shaun cause they see him as more of a leader.

Actually the reason given by the now defunct Nolan regime for drafting Smith #1 overall vs. local fave Aaron Rodgers from Cal was that Smith showed better leadership skills. Rodgers had the better arm, both had that "system QB" knock from college, & Rodgers dropped to #24 taken in the 1st rd. & waited interminably behind Favre for his f*ckups to catch up to him (note Favre's setting the career INT rcd.) while Smith got 24M guaranteed $, hindsight is 20/20, go figure.....

[Madirishman]

Actually the reason given by the now defunct Nolan regime for drafting Smith #1 overall vs. local fave Aaron Rodgers from Cal was that Smith showed better leadership skills. Rodgers had the better arm, both had that "system QB" knock from college, & Rodgers dropped to #24 taken in the 1st rd. & waited interminably behind Favre for his f*ckups to catch up to him (note Favre's setting the career INT rcd.) while Smith got 24M guaranteed $, hindsight is 20/20, go figure.....

Rodgers was put in a much better position, with a better chance to succeed than Smith. You can't assume that Smith was the wrong pick and Rodgers was the right one because of what happened. Also, given the same circumstances as Rodgers, Smith may have done better. Due to Alex's injuries the last couple years and Rodgers having one good season (in which he couldn't lead his team to the playoffs) the jury is till out on both IMO.

I was commenting on Alex's leadership skills NOW, not back when Nolan & Co. drafted him in '05. I paid very close attention to that draft, and Alex seemed much more confident during the Draft process, had graduated early (3 years) suggesting that he could digest a playbook, etc. Rodgers stance while holding the ball was put into question and he was rumored as giving a hometown discount. I gave the slight advantage to Alex when considering who I would take at QB if it was my call.

[BandwagonPunditry]

I don't think Rodgers would have done much differently had he come here. The issue wasn't the talent of the quarterback it was the woeful supporting cast we gave him. Sub-standard WRs and a joke of an O-line stunted Smith's development and led directly to his injuries. In similar circumstances I think most rookie, or even experienced QBs would struggle. We should have sat him for a year to hone his skills whilst we built a better line and WR corps.

On another note...Mike Holmgren has apparently decided he's ready to work again. Cue Dan.

[Brent]

I don't think Rodgers would have done much differently had he come here. The issue wasn't the talent of the quarterback it was the woeful supporting cast we gave him. Sub-standard WRs and a joke of an O-line stunted Smith's development and led directly to his injuries. In similar circumstances I think most rookie, or even experienced QBs would struggle. We should have sat him for a year to hone his skills whilst we built a better line and WR corps.
Not to mention that Rodgers has had only one playbook since 2006.

[Borat]

I'm so tired of the Alexcuses. None of the issues that ever get stated have anything to do with the fact that he never improved on his mechanics. Just look at him throwing the ball. His feet are awful. He throws off his back foot all the time and as a result of his bad mechanics, his accuracy suffers bigtime. Shaun Hill is a fairly "ugly" QB, but he delivers an accurate ball and voila, we actually move the ball down the field. You can't assume that Rogers would have been as incapable as Alex in improving his mechanics.

[king2am]

I'm so tired of the Alexcuses. None of the issues that ever get stated have anything to do with the fact that he never improved on his mechanics. Just look at him throwing the ball. His feet are awful. He throws off his back foot all the time and as a result of his bad mechanics, his accuracy suffers bigtime. Shaun Hill is a fairly "ugly" QB, but he delivers an accurate ball and voila, we actually move the ball down the field. You can't assume that Rogers would have been as incapable as Alex in improving his mechanics.

His mechanics have been an issue. True.

If he had flawless mechanics he would have been able to overcome different coordinators, a subpar supporting cast, and ultimately would have been successful. False.

[Borat]

His mechanics have been an issue. True.

If he had flawless mechanics he would have been able to overcome different coordinators, a subpar supporting cast, and ultimately would have been successful. False.

You mean the same "different coordinators and subpar supporting cast" that Shaun Hill has overcome?

[Brent]

You mean the same "different coordinators and subpar supporting cast" that Shaun Hill has overcome?
This isnt a defense of Alex, but, the supporting cast wasnt bad last year.

[Madirishman]

This isnt a defense of Alex, but, the supporting cast wasnt bad last year.

80% of Isaac Bruce is better than any receiver on the roster for the Niners since TO.

[LizardState]

On another note...Mike Holmgren has apparently decided he's ready to work again. Cue Dan.

Holmgren dogged the 9ers HC job for yrs. like it was his personal Holy Grail -- he's from Ess Eff & left his heart there like the song says. ESPN said today he would like to work in some team's front office -- good call from Mr. Punditry here -- I can see him as a special consultant to McCloghan if they can persuade the Yorks to sign off on it.

At least they wouldn't have any more D-minus-grade drafts & improve the o-line, something Holmgren did well in both Green Bay & Seattle. C'mon home, Mike, your city is calling!

[king2am]

You mean the same "different coordinators and subpar supporting cast" that Shaun Hill has overcome?

Learning an offense in the offseason and starting day is more difficult than learning an offense and starting mid season, or in the case of his first stint, the end of the season.

[Borat]

Or he could just work on his ******* mechanics all ******* year long. Seriously, did he ever look at film of himself? There is no way in hell, a competent QB could look at Alex throwing the ball and not notice the awful footwork.

But whatever. People can keep making up excuses for him and he'll continue to ignore the true problems.

[Madirishman]

If Alex's problems hinges on his bad mechanics, then why hasn't he been better coached? The kid isn't an idiot, and at this point, he shouldn't have an ego that would get in the way of him learning something to make him better. Just like a hitting coach in baseball, coaches should break it down with Alex, having hm work on improving his footwork, throwing motion, etc. Wouldn't that make him progress better than doing more of the same; practicing standard pass plays in practice, and overthrowing guys?

[YAYareaRB]

If Alex's problems hinges on his bad mechanics, then why hasn't he been better coached? The kid isn't an idiot, and at this point, he shouldn't have an ego that would get in the way of him learning something to make him better. Just like a hitting coach in baseball, coaches should break it down with Alex, having hm work on improving his footwork, throwing motion, etc. Wouldn't that make him progress better than doing more of the same; practicing standard pass plays in practice, and overthrowing guys?

He has been better coached.. see Norv Turner

[Brent]

jUYUaTwfmSk

I saw this while browsing youtube and it got me excited for the season to start.

[Madirishman]

He has been better coached.. see Norv Turner

And he responded. So why has he seemingly regressed?

[YAYareaRB]

And he responded. So why has he seemingly regressed?

That year.. His mechanics were making progress. Exit Turner.. Enter Hostetler. Hostetler wasn't as hard on mechanics as he was trying to live up to Norv's standard. One and done. Enter Mike Martz. Mike Martz is all about mechanics. the Martz Mechanics. Not necessarily a bad thing but his mechanics and that of Norv Turner are contradicting if you look at Norv's past QB pupils and that of Martz. Now you tell me if you were a guy, who had questionable mechanics from the get go, would your mechanics regress or progress under this situation.

[dan77733]

The loss of Turner, getting injured and having Nolan mismanage his injury is what has caused him to regress because you have to wonder how he would have played if Turner never left and if he never got injured to begin with.

[Madirishman]

Once Turner worked with his mechanics, and he was improving, you think that a smart kid like him could just keep it up, getting better. It's nice to be coached up more and more, but once he learned, I'd like to think that Alex could maintain some of the basic fundamentals he had improved on, such as not throwing off his back foot.

Alex's accuracy seems to be the biggest issue, and what keeps him from being consistent. He often overthrows players, and was even doing that when Nolan played him through the shoulder injury.

[thediggler3030]

I really like this scenario:

http://www.fantasyfootballjungle.com/articles/index.php?id=651

Would love the panther's pick being somewhere between 10 and 15. And if ours could be in the early to mid 20s as well I would be ecstatic.

I'm hoping we grab the best defensive player available with our first pick, this mock its Sergio Kindle, and then the best OT with the later pick.

I would be very happy with that draft :D

Of course this all depends on how the QB situation works out.

[49ersfan_87]

McKilla and Francois signed contracts today...the 2nd and 3rd draft picks to sign their contracts after Stafford.

http://www.49ers.com/pressbox/news_detail.php?PRKey=5301&section=PR%20News

The San Francisco 49ers announced today that they have signed fifth-round draft choice LB Scott McKillop and seventh-round draft choice DE Ricky Jean-Francois to four-year contracts. The players become the second and third 2009 draft picks to sign contracts with their NFL teams this offseason. Lions QB Matthew Stafford signed his contract prior to the start of the draft.

[Brent]

They also seem to think we're going to win the division.

[Madirishman]

Good. I'm hoping we can get Crabs signed quickly without any BS as well. That was my only issue with drafting him; that he thought he'd go higher so his agents would want more. Kind of like what Reggie Bush did a couple years ago when he dropped only 1 slot.

[Madirishman]

Also, both guys signed 4 year contracts, which isn't too normal for later round picks. They must be pretty high on Jean-Francois, or didn't offer him much guaranteed money. This could also be another sign that Ray McDonald's days are numbered.

[Menardo75]

Also, both guys signed 4 year contracts, which isn't too normal for later round picks. They must be pretty high on Jean-Francois, or didn't offer him much guaranteed money. This could also be another sign that Ray McDonald's days are numbered.

Makes you wonder if his injury is that serious. This is great news Crabs probably won't be signed for a while, but hopefully it won't be a serious issue.

[Menardo75]

They also seem to think we're going to win the division.

Why shouldn't they :)

[phlysac]

Makes you wonder if his injury is that serious.

It's his 3rd ACL injury on the same knee in just over 3 years. It's serious.

[YAYareaRB]

I thought Ray McDonald was pretty good though.

[Menardo75]

I thought Ray McDonald was pretty good though.

He is but lets not forget that RJF is a first day talent so they could also be signing him for that reason.

[CJSchneider]

He is but lets not forget that RJF is a first day talent so they could also be signing him for that reason.

Very true. someone is going to look like a genius when RJF is tearing it up and he was signed to 7th round pick money for 4 years.

[Madirishman]

Very true. someone is going to look like a genius when RJF is tearing it up and he was signed to 7th round pick money for 4 years.

Correct! I wonder if there was any guaranteed money on the deal?

[YAYareaRB]

Hmmm. Imagine if RJF only showed up in playoff games like how he only showed up in the NC in college lol

[BandwagonPunditry]

Very true. someone is going to look like a genius when RJF is tearing it up and he was signed to 7th round pick money for 4 years.

...until he holds out and screws us. :P

[Ness]

And he responded. So why has he seemingly regressed?

Because he has been seriously injured the past two seasons. He's still the same player and was improving. But he has been throwing injured. We all saw how much pain he was in during 2007 when he was basically forced to throw with his injury and his arm was definitely not the same pre injury.

[king2am]

...until he holds out and screws us. :P

My exact thought.

[thediggler3030]

They also seem to think we're going to win the division.

I mean, its the NFC West. We easily could lol.

[abaddon41_80]

You know what it amazing? This topic has 5 pages before the 2009-2010 season has even started.

[Madirishman]

My exact thought.

Better problem to have than him sucking. It will be great when he outplays his crappy contract.....that means he's EARNING his money!

[farfromforgotten]

My exact thought.

And mine also, but as Irish said, atleast it will mean that he worked hard for it and earned a new contract. Nothing wrong with that.

[CJSchneider]

Yeah, I have no problem rewarding someone for a job well done.

[49ersfan_87]

We still have $25 million in cap space (not counting the extra $1 mil the league added)

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/16/cap-space-as-of-may-15-2009/

(http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/16/cap-space-as-of-may-15-2009/#)San Francisco 49ershttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/16/cap-space-as-of-may-15-2009/#) $25.4 million.

I'm liking what our FO is doing. 2 1st round picks and top 4 in the NFL for cap room? Great job done by McCloughan and Marathe this offseason.

[CJSchneider]

Wow, we should be able to make some huge moves on Free agents next year that is for sure.

[YAYareaRB]

What is your guys' thoughts on Julius Peppers?

[Madirishman]

Wow, we should be able to make some huge moves on Free agents next year that is for sure.

A lot of teams might be able to so as well if it's an uncapped year. :(

[dan77733]

Like a few years ago, I dont see an uncapped year happening. Everything is going great for the NFL, Owners and Players and quite simply, there's no reason to take a chance screwing it all up. I also think that if necessary, Goodell will push back the start of the 2010 league year to ensure a deal gets done like he did in 2006.

Anyway, I dont know who'll be free agents in 2010 but as of right now, im actually more pumped up with the two first rounders. Yeah, I didnt like it at first but after thinking about it, they can be used to move up, trade for a young player who wants to move on (like Jason Peters) or just get two starters right off the bat.

As for Peppers, no thanks. Haralson just turned 25 in January and Lawson turns 25 in July. Peppers turned 29 in January. I dont want to see us trade away a minimum of a first rounder plus have to give him a huge contract. We just signed Haralson to an extension and im guessing that Lawson will soon follow especially if he bounces back this year as he should finally be healthy from his IR 2007 season.

Just my opinion.

[Brent]

A lot of teams might be able to so as well if it's an uncapped year. :(
Actually, the way that uncapped thing works for FA is that the better your team finishes, the less you can spend on FAs.

[Madirishman]

Actually, the way that uncapped thing works for FA is that the better your team finishes, the less you can spend on FAs.

So hopefully the Niners will be SCREWED by this after their monster season! :)

[YAYareaRB]

Curtis Taylor Signed..

"49ers signed seventh-round S Curtis Taylor to a four-year, $1.8 million contract. The deal includes a $59,880 signing bonus.
Taylor, who replaced LaRon Landry as LSU's free safety in his junior year, has intriguing size at 6'3/204, but battled inconsistency and injuries in college. He'll likely focus on special teams if he makes the Niners' roster."

via Matt Maiocco's twitter.

[Madirishman]

A 60k signing bonus is not a salary cap influencing number. I like it. ;)

Also, ESPN rumors have the Niners signing Plaxico. I think they have too many WRs as it is. Probably BS.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Curtis Taylor Signed..

"49ers signed seventh-round S Curtis Taylor to a four-year, $1.8 million contract. The deal includes a $59,880 signing bonus.
Taylor, who replaced LaRon Landry as LSU's free safety in his junior year, has intriguing size at 6'3/204, but battled inconsistency and injuries in college. He'll likely focus on special teams if he makes the Niners' roster."

via Matt Maiocco's twitter.

Marathe is hammering out deals. 49ers: 3, Rest of the League: 1.

Also Jimmy Williams cut:
Niners waive DB Jimmy Williams, whom the club signed a couple months ago. He was out of the league in '09.
about 3 hours ago from txt

Was talking to my brother last night and we both thought he had a good shot to make the roster. Probably showed up out shape to OTA's today.

Also is it sad that I am excited that today is the first day of OTAs?

[Madirishman]

Damn...Jimmy Williams....I though he had a shot. What a waste of talent and potential. Have fun with the Raiders!

[Menardo75]

A 60k signing bonus is not a salary cap influencing number. I like it. ;)

Also, ESPN rumors have the Niners signing Plaxico. I think they have too many WRs as it is. Probably BS.

Highly doubtful

[Brent]

I would not want Plexiglass "I dont practice" Burress on the Niners.

[CJSchneider]

Please Jesus, I hope we don't.

[farfromforgotten]

Also, ESPN rumors have the Niners signing Plaxico. I think they have too many WRs as it is. Probably BS.

No no no. I would like our young WRs to be influenced by a classy guy like Isaac Bruce, not a punk like Plaxico Burress. Crabtree doesnt need someone like Burress rubbing off on him. Neither do Morgan or Hill for that matter.

[CJSchneider]

My dog doesn't need someone like Burress rubbing off on him.

[Madirishman]

My dog doesn't need someone like Burress rubbing off on him.

I'm sure you'd want Vick to stay away as well then.