San Francisco 49ers Discussion

[Ness]

Here some other older games I've uploaded to my YouTube account in case you are interested. Both are from the 1994 season.

San Francisco 49ers at Atlanta Falcons 1994 Week 7

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Los Angeles Rams at San Francisco 49ers 1994 Week 12 Part 1

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Los Angeles Rams at San Francisco 49ers 1994 Week 12 Part 2

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[Ness]

Oh and if you want to watch last night's preseason game again, it's on my channel for a couple of days. Be warned though that it won't remain there for long and it's also the Vikings broadcasting network, so the commentators are going to focus more on the Vikings franchise. If that doesn't bother you feel free to watch.

Part 1:

eofs1DlQWkU

Part 2:

Ej3F9v2vMGQ

[phlysac]

including Byham, will have an uphill battle to make the 53, and Nate will likely end up on the P-Squad.
Sadly, Nate Byham isn't eligible for the Practice Squad.

Anyone notice that AJ Jenkins looked kind of small out there? I thought his build was a little bit stockier. Maybe it's just me.
One of A.J. Jenkins' biggest knocks coming out was his thin frame and perceived lack of strength.

[Ness]

Well hopefully Jenkins can use this year to bulk up and improve his strength.

[Brent]

Watching the game again (btw, thanks Ness), I hope we can manage to keep some of those rookie WRs around. Palmer and Owusu looked good out there.

[phlysac]

Can anyone comment on how Kilgore played

I've only re-watched the 1st half thus far.

Can someone verify what I saw... Kilgore had 2 pancake blocks and a 3rd time he knocked his man to the ground twice.

That aside, it's difficult to assess because I have no idea what his blocking assignments are. What I see is that he dominates when he is asked to move his man one side or the other. He didn't drive men off the ball per se. Often his man would pick a gap and he would simply ride that player's momentum out of the play. I only saw him shrugged off and ineffective on 1-snap.

Is he close to challenging Goodwin? I'm not making that call. But what I see doesn't obviously scream that he'd be a major downgrade should he go against the ones.

[Madirishman]

Sadly, Nate Byham isn't eligible for the Practice Squad.


One of A.J. Jenkins' biggest knocks coming out was his thin frame and perceived lack of strength.


Byham's not? I thought I read an article somewhat recently from Maiocco where he mentioned that Byham did still have practice squad eligibility. If he doesn't, bummer. He'll have no choice but to go to some team, convert to a weird looking FB and meet us in a Championship game....er....Bear Pascoe.

[dan77733]

Thanks for uploading the game Ness. Can you post the link to your YouTube channel? Watched the first half of the game.

Kaepernick played well and good pass to Jenkins who made a good catch near the sideline.

OL played well. Only negative was the false start by Davis. Otherwise, good.

Defense played well but missed some tackles. Didnt like that but its only pre-season.

I love Kendall Hunter. If James can play as well this year as Hunter did last year, our future at RB after Gore is going to be damn good. Jacobs did better than I was expecting but with him, whether or not he stays focused and determined remains to be seen once Gore starts and Hunter/James get carries/screens over Jacobs. I can say that it seems Jacobs has already surpassed Dixon but at the same time, thats not exactly saying much.

Definitely looking forward to the season and Moss mooning the fans in GB. :p

[dan77733]

On a somewhat related note -

For those interested, the Madden NFL 13 demo will be released Tuesday for PS3/360 and features the Giants/49ers matchup. The other matchup is the Redskins/Seahawks which makes no sense to me. Would have liked a Ravens/Patriots matchup. Oh well.

[phlysac]

Byham's not? I thought I read an article somewhat recently from Maiocco where he mentioned that Byham did still have practice squad eligibility. If he doesn't, bummer. He'll have no choice but to go to some team, convert to a weird looking FB and meet us in a Championship game....er....Bear Pascoe.

a player cannot participate on the practice squad for more than three seasons, or if he has accrued a year of NFL experience (six or more games on a club's 53-man active roster or official Injured Reserve list.)

Byham played in 14 games in 2010.

[Madirishman]

Byham played in 14 games in 2010.

$h!t+y. Better step his game up and really show something then or he'll be heading back East, landing with someone closer to home, like the Steelers.

[VAfy-ya]

I think its pretty obvious that Byham's a goner. Dobbs looks like a lock as the 3rd TE and his play along the D-Line on Friday I think only cemented his spot on the 53. Really liked Byham before his injury but Dobbs just does a ton more for this team overall at this point. And with so many good players at other positions, keeping only two true TEs in VD and Walker seems like the best option at this point.

I'm more interested in who we keep among the O-Lineman, D-Lineman, OLB, and saftey. So many good players and options between those four groupings. I think the rest of the roster is pretty much set.

[49ersfan_87]

I've only re-watched the 1st half thus far.

Can someone verify what I saw... Kilgore had 2 pancake blocks and a 3rd time he knocked his man to the ground twice.

That aside, it's difficult to assess because I have no idea what his blocking assignments are. What I see is that he dominates when he is asked to move his man one side or the other. He didn't drive men off the ball per se. Often his man would pick a gap and he would simply ride that player's momentum out of the play. I only saw him shrugged off and ineffective on 1-snap.

Is he close to challenging Goodwin? I'm not making that call. But what I see doesn't obviously scream that he'd be a major downgrade should he go against the ones.

Barrows said the 49ers are getting Kilgore extra work at C in the practices. I think they may want him to take over soon, maybe before the year is up.

Anyone going to fanfest today? Would love to hear any fan reports on TC, its the only open practice all TC.

[Ness]

Thanks for uploading the game Ness. Can you post the link to your YouTube channel? Watched the first half of the game.


You should be able to click on the "YouTube" icon on the video links I posted here, which will take you to the YouTube website and you can click on my channel that way.

[VAfy-ya]

Anyone going to fanfest today? Would love to hear any fan reports on TC, its the only open practice all TC.

Couple of observation threads on both the .com boards as well as webzone. Even some vids..

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And apparently, Tolizen is the next Drew Brees..

http://www.mercurynews.com/49ers/ci_21298605/san-francisco-49ers-backup-quarterback-scott-tolzien-draws

[dan77733]

You should be able to click on the "YouTube" icon on the video links I posted here, which will take you to the YouTube website and you can click on my channel that way.

I clicked on youtube and it came up as "astroboy". I clicked on that username and only two videos are listed. Is that you or am I missing something?

[Ness]

I clicked on youtube and it came up as "astroboy". I clicked on that username and only two videos are listed. Is that you or am I missing something?

astrostar49.

Anyways, that is me. And yes there are only two videos that are open to the public. If you clicked on the 49ers videos I posted here and went to YouTube you would see that they are viewed as unlisted. It says that in the description. That means only people with a link can see them. I've done that with all the videos I've posted in this thread.

And it is for obvious reasons. If the NFL catches that I'm posting full games on YouTube they'll get taken down. This has happened to other channels.

[dan77733]

astrostar49.

Anyways, that is me. And yes there are only two videos that are open to the public. If you clicked on the 49ers videos I posted here and went to YouTube you would see that they are viewed as unlisted. It says that in the description. That means only people with a link can see them. I've done that with all the videos I've posted in this thread.

And it is for obvious reasons. If the NFL catches that I'm posting full games on YouTube they'll get taken down. This has happened to other channels.

Oops. Sorry.

Yeah, I noticed that they're unlisted so basically, unless you want to post a link to the actual game, no one can watch them.

Just curious, how many games do you have? And do you happen to have the playoff and Super Bowl games from the 49ers five championship runs?

I have always been tempted to buy the 49ers DVD's but dont because they only show the SB while all the other games are just highlights.

Also, seeing as how you have a pic of Montana under your screen name, do you have the game of him as a Chief against Elway and the Bronocos which is an offensive based game and Montana leading the Chiefs to a win at the end.

Hope im correct on that as I dont remember a lot of the old stuff since I wasnt as big a fan as I am now. Thanks.

[Brent]

Just curious, how many games do you have?
Dan, just search for 49ers games on YouTube and you will see there are TONS of historic games, in full, on there.

I know this because I once spent a whole evening watching the game where they went to Soldier Field and stomped on the Bears in the playoffs.

[Ness]

I have a decent amount of 49ers games acquired. I don't have all of the playoff games from the 49ers Super Bowl runs no. I could probably get them in time if I wanted.

I don't have the game of Montana against Elway. I could probably get it if I wanted, but I have no desire.

[dan77733]

Okay thanks.

[phlysac]

Assuming Delanie is done for the preseason. Signed two TE's today.

[Ness]

I've uploaded another video to my channel. This is the 1989 game between the 49ers and the Eagles in Philadelphia in week three of the season. It's considered by many to be Montana's finest hour. The 49ers offensive line couldn't protect Montana as he got sacked eight times. The 49ers trailed 21-10 into the fourth quarter, but Montana rallied and threw four touchdowns in that quarter alone, giving him five on the afternoon in total along with 428 passing yards on 34 attempts. Despite the circumstances Montana was a BOSS that day.

I think this is already on YouTube, but it's split into parts. My link has the entire broadcast in one video. Enjoy.

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[Ness]

Sorry. Had to take down my videos. YouTube started to crack down.

[Ness]

So who is ready for the Texans? I'm excited as I actually love watching that offense work. They beat the **** out of us in the preseason last season and Arian Foster was actually slicing through our run defense on the few attempts he had. Doesn't mean anything really obviously. I hope we see more from the passing game this weekend.

[Borat]

I'm going to try my best to do a gameday thread this week. I'm taking over a new company soon and the transition has been super hectic. I will try like hell to get one done for the Texans game!

[Ness]

I wouldn't even worry about it. It's preseason.

[phlysac]

Let's see how well Tolzien performs against the Texan's 4th stringers.

Tolz to be #4 against Texans.

I'm assuming he and Johnson will alternate reps until one emerges.

[Brent]

I'm going to try my best to do a gameday thread this week. I'm taking over a new company soon and the transition has been super hectic. I will try like hell to get one done for the Texans game!
http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/16660_o.gif

[Ness]

Notes from yesterday's practice. This is what I've been waiting to hear all along:

Summary: Quarterback Alex Smith opened the 7-on-7 and team portions of practice on a hot streak. The ball rarely hit the ground in the first half of practice with Smith delivering on-target passes to a variety of targets, including two scoring passes to Randy Moss.

The only incompletion through Smith's first 25 pass attempts came when his throw to Moss along the back of the end zone slipped through his hands. The other throw up to that point that hit the ground was an incomplete pass intended for Ted Ginn. But Tarell Brown was called for pass interference on the play.

Smith and Mario Manningham picked up where they left off from practice Monday. The pair capped a two-minute drill with a perfect pitch-and-catch of a 33-yard pass down the right sideline against the coverage of rookie Deante' Purvis. Later, Smith and Manningham hooked up for another deep pass against Purvis and safety Colin Jones.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/49ers-camp-summary-814-Smith-heats-up-ne?blockID=756991&feedID=5936

I hope Smith makes Cossell look like an idiot again this season.

[phlysac]

Notes from yesterday's practice. This is what I've been waiting to hear all along:

I hope Smith makes Cossell look like an idiot again this season.

More optimism for ya Ness...

Alex Smith throwing with better accuracy


SANTA CLARA -- Quarterback Alex Smith has looked good during the offseason months in previous years. But he has never looked quite like this.

His strong training camp continued Tuesday with an outstanding start to the 49ers' three-hour practice. The only incomplete pass among his first 25 attempts came when his toss to Randy Moss, running the back line of the end zone, zipped through Moss' hands.

Smith's next two incomplete passes were deep attempts to tight end Vernon Davis late in practice. Three of Smith's final four attempts were incomplete -- no need to sound the alarm.

Smith looks to be better at every aspect of his game. Obviously, with a year of experience working with Jim Harbaugh, Greg Roman and Geep Chryst, his knowledge of the system is better than ever.

Examining him with the naked eye -- usually from a hundred yards away, where the media is stationed during practices -- it's impossible to pinpoint any dramatic mechanical differences. But the Alex Smith I've seen through 14 practices has been noticeably more accurate with his short, intermediate and deep passes. He also appears to be quicker with his decision-making.

I'm not predicting a Pro Bowl season for Smith. But I am predicting the 49ers' passing game will be more formidable than a year ago when the team ranked 31st in the league in third-down conversions and 29th in passing yards.

The 49ers have surrounded Smith with better options. As written and talked about after the 49ers' exhibition opener, look for the 49ers to use a lot more variety in the passing game. Michael Crabtree and Vernon Davis are the team's top targets, and expect Randy Moss and Mario Manningham to share time as the Nos. 2 and 3 wideouts.

Smith signed a three-year, $24 million contract in the offseason. His average salary places him in a tie with Matt Schaub for 18th-highest-paid quarterback in the NFL. Schaub and Joe Flacco, whose contracts expire after this season, will likely bump Smith down to No. 20 next year.

Once thought to be worth nowhere near the financial investment of the No. 1 overall pick, Smith could become one of the best bargain players in the NFL if his training camp carries over to the regular season.
http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/Alex-Smith-throwing-with-better-accuracy?blockID=757289&feedID=5936

[49ersfan_87]

Alex Boone locking up the RG job according to Roman

http://twitter.com/MBachCSN/status/235837619441893377

#49ers OC Greg Roman: "Alex Boone, as of right now Is winning the right guard job." Roman pleased with Boone's first preseason game

[Ness]

Good for Boone. I'm a little nervous since he's so tall for a guard. We had Kevin Gogan who I think was 6'7 and he worked out okay. Hopefully Boone becomes a mainstay and we get a better performance out of him than we did Snyder and Rachal.

[Brent]

I have a fantasy football draft on the 1st of September. I am going to take so many 49ers.

[VAfy-ya]

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest/post/_/id/71690/camp-confidential-49ers-2

[Ness]

Nate Byham waived.

[Madirishman]

Nate Byham waived.

Maybe his not coming back from injury well, not DWalk's injury, caused them to sign the two TEs from earlier this week though one of those new signings has also already been waived.

[Ness]

Yeeeeeeeaaaaaaahhhhhhh!

Summary: Quarterback Alex Smith began Thursday's practice on another hot streak. His only incompletion among his first 15 pass attempts in the 7-on-7 and team portions coming when fullback Bruce Miller dropped a pass that hit him between the numbers.

Offensive play of the day: In a first-team vs. first-team drive situation, the offense was given the ball at the 40-yard line. It took Smith and tight end Vernon Davis all of one play to get into the end zone. Linebacker Patrick Willis had coverage on Davis, who ran a deep corner route, caught Smith's perfect throw in stride and took it the rest of the way for the touchdown.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/49ers-camp-summary-816-Offense-ends-on-h?blockID=758319&feedID=5936

http://www10.pic-upload.de/17.08.12/yz5yz33kkrj.gif

[Verloren]

Maybe his not coming back from injury well, not DWalk's injury, caused them to sign the two TEs from earlier this week though one of those new signings has also already been waived.

Definitely not coming back well enough, and the team probably needs the spot for someone else. McKillop and Adams went through the same thing last year.

[Madirishman]

Definitely not coming back well enough, and the team probably needs the spot for someone else. McKillop and Adams went through the same thing last year.

Yes, and they've had Byham and Holcolmb who have filled that role already this year. Too bad for them that they were inured as both those cats had some potential. It's hard to make this 53. Byham will catch on with someone else unless his recovery was worse than thought.

[dan77733]

Pretty sure Harbaugh moving Dobbs to play the third string TE was also a factor in waiving Byham. Its going to be fun seeing what the final 53 looks like after final cuts (and hopefully, EA doesnt screw it up in Madden, lol).

[Brent]

It's hard to make this 53.
Feels like it's been a while since that could be said of this franchise.

[phlysac]

49ers may want to IR Byham. The only way they are permitted to do that is if he clears waivers. It's Giants vs. Patriots with Jake Ballard.

[Madirishman]

49ers may want to IR Byham. The only way they are permitted to do that is if he clears waivers. It's Giants vs. Patriots with Jake Ballard.

Perhaps that is their strategy but Ballard > Byham. They've got a better chance of keeping their guy, if that's their strategy. He may just not have a future with the team. We'll know if they IR him.

[Madirishman]

Feels like it's been a while since that could be said of this franchise.

It has been awhile and it's about time! It's our turn.

[phlysac]

Perhaps that is their strategy but Ballard > Byham.

Only due to health. Byham was drafted in 2010 while Ballard was undrafted. Byham contributed at a much higher level in 2010. Who knows what Byham does if he's healthy and the Giants #1 TE in 2011.

None of it matters, and it's a poor argument. But if Byham was healthy he'd be on the field. I don't knock his ability when he's not yet recovered.

It's very possible the 49ers completely moved on.

[Brent]

It's very possible the 49ers completely moved on.
I think this is most likely the case. The need for a "blocking TE" is damn near non-existent. With an improved WR core, a 3rd TE who can catch is no longer needed.

[YAYareaRB]

i say out with byham, in with the garbage man (reuland).

[phlysac]

i say out with byham, in with the garbage man (reuland).

I'm not bashing the guy but what has he done? None of the #3 TE's have shown anything, really aside from Dobbs at DE.

[VAfy-ya]

Sucks about the injuries but if there was one position we could probably afford guys getting banged up it would be RB. We'll bring in some bodies to hold us over for pre-season and if LMJ and Jacobs happen to be out for an extended time, maybe we kick the tires on a vet like Ryan Grant. Like what I saw from the 1's, hate the drops by WR core. JJ and Tolizen are in a dead heat. JJ looked solid. The last pre-season game will be the measuring stick for both.

[dan77733]

Not happy about James getting injured. Anyone know if its serious or not?

[49ersfan_87]

I only watched a bit of the game, from what i could tell my 2 problems were pass protection and pass defense. Few pass attempts, no deep drops, and we still give up pressure like crazy. Also, disappointed in Culliver and especially Brock. It seems like every time Brock is in the game he's giving up a big gainer. I don't think his spot is a lock at all. Michael Thomas had a sack right? Whitner said Thomas is very underrated and could be a surprise player on the 53.

Sucks about the injuries but if there was one position we could probably afford guys getting banged up it would be RB. We'll bring in some bodies to hold us over for pre-season and if LMJ and Jacobs happen to be out for an extended time, maybe we kick the tires on a vet like Ryan Grant. Like what I saw from the 1's, hate the drops by WR core. JJ and Tolizen are in a dead heat. JJ looked solid. The last pre-season game will be the measuring stick for both.

BTW how did LMJ and Jenkins look today? LMJ had 4 carries/19 yards, Jenkins had a 30 yard catch and was overthrown on a potential TD the next play, so i hear. But i didn't actually watch them.

[VAfy-ya]

Actually Jenkins was overthrown again in the 4th quarter for what would have been a long TD catch. The back-up QBs missed a lot of throws for huge gains. But the receivers also dropped ALOT of balls that would have been big catches. Jenkins looked fined.....the guys got some wheels, that's for sure. He just isn't ready yet. I wouldn't feel to bad if he had to play significant snaps due to injury but I don't think he's strong enough to be a factor this year consistently, which is why he's way down on the depth chart.

LMJ said he just turned his ankle and should be back at practice on Monday. Good news. He didn't look particular good yesterday. He's still trying to find his way. Remember he missed a lot of off-season work due to the rules about rookies not being able to practice until they graduate. He just looks a step slow....like he's still in OTA mode. He'll be fine, just has to be more decisive as a runner. I dont think he'll be as much of a factor this year as ppl think. Hunter has looked fantastic, Gore is Gore, and Jacobs should pick up right where he left off before the injury. LMJ, like Jenkins was a pick towards the future. Most of the carries will be shouldered by those 3 names I listed above. Doubt you'll see either James or Jenkins active on gamedays much this year.

Overall though, we look much sharper than we were at this point last pre-season. Texans have a very good defense and we were able to move the ball on them fairly well. If not for a couple of drops, we could have probably put a TD or two more on the scoreboard. But you can see the potential, we'll at least I can. We were missing our two starting OLBs and their offense couldn't do much until the 2's were inserted. I think we're right on schedule. The Broncos will be a good test for both sides of the ball.

[VAfy-ya]

And its looking more and more like Bakhtiari will make the 53. Guy looked solid last night playing with the starters and he played the entire game. And after a stellar first pre-season game, he would really have to **** the bed to fall out of favor with the coaches. And he's a excellent STer as well. They should just IR Cam Johnson and get it over with so he can really get that knee right. I see Brown on the PS.

[dan77733]

I'm so happy that James will be okay and back at practice on Monday. Personally, im hoping to see him play this season with more of Hunter so Gore can be fresh in December and January. Also, I want to see an up tempo fast pace offense. Guys like Hunter and James will be effective that way. Also, want to see James on returns too.

[VAfy-ya]

Im so happy that James will be okay and back at practice on Monday. Personally, im hoping to see him play this season with more of Hunter so Gore can be fresh in December and January. Also, I want to see an up tempo fast pace offense. Guys like Hunter and James will be effective that way. Also, want to see James on returns too.

I don't want to see anymore of James returning punts. He muffed one last night badly and DOES NOT look natural doing it. He had like a whopping 3 yards punt return average. I REALLY would like to see Culliver have a crack at it. He was a awesome returner in college, but I think he's too valuable to the defense so they won't risk putting him back there. It'll be Ginn with K-10 as the back-up, just like last year.

[hawkeye123]

Lamichael James has looked solid in the few carries he has had. He explodes through the hole, no hesitation from him. I love that in a running back. That's the problem with a guy like Anthony Dixon, they dance around to much in the backfield. I believe James will get a lot of touches as a 3rd down back this year.

[dan77733]

I don't want to see anymore of James returning punts. He muffed one last night badly and DOES NOT look natural doing it. He had like a whopping 3 yards punt return average. I REALLY would like to see Culliver have a crack at it. He was a awesome returner in college, but I think he's too valuable to the defense so they won't risk putting him back there. It'll be Ginn with K-10 as the back-up, just like last year.

Every returner muffs or screws up a punt return because they get too anxious and forget to catch and secure the ball before running. He could still return kickoffs and we have Cox too. Of course, I would use Ginn exclusively on returns with Williams, James and Cox as the backups.

Dont want to see Culliver on returns because he's basically a starter when Rogers moves inside to the slot. James is a 3rd string RB while Culliver is a 2nd string CB. Wouldnt risk that especially since we have four guys who could be used in that role instead of Culliver.

James was an excellent returner in college too but so what? I just want to see James because of his speed and explosiveness. Think he could give us a lot of good returns. Either way, our future at RB looks bright with Hunter and James being a damn good one two punch once Gore is done.

[Ness]

I've only watched the first quarter so far. Wasn't really impressed or disappointed.

[dan77733]

I've only watched the first quarter so far. Wasn't really impressed or disappointed.

Any chance of posting the game here?

[Ness]

Any chance of posting the game here?

No. I already got a warning from YouTube one of my other videos even though it was private listed. I wish I could, but I don't want to risk my account getting the boot. The NFL has cracked down everywhere lately it seems.

[dan77733]

No. I already got a warning from YouTube one of my other videos even though it was private listed. I wish I could, but I don't want to risk my account getting the boot. The NFL has cracked down everywhere lately it seems.

Sorry about that but how the hell can you get a warning for a private video? Damn youtube. Oh well. Thanks anyway. At least its just pre-season.

[Ness]

I don't know. Well for about almost a week I had that video on regular viewing status. When I noticed that all the other full length NFL videos were getting taken down, I made that one private. The ones following were all private as well. So maybe someone saw it while it was exposed. Or maybe it doesn't matter if it's private listed. I don't know. I just don't want to take the risk as I've already gotten two warnings because the video was split into two parts. If I get a third it's over.

[49ersfan_87]

53 man roster prediction. Based on preseason games, TC reports, injuries, and my own personal gut feelings.

QB- Alex Smith (Colin Kaepernick, Scott Tolzien)
RB- Frank Gore (Kendall Hunter, Brandon Jacobs, LaMichael James)
FB- Bruce Miller
TE- Vernon Davis (Delanie Walker, Konrad Reuland)
OL- Joe Staley, Mike Iupati, Jonathon Goodwin, Alex Boone, Anthony Davis (Mike Person, Daniel Kilgore, Joe Looney, Jason Slowey)
DL- Justin Smith, Isaac Sopoaga, Ray McDonald (RJF, Dobbs, Ian Williams)
OLB- Aldon Smith, Ahmad Brooks (Parys Haralson, Eric Bakhtiari)
ILB- Patrick Willis, NaVarro Bowman (Larry Grant, Tavares Gooden)
CB- Carlos Rogers, Tarrell Brown (Chris Culliver, Perrish Cox, Tramaine Brock)
S- Dashon Goldson, Dante Whitner (CJ Spillman, Trenton Robinson, Colin Jones)
ST- Lee, Akers, Jennings

IR- OLB Darius Fleming, RB Jewel Hampton, PUP- OLB Cam Johnson
PS- WR Chris Owusu, WR Nathan Palmer, WR Bryan Tyms, OL Chase Beeler, OL Derek Hall, ILB Joe Holland, S Michael Thomas, CB Anthony Mosley

Notable cuts: Josh Johnson, Anthony Dixon, Rock Cartwright, Leonard Davis, Will Tuakufu

[Verloren]

Moss, Manningham, Crabtree, Williams, Ginn, Jenkins?

[Brent]

Moss, Manningham, Crabtree, Williams, Ginn, Jenkins?
This is Harbaugh's offense we're talking about, no need for WRs!

[dan77733]

I don't know. Well for about almost a week I had that video on regular viewing status. When I noticed that all the other full length NFL videos were getting taken down, I made that one private. The ones following were all private as well. So maybe someone saw it while it was exposed. Or maybe it doesn't matter if it's private listed. I don't know. I just don't want to take the risk as I've already gotten two warnings because the video was split into two parts. If I get a third it's over.

Someone probably saw it when it was regular and complained. Youtube then probably checked your account and saw private videos. Whats really crappy is that there's so much stuff on youtube that shouldnt be there but is. It all makes no sense to me. Everything should either be removed or nothing at all. Its such bullcrap.

[dan77733]

Here's my final 53 (as of right now) -

QB - Smith, Johnson, Tolzien, Kaepernick (4)
RB - Gore, Hunter, James, Dixon (8)
FB - Miller, Cartwright (10)
WR - Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Jenkins, Ginn (16)
TE - Davis, Walker (18)
C - Goodwin, Kilgore (20)
OG - Iupati, Boone, Looney (23)
OT - Staley, Davis, Person (26)

DE - Smith, McDonald, Dobbs (29)
DT - Sopoaga, Jean-Francois, Williams (32)
OLB - Smith, Brooks, Haralson, Bakhtiari (36)
ILB - Willis, Bowman, Grant, Gooden (40)
CB - Rogers, Brown, Culliver, Brock, Cox (45)
SS - Whitner, Spillman (47)
FS - Goldson, Robinson, Jones (50)

K - Akers (51)
P - Lee (52)
LS - Jennings (53)

I think that Jacobs will go on the PUP list if he cant play week one. If he can, replace Dixon with Jacobs. And yes, I think that we'll keep four QB's because Kaepernick is the future and shouldnt be used often. Tolzien could be trade bait eventually and Johnson is basically the veteran backup behind veteran Alex Smith. Cartwright replaces Costanzo and see him making the final 53. Only listed two TE's because Dobbs could be 3rd and with the fact that we signed and drafted three receivers combined plus re-signed Ginn, not much need for other TE's.

[phlysac]

Here's my final 53 (as of right now) -

QB - Smith, Johnson, Tolzien, Kaepernick (4)
RB - Gore, Hunter, James, Dixon (8)
FB - Miller, Cartwright (10)
WR - Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Jenkins, Ginn (16)
TE - Davis, Walker (18)
C - Goodwin, Kilgore (20)
OG - Iupati, Boone, Looney (23)
OT - Staley, Davis, Person (26)

DE - Smith, McDonald, Dobbs (29)
DT - Sopoaga, Jean-Francois, Williams (32)
OLB - Smith, Brooks, Haralson, Bakhtiari (36)
ILB - Willis, Bowman, Grant, Gooden (40)
CB - Rogers, Brown, Culliver, Brock, Cox (45)
SS - Whitner, Spillman (47)
FS - Goldson, Robinson, Jones (50)

K - Akers (51)
P - Lee (52)
LS - Jennings (53)



Would be tough convincing me that Leonard Davis and Will Tukuafu will be cut. They're both currently 2nd-teamers while you have 3rd and 4th teamers making your squad.

[VAfy-ya]

1. We won't keep 4 QBs

2. Highly doubt Jones makes it. This year's team has more talent top to bottom than last year squad. We won't have room to carry Jones because he hasn't developed at all as a safety. Guys like McBath and Michael Thomas have flashed more and can offer more in terms of being a actual back-up, as well as being standouts on special teams. The writing was on the wall for Jones when they were talking about moving him to WR early in the off-season. I don't see how he fits on this roster as just a special teamer. Guys need to provide more this year to stick.

3. Gooden might not be safe.I know we resigned him this off-season for modest money but I can see them going with only 3 ILBs and 4 OLBs if they really want to keep a young guy they like Michael Thomas or Reuland.

4. Tukuafu is definitely a lock because of his presence on offense, STs, and defense.

5. Jacobs should be ready by to go by week 2 at the least. Dixon is as good as gone.

[dan77733]

Would be tough convincing me that Leonard Davis and Will Tukuafu will be cut. They're both currently 2nd-teamers while you have 3rd and 4th teamers making your squad.

Tukuafu will probably make the team but I left him out since I have four QB's and four RB's. If Davis cant beat out a second year player in Kilgore and a converted OT to OG in Boone, I dont see him making the team especially when there's a far greater chance of losing one of the young guys to another team than there is with Davis.

[dan77733]

1. We won't keep 4 QBs

2. Highly doubt Jones makes it. This year's team has more talent top to bottom than last year squad. We won't have room to carry Jones because he hasn't developed at all as a safety. Guys like McBath and Michael Thomas have flashed more and can offer more in terms of being a actual back-up, as well as being standouts on special teams. The writing was on the wall for Jones when they were talking about moving him to WR early in the off-season. I don't see how he fits on this roster as just a special teamer. Guys need to provide more this year to stick.

3. Gooden might not be safe.I know we resigned him this off-season for modest money but I can see them going with only 3 ILBs and 4 OLBs if they really want to keep a young guy they like Michael Thomas or Reuland.

4. Tukuafu is definitely a lock because of his presence on offense, STs, and defense.

5. Jacobs should be ready by to go by week 2 at the least. Dixon is as good as gone.

1. I think that there's a chance we do. Smith and Kaepernick are obvious locks. Tolzien has played better than Johnson but its just pre-season. I would be far more comfortable with Johnson over Tolzien during the regular season. Tolzien could always become trade bait down the line. Just wouldnt be surprised to see us keep four QBs.

2. Special teams is important and if a guy like Jones excels on special teams where as the other two dont, I would much rather keep Jones because the other two guys would be third stringers and be stuck on special teams anyway so I would rather see the better special teamer guy make the team.

3. I'll be surprised to see Gooden not make the final 53. Granted, he's the fourth ILB but he's a good special teamer. Our special teams was damn good. No reason to screw that up. Besides, those other guys can be placed on the practice squad. Gooden cant. Also, like Jones, if the other guys we're keeping arent as good on special teams as the guys we're losing and are third or fourth stringers on defense, I dont see the point in sacrificing those guys.

4. Tukuafa is probably a lock but since I had four QB's and four RB's make the team, I left Tukuafa off.

5. Yeah, im pretty sure that Dixon is as good as gone. I thought that Jacobs was going to be out longer than just a week. Either way, I honestly wouldnt keep either one but thats just me.

[phlysac]

If Davis cant beat out a second year player in Kilgore and a converted OT to OG in Boone, I dont see him making the team especially when there's a far greater chance of losing one of the young guys to another team than there is with Davis.

I agree, in theory, but having a veteran presence can be crucial. Also, Kilgore has been getting most of his reps at Center.

[dan77733]

I agree, in theory, but having a veteran presence can be crucial. Also, Kilgore has been getting most of his reps at Center.

True but only if the veteran plays to be a presence. Just dont think its worth keeping Davis over one of the younger guys if he cant beat out Boone because releasing the younger guys will expose them to other teams. If the younger guys have the potential and upside, I wouldnt release them.

[49ersfan_87]

Moss, Manningham, Crabtree, Williams, Ginn, Jenkins?

This is Harbaugh's offense we're talking about, no need for WRs!

lmao, yes i meant for those 6 WR's. Brainfart.

[VAfy-ya]

I agree, in theory, but having a veteran presence can be crucial. Also, Kilgore has been getting most of his reps at Center.

I actually have to agree with Dan for once. I like Looney's potential a lot more than Davis. And I find it odd Davis didn't play at all last week. I could see them going with potential over the vet presence. And I remember reading Looney looking good when he finally came back from his foot injury, though I don't recall seeing him against the Texans last week. But I could also see it vice versa, in favor of Davis. I haven't even done a 53-man projection this year because I really have no clue what this roster will look like. Hopefully, that's a good thing.

[phlysac]

I actually have to agree with Dan for once. I like Looney's potential a lot more than Davis. And I find it odd Davis didn't play at all last week. I could see them going with potential over the vet presence. And I remember reading Looney looking good when he finally came back from his foot injury, though I don't recall seeing him against the Texans last week. But I could also see it vice versa, in favor of Davis. I haven't even done a 53-man projection this year because I really have no clue what this roster will look like. Hopefully, that's a good thing.

I don't disagree that keeping Looney, Kilgore, etc over L. Davis makes sense. My point is that keeping L. Davis makes more sense than say, keeping a 4th QB or Rock Cartwright, etc.

[Borat]

Looney is going to make the team. No doubt. Not even worth discussing.

I think JJ gets cut.

[phlysac]

Offense (25)

QB - Alex Smith | Colin Kaepernick | Scott Tolzien (3)
RB - Frank Gore | Kendall Hunter | Brandon Jacobs | LaMichael James (4)
FB - Bruce Miller (1)
TE - Vernon Davis | Delanie Walker (2)
OT - Joe Staley | Anthony Davis | Mike Person (OG) (3)
OG - Mike Iupati | Alex Boone (OT) | Leonard Davis | Joe Looney (4)
C - Jonathan Goodwin | Daniel Kilgore (OG) (2)
WR - Michael Crabtree | Randy Moss | Mario Manningham | Ted Ginn | Kyle Williams | A.J. Jenkins (6)

Defense (25)

DE - Justin Smith | Ray McDonald | DeMarcus Dobbs (TE/OLB)| Will Tukuafu (FB)(4)
NT - Isaac Sopoaga (DE)| Ricky Jean Francois (DE) | Ian Williams (DE) (3)
OLB - Aldon Smith | Ahmad Brooks | Parys Haralson | Eric Bakhtiari (4)
ILB - Patrick Willis | NaVorro Bowman | Larry Grant | Tavares Gooden (4)
CB - Tarell Brown | Carlos Rogers | Chris Culliver | Perrish Cox | Tramaine Brock (5)
S - Dashon Goldson | Donte Whitner | C.J. Spillman | Trenton Robinson | Colin Jones (5)

Special Teams (3)

K - David Akers
P - Andy Lee
LS - Brian Jennings

Fringe
QB - Josh Johnson
RB - Anthony Dixon
FB - Rock Cartwright
TE - Konrad Reuland (PS)
OLB - Cam Johnson (PS)
S - Darcel McBath
S - Michael Thomas (PS)

Practice Squad

C - Jason Slowey
WR - Chris Owusu
WR - Nathan Palmer
WR - Bryan Tyms
OLB - Kourtnei Brown
ILB - Michael Wilhoite (FB)
DB - Ben Hannula (WR)
DE - Tony Jerod-Eddie

[Ness]

By the way out of all the potentially disappointing factors that could occur against the Packers, I hope our offensive line doesn't crumble from the get go and Alex ends up taking a beating on every snap. Especially since this unit has been together for a while now.

[Brent]

By the way out of all the potentially disappointing factors that could occur against the Packers, I hope our offensive line doesn't crumble from the get go and Alex ends up taking a beating on every snap. Especially since this unit has been together for a while now.
the game just needs to start so I can stop being anxious about it

[Ness]

Borat's first game thread should be interesting. Get ready to see this guy:

http://sportscribes.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/packers-falcons-aaron-rodgers21.jpg

You know, the one we passed on.

http://sportige.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/Aaron-Rodgers.jpg

Whoops...

[dan77733]

Even if we drafted Rodgers over Smith, to be honest, I think that everything goes the same way except that Smith wins a SB and Rodgers doesnt because both would be in the opposite situation that they were in and thus, the opposite would happen.

If Rodgers was a 49er and went through all those OC's, everyone here would be wanting him long gone just like we wanted Alex gone a year ago. And yeah, I do think that Smith would have won a SB in GB because look at the talent level of that team and being in the same system for his entire career would have resulted in Smith winning a SB.

Smith has the talent and skill but when all that other crap goes on around you and you're losing and getting killed out there, its easy to just say screw it and give up.

[dan77733]

I don't disagree that keeping Looney, Kilgore, etc over L. Davis makes sense. My point is that keeping L. Davis makes more sense than say, keeping a 4th QB or Rock Cartwright, etc.

I can see keeping Davis over a 4th string QB but not over Cartwright. Cartwright is good on special teams which is something Davis wont play on. He also adds another veteran presence to the RB position. Him and Gore would be good for Hunter, James and Miller. As for Jacobs, I would keep Cartwright over him because yeah, he'll look good early but trust me, watching him play with the Giants, he's going to decline sooner rather than later.

[phlysac]

I can see keeping Davis over a 4th string QB but not over Cartwright. Cartwright is good on special teams which is something Davis wont play on. He also adds another veteran presence to the RB position. Him and Gore would be good for Hunter, James and Miller. As for Jacobs, I would keep Cartwright over him because yeah, he'll look good early but trust me, watching him play with the Giants, he's going to decline sooner rather than later.

At the same time, ST's value only gets you so far. Only 10 position players line up on ST's. Cartwright would only see regular action if 4 RBs go down. Whereas Davis would see the field if 1 G went down. I'd like to see Cartwright make the team, but tough cuts will need to be made.

And I agree you can feel that Jacobs could wear down, but when was the last time you remember anything about Cartwright as a RB? He averages 1.4 carries per game in a 10 year career.

[VAfy-ya]

At the same time, ST's value only gets you so far. Only 10 position players line up on ST's. Cartwright would only see regular action if 4 RBs go down. Whereas Davis would see the field if 1 G went down. I'd like to see Cartwright make the team, but tough cuts will need to be made.

And I agree you can feel that Jacobs could wear down, but when was the last time you remember anything about Cartwright as a RB? He averages 1.4 carries per game in a 10 year career.

Meh, you can say the same for Jones, who provides virtually no depth at all at safety but you have him making it over a guy like Thomas, who the coaches have raved about his play and versatility(can play both safety and CB) and with his speed looks to be a excellent gunner on STs from what I saw. Cartwright is a ace STer and can back-up both RB and FB. Like I said, your going to have to do more this year as a fringe player to stick. That's why I have a hard time seeing Jones on this roster. As of now, I would Thomas in over him. Jones is a good STer...but its not like we couldn't get as good of play out of either McBath(who was a good STer in his own right before his injury) or Thomas in the same role. And those guys have a pulse, in terms of being actual depth and contributing down the road as a safety. I've yet to hear one positive word or meaningful play mentioned in association with Jones as a defensive player

[Ness]

Even if we drafted Rodgers over Smith, to be honest, I think that everything goes the same way except that Smith wins a SB and Rodgers doesnt because both would be in the opposite situation that they were in and thus, the opposite would happen.

If Rodgers was a 49er and went through all those OC's, everyone here would be wanting him long gone just like we wanted Alex gone a year ago. And yeah, I do think that Smith would have won a SB in GB because look at the talent level of that team and being in the same system for his entire career would have resulted in Smith winning a SB.

Smith has the talent and skill but when all that other crap goes on around you and you're losing and getting killed out there, its easy to just say screw it and give up.

You have to take into consideration that the 49ers just got the pick wrong plain and simple. Obviously playing in Green Bay helps with the system they had there and whatever, but sometimes a player is just better physically and mentally. I'd be hard pressed to say Aaron Rodgers doesn't have that over Alex Smith. If the 49ers took Rodgers he may not have blown up like he is doing in Green Bay, but he might have a least been decent even with all the turnaround and maybe Nolan might even still be employed. Who knows. If Alex Smith went to the Packers he could very well be out of the NFL right now.

[dan77733]

Cartwright is a special teamer/backup FB. He's not meant to be the RB. He's meant to block for the RB or be on special teams.

Kaepernick was named the backup QB today and if im Baalke/Harbaugh, I shop both Johnson and Tolzien and whoever gets me the best offer is gone and keep the other as the third stringer.

[dan77733]

You have to take into consideration that the 49ers just got the pick wrong plain and simple. Obviously playing in Green Bay helps with the system they had there and whatever, but sometimes a player is just better physically and mentally. I'd be hard pressed to say Aaron Rodgers doesn't have that over Alex Smith. If the 49ers took Rodgers he may not have blown up like he is doing in Green Bay, but he might have a least been decent even with all the turnaround and maybe Nolan might even still be employed. Who knows. If Alex Smith went to the Packers he could very well be out of the NFL right now.

Yeah, they did and while there's no guarantee either way, I still think that whoever would have ended up in SF would be exactly where Smith is now and that the other would have been where Rodgers is now. Of course, I preferred Rodgers over Smith because he was from Cal but had neither in my top five that year.

Nolan??? I said he sucked since day one and hated that guy from the start. I'll be shocked if he ever gets another HC job.

As for Rodgers being stronger mentally, switch him with Smith and I guarantee you that he wouldnt be. Hell, I dont think that any QB would be after going through what Alex went through here in SF. The main reason he's finally doing good and improving is because of Harbaugh. If Smith can fix his accuracy then I do believe that we can see him guide us to a SB win. Hell, he almost did it last year.

I'm not the biggest Smith fan in the world and hell, wanted him gone like most but after seeing him play with an offensive based HC who used to be a QB, everything changed. Now, if he can just improve his accuracy and they actually take the chains off of him, I'll be a happier camper.

[SolidGold]

Cartwright is a special teamer/backup FB. He's not meant to be the RB. He's meant to block for the RB or be on special teams.

Kaepernick was named the backup QB today and if im Baalke/Harbaugh, I shop both Johnson and Tolzien and whoever gets me the best offer is gone and keep the other as the third stringer.

Tolzien might actually get you guys a later round pick - He was impressive last preseason with San Diego and has played well this preseason. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back with the Chargers or maybe the Packers if he gets cut or traded.

[VAfy-ya]

Cartwright is a special teamer/backup FB. He's not meant to be the RB. He's meant to block for the RB or be on special teams.

Kaepernick was named the backup QB today and if im Baalke/Harbaugh, I shop both Johnson and Tolzien and whoever gets me the best offer is gone and keep the other as the third stringer.

No one's going to trade for a back-up QB they know will be available in a week. I could understand if both had some highly impressive pre-season tape for teams to drool over. But both have just looked "ok" in that regard. No GM is that stupid unfortunately.

[VAfy-ya]

Tolzien might actually get you guys a later round pick - He was impressive last preseason with San Diego and has played well this preseason. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back with the Chargers or maybe the Packers if he gets cut or traded.

Except I don't see Tolizen being the odd man out...so do you really see a team giving up anything for JJ? Highly unlikely....

[phlysac]

Meh, you can say the same for Jones, who provides virtually no depth at all at safety but you have him making it over a guy like Thomas, who the coaches have raved about his play and versatility(can play both safety and CB) and with his speed looks to be a excellent gunner on STs from what I saw. Cartwright is a ace STer and can back-up both RB and FB. Like I said, your going to have to do more this year as a fringe player to stick. That's why I have a hard time seeing Jones on this roster. As of now, I would Thomas in over him. Jones is a good STer...but its not like we couldn't get as good of play out of either McBath(who was a good STer in his own right before his injury) or Thomas in the same role. And those guys have a pulse, in terms of being actual depth and contributing down the road as a safety. I've yet to hear one positive word or meaningful play mentioned in association with Jones as a defensive player

Don't disagree. Everyone in red on my list is virtually interchangeable based on what 'I' know. The only exception being L. Davis whom I feel very strongly about being on the team due to a lack of talent behind Staley and A.Davis at OT.

[49ersfan_87]

Tolzien might actually get you guys a later round pick - He was impressive last preseason with San Diego and has played well this preseason. I wouldn't be surprised to see him back with the Chargers or maybe the Packers if he gets cut or traded.

I don't think Tolzien would clear waivers, and i agree that GB or SD could place a claim for him. However, i think he'll make it as the #3 QB. Would Josh Johnson get that kind of interest if he was waived? Who knows, but i do think he would probably be the best QB available after all the cuts in September.

[Ness]

EDIT: Nevermind.

[Ness]

Yeah, they did and while there's no guarantee either way, I still think that whoever would have ended up in SF would be exactly where Smith is now and that the other would have been where Rodgers is now. Of course, I preferred Rodgers over Smith because he was from Cal but had neither in my top five that year.

Nolan??? I said he sucked since day one and hated that guy from the start. I'll be shocked if he ever gets another HC job.

As for Rodgers being stronger mentally, switch him with Smith and I guarantee you that he wouldnt be. Hell, I dont think that any QB would be after going through what Alex went through here in SF. The main reason he's finally doing good and improving is because of Harbaugh. If Smith can fix his accuracy then I do believe that we can see him guide us to a SB win. Hell, he almost did it last year.

I'm not the biggest Smith fan in the world and hell, wanted him gone like most but after seeing him play with an offensive based HC who used to be a QB, everything changed. Now, if he can just improve his accuracy and they actually take the chains off of him, I'll be a happier camper.

Hold your horses. Our defense almost guided us to a Super Bowl win. It wasn't our offense and it certainly wasn't our passing game. They made their fair share of plays when the unit had to, but if it wasn't for our defense and special teams play with the turnovers and constant good field position giving the offense way more chances than it deserved, we wouldn't have made it to the NFC Championship game and certainly wouldn't have had had 13 wins.

As for your guarantees Dan, don't be surprised if I don't take your word for it. Rodgers may have looked better with McCarthy (since he was here) in his first season than Alex Smith, where you really couldn't do much worse. Even though the team didn't have that much talent, Rodgers may have just been the better quarterback plain and simple from an ability standpoint. As for if the two were switched, there are just way too many variables to come to a concrete conclusion.

[dan77733]

Hold your horses. Our defense almost guided us to a Super Bowl win. It wasn't our offense and it certainly wasn't our passing game. They made their fair share of plays when the unit had to, but if it wasn't for our defense and special teams play with the turnovers and constant good field position giving the offense way more chances than it deserved, we wouldn't have made it to the NFC Championship game and certainly wouldn't have had had 13 wins.

As for your guarantees Dan, don't be surprised if I don't take your word for it. Rodgers may have looked better with McCarthy (since he was here) in his first season than Alex Smith, where you really couldn't do much worse. Even though the team didn't have that much talent, Rodgers may have just been the better quarterback plain and simple from an ability standpoint. As for if the two were switched, there are just way too many variables to come to a concrete conclusion.

Yeah, our defense was good as was our special teams and running game but it was Smith who won us the NFC divisional game...not the defense, not the running game, not special teams. It was Smith. Subtract Smith and we get blown out against the Saints because while our defense got turnovers, they still gave up 32 points despite getting those few turnovers. Also, while you can say it was Justin Smith who turned our season around against the Eagles, I say it was Alex who put Justin in that spot to make that play to begin with. If Smith doesnt have the second half that he did, we would have probably been 8-8 or worse and our defense, special teams, running game wouldnt have been as good as it was.

I know you're not a fan of Smith and im not his biggest fan either but give the guy some credit for going through six years of hell in SF and leading us to the championship game. And if our receivers didnt suck, we would have beat the Giants and probably blow them out.

As for Rodgers, I dont think that he would have done any better than Smith because he would have been in the exact same situation. Six different OC's in six years. Two crappy HC's. Best receiver being Bryant and that was for one year. A crappy defense, average at best running game and hell, if it wasnt for Gore, we wouldnt have had a running game either. Smith on the other hand would have sat behind Favre for three years and then start with a loaded as **** offense and a way better OL than we had in those six years.

So while you may think that Rodgers would have won a SB with us or at least been way better than Smith, I dont because he would have been in the same exact situation as Smith was and thus, the results would be the same. You could put a rookie Peyton Manning out there and he would have sucked going through six OC's in six years.

The majority who succeed are those who have continuity and consistency around them year in and year out. Swap our receivers for the Packers receivers and we blow away the Saints, Giants and Patriots last year but our receivers sucked so well, there ya go.

Rodgers got to sat behind one of the best QB's of all time and learned the offense in and out. He wasnt thrown into the fire with crap around him like Smith was. Quite simply, I dont care if it was Rodgers or any other QB instead of Smith, they were destined to fail since the day they were drafted number one overall in 2005.

And sorry if you somehow think that Rodgers would have done better than Smith in the same situation with the same crappy players and coaches around him.

But hey, to each his own bud.

[Ness]

Yeah, our defense was good as was our special teams and running game but it was Smith who won us the NFC divisional game...not the defense, not the running game, not special teams. It was Smith. Subtract Smith and we get blown out against the Saints because while our defense got turnovers, they still gave up 32 points despite getting those few turnovers. Also, while you can say it was Justin Smith who turned our season around against the Eagles, I say it was Alex who put Justin in that spot to make that play to begin with. If Smith doesnt have the second half that he did, we would have probably been 8-8 or worse and our defense, special teams, running game wouldnt have been as good as it was.

I know you're not a fan of Smith and im not his biggest fan either but give the guy some credit for going through six years of hell in SF and leading us to the championship game. And if our receivers didnt suck, we would have beat the Giants and probably blow them out.

As for Rodgers, I dont think that he would have done any better than Smith because he would have been in the exact same situation. Six different OC's in six years. Two crappy HC's. Best receiver being Bryant and that was for one year. A crappy defense, average at best running game and hell, if it wasnt for Gore, we wouldnt have had a running game either. Smith on the other hand would have sat behind Favre for three years and then start with a loaded as **** offense and a way better OL than we had in those six years.

So while you may think that Rodgers would have won a SB with us or at least been way better than Smith, I dont because he would have been in the same exact situation as Smith was and thus, the results would be the same. You could put a rookie Peyton Manning out there and he would have sucked going through six OC's in six years.

The majority who succeed are those who have continuity and consistency around them year in and year out. Swap our receivers for the Packers receivers and we blow away the Saints, Giants and Patriots last year but our receivers sucked so well, there ya go.

Rodgers got to sat behind one of the best QB's of all time and learned the offense in and out. He wasnt thrown into the fire with crap around him like Smith was. Quite simply, I dont care if it was Rodgers or any other QB instead of Smith, they were destined to fail since the day they were drafted number one overall in 2005.

And sorry if you somehow think that Rodgers would have done better than Smith in the same situation with the same crappy players and coaches around him.

But hey, to each his own bud.

Right, but who got us to that point in the divisional game though? Who was mainly responsible for winning the first 13 games? It wasn't the offense. I wasn't talking about one game specifically. I'm talking about which units on the team were dominant the majority of the season and put us in the best position to win football games week in and week out. :facepalm:

As for giving Smith credit, I'll say it's about time he did something useful.

Wait where did I say Rodgers would have won us a Super Bowl? Reading comprehension fail.

And why are you apologizing to me in your second to last sentence? What's wrong with you?

[dan77733]

Right, but who got us to that point in the divisional game though? Who was mainly responsible for winning the first 13 games? It wasn't the offense. I wasn't talking about one game specifically. I'm talking about which units on the team were dominant the majority of the season and put us in the best position to win football games week in and week out. :facepalm:

As for giving Smith credit, I'll say it's about time he did something useful.

Wait where did I say Rodgers would have won us a Super Bowl? Reading comprehension fail.

And why are you apologizing to me in your second to last sentence? What's wrong with you?

Subtract Alex's performance against the Eagles in the second half and no one would even be talking about the defense or going 13-3 because it never would have happened. That game turned around what would have been a 2-2 start as an average at best team.

About time Smith did something useful? Its not his fault he was drafted by morons, had six OC's in six years, two crappy HC's and except for Gore, no talent whatsoever around him. Personally, im shocked he was able to put the first six years of his career behind him and have as good as a season he did last year. Quite honestly, any other QB would have failed too and that includes Montana, Young, Garcia, etc.

You didnt say it but implied it by showing a pic of Rodgers holding the Lombardi trophy and saying...the guy we passed on...whoops as if we would have won the SB if we drafted him instead of Smith.

Rodgers is a great QB but he was also drafted into a situation that was the opposite of Smith and had a far greater chance of succeeding compared to Smith.

I'm not actually apologizing to you. I'm apologizing for you thinking that if Rodgers was drafted instead of Smith, things would have somehow turned out differently for the 49ers. They wouldnt have. Only difference would be that now, you would be saying that Rodgers finally did something useful instead of Smith.

[Ness]

Subtract Alex's performance against the Eagles in the second half and no one would even be talking about the defense or going 13-3 because it never would have happened. That game turned around what would have been a 2-2 start as an average at best team.

About time Smith did something useful? Its not his fault he was drafted by morons, had six OC's in six years, two crappy HC's and except for Gore, no talent whatsoever around him. Personally, im shocked he was able to put the first six years of his career behind him and have as good as a season he did last year. Quite honestly, any other QB would have failed too and that includes Montana, Young, Garcia, etc.

You didnt say it but implied it by showing a pic of Rodgers holding the Lombardi trophy and saying...the guy we passed on...whoops as if we would have won the SB if we drafted him instead of Smith.

Rodgers is a great QB but he was also drafted into a situation that was the opposite of Smith and had a far greater chance of succeeding compared to Smith.

I'm not actually apologizing to you. I'm apologizing for you thinking that if Rodgers was drafted instead of Smith, things would have somehow turned out differently for the 49ers. They wouldnt have. Only difference would be that now, you would be saying that Rodgers finally did something useful instead of Smith.

http://pinkie.ponychan.net/chan/files/src/134576950023.gif

[Brent]

every time the Rodgers/Smith conversation comes up:

http://coolgifs.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/homer-simpson-hiding-in-the-bushes.gif

[Ness]

Don't be a coward Brent. Pick a side. LOL.

[Justone2]

So many variables that its hard to say where they both where when they would have been in the other situation. fact is that Rodgers had a "easier" transition to the NFL with sitting behind Favre with a good HC while Smith had a new OC every year with bad HC's.

Based on that i think Rodgers wouldn't have been as good as he is now while Smith might have been a better career till now.

[NotMyJob]

i laugh whenever anybody defends Alex Smith over Rodgers.

[phlysac]

My opinion, sad to say is... if you love Aaron Rodgers that much more than Alex Smith.... feel free to be a Packers fan. Alex Smith is the 49ers QB. Eff Aaron Rodgers!

[phlysac]

Interesting tidbit regarding Brandon Jacobs and the feared perception that he is a poor short-yardage runner...

I was surprised to discover the 49ers ranked 32nd — as in last in the NFL — on third-and-short runs in 2011. San Francisco converted 27.1 percent of their attempts when running on 3rd-and-1 or 3rd-and-2. In addition, their touchdown percentage (35.3) on runs inside the 3-yard line ranked 27th.

Enter Jacobs, who converted 5 of 7 chances on third-and-short (2 yards or fewer) and was 17 of 24 on all short-yardage situations in 2011, according to Pro Football Focus. He was also 4 of 4 in short yardage in the preseason opener against the Vikings.
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/08/24/jacobs-officially-on-board-to-correct-serious-shortcoming/

[Ness]

My opinion, sad to say is... if you love Aaron Rodgers that much more than Alex Smith.... feel free to be a Packers fan. Alex Smith is the 49ers QB. Eff Aaron Rodgers!

Well there is no shame in giving credit where it's due. I love Aaron Rodgers the player, and I wish we had him, but we don't. Doesn't mean I love the Packers though. Smith will have to be our stop gap until we can upgrade the position. Either that or Smith magically becomes an All-Pro which I don't see happening.

Interesting tidbit regarding Brandon Jacobs and the feared perception that he is a poor short-yardage runner...


http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/08/24/jacobs-officially-on-board-to-correct-serious-shortcoming/

I wonder where the 49ers ranked in the passing game on third downs overall.

Can you find that for me? Just curious.

[phlysac]

Well there is no shame in giving credit where it's due.

Then please feel free to give some to your favorite team's QB. He deserves some.

Love ya, Ness but a Smith vs Rodgers debate after last season and the hopes of this offseason are really sour to me.

[Ness]

Then please feel free to give some to your favorite team's QB. He deserves some.

Love ya, Ness but a Smith vs Rodgers debate after last season and the hopes of this offseason are really sour to me.

He played okay. Sorry my friend, I'm used to the days of Steve Young, and even Jeff Garcia if I have to say so. Quarterbacks that could just take over games and straight up dominate passing for 300 plus yards on less than 40 attempts while having four touchdowns. That's a real quarterback.

Obviously Smith isn't the main problem, but there is a reason why he only got a three year deal instead of those inflated seven year contracts that Brees, Brady, and even Fitzpatrick get. As of this moment he's a game manager. He's not the kind of guy that will carry a team offensively through an entire season if the defense is middle of the pack and the run game falters. He isn't the franchise. We could be doing a lot worse I'll say that. I hate to rain on your parade, but it's how I see it. I hope he certainly proves me wrong, but he has a long way to go...assuming he ever gets there which I have doubts about.

[phlysac]

He played okay. Sorry my friend, I'm used to the days of Steve Young, and even Jeff Garcia if I have to say so. Quarterbacks that could just take over games and straight up dominate passing for 300 plus yards on less than 40 attempts while having four touchdowns. That's a real quarterback.

Obviously Smith isn't the main problem, but there is a reason why he only got a three year deal instead of those inflated seven year contracts that Brees, Brady, and even Fitzpatrick get. As of this moment he's a game manager. He's not the kind of guy that will carry a team offensively through an entire season if the defense is middle of the pack and the run game falters. He isn't the franchise. We could be doing a lot worse I'll say that. I hate to rain on your parade, but it's how I see it. I hope he certainly proves me wrong, but he has a long way to go...assuming he ever gets there which I have doubts about.

Don'tplay the "I'm used to Steve Young" card. I'm used to the days of Joe Montana and Steve Young. It shouldn't affect how I feel about my favorite team's QB 15-25 years later.

It's callled being spoiled and using that as an excuse whenever a QB isn't playing like a 1st ballot HOFer.

I'm not asking you to like Alex Smith. I'm asking that you save the drama about finding an opportunity to passive-aggressively bash your team's QB after they were in the NFC Championship game and are a common favorite to win it all in 2012.

It's sour grapes without any foreseeable way for your opinion to change. If he did all of the things you want (which he has already crushed many of the things you used to say he'd NEVER do) then you'd just come up with another list of ideals you'd want in your QB that he doesn't fulfill.

[ViperVisor]

I wonder where the 49ers ranked in the passing game on third downs overall.

Can you find that for me? Just curious.

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Passing&range=NFL&rank=098

[YAYareaRB]

Don'tplay the "I'm used to Steve Young" card. I'm used to the days of Joe Montana and Steve Young. It shouldn't affect how I feel about my favorite team's QB 15-25 years later.

It's callled being spoiled and using that as an excuse whenever a QB isn't playing like a 1st ballot HOFer.

I'm not asking you to like Alex Smith. I'm asking that you save the drama about finding an opportunity to passive-aggressively bash your team's QB after they were in the NFC Championship game and are a common favorite to win it all in 2012.

It's sour grapes without any foreseeable way for your opinion to change. If he did all of the things you want (which he has already crushed many of the things you used to say he'd NEVER do) then you'd just come up with another list of ideals you'd want in your QB that he doesn't fulfill.

This!!!! Stop making so much sense!

[phlysac]

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Passing&range=NFL&rank=098

Gracias. Another breakdown...

#12 in NFC on 3rd down passing conversions, #23 overall.
#16 in NFC on 3rd and <3 yards, #32 overall.
#11 in NFC on 3rd and 3-7 yards, #23 overall.
#11 in NFC on 3rd and 8+ yards, #20 overall.
#12 in % First Downs/Attempt, #20 overall.

Here's the links for rushing stats on 3rd down...

http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?type=Rushing&range=NFL&rank=016

Yet they ranked 10th overall in rushing 1st downs. Just can't convert the short ones. Smith's 3rd down % was actually higher than the short-yardage rushing conversion % but many still believe 3rd down was an Alex Smith problem. Clearly it was a team problem.

[Ness]

Don'tplay the "I'm used to Steve Young" card. I'm used to the days of Joe Montana and Steve Young. It shouldn't affect how I feel about my favorite team's QB 15-25 years later.

It's callled being spoiled and using that as an excuse whenever a QB isn't playing like a 1st ballot HOFer.

I'm not asking you to like Alex Smith. I'm asking that you save the drama about finding an opportunity to passive-aggressively bash your team's QB after they were in the NFC Championship game and are a common favorite to win it all in 2012.

It's sour grapes without any foreseeable way for your opinion to change. If he did all of the things you want (which he has already crushed many of the things you used to say he'd NEVER do) then you'd just come up with another list of ideals you'd want in your QB that he doesn't fulfill.

Why not use that card? As as fan you should be used to greatness at the position that provides your team the best chance to win every year. So you're going to tolerate less as a fan just because they're you're team? Newsflash you can still be a fan without being a homer. There is nothing wrong about being objective about your team's current situation good or bad.

You're acting like I have a bias and would never support anything Alex will or has ever done. This isn't true. But I'm not going to pretend like he's playing better than he actually is, until he proves it on a consistent basis. Even Scott Mitchell had one good season in the NFL. A lot of players had one good moment or year.

You can it being spoiled as a fan. I call it wanting continued success year after year for my team. And the only that realistically is going to happen is consistently good play at the quarterback position. Sue me.

By the way Alex doesn't have to play like a 1st ballot Hall of Famer. Just someone that convert their fair share of third downs and not have to depend on a running game, special teams unit, and shut down defense to be successful. Someone that has the potential to even make the friggin Pro Bowl for crying out loud.

Again, I'll support Alex when he plays well, but I'm not ready to crown his ass just because he was in the NFC Championship game. The man still has A LOT to prove.

Sorry my friend, but my opinion is the facts. If you have an issue with that, well...

http://www10.pic-upload.de/25.08.12/7xdynnp37tm.gif

[YAYareaRB]

**** that.. we don't have to see Rogers. He has to see this defense!

[Ness]

Yet they ranked 10th overall in rushing 1st downs. Just can't convert the short ones. Smith's 3rd down % was actually higher than the short-yardage rushing conversion % but many still believe 3rd down was an Alex Smith problem. Clearly it was a team problem.

Well Alex is a part of the team. But if you take rushing out of the equation and just compare the passing third down percentage where did he rank amongst his peers? This would be more an evaluation of him.

[YAYareaRB]

What are you trying to get out of us? Rogers is better than Smith. OK he is, thank you captain obvious! He DID win a sb.. we all watched it. But, hes not on our team nor will he ever be so **** him. He's a great qb that was put in a great position, no doubt, but he's not on our team so I don't support him. Alex Smith for MVP 2012!!

[Ness]

What are you trying to get out of us? Rogers is better than Smith. OK he is, thank you captain obvious! He DID win a sb.. we all watched it. But, hes not on our team nor will he ever be so **** him. He's a great qb that was put in a great position, no doubt, but he's not on our team so I don't support him. Alex Smith for MVP 2012!!

LOL. This discussion moved beyond Rodgers a while back. I was talking with phlysac about something which evolved into basic support for a player on your team. My point is that I'm not going to bend over and act like Smith is better than what he really is until he proves it on a consistent basis. Doesn't matter if he was in the NFC Championship game. How many scrub quarterbacks have been there in the NFL's history? My standards are higher. But I guess that makes me a hater and apparently my fan association is in jeopardy. Being objective FTL.

[phlysac]

LOL. This discussion moved beyond Rodgers a while back. I was talking with phlysac about something which evolved into basic support for a player on your team. My point is that I'm not going to bend over and act like Smith is better than what he really is until he proves it on a consistent basis. Doesn't matter if he was in the NFC Championship game. How many scrub quarterbacks have been there in the NFL's history? My standards are higher. But I guess that makes me a hater and apparently my fan association is in jeopardy. Being objective FTL.

Objectivity is recognizing both the good AND the bad. You have a "I don't think he can" approach. That's not objectivity. It's pessimism.

[phlysac]

Well Alex is a part of the team. But if you take rushing out of the equation and just compare the passing third down percentage where did he rank amongst his peers? This would be more an evaluation of him.

Third down passing was bad, Ness. I agree. But 3rd down rushing was WORSE!!! So it's NOT an Alex Smith problem. It's a 3rd down TEAM problem.

You aren't being "objective" and bashing the offensive line and running backs for their putrid 3rd down numbers. Just being "objective" in bashing Alex Smith's 3rd down numbers. I'm assuming then, that you are just being "objective."

[Ness]

Objectivity is recognizing both the good AND the bad. You have a "I don't think he can" approach. That's not objectivity. It's pessimism.

No it's objectivity. From what I've observed up to this point he hasn't shown that he can succeed on consistent basis unless everything is working for him. I'm NOT saying that he'll never turn it around or can't. But as of now I'm not going to crown him. There is a reason everyone slights him as a game manager and there is a reason why he only got a three year deal.

[phlysac]

Objectivity?

If Alex Smith went to the Packers he could very well be out of the NFL right now.

Smith will have to be our stop gap until we can upgrade the position. Either that or Smith magically becomes an All-Pro which I don't see happening.


Your objectivity caused you to state that Alex Smith would in no way be back in 2011. And if he were to come back it would be "awful for the franchise and humiliating."

Your objectivity caused you to state that you had no idea why Nate Davis was cut and Alex Smith was re-signed.

Your objectivity caused you to say this...

Alex will never be a good quarterback. I'm willing to bet you 100 dollars that within the next five years he won't do anything significant anywhere.

Your objectivity caused you to say that Alex Smith wasn't even "average." You said that he was "downright terrible."


I don't feel I need to go on with how consistently "objective" you've been in your opinion of Alex Smith.

[phlysac]

We all get it. You're not a fan of your favorite team's QB. We all know it. Unless he puts up video game numbers consistently for several years you will not waver. I'm fine with that. It's your opinion, and you're absolutely entitled to it.

All we're asking is to not passively, yet dramatically find ways to reiterate your opinion of him while disguising it under a cloak of "objectivity."

I'd be much more comfortable if you just said something like, "I really don't like him, and it'd be damn near impossible for him to change my opinion."

[Ness]

Objectivity?





Your objectivity caused you to state that Alex Smith would in no way be back in 2011. And if he were to come back it would be "awful for the franchise and humiliating."

Your objectivity caused you to state that you had no idea why Nate Davis was cut and Alex Smith was re-signed.

Your objectivity caused you to say this...



Your objectivity caused you to say that Alex Smith wasn't even "average." You said that he was "downright terrible."


I don't feel I need to go on with how consistently "objective" you've been in your opinion of Alex Smith.

So you're going to take something that was said two years ago and try to run with it to make a point? Yeah, because people's opinions never change. :njx:

I'm telling you how I feel about Alex Smith up to this point as of right now based on what I've seen recently. That should be all that matters. :facepalm:

You can keep going back and wasting your time digging through comments that are two years old. I'm sure I could find something that you had a completely different opinion about that far back than you do now if I wanted to actually waste my time.

[dan77733]

I can end this discussion easily.

Arguing with Ness about Smith is like everyone here arguing with me about T.O.

Quite simply, nothing more than a waste of everyone's time.

[Ness]

We all get it. You're not a fan of your favorite team's QB. We all know it. Unless he puts up video game numbers consistently for several years you will not waver. I'm fine with that. It's your opinion, and you're absolutely entitled to it.

All we're asking is to not passively, yet dramatically find ways to reiterate your opinion of him while disguising it under a cloak of "objectivity."

I'd be much more comfortable if you just said something like, "I really don't like him, and it'd be damn near impossible for him to change my opinion."

He doesn't have to put up video game numbers. Aikman and McNair didn't. Just show the ability to dominate without the assistance of a knock out special team's unit, ground game, and defense that basically make the world a whole lot easier. Basically have success without EVERYTHING having to be in perfect order for him to succeed. Also not have every game come down to the wire in the 4th quarter after getting boatloads of chances the previous three from the other units.

Like I said, there is a reason why people slight him as a game manager and he only got a three year deal. The front office even went after Peyton Manning. How genuine is their faith in Alex? Is he even making more money than Flynn? I don't think money was even an issue for Alex personally, it was the commitment factor to him according to Matt Barrows who believes Alex was initially disappointed in the faith from the 49ers. Of course Alex came back because no one else was going to pay him and he didn't want to be in another system again. He had no choice but to take a three year deal.

So obviously I'm not the only one that believes he isn't the key to the franchise or might not ever be one. And as a 49ers fan, I don't think I should be entitled to put lipstick on a pig just because they are my team. Dashon Goldon is a decent safety, but I'm not going to holler that he deserves All Pro honors because he plays for the 49ers.

As for my objectivity, I don't know what you want me to say that would be aesthetically pleasing to your ears. Watching Alex play last year, he improved, but I wasn't that impressed with his performances from week to week. The team is better, but I'm still going to need a world of convincing to change my opinion on the matter. I'll support him if he does well, but if he doesn't I will bust his balls for it. I have that right as a fan that won't simply get on my knees just because he happens to be on the team.

Third down passing was bad, Ness. I agree. But 3rd down rushing was WORSE!!! So it's NOT an Alex Smith problem. It's a 3rd down TEAM problem.

You aren't being "objective" and bashing the offensive line and running backs for their putrid 3rd down numbers. Just being "objective" in bashing Alex Smith's 3rd down numbers. I'm assuming then, that you are just being "objective."

I'm just passing the notion that Alex may be apart of the problem. I believe I've stating my feelings on the offensive line a while back. Some quarterbacks have an ability to make their offensive lines look worse or better though. Our right guard position was terrible and Anthony Davis wasn't that great along with Goodwin. Regardless, I've seen quarterbacks with worse offensive lines look fantastic. So it's a wild card for me.

The rushing numbers on third and short were bad, but that is irrelevant for passing the ball on third down. I'm not talking about third and short. I'm talking about third and long when your quarterback needs to get you a conversion and move the chains instead of taking a sack or overthrowing a wide open receiver. The Cowboys also sucked on third downs, and their offensive line sucks. Yet Romo still played well every season because of his natural ability as a passer. Which is why Dallas still ranked 8th in the league on third down conversions through the air despite their problems on the offensive line and converting on third and short via the ground.

[phlysac]

I don't want to argue anymore, brotha. We both want him to be ridiculously good as a 49er.

Bring on the Broncos!

[Ness]

Agreed. I'll try to be more open minded in the future regarding Alex Smith.

[phlysac]

Agreed. I'll try to be more open minded in the future regarding Alex Smith.

And like I said... I really don't care if you're pessimistic about him, just be more "just" when you decide to call his ability into question. Mentioning that the 49ers open against the Packers isn't the appropriate time to question Alex Smith, especially when the team is so good.

Now if he plays poorly, that's one thing. But just out of the blue without provocation screams agenda...

... and I don't want to think of you as Greg Cosell. ;)

[49ersfan_87]

Kaepernick has looked really good today. That throw to Reuland was really good, where he evaded pressure and threw across his left side. Really unnatural and a good strike under pressue. Good catch by Reuland too. Only bad pass was a deep strike on his first throw.

Dixon has also made a case to stay on the team. Then Cartwight broke free for a 20 yard run.

Biggest disappointments- 1st team Secondary, 1st team pass rush (even with blitzes we Manning had all day, even when he didn't release quick), and 1st team O as a whole. One explosive play and then terrible throughout. 142 QBR for Alex is very misleading. OL struggled. Gore looked slow and IMO started to decline heavily last year. Might decline again.

Basically, our entire 1st team O and D looked shaky, besides our run D (which was only OK though). For all the hoopla, our 1st team passing O looks average at best. 1 explosive play to VD and a lot of struggling otherwise. Although i think our 1st team O would look better with Hunter at this point.

[Ness]

Aldon Smith might be more important than I previously thought. This is the second straight game that getting pressure on the quarterback with our starting unit has been a problem, and it's the second straight game that Aldon has missed snaps with the starting unit. He's obviously a good player, but I'm hoping that if he does get hurt down the line it won't be the end of the world for our front seven.

[phlysac]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-jME95yG1z9k/Two0zz-SSSI/AAAAAAAAAKA/ns-mAjCW1xw/s1600/ashleymbhs6.edublogs.org%25252C%2BDisney-Chicken-Little-Sky-Falling.jpg

[phlysac]

Aldon Smith might be more important than I previously thought. This is the second straight game that getting pressure on the quarterback with our starting unit has been a problem, and it's the second straight game that Aldon has missed snaps with the starting unit. He's obviously a good player, but I'm hoping that if he does get hurt down the line it won't be the end of the world for our front seven.

And they don't blitz or run stunts with the 1st team. Missing Smith, Brooks, Bowman etc for the majority of snaps.

Relax a bit.

[49ersfan_87]

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-jME95yG1z9k/Two0zz-SSSI/AAAAAAAAAKA/ns-mAjCW1xw/s1600/ashleymbhs6.edublogs.org%25252C%2BDisney-Chicken-Little-Sky-Falling.jpg

I didn't say we would suck ass in the regular season brah, just pointing out poor preseason play. Why don't you tell me what you specifically disagreed with.

[phlysac]

I didn't say we would suck ass in the regular season brah, just pointing out poor preseason play. Why don't you tell me what you specifically disagreed with.

I didn't really agree with much of anything.

Defense - Everything is vanilla. No blitz schemes, no stunts, no disguised coverages, no Aldon smith/NaVorro Bowman/Chris Culliver.

Offense - Everything is vaniilla. Two pass plays beyond 10 yards. One resulted in a TD. Scored 10 points in 3 possessions. Staley and Miller missed big blocks but that stuff happens. Gore may be slower (not sure he is) but Hunter surely isn't. James surely isn't.

Also... Peyton Manning's Colts teams were winless nearly every year in Preseason. Saints and Packers SB years were winless in preseason. Lions were 4-0 and 0-16. Did you see how absolutely terrible the Patriots offense looked? Doubt they'll be a poor offensive team.

Things can always improve. But preseason doesn't translate to regular season.

[49ersfan_87]

I didn't really agree with much of anything.

Defense - Everything is vanilla. No blitz schemes, no stunts, no disguised coverages, no Aldon smith/NaVorro Bowman/Chris Culliver.

Offense - Everything is vaniilla. Two pass plays beyond 10 yards. One resulted in a TD. Scored 10 points in 3 possessions. Staley and Miller missed big blocks but that stuff happens. Gore may be slower (not sure he is) but Hunter surely isn't. James surely isn't.

Also... Peyton Manning's Colts teams were winless nearly every year in Preseason. Saints and Packers SB years were winless in preseason. Lions were 4-0 and 0-16. Did you see how absolutely terrible the Patriots offense looked? Doubt they'll be a poor offensive team.

Things can always improve. But preseason doesn't translate to regular season.

I agree, which is why i didn't say "OMG 49ers suck again" or some random BS. I think most issues will get worked on/fixed by Week 1, like last preseason. I even said as much in the general preseason week 3 thread in the NFL forum.

Only thing i am worried about for the regular season is 1st team passing O. They don't get the benefit of the doubt. And thats not bagging on Alex only, that includes the poor OL protection and WR's too.

[phlysac]

I agree, which is why i didn't say "OMG 49ers suck again" or some random BS. I think most issues will get worked on/fixed by Week 1, like last preseason. I even said as much in the general preseason week 3 thread in the NFL forum.

Only thing i am worried about for the regular season is 1st team passing O. They don't get the benefit of the doubt. And thats not bagging on Alex only, that includes the poor OL protection and WR's too.

At the same time it's easy to be hypercritical. The 1st team O has scored on 5 of 8 possessions this preseason. They've done that will a very vanilla scheme and zero gameplanning. Breakdowns in protection/blocking this game... Miller missed a cut block on Von Miller. Fix it, but Miller is legit. Staley missed a cut block on Dumerville. Fix it, but Dumerville lead the NFL in sacks in 2010.

The rust is perfect for learning and growing. I'd prefer rustiness to complacency.

[49ersfan_87]

Sounds like Harbaugh's not happy with the O today

"We got lucky on the pass to Vernon Davis. It was a luck thing." - Jim Harbaugh

https://twitter.com/CGin49ers/status/239872591924453376

[phlysac]

Sounds like Harbaugh's not happy with the O today



https://twitter.com/CGin49ers/status/239872591924453376

Lucky that it was blown coverage, yes. But that's the name of the game. Taking advantage of other team's mistakes.

But I hope Harbaugh doesn't let up. Always improve. Always try to be great.

[Ness]

The 49ers, as they've done this exhibition season, played a vanilla defense. In three games, the 49ers have yet to get a sack from a projected starter.

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/Scary-start-for-49ers-defense-against-Br?blockID=763399&feedID=5936

Even if we aren't throwing that many blitzes in, this is still quite sad.

[phlysac]

http://www.csnbayarea.com/football-san-francisco-niners/niners-talk/Scary-start-for-49ers-defense-against-Br?blockID=763399&feedID=5936

Even if we aren't throwing that many blitzes in, this is still quite sad.
Projected starters have played 5 or 6 possessions. Aldon Smith has played 2. Ahmad Brooks has played 3.

That's the equivalent of one half of football. One half of football without blitzes, stunts, or disguised coverages. Not sad at all.

[phlysac]

It's as simple as this...

http://www.popsci.com/files/imagecache/article_image_large/articles/PSC0512_FY_037.jpg

which is it?

[Ness]

Come on you're telling me the 49ers haven't sent any blitzes in this preseason? They've sent a decent amount (at least five rushers) on several occasions with their starting unit.

Last season they depended on their defensive lines getting a good amount of pressure too without always sending the house a la Greg Williams. But just from one on ones, the defensive starters aren't getting much of a push. There really isn't an excuse for that. They just aren't playing well. I'm of course giving Just Smith and Ray McDonald the benefit of the doubt heading into the season, but I just haven't been impressed with what I've seen with one on one's.

[Verloren]

It's as simple as this...

http://www.popsci.com/files/imagecache/article_image_large/articles/PSC0512_FY_037.jpg

which is it?

It's a two toned empty cup.

J/k.

Haven't watched the game yet, but I'm not worried about this too much. There's no point wasting all of the team's effort and energy in winning preseason games when they don't count.

[Brent]

Considering Harbaugh is paranoid about practice to the point that the Niners use the furthest field from where the beat writers can see, I imagine that in a preseason game, he's even less likely to show the slightest hint at what they've got in the playbook.

[phlysac]

Come on you're telling me the 49ers haven't sent any blitzes in this preseason? They've sent a decent amount (at least five rushers) on several occasions with their starting unit.

Last season they depended on their defensive lines getting a good amount of pressure too without always sending the house a la Greg Williams. But just from one on ones, the defensive starters aren't getting much of a push. There really isn't an excuse for that. They just aren't playing well. I'm of course giving Just Smith and Ray McDonald the benefit of the doubt heading into the season, but I just haven't been impressed with what I've seen with one on one's.

We didn’t really game plan for this. You can really tell that they game planned for us.
~Donte Whitner

This all, of course, could be as meaningless as these preseason games, which can disinterest fans and players alike. The 49ers, after all, aren’t game-planning for their opponents or trotting out exotic schemes. They have also had four starters – defensive tackle Justin Smith and linebackers Aldon Smith, NaVorro Bowman and Ahmad Brooks – combine to miss five games. On Sunday, Aldon Smith and Bowman were out and No. 3 cornerback Chris Culliver didn’t make the trip to Denver.

[phlysac]

Considering Harbaugh is paranoid about practice to the point that the Niners use the furthest field from where the beat writers can see, I imagine that in a preseason game, he's even less likely to show the slightest hint at what they've got in the playbook.

Safety Donte Whitner suggested life wouldn’t be so easy for the Packers’ Aaron Rodgers in the regular-season opener Sept. 9 at Green Bay.

“It’s going to be easy to clean up,” Whitner said. “We didn’t really game plan for this. You can really tell that they game planned for us. They did a good job on what they do. But we’re all geared up for Week 1. That’s what we’re focused on.”
http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/08/26/lb-brooks-on-defense-its-been-a-scary-start-to-this-point/ (http://blog.sfgate.com/49ers/2012/08/26/lb-brooks-on-defense-its-been-a-scary-start-to-this-point/)

[Ness]

~Donte Whitner

Didn't Whitner also say Tolzein was "baby Drew Brees". Okay...

In any case exotic schemes or not, that still isn't an excuse for not getting push up front one on one.

By the way Whitner is the first person I'll want to hear from if it's a blowout at Lambeau. Honestly Whinter should just stop talking. I highly doubt the Broncos gameplanned for the 49ers in the preseason. He just comes off as butthurt that their first unit got owned. Yes we know you didn't gameplan for this game Whitner, but don't try to one-up the Broncos by saying they gameplanned. Just stop.

[Goon61]

i remember last year when the niners were destroyed by the saints in the preseason in what seemed like a ploy by Harbaugh to see a bigger portion of the saint's playbook. Preseason doesn't mean much, at least the first team threw a TD in this game. I will hold my judgement until the season starts. The team is facing a tough schedule right at the get-go so we will know what the team is made up of early.

[49ersfan_87]

Whitner said the same thing after HOU beat SF 30-7 last preseason, about no gameplanning. At the time people thought he was making excuses but we were 10x better in the regular season. So i believe him.

[Ness]

Whitner said the same thing after HOU beat SF 30-7 last preseason, about no gameplanning. At the time people thought he was making excuses but we were 10x better in the regular season. So i believe him.

He did? I don't remember that quote. By the way maybe Tolzein should be the automatic starter then haha.

[VAfy-ya]

It still amazes me how ppl over-react to preseason. CHILL THE **** OUT. Our issues today were simply execution. Even if we are playing vanilla, we still need to execute, which we didn't at times. And that's what Jimbaugh is mad at. He can forgive being out-schemed....because we never gameplan in the pre-season. What he can't forgive is missed blocks, missed tackles, blown assignments, guys not being lined up properly, bad QB/C exchanges, bad replacement refs screwing with his offensive tempo, things that are preventable because they work on them everyday. That's the stuff he'll clean up for the Packers.

As far as the defense, I'm really not worried about that unit. Even the blitzes we sent were basic A-gap blitzes. Very vanilla stuff from that unit. Like I said, the missed tackles were a little alarming but when the lights come on, guys on that side of the ball will perform. We haven't played one preseason defensive snap with all 11 defensive starters on the field. People have to understand preseason is more of a evaluation tool. It's not set-up for teams to win, its more a attempt to see how players respond and react to different scenarios. It's just a slight extension of TC, just that you going against a different colored jersey

[Ness]

By the way this was hilarious. I couldn't stop laughing about this comment directed towards me when I went to the gym later.

Blame Alex!!!

Vote for Ness in 2012

I think I might put it in my sig.

[49ersfan_87]

He did? I don't remember that quote. By the way maybe Tolzein should be the automatic starter then haha.

Yep. Quote during the 30-7 Week 3 loss to the Texans last preseason.

We didn’t game plan at all. We just came out here, we actually had a light practice yesterday. We just came out here and wanted to use our base things again and see what we could do against them.

http://49ers.pressdemocrat.com/2011/08/inside-the-49ers/donte-whitner-in-game-quotes/

[Ness]

Right, but not gameplanning and missing tackles, being out of position, screwing up fundamentals are two different things. Harbaugh needs to clean that up.

[Ness]

Rewatching the game. On the second touchdown pass that Decker caught, Goldson could have helped Brock, but basically stood there. He could have shifted over.

[Ness]

By the way, this was our play of the day. Beautiful throw.

http://i.minus.com/iuZxY8ujUsEWX.gif

[phlysac]

He did? I don't remember that quote. By the way maybe Tolzein should be the automatic starter then haha.

Ness don't become the King of taking things out of context.

Whitner mentioned that Tolzien played extremely well against the Vikings. Saying "he played about as well as anyone can out there, he was like a baby Brees."

Singular comment on a singular moment. If you'll remember, Tolzien looked ridiculously good that game. Don't bash Whitner for it now.

Then again, the media deserves a large chunk of blame for clouding the context from the jump.

[phlysac]

By the way, this was our play of the day. Beautiful throw.

http://i.minus.com/iuZxY8ujUsEWX.gif

I enjoyed watching it in simulcast with your avatar.

[49ersfan_87]

49ers make 14 roster moves to get down to 75 players

OL Jason Slowey (sixth-round pick), LB Kourtnei Brown, FB Cameron Bell, WR Joe Hastings, WR Brian Tyms, WR Ben Hannula, S Cory Nelms, K Giorgio Tavecchio, DL Matt Masifilo, CB Deante Purvis, TE Joe Sawyer, DL Patrick Butrym, LB Darius Fleming (reserve/PUP), RB Jewel Hampton (reserve/non-football injury)

http://sulia.com/channel/san-francisco-49ers/f/387228e1-c809-481e-b96d-14b269756d11/?source=twitter

Biggest name is Slowey, the 6th rounder. Drafted in the 6th and didn't even make it past the first round of cuts.

Other than that, meh.

[Madirishman]

I thought Slowey and Brown would make it further. In Harbaalke I trust.

[Ness]

Palmer and Owusu are still alive!

[phlysac]

Palmer and Owusu are still alive!

Till Friday.

[Ness]

One of them can make the practice squad.

[49ersfan_87]

According to his latest PC, Fangio isn't worried about the overall D, although he was concerned with some technique issues and 1 on 1 matchups of course.

He also seem concerned about his backup Safeties. He said none of them have jumped out, which includes 6th round pick Robinson, Thomas, Jones, Spillman, and McBath. Seems like Spillman is the only guy assured of a spot at the S position because he's a standout STer/new contract.

Personally, i think we're relatively deep across the roster...except at S and maybe OLB.

[VAfy-ya]

In a glass have full kind of view, if a rookie 5th round pick and rookie UDFA are holding their own and are right there with guys who have been in the league a couple of years, I suspect that's a good thing and I would honestly go with youth in this instance. So Spillman, Robinson, and Thomas would suit me jus fine as guys behind the starters. I think both Robinson and Thomas have a ton of talent, just no experience. I think Thomas could be gem in a couple years. That cover FS type, that can drop down and cover the slot is something rare and would be highly coveted in this pass-happy league we're in.

[dan77733]

My final 53 player roster -

QB / 3 - Smith, Kapernick, Johnson
RB / 7 - Gore, Jacobs, Hunter, James
FB / 9 - Miller, Cartwright
WR / 15 - Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Jenkins, Ginn
TE / 17 - Davis, Walker
C / 19 - Goodwin, Kilgore
OG / 22 - Iupati, Boone, Looney
OT / 25 - Staley, Davis, Person

DE / 29 - Smith, McDonald, Dobbs, Tukuafu
DT / 32 - Sopoaga, Jean-Francois, Williams
OLB / 36 - Smith, Brooks, Haralson, Bakhtiari
ILB / 40 - Willis, Bowman, Grant, Gooden
CB / 45 - Rogers, Brown, Culliver, Brock, Cox
SS / 48 - Whitner, Spillman, Thomas
FS / 50 - Goldson, Robinson

K / 51 - Akers
P / 52 - Lee
LS / 53 - Jennings

[edgrenade]

My final 53 player roster -

QB / 3 - Smith, Kapernick, Johnson
RB / 7 - Gore, Jacobs, Hunter, James
FB / 9 - Miller, Cartwright
WR / 15 - Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Jenkins, Ginn
TE / 17 - Davis, Walker
C / 19 - Goodwin, Kilgore
OG / 22 - Iupati, Boone, Looney
OT / 25 - Staley, Davis, Person

DE / 29 - Smith, McDonald, Dobbs, Tukuafu
DT / 32 - Sopoaga, Jean-Francois, Williams
OLB / 36 - Smith, Brooks, Haralson, Bakhtiari
ILB / 40 - Willis, Bowman, Grant, Gooden
CB / 45 - Rogers, Brown, Culliver, Brock, Cox
SS / 48 - Whitner, Spillman, Thomas
FS / 50 - Goldson, Robinson

K / 51 - Akers
P / 52 - Lee
LS / 53 - Jennings

Looks good. The only ones I would say are a toss up are : I. Williams, Bakhtiari, Thomas, and Robinson. I could see one of these guys being dropped for another LB and/or another player at their position

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Wasn't a big fan of the Jenkins pick but he has impressed the hell out of me the past 3 games. If Ginn is out, I hope he is active and gets some rotational snaps. Looks silky smooth out there.

[dan77733]

Looks good. The only ones I would say are a toss up are : I. Williams, Bakhtiari, Thomas, and Robinson. I could see one of these guys being dropped for another LB and/or another player at their position

I'll be shocked if Williams doesnt make the final 53. He's only in his second year and the only NT under contract beyond 2012. From what I have read, Bakhtiari, has played well and we need a 4th OLB. Dont know who else would win that spot besides him. I put Robinson and Thomas on the list because I dont think that they'll make it to the PS.

Excluding Williams, I can see the others being released after today if we pick up other players off waivers.

Wasn't a big fan of the Jenkins pick but he has impressed the hell out of me the past 3 games. If Ginn is out, I hope he is active and gets some rotational snaps. Looks silky smooth out there.

Agreed.

[phlysac]

I'll be shocked if Williams doesnt make the final 53. He's only in his second year and the only NT under contract beyond 2012. From what I have read, Bakhtiari, has played well and we need a 4th OLB. Dont know who else would win that spot besides him. I put Robinson and Thomas on the list because I dont think that they'll make it to the PS.

Excluding Williams, I can see the others being released after today if we pick up other players off waivers.


4th OLB... Health permitting... Demarcus Dobbs.

[dan77733]

4th OLB... Health permitting... Demarcus Dobbs.

Isnt Dobbs our main backup at DE?

[phlysac]

Isnt Dobbs our main backup at DE?

RJF as well. Position versatility. The 4th OLB will only be needed in one of the top-3 gets injured.

[phlysac]

My Final-53 prediction (not accounting for FA signings)


Offense (26)

QB (3) - Alex Smith | Colin Kaepernick | Josh Johnson
RB (4) - Frank Gore | Kendall Hunter | Brandon Jacobs | LaMichael James
FB (2) - Bruce Miller | Anthony Dixon (RB)
WR (6) - Michael Crabtree | Randy Moss | Mario Manningham | Ted Ginn | Kyle Williams | A.J. Jenkins
TE (2) - Vernon Davis | Delanie Walker
OT (3) - Joe Staley | Anthony Davis | Mike Person
OG (4) - Mike Iupati | Alex Boone (OT) | Leonard Davis | Joe Looney
C (2) - Jonathan Goodwin | Daniel Kilgore (OG)


Defense (24)

DE (4) - Justin Smith | Ray McDonald | Demarcus Dobbs (TE/OLB) | Will Tukuafu (FB)
NT (3) - Isaac Sopoaga | Ricky Jean Francois (DE) | Ian Williams
OLB (3) - Aldon Smith | Ahmad Brooks | Parys Haralson
ILB (4) - Patrick Willis | NaVorro Bowman | Larry Grant | Tavares Gooden
CB (5) - Tarell Brown | Carlos Rogers | Chris Culliver | Perrish Cox | Tramaine Brock
S (5) - Dashon Goldson | Donte Whitner | C.J. Spillman | Trent Robinson | Colin Jones


Special Teams (3)

K - David Akers
P - Andy Lee
LS - Brian Jennings


Fringe

Josh Johnson
Scott Tolzien
Rock Cartwright
Konrad Reuland
Mike Person
Leonard Davis
Ian Williams
Eric Bakhtiari
Trent Robinson
Colin Jones
Darcel McBath
Michael Thomas

12 or more guys fighting for the last 5 or so spots.


Player that deserves to make the team but won't...

Brett Swain


Player that doesn't deserve to make the team but will...

Mike Person

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

@RavensInsider #49ers trade safety/special teams ace Colin Jones to the Carolina Panthers

(Probably) another draft pick!

[VAfy-ya]

^^7th rounder per Borrows. Also Rock Carthwright has been waived according to his Twitter. He should find work pretty quickly. He looked good during the pre-season.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Brett Swain cut according to Adam Caplan and Anthony Mosley cut according to Maiocco. Bet Swain ends up in Miami.

Add another: Joe Holland

[dan77733]

Surprised about Cartwright and trading Jones. I just hope our special teams coverage doesnt suffer.

[phlysac]

Surprised about Cartwright and trading Jones. I just hope our special teams coverage doesnt suffer.

Team still has 8 of the 10 top ST guys from last season. Losing Jones and Castonzo.

[hawkeye123]

Matt Maiocco:

Source: 49ers release TE Konrad Reuland. He's practice-squad eligible.

[phlysac]

Michael Wilhoite
Chris Owusu

[Ness]

I'm guessing Palmer makes the practice squad?

[49ersfan_87]

I'm guessing Palmer makes the practice squad?

Probably. He showed some flashes and i was a big fan of him making the 53, but those hands...he had like 4 or 5 inexcusable drops in the preseason.

He hasn't earned a spot. Only way he makes it is if SF is convinced another team wants him, and is also convinced that they dont want to lose him. But we'll see where he ends up in a few hours.

No major shockers so far. Little surprised that Bakhtiari was released but no biggie. Wilhoite, Holland, Mosley, Reuland and Owusu are all PS candidates of everyone released. Nice to see we got a pick for Jones instead of outright releasing him.

So far we have 66 players, 13 more to go in 90 minutes.

[dan77733]

Chargers released FB Jacob Hester. Any of you interested in him or not worth the time?

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Mike Person, Al Netter, and Cam Johnson cut. SF going with 8 OL. Scotty T also made the team. No word on Josh Johnson's fate yet.

@KyleBonagura: Confirmed: Darcel McBath will be on initial 53-man roster. #49ers

Adam Caplan:
Wow. I was wrong: Brent Celek's younger brother, Garrett, made the #49ers 53-man roster, per source.

Wanted Konrad but happy just to have a pure TE as the 49ers 3rd TE.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

Chargers released FB Jacob Hester. Any of you interested in him or not worth the time?

Pass, have Bruce Miller and about half the defense playing fullback. Wouldn't mind SF putting a claim in for former Stanford product Evan Moore.

[dan77733]

Surprised Cam Johnson was cut. Hopefully, he makes it to the practice squad.

[WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?]

The #49ers released the following players: LB Alama-Francis, LB Bakhtiari, RB Cartwright, T Derek Hall, LB Holland, DT Jerod-Eddie, LB C. Johnson, QB J. Johnson, DT Masifilo, CB Mosley, TE Nelson, T Netter, WR Owusu, WR Palmer, T Person, TE Reuland, LB Rowe, WR Swain, S Thomas, T Wiggins, LB Wilhoite

Axe falls on Josh Johnson.

[phlysac]

50/53 ain't bad. Only real surprise is Celek and Person.

[dan77733]

I got 49/53 right but as we all know, not all 53 players will still be on the team a week from now after waiver claims, etc.

[dan77733]

Oh wow!!! Just noticed that we kept five RB's. Gore, Jacobs, Hunter, James and Dixon. And FB Miller. Wasnt expecting Dixon to make the roster.

[VAfy-ya]

Surprised Cam Johnson was cut. Hopefully, he makes it to the practice squad.

He was hurt basically the entire off-season and most of TC. I don't know why he wasn't just put on IR. Celek over Person was a little bit of a shock. Other than that, not much suprise. Hopefully Thomas, Palmer, Reuland and Owusu clear waivers

[phlysac]

Oh wow!!! Just noticed that we kept five RB's. Gore, Jacobs, Hunter, James and Dixon. And FB Miller. Wasnt expecting Dixon to make the roster.

Shoulda listened to me about Dixon and Leonard Davis, Dan.


:P

[phlysac]

Keep your eyes on TE, OT, and OLB cuts.

[dan77733]

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I ******* hate crappadden!!! And I ******* hate EA/Tiburon!!!

NEWS FLASH!!!!!

Player position requirements dont exist in reality you morons!!! If a team wants to have 53 QB's on their roster, they can. Granted, no team is going to do that but the option is still there.

And being honest with you guys, I seriously dont know how any of you can play Madden. This year's version has pissed me off more than years past and for the first time ever, its not the gameplay. Granted, there's a few things im not happy about gameplay wise but management wise, im getting pissed off with each passing day. On the bright side, the game will be gone within two weeks either way.

And sorry guys, just felt like venting and didnt want to do it on operation sports since all the moderators there are paid off by EA and dont want to get banned.

[dan77733]

Shoulda listened to me about Dixon and Leonard Davis, Dan.


:P

I guess but the season hasnt started yet. Either or both could still be gone within the next week. And just curious, who's our starting RG? It's Boone right? If so, that means we have no backup OT.

[phlysac]

I guess but the season hasnt started yet. Either or both could still be gone within the next week. And just curious, who's our starting RG? It's Boone right? If so, that means we have no backup OT.

Which is why I said keep an eye on OT cuts.

Other option if Staley/A.Davis goes down would be to kick Boone out to Tackle and start Leonard Davis at RG.

IMO...

Boone at T and L. Davis at G >>>>>>>>> Boone at G and Mike Person at T.

[edgrenade]

I think that Celek is the first guy to get cut. I hope that they bring in a LB. we got really lucky last year with no injuries to the LBs

[edgrenade]

Which is why I said keep an eye on OT cuts.

Other option if Staley/A.Davis goes down would be to kick Boone out to Tackle and start Leonard Davis at RG.

IMO...

Boone at T and L. Davis at G >>>>>>>>> Boone at G and Mike Person at T.

I second this. I figured that was the plan all along

[Ness]

AAARRRGGGHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I ******* hate crappadden!!! And I ******* hate EA/Tiburon!!!

NEWS FLASH!!!!!

Player position requirements dont exist in reality you morons!!! If a team wants to have 53 QB's on their roster, they can. Granted, no team is going to do that but the option is still there.

And being honest with you guys, I seriously dont know how any of you can play Madden. This year's version has pissed me off more than years past and for the first time ever, its not the gameplay. Granted, there's a few things im not happy about gameplay wise but management wise, im getting pissed off with each passing day. On the bright side, the game will be gone within two weeks either way.

And sorry guys, just felt like venting and didnt want to do it on operation sports since all the moderators there are paid off by EA and dont want to get banned.

I thought you said you didn't play Madden.

[phlysac]

I think that Celek is the first guy to get cut. I hope that they bring in a LB. we got really lucky last year with no injuries to the LBs

Unless Baalke truly plans on using Dobbs as emergency OLB.

[VAfy-ya]

Well there hasn't been any OLBs cut worth mentioning so I guess were going with three for now...

[Ness]

Well there hasn't been any OLBs cut worth mentioning so I guess were going with three for now...

Or we'll just get the best of what's out there. I'd be shocked if they actually head into the season with only three OLB. That's insane.

[dan77733]

I thought you said you didn't play Madden.

I dont. This is the first year since 2005 that I have actually played the game for more than a week. I played 2K5 until Madden 2010. Saw an awesome video on youtube with the Ravens against the Titans and got into it. Purchased it and sold it quickly. 2011 and 2012 were sold within a few days give or take.

This year, the gameplay is actually pretty good. Amazingly, for the first time since 2005, im actually enjoying and getting into the gameplay to where I can actually play through a season but all the non-gameplay stuff is killing me and preventing that from happening. CCM is horrible and I miss franchise mode. I really hope that 2K returns in two years but after Madden sold 900,000 copies on release day, I dont ever see that happening, nor do I ever see myself actually playing through an entire season in Madden happening either. UGH.

[dan77733]

Which is why I said keep an eye on OT cuts.

Other option if Staley/A.Davis goes down would be to kick Boone out to Tackle and start Leonard Davis at RG.

IMO...

Boone at T and L. Davis at G >>>>>>>>> Boone at G and Mike Person at T.

Agreed. Are there any OT's that were released we could go after?

[edgrenade]

Now that I think about it, I remember hearing something about Dobbs competing for the pass rush role that Aldon held. Because Aldon played about 90% DE last year, so I guess that is what they envision for Dobbs maybe?

[Verloren]

Now that I think about it, I remember hearing something about Dobbs competing for the pass rush role that Aldon held. Because Aldon played about 90% DE last year, so I guess that is what they envision for Dobbs maybe?

Probably. Dobbs could be a solid backup to Brooks/Smith in nickel packages.

[VAfy-ya]

I dont. This is the first year since 2005 that I have actually played the game for more than a week. I played 2K5 until Madden 2010. Saw an awesome video on youtube with the Ravens against the Titans and got into it. Purchased it and sold it quickly. 2011 and 2012 were sold within a few days give or take.

This year, the gameplay is actually pretty good. Amazingly, for the first time since 2005, im actually enjoying and getting into the gameplay to where I can actually play through a season but all the non-gameplay stuff is killing me and preventing that from happening. CCM is horrible and I miss franchise mode. I really hope that 2K returns in two years but after Madden sold 900,000 copies on release day, I dont ever see that happening, nor do I ever see myself actually playing through an entire season in Madden happening either. UGH.

Franchise mode is in the Connected Careers....just select the role as head coach.

[VAfy-ya]

Probably. Dobbs could be a solid backup to Brooks/Smith in nickel packages.

I just hope they aren't spreading Dobbs too thin. DE, TE, ST, and now OLB...seems like a lot of roles for a guy who's still working to improve his main role as a 5-Tech. Only guy I saw cut who might make sense as a OLB is Everette Brown. He flashed potential in this league before and as a 4th OLB you could kick the tires and see if he might work as a rehab project in a 3-4.

[dan77733]

Franchise mode is in the Connected Careers....just select the role as head coach.

Yeah, I know but below is why I cant play it...way too many problems and because there's no editing in CCM, I cant get around the majority of the problems like I used to.

Check my list ...26th post down

http://www.operationsports.com/forums/madden-nfl-football/572570-september-11th-patch-news.html

Either way, I have until September 14th which is two weeks away from yesterday until my Xbox Live trial ends. If there's no patch released by then, game is gone 100% and may even be gone a week from today because I want to make sure that when I trade this in to Best Buy, their 100% trade in promotion still exists. Add in the 10% extra since im a GCU member and I'll get back $42. Game cost me $65 but then add in the $20 Reward cert. I get for pre-ordering and the $10 coupon I received for ordering online and picking up in-store and well, I actually make about a $7 profit and still was able to play the game.

[VAfy-ya]

Supposed to be a patch update in another week Dan is what I read. My Madden 13 isn't even playable....well it is but it isn't so I'm just like "meh" about it at the moment.

[VAfy-ya]

Jets claim Reuland, Chargers add Owusu. ****! Palmer, Thomas clear

[49ersfan_87]

We ended up losing a few players to other team's 53 man rosters or Practice Squads

-S Colin Jones traded to Panthers 53
-OL Mike Person to Colts 53
-TE Konrad Reuland to Jets 53
-WR Chris Owusu to Chargers PS (Either chose to go, or we didnt want him. Maybe both)
-OL Chase Beeler to Eagles PS

Also heard WR Bryan Tyms is working out with the Dolphins, PS possibility there

So far, per reports, our PS is looking like

-WR Nathan Palmer
-OL Kenny Wiggins
-OL Al Netter
-S Michael Thomas
-LB Michael Wilhoite

3 more spots to go. Got these through various updates per Maiocco, Branch, and Barrows

https://twitter.com/MaioccoCSN
https://twitter.com/mattbarrows
https://twitter.com/Eric_Branch

[dan77733]

Supposed to be a patch update in another week Dan is what I read. My Madden 13 isn't even playable....well it is but it isn't so I'm just like "meh" about it at the moment.

The patch that was scheduled for September 11th has been delayed/cancelled according to the topic on operation sports. Personally, I dont see EA fixing anything in CCM. EA wants everyone online and no point in having editing when you're stuck using EA's rosters when playing online.

Sad part is that if EA/Tiburon would have just left in franchise mode, I would probably be playing right now but instead, I have spent more time posting here and on Operation Sports about all the problems. Its amazing. I dont even think that EA tests the game. They let us, the consumers test it for them.

Anyway, hopefully I'll pick up Madden NFL 12 tomorrow for $10 at Best Buy. Using Modio and a USB flash drive, i'll be able to download the actual full Madden NFL 13 default roster and use it in Madden NFL 12. Its amazing, people who do roster editing and such do more work than Tiburon/EA does.

[dan77733]

Dont care about the players we lost to other teams but I hope Palmer can make the practice squad and doesnt get plucked during the season.

[49ersfan_87]

As it stands now, our 53 man roster+PS+injury list

QB- Alex, Kaepernick, Tolzien
RB- Gore, Jacobs, Hunter, James, Dixon, Miller
TE- Davis, Walker, Celek
WR- Moss, Crabtree, Manningham, Williams, Ginn, Jenkins
OL- Staley, Iupati, Goodwin, Boone, Davis, Kilgore, Looney, L Davis
DL- Justin Smith, McDonald, Sopoaga, Williams, Dobbs, Tuakufu, RJF
ILB- Willis, Bowman, Grant, Gooden
OLB- Aldon, Brooks, Haralson
CB- Rogers, Brown, Culliver, Cox, Brock
S- Goldson, Whitner, Robinson, Spillman, McBath
ST- Akers, Lee, Jennings

PS- WR Palmer, OL Netter, OL Wiggins, DL Masifilo, DL Jerrod-Eddie, LB Wilhioite, LB Johnson, S Thomas

PUP- OLB Fleming, Non-football injury- RB Hampton

Players from camp on other teams- TE Reuland (Jets), OL Person (Colts), S Jones (Panthers), WR Owusu (Chargers- Practice Squad), OL Beeler (Eagles- Practice Squad)

Looks like we didn't make any waiver wire moves. In 2011, we signed Tavares Gooden and Scott Tolzien after roster cuts. No such move this year.

We're still a little light at OLB and OT. We do have 2 OT's and 1 OLB on the PS though.

[Verloren]

I just hope they aren't spreading Dobbs too thin. DE, TE, ST, and now OLB...seems like a lot of roles for a guy who's still working to improve his main role as a 5-Tech. Only guy I saw cut who might make sense as a OLB is Everette Brown. He flashed potential in this league before and as a 4th OLB you could kick the tires and see if he might work as a rehab project in a 3-4.

It is a worry, but I think Dobbs will be doing the same thing as a DE and OLB backup - get to the passer.

[phlysac]

Baalke tried to claim Jamal Westerman but the Cardinals were higher on the list and got him.

[VAfy-ya]

Seems we will sign Clark Haggans, pending him passing his physical on Sunday. Meh....was hoping for better but its whatever at this point. Sucks we couldn't grabbed Westernman, he would have been a perfect fit on this team.

[dan77733]

Dont care about Haggans but can he play on ST? If not, dont see the point since he would be 4th on the DC at OLB.

[49ersfan_87]

https://twitter.com/MikeKlis/status/242381095503527936

Most popular waived player: OT Mike Person. He was claimed by Indy, Seattle, NE.

Wonder if we should have kept him over a guy like McBath or Celek or something...

Although i think it speaks to the depth of our roster when so many 49ers are being claimed on waivers. Players not good enough for us are given roster spots on other teams. Person, Reuland, even former 49ers like Cody Wallace and Phillip Adams were claimed off waivers. Plus Beeler and Owusu to other teams practice squads and Jones was traded to Carolina.

[VAfy-ya]

https://twitter.com/MikeKlis/status/242381095503527936



Wonder if we should have kept him over a guy like McBath or Celek or something...

Person didn't really standout to me during pre-season. Not that he played bad, but I expected to see a decent jump in his play from last pre-season. I didn't see it. I wouldn't put much stock into the teams that put in claims, all those teams had O-Line issues. Person is decent tackle, who still has room to grow and is very young. I wasn't surprised he ended up getting a few claims. But I also think we were quietly impressed with the development of Derek Hall. I thought he looked solid all pre-season.

[phlysac]

Dont care about Haggans but can he play on ST? If not, dont see the point since he would be 4th on the DC at OLB.

The point is, he can play OLB if Aldon Smith, Ahmad Brooks, or Parys Haralson get hurt. Of course Baalke wanted Westerman (ST value) but he didn't get him. He got a very experienced vet who has played his entire career in a 3-4 or hybrid. Nearly the entire roster can play ST, so it's irrelevant if Haggans can't.

[49ersfan_87]

Person didn't really standout to me during pre-season. Not that he played bad, but I expected to see a decent jump in his play from last pre-season. I didn't see it. I wouldn't put much stock into the teams that put in claims, all those teams had O-Line issues. Person is decent tackle, who still has room to grow and is very young. I wasn't surprised he ended up getting a few claims. But I also think we were quietly impressed with the development of Derek Hall. I thought he looked solid all pre-season.

I liked Hall too but he's not even on the PS, let alone 53. We have Wiggins and Netter on the PS.

[49ersfan_87]

Haralson might go on IR?

Depth. Haralson might be out for a long time, might go on IR. RT @attitud330: what's the point to the Haggans signing at this time?

https://twitter.com/mattbarrows/status/242447543794024448

i think new ir rules state we can bring him back later in the year, but he could miss a significant chunk of time regardless..

[VAfy-ya]

I liked Hall too but he's not even on the PS, let alone 53. We have Wiggins and Netter on the PS.

I meant to say Wiggins. I always get the 3rd and 4th stringers confused. Though I liked Hall too.

[phlysac]

So Barrows just threw out "IR" when referring to Parys Haralson .



:O

[edgrenade]

Haralson might go on IR?



https://twitter.com/mattbarrows/status/242447543794024448

i think new ir rules state we can bring him back later in the year, but he could miss a significant chunk of time regardless..

I saw that too.....

Hopefully Cam Johnson can step it up and learn fast. I'm not counting on much from Haggans.

[phlysac]

Haralson has a left arm injury. Biceps, elbow, forearm-type. No idea how serious.

[dan77733]

That sucks if Haralson goes on IR even if he gets taken off later in the year. Of course, couldnt he just be placed on the PUP list instead of going on IR?

Obviously, there's more to the Haggans signing that we originally thought. Still a downgrade from Haralson though. WOW!!! Never thought that I would say that. LOL.

[phlysac]

Haralson officially placed on IR. They did it before the "Special Designation" timeframe of 1pm Tuesday, meaning that Haralson is done for the ENTIRE SEASON, including playoffs!!!


:(

[49ersfan_87]

Haralson officially placed on IR. They did it before the "Special Designation" timeframe of 1pm Tuesday, meaning that Haralson is done for the ENTIRE SEASON, including playoffs!!!


:(

The fact that they didn't even bother to wait the extra 24 hours says they didn't believe Haralson had a shot of coming back this year, like at all.

Haggans certainly isn't a bad backup. But we should still have a 4th OLB. Obviously the team isn't comfortable with Rowe, Bakhtiari, and Francis, nor anyone else on the FA market. Anyone out there we can trade for? Or maybe promote Cam Johnson to the 53 in a week or 2.

[Brent]

well... goddamnit

[49ersfan_87]

49ers sure aged this offseason...

49ers have NFL's 5th-oldest roster after adding Clark Haggans, 35, and putting Haralson on IR. Packers 4th-youngest.

https://twitter.com/espn_nfcwest/status/242704914713825280

49ers have 10th-oldest roster if we remove all NFL specialists (K, P, LS) from equation. SD, ATL, DET three oldest that way.

https://twitter.com/espn_nfcwest/status/242718488580485120

We were 10th youngest or something like that last year. Of course, 19 of 22 opening day starters returned and aged another year.

We still have a lot of youth and guys in their prime. Only major old contributors are Justin, Ice (could be replaced by RJF/Williams next year), Carlos, Moss, Goodwin, and Jacobs. And of course, including Akers/Lee/Jennings on ST's too.

[Brent]

Yeah, I was going to say, the core group is rather young. The team added some older vets, but it isn't like we're expecting Haggans or Jacobs to be heavy contributors.

[abaddon41_80]

So we are going into the season with Brooks, Aldon and Haggans are our only outside linebackers? Well, plus Cam Johnson on the PS. I don't feel good about that

[edgrenade]

I still think that we'll be seeing Dobbs come in on passing downs at DE, so that might alleviate this situation.



Hopefully....

[abaddon41_80]

Still confused as to why we didn't keep Bakhtiari. I thought he impressed enough in the preseason to earn a spot, especially considering how thin we were at outside linebacker

[dan77733]

This sucks. Didnt know Haralson was even seriously injured. Here's an idea even though it would be an expensive one year rental -

Trade a 4th rounder to the Giants for DE Osi Umenyiora. Could move him to OLB as an extra pass rusher. Granted, its for one year and would cost a lot but he's the only veteran player who's 30 or older, has one year left on his current contract and could be available.

Obviously, Giants gave him a pay raise in June but they're not going to give him a long term deal so he could be available for trade. If he can do what Aldon did for us last year, I think that he would be worth the risk.

Thoughts?

[Ness]

Not going to happen. Those are my thoughts.

[hawkeye123]

Maybe in Madden that could happen.

[Ness]

Maybe in Madden that could happen.

Maybe. You never know when the game will experience a glitch.

[Madirishman]

The main reasons Osi wants to leave NY are that he doesn't get the $ or playing time he ideally desires. He would have the opportunity to have less to become a 49er. We're all stocked up on ex-Giants. Next topic.

[phlysac]

Still confused as to why we didn't keep Bakhtiari. I thought he impressed enough in the preseason to earn a spot, especially considering how thin we were at outside linebacker

He gets completely washed out supporting the run and if he doesn't win the edge, he gets swallowed up by tackles in pass pro. He had "okay" success as a speed rusher against OTs that aren't NFL caliber.

[abaddon41_80]

He gets completely washed out supporting the run and if he doesn't win the edge, he gets swallowed up by tackles in pass pro. He had "okay" success as a speed rusher against OTs that aren't NFL caliber.

Maybe but we also kept guys like Ian Williams and Garrett Celek who were even less impressive against non-NFL caliber players and play positions that we have enough depth at

[phlysac]

Maybe but we also kept guys like Ian Williams and Garrett Celek who were even less impressive against non-NFL caliber players and play positions that we have enough depth at

I won't argue Celek, but Ian Williams looked dominant at times against 2nds and 3rds whereas Baktiari occasionally looked capable. That's a big difference, in my eyes.

If a recently cut OLB of Baalke's was brought back, in my opinion it'd be Akaika Alama-Francis. He looked much more natural setting an edge.

[dan77733]

Okay guys. It was just a thought because he's a pass rusher. As for Madden, I dont have that problem anymore since I traded in M12 and M13 today to Best Buy. Received $54+ in credit and actually made about a $12 profit and was still able to play both games.

Oh well, back to ebay to find a copy of 2K5. :)

[Borat]

Okay guys. It was just a thought because he's a pass rusher. As for Madden, I dont have that problem anymore since I traded in M12 and M13 today to Best Buy. Received $54+ in credit and actually made about a $12 profit and was still able to play both games.

Oh well, back to ebay to find a copy of 2K5. :)

I think I still have 2K5 in hopes they would make it compatible for the 360. You can have mine for free. Just pay the shipping. PM me your name/address.

Also I'm hoping to do the Gameday thread tonight.

[Ness]

I hope Ted Ginn will play. Oh and I'm guessing it will be sunny in Lambeau. I think I'll stay at home for game 1.

[dan77733]

I think I still have 2K5 in hopes they would make it compatible for the 360. You can have mine for free. Just pay the shipping. PM me your name/address.

Also I'm hoping to do the Gameday thread tonight.

Thanks and while I could be a prick and take the game from you for free, im not like that. 2K5 IS backwards compatible for 360. Just have to download the update via your ethernet connection. You'll also have a patch to download which eliminates the negative yardage clipping penalty stat glitch on offense.

You can go to -

http://www.operationsports.com/forums/espn-nfl-2k5-football/

and

http://www.nfl2k5rosters.com/

for roster updates, Finn's editor, etc. :)