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View Full Version : AFC East vs. AFC North: Best Division All-Pro Team


diabsoule
05-15-2009, 12:01 AM
AFC East

QB Tom Brady (NE)
RB Marshawn Lynch (BUF)
FB Tony Richardson (NYJ)
WR Randy Moss (NE)
WR Terrell Owens (BUF)
TE Dustin Keller (NYJ)
RT Jake Long (MIA)
RG Alan Faneca (NYJ)
C Nick Mangold (NYJ)
LG Logan Mankins (NE)
LT Matt Light (NE)

DE Richard Seymour (NE)
NT Vince Wilfork (NE)
DE Ty Warren (NE)
OLB Joey Porter (MIA)
ILB David Harris (NYJ)
ILB Jerod Mayo (NE)
OLB Adalius Thomas (NE)
CB Darrelle Revis (NYJ)
CB Terrence McGee (BUF)
FS Donte Whitner (BUF)
SS Kerry Rhodes (MIA)

7 Notable Reserves WR Wes Welker (NE), OLB/DE Calvin Pace (NYJ), S Gibril Wilson (MIA), NT Kris Jenkins (NYJ), DT Marcus Stroud (BUF), RB Thomas Jones (NYJ), KR/PR Roscoe Parrish


AFC North

QB Ben Roethlisberger (PIT)
RB Willie Parker (PIT)
FB Le'Ron McClain (BAL)
WR Hines Ward (PIT)
WR Chad Ochocinco (CIN)
TE Heath Miller (PIT)
LT Joe Thomas (CLE)
LG Eric Steinbach (CLE)
C Matt Birk (BAL)
RG Ben Grubbs (BAL)
RT Jared Gaither (BAL)

DE Aaron Smith (PIT)
NT Shaun Rogers (CLE)
DE Haloti Ngata (BAL)
OLB James Harrison (PIT)
ILB Ray Lewis (BAL)
ILB James Farrior (PIT)
OLB Terrell Suggs (BAL)
CB Leon Hall (CIN)
CB Ike Taylor (PIT)
FS Ed Reed (BAL)
SS Troy Polamalu (SS)

7 Notable Reserves: DE/OLB LaMarr Woodley (PIT), WR Braylon Edwards (CLE), CB Jonathan Joseph (CLE), LB D'Qwell Jackson (CLE), WR Derrick Mason (BAL), CB Eric Wright (CLE), PR/KR Joshua Cribbs (CLE)

Strongside
05-15-2009, 12:08 AM
I'm still saying AFC north and their nasty, nasty defense.

Also the East offense only has 10 players right now.

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 12:10 AM
I'm still saying AFC north and their nasty, nasty defense.

Also the East offense only has 10 players right now.

Thanks for pointing that out. It's been fixed.

RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES
05-15-2009, 12:12 AM
All about the defense

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 12:15 AM
I'm going to be Cpt. Obvious but both of you guys are fans of AFC North teams...

However, if the AFC North did beat the AFC South with their offense (P. Manning, D. Clark, R. Wayne, A. Johnson, MJD) then I think they could handily beat the AFC East offense.

bam bam
05-15-2009, 12:22 AM
I don't know that there is an OLine that would not get handled by the AFC North's front 7. Ngata, Rogers and arguably Smith need attention from two people at all times so what does it mean when Suggs and Harrison are sent in? Or Reed or Polamalu are sent in?

And if you allow Ed Reed and Polamalu to roam as they please then you can simply count on your passing game getting severely disrupted.

The simple fact of the matter is that you wouldn't be able to run or pass on this defense.

I do like the East team though, especially their D, but that O-Line would not be able to handle it.

Don Vito
05-15-2009, 12:59 AM
A healthy Brady with those targets and that line in front of him would be ridiculous, and that is a very solid defense too. The AFC North defense would be nasty too.

I would put Nick Mangold over Dan Koppen all day.

Mr. Stiller
05-15-2009, 01:03 AM
I don't know that there is an OLine that would not get handled by the AFC North's front 7. Ngata, Rogers and arguably Smith need attention from two people at all times so what does it mean when Suggs and Harrison are sent in? Or Reed or Polamalu are sent in?

And if you allow Ed Reed and Polamalu to roam as they please then you can simply count on your passing game getting severely disrupted.

The simple fact of the matter is that you wouldn't be able to run or pass on this defense.

I do like the East team though, especially their D, but that O-Line would not be able to handle it.



Not to mention Farrior/Lewis are 2 of the best Blitzing LB's in the game, toppled with LaMarr Woodley waiting in the wings when a guy needs a breather.

(Not to mention Lawrence Timmons who could attack the QB from Any LB position, or cover teams #3 WR or TE.)

Ike Taylor Shut out TO last season. Not to mention Moss wouldn't be able to get past both Reed AND Polamalu.

Personally, I think the Notables Guys even leans to AFC North (Considering who you had to leave off..

S. Holmes, R. Mendenhall...)

Not to mention Rey Maualuga, Andre Smith, and Michael Johnson just from Cincy alone could make depth even more intriguing in AFCN's favor.

TimD
05-15-2009, 03:23 AM
how is jenkins and rhodes not first team? whered u get these teams from.

AntoinCD
05-15-2009, 04:54 AM
how is jenkins and rhodes not first team? whered u get these teams from.

Not sure why Rhodes isn't but Wilfork would start over Jenkins. Jenkins played very well last year but faded badly down the stretch last year and Wilfork has been a top NT for at least 3 years now.

As for who would win between the teams i'm going to pick the East for one reason. As good as the North's defense is the East's offense could score quickly. As far as best in divisions go, both the East defense and North offense are average at best so then it comes down to East offense and North defense. And while the defense of the North is scary they do have a slight weakness at the CB position and WR is definitely a position of strength for the East.

Mr. Stiller
05-15-2009, 05:05 AM
Not sure why Rhodes isn't but Wilfork would start over Jenkins. Jenkins played very well last year but faded badly down the stretch last year and Wilfork has been a top NT for at least 3 years now.

As for who would win between the teams i'm going to pick the East for one reason. As good as the North's defense is the East's offense could score quickly. As far as best in divisions go, both the East defense and North offense are average at best so then it comes down to East offense and North defense. And while the defense of the North is scary they do have a slight weakness at the CB position and WR is definitely a position of strength for the East.

I can't see them scoring Quickly.

Ike Taylor shut down TO in Man coverage last year. I'm sure Hall/Joseph/Reed (Some combination) could easily Manage Moss.

That OL isn't that good either.

The CB's for the North are underrated.. but even if they're "Weak" as perceived (which they're not, as I said TO was shut out last year 1 on 1 with Taylor)..

Having the best 2 safeties in the league in the deep field would certainly limit anything Moss/Brady are capable of doing.


CB Darrelle Revis (NYJ)
CB Terrence McGee (BUF)
FS Donte Whitner (BUF)
SS Yeremiah Bell (MIA)

Outside of Revis... that secondary isn't exactly scary either. Whats to say Ward, OchoCinco, mason, Holmes, Etc. wouldn't easily exploit that group?

AntoinCD
05-15-2009, 05:19 AM
I can't see them scoring Quickly.

Ike Taylor shut down TO in Man coverage last year. I'm sure Hall/Joseph/Reed (Some combination) could easily Manage Moss.

That OL isn't that good either.

The CB's for the North are underrated.. but even if they're "Weak" as perceived (which they're not, as I said TO was shut out last year 1 on 1 with Taylor)..

Having the best 2 safeties in the league in the deep field would certainly limit anything Moss/Brady are capable of doing.


CB Darrelle Revis (NYJ)
CB Terrence McGee (BUF)
FS Donte Whitner (BUF)
SS Yeremiah Bell (MIA)

Outside of Revis... that secondary isn't exactly scary either. Whats to say Ward, OchoCinco, mason, Holmes, Etc. wouldn't easily exploit that group?

I didn't say the CBs where weak I was saying compared to the rest of the team and with the WRs they were going against that it is a weakness for their defense. As for Taylor shutting down TO, yea fair enough but it takes more than one game to make a fair judgement that Taylor will shut down TO, plus Brady is on a completely different level to Romo as a QB. As for Ocho Cinco, Mason, Ward, Holmes etc, yes they would have a very good shot at exploiting that group, but I would take Moss, TO, Welker and Lee Evans anyday over them.

And as for saying the East secondary isn't exactly scary, I did mention that their defense in comparison to other Division bests is average at best.

Mr. Stiller
05-15-2009, 05:27 AM
I didn't say the CBs where weak I was saying compared to the rest of the team and with the WRs they were going against that it is a weakness for their defense. As for Taylor shutting down TO, yea fair enough but it takes more than one game to make a fair judgement that Taylor will shut down TO, plus Brady is on a completely different level to Romo as a QB. As for Ocho Cinco, Mason, Ward, Holmes etc, yes they would have a very good shot at exploiting that group, but I would take Moss, TO, Welker and Lee Evans anyday over them.

And as for saying the East secondary isn't exactly scary, I did mention that their defense in comparison to other Division bests is average at best.

So if you rate:

AFCN Offense: 8
AFCE Offense: 10

AFCN Defense: 10
AFCE Defense: 5

I would think the AFCN offense would have an easier time driving on the AFCE defense... than Vice Versa.

Go_Eagles77
05-15-2009, 06:05 AM
I said the east. That offense could be unstoppable and the north's cornerbacks are a tad underwhelming. Their safeties are just beastly though.

AntoinCD
05-15-2009, 07:27 AM
So if you rate:

AFCN Offense: 8
AFCE Offense: 10

AFCN Defense: 10
AFCE Defense: 5

I would think the AFCN offense would have an easier time driving on the AFCE defense... than Vice Versa.

Ok but if you rate the AFC East defense 6 and the offense 10, then AFC North Defense 10 and the offense 6 then it's not as clear cut.The North's offense is just not very explosive

Mr. Stiller
05-15-2009, 08:20 AM
Ok but if you rate the AFC East defense 6 and the offense 10, then AFC North Defense 10 and the offense 6 then it's not as clear cut.The North's offense is just not very explosive

Not explosive?

Perhaps not, but there is power, speed, and a wide array of both young guns and talented Vets.



I don't know why everyone keeps finding the AFCN DB's "Underwhelming". Ike Taylor has terrible hands, but he just shuts people down. And Jonathon Joseph when healthy is a force, not to mention Fabian Washington/Leon Hall who are 2 younger studs.

You also have to figure as well, the 2 most dangerous safeties in the game in the deep field.


I would say Ward/Ochocinco/Mason/Holmes/Edwards/Clayton/etc would have a much easier time exploiting the AFCE defense than Moss/Welker/Owens would have trying to exploit the AFCN defense.

Not to mention, against the AFCN Front 7, there is no threat from the AFCE run game.

The OL is Underwhelming too. That many Passrushers (Ngata, Rogers, Harrison, Woodley, Timmons, Farrior, Lewis, Suggs)...

Did everyone forget how Tom Terrific did merely 2 seasons ago in the Superbowl against a powerful defense?

BmoreBlackByrdz
05-15-2009, 09:00 AM
Everyones trashing the AFC North CB's but that front 7 and Reed and Polumalu (best safety tandem in the NFL)more than makes up for it. Defense with a balanced offense wins championships, so the North gets my vote.

Bigburt63
05-15-2009, 10:06 AM
Not explosive?

Perhaps not, but there is power, speed, and a wide array of both young guns and talented Vets.

I would say Ward/Ochocinco/Mason/Holmes/Edwards/Clayton/etc would have a much easier time exploiting the AFCE defense than Moss/Welker/Owens would have trying to exploit the AFCN defense.


Did everyone forget how Tom Terrific did merely 2 seasons ago in the Superbowl against a powerful defense?

But the strength of the AFCE defense is power and stopping the run game. The front 3 (plus Jenkins as a reserve) is designed to stop a running game like that. Revis is a very good corner, outside of him there is alot to be desired, but so are the WR's from the north. They are all solid, but not spectacular (for the most part).

Did you forget how Tom Terrific did against the Steeler, Raven, Giant (first game), Cowboy, and Charger defenses that year? One game doesn't make a case.

Everyone seems to be underrating the AFCE's front 7. The front 3 are beastly, and with Harris and Mayo in the middle and Porter (I hate him but he's good) and Thomas on the outside, that front 7 is beastly in its own right.

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 12:23 PM
Winner of this matchup faces the winner of the NFC East vs. NFC North matchup in the Champion Round!

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 04:01 PM
This one is coming down to the wire.

Crazy_Chris
05-15-2009, 04:42 PM
I have to go with the AFC North and that amazing defense on this one. I don't see Marshawn Lynch do anything on the against the north's defense. Even with Tom Brady throwing to T.O. and Randy Moss, I don't see him being able get them too much with both Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu free to roam.

The AFC East has an excellent defense of it's own but I see the AFC North offense being able to do good enough against that defense to get the win.

TitanHope
05-15-2009, 04:55 PM
I'm going to be Cpt. Obvious but both of you guys are fans of AFC North teams...

However, if the AFC North did beat the AFC South with their offense (P. Manning, D. Clark, R. Wayne, A. Johnson, MJD) then I think they could handily beat the AFC East offense.

The AFC South offense is the best among the AFC Divisions, but their defense was their weak link. The AFC East offense is very good in it's own right, but their defensive Front-7 rivals the AFC North unit. Gonna be hard to run the ball on either defense.

I vastly under-estimated the AFC East squad. It's easily the most balanced Division in the AFC.

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 05:07 PM
You really get a feel for how deep these divisions are the more reseves you toss in. I should have been doing that all along. I went 7 deep this round just so you can get a better feel for each squad.

LonghornsLegend
05-15-2009, 05:48 PM
However, if the AFC North did beat the AFC South with their offense (P. Manning, D. Clark, R. Wayne, A. Johnson, MJD) then I think they could handily beat the AFC East offense.

That's my reasoning, that last offense was much stronger, this one would be easier to contain.

Don Vito
05-15-2009, 05:53 PM
Channing Crowder would be a nice ILB for the East along with Mayo and Harris. Jason Taylor is back too so he could get some time at OLB with Adailus, Porter, and Pace. The North defense is more star studded but I think the East defense would be very, very good. The 3-4 DL would be insane, the LBs would be talented with some really nice depth, and the secondary would be very good too. Meriweather would be a valuable backup because he can play anywhere in the secondary.

BamaFalcon59
05-15-2009, 08:54 PM
AFC East

QB Tom Brady (NE)
RB Marshawn Lynch (BUF)
FB Tony Richardson (NYJ)
WR Randy Moss (NE)
WR Terrell Owens (BUF)
TE Dustin Keller (NYJ)
RT Jake Long (MIA)
RG Alan Faneca (NYJ)
C Nick Mangold (NYJ)
LG Logan Mankins (NE)
LT Matt Light (NE)



They're not losing.

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 08:54 PM
This is definitely the closest vote we've had. Surprised at the lack of discussion, though.

BamaFalcon59
05-15-2009, 08:59 PM
And Thomas Jones should be starting for the AFC East.

TimD
05-15-2009, 09:31 PM
CB Darrelle Revis (NYJ)
CB Terrence McGee (BUF)
FS Donte Whitner (BUF)
SS Yeremiah Bell (MIA)

Outside of Revis... that secondary isn't exactly scary either. Whats to say Ward, OchoCinco, mason, Holmes, Etc. wouldn't easily exploit that group?

Revis and Rhodes both need to be there. I don't think Whitner and Bell are better than Rhodes.

Bills2083
05-15-2009, 09:39 PM
Revis and Rhodes both need to be there. I don't think Whitner and Bell are better than Rhodes.

It should be...

CB - Darrelle Revis
CB - Terrence McGee
FS - Kerry Rhodes
SS - Donte Whitner

diabsoule
05-15-2009, 09:52 PM
And Thomas Jones should be starting for the AFC East.

Over Marshawn Lynch?

Mr. Stiller
05-15-2009, 10:30 PM
I'm sorry.

I see Ike Taylor 1 on 1 with TO shutting him down.

I see Reed giving over the top help to Hall/Joseph with Moss.

I see Welker getting crushed by Polamalu/Farrior/Lewis if he tries to open up the middle of the field.

And I see Suggs, Woodley and Harrison having their way with those OT's.

I see them having an easier time with that offense than the East defense having with the Norths offense. What it lacks in Speed (outside Williams, Holmes, Parker, Mendenhall) It certainly makes up for in Wily Veterans who know how to exploit defenses, especially in the case of Mason/Ward.

Nalej
05-15-2009, 11:03 PM
This whole I. Taylor will lock down T.O. *no hesitation* is laughable.
I won't debate the fact that he didn't do it but so has other CBs in certain games.
T.O. is a gamer and the second you think that you DON'T have to worry 'bout him is the time that'll burn you for 3 TDs.

steel man
05-15-2009, 11:39 PM
i can not believe no one has said anything about All-pro Casey Hampton. it takes 2-3 guys just to move him, he would stop any running attempt.

steel man
05-15-2009, 11:41 PM
This whole I. Taylor will lock down T.O. *no hesitation* is laughable.
I won't debate the fact that he didn't do it but so has other CBs in certain games.
T.O. is a gamer and the second you think that you DON'T have to worry 'bout him is the time that'll burn you for 3 TDs.

i know it is laughable to think T.O. is even near an All-pro and could do anything against Ike anyway

steel man
05-16-2009, 12:08 AM
AFC East

QB Tom Brady (NE)
RB Marshawn Lynch (BUF)
FB Tony Richardson (NYJ)
WR Randy Moss (NE)
WR Terrell Owens (BUF)
TE Dustin Keller (NYJ)
RT Jake Long (MIA)
RG Alan Faneca (NYJ)
C Nick Mangold (NYJ)
LG Logan Mankins (NE)
LT Matt Light (NE)

DE Richard Seymour (NE)
NT Vince Wilfork (NE)
DE Ty Warren (NE)
OLB Joey Porter (MIA)
ILB David Harris (NYJ)
ILB Jerod Mayo (NE)
OLB Adalius Thomas (NE)
CB Darrelle Revis (NYJ)
CB Terrence McGee (BUF)
FS Donte Whitner (BUF)
SS Kerry Rhodes (MIA)

7 Notable Reserves WR Wes Welker (NE), OLB/DE Calvin Pace (NYJ), S Gibril Wilson (MIA), NT Kris Jenkins (NYJ), DT Marcus Stroud (BUF), RB Thomas Jones (NYJ), KR/PR Roscoe Parrish


AFC North

QB Ben Roethlisberger (PIT)
RB Willie Parker (PIT)
FB Le'Ron McClain (BAL)
WR Hines Ward (PIT)
WR Chad Ochocinco (CIN)
TE Heath Miller (PIT)
LT Joe Thomas (CLE)
LG Eric Steinbach (CLE)
C Matt Birk (BAL)
RG Ben Grubbs (BAL)
RT Jared Gaither (BAL)

DE Aaron Smith (PIT)
NT Shaun Rogers (CLE)
DE Haloti Ngata (BAL)
OLB James Harrison (PIT)
ILB Ray Lewis (BAL)
ILB James Farrior (PIT)
OLB Terrell Suggs (BAL)
CB Leon Hall (CIN)
CB Ike Taylor (PIT)
FS Ed Reed (BAL)
SS Troy Polamalu (SS)

7 Notable Reserves: DE/OLB LaMarr Woodley (PIT), WR Braylon Edwards (CLE), CB Jonathan Joseph (CLE), LB D'Qwell Jackson (CLE), WR Derrick Mason (BAL), CB Eric Wright (CLE), PR/KR Joshua Cribbs (CLE)

the East may only have 7 worthy reserves but the North has many more then listed....

Timmons (Pit) is one of the if not the most versatile LBers in the NFL. He is one of the hardest hitting players in the game, can cover any TE and most 3rd WR's, and a great blitzing LBer. he is a man among kids.

Hampton (Pit) is an All-pro and considered the best NT in the 3-4 defence in the NFL

Homes (Pit) a SB MVP and he is not on the list, he needs to be added.

Mendenhall (Pit) has not got to prove himself but he will be great

Flacco (Bal) is a good young QB

Palmer (Cin) is a great QB, enough said

McGahee (Bal) when healthy is a good player

Rivers (Cin) a really solid LBer

"Tank" Johnson (Cin) a good player if he stays out of trouble

Coles (Cin) is a solid WR

Roy Williams (Cin), Leonard (Cin) - good players

Lewis (Clev) still a better then avg RB

TitanHope
05-16-2009, 12:37 AM
Since when did Ike Taylor all of the sudden become an All-Pro?

He's a good Corner, but gimme a break...

SuperMcGee
05-16-2009, 01:18 AM
I'll vote for the North, but I don't care for how some people expect that Welker would be handled rather easily.

All this mentioning of Santonio Holmes against none for Lee Evans is also odd to me.

Crickett
05-16-2009, 01:44 AM
Over Marshawn Lynch?

Season Team Rushing Receiving Fumbles
G GS Att Yds Avg Lng TD Rec Yds Avg Lng TD FUM Lost

2008 Buffalo Bills 15 15 250 1,036 4.1 50 8 47 300 6.4 42 1 2 1
2008 New York Jets 16 14 290 1,312 4.5 59T 13 36 207 5.8 19 2 2 1

You need to ask?


Hampton (Pit) is an All-pro and considered the best NT in the 3-4 defence in the NFL

Actually, Casey Hampton has never been an all-pro. But you know was?

Richard Seymour, Vince Wilfork, Kris Jenkins AND Marcus Stroud.

Homes (Pit) a SB MVP and he is not on the list, he needs to be added.

A receiver who has never reached 1,000 in a season on your all pro team? Awesome.

Mendenhall (Pit) has not got to prove himself but he will be great

He played in four games. Didn't do much.

Flacco (Bal) is a good young QB

True enough.

Palmer (Cin) is a great QB, enough said

All true enough.

McGahee (Bal) when putting forth an effort is a good player

Fixed.

Rivers (Cin) a really solid LBer

Starting to reach a bit here.

"Tank" Johnson (Cin) a good player if he stays out of trouble

Coles (Cin) is a solid WR

Roy Williams (Cin), Leonard (Cin) - good players

Lewis (Clev) still a better then avg RB

And here we go into starting to list moderately decent players as "worthy".

Mr. Stiller
05-16-2009, 02:13 AM
This whole I. Taylor will lock down T.O. *no hesitation* is laughable.
I won't debate the fact that he didn't do it but so has other CBs in certain games.
T.O. is a gamer and the second you think that you DON'T have to worry 'bout him is the time that'll burn you for 3 TDs.

Who said you didn't have to worry about TO? Thats why we put Ike Taylor on him.

His 3/32 performance was anything to brag about. He was single covered by Ike Taylor in the game.

Mr. Stiller
05-16-2009, 02:16 AM
Since when did Ike Taylor all of the sudden become an All-Pro?

He's a good Corner, but gimme a break...

if Ike Taylor could catch I have no hesitation believing he'd push for an all-pro list.

Guy is lockdown, just can't catch balls that hit his hands for ****.

diabsoule
05-16-2009, 09:12 AM
the East may only have 7 worthy reserves but the North has many more then listed....

Timmons (Pit) is one of the if not the most versatile LBers in the NFL. He is one of the hardest hitting players in the game, can cover any TE and most 3rd WR's, and a great blitzing LBer. he is a man among kids.

Hampton (Pit) is an All-pro and considered the best NT in the 3-4 defence in the NFL

Homes (Pit) a SB MVP and he is not on the list, he needs to be added.

Mendenhall (Pit) has not got to prove himself but he will be great

Flacco (Bal) is a good young QB

Palmer (Cin) is a great QB, enough said

McGahee (Bal) when healthy is a good player

Rivers (Cin) a really solid LBer

"Tank" Johnson (Cin) a good player if he stays out of trouble

Coles (Cin) is a solid WR

Roy Williams (Cin), Leonard (Cin) - good players

Lewis (Clev) still a better then avg RB

The North also has more than 7.

WR Lee Evans (BUF)
CB Leigh Bodden (NE)
RB Ronnie Brown (MIA)
ILB Channing Crowder (MIA)
SS Jim Leonhard (NYJ)
TE Anthony Fasano (MIA)
OT Vernon Carey (MIA)
C Dan Koppen (NE)
QB Chad Pennington (MIA)
CB Leodis McKelvin (BUF)
RB Leon Washington (NYJ)
ILB Bart Scott (NYJ)

Gay Ork Wang
05-16-2009, 09:32 AM
Did someone just call Roy Williams a good player?

Bigburt63
05-16-2009, 03:28 PM
I'll vote for the North, but I don't care for how some people expect that Welker would be handled rather easily.

All this mentioning of Santonio Holmes against none for Lee Evans is also odd to me.

I know right? All Welker did the past 2 years was abuse the men covering him for 111 catches each year. Timmons could not lock him down every play...I don't think any one player (outside of a few lockdown corners) could, and even then he's still going to get his. Plus Evans should definitely be in the discussion for the AFCE.

So Taylor locks TO down one game and all of a sudden he beats him every time? If you want to man up on TO, and have Leon Hall and a safety over the top on Moss then Welker is either being covered by the other safety or a LB, advantage Welker. I really doubt the AFCE would start a FB, and even if they did Keller would probably line up in the other slot as an H-back type.

I'm not saying it would always work or be easy, but the AFCE offense would be able to move the ball and score points. The running game would be very limited to say the least, but there are ways of neutralizing the pass rush somewhat (i.e. 3 step drops, screens, etc.).

The Great Jonathan Vilma
05-16-2009, 03:34 PM
Some of this Steeler hype is pretty rediculous. The fact that i've heard Mendenhall's name on more than one occasion just kills me. Give it up quick.

As soon as you mention Roy Williams, i question using you as a credible source.

Ike Taylor is a solid corner, but he isn't the god you are hyping him up to be. You keep saying that he shut TO out therefore he will obviously do it again, which is looking at the situation in a very narrow and biased manner.

You keep throwing Holmes out there like he's some HoF'er. His SB performance was very strong. Welker has also had some good games/seasons in the recent past. I also vaguely recall Moss/Brady/Welker being the center of a pretty impressive offense fairly recently.

I'm not saying the North wouldn't win, but some of the reasoning and homer comments are rediculous (Steeler fans in particular)

Don Vito
05-16-2009, 03:59 PM
QB: Tom Brady-Chad Pennington
RB: Marshawn Lynch-Ronnie Brown-Thomas Jones
FB: Tony Richardson-Lousaka Polite
WR: Randy Moss-Wes Welker
WR: Terrell Owens-Lee Evans
TE: Dustin Keller-Anthony Fasano
LT: Matt Light-D'Brickashaw Ferguson
LG: Alan Faneca-Justin Smiley
C: Nick Mangold-Dan Koppen
RG: Logan Mankins-Damien Woody
RT: Jake Long-Vernon Carey

Other guys to consider: Trent Edwards (QB), Fred Taylor (RB), Roscoe Parrish (WR-RS), Jerico Cotchery (WR), Ted Ginn Jr. (WR), Alex Smith (TE), Langston Walker (OL), Jake Grove (OL)

DE: Richard Seymour-Marcus Stroud
NT: Vince Wilfork-Kris Jenkins
DE: Ty Warren-Shaun Ellis
OLB: Joey Porter-Aaron Schoebel
ILB: Jerod Mayo-Bart Scott
ILB: David Harris-Channing Crowder
OLB: Adailus Thomas-Calvin Pace
CB: Darrell Revis-Will Allen
CB: Terrence McGee-Leigh Bodden
FS: Gibril Wilson-Brandon Meriweather
SS: Kerry Rhodes-Donte Whitner

Other guys to consider: Phillip Merling (DE), Paul Posluszny (ILB), Jason Taylor (OLB), Bryan Thomas (OLB), Vontae Davis (CB), Shawn Springs (CB), Yeremiah Bell (SS), Jim Leohnard (SS)

K: Stephen Gostkowski
P: Brian Moorman
KR: Leon Washington-Leodis McKelvin
PR: Roscoe Parrish

That is what I have for the East team in the AFC East division forum. There is a lot of talent and a lot of depth, and I think it would be a great game. However, I think there are some people who are undervaluing some East players Vilma and SuperMcGee said. The North definitely has some studs, especially on defense, but some people are giving the North a little too much of an edge over the East.

The North would have a great front 7, but the East has a great line. The North would have a great secondary, but the East has an elite QB throwing to some of the best receivers in the NFL not to mention RB's who can make plays as receivers. I am not saying the East would dominate I'm just saying it would be a great and very evenly matched game.

Mr. Stiller
05-16-2009, 05:00 PM
I know right? All Welker did the past 2 years was abuse the men covering him for 111 catches each year. Timmons could not lock him down every play...I don't think any one player (outside of a few lockdown corners) could, and even then he's still going to get his. Plus Evans should definitely be in the discussion for the AFCE.

So Taylor locks TO down one game and all of a sudden he beats him every time? If you want to man up on TO, and have Leon Hall and a safety over the top on Moss then Welker is either being covered by the other safety or a LB, advantage Welker. I really doubt the AFCE would start a FB, and even if they did Keller would probably line up in the other slot as an H-back type.

I'm not saying it would always work or be easy, but the AFCE offense would be able to move the ball and score points. The running game would be very limited to say the least, but there are ways of neutralizing the pass rush somewhat (i.e. 3 step drops, screens, etc.).

So, what if the other Safety is Troy?


My point has been yeah, this is a high powered offense and yeah they could score a lot of points.

My issue is the posts that go:

Tom Brady + Randy Moss + TO = Auto-Win.

Sure, there's a possibility Ike wouldn't shut TO down again, but the difference is he proved he can do it, so it's not out of the question as people are making it.

Sure there's probably going to be scoring, but at the same time, I think it's just unnerving to see people undercut this secondary just because they're facing Moss/Brady/TO.

Forgetting the Best FS/SS in the league are in the deep centerfield, and that Ike Has shown he can cover these guys.

eaglesalltheway
05-16-2009, 05:03 PM
Voted North, the trenches win again... That front 7 for the North is killer. Really close though.

Mr. Stiller
05-16-2009, 05:19 PM
QB: Tom Brady-Chad Pennington
RB: Marshawn Lynch-Ronnie Brown-Thomas Jones
FB: Tony Richardson-Lousaka Polite
WR: Randy Moss-Wes Welker
WR: Terrell Owens-Lee Evans
TE: Dustin Keller-Anthony Fasano
LT: Matt Light-D'Brickashaw Ferguson
LG: Alan Faneca-Justin Smiley
C: Nick Mangold-Dan Koppen
RG: Logan Mankins-Damien Woody
RT: Jake Long-Vernon Carey

Other guys to consider: Trent Edwards (QB), Fred Taylor (RB), Roscoe Parrish (WR-RS), Jerico Cotchery (WR), Ted Ginn Jr. (WR), Alex Smith (TE), Langston Walker (OL), Jake Grove (OL)

DE: Richard Seymour-Marcus Stroud
NT: Vince Wilfork-Kris Jenkins
DE: Ty Warren-Shaun Ellis
OLB: Joey Porter-Aaron Schoebel
ILB: Jerod Mayo-Bart Scott
ILB: David Harris-Channing Crowder
OLB: Adailus Thomas-Calvin Pace
CB: Darrell Revis-Will Allen
CB: Terrence McGee-Leigh Bodden
FS: Gibril Wilson-Brandon Meriweather
SS: Kerry Rhodes-Donte Whitner

Other guys to consider: Phillip Merling (DE), Paul Posluszny (ILB), Jason Taylor (OLB), Bryan Thomas (OLB), Vontae Davis (CB), Shawn Springs (CB), Yeremiah Bell (SS), Jim Leohnard (SS)

K: Stephen Gostkowski
P: Brian Moorman
KR: Leon Washington-Leodis McKelvin
PR: Roscoe Parrish

That is what I have for the East team in the AFC East division forum. There is a lot of talent and a lot of depth, and I think it would be a great game. However, I think there are some people who are undervaluing some East players Vilma and SuperMcGee said. The North definitely has some studs, especially on defense, but some people are giving the North a little too much of an edge over the East.

The North would have a great front 7, but the East has a great line. The North would have a great secondary, but the East has an elite QB throwing to some of the best receivers in the NFL not to mention RB's who can make plays as receivers. I am not saying the East would dominate I'm just saying it would be a great and very evenly matched game.

if we were doing full-depth...


QB: Ben Roethlisberger -> Carson Palmer
RB: Willie Parker -> Willis McGahee -> Mewelde Moore
FB: Le'Ron McClain -> Lawrence Vickers
WR: Hines Ward -> Santonio Holmes
WR: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR: Derrick Mason -> Mark Clayton
TE: Heath Miller -> Todd Heap
LT: Joe Thomas -> Max Starks
LG: Eric Steinbach -> Andrew Whitworth
C: Matt Birk -> Justin Hartwig
RG: Ben Grubbs -> Willie Colon
RT: Jared Gaither -> Michael Oher/Andre Smith


WDE: Haloti Ngata -> Trevor Pryce
NT: Shaun Rogers -> Casey Hampton
SDE: Aaron Smith -> Justin Bannan

WOLB: James Harrison -> Terrell Suggs
WILB: Ray Lewis -> D'Qwell Jackson
SILB: James Farrior -> Dhani Jones
SOLB: LaMarr Woodley -> Robert Geathers

CB: Ike Taylor -> Jonathon Joseph -> Leon Hall
CB: Fabian Washington -> Eric Wright

FS: Ed Reed -> Ryan Clark
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Dawan Landry


Other Notables:

Dominique Foxworth (CB), Antwan Barnes (OLB), Ray Rice (RB) (Scotty isnt' this Auto-Win?), L.J. Smith (TE)

Brandon McDonald(CB), Kamerion Wimbley (OLB), Jamal Lewis(RB), Josh Cribbs (KR/PR)

Keith Rivers (ILB), Anthony Collins (OT), Brian Leonard (RB/FB)(Another Autowin?), Cedric Benson (RB)

Lawrence Timmons (ILB/OLB), Chris Hoke (NT)


Can we petition the NFL to let us watch the game?


not to mention...

Tomlin at HC.. with Mangini/LeBeau/Lewis/Ryan
Cam Cameron with assistants Arians/Bratkowski.
Harbaugh with ST's with Bob Ligashesky.

Very interesting game.

OSUGiants17
05-16-2009, 05:21 PM
The North's D is just to good to vote against.

Don Vito
05-16-2009, 05:44 PM
if we were doing full-depth...


QB: Ben Roethlisberger -> Carson Palmer
RB: Willie Parker -> Willis McGahee -> Mewelde Moore
FB: Le'Ron McClain -> Lawrence Vickers
WR: Hines Ward -> Santonio Holmes
WR: Chad Johnson -> Braylon Edwards
WR: Derrick Mason -> Mark Clayton
TE: Heath Miller -> Todd Heap
LT: Joe Thomas -> Max Starks
LG: Eric Steinbach -> Andrew Whitworth
C: Matt Birk -> Justin Hartwig
RG: Ben Grubbs -> Willie Colon
RT: Jared Gaither -> Michael Oher/Andre Smith


WDE: Haloti Ngata -> Trevor Pryce
NT: Shaun Rogers -> Casey Hampton
SDE: Aaron Smith -> Justin Bannan

WOLB: James Harrison -> Terrell Suggs
WILB: Ray Lewis -> D'Qwell Jackson
SILB: James Farrior -> Dhani Jones
SOLB: LaMarr Woodley -> Robert Geathers

CB: Ike Taylor -> Jonathon Joseph -> Leon Hall
CB: Fabian Washington -> Eric Wright

FS: Ed Reed -> Ryan Clark
SS: Troy Polamalu -> Dawan Landry


Other Notables:

Dominique Foxworth (CB), Antwan Barnes (OLB), Ray Rice (RB) (Scotty isnt' this Auto-Win?), L.J. Smith (TE)

Brandon McDonald(CB), Kamerion Wimbley (OLB), Jamal Lewis(RB), Josh Cribbs (KR/PR)

Keith Rivers (ILB), Anthony Collins (OT), Brian Leonard (RB/FB)(Another Autowin?), Cedric Benson (RB)

Lawrence Timmons (ILB/OLB), Chris Hoke (NT)


Can we petition the NFL to let us watch the game?


not to mention...

Tomlin at HC.. with Mangini/LeBeau/Lewis/Ryan
Cam Cameron with assistants Arians/Bratkowski.
Harbaugh with ST's with Bob Ligashesky.

Very interesting game.

I think it would be a great matchup, possibly the best division vs. division game. Both teams would have great starters but what really is astounding is the depth. I'm sure you could find it in most divisions, but this game would be so physical I would love to see it happen.

Bigburt63
05-16-2009, 06:14 PM
So, what if the other Safety is Troy?


My point has been yeah, this is a high powered offense and yeah they could score a lot of points.

My issue is the posts that go:

Tom Brady + Randy Moss + TO = Auto-Win.

Sure, there's a possibility Ike wouldn't shut TO down again, but the difference is he proved he can do it, so it's not out of the question as people are making it.

Sure there's probably going to be scoring, but at the same time, I think it's just unnerving to see people undercut this secondary just because they're facing Moss/Brady/TO.

Forgetting the Best FS/SS in the league are in the deep centerfield, and that Ike Has shown he can cover these guys.

I'm not trying to say that simply because Brady, Moss and TO are on the same team that they would shred the defense. It would be a great matchup. To say that Leon Hall and Ike Taylor could shut down Moss and TO is ridiculous. If they could, then ya, the AFCE would be in terrible trouble, but I couldn't see that happening. My point is that just because Taylor did it once doesn't mean he is going to do it again, nevermind the fact that IMO Hall would get shredded by Moss.

That safety tandem is ridiculous, and the front 7 is crazy. I even said running the ball would be extremely difficult, if not impossible. At the same time, people seem to be underestimating the abilities of a wide receiver corps of Moss, TO, Welker, Evans, and Keller at TE.

By the same token, I don't see much running room against the AFCE's front 7.

steel man
05-17-2009, 02:10 PM
Actually, Casey Hampton has never been an all-pro.

before you TRY to discredit someone look your facts up, he has been all pro 4 times

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HampCa00.htm

here's my proof.....i do know what i am talking about unlike some.

Crickett
05-17-2009, 03:05 PM
before you TRY to discredit someone look your facts up, he has been all pro 4 times

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HampCa00.htm

here's my proof.....i do know what i am talking about unlike some.


http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story?id=09000d5d80d60467&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true

this is the pro bowl.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/01/09/all-pro-roster.ap/index.html

All-Pro


From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

All-Pro is a term mostly used in the NFL for the best players of each position during that season. It began as polls of sportswriters in the early 1920s. There are also 2nd Team All-Pros which connotes the runner-up at each position. It is generally considered more prestigious than the Pro Bowl.

Pro Bowl
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Pro bowl)
Jump to: navigation, search

In professional American football, the Pro Bowl is the all-star game of the National Football League (NFL). Since the merger with the rival American Football League (AFL) in 1970, it has been officially called the AFC-NFC Pro Bowl, matching players in the American Football Conference (AFC) against those in the National Football Conference (NFC).


This is my proof you haven't got a clue wtf you're talking about.

And that before you TRY to discredit someone look your facts up, he has been all pro 0 times

steelernation77
05-17-2009, 04:07 PM
http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story?id=09000d5d80d60467&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true

this is the pro bowl.


http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/football/nfl/01/09/all-pro-roster.ap/index.html

All-Pro


From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

All-Pro is a term mostly used in the NFL for the best players of each position during that season. It began as polls of sportswriters in the early 1920s. There are also 2nd Team All-Pros which connotes the runner-up at each position. It is generally considered more prestigious than the Pro Bowl.

Pro Bowl
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
(Redirected from Pro bowl)
Jump to: navigation, search

In professional American football, the Pro Bowl is the all-star game of the National Football League (NFL). Since the merger with the rival American Football League (AFL) in 1970, it has been officially called the AFC-NFC Pro Bowl, matching players in the American Football Conference (AFC) against those in the National Football Conference (NFC).


This is my proof you haven't got a clue wtf you're talking about.

And that before you TRY to discredit someone look your facts up, he has been all pro 0 times

Hampton doesn't play a position that lend itself to garnering the type of stats needed for All-Pro.

Crickett
05-17-2009, 04:13 PM
Hampton doesn't play a position that lend itself to garnering the type of stats needed for All-Pro.

Then how did Kris Jenkins, Vince Wilfork and Jamal Williams manage it?

steel man
05-18-2009, 10:47 PM
1st i will admit that i typed the wrong phase in the beginning when i said all-pro...as you can tell by my post i was talking about pro-bowls, the ALL_PRO team does not mean anything, it tells you something when some of the players that make the All-pro did not make the Pro-bowl. the all-pro team is a bunch of sportswriters voting on who they like....if a player did not give them an interview or said something that they did not like then they would not vote for him, whereas 2/3's of the pro-bowl's vote comes from people that know real football not just stats in coaches and players so that is why i was proving that he made the pro-bowl 4 times.

Crickett
05-18-2009, 10:57 PM
1st i will admit that i typed the wrong phase in the beginning when i said all-pro...as you can tell by my post i was talking about pro-bowls, the ALL_PRO team does not mean anything, it tells you something when some of the players that make the All-pro did not make the Pro-bowl. the all-pro team is a bunch of sportswriters voting on who they like....if a player did not give them an interview or said something that they did not like then they would not vote for him, whereas 2/3's of the pro-bowl's vote comes from people that know real football not just stats in coaches and players so that is why i was proving that he made the pro-bowl 4 times.


1. People who make the pro bowl are called "pro bowlers". Example: "Eli Manning is a pro bowl quarterback." People who make the all-pro team are referred as "all-pro".
Example: "Peyton Manning is an all-pro quarterback"

2. "2/3's of the pro bowl's vote comes from people that know real football not just stats in coaches and players". Yeah, that's how Roy Williams got in there five consecutive times. Seriously, you're defending the ultimate popularity contest in football as a better gauge of player quality as better than the all-pro team? Really? Really?

Mr. Stiller
05-19-2009, 12:29 AM
1. People who make the pro bowl are called "pro bowlers". Example: "Eli Manning is a pro bowl quarterback." People who make the all-pro team are referred as "all-pro".
Example: "Peyton Manning is an all-pro quarterback"

2. "2/3's of the pro bowl's vote comes from people that know real football not just stats in coaches and players". Yeah, that's how Roy Williams got in there five consecutive times. Seriously, you're defending the ultimate popularity contest in football as a better gauge of player quality as better than the all-pro team? Really? Really?

Sorry Steel Man.

The AP List is the list of people who actually know what they're talking about. AP Is more a gauge of player ability and success than the Pro-bowl, which almost featured 22 Redskins last year.