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jsa230
05-15-2009, 12:52 PM
Let me start by saying i don't know much about this guy and have only seen him play probably 3 times. I know the spread opened some serious lanes up for him and he beniffited from alot of talent around him. Will he declare this year? Is he a legit first day guy or more of a late rounder? Basically, I would like to get some takes on devine as a prospect. If he tore it up this offseason (combine/workouts/proday) i could see him in the late first/second.

How does DeVine grade out as a pro prospect?

YAYareaRB
05-15-2009, 12:55 PM
He would definitely have to tear it up this season and the success of Steve Slaton only helps his case. Size is becoming a non factore, at least at the RB position.

Notredameleo
05-15-2009, 12:57 PM
This guy, worst case scenario, will be the best return man ever!!!

YAYareaRB
05-15-2009, 01:00 PM
This guy, worst case scenario, will be the best return man ever!!!

Definitely worst case scenario. You put this guy on the field and he'll do something special for you.

BuddyCHRIST
05-15-2009, 01:34 PM
He's more of a 5th-6th rounder to me considering how far some good RB's have fallen. Not only is he coming out of that offense but he's very small and a bit of a headcase.

Texas Homer
05-15-2009, 02:43 PM
He doesn't have ideal size. He is VERY TALENTED though.

Just my early opinion, but 3rd or 4th round.

YAYareaRB
05-15-2009, 02:44 PM
I think the size factor is beginning to come in question when evaluating backs.

BeerBaron
05-15-2009, 02:48 PM
I think the size factor is beginning to come in question when evaluating backs.

"Come into question" as in, becoming less important? Then I'll agree....because we've been seeing smaller backs tear it up in recent years, like Slaton who preceded Devine.

I look at Devine as a poor mans Percy Harvin. Harvin went in the first round, even with the questions about his durability, true position and his mental makeup, so I could see Devine sneaking into the 2nd round as a change of pace back who can split out wide and be a return man.

That's if he really tears it up this year and shows to have great numbers in the pre-draft stuff.

ncst8fan83
05-15-2009, 03:01 PM
Devine=Sproles?

hagy34
05-15-2009, 03:51 PM
He would definitely have to tear it up this season and the success of Steve Slaton only helps his case. Size is becoming a non factore, at least at the RB position.

The success of Sproles in SD also helps his value, teams will view him as a 3rd down back but a stud returner.

rockio42
05-15-2009, 04:12 PM
I would hope that guys like Maurice Jones-Drew and Darren Sproles would finally shut people up about height with RBs...Devine is a playmaker and you can't fight that, even when you look at his size

CC.SD
05-15-2009, 04:17 PM
Devine=Sproles?

I'm not sure it's the best comparison. I don't have a problem with a guy being short, but Devine is slight, and that's a bigger issue. Sproles came into the league having outbenched Merriman at the combine, and is in general an extremely thick and strong dude. And even he has gotten knicked up and banged around.

Devine's got unholy wheels and moves, but I'm not sure he's anything more than an extremely situational guy outside of special teams. Don't get me wrong, he could still change games from that position. If I were GM/coach, I don't think I would rule out a position change to wideout.

Hines
05-15-2009, 04:17 PM
I don't think he will make an impact as a running back, but you get him in space, and he will make defenders look silly. I can see him as a gadget type of player in the NFL and return specialist. I do think he comes out after this season to provide for his children.

BeerBaron
05-15-2009, 04:27 PM
Devine's got unholy wheels and moves, but I'm not sure he's anything more than an extremely situational guy outside of special teams. Don't get me wrong, he could still change games from that position. If I were GM/coach, I don't think I would rule out a position change to wideout.

I don't think he will make an impact as a running back, but you get him in space, and he will make defenders look silly. I can see him as a gadget type of player in the NFL and return specialist. I do think he comes out after this season to provide for his children.

The success of Sproles in SD also helps his value, teams will view him as a 3rd down back but a stud returner.


If you all would just glance a few posts up you'll see:



I look at Devine as a poor mans Percy Harvin. Harvin went in the first round, even with the questions about his durability, true position and his mental makeup, so I could see Devine sneaking into the 2nd round as a change of pace back who can split out wide and be a return man.


Thank you.

ncst8fan83
05-15-2009, 04:30 PM
I'm not sure it's the best comparison. I don't have a problem with a guy being short, but Devine is slight, and that's a bigger issue. Sproles came into the league having outbenched Merriman at the combine, and is in general an extremely thick and strong dude. And even he has gotten knicked up and banged around.

Devine's got unholy wheels and moves, but I'm not sure he's anything more than an extremely situational guy outside of special teams. Don't get me wrong, he could still change games from that position. If I were GM/coach, I don't think I would rule out a position change to wideout.

Devine's max is 405 on the bench...dude is awesome man.

CC.SD
05-15-2009, 04:32 PM
If you all would just glance a few posts up you'll see:




Thank you.

Harvin was always more blue chip than Devine though. He also entered the draft as a clear wideout (who could also offer more if your bag of tricks is deep enough). There's definitely similarities between them but if Devine wants to be a RB in the NFL he does not have an easy path ahead of him.

CC.SD
05-15-2009, 04:34 PM
Devine's max is 405 on the bench...dude is awesome man.

Is this true? Pretty nifty. He still seems significantly less built than Sproles and of course Mo Jo.

BeerBaron
05-15-2009, 04:37 PM
Harvin was always more blue chip than Devine though. He also entered the draft as a clear wideout (who could also offer more if your bag of tricks is deep enough). There's definitely similarities between them but if Devine wants to be a RB in the NFL he does not have an easy path ahead of him.

Did he enter as a true receiver though? I mean, thats where he's going to have to play mostly in the pros, but he wasn't really a true receiver in college. He also didn't do any return work in college....

If Harvin can go first round, and someone like Pat White second round, and with the recent successes of "undersized" running backs, I think Devine's chances go way up of succeeding and being drafted reasonably high.

Like I said, with a good season and good pre-draft workouts, I think he could be a 2nd round chance of pace kind of back who also splits out white and does return work.

Cicero
05-15-2009, 04:42 PM
I'm not sure it's the best comparison. I don't have a problem with a guy being short, but Devine is slight, and that's a bigger issue. Sproles came into the league having outbenched Merriman at the combine, and is in general an extremely thick and strong dude. And even he has gotten knicked up and banged around.

Devine's got unholy wheels and moves, but I'm not sure he's anything more than an extremely situational guy outside of special teams. Don't get me wrong, he could still change games from that position. If I were GM/coach, I don't think I would rule out a position change to wideout.

Noel Devine's bench max was confirmed at 405 lbs, and I've heard it was anywhere from there up to 435 lbs.

I'm only 19, but Devine has the best combination of balance, speed, and agility that I have ever seen in college football. He is extremely difficult to even get a hand on, and if you do manage to get a hand on him he can still break tackles. His lateral agility is second to none, and he can change directions on a dime. He's a legitimate threat to take it to the house anytime he has the ball in his hands, and he's the kind of player who can turn a 1 yard run into a 15 yard run. All this, plus I would bet that he can run about a 4.3 flat forty.

I can't think of any scenario outside of a devastating injury that would lead to Devine falling to day 2. Every offensive coordinator dreams about having a weapon like him.

CC.SD
05-15-2009, 04:44 PM
Did he enter as a true receiver though? I mean, thats where he's going to have to play mostly in the pros, but he wasn't really a true receiver in college. He also didn't do any return work in college....

If Harvin can go first round, and someone like Pat White second round, and with the recent successes of "undersized" running backs, I think Devine's chances go way up of succeeding and being drafted reasonably high.

Like I said, with a good season and good pre-draft workouts, I think he could be a 2nd round chance of pace kind of back who also splits out white and does return work.

Yah in general I agree with this assessment. I know Percy shifted around a lot in college, I meant that in the pros he is going to be spending his time as a WR/returner.

etk
05-15-2009, 05:58 PM
I'm not sure it's the best comparison. I don't have a problem with a guy being short, but Devine is slight, and that's a bigger issue. Sproles came into the league having outbenched Merriman at the combine, and is in general an extremely thick and strong dude. And even he has gotten knicked up and banged around.


Are we talking about the same player? Noel Devine is much more powerful than Sproles. I've never seen someone get a clean hit on him. He's short, squatty, strong, has outstanding balance, feet and agility. He bounces off tackles and runs with forward lean. Sproles is hard to catch but he's an easy tackle when you find him.

I think he's a rich man's Sproles, and the fact that Sproles got a franchise tag leads me to believe that Devine will be a 1st rounder...although character concerns may push him down.

SKim172
05-15-2009, 06:51 PM
While I agree that size is overrated and that height is almost irrelevant, I don't think the comparisons between Devine and MJD are accurate. MJD is short, but he's a rock-solid 208 pounds. Devine is just 175, last I checked. And more than that, MJD has a unique build, with his bulk centered lower on his body. Devine is slight and while I don't think it means he can't succeed in the NFL, it's unreasonable to say it won't affect his chances and certainly his draft stock.

Sproles is just 180, so I think that's a more accurate comparison. But he seems to be an exception, rather than the norm. Shorter backs tend to be quite weighty for their size. Steve Slaton is an inch taller than Devine and weighs in at 203. Ray Rice is the same height and weighs 205.

Race for the Heisman
05-15-2009, 07:25 PM
I don't really like comparisons to all-time greats, but if there is a second coming of Barry Sanders, it's Devine. The thing is though, he's a very north-south runner and he doesn't really retreat with the prospect for an even bigger gain, which is always one of the negatives brought up when you compare a player to Sanders.

Aside from the big guys that you might look at as true franchise backs (Dwyer for the most part, maybe a guy like Blount or Best), Devine is the best prospect, which includes a pretty solid list of guys in DeMarco Murray, C.J. Spiller, Joe McKnight, and Graig Cooper, to name a few.

TheDoctor8
05-15-2009, 08:50 PM
How can somebody say that Devine will be a 4th to 6th rounder when Pat White was a 2nd rounder. Devine is the most explosive player in college football. If it wasn't for the off the field problems he had in high school then he would have went to the Florida or Miami. Can you imagine a far better Jeffrey Demps, I mean like a lot better Jeffrey Demps. He would have had close to 2,000 yards total offense, he is that good.

superman
05-15-2009, 09:41 PM
Devine's max is 405 on the bench...dude is awesome man.

eh didn't really help antone smith at all. then again, devine is better. but they're not gonna look at that bench and see "every down back"

superman
05-15-2009, 09:42 PM
While I agree that size is overrated and that height is almost irrelevant, I don't think the comparisons between Devine and MJD are accurate. MJD is short, but he's a rock-solid 208 pounds. Devine is just 175, last I checked. And more than that, MJD has a unique build, with his bulk centered lower on his body. Devine is slight and while I don't think it means he can't succeed in the NFL, it's unreasonable to say it won't affect his chances and certainly his draft stock.

Sproles is just 180, so I think that's a more accurate comparison. But he seems to be an exception, rather than the norm. Shorter backs tend to be quite weighty for their size. Steve Slaton is an inch taller than Devine and weighs in at 203. Ray Rice is the same height and weighs 205.


i thought mjd was around 217-220

lordquas
05-15-2009, 09:58 PM
If Lebron is the new Jordan,
Devine will be the new Barry Sanders

Cicero
05-15-2009, 10:10 PM
eh didn't really help antone smith at all. then again, devine is better. but they're not gonna look at that bench and see "every down back"

Antone Smith has horrible vision and it didn't take much more than a few long blades of grass to bring him down. There is no comparison there besides small and fast.

marshallb
05-15-2009, 10:12 PM
i thought mjd was around 217-220

nope, on ESPN, he's listed at 5'7" 208. That's rock solid for 5'7" tho. Think of it this way, AD is 6'1" 218, and he's ripped, and people are complaining cause he wants to put on another 5-10 pounds this offseason b/c they think it'll slow him down.

superman
05-15-2009, 10:14 PM
Antone Smith has horrible vision and it didn't take much more than a few long blades of grass to bring him down. There is no comparison there besides small and fast.

i was going off the freakish bench. i know he's less of a player.

superman
05-15-2009, 10:15 PM
nope, on ESPN, he's listed at 5'7" 208. That's rock solid for 5'7" tho. Think of it this way, AD is 6'1" 218, and he's ripped, and people are complaining cause he wants to put on another 5-10 pounds this offseason b/c they think it'll slow him down.

maybe he was getting too stocky and they had him slim down. i know in a previous year he was heavier. i couldn't even imagine how a guy that short could weigh that much and still be quick.

eaglesalltheway
05-15-2009, 10:29 PM
maybe he was getting too stocky and they had him slim down. i know in a previous year he was heavier. i couldn't even imagine how a guy that short could weigh that much and still be quick.

I'm 5'8 208 and pretty quick. I'm not MJD by any means, but I'm just as quick at my weight now than if I were 15 lbs less, and as long if I'd gain the right 10 lbs, I'd be just as quick at 218 as I am at 208. Just magnify my (in comparison) lackluster athletecism to get MJD's. As long as you know where to add the weight and if it isn't garbage weight, you can lose very little athletecism.

SKim172
05-15-2009, 10:34 PM
I don't really like comparisons to all-time greats, but if there is a second coming of Barry Sanders, it's Devine.

But again, weight comes up as a big disparity. Sanders was short, at 5'8", but he weighed 203 pounds. Devine is the same height, but weighs 28 pounds less. That's why I really don't like that comparison.

There's an interesting article by Pro-Football-Reference from last year comparing running backs and BMI (http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=489) (Body Mass Index), a ratio that compares height to weight.

They calculated the BMI of the top 50 rushers since 1970 and the weighted average was about 29.6.

At his listed height and playing weight, Devine's BMI is roughly 26.6 - on the low end. Sproles, at 66 inches and 181 lbs, has a BMI of about 29.1, which is actually decent. Devine's BMI matches up with Warrick Dunn and I think he'll have to bring a similar game.

Of course, it's not entirely scientific, but it is food for thought.

wogitalia
05-15-2009, 11:27 PM
^ I love BMI, it is the absolute stupidest test I can think of.

According to BMI, every single one of the greatest RBs in NFL history was at the very least "Overweight". Hell 20 of them are "Dangerously Obese". Last I checked LT was not obese but according to BMI you better believe that he is.

What a ridiculous, stupid way of measuring anything.

Race for the Heisman
05-16-2009, 12:11 AM
^ I love BMI, it is the absolute stupidest test I can think of.

According to BMI, every single one of the greatest RBs in NFL history was at the very least "Overweight". Hell 20 of them are "Dangerously Obese". Last I checked LT was not obese but according to BMI you better believe that he is.

What a ridiculous, stupid way of measuring anything.

Well, it makes sense for normal people. BMI makes assumptions about tissue distribution that just don't apply to athletes.

kwilk103
05-16-2009, 12:22 AM
5'7 175lbs (last years numbers, looks like he put on 5 lbs at spring game)

testing numbers (last years)

bench---405
squat---475
40----4.30
vert---41

http://footballrecruiting.rivals.com/content.asp?SID=880&CID=387747

could bench 330 at age 16

He's had a tremendous spring. He's so fast. He's 175 pounds and he bench-pressed - bench-pressed! - 405 pounds. He took 405 down, off his chest, paused and blew it up. I saw him at 350 and I was going to stop him. Then, when he got to 365, I was distracted by pro scouts. Then this little cat went 405.-----Bill Stewart, WVU Coach

also, i'd like to see a 10 yd split on his 40; he gets from 0 to top speed so quick

little long, but one last thing; hes the hardest worker on the team; 1 of 4 to be named hardest workers before spring game; article in local paper, said how he was getting on players for not showing up on saturdays for optional workouts; hes taking on a more leadership role this year

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=290r2b7&s=3

wogitalia
05-16-2009, 07:14 AM
Well, it makes sense for normal people. BMI makes assumptions about tissue distribution that just don't apply to athletes.

But it doesn't. Normal people can have athletic builds, I am dangerously obese with a sub 10% body fat according to BMI. I just think it is stupid, it has no foundation, the standards they set are actually dangerously low anyway, it's like saying passing yards = good qb, without taking anything else into consideration. Just a stupid system.

SKim172
05-16-2009, 07:36 AM
BMI is a standard of measurement. It is often used by medical professionals to estimate obesity. A person over a certain BMI tends to be overweight, but there are plenty of exceptions. It's merely a guideline - medically, you can't be determined as "obese" without measuring your fat level. Many people who are considered underweight are, in fact, obese, because they have a high amount of body fat and a low amount of muscle tissue.

In a pure sense, BMI does not determine your obesity. It merely states how much mass your body has in relation to your size. It's a measure of density, not your obesity. Muscle tissue is denser than fat, which is why athletic people have higher BMI's. But again, it does not directly measure your obesity. That is why it's a useful tool in gauging athletes and their size.

So don't be offended, dude. It's not about body fat, it's simply how much mass and density a person has.

BMI does have its shortcomings, because it makes assumptions about the average distribution of bone and muscle mass. So if Noel Devine has a unique build with an extremely high level of muscle density, then BMI would be misleading.

Again, it's just a guideline. And it doesn't directly measure fat level. That's just something they started doing in the 50's and has been a heavily-criticized practice. That's why you see athletes in the pod at the Combine - much more scientific.

lordquas
05-16-2009, 08:32 AM
who really cares about height and weight and 40 times and bench press.
Barry Sanders had excellent vision, terrific agility, and even better acceleration. He was the most elusive player to ever touch a football.
Sanders was 5'8 200 pounds.
Devine is 5'8 180. Seems pretty similar to me.

Its such a great comparison because both guys are incredible athletes and the same kind of runners. Speed, Agility, and Cutting on a dime is what both of these guys do so well. Devine probably won't win any Heismans but as a player is certainly a Barry Sanders clone.
Maybe Darren Sproles, Maybe even Chris Johnson.
But Barry Sanders, Noel Devine is just too perfect of a comparasion

eaglesalltheway
05-16-2009, 12:38 PM
Eagles O-linemen Nick Cole apparently has the highest BMI in NFL history...

He is either 5'11 or 6', and weighs something like 360 lbs...

Thats a damn high BMI, whatever it may be. I agree even for regular people BMI isn't a good system, because it only gauges height and weight, not what the weight is made up of. I was always on the heavier side in school, and my school district was the one that started the "fat letters". I never got one, but most of the athletes got them, and they were ripped as hell. The BMI completely forgets that muscle is more dense than fat, and is healthier, but on BMI, results show that as bad. It is a bogus system IMO.

superman
05-16-2009, 01:00 PM
^ I love BMI, it is the absolute stupidest test I can think of.

According to BMI, every single one of the greatest RBs in NFL history was at the very least "Overweight". Hell 20 of them are "Dangerously Obese". Last I checked LT was not obese but according to BMI you better believe that he is.

What a ridiculous, stupid way of measuring anything.

it's not stupid to compare it to other backs though. it's like everybody running the 40 at the combine, it's fair there to compare since it's all on even playing field. but it's not fair to compare someone running at pro day to someone running at combine.

we all know they're all technically overweight compared to the regular person.

BamaFalcon59
05-16-2009, 11:58 PM
eh didn't really help antone smith at all. then again, devine is better. but they're not gonna look at that bench and see "every down back"

Him saying that was in response to someone bragging about Sproles' weight room numbers.

holt_bruce81
05-17-2009, 12:14 AM
When I think of Noel Devine I always want to compare him to Darren Sproles. Not sure if that's a good comparison for him or not.

fenikz
05-17-2009, 05:20 AM
This guy, worst case scenario, will be the best return man ever!!!

he isnt close to Hester in return skills

superman8456
05-17-2009, 01:19 PM
imo he will be like a Chris Johnson. A lot of people sleep on him even though he puts up great numbers, then a team takes a chance on him and reaps the benefits when he turns out good

superman
05-17-2009, 01:35 PM
or he'll be like john avery

superman
05-17-2009, 01:36 PM
imo he will be like a Chris Johnson. A lot of people sleep on him even though he puts up great numbers, then a team takes a chance on him and reaps the benefits when he turns out good

i didnt even notice we have about the same username

Race for the Heisman
05-17-2009, 01:41 PM
I'm by no means a professional scout and I've already offered my say on Devine, but this is just a little something I wrote up after re-watching some tape:

Noel Devine, RB, West Virginia

The first thing that strikes you about Devine is his size. Without mincing words, heís on the small side at roughly 5070 or so, but he looks well put together at 180 or so. Watching him play, his speed jumps out. Devine has absolutely phenomenal quickness and lateral agility second to none. His burst is incredible, and his long speed may not be quite the same, but it canít be much worse that 4.45 at the absolute worst. Devine runs very north-south for such a small player and has fantastic vision in traffic. Heís got a good eye for the cut back lane. He runs hard, and his natural leverage compensates for a lot of what his size causes him to lack. Heís incredibly shifty; he makes players miss with regularity in the open field and while he can be tackled, it is a rarity to see someone land a clean hit on him. He is not always the most patient player when it comes to picking up blocks downfield (EDIT: sophomore season shows some improvement in this area), but that can be improved. He has special teams experience on kick returns (primarily from his freshman season Ė he only returned three kicks as a sophomore), which is no doubt something he would be asked to do since it is unlikely he would be a feature back. He doesnít have any experience with punt returns in college, which is a bit of a concern, but you have to think someone of his natural athleticism would be capable back there. Has played primarily in the zone-read as a one-cut and go-type back, something which he would likely to continue to excel in at the next level. He also has some experience running in an I-form as well, although that handful of carries looked more toss- than dive-oriented. I donít see much in the way of yards after the catch as I would expect out of a guy in that particular system at West Virginia, but when you look at his film catching doesnít appear to be a problem in terms of hands, although I wonder if his arm length might cause problems later on. Could use two hands on the ball when going through traffic, but fumbling doesnít seem to be an issue. Protects the ball well considering all the spinning and juking he does. This could be because opponents are more concerned with just tackling him than anything more. Shows good leg drive, routinely picking up numerous yards after first contact. Has shown a willingness to block, although his technical acumen is questionable in that area.

From a statistical analysis, 1200 yards on 200 carries (rounded for convenience) is impressive, but his four rushing touchdowns also tell you that he is a between the twenties player for the moment and his stock should be evaluated accordingly if he were to be considered as a true tailback, however unlikely that may be. That doesnít mean he canít be the Warrick Dunn to someoneís Mike Alstott, however. Also, he reminds me of a smaller Felix Jones (to not use the Barry Sanders comparison he receives elsewhere), and I think he could go in a similar area, all things considered.

Character is a concern. He had trouble qualifying for college (more of an intelligence thing, but attending class/work ethic come into play) and already has three children as a sophomore in college (Travis Henry, anyone?), although he claims to keep in contact with them. He was also one of four West Virginia players who plead no contest to a misdemeanor battery charge following his freshman (í07-í08) season. If you look back to his high school days, however, the number of people jumping up to defend Devine and make everything easy for him are numerous, so that may say something about what the people close to him believe.

kwilk103
05-17-2009, 01:48 PM
I'm by no means a professional scout and I've already offered my say on Devine, but this is just a little something I wrote up after re-watching some tape:

Noel Devine, RB, West Virginia

The first thing that strikes you about Devine is his size. Without mincing words, heís on the small side at roughly 5070 or so, but he looks well put together at 180 or so. Watching him play, his speed jumps out. Devine has absolutely phenomenal quickness and lateral agility second to none. His burst is incredible, and his long speed may not be quite the same, but it canít be much worse that 4.45 at the absolute worst. Devine runs very north-south for such a small player and has fantastic vision in traffic. Heís got a good eye for the cut back lane. He runs hard, and his natural leverage compensates for a lot of what his size causes him to lack. Heís incredibly shifty; he makes players miss with regularity in the open field and while he can be tackled, it is a rarity to see someone land a clean hit on him. He is not always the most patient player when it comes to picking up blocks downfield (EDIT: sophomore season shows some improvement in this area), but that can be improved. He has special teams experience on kick returns (primarily from his freshman season Ė he only returned three kicks as a sophomore), which is no doubt something he would be asked to do since it is unlikely he would be a feature back. He doesnít have any experience with punt returns in college, which is a bit of a concern, but you have to think someone of his natural athleticism would be capable back there. Has played primarily in the zone-read as a one-cut and go-type back, something which he would likely to continue to excel in at the next level. He also has some experience running in an I-form as well, although that handful of carries looked more toss- than dive-oriented. I donít see much in the way of yards after the catch as I would expect out of a guy in that particular system at West Virginia, but when you look at his film catching doesnít appear to be a problem in terms of hands, although I wonder if his arm length might cause problems later on. Could use two hands on the ball when going through traffic, but fumbling doesnít seem to be an issue. Protects the ball well considering all the spinning and juking he does. This could be because opponents are more concerned with just tackling him than anything more. Shows good leg drive, routinely picking up numerous yards after first contact. Has shown a willingness to block, although his technical acumen is questionable in that area.

From a statistical analysis, 1200 yards on 200 carries (rounded for convenience) is impressive, but his four rushing touchdowns also tell you that he is a between the twenties player for the moment and his stock should be evaluated accordingly if he were to be considered as a true tailback, however unlikely that may be. That doesnít mean he canít be the Warrick Dunn to someoneís Mike Alstott, however. Also, he reminds me of a smaller Felix Jones (to not use the Barry Sanders comparison he receives elsewhere), and I think he could go in a similar area, all things considered.

Character is a concern. He had trouble qualifying for college (more of an intelligence thing, but attending class/work ethic come into play) and already has three children as a sophomore in college (Travis Henry, anyone?), although he claims to keep in contact with them. He was also one of four West Virginia players who plead no contest to a misdemeanor battery charge following his freshman (í07-í08) season. If you look back to his high school days, however, the number of people jumping up to defend Devine and make everything easy for him are numerous, so that may say something about what the people close to him believe.

i would agree with this

hes not gonna return kicks/punts anymore unless he is needed to (like we are down and need a big return)

and we are going to run more out of the i with him, since he is better out of it, than he is the zone-read

he is close to his kids----whenever we have school off, or stew gives the team a week off in the summer, he is down in florida with his kids

RealityCheck
05-17-2009, 01:48 PM
I'll just say that if he stays for 2011, he'll be the #1 RB.

wogitalia
05-18-2009, 01:23 AM
we all know they're all technically overweight compared to the regular person.

How so? Is a guy like LT overweight? BMI says he is obese(standard descriptions from BMI). LT looks damn healthy to me, ripped would be a word I would use. I just hate the whole idea that you can set a range based on height and weight and try and apply it to different people. Each individual would need their own range set for BMI to work and then it is a completely different thing.

it's like everybody running the 40 at the combine, it's fair there to compare since it's all on even playing field. but it's not fair to compare someone running at pro day to someone running at combine.

No it isnt. BMI says nothing of the makeup of a person. It would be like saying 10 guys ran the 40 at the combine only they all ran it on a different track, with some tracks being quicksand and the others top running surfaces. Its taking a generic test based on two numbers and applying it with nothing else considered and then coming out with a determination as to whether a person is healthy, obese, underweight or overweight. Any test that measures whether someone is any of those that can be conducted sight unseen is a fraud and waste of time. It is a stupid test, period, which would be why the NFL teams don't use it.

superman
05-18-2009, 01:59 AM
How so? Is a guy like LT overweight? BMI says he is obese(standard descriptions from BMI). LT looks damn healthy to me, ripped would be a word I would use. I just hate the whole idea that you can set a range based on height and weight and try and apply it to different people. Each individual would need their own range set for BMI to work and then it is a completely different thing.



No it isnt. BMI says nothing of the makeup of a person. It would be like saying 10 guys ran the 40 at the combine only they all ran it on a different track, with some tracks being quicksand and the others top running surfaces. Its taking a generic test based on two numbers and applying it with nothing else considered and then coming out with a determination as to whether a person is healthy, obese, underweight or overweight. Any test that measures whether someone is any of those that can be conducted sight unseen is a fraud and waste of time. It is a stupid test, period, which would be why the NFL teams don't use it.

when i say overweight, i realize in these guy's cases, it's not from fat. because a majority of them would be around 28-30 bmi (guessing), it's fair to use this to compare them to each other. just not to normal people. it's almost like target range should be altered for an nfl player, if it were to ever be used at the combine. which i don't really think it should be.

Dagagad
05-18-2009, 02:46 AM
[QUOTE=lordquas;1664161]who really cares about height and weight and 40 times and bench press.
QUOTE]

Wait. Above the guy quoted a blog, which calculated that of the top 50 backs in nfl history, the average was 29.6.

Looking at the link he provided...

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/blog/?p=489

..the majority of the backs are between 28 and 31 bmi.

If I see a guy who is an outlier to that range, then I would be very hesitant in drafting him high, even if he was outstanding in other areas.

Actually, seeing as this list goes pretty far back, I'd be looking at a range of 29-31/2 for an ideal workhorse back.

Noel Devine is 5-8, 170 according to espn. I'd say he would need to be at 200lbs to be seriously considered as a team's primary running back in the nfl.

190 puts him at 28.9
200 puts him at 30.4

That would put him in the ideal range. If he can show he can block, runs a sub 4.5 in the combine then he could go first round.

So who really cares about height, weight and 40 times? NFL gms.

bench press...no one.

SKim172
05-18-2009, 08:35 AM
How so? Is a guy like LT overweight? BMI says he is obese(standard descriptions from BMI). LT looks damn healthy to me, ripped would be a word I would use. ... with a determination as to whether a person is healthy, obese, underweight or overweight. Any test that measures whether someone is any of those that can be conducted sight unseen is a fraud and waste of time. It is a stupid test, period, which would be why the NFL teams don't use it.

Okay, see, this is what I meant when I said don't get offended. BMI has nothing directly to do with body fat. The terms "underweight," "overweight," have nothing to do with your healthiness. "Overweight" just means "heavier than the average population," and the average is around 25 for males. Nobody said LT isn't healthy, they said he's overweight. It has nothing to do with health.

Indirectly, people have used BMI as a guideline to determining body fat level, as there is an average range that the majority of people fit in. If you've got a guy who's 5'5" and 400 pounds, BMI determines he has a lot of mass on his body. We can guess that, based on the average population, the man has high body fat, but until we do more scientific tests, nothing is certain.

When we talk about using BMI for NFL players, we are not determining healthiness or fat levels. We are simply comparing the average mass for a starting NFL running back with the mass of an upcoming draftee.

You are correct - there is no absolute here and running backs like Warrick Dunn have succeeded with a lower BMI. It's just a point of comparison. Based on observed data, we can note a pattern among a certain group of people and we can also note that Devine, who wishes to join that group of people, does not fit that pattern. That's all.

We can also note that most NFL tailbacks have forty times lower than 4.6. Does this mean any tailback higher than 4.6 automatically fails the test? No, but as a point of comparison, it tells us that player does not fit the common profile. It's a tool for measurement and comparison.

We make no assumptions about build. We are not making any absolute statements. We're not saying someone's healthy or someone's not. Those are all indirect judgments people can make based on the data. But in this case, there are no indirect statements, just comparing a measurement of a player to the measurements of others.

So don't be offended. It's not about health.

CC.SD
05-18-2009, 10:18 AM
How so? Is a guy like LT overweight? BMI says he is obese(standard descriptions from BMI). LT looks damn healthy to me, ripped would be a word I would use. I just hate the whole idea that you can set a range based on height and weight and try and apply it to different people. Each individual would need their own range set for BMI to work and then it is a completely different thing.


Your argument is null: It's true, LT is a fatty. If AD gains weight, he too will be a fatty.

Mr. Hero
05-18-2009, 11:55 AM
I don't know if he's a first day pick but he's close and I don't think he falls out of the third with a good season and combine. If he overachieves at either than he can solidify himself as a second rounder.

San Diego Chicken
05-18-2009, 05:30 PM
He has been a playmaker his whole career and I don't expect that to change in the NFL. I would love for A.J. Smith to pick this guy up if Sproles leaves next year. He's pretty good at catching the ball out of the backfield too...

703SKINS202
05-18-2009, 05:33 PM
He will be no later than a 2nd round pick and you can quote me on that. One of my favorite players obviously and would fit a need here in Washington! Get em.

Staubach12
05-18-2009, 06:38 PM
This guy will not take a ton of snaps every game, and he most likely won't have a long career. But someone needs him to fit in that scatback role and will be willing to give up a second or third round pick.

etk
05-18-2009, 06:54 PM
This guy will not take a ton of snaps every game, and he most likely won't have a long career. But someone needs him to fit in that scatback role and will be willing to give up a second or third round pick.

Why is that? Injuries haven't been a problem for him and he trains extremely hard. He will always have a role on teams because he's a change-of-pace back.

Again, I find this late 1st day talk to be ridiculous. Chris Johnson was a 1st round pick and it turned out well. Darren Sproles has created a niche for himself. Reggie Bush is beginning to produce. Warrick Dunn was one of the best backs in the game and his career is just ending now. Devine is going to be a highly-coveted player.

parrish_lemar24DBSkins
05-18-2009, 10:03 PM
The more I think about it, the more I've come to realize that Warrick Dunn is a freak in today's modern NFL. He came into the league 5'8, 180 pounds and was a feature RB!!

I don't know if Devine is capable of that and I wouldn't want to use him that way either.

The only thing I want to know is what kind of hands does he have and can he run routes?

Noel Devine is the type of player that an OC draws up pet plays to get him into space with the ball, not having him forced to run over 250 pound MLBs.

And for those who want to compare Devine to Barry Sanders, I have to assume they were too young to have watched Sanders junior year at Oklahoma State. Every Saturday night he had game highlights running 70 yard TDs. I've never seen a college back dominate like Barry Sanders in college, and probably won't again any time soon.

As for Devine, there have been more than several players who fit his physical profile and production that I would compare him to before I ever pulled the Barry Sanders card.

jkpigskin
05-18-2009, 10:50 PM
idk where the BMI talk came from, but just a FYI, the BMI levels of athletes is relatively useless and should not be looked at.

kwilk103
05-18-2009, 10:51 PM
from today on espn

West Virginia

You know that Noel Devine is fast. Freakishly fast. But did you have any idea how strong the Mountaineers' running back is?

According to West Virginia's numbers, the 5-foot-7, 175-pound Devine can power clean 300 pounds, squat 500 and bench 435. Those numbers are better than some of the team's offensive linemen. He also posted a 38-inch vertical leap, a 10-foot-7 inch broad jump and ran the pro agility drill in a microscopic 4.04 seconds.

http://myespn.go.com/blogs/bigeast/0-4-298/Allen--Murphy--Devine-among-other-Big-East-workout-warriors.html

Staubach12
05-19-2009, 12:29 AM
Why is that? Injuries haven't been a problem for him and he trains extremely hard. He will always have a role on teams because he's a change-of-pace back.

Again, I find this late 1st day talk to be ridiculous. Chris Johnson was a 1st round pick and it turned out well. Darren Sproles has created a niche for himself. Reggie Bush is beginning to produce. Warrick Dunn was one of the best backs in the game and his career is just ending now. Devine is going to be a highly-coveted player.

Because backs under 180 typically don't have long careers. Could he break that pattern and go for 15 years? Maybe. But right now, chances are his career will not last as long as someone who's 220. Also, the talk about Devine as a late 1st day pick isn't ridiculous at all. It's not difficult to find RBs in today's NFL. There are tons of teams with more RBs that than they can put on the field, and the teams that desperately need RBs are few and far between. Combine that with the fact that teams could use their earlier picks on bigger (and better) RBs like LeGarrette Blount, Jonathan Dwyer, Jahvid Best, Joe McNight, Charles Scott, etc and it's going to be tough for a team to pull the trigger on a RB like him in the first or early second round.

wogitalia
05-19-2009, 07:18 AM
Okay, see, this is what I meant when I said don't get offended. BMI has nothing directly to do with body fat. The terms "underweight," "overweight," have nothing to do with your healthiness. "Overweight" just means "heavier than the average population," and the average is around 25 for males. Nobody said LT isn't healthy, they said he's overweight. It has nothing to do with health.

I notice you left out Obese? It is not in reference to the average, I have no problems in saying someone is overweight, if they are actually overweight, but to arbitrarily assign someone a status based on their height or weight is stupid. I'm sorry, no other word describes BMI as appropriately.

The medical definition of Obese includes the following "Obesity is often multifactorial, based on both genetic and behavioral factors. Accordingly, treatment of obesity usually requires more than just dietary changes."

Now from that are you going to say that the BMI sounds good. So Obesity requires treatment, thus LT, who is obese(American National Institute of Health is BMI >30), should require treatment for his obesity. As long as actual medical institutes are using such a stupid test to try and measure something that can be as detrimental to peoples health as "obesity" I will call it stupid.

Once again, there is nothing wrong with someone being overweight or underweight, compared to the average, but when it is calculated based on BMI, which has nothing to do with average people, it is a pure mathematical calculation based on two numbers, no factoring for muscle mass or anything else that a logical person would consider when determining whether someone is overweight or underweight. It is a stupid test.

I am not even commenting in regards to using it on NFL players, I am saying the test as a whole is stupid, of course NFL players fall in a certain range, that list shows a diversity like real life would, I could add the 50 worst RBs in history and they would fit in that range, it shows absolutely nothing useful to football, it shows you nothing more than what height and weight already tell you, all it does is apply a label on someone as a result of their height and weight. Based on purely your height and weight you are 1 of 4 categories, that is what it does and how it works.

As for Devine, I like him, only slight I have really seen, outside of his size, is his top end speed. He is explosive as hell, agile and powerful as a runner but his top end speed doesn't look great to me, but I don't really care about that when judging a back, sure it is nice to have AD or Chris Johnson finishing ability, but if you can get 5 yards consistently I'm perfectly happy. All that said, you don't see him getting run down either so he is probably faster than he looks.

Dagagad
05-19-2009, 08:14 AM
I am not even commenting in regards to using it on NFL players, I am saying the test as a whole is stupid, of course NFL players fall in a certain range, that list shows a diversity like real life would, I could add the 50 worst RBs in history and they would fit in that range, it shows absolutely nothing useful to football,



If the top 50 rbs and the bottom 50 rbs(and presumably all in between) all fall into that range with a few outliers each way...

..wouldn't that indicate that the probability of a rb outside that bmi range, making the nfl is very very slim? That is useful information.

If Noel Devine is 5'8 and 170 lbs(25.8 bmi), he is too small to be a starting nfl running back. Who tells us this? NFL gms who almost never draft guys with that bmi to play running back.

It does not matter how fast he is, how explosive he is, or how talented he is, all that matters at that weight is how he does in receiving drills because that is where he would play at 25.8 bmi in all probability.

How you could describe a range that basically gives you a blueprint for what an nfl running back looks like as 'showing absolutely nothing useful' is mind boggling.

I'm sure this will be a pointless discussion anyway. He'll be 190 at combine and 195 after a year in the nfl.


edit: bmi for the article on running backs was used as a simple tool to compare the height/weight of different backs. Whether or not that makes them technically obese or not is so irrelevant, I have a question for anyone following that line of reasoning. Did you actually read the linked article, or did you just see the word 'bmi' and hit post reply?

The first paragraph of the article answers that question. It basically says that BMI was used just as a tool to compare the body composition of guys of different height/weights. Please read something before you argue about it.

"Most of you have probably heard of the Body Mass Index, a ratio that’s pretty simple to calculate and can be a useful tool to gauge someone’s health, but with a key caveat. Muscular people have very high BMIs, and high BMIs are usually associated with poor health (because most people that weigh a lot are fat, not muscular). In football, the opposite is true: the better athletes usually have higher BMIs, because that means they’ve got more muscle on their frame. For the most part, skill position players in the NFL don’t have much fat on them, so we can assume the added weight is solid muscle. Using weight is a poor way to measure the type of muscle we’re interested in when looking at running backs, since a 5-10, 225 lb RB is more solidly built than a 6-2, 240 lb running back."

DiG
10-02-2009, 08:12 AM
time to bring this thread back and get some updated thoughts. i am loving devine as a prospect for a team that is looking for a change of pace, sproles type role player. i actually think sproles success recently will increase devines stock come draft time. i see devine as a legitimate 2nd round grade. i cant see him cracking the first round based on primarily his size and guys like jahvid best and cj spiller will go ahead of him. as a return man and dynamic playmaker he is easily one of the tops prospects in the draft. he wont be a primary back in the nfl but that wouldnt stop me from taking him in the 2nd round.

JFLO
10-02-2009, 09:46 AM
time to bring this thread back and get some updated thoughts. i am loving devine as a prospect for a team that is looking for a change of pace, sproles type role player. i actually think sproles success recently will increase devines stock come draft time. i see devine as a legitimate 2nd round grade. i cant see him cracking the first round based on primarily his size and guys like jahvid best and cj spiller will go ahead of him. as a return man and dynamic playmaker he is easily one of the tops prospects in the draft. he wont be a primary back in the nfl but that wouldnt stop me from taking him in the 2nd round.

I agree with this, but I don't think he is a second rounder. If I was a scout (and I'm not) I would find it difficult to pull the trigger on a 5'7" change of pace back who is still raw.

I agree with you in the sense that he has a ton of potential at the next level. I don't think people realize how strong and explosive he is once he establishes contact, it is truly an underrated attribute of his.

His strength isn't MJD, but I agree with you in the sense that he is a nice complimentary back like Sproles. I would probably take him in the 3rd round if the scenario struck.

BigBanger
10-02-2009, 10:01 AM
time to bring this thread back and get some updated thoughts. i am loving devine as a prospect for a team that is looking for a change of pace, sproles type role player. i actually think sproles success recently will increase devines stock come draft time. i see devine as a legitimate 2nd round grade. i cant see him cracking the first round based on primarily his size and guys like jahvid best and cj spiller will go ahead of him. as a return man and dynamic playmaker he is easily one of the tops prospects in the draft. he wont be a primary back in the nfl but that wouldnt stop me from taking him in the 2nd round.
I never thought of the Sproles comparison or the success correlation, but that does bring up an interesting point. I do agree that he's a legit second round pick, and if a team has the luxury of taking a #2 back / special teams player in the first round (Felix Jones to Dallas), then I don't think it would be a reach or a bad move, but that team needs to have that luxury, so they should be stacked to begin with and have very few needs or holes.

Devin, regardless of size, has everything you'd want in an NFL back.

kwilk103
10-02-2009, 10:19 AM
I agree with this, but I don't think he is a second rounder. If I was a scout (and I'm not) I would find it difficult to pull the trigger on a 5'7" change of pace back who is still raw.

I agree with you in the sense that he has a ton of potential at the next level. I don't think people realize how strong and explosive he is once he establishes contact, it is truly an underrated attribute of his.

His strength isn't MJD, but I agree with you in the sense that he is a nice complimentary back like Sproles. I would probably take him in the 3rd round if the scenario struck.

devine is very very strong; 435 bench, he did 405 at our pro day 2 years ago

he has returned kicks, but not punts; we just dont use him on kicks anymore because we dont want him to get hurt

Falcon<3
10-02-2009, 10:25 AM
Does anyone else see him as a poor man's Barry Sanders? I look at him and I know he's not Barry, but those moves, and his propensity to get hit in the backfield for a loss, only before breaking 5 guys ankles on the next run to take it to the house from 60+ out. I think this kid can be special, yeah, he's really short, but anymore that doesn't seem to really hurt, not even in pass pro cause you naturally have better leverage.

I don't think he should declare this year, then again if he can build himself into the Heisman TALK, not even voting, just get people talking about him, then it may be time to strike while the iron is hot. That game last night was sick.

Barry is my favorite player of all time though, and I doubt the NFL ever sees a running back like Barry again, football prolly will never see another one. Barry was a fun guy to watch, but beyond that, I think he's the greatest pure runner to ever play the game. If he hadn't retired early E. Smith wouldn't have that record he doesn't deserve. (But that's just my opinion)

kwilk103
10-02-2009, 10:40 AM
stats

2009: 73 car 540 yds 7.3 ypc 6 tds
career: 352 car 2,456 yds 6.9 ypc 16 tds

DiG
10-02-2009, 10:47 AM
although he is listed at 5'8 176, i fully anticipate that he will come into the combine at at least 185. hes a machine in the weight room and probably wouldnt have much of a problem adding weight. i wouldnt call him a workout warrior though because he backs it up on the field with production. he has to be one of the most fun players to watch in college football.

sproles was 5'6, 181 lbs at the combine.

ironman4579
10-02-2009, 11:40 AM
Does anyone else see him as a poor man's Barry Sanders? I look at him and I know he's not Barry, but those moves, and his propensity to get hit in the backfield for a loss, only before breaking 5 guys ankles on the next run to take it to the house from 60+ out. I think this kid can be special, yeah, he's really short, but anymore that doesn't seem to really hurt, not even in pass pro cause you naturally have better leverage.

I don't think he should declare this year, then again if he can build himself into the Heisman TALK, not even voting, just get people talking about him, then it may be time to strike while the iron is hot. That game last night was sick.

Barry is my favorite player of all time though, and I doubt the NFL ever sees a running back like Barry again, football prolly will never see another one. Barry was a fun guy to watch, but beyond that, I think he's the greatest pure runner to ever play the game. If he hadn't retired early E. Smith wouldn't have that record he doesn't deserve. (But that's just my opinion)


Barry was also about 20-30 pounds heavier with massive legs. I don't think height is as much of an issue anymore, if at all, with smaller backs, but I think weight still certainly is. I've seen people compare him size wise to MJD, Slaton and Sproles, but MJD is listed at 208, so about 30 pounds heavier. Slaton's listed at 215, so about 40 pounds heavier. The only one that's really close is Sproles.

villagewarrior
10-02-2009, 01:21 PM
Given his speed I fully expect the Raiders to draft him in round 1.

I kind of see a little Dante Hall in him. They both have similar builds and their skills are comparable, though Devine looks to be much more explosive. Hall was a running back coming out of Texas A&M and Dick Vermeil moved him to wide receiver/return man because of his stature and jukability.

I think I would use him as a slash type of a guy, try to get him in space against a linebacker, single back when I spread the receivers out, etc. I just think he is too slight based on what I saw last night to handle even what Darren Sproles has done the last couple of years.

FUNBUNCHER
10-02-2009, 04:03 PM
Devine is gonna earn his checks catching swing passes, bubble screens, draw plays, and on specials.

He's the kind of versatile, talented skill player every team in the league wants on their roster.
I could easily see him gone in the first 40 picks.

SKim172
10-02-2009, 10:06 PM
I really like Devine, but I'm still a little leery about his size. If I was a franchise with a mostly solid roster, I would strongly consider him for a late 1st or a second.

roscoesdad27
10-02-2009, 10:28 PM
I really like Devine, but I'm still a little leery about his size. If I was a franchise with a mostly solid roster, I would strongly consider him for a late 1st or a second.

i could see the patriots getting him in the mid to late second with one of their 3 second round picks...they need a third down back and could use an upgrade in the return game....i think devine has feature back potential as well IF he can add some weight and keep his agility and speed....thats a BIG IF but thats what it comes down to imho....hes a dynamic, reggie bush esq. weapon either way.

DoughBoy
10-02-2009, 10:33 PM
Reminds me of Garrett Wolfe..maybe a little faster.

roscoesdad27
10-02-2009, 10:57 PM
Reminds me of Garrett Wolfe..maybe a little faster.

he's more than a lil faster....somewhere between the upper 4.2's to the lower 4.3's....what did wolfe run?

HoopsDemon12
10-02-2009, 11:26 PM
I would hope that guys like Maurice Jones-Drew and Darren Sproles would finally shut people up about height with RBs...Devine is a playmaker and you can't fight that, even when you look at his size

Add Deangelo Williams to that group as well... there have been a lot of good small running back as of late. The whole running back by committee thing is defiantly helping out the little guys!

fenikz
10-02-2009, 11:36 PM
deff wouldn't mind him on the cardinals to mix in with Wells and Hightower

ironman4579
10-03-2009, 08:07 AM
Add Deangelo Williams to that group as well... there have been a lot of good small running back as of late. The whole running back by committee thing is defiantly helping out the little guys!

Again though, and this is just IMO of course, it's the weight that matters more than the height for the "little guys." Williams is 217 pounds. He may be short, but he's far from little, especially compared to Devine at under 180.

FUNBUNCHER
10-03-2009, 10:03 AM
Again though, and this is just IMO of course, it's the weight that matters more than the height for the "little guys." Williams is 217 pounds. He may be short, but he's far from little, especially compared to Devine at under 180.

Yeah, I never really considered Deangelo Williams a small back. To me he's a feature type guy who can carry the load for 300-340 times a year.

Really, Williams is nearly the exact same size as Emmitt Smith.

DiG
10-03-2009, 10:34 AM
Again though, and this is just IMO of course, it's the weight that matters more than the height for the "little guys." Williams is 217 pounds. He may be short, but he's far from little, especially compared to Devine at under 180.

at 180 i agree devine is a dynamic role player but i expect him to jack up to the 190-195 range for the combine and run in the 4.3s.

DoughBoy
10-03-2009, 12:43 PM
he's more than a lil faster....somewhere between the upper 4.2's to the lower 4.3's....what did wolfe run?

Wolfe ran between a 4.36 or a 4.44. If Noel runs anything under 4.35 I will **** a brick.

BigBanger
10-03-2009, 01:31 PM
Thickness boys... thickness. Length don't really matter, but if you're thick, you got a chance to give a pounding.

JFLO
10-03-2009, 01:35 PM
Thickness boys... thickness. Length don't really matter, but if you're thick, you got a chance to give a pounding.

Exactly, if your able to bounce off of a couple hits and keep your head up, then you have a future in the NFL. IMO, that is the main reason why Reggie Bush hasn't lived up to the hype during his career. He's obviously able to run outside and take the angle, but he isn't able to bounce off tacklers and take hits when needed.

Noel Devine's stature is very deceiving and he has shown at WVU that he is capable of taking some hits and then taking it the distance.

FUNBUNCHER
10-03-2009, 02:01 PM
Thickness boys... thickness. Length don't really matter, but if you're thick, you got a chance to give a pounding.

:eek: LOL!!!

Sorry, I have a really dirty mind. Carry on...

yourfavestoner
10-03-2009, 02:30 PM
Thickness boys... thickness. Length don't really matter, but if you're thick, you got a chance to give a pounding.

That's what she said.

babyballa
10-05-2009, 10:56 PM
Noel may be strong, but you have to be realistic size wise. I don't believe him to be 5'8. Lets face it players are usually listed an inch or two taller and roughly 8 lbs heavier than they actually are. Desean Jackson was listed at 6 ft and 180 lbs in college, at the combine he was measured at 5'9.5 and weighed 169 lbs.There are plenty of 5'8 RB's out there in college and none of them look even close to as small as Devine. I'd put him at 5'6 168 lbs. Now after saying that his talent is unbelievable and I have not seen a RB with as exciting as his style of running in a long time. I think he will be an impact returner and screen back in the NFL. Simply put he can bounce around in college at his size, but in the NFL 250 lb LB's will smother him. The size of legs are an important part of being able to bounce off tackles and if you take a look at these picture you can see his legs are very slender.

http://jeremyraybrown.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/noeldevine.jpg

http://www.wvmetronews.com/images/pics3/uconn10112407.jpg

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0916/ncf_a_devine5_200.jpg

Now that may have sounded extremely negative, but Noel is my favorite RB and has been since his senior year of high school. I personally believe he is a freak talent that only comes around every so many years, and I think part of his talent has to do with his size. I do see a bright future in the NFL, just not as an every down back.

Sniper
10-05-2009, 11:25 PM
Desean Jackson was listed at 6 ft and 180 lbs in college

http://www.calbears.com/sports/m-footbl/mtt/jackson_desean00.html

5'11", 172 lbs.

Saints-Tigers
10-05-2009, 11:28 PM
Does anyone even want an every down back anymore? Even if you have a guy that CAN shoulder that load, they decline so quickly, there is no point in not having other guys to help carry the load.

I look at someone like Deuce McAllister, and I think about how we could still have him had the RBC been more popular when he was drafted. Instead, a great great back that could do it all, isn't even on a team at 30 years old, because we ran him into the ground.

Build up a big O-line, and let Devine run wild, have a change of pace back to go with him, stop worrying about labels like "every down back" and all that crap.

brat316
10-05-2009, 11:42 PM
Thickness boys... thickness. Length don't really matter, but if you're thick, you got a chance to give a pounding.

exactly MJD 5-7 like myself he give me hope. But 207 lbs, so he takes away that hope.

But just goes to show don't have to be tall, just thick enough.

FUNBUNCHER
10-05-2009, 11:43 PM
babyballa, Devine isn't under 170# IMO, and I'd be shocked if he was shorter than 5'7.
You're right, he'll be a specialist, screen type RB who occasionally will take that quick hitter through the Oline, but he can't make his living running into Dlineman who outweigh him by almost 150 pounds.

msolimani
10-06-2009, 12:17 AM
babyballa, Devine isn't under 170# IMO, and I'd be shocked if he was shorter than 5'7.
You're right, he'll be a specialist, screen type RB who occasionally will take that quick hitter through the Oline, but he can't make his living running into Dlineman who outweigh him by almost 150 pounds.

I actually have a class with Devine and Selvish Capers at WVU. Devine doesn't look like a football player at all, he's so short and stocky. I think there will definitely be a place for him in the NFL though in a Darren Sproles/Leon Washington role.

babyballa
10-06-2009, 12:46 PM
babyballa, Devine isn't under 170# IMO, and I'd be shocked if he was shorter than 5'7.
You're right, he'll be a specialist, screen type RB who occasionally will take that quick hitter through the Oline, but he can't make his living running into Dlineman who outweigh him by almost 150 pounds.


Trust me when he goes to the combine he will be no taller than 5070 at the absolute most and you probably are right he could be anywhere from 168-174 but his chances of bulking up to 190 are very slim.

Falcon<3
10-06-2009, 12:52 PM
I don't think anyone would ask him to be a feature back in the NFL, but just a change of pace/swingpass/screenpass/kr/pr guy in the NFL, a role much akin to the likes of Darren Sproles. Now that being said Sproles is more capable of being a feature back, or a primary back in a 2 back system, but give this Devine kid some credit, he's got a spot in the NFL waiting on him, it's just going to be how early does a team want to go out and snag a KR/PR/2-3rd string RB? It's becoming more important to have depth at the RB position in the NFL, more than ever before even, and that's why I think this guy has a spot in the 3rd round of the NFL draft when he comes out.

People will knock his size, but Warrick Dunn went in the first round, it's about being able to avoid the big hit, not being big enough to take it. Everyone knows there's plenty of backs big enough to take the hits, but their careers just don't last like a smaller more elusive back. No I'm not a WVU fan, but I'd love to see that guy suited up for the Falcons.

babyballa
10-06-2009, 01:14 PM
I would love to see what he does in the NFL, my whole point is he's much smaller than any other back in the NFL, not necessarily weight or height wise but I'd give him 5'6.5 172 lbs. Now yes Warrick Dunn was only 5'8 180 but his legs are much bigger than Devine's and his build is thicker. So its more about the build than the weight/height.

Falcon<3
10-06-2009, 01:51 PM
I would love to see what he does in the NFL, my whole point is he's much smaller than any other back in the NFL, not necessarily weight or height wise but I'd give him 5'6.5 172 lbs. Now yes Warrick Dunn was only 5'8 180 but his legs are much bigger than Devine's and his build is thicker. So its more about the build than the weight/height.

Doesn't Devine have another full year after this one if he chooses to stay at WVU?

703SKINS202
10-06-2009, 04:05 PM
Doesn't Devine have another full year after this one if he chooses to stay at WVU?
Yes, its called a senior year.

babyballa
10-06-2009, 04:54 PM
Yes, its called a senior year.

LOL, but yes he does

eagles6606
10-08-2009, 09:36 PM
I think Devine is a fourth round pick. He's too small to be an everydown back, but he can help a team out in lots of different ways. Scat back, punt returner, and I also see him playing some slot reciever

Race for the Heisman
10-10-2009, 02:37 PM
I think Devine is a fourth round pick. He's too small to be an everydown back, but he can help a team out in lots of different ways. Scat back, punt returner, and I also see him playing some slot reciever

I categorically reject this. Devine is a game-breaker in the same mold as someone like Chris Johnson or Felix Jones regardless of his size. The only questions it seems one can ask about him is will he hold up at his weight, because he's proved almost everything else you'd want to know about a prospect (except character, which I think is overblown in his case, and maybe pass blocking, which I haven't seen enough of). Players with that kind of talent don't last until the fourth round. Devin Hester was what, the 37th overall pick? Chris Johnson 24, Felix Jones 28? Devine belongs in that range, fourth round is crazy talk.