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holt_bruce81
09-09-2009, 11:45 PM
As a Rams fan, of course I'm rooting for all the players on the roster to have successful seasons. But I just don't see it for Bulger. You can blame all his struggles on the Offensive Line if you want to, but the truth is he's to blame just as much as the Offensive Line is. And seeing that he's been thrown to the ground SOOO many times over the past few seasons, I just think he's afraid now.

It reminds me alot of the Kurt Warner situation. Warner was fearless when he dropped back in '99 but then as the years went on he took more and more hits and in 2002 you could tell he just didn't look comfortable dropping back and it took him a good 5 years to get his confidence back.

So If Marc Bulger does struggle this season like he has in 2007 and 2008 what would you do? Would you sign Boller for next season and start him? Would you draft a Quarterback this year? Which Quarterback would you draft.....Bradford? Snead? Later Round?

NGSeiler
09-10-2009, 10:21 AM
You can blame all his struggles on the Offensive Line if you want to, but the truth is he's to blame just as much as the Offensive Line is.

Marc Bulger has been the most sacked quarterback in the league since 2003. Thus, I disagree that he's just as much to blame for his struggles as the offensive line. I think the offensive line and the lack of pass protection carries the lion's share of the blame for Bulger's decline.

Doesn't mean he's played flawlessly, doesn't mean he doesn't have areas to improve upon. But I don't know how anyone can look at this team and conclude that pass protection hasn't been the biggest factor in the decline of Bulger.

So If Marc Bulger does struggle this season like he has in 2007 and 2008 what would you do? Would you sign Boller for next season and start him? Would you draft a Quarterback this year? Which Quarterback would you draft.....Bradford? Snead? Later Round?

If Bulger struggles again in 2009, it will be tough to carry him based on his contract. I don't think Boller is a great fit in this offense, so I wouldn't be inclined to carry him over. Furthermore, unless someone unexpectedly is available next offseason, the free agent crop of QBs doesn't look promising.

So I'd probably try to get Marc to restructure to provide cap savings in 2010, assuming there is a cap. Then I'd draft someone to groom behind Bulger if not compete with him as a rookie. Obviously Bradford is the big name, though it'll be interesting to see if his recent injury affects his draft status.

The Rams would probably have to look for a QB in the first three rounds, especially if they expect the guy to be able to push for the starting job sooner rather than later.

nfrillman
09-10-2009, 03:21 PM
Personally I'm not ready to give up on Bulger just yet. I've had that argument many times with friends, but I still remember what he can do. With that being said, if he struggles mightily this season then his time as the unquestioned starting QB for the Rams is done. If the chances to make the playoffs are essentially over by the time Bulger is yanked I would like to see Null thrown in there. If he gets a handful of starts and does well I might give him a shot next year. If Null doesn't get much of a look I'd probably draft another rookie and have those two compete. Definitely wouldn't give the reigns to Boller. That is all assuming Bulger struggles throughout the year though, which I don't think he will.

holt_bruce81
09-10-2009, 04:16 PM
Marc Bulger has been the most sacked quarterback in the league since 2003. Thus, I disagree that he's just as much to blame for his struggles as the offensive line. I think the offensive line and the lack of pass protection carries the lion's share of the blame for Bulger's decline.

Half those sacks aren't the O-Lines fault. Bulger holds onto the ball WAY to long and has absolutely the worst pocket presence in the League.

NGSeiler
09-10-2009, 06:37 PM
Half those sacks aren't the O-Lines fault.

Like any QB, Bulger is to blame for a portion of his sacks due to holding onto the ball for too long. I would disagree completely that he's to blame for as many as half of them, though.

Bulger holds onto the ball WAY to long and has absolutely the worst pocket presence in the League.

Bulger does hold onto the ball too long at times, it's one of the things he has to improve. I'm not sure about the worst pocket presence in the league. I don't think his pocket presence is what it used to be, largely because he's had it beaten out of him behind one of the league's worst lines.

Keep in mind that the Rams have given up 40+ sacks every season since 2000. When your team averages 44 sacks a year for the last ten years, then you've got some protection problems. They existed before Bulger took the starting job and existed while he was on the sideline injured. Some of it was Martz's scheme as well, but this offensive line has really been short on talent for quite some time.

Finally, with the addition of Bell, Jason Brown, and Jason Smith, it looks like the Rams are at least making an effort to try and improve the play up front. Hopefully that translates into better protection, which hopefully will translate into better quarterbacking. If it doesn't, then I'm sure the Rams will start looking elsewhere.

holt_bruce81
09-10-2009, 09:25 PM
How did you arrive at half? :confused:



Bulger does hold onto the ball too long at times, it's one of the things he has to improve. I'm not sure about the worst pocket presence in the league. I don't think his pocket presence is what it used to be, largely because he's had it beaten out of him behind one of the league's worst lines.

Keep in mind that the Rams have given up 40+ sacks every season since 2000. When your team averages 44 sacks a year for the last ten years, then you've got some protection problems. They existed before Bulger took the starting job and existed while he was on the sideline injured. Some of it was Martz's scheme as well, but this offensive line has really been short on talent for quite some time.

Finally, with the addition of Bell, Jason Brown, and Jason Smith, it looks like the Rams are at least making an effort to try and improve the play up front. Hopefully that translates into better protection, which hopefully will translate into better quarterbacking. If it doesn't, then I'm sure the Rams will start looking elsewhere.

2005
Bulger- 7.5 games - 26 sacks- 55 sacks per 16 games- (287 attempts, 38 per game)
Backups- 8.5 games - 21 sacks- 40 sacks per 16 games (312 attempts, 37 per game)


2007
Bulger- 11.5 games - 37 sacks- 51 sacks per 16 games- (378 attempts, 33 per game)
Backups- 4.5 games - 11 Sacks- 39 sacks per 16 games- (174 attempts, 39 per game)

2008
Bulger- 13.5 games - 38 sacks- 45 sacks per 16 games- (440 attempts, 33 per game)
Backups- 2.5 games - 6 sacks- 38 sacks per 16 games- ( 75 attempts, 30 per game)

Even in the first preseason game Bulger was sacked 3 times in the first Quarter. The other Quarterbacks (Null, Berlin and Boller) were sacked only once the rest of the game.

NGSeiler
09-10-2009, 11:38 PM
2005
Bulger- 7.5 games - 26 sacks- 55 sacks per 16 games- (287 attempts, 38 per game)
Backups- 8.5 games - 21 sacks- 40 sacks per 16 games (312 attempts, 37 per game)


2007
Bulger- 11.5 games - 37 sacks- 51 sacks per 16 games- (378 attempts, 33 per game)
Backups- 4.5 games - 11 Sacks- 39 sacks per 16 games- (174 attempts, 39 per game)

2008
Bulger- 13.5 games - 38 sacks- 45 sacks per 16 games- (440 attempts, 33 per game)
Backups- 2.5 games - 6 sacks- 38 sacks per 16 games- ( 75 attempts, 30 per game)

You highlighted the following sentence of mine: "They [pass protection problems] existed before Bulger took the starting job and existed while he was on the sideline injured." So what is your response arguing? That the Rams didn't have protection problems when other quarterbacks have played? I didn't realize projected sack numbers of 38-40 sacks in a season qualified as great pass protection these days.

Again, refer back to the first part of my secondary response: "Bulger does hold onto the ball too long at times, it's one of the things he has to improve." You'll also notice I edited the initial post to say, "Like any QB, Bulger is to blame for a portion of his sacks due to holding onto the ball for too long." No one is arguing some of these sacks aren't on Bulger.

But anyone who has been watching Rams football the last couple of years knows that the pass protection wasn't magically fixed when Bulger left the line-up. I'd also point out that, despite being sacked more, Bulger has outperformed each of the back-ups during the three years you cited - Martin in 2005, Frerotte in 2007, and Green in 2008.

Again, I don't think a team posts nine years worth of 40+ sack seasons without major issues in pass protection. Do you disagree with that? That's why one of the first priorities of this new regime was improving the line by signing an outstanding free agent center and spending a second overall pick on a tackle of the future. Simply put, this line needed (and I'd argue still needs) improvement. This isn't a controversial statement; nearly everyone has been saying this about the Rams for years.

Even in the first preseason game Bulger was sacked 3 times in the first Quarter.

Actually the third sack came in the second quarter. But I thought it was pretty clear from watching the game and then rewatching those specific plays after the game that at least two if not all three of those sacks resulted from failed blitz pick-ups.

holt_bruce81
09-12-2009, 12:22 AM
I'm just saying it's not all on the O-Line. Which I think a lot of St Louis fans blame the Teams struggles and Bulger's struggles on.

IMO Bulger takes a lot of unnecessary sacks which I think we both agree on.

Thread Killer
11-11-2009, 09:45 AM
Bugler stinks.

There I said it.:p

Auron
11-11-2009, 05:04 PM
Bugler stinks.

There I said it.:p

Great.. now that you said it he's going to go off on the Saints and have his best game of the season throwing 4 TD passes or something. :mad:

holt_bruce81
11-13-2009, 11:03 PM
Great.. now that you said it he's going to go off on the Saints and have his best game of the season throwing 4 TD passes or something. :mad:

If he does that. I'll retire from this site. He has 3 TDs on the hole freaking season.

Auron
11-16-2009, 09:05 PM
If he does that. I'll retire from this site. He has 3 TDs on the hole freaking season.

Well I was half way right, Bulger notched 2 TDs and had most likely his best game of the season. Not to take anything away from him, but I'm not sure how much of that was 3/4ths of our Secondary being out for part of the game. Starting CB (Greer) and FS (Sharper) did not dress, and the other starting CB was lost in the 3rd quarter to injury... but on the other hand he was also short handed with his receiving options.. the Rams lost a receiver early on, and came in with 1 less.

The one thing that cost the Rams was the final 2 minute drill, Bulger had some questionable decisions when he made some throws that didn't give his receivers much chance at stopping the clock in the middle of the field, and kept the clock running. Brandon Gibson did impress me with his receiving ability however, he should be a good solid option alongside Avery for the future.

NGSeiler
11-16-2009, 10:40 PM
The one thing that cost the Rams was the final 2 minute drill, Bulger had some questionable decisions when he made some throws that didn't give his receivers much chance at stopping the clock in the middle of the field, and kept the clock running.

Two things.

One, I think the kick return for touchdown and earlier drops in the game cost the Rams more than any mistakes on the two-minute drive at the end of the game. Better execution earlier on would have helped keep the Rams out of that situation.

Two, while I thought Bulger played a very good game overall (and statistically outplayed Brees despite having poorer weapons), I think there were two fundamental errors on that final drive. The first was not spiking the football after Randy McMichael caught a first down ball over the middle with 50-some seconds on the clock. You've got the first down, no need to waste time and try to get another play off. Just spike the ball, huddle up, and go from there. The second mistake was the check down pass to Jackson over the middle with 19 seconds left. That ball should have just been thrown away.

Other than that, it would seem Bulger had a pretty good outing. And I imagine it's pretty hard to run a two-minute offense when two of the three receivers you're throwing to weren't on your team at the start of the season. It'll be interesting to see if they can keep this up; Gibson looked like a breath of fresh air at receiver, which just goes to show you how inconsistent the other targets on this team have been.

holt_bruce81
11-18-2009, 12:49 AM
Two things.

One, I think the kick return for touchdown and earlier drops in the game cost the Rams more than any mistakes on the two-minute drive at the end of the game. Better execution earlier on would have helped keep the Rams out of that situation.

Two, while I thought Bulger played a very good game overall (and statistically outplayed Brees despite having poorer weapons), I think there were two fundamental errors on that final drive. The first was not spiking the football after Randy McMichael caught a first down ball over the middle with 50-some seconds on the clock. You've got the first down, no need to waste time and try to get another play off. Just spike the ball, huddle up, and go from there. The second mistake was the check down pass to Jackson over the middle with 19 seconds left. That ball should have just been thrown away.

Other than that, it would seem Bulger had a pretty good outing. And I imagine it's pretty hard to run a two-minute offense when two of the three receivers you're throwing to weren't on your team at the start of the season. It'll be interesting to see if they can keep this up; Gibson looked like a breath of fresh air at receiver, which just goes to show you how inconsistent the other targets on this team have been.

That play was mind boggling.

You can also blame Danny Amendola. That drop earlier that Quarter, yikes. If he caught that it might have been a Touchdown, there was no one around him.

holt_bruce81
11-23-2009, 12:21 AM
I'll say it again.......we need a Quarterback!

fenikz
11-23-2009, 01:39 PM
not like getting a new QB is gonna keep him on his feet, Bulger was getting lit up out there

KCJ58
11-23-2009, 03:00 PM
not like getting a new QB is gonna keep him on his feet, Bulger was getting lit up out there

I agree we need to establish more important issues like our O-Line/D-Line help with the 1st pick then a QB, sucks to say but we invested too much money into Bulger that we kinda have no other choice then try to give Bulger some help because were stuck with him for the time being

brat316
11-23-2009, 03:03 PM
I remember when Bulger was tearing it up.

holt_bruce81
11-23-2009, 09:37 PM
not like getting a new QB is gonna keep him on his feet, Bulger was getting lit up out there

I was listening to the game at work. the Radio guys said the O-Line was protecting Bulger pretty well, just holding onto the ball for to long.

NGSeiler
11-23-2009, 09:55 PM
Bulger is out 3-6 weeks with a broken tibia, so we'll see what Boller can do. Maybe a Null sighting by the end of the year.


I was listening to the game at work. the Radio guys said the O-Line was protecting Bulger pretty well, just holding onto the ball for to long.

That's not really what I saw, especially on that final drive. I think the O-line took a step back today, both in protection and run blocking for Jackson.

The Rams need a QB of the future, but if they expect him to be successful, they need to continue adding talent at other areas, some of which have been just as if not more problematic (ie. receiver, tight end, back-up RB).

KCJ58
11-23-2009, 11:37 PM
let Keith Null start were already 1-9