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LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 09:37 AM
I haven't heard his name mentioned up there with the best backs in the league yet, but do you guys think he's there yet? Is Adrian Peterson still a tier above him?


His rookie season he had 1600+ yards and 10 TD's while splitting carries and was just a hair away from averaging 5 YPC. This season he's on pace for 2,000 yards and averaging a sick 6.7 (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20091110/SPORTS01/911100350/1027)

The Titans running back is averaging 6.7 yards per carry, the highest average for a rushing yards leader through nine weeks since 1970, according to the league.



CJ looks like his first 2 years will be better then Peterson's, he's a great receiver, shown he can run tough inside the tackles. Is this not the player that the Saints thought they would get with the #2 pick?


How long you going to give him before annointing him? I know that last year was a pretty good rookie RB class but CJ looks really special to me.

21ST
11-10-2009, 09:43 AM
He is easily one of the best offensive players in the NFL and the 2nd best RB to me

Xonraider
11-10-2009, 09:46 AM
He is easily one of the best offensive players in the NFL and the 2nd best RB to me

Really? Even over Steven Jackson and DeAngelo Williams? I still like those two over Chris Johnson, and of course Adrian Peterson being number 1.

stephenson86
11-10-2009, 09:49 AM
as titans fan i personally do have homer bias, there is noone more explosive than him in the league right now (not saying he is the only extremely explosive player but no1 is more explosive than him) he can run between the tackles and gain yards but he is most dangerous at the perimeter because of his speed, as he showed on his long run against SF that was pulled back he has incredible feet and balance and well he is very self confident he doesnt have the diva attitude that brings talented players down. He for me is 1A and 1B with Peterson, as much as i love peterson i cant put him above johnson because johnsons impact for the titans the last 2 years has been imeasurable and without him we would have gone nowhere last year and certainly wouldnt have 2 wins this year. it will be interesting to see him against the worst run defense this sunday...300 yards?

DoughBoy
11-10-2009, 09:50 AM
Really? Even over Steven Jackson and DeAngelo Williams? I still like those two over Chris Johnson, and of course Adrian Peterson being number 1.

What has Steven Jackson done since is 1500 yard season? I know the offense is piss poor outside him but really? You have never really seen a titans game have you? I can understand DeAngelo, just because he has been in the NFL longer, but Chris Johnson has had a better start to his career than both and is playing MUCH better than Deangelo this year.

21ST
11-10-2009, 09:51 AM
Really? Even over Steven Jackson and DeAngelo Williams? I still like those two over Chris Johnson, and of course Adrian Peterson being number 1.

Yeah over both of them, not taking anything away from either one of them though.

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 09:52 AM
What's not to like, he is a speed demon with good vision, insane burst, and a stellar set of run blockers. It wouldn't surprise me at all if he came close to 2000. Maybe a notch below Peterson? Even that is iffy at this point.

no bare feet
11-10-2009, 10:09 AM
right now, Chris Johnson is the number 2 back in the NFL.

EvilNixon
11-10-2009, 10:10 AM
I love how he doesn't over dance at the line and instead hit the hole. A great RB.

Ravens1991
11-10-2009, 10:13 AM
I love the way he plays I rate him as the #2 RB behind Peterson. If I could build a offense I would take a back like him in a heart beat and get a FB like McClain who can be a lead blocker/power back.

CashmoneyDrew
11-10-2009, 10:13 AM
I don't see how you can put Steven Jackson ahead of him at this point. He just can't stay healthy enough. He's having a good season so far though.

Splat
11-10-2009, 10:16 AM
I would take CJ over Jackson in a heart beat its not even close.

ElectricEye
11-10-2009, 10:16 AM
Depending on scheme, I would take him over Peterson in some situations. Granted, it's almost a given Peterson is going to have another holy **** season in a few years that might make my saying that look silly, but I love Johnson's game. He is exactly what Reggie Bush was supposed to be. He's good for at least one game changing play a week.

senormysterioso
11-10-2009, 10:17 AM
right now if you tell me I can have any running back in the league on my team, I would take Adrian Peterson of course but after him I think it's either Chris Johnson or MJD...I think that those three are the premier running backs in the league right now.

M.O.T.H.
11-10-2009, 10:25 AM
I thought he'd be good but not this good.

For Dallas at least, he will always be linked with Felix Jones and I sure hope Felix will get to see as many touches as Chris gets to see, one day. Right now, Felix is so under used it's disgusting. Then again, he's also had a problem staying healthy. I honestly dont think his health matters to Garrett, though. He just forgets about him for whatever reason.

But yeah, Chris is just insane. Would I take him over AD in any situation? No. But I dont have a big problem calling him the 2nd best RB in the league right now.

FlyingElvis
11-10-2009, 10:26 AM
CJ is top 3. I'd take him, MJD and AP in any order, really. Throw in Turner & Jackson as the 2 beasts in less than stellar situations (Turner simply b/c the Falcons schedule is brutal) and that would round out my top 5. DWilliams, Benson & Rice are close behind.

M.O.T.H.
11-10-2009, 10:27 AM
Benson...haha. Never thought I'd hear that. Kudos to him, though. What an unexpected rise.

drowe
11-10-2009, 10:30 AM
I don't understand why it's such a slam dunk that Adrian Peterson is #1. I think he's slightly over rated this year. He's been shut down in games..and for the feature back on a 7-1 team, he just hasn't been taking over games like somebody in his situation should.

CJ takes over games. He just keeps getting better as the year goes on. Despite the fact that he's the only weapon that needs to be accounted for, he is still lighting up the scoreboard week after week.

LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 10:33 AM
I don't understand why it's such a slam dunk that Adrian Peterson is #1. I think he's slightly over rated this year. He's been shut down in games..and for the feature back on a 7-1 team, he just hasn't been taking over games like somebody in his situation should.

CJ takes over games. He just keeps getting better as the year goes on. Despite the fact that he's the only weapon that needs to be accounted for, he is still lighting up the scoreboard week after week.

I'm glad someone pointed this out, that's very true. CJ isn't a secret anymore, and they don't have the weapons that the Vikings have to spread the field out either, but lately he's dominated games in a far more impressive fashion then AD has.


AD has had some pedestrian gains, and gotten stopped for the short losses at times too, I don't think it's too soon to say at worst their a 1A and 1B. Their two different types of backs obviously, but the case can be made for CJ.

abaddon41_80
11-10-2009, 10:41 AM
I have him at #2, still slightly behind AP

1. AP
2. CJ
3-5. Jackson, Gore, Williams
6. Turner
7. Brown
8. MJD

Brent
11-10-2009, 10:47 AM
My problem with Peterson is that he'll have like 6 or 7 carries in a row that go for 1-3 yards, and then the occasional 10-20 yard run.

RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES
11-10-2009, 10:47 AM
I have him 2nd as well.
1. AP
2. CJ
3.D.Will
4. MJD
5. Gore

LizardState
11-10-2009, 10:49 AM
right now, Chris Johnson is the number 2 back in the NFL.

That's true, behind Adrian Peterson.

He's the fastest one in the league, with the best speed burst, classic overachiever on an underachieving team.

hockey619
11-10-2009, 10:57 AM
There were rumblings over the summer that Peterson was looking to gains ten pounds of muscle so he could take more carries and deliver more punishment. Childress and other rb's around the league advised against it because they said it could cost him some of his burst and top speed that make him such a special player. I think LT said hes played at a lighter playing weight than in college at times because being faster and quicker has made it easier to get away from the big slower linebackers and lineman. i think he said he plays at around 210.

I think Peterson ended up gaining some weight, and it looks it a little. Hes not quite as explosive or gamebreaking as in years past despite a better team around him. still a great player but it def hurt his game a bit.

I think its something that Bush did coming out of college and since getting to the nfl, he added upper body muscle so that his bench would be better at his workout and people would think he could 'carry the load' and do away with that criticism. unfortunately, it took his change of direction skills and burst away a bit. They were a bit overrated beforehand if you watch his college highlights hes not quite as fast straight ahead or side to side as people seem to remember, still very good, but not Barry laterally or CJ straight ahead. Bush doesnt have the mental approach of a up the gut for 4 tough yards back, but his slight drop in that special something hurt him and his confidence and he hasnt been the same player since.

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 11:04 AM
Chris Johnson is a perfect example of the new trend emerging in the NFL.

I'm probably gonna make a write up next week and it will be in it. But in short, with teams using more spread formations and using the pass to set up the run, RBs like Chris Johnson are the emerging premiere guys at that position.

The days of the Brandon Jacobs, Stephen Jacksons of the world are slowing coming to a close, as theyre better off being complimentary players than the feature back in today's style of offense.

Staubach12
11-10-2009, 11:07 AM
I've been saying he's the #2 back in the league for a while now. He's just a ridiculous threat to any defense.

21ST
11-10-2009, 11:09 AM
also gotta show MJD some love probly the hardest rb to tackle i wonder where keak is lol

LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 11:10 AM
There were rumblings over the summer that Peterson was looking to gains ten pounds of muscle so he could take more carries and deliver more punishment. Childress and other rb's around the league advised against it because they said it could cost him some of his burst and top speed that make him such a special player. I think LT said hes played at a lighter playing weight than in college at times because being faster and quicker has made it easier to get away from the big slower linebackers and lineman. i think he said he plays at around 210.

I think Peterson ended up gaining some weight, and it looks it a little. Hes not quite as explosive or gamebreaking as in years past despite a better team around him. still a great player but it def hurt his game a bit.

I think its something that Bush did coming out of college and since getting to the nfl, he added upper body muscle so that his bench would be better at his workout and people would think he could 'carry the load' and do away with that criticism. unfortunately, it took his change of direction skills and burst away a bit. They were a bit overrated beforehand if you watch his college highlights hes not quite as fast straight ahead or side to side as people seem to remember, still very good, but not Barry laterally or CJ straight ahead. Bush doesnt have the mental approach of a up the gut for 4 tough yards back, but his slight drop in that special something hurt him and his confidence and he hasnt been the same player since.

Peterson never gained that extra weight, his dad came out and told him it wasn't a good idea and he listened. I don't think he looks worse, we just always compare him to a guy who can get 300 yards a game.


Here’s the surefire formula: Bulk up, one of the vets suggested. Add 10 more pounds to that 6-1, 220-pound frame and watch the extra yards pile up.

Peterson, an earnest 24-year-old with the Minnesota Vikings, took the bait hook, line and sinker.

That was clear when he espoused his newfound, self-improvement strategy to a couple of news reporters after practice the next day.

“I don’t think too many guys would be too excited to see me at 230 pounds twice a year,” Peterson said then. “I’ll be pretty nasty.”

Fortunately, Peterson’s father, Nelson, got wind of the attempted scam and urged his son not to sacrifice his 4.37-second speed over 40 yards by packing on added body armor.
http://thevikingage.com/2009/06/03/adrian-peterson-nearly-duped-into-gaining-weight/

FlyingElvis
11-10-2009, 11:10 AM
Chris Johnson is a perfect example of the new trend emerging in the NFL.

I'm probably gonna make a write up next week and it will be in it. But in short, with teams using more spread formations and using the pass to set up the run, RBs like Chris Johnson are the emerging premiere guys at that position.

The days of the Brandon Jacobs, Stephen Jacksons of the world are slowing coming to a close, as theyre better off being complimentary players than the feature back in today's style of offense.

I agree with the premise but Jackson shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence as Jacobs. He has the break away speed and is shifty enough to make people miss. Not like CJ, but Jackson is a rare talent sadly wasting away on a terrible team. Jax can do it all.

SuperKevin
11-10-2009, 11:11 AM
In short...Real Good

As everyone else already mentioned, he's probably the #2 RB behind Peterson but could easily be considered #1 by certain teams and systems

Vikes99ej
11-10-2009, 11:19 AM
I don't understand why it's such a slam dunk that Adrian Peterson is #1. I think he's slightly over rated this year. He's been shut down in games..and for the feature back on a 7-1 team, he just hasn't been taking over games like somebody in his situation should.

CJ takes over games. He just keeps getting better as the year goes on. Despite the fact that he's the only weapon that needs to be accounted for, he is still lighting up the scoreboard week after week.

I can see why it may look like he's been struggling, but we've had to deal with a new starter at center and right tackle. And lolz to anyone taking another runningback over Peterson. Chris Johnson is a G though

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 11:21 AM
I agree with the premise but Jackson shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence as Jacobs. He has the break away speed and is shifty enough to make people miss. Not like CJ, but Jackson is a rare talent sadly wasting away on a terrible team. Jax can do it all.

i kind of feel the same way about Marshawn Lynch. He's like Stephan Jackson part 2.

but you know what though? the great great players at RB make it happen even on terrible teams. Look at Ricky Williams, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Tomlinson, etc.

The greats make it happen on their own. Any RB can get 5 ypc with a good oline. The special ones can do it on their own. Thats why very few RBs are worth spending a 1st round pick on imo. Only rarely do you ever see a talent worth it in the 1st.

hockey619
11-10-2009, 11:27 AM
Chris Johnson is a perfect example of the new trend emerging in the NFL.

I'm probably gonna make a write up next week and it will be in it. But in short, with teams using more spread formations and using the pass to set up the run, RBs like Chris Johnson are the emerging premiere guys at that position.

The days of the Brandon Jacobs, Stephen Jacksons of the world are slowing coming to a close, as theyre better off being complimentary players than the feature back in today's style of offense.


THIS

very true, it runs in cycles it seems. Teams are spreading out again (like in the run n gun, air coryell days) because of the rule changes that make passing easier. This spread out means there are natural creases that a fast runningback can take advantage of. the combination of these two facts means defenses will look to get faster which generally means smaller (although in general players are getting bigger and faster there arent many of those freak guys and after those special guys more emphasis is being put on speed and coverage skills/pass rush than just being big if they cant have both in one player.) This will eventually lead to a team going to a power running offense where they just bulldoze there way with a big back and the copycat trend will reverse and cycle back. looking at the history of the league, offensive and defensive trends seem to run in cycles.

Vikes99ej
11-10-2009, 11:28 AM
Me thinks backs like Jahvid Best and C.J. Spiller are going to go kinda high come this April.

hockey619
11-10-2009, 11:29 AM
Peterson never gained that extra weight, his dad came out and told him it wasn't a good idea and he listened. I don't think he looks worse, we just always compare him to a guy who can get 300 yards a game.



http://thevikingage.com/2009/06/03/adrian-peterson-nearly-duped-into-gaining-weight/



my bad, i read that article but forgot the ending part, which sort of made the rest irrelevant. he still looks a little off to me but i cant quite put my finger on it.

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 11:29 AM
THIS

very true, it runs in cycles it seems. Teams are spreading out again (like in the run n gun, air coryell days) because of the rule changes that make passing easier. This spread out means there are natural creases that a fast runningback can take advantage of. the combination of these two facts means defenses will look to get faster which generally means smaller (although in general players are getting bigger and faster there arent many of those freak guys and after those special guys more emphasis is being put on speed and coverage skills/pass rush than just being big if they cant have both in one player.) This will eventually lead to a team going to a power running offense where they just bulldoze there way with a big back and the copycat trend will reverse and cycle back. looking at the history of the league, offensive and defensive trends seem to run in cycles.

this summed it all up perfectly.

great post.

The Unseen
11-10-2009, 11:31 AM
IMO he is in fact the best running back in the NFL. Considering the stats and what we usually think, he would be equal or just under AP. However, he's leading the league's in rushing on a 2-6 team that usually would have to come from behind and pass more. He's played with an impotent Kerry Collins and now a solid Vince Young. His speed and ability as a weapon everywhere on a field puts him over the top.

My ranking:

1. CJ
2. AD
3. MJD
4. Steven Jackson
5. Frank Gore

MJD, SJ, and Frank are all pretty close, but I consider MJD's overall skills to give him a slight edge (and perhaps a little homerism, lol).

steelernation77
11-10-2009, 11:40 AM
Johnson's a great back but I think his window is going to be a bit smaller as far as effectiveness. So much of his game is about burst and quick cuts, when he inevitably starts slow down, he's going to have a hard time being effective.

LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 11:48 AM
Johnson's a great back but I think his window is going to be a bit smaller as far as effectiveness. So much of his game is about burst and quick cuts, when he inevitably starts slow down, he's going to have a hard time being effective.

Didn't people say that about Clinton Portis too? He's also still doesn't have to worry about that until he's at least approaching 30, but you could say powerbacks have some of their own concerns also for longevity.

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 11:50 AM
Backs in general have concerns. If anything, powerbacks take more abuse and have shorter careers.

Thats why im personally a big believer in the RBC. Just constantly rotate some cheap midround guys and have a committee. Its cheaper, it keeps your run game fresher into the postseason, and its easier to replenish.

FlyingElvis
11-10-2009, 12:00 PM
i kind of feel the same way about Marshawn Lynch. He's like Stephan Jackson part 2.

but you know what though? the great great players at RB make it happen even on terrible teams. Look at Ricky Williams, Barry Sanders, Walter Payton, Tomlinson, etc.

The greats make it happen on their own. Any RB can get 5 ypc with a good oline. The special ones can do it on their own. Thats why very few RBs are worth spending a 1st round pick on imo. Only rarely do you ever see a talent worth it in the 1st.

I agree with this, too. But I would argue that Jackson is making it happen on his own. That Rams team is just terrible at virtually every position. Despite teams playing SJax and only SJax, he's still producing. 98 ypg, 4.8 ypc, and 180+ recieving.

Damn I wish the Rams had just traded him to NE at the deadline.

Shiver
11-10-2009, 12:00 PM
I don't know if I would take Adrian Peterson over Chris Johnson. Really, he has the reputation, but has Peterson really done more on the field? Johnson had a better rookie year, sophomore year and he does far more in the passing game.

gsorace
11-10-2009, 12:02 PM
I love watching him play, I remember a lot of people hated the pick when the titans took him instead of a WR.

Shiver
11-10-2009, 12:03 PM
Chris Johnson is to the NFL what Reggie Bush was to CFB.

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 12:13 PM
I still think Peterson is better. CJ is #2 though.

The thing is, Peterson is just not getting that many carries this year. Its not like years past, when he was the entire offense. The Vikings are a passing team now, believe it or not.

AP is more of an afterthought to their passing attack.

If they ran him like hell and made Favre the compliment, he'd put up monster numbers. They did for the first couple of games, and AP looked like he might hit 2000 yards for the season. But then they started making AP the compliment to Favre.

And his numbers have went down since.

And AP can catch, they just dont ask him to do so much. He's not the blocker that CJ is though.

CJ can run between the tackles, but he's still a scatback. AP is an everything back.

abaddon41_80
11-10-2009, 12:17 PM
Chris Johnson is to the NFL what Reggie Bush was to CFB.

I don't know about all that. Bush was literally unstoppable in college

Shiver
11-10-2009, 12:23 PM
I still think Peterson is better. CJ is #2 though.

The thing is, Peterson is just not getting that many carries this year. Its not like years past, when he was the entire offense. The Vikings are a passing team now, believe it or not.

AP is more of an afterthought to their passing attack.

If they ran him like hell and made Favre the compliment, he'd put up monster numbers. They did for the first couple of games, and AP looked like he might hit 2000 yards for the season. But then they started making AP the compliment to Favre.

And his numbers have went down since.

And AP can catch, they just dont ask him to do so much. He's not the blocker that CJ is though.

CJ can run between the tackles, but he's still a scatback. AP is an everything back.

I wouldn't say he is a scatback at all. He is getting the majority of his teams carries, including the goal-line work. Adrian Peterson looked like he might hit 2000, but Chris Johnson has a really good chance to get there himself this year. CJ gets to play the worst run-D in the league this week.

A Perfect Score
11-10-2009, 12:30 PM
I don't know about all that. Bush was literally unstoppable in college

Maybe because he had cutback lanes you could drive a truck through every game and played on one of the more talented offenses in recent years.

Anyways, I think Johnson most valuable asset is that he can simply run away from people. Once he gets in the open field, its game over. He doesnt break tackles like Peterson does, but hes a much better inside runner then I ever would of given him credit for coming out of college.

I think at the top, it goes Peterson, Johnson, MJD. Drew is a workhorse, and he has killer speed as well.

ThePudge
11-10-2009, 12:31 PM
I wasn't necessarily a believer of Chris Johnson as a feature back coming into the season, foreseeing a 1-2 punch of Johnson and a slimmer, more fit LenDale White. I was wrong, and I admit that. He's the second best back in the league and he's one of the best friend's a quarterback could have. Some lists above me have me wanting to do my own here.

1. Adrian Peterson - Vikings
2. Chris Johnson - Titans
3. Steven Jackson - Rams
4. Maurice Jones-Drew - Jaguars
5. Frank Gore - 49ers
6. Cedric Benson - Bengals
7. DeAngelo Williams - Carolina
8. Michael Turner - Falcons
9. Ray Rice - Ravens
10. Ronnie Brown - Dolphins

Honorable Mention: Thomas Jones, Rashard Mendenhall, Brandon Jacobs

Not Listed: Brian Westbrook

bigbluedefense
11-10-2009, 12:31 PM
I wouldn't say he is a scatback at all. He is getting the majority of his teams carries, including the goal-line work. Adrian Peterson looked like he might hit 2000, but Chris Johnson has a really good chance to get there himself this year. CJ gets to play the worst run-D in the league this week.

To me, if you can't take 20 runs up the gut every game, youre more of a scatback.

I can't see CJ holding up for an entire season if he had to do that. AP could. He's more of a complete runner. But CJ is more of a complete player. If that makes any sense.

DoughBoy
11-10-2009, 12:35 PM
I don't know about all that. Bush was literally unstoppable in college

CJ isnt? The guy is good for 2 or 3 big plays a game. I love the hype CJ is getting in this thread though. I dont think CJ is what Bush was supposed to be either. I thought Bush was going to be the next Barry Sanders coming out and after his rookie year.I also thought CJ was the second coming of Tony Dorsett. after his rookie year But, as far as his talent goes, his balance, speed, agility, vision, carrying(1 fumble last year, 1 this year) and blocking are all out of this world. He might be the most talented player we have had since Jevon Kearse and Pacman( Just hope he doesnt develop the injury bug or beat up strippers).

Shiver
11-10-2009, 12:35 PM
I understand that completely, but I think Chris Johnson has a better chance of holding up than Adrian Peterson does. Eventually Peterson's violent running style will catch up to him; in fact, I'm amazed it hasn't happened yet. Chris Johnson might have a 2,400 yard season and only have about 300 touches. That is out of this world.

umphrey
11-10-2009, 12:41 PM
Backs in general have concerns. If anything, powerbacks take more abuse and have shorter careers.

Thats why im personally a big believer in the RBC. Just constantly rotate some cheap midround guys and have a committee. Its cheaper, it keeps your run game fresher into the postseason, and its easier to replenish.

This is how I feel. I was thinking about downgrading CJ a bit because I don't think he should carry the load for a team. But it's not that he can't, he just shouldn't, and it's NFL Coaching 101 that there should be someone else to take snaps away from him to keep him fresher over the year and over his career.

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 12:52 PM
Come on guys, don't you know that Ladainian is the best back?!?!

FloridaSkinzFan
11-10-2009, 12:54 PM
As of right now Chris Johnson is top5 nfl back.

no specific order but, Peterson, Turner, D.Williams and C.Johnson come to mind

Saints-Tigers
11-10-2009, 01:01 PM
Wonderful talent there. I wouldn't worry so much about him not holding up, they do a tremendous job of getting him to the second level, and sealing off the edges so that he isn't getting piled on by linemen, and guys don't really get a clean shot on him, he'll be fine as long as they continue the spectacular blocking for him. Great synergy going. He's one of the 3 fastest players in the league at worst, he has a great size/speed ratio, his line is hitting on all cylinders for him, and the coaches are feeding him the rock.

They could get him more involved in the passing game though, he's a better receiver than his stat line indicates.

I can't help but think everyone going RBBC actually has a few negatives. I think when one back gets the bulk of the carries, he gets more loose, more into the flow of the game, and establishes a rhythm that leads to more big plays than guys who split carries.

The RBBC guys might have fresher legs, but when you know you aren't getting the carries, you are more prone to try and push too hard on your holes, or not really get a feel for what the defense is doing.

My own team as an example, I do love what we are doing with the 3 back system, where no guy is being overly exerted and pounded on, because with our line, the first half is full on grind it out mode where we are smashing into the LOS, and then in the 4th quarter after we've worn them down, we start hitting our big runs.

If we ran one back 25 times a game, he'd be demolished. I'd love to see more big runs, and I think those come more often with a feature guy that gets in rhythm, but Thomas, Bush and Bell all haven't shown that they can stay healthy enough to shoulder that load.

Thomas and Bell run so violently that they are always going to be a little nicked up, because neither are huge backs.

Bush has played most of his career with some sort of injury it seems, he had the heel injury as a rookie that nagged him for a while in the beginning of the season, and he's had his other two seasons nicked up and eventually ended with injury.

On that note, I want to hear from someone more medically educated than I am, but from what I know from basketball, Microfracture is always a serious surgery for a guy that relies on his athletic ability like Reggie does, but the usual deal is, it's 1 year of rehab and recovery, and then they can start playing, but you don't expect the knee to be back to 100% until around 2 years after the surgery.

I've never seen a player play until at LEAST the 1 year mark. Reggie had his surgery in mid-december of 2008, and he was back in june of 2009, that's not even 7 months. Is this a good sign that he recovered faster than expected, or did he come back too soon?

Granted he still is explosive, but he doesn't look quite as quick as he did last season before he got injured, when he was leading the league in touchdowns....

I guess we'll see what happens, but the Saints still seem to be being very cautious about it, because he gets taken from the game completely once we are ahead, and even when he starts out running well, they still don't feed him the ball when he looks to be flowing.

All in all though, I think RBBC and having a workhorse both have pros and cons that I notice more and more as I watch teams around the league.

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 01:03 PM
i think he got lost trying to find the end zone in week 6.

Honestly those two red zone visits were when I finally started thinking the era of LT may be winding down (and I know, against the masses, I am very late to that conclusion). The Ladainian I know simply doesn't get stopped there...as terrible as the O-line is, that was too close.

Shiver
11-10-2009, 01:07 PM
As of right now Chris Johnson is top5 nfl back.

no specific order but, Peterson, Turner, D.Williams and C.Johnson come to mind


In my personal order:

1. Chris Johnson
2. Adrian Peterson
3. Maurice Jones-Drew
4. Ray Rice
5. DeAngelo Williams
6. Michael Turner
7. Steven Jackson
8. Ronnie Brown
9. Cedric Benson (I still have a hard time typing that)
10. Frank Gore

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 01:11 PM
You know who is playing really well and receiving very little credit for it right now, Ricky Williams.

umphrey
11-10-2009, 01:16 PM
You know who is playing really well and receiving very little credit for it right now, Ricky Williams.

Maybe his time off doing yoga and getting stoned gave him fresher legs

Shiver
11-10-2009, 01:17 PM
Come on guys, don't you know that Ladainian is the best back?!?!


I miss LaDainian Tomlinson. The best moment of my football life was watching him pass Walter Payton with a 3-TD, 200 total yard game at Arrowhead Stadium.

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 01:21 PM
I miss LaDainian Tomlinson. The best moment of my football life was watching him pass Walter Payton with a 3-TD, 200 total yard game at Arrowhead Stadium.

Better believe during this coming offseason when the turk comes for Ladainian I am starting a 'memories' thread. Engineering a 21 point comeback at Cincinnati with the ground game is a personal favorite of mine.

The Unseen
11-10-2009, 01:25 PM
In my personal order:

1. Chris Johnson
2. Adrian Peterson
3. Maurice Jones-Drew
4. Ray Rice
5. DeAngelo Williams
6. Michael Turner
7. Steven Jackson
8. Ronnie Brown
9. Cedric Benson (I still have a hard time typing that)
10. Frank Gore

We have the same top 3, but why Gore so low and Rice so high?

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 01:28 PM
We have the same top 3, but why Gore so low and Rice so high?

SHHHH he'll hear you!

The Unseen
11-10-2009, 01:34 PM
Backs in general have concerns. If anything, powerbacks take more abuse and have shorter careers.

Thats why im personally a big believer in the RBC. Just constantly rotate some cheap midround guys and have a committee. Its cheaper, it keeps your run game fresher into the postseason, and its easier to replenish.

Interestingly for the Jaguars, this is the first time in awhile we haven't had a RBBC. Fred Taylor and MJD were a kickass 1-2 punch in years past, but without Fred Taylor MJD is the lone guy. We have a decent backup in rookie Rashad Jennings who ran for his first TD this week, but he barely gets any carries, and neither does Greg Jones. The big question was if MJD could carry the load, and that seems to be the case.

Shiver
11-10-2009, 01:36 PM
We have the same top 3, but why Gore so low and Rice so high?


Gore is too injury prone. Maybe I should have swapped him and Ronnie Brown in hindsight, but I wouldn't take him over any of the first seven guys I mentioned.

Why wouldn't Rice be that high? What can't he do as a RB? The guy is on pace to get 1,100 yards rushing, ten touchdowns and 90 catches for 900 yards, receiving! He also has assumed the goal-line job. Look what he did to the Minnesota Vikings' defense, that was one of the most impressive performances I've seen this year.

RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES
11-10-2009, 01:37 PM
Gore is too injury prone. Maybe I should have swapped him and Ronnie Brown in hindsight, but I wouldn't take him over any of the first seven guys I mentioned.

Why wouldn't Rice be that high? What can't he do as a RB? The guy is on pace to get 1,100 yards rushing, ten touchdowns and 90 catches for 900 yards, receiving! He also has assumed the goal-line job. Look what he did to the Minnesota Vikings' defense, that was one of the most impressive performances I've seen this year.

:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

Jvig43
11-10-2009, 01:44 PM
From what ive seen, if you can get past the line and get to Cj in the backfield, its going to be a loss. AD however can, in worst case scenario, get back to the line of scrimmage. But lets not forget about him because Farve came to town and the play calling changed significantly. Oh and yeah Cj is real good, second best next to peterson.

drowe
11-10-2009, 01:45 PM
oh yeah. Rice is everything Frank Gore SHOULD be. but, he's just never put it together for a season. Any list that has Gore over Rice would have to be based on potential...and even that is debateable.

I won't even attempt to rank them, but I'll just say that this is what I think are top tier RBs right now.

-Ronnie Brown
-Cedric Benson
-Ray Rice
-Chris Johnson
-MJD
-AD
-DeAngelo Williams
-Michael Turner
-Steven Jackson

The Unseen
11-10-2009, 01:47 PM
Gore is too injury prone. Maybe I should have swapped him and Ronnie Brown in hindsight, but I wouldn't take him over any of the first seven guys I mentioned.

Why wouldn't Rice be that high? What can't he do as a RB? The guy is on pace to get 1,100 yards rushing, ten touchdowns and 90 catches for 900 yards, receiving! He also has assumed the goal-line job. Look what he did to the Minnesota Vikings' defense, that was one of the most impressive performances I've seen this year.

Yeah, good point. I knew he had a lot of receiving yards, but that's pretty damn impressive.

ThePudge
11-10-2009, 01:55 PM
In my personal order:

1. Chris Johnson
2. Adrian Peterson
3. Maurice Jones-Drew
4. Ray Rice
5. DeAngelo Williams
6. Michael Turner
7. Steven Jackson
8. Ronnie Brown
9. Cedric Benson (I still have a hard time typing that)
10. Frank Gore

You better not have such a hard time squeezing Benson into that Top 6 or 7 by year's end. I've watched every game since his start with the Bengals and this guy is more than legit. His explosiveness and speed is tremendous for a power back and he's a terror between the tackles because of his vision, balance, and knack for falling forward. I don't like Rice that high, though I more than acknowledge and respect what he is doing. In no way was he the more dangerous back last week, and he is targeted on screen passes more often than any back in the league. Still the right choice for the Ravens, and a Top 10 back, I'm just not sold on him more so than Benson/Turner/Williams who I had listed at 6, 7, 8 respectively.

Giantsfan1080
11-10-2009, 01:55 PM
Rice is having an underrated year. I'm not sure if there is anyone is can catch better than him out of the backfield already. There are some guys close but Rice might be the best.

E-Man
11-10-2009, 02:05 PM
CJ is very very good. If he can keep up the pace I'd label him great. It's a great comparison to stack him up with Peterson. Peterson's talent is out of this world, but I do wish that he carried the ball more. One thing I hate with Viking games is that when Peterson breaks a huge play, he's on the sideline and Chester Taylor comes in. I know you want to keep him fresh, but when the guy is hot I feel that you gotta keep going with him on that same drive. When they lost to the Steelers on that last drive, he wasn't even in the game. You gotta have your best player on the field when it's crunch time. I don't know if that's a coaching decision or not, but that shouldn't happen.

ThePudge
11-10-2009, 02:10 PM
Rice is having an underrated year. I'm not sure if there is anyone is can catch better than him out of the backfield already. There are some guys close but Rice might be the best.

In terms of hands, vision, elusiveness, strength, and balance, Ray Rice has no equals right now. He's an extreme weapon for that Baltimore, and should continue this great statistical year. He doesn't have quite the home run ability of Chris Johnson out of the backfield, but overall as a receiver, he may be the most dangerous we've seen in awhile. He has some Brian Westbrook in him, and you better believe former Eagles assistant John Harbaugh has thought that same thing.

A Perfect Score
11-10-2009, 02:32 PM
In terms of hands, vision, elusiveness, strength, and balance, Ray Rice has no equals right now. He's an extreme weapon for that Baltimore, and should continue this great statistical year. He doesn't have quite the home run ability of Chris Johnson out of the backfield, but overall as a receiver, he may be the most dangerous we've seen in awhile. He has some Brian Westbrook in him, and you better believe former Eagles assistant John Harbaugh has thought that same thing.

The thing about this is, he had a grand total of 37 receptions at Rutgers. Weird huh?

Giantsfan1080
11-10-2009, 02:36 PM
The thing about this is, he had a grand total of 37 receptions at Rutgers. Weird huh?

We had great WR's to throw to so Teel didn't like to throw to the RB's that often. We all knew Rice could catch very well out of the backfield though. Last year during the Steelers/Ravens playoff game the only big play a RB got was Rice gaining like 17 yards on a catch. You could tell then the Ravens would have a wepon like him to use in the upcoming years.

ThePudge
11-10-2009, 02:37 PM
The thing about this is, he had a grand total of 37 receptions at Rutgers. Weird huh?

Yeah, a big question mark on Rice going into the draft was how well he was going to catch the ball out of the backfield (which at his size, we naturally assumed he would have to do.) By the looks of it, if they'd have used him more as a receiver at Rutgers, Rice could have been a first round pick despite his size.

Giantsfan1080
11-10-2009, 02:40 PM
Not to take over the thread but Rutgers didn't need to use him as a receiver out of the backfield. We had no use for it because our offense was above average and suited very well for what we were doing with Rice. As for him being a 1st rounder Scotty, the other RU fans around here and I all thought he should have been anyway. I think the size issue was going to go against him no matter what. In the coming years we'll see teams not underrate the smaller RB's like they have because of the likes of MJD, Johnson, Rice and so on.

yo123
11-10-2009, 02:49 PM
It's good to see most people are not bumping CJ over Peterson based on a half a season. I lol at people saying he's even having a down year, he's on pace for 1500 yards and 18 TD's. If that's a down year we're talking about one of the best RB's of all time here.

Also I don't understand why some people were saying that CJ had a better rookie year than AD had.

Peterson- 1341 yards 5.6 YPC 12 TD
Johnson- 1228 yards 4.9 YPC 9 TD

Don't take this as me saying that Chris Johnson isn't amazing, he is and if he keeps this up for a prolonged stretch he could definitely catch Peterson, but as of now it's Adrian Peterson 1 and CJ 2.

scottyboy
11-10-2009, 02:54 PM
the last page and a half make me smile <3

I put johnson below AD, MJD and Raymell baby with Gore VERY close behind

DoughBoy
11-10-2009, 03:02 PM
the last page and a half make me smile <3

I put johnson below AD, MJD and Raymell baby with Gore VERY close behind

I hate you scotty. You only put Ray ahead of CJ because you dumb homer and you put MJD ahead of him because he looks like Ray.

scottyboy
11-10-2009, 03:17 PM
I hate you scotty. You only put Ray ahead of CJ because you dumb homer and you put MJD ahead of him because he looks like Ray.

actually:
Ray Rice is the best ever, that's why he's ahead of CJ
and I just LOOOOOVE MJD, have for a long time. I just feel they're more complete backs in terms of having power along with speed and agility.
They both have outstanding recieving ability, speed, and power.
Ray Rice's thighs are also the juiciest things on the face of the earth.
but Raymell has no influence on me putting MJD ahead of Johnson. I take MJD over CJ every day. There are times I believe MJD is better than AD

DoughBoy
11-10-2009, 03:23 PM
Would you like CJ more if he had big juicy man thighs Scotty?

:)

scottyboy
11-10-2009, 03:27 PM
Would you like CJ more if he had big juicy man thighs Scotty?

:)

that or if he went to Rutgers.

Saints-Tigers
11-10-2009, 03:38 PM
Rutgers is dumm.

oh **** son

Shiver
11-10-2009, 03:45 PM
I don't think he is having a down year per say. He is actually having his most balanced season ever in terms of use in the passing game.

Brothgar
11-10-2009, 04:23 PM
I want to have Chris Jonhson's babies.

LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 06:57 PM
It's good to see most people are not bumping CJ over Peterson based on a half a season. I lol at people saying he's even having a down year, he's on pace for 1500 yards and 18 TD's. If that's a down year we're talking about one of the best RB's of all time here.

Also I don't understand why some people were saying that CJ had a better rookie year than AD had.

Peterson- 1341 yards 5.6 YPC 12 TD
Johnson- 1228 yards 4.9 YPC 9 TD

Don't take this as me saying that Chris Johnson isn't amazing, he is and if he keeps this up for a prolonged stretch he could definitely catch Peterson, but as of now it's Adrian Peterson 1 and CJ 2.



So receiving numbers don't count for RB's? CJ had a better overall rookie season, really any way you look at it. At this pace, his sophmore season will be better too, I know AD was hurt, but that counts too, because CJ has showed he can be durable when everyone thought he was just a scat back.


Why don't you look at their total yards from scrimmage their rookie years, and not just rushing totals. That's why people are saying CJ had a better rookie season.


CJ has played well for more then a half of a season, and honestly it only took about a half of a season for people to start the AD>LT talk and it was perfectly fine then for most people so I don't see much difference in that now.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-10-2009, 07:06 PM
There were rumblings over the summer that Peterson was looking to gains ten pounds of muscle so he could take more carries and deliver more punishment. Childress and other rb's around the league advised against it because they said it could cost him some of his burst and top speed that make him such a special player. I think LT said hes played at a lighter playing weight than in college at times because being faster and quicker has made it easier to get away from the big slower linebackers and lineman. i think he said he plays at around 210.

I think Peterson ended up gaining some weight, and it looks it a little. Hes not quite as explosive or gamebreaking as in years past despite a better team around him. still a great player but it def hurt his game a bit.

I think its something that Bush did coming out of college and since getting to the nfl, he added upper body muscle so that his bench would be better at his workout and people would think he could 'carry the load' and do away with that criticism. unfortunately, it took his change of direction skills and burst away a bit. They were a bit overrated beforehand if you watch his college highlights hes not quite as fast straight ahead or side to side as people seem to remember, still very good, but not Barry laterally or CJ straight ahead. Bush doesnt have the mental approach of a up the gut for 4 tough yards back, but his slight drop in that special something hurt him and his confidence and he hasnt been the same player since.

I was wondering about that. I've seen AD get caught from behind this year even without a great angle. That didn't used to happen.

Supporting Caste
11-10-2009, 07:26 PM
I'm shocked at how good Johnson has been. I wasn't impressed with him at all in college and saw nothing in his game that made me think he was really anything more than another Trung Canidate/Sultan McCullough.

I think he's gotten a lot better since he came into the NFL, because he was very unproductive his first three years at ECU and even in his breakout senior year he didn't really produce against legitimate defenses.

But yeah, I don't see how he could be anything less than top five at the moment, and it's a pretty easy argument to say he's in the top three.

I would definitely take Peterson and Williams ahead of him, and probably Maurice Jones-Drew until I see Johnson sustain his current production.

senormysterioso
11-10-2009, 07:32 PM
He is so fast...it's rediculous. Watching him turn the corner on NFL defenses is like watching Florida or something against a cream puff D1A schedule filler at the beginning of the year. Tennessee has a talented offensive line, and he benefits from that..but you can't hold that against him. His speed is probably the scariest thing for opposing coaches in the NFL right now.

Trivia
11-10-2009, 07:37 PM
Adrian Peterson
Frank Gore
D Will
Chris Johnson
Stephen Jackson

AP clearly #1

Pit Bull #53
11-10-2009, 07:41 PM
He protects the ball as well. 2 fumbles since he's been in the league.

Xonraider
11-10-2009, 07:47 PM
What has Steven Jackson done since is 1500 yard season? I know the offense is piss poor outside him but really? You have never really seen a titans game have you? I can understand DeAngelo, just because he has been in the NFL longer, but Chris Johnson has had a better start to his career than both and is playing MUCH better than Deangelo this year.

Well, mainly because he puts up 1000 yard seasons consistently in St. Louis, and CJ has only been in the league for a year and a half, with pretty good O-Line play I would think. I think if he keeps up next year he will be top two. No real need to get all defensive because he plays for your team man.

yo123
11-10-2009, 08:39 PM
So receiving numbers don't count for RB's? CJ had a better overall rookie season, really any way you look at it. At this pace, his sophmore season will be better too, I know AD was hurt, but that counts too, because CJ has showed he can be durable when everyone thought he was just a scat back.


Why don't you look at their total yards from scrimmage their rookie years, and not just rushing totals. That's why people are saying CJ had a better rookie season.


CJ has played well for more then a half of a season, and honestly it only took about a half of a season for people to start the AD>LT talk and it was perfectly fine then for most people so I don't see much difference in that now.


Peterson had more receiving yards in his rookie year than Johnson did so this makes no sense.

yo123
11-10-2009, 08:42 PM
i'm curious how much of peterson's "down year" is attributable to having the worst play-calling coach in the league.



It's really scary that he's this good despite Childress. There's been a number of times this year where Peterson went through long periods of not touching the ball, which is incredibly frustrating. I don't care if his first 20 carries go for 20 yards, the way Peterson is the 21st could go for 80 and Childress has forgotten this for some reason.

TitanHope
11-10-2009, 08:48 PM
To me, if you can't take 20 runs up the gut every game, youre more of a scatback.

I can't see CJ holding up for an entire season if he had to do that. AP could. He's more of a complete runner. But CJ is more of a complete player. If that makes any sense.

I think that definition is a bit unfair.

CJ has already displayed the ability to be an inside runner. He's not limited at all to running outside. It's just because he has that speed that if he can turn the corner, he's getting a 1st Down or more. The Titans aren't spreading the field to open things up for CJ. They're lining up in the I-Formation with a FB and TE and playing power football. Now that VY is in there though, we're seeing some option stuff and other things too. It's gonna be interesting to see how they continue to utilize both VY and CJ together.

CJ's a lot tougher than he's given credit for. He's not gonna truck you like AD, but he can still break tackles.

LonghornsLegend
11-10-2009, 08:56 PM
Peterson had more receiving yards in his rookie year than Johnson did so this makes no sense.

Your right, I don't know what numbers I was looking at while I was at work :(

Halsey
11-10-2009, 09:17 PM
Imagine what Johnson could do with a passing game around him that kept defenses spread out. Yeah, he's pretty ridiculous.

abaddon41_80
11-10-2009, 09:38 PM
i'm curious how much of peterson's "down year" is attributable to having the worst play-calling coach in the league.

Jimmy Raye disagrees with this statement

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 09:42 PM
Imagine what Johnson could do with a passing game around him that kept defenses spread out. Yeah, he's pretty ridiculous.

When the Titans draft Clausen this will start to happen.

Oh yah that's the train I'm starting, choo choo git on the train.

senormysterioso
11-10-2009, 10:04 PM
When the Titans draft Clausen this will start to happen.

Oh yah that's the train I'm starting, choo choo git on the train.

you're predicting that they're gonna choo choo choose jimmy clausen?

http://www.dandarcy.com/images/choo_choo.jpg

Saints-Tigers
11-10-2009, 10:07 PM
Imagine what Johnson could do with a passing game around him that kept defenses spread out. Yeah, he's pretty ridiculous.

That's what everyone said about Peterson the first two seasons.

Touches and offensive line play> having a good passing game

(when we are talking about runners racking up numbers)

CC.SD
11-10-2009, 10:18 PM
you're predicting that they're gonna choo choo choose jimmy clausen?


oh Yes.
http://i650.photobucket.com/albums/uu226/ccsdccsd/Screenshot2009-11-10at81305PM-1.png

Halsey
11-10-2009, 10:18 PM
That's what everyone said about Peterson the first two seasons.

Touches and offensive line play> having a good passing game

(when we are talking about runners racking up numbers)

I'll take all three. Peterson is averaging the same number of ypc as last year, isn't having to run the ball as much and wear down his body, is catching more passes, and his team is better.

Vox Populi
11-10-2009, 10:18 PM
Side note to the thread, but the Ray Rice nut hugging and saying he is a better back than Frank Gore is crap to me, especially the one guy who said Gore hasn't ever put it all together and that Gore should be what Rice is? Uhhh... you miss the past 3 years? Rice is having a great year, but the Ravens would still be competitive without him. You take Gore out of the 49ers backfield and their offense is nonexistent. I know its crazy to imagine that the Ravens don't have a terribad offense, but it is actually solid now with a real quarterback and one of the most impressive offensive lines in the game right now. Then we take a peak over at the 49ers where we've got Alex Smith, one of the bottom 5 lines in the league. The receivers 49ers probably get an edge over Baltimore at this point with VD playing as well as he is now and all the young potential at wideout they've got. I have a hard time putting Gore behind anyone not named Peterson, Chris Johnson or Maurice Jones-Drew this year. He's right in the 4-7 range with SJax, Michael Turner and DeAngelo Williams. I'm not saying Rice isn't going to be a better back, but to downgrade him so much because of injury is crap, because you can tell he makes more or as much of a difference for his team than any other back.

I'd rank my top 10 something like this...
1. Adrian Peterson
2. Chris Johnson
3. Maurice Jones-Drew
4. Frank Gore
5. Stephen Jackson
6. DeAngelo Williams
7. Cedric Benson
8. Michael Turner
9. Ronnie Brown
10. Ray Rice

I won't be surprised if someone 8-10 gets knocked off in favour of Mendenhall by years end though. Hes played great since he took over for Parker now that hes getting more than 1 carry every 2 quarters. Speaking of which, since the first couple weeks of the season, anyone else think the Steelers offensive line has gotten WAY better? Just something I've noticed in the 2-3 games I've seen of them starting from the Chargers game.

DoughBoy
11-10-2009, 10:25 PM
I think that definition is a bit unfair.

CJ has already displayed the ability to be an inside runner. He's not limited at all to running outside. It's just because he has that speed that if he can turn the corner, he's getting a 1st Down or more. The Titans aren't spreading the field to open things up for CJ. They're lining up in the I-Formation with a FB and TE and playing power football. Now that VY is in there though, we're seeing some option stuff and other things too. It's gonna be interesting to see how they continue to utilize both VY and CJ together.

CJ's a lot tougher than he's given credit for. He's not gonna truck you like AD, but he can still break tackles.

iHNRoHqhR0Q

2:13 :)

TitanHope
11-10-2009, 10:37 PM
iHNRoHqhR0Q

2:13 :)

Lol, I ALMOST put "(unless you're from Jacksonville)" in my post. :D

He ain't no Earl or Eddie though. But, why run through someone when you can blow their doors off? ;)

TitansCJftw
11-10-2009, 10:46 PM
the last page and a half make me smile <3

I put johnson below AD, MJD and Raymell baby with Gore VERY close behind

wow... that made me smile... at your stupidity :eek: :eek: :confused:

RufusMcDaniel
11-10-2009, 10:47 PM
Chris Johnson has all the characteristics I look for in a running back.

Fast, awesome, dreads, gold teeth, beat Boise State, called out Jamie Dukes and most importantly plays for the Titans.

FUNBUNCHER
11-10-2009, 10:50 PM
He looks so much faster than Bush! The only thing I wonder about CJ is that for a 200 lb. RB, how many years can he hold up??

Love how Chris Johnson doesn't dance and juke, instead he cuts, slashes, and gets up field.

Mr. Bush would do himself well to watch some CJ highlights.

Halsey
11-10-2009, 10:56 PM
Well, I hate to brag, but....well, I actually like bragging. Here's me, months before the 2008 Draft, saying Chris Johnson was a less hyped version of what Reggie Bush was supposed to be.

http://life.atlantafalcons.com/topic/3230619-if-chris-johnson-played-at-a-big-time-school-with-lineman-opening-up-big-holes-in-front-of-him/page__mode__threaded__pid__3241811

Shiver
11-10-2009, 11:10 PM
In that thread I found this gem:

Wow, the kid runs hard as ****. He breaks more tackles in one game than Darren McFadden broke all season, probably in his entire collegiate career, and he runs faster than "DMC" too. I'm going to have to watch some tape on this kid, he looks like a baller.

Sounds about right, oh and he doesn't fumble twice every game.

smittyjs
11-10-2009, 11:12 PM
He is top three IMO, even with his speed he will break tackles. IMO he looks like Barry Sanders with less dancing, like Sanders, no can get a proper angle on him because of his speed he just bouces off tackles.

smittyjs
11-10-2009, 11:14 PM
Chris Johnson has all the characteristics I look for in a running back.

Fast, awesome, dreads, gold teeth, beat Boise State, called out Jamie Dukes and most importantly plays for the Titans.

He looks intense with his golds LOL, i always like it when he smiles after a TD. :)

scottyboy
11-10-2009, 11:18 PM
wow... that made me smile... at your stupidity :eek: :eek: :confused:

ah the good ol' homer goggles. some people can't admit that another teams RB is superior to their own

Saints-Tigers
11-10-2009, 11:57 PM
Looking at that highlight reel makes me jealous of how well the Titans seal off the edges and get him toss plays, I wish we could do that. :(

That's one thing we lack right now, big plays, even though we are running the ball well, we really have to put in our heavy set to get the job done, we don't even have a fullback right now, so we run from the spread, or in the heavy formation with a third tackle, and David Thomas at FB, haha.

Despite being top 5 in rushing yards per game, and top 8 in yards per carry, we really can't spring big plays, our longest run of the year is 35 yards by Mike Bell, and we only have 7 rushes of more than 20 yards.

Ah well, as long as Brees and Peyton are here, the linemen we put in, and the scheme are going to be geared towards holding up the passing game, and it's nice that we have some consistency, but with the talent we have at HB and with the way we have the field spread, we should be busting more big runs.

Maybe that's the key, anyone think the fact that we almost never see 8-9 men fronts has something to do with it? Since the safeties are forced to sit back, we can get a lot more runs in the 5-15 yard range, but there is always a last line of defense to stop it from going 80?

Back on topic, props to the Tennessee coaching staff for recognizing how talented Johnson is and getting him the ball in all the right ways, props to the O-line for looking dominant in the run game, and props to Chris Johnson for being a ******* beast.

I knew their running game would be special after I saw Lendale White run 80 yards UNTOUCHED against the Chiefs last year. Really think about that for a second, haha.

TitansCJftw
11-11-2009, 01:21 AM
ah the good ol' homer goggles. some people can't admit that another teams RB is superior to their own

i might not admit that another teams rb is superior to my teams but i will admit that several running backs have an arguement and ray rice isnt one of them and everyone accept die hard rutgers/ravens fans will agree, ray rice top 10? yes there is an arguement there but a top 3 rb in the league HELL NO, im not dumb enough to let my titans homerism make me sound like a fool, however you have fun doing that

Brent
11-11-2009, 01:23 AM
the Frank Gore love in this thread makes me so happy haha

BlindSite
11-11-2009, 02:59 AM
Frank Gore is like Marvin Harrison was a few years ago when discussions on the best WRs come up, he's the forgotten **** wrecker.

Gore has been amazingly good for a number of years now and his production hasn't waned all that much considering his offensive supporting cast consisted of a fast but otherwise useless (till now) tight end and a few cast offs at Wide Receiver and quarterback.

Chis Johnson is among the best in the league, without a shadow of a doubt as are Ray Rice, Cedric Benson and MJD, but I still rank Turner, Williams and Peterson ahead of them. I don't get into numerical rankings because I think they're mildly ******** as a form of discussion, but I feel that both Turner and Williams are the most complete backs in the league. Sure the previous guys I mentioned can catch and in some cases pass protect as well, but the three I have ranked ahead of the others run, catch and protect just as well and those previous (except peterson) but posses better vision, on field awareness (finding holes in zone coverage, knowing when to wiff blocks on a screen, knowing when to drop or get out of bounds, knowing when to break on a route etc) more than the others, and I think their production as a collective cannot be ignored.

Peterson is the enigma, he's not all that good of a receiver or as a blocker, but his brilliance in all other areas make him too much of a force to ignore, and I've probably been one of his biggest detractors over the past two seasons.

Johnson is close to eclipsing Turner and Williams in my opinion, however his blocking and field craft isn't right where it needs to be to rank him ahead. His production is good enough though you could probably ranking him just below my big three but above the others.

Williams, Turner, peterson

c Johnson


Ray Rice, Benson, MJD, Gore, Jackson, Brown








Others

wogitalia
11-11-2009, 04:22 AM
I'm a huge Johnson fan, I personally think he is the leagues most exciting player.

It's an interesting situation between him and Peterson and personally I think it is between them.

Johnson is a far better receiver, get that part out of the way early. Both are average blockers, so as far as the passing game goes, big win to Johnson.

Now it's interesting from there. For me Johnson works with a fair bit better OL and has for both his seasons, that Tennessee line is great and to me is what makes their performance so far so surprising. Favre, Rice and Harvin have made the Vikes passing game a fair bit better this year, but it seems to have taken away from Peterson a bit so who knows on that front?

Peterson is a bit better inside, Johnson is better outside, both hit homeruns consistently. Just a pair of very good backs doing what they do. I think Johnson is having a better year but I still have Peterson as 1a over Johnson at 1b if I were to pick one just because his size should hold up better longterm. Flat out can't go wrong with either.

Also no knock on Gore or DeAngelo who are the next two best for me. Lot of other guys are in the next pack after those two. I would actually hate to be a RB prospect right now as very few teams have needs there, most have good young backs, which makes the whole passing frenzy in the league all the more questionable.

GhostDeini
11-11-2009, 05:42 AM
Second most dangerous offensive player in the NFL imo behind Peterson. I say Peterson because he can set, break, or tie an NFL record any time he steps on the field. Johnson is ridiculous himself too but in different ways. I can really see him averaging 6 plus yards a carry over an entire season. Last to do that was Barry Sanders.

GhostDeini
11-11-2009, 06:03 AM
Hold up, Gore has never put it together ??????? That guy must've started watching NFL the year after Gore dropped 1695 yards on 5.4 YPC on peoples heads.

He also probably slept in when Gore had those 2 80 yard runs for TD's earlier in the season. First RB to have 2 80 yarders in same game since Barry Sanders.

Iamcanadian
11-11-2009, 06:12 AM
I don't have the answer but the question for me when rating RB isn't just yards or receiving skills, ' How good a pass blocker are they' because if they are weak as a pass blocker, it really hurts the team's ability to pass the ball.

I also love how few people rate Benson among the top RB's. He is right up there with the best of them today.

DoughBoy
11-11-2009, 06:51 AM
Frank Gore is like Marvin Harrison was a few years ago when discussions on the best WRs come up, he's the forgotten **** wrecker.

Gore has been amazingly good for a number of years now and his production hasn't waned all that much considering his offensive supporting cast consisted of a fast but otherwise useless (till now) tight end and a few cast offs at Wide Receiver and quarterback.

Chis Johnson is among the best in the league, without a shadow of a doubt as are Ray Rice, Cedric Benson and MJD, but I still rank Turner, Williams and Peterson ahead of them. I don't get into numerical rankings because I think they're mildly ******** as a form of discussion, but I feel that both Turner and Williams are the most complete backs in the league. Sure the previous guys I mentioned can catch and in some cases pass protect as well, but the three I have ranked ahead of the others run, catch and protect just as well and those previous (except peterson) but posses better vision, on field awareness (finding holes in zone coverage, knowing when to wiff blocks on a screen, knowing when to drop or get out of bounds, knowing when to break on a route etc) more than the others, and I think their production as a collective cannot be ignored.

Peterson is the enigma, he's not all that good of a receiver or as a blocker, but his brilliance in all other areas make him too much of a force to ignore, and I've probably been one of his biggest detractors over the past two seasons.

Johnson is close to eclipsing Turner and Williams in my opinion, however his blocking and field craft isn't right where it needs to be to rank him ahead. His production is good enough though you could probably ranking him just below my big three but above the others.

Williams, Turner, peterson

c Johnson


Ray Rice, Benson, MJD, Gore, Jackson, Brown








Others

Chris Johnson is a very good blocker my friend. I dont no what the hell field craft is but Im sure Chris has plenty of it.

DoughBoy
11-11-2009, 06:57 AM
I'm a huge Johnson fan, I personally think he is the leagues most exciting player.

It's an interesting situation between him and Peterson and personally I think it is between them.

Johnson is a far better receiver, get that part out of the way early. Both are average blockers, so as far as the passing game goes, big win to Johnson.

Now it's interesting from there. For me Johnson works with a fair bit better OL and has for both his seasons, that Tennessee line is great and to me is what makes their performance so far so surprising. Favre, Rice and Harvin have made the Vikes passing game a fair bit better this year, but it seems to have taken away from Peterson a bit so who knows on that front?

Peterson is a bit better inside, Johnson is better outside, both hit homeruns consistently. Just a pair of very good backs doing what they do. I think Johnson is having a better year but I still have Peterson as 1a over Johnson at 1b if I were to pick one just because his size should hold up better longterm. Flat out can't go wrong with either.

Also no knock on Gore or DeAngelo who are the next two best for me. Lot of other guys are in the next pack after those two. I would actually hate to be a RB prospect right now as very few teams have needs there, most have good young backs, which makes the whole passing frenzy in the league all the more questionable.

Lol, I dont know where you guys get this from. I guess I would assume since CJ was so small people think he is not big enough to block (hell if I was not a titans fan I would assume the same). The guy sells his body out on about every pass play he is not involved in. People forget he is tough.

Cicero
11-11-2009, 07:07 AM
Lol, I dont know where you guys get this from. I guess I would assume since CJ was so small people assume he is not big enough to block (hell if I wasent a titans fan I would assume the same). The guy sells his body out on about every pass play he is not involved in though. People forget he is tough.

That Westbrook guy is pretty small too so he must not be a good pass protector either.

senormysterioso
11-11-2009, 07:18 AM
you could say that He is..."every coaches dream"

Shane P. Hallam
11-11-2009, 08:27 AM
I do think Tennsspeed is the 2nd best RB in the league. I was skeptical even last week, but he does things NO ONE in the NFL can do. Adrian Peterson passes the Eye Test more for me, so I put Tennesspeed #2.

Brothgar
11-11-2009, 09:12 AM
you could say that He is..."every coaches dream"

Or nightmare when they go against him.

yo123
11-11-2009, 12:46 PM
Johnson is a far better receiver, get that part out of the way early. Both are average blockers, so as far as the passing game goes, big win to Johnson.



I wouldn't say far better, Peterson has more receiving yards than Johnson this year, we've finally started to use him more in the passing game. He's a better receiver than he's given credit for. We still need to start giving him more screens.

TitanHope
11-11-2009, 07:49 PM
I do think Tennsspeed is the 2nd best RB in the league. I was skeptical even last week, but he does things NO ONE in the NFL can do. Adrian Peterson passes the Eye Test more for me, so I put Tennesspeed #2.

"Tennesspeed" is to JBond as "Akron Hammer" is to Sports Nation. :D

P-L
11-11-2009, 09:14 PM
I wouldn't say far better, Peterson has more receiving yards than Johnson this year, we've finally started to use him more in the passing game. He's a better receiver than he's given credit for. We still need to start giving him more screens.
Peterson was always knocked as a pass-catcher. Not because he's a bad receiving back, but because Minnesota didn't throw him the ball. Peterson has proved to be pretty good at catching the ball out of the backfield this year. He's averaging just a hair under 10 yards per reception.

Splat
11-11-2009, 09:18 PM
I also love how few people rate Benson among the top RB's. He is right up there with the best of them today.

He has to do it longer for me to believe it to many RB's have flashed for short periods of time then nothing.

I'm not knocking him and he is playing good right now I'm just not ready to throw him in the mix when talking top backs.

scar988
11-11-2009, 09:23 PM
Thoughts for comparison: Chris Johnson = Barry Sanders, AD = Emmitt Smith

Splat
11-11-2009, 09:25 PM
Thoughts for comparison: Chris Johnson = Barry Sanders, AD = Emmitt Smith

I don't think Emmitt ever had AD's power.

Giantsfan1080
11-11-2009, 09:42 PM
From what I've seen I'm not sure if Johnson is that good of a comparison to Sanders either. Sanders used to just dance in the backfield while Johnson is so fast he just hits his hole and is gone.

Splat
11-11-2009, 09:46 PM
From what I've seen I'm not sure if Johnson is that good of a comparison to Sanders either. Sanders used to just dance in the backfield while Johnson is so fast he just hits his hole and is gone.

If Jeff Fisher gets the boot they should bring in Mike Shanahan he would have a field day with CJ.

TitanHope
11-11-2009, 09:48 PM
Thoughts for comparison: Chris Johnson = Barry Sanders, AD = Emmitt Smith

CJ = Marshall Faulk

AD = Eric Dickerson

The best I can think of for both.

CashmoneyDrew
11-11-2009, 09:50 PM
It ain't gonna happen Splat.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-11-2009, 09:53 PM
CJ is like Earl Campbell and AD reminds me so much of Gayle Sayers.

Just kidding, I'm not ********.

Anyway just thought I'd say I wasn't a believer in Chris Johnson coming out. Seems you never really heard of him until the 4.24, which had me thinking Chris Henry, ESPECIALLY when the Titans picked him. But he made me look silly.

Splat
11-11-2009, 09:54 PM
It ain't gonna happen Splat.

I just thought you might want to "feel like a winner"...

holt_bruce81
11-11-2009, 09:56 PM
Steven Jackson is the best Running back in the League THIS SEASON.

He is the Rams.

Giantsfan1080
11-11-2009, 09:56 PM
Chris is right considering most people thought Johnson was the worst reach in the 1st round last year. Tons of people eating crow for that one.

yo123
11-11-2009, 09:58 PM
Thoughts for comparison: Chris Johnson = Barry Sanders, AD = Emmitt Smith



I don't see any Emmit in Peterson at all. Emmit didn't have his power or speed, he relied more on vision and quickness.

TitanHope
11-11-2009, 10:01 PM
I just thought you might want to "feel like a winner"...

Don't worry, we have a Vince Young for that. :p

CashmoneyDrew
11-11-2009, 10:02 PM
Steven Jackson is the best Running back in the League THIS SEASON.

He is the Rams.

I don't care how little talent Steven Jackson has around him, he can't be called the best back in the league this season when we're half way through it and he has one total TD.

MetSox17
11-11-2009, 10:08 PM
I don't care how little talent Steven Jackson has around him, he can't be called the best back in the league this season when we're half way through it and he has one total TD.

A week or two ago i had read a stat that so far in the year he had something like 3 red zone carries. THREE.

CashmoneyDrew
11-11-2009, 10:11 PM
A week or two ago i had read a stat that so far in the year he had something like 3 red zone carries. THREE.

NFL.com has Steven Jackson at 12 red zone carries and Chris Johnson at 10 red zone carries.

Splat
11-11-2009, 10:15 PM
O ya well the Chiefs haven't had one rushing TD as a team a TEAM beat that.

CC.SD
11-11-2009, 10:34 PM
I love CJ but think Barry Sanders is not a great comp.

Giantsfan1080
11-11-2009, 10:39 PM
I love CJ but think Barry Sanders is not a great comp.

Exactly. This is what I said last page. They aren't close at all.

aNYtitan
11-11-2009, 10:58 PM
I remember absolutely hating this pick when the Titans drafted him in the first round. Another workout warrior I was thinking that we drafted, and look how Chris Henry turned out. Boy I was dead wrong. Its getting close right now as to who the best back in the league is. Peterson has downright strength when it comes to stripping blockers and has great speed in the open field. Yet CJ has unmatched speed in the open field, and just sees holes open very quickly. Now in the new offensive set out of the spread and a much more conservative options, I think 2,000 yards is attainable.

Now I know what Titans jersey to get next

FUNBUNCHER
11-11-2009, 11:37 PM
No diss on the Pirates, but how did a guy like Chris Johnson end up at a program like East Carolina in the first place?? Was it an academic issue or was he a skinny kid coming out of HS?

I missed on CJ too and never considered him nearly a top 10 pick. I'm always amazed by players who look better in the NFL than in college.

RufusMcDaniel
11-11-2009, 11:39 PM
Now I know what Titans jersey to get next

Wearing his jersey makes everything faster...running, eating, sex.....well thats always fast, but you get my point.

wogitalia
11-11-2009, 11:59 PM
No diss on the Pirates, but how did a guy like Chris Johnson end up at a program like East Carolina in the first place?? Was it an academic issue or was he a skinny kid coming out of HS?

Not sure the reason why he ended up there, but I do know that he spent a lot of time playing WR and was somewhat of a tweener early in his career. That said, it's not like you just magically develop 4.2 speed.

He was a 2 star prospect though and according to wiki, broke his leg in his senior year of HS, which would explain how he ended up at ECU, apparently over Eastern Kentucky and UConn.

Kind of makes his journey all that much better that he wasn't a heralded recruit.

OzTitan
11-12-2009, 01:21 AM
Imagine what Johnson could do with a passing game around him that kept defenses spread out. Yeah, he's pretty ridiculous.

Was thinking this after last week's game - with all due respect to Marshall Faulk, what would CJ look like on that Rams offense?

tuan33
11-12-2009, 01:51 AM
I don't think CJ has anywhere near the receiving skills or route running abilities of Marshall. How about CJ=Tony Dorsett. Average inside runners but amazing outside because of their vision and speed.

TitansCJftw
11-12-2009, 02:10 AM
No diss on the Pirates, but how did a guy like Chris Johnson end up at a program like East Carolina in the first place?? Was it an academic issue or was he a skinny kid coming out of HS?

I missed on CJ too and never considered him nearly a top 10 pick. I'm always amazed by players who look better in the NFL than in college.

Hi die hard ecu fan here, he was recruited by to play for john thompson... possibly one of the worst D1 coaches ever, he was the definition of "track athlete" not a football player in high school and he broke his leg in his senior year of football and didnt play hardly at all, before breaking his leg he had interest from florida state but that quickly subsided with the broken leg, he was recruited as a wide receiver and his speed was no secret to anybody he was the anchor for the 4x4 relay state champions in florida(and fasted 4x4 relay team in the country) despite being recruited as a wr he never played the position at ecu and was switched to rb immediately, i cant find the particular stats or box score but i was a sophmore at ecu in 2004 his true freshman year and he was mostly non-existent along with the rest of the team except for 1 spectacular play that i witnessed in a mostly empty dowdy-ficklen stadium vs wake forest where he ripped off an 86? yard td run as a true freshman to standing cheers from the small crowd, in which he outran every person on wake forest's defense with ease, throughout that season and his next 2 he struggled behind absolutely pathetic offensive lines but in his 4th year coach skip holtz pulled together the best offensive line since the days of steve logan and david garrard and johnsons talent shined bright reeling off crazy numbers all over the place, mostly vs CUSA teams but a brilliant day vs UNC and a mesmerizing performance vs memphis in which he rushed for over 300 yards ahhhh ive probably begun to rant now but anyways take it as you will, he should've never been at ecu but stranger things have happened

MetSox17
11-12-2009, 02:39 AM
NFL.com has Steven Jackson at 12 red zone carries and Chris Johnson at 10 red zone carries.

How many of CJ's TD runs have come outside of the 20?

Saints-Tigers
11-12-2009, 03:00 AM
Is Peterson really that bad of a blocker, or is it just because he's so good at running that people just want to downgrade him on something?

Bengalsrocket
11-12-2009, 03:57 AM
I don't think CJ has anywhere near the receiving skills or route running abilities of Marshall. How about CJ=Tony Dorsett. Average inside runners but amazing outside because of their vision and speed.

I agree, No one in the league compares to Marshall right now imo.

LonghornsLegend
11-12-2009, 08:13 AM
I remember reading alot about how CJ was training with Tom Shaw this off-season, the speed specialist, and he's helped quite a few guys take the next jump:


Chris Johnson isn't at the Titans' facility this offseason because he's working with speed and performance specialist Tom Shaw in Florida.
Shaw helps players train for the NFL Scouting Combine and has tutored each of the last six Super Bowl MVPs. Four days a week Johnson is pushing golf carts to increase his leg drive and working on his side-to-side movements.
Source: Nashville Tennessean



Rather than participate in the Titans' offseason conditioning program, Johnson worked out with speed and performance specialist Tom Shaw in Florida. Shaw helps rookies prepare for the NFL Scouting Combine and has worked with each of the last six players to win the Super Bowl MVP, including Steelers wide receiver Santonio Holmes.

The training includes pushing golf carts to increase leg strength and drive and working on side-to-side movements to improve lateral movement and elusiveness. All of these workouts are meant to make an already dangerous running back an even greater threat between the white lines.



I know he's not the only one who worked with him, but I had heard alot of good things about Tom Shaw well before this, and remembered thinking how much better he could potentially make CJ for this year.

terribletowel39
11-12-2009, 09:46 AM
Alot of Steelers players go train with Tom Shaw. He apparently is awesome. Little known fact and not one that is apparent in his play. Tom Shaw has said that Ike Taylor is the fastest guy he has ever trained. And he has trained CJ and Deion.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_635267.html

CC.SD
11-12-2009, 09:56 AM
Is Peterson really that bad of a blocker, or is it just because he's so good at running that people just want to downgrade him on something?

Yep it's a giant conspiracy shhhh

FuzzyGopher
11-12-2009, 10:05 AM
He is what Michael Bennett was supposed to develop into.

LonghornsLegend
11-12-2009, 12:21 PM
Alot of Steelers players go train with Tom Shaw. He apparently is awesome. Little known fact and not one that is apparent in his play. Tom Shaw has said that Ike Taylor is the fastest guy he has ever trained. And he has trained CJ and Deion.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_635267.html

Yea, I read that when I was going across some articles about Tom Shaw, was pretty interesting actually considering everyone he has trained. Never knew he was that fast.

CashmoneyDrew
11-12-2009, 03:31 PM
How many of CJ's TD runs have come outside of the 20?

Four of his six TDs.

TitanHope
11-12-2009, 04:21 PM
Four of his six TDs.

Yup, the San Fran game was the first time he scored a TD of under 40-yards.

Saints-Tigers
11-12-2009, 06:03 PM
I don't see the Barry comparison as much. Johnson is taller and thinner, and much more of a 1 cut runner.

smittyjs
11-12-2009, 06:13 PM
He is what Michael Bennett was supposed to develop into.
I would say the same about Reggie Bush too

wordofi
11-12-2009, 07:03 PM
I haven't heard his name mentioned up there with the best backs in the league yet, but do you guys think he's there yet? Is Adrian Peterson still a tier above him?


His rookie season he had 1600+ yards and 10 TD's while splitting carries and was just a hair away from averaging 5 YPC. This season he's on pace for 2,000 yards and averaging a sick 6.7 (http://www.tennessean.com/article/20091110/SPORTS01/911100350/1027)





CJ looks like his first 2 years will be better then Peterson's, he's a great receiver, shown he can run tough inside the tackles. Is this not the player that the Saints thought they would get with the #2 pick?


How long you going to give him before annointing him? I know that last year was a pretty good rookie RB class but CJ looks really special to me.

He's running the ball better than any back in the NFL right now. I remember Scott Wright said that Tennesse made a terrible pick in drafting him because they already had LenDale White and Chris Henry. He was obviously wrong. The bottom line is that he'd be getting more attention if he played in New York or Boston.

wogitalia
11-12-2009, 07:54 PM
Is Peterson really that bad of a blocker, or is it just because he's so good at running that people just want to downgrade him on something?

He is spot on average, not a bad blocker, not a good blocker. Just average, not the kind of back that you leave in to block an elite rusher, but he can slow someone a bit, I think it is more that for someone his size you sort of think automatically that he should be a dominant blocker and the fact that he isn't gets overstated to the point where people are overly critical of his blocking.

I just love the way that Johnson makes a quick read, makes his cut and explodes, it helps him greatly having such a good line opening the holes, but he is still the guy who sees them, reacts and then just blazes

holt_bruce81
11-12-2009, 07:56 PM
I don't care how little talent Steven Jackson has around him, he can't be called the best back in the league this season when we're half way through it and he has one total TD.

That doesn't matter. You see his team? total garbage. how he is 3rd in the league in rushing and 2nd in total yards is astonishing. Teams that play the Rams just stack up to stop him and they still can't do it. No way Marc Bulger and his 55.9 cmp%(26th in nfl) 10/27 in the redzone, or his 5.5 YPA(28th in NFL) Scares anyone. Heck since 2007 Marc Bulger has statistically been one of the worst starting Quarterback in the NFL. In that span Bulger ranks 39th among NFL quarterbacks in completion percentage, 42nd in yards per attempt and 40th in passer rating.

yo123
11-12-2009, 09:32 PM
That doesn't matter. You see his team? total garbage. how he is 3rd in the league in rushing and 2nd in total yards is astonishing. Teams that play the Rams just stack up to stop him and they still can't do it. No way Marc Bulger and his 55.9 cmp%(26th in nfl) 10/27 in the redzone, or his 5.5 YPA(28th in NFL) Scares anyone. Heck since 2007 Marc Bulger has statistically been one of the worst starting Quarterback in the NFL. In that span Bulger ranks 39th among NFL quarterbacks in completion percentage, 42nd in yards per attempt and 40th in passer rating.


It's not like Tennessee is much better.

LonghornsLegend
11-12-2009, 09:39 PM
That doesn't matter. You see his team? total garbage. how he is 3rd in the league in rushing and 2nd in total yards is astonishing. Teams that play the Rams just stack up to stop him and they still can't do it. No way Marc Bulger and his 55.9 cmp%(26th in nfl) 10/27 in the redzone, or his 5.5 YPA(28th in NFL) Scares anyone. Heck since 2007 Marc Bulger has statistically been one of the worst starting Quarterback in the NFL. In that span Bulger ranks 39th among NFL quarterbacks in completion percentage, 42nd in yards per attempt and 40th in passer rating.


I think you may be confused. What QB does Tennessee have that scares teams? What WR's? Your talking about Bulger like Collins and VY are great deep field passers that open up lanes for CJ.

niel89
11-12-2009, 11:06 PM
You added and extra 'o' to the title. It should read 'How god is Chris Johnson?'

JT Jag
11-13-2009, 09:44 AM
I have him at #2, still slightly behind AP

1. AP
2. CJ
3-5. Jackson, Gore, Williams
6. Turner
7. Brown
8. MJDMJD is way better than both Turner and Brown, and should be in that third category.

Chris Johnson is dominant. My question is this: How long can it last? Speed is the first thing to go for a player, and his style is such that just one major knee injury could totally wreck his career, even if he rehabs perfectly.

Shiver
11-13-2009, 10:20 AM
MJD is way better than both Turner and Brown, and should be in that third category.

Chris Johnson is dominant. My question is this: How long can it last? Speed is the first thing to go for a player, and his style is such that just one major knee injury could totally wreck his career, even if he rehabs perfectly.


Is it? He has Deion Sanders/Darrell Green speed. Even when he slows down by age he will still be one of the fastest players in the league, just like they were ten+ years into their career. You are right about the injury risk though.

LonghornsLegend
11-13-2009, 10:50 AM
Well then what isn't an injury risk? People say power runners don't last and are a big risk to injury or shortened career ie Earl Campbell, now people are saying speed runners are a big risk to injury and shortened careers. So the only way to avoid injury risk is to be an average speed timid runner who avoids contact?

senormysterioso
11-13-2009, 12:06 PM
MJD is way better than both Turner and Brown, and should be in that third category.

Chris Johnson is dominant. My question is this: How long can it last? Speed is the first thing to go for a player, and his style is such that just one major knee injury could totally wreck his career, even if he rehabs perfectly.

Speed isn't always the first thing to go, Darrell Green played into his 40's and still ran a 4.4 at the age of 40 or 41...granted that's not the 3.9-4.1 that he supposedly ran as a rookie but Chris Johnson can afford to loose a step or two and still be one of the fastest in the league.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-13-2009, 12:39 PM
Well then what isn't an injury risk? People say power runners don't last and are a big risk to injury or shortened career ie Earl Campbell, now people are saying speed runners are a big risk to injury and shortened careers. So the only way to avoid injury risk is to be an average speed timid runner who avoids contact?

Now that you mention it, Shaun Alexander was healthy for a pretty long time.

MetSox17
11-13-2009, 01:14 PM
Now that you mention it, Shaun Alexander was healthy for a pretty long time.

Then he completely fell off the face of the earth. He didn't even deteriorate slowly like most players do. He just went from being the best, to the worst.

Gay Ork Wang
11-13-2009, 02:28 PM
maybe it was.... THE OLINE? Shocking

TitanHope
11-13-2009, 02:31 PM
Well then what isn't an injury risk? People say power runners don't last and are a big risk to injury or shortened career ie Earl Campbell, now people are saying speed runners are a big risk to injury and shortened careers. So the only way to avoid injury risk is to be an average speed timid runner who avoids contact?

That's the key. You can't seek contact. Guys like Emmitt Smith took as few hits as possible, and it prolonged their careers.

Chris Johnson isn't a tiny little guy. He's 5'11, 200+ lbs - it's not like he's Darren Sproles. And he's so quick, it's hard to get a good shot on him. Most of the time you have to push him out of bounds or trip him up. He doesn't seek contact either. He's so much more than just fast too. He's got great vision, and very little wasted body movement. Even when his speed starts to diminish, which probably won't be for a while, all he'll have to do is become more patient as a runner and he'll still have success. Besides, what'll his 40-time be when he's entering his early 30's? A 4.38? He'll still have speed.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-13-2009, 02:34 PM
Then he completely fell off the face of the earth. He didn't even deteriorate slowly like most players do. He just went from being the best, to the worst.

Better to burn out than to fade away.

tuan33
11-13-2009, 03:04 PM
Better to burn out than to fade away.

That's definitely true. He went supernova instead of the Curtis Martin type of smothering out.

FUNBUNCHER
11-13-2009, 03:16 PM
Speed isn't always the first thing to go, Darrell Green played into his 40's and still ran a 4.4 at the age of 40 or 41...granted that's not the 3.9-4.1 that he supposedly ran as a rookie but Chris Johnson can afford to loose a step or two and still be one of the fastest in the league.

Actually, Darrell Green ran a mid 4.3 at the age of 40, what he really lost was his lateral quickness and change of direction of skills, no longer able to turn and run with the fastest WRs.

But I agree about Chris Johnson, even if he loses say, .15 seconds off his 40 over 10 years, you're still talking about a RB who runs a 4.40 flat. His biggest concern IMO is injury because he is not a big man.

Bucs_Rule
11-13-2009, 07:37 PM
With LT, the biggest drop in his abilities is losing his jump. He's quickness and ability to make very quick cuts and burst after that.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-13-2009, 07:45 PM
It's not like Tennessee is much better.

But Tennessee's offensive line is much better when it comes to both run blocking and pass blocking. Both teams have a similar number of passing attempts, but St. Louis has surrendered more than twice as many sacks and QB hits as Tennessee has.

CC.SD
11-13-2009, 08:27 PM
The only thing I don't like about Chris Johnson is that he is going to get a bunch of other track stars drafted very highly.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
11-13-2009, 08:48 PM
The only thing I don't like about Chris Johnson is that he is going to get a bunch of other track stars drafted very highly.

Hopefully by the Chargers.

LonghornsLegend
11-14-2009, 01:35 AM
maybe it was.... THE OLINE? Shocking

Some of his best plays are not even due to the blocking: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-plays/09000d5d813de841/WK-8-Can-t-Miss-Play-CJ-can-t-be-caught


He had to pick his hole, broke 2 tackles 1 of which was head on, and still outran everyone. Though you do have to give alot of credit to the guys up front because if they can get him 2 the second level it's over.



And while I was looking for that, stumbled across this video of him & Jamie Dukes I never saw before: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d812e3cfb/CJ-I-won-t-lay-down



LMAO. CJ owned Jamie Dukes, then he tried to back off of the remarks he made about him earlier in the week and switch it around. I never did like him, this is just one of the reasons why.

TitansCJftw
11-14-2009, 01:46 AM
i thought ork he was talking about shaun alexander...? feel free to clarify wang

Paranoidmoonduck
11-14-2009, 02:21 AM
Some of his best plays are not even due to the blocking: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-cant-miss-plays/09000d5d813de841/WK-8-Can-t-Miss-Play-CJ-can-t-be-caught


He had to pick his hole, broke 2 tackles 1 of which was head on, and still outran everyone. Though you do have to give alot of credit to the guys up front because if they can get him 2 the second level it's over.

Listen, there's no doubt that once Chris Johnson gets behind the linebackers (something he does very quickly), he's probably the most dangerous runner in the NFL right now. But to act like that run isn't a product of his offensive line, which has done a fantastic job of getting him to the second level this season, isn't strictly true. Johnson doesn't really pick a hole so much as take advantage of the fact that the right side of line cracked down on the Jags defense stupendously. Watch the last angle on that video. You'll see this...

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m249/paranoidmoonduck/CJ.jpg

Of course, Johnson just destroys both the corner's and safety's angles on him then shrugs off a really terribly head on tackle, but the offensive line (as well as receiver #85, Britt?) seal that edge with amazing effectiveness.

LonghornsLegend
11-14-2009, 09:51 AM
Listen, there's no doubt that once Chris Johnson gets behind the linebackers (something he does very quickly), he's probably the most dangerous runner in the NFL right now. But to act like that run isn't a product of his offensive line, which has done a fantastic job of getting him to the second level this season, isn't strictly true. Johnson doesn't really pick a hole so much as take advantage of the fact that the right side of line cracked down on the Jags defense stupendously. Watch the last angle on that video. You'll see this...

http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m249/paranoidmoonduck/CJ.jpg

Of course, Johnson just destroys both the corner's and safety's angles on him then shrugs off a really terribly head on tackle, but the offensive line (as well as receiver #85, Britt?) seal that edge with amazing effectiveness.



He only got 3 yards before he had to break a tackle, it's not like they sealed off an edge for him and he took that 45 yards clear and free....The job did a nice job, but the 2 tackles he broke were far more impressive. The line got him 3 yards, he made the 86 yards himself. Both defenders had a head on shot at him, without any blockers in sight.

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 12:26 PM
I'll still take Steven Jackson over anybody.

Great at running the ball, he's got the speed to beat you, the agility to go around you ( through air, juke, or spin ), and the power to got through you. He's got a great attitude, he wants to win and wants to help turn the Rams franchise around, he does nothing but the best for the community. He can catch the ball out of the backfield and take it some distance, he's getting pretty good at blocking. He's got great vision, he breaks more tackles than anyone I've seen. And he's doing this all with A) A terrible surrounding cast, B) 8 - 9 men in the box, C) Gameplans designed to stop him ONLY, we have no other threats, D) A losing team, E) ONE BACK SYSTEM ( He doesn't have someone to come in and spell him and keep the defense off guard ) F) OK offensive line.. It's hard to put up great numbers on a ****** team. Not to mention he fumbles very little, so he has great carrying ability.

And no one is going to tell me differently.

This being said, I have the upmost respect for the other running backs in the NFL.

1. Steven Jackson
2. Chris Johnson
3. Adrian Peterson
4. Frank Gore
5. Maurice Jones-Drew

scottyboy
11-14-2009, 12:40 PM
I'll still take Steven Jackson over anybody.

Great at running the ball, he's got the speed to beat you, the agility to go around you ( through air, juke, or spin ), and the power to got through you. He's got a great attitude, he wants to win and wants to help turn the Rams franchise around, he does nothing but the best for the community. He can catch the ball out of the backfield and take it some distance, he's getting pretty good at blocking. He's got great vision, he breaks more tackles than anyone I've seen. And he's doing this all with A) A terrible surrounding cast, B) 8 - 9 men in the box, C) Gameplans designed to stop him ONLY, we have no other threats, D) A losing team, E) ONE BACK SYSTEM ( He doesn't have someone to come in and spell him and keep the defense off guard ) F) OK offensive line.. It's hard to put up great numbers on a ****** team. Not to mention he fumbles very little, so he has great carrying ability.

And no one is going to tell me differently.

This being said, I have the upmost respect for the other running backs in the NFL.

1. Steven Jackson
2. Chris Johnson
3. Adrian Peterson
4. Frank Gore
5. Maurice Jones-Drew

I thought I smelled some fail...

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 12:42 PM
I thought I smelled some fail...
You still upset for me bad mouthing your "boy" Brian Leonard? Get over it. He was worthless in St. Louis.

dabears10
11-14-2009, 12:52 PM
You still upset for me bad mouthing your "boy" Brian Leonard? Get over it. He was worthless in St. Louis.

No, it is just that Adrian Peterson does most of what Steven Jackson can do but better.

MetSox17
11-14-2009, 12:55 PM
I'll still take Steven Jackson over anybody.

Great at running the ball, he's got the speed to beat you, the agility to go around you ( through air, juke, or spin ), and the power to got through you. He's got a great attitude, he wants to win and wants to help turn the Rams franchise around, he does nothing but the best for the community. He can catch the ball out of the backfield and take it some distance, he's getting pretty good at blocking. He's got great vision, he breaks more tackles than anyone I've seen. And he's doing this all with A) A terrible surrounding cast, B) 8 - 9 men in the box, C) Gameplans designed to stop him ONLY, we have no other threats, D) A losing team, E) ONE BACK SYSTEM ( He doesn't have someone to come in and spell him and keep the defense off guard ) F) OK offensive line.. It's hard to put up great numbers on a ****** team. Not to mention he fumbles very little, so he has great carrying ability.

And no one is going to tell me differently.

This being said, I have the upmost respect for the other running backs in the NFL.

1. Steven Jackson
2. Chris Johnson
3. Adrian Peterson
4. Frank Gore
5. Maurice Jones-Drew

Top to bottom, agreed.

If i'd disagree with anything i guess it would just be the rankings. I think you can put Jackson and Peterson at number one and not be wrong. I'm still skeptical about Chris Johnson.. i think he's great, but i don't think he's the best in the league right now. Not fully convinced yet.

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 01:15 PM
No, it is just that Adrian Peterson does most of what Steven Jackson can do but better.
He's got a great run blocking offensive line, that constantly gets him a cut back lane. Jackson doesn't.

scottyboy
11-14-2009, 01:20 PM
You still upset for me bad mouthing your "boy" Brian Leonard? Get over it. He was worthless in St. Louis.

first off, that's not about it at all, and of course he was worthless in St Louis. such an awful organization had no idea how to use him...or do anything else right for that matter, but that's besides the point.

Anyway, AD does what SJax does, but twice as good. And really, does everything to help the team win? Helps the community? I'm pretty sure almost EVERY RB does the first one, and helping the community a LOT of players do and has no impact on RB rankings at all. It's just you put a lot of reasoning to why SJax is a good RB, and we should say he's the best because he's putting up ok numbers on a **** team. I mean, AD did it with guys like Tavaris at QB throwing to virtually nobody.

yo123
11-14-2009, 01:31 PM
He's got a great run blocking offensive line, that constantly gets him a cut back lane. Jackson doesn't.



Facepalm. Our offensive line used to be great. It's now borderline top 10. Very borderline. And Steven Jackson over Peterson? You cannot be serious. I've seen some homerish things posted on here but that one may take the cake.

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 01:33 PM
first off, that's not about it at all, and of course he was worthless in St Louis. such an awful organization had no idea how to use him...or do anything else right for that matter, but that's besides the point.

Anyway, AD does what SJax does, but twice as good. And really, does everything to help the team win? Helps the community? I'm pretty sure almost EVERY RB does the first one, and helping the community a LOT of players do and has no impact on RB rankings at all. It's just you put a lot of reasoning to why SJax is a good RB, and we should say he's the best because he's putting up ok numbers on a **** team. I mean, AD did it with guys like Tavaris at QB throwing to virtually nobody.
It's hard to utilize any player when he can't get on the field isn't it?

Adrian Peterson does it twice as good? Are you serious?

Steven Jackson has 165 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 163 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 24 receptions for 186 yards and a 7.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 19 receptions for 189 yards and a 9.9 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.
Adrian Peterson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.

Almost even, however, Adrian Petersons receptions and yardage go to show that having a good surrounding helps you out a lot. Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Bernard Berrian, Visanthe Shiancoe , Brett Favre.

OR Donnie Avery, Keenan Burton, Randy McMichael, Daniel Fells, Marc Bulger.


Hmm.... Minnesota's surrounding cast is FAR superior to that of St. Louis. The offensive line comparison is a joke too, the only advantage St. Louis has is Jason Smith over Loadholt and Jason Brown over John Sullivan.

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 01:34 PM
Facepalm. Our offensive line used to be great. It's now borderline top 10. Very borderline. And Steven Jackson over Peterson? You cannot be serious. I've seen some homerish things posted on here but that one may take the cake.
I am serious, put Jackson on that team and he's doing amazing things.


In 2006 with a decent supporting cast, he had 2,300 total yards.

Call it homerism if you prefer, I call it an opinion.

yo123
11-14-2009, 01:36 PM
It's hard to utilize any player when he can't get on the field isn't it?

Adrian Peterson does it twice as good? Are you serious?

Steven Jackson has 165 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 163 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 24 receptions for 186 yards and a 7.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 19 receptions for 189 yards and a 9.9 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.
Adrian Peterson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.

Almost even, however, Adrian Petersons receptions and yardage go to show that having a good surrounding helps you out a lot. Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Bernard Berrian, Visanthe Shiancoe , Brett Favre.

OR Donnie Avery, Keenan Burton, Randy McMichael, Daniel Fells, Marc Bulger.


Hmm.... Minnesota's surrounding cast is FAR superior to that of St. Louis. The offensive line comparison is a joke too, the only advantage St. Louis has is Jason Smith over Loadholt and Jason Brown over John Sullivan.



Ok, I'll grant you that he's had a better first 8 games of the year, but look at the last two years too when Peterson had nothing around him and still put up better numbers than Jackson has this year.

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 01:37 PM
did you know stejax has only played 16 games once and hasnt competed in more than 12 games in the last 2 seasons, has a career average of 4.4 averages 7.5 total TD's a year. I mean dont get me wrong i love SJ but he hardly puts up lightyear numbers, doesnt have the durability you want from your feature back, has had one great season and the rest have been well less than youd expect from the number one running back on your list.

dont get me wrong SJ is a great RB but wow hes not the best at all

Paranoidmoonduck
11-14-2009, 01:38 PM
He only got 3 yards before he had to break a tackle, it's not like they sealed off an edge for him and he took that 45 yards clear and free....The job did a nice job, but the 2 tackles he broke were far more impressive. The line got him 3 yards, he made the 86 yards himself. Both defenders had a head on shot at him, without any blockers in sight.

Yes, the last tackler had a straight shot at him, but it was an awful tackle. The guy went in head down and left his feet. And the corner was semi-flat footed and didn't really get his tackle broken so much as Johnson making him miss.

And, once again, the only reason that Johnson only had to deal with 2 or 3 defenders on a run that long is because his offensive line took the other 8 completely out of the equation.

HawkeyeFan
11-14-2009, 01:39 PM
Ok, I'll grant you that he's had a better first 8 games of the year, but look at the last two years too when Peterson had nothing around him and still put up better numbers than Jackson has this year.
Steven Jackson played in 12 games last year, and 12 games the year before.

Arguing over Jackson and Peterson is frustrating, to a Rams fan, Jackson is #1, and to a Viking fan Peterson is #1. When in reality it's 1A/1B.

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 01:40 PM
Yes, the last tackler had a straight shot at him, but it was an awful tackle. The guy went in head down and left his feet. And the corner was semi-flat footed and didn't really get his tackle broken so much as Johnson making him miss.

And, once again, the only reason that Johnson only had to deal with 2 or 3 defenders on a run that long is because his offensive line took the other 8 completely out of the equation.

aside from that u have to do something right to have a 6.7 yard average

Paranoidmoonduck
11-14-2009, 01:43 PM
aside from that u have to do something right to have a 6.7 yard average

I'm really not trying to take something away from Chris Johnson. I have absolutely no problem saying he's been the best runner this year and is a stupendous player. In fact, it pains me that the one time the Raider don't pursue the fastest player in the draft, he turns out to be this good. But no runner can separate themselves from their offensive line's playing ability, and despite Tennessee's W/L record, their offensive line is playing like one of the best units in the NFL. That has been a huge factor in Johnson's success, period.

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 01:47 PM
I'm really not trying to take something away from Chris Johnson. I have absolutely no problem saying he's been the best runner this year and is a stupendous player. In fact, it pains me that the one time the Raider don't pursue the fastest player in the draft, he turns out to be this good. But no runner can separate themselves from their offensive line's playing ability, and despite Tennessee's W/L record, their offensive line is playing like one of the best units in the NFL. That has been a huge factor in Johnson's success, period.

Oh don't get me wrong I'm first to admit that the right side of our line is quite possibly the best run blocking side of the line in the NFL. David Stewart and Jake Scott are country boy maulers who love a fight with the DL. However impressively in the game against SF Leeroy Harris was our RT as Stewart was out, shows we have some depth. But I totally agree that if our O Line didn't get themselves out of the blocks the way they do he would not be as successful but still would be a contender for the rushing title.

Gay Ork Wang
11-14-2009, 01:51 PM
did you know stejax has only played 16 games once and hasnt competed in more than 12 games in the last 2 seasons, has a career average of 4.4 averages 7.5 total TD's a year. I mean dont get me wrong i love SJ but he hardly puts up lightyear numbers, doesnt have the durability you want from your feature back, has had one great season and the rest have been well less than youd expect from the number one running back on your list.

dont get me wrong SJ is a great RB but wow hes not the best at all

sorry totally offtopic, but what are lightyear numbers?

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 01:53 PM
call it a poor british way of saying really really really high

eg carries 300, yards 1800, 6.0 avg, 20td's

....pretty much, you dont have to achieve all that to have "lightyear" numbers but it has to be a very good statistical season

Gay Ork Wang
11-14-2009, 01:54 PM
im just wondering since light years = distance, so i didnt make sense to me one way or the other. Its like saying: he has mile numbers

scottyboy
11-14-2009, 01:59 PM
It's hard to utilize any player when he can't get on the field isn't it?

Adrian Peterson does it twice as good? Are you serious?

Steven Jackson has 165 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 163 carries for 784 yards and a 4.8 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 24 receptions for 186 yards and a 7.8 yard average.
Adrian Peterson has 19 receptions for 189 yards and a 9.9 yard average.
Steven Jackson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.
Adrian Peterson has 2 fumbles, 2 lost.

Almost even, however, Adrian Petersons receptions and yardage go to show that having a good surrounding helps you out a lot. Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Bernard Berrian, Visanthe Shiancoe , Brett Favre.

OR Donnie Avery, Keenan Burton, Randy McMichael, Daniel Fells, Marc Bulger.


Hmm.... Minnesota's surrounding cast is FAR superior to that of St. Louis. The offensive line comparison is a joke too, the only advantage St. Louis has is Jason Smith over Loadholt and Jason Brown over John Sullivan.

i said DID, as in I'm talking about in the past when it was Tavaris Jackson and Bobby Wade. Last year peterson was ridiculous with a VERY meh team around him.

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 01:59 PM
fair enough but then you can look at lightyears as something very big in a way, even though its strictly distance, personally speaking

scottyboy
11-14-2009, 02:01 PM
Facepalm. Our offensive line used to be great. It's now borderline top 10. Very borderline. And Steven Jackson over Peterson? You cannot be serious. I've seen some homerish things posted on here but that one may take the cake.

but he wrote a lot and it's his opinion so he's right and it's not homerish, a duh. you dumb vikings homer

and child please, MJD is better than SJax, throwing that out there.

FUNBUNCHER
11-14-2009, 03:39 PM
Steven Jackson played in 12 games last year, and 12 games the year before.

Arguing over Jackson and Peterson is frustrating, to a Rams fan, Jackson is #1, and to a Viking fan Peterson is #1. When in reality it's 1A/1B.

Yeah, I can't imagine there are two more similar backs in the NFL. Sure you give AD the edge in long speed, maybe quickness, but otherwise they are two of the best big/power running backs in the league.

CC.SD
11-14-2009, 03:48 PM
The other day I was driving through Minnesota and saw Stephen Jackson rooting through Adrian Peterson's trash, true story.

Jvig43
11-14-2009, 03:51 PM
AD is the best running back in the league, even if his numbers are down because Farve is throwing a ton.

Shane P. Hallam
11-14-2009, 03:54 PM
Steven Jackson is a great runner, but to me he isn't a Top 3 RB. No matter the team around you, I just want more consistency from him. He doesn't break off big runs, and just isn't as complete a player as AD or Tennesspeed.

stephenson86
11-14-2009, 03:55 PM
Steven Jackson is a great runner, but to me he isn't a Top 3 RB. No matter the team around you, I just want more consistency from him. He doesn't break off big runs, and just isn't as complete a player as AD or Tennesspeed.

incredible

Saints-Tigers
11-14-2009, 03:59 PM
Steven Jackson played in 12 games last year, and 12 games the year before.

Arguing over Jackson and Peterson is frustrating, to a Rams fan, Jackson is #1, and to a Viking fan Peterson is #1. When in reality it's 1A/1B.


Umm, no, that's going to be a VERY small minority that believes that.

LonghornsLegend
11-14-2009, 04:02 PM
Umm, no, that's going to be a VERY small minority that believes that.

I was just thinking the same thing, I think Steven Jackson is a very good back but I don't know about 1A/1B with Peterson.

Gay Ork Wang
11-14-2009, 04:10 PM
haha Jbond has been trying to get it out there since last year. He uses it all the time on IRC

Shane P. Hallam
11-14-2009, 04:13 PM
haha Jbond has been trying to get it out there since last year. He uses it all the time on IRC

You can't tell me it is not a good nickname! Before next season, I am tweeting it to Chris Johnson every day until he acknowledges me!

TitanHope
11-14-2009, 04:18 PM
You can't tell me it is not a good nickname! Before next season, I am tweeting it to Chris Johnson every day until he acknowledges me!

Pocket Rocker is betta'! :D

Gay Ork Wang
11-14-2009, 04:19 PM
i like it, is cool, no one else uses it though haha so long

senormysterioso
11-14-2009, 04:23 PM
I'm kind of upset he wasn't more committed to making Every Coaches Dream happen. It's a stupid nickname but it would have been funny to hear him insist people call him that.

Bengalsrocket
11-14-2009, 04:28 PM
Rofl how can Steven Jackson be #1 or #2?????


The guy didn't even go to Rutgers, which is automatic #3 from the get go:

Leonard
Rice
Peterson
Gore
Jackson


imo.

Paranoidmoonduck
11-14-2009, 04:31 PM
I think Steven Jackson gets pretty damn close to cracking the top 3 for me. He's going to make it 5 straight seasons over 1000 barring injury, and he's done it for a team that hasn't had a single winning season since he's been there. And while Chris Johnson has racked up over 70% of his rushing total in just 4 games this season, Jackson has managed to be a little more consistent. Moreover, Johnson's production after his 20th carry falls off the table (something that doesn't happen with either Peterson or Jackson).

Guys like Jackson and Frank Gore are realistically just a consistent offense and a stretch of healthy seasons away from being recognized for the excellent talents they are. They have both managed quite impressive consistency despite injuries and lackluster offenses and it's hard to compare them to guys like Johnson and Peterson who are just beginning their NFL careers (both with good support from their offensive lines) and haven't had to deal with the issues that runners face the longer they play in the NFL.

edit -

I really don't buy Jackson has being a less complete player than AD or Johnson. He's a great receiver for his size and a really good blocker. Peterson's made good strides in the passing game this year, but it's not like he's surpassed Jackson or anything.

Also, on the tone of Johnson's inconsistency, over 45% of his rushing yardage has come on just 7 of his 144 carries. In those 7 carries, he's averaging about 64 YPC. The other 137 carries he's averaging 3.7 YPC.

Rosebud
11-14-2009, 04:43 PM
AD's clearly the best in the league, but after him I don't know how anyone can definitively argue against CJ, Gore, Stephen Jackson, MJD, Ahmad Bradshaw (or as you commonly refer to him Ray Rice) or even Brian Westbrook if you want ignore his injury-proneness.

Rosebud
11-14-2009, 04:56 PM
I think something else that gets lost in the discussion of these guys' supporting casts is their defenses. Stephen Jackson has had a terrible defense which means his team is playing from behind most of the time. That is a lot more damaging to the production of a guy like SJ than a big play runner like Chris Johnson or AD. Add to that that AD has always had at least a solid defense and CJ had a great defense before this season and that discussion starts to tip things in AD and Gore's favors. As I said a lot of these guys have cases why they deserve to be ranked very highly, although I do think AD is on another level because of how insanely dominant he has already shown he can be.

Bengalsrocket
11-14-2009, 04:58 PM
AD's clearly the best in the league, but after him I don't know how anyone can definitively argue against CJ, Gore, Stephen Jackson, MJD, Ahmad Bradshaw (or as you commonly refer to him Ray Rice) or even Brian Westbrook if you want ignore his injury-proneness.


For me, I agree Adrian Peterson is the number 1 league in the back, Gore and Jackson have both had consistent production (Even Jackson who is always injured still put up 1,000 yards in his last four seasons).

Chris Johnson is young still, but thus far is having one of the best seasons ever by a running back. And MJD is amazing with both his running ability and his special teams plays (though I guess he's not the returner any more since he's had to take the number 1 spot).

Lastly Rice has more than double the amount of receiving yards than each of them, along with an impressive running game (though he doesn't have that many carries).

They've all been impressive, that's for sure. I'm looking forward to seeing if any of them can split off from the pack and really separate themselves in terms of definition.

LonghornsLegend
11-14-2009, 05:01 PM
You can't tell me it is not a good nickname! Before next season, I am tweeting it to Chris Johnson every day until he acknowledges me!

Which name?

Bengalsrocket
11-14-2009, 05:01 PM
I think something else that gets lost in the discussion of these guys' supporting casts is their defenses. Stephen Jackson has had a terrible defense which means his team is playing from behind most of the time. That is a lot more damaging to the production of a guy like SJ than a big play runner like Chris Johnson or AD. Add to that that AD has always had at least a solid defense and CJ had a great defense before this season and that discussion starts to tip things in AD and Gore's favors. As I said a lot of these guys have cases why they deserve to be ranked very highly, although I do think AD is on another level because of how insanely dominant he has already shown he can be.

Well, Jackson still has more carries than any of them (even AP, 165 to 163). Though I'm going to assume that Chester Taylor takes more carries away from AP than whoever is sitting behind Jackson takes away from him.

Gay Ork Wang
11-14-2009, 05:17 PM
Which name?
Tennesspeed

LonghornsLegend
11-14-2009, 06:02 PM
Tennesspeed

I thought that won a voting contest is where that name came from, I heard it used on some different sites, but really never knew where it got started lol.

Saints-Tigers
11-14-2009, 06:11 PM
Don't get me wrong, I'd have no real problem with someone thinking Jackson is top 3, or even number 2, but he's not 1a/1b with Peterson.

CC.SD
11-14-2009, 06:42 PM
Arguing over Jackson and Peterson is frustrating, to a Rams fan, Jackson is #1, and to a Viking fan Peterson is #1. When in reality it's 1A/1B.

Nobody is actually having this argument though, so I bet it's not all that frustrating.

TitanHope
11-14-2009, 07:35 PM
I thought that won a voting contest is where that name came from, I heard it used on some different sites, but really never knew where it got started lol.

I think it was a vote, but it was done by some random writer. I forget who.

Titans fans just call him CJ.

I've referred to him as "Twitch" a couple of times, but that has less to do with his quick-twitch muscles as it does him having compulsive ticks - if you see him play, you'll see his head bob routinely.

irishbucsfan
11-14-2009, 07:45 PM
I like Chris Johnson he is a cool guy and doesnt afraid of anything

TitanHope
11-15-2009, 02:47 AM
According to Football Outsiders:

Tennessee's OL: 22nd in Run-Blocking, 3rd in Pass-Blocking
Minnesota's OL: 19th in Run-Blocking, 21st in Pass-Blocking
St. Louis's OL: 13th in Run-Blocking, 14th in Pass-Blocking
Jacksonville's OL: 12th in Run-Blocking, 24th in Pass-Blocking

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/ol

Interesting to see how much the Top 4 RB's OL's performances could be attributed for their success.

I also think run-blocking is the most overplayed excuse for a RB in the league, but that's really not the point I guess.

DeepThreat
11-15-2009, 10:58 AM
I'd like to point out that Joe Thomas and Eric Steinbach give the Browns the 3rd best run blocking left side.

holt_bruce81
11-15-2009, 06:20 PM
Rofl how can Steven Jackson be #1 or #2?????


The guy didn't even go to Rutgers, which is automatic #3 from the get go:

Leonard
Rice
Peterson
Gore
Jackson


imo.

scottyboy do you have 2 Screen names? Or does this guy have a man crush on you?

TitanHope
11-15-2009, 06:51 PM
Chris Johnson today:
24 carries, 132 yards, 5.1 YPC, Long of 32, 2 TD's, and 0 Fumbles.
9 catches, 100 yards, 11.1 YPC, Long of 17, 0 TD's, and 0 Fumbles.

33 touches, 232 total yards, 7 Yards Per Touch, 2 Total TD's, and 0 Fumbles.


Season (9 Games):
170 carries, 1,091 yards, 6.4 YPC, 8 TD's, and 1 Fumble.
30 catches, 262 yards, 8.7 YPC, 1 TD, and 0 Fumbles.

200 touches, 1,353 total yards, 6.8 Yards Per Touch, 9 Total TD's, and 1 Fumble.


Last Season (15 Games):

251 carries, 1,228 yards, 4.9 YPC, 9 TD's, and 1 Fumble.
43 catches, 260 yards, 6.0 YPC, 1 TD, and 0 Fumbles.

294 touches, 1,488 total yards, 5.1 Yards Per Touch, 10 Total TD's, and 1 Fumble.


CJ is the 3rd RB in Titans/Oilers history to have back-to-back 1,000+ yard rushing seasons in their first 2 seasons (Earl Campbell, Eddie George).

CJ also leads the NFL in Yards After Contact, according to the CBS Post Game crew.

Bengalsrocket
11-15-2009, 07:19 PM
scottyboy do you have 2 Screen names? Or does this guy have a man crush on you?

Leonard is the man, gotta represent the Rutger's love for him and Scottyboy.

tjsunstein
11-15-2009, 07:24 PM
I has Chris Johnson in fantasyzz.