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Splat
12-10-2009, 05:41 PM
JaMarcus won't consider a pay cut (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/10/jamarcus-wont-consider-a-pay-cut/)

When asked about possibly reworking his contract.

"Oh, no. That's over and done with. I don't even consider that as a part of it," Russell said.

Russell was asked what Gradkowski was doing well:

"Now it's just all around. Guys are just making plays around him," Russell said. "In the Dallas game after you go out and win in Cincinnati there weren't plays really made the whole game, you know what I mean.

"Going into Pittsburgh, guys were making plays for him. That's what a quarterback needs, his surrounding players. That's what was going on."

This was Russell's response when asked to grade his performance this year:

"Uh, kind of hard because there was times where you try to get guys a chance to make plays and at the early part of the year, it wasn't happening. So the quarterback job, I say he looks for more help around from everybody because he can't do it himself. It wasn't so well, but at times it was. When we look at film, it don't be as bad as it seems on the field always."

But he promises a different player when he gets back on the field.

"A totally different JaMarcus. People going to have their opinion, and I really don't pay too much attention to that. I worry about JaMarcus and JaMarcus only."

djp
12-10-2009, 05:42 PM
JaMarcus won't consider a pay cut (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/12/10/jamarcus-wont-consider-a-pay-cut/)

When asked about possibly reworking his contract.

"Oh, no. That's over and done with. I don't even consider that as a part of it," Russell said.

Russell was asked what Gradkowski was doing well:

"Now it's just all around. Guys are just making plays around him," Russell said. "In the Dallas game after you go out and win in Cincinnati there weren't plays really made the whole game, you know what I mean.

"Going into Pittsburgh, guys were making plays for him. That's what a quarterback needs, his surrounding players. That's what was going on."

This was Russell's response when asked to grade his performance this year:

"Uh, kind of hard because there was times where you try to get guys a chance to make plays and at the early part of the year, it wasn't happening. So the quarterback job, I say he looks for more help around from everybody because he can't do it himself. It wasn't so well, but at times it was. When we look at film, it don't be as bad as it seems on the field always."

But he promises a different player when he gets back on the field.

"A totally different JaMarcus. People going to have their opinion, and I really don't pay too much attention to that. I worry about JaMarcus and JaMarcus only."

This is like one of those Madden Superstar interviews where you just feel like being the biggest douchebag possible.

vikes_28
12-10-2009, 05:45 PM
:rolleyes: Russell is just making excuses now. It also seems like a classic case of team giving up on quarterback.

Splat
12-10-2009, 05:46 PM
"I worry about JaMarcus and JaMarcus only"

That is a QB saying that it just blows my mind.

Damix
12-10-2009, 05:47 PM
I really don't have an issue with anything he said.

JFLO
12-10-2009, 06:01 PM
If I knew that I was a complete bust in the NFL, I wouldn't want to restructure my contract for less money either :)

TitanHope
12-10-2009, 06:08 PM
The fact that guys are playing harder for the other QB and making plays for him when they didn't for you should speak volumes to JaMarcus...probably won't get through that head of his, though.

No way he's gonna restructure his deal though. He'll probably think he'll be able to get a job elsewhere if they threaten to cut him.

Gay Ork Wang
12-10-2009, 06:22 PM
I really don't have an issue with anything he said.
me neither. in his position id prolly say the same.

CC.SD
12-10-2009, 06:23 PM
This kid is a tard.

RealityCheck
12-10-2009, 06:24 PM
The best deal would be Oakland trading him to someone who needs a future QB. Minnesota and Carolina?

Bengalsrocket
12-10-2009, 06:33 PM
"I worry about JaMarcus and JaMarcus only"

That is a QB saying that it just blows my mind.

That is really the only part of the interview that seemed bad to me.

I mean the whole interview was clearly just Jamarcus awkwardly dodging the interviewers subtle question of he believes he is a bust or not, but I didn't read any of it thinking that he was dumb or answered poorly even, except that last line.

BandwagonPunditry
12-10-2009, 06:36 PM
JaMarcus won't consider a pay cut

Ah, the Larry Johnson school of football economics.

vidae
12-10-2009, 06:38 PM
This is like one of those Madden Superstar interviews where you just feel like being the biggest douchebag possible.

Haha I thought the EXACT same thing when I read that. Hilarious.

Splat
12-10-2009, 06:41 PM
The best deal would be Oakland trading him to someone who needs a future QB. Minnesota and Carolina?

I think he would still have to take a pay cut no one is going to want him with that kinda deal.

wogitalia
12-10-2009, 06:41 PM
I worry about JaMarcus and JaMarcus only."

The funny thing is that you could have just posted that line and it would have completely summed up the rest of what he said.

Basically... It's not my fault, it was the other guys, who now are trying for Bruce and weren't for me.

Pathetic loser attitude he is showing there. I think this interview pretty much cements that he will be out of this league within 4 years, doesn't have the attitude you want sitting on your bench and hasn't shown the ability to start, just not worth a lazy, overweight cancer in your locker room if they aren't going to be stars.

wogitalia
12-10-2009, 06:43 PM
That is really the only part of the interview that seemed bad to me.

The rest of it just feels like him passing the blame, sure there were some drops on his watch(no more than their have been since he was benched), he was missing wide open guys, that isn't his team mates fault.

RealityCheck
12-10-2009, 06:48 PM
I think he would still have to take a pay cut no one is going to want him with that kinda deal.
Yeah, somebody has to tell Big JaMarc how football and money work together.

Bucs_Rule
12-10-2009, 06:54 PM
The best deal would be Oakland trading him to someone who needs a future QB. Minnesota and Carolina?

His contract is way too big. No team would be willing to pay him anything close to what he's currently making.

CC.SD
12-10-2009, 06:59 PM
Honestly I don't know how anyone could feel bad for Jamarcus, I could complete some of the throws he misses by 5+ yards. No accuracy whatsoever, he is just a big kid hucking it. Move him to the OL and get it over with.

EvilNixon
12-10-2009, 07:00 PM
This is like one of those Madden Superstar interviews where you just feel like being the biggest douchebag possible.

lmaoooo

He needs to be cut even if the year is capped. He's not even a below average QB.

LonghornsLegend
12-10-2009, 07:06 PM
This is like one of those Madden Superstar interviews where you just feel like being the biggest douchebag possible.

AHahhaahahhaaha x10000.


That pretty much summed up my feelings after reading that, nice call.


He doesn't even talk like a QB, or a leader, I wouldn't want anything to do with this guy, he just doesn't get it.

LonghornsLegend
12-10-2009, 07:14 PM
I really don't have an issue with anything he said.




me neither. in his position id prolly say the same.



He couldn't even man up and say Gradkowski was playing better. It's kinda hard for surrounding players to make plays when you can't accurately get the play-makers the ball. Plus you don't see anything wrong with not wanting to restructure your deal after playing like the worst starting QB in years?


Alex Smith manned up and took a pay cut no problem and look how well he's playing now. He's making it seem like nobody helped him out, but everyone is magically helping out Gradkowski, it's common sense.


A decent QB makes the team better, you can't expect anyone to contribute when your throwing balls all over the damn place. Maybe these answers would be ok for a WR, people expect that kinda crap, but for a QB who hasn't done ****, won't accept he's played horribly, and still wants to be one of the highest players in the league I question what you guys even expect from a QB then.

Gay Ork Wang
12-10-2009, 07:17 PM
no because if i was jamarcus, id try to get as much money as possible. im not saying i dont see anything wrong from any other perspective, but as a really bad player myself, i wouldnt go out there, let them give me less money if i could have more. its not like he will ever gain that kind of money ever again.

i mean if i was someone with job security or something, yes lets restructure. not when im jamarcus russel and prolly never gonna get a chance to get that kind of money ever again

NOLAFan
12-10-2009, 07:17 PM
While he isn't gonna make bank with another team, i am willing to bet my left nut some team takes him and that he is better than he is in Oakland.

Idc what people thoughts of him are, being stuck in Oakland is the worse possible thing for a QB. You have almost no chance to succeed. Grad...whatever his name is playing better than Russel and its because he knows the team sucks ass, so whatever he does is no big deal

RaiderNation
12-10-2009, 07:24 PM
He has been saying this **** the whole year. Blaiming this, blaiming that. He never says" oh I had a bad game", he blaims others. He is a me player, not a team player. Maybe if your accurate the WR's can make a play for you

619
12-10-2009, 07:31 PM
He has been saying this **** the whole year. Blaiming this, blaiming that. He never says" oh I had a bad game", he blaims others. He is a me player, not a team player. Maybe if your accurate the WR's can make a play for you

Thank you.

To sum it up in his words,

"JaMarcus is where he is because of JaMarcus"

Nothing else needs to be said. Don't give me this BS about your poor supporting cast. Maybe if you learned your damn playbook we could've opened up the playbook 100X more so you wouldn't have to play in what closely resembled to a HS offense. This is the kinda stuff that makes me think he is on his way to Ryan Leaf bust status.

RaiderNation
12-10-2009, 07:35 PM
If his supporting cast is so bad, how is a career back up going into games right now and beating good teams? Truth is JaMarcus is horrible and cares about getting his money than his team, as in Gradkowski is a leader and wants to win.

619
12-10-2009, 07:38 PM
If his supporting cast is so bad, how is a career back up going into games right now and beating good teams? Truth is JaMarcus is horrible and cares about getting his money than his team, as in Gradkowski is a leader and wants to win.

JaMarcus is the classic example of a pro athlete not giving a **** when he finally gets paid millions. Forget the work ethic, just look at his weight issues, which he admitted to in training camp.

EvilNixon
12-10-2009, 07:40 PM
He needs to be cut with cap or not,then watch him become good elsewhere.

619
12-10-2009, 07:43 PM
He needs to be cut with cap or not,then watch him become good elsewhere.

It will not happen. There are some players out there who will never get what it takes to be successful, and he is one of them. Best he ever becomes is an above average QB based only on his talent, which alone can't get you anywhere in Oakland.

EvilNixon
12-10-2009, 07:50 PM
It will not happen. There are some players out there who will never get what it takes to be successful, and he is one of them. Best he ever becomes is an above average QB based only on his talent, which alone can't get you anywhere in Oakland.

We picked him at the wrong time. We don't have a line to protect him and only 1 reliable receiver.

He can be good,but he has to change his attitude,which may come when he's a cheeseburger from being out of the league.

Crickett
12-10-2009, 07:50 PM
He needs to be cut with cap or not,then watch him become good elsewhere.

Having watched him play against the Jets and the Giants, I would be shocked if he became good anywhere else.

From what I've seen, if Jamarcus Russell entered one of those halftime football throwing contests like the one they had during the SEC championship halftime game......... he would lose.

LonghornsLegend
12-10-2009, 07:55 PM
The whole "well look what's around him" argument is certainly true, but come on, who here thinks Gradkowski is really all that good? So it's ok to blame the surrounding talent on JR failing yet Gradkowski can come in and instantly make that exact same supporting cast beat Pittsburgh and Cincy?


Please.


It's time to stop making excuses, if he doesn't care, or try, or push himself to be a better player he never will be. At this point nobody should be bringing up the WR's, or the line, or Raiders organization as an excuse for him performing poorly. Gradkowski isn't even a starting caliber QB yet somehow took those same pieces to beat playoff caliber teams in the few weeks he's played.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-10-2009, 08:56 PM
Just cut him lose and be done with it.

He's only got 3 million left in guarantees, last I checked. If he doesn't want to make less than 9 million next season to ride the bench, then let him earn the vet's minimum on some other team.

Brent
12-10-2009, 09:11 PM
let him earn the vet's minimum on some other team.
who's going to sign that whale?

Malaka
12-10-2009, 09:13 PM
who's going to sign that whale?

The Lions could use a LT to replace Jeff Backus.

aNYtitan
12-10-2009, 10:16 PM
Ah JaMarcus, how much talent you had and how pitifully you used it through your laziness. I hope you get cut this offseason and wind up taking a 1 year deal or something. Does any reconstructing team take a chance on this guy and hope he can turn it around instead of getting a veteran or a QB via the draft?

Jvig43
12-10-2009, 10:48 PM
He has been saying this **** the whole year. Blaiming this, blaiming that. He never says" oh I had a bad game", he blaims others. He is a me player, not a team player. Maybe if your accurate the WR's can make a play for you

This guy really amazes me that some team took him from the draft, let alone the number one pick. I hope he has invested his money the right way because he wont be playing in this league much longer.

Are the Raiders officially done with the guy?

jimmylishis
12-10-2009, 11:37 PM
The best deal would be Oakland trading him to someone who needs a future QB. Minnesota and Carolina?

yea but I don't want to give up our 1st rounders for the next 3 years. thats just what hes worth just ask JaMarcus, JaMarcus will tell you how much JaMarcus is worth.

Job
12-11-2009, 12:12 AM
I didn't feel like clicking the subscribe button in the thread tools, so I'll just post here and bring nothing to the discussion so it's done automatically.

Shiver
12-11-2009, 12:15 AM
Why would he? At this point he doesn't have much a future and he knows it. If I were him I would do the same thing. What incentive does he have to accept a pay cut? If the Raiders didn't want to pay him they shouldn't have taken the huge chance by drafting him.

Crickett
12-11-2009, 12:19 AM
If I were him I would do the same thing. What incentive does he have to accept a pay cut?


Possibly staying in the league a few extra years?

diabsoule
12-11-2009, 12:20 AM
Possibly staying in the league a few extra years?

Whoever gets him should know they have a project on their hands. He has zero pocket presence, stares down his wide receivers, has zero leadership skills, and can't think fast enough to save his life.

RaiderNation
12-11-2009, 12:28 AM
Whoever gets him should know they have a project on their hands. He has zero pocket presence, stares down his wide receivers, has zero leadership skills, and can't think fast enough to save his life.

I agree he still pretty much a rookie right now, guys like Matt Ryan arnt really learning how to play in the NFL right now, JaMarcus just shows up and does his thing. Puts his stupid beanie on and sits on the sidelines with some skittles in his pocket while he watches what a real QB should do. If I were Cable I just would just look him in the eye and say do you want to be here. If he says no Id say go home since your not helping us in anyway

Crickett
12-11-2009, 12:39 AM
Whoever gets him should know they have a project on their hands. He has zero pocket presence, stares down his wide receivers, has zero leadership skills, and can't think fast enough to save his life.

You forgot inaccurate too.

MetSox17
12-11-2009, 03:55 AM
He was the longest holdout in his draft because he wasn't getting enough money, is anyone really surprised that he won't take a pay-cut?

Paranoidmoonduck
12-11-2009, 04:01 AM
Why would he? At this point he doesn't have much a future and he knows it. If I were him I would do the same thing. What incentive does he have to accept a pay cut? If the Raiders didn't want to pay him they shouldn't have taken the huge chance by drafting him.

Well, because making somewhat less than 12 million dollars is conceivably more attractive than making 3 million and being out of a job.

Saints-Tigers
12-11-2009, 05:55 AM
I remember when JaMarcus used to be accurate. Apparently JaMarcus hasn't seen the regression in his own game.

Hell, if his game were exactly where it were last year, he'd be better than he is now and better than Gradkowski.

I've not seen a QB regress that much at a young age in... ever?

regoob2
12-11-2009, 07:52 AM
He needs to be cut yesterday.

Trying to read what he said out loud was very hard. Guys a moron.

General Zod
12-11-2009, 10:04 AM
Hey, its not his fault that Crazy Al will open up the bank for any player that can throw far and run fast. :-)

bigbluedefense
12-11-2009, 11:26 AM
I hated him before he got drafted. I can't say I saw this coming (I didn't think he'd be this terrible), but I knew he was going to suck.

He's the biggest bust since Ryan Leaf. Its not even a question anymore. His actions this year have officially stamped that envelope.

adamprez2003
12-11-2009, 12:10 PM
no because if i was jamarcus, id try to get as much money as possible. im not saying i dont see anything wrong from any other perspective, but as a really bad player myself, i wouldnt go out there, let them give me less money if i could have more. its not like he will ever gain that kind of money ever again.

i mean if i was someone with job security or something, yes lets restructure. not when im jamarcus russel and prolly never gonna get a chance to get that kind of money ever again unfortunately i agree. This is the most money this guy is ever going to see. After his contract runs out or he's cut he goes on the Jeff George road tour to every team that has a QB Coach that wants a shot at coaching up this guy. He'll still make a million a year based on unrealized potential but never the kind of money he made in that original contract. Although, if he actually works at his craft by the time he's 29 maybe he'll start to be serviceable

CC.SD
12-11-2009, 12:19 PM
Soon Jamarcus is going to disappear, and be found in a few years tied up in Jon Gruden's basement.

Abaddon
12-11-2009, 12:23 PM
That is really the only part of the interview that seemed bad to me.

I mean the whole interview was clearly just Jamarcus awkwardly dodging the interviewers subtle question of he believes he is a bust or not, but I didn't read any of it thinking that he was dumb or answered poorly even, except that last line.

So...making excuse after excuse, and refusing to give the new starting QB even a little credit for the team's success...that doesn't strike you as a little weak? Wow.

Russell hasn't changed since he got to Oakland, other than to become a worse version of himself. He's a bum with no sense of personal accountability. He can't be cut loose soon enough.

Crickett
12-11-2009, 01:05 PM
He's the biggest bust since Ryan Leaf. Its not even a question anymore. His actions this year have officially stamped that envelope.

QFT. I don't think he can reach Ryan Leaf's level without some kind of major legal infraction or at least 2 on camera incidents, but he's closer than Tim Couch, David Carr or Alex Smith ever got imo.

CC.SD
12-11-2009, 01:15 PM
QFT. I don't think he can reach Ryan Leaf's level without some kind of major legal infraction or at least 2 on camera incidents, but he's closer than Tim Couch, David Carr or Alex Smith ever got imo.

Every player just mentioned was a #1 overall pick except Ryan, and none of them did anything. Absolute zero. Just saying.

Crickett
12-11-2009, 01:21 PM
Every player just mentioned was a #1 overall pick except Ryan, and none of them did anything. Absolute zero. Just saying.

That's the point. None of them ever did anything. They didn't try to get the franchise player arrested. They didn't read apologies to a national audience off of a cue card in his hand. They didn't snap at fans or reporters. At least not on camera.

Bengalsrocket
12-11-2009, 01:25 PM
So...making excuse after excuse, and refusing to give the new starting QB even a little credit for the team's success...that doesn't strike you as a little weak? Wow.

Russell hasn't changed since he got to Oakland, other than to become a worse version of himself. He's a bum with no sense of personal accountability. He can't be cut loose soon enough.

I'm just using empathy here. Put yourself in his shoes and then ask yourself, would you admit to being a failure in a public interview?

I'm not saying he is correct, or that he said the right things. I'm just saying I understand where he's coming from when he said all of that (except the final line where he said he was only thinking about himself).

As much as we would all like to think that would could stand in front of the lights and give an honest evaluation of ourselves, it's a lot harder when you actually have to do it, and I don't blame him for not stepping up at this point in his life.

CC.SD
12-11-2009, 01:37 PM
That's the point. None of them ever did anything. They didn't try to get the franchise player arrested. They didn't read apologies to a national audience off of a cue card in his hand. They didn't snap at fans or reporters. At least not on camera.

That's true, and don't get me wrong if I saw Ryan on the street I would shiv him and walk away whistling, but none of those things made him any worse on the field than the #1 busts. Ultimately each of their teams cut ties having gained de nada, same as Ryan. Except Ryan was a #2 overall. So the idea that he is a bigger bust doesn't quite compute for me.

Again, I would like to reemphasize that I still would like to stab him.

The Great Jonathan Vilma
12-11-2009, 02:49 PM
I'm sure someone else mentioned it, but if I were in his situation I wouldn't restructure my deal either, knowing that I won't be getting another contract and i'd be basically giving away money. He needs to get what he can while he can, because odds are its all he's getting. Too bad he's too damn stupid to know what to do with it while he has it and will be one of those broke athletes by his 30's.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-11-2009, 03:02 PM
I'm sure someone else mentioned it, but if I were in his situation I wouldn't restructure my deal either, knowing that I won't be getting another contract and i'd be basically giving away money. He needs to get what he can while he can, because odds are its all he's getting. Too bad he's too damn stupid to know what to do with it while he has it and will be one of those broke athletes by his 30's.

Except that restructuring his contract might keep him from being cut, which will almost certainly mean less money in the end.

Brent
12-11-2009, 03:04 PM
Soon Jamarcus is going to disappear, and be found in a few years tied up in Jon Gruden's basement.
I would have said "eating a Golden Corral out of business"

The Great Jonathan Vilma
12-11-2009, 03:06 PM
I'm just using empathy here. Put yourself in his shoes and then ask yourself, would you admit to being a failure in a public interview?

I'm not saying he is correct, or that he said the right things. I'm just saying I understand where he's coming from when he said all of that (except the final line where he said he was only thinking about himself).

As much as we would all like to think that would could stand in front of the lights and give an honest evaluation of ourselves, it's a lot harder when you actually have to do it, and I don't blame him for not stepping up at this point in his life.

I agree with what your saying, however he didn't take the correct route around the subject. There were a few different paths, and he chose the dark one that went downhill rather than take the high road and assume some of the blame.

Saints-Tigers
12-11-2009, 05:02 PM
He's not as big a bust as Ryan Leaf, because he wasn't looked at as that great of a prospect.

Russell went first because he had a big arm, and the Raiders needed a QB, not because he was a Leaf/Manning level prospect.

LonghornsLegend
12-11-2009, 07:00 PM
If nobody has a problem with what JR said or how he handled the situation you should take notice of how Alex Smith went at it:


Smith was due to make nearly $10 million in the upcoming season under the deal that he signed in 2005. The 49ers now have Smith under contract for the next two years at a salary more commensurate with his four up-and-down years with the team, although the exact details of the deal weren't disclosed.


"I don't measure myself in my contract in terms of what I'm making," said Smith, who missed most of the past two seasons because of arm injuries. "Having gone through what I've gone through the last couple of years, and being on the sideline, I guess I've got a different perspective on this game. When it came time to restructure the contract, it wasn't anything to do with ego. I just wanted the chance to compete."


http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d80f2d0ba&template=without-video-with-comments&confirm=true



I understand the whole concept of he doesn't have to, and he'll never make that type of money again, but this says a whole lot about the type of character and player you are. He's a QB, it's a position where you shouldn't want to be all about yourself and as selfish as possible.



This speaks volumes to me about the type of player he is, and how he just doesn't get it. It doesn't sound like someone who is supposed to lead an entire team, again it's not like he's a WR or CB or RB who can act like this and still do his job, he's supposed to have a team rally around him. Comments like those just doesn't sound like he's got any chance to be a starter again.

Iamcanadian
12-11-2009, 08:23 PM
If he's cut, Oakland still has to pay the guaranteed part of his contract and then another team will pick him up to see what a solid organization with a good HC can make of him. Plenty of me first players become stars in the NFL or get picked up and change when they get on a winning team. See Dillion and Moss. In fact quite a few NFL teams will be anxious to find out if they can motivate him. Oakland couldn't motivate Moss and Cincy couldn't motivate Dillion but in NE they had no problem getting motivated playing for a winning organization under a great HC.
Sure, he'll take a pay cut with whichever team he signs with but if he surprises, he won't be low paid for too long.

CC.SD
12-11-2009, 08:44 PM
If he's cut, Oakland still has to pay the guaranteed part of his contract and then another team will pick him up to see what a solid organization with a good HC can make of him. Plenty of me first players become stars in the NFL or get picked up and change when they get on a winning team. See Dillion and Moss. In fact quite a few NFL teams will be anxious to find out if they can motivate him. Oakland couldn't motivate Moss and Cincy couldn't motivate Dillion but in NE they had no problem getting motivated playing for a winning organization under a great HC.
Sure, he'll take a pay cut with whichever team he signs with but if he surprises, he won't be low paid for too long.

I am honestly surprised the discussion has started up about Jamarcus' future in the nfl. I mean, this kid is bad. He's so, so bad.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-11-2009, 08:57 PM
If he's cut, Oakland still has to pay the guaranteed part of his contract and then another team will pick him up to see what a solid organization with a good HC can make of him. Plenty of me first players become stars in the NFL or get picked up and change when they get on a winning team. See Dillion and Moss. In fact quite a few NFL teams will be anxious to find out if they can motivate him. Oakland couldn't motivate Moss and Cincy couldn't motivate Dillion but in NE they had no problem getting motivated playing for a winning organization under a great HC.
Sure, he'll take a pay cut with whichever team he signs with but if he surprises, he won't be low paid for too long.

Only difference is that Moss and Dillon had already been very successful in terms of production before they made it to winning teams. Very very successful.

Russell has been supplanted by Bruce Gradkowski. Slight difference.

Monomach
12-11-2009, 09:23 PM
The best deal would be Oakland trading him to someone who needs a future QB. Minnesota and Carolina?

If I were a Minny fan, I'd rather Tavaris Jackson start than Russell.

In fact, I think Jackson is underrated, anyway.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2009, 01:16 AM
Only difference is that Moss and Dillon had already been very successful in terms of production before they made it to winning teams. Very very successful.

Russell has been supplanted by Bruce Gradkowski. Slight difference.

Only Moss played for the dysfunctional organization called Oakland and the best he could do there is ride the bench. So is it the organization or is it Russell??? There will be probably 31 teams willing to take him on to find out. It is hard enough for a young QB to succeed in the NFL so don't tell me playing in the asylum of Al Davis with his 'yes sir' coaching staff couldn't had a very negative effect on Russell.

As for Dillion, he was called a Cancer in Cincy, a player nobody wanted, especially nobody in Cincy, yet as soon as he changed teams, nobody ever mentioned those traits again, he suddenly became motivated and turned into a real team player.
IMO, it is ridiculous to write off Russell coming from the Oakland mess. Now I wouldn't offer him a huge contract, it would probably be filled with bonus clauses for reaching certain goals with a million base for 1 year with an option year attached, but I would definitely make every effort to sign him, after all, 2 HC's that Al Davis deemed failures, Shanahan and Gruden went on to win numerous Super Bowls, whose to say that the change of scenery wouldn't have the same results with Russell.
I'm sure everybody on this site wrote off Vince Young and Alex Smith and they have moved on to be starters in this league. I remember Giant fans and many other football fans ridicule Eli after 3 years on the job.
Russell has immense physical potential, now that doesn't guarantee his mental approach won't keep him from reaching it, but wouldn't you like to see him on another franchise besides Oakland, to see how he reacts to the change, I certainly would.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-12-2009, 03:27 AM
Only Moss played for the dysfunctional organization called Oakland and the best he could do there is ride the bench. So is it the organization or is it Russell??? There will be probably 31 teams willing to take him on to find out. It is hard enough for a young QB to succeed in the NFL so don't tell me playing in the asylum of Al Davis with his 'yes sir' coaching staff couldn't had a very negative effect on Russell.

Um, Moss never "rode the bench" in Oakland. He started 28 out of the 29 games he played in Oakland and put up over 1000 yards his first year there. Granted, he totally crapped out on the team in 2006, something that still gets me a bit frustrated, but he gave out well after the offense was already one of the worst to take the field in the last few decades of football.

As for Dillon, he was arguably one of the most consistent and dynamic runners in the NFL with the Bengals.

There is a world of difference between being a great player with a bad attitude on a bad team and being a bad player with a bad attitude on a bad team. Moss and Dillon were the former, Russell has done absolutely nothing to prove he's not the latter. In fact, Russell has done nothing to prove that he's even willing to pretend like he cares, much less put in the work necessary to become a starting quarterback in the NFL.

I'm not saying that he doesn't get signed somewhere else. I'm saying that I can't imagine he'll find success anywhere, and using great players like Dillon and Moss as some sort of example is disingenuous.

RealityCheck
12-12-2009, 09:57 AM
QFT. I don't think he can reach Ryan Leaf's level without some kind of major legal infraction or at least 2 on camera incidents, but he's closer than Tim Couch, David Carr or Alex Smith ever got imo.
Alex Smith is proving he's NOT a bust right now.

bearsfan_51
12-12-2009, 10:26 AM
While he isn't gonna make bank with another team, i am willing to bet my left nut some team takes him and that he is better than he is in Oakland.

Idc what people thoughts of him are, being stuck in Oakland is the worse possible thing for a QB. You have almost no chance to succeed. Grad...whatever his name is playing better than Russel and its because he knows the team sucks ass, so whatever he does is no big deal
I'm dumber for having read this.

Brent
12-12-2009, 11:02 AM
I'm dumber for having read this.

Rich Gannon sucked in Oakland, remember that loser? Wait...

Iamcanadian
12-12-2009, 01:20 PM
Um, Moss never "rode the bench" in Oakland. He started 28 out of the 29 games he played in Oakland and put up over 1000 yards his first year there. Granted, he totally crapped out on the team in 2006, something that still gets me a bit frustrated, but he gave out well after the offense was already one of the worst to take the field in the last few decades of football.

As for Dillon, he was arguably one of the most consistent and dynamic runners in the NFL with the Bengals.

There is a world of difference between being a great player with a bad attitude on a bad team and being a bad player with a bad attitude on a bad team. Moss and Dillon were the former, Russell has done absolutely nothing to prove he's not the latter. In fact, Russell has done nothing to prove that he's even willing to pretend like he cares, much less put in the work necessary to become a starting quarterback in the NFL.

I'm not saying that he doesn't get signed somewhere else. I'm saying that I can't imagine he'll find success anywhere, and using great players like Dillon and Moss as some sort of example is disingenuous.

I'm not saying he will find success either but a lot of teams will be lined up to find out if he can succeed in a better situation. Most people in football are at the point that they just shake their head when Oakland is mentioned, after all, Davis cannot hire a decent HC any longer after what he did to Shanahan and Gruden and maybe Kiffen as well. The young bright minds he once used to find, no longer will even interview for the HCing position, his drafts have taken on an eerie feeling. Al was once one of the great minds in pro football, his record speaks for itself, but he has grown old and proved he is incapable of relinquishing any authority leaving every decision to this old man.
He drafted a very young QB who is obviously a bit immature and stuck him in this mess with no real leadership to guide the kid. Davis told the HC to play him, I'm sure Cable would have liked to bring him along slowly but Al calls all the shots and he said play him come h-ll or high water. Russell is stuck in the middle between an owner who is likely out of touch with the current NFL, living on his past successes, refusing to step aside and let his authority pass to the younger generation, and a HC who only has his job because he obeys Davis's every command and likely resents having no say about his own team. Under the same conditions Kiffen tried something like a 73 yard FG just to piss the old man off.
This franchise is simply dead in the water barely afloat. Into this mess comes a rookie QB, maybe he has real talent, maybe he doesn't, but he has to perform in this traveling circus. All of a sudden, he performs badly, maybe its his fault maybe it is the organization's fault, but he is getting blamed for the whole mess. Tell me, is he likely to grow in these circumstances or is it more likely at his age, that he will be completely confused about the whole situation.
That raises the question, can any young QB succeed into this dysfunctional organization. The answer is I don't know but if I'm a NFL GM, I would sure like to find out for myself how he would do in a stable situation under a solid coaching staff and IMO, that is the opportunity he will get somewhere down the road. Then it is all up to him to put his career back on track or not.
All I know is this guy was a top 5 prospect in his draft year no matter what some people claim around here who have probably hated Ryan, Young and many of the top rookie QB's who were drafted. That means most GM's and scouts loved Russell's potential. I'm prepared to wait it out before I give my final judgment. You obviously have made yours and that is fine, we'll just have to wait to see how the situation plays itself out. I'm certainly not saying your wrong in your opinion just maybe a little hasty.

Saints-Tigers
12-12-2009, 02:46 PM
As much as I've stuck up for JaMarcus and blamed a lot of the woes on the franchise, he has to be held accountable for his regression in his throwing accuracy.

I suppose it doesn't help your confidence when you come out, and the first pass of the season bricks off someone's hands.

Really though, he went from a guy that had a pretty good TD/INT ratio for such a young guy without any receivers around him(13:8 I believe?) to a guy that was overthrowing swing passes and completing 35% of his passes.

Was his confidence destroyed? You can blame that, but ultimately, you have to keep your composure, or the best you can ever be is a decent QB when the team has a ton of talent.

I'm still just perplexed by his accuracy woes. I mean, decision making, maturity, weight fluctuations, those were all question marks anyway, and him never improving on that shows his work ethic, but he used to be able to put the football anywhere he wanted with a flick of the wrist.

Gradkowski is a guy who is confident and swaggalicious no matter how ****** up things get, he's been on ****** up teams before..... Those kind of guys can help you overachieve a little sometimes, but ultimately it's a stop gap.

I'd like to see Russell go somewhere else, or see if someone can mold him. Alex Smith is showing out now, but Russell was better last year than Smith ever was prior to this season, IMO.

McBain
12-13-2009, 01:28 AM
Yeah, somebody has to tell Big JaMarc how football and money work together.

boooom reality check jamarcus russell. you've just been reality checked jamarcus russell now deal with like a man.... in reality.

diabsoule
12-13-2009, 02:00 AM
As much as I've stuck up for JaMarcus and blamed a lot of the woes on the franchise, he has to be held accountable for his regression in his throwing accuracy.

I suppose it doesn't help your confidence when you come out, and the first pass of the season bricks off someone's hands.

Really though, he went from a guy that had a pretty good TD/INT ratio for such a young guy without any receivers around him(13:8 I believe?) to a guy that was overthrowing swing passes and completing 35% of his passes.

Was his confidence destroyed? You can blame that, but ultimately, you have to keep your composure, or the best you can ever be is a decent QB when the team has a ton of talent.

I'm still just perplexed by his accuracy woes. I mean, decision making, maturity, weight fluctuations, those were all question marks anyway, and him never improving on that shows his work ethic, but he used to be able to put the football anywhere he wanted with a flick of the wrist.

Gradkowski is a guy who is confident and swaggalicious no matter how ****** up things get, he's been on ****** up teams before..... Those kind of guys can help you overachieve a little sometimes, but ultimately it's a stop gap.

I'd like to see Russell go somewhere else, or see if someone can mold him. Alex Smith is showing out now, but Russell was better last year than Smith ever was prior to this season, IMO.

Did you just call The Bruce Gradkowski a stop gap? I think you did. Well let me tell you something about "Badass" Bruce Gradkowski...

When he was growing up on the mean streets of Pittsburgh, PA he was always picked last to play football with the other kids. Most of the time that would destroy a kid's confidence but no, not Bruce. See, Bruce was a special guy. There was nothing friendly when he was on the playground because Bruce doesn't play. Playground? **** that. That's a warground and Bruce is always prepared for battle. When the starting quarterback on his flag football team went down, Bruce got in there and unleashed hell. Even as a tyke he possessed a laser, rocket arm and could deliver the football with pin-point accuracy.

One day after school, the high school football coach saw him throwing footballs twenty yards downfield at a makeshift target. You know what he was throwing at? A pack of gum, Juicy Fruit, and hitting it every time. Coach walked up to him and said "hey, kid, you should play football. We need a QB with that kind of arm." Ya know what Bruce said "**** yeah. Wanna piece of gum?"

That's the kind of kid Bruce Gradkowski is. Swagger. Style. Grace. 6'1", 220lbs, of real deal sex appeal. A lot of famous quarterbacks are from the area he's from. Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Joe Namath, Johnny Unitas. You know what sets Bruce apart? Two things: 1) His name's not Joe. It's Bruce, ya'heard? 2) He wiped his ass with their records. That high school record set by Dan Marino? Yeah, he broke that. Crushed that **** just like he crushes that ass at his crib.

While he was at Toledo, he had to start his sophomore year? Psh, no biggie. Know what Bruce did? He set a record. He set a Mid-American Conference season record by completing 71.2% of his passes. He threw for 3,210 yards, with a school season record of 29 touchdowns and 7 interceptions and a final passer rating of 161.53. You know what? There is no thing as a 161.53 passer rating. They had to set a new number because Bruce breaks records.

Finally, it's his time to shine and just like in grade school, he was picked close to last. This time Tampa Bay picks him in the 6th round. But ya know what? That wasn't a challenge for him. Tampa Bay? Too easy to turn around. Next stop on the Grad train, St. Louis? Psh. Too easy. The Grad-man needs a challenge. Off to Cleveland? He started the last game of the season for Cleveland afterward the Browns cut him. Was it because he sucked? No. He was a threat to Brady Quinn. Finally, Bruce chose the Raiders. Did Al Davis find this phenom waiting to be unleashed? No. Bruce called the Raiders and said "Do you want a Super Bowl?" So, now he's on the Raiders. He came to Oaktown to wave his balls around and make bitches swoon. While he's doing that he's also going to win some games because THE Bruce Gradkowski makes things happen.

Washington, Denver, Cleveland, Baltimore... Get ready. Hide your women. Stay late for practice. Study film over and over because the Polish Cannon is getting ready to jizz all over your defenses.

EvilNixon
12-13-2009, 02:09 AM
Did you just call The Bruce Gradkowski a stop gap? I think you did. Well let me tell you something about "Badass" Bruce Gradkowski...

When he was growing up on the mean streets of Pittsburgh, PA he was always picked last to play football with the other kids. Most of the time that would destroy a kid's confidence but no, not Bruce. See, Bruce was a special guy. There was nothing friendly when he was on the playground because Bruce doesn't play. Playground? **** that. That's a warground and Bruce is always prepared for battle. When the starting quarterback on his flag football team went down, Bruce got in there and unleashed hell. Even as a tyke he possessed a laser, rocket arm and could deliver the football with pin-point accuracy.

One day after school, the high school football coach saw him throwing footballs twenty yards downfield at a makeshift target. You know what he was throwing at? A pack of gum, Juicy Fruit, and hitting it every time. Coach walked up to him and said "hey, kid, you should play football. We need a QB with that kind of arm." Ya know what Bruce said "**** yeah. Wanna piece of gum?"

That's the kind of kid Bruce Gradkowski is. Swagger. Style. Grace. 6'1", 220lbs, of real deal sex appeal. A lot of famous quarterbacks are from the area he's from. Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Joe Namath, Johnny Unitas. You know what sets Bruce apart? Two things: 1) His name's not Joe. It's Bruce, ya'heard? 2) He wiped his ass with their records. That high school record set by Dan Marino? Yeah, he broke that. Crushed that **** just like he crushes that ass at his crib.

While he was at Toledo, he had to start his sophomore year? Psh, no biggie. Know what Bruce did? He set a record. He set a Mid-American Conference season record by completing 71.2% of his passes. He threw for 3,210 yards, with a school season record of 29 touchdowns and 7 interceptions and a final passer rating of 161.53. You know what? There is no thing as a 161.53 passer rating. They had to set a new number because Bruce breaks records.

Finally, it's his time to shine and just like in grade school, he was picked close to last. This time Tampa Bay picks him in the 6th round. But ya know what? That wasn't a challenge for him. Tampa Bay? Too easy to turn around. Next stop on the Grad train, St. Louis? Psh. Too easy. The Grad-man needs a challenge. Off to Cleveland? He started the last game of the season for Cleveland afterward the Browns cut him? Was it because he sucked? No. He was a threat to Brady Quinn. Finally, Bruce chose the Raiders. Did Al Davis find this phenom waiting to be unleashed? No. Bruce called the Raiders and said "Do you want a Super Bowl?" So, now he's on the Raiders. He came to Oaktown to wave his balls around and make bitches swoon. While he's doing that he's also going to win some games because THE Bruce Gradkowski makes things happen.

This pretty much sums up what Bruce The God Gradkowski is about.

DoughBoy
12-13-2009, 02:51 AM
Did you just call The Bruce Gradkowski a stop gap? I think you did. Well let me tell you something about "Badass" Bruce Gradkowski...

When he was growing up on the mean streets of Pittsburgh, PA he was always picked last to play football with the other kids. Most of the time that would destroy a kid's confidence but no, not Bruce. See, Bruce was a special guy. There was nothing friendly when he was on the playground because Bruce doesn't play. Playground? **** that. That's a warground and Bruce is always prepared for battle. When the starting quarterback on his flag football team went down, Bruce got in there and unleashed hell. Even as a tyke he possessed a laser, rocket arm and could deliver the football with pin-point accuracy.

One day after school, the high school football coach saw him throwing footballs twenty yards downfield at a makeshift target. You know what he was throwing at? A pack of gum, Juicy Fruit, and hitting it every time. Coach walked up to him and said "hey, kid, you should play football. We need a QB with that kind of arm." Ya know what Bruce said "**** yeah. Wanna piece of gum?"

That's the kind of kid Bruce Gradkowski is. Swagger. Style. Grace. 6'1", 220lbs, of real deal sex appeal. A lot of famous quarterbacks are from the area he's from. Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Joe Namath, Johnny Unitas. You know what sets Bruce apart? Two things: 1) His name's not Joe. It's Bruce, ya'heard? 2) He wiped his ass with their records. That high school record set by Dan Marino? Yeah, he broke that. Crushed that **** just like he crushes that ass at his crib.

While he was at Toledo, he had to start his sophomore year? Psh, no biggie. Know what Bruce did? He set a record. He set a Mid-American Conference season record by completing 71.2% of his passes. He threw for 3,210 yards, with a school season record of 29 touchdowns and 7 interceptions and a final passer rating of 161.53. You know what? There is no thing as a 161.53 passer rating. They had to set a new number because Bruce breaks records.

Finally, it's his time to shine and just like in grade school, he was picked close to last. This time Tampa Bay picks him in the 6th round. But ya know what? That wasn't a challenge for him. Tampa Bay? Too easy to turn around. Next stop on the Grad train, St. Louis? Psh. Too easy. The Grad-man needs a challenge. Off to Cleveland? He started the last game of the season for Cleveland afterward the Browns cut him. Was it because he sucked? No. He was a threat to Brady Quinn. Finally, Bruce chose the Raiders. Did Al Davis find this phenom waiting to be unleashed? No. Bruce called the Raiders and said "Do you want a Super Bowl?" So, now he's on the Raiders. He came to Oaktown to wave his balls around and make bitches swoon. While he's doing that he's also going to win some games because THE Bruce Gradkowski makes things happen.

I canz sig quotez this thing without being infracted?

diabsoule
12-13-2009, 03:07 AM
I canz sig quotez this thing without being infracted?

The whole thing is a bit too big too sig quote but take your favorite sentence and sig quote it.

619
12-13-2009, 09:03 AM
how the hell did he get past interviews?

Al doesn't care. The biggest red flag for me that I could remember was at the combine. I don't remember him doing ANYTHING, though someone could correct me if I'm wrong. That's when I knew there was potential risk involved with him. I will admit I bought into hype after the bowl game, but as the process went along I started clamoring for CJ, like most other fans.

Raider_fan_Canada
12-13-2009, 10:18 AM
Al doesn't care. The biggest red flag for me that I could remember was at the combine. I don't remember him doing ANYTHING, though someone could correct me if I'm wrong. That's when I knew there was potential risk involved with him. I will admit I bought into hype after the bowl game, but as the process went along I started clamoring for CJ, like most other fans.

Well to be fair top QBs usualy dont do much. He could just ride the hipe and go #1 overall. Agents tend to suggest these kids they should not take a risk in that situation. He did everything at his pro day and he was great (unfortunately).

The problem at the combine was showing up overwheight! Then he pushes himself to be in great shape for the pro day, gets picked #1 overall, holded out for his money, got it and could not care less from that point. After signing he came in overwheight again and played yo-yo ever since. This year it's been specialy atrocious. He was so fat in OTAs you could not make any excuse anymore. It was just an obvious disaster.

Crickett
12-13-2009, 12:24 PM
Did you just call The Bruce Gradkowski a stop gap? I think you did. Well let me tell you something about "Badass" Bruce Gradkowski...

When he was growing up on the mean streets of Pittsburgh, PA he was always picked last to play football with the other kids. Most of the time that would destroy a kid's confidence but no, not Bruce. See, Bruce was a special guy. There was nothing friendly when he was on the playground because Bruce doesn't play. Playground? **** that. That's a warground and Bruce is always prepared for battle. When the starting quarterback on his flag football team went down, Bruce got in there and unleashed hell. Even as a tyke he possessed a laser, rocket arm and could deliver the football with pin-point accuracy.

One day after school, the high school football coach saw him throwing footballs twenty yards downfield at a makeshift target. You know what he was throwing at? A pack of gum, Juicy Fruit, and hitting it every time. Coach walked up to him and said "hey, kid, you should play football. We need a QB with that kind of arm." Ya know what Bruce said "**** yeah. Wanna piece of gum?"

That's the kind of kid Bruce Gradkowski is. Swagger. Style. Grace. 6'1", 220lbs, of real deal sex appeal. A lot of famous quarterbacks are from the area he's from. Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Joe Namath, Johnny Unitas. You know what sets Bruce apart? Two things: 1) His name's not Joe. It's Bruce, ya'heard? 2) He wiped his ass with their records. That high school record set by Dan Marino? Yeah, he broke that. Crushed that **** just like he crushes that ass at his crib.

While he was at Toledo, he had to start his sophomore year? Psh, no biggie. Know what Bruce did? He set a record. He set a Mid-American Conference season record by completing 71.2% of his passes. He threw for 3,210 yards, with a school season record of 29 touchdowns and 7 interceptions and a final passer rating of 161.53. You know what? There is no thing as a 161.53 passer rating. They had to set a new number because Bruce breaks records.

Finally, it's his time to shine and just like in grade school, he was picked close to last. This time Tampa Bay picks him in the 6th round. But ya know what? That wasn't a challenge for him. Tampa Bay? Too easy to turn around. Next stop on the Grad train, St. Louis? Psh. Too easy. The Grad-man needs a challenge. Off to Cleveland? He started the last game of the season for Cleveland afterward the Browns cut him. Was it because he sucked? No. He was a threat to Brady Quinn. Finally, Bruce chose the Raiders. Did Al Davis find this phenom waiting to be unleashed? No. Bruce called the Raiders and said "Do you want a Super Bowl?" So, now he's on the Raiders. He came to Oaktown to wave his balls around and make bitches swoon. While he's doing that he's also going to win some games because THE Bruce Gradkowski makes things happen.

Washington, Denver, Cleveland, Baltimore... Get ready. Hide your women. Stay late for practice. Study film over and over because the Polish Cannon is getting ready to jizz all over your defenses.

You cannot give Reputation to the same post twice

A Perfect Score
12-13-2009, 12:28 PM
Did you just call The Bruce Gradkowski a stop gap? I think you did. Well let me tell you something about "Badass" Bruce Gradkowski...

When he was growing up on the mean streets of Pittsburgh, PA he was always picked last to play football with the other kids. Most of the time that would destroy a kid's confidence but no, not Bruce. See, Bruce was a special guy. There was nothing friendly when he was on the playground because Bruce doesn't play. Playground? **** that. That's a warground and Bruce is always prepared for battle. When the starting quarterback on his flag football team went down, Bruce got in there and unleashed hell. Even as a tyke he possessed a laser, rocket arm and could deliver the football with pin-point accuracy.

One day after school, the high school football coach saw him throwing footballs twenty yards downfield at a makeshift target. You know what he was throwing at? A pack of gum, Juicy Fruit, and hitting it every time. Coach walked up to him and said "hey, kid, you should play football. We need a QB with that kind of arm." Ya know what Bruce said "**** yeah. Wanna piece of gum?"

That's the kind of kid Bruce Gradkowski is. Swagger. Style. Grace. 6'1", 220lbs, of real deal sex appeal. A lot of famous quarterbacks are from the area he's from. Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Joe Namath, Johnny Unitas. You know what sets Bruce apart? Two things: 1) His name's not Joe. It's Bruce, ya'heard? 2) He wiped his ass with their records. That high school record set by Dan Marino? Yeah, he broke that. Crushed that **** just like he crushes that ass at his crib.

While he was at Toledo, he had to start his sophomore year? Psh, no biggie. Know what Bruce did? He set a record. He set a Mid-American Conference season record by completing 71.2% of his passes. He threw for 3,210 yards, with a school season record of 29 touchdowns and 7 interceptions and a final passer rating of 161.53. You know what? There is no thing as a 161.53 passer rating. They had to set a new number because Bruce breaks records.

Finally, it's his time to shine and just like in grade school, he was picked close to last. This time Tampa Bay picks him in the 6th round. But ya know what? That wasn't a challenge for him. Tampa Bay? Too easy to turn around. Next stop on the Grad train, St. Louis? Psh. Too easy. The Grad-man needs a challenge. Off to Cleveland? He started the last game of the season for Cleveland afterward the Browns cut him. Was it because he sucked? No. He was a threat to Brady Quinn. Finally, Bruce chose the Raiders. Did Al Davis find this phenom waiting to be unleashed? No. Bruce called the Raiders and said "Do you want a Super Bowl?" So, now he's on the Raiders. He came to Oaktown to wave his balls around and make bitches swoon. While he's doing that he's also going to win some games because THE Bruce Gradkowski makes things happen.

Washington, Denver, Cleveland, Baltimore... Get ready. Hide your women. Stay late for practice. Study film over and over because the Polish Cannon is getting ready to jizz all over your defenses.

I think you are mistaking Bruce Gradkowski for a different, sexier QB, whose name rhymes with Brossman...Just sayin, Sexy Rexy is gunna bounce back better then ever.

diabsoule
12-13-2009, 03:15 PM
I think you are mistaking Bruce Gradkowski for a different, sexier QB, whose name rhymes with Brossman...Just sayin, Sexy Rexy is gunna bounce back better then ever.

Who do you think Bruce was tutored bye? Little known story: After the Sex Cannon was drafted by Chicago, he traveled to Toledo for their spring game during Gradkowski's sophomore year. They went out in downtown Toledo, drank a few bars out of business, and left a trail of women in their wake that weren't able to walk straight for a week. That night, Toledo's Finest Polish Cannon was born and that year he would go on to set MAC records and school records. Also, nine months after the Sex Cannon came to town Toledo saw a spike in the birth rate.

True story.

Komp
12-14-2009, 01:28 PM
What can the Polish Cannon do with torn MCL's in both knees you ask? Your mom and your sister....thats what he can do....

Stash
12-14-2009, 10:49 PM
The Charlie Frye era has begun! Hide your women!

619
12-14-2009, 10:51 PM
The Charlie Frye era has begun! Hide your women!

Anyone defending JaMarcus please GTFO. If this doesn't tell you all you need to know, then I don't know what will.

Charlie ******* Frye. 'Nuff said.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-14-2009, 11:51 PM
Anyone defending JaMarcus please GTFO. If this doesn't tell you all you need to know, then I don't know what will.

Charlie ******* Frye. 'Nuff said.

Yeah? He still led the offense to three more yards in the second half against Washington than Chris Simms could. Jamarcus Russell is like Peyton Manning compared to Chris ******* Simms.

RaiderNation
12-15-2009, 12:49 AM
If we start Frye this week, Im pretty sure Russell's days in Oakland are done. Hopefully Frye can be somewhat better than Russell to keep JaFatass on the bench. I say we go into the offseason saying Gradkowski is our guy, and draft a QB in the 3rd(where we have 2 picks anyways). Maybe Tony Pike catches Al's eye and he takes him.

619
12-15-2009, 12:54 AM
If we start Frye this week, Im pretty sure Russell's days in Oakland are done. Hopefully Frye can be somewhat better than Russell to keep JaFatass on the bench. I say we go into the offseason saying Gradkowski is our guy, and draft a QB in the 3rd(where we have 2 picks anyways). Maybe Tony Pike catches Al's eye and he takes him.

That's the perfect plan! That's what I wanted us to do even before Gradkowski went down this week. Someone really good is going to drop, and Pike could be a good candidate to be that guy. We'll have to see how things play out.

Jvig43
12-15-2009, 01:23 AM
No offense intended but do you guys really expect your team to make intelligent decisions come draft day with Al Davis still running the show?

RaiderNation
12-15-2009, 01:27 AM
No offense intended but do you guys really expect your team to make intelligent decisions come draft day with Al Davis still running the show?

There is 4 1/2 monthes before the draft starts, Al can die in that time

Jvig43
12-15-2009, 01:36 AM
There is 4 1/2 monthes before the draft starts, Al can die in that time

I lol'd. The heyward pick still has me confused.

CC.SD
12-15-2009, 01:39 AM
I lol'd. The heyward pick still has me confused.

Sad to say but there are many, many people who called that pick far in advance. Al's craziness has gotten predictable, that's when you know it's time to hang em up.

Jvig43
12-15-2009, 01:42 AM
Sad to say but there are many, many people who called that pick far in advance. Al's craziness has gotten predictable, that's when you know it's time to hang em up.

I missed the first bit of the draft but someone called me and told me they got heyward bey over Crabtree, and I couldnt even bring myself to laugh. I'm sorry Raider fans :(

CC.SD
12-15-2009, 01:46 AM
I missed the first bit of the draft but someone called me and told me they got heyward bey over Crabtree, and I couldnt even bring myself to laugh. I'm sorry Raider fans :(

In retrospect even drafting a WR was a crap decision. After so, so many misses can someone please just get Al to draft a blue chipper? Maybe the ceiling won't be as high but please just remove some of the risk from the equation. Picking that high, they need to stick to the can't-miss type prospects from now on, like Robert Gallery :) . And they need to make this next one count due to the Seymour trade, oy.

BTW if Seymour walks somehow, that's Al Davis' worst move by far. I know they can still franchise him but if he makes it clear he won't be a long term Raider, it's pointless.

RaiderNation
12-15-2009, 02:11 AM
BTW if Seymour walks somehow, that's Al Davis' worst move by far. I know they can still franchise him but if he makes it clear he won't be a long term Raider, it's pointless.

Seymour isnt going anywhere. He will atleast be franchised once or twice. Probably end up like Nnamdi and be franchised enough to just say alright I will sign a long term deal. He has said in the past he was a raider fan growing up so you never know

Paranoidmoonduck
12-15-2009, 03:10 AM
Yeah, I'd be shocked if Seymour isn't franchised.

Bucs_Rule
12-15-2009, 10:57 AM
You don't trade a first round pick to have a player for just one season.

Splat
12-15-2009, 11:22 AM
You don't trade a first round pick to have a player for just one season.

Most teams wouldn't this is Al Davis we are talking about.

diabsoule
12-15-2009, 11:36 AM
Most teams wouldn't this is Al Davis we are talking about.

http://bullmurph.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/al.png

Bucs_Rule
12-15-2009, 07:03 PM
Most teams wouldn't this is Al Davis we are talking about.

In the past he has shown if he really wants to sign a player he will pay them whatever they want.

I don't think his ego would allow him to leave. If he does he'd be admitting he made a horrendous move.

It is true with Davis you can never know for sure, except with drafting workout warriors.

Splat
12-17-2009, 12:51 PM
Oakland Raiders trying to get rid of JaMarcus Russell? (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Oakland-Raiders-trying-to-get-rid-of-JaMarcus-Ru?urn=nfl,209478)

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 12:54 PM
I still want to know why Al thought Jamarcus was even remotely comparable to Elway. Does anyone else remember this coming out around the draft? He missed his chance for John and saw some redemption potential in Russell. errr....

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 12:57 PM
We're still talking about this?

Russell sucked 5 pages ago guys. Nothing has changed since then.

49ersfan_87
12-17-2009, 12:57 PM
Oakland Raiders trying to get rid of JaMarcus Russell? (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Oakland-Raiders-trying-to-get-rid-of-JaMarcus-Ru?urn=nfl,209478)

He's not even the worst starting QB in the NFL, he's probably the worst backup too. He's awful and won't accept a pay cut. I'd cut him as soon as the season ends.

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 01:24 PM
I think this topic is still alive because it really is hilarious how awful he is.

umphrey
12-17-2009, 01:26 PM
Where is his place in biggest busts of all time?
Career stats:
8 wins, 21 losses in games he played in
51.9% completion
6.0 yard average
17 TDs, 22 INTs, 3934 yards
65.0 rating

They played him a lot, but wow he was awful. Especially in 2009.

Lets compare him to Rodgers who played in only 1 more game and, well, because it'll be hilarious:

15-15, 64.2%, 7.6 AVG, 54 TDs, 21 INTs, 7946 yards, 96.3 rating

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 01:29 PM
Depends. Ryan Leaf is considered the biggest bust, but as CCSD points out, he wasn't the 1st pick in the draft.

And his bustness is exacerbated by the fact that he was in the same draft class as Peyton and there were many who felt he was better than Peyton.

Russell was the 1st pick in the draft, and probably has displayed equal ineptitude since being drafted compared to Leaf, but he doesn't have that Peyton Manning comparison.

Id say Russell is probably the 2nd biggest bust of all time.

Gay Ork Wang
12-17-2009, 01:35 PM
Depends. Ryan Leaf is considered the biggest bust, but as CCSD points out, he wasn't the 1st pick in the draft.

And his bustness is exacerbated by the fact that he was in the same draft class as Peyton and there were many who felt he was better than Peyton.

Russell was the 1st pick in the draft, and probably has displayed equal ineptitude since being drafted compared to Leaf, but he doesn't have that Peyton Manning comparison.

Id say Russell is probably the 2nd biggest bust of all time.
Mandarich?

Addict
12-17-2009, 01:36 PM
Depends. Ryan Leaf is considered the biggest bust, but as CCSD points out, he wasn't the 1st pick in the draft.

And his bustness is exacerbated by the fact that he was in the same draft class as Peyton and there were many who felt he was better than Peyton.

Russell was the 1st pick in the draft, and probably has displayed equal ineptitude since being drafted compared to Leaf, but he doesn't have that Peyton Manning comparison.

Id say Russell is probably the 2nd biggest bust of all time.

Leaf also has going for him that he didn't have a career afterwards. I could see some desperate team landing JR (provided he takes less money, obviously) before all is said and done.

Essentially: if the Raiders give up on him and he tries out for another team (or two) and fails there miserably as well... he'll be the biggest in history. The contract size, the holdout, the attitude, the waist size... wow.

Also he's #1 bust with a bullet if Brady Quinn's career pans out (I don't expect that to happen at this point, but you never know)

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 01:36 PM
Mandarich?

he's probably #3.

the expectations are much higher for a quarterback.

umphrey
12-17-2009, 01:37 PM
Was just going to mention his name. That draft went like this:
1) Troy Aikman
2) Tony Mandarich
3) Barry Sanders
4) Derrick Thomas
5) Deion Sanders

*face palm*

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 01:41 PM
Was just going to mention his name. That draft went like this:
1) Troy Aikman
2) Tony Mandarich
3) Barry Sanders
4) Derrick Thomas
5) Deion Sanders

*face palm*

Is that really so much worse than:

1. Eli Manning
2. Robert Gallery
3. Larry Fitzgerald
4. Philip Rivers
5. Sean Taylor

Actually looking at both lists, yeah it is. But still notable.


AD, Joe Thomas, and Calvin being picked just after Jamarcus aren't doing him any favors either.

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 01:43 PM
Leaf also has going for him that he didn't have a career afterwards. I could see some desperate team landing JR (provided he takes less money, obviously) before all is said and done.

Essentially: if the Raiders give up on him and he tries out for another team (or two) and fails there miserably as well... he'll be the biggest in history. The contract size, the holdout, the attitude, the waist size... wow.

Also he's #1 bust with a bullet if Brady Quinn's career pans out (I don't expect that to happen at this point, but you never know)

If I remember correctly, a couple of teams gave Leaf a shot afterwards but he failed each time no?

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 01:44 PM
Is that really so much worse than:

1. Eli Manning
2. Robert Gallery
3. Larry Fitzgerald
4. Philip Rivers
5. Sean Taylor

Actually looking at both lists, yeah it is. But still notable.


AD, Joe Thomas, and Calvin being picked just after Jamarcus aren't doing him any favors either.

The thing with Gallery is, as much of a disappointment he's become, hes actually a pretty decent Guard now.

So he's not as bad as you'd think. Sure, he's not a franchise LT but still. At least he's usable.

Gay Ork Wang
12-17-2009, 01:44 PM
haha but if you are talking about drafted with people that are good: Aikman, Derrick Thomas, Barry Sanders and Deion Sanders. 4 HoF

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 01:44 PM
If I remember correctly, a couple of teams gave Leaf a shot afterwards but he failed each time no?

You do remember correctly. Cowboys gave him the most legit shot.

Yeah I know Gallery is a passable guard. That's a long ways from the Hall of Fame lock at LT he was billed as, and still sticks out like a sore thumb (anyone ever seen a thumb and gone 'Whoah, that baby is sore!') amongst the rest of the 04 class.

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 01:50 PM
You do remember correctly. Cowboys gave him the most legit shot.

Yeah I know Gallery is a passable guard. That's a long ways from the Hall of Fame lock at LT he was billed as, and still sticks out like a sore thumb (anyone ever seen a thumb and gone 'Whoah, that baby is sore!') amongst the rest of the 04 class.

i remember wanting Gallery so bad. i was so pissed bc at the time Kerry Collins tricked me into thinking he was an actual quarterback, and i wasnt willing to accept the fact that the Giants needed to rebuild the entire team at that point.

best decision everrrr by the Giants.

the 04 class will go down as one of the strongest draft classes ever.

Addict
12-17-2009, 02:03 PM
04 was insane... even a few of the undrafted guys made the Pro Bowl (Welker, Fast Willie and Jason Peters :|)

Shiver
12-17-2009, 02:04 PM
i remember wanting Gallery so bad. i was so pissed bc at the time Kerry Collins tricked me into thinking he was an actual quarterback, and i wasnt willing to accept the fact that the Giants needed to rebuild the entire team at that point.

best decision everrrr by the Giants.

the 04 class will go down as one of the strongest draft classes ever.

The Cardinals won out big time:

Larry Fitzgerald
Karlos Dansby
Darnell Dockett

One draft can turn you from a perennial loser to a Super Bowl contender.

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 02:09 PM
The Cardinals won out big time:

Larry Fitzgerald
Karlos Dansby
Darnell Dockett

One draft can turn you from a perennial loser to a Super Bowl contender.

I love Darnell Dockett.

You know who gets no love on that Cardinals team? Calais Campbell. He's been beasting it.

Splat
12-17-2009, 02:12 PM
I'm not going to lie I thought Gallery would step on the field and day one be one of the best LT's in the game that is one pick you can't blame AL on I mean who new?

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 02:15 PM
The Cardinals won out big time:

Larry Fitzgerald
Karlos Dansby
Darnell Dockett

One draft can turn you from a perennial loser to a Super Bowl contender.

It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

bigbluedefense
12-17-2009, 02:20 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

The Giants landed Eli, Chris Snee and Gibril Wilson in that draft. Not too shabby. All were big players in our SB.

Oddly enough, it was our 05 class that really set us up. Everyone said we lost out by trading our picks in 05 away, but that year we landed:

Corey Webster
Justin Tuck
Brandon Jacobs

with only 4 draft picks.

05 hooked you guys up too.

04 and 05 really set up the Giants and Chargers for years to come.

Splat
12-17-2009, 02:21 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

The Chiefs took some little known DE Jared Allen in the 4th round of the 2004 draft.

And I said who the hell is Jared Allen?

:)

Addict
12-17-2009, 02:21 PM
I'm not going to lie I thought Gallery would step on the field and day one be one of the best LT's in the game that is one pick you can't blame AL on I mean who new?

I think everyone believed Gallery. I do wonder what went wrong with him though... his own fault, scouting error, coaching mistakes?

LonghornsLegend
12-17-2009, 03:39 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

I know right! Even Dallas has their own dreamy story, it's the one that ended with us passing up Steven Jackson for Julius Jones and following that up with gems like Jacob Rogers, Stephen Peterman, Bruce Thornton, Sean Ryan, & Nathan Jones.


But hey, at least we made out like bandits with Patty Crayton in the 7th, woooo Parcells!!!!!11!!1

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 04:17 PM
The Giants landed Eli, Chris Snee and Gibril Wilson in that draft. Not too shabby. All were big players in our SB.

Oddly enough, it was our 05 class that really set us up. Everyone said we lost out by trading our picks in 05 away, but that year we landed:

Corey Webster
Justin Tuck
Brandon Jacobs

with only 4 draft picks.

05 hooked you guys up too.

04 and 05 really set up the Giants and Chargers for years to come.


Yah the Charger 04 class has a lot of name recognition, but the 05 draft was the secret assassin...Merriman, Castillo, Vincent Jackson, Darren Sproles

Mr.Regular
12-17-2009, 05:41 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.
Check out our dreamy first three rounds:

Ahmad Carrol.... uber bust... one of the worst players I've ever seen.
Joey Thomas.... uber bust.
Donnel Washington.... uber bust. Never played a game for us.
BJ Sander... a punter... that sucked a lot.....uber bust.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-17-2009, 05:45 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

I hate you...

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 05:58 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

Pro Bowlers from the 2004 draft, by round (selection in parenthesis):

Round One:
Eli Manning (1)
Larry Fitzgerald (3)
Philip Rivers (4)
Sean Taylor (5)
Kellen Winslow Jr. (6)
Roy Williams (8)
Ben Roethlisberger (11)
Jonathan Vilma (12)
Tommie Harris (14)
Shawn Andrews (16)
Will Smith (18)
Vince Wilfork (21)
Steven Jackson (24)

Round 2:
Chris Snee (34)
Bob Sanders (44)

Round 3:
Darnell Dockett (64)
Nate Kaeding (65)
Nick Hardwick (66)
Chris Cooley (81)

Round 4:
Nathan Vasher (110)
Jared Allen (126)

Round 5:
Michael Turner (154)

Round 6:
Andy Lee (Punter) (188)

Round 7:
None

Undrafted FAs:
Willie Parker
Jason Peters
Wes Welker

And we selected Reggie ******* Williams. Go figure.

Shiver
12-17-2009, 06:05 PM
Pro Bowlers from the 2004 draft, by round (selection in parenthesis):

Round One:
Eli Manning (1)
Larry Fitzgerald (3)
Philip Rivers (4)
Sean Taylor (5)
Kellen Winslow Jr. (6)
Roy Williams (7)
DeAngelo Hall (8)
Ben Roethlisberger (11)
Jonathan Vilma (12)
Tommie Harris (14)
Shawn Andrews (16)
Will Smith (18)
Vince Wilfork (21)
Steven Jackson (24)

Round 2:
Chris Snee (34)
Bob Sanders (44)

Round 3:
Darnell Dockett (64)
Nate Kaeding (65)
Nick Hardwick (66)
Chris Cooley (81)

Round 4:
Nathan Vasher (110)
Jared Allen (126)

Round 5:
Michael Turner (154)

Round 6:
Andy Lee (Punter) (188)

Round 7:
None

Undrafted FAs:
Willie Parker
Jason Peters
Wes Welker
Matt McBriar

And we selected Reggie ******* Williams. Go figure.

DeAngelo Hall and Matt McBriar want a word with you.

Addict
12-17-2009, 06:21 PM
DeAngelo Hall and Matt McBriar want a word with you.

McBriar's a punter, that hardly counts.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-17-2009, 06:38 PM
Denver only got DJ Williams out of that draft, really. He's pretty good, but not as good as was predicted. Tatum Bell was good for a little while, too. Could get you good yards per carry as long as he didn't get too many carries.

2006 draft was where Denver destroyed, though.

Cutler
Scheffler
Marshall
Dumervil
Even Domenik Hixon, who was a bust here, is doing good things in the league in NY.

If Cutler hadn't had that falling out last year, that would have been 4 crucial pieces of our franchise for the next several years. Cutler himself turned into 2 first rounders and Kyle Orton who might still turn out to be a QB capable of taking us somewhere. Even if you leave him out though, that's a solid ass draft.

Splat
12-17-2009, 06:47 PM
The Chiefs don't have one player left on their roster from the 2004 draft as much as I love and respect Dick Vermil his drafting was the worst.

That is a huge reason why the Chiefs are in the mess they are now they had great starters under DV but no depth when all those older guys left they had no one to replace them with.

RealityCheck
12-17-2009, 07:01 PM
Benjamin Watson, Marquise Hill (RIP), Guss Scott, Dexter Reid, Cedric Cobbs, P.K. Sam and Christian Morton.

How lame.

Bengalsrocket
12-17-2009, 07:11 PM
Chris Perry - gone.
Keiwan Ratliff - gone.
Caleb Miller - gone.
Landon Johnson - gone.
Matthias Askew - gone.
Stacey Andrews - gone.
Maurice Mann - gone.
Greg Brooks - gone.
Casey Bramlet - gone.

9 picks and none of them are with us 5 years later. That's the definition of a dreamy draft story.

2004 was Marvin's worst draft (and despite people ripping the Bengals for their drafting, I think we actually do a pretty good job usually).

tjsunstein
12-17-2009, 07:11 PM
It seems like everyone has their dreamy 04 draft story. It really was one of the best ever.

Check out our dreamy first three rounds:

Ahmad Carrol.... uber bust... one of the worst players I've ever seen.
Joey Thomas.... uber bust.
Donnel Washington.... uber bust. Never played a game for us.
BJ Sander... a punter... that sucked a lot.....uber bust.

But our 2005 draft was sick!

Aaron Rodgers
Nick Collins

That's all you need to know. Seriously, don't look at the rest of it.