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Thunder&Lightning
12-16-2009, 05:10 PM
what rookie has been most dissapointing in the NFL this year?

CC.SD
12-16-2009, 05:13 PM
Bad year to be named Aaron.

Cicero
12-16-2009, 05:14 PM
DHB. (10chars)

Babylon
12-16-2009, 05:16 PM
DHB. (10chars)

By a landslide. I'm not as down on Aaron Curry as some others i think he's done some good things but in hindsight i'd have traded down and grabbed Cushing or Matthews.

wicket
12-16-2009, 05:17 PM
dhb, maybin and ziggy hood in that order imo

Babylon
12-16-2009, 05:23 PM
dhb, maybin and ziggy hood in that order imo

Geez i had forgot all about Maybin, how is that pick looking now?

billybeejr
12-16-2009, 05:26 PM
Geez i had forgot all about Maybin, how is that pick looking now?

Not good. He barely even seems to have an effect on the games.

GaMeTiMe
12-16-2009, 05:35 PM
I don't think saying DHB is fair. He's gotten only negative attention since the very second his name was called on draft day, only because that horrible franchise horribly reached for him. You can't say he wouldn't have performed to his stock if he was picked where he was supposed to be and played on another team. We've seen the weaknesses in his game on the field, no doubt, but to name him the undoubted disappointment of the rookie class is a little unfair.

I'd put Maybin ahead of him, Seattle definitely expected more from Curry, Robert Ayers has shown horrible signs, and Peria Jerry by default for going on IR. I think when directly answering to the word "disappointing", they're all at the top. DHB could be Calvin Johnson and wouldn't be producing in that offense.

Unbiased
12-16-2009, 05:37 PM
I don't think saying DHB is fair. He's gotten only negative attention since the very second his name was called on draft day, only because that horrible franchise horribly reached for him. You can't say he wouldn't have performed to his stock if he was picked where he was supposed to be and played on another team. We've seen the weaknesses in his game on the field, no doubt, but to name him the undoubted disappointment of the rookie class is a little unfair.

I'd put Maybin ahead of him, Seattle definitely expected more from Curry, Robert Ayers has shown horrible signs, and Peria Jerry by default for going on IR. I think when directly answering to the word "disappointing", they're all at the top. DHB could be Calvin Johnson and wouldn't be producing in that offense.

Then why has Louis Murphy been productive for the Raiders?

DHB is a bust.

Unbiased
12-16-2009, 05:39 PM
dhb, maybin and ziggy hood in that order imo

You have to account for expectations.

Ziggy Hood was not expected to do anything his first year. He's a future replacement.

SchizophrenicBatman
12-16-2009, 05:51 PM
Aha remember when everyone was like "Why would you draft a LB in the top 5?" and the NFL was like "Nah mang, Aaron Curry is PERFECT yo, there's no way he could bust. You got a guaranteed good player no matter what" and we were all like "Whatever"

GaMeTiMe
12-16-2009, 05:53 PM
Then why has Louis Murphy been productive for the Raiders?

DHB is a bust.

You call Louis Murphy's season productive?

Borat
12-16-2009, 05:53 PM
I'd throw Michael Jenkins' name in the mix.

keylime_5
12-16-2009, 06:00 PM
Well Aaron Curry was supposed to be the best player in the draft and such a safe pick and all.....yet Brian Cushing (clearly) and Clay Matthews have looked better.

Splat
12-16-2009, 06:03 PM
I was pretty surprised Ziggy Hood went in the first round I saw him as more of a depth player in the NFL then a starter.

Hurricanes25
12-16-2009, 06:06 PM
You call Louis Murphy's season productive?

He's not doing bad considering that JaMarcus Russell has been throwing the ball to him for 10 games.

murdamal86
12-16-2009, 06:11 PM
You call Louis Murphy's season productive?

For a 4th round pick, heck yea

Matthew Jones
12-16-2009, 06:19 PM
Maybe Aaron Maybin, although I doubt many people expected a sophomore to really have a huge impact as a rookie. I haven't really noticed him making plays at all, and I follow the AFC East pretty significantly. Ziggy Hood has to be up there, but then, why was he drafted in the first round to begin with?

underscore
12-16-2009, 06:22 PM
Not a lot of people expected much out of Maybin this year though

Matthew Jones
12-16-2009, 06:23 PM
Not a lot of people expected much out of Maybin this year though

I addressed that in the post. Still, for someone picked in the top twelve, you'd expect at least some kind of flash.

ThePudge
12-16-2009, 06:31 PM
I'd throw Michael Jenkins' name in the mix.

Malcolm Jenkins? I was under the impression he was playing fine for the Saints. He ranks 6th on the team in tackles, has an interception, and has been a part of the New Orleans mix on defense. While I don't think any of that makes him a great success as a rookie, you have to figure playing average football would keep you out of this conversation. DHB, the 7th Overall pick, has not been used creatively and has not shown much. I'm not saying anyone is or isn't a bust, but DHB certainly fits "disappointing" so far with only 9 receptions for 124 yds and a lack of development thus far with plenty opportunity.

gsorace
12-16-2009, 06:44 PM
DHB isn't disappointing because I didn't really expect him to do anything. For me it's easily Aaron Curry, I thought he'd be a beast from the minute he stepped onto the field.

Also, hows Jason Smith been doing?

San Diego Chicken
12-16-2009, 06:44 PM
Whats going on with Andre Smith? He should be back from his foot problem, is he playing?

ThePudge
12-16-2009, 06:51 PM
Whats going on with Andre Smith? He should be back from his foot problem, is he playing?

Yes, he's playing. Looking pretty good so far and getting better each week. He's only getting between 10 and 20 snaps a game right now because RT Dennis Roland has played so well for the Bengals there. The holdout and foot injury set him back, but he's proven to be too good to keep out of the lineup even when the OL is really clicking. Definitely expecting much bigger things from him down the line, but I'm certainly not upset with the Bengals OL situation right now.

brat316
12-16-2009, 07:01 PM
Guys really Ziggy Hood? When is the last time Steelers started a defensive rookie? Look who he has in front of him Aaron Smith, and even with Aaron Smith's injury he has gotten snaps but limited because he is a rookie.

Also since when does a 3-4 DE become noticeable or pile up stats.

phlysac
12-16-2009, 07:06 PM
Vernon Gholston

I know he was drafted in 2008 but I thought I'd give him an extra year to show up.

holt_bruce81
12-16-2009, 07:25 PM
Jason Smith has been nagged by injuries.

Bengals78
12-16-2009, 07:30 PM
Chase Coffman for me.
I at least expected a few snaps out of him then he hit the IR

holt_bruce81
12-16-2009, 07:32 PM
Chase Coffman for me.
I at least expected a few snaps out of him then he hit the IR

Did he get injured? I expected the same. He had the greatest hands I've ever seen, guess he just couldn't get the blocking thing down.

Bengals78
12-16-2009, 07:40 PM
He got injured like a week ago. He didnt play a single down I remember before that. Behind JP Foschi and Dan StoneHands Coats

Calvin & Kevin
12-16-2009, 07:47 PM
How refreshing it is not to even be able to list a Lions player in this thread. Sure the team still sucks, but at least they didn't draft a black hole for a change.

What about Robert Ayers and Alphonso Smith? Two guys that a lot of people loved... 16 and 12 tackles respectively for the Broncos, with no sacks for Ayers or interceptions for Smith. That's pretty disappointing.

BufFan71
12-16-2009, 07:49 PM
although Maybin has been a disapointment...

whichever DE we drafted, whether Maybin or Orakpo, neither would make a difference.

Kelsay and Schobel have stepped up their play, so the need for that 3rd down speed rusher hasnt been needed as much as expected. Add in hes only 21, and only started 1 year in college. The guy does go 100% whenever he is in. Give him 2-3 years and i full expect him to be a monster

gpngc
12-16-2009, 07:51 PM
Aaron Curry.

If you look at the #s, you'd think he's doing fine but LeSean McCoy hasn't really looked too good either.

Same with Moreno. Too many fumbles, hasn't broken any big runs. He had one great game on Thanksgiving and everything else has been pretty average.

P-L
12-16-2009, 07:57 PM
Vernon Gholston

I know he was drafted in 2008 but I thought I'd give him an extra year to show up.
Gholston should soon be talked about as one of the biggest busts of all-time. 26 games, 26 tackles, 0 sacks. It's a major problem when you're only strength coming out of college is rushing the passer, and than you can't rush the passer in the NFL. There were some Dolphins fans on here who wanted to draft him #1 overall instead of Jake Long...

LonghornsLegend
12-16-2009, 07:57 PM
Then why has Louis Murphy been productive for the Raiders?

DHB is a bust.

Oh please :rolleyes: You must not understand football very well, but I guess you were calling Roddy White a bust after 14 games and Sidney Rice a bust last year too right?


Everyone knew DHB was raw as hell, just because he was thrown into the starting line-up immediately for one of the worst coached franchises in the NFL and hasn't performed doesn't mean he's a bust. It's not like he was a guy who was very polished, he's a track star, not a football player, it's silly to expect him to step in and dominate, it's also silly to call him a bust.


There are still a large portion of WR's that don't do crap until year 3, why is he any different? He's looked terrible no doubt, but your jumping the gun even throwing the word bust around.


But hey, Rashard Mendenhall is a bust too though right? I mean, anytime you play as a rookie and don't immediately produce results your career is already defined and your a huge bust.




Gholston should soon be talked about as one of the biggest busts of all-time. 26 games, 26 tackles, 0 sacks. It's a major problem when you're only strength coming out of college is rushing the passer, and than you can't rush the passer in the NFL. There were some Dolphins fans on here who wanted to draft him #1 overall instead of Jake Long...


I can't remember his name, but not only did he want to draft Gholston #1 overall, he pretty much called anyone who said Long was the pick stupid and said there was 0% chance it was happening. Sniper had a good sig quote of it. Gholston has been completely terrible, sad that he can be that big but not physical at all.

P-L
12-16-2009, 08:00 PM
From what I've seen (which is admittedly only a handful of Seahawks games) Curry has been a solid linebacker, but hasn't come close to living up to the hype he garnered before the draft. I remember all the idiot Lions fans who wanted to draft Aaron Curry because "he was the only sure superstar in this draft" and because "We don't need a quarterback, we have Daunte Culpepper."

gpngc
12-16-2009, 08:09 PM
From what I've seen (which is admittedly only a handful of Seahawks games) Curry has been a solid linebacker, but hasn't come close to living up to the hype he garnered before the draft. I remember all the idiot Lions fans who wanted to draft Aaron Curry because "he was the only sure superstar in this draft" and because "We don't need a quarterback, we have Daunte Culpepper."

He's a step late way too much. Hopefully that will change with experience.

In any case, the decision to pass on Crabtree and Sanchez for yet another talented 4-3 OLB is not looking good. They still need a QBotF, LT (whole line, really), RB, an entire defense, AND Housh is old and not a #1 WR, Burleson can never stay healthy, and Branch is gone soon so they still need another young WR to pair with Butler.

It's no use to have mega-talented LBs in a 4-3 if your down lineman can't get any pressure on the QB or stop the run, and your secondary can't cover or help against the run.

They had been down the "3 great LBs, average or below average everywhere else defense" road before then decided to trade Peterson for Corey Redding (lol) and draft a young Peterson.

Lateral move. I hated it then and I still hate it now.

Hopefully Curry can become a great player but it didn't happen in his rookie season and I fail to see how a 4-3 OLB could make anywhere near the impact a franchise QB or WR would have made.

Frustrating.

DeepThreat
12-16-2009, 08:12 PM
1. Jason Smith
2. Aaron Curry
3. Knowshon Moreno

the decider13
12-16-2009, 08:15 PM
1. Jason Smith
2. Aaron Curry
3. Knowshon Moreno

yeah...13th overall in rushing yards and 5 TDs is such a disappointment.

If any Broncos are mentioned, it has to be Smith and Ayers. Neither has played that much and Smith really hasn't looked good when he has played. I still think Ayers will be a very good player though.

scottyboy
12-16-2009, 08:22 PM
with Curry is, he's out in bumble ****. all the way out in Seattle, he gets limited attention. He's been ok and solid from what I've read.

superman8456
12-16-2009, 08:23 PM
How has Aaron Curry been a disappointing player?

I havent followed any Seahawks games, but hes 3rd on his team in tackles. I dont know what you guys expect from him. He was considered a "safe" pick for numerous reasons. One of the major reasons is that it was a pretty weak draft class at the top.

DeepThreat
12-16-2009, 08:25 PM
Only thing with Knowshon is that he isn't a game breaker. That's what you expect from the 12th pick. And with the Broncos rushing attack...

P-L
12-16-2009, 08:27 PM
Tackles aren't a great way to evaluate a player. Usually great players have a lot of tackles, but not all players with a lot of tackles are great. In 2007 Ernie Sims was 4th in the NFL in tackles and he is terrible. Paris Lenon was 10th in the NFL in tackles last year and was probably the worst linebacker in all of football.

gpngc
12-16-2009, 08:28 PM
How has Aaron Curry been a disappointing player?

I havent followed any Seahawks games, but hes 3rd on his team in tackles. I dont know what you guys expect from him. He was considered a "safe" pick for numerous reasons. One of the major reasons is that it was a pretty weak draft class at the top.

When you take someone fourth overall, you want them to help the team get better. Impact is the word I always use. He's not making much of an impact. Tackling stats can be misleading. He may be making tackles five yards down the field but he doesn't make many splash plays and the addition of him has not improved the Seahawks defense.

This season, he's been disappointing. Not to the point where he's a bust or anything, but to this point he's been disappointing- as has everything in Seahawkland, or "out in bumble ****".

Prophet
12-16-2009, 08:29 PM
Aaron Curry is #1 with a bullett.
Wasn't he supposed to be the best overall player in the draft? Not to mention the safest pick? Cushing has big time outperformed him as has Matthews.
DHB is a dissapointment for where he went but cummon, the guy shoulda gone late 1st at best. Everyone knows that and everyone already knew entering the season it was highly unlikely he would would live up to the billing of a top 10 pick because he shouldn't have been one to begin with.
As well no one expected anything from Ziggy Hood, cannot be dubbed a dissapointment (yet).

scottyboy
12-16-2009, 08:33 PM
He's a step late way too much. Hopefully that will change with experience.

In any case, the decision to pass on Crabtree and Sanchez for yet another talented 4-3 OLB is not looking good. They still need a QBotF, LT (whole line, really), RB, an entire defense, AND Housh is old and not a #1 WR, Burleson can never stay healthy, and Branch is gone soon so they still need another young WR to pair with Butler.

It's no use to have mega-talented LBs in a 4-3 if your down lineman can't get any pressure on the QB or stop the run, and your secondary can't cover or help against the run.

They had been down the "3 great LBs, average or below average everywhere else defense" road before then decided to trade Peterson for Corey Redding (lol) and draft a young Peterson.

Lateral move. I hated it then and I still hate it now.

Hopefully Curry can become a great player but it didn't happen in his rookie season and I fail to see how a 4-3 OLB could make anywhere near the impact a franchise QB or WR would have made.

Frustrating.

franchise QB? child please, you've got this man:

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/106643/t1_teel.jpg

Splat
12-16-2009, 08:37 PM
Gholston should soon be talked about as one of the biggest busts of all-time. 26 games, 26 tackles, 0 sacks. It's a major problem when you're only strength coming out of college is rushing the passer, and than you can't rush the passer in the NFL. There were some Dolphins fans on here who wanted to draft him #1 overall instead of Jake Long...

I picked him up in FA in Madden moved him to DE and was beasting with him.

gsorace
12-16-2009, 08:43 PM
Gholston should soon be talked about as one of the biggest busts of all-time. 26 games, 26 tackles, 0 sacks. It's a major problem when you're only strength coming out of college is rushing the passer, and than you can't rush the passer in the NFL. There were some Dolphins fans on here who wanted to draft him #1 overall instead of Jake Long...

Even Rex gave up on him, the guy just doesn't care about football, he even sucks on special teams. I hope next year is uncapped so the Jets can cut him.

the decider13
12-16-2009, 08:43 PM
Only thing with Knowshon is that he isn't a game breaker. That's what you expect from the 12th pick. And with the Broncos rushing attack...

He might not be a game breaker, but I hardly would call him a disappointment at this point. Can't be mad at a 1000 yard season (yes I know he doesn't have it yet) when there are so many terrible players.

senormysterioso
12-16-2009, 08:49 PM
I'll throw Beanie Wells name into the discussion. Also, I don't know if it's just because he's on a bad team or because he plays about the most unglamerous position in football, but I haven't hear Tyson Jacksons name at all this year. Same with Larry English.

PossibleCabbage
12-16-2009, 10:16 PM
I would have to say that anybody who is disappointed by Aaron Maybin really wasn't paying attention. This was a kid that everybody thought should go back to school for a year because redshirt sophomores really never do anything in their rookie seasons. The reason that Maybin went so high is the belief that with a year or two of NFL coaching and working in an NFL offseason program, he could be dynamite. Redshirt Sophomores who get drafted to oftentimes go from doing nothing positive in their rookie years to being gamechangers in their second years (c.f. Finley, Jermichael).

I knew right away that whoever drafted Maybin was drafting him for who he can be in a year or two, not who he is right now. The only thing that surprised me was that the Bills drafted him, what with them going "all-in" this offseason. I would have thought they would have drafted somebody, anybody, who could be an immediate contributor.

As for who is actually the most disappointing player, I would have to say it depends on whether you measure disappointment as "performance vs. draft position" or "performance vs. your personal expectation". If we go with the former, there's no question it's DHB. He gets a pass on the latter criterion because he ended up in a terrible situation and I wasn't really high on him in the first place. The guy who has so far fallen furthest from the greatness I expected is probably either Curry or one of the OTs.

CC.SD
12-16-2009, 10:33 PM
I'll throw Beanie Wells name into the discussion. Also, I don't know if it's just because he's on a bad team or because he plays about the most unglamerous position in football, but I haven't hear Tyson Jacksons name at all this year. Same with Larry English.

English hasn't been there on the stat sheet (2 sacks) but playing behind Shaun Phillips and Merriman he has gotten some pretty good pressures and made at least some impact. Not Clay Matthews impact but then again he's not a starter.

Maybin is in the same boat, the difference is that Orakpo wouldn't be stuck behind Kelsay/Schobel, and Orakpo was the better prospect from day 1. Bizarre pick.

HawkeyeFan
12-16-2009, 10:41 PM
I don't know how Jason Smith is disappointing. He's got a terrible concussion that's made him miss the last 3 weeks and probably the next few to end the season.

While he's been in the game, he's an absolute monster in the run blocking game. His pass protection has steadily improved.

He's my favorite Offensive Line to watch in the NFL. I love his attitude. The dude's been a beast. And I know this because I've watched every Rams game.

holt_bruce81
12-16-2009, 10:47 PM
I'll throw Beanie Wells name into the discussion. Also, I don't know if it's just because he's on a bad team or because he plays about the most unglamerous position in football, but I haven't hear Tyson Jacksons name at all this year. Same with Larry English.

Beanie Wells really? He hasn't been great, but I think he's doing a solid job in the Cardinals Offense.

LonghornsLegend
12-16-2009, 11:46 PM
I don't know how Jason Smith is disappointing. He's got a terrible concussion that's made him miss the last 3 weeks and probably the next few to end the season.

While he's been in the game, he's an absolute monster in the run blocking game. His pass protection has steadily improved.

He's my favorite Offensive Line to watch in the NFL. I love his attitude. The dude's been a beast. And I know this because I've watched every Rams game.


Any word on if he is going to be moved to LT at some point, or stick at RT? I felt he was better suited on the left but getting him comfortable on the right makes sense. If you take a franchise QB, I'd definately move him to the blindside, he's still got a tremendous amount of potential.

FloridaSkinzFan
12-16-2009, 11:51 PM
Im really disappointed in,

1) Aaron Maybin
2) Aaron Curry
3) Darius Heyward-Bey

RaiderNation
12-16-2009, 11:55 PM
I think we all knew DHB wasnt going to come in and put up good stats as a rookie. He is the type of prospect that will be nothing until year 3 or 4.

RaiderNation
12-16-2009, 11:58 PM
Andre Smith also could be considered. Had a lengthy hold out then shows up out of shape and breaks his foot.

Sniper
12-17-2009, 12:01 AM
I can't remember his name, but not only did he want to draft Gholston #1 overall, he pretty much called anyone who said Long was the pick stupid and said there was 0% chance it was happening. Sniper had a good sig quote of it. Gholston has been completely terrible, sad that he can be that big but not physical at all.

thebow305.

http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21259

For all the Jake Long lovers out there, I know a lot is made about how he only gave up one sack and that it was to Gholston. Some use this to argue against Jake Long and for Gholston, and some go the other way. But it seems to me that the more I watch that Ohio State-Michigan game this year, it seems like Jake looked completely overmatched and overwhelmed the entire time. You can see from the clips from that game that even when going against #97 Cameron Heyward, a Freshman, Long got bull rushed on more than one occasion and even put on his back from time to time.

Call me crazy, at least from this video, Gholston seems like the superior prospect.

http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20055

s that a joke? Jake Long isn't even a complete player, he will be a RT in the NFL, probably a pretty good one, but would be a very average LT.

The pick has to be Chris Long or Gholston, anything else would be a mistake, especially Jake Long.

Vernon Gholston: (Best: Shawne Merriman/ Worst: Kamerion Wimbley)

Jake Long: (Best: (At LT) Matt Light, Worst: Robert Gallery, Best: (At RT) Jon Runyan, Worst: Kyle Turley)

When he named Carey the starting LT for next season, he might as well denounced Jake as our pick alltogether. That's how it's looking right now. Just like I have been saying all along, it is a two-horse race between Vernon Gholston and Chris Long. Chris being the favorite but with Gholston gaining some serious steam and momentum heading down the stretch run here. I feel more confident with each passing day about my Gholston prediction I made months ago. Don't get me wrong, I would be happy with either, I just see Gholston as the pick.

CashmoneyDrew
12-17-2009, 12:40 AM
Robert Ayers will be good guys. Just give him some time to adjust. I promise.

TitanHope and and my reputations are at stake. :)

thule
12-17-2009, 02:32 AM
Jason Williams has only been active for one game all year. Although he was a second round pick he was the first pick the cowboys had. Just thought I'd throw that out there...not even playing on special teams.

umphrey
12-17-2009, 08:37 AM
DHB has some nice tools. He is a serious candidate for the WR 3rd year breakout club. Unfortunately he still very underdeveloped and Oakland isn't going to help him any.

HawkeyeFan
12-17-2009, 08:40 AM
Any word on if he is going to be moved to LT at some point, or stick at RT? I felt he was better suited on the left but getting him comfortable on the right makes sense. If you take a franchise QB, I'd definately move him to the blindside, he's still got a tremendous amount of potential.
Yeah, he's going to be moved to LT at the end of the year. The coaching staff was slowly getting him up to speed by playing him at RT so he doesn't get overwhelmed. But next year he's moving to LT.

619
12-17-2009, 09:18 AM
DHB has some nice tools. He is a serious candidate for the WR 3rd year breakout club. Unfortunately he still very underdeveloped and Oakland isn't going to help him any.

Finding a competent QB, like we currently have in Gradkowski, goes a long way to solving his problems. Part of it was also his fault, of course, especially very early on, and unluckily we did not get to see very much of him with possibly our QB for the very near future in Gradkowski (excluding the rest of this season).

The last game he was healthy for you saw those baby strides everyone is eventually expecting him to make with his first career TD and most productive performance of his rookie year. I would expect those strides to continue into next season where I could see his reception total hovering around 30-40, and then increasing to 50-60 by his third season, which could be that breakout year you hinted at in your post.

I find it funny that everyone is claiming him to be the most disappointing rookie this season when to be fair not much was really expected of him, even in a starting role, for at least a full season or two. He is still learning how to play the position, forget on how to excel at it on a pro level. Still, I wouldn't rule this kid out for a third or fourth year breakout because he has the right frame of mind and work ethic to improve at what he does until he gets it, and god knows Al Davis will stay patient. By that time I expect that 'light switch' to go on where he starts playing rather than thinking, and his physical talents are actualized in exploiting the defenses Al's way -- the deep vertical passing game!

A great example of a similar learning curve was that of Robert Meachem. Everyone knows he is doing big things in the Bayou. In hindsight, DHB should have been picked right around where he was in his draft year (27th overall). Al really does bring criticism upon himself.

draftguru151
12-17-2009, 09:40 AM
thebow305.

http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21259



http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20055

He also wanted Ted Ginn. :/

Day One Pick
12-17-2009, 11:20 AM
You have to account for expectations.

Ziggy Hood was not expected to do anything his first year. He's a future replacement.

Right, but expect to one day be able to call him a bust unless the Steelers switch to a Tampa 2. Hoods biggest weakness was standing up blockers in the run game. Gee, that's what a 3-4 DL is asked to do.

Addict
12-17-2009, 12:04 PM
DHB can't really dissapoint right now I think... nobody really expected much.

vidae
12-17-2009, 12:17 PM
I wouldn't necessarily call Tyson Jackson a disappointment. He's a 3-4 DE and he's playing well enough, but I doubt you'll hear his name called a lot. That said, Glenn Dorsey is playing 3-4 DE at a higher level right now but he's also been in the NFL for a year so maybe that has something to do with it.

I really wish we would have drafted OL last year in the first and a 3-4 DE this year though. :(

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 12:44 PM
Robert Ayers will be good guys. Just give him some time to adjust. I promise.

TitanHope and and my reputations are at stake. :)

It's okay you guys can go double or nothing on Eric Berry.

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 12:58 PM
I'm surprised Percy Harvin is still in the NFL, he was such a guarantee to be a colossal bust. I mean, he doesn't even have a true position!

Addict
12-17-2009, 01:50 PM
I'm surprised Percy Harvin is still in the NFL, he was such a guarantee to be a colossal bust. I mean, he doesn't even have a true position!

It wouldn't suprise me if the Vikes roster looks like:

Favre, Brett - QB
Peterson, Adrian - RB
Rice, Sydney - WR
Berrian, Bernard - WR
Harvin, Percy - Runs around and does stuff

Splat
12-17-2009, 02:08 PM
I'll throw Beanie Wells name into the discussion. Also, I don't know if it's just because he's on a bad team or because he plays about the most unglamerous position in football, but I haven't hear Tyson Jacksons name at all this year.

Stat wise Jackson has had a down year but he has been doing things that don't show up in the stat sheet.

I think he has flashed at times and while he was a reach at #3 he fills what was a huge need at the time and a player we can build around.

I really do think the Chiefs DL has potential to be a pretty good group I believe they are set at DE for years to come with Jackson and Dorsey.

I still feel they need a true NT Ron Edwards has filled the role and flashed at times but I still feel he is more of a depth player.

Addict
12-17-2009, 02:15 PM
Stat wise Jackson has had a down year but he has been doing things that don't show up in the stat sheet.

I think he has flashed at times and while he was a reach at #3 he fills what was a huge need at the time and a player we can build around.

I really do think the Chiefs DL has potential to be a pretty good group I believe they are set at DE for years to come with Jackson and Dorsey.

I still feel they need a true NT Ron Edwards has filled the role and flashed at times but I still feel he is more of a depth player.

mount cody?

CashmoneyDrew
12-17-2009, 02:16 PM
mount cody?

Dan Williams! ;)

Splat
12-17-2009, 02:18 PM
mount cody?

Only if he fell to the second round to big a risk (no pun intended) to take in the top ten which will be were the Chiefs will be picking.

Addict
12-17-2009, 02:22 PM
Only if he fell to the second round to big a risk (no pun intended) to take in the top ten which will be were the Chiefs will be picking.

pray he falls to round two then!

descendency
12-17-2009, 05:14 PM
Ron Brace. Ron Brace. Ron Brace. I was hoping this guy could be a vince wilfork replacement and now I just hope he plays.

cajuncorey
12-17-2009, 05:23 PM
i think calling aaron curry a dissappointment rediculous. first all hes playing in seattle so none of you or myself have seen him play. second of all hes playing in seattle and they dont play defense. third of all hes in seattle he didnt have a chance from the start.

tjsunstein
12-17-2009, 05:59 PM
Jason Williams has only been active for one game all year. Although he was a second round pick he was the first pick the cowboys had. Just thought I'd throw that out there...not even playing on special teams.

I didn't understand the pick at the time. I thought I had just missed something when looking over the linebackers in the draft last year. Apparently not.

i think calling aaron curry a dissappointment rediculous. first all hes playing in seattle so none of you or myself have seen him play. second of all hes playing in seattle and they dont play defense. third of all hes in seattle he didnt have a chance from the start.

Right. So what team you're drafted by determines what impact you should have and will have? No, that's on the individuals. A collaboration of these individuals makes a team. Welcome to football. So you're saying that when the Vikings picked Adrian Peterson in the top 10 in 2007, he was doomed because Minnesota was bad when they picked him. How's that worked out?

Biggest bust in the most recent draft is hard to determine because everyone had different expectations. If a guy was drafted higher than a person thought they should go, that person most likely would lower their expectations for them. Prime example, DHB. Some think that players should live up to where they're drafted instead of how they originally graded the prospect pre-draft.

Based on draft position, the biggest bust to me is DHB.
Based on my expectations, for me it's Jarron Gilbert. Remember him?

cajuncorey
12-17-2009, 06:15 PM
[QUOTE=tjsunstein;1928310]I didn't understand the pick at the time. I thought I had just missed something when looking over the linebackers in the draft last year. Apparently not.



Right. So what team you're drafted by determines what impact you should have and will have? No, that's on the individuals. A collaboration of these individuals makes a team. Welcome to football. So you're saying that when the Vikings picked Adrian Peterson in the top 10 in 2007, he was doomed because Minnesota was bad when they picked him. How's that worked out?QUOTE]

You have just commited a hasty generaliztion and leading me to say your argument isnt valid

1)A linebacker is no where going to impact your team as much as a runningback will
2)Aaron Curry is human, adrian peterson is not
3)The team you are drafted to will determine the impact you should and will have, do you think if players like mike anderson, tatum bell, Orldandis Gary werent drafted by the broncos they would have been that sucessful?... OF COARSE NOT

Addict
12-17-2009, 06:22 PM
You have just commited a hasty generaliztion and leading me to say your argument isnt valid

1)A linebacker is no where going to impact your team as much as a runningback will
2)Aaron Curry is human, adrian peterson is not
3)The team you are drafted to will determine the impact you should and will have, do you think if players like mike anderson, tatum bell, Orldandis Gary werent drafted by the broncos they would have been that sucessful?... OF COARSE NOT

dude... you're American... you have NO excuse to butcher your own language like that.

cajuncorey
12-17-2009, 06:24 PM
dude... you're American... you have NO excuse to butcher your own language like that.

i dont understand haha

Splat
12-17-2009, 06:27 PM
I don't think you can just blame Seattle I know they have had a bad couple of years but its not like they are a bad organization.

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 06:35 PM
i dont understand haha

I'm not surprised.

Addict
12-17-2009, 06:39 PM
i dont understand haha

if this were a real life situation you'd be the only guy in the room who doesn't get it.

cvv84
12-17-2009, 06:40 PM
I'm willing to give guys like Andre Smith, DHB, and Aaron Maybin passes because I really didn't expect much from them this year.

So I'd say in no particular order:

Aaron Curry - He was deemed the safest pick in the draft and while he's having a descent season he isn't the tackling machine that you would've expected.

Robert Ayers - I questioned how they'd use him in the 3-4 then and its still a mystery to me today. I guess they haven't learned from the Jarvis Moss experiment.

Alex Mack - He may have progressed but the few Browns games I've seen this year he was getting eaten up quite a bit. Browns had the 5th overall pick and traded down for a center which was something I always questioned too.

Peria Jerry - He was injury prone in college and what happens his 1st year in the NFL? He goes on IR. Does Justin Harrell have a brother?

Eric Wood/Andy Levitre - The Bills traded Jason Peters and haven't found a capable replacement, yet alone any stable play along their offensive line. At least they drafted Jairus Byrd though.

Brian Robiskie - Not looking like he was worth the hype.

Alphonso Smith - Gave up a 1st round pick for him remember.

Everette Brown - Gave up a 1st round pick for him remember.

Pat White - Hasn't added to the wildcat like they hoped.

Derrick Williams - Well he plays for the Lions so...

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 06:49 PM
Eric Wood/Andy Levitre - The Bills traded Jason Peters and haven't found a capable replacement, yet alone any stable play along their offensive line. At least they drafted Jairus Byrd though.

Andy Levitre has been our most consistent lineman on a corps that has suffered countless injuries. Eric Wood played OK before he mutilated his leg in the Jacksonville game. But forget that, you honestly think that project players could automatically step in for a Pro Bowl caliber OT and fix the OL immediately? I have no idea why you deem them both as disappointments

tjsunstein
12-17-2009, 06:52 PM
You have just commited a hasty generaliztion and leading me to say your argument isnt valid

1)A linebacker is no where going to impact your team as much as a runningback will
2)Aaron Curry is human, adrian peterson is not
3)The team you are drafted to will determine the impact you should and will have, do you think if players like mike anderson, tatum bell, Orldandis Gary werent drafted by the broncos they would have been that sucessful?... OF COARSE NOT

Pick anyone in the last 3 years (2006-2008) that was picked in the top 10 that year that are now playoff teams. Packers, Bengals, Vikings, the list goes on. Were all of those players (Ronnie Brown, Antrel Rolle, Reggie Bush, Matt Ryan) doomed from the start because of the team that drafted them, no matter how good they were ranked as prospects? Obviously not. Am I still generalizing?

Like a post before me said, Seattle isn't a franchise that has been in the gutter for decades. They're cleary rebuilding. They won the NFC West in 2007. That may seem like longer but it really isn't. Truth be told, they dominated that division for years before that and were one of the top teams in the NFC.

Just because Curry was drafted by Seattle doesn't mean he's ultimately doomed, like you implied.

cvv84
12-17-2009, 08:43 PM
Andy Levitre has been our most consistent lineman on a corps that has suffered countless injuries. Eric Wood played OK before he mutilated his leg in the Jacksonville game. But forget that, you honestly think that project players could automatically step in for a Pro Bowl caliber OT and fix the OL immediately? I have no idea why you deem them both as disappointments

Yes that is what I said and think. :rolleyes:

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 08:44 PM
Yes that is what I said and think. :rolleyes:

Well you're ******* nuts then you ******

cvv84
12-17-2009, 08:50 PM
Well you're ******* nuts then you ******

I bet you can distinguish the taste between Dove and Zest soap brands.

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 08:53 PM
I bet you can distinguish between Dove and Zest soap brands.

I tend to prefer dividing by zero in my spare time. I know they didn't teach you that on the short bus either.

cvv84
12-17-2009, 08:58 PM
I tend to prefer dividing by zero in my spare time. I know they didn't teach you that on the short bus either.

Wow someone can't handle criticism of their team.

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 09:07 PM
Wow someone can't handle criticism of their team.

Its not that I can't handle criticism of my own team. Believe me, as a former season ticket holder, I'm on the front lines after every game. Seriously, how many Bills games have you watched this year? It's that people like you do not realize the situation we've been going through with injuries all year, especially on the OL. Secondly, you're expectations for players are irrational and completely unrealistic. There's a difference between a project and an immediate difference maker, realize that. Two rookies on a neglected offensive line replacing a perennial pro bowler? At different positions, even? Jesus Christ, be real

cvv84
12-17-2009, 09:53 PM
Its not that I can't handle criticism of my own team. Believe me, as a former season ticket holder, I'm on the front lines after every game. Seriously, how many Bills games have you watched this year? It's that people like you do not realize the situation we've been going through with injuries all year, especially on the OL. Secondly, you're expectations for players are irrational and completely unrealistic. There's a difference between a project and an immediate difference maker, realize that. Two rookies on a neglected offensive line replacing a perennial pro bowler? At different positions, even? Jesus Christ, be real

You have no idea what my expectations are. You're making the assumption upon yourself. Get over it, move on, and quit ******* crying about it.

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 10:08 PM
You have no idea what my expectations are. You're making the assumption upon yourself. Get over it, move on, and quit ******* crying about it.

Please clarify your expectations for me, because from what these expectations sound like, it seems as if you expect your 6th round backup guard to be the next Steve Hutchinson all of a sudden

cvv84
12-17-2009, 10:18 PM
Please clarify your expectations for me, because from what these expectations sound like, it seems as if you expect your 6th round backup guard to be the next Steve Hutchinson all of a sudden

I suggest re-reading what I wrote then. Take the criticism like the man. I'm done with this pointless conversation that you've dramatically blown out of proportion due to poor comprehension skills.

fischbowl
12-17-2009, 10:20 PM
I suggest re-reading what I wrote then. Take the criticism like the man. I'm done with this pointless conversation that you've dramatically blown out of proportion due to poor comprehension skills.

So you're solely blaming Wood/Levitre for the Bills shoddy OL play? And that both a guard and a center are incapable of replacing a LT?

vidae
12-17-2009, 10:34 PM
I would absolutely love Cody on the Chiefs, in the second. If he's gone, Dan Williams would be good too. If they're both gone, fml.

jCut
12-17-2009, 10:35 PM
What about Robert Ayers and Alphonso Smith? Two guys that a lot of people loved... 16 and 12 tackles respectively for the Broncos, with no sacks for Ayers or interceptions for Smith. That's pretty disappointing.

I'm surprised it took this long for these guys to get mentioned. Alphonso Smith was benched in favor of Ty Law. This was a guy so highly thought of in our organization that we traded this years 1st round pick for him. What a bonehead move by McDaniels. And Ayers.. I can't believe we passed on Orakpo, thinking that Ayers was going to be available later and was just as good a prospect.

Rosebud
12-18-2009, 03:37 AM
Ramses Barden has been a disappointment as a giants fan. He's young so he's still got plenty of time but I was really high on him this draft and was giddy after the giants managed to nab him and beatty with our second second and third round picks. Barden still hasn't gotten onto the field or gotten activated, but his upside is phenomenal.

Giantsfan1080
12-18-2009, 04:56 AM
Barden played in the game against Tampa Bay.

brat316
12-18-2009, 05:03 AM
Gilbert Jarron? The man that could jump out of pools.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-18-2009, 05:05 AM
Peria Jerry for me. We were counting on him big time, and he got hurt in just his second game. Now he's going to essentially be a 37 year old rookie next year.

edgrenade
12-18-2009, 06:22 AM
for the Niners, i'd have to say Glen Coffee

Poz51
12-18-2009, 07:42 AM
I'm willing to give guys like Andre Smith, DHB, and Aaron Maybin passes because I really didn't expect much from them this year.

So I'd say in no particular order:

Alex Mack - He may have progressed but the few Browns games I've seen this year he was getting eaten up quite a bit. Browns had the 5th overall pick and traded down for a center which was something I always questioned too.

Peria Jerry - He was injury prone in college and what happens his 1st year in the NFL? He goes on IR. Does Justin Harrell have a brother?

Eric Wood/Andy Levitre - The Bills traded Jason Peters and haven't found a capable replacement, yet alone any stable play along their offensive line. At least they drafted Jairus Byrd though.


I have a hard time giving Maybin a pass, he's played marginally well in one game this year, is almost always the last guy off the ball, and was taken ahead of Orakpo who is a 4 down player, Maybin hasnt even generated a shred of a pass rush, Cushing who's production would be a welcome addition, and Oher who should have been the pick hands down (my apologies to the good folks of Nags Head who had to endure my 30 second tirade in regards to this matter)... Great point about Mack and trading back, dont forget they also got several excellent back ups that start or dont see the field, awesome trade :roll: I would agree with the Peria points as well... You lose me a bit with the Wood/Levitre analysis, Wood was the best lineman on the team before his injury, Levitre was very solid and has continued the solid play all season even when forced into playing left tackle against Tennessee, Hangartner has been a rock in the middle of the line, and the three of them I would say played beyond expectations and provided stability on the interior of the line, especially when considering the poor play on the interior of the line in the past several years... They have not however found a replacement for Peters, and losing Butler for the season hurt more than I thought it would, and not having sufficient depth at the tackle positions is where the instability along the Bills line is... Amen to the Byrd comment, he is a ball player, smart, always in position, takes advantage of every oppurtunity presented, and is a better tackler than I thought. Levitre and Wood have not been disapointments by any means though, and were not brought in to replace Peters, they were brought in to replace Dockery (useless paycheck *****) and stabilize the interior of the line, which they were in the process of doing, and will continue to do so... Now they need to address the loss of Peters, which is completely seperate from Levitre/Wood.

Brent
12-18-2009, 07:56 AM
Well, it's obviously got to be Michael Crabtree, I mean even Geo called it back in September:

He was damaged goods, lacks speed, can't run a full route tree, never played in a pro offense (was a QB in high school if I recall), and has questionable character.

This twerp isn't as good as Dwayne Bowe was and Bowe went 23rd overall in 2007. Bowe played in a pro offense, he could play physical, he could run-block well, and he tested before the Draft. Bowe didn't play against garbage Big XII defenses, and participated at the Senior Bowl.

37 receptions, 473 yards, and 2 TDs in his first 8 games? BUST.

EvilNixon
12-18-2009, 08:02 AM
DHB. (10chars)
How many Raider games have you seen?

Then why has Louis Murphy been productive for the Raiders?

DHB is a bust.

They play 2 completely different roles. All I've seen of DHB has been nothing but deep routes with a terrible QB. He got his first TD with Grad throwing him the ball. Murphy isn't used as extensively as nothing more than a deep route runner as DHB has.

Addict
12-18-2009, 09:14 AM
Well, it's obviously got to be Michael Crabtree, I mean even Geo called it back in September:

37 receptions, 473 yards, and 2 TDs in his first 8 games? BUST.

I understand you're being sarcastic, but blaming someone misreading a situation is really corny. Almost everyone on the boards misjudged JaMarcus Russell when he came out. And everyone who didn't misjudge Russel spent the same amount of time misjudgin Brady Quinn.

Everyone's wrong here all the time, it happens.

STsACE
12-18-2009, 10:00 AM
Alex Mack - He may have progressed but the few Browns games I've seen this year he was getting eaten up quite a bit. Browns had the 5th overall pick and traded down for a center which was something I always questioned too.
.

Brian Robiskie - Not looking like he was worth the hype.

..

I figured I'd chime in being a Browns fan.

At the time Mack was picked, I like many others were very upset that we traded back that far to pick up a Center, when Clay Matthews JR was the one we were all hoping to move back and grab.

Mack has made steady, consistent improvement throughout the year. He started out in the beginning of the year needing help in the middle with his blocking. Don't forget he was also baptised by fire being thrown against the wolves of the Vikings D-Line. He's come along to the point where he is holding his own without help on the line. He's been handling some of the better NT's in the league, just last Thursday he took Casey Hampton completely out of the game. His future looks bright as long he he continues to improve his game.

Robiskie, I didn't like the pick (Wolverine fan as well). Robiskie spent a few games wearing street clothes and he wasn't even injured. He has improved, but for being our first 2nd rounder he's not lived up to the hype of being the supposed most polished WR from the 2008 draft since his dad is a WRs coach in the NFL. Most fans are just hoping he can be at least a slot WR in the future LOL.

I haven't seen anyone mention Sanchez. I will being the Browns took alot of heat for not going with him. The first part of the season it looked like the Browns got ripped off as Sanchez was putting up real good numbers. But since about the 6th game of the year on, he's looked unready and that he should have stayed in College another year. I will consider him a bust candidate as a playoff caliber team moved up to grab to him as their starter.

If you want to talk bust candidates for the Browns, David Veikune.

Marino13
12-18-2009, 11:25 AM
Might as well mention Pat White, everybody from local to national media thought he'd make the Wildcat even more dangerous, but when he's been in he's been more of a liability than an asset.

CashmoneyDrew
12-18-2009, 12:53 PM
Ryan Mouton literally fumbled a very important game away from us.

Thanks a lot D! :p

cvv84
12-18-2009, 01:47 PM
I figured I'd chime in being a Browns fan.

At the time Mack was picked, I like many others were very upset that we traded back that far to pick up a Center, when Clay Matthews JR was the one we were all hoping to move back and grab.

Mack has made steady, consistent improvement throughout the year. He started out in the beginning of the year needing help in the middle with his blocking. Don't forget he was also baptised by fire being thrown against the wolves of the Vikings D-Line. He's come along to the point where he is holding his own without help on the line. He's been handling some of the better NT's in the league, just last Thursday he took Casey Hampton completely out of the game. His future looks bright as long he he continues to improve his game.

Robiskie, I didn't like the pick (Wolverine fan as well). Robiskie spent a few games wearing street clothes and he wasn't even injured. He has improved, but for being our first 2nd rounder he's not lived up to the hype of being the supposed most polished WR from the 2008 draft since his dad is a WRs coach in the NFL. Most fans are just hoping he can be at least a slot WR in the future LOL.

I haven't seen anyone mention Sanchez. I will being the Browns took alot of heat for not going with him. The first part of the season it looked like the Browns got ripped off as Sanchez was putting up real good numbers. But since about the 6th game of the year on, he's looked unready and that he should have stayed in College another year. I will consider him a bust candidate as a playoff caliber team moved up to grab to him as their starter.

If you want to talk bust candidates for the Browns, David Veikune.

Glad to hear that Mack is doing better. I've always secretly rooted for the Browns but I figured they'd get set back with Mangini at the helm. I'm not saying that you guys should've drafted Sanchez but I thought for sure Raji would've been on their radar at #5. But I really can't complain because I was estatic about landing Raji and Matthews :)

I have a hard time giving Maybin a pass, he's played marginally well in one game this year, is almost always the last guy off the ball, and was taken ahead of Orakpo who is a 4 down player, Maybin hasnt even generated a shred of a pass rush, Cushing who's production would be a welcome addition, and Oher who should have been the pick hands down (my apologies to the good folks of Nags Head who had to endure my 30 second tirade in regards to this matter)... Great point about Mack and trading back, dont forget they also got several excellent back ups that start or dont see the field, awesome trade :roll: I would agree with the Peria points as well... You lose me a bit with the Wood/Levitre analysis, Wood was the best lineman on the team before his injury, Levitre was very solid and has continued the solid play all season even when forced into playing left tackle against Tennessee, Hangartner has been a rock in the middle of the line, and the three of them I would say played beyond expectations and provided stability on the interior of the line, especially when considering the poor play on the interior of the line in the past several years... They have not however found a replacement for Peters, and losing Butler for the season hurt more than I thought it would, and not having sufficient depth at the tackle positions is where the instability along the Bills line is... Amen to the Byrd comment, he is a ball player, smart, always in position, takes advantage of every oppurtunity presented, and is a better tackler than I thought. Levitre and Wood have not been disapointments by any means though, and were not brought in to replace Peters, they were brought in to replace Dockery (useless paycheck *****) and stabilize the interior of the line, which they were in the process of doing, and will continue to do so... Now they need to address the loss of Peters, which is completely seperate from Levitre/Wood.

I guess I meant give Maybin a break because of the holdout and I guess I really wasn't expecting much from him because he seemed a little too raw to make an impact or play much as a rookie. I haven't seen Wood/Levitre play much, obviously Wood is injured, so I was going on what I heard early in the season. Nice breakdown on them though, which is a breath of fresh air over that other guy going ape lol.

broncofan7
12-18-2009, 02:09 PM
Aaron Maybin I have barely heard his name this year. I still can't believe the Bills passed up on Michael Oher and Brian Orakpo.

jimbo
12-18-2009, 02:49 PM
Gilbert Jarron? The man that could jump out of pools.

Jarron Gilbert. He wasn't expected to see the field a ton this year anyway. I haven't caught the last few Bears games because they're quite painful to watch and I've been busy so I'm not sure if he has seen any playing time or not.

GatorsBullsFan
12-18-2009, 02:53 PM
When are teams going to realize that a lot of these Hybrid DE/OLB in College aren't going to work in the NFL. Its like the Option, it just wont work in the NFL. Its proven with Maybin and Gholston, these Skinny Hybrids are going to get destroyed in the NFL.

Brent
12-18-2009, 03:10 PM
I understand you're being sarcastic, but blaming someone misreading a situation is really corny. Almost everyone on the boards misjudged JaMarcus Russell when he came out. And everyone who didn't misjudge Russel spent the same amount of time misjudgin Brady Quinn.

Everyone's wrong here all the time, it happens.
I am just poking fun at Geo, who got so worked up over Michael Crabtree.

Goon61
12-18-2009, 03:29 PM
I was initially pissed that the niners did not take micheal oher and everrette brown.

How are Oher and Everrrette Brown doing?

devinhester=R.O.Y 2006
12-18-2009, 05:49 PM
Jarron Gilbert. He wasn't expected to see the field a ton this year anyway. I haven't caught the last few Bears games because they're quite painful to watch and I've been busy so I'm not sure if he has seen any playing time or not.

He was inactive last week due to management wanting to get a look at the failed experiment that is Gaines Adams.

Thanks alot Jerry Angelo!

ThePudge
12-18-2009, 06:31 PM
When are teams going to realize that a lot of these Hybrid DE/OLB in College aren't going to work in the NFL. Its like the Option, it just wont work in the NFL. Its proven with Maybin and Gholston, these Skinny Hybrids are going to get destroyed in the NFL.

Vernon Gholston skinny? A better example would easily be Manny Lawson. You must not be all too high on Jason Pierre-Paul or Ricky Sapp, as they fit that same thin hybrid role.

BigBanger
12-18-2009, 06:38 PM
I was initially pissed that the niners did not take micheal oher and everrette brown.

How are Oher and Everrrette Brown doing?
Let's just say, they got the MUCH better player than either of those two. MUCH better.


Jason Smith is by far the biggest disappointment, because I had high expectations and he hasn't played. Simple as that, but I'm not worried about him being a bust.

ThePudge
12-18-2009, 07:08 PM
Let's just say, they got the MUCH better player than either of those two. MUCH better.


Jason Smith is by far the biggest disappointment, because I had high expectations and he hasn't played. Simple as that, but I'm not worried about him being a bust.

He's been seriously concussed. Smith came out as a guy that wasn't yet the total package, but had the mental and physical tools to improve and be the best OL in the class. Andre Smith, Michael Oher, and Eugene Monroe were all slightly further along in their development as players, so I'm not sure why you had such high expectations from him at RT as a rookie.

BigBanger
12-18-2009, 07:12 PM
He's been seriously concussed. Smith came out as a guy that wasn't yet the total package, but had the mental and physical tools to improve and be the best OL in the class. Andre Smith, Michael Oher, and Eugene Monroe were all slightly further along in their development as players, so I'm not sure why you had such high expectations from him at RT as a rookie.
I didn't have RT expectations (I'm assuming you did with that irrelevant comment?)... you actually have no clue what my expectations are.

He hasn't played. I expected him starting at his natural position. What part of that is hard to comprehend?

"He's been seriously concussed." Cry me a river fat boy.

phlysac
12-18-2009, 07:25 PM
Vernon Gholston skinny? A better example would easily be Manny Lawson. You must not be all too high on Jason Pierre-Paul or Ricky Sapp, as they fit that same thin hybrid role.

I would even mention Ricky Sapp, Von Miller, George Selvie, and Austen Lane as befitting that description even more than JPP.

billsfootball15
12-18-2009, 07:28 PM
aaron maybin hands down. doesnt have the body to play 4-3 DE in the NFL which is what he was drafted to do.

ThePudge
12-18-2009, 07:42 PM
I didn't have RT expectations (I'm assuming you did with that irrelevant comment?)... you actually have no clue what my expectations are.

He hasn't played. I expected him starting at his natural position. What part of that is hard to comprehend?

"He's been seriously concussed." Cry me a river fat boy.

Not actually fat, quite the opposite. I'm 6'3 170. Tall and skinny. I don't assume you're a big guy that bangs a lot of women, or a moose under the boards in basketball, it's just a user name. I could be "HispanicHIV" without being Hispanic or having HIV.

You have to comprehend that he's played in eight games, starting five. He's played. He's shown some good stuff, improved greatly as a run blocker. Now, he's been hurt. No one is immune to injury. I don't think it's fair for a player having his season severely stunted by injuries to be considered disappointing, so I said something, being as this is a discussion board. Only discussion brother, calm yourself down a couple notches.

By your logic, Carson Palmer must have been the most disappointing #1 pick in the past decade his rookie year.

LonghornsLegend
12-18-2009, 08:07 PM
I didn't have RT expectations (I'm assuming you did with that irrelevant comment?)... you actually have no clue what my expectations are.

He hasn't played. I expected him starting at his natural position. What part of that is hard to comprehend?

"He's been seriously concussed." Cry me a river fat boy.

Angry much?



I also wouldn't consider a player a huge disappointment in their rookie year if they had a concussion and are unable to play, to me a huge disappointment is more a guy who has been able to play but has looked bad yet he was supposed to be NFL ready when he came out, or a guy who can't crack the starting line-up but is healthy.

Paranoidmoonduck
12-18-2009, 08:24 PM
When are teams going to realize that a lot of these Hybrid DE/OLB in College aren't going to work in the NFL. Its like the Option, it just wont work in the NFL. Its proven with Maybin and Gholston, these Skinny Hybrids are going to get destroyed in the NFL.

Yeah, why would the NFL think that just because guys like DeMarcus Ware, Shawne Merriman, Brian Orakpo, Elvis Dumervil, LaMarr Woodley, and Terrell Suggs have had success in the NFL doesn't mean that DE/OLB hybrid prospects will ever work in the NFL!

Seriously, just what the hell are you going on about?

Splat
12-18-2009, 08:37 PM
Yeah, why would the NFL think that just because guys like DeMarcus Ware, Shawne Merriman, Brian Orakpo, Elvis Dumervil, LaMarr Woodley, and Terrell Suggs have had success in the NFL doesn't mean that DE/OLB hybrid prospects will ever work in the NFL!

Seriously, just what the hell are you going on about?

You left out the guy in my sig.:)

Paranoidmoonduck
12-18-2009, 08:41 PM
You left out the guy in my sig.:)

Yeah, but Tamba came in as a 43 DE and played there for three years and probably wouldn't called skinny even now.

senormysterioso
12-18-2009, 08:42 PM
Yeah, why would the NFL think that just because guys like DeMarcus Ware, Shawne Merriman, Brian Orakpo, Elvis Dumervil, LaMarr Woodley, and Terrell Suggs have had success in the NFL doesn't mean that DE/OLB hybrid prospects will ever work in the NFL!

Seriously, just what the hell are you going on about?

and Trent Cole and Kiwi

PossibleCabbage
12-18-2009, 09:01 PM
Yeah, why would the NFL think that just because guys like DeMarcus Ware, Shawne Merriman, Brian Orakpo, Elvis Dumervil, LaMarr Woodley, and Terrell Suggs have had success in the NFL doesn't mean that DE/OLB hybrid prospects will ever work in the NFL!

Seriously, just what the hell are you going on about?

Yeah, it's really just a position with a high bust rate (considering DE/OLB tweener as an outside pass rusher as a position), nothing more and nothing less. You take a risk when you take a guy lik this in the first round, since there are more failures than successes, but no draft picks are without risk.