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Scott Wright
12-17-2009, 05:17 AM
I just posted a new mock draft, which is the fourth of the year. This will in all likelihood be the last update until after the deadline for underclassmen to declare in the middle of January.

You can view it via the main page:

2010 Mock Draft - v.4.0
http://www.draftcountdown.com/

As always constructive criticism is not only welcomed but encouraged. However, please be sure to explain the reasoning behind your opinions or risk being infracted.

Let's keep this thread fun and informative!

FIRE AWAY! :)

WMD
12-17-2009, 05:35 AM
I knew there was a reason I stayed up so late!

Can't complain about McCoy to the Lions. Bradford #1 is surprising though. Do you really think McCoy could get drafted ahead of Suh?

Paranoidmoonduck
12-17-2009, 05:47 AM
Quick thoughts before I pass out...

I think the disparity between Suh and Bradford is much greater than the gap between Dorsey and Ryan was and that will make it much harder for St. Louis to pass on Suh, but you may be right about them going for a quarterback. I'd just be a bit surprised if it's Bradford.

I'm not sold that the Redskins feel the same way about Campbell as they felt during the offseason. Obviously, we'll know when they either resign him or not, but he's played well enough to change some minds.

Pierre-Paul is a interesting pick for the Raiders. I agree that the Oakland pick will likely be a defensive lineman and I also agree that with McCoy and Suh off the board, that defensive lineman will likely be viewed as a reach. I'm just not sure it'll be a defensive end. Someone like Marvin Austin would be right in Davis' wheelhouse.

Does the Florida connection really make the Tebow pick worth it. Because I can't see him going that high.

Other than that, at a quick glance everything looks solid.

Day One Pick
12-17-2009, 05:48 AM
-Sam Bradford, I see him having far too many question marks to be the first player off the board. In fact, I won't be shocked if he doesn't even go in the first round. I also think Suh may be too good to pass up. He seems like one of those can't miss prospects.

-Gerald McCoy, I think I like this pick to the Lions. I think most just automatically put Okung there figuring a LT for Stafford makes sense. I don't really think Backus has been all that bad. McCoy is the better value, but the DT class is a lot deeper. They might have to flip a coin in this scenario.

-Jason Pierre-Paul, I know it's the Raiders but I don't know about this one. Do you think they will ever learn?

-Taylor Mays, just seems like his stock has plummeted. I think he could be an in the box SS somewhat in the mold of Troy Polamalu, but a projection like that is pretty lofty and risky to take that high. I absolutely don't think he'll be a FS.

-Trent Williams, at #13? I think he's absolutely not a LT prospect and maybe not even a RT prospect. He might wind up playing guard. I think he goes in the 2nd round. Still might be a 49er though.

-Arrelious Benn, is it just me or is he similar to Heyward-Bey. Great athlete, he should put a show on at the combine. But what type of football player is he? Similar to DHB last year, you could turn on an Illinois game and maybe not even notice him. I realize the QB was an issue, but so was Reggie Ball when he was throwing to Calvin Johnson.

-Terrance Cody, I think there are too many 3-4 teams passing on Cody in this mock. Nose tackle is such a vital position to the 3-4, and there just aren't many NT prospects out there.

-Anthony Davis, I think he goes a lot higher. Swap him for Trent Williams and I think you have a more likely scenario.

-Patrick Robinson, entered the season as many scouts top CB. I think his mediocre play has killed his stock. Mid 2nd is the highest I see him going baring a rebound during the off season.

-Jared Odrick, might be this years Tyson Jackson. I think he's a top 15 prospect for any sceme but his ability to play DE in a 3-4 I think will earn him a big payday.

CJSchneider
12-17-2009, 07:56 AM
Scott, I love the 49er and Saints picks. You are right on the money with them so far this year. The only way I see the 49ers not drafting Williams or Hayden is if for some odd reason;
a)Berry falls to us and b) Williams just stinks up the combine.

As for the Weatherspoon pick, I really hope he is there at #32
(I know that was a typo, right :) )
If not, I see Brian Price or maybe Everson Griffen as a possibility.

DiG
12-17-2009, 08:21 AM
clausen to the skins scares the crap out of me. the skins arent that far away from being a playoff team and drafting/paying a top 10 qb will set us back farther than necessary. reaching on an OT is possible but id prefer a trade back in that scenario. other guys that could be good fits would be mcclain, haden, or spiller.

Day One Pick
12-17-2009, 08:34 AM
clausen to the skins scares the crap out of me. the skins arent that far away from being a playoff team and drafting/paying a top 10 qb will set us back farther than necessary. reaching on an OT is possible but id prefer a trade back in that scenario. other guys that could be good fits would be mcclain, haden, or spiller.

McClain would be a nice pick to go along with last years 1st round pick Brian Orakpo. Nice pair of young LB's. London Fletcher is still solid, but he has to be getting near the end. McClain could really benefit from a season learning from Fletcher.

619
12-17-2009, 08:35 AM
The one pick that caught me by surprise was the Steelers' pick because of all their woes in the secondary I thought it would be a lock that they would go corner. Then I realized that since Haden came off the board the pick before there was no value for justifying another corner that early.

If the Raiders decide to keep Ellis around for one more year then I would be a big fan of the JPP selection. The team would have depth at the position to survive a season or two, while JPP continues to work into his immense potential, which is by far the greatest of any defensive end that should be available. I would go as far as saying that on potential alone he is one of the five or six best players in this class. A classic Raider pick indeed.

DiG
12-17-2009, 08:39 AM
McClain would be a nice pick to go along with last years 1st round pick Brian Orakpo. Nice pair of young LB's. London Fletcher is still solid, but he has to be getting near the end. McClain could really benefit from a season learning from Fletcher.

Actually the primary benefit would be moving orakpo more to de as a full time job. when he lines up with his hand on the ground he has been unblockable. mcintosh has been amazing this year and hopefully will be a key player in our defense for a long time. you are right that working with fletcher would really do wonders for mcclain. fletcher is probably one of the most under appreciated team leaders and field generals in the nfl.

FloridaSkinzFan
12-17-2009, 08:46 AM
clausen to the skins scares the crap out of me. the skins arent that far away from being a playoff team and drafting/paying a top 10 qb will set us back farther than necessary. reaching on an OT is possible but id prefer a trade back in that scenario. other guys that could be good fits would be mcclain, haden, or spiller.

pretty much agreee ^

Day One Pick
12-17-2009, 08:48 AM
Actually the primary benefit would be moving orakpo more to de as a full time job. when he lines up with his hand on the ground he has been unblockable. mcintosh has been amazing this year and hopefully will be a key player in our defense for a long time. you are right that working with fletcher would really do wonders for mcclain. fletcher is probably one of the most under appreciated team leaders and field generals in the nfl.

I see. Speaking of McIntosh, I've always liked him and felt he was pretty underrated.

Borat
12-17-2009, 09:00 AM
If Jerry Hughes drops out of the first, the Niners better trade up immediately and get him.

BeerBaron
12-17-2009, 09:01 AM
Does any fan of a team who gets a QB in a mock draft really like it?

That observation aside....

Suh is going to be really, really, really tough for someone to pass on, especially for one of the QBs in Bradford or Clausen, neither of whom I really consider can't miss guys. It's going to be real interesting if the Rams end up #1 overall.

And does anyone know, if both the Rams and Bucs lose out, do the Rams for sure get to pick ahead of them? If not, the Bucs would definitely make it real easy on the Rams and take Suh right out of the equation...

PACKmanN
12-17-2009, 09:02 AM
Wouldn't mind the Packers pick at all.

Day One Pick
12-17-2009, 09:09 AM
The one pick that caught me by surprise was the Steelers' pick because of all their woes in the secondary I thought it would be a lock that they would go corner. Then I realized that since Haden came off the board the pick before there was no value for justifying another corner that early.

If the Raiders decide to keep Ellis around for one more year then I would be a big fan of the JPP selection. The team would have depth at the position to survive a season or two, while JPP continues to work into his immense potential, which is by far the greatest of any defensive end that should be available. I would go as far as saying that on potential alone he is one of the five or six best players in this class. A classic Raider pick indeed.

No position is a lock for the Steelers in the first round. It's BPA that fits a need. In this case Spiller meets that criteria. The accuracy of this pick would just depend on how thier board is stacked. I actually think the pick would be Terrance Cody or Anthony Davis based on this mock.

I expect the Steelers board at this point would look something like this. Real simple, the best player on the board is the choice.

1 Eric Berry, SS/CB, Tennessee*
2 Ndamukong Suh, DT/DE, Nebraska
3 Gerald McCoy, DT/DE, Oklahoma*
4 Russell Okung, OT, Oklahoma State
5 Rolando McClain, ILB/OLB, Alabama*
6 Joe Haden, CB, Florida*
7 Terrence Cody, DT/NT, Alabama
8 Anthony Davis, OT, Rutgers*
9 C.J. Spiller, RB, Clemson
10 Brandon Spikes, ILB, Florida
11 Dan Williams, DT/NT, Tennessee
12 Jared Odrick, DT/DE, Penn State
13 Earl Thomas, SS/CB, Texas#
TRADE DOWN IN THE FIRST ROUND
14 Mike Iupati, OG/OT, Idaho
15 Jahvid Best, RB, California*
16 Bruce Campbell, OT, Maryland*
17 Carlos Dunlap, DE, Florida*
18 Jason Fox, OT, Miami
19 Morgan Burnett, SS, Georgia Tech*
20 Maurkice Pouncey, C, Florida*
TRADE OUT OF THE FIRST ROUND
21 Donovan Warren, CB, Michigan*
22 Trent Williams, OT/OG, Oklahoma
23 Perrish Cox, CB, Oklahoma State
24 Chad Jones, SS/FS, Louisiana State*
25 Arthur Jones, DT/DE, Syracuse
26 Vince Oghobaase, DT/DE, Duke
27 John Asamoah, OG, Illinois
28 Eric Olsen, C, Notre Dame
29 Charles Brown, OT, Southern California
30 Eric Norwood, OLB/ILB, South Carolina
31 Patrick Robinson, CB, Florida State
32 Trevard Lindley, CB, Kentucky
TRADE DOWN IN THE SECOND ROUND
33 Reshad Jones, FS, Georgia*
34 Brandon Ghee, CB, Wake Forest
35 Nate Allen, FS, South Florida
36 Rodney Hudson, OG, Florida State*
37 Major Wright, FS, Florida*
38 Ras-I Dowling, CB, Virginia*
TRADE OUT OF THE SECOND ROUND
39 Syd'Quan Thompson, CB, California
40 Ryan Mathews, RB, Fresno State
41 Allen Bailey, DT/DE, Miami
42 Joe McKnight, RB, Southern California*
43 Micah Johnson, ILB, Kentucky
44 Darrell Stuckey, SS/FS, Kansas
45 DeAndre McDaniel, SS, Clemson*
46 Sergio Render, OG, Virginia Tech
47 Kam Chancellor, FS, Virginia Tech
48 Sam Young, OT/OG, Notre Dame
49 Adrian Clayborn, DE, Iowa*
50 Selvish Capers, OT, West Virginia

DiG
12-17-2009, 10:07 AM
I see. Speaking of McIntosh, I've always liked him and felt he was pretty underrated.

He has hands down been one of the best most consistent players on our defense this year.

drowe
12-17-2009, 10:09 AM
-Really applaud you going out on a limb with JPP like this. I have no opinions of him, but the way you're taking every opportunity possible to make the bold prediction that this guy is gonna go not only in the first, but the early first is a refreshing change of pace from other draft experts. I'll be pulling for him just so you can look like a genius in April.

-The way the draft goes, I like the Packers pick.

-So, Carlos Dunlap staying in school, or did the DUI drop him out of the first?

Splat
12-17-2009, 10:21 AM
I would not mind the Chiefs drafting Russell Okung it would fill a need that said I would prefer Eric Berry or Rolando McClain.

The Chiefs might have the worst set of starting safeties in the NFL and teams have took advantage of that all year with deep passing plays.

As for their LB's Tamba Hali has been a pleasant surprise but other then him they are really hurting at the LB position they REALLY lack that force in the middle.

With two second round picks like you said I could see the Chiefs going a number of different ways in round one.

Halsey
12-17-2009, 10:25 AM
Agree with the Falcons pick, but I think maybe finding someone to boost the pass rush will be even more important than finding a CB. Abraham will be 32 by the start of next season and he just doesn't look the same this year. I think you can count on the Falcons releasing either him or Jamaal Anderson. I don't think they can afford to release them both, but they'd probably like to. How bad the Falcons feel they need to add a pass rusher will also depend on how they feel about young DE's Kroy Biermann and Lawrence Sidbury.

This won't be a popular opinion, but I actually think the Falcons could look for a DT earlier than most people expect. Peria Jerry is coming off a knee injury and has a history off durability problems. Jonathan Babineaux just got arrested for marijuana possession, among other charges, so he'll likely be suspended at some point. The depth behind Jerry and Babs is not good. Maybe adding a DT would boost the pass rush.

derza222
12-17-2009, 10:27 AM
Scott, awesome explanation on the Jets' pick. I've got my reservations about them drafting a WR but I think you really hit the nail on the head. Definitely think Edwards will be back for a one year contract and the Jets have nothing beyond their starters at WR. Would help in the near and long term, kind of what a lot of Jets fans were hoping the FO would do last year before Coles got cut last year when he just had a year left on his deal.

I saw on your Twitter that if Mangini is in Cleveland next year you think Kerry Rhodes might land there, and you also mention safety as a need in the writeup. If he does get moved, how early do you think they pop a safety provided the value is right?

BigJohn98
12-17-2009, 10:34 AM
Tim Tebow will not fix our terrible pass rush or terrible offensive line. We need a QUARTERBACK, not an athlete.

bergo23
12-17-2009, 10:38 AM
Are the concerns about system really that significant? He would be the perfect pick for the Bolts late in round one...which you mention as a possibility Scott. I would take the big fella from Idaho though!!!

Is Iupata the best RT prospect after Trent Williams? The Big Fella from UMass is another possibility.

ElectricEye
12-17-2009, 10:40 AM
I like Sapp, but I would prefer Jerry Hughes. They're similar players from a size and measurables standpoint, but Hughes is much more advanced as a pass rusher.

JRTPlaya21
12-17-2009, 10:44 AM
Months ago I would have loved the Clausen pick, but now I'm not completely sour on Campbell. Okung is on top of my Redskins big board at this point.

thebow305
12-17-2009, 11:26 AM
Perfect Phins pick! I'm so glad you came back to "Mount Cody" for the Phins. NT is going to be our biggest need if Ferguson doesn't return, and even if he does, he's got one year left at the most, and that would be great to bring in Cody to groom as the future replacement in the middle.

rfc17
12-17-2009, 11:35 AM
No offense but as a Jags fan I think having us take Tebow is just laziness. I see a lot of mocks doing this. And I think folks just throw Tebow at us so they dont actually have to do any research on the team. Its just an easy pick.

However, other than the one quote from Weaver saying theyd "consider" Tebow because of his star power, there has been no inidcation from anyone in the organization, especially those who actually pick the players aka Gene Smith, that they are interested. In fact, most reports are that we dont like Tebow as a QB. maybe its a smokescreen but I think most intelligent scouts realize Tebow is too much of a reach for the first round. And with Gene Smith, I think the Jaguars do in fact have an intelligent GM.

They claim to draft under the Best Player Available philosophy however I think need influences their decisions slightly. And having major needs on both the offensive and defensive line, I think itd be a surprise if they didnt go line in the first round. maybe they draft a QB if someone like Clausen falls, but it definitely wont be Tebow.

Halsey
12-17-2009, 11:48 AM
No offense but as a Jags fan I think having us take Tebow is just laziness. I see a lot of mocks doing this. And I think folks just throw Tebow at us so they dont actually have to do any research on the team. Its just an easy pick.

However, other than the one quote from Weaver saying theyd "consider" Tebow because of his star power, there has been no inidcation from anyone in the organization, especially those who actually pick the players aka Gene Smith, that they are interested. In fact, most reports are that we dont like Tebow as a QB. maybe its a smokescreen but I think most intelligent scouts realize Tebow is too much of a reach for the first round. And with Gene Smith, I think the Jaguars do in fact have an intelligent GM.

They claim to draft under the Best Player Available philosophy however I think need influences their decisions slightly. And having major needs on both the offensive and defensive line, I think itd be a surprise if they didnt go line in the first round. maybe they draft a QB if someone like Clausen falls, but it definitely wont be Tebow.

Actually, you're the one being lazy. There has been more than one quote from the owner of the Jags regarding Tim Tebow. There are also fans and even the governor of the state of Florida calling for the Jags to draft Tebow. Part of the reason is a need to sell tickets. All you're doing is trying to put your own spin on what is being said based on your own personal feelings.

Borat
12-17-2009, 12:03 PM
God, I want the Jags to actually draft Tebow so badly. The amount of crow dished out would be breathtaking.

holt_bruce81
12-17-2009, 12:07 PM
Love the Rams pick. Love where you have Weatherspoon going.

It's Suh or Bradford for me, I really don't think any other QB in the draft warrants top 10 consideration. I know a lot of people are high on Clausen, but he has a lot of growing up to do.

keylime_5
12-17-2009, 12:16 PM
Berry to Brown is dream scenario this year. I think we might not have a top 3 pick but rather a pick in the 4-6 range b/c we'll probably beat either Oakland or Kansas City (or both? - doubtfully) in the next two weeks. I think St.Louis takes Suh too even though they need a QB bad.

vidae
12-17-2009, 12:28 PM
Always look forward to your mocks, it's the main reason I'm even on this site to begin with, but I'm not loving the KC pick.

If you look at this team, most of the problems we're having along the offensive line is the interior, not the tackles. Branden Albert has struggled a bit this year, but I'm confident he can be our LT for many years to come, and Ryan O'Callaghan, who we picked up off of waivers, has played better than expected at RT.

But Vidae, why not draft Okung and move Branden Albert to G if you're having interior OL problems? Branden Albert has played well enough to keep his job. He has started at LT since he was drafted and I'd be worried about moving him now. We have two picks in the early second and a pick in the early third to use on interior offensive lineman, like Mike Iupati and Matt Tennant.

Because of that, I'd much rather have Rolando McClain (I'm on his bandwagon now big time) or Eric Berry.

The Chiefs only have one starting caliber LB on the roster, Tamba Hali. Derrick Johnson most likely will not be back next year, Vrable is solid but nothing special, and Corey Mays and Demorrio Williams are backups at best. McClain would come in right away and be an impact player on our defense. Our defensive line seems to be doing their job, but our linebackers can't make the plays needed to stop anyone. Plus, we have a decent track record of drafting LBs from Alabama. :D

As for Safety, the Chiefs are starting Mike Brown (who is absolutely terrible) and Jon McGraw (who is our special teams captain and solid for a backup safety role) right now. It doesn't get much uglier than that. Eric Berry is clearly an upgrade over both.

Either one of these guys would make a much bigger impact than Okung. It seems to me that we absolutely must come out of the first round with one of those guys to make a positive step forward.

tl;dr: Good KC pick, but McClain or Berry would be better.

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 12:39 PM
I like Iupati but not in the first, especially to the Chargers where his future is a little clouded given his multipositional nature. The organization remains high on Clary and now Dombrowski isn't sucking...if anyone is going to beat them out it's going to be a true RT.

I miss Cody. Sigh.

I would swap Bradford and Clausen but I know that's all up in the air right now.

Smooth Criminal
12-17-2009, 12:40 PM
Don't like how this draft goes for the Steelers. I really wanna land McClain, Haden, or Mays and if they're all off the board Id rather trade down and try to get Cody.

Locker going back to school really makes this draft top heavy with defensive players.

vikes_28
12-17-2009, 12:44 PM
The Vikings pick is ok. I would rather see us take a safety there, but nonetheless, Austin would be a great eventual replacement for Fatty Patty.

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 12:46 PM
Actually, you're the one being lazy. There has been more than one quote from the owner of the Jags regarding Tim Tebow. There are also fans and even the governor of the state of Florida calling for the Jags to draft Tebow. Part of the reason is a need to sell tickets. All you're doing is trying to put your own spin on what is being said based on your own personal feelings.

Actually, he's not being lazy. There's been more than one quote, yes, but they all stemmed from one singular interview.

If Weaver had any say in personnel matters, I'd say there's a chance. But he doesn't, and he likes it that way. He lets his football people handle his football business.

Also, there's Vic Ketchman. Ketchman is the senior reporter for Jaguars.com and gives a lot of inside information to what people upstairs in the organization are thinking. He basically told the readers that the Jags would draft Marcedes Lewis a month before it happened. Well, everyday Ketchman does an "Ask Vic" question and answer column. Every question concerning Tebow to the Jags is met with an "I wouldn't worry about that" answer, leading me to believe that the people upstairs don't think very highly of him.

If they DO select him, I could see it happening in the third round. I will stop smoking weed forever if they take him in the first round, that's how confident I am it won't happen. We don't have a pick in the second, but he's a third round value and I wouldn't complain about that.

coordinator0
12-17-2009, 12:46 PM
-Arrelious Benn, is it just me or is he similar to Heyward-Bey. Great athlete, he should put a show on at the combine. But what type of football player is he? Similar to DHB last year, you could turn on an Illinois game and maybe not even notice him. I realize the QB was an issue, but so was Reggie Ball when he was throwing to Calvin Johnson.


That's why Calvin was an elite prospect and one of the best of the decade. Benn isn't, and I'm pretty sure there isn't anybody claiming him to be.

I like this pick for the Ravens. It's clearly a need and the value is there as well.

CC.SD
12-17-2009, 12:50 PM
If they DO select him, I could see it happening in the third round. I will stop smoking weed forever if they take him in the first round, that's how confident I am it won't happen. We don't have a pick in the second, but he's a third round value and I wouldn't complain about that.

You're sticking your neck out for no reason here YFS! I wouldn't be at all surprised to see the Tebow Mandate come down from ownership, although I definitely don't think he's first round value.

marshallb
12-17-2009, 01:00 PM
The Vikings pick is ok. I would rather see us take a safety there, but nonetheless, Austin would be a great eventual replacement for Fatty Patty.

He'd be a good replacement, but I don't think DT is a big need. Kennedy and Evans have been playing well in rotation and the Vikings have bigger needs, most namely, S and QB, and possibly DE if Edwards leaves. I'd also much rather have Weatherspoon there to upgrade/replace Leber.

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 01:05 PM
You're sticking your neck out for no reason here YFS! I wouldn't be at all surprised to see the Tebow Mandate come down from ownership, although I definitely don't think he's first round value.

I think Wayne Weaver is smart enough to know that Tebow wouldn't be anything more than slapping a band aid on a gash.

It's not like they're just coming up a couple thousand short on the blackout list every year. They're 30,000+ people short, and this is for a team that is challenging for a wildcard spot. How many tickets does Tebow realistically sell for them? 5,000? 10,000? Are people gonna pay for season tickets knowing he'll probably sit on the bench for at least a season?

What happens if Tebow isn't a starting caliber NFL quarterback (very likely)? You've set the development of your team back, plus every dumb redneck in Jacksonville will blame the organization for him failing.

It's a lose/lose situation. You sell a few more thousand tickets for a season or two, then the entire experiment comes crashing down around you. As a matter of fact, if they select Tebow, I'm willing to bet they'll have relocated to LA within three years.

vikes_28
12-17-2009, 01:06 PM
I will stop smoking weed forever if they take him in the first round, that's how confident I am it won't happen.

I'm holding you to this in a sig quote. :D

rfc17
12-17-2009, 01:07 PM
Actually, you're the one being lazy. There has been more than one quote from the owner of the Jags regarding Tim Tebow. There are also fans and even the governor of the state of Florida calling for the Jags to draft Tebow. Part of the reason is a need to sell tickets. All you're doing is trying to put your own spin on what is being said based on your own personal feelings.

yea because the governor is clearly in charge of drafting players for the jaguars. may as well say hey a radio caller wants Tebow so its gonna happen!

anyone who lives in town and follows the team closely knows that the ones in charge of drafting personnel are not interested in Tebow. whether it be reading the teams online columnist, whether it be listening to their interviews on the radio, or whether it be following the media with connections to the organization, its evident that the ones in charge of drafting arent intereseted in Tebow. at least not in the first round. but just because Weaver was asked at a business lunch months ago about Tebow and he says the guy has star power and may sell some extra tickets, DONE DEAL, Jags drafting Tebow!

its an easy pick for people putting together mock drafts. requires no thought and no effort. thats what it is. even as Tebow's stock is dropping like a rock, you still see folks having the Jags take him in their mocks. I like Tebow as much as the next person but go around to different message boards and talk to folks who really follow the Jags and the draft. We're all in agreement that the Jags arent taking him in the first round. But that requires effort.

scottyboy
12-17-2009, 01:12 PM
Like the Giants pick, but am sad panda at how low Anthony Davis is :(

yourfavestoner
12-17-2009, 01:23 PM
yea because the governor is clearly in charge of drafting players for the jaguars. may as well say hey a radio caller wants Tebow so its gonna happen!

anyone who lives in town and follows the team closely knows that the ones in charge of drafting personnel are not interested in Tebow. whether it be reading the teams online columnist, whether it be listening to their interviews on the radio, or whether it be following the media with connections to the organization, its evident that the ones in charge of drafting arent intereseted in Tebow. at least not in the first round. but just because Weaver was asked at a business lunch months ago about Tebow and he says the guy has star power and may sell some extra tickets, DONE DEAL, Jags drafting Tebow!

its an easy pick for people putting together mock drafts. requires no thought and no effort. thats what it is. even as Tebow's stock is dropping like a rock, you still see folks having the Jags take him in their mocks. I like Tebow as much as the next person but go around to different message boards and talk to folks who really follow the Jags and the draft. We're all in agreement that the Jags arent taking him in the first round. But that requires effort.

^^^ this post is win.

HawkeyeFan
12-17-2009, 02:31 PM
Yuck! Not a fan of Sam Bradford in the 1st Round, let alone #1!

I hope I'm wrong.

Babylon
12-17-2009, 02:33 PM
Berry to Brown is dream scenario this year. I think we might not have a top 3 pick but rather a pick in the 4-6 range b/c we'll probably beat either Oakland or Kansas City (or both? - doubtfully) in the next two weeks. I think St.Louis takes Suh too even though they need a QB bad.

I dont see the upside with Bradford, sort of looks like the Alex Smith if it does happen. Good for the player bad for the team.

Unbiased
12-17-2009, 02:35 PM
Actually, you're the one being lazy. There has been more than one quote from the owner of the Jags regarding Tim Tebow. There are also fans and even the governor of the state of Florida calling for the Jags to draft Tebow. Part of the reason is a need to sell tickets. All you're doing is trying to put your own spin on what is being said based on your own personal feelings.

Christ.

Gene Smith is the general manager. He's the one who makes the draft picks. Why don't you see what he had to say about Tim Tebow.

Bottom line is Tebow is highly unlikely to be the BPA there, so it's highly unlikely he would be the pick.

I hate to come across like that, but do some research.

RaiderNation
12-17-2009, 02:52 PM
I guess JPP is better than Dunlap

Halsey
12-17-2009, 02:56 PM
I'm not gonna spend a lot time arguing with people who are just going to spin what others say to fit their own feelings. Gene Smith didn't say the Jags wouldn't Draft Tebow. That may be what you want to spin it to, but it's not what he said. He said the Jags wouldn't Draft Tebow based solely on marketing. He said they would only Draft him if he was the best player. Don't try to tell me you know whether or not Tebow will be considered by the Jags to be the best player.

And another thing: The whole line teams give about best player is just to appease fans. Many fans believe in this nonsensical idea that's there's some sure way to measure who the 'Best Player' is, as if there's some way to quantify that. Don't try to tell me need doesn't play a role when the Jags spent their top 2 picks to address their obvious need for O-lineman.

Todd Bertuzzi
12-17-2009, 03:00 PM
Not a fan of the Robinson pick. I was really underwhelmed with what I saw this year and I don't think he's a first round pick. CB is a need, but to be honest the only corner i would feel happy with in the 1st round is Haden and he should be long gone by the time we're picking. I'd prefer a DE like Romeus.

Babylon
12-17-2009, 03:18 PM
Christ.

Gene Smith is the general manager. He's the one who makes the draft picks. Why don't you see what he had to say about Tim Tebow.

Bottom line is Tebow is highly unlikely to be the BPA there, so it's highly unlikely he would be the pick.

I hate to come across like that, but do some research.

Keep in mind though that GMs have their paycheck signed by the owner. If the boss says draft so and so they will, might not like it but probably like eating better.

JRTPlaya21
12-17-2009, 03:25 PM
Like the Giants pick, but am sad panda at how low Anthony Davis is :(

Well I believe I saw Davis to the Giants in one of Scott's buddies mocks. That would just put you on cloud 9 I bet Scotty.

keylime_5
12-17-2009, 03:34 PM
i really don't get the tebow hype in the draft. People say he'll either be a late first or possibly 2nd rounder. He'll likely be picked as a TE or H-B. Even a guy who is gonna be a pretty good TE or H-B in the NFL, he would never be a first or second round pick if he's never ever ever played the position in his life. He's probably not that fast and probably doesn't have great hands. I wouldn't touch Tebow until about the 4th round at the eariest. His upside is vastly overrated (shocking, I know). If the rest of the NFL is right in the head, the Jags could be able to draft Tebow with their 2nd or even 3rd pick.

MidwayMonster31
12-17-2009, 03:37 PM
Didn't the owner for the Titans decide on picking Vince Young, while Jeff Fisher and Floyd Reese wanted Leinart? It could happen with the Jags owner.
But, overall good job. There's a lot of talent in the first round.
There's not much to argue with the Lions taking Gerald McCoy, since I think he's a better overall prospect than Okung and will instantly make that defense better. Also, Jason Fox, Charles Brown and Bruce Campbell could still be there in the second round for the Lions.
I think the 49ers could've done better with those picks. Gore and Spiller would make for a filthy combo. I also don't think Trent Williams is worth it at 13.
For Tennessee, I can't argue with a defensive end, I'm just not sure that Kindle will play 4-3 DE in the NFL.
Philadelphia has always found good cornerbacks later in the draft. I think Brandon Graham, or Sean Weatherspoon would help them out more.
The Bucs, Browns, Seahawks, Broncos, Falcons, Texans, Giants, Dolphins Cardinals, Packers, Chargers and Saints had great picks. Atlanta, Arizona and Houston were my favorite picks.

Thumper
12-17-2009, 03:38 PM
Donovan Warren or Kyle Wilson >>>>>> Patrick Robinson

murdamal86
12-17-2009, 03:44 PM
Donovan Warren or Kyle Wilson >>>>>> Patrick Robinson

True enough my friend

Bald_81
12-17-2009, 04:01 PM
It pains me to see you write "Jake Locker would've been a slam dunk for this pick" in reference to the Rams..oh, what could've been!

I don't think we're going to go Bradford, barring a trade down. If we stay at #1, we're going to take Suh because even if Bradford tests out medically there are still some injury concerns as well as how he'll transition to a pro-style offense. Now, if we get someone infatuated with Suh and therefore trade down, all bets are off and I can definitely see us taking him.

Cigaro
12-17-2009, 04:26 PM
Jason Pierre-Paul...way too early. If they're really going to reach that much, it'll be for Ricky Sapp, who should have the best combine of all defensive lineman.

Tim Tebow...don't see him as anything close to a first round pick come Draft Day.

Dan Williams...don't see him going that early, although it is a possibility.

Corey Wootton...still don't see this guy as first-round material. Is nothing like he was last year, and we should not forget that last year was also his only good year. He did get better as the season progressed, so it'll be his postseason work that'll make it or break it for me.

Marvin Austin...good to see you continue to drop him since putting him at around 15 to the Texans. I could see this pick realistically.

I like the Golden Tate pick.

yaga
12-17-2009, 04:26 PM
For the Texans, the EarL Thomas pick is OK but I don't see it happening. The Texans generally view the Safety position like the RB position on offense where they feel like they can get talent in the later rounds for the position. Most glaring needs for the Texans are DT, CB, RB, OG and FS in that order. With Hayden most likely gone, I think they would go with Dan Williams.

NGSeiler
12-17-2009, 04:45 PM
I really have a hard time seeing the Rams pass on Suh if he's there for the taking.

The Rams didn't have a problem passing on Matt Ryan for Chris Long, nor did they have a problem passing on Mark Sanchez for Jason Smith. While you could argue that previously passing on franchise QBs means they may be more likely to take one now, I think the bigger point is that they aren't afraid to pass on a quarterback if there's better talent on the board.

You know I love your work, Scott. But this one just doesn't taste right. If Suh's off the board, I have a much easier time seeing the QB pick. But if Suh is available, I think it's a no brainer. Especially for a team that's had to play guys like LaJuan Ramsey and Leger Douzable at DT this season and whose best interior DL is Clifton Ryan.

Halsey
12-17-2009, 06:46 PM
I really have a hard time seeing the Rams pass on Suh if he's there for the taking.

The Rams didn't have a problem passing on Matt Ryan for Chris Long, nor did they have a problem passing on Mark Sanchez for Jason Smith. While you could argue that previously passing on franchise QBs means they may be more likely to take one now, I think the bigger point is that they aren't afraid to pass on a quarterback if there's better talent on the board.

You know I love your work, Scott. But this one just doesn't taste right. If Suh's off the board, I have a much easier time seeing the QB pick. But if Suh is available, I think it's a no brainer. Especially for a team that's had to play guys like LaJuan Ramsey and Leger Douzable at DT this season and whose best interior DL is Clifton Ryan.

Passing on Ryan and Sanchez the last 2 years is why the Rams are playing with Kyle Boller and Craig Nall at QB this year. It's also a big reason they are likely to be picking #1 in the 2010 Draft. There may be better 'talents' on the board, but quality at the QB position is the biggest difference between the good and the bad teams in the NFL.

And people saying they don't like this QB prospect or that QB prospect say that every year about every QB prospect. NFL teams can't let fan's fear of QB's dictate how they draft.

holt_bruce81
12-17-2009, 07:00 PM
Passing on Ryan and Sanchez the last 2 years is why the Rams are playing with Kyle Boller and Craig Nall at QB this year. It's also a big reason they are likely to be picking #1 in the 2010 Draft. There may be better 'talents' on the board, but quality at the QB position is the biggest difference between the good and the bad teams in the NFL.

And people saying they don't like this QB prospect or that QB prospect say that every year about every QB prospect. NFL teams can't let fan's fear of QB's dictate how they draft.

It's Keith Null.......shame on you! lol

NGSeiler
12-17-2009, 10:56 PM
Passing on Ryan and Sanchez the last 2 years is why the Rams are playing with Kyle Boller and Craig Nall at QB this year. It's also a big reason they are likely to be picking #1 in the 2010 Draft. There may be better 'talents' on the board, but quality at the QB position is the biggest difference between the good and the bad teams in the NFL.

Poor quarterback play has certainly been a factor. But so has poor offensive line play, and the depletion of talent at wide receiver. Plus the Rams have had one of the NFL's worst defenses for about half a decade now. Take your pick, they're all issues.

This is a 1-12 football team for more reasons than the quarterback; plugging in a new face of the franchise isn't the magic wand that's suddenly going to make them good, because they have so many areas that need improvement. That's why, IMO, you take the best player on the board there. Because you need an awful lot of help when you're 1-12.

It's not as if I'm arguing against ANY quarterback for the Rams. They could easily take one in the second round (unless I missed him, doesn't Colt McCoy fall out of the 1st in Scott's mock?). I just prefer to see the Rams use their top pick on the best talent available at a position of need. Which, IMO, is Suh.

And people saying they don't like this QB prospect or that QB prospect say that every year about every QB prospect. NFL teams can't let fan's fear of QB's dictate how they draft.

Right, but my response wasn't, "I don't like the Rams pick because I hate Sam Bradford." My objection was because I think there's a more talented prospect available, one whom the Rams could certainly use. It's not a fan's fear of a QB but rather a fan's perception of who is the best prospect available. IMO, it's Suh. And if there's any truth to the Peter King report from Sunday night, a lot of people around the league seem to agree. If the Rams were picking a few spots lower, I think one of the QBs would make a lot of sense. But not with Suh on the board, and not first overall.

Anyways, I'd hate to derail Scott's thread by making it about the Rams, so I'll leave it at that.

Splat
12-17-2009, 10:59 PM
And people saying they don't like this QB prospect or that QB prospect say that every year about every QB prospect. NFL teams can't let fan's fear of QB's dictate how they draft.

This is true fans have a fear of taking a QB that high my self being one of them a big part of that being if they fail your team fails for years.

Flyboy
12-18-2009, 12:31 AM
Mmmm, Sean Weatherspoon.

Sniper
12-18-2009, 12:59 AM
While I can understand the selection of another CB, I would much prefer a DE. Preferably an undersized one from Michigan with a non-stop motor, great production and a very balanced game.

Bengalsrocket
12-18-2009, 01:02 AM
This is true fans have a fear of taking a QB that high my self being one of them a big part of that being if they fail your team fails for years.

If your team needs a QB (which you would in order to draft one that high) then you will fail for years anyways.

Its alright if a fan genuinely dislikes a QB prospect, or parts of his game, but for the most part, there's only 1 way out of sucking, and that's to draft the next QB.

The most recent team to have a turn around with out drafting a top QB was the Dolphins from 07-08, and they lucked out with a big free agent pick up in Chad Pennington to be their stop-gap QB while Henne was developing (and he's still developing, so it's not like their situation has turned out perfectly yet).

Outside of getting extremely lucky, your best chance at becoming a better team is to have a better QB. Every team has to do it eventually, even the ones that get lucky from time to time end up having to draft another QB eventually.

Not that I don't understand your reasoning, but your logic is flawed.

CC.SD
12-18-2009, 01:37 AM
I really have a hard time seeing the Rams pass on Suh if he's there for the taking.

The Rams didn't have a problem passing on Matt Ryan for Chris Long, nor did they have a problem passing on Mark Sanchez for Jason Smith. While you could argue that previously passing on franchise QBs means they may be more likely to take one now, I think the bigger point is that they aren't afraid to pass on a quarterback if there's better talent on the board.

You know I love your work, Scott. But this one just doesn't taste right. If Suh's off the board, I have a much easier time seeing the QB pick. But if Suh is available, I think it's a no brainer. Especially for a team that's had to play guys like LaJuan Ramsey and Leger Douzable at DT this season and whose best interior DL is Clifton Ryan.

Well they passed on those guys and somehow got worse after picking 2nd overall twice in a row. Sooner or later they just have to bite the bullet and get a fresh signal caller in there. I love Suh too but enough is enough with these linemen at the top of the draft while the QB position leaves the team completely unable to win games or even field a competitive team.

KCStud
12-18-2009, 02:08 AM
Scott, I just don't see KC targeting Okung first. I think Branden Albert is most definitely good enough to be our LT. He had to lose a lot of weight and adjust to a new system, plus about half of his sacks given up were from Cassel holding onto the ball too long. Pioli actually said in a recent interview that he liked his young players such as his OLB Tamba Hali, CB Brandon Flowers, RB Jamaal Charles and LT Branden Albert.

I honestly think McClain and Bryant are the frontrunners at this point. KC has no leadership and talent in the middle of the defense and we are the worst in the NFL in drops.

McClain would personally be my pick, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was Bryant or Okung.

will99890
12-18-2009, 03:08 AM
I'm liking the Haden pick, but a pass rusher would be more important. And the Trent Williams pick scares me. I would take Anthony Davis or Brian Bulaga over Williams all day. Davis and Jerry Hughes = perfect 1st round imo.

Sniper
12-18-2009, 03:14 AM
Donovan Warren or Kyle Wilson >>>>>> Patrick Robinson

I'm holding out hope that Warren comes back for one more year.

rfUYuIVbFg0

Aurawolf
12-18-2009, 03:45 PM
Every mock draft on the planet at this point has the Jags picking Tebow, the problem with that is Gene Smith who willbe making the pick said they will go best player available meaning not Tebow. Wayne Weaver just said he would keep an eye on it not we are gaurenteed to pick up Tebow. The Jags have far greater needs right now and will go later for a development QB sometime after the third round.

RealityCheck
12-18-2009, 03:49 PM
Wow, JPP at #7 is kind of shocking.

twizbuck
12-18-2009, 05:47 PM
I really don't like the Bengals pick. We just drafted Coffman, and I know you addressed that, but he's also been hurt, and why would we take yet another injured TE? It's just redundant. I'd rather see us address FS (Ndukwe's the future at SS), DT (though I love the guys we have) or even OL again. Heck, I still think we could use another RB, just not a first rounder unless there's some ridiculous value sitting there.

keylime_5
12-18-2009, 05:51 PM
I think Gresham's a huge steal in the late 20s. Guy would've been a top 15 pick this year, and maybe even so if he had come out last year. Next great TE in the NFL. I'd take him even if I had a healthy Coffman. Coffman is never gonna be anything more than a #2 TE or a slot guy ala Dallas Clark (but no where near that quick or good) due to his blocking liabiity.

vidae
12-18-2009, 05:52 PM
While I can understand the selection of another CB, I would much prefer a DE. Preferably an undersized one from Michigan with a non-stop motor, great production and a very balanced game.

Wow, you're being extremely detailed here. Where will you ever be able to find a player in this years draft that meets all of that criteria?

twizbuck
12-18-2009, 05:58 PM
I think Gresham's a huge steal in the late 20s. Guy would've been a top 15 pick this year, and maybe even so if he had come out last year. Next great TE in the NFL. I'd take him even if I had a healthy Coffman. Coffman is never gonna be anything more than a #2 TE or a slot guy ala Dallas Clark (but no where near that quick or good) due to his blocking liabiity.

While those are all good points, I still think our pick could be used on a position that would better compliment our team. A large reason that the TE has never flourished with us is that our offense doesn't utilize them. It's like the Ohio State of the NFL. We've had guys capable, even Foschi has shown he can catch, but they're never focused on. On top of this, I don't think giving Palmer any more weapons is the answer for him. He's just not the QB he once was, and never will be again.

I'd rather see us build on our strong defense with a star Safety or DT.

twizbuck
12-18-2009, 06:08 PM
I'll say this: maybe if we drafted Gresham, this would change. I just don't want to have to hope and pray for that to happen.

billsfootball15
12-19-2009, 10:47 AM
The Bills are drafting too late for my liking. I cant complain that we are finally winning some games but it is really killing our draft position. Ideal spot for us would be 5 or 6 (we are bad enough to be there) but it looks like we are again going to wind up with 10 or 11. This is not a good spot to be imo. Mel kiper jr said the Bills have a lot of interest in Suh, he said moreso than any other NFL team and he really thinks the Bills will try to trade up to get him. With a pick at 10, it will take that much more to get into top 2. Also, at pick 10 we will miss out on Okung and we desperately need a LT and we may potentially miss out on a guy like Rolando McClain who is going to be an absolute monster in the NFL. With LT being the biggest position of need, I would not be surprised one bit to see the Bills reach for a guy like Anthony Davis out of Rutgers. While I absolutely love Dez Bryant, that pick will only happen if we are able to address the tackle position in free agency.

DreadedDatSkinsFan
12-22-2009, 11:49 AM
Scott please do NOT mock the Skins a QB...

Jason Campbell has proven to not only be one of the toughest qb's in the league, but I believe if he had any type of line he could be a top 10. If he and the WR crew (or at least Thomas and Kelly) would go out put work in together during the off season in order to obtain some type of comradery, I can see him continuing to throw for over 300 yards along with completing 65 plus passing %...all Jimmy Clausen (or any rookie QB) would do is set us back even further.

With that being said the first round pick needs to be Russell Okung!!!!!!!!!!!!! If he is off the board then TRADE DOWN....that is unless Eric Berry falls in our hands (wishful thinking)

Scott Wright
12-22-2009, 12:07 PM
I've been on the record for a while now saying that Jason Campbell is better than most think and that the Redskins should worry about fixing their offensive line.

However, I'm not running the team. Daniel Snyder is, and I think we all know which direction he is going to lean. He doesn't like Campbell and he likes to make a splash.

DreadedDatSkinsFan
12-22-2009, 02:09 PM
Respect, well I have a question for you....I know new coaching staff usually equals new QB, but can you see a scenrio where Bruce Allen has Campbell franchised for the purpose of some sort continuity if nothing else? That would allow us to select a tackle or 2 in the draft which would also benifit Campbell, maybe allowing him to have time in the pocket and proving he is a franchise QB.

CC.SD
12-22-2009, 02:39 PM
Respect, well I have a question for you....I know new coaching staff usually equals new QB, but can you see a scenrio where Bruce Allen has Campbell franchised for the purpose of some sort continuity if nothing else? That would allow us to select a tackle or 2 in the draft which would also benifit Campbell, maybe allowing him to have time in the pocket and proving he is a franchise QB.

The problem with this scenario is that they might not want to have Campbell's continuity. With Zorn assuredly gone and a new GM, along with putrid results on the field, I think everybody goes. Skins should be in a good position to pick up Clausen or Bradford, which is very possible given how badly they wanted Cutler/Sanchez last year.

However if they miss on Clausen (very possible) and decide Bradford's not worth the injury risk, the OT option is going to be there. Bottom line,I don't see them spending franchise tag money at the QB position on a guy who is not part of their long term plan.

molenguinurtle
12-23-2009, 12:59 PM
I'd take Campbell in Jacksonville.

JT Jag
12-23-2009, 01:17 PM
Keep in mind though that GMs have their paycheck signed by the owner. If the boss says draft so and so they will, might not like it but probably like eating better.Please provide any proof that Wayne Weaver has ever meddled in Jaguars personnel affairs in the team's 15-year history, and if you cannot please provide substantial evidence as to why that would change now.

All the other Jaguar fans here have covered why "Tebow to Jacksonville is an easy pick here" is a traditional fallacy. I'm just going to chip in and say that I know several long-term season ticket holders who would GIVE UP their season tickets if we draft Tebow, because then the team is exhibiting that they just don't want to win.

What's better? 10 fans that buy season tickets for one year and then leave when the reason they bought season tickets can't get off the bench/does get off the bench but looks horrible, or 5 fans that have bought tickets for 15 years and will do so for the forseeable future as long as the team is at least trying?

BuffaloBillsFan
12-24-2009, 12:12 AM
To be honest, I would not be angry one bit if Golden Tate was selected with our 10th pick. Terrell Owens will be gone and the rest of receivers suck, Bryant isn't a bad pick but I'm not entirely familiar with him as I've not caught too many Oklahoma State games (1-2 games) but I have watched Tate plenty. He is an awesome receiver, sign me up for Tate if your draft goes as planned.