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Scott Wright
01-01-2010, 03:47 PM
The Senior Bowl just announced that Taylor Mays has accepted his invitation.

Say what you want about those USC players but they aren't afraid to compete!

Can't wait to see Mays in action.

Babylon
01-01-2010, 03:52 PM
^
It's the culture at SC you just keep competing. Mays would probably be one of those guys that cant gain a lot by going to the Senior Bowl (he certainly would at the combine)but he's going. Shows me a lot.

TitanHope
01-01-2010, 03:59 PM
I'm excited to see him go. This will be my first year with NFL Network, so I'll be able to watch the game. As a fan, I want to see the best players play and compete. As long as he doesn't mind getting spun out of his shoes by Hardesty. :cool:

BrabbitMcRabbit
01-01-2010, 06:26 PM
BUST

He might look like an All-Pro in pads, but he plays like The Invisible Woman. Terrible instincts. Never around the ball (unless you count diving on the pile after letting up a huge gain). Mays is simply not a playmaker.

The great safeties like Polamalu, Reed, and Byrd all had a knack for being in the right place at the right time. I've never seen that from Mays. He's just another physical specimen with marginal football skills, which means Al Davis will probably pick him in the top 10 and put him on the mantle alongside Darrius Has-No-Game, JaBustus Russell, and Runt DMC.

Thumper
01-01-2010, 06:40 PM
I'm excited to see him go. This will be my first year with NFL Network, so I'll be able to watch the game. As a fan, I want to see the best players play and compete. As long as he doesn't mind getting spun out of his shoes by Hardesty. :cool:

Woah, you work for the NFL Network? What do you do?

Scott Wright
01-01-2010, 06:40 PM
Woah, you work for the NFL Network? What do you do?

I think he means it's his first year with the NFL Network on his television package. :)

holt_bruce81
01-01-2010, 06:42 PM
Nice to see! Can't wait to see him in action.

Babylon
01-01-2010, 06:48 PM
BUST

He might look like an All-Pro in pads, but he plays like The Invisible Woman. Terrible instincts. Never around the ball (unless you count diving on the pile after letting up a huge gain). Mays is simply not a playmaker.

The great safeties like Polamalu, Reed, and Byrd all had a knack for being in the right place at the right time. I've never seen that from Mays. He's just another physical specimen with marginal football skills, which means Al Davis will probably pick him in the top 10 and put him on the mantle alongside Darrius Has-No-Game, JaBustus Russell, and Runt DMC.


I know we tend to exaggerate a bit in here but i think 268 career tackles would indicate he is around the ball occasionally.

DreadedDatSkinsFan
01-01-2010, 06:48 PM
LOL @ Darius Has-No-Game...lmao

I'm glad Mays is playin tho. He is a bum to me, but its gonna be interesting to see how he plays ...

BrabbitMcRabbit
01-01-2010, 06:58 PM
I know we tend to exaggerate a bit in here but i think 268 career tackles would indicate he is around the ball occasionally.

Yea, he's around the ball all the time when he takes a bad angle, bites on a fake, gets beaten for a 30 yard gain, then runs someone down on the 10 yard line.

Seriously, I've watched great safeties in college. Roy Williams. Ed Reed.Troy Polamalu. Jarrad Page. OJ Atogwe. Jairus Byrd (I know he played CB, but he qualifies). These guys were always around the ball making game-changing plays.

I can't remember a single great play Taylor Mays has made. He's big. He's fast. Who cares? He can't play a lick. He's not a difference maker in the Pac-10. He certainly won't be one in the NFL against bigger, faster, and better competition.

I'm much more intrigued by Rahim Moore. He might not be the specimen that Mays is, but at least he's a real football player.

Scott Wright
01-01-2010, 07:00 PM
Is this like James Laurinaitis being a "pile jumper"?

Thumper
01-01-2010, 07:05 PM
I think he means it's his first year with the NFL Network on his television package. :)

Lol... :o

Anyways, I think Taylor Mays will drop his stock at the Senior Bowl and that his flaws will really be exposed, I'm picturing what happened to Clint Sintim last year, heading in with a first round stock and leaving falling because he didn't do very well during the week.

Scott Wright
01-01-2010, 07:19 PM
Anyways, I think Taylor Mays will drop his stock at the Senior Bowl and that his flaws will really be exposed, I'm picturing what happened to Clint Sintim last year, heading in with a first round stock and leaving falling because he didn't do very well during the week.

I think the reason Sintim struggled is because he was put in a 4-3 defense after playing in a 3-4 his entire college career. He was asked to do new things and didn't adjust well / quickly enough.

BrabbitMcRabbit
01-01-2010, 07:25 PM
Is this like James Laurinaitis being a "pile jumper"?

No, it's like JaMarcus Russell (your #5 ranked player in 2007) being a horrific bust because he had no football instincts to complement his impressive physical talent.

TitanHope
01-01-2010, 07:32 PM
Woah, you work for the NFL Network? What do you do?

Pshh, I wish! But +rep for lettin' me live the dream for a millisecond. :D

I think he means it's his first year with the NFL Network on his television package. :)

DirectTV FTW!!!

Scott Wright
01-01-2010, 08:55 PM
No, it's like JaMarcus Russell (your #5 ranked player in 2007) being a horrific bust because he had no football instincts to complement his impressive physical talent.

Ha, very true.

I missed on Russell despite the warning signs, but so did everyone else.

His arm strength is still breathtaking, unfortunately he is always throwing it to the other team.

ThePudge
01-01-2010, 09:05 PM
I don't see the Senior Bowl week hurting Mays at all. I think it's going to raise some opinions on him, as we all know he can be a practice hero. Most NFL personnel is gone and watches only a little footage of the game itself, the practices are what really get picked apart. As a Safety, I'm not so sure how demanding his week of practice will be. Generally speaking, I think the Senior Bowl is more telling for OL/DL, QBs, RBs, FBs, and WRs/CBs. Scott may be able to correct me on that, but I figure you get more one on one matchups/opportunites at those positions and more of a chance to compare to their peers. As I said though, I would expect Mays to excel in a practice setting.

FUNBUNCHER
01-01-2010, 09:22 PM
Is this like James Laurinaitis being a "pile jumper"?


LOL!!!

I must have said that about Laurinaitis to my friends a million times heading up to the '09 draft!:rolleyes:

ThePudge
01-01-2010, 09:29 PM
LOL!!!

I must have said that about Laurinaitis to my friedns a million times heading up to the '09 draft!:rolleyes:

That was the famous Sniper quote hahah Some points he made were very valid there, but as a whole, James was clearly a good football player. 115 Tackles as a rookie through 15 starts for the last place Rams. Like many of us said, he's not perfect, but he should be fine.

Hines
01-02-2010, 12:42 AM
BUST

He might look like an All-Pro in pads, but he plays like The Invisible Woman. Terrible instincts. Never around the ball (unless you count diving on the pile after letting up a huge gain). Mays is simply not a playmaker.

The great safeties like Polamalu, Reed, and Byrd all had a knack for being in the right place at the right time. I've never seen that from Mays. He's just another physical specimen with marginal football skills, which means Al Davis will probably pick him in the top 10 and put him on the mantle alongside Darrius Has-No-Game, JaBustus Russell, and Runt DMC.

This was his first season. I don't think you can call him great yet.

I think Mays will be fine. He is a centerfielder and USC had him playing closer to the box this season. He doesn't have the greatest ball skills, but he seems to be playing with more athletic ability than actual football sense and technique.

Also, are the Jags and Niners the coaches again?

SickwithIt1010
01-02-2010, 02:23 AM
BUST

He might look like an All-Pro in pads, but he plays like The Invisible Woman. Terrible instincts. Never around the ball (unless you count diving on the pile after letting up a huge gain). Mays is simply not a playmaker.

The great safeties like Polamalu, Reed, and Byrd all had a knack for being in the right place at the right time. I've never seen that from Mays. He's just another physical specimen with marginal football skills, which means Al Davis will probably pick him in the top 10 and put him on the mantle alongside Darrius Has-No-Game, JaBustus Russell, and Runt DMC.

sounds like someone is a little bit of a hater...

Saints-Tigers
01-02-2010, 04:01 AM
^
It's the culture at SC you just keep competing. Mays would probably be one of those guys that cant gain a lot by going to the Senior Bowl (he certainly would at the combine)but he's going. Shows me a lot.


I disagree, I think he can gain a lot in terms of showing things he can do. Whether he does or not is up for debate, but if he has a strong week and a strong showing in the game, he can definitely move up my own draft board.

D-Unit
01-02-2010, 04:10 AM
Mays really needs to fall to the Cowboys. It's the best thing that could happen. I'm really hoping that he stinks it up.

Babylon
01-02-2010, 12:14 PM
I disagree, I think he can gain a lot in terms of showing things he can do. Whether he does or not is up for debate, but if he has a strong week and a strong showing in the game, he can definitely move up my own draft board.

I guess my point was i have him in the top 10 now so not sure how high he could go from there.

RealityCheck
01-02-2010, 01:20 PM
Well... Is it good or bad?

Babylon
01-02-2010, 01:24 PM
Well... Is it good or bad?

To me it's good, he doesnt seem to mind coming back to USC for a year even if it meant his stock would suffer and he doesnt seem to mind going to Mobile. I say screw all this trying to back door the draft somehow and just compete. He's got my respect.

jballa838
01-02-2010, 04:54 PM
To me it's good, he doesnt seem to mind coming back to USC for a year even if it meant his stock would suffer and he doesnt seem to mind going to Mobile. I say screw all this trying to back door the draft somehow and just compete. He's got my respect.
What defense do they run in Mobile. Can it be cover 1 or 2 or is it man? If it's man I could see him getting TORCHED! While I would love to see him in a cover 2 showcasing his ability to move on the field.

TACKLE
01-02-2010, 05:15 PM
What defense do they run in Mobile. Can it be cover 1 or 2 or is it man? If it's man I could see him getting TORCHED! While I would love to see him in a cover 2 showcasing his ability to move on the field.

I'm pretty sure Cover 1, 2 and 3. You're going to get to see him do 1-on-1's. Safeties always do a bit of 1-on-1's with the Recievers. They usually struggle but its fun to see them compete. Mays should just jam the **** out of the reciever at the line and then just run and chase.

CC.SD
01-02-2010, 05:20 PM
Sigh well he will probably redeem himself at Mobile.

D-Unit
01-02-2010, 06:09 PM
I wonder how many haters will start to say they love him during Senior Bowl week.

truth393
01-02-2010, 06:13 PM
This was his first season. I don't think you can call him great yet.

I think Mays will be fine. He is a centerfielder and USC had him playing closer to the box this season. He doesn't have the greatest ball skills, but he seems to be playing with more athletic ability than actual football sense and technique.

Also, are the Jags and Niners the coaches again?

I think the Lions and Rams will be coaching the game this year.

TonyGfortheTD
01-02-2010, 07:08 PM
Todd Haley really should be one of the coaches just to see him explode on a QB like Tim Tebow (if he goes and plays).

"Jesus Christ"
"Jesus Christ, Tebow"
"Snap the f**king ball"
"Do you hear me?"
"Snap the f**king ball!"

Brent
01-03-2010, 09:12 AM
I wonder how many haters will start to say they love him during Senior Bowl week.
I'll set the over/under at 15.5

RealityCheck
01-03-2010, 09:42 AM
I think the Lions and Rams will be coaching the game this year.
That is going to hurt the prospects' stock so bad... :rolleyes:

stephenson86
01-03-2010, 10:15 AM
I think the Lions and Rams will be coaching the game this year.

wow maybe the rams can get a win to make it 2 on the season

PickedOffTwice
01-03-2010, 10:42 AM
I wonder how many haters will start to say they love him during Senior Bowl week.

Don't forget how they will repeat over and over that they have of course always loved the guy and the senior bowl proved their point even further. ;-)

619
01-03-2010, 11:13 AM
I wonder how many haters will start to say they love him during Senior Bowl week.

He is what he is, and that is a better pro than college player. His scheme versatility because of the H-W-S specimen he is will enable him to flourish in an innovative system tailored partially to his strengths. If he goes to the Raiders let's say, then he bombs because we run strictly a man-to-man scheme and that will never change under stubborn Al, but in most scenarios I can see D-coordinators masking his deficiencies, especially early on, something Carroll could not always do because of a depleted front seven after all the talent that was lost the year prior.

brasho
01-03-2010, 11:46 AM
What defense do they run in Mobile. Can it be cover 1 or 2 or is it man? If it's man I could see him getting TORCHED! While I would love to see him in a cover 2 showcasing his ability to move on the field.

Cover 2 is not allowed, only cover 3 or 1, and in cover 1 no bump and run is allowed.

brasho
01-03-2010, 11:49 AM
I think the Lions and Rams will be coaching the game this year.

It will be the team with the worst record in the AFC with the worst record and no coaching changeover against the NFC's same version. Right now it is Chiefs vs Rams.

brasho
01-03-2010, 11:55 AM
No, it's like JaMarcus Russell (your #5 ranked player in 2007) being a horrific bust because he had no football instincts to complement his impressive physical talent.

Russell's biggest problem was that he had ZERO work ethic and that showed up in full-force when he showed up at the Combine (AKA biggest job interview of his life) looking like a fat reject guard from the USFL. I stated back then, not on here but on buccaneers.com, that he should be no better than a 2nd because of his terrible work ethic.

brasho
01-03-2010, 11:58 AM
I'll be excited to see Mays at the Senior Bowl. I think he really has a shot at improving his stock (because if many personnel men in the NFL are like me, his stock is not very high). We know he can run, and has great size and can hit a little but I still don't know if he can play. What we do know is that the Trojans have played very good defense against the pass the past few seasons despite only lining up with 10 guys. Maybe the guy can play, maybe this guy is the FS version of former Fresno St. WR Paul Williams. Whatever it is, we'll see.

descendency
01-03-2010, 03:54 PM
I wonder how many haters will start to say they love him during Senior Bowl week.

Nothing is going to change my mind about him. He's an undersized cover-2 WLB.

edit: I'll be willing to admit I am wrong if he shows up to mobile and makes plays, but if he plays like he has at USC so far, I am going to basically say he's an in box defender with no coverage skills (or really, football skills).

His athleticism will shine from now until the draft though. It happens every year.

BrabbitMcRabbit
01-27-2010, 09:31 PM
Hopefully this week of failure in practice finally convinced people who don't actually watch USC games that Taylor Mays is massively overrated. The whole Pac-10 fan base has known it all season and now some of the national media who bought the "jeepers he's big and fast" hype are starting to catch on.

Looks like Tarzan. Plays like Jane.

FUNBUNCHER
01-27-2010, 09:41 PM
I hate to 'hate' on a player, but Taylor Mays just isn't the football player many had hoped he would be because of his physical tools.
It's the same realization I had to accept about Lavar Arrington, that being 6'3, 250#, and running a low 4.5 doesn't mean you're the next Lawrence Taylor.

Mays will be a starter and a solid consistent contributor for some team, but he's never going to take over a game or be the missing link that makes a good defense an all-world unit.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 02:26 AM
Nothing is going to change my mind about him. He's an undersized cover-2 WLB.

edit: I'll be willing to admit I am wrong if he shows up to mobile and makes plays, but if he plays like he has at USC so far, I am going to basically say he's an in box defender with no coverage skills (or really, football skills).



So nothing is going to change your mind...unless he makes plays in mobile. check.

The suggestion of Taylor as a linebacker can only come from guys who have not seen him play much. It's easy to admit he didn't have a perfect year but a position change is not at all in the cards.

Saints-Tigers
01-28-2010, 03:46 AM
So now all us "haters" on the site and the whole scouting world are still failing to see all the wondrous things that some are still seeing.

Oh the hate, hopefully he runs that 4.25 so people forget about his game tape.

jayceheathman
01-28-2010, 04:00 AM
Mays really needs to fall to the Cowboys. It's the best thing that could happen. I'm really hoping that he stinks it up.

No, the Texans need him instead of undersized Earl Thomas. :)

descendency
01-28-2010, 04:02 AM
Looks like Tarzan. Plays like Jane.
Lol, what???

He doesn't have that problem. He just takes terrible angles, has no ball skills, and no man coverage skills. Doesn't wrap up enough.

But he is fast, has an outstanding burst, big hitter, hard worker, outstanding build.

His basic problem is he's an athlete that has been able to out man everyone in college without having very good technique. That won't happen in the NFL.

wicket
01-28-2010, 07:28 AM
Lol, what???

He doesn't have that problem. He just takes terrible angles, has no ball skills, and no man coverage skills. Doesn't wrap up enough.

But he is fast, has an outstanding burst, big hitter, hard worker, outstanding build.

His basic problem is he's an athlete that has been able to out man everyone in college without having very good technique. That won't happen in the NFL.

So you mean:

Looks like Tarzan, Plays like Stevie Wonder

DaBrowns41
01-28-2010, 11:46 AM
I've been saying how Mays is overrated for about a year and a half now, only this was when I was on Footballsfuture.com.

For Wright to have him in the top 10 is a joke, and hopefully he catches the hint, like Russell. Mays has a high ceiling, but lacks football intelligence, and doesn't know how to play a position other than Deep Middle.

FuzzyGopher
01-28-2010, 12:09 PM
Lol, what???

He doesn't have that problem. He just takes terrible angles, has no ball skills, and no man coverage skills. Doesn't wrap up enough.

But he is fast, has an outstanding burst, big hitter, hard worker, outstanding build.

His basic problem is he's an athlete that has been able to out man everyone in college without having very good technique. That won't happen in the NFL.

Are you talking about LaRon Landry or Taylor Mays?

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 12:09 PM
I've been saying how Mays is overrated for about a year and a half now, only this was when I was on Footballsfuture.com.

For Wright to have him in the top 10 is a joke, and hopefully he catches the hint, like Russell. Mays has a high ceiling, but lacks football intelligence, and doesn't know how to play a position other than Deep Middle.


Shrug. These statements seem extremely contradictory to me, probably because I know that playing the deep middle at an elite level, which he did his whole junior year, is one of the rarest and most valuable things a defense can have. Mays had a lot working against him this year between his role in the scheme changing, a leg injury, and a massive talent exodus on the Trojan defense, and still he has been completely written off...by everyone except the people who matter aka Scouts and GMs.

Looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane

Dude I love your name so I hate to say this but I'm not sure you know what that phrase means. 'Looks like Tarzan, plays like a safety more interested in laying the wood than going after the ball' doesn't have quite the same ring to it though, it's true.

killxswitch
01-28-2010, 12:29 PM
Are there any prospects in recent memory that had a bad Senior Bowl and then went on to have good careers?

Saints-Tigers
01-28-2010, 12:33 PM
JaMarcus Russell is a bad comparison here anyway, because JaMarcus had great production at the college level.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 12:34 PM
Are there any prospects in recent memory that had a bad Senior Bowl and then went on to have good careers?

Killswiiiiitch you know this is not going to fly as a success metric, it's a week of practice followed by a stiff game.

also, randomly, still want to fire Bill Polian? :D

killxswitch
01-28-2010, 12:42 PM
Killswiiiiitch you know this is not going to fly as a success metric, it's a week of practice followed by a stiff game.

also, randomly, still want to fire Bill Polian? :D

I was just curious. It wasn't a trap, I really don't know if anyone has had a bad Senior Bowl and gone on to do well.

I never said I wanted to fire Bill Polian. I said if they aren't successful in the post-season, he would probably have to retire because of the circumstances. As they've been successful, I think even if the Colts lose he'll be fine next year. But if we'd lost to the Jets there would've been a shitstorm.

I will be thrilled if we win the SB, and I acknowledge Polian is very good at some parts of his job, but he is still an arrogant prick, and a lot of people (including myself) will look back on this year as the year we won the SB but could've been the only 19-0 team ever. Bittersweet is the wrong word, a SB win is still incredible. But 19-0 would've been epic.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 12:48 PM
I was just curious. It wasn't a trap, I really don't know if anyone has had a bad Senior Bowl and gone on to do well.

I never said I wanted to fire Bill Polian. I said if they aren't successful in the post-season, he would probably have to retire because of the circumstances. As they've been successful, I think even if the Colts lose he'll be fine next year. But if we'd lost to the Jets there would've been a shitstorm.

I will be thrilled if we win the SB, and I acknowledge Polian is very good at some parts of his job, but he is still an arrogant prick, and a lot of people (including myself) will look back on this year as the year we won the SB but could've been the only 19-0 team ever. Bittersweet is the wrong word, a SB win is still incredible. But 19-0 would've been epic.

Yah I think a little bittersweetness would be understandable. Polian's run of success though is ridic, and I'm not sure retirement would have been a factor in any case. But we will never know I suppose.

I'm sure there are prospects that have had abysmal Senior Bowls and gone on to have NFL success...law of averages and all that, dontchaknow.

cvv84
01-28-2010, 12:56 PM
ĽUSC S Taylor Mays has really disappointed this week. He's made a couple of nice hits but at 6-3 and 231, some scouts think he's just too big to play safety. He takes forever to get to a ball on the hashmarks when he's playing deep middle. Even worse is that he appears like he didn't come in great condition -- looks like he's mostly been hitting the weights. Mays has had to ask out on a few different occasions to get his breath. And some teams have said he's come off poorly in interviews.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/82944837.html

descendency
01-28-2010, 01:22 PM
In my opinion, Taylor Mays floor is a special teams captain and ceiling is the greatest safety ever. It just depends on how much he gets and how much he doesn't.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 01:28 PM
In my opinion, _______'s floor is a special teams captain and ceiling is the greatest ________ ever. It just depends on how much he gets and how much he doesn't.


Did I just blow your mind? :)

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2010, 01:33 PM
Even worse is that he appears like he didn't come in great condition -- looks like he's mostly been hitting the weights. Mays has had to ask out on a few different occasions to get his breath. And some teams have said he's come off poorly in interviews.

This is really interesting to me. I know that USC coaches have largely tried to keep Mays out of the weight room to keep his quickness up, but perhaps with his expanded role in 2009 they let him pack on a little more muscle (might that explain why he looks so much slower now?).

The interviewing thing is going to be key. People who make a living from this kind of stuff all pretty much said that Mays was a good and smart kid, but my impression had always been a little less stellar. If Mays is going to be a successful deep cover safety in the NFL, he's not going to be able shirk his studies nor can he afford to play undisciplined.

If Mays winds up both being too heavy/bulky to show the quickness he displayed in 2007 and 2008 and can't convince teams he's got the attitude to excel in the NFL, he's totally ****** draft position-wise (to put it lightly).

descendency
01-28-2010, 01:39 PM
Did I just blow your mind? :)

No, because lots of people don't have the speed or overall size to be a special teamer.

I see what you mean. I mean an elite special teams captain. Not one that is plugged in because you have to fill the spot. His size, speed, hitting ability, and physicality will make him hard to stop from getting to the ball carrier on punts and kickoffs. And maybe even field goals.

edit: Furthermore, some people just don't have a very high ceiling. No one is going to argue that Wes Welker type clones have any hope of being better than Jerry Rice.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 01:39 PM
If Mays winds up both being too heavy/bulky to show the quickness he displayed in 2007 and 2008 and can't convince teams he's got the attitude to excel in the NFL, he's totally ****** draft position-wise (to put it lightly).

yah, ****** like a fox. (yeah you let that one simmer around in your brain bwahah) Let him fall to the playoff teams, 28 sounds about right. I've got my fingers crossed anyway.

Although if he were to come to the bolts, welcome to pipe dream land, he would displace Kevin Ellison his old partner in crime which makes me a little sad.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2010, 01:44 PM
Although if he were to come to the bolts, welcome to pipe dream land, he would displace Kevin Ellison his old partner in crime which makes me a little sad.

You'd expect him to play SS for the Bolts? I assume Ellison didn't get anywhere near the FS spot.

descendency
01-28-2010, 01:45 PM
yah, ****** like a fox. (yeah you let that one simmer around in your brain bwahah) Let him fall to the playoff teams, 28 sounds about right. I've got my fingers crossed anyway.

Although if he were to come to the bolts, welcome to pipe dream land, he would displace Kevin Ellison his old partner in crime which makes me a little sad.

I agree that his potential is worth taking him in round 1 if you have no needs that can be filled there (where your need is a highly valuable player). No one should debate his ceiling. But I don't think if you are the Chiefs that you should take him and expect to plug him in day 1. (round 1 or 2)

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 01:48 PM
You'd expect him to play SS for the Bolts? I assume Ellison didn't get anywhere near the FS spot.

He would have to, Eric Weddle is pretty cemented into the FS spot while SS is a complete rotation. It's not a great fit honestly and I have no doubt he'll be long gone but that's the way it would have to be. In theory, RR's defense doesn't favor safety responsibilities like a traditional FS/SS setup but to cure our run stopping issues I definitely noticed the SS in the box quite a bit.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2010, 01:48 PM
He would have to, Eric Weddle is pretty cemented into the FS spot while SS is a complete rotation. It's not a great fit honestly and I have no doubt he'll be long gone but that's the way it would have to be.

Yeah, if he's proved one thing at the Senior Bowl is that he's a long way away from being a SS. His man coverage skills just simply aren't there.

descendency
01-28-2010, 01:49 PM
ĽUSC S Taylor Mays has really disappointed this week. He's made a couple of nice hits but at 6-3 and 231, some scouts think he's just too big to play safety. He takes forever to get to a ball on the hashmarks when he's playing deep middle. Even worse is that he appears like he didn't come in great condition -- looks like he's mostly been hitting the weights. Mays has had to ask out on a few different occasions to get his breath. And some teams have said he's come off poorly in interviews.

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/82944837.html

He either isn't listening to his advisors or they are idiots. He really needed to be in shape to show off his athleticism. It's by far his best feature (probably better than any other safety, at least ones in Mobile).

Babylon
01-28-2010, 01:56 PM
He either isn't listening to his advisors or they are idiots. He really needed to be in shape to show off his athleticism. It's by far his best feature (probably better than any other safety, at least ones in Mobile).

Then you have the comment about him at the weigh-in that he looked like a Greek God. Here's the deal. If anyone has a problem with Taylor May's physicality they are out of their minds. He may not be the best cover guy or take the best angles but he's a physical marvel.

FUNBUNCHER
01-28-2010, 01:56 PM
So you mean:

Looks like Tarzan, Plays like Stevie Wonder

LOLOL!!
+2
Laughed out loud reading this!!

D-Unit
01-28-2010, 02:02 PM
Are there any prospects in recent memory that had a bad Senior Bowl and then went on to have good careers?
There are a lot more cases of guys having good weeks, getting drafted high and then being a bust.

FUNBUNCHER
01-28-2010, 02:04 PM
He either isn't listening to his advisors or they are idiots. He really needed to be in shape to show off his athleticism. It's by far his best feature (probably better than any other safety, at least ones in Mobile).

Thing is, I think Mays WAS in as good shape as he was all last season. It's not like he played last season at 220#. His game is lacking and the holes are beginning to show. He lacks the versatility one would expect for an athlete of his caliber.

descendency
01-28-2010, 02:15 PM
Then you have the comment about him at the weigh-in that he looked like a Greek God. Here's the deal. If anyone has a problem with Taylor May's physicality they are out of their minds. He may not be the best cover guy or take the best angles but he's a physical marvel.

I agree, but if someone is saying he needs to come out for a breather more often than normal, that's very bad and seemingly contradictory to what you would think. Granted, they could be wrong.

killxswitch
01-28-2010, 02:51 PM
Looking like "a Greek god" doesn't mean his stamina is where it should be. Bodybuilders have low single digit fat when they do their shows but their bulk makes it hard for them to even get up the stairs without taking a rest.

Babylon
01-28-2010, 03:45 PM
I agree, but if someone is saying he needs to come out for a breather more often than normal, that's very bad and seemingly contradictory to what you would think. Granted, they could be wrong.

He never came off the field for a breather when he was at USC so i'm calling BS on this claim about him. He has his faults but so does everyone else. I'll take all the guys people want to deep-six: Mays, Tebow, Gerhart, Dunlap, Spikes....send them to Seattle i'll pick up the shipping.

wogitalia
01-28-2010, 07:30 PM
Is reminding me a lot of Kenny Phillips in the lead up to the draft right now.

Physically it all seems there but just doesn't seem "focused" on the right things in the lead up. His 40 time is going to be massive because from what I've seen he has looked slower this year than in the past and lets be honest, for all the 4.2/3 crap you hear, who actually believes school times until they are proven?

Mays has probably had the worst senior bowl of anyone but he certainly has a lot of intriguing physical skills. I think he needs to get into one of the elite training programs and get himself really well prepared for the combine or he will slip to a late round pick. I'm not sure I want him on the Vikes but I know that is one team that will have a really hard time saying no if he were to fall that far.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-28-2010, 07:36 PM
I really hope DUnit gets his wish and Mays ends up on the Cowboys. That'd go a long way towards starting another 15 year playoff winless streak

FUNBUNCHER
01-28-2010, 09:11 PM
I still believe Mays has not received hard nosed coaching since his freshman year. He's been the BMOC on USC's D forever, and I think his defensive back coaches treated him like he was an untouchable superstar and were reluctant to tell him when he played like crap.

If he goes somewhere that has a coaching staff that is willing to CRITIQUE Mays when he screws up, he really will have a chance to get better.

Someone posted in the Golden Tate thread a highlight of ND v. USC last season; Clausen and Tate outright VIOLATED USC's secondary, on top of that Mays looked clueless in coverage. There's a segment where Tate outleaps the corner for the ball in the endzone and Mays flashes into the screen for a big hit, instead of turning his head and finding the football, and totally misses Tate!!
You draft Mays and you're getting a starter, but he needs major coaching if he's ever going to reach his near unlimited potential.

CC.SD
01-28-2010, 09:21 PM
Someone posted in the Golden Tate thread a highlight of ND v. USC last season; Clausen and Tate outright VIOLATED USC's secondary, on top of that Mays looked clueless in coverage. There's a segment where Tate outleaps the corner for the ball in the endzone and Mays flashes into the screen for a big hit, instead of turning his head and finding the football, and totally misses Tate!!
You draft Mays and you're getting a starter, but he needs major coaching if he's ever going to reach his near unlimited potential.

Alright I don't want this misconstrued because my loyalty is unlimited, but I think if Taylor ends up somewhere with an savvy NFL veteran either on the coaching staff or on the roster, it will make his transition significantly more impressive. I think NFL teams probably feel this way too. My worst nightmare is him ending up on the Broncos at 10, getting tutored by Dawkins.

FUNBUNCHER
01-28-2010, 09:32 PM
Mays is the padawan to Dawkins Jedi master!!!

Too perfect, which means it'll probably happen.

CashmoneyDrew
01-28-2010, 09:36 PM
I don't chime in on the Taylor Mays situation much, but it really sucks for him that if he runs a 4.4 forty it'll be a major letdown since he's been hyped up as a 4.25/4.3 guy.

descendency
01-28-2010, 09:56 PM
The Steelers would be an interesting landing point given Polamalu's USC connection.

D-Unit
01-28-2010, 10:30 PM
The Steelers would be an interesting landing point given Polamalu's USC connection.
That's a ridiculous statement. Were you being serious?

D-Unit
01-28-2010, 10:32 PM
I really hope DUnit gets his wish and Mays ends up on the Cowboys. That'd go a long way towards starting another 15 year playoff winless streak
Just look at your avatar and instead of #41, think #2. :D

phlysac
01-29-2010, 10:14 AM
Just observing that Mays is still getting the "potential" massage even after it was said that he would excel in Mobile.

I'm still waiting for the haters to flip-flop and say how much they love him after this week.

J-Mike88
01-30-2010, 08:12 AM
Why didn't Mays come out last year with Matthews, Cushing, and Rey Rey? Oh, and Sanchez...

Is the payroll at USC that high these days?

descendency
01-30-2010, 11:10 AM
Just observing that Mays is still getting the "potential" massage even after it was said that he would excel in Mobile.

I'm still waiting for the haters to flip-flop and say how much they love him after this week.

What's amazing is how different scouts seem to see different things. While one might see decent coverage, the next will tell you that his stock is tanking.

Babylon
01-30-2010, 11:58 AM
What's amazing is how different scouts seem to see different things. While one might see decent coverage, the next will tell you that his stock is tanking.

In fairness to Mays he probably wasnt asked to cover one on one much at SC now he's lining up in drills against pro type WRs, only question i would have is how much of this stuff can be taught at the next level.

phlysac
01-30-2010, 12:10 PM
What's amazing is how different scouts seem to see different things. While one might see decent coverage, the next will tell you that his stock is tanking.

I agree that scouts can view things differently. I haven't really read any scouts saying that Mays has been decent in coverage this week in Mobile.

descendency
01-30-2010, 01:47 PM
That's a ridiculous statement. Were you being serious?

It was meant to be a little bit of a joke. But the Steelers may need a safety across from Polamalu and one who can come in and play SS when Troy goes down.

DaBrowns41
01-30-2010, 02:28 PM
Shrug. These statements seem extremely contradictory to me, probably because I know that playing the deep middle at an elite level, which he did his whole junior year, is one of the rarest and most valuable things a defense can have. Mays had a lot working against him this year between his role in the scheme changing, a leg injury, and a massive talent exodus on the Trojan defense, and still he has been completely written off...by everyone except the people who matter aka Scouts and GMs.

Yeah, it's great when you're in college. In an NFL defense... you know, a defense that he's going to end up playing, he has to actually play more than one position. Not sure how much NFL football you watch, but the safety position is more elaborate than just playing the deep middle every single play.

Good try, though!

FUNBUNCHER
01-30-2010, 06:11 PM
After seeing Mays tonight in the Senior Bowl, I'm gonna walk back on my opinion he's not going offer much more than an in the box starting SS.

I feel confident in saying that Mays will be a MUCH better pro than collegian, and could still end up being a top 10 pick.

Apparently at the Senior Bowl, Mike Nolan emphasized to Mays the importance of playing the football in coverage and coached Mays on how to sit on routes. What happens?? Mays baits the QB and grabs a pick at the goal line.

I really think Mays may have been poorly coached at USC to be a physical enforcer who punished WRs, his primary responsibility to prevent completions over the top of the defense.
He can clearly become better in coverage, and the pure ball instincts might never be there for Mays, but he clearly has ball skills; the hand/eye coordination to catch the ball in the air, which I thought before the Senior Bowl game he lacked.

Poorly coached, poorly utilized at USC, upside and his best football are still in front of him, IMO.

There's something to be said for being 'too coachable'.

stephenson86
01-30-2010, 06:24 PM
I would agree I think he has been poorly coached at USC

descendency
01-30-2010, 06:59 PM
Mays made plays. I was impressed. He played much better than he did at USC, granted he had good coaching at Mobile.

I would agree I think he has been poorly coached at USC

You're saying everything I'm going to before I do :(

Nalej
01-30-2010, 07:11 PM
Glad to hear he did well. I hate so see "work out warriors" fail lol

stephenson86
01-30-2010, 07:14 PM
its funny how with some pro coaching and being told to play his overall game differently he vastly improved, like said before i think he was literally coached to be an enforcer and nothing more

descendency
01-30-2010, 07:23 PM
its funny how with some pro coaching and being told to play his overall game differently he vastly improved, like said before i think he was literally coached to be an enforcer and nothing more
Is anyone feeling sorry for Seattle right now?

stephenson86
01-30-2010, 07:50 PM
Is anyone feeling sorry for Seattle right now?

very much so lol

D-Unit
01-30-2010, 07:58 PM
Yeah cause players that have played for USC while Carroll was there have all been poorly coached and failed to play to their potential under him.

The masses love to pile on, and anaylze one situation and then claim that to tell the entire story. There must be a name for this type of analysis. What is it? It's so common in forums.

D-Unit
01-30-2010, 08:02 PM
Mays made plays. I was impressed. He played much better than he did at USC, granted he had good coaching at Mobile.



You're saying everything I'm going to before I do :(
But you were so passionate about saying he was and predicting him to be a terrible player. What? You expected his coaching in the NFL to be bad? haha. I ain't mad at you though. Taylor Mays will make believers out of all his haters. It's only just begun. ;)

FUNBUNCHER
01-30-2010, 08:04 PM
D Unit, other than Polamalu, who was the last 5 star USC secondary recruit who amounted to anything in the pros??

I think there's credence to the argument that Carroll doesn't develop secondary talent under his tutelage.

When you have arguably the best pure athlete in college football starting for 4 years at safety and he roughly looks like the same player he was as a sophomore, then in ONE allstar game he plays better than he has in all but a handful of 45+ games he played at USC, IMO you have to look at the coaching and instruction he received at USC.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-30-2010, 08:06 PM
I'm confused. What exactly did Mays show everyone that was surprising? During the week's practices, he struggled in man coverage, didn't always take the right angles, and showed great range. During the game, he played a deep cover free safety role and did a great job, although he didn't always wrap up. That exactly the player we knew he was.

During the game he played the same role he played for the Trojans in 2008, the role that he had excelled at with the help of the USC coaches, but now that he played it well after a week of coaching, it's the Senior Bowl coaching staff that gets the credit? How does that make any sense at all?

I swear, people have the most twisted view of Mays ever. He was exactly what I knew he was today and during the week.

FUNBUNCHER
01-30-2010, 09:46 PM
Mays didn't play deep coverage all game, there were plays where he came up and covered the TE, and he looked comfortable doing it.

Nolan had Mays handling specific man coverage responsibilities as well as deep coverage and he showed well.

D-Unit
01-30-2010, 11:05 PM
D Unit, other than Polamalu, who was the last 5 star USC secondary recruit who amounted to anything in the pros??

I think there's credence to the argument that Carroll doesn't develop secondary talent under his tutelage.

When you have arguably the best pure athlete in college football starting for 4 years at safety and he roughly looks like the same player he was as a sophomore, then in ONE allstar game he plays better than he has in all but a handful of 45+ games he played at USC, IMO you have to look at the coaching and instruction he received at USC.
I don't know what 5 star or any other star really matters, but Terrell Thomas is one of the up and coming corners in the league. People bashed on Kevin Ellison last year and he's started for the Chargers. I'll openly admit, there's not some long lineage to prove that he's one of the best secondary coaches around, and I'm not trying to say he is, but at the same time, he's seemingly being bashed for being a bad defensive coach, period. Mays didn't arrive at USC and leave the same player. There was major all around development and whether you wanna credit Taylor's own work ethic or coaching, he to being talked about as a potential Top 10 prospect in college football.

descendency
01-30-2010, 11:10 PM
Nolan had Mays play the ball more in that game than he did in his entire career at USC.

But you were so passionate about saying he was and predicting him to be a terrible player. What? You expected his coaching in the NFL to be bad? haha. I ain't mad at you though. Taylor Mays will make believers out of all his haters. It's only just begun. ;)

I said what he was in college is was vastly over-rated. I have to admit, he has taken well to his coaching. I'll admit I was impressed at his growth this week.

FUNBUNCHER
01-30-2010, 11:35 PM
I also got the impression after the Senior Bowl that Mays is more of a 'work hard' super-athlete than a gifted primadonna, which sold me even more on his upside.

Some reporter was asking him indirectly about his lack of production at USC, and he stated, 'I just do what the coaches ask me to', which to me speaks volumes.
First revelation, that 230# is Mays natural playing weight(!); I thought that would be too big for him, but so far it hasn't shown to be that big a problem.

Second is that he responds to input from his coaches and tries to execute what they want him to do. Again, I thought Mays was primadonna, which he really may not be at all.

If he can learn the value of making a jarring, open field wrap-up tackle, ( the hallmark of the Ravens '00 SB defense, which gave up very low YAC) instead of the flashy knockout blow, , he'll be lights out IMO at the pro level.

bengalbuck
01-30-2010, 11:44 PM
I don't like Mays at all. He seems like a more athletic Darnell Bing. Another SC safety who was getting hyped as a 1st rounder but fell to the 4th and then sucked.

Mays reminds me a little of the DB version of Vernon Gholston. Great athletes, made some big plays in college, etc. But both guys seem to be stiff and not agile enough to ever be stars in the NFL.

Just my opinion, but I'd rather have a guy like Chad Jones than Taylor Mays in the 2nd round.

FUNBUNCHER
01-31-2010, 12:12 AM
Mays will be 10x the player Gholston ever wishes he was.

FIrstly, Mays will start as a rookie, given. Not really the best comparison for Mays, neither is Bing, considering that Mays is almost a quarter sec faster than Bing.

descendency
01-31-2010, 12:23 AM
I wrote a blog a while back saying that the word 'upside' gets tossed around too much. Mays displayed upside today. He has potential and met some of it.

A lot of guys with 'upside' never show any improvement. And they bust.

dolphinfan2k5
01-31-2010, 01:17 AM
I wrote a blog a while back saying that the word 'upside' gets tossed around too much. Mays displayed upside today. He has potential and met some of it.

A lot of guys with 'upside' never show any improvement. And they bust.

Is it just me or does this contradict itself twice?

descendency
01-31-2010, 01:21 AM
Is it just me or does this contradict itself twice?

Upside = the potential to grow. The main problem is that people assume every player can grow. If you don't see them respond well to coaching or work hard or any other things required to get better, then how do you know they can grow? Therefore they have no upside. If you want an example of a player who people will cry over... Tim Tebow. His development capped at around the completion of his sophomore season. This is in spite of his work ethic and all of the other things people attribute to him.

Saints-Tigers
01-31-2010, 03:52 AM
I kinda feel bad, he really can't win at the combine, expectations for him are gonna be stupid high.

LonghornsLegend
01-31-2010, 04:33 AM
I kinda feel bad, he really can't win at the combine, expectations for him are gonna be stupid high.

Blame that on all the people who were clamoring that he ran a 4.2 40 hands down, they were so sure of it for years now. We'll see how close that is to being true which most of us knew he wouldn't run. If he is able to run a 4.4 that's great speed for his size, but my questions about Mays wouldn't be answered at the Combine anyway that's where he is going to impress.

FUNBUNCHER
01-31-2010, 05:54 AM
Seeing him wear #21 gave me chills as a Skins fan.

He represented himself well.

DaBrowns41
01-31-2010, 11:16 AM
Seeing him wear #21 gave me chills as a Skins fan.

He represented himself well.

I hope this post was a joke.

Mays is nothing like Taylor. Sean Taylor was a true player, and was easily the best player one an amazing defense.

Taylor Mays was maybe the 4th or 5th best player on last years USC defense, and the 2nd best player on this years mediocre defense behind Everson Griffen.

One interception doesn't mean that he represented himself well. He made some piss poor tackles, and didn't play all that great. He was average in this game, as he's been for his career.

He has a lot of upside because of his strength and 40 time, but for somebody of his caliber, he's really struggled.

Babylon
01-31-2010, 11:44 AM
I also got the impression after the Senior Bowl that Mays is more of a 'work hard' super-athlete than a gifted primadonna, which sold me even more on his upside.

Some reporter was asking him indirectly about his lack of production at USC, and he stated, 'I just do what the coaches ask me to', which to me speaks volumes.
First revelation, that 230# is Mays natural playing weight(!); I thought that would be too big for him, but so far it hasn't shown to be that big a problem.

Second is that he responds to input from his coaches and tries to execute what they want him to do. Again, I thought Mays was primadonna, which he really may not be at all.

If he can learn the value of making a jarring, open field wrap-up tackle, ( the hallmark of the Ravens '00 SB defense, which gave up very low YAC) instead of the flashy knockout blow, , he'll be lights out IMO at the pro level.

I think his line was "i just do what coach Carroll tells me to do", as if he's still his coach.:)

descendency
01-31-2010, 04:32 PM
I think his line was "i just do what coach Carroll tells me to do", as if he's still his coach.:)

Seattle needs a safety and they are picking in the top 15 twice. He may be again. But after seeing Mays in the game, I took my late second round grade off and put the first rounder back on. I was starting to wonder if Myron Rolle was a better safety prospect. I couldn't believe that an athlete like Mays could be that unproductive at USC. Some may disagree but he's definitely re-earned his top 2 safety rank.

Babylon
01-31-2010, 05:02 PM
Seattle needs a safety and they are picking in the top 15 twice. He may be again. But after seeing Mays in the game, I took my late second round grade off and put the first rounder back on. I was starting to wonder if Myron Rolle was a better safety prospect. I couldn't believe that an athlete like Mays could be that unproductive at USC. Some may disagree but he's definitely re-earned his top 2 safety rank.

275 career tackles would indicate he wasnt totally unproductive and there were probably games along the way when the front 7 did most of the mopping up. Not trying to disagree because i think you're back in the fold but just wanted to point that out.

FUNBUNCHER
01-31-2010, 05:22 PM
I hope this post was a joke.

Mays is nothing like Taylor. Sean Taylor was a true player, and was easily the best player one an amazing defense.

Taylor Mays was maybe the 4th or 5th best player on last years USC defense, and the 2nd best player on this years mediocre defense behind Everson Griffen.

One interception doesn't mean that he represented himself well. He made some piss poor tackles, and didn't play all that great. He was average in this game, as he's been for his career.

He has a lot of upside because of his strength and 40 time, but for somebody of his caliber, he's really struggled.

Thank you for telling this Skins fan about the sublime entity formerly known as Sean Taylor.

RIP.

How many INTs were there in the Senior Bowl? 2? 3?? For a guy who's had a total of 2 INTs the last 3 years and 5 total for his career, a pick in the Senior Bowl is significant.
Mays showed he could handle one on one coverage, and he still needs to clean up his tackling technique.
But yeah anytime a big, mobile athlete is wearing #21 in the defensive secondary and snags a pick the way Mays did, as a SKins fans the brief memory of ST flashes through your head.

I feel comfortable in saying, in a good way, I have no idea what Mays' ceiling is a football player. I'm off that riff he should transition to weakside LB and believe Mays stopped his slide out of the top 10.

I know the word 'potential' is an epithet in sports, and life, but when NFL GMs/ D coordinators think about what Mays could become with professional coaching and better instruction, it's hard to pass on his enigmatic upside.

I don't even think Mays has learned how to read an offense or a QB from the defensive backfield because of the way he was used at USC; just track the guy going deep, or attack the WR on the underneath route once he's made a completion.

His game was completely reactive in college, but maybe that changes with a new coaching staff to learn from.

Seattle, Cleveland, Oakland, Buffalo, Denver....or someone trades up to get him.

D-Unit
01-31-2010, 06:01 PM
I have personally never believed he could run his 40 in the 4.2 range. I've never said it or claimed it or used it to back up my belief in him. I think if he runs a 4.35-8, then that will cement his legitimacy.

As for his draft stock, I think that everyone here is right. There really may be teams out there that consider him a 2nd round prospect. ...and I think there are teams that consider him a high first round prospect. So who's to say, who is right? The variance on him is all over the place and we're all right to a degree.

Saints-Tigers
02-01-2010, 01:53 AM
Yea, I think he's a second round PLAYER at the moment, but I can certainly justify taking him high in the first round to be honest.

The thing is, all the talk about his ceiling is great, but I think he has a nice floor, because even when I'm bitching about him, it's not because he's doing bad, it's because he could be doing more.

It might be a part of the whole USC thing that Mays has played like "one of the guys" instead of stepping up and being THE guy.

interesting prospect though, a new coach and change of scenery might change things.

descendency
02-01-2010, 03:23 AM
Yea, I think he's a second round PLAYER at the moment, but I can certainly justify taking him high in the first round to be honest.

If he runs a 4.4 at lucas oil at 6'3" 230 lbs and a coach feels his instincts can be coached, then he's a top 10 pick. Period. He would be an "upside" pick in that case. And from what I saw, in a week of NFL coaching Taylor Mays turned into a decent safety (granted the QBs were awful), but he was doing things better at Mobile than at USC. Which to me says he has a lot of actual upside.

Shahin
02-03-2010, 04:00 AM
what round is myron rolle gonna go in do you think

Shane P. Hallam
02-03-2010, 04:28 AM
what round is myron rolle gonna go in do you think

I think Rolle may end up in the 2nd or 3rd round based on potential, intelligence, and leadership.

FUNBUNCHER
02-03-2010, 09:01 AM
If teams look at Rolle's game film from FSU, I think he goes no earlier than than the 4th.

YAYareaRB
02-03-2010, 09:08 AM
Yeah he wasn't really good when he played. The Rhodes Scholar is impressive but it shouldn't get him drafted high.

yourfavestoner
02-03-2010, 11:46 AM
If teams look at Rolle's game film from FSU, I think he goes no earlier than than the 4th.

I was a big critic of Rolle's game while he was at FSU, but I have to wonder how mcuh of that is due to not being totally dedicated to football. I think he's smart enough to realize that he'll only get one shot at the NFL and will committ totally to it. He has the rest of his life to be a doctor.