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View Full Version : Opinion: Can Cleveland go QB in the draft?


descendency
01-05-2010, 09:07 AM
Before I start, let me ask the question? Is Tony Romo a good QB? Most would say so. Would Tony Romo succeed in Buffalo? Cleveland? Green Bay? New York? The question certainly should be asked.

I'm not a Cleveland Browns fan. I'm using them as an example to start a more general debate about when it is and isn't feasible to draft a quarterback in the first two or three rounds.

So, the Cleveland Browns' QBs are Brady Quinn, Derek Anderson, and Brett Ratliff. Of the three, only Ratliff was drafted by the current head coach (although he could be fired soon), Eric Mangini. Ratliff was drafted as a Jet and traded as part of the package from the Jets to acquire the 5th overall pick in the 2009 draft, which they used to draft Mark Sanchez.

Brady Quinn and Derek Anderson are left-overs from a previous administration. Quinn, the 22nd overall pick in the 2007 so the money guaranteed to him is not insurmountable if the Browns wanted to part ways with him. Derek Anderson signed a big deal after the 2007 season where he put up pro bowl numbers in a fluke season. Anderson (according to roto world) is only signed through 2010. Neither have looked like a Pro-QB since.

So, the Browns clearly should at least strongly consider a QB, right?

In my not so professional or necessarily good opinion, no. The Browns can't afford to make that investment this year.

First, they play in Cleveland. 8 games a year will be guaranteed to be in cleveland. 1 in Pittsburgh, 1 in Baltimore, and 1 in Cincinnati. Then you have a good chance of 1 being in either New York, Buffalo, or New England (miami as well). The other two divisional match ups could be in much milder conditions. Given the right year, you could play 14 games in cities that are brutal on QBs in the months of October, November, December, and January. The very best you could do is 11 games where very few are in those months. Those are the most important months of the year. Let's not forget, the ideal situation is to be playing at home in the playoffs. Do you really want Chad Pennington or Matt Cassel throwing in the snow and wind of Cleveland in late January? So, the first qualification to be a QB in Cleveland is that you must have enough arm strength to throw the ball 40+ yards in almost any conditions with good enough velocity for it to have a reasonable chance to be completed. (If you saw the Buffalo versus New England game in 2008 towards the end of the year, that might be excluded...)

Second, he would have to play for Cleveland. If you haven't noticed, Cleveland has Joe Thomas on that OL. He's an excellent LT in pass protection. Other than the fact that they drafted Alex Mack and Billy Yates (a backup) was a former Patriot, I haven't heard of any of the other lineman really. Are they any good? Can they provide protection in the passing game? Can the running game supplement the passing game or at least draw safeties and corners in? Do they have any vertical threats that require an elite QB? Personally, I don't think the rest of the offense can sustain an elite QB right now. If you get good value on one, you might consider it, but would a QB really benefit them that much? Surely they would be an upgrade to Derek Anderson, Brady Quinn, and Brett Ratliff (who will likely be cut if Mangini is fired). The second criteria I would say is that the QB has to be a value at the position he is drafted, which never happens. (Baring flukes, Marc Bulger, Tom Brady, etc... You could even argue Peyton Manning)

Taking a look at the top 10 QB prospects that are potentially available in the 2010 draft, you have something like the following:
Jimmy Clausen
Sam Bradford
Ryan Mallett
Tony Pike
Tim Tebow
Jevan Snead
Colt McCoy
Christian Ponder
Jonathan Crompton

(I'm sure you want to debate the rankings or maybe even the bottom few, but don't miss the point here...)

Jimmy Clausen played football at Notre Dame and is easily #1. He was accurate. He lead consistent scoring drives. He played in a pro style offense. He showed above average arm strength (in a northern city). Good command. Good leadership. His question marks are mainly minor things unless you can't stand him personally (some reports suggest he is kind of annoying, potentially the reason he got punched at the pub). The problem is he will be taken in the top 4 for sure (either Washington or St Louis). If he makes it to 6th, then seattle will take him. If by a miracle he makes it to 7th, be prepared to here his name.

Sam Bradford is highly accurate, quick throwing motion, but has average arm strength (played his games at OU) and is a serious injury risk because the few times he's been hit, he's snapped like a twig. He has a serious injury that could prevent him from even being drafted in the first two rounds. (A second shoulder injury to a QB who barely gets hit is going to be a big concern for most GMs)

Ryan Mallett has accuracy issues, but has the arm strength, durability, mobility, and others that you look for. He compares to a Tom Brady and Joe Flacco combination, both cold city QBs. He may not declare. (while i think it would be smart to declare, getting his accuracy up could help him be in the first overall race next year)

Tony Pike has arm strength and velocity issues, but does play in Cincinnati.

Tim Tebow has mechanics issues and minor velocity issues, but has the arm strength and physical ability to play in Cleveland.

Jevan Snead should not declare. He has the requirements, but can't read defenses and suffers from the Jay Cutler syndrome (minus the whiny loser look, no offense Bears fans... but I see an emo 12 year old when I look at Cutler).

Colt McCoy lacks the arm strength and velocity to play in Cleveland.

Christian Ponder, too.

Case Keenum is a bit undersized (6'2", 210), plays in a college-style offense, and is hard to predict what will and what won't translate. Probably not a 3rd rounder either.

Jonathan Crompton has serious accuracy issues. He has some positives including mild success in a pro-style offense. While I think Crompton's could be getting better (higher upside), I don't know that you invest a 3rd rounder on him, so he is outside of the scope of this post.

So in reality, the best QBs that Cleveland could (and should) take a look at either won't be available (Clausen, won't make it past washington), may not declare (Mallett, who would be a reach or requires a trade down), or carries a massive stigma and lacks key talents to be an NFL QB (Tebow).

The rest, based on what I said above, can't even be considered. Either they have that guy already on their roster in DA or Quinn or they don't have the ability to even play in Cleveland for a said reasons.

So, can Cleveland really be expected to draft a new QB this year? With a new GM, President of Operations, and potentially head coach, the answer would thought to be yes. If Holmgren makes a business decision to keep mangini, then the guys on the roster could stay. But regardless of what happens, this class doesn't have the right guy for them. So, no, I don't think you make the case for a QB in Cleveland.

Going back and looking at Bradford for a second, I think either the team has to be a dominantly southern team (like a Carolina) or play in a dome (like a Minnesota) to even look at him. Then you have to have a good offensive line that will get him time (unlike an Indianapolis). If that shoulder isn't fully healed, he could be a guy booking his hotel another night in NYC. Irregardless, the Browns should avoid him until they have him so much higher on their board than the other players, they have to take him.

So, while I think you should always a franchise QB, there are teams that don't have that option. People who could be franchise QBs for one team may bust in another.

Let's look at a hypothetical for a second. In 1997, the New York Jets had the #1 overall pick, which was traded to St Louis to draft Orlando Pace. It could have been Peyton Manning who returned to school. If you read the post about domes versus fields, you'll know that Peyton Manning would have faced a much stiffer challenge playing in New York versus Indianapolis. He would have been subject to more scrutiny in the media. His rookie year could have been bad enough to get him benched. He may not have made it to year 3. Granted, all of this is speculation, but it's to illustrate a point. Not all franchise players are franchise players for everyone. Sure, Manning would have probably survived... probably. It's a good thing he's a sure hall of famer in Indianapolis.

Overall, I think the Browns will decide if they want a QB based on one thing: Do they keep Eric Mangini. If they do, they will likely skip drafting one. If they don't, they will have 3 QBs on their roster, all of which could be on their way out (although at least 1 will stay), none of which were drafted or brought in by the current regime and therefore are baggage from a previous administration.

Should they though? Probably not.

Does this mean, in general, there is a way to argue against drafting a QB? No. This is a weak QB class for certain teams. Other teams could find that guys with good velocity and accuracy (Sam Bradford) with good OLs and play in domes could get mega-talent out of this draft. Simply looking at a teams current QBs and determining they need one isn't enough to draft one in a given year. A slow release with low velocity will fail in a dome, but on a field in windy cities, in snow and rain could be successful as long as the pass is ultimately "catchable" (whatever that means).

I'm sure lots of people will like to disagree here, but I thought it was worth venturing my opinion on the matter. (Now, time for everyone to post about how I'm wrong about X player and how they will be an NFL legend... and completely miss the point.)

As a side note, the current QBs in non dome, northern cities:
New England - Tom Brady (Strong arm, successful)
Cincinnati - Carson Palmer (Strong arm, successful)
New York Giants - Eli Manning (Strong arm, successful)
New York Jets - Mark Sanchez (Strong arm, rookie - decent success leaning on his team)
Baltimore - Joe Flacco (Strong arm, successful)
Pittsburgh - Ben Roetlisberger (Strong arm, successful)
Cleveland - Brady Quinn (Weak arm, unsuccessful) / Derek Anderson (decent arm, mild success at times)
Chicago - Jay Cutler (Strong Arm, average)
Green Bay - Aaron Rodgers (Strong arm, successful)
Seattle - Matt Hasselbeck (Weak arm, generally successful - not in last 2 years)
Buffalo - Trent Edwards (does he ever throw it deep???, average)
Philadelphia - Donovan McNabb (Strong arm, successful)
Broncos - Kyle Orton (Weak Arm, average)
Kansas City - Matt Cassel (weak arm, below average)

Notice a trend?

RealityCheck
01-05-2010, 09:20 AM
I see the Brownies taking Canfield, Crompton or Skelton in the 3rd to give Quinn and Anderson worries.

YotoJets007
01-05-2010, 09:21 AM
Ratliff was signed as UDFA by Jets.

Since none of 2010 qb class is most ready NFL material I dont see Browns will fetch a qb earlier. 4th-6th round is a possibility

DiG
01-05-2010, 09:51 AM
As a side note, the current QBs in non dome, northern cities:
New England - Tom Brady (Strong arm, successful)
Cincinnati - Carson Palmer (Strong arm, successful)
New York Giants - Eli Manning (Strong arm, successful)
New York Jets - Mark Sanchez (Strong arm, rookie - decent success leaning on his team)
Baltimore - Joe Flacco (Strong arm, successful)
Pittsburgh - Ben Roetlisberger (Strong arm, successful)
Cleveland - Brady Quinn (Weak arm, unsuccessful) / Derek Anderson (decent arm, mild success at times)
Chicago - Jay Cutler (Strong Arm, average)
Green Bay - Aaron Rodgers (Strong arm, successful)
Seattle - Matt Hasselbeck (Weak arm, generally successful - not in last 2 years)
Buffalo - Trent Edwards (does he ever throw it deep???, average)
Philadelphia - Donovan McNabb (Strong arm, successful)
Broncos - Kyle Orton (Weak Arm, average)
Kansas City - Matt Cassel (weak arm, below average)

Notice a trend?

How come you include Baltimore but not DC?? Ill help you out.

Washington - Jason Campbell (strong arm, average at best)

descendency
01-05-2010, 09:52 AM
How come you include Baltimore but not DC?? Ill help you out.

Washington - Jason Campbell (strong arm, average at best)

A mistake. I'm sure I made a few. Like Jets "draftee" Brett Ratliff, who was undrafted.

fear the elf
01-05-2010, 10:13 AM
Second, he would have to play for Cleveland. If you haven't noticed, Cleveland has Joe Thomas on that OL. He's an excellent LT in pass protection. Other than the fact that they drafted Alex Mack and Billy Yates (a backup) was a former Patriot, I haven't heard of any of the other lineman really.

Eric Steinbach is a good LG. Really the left half of the Oline is very good and Mack is playing really well at the end of the season. RT is an issue for sure

Jimmy Clausen played football at Notre Dame and is easily #1. He was accurate. He lead consistent scoring drives. He played in a pro style offense. He showed above average arm strength (in a northern city). Good command. Good leadership. His question marks are mainly minor things unless you can't stand him personally (some reports suggest he is kind of annoying, potentially the reason he got punched at the pub). The problem is he will be taken in the top 4 for sure (either Washington or St Louis). If he makes it to 6th, then seattle will take him. If by a miracle he makes it to 7th, be prepared to here his name.

I can't imagine we take Clausen at 7, even if he is still there. He sounds too much like this one guy on our team, I can't remember his name but I think he played for ND under Coach Weis too. Besides, he still doesn't have a full season of starts in the NFL under his belt. I'm not even sure he has double digits yet.

DiG
01-05-2010, 10:18 AM
I can't imagine we take Clausen at 7, even if he is still there. He sounds too much like this one guy on our team, I can't remember his name but I think he played for ND under Coach Weis too. Besides, he still doesn't have a full season of starts in the NFL under his belt. I'm not even sure he has double digits yet.

I actually think that, outside of being Notre Dame alum, Clausen and Quinn are fairly different prospects.

RealityCheck
01-05-2010, 10:34 AM
Eric Steinbach is a good LG. Really the left half of the Oline is very good and Mack is playing really well at the end of the season. RT is an issue for sure
What happened to Joe Andruzzi? Did he retire?

descendency
01-05-2010, 10:43 AM
I can't imagine we take Clausen at 7, even if he is still there. He sounds too much like this one guy on our team, I can't remember his name but I think he played for ND under Coach Weis too. Besides, he still doesn't have a full season of starts in the NFL under his belt. I'm not even sure he has double digits yet.

Jonathan Crompton and Peyton Manning played under Fulmer and for Tennessee, should I assume Crompton is the next NFL great?

When you consider the first 6 picks could be Berry, Suh, G McCoy, Okung, Haden, and McClain, who would you suggest at that point?

But, the point remains: New regimes want their QB. When an NFL GM and coach change, the previous guys are baggage.

fear the elf
01-05-2010, 10:54 AM
Jonathan Crompton and Peyton Manning played under Fulmer and for Tennessee, should I assume Crompton is the next NFL great?

When you consider the first 6 picks could be Berry, Suh, G McCoy, Okung, Haden, and McClain, who would you suggest at that point?

But, the point remains: New regimes want their QB. When an NFL GM and coach change, the previous guys are baggage.

Jonathan Crompton isn't considered a top 10 pick like Manning was, the point is lacking.

Based on your asessment of Clausen:

Jimmy Clausen played football at Notre Dame...He was accurate...lead consistent scoring drives...played in a pro style offense...showed above average arm strength (in a northern city). Good command. Good leadership.

Those traits sound similar to Quinn to me. Other aspects of their games may be different, but based on that, I think they sound similar.

Not to mention, if we just got burned (and I'm not sure yet, like I said, I don't think Quinn has had a fair shake just yet) I would think the organization would shy away from another QB from the exact same program and coach that just burned them.

And, besides Montana, ND doesn't have a great QB pedigree.

vidae
01-05-2010, 11:12 AM
Arm strength isn't indicative of success so yes, those are all coincidences. Kyle Boller anyone?

As for Quinn, I haven't seen a lot of Browns games, but I'd give him another shot. They traded away his two best weapons this year. Get him some weapons and a defense to keep games closer and I think he could be successful

descendency
01-05-2010, 11:16 AM
Arm strength isn't indicative of success so yes, those are all coincidences. Kyle Boller anyone?

Not the point. Arm strength is a requirement to be a good QB in the north. It's not that all strong arm QBs are successful, just no weak arm QB is going to be successful (especially in the playoffs) if they have to win a game in the weather.

phlysac
01-05-2010, 11:50 AM
I'm pretty confident in saying that Bernie Kosar had a far from "strong" arm and he was/is a legend in Cleveland.

You mention "the North" but wind and weather are a significant factor in San Francisco where both Joe Montana and Steve Young (neither had strong arms) lead HOF careers.

I understand what you're theorizing and it's an interesting perspective but I think it's more coincidental than an actual factor. Just my opinion, though.

STsACE
01-05-2010, 11:59 AM
Not the point. Arm strength is a requirement to be a good QB in the north. It's not that all strong arm QBs are successful, just no weak arm QB is going to be successful (especially in the playoffs) if they have to win a game in the weather.

Brady has decent arm strength. His short accuracy is good, but needs improvement. His long ball has big accuracy issues.

DA has very strong arm. His short accuracy is okay, but needs improvement. His long ball is hit or miss as he forces throws due to him thinking he can rifle everything in tight holes causing a large amount of interceptions.

Arm strength is something I think some people misunderstand. Yes, it's nice to be able to thrown 60yd. passes on a rope all game, but that doesn't happen all game long. It usually only happens once or twice and depending on the success that brings more tries may be attempted. The RAC is really what sets some of the successful teams apart with their QB play.

The Browns had quite a few games down the stretch where the wind was 15-20 mph +. Passing on both Clevelands and the opposing teams QB were not stellar. Some of the opposing QBs may have put up good numbers, but they were playing from behind causing many passing attempts and Cleveland plays a kinda bend but don't break Defense. We'll give up many short plays, but limit the RAC.

I personally don't want another QB with our first rounder this year. We have more needs that need to be addressed (Safeties, another CB, Right side of O-Line). I'd like to think Holmgren will want to work with one of our QBs we currently have and improve their game. I don't know if you saw Frye play this year from Oakland, but he's a Browns castoff that learned alot from one year under Holmgren is Seattle and played very well once Russell was benched and Gradkowski was hurt.

As a Browns fan, I was really impressed with the growth of Frye since he left Cleveland. I'm really hoping he is able to do the same for us with our QB situation.

Hurricanes25
01-05-2010, 12:03 PM
What happened to Joe Andruzzi? Did he retire?

He was diagnosed with cancer and I think he retired.

j05son
01-05-2010, 12:03 PM
On Cleveland's o-line: Joe Thomas is a for sure top 3 LT in the game. Mack looks to be one of the best centers in the game here shortly. He has a great blend of strength (matched up on Casey Hampton 1 on 1 and knocked him on his ass) and speed (he's consistently pulling outside the tackles and hitting his blocks). Steinbach didn't start off to well in what Mangini wanted to be a big and bruising O-Line but when we switched to a zone blocking scheme, Steinbach's play has been excellent and along with Mack is a pulling machine. The problem with the offensive line is the right side. There's no youth on the right side, mostly just stop gap players (St. Clair, Porkcop Womach, Fraley and Hadnot).

On our QB's. Your right that neither one is producing much but I don't think your accurate on your assessment of them. Quinn definitely doesn't have the biggest arm, but I would say it's more average than weak. His main problem has been his accuracy especially the deeper he goes. Anderson doesn't have a decent arm, he has a ******* cannon. Anderson's size and arm scream starting QB but everything else about him scream backup at best.

Also Cleveland will be changing to the West Coast Offense which relies more on accuracy than arm strength.

I'll agree that I don't want a QB this year especially since Quinn has fewer starts than Sanchez and has a better rating with a team that definitely doesn't have the amount of talent NY does.

GatorsBullsFan
01-05-2010, 12:12 PM
Only way Browns could possibly take a QB in the first round would be by totally parting ways with either Anderson or Quinn, maybe both, Trade Quinn and Anderson before they lose all there value. The longer Quinn and Anderson sit in Cleveland with no Weapons but a Wildcat QB in Josh Cribbs and a RB in Harrison. Wasn't there TE Heiden there best passing Option? Quinn was iffy coming out of college and Im truthfully not surprised at all with where he is at, I was never really that high on the him in the first place, and Anderson was a one year wonder that just came out of no where and became good for a season. These guys still have trade value Browns just need to stop lolly gagging around and make some deals. They wanted to trade there best WR but they wont trade two QBs on a downhill slide.

Brown Leader
01-05-2010, 12:27 PM
Whether Mangini stays or not I'll wager Holgrem looks to acquire a QB already in the league who is competitive, runs the WCO competently and has the potential to be a solid starter in the right fit.

Michael Vick- [Marty Mornhinweg tutelage this season]
Seneca Wallace- [drafted by Holmgren-can be a starter imo. Zorn]
Jason Campbell- [Might be foolishly let go by Redskins-but I doubt it. Jim Zorn]
Tarvaris Jackson- [010 FA plays WCO. Darrell Bevell]

Any others? All these guys have mobility and would fit well into the identity that Mangini has concocted in Cleveland-OL dominant running team-but also possess better arms than any current Browns QB's. Coached by guys who could be a part of Holmgren's Browns in 010.

YotoJets007
01-05-2010, 12:37 PM
Whether Mangini stays or not I'll wager Holgrem looks to acquire a QB already in the league who is competitive, runs the WCO competently and has the potential to be a solid starter in the right fit.

Michael Vick- [Marty Mornhinweg tutelage this season]
Seneca Wallace- [drafted by Holmgren-can be a starter imo. Zorn]
Jason Campbell- [Might be foolishly let go by Redskins-but I doubt it. Jim Zorn]
Tarvaris Jackson- [010 FA plays WCO. Darrell Bevell]

Any others? All these guys have mobility and would fit well into the identity that Mangini has concocted in Cleveland-OL dominant running team-but also possess better arms than any current Browns QB's. Coached by guys who could be a part of Holmgren's Browns in 010.

For WCO, any qb can accomplish so they already have Quinn and Ratliff.

Bringing Jackson, Vick or Wallace in would topple moving the team to Baltimore easily for the worst move in the Browns history. Campbell is not a need, imo.

Brown Leader
01-05-2010, 12:47 PM
For WCO, any qb can accomplish so they already have Quinn and Ratliff.

Bringing Jackson, Vick or Wallace in would topple moving the team to Baltimore easily for the worst move in the Browns history. Campbell is not a need, imo.

First statement undermines credibility of your second statement. Vick and Campbell if available are realistic.

PoopSandwich
01-05-2010, 12:48 PM
Browns need to build around the QB. Anderson was a great quarterback when he had people to throw the ball to. However, if Bradford or Clausen fall to 7 I just don't see how the Browns could pass on one of them.

EDIT: I would rather prefer we get Vick or Campbell and build around the QB though.

YotoJets007
01-05-2010, 01:12 PM
First statement undermines credibility of your second statement. Vick and Campbell if available are realistic.

none of them are UFA so that means Browns have to fork over picks that may be needed to fill another positions.

keylime_5
01-05-2010, 01:22 PM
Meh, Vick was a disaster in the WCO in Atlanta under Greg Knapp/Jim Mora Jr., and in Philadelphia he's no more than a runner in that offense and wildcat option. Campbell is intriguing since he was left out to dry behind Washington's Oline. Other than Campbell or maybe Hasselbeck as a veteran stopgap the best option is to give Quinn another year since he has so little experience and such poor weapons to throw to. Give him a solid RT and a couple good receivers and see what he can do.

fear the elf
01-05-2010, 01:23 PM
Meh, Vick was a disaster in the WCO in Atlanta under Greg Knapp/Jim Mora Jr., and in Philadelphia he's no more than a runner in that offense and wildcat option. Campbell is intriguing since he was left out to dry behind Washington's Oline. Other than Campbell or maybe Hasselbeck as a veteran stopgap the best option is to give Quinn another year since he has so little experience and such poor weapons to throw to. Give him a solid RT and a couple good receivers and see what he can do.

This

10 char

j05son
01-05-2010, 01:47 PM
I agree with you Keylime in giving Quinn a chance. I think he may be a Rich Gannon clone and Rich really didn't evolve into a QB until Oakland's WCO.

descendency
01-05-2010, 02:08 PM
I don't think Quinn shouldn't be given a chance. However, A GM and Coach want to succeed in the league. The best way is to get the guy you have the most confidence in. A Coach who just came in will have little to no confidence in a QB left over from a previous administration. Peyton Manning is an exception. (mainly, he's bill polians guy).

Jason Campbell is under-appreciated by lots of people and could be successful in Cleveland given the right stuff. I have a feeling he will be a cheap RFA or a free UFA. The redskins don't exactly love him right now (Snyder hates him, Bruce Allen and Mike Shanahan have no reason to like him, yet).

I'm pretty confident in saying that Bernie Kosar had a far from "strong" arm and he was/is a legend in Cleveland.

You mention "the North" but wind and weather are a significant factor in San Francisco where both Joe Montana and Steve Young (neither had strong arms) lead HOF careers.

Kosar left Cleveland in 93 and Young left San Fran in 99 (Montana, before him). I have to believe there is a reason why there are so many strong arm QBs in the north (and even san fransisco, where Alex Smith has good velocity on his passes with good deep ball ability). Coincidence? Potentially.

I wanted to say it was just a product of the era, but 10 years ago isn't that long really. I don't really know how to counter that.

Also, let me make it perfectly clear, being able to rocket a ball into coverage is velocity (and is controlled by how fast your arm moves). The ability to throw the ball deep consistently is determined by muscle (similar to a shot putter). The two together is a big and dynamic arm.

edit: I just think Clausen has more and better overall skills than Brady Quinn. While they aren't total different, even the areas they are similar, I think Clausen is just better. I mean, if you read the article written by Matt McGuire on how under appreciated Clausen's junior season is, you'll probably have more confidence in him. (then again, you may not. If you are interested, search google for it since this site has a no link policy.)

Babylon
01-05-2010, 02:31 PM
Mike Holmgren is on record as late as a couple of weeks ago as saying he doesnt like drafting underclassmen, his M.O. is to draft a mid round project like a Brunell or a Hasselbeck and develope them that way.

MattyFos
01-05-2010, 02:41 PM
I think Holmgren will give Brady a chance to run his WCO. I think Holmgren is going to move Derek Anderson, and have to replace him in the draft. There's a chance Hasselbeck will not longer be a Seattle Seahawk. Will he be coming to Cleveland with Holmgren?
Holmgren was a Packer, then a Seahawk, now a Brown
Hasselbeck was a Packer, then a Seahawk, now a Borwn (?)

I think Holmgren feels that Quinn can be a successful QB in a WCO, so no need to waste a pick on a first round QB

the magical mangenie
01-05-2010, 02:53 PM
Brady Quinn can rub my magic lamp anytime

DeepThreat
01-05-2010, 02:58 PM
Quinn has been given a chance, and he's been awful. You can point at his receivers all day long, but his accuracy was still awful. He doesn't have it.

The left three linemen are very good, and even the right side played well the last few games.

And Joe Andruzzi retired after being diagnosed with cancer in like 2006.

Cicero
01-05-2010, 03:09 PM
The Browns need a QB but I don't think Bradford or Clausen will be available at their pick.

Stamper
01-05-2010, 03:10 PM
if anybody has watched any browns games they would know that quinn has awful accuracy, especially past ten yards. he just doesn't have what it takes to be an nfl quarterback. im aware that he hasn't has much time or opportunity, add in the fact that he has no weapons but i haven't seen any signs of brilliance, any moments where i could say "hey, he looks like an nfl quarterback". and against detroit doesnt count. its detroit.

im not a fan of bradford and wouldnt want the browns to draft him but hes insanely accurate and has great pocket presence. i could see the browns taking him.

i would rather see a playmaker, on defense or offense. someone that can be the face of a defense: mclain/berry or offense.

the browns need an identity in the worst way.

Babylon
01-05-2010, 03:15 PM
The Browns need a QB but I don't think Bradford or Clausen will be available at their pick.

Dont tell me either of those two are going to Seattle, i dont want to hear that.

Cicero
01-05-2010, 03:47 PM
Dont tell me either of those two are going to Seattle, i dont want to hear that.

New GM means new QB, that's just how it works. Whether you like it or not that's a very real possibility and you're going to see people mocking a QB to the Hawks from now until draft day.

You can hope that the Rams take Clausen and the Skins take Bradford OI guess ha.