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Ryden
01-08-2010, 02:17 PM
Who will dissapoint and who will impress at the combine, which prospect will have the most anticipated 40, and lets break the prospects up into 2 groups, under 210lbs, and over 210lbs, here goes

1. Fastest 40 under 210lbs: CJ Spiller or Jacoby Ford: HIgh 4.2's
over 210lbs: Reily Cooper: High 4.3's

Let me know what you think.

RealityCheck
01-08-2010, 02:40 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

Babylon
01-08-2010, 02:47 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

Dont agree witht the Joe Haden 4.33 and the Tim Tebow 4.51 (would guess 4.43 and 4.61 for those gators) i think you have most of them pretty spot on though.

Mardy Gilyard pretty off too.

Michigan
01-08-2010, 03:01 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

Did they move the combine to Ohio State's track? Adding .10 to each of those times might still not be enough.

terribletowel39
01-08-2010, 03:07 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31
You have Devine at 4.28. Well the bowl game Robinson caught Devine like he was in mud. That should mean Robinson runs a 3.86.

Also, Trindon Holliday will beat Ford's time if he gets invited. And it won't be that fast. Holliday will have the fastest time though, with Ford 2nd.

underscore
01-08-2010, 03:26 PM
Fastest TE...Andrew Quarless. He'll be in the 4.5s

StorminNorman
01-08-2010, 03:36 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

Irony!;) :D

JFLO
01-08-2010, 03:53 PM
Tim Tebow - 4.70
C.J. Spiller - 4.33
Toby Gerhart - 4.61
Dexter McCluster - 4.50
Dez Bryant - 4.39
Anthony Davis - 5.15

Just some offensive players...

Jakey
01-08-2010, 03:56 PM
I think Taylor May will run allot slower than expected, im gonn take a guess at around...4.46.

Not bad, but not as fast as some people expect.

dhp318
01-08-2010, 04:42 PM
I think Taylor May will run allot slower than expected, im gonn take a guess at around...4.46.

Not bad, but not as fast as some people expect.

I keep thinking that, and then I watch this and quickly change my mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26rLxHZpiKQ

SUP
01-08-2010, 04:56 PM
Tebow will be around a 4.7 and Cooper in the 4.38-4.44 range. I think Haden will run around a 4.34

Babylon
01-08-2010, 05:00 PM
Tebow will be around a 4.7 and Cooper in the 4.38-4.44 range. I think Haden will run around a 4.34

I think if Haden can run under a 4.3 he's going to go very early.

SUP
01-08-2010, 05:41 PM
I think if Haden can run under a 4.3 he's going to go very early.

it wouldnt shock me if he did. Haden can fly, so can Coop. If Coop runs a low 4.3, I wouldnt be shocked either.

Im curious to see what Spikes and Hernandez run too.


Im obviously a big Gator Homer.

Babylon
01-08-2010, 05:49 PM
it wouldnt shock me if he did. Haden can fly, so can Coop. If Coop runs a low 4.3, I wouldnt be shocked either.

Im curious to see what Spikes and Hernandez run too.


Im obviously a big Gator Homer.

Wasnt there some kind of list of the Gators that ran under 4.4?

SUP
01-08-2010, 06:01 PM
Wasnt there some kind of list of the Gators that ran under 4.4?

yeah ive seen that, but 40 times are so funny. Who knows how accurate the timing was.

Babylon
01-08-2010, 06:10 PM
yeah ive seen that, but 40 times are so funny. Who knows how accurate the timing was.

Dont get me wrong i'm the first to question schools 40 times (yes you USC). My guess on 40 times is seeing player A run past player B who ran by player C. Odd but that gives me a better handle on 40 times.

SUP
01-08-2010, 06:12 PM
Dont get me wrong i'm the first to question schools 40 times (yes you USC). My guess on 40 times is seeing player A run past player B who ran by player C. Odd but that gives me a better handle on 40 times.

definately agree

although I think 40s are vastly overrated in most situations.

Ryden
01-08-2010, 06:13 PM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

Gilliard is a great receiver, but he is no where near that, he got caught from behind this year on a slant hit fully in stride this year, but I think he is a low 4.5 guy at best

yourfavestoner
01-08-2010, 06:39 PM
Wasnt there some kind of list of the Gators that ran under 4.4?

Yeah, but they're hand-timed. Not the most accurate thing in the world.

RGVBadBoy
01-08-2010, 09:57 PM
Tim Tebow 4.65
Colt McCoy 4.63
Riley Cooper 4.50
Noel Devine 4.42
Toby Gerdardt 4.59
CJ Spiller 4.40
Jacoby Ford 4.30
Jordan Shipley 4.45
Dez Bryant 4.55 IF HE RUNS!!!!
Taylor Mays 4.50, Yeah thats right!!!
Mardy Gilliard 4.54
Dexter McCluster 4.48

The NFL Combine track isnt the fastest out there.... I don't think anyone will be in the 4.2s this year.

DreadedDatSkinsFan
01-09-2010, 01:28 AM
You have Devine at 4.28. Well the bowl game Robinson caught Devine like he was in mud. That should mean Robinson runs a 3.86.
Lmao @ 3.86

stlouisfan37
01-09-2010, 02:27 AM
Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31

You're on dope if you think that Jacoby Ford will run a 4.19. Chris Johnson ran a 4.24 a couple of years ago and he was flying. If you read all the articles this year regarding his push for 2,000 yards you know that he is widely regarded as the fastest player in the NFL.

Darrell Green used to claim that he could run the 40 "in the low-to-mid-4.2's". Joey Galloway ran a 4.27 in his combine and James Jett ran a 4.29. At 38 years of age Green told reporters that Galloway and Jett were the only two receivers he had covered in the NFL that had forced him to run full speed.

Eric Dickerson won the 100 yard dash as a high school senior in Texas and ran a legitimate 4.4 40 coming out of college. In the playoffs in 1985 Dickerson broke away through the Redskins defense on his way to the end zone. As Dickerson crossed the 35 yard line you could see Green coming into the picture on the screen at midfield. Green caught Dickerson from behind like he was standing still and brought him down at the 15 yard line.

I have done extensive research on football speed. There are four kinds of speed, or gears, if you will. There is game speed. This is the player who plays as fast as he runs. Then there is fast, which is the player who is able to turn it on when he wants and create a play when the viewer could not see that it was open. This is the category that most of the players we call "fast" fit into.

The next two categories are rarely found. There is what is called "special" speed. This is the guys like Galloway, or Deangelo Hall, or Randy Moss. They get the ball in their hands and something special happens, where a burst of energy occurs and suddenly they are on the field by themselves and what looks like an angle will be cut off ends up being an easy touchdown where players that we call "fast" are embarrassed on Sportscenter. Most teams have maybe one player who fits this billing; whether or not he is also an athlete and can convert this kind of speed onto the field is generally the difference between him being a contributor on special teams or a star on Sundays.

The final category is what is called "elite" speed. This speed is only found in few humans and rarely transcends into a good football player. Darrell Green had it, and he is one of the very few who were able to make money in the NFL with it. Renaldo Nehemia had it, but he couldn't catch a football to save his life. Willie Gault had it, but, while he had a decent career, few of Gault's catches occurred unless his speed gave him the gift of being wide open. Countless track stars have been recruited over the years to join college football teams. The Washington Huskies gave a full ride scholarship in 1998 to a track star named Ja'Warren Hooker. He had elite speed but was scared to death to get tackled on a kickoff return.

Long story short, Jacoby Ford is a decent football player, and he might have special speed, but he does not have "elite speed". If he did he would be a lot more player than he is, and would have been a man among boys at the college level. It would take "elite speed" to run a 4.19 at the combine in Indianapolis.

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 12:30 AM
Travis Lewis- 4.34(ran 4.34 in hs)
C.J. Spiller- 4.33
Jacoby Ford- 4.31
Dez Bryant- 4.53
Patrick Robinson- 4.39
Dekoda Watson- 4.55

Buc Baller12
01-16-2010, 01:35 AM
what do you think Demaryious Thomas 40 time will be? 4.5 or a 4.6?

Duffman57
01-16-2010, 01:58 AM
Please tell me why there has been no mention of Trindon Holliday? The dude will easily be the fastest person at the combine at around 4.22 or so. He is crazy fast. The other guy next year thats gonna turn out to be a freak is Nigel Bradham. He is around 6'3" 235 but will run in the mid 4.4's

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 02:24 AM
Please tell me why there has been no mention of Trindon Holliday? The dude will easily be the fastest person at the combine at around 4.22 or so. He is crazy fast. The other guy next year thats gonna turn out to be a freak is Nigel Bradham. He is around 6'3" 235 but will run in the mid 4.4's

Nigel is a baaad man.
Sprint Wars!!
http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/blog/dr_saturday/post/Of-course-Jacoby-Ford-knows-this-means-sprint-w?urn=ncaaf,142047

TACKLE
01-16-2010, 02:43 AM
what do you think Demaryious Thomas 40 time will be? 4.5 or a 4.6?

A lot of times he looks like a 4.6 but he looks a lot faster on this one play. This guy is 6'3 230lbs. What a beast. I love WR's in his mold.

(0:27-0:39)
Maf0y1s5i7Q

LickaMahfeetz
01-16-2010, 03:29 AM
I keep thinking that, and then I watch this and quickly change my mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26rLxHZpiKQ
I was going to bring up that very play. Good find.

LickaMahfeetz
01-16-2010, 03:33 AM
You're on dope if you think that Jacoby Ford will run a 4.19. Chris Johnson ran a 4.24 a couple of years ago and he was flying. If you read all the articles this year regarding his push for 2,000 yards you know that he is widely regarded as the fastest player in the NFL.

Darrell Green used to claim that he could run the 40 "in the low-to-mid-4.2's". Joey Galloway ran a 4.27 in his combine and James Jett ran a 4.29. At 38 years of age Green told reporters that Galloway and Jett were the only two receivers he had covered in the NFL that had forced him to run full speed.

Eric Dickerson won the 100 yard dash as a high school senior in Texas and ran a legitimate 4.4 40 coming out of college. In the playoffs in 1985 Dickerson broke away through the Redskins defense on his way to the end zone. As Dickerson crossed the 35 yard line you could see Green coming into the picture on the screen at midfield. Green caught Dickerson from behind like he was standing still and brought him down at the 15 yard line.

I have done extensive research on football speed. There are four kinds of speed, or gears, if you will. There is game speed. This is the player who plays as fast as he runs. Then there is fast, which is the player who is able to turn it on when he wants and create a play when the viewer could not see that it was open. This is the category that most of the players we call "fast" fit into.

The next two categories are rarely found. There is what is called "special" speed. This is the guys like Galloway, or Deangelo Hall, or Randy Moss. They get the ball in their hands and something special happens, where a burst of energy occurs and suddenly they are on the field by themselves and what looks like an angle will be cut off ends up being an easy touchdown where players that we call "fast" are embarrassed on Sportscenter. Most teams have maybe one player who fits this billing; whether or not he is also an athlete and can convert this kind of speed onto the field is generally the difference between him being a contributor on special teams or a star on Sundays.

The final category is what is called "elite" speed. This speed is only found in few humans and rarely transcends into a good football player. Darrell Green had it, and he is one of the very few who were able to make money in the NFL with it. Renaldo Nehemia had it, but he couldn't catch a football to save his life. Willie Gault had it, but, while he had a decent career, few of Gault's catches occurred unless his speed gave him the gift of being wide open. Countless track stars have been recruited over the years to join college football teams. The Washington Huskies gave a full ride scholarship in 1998 to a track star named Ja'Warren Hooker. He had elite speed but was scared to death to get tackled on a kickoff return.

Long story short, Jacoby Ford is a decent football player, and he might have special speed, but he does not have "elite speed". If he did he would be a lot more player than he is, and would have been a man among boys at the college level. It would take "elite speed" to run a 4.19 at the combine in Indianapolis.
Call it what you want. I bet he runs something very close in the 4.2 range.

MattyFos
01-16-2010, 04:59 AM
From what I heard, and no one knows for sure. Primetime ran below a 4.2.. I think there are rumors that he ran a 4.18 or a 4.19. He never says what he ran. And there's no record of it either. But I think Deion is the only player to ever break the 4.2 threshold... if you believe in rumors

Thumper
01-16-2010, 05:10 AM
Jacoby Ford is faster than Trinidon Holliday...

Evidence:
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/n9UNxPhDee4&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/n9UNxPhDee4&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

nhlkdog411
01-16-2010, 09:01 AM
Jacoby Ford is faster than Trinidon Holliday...

Evidence:
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/n9UNxPhDee4&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/n9UNxPhDee4&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

And the video someone linked above of a different race is Holliday beating Ford...lets face it we won't know who's faster in the 40 between those 2 until the combine. (or pro-days if Holliday doesn't get an invite)

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 11:14 AM
And the video someone linked above of a different race is Holliday beating Ford...lets face it we won't know who's faster in the 40 between those 2 until the combine. (or pro-days if Holliday doesn't get an invite)

I posted the link, are we talking 60m or 100m? Jacoby beat him in the 60m but got beat in the 100m by Holliday. With 60m being better to speculate 40 speed you could say Jacoby is faster.

billsfootball15
01-16-2010, 11:27 AM
Here are some of my guesses:
CJ Spiller: 4.37
Jacoby Ford: 4.32
Trindon Holliday: 4.34
Dexter McCluster: 4.47
Ndamukong Suh: 5.02
Terrence Cody: 5.90
Taylor Mays: 4.41
Tim Tebow: 4.62

keylime_5
01-16-2010, 11:32 AM
the new surface in Lucas Oil Stadium seems to be a bit slower track than what they had in the RCA dome. Also, Tebow has never been considered a fast guy, more of a power runner who is fast enough for a QB. I doubt he breaks 4.6. I could see him running around 4.7 really.

brasho
01-16-2010, 12:21 PM
Holiday vs. Ford... something for you guys that think you know everything about speed but really don't:

The very first aspect in competitive sprinting is reaction time does not every come in to play when running a 40. In Olympic style sprinting the runners start running at the sound of the gun, in a 40 yard dash the runner begins when he is ready and the clock starts at first movement.



Also, all of this talk of fastest 40 time ever and no mention of Bo Jackson's 4.20 during his combine? Considering he did that at 222 lbs I would consider that far more impressive than what Deion did (widely disputed to be as low as 4.19) at his 187 lbs or so.

Babylon
01-16-2010, 12:31 PM
Here are some of my guesses:
CJ Spiller: 4.37
Jacoby Ford: 4.32
Trindon Holliday: 4.34
Dexter McCluster: 4.47
Ndamukong Suh: 5.02
Terrence Cody: 5.90
Taylor Mays: 4.41
Tim Tebow: 4.62

I think Mays will break below 4.4 on any surface.

Also dont even want to visualize Cody running the 40. Hope he keeps his shirt on.

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 12:37 PM
Holiday vs. Ford... something for you guys that think you know everything about speed but really don't:

The very first aspect in competitive sprinting is reaction time does not every come in to play when running a 40. In Olympic style sprinting the runners start running at the sound of the gun, in a 40 yard dash the runner begins when he is ready and the clock starts at first movement.



Also, all of this talk of fastest 40 time ever and no mention of Bo Jackson's 4.20 during his combine? Considering he did that at 222 lbs I would consider that far more impressive than what Deion did (widely disputed to be as low as 4.19) at his 187 lbs or so.

You can't compare older players speed to now. Players are faster and stronger across the board. If a players combine time was before 1990 it's not accurate compared to a players time now.

Cigaro
01-16-2010, 12:37 PM
Not concerned with a specific time, but I'll say Jacoby Ford will set the new Combine 40 record.

brasho
01-16-2010, 01:14 PM
You can't compare older players speed to now. Players are faster and stronger across the board. If a players combine time was before 1990 it's not accurate compared to a players time now.


Really? Why is that? Because now they are done electronically? WRONG. Even now at the combine the start of the 40 is done with handheld.

And from what you said that makes what Jackson did even more impressive. At 6'1 222 lbs running a 4.20 back in 86, just think what he would have run now in 2010. With the advances in nutrition, supplementation, speed and strength training, plus giong to a specialist to teach him how to run a fast 40, he would have been 235-240 lbs and run 4.15. What year do you think Deion came out anyways? Wasn't it 1989?

SkyNet
01-16-2010, 01:17 PM
Really? Why is that? Because now they are done electronically? WRONG. Even now at the combine the start of the 40 is done with handheld.

And from what you said that makes what Jackson did even more impressive. At 6'1 222 lbs running a 4.20 back in 86, just think what he would have run now in 2010. With the advances in nutrition, supplementation, speed and strength training, plus giong to a specialist to teach him how to run a fast 40, he would have been 235-240 lbs and run 4.15. What year do you think Deion came out anyways? Wasn't it 1989?

I would bet the following......my house,car,wife,dog,business,anything else I could POSSIBLE Y think off, Bo Jackson did NOT run a legit 4.2

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 01:29 PM
Really? Why is that? Because now they are done electronically? WRONG. Even now at the combine the start of the 40 is done with handheld.

And from what you said that makes what Jackson did even more impressive. At 6'1 222 lbs running a 4.20 back in 86, just think what he would have run now in 2010. With the advances in nutrition, supplementation, speed and strength training, plus giong to a specialist to teach him how to run a fast 40, he would have been 235-240 lbs and run 4.15. What year do you think Deion came out anyways? Wasn't it 1989?

I'm more worried about the stopwatch they used to do Bo Jackson's 40. You can lose up to .5 seconds this way. Now with technology we have it done electronic when they cross the 40.

HotRod35
01-16-2010, 01:51 PM
I keep thinking that, and then I watch this and quickly change my mind:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26rLxHZpiKQ

That is a good post with the link. I think Mays runs at 4.5 to4.55 right now, at his current weight. So I think he is slower than you say, but let me stress that is still very fast for a safety his size. It is plenty fast enough. 40 times overall are vastly skewed, to show the vast majority of players are faster than they are (though there are some notable exceptions where for some reason, people want to claim a they certain player is slower).

Keep in mind, contrary to misconception, there are really not that many guys who run less than 4.5 seconds on a consistent basis.

Fact: According to last year's combine the average 40, for a Free safety, was 4.61 timed by hand and 4.57 timed electronically. The average size for the timed players was 5'11" and 204 lbs. For strong Safeties the average times were actually a touch faster, which is a little surprising, at 4.57 and 4.54 respectively; the average size was 6'0.5" (meaning less than 6'1") and 212lbs.

So guys need to remember that when they say this guy, or that guy is slow, when they run a 4.55 second 40. That is not slow, especially if you are well over 200lbs. The times and weights above are from Draft Daddy. com

A, perhaps, more important question, is whether or not the link you posted is proof that Best has a lot of trouble, turning the corner, and will this impact his draft status as it tends to indicate he is a one dimensional?

For the record, I don't think that is true, but I know a lot of people would make that argument for other running backs if they had a run exactly like that.

superman8456
01-16-2010, 02:09 PM
Who do you guys think will have the most reps of 225?

LookItsAlDavis
01-16-2010, 02:32 PM
Who do you guys think will have the most reps of 225?

Tim Tebow, Duh. He's putting it up 3:16 times, and his 40's going to be 4:19.

HotRod35
01-16-2010, 02:47 PM
I think it is going to be interesting to see what Tebow posts. Not for the reasons that some people think because I don't think it will make much difference where he goes one way or the other. That is unless he posted something less than, say, 4.5, or over 5.0, but there is not a chance that will happen.(well over 5.0 maybe, if he is hurt or something).

The reason that I am interested is that I think Tebow has proven, the last 4 years you can be a very effective runner and not exhibit anything approaching "elite" speed. I think he was an exceptional runner, and this is coming from a die hard Seminole.

Over and over he exhibited, what power, and vision can do for you on a football field, not to mention determination and will power. There are plays were he breaks the line and a safety is looking right at him, and there are other players one side of Tebow, which means he is limited in his options. Yet the Safety will hesitate; just for a split second even though there is no one between them and their prey. I am watching and thinking, "he's going to get him eaisly" but the guy delays ever so slightly. Before you know it, Tebow gets and extra 5 or 6 yards for an 8 yard run when you are thinking at best it should have been a 3 or 4 yard run.

I saw it over and over. Guess what, almost no D1 DB has a problem running up to a 180 to 210 runner, but as Tebow proved over and over, most of them have an issue when the runner is 230 to 240, and he runs with determination. If the DB pauses at all he negates his 1 to 2 tenths second speed advantage, and now it is "mano mano" and Tebow will win that deal far more than not.

Again, I am a Nole, and I was pullling for those guys to nail him, but, I a like to be fair in my analysis and most of the time they did not. They gave up thier speed advantage with the slightest of hesitation and at that point Tebow's, power, and determination took over, and won far more than not.

So, I am just curious what he will run. If it is say 4.8, it will be interseting becasue I think the guy can play.

brasho
01-16-2010, 03:06 PM
I'm more worried about the stopwatch they used to do Bo Jackson's 40. You can lose up to .5 seconds this way. Now with technology we have it done electronic when they cross the 40.

Not .5, that's incorrect.... I've seen some estimate as high as .15 and others as low as .05 plus or minus and from watching handtimes vs. official times at the combine it is usually off no more than .03-.09

brasho
01-16-2010, 03:09 PM
I think it is going to be interesting to see what Tebow posts. Not for the reasons that some people think because I don't think it will make much difference where he goes one way or the other. That is unless he posted something less than, say, 4.5, or over 5.0, but there is not a chance that will happen.(well over 5.0 maybe, if he is hurt or something).

The reason that I am interested is that I think Tebow has proven, the last 4 years you can be a very effective runner and not exhibit anything approaching "elite" speed. I think he was an exceptional runner, and this is coming from a die hard Seminole.

Over and over he exhibited, what power, and vision can do for you on a football field, not to mention determination and will power. There are plays were he breaks the line and a safety is looking right at him, and there are other players one side of Tebow, which means he is limited in his options. Yet the Safety will hesitate; just for a split second even though there is no one between them and their prey. I am watching and thinking, "he's going to get him eaisly" but the guy delays ever so slightly. Before you know it, Tebow gets and extra 5 or 6 yards for an 8 yard run when you are thinking at best it should have been a 3 or 4 yard run.

I saw it over and over. Guess what, almost no D1 DB has a problem running up to a 180 to 210 runner, but as Tebow proved over and over, most of them have an issue when the runner is 230 to 240, and he runs with determination. If the DB pauses at all he negates his 1 to 2 tenths second speed advantage, and now it is "mano mano" and Tebow will win that deal far more than not.

Again, I am a Nole, and I was pullling for those guys to nail him, but, I a like to be fair in my analysis and most of the time they did not. They gave up thier speed advantage with the slightest of hesitation and at that point Tebow's, power, and determination took over, and won far more than not.

So, I am just curious what he will run. If it is say 4.8, it will be interseting becasue I think the guy can play.


40 time for QBs is irrelevant, even for the scramblers. Jake Plummer ran a 4.87 and was known as one of the most most mobile QBs around.... then Bruce Gradkowski ran a 4.59 and couldn't get away from the rush... it has more to do with feet and how it relates to escapability. Tebow will be plenty fast when he's running as a QB but don't think for a second that he will be out there running over guys, it will lead to a very short career.

ThePudge
01-16-2010, 03:14 PM
Who do you guys think will have the most reps of 225?

I expect Brandon Graham to break 30. I doubt that'll be the highest, but I expect his total to be very impressive.

Thumper
01-16-2010, 03:19 PM
Suh should be a monster at the bench press, the guys arms are monstrous. Also Rennie Curran is ripped as hell and put up 400+ as a senior in highschool so I would expect him to be at least in the discussion.

brasho
01-16-2010, 03:22 PM
I would bet the following......my house,car,wife,dog,business,anything else I could POSSIBLE Y think off, Bo Jackson did NOT run a legit 4.2

That's all you, then. Because I kept that USA Today combine comparison of draft prospects from that year for a long, long time... and it said 4.2... and nobody else was close to him. Now I didn't time Jackson myself but I know what I saw in the paper. I also didn't time Chris Johnson but I know he was fast.

Then he goes to baseball and he was easily the fastest player in baseball with the strongest outfield arm and could hit a ball farther than anybody in the game... then he goes to the Raiders and he was again the fastest player in that sport plus his QB, Jay Schroeder had the strongest arms of any QB in the game...and yet Schroeder didn't even have the strongest arm on his own team, Jackson did.

Mr.KnowItAll
01-16-2010, 03:54 PM
Not .5, that's incorrect.... I've seen some estimate as high as .15 and others as low as .05 plus or minus and from watching handtimes vs. official times at the combine it is usually off no more than .03-.09

.5 is CORRECT. Post a link saying it's not if you have proof like me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40-yard_dash

brasho
01-16-2010, 10:10 PM
.5 is CORRECT. Post a link saying it's not if you have proof like me.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/40-yard_dash

Are you freaking kidding me? You're using wikipedia as your proof? You probably wrote the entry, that's freaking ridiculous. I could go on there right now, change whatever you say it says and put on there that hand-timing is better than ice cream and rainbows. You know nothing. As an English teacher, and like all other teachers, when we ask for sources on written reports, wikipedia is NOT a valid source... for anything.

But let's use logic here.. So you're saying that a trained scout can hold a hand-timer for a guy that just ran a 4.5 and put down a 4.0 for him instead? Nobody's reaction times with a clock in their hand is that slow, not old Gil Brandt, not Joe Paterno, not even Tom Landry (and yes, I know Landry is dead).

Give us all a break, .5 is NOT right, not even close. I get your moniker now, I mean because for a short time I actually thought you might know some things, but you don't, it's based on irony, right?

brasho
01-16-2010, 10:19 PM
Suck on this, know-nothing http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2008/11000/Reliability_and_Accuracy_of_Handheld_Stopwatches.3 5.aspx

It states here on the NSCA site, the Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research, only the #1 source for athletic training in the world that the margin for error was anywhere from .16 to .24 and that 67.3% were faster and 29.4% were slower, which means 32.7% were slower or the same. Plus, add in the fact that the times at the combine are only half digital and then the margin for error will likely go down even more. Do you even understand what I just wrote or the article, or should I put it in wikipedia under an article titled, "stopwatch research for dummies"?

Thumper
01-16-2010, 10:21 PM
^^^^
Psssshhh.... Are YOU kidding? We all know that Deion and Bo Jackson ran 4.7 40 yard dash times!!1!1 You're very clearly wrong because Wikipedia is the most reliable source out there, it's like an encyclopedia, it has stuff on everything!! So Wikipedia >YOU! Take that! Internetz is straight bizznezz, no time for clowns like you!

:D

brasho
01-17-2010, 09:49 AM
^^^^
Psssshhh.... Are YOU kidding? We all know that Deion and Bo Jackson ran 4.7 40 yard dash times!!1!1 You're very clearly wrong because Wikipedia is the most reliable source out there, it's like an encyclopedia, it has stuff on everything!! So Wikipedia >YOU! Take that! Internetz is straight bizznezz, no time for clowns like you!

:D

You might want to let Dr. Know-nada that you are kidding, he might actually use your post as proof that he is somehow right. Of course that might make it even funnier so maybe not.

BTW, are you sure about Sanders and Jackson running 4.7's, you know there i about a 1/3 chance that the clocks were .5 off the other way and they ran 3.7's.

Mr.KnowItAll
01-17-2010, 12:25 PM
Suck on this, know-nothing http://journals.lww.com/nsca-jscr/Abstract/2008/11000/Reliability_and_Accuracy_of_Handheld_Stopwatches.3 5.aspx

It states here on the NSCA site, the Journal of Strength and Conditioning Research, only the #1 source for athletic training in the world that the margin for error was anywhere from .16 to .24 and that 67.3% were faster and 29.4% were slower, which means 32.7% were slower or the same. Plus, add in the fact that the times at the combine are only half digital and then the margin for error will likely go down even more. Do you even understand what I just wrote or the article, or should I put it in wikipedia under an article titled, "stopwatch research for dummies"?

So basically your saying that your Bo Jackson could be off anywhere from .16 to .24??? I wouldn't call that an accurate timing method but what do I know I'm a ****** right

brasho
01-17-2010, 12:52 PM
So basically your saying that your Bo Jackson could be off anywhere from .16 to .24??? I wouldn't call that an accurate timing method but what do I know I'm a ****** right

Yes, he "could" be off by that much.... but also keep in mind that before the official timing began, the times that were used and listed at the combine were usually averages of several different people.... and also keep in mind that the times at the combine are only half electronic... the timer is started by hand (which relies on reaction time rather than anticipation, like the finish, which is where most times go awry). If you read the numbers listed in the study, the 250+ people that were being used in the study had no prior experience with timers... I would think that experienced scouts would be even more accurate.


And no, I don't think you're a ********, you seem like more of a ******. (for the record, I wasn't sure what a ******* was, so I just typed astericks for both "words".

bored of education
01-17-2010, 01:08 PM
Toby Gerhart runs a 4.41

PhinsRock
01-17-2010, 02:16 PM
Riley Cooper a 4.3?? I consider him more of a 4.5 guy.

Babylon
01-17-2010, 03:07 PM
Riley Cooper a 4.3?? I consider him more of a 4.5 guy.

He's run away from most SEC corners in his time at Florida and he says he's a 4.3-4.4 guy. Not ready to disagree with him based on what i've seen.

RealityCheck
01-17-2010, 03:17 PM
Dexter McCluster - 4.50
No chance in hell.

Notredameleo
02-10-2010, 01:51 PM
There is no way in hell that there is a .5 discrepancy. That is ridiculous. So, Chris Johnson ran anywhere from a 3.7-4.7?

Ozzy
02-10-2010, 02:11 PM
Realitycheck: Jacoby Ford - 4.19 (yeah)
C.J. Spiller - 4.30
Riley Cooper - 4.36
Toby Gerhart - 4.55
Noel Devine - 4.28
Mardy Gilyard - 4.24 (mark it down)
Tim Tebow - 4.51
Joe Haden - 4.33
Taylor Mays - 4.31
Are you serious? Gerhart running a 4.55? I seriously doubt that, and Tebow running a 4.51? Honestly? If he could run that fast, there would be no issue with him moving to tight end potentially, sad thing is I doubt he is that fast in a straight line. He ran over people in college, not past them. The rest I can see happening, would be lovely if Joe Haden is that fast but I am not sure. And as for Cooper, well if he was really that fast, he would have been a lot more productive in his early years at Florida instead of just having a good senior season. Lucky for him the receivers are not that deep this year so he will get picked probably in the 3rd or 4th maybe.

Babylon
02-10-2010, 02:21 PM
Are you serious? Gerhart running a 4.55? I seriously doubt that, and Tebow running a 4.51? Honestly? If he could run that fast, there would be no issue with him moving to tight end potentially, sad thing is I doubt he is that fast in a straight line. He ran over people in college, not past them. The rest I can see happening, would be lovely if Joe Haden is that fast but I am not sure. And as for Cooper, well if he was really that fast, he would have been a lot more productive in his early years at Florida instead of just having a good senior season. Lucky for him the receivers are not that deep this year so he will get picked probably in the 3rd or 4th maybe.

Gerhart probably pulls a Beanie Wells and runs a high 4.5 low 4.6 so i dont think saying 4.55 is that far off.

As for Cooper he was pretty much a baseball/football guy who didnt really commit one way or the other till this year, he was also pretty deep on the depth chart for his early years behind some really talented receivers, when thrown to he was very productive. As for the relation between fast 40 times and being a really good reciever i dont think that logic holds much water.

Ozzy
02-10-2010, 07:48 PM
Gerhart probably pulls a Beanie Wells and runs a high 4.5 low 4.6 so i dont think saying 4.55 is that far off.

As for Cooper he was pretty much a baseball/football guy who didnt really commit one way or the other till this year, he was also pretty deep on the depth chart for his early years behind some really talented receivers, when thrown to he was very productive. As for the relation between fast 40 times and being a really good recieve
I would be very impressed if Gerhart pulls off a 4.5 40 time, Wells that does not surprise me at all, but if Gerhart can do it very impressive.

As for Cooper, well I would be shocked if he runs that fast, and as for speed and getting on the field, since when did speed not matter? True he sat behind Murphy and Harvin but he still could have got on the field if he was that fast. And he got so many balls this year and had a great year but not like Tebow had many other targets to throw too.

True I could be incorrect, but basing all of this on how fast they look on the field. And really, one can run a fast 4.3 40 but on the field they are not that fast and are not that explosive. Then yes 40 times in some ways mean nothing. Game speed means a lot, and having those pads is pretty important as well.

Grizzlegom
02-10-2010, 08:40 PM
Penn State Player 40 predictions:

Navorro Bowman - 4.71
Sean Lee - 4.66
Andrew Quarless - 4.57
Daryll Clark - 4,69
Josh Hull - 4.81
Jared Odrick - 5.01

I think Sean Lee's knees are going to test fine and he's going to surprise people with his speed as he makes everyone remember how high he was ranked before he tore up his knee. Bowman and Quarless should also both work out well while Odrick and Hull show they are blue collar overachievers that flash on tape but don't wow in workouts. Clark should test well physically but he'll struggle in QB workouts.

Woody56
02-11-2010, 11:25 PM
Cooper not fast? Check out 2:07 of this video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mAZ7y2kWCw4

looks like 4.45 at least

batsandgats
02-12-2010, 12:33 AM
Cooper was timed at 4.35 so I dont think his time will be that far off. 4.4 at the slowest. I remember one play where he was blocking for james on a td return, made a key block to spring him open and then beat him to the endzone. When Tebow has hit him in stride (which didnt happen often) he burned whoever was covering him, just look at the 80 yard td in the sugar bowl and the pass against South Carolina. His coaches even said that on the field he could run step for step with guy like Demps (who does have elite speed) they said he wouldn't beat him in a race but he would only be a step or two behind.

As for Gerhart, he was recently timed at 4.43, so I doubt he runs any lower than 4.55 electronically. He ran step for step with Taylor Mays for about 30 yards and has burned quite a few dbs in his career.

I think Daryll Clark will run in the 4.5 range.

underscore
02-15-2010, 06:05 PM
Penn State Player 40 predictions:

Navorro Bowman - 4.71
Sean Lee - 4.66
Andrew Quarless - 4.57
Daryll Clark - 4,69
Josh Hull - 4.81
Jared Odrick - 5.01

I think Sean Lee's knees are going to test fine and he's going to surprise people with his speed as he makes everyone remember how high he was ranked before he tore up his knee. Bowman and Quarless should also both work out well while Odrick and Hull show they are blue collar overachievers that flash on tape but don't wow in workouts. Clark should test well physically but he'll struggle in QB workouts.

Odrick will test well. He's very lean for 300lbs, so his 40 time should be below 5. I think Bowman will run in the low 4.6s. Hull may not break 4.9. Clark and Lee sound about right.

Babylon
02-15-2010, 06:18 PM
Odrick will test well. He's very lean for 300lbs, so his 40 time should be below 5. I think Bowman will run in the low 4.6s. Hull may not break 4.9. Clark and Lee sound about right.

If Odrick runs under 5.0 i think he gets himself into the 20s.

Thumper
02-15-2010, 06:23 PM
Everson Griffen is going to blow the roof off the stadium, thats all I'm going to say.

underscore
02-16-2010, 03:58 PM
SOmeone on the Scout.com Steelers forum claims to have worked out with Sean Lee today, and Lee weighed in at 242 and ran a 4.53 in some combine prep workouts.

Take it FWIW...

Babylon
02-16-2010, 04:41 PM
SOmeone on the Scout.com Steelers forum claims to have worked out with Sean Lee today, and Lee weighed in at 242 and ran a 4.53 in some combine prep workouts.

Take it FWIW...

Doesnt surprise me. He's a good player but injuries, size and the fact that he'll be 24 before the start of next season will probably knock him down a bit.