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View Full Version : Pioli: "You know how I feel about safeties that early"


FrankGore
03-22-2010, 12:33 PM
Atlanta GM Thomas Dimitroff calls the safety-at-the-top-of-the-draft debate a conundrum. "It's been on my mind a lot lately," he said, "and I realize I'm speaking out of both sides of my mouth here, but Berry's a really good player. It's been on my mind quite a bit recently. You want the good hitter with hip movement, able to turn and run, but then reality sets in. I was talking to [Kansas City GM] Scott Pioli about Berry, and I said, 'Scott, this guy's your pick.' And he said, 'You know how I feel about safeties that early.' And I understand.''

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/peter_king/03/21/meetings/1.html#ixzz0ivWyRAa1

Smokescreen? Irrelevant, since Pioli could make an exception if Berry is a good enough prospect?

I dunno, but it seems to fall in line with what a lot of people are thinking about KC's pick, and there was a STRONG pre-draft read on what KC was going to do last year when they picked Tyson Jackson. This is going to be a very interesting team to watch as we inch closer to the draft. As much as KC fans don't want to see it happen, I would not be surprised to see a tackle, a trade down or a pick out of left field.

STsACE
03-22-2010, 12:41 PM
If KC wants to trade down to say #7 for an additional 3rd rounder, I'd do it;)

I was really surprised last year when Tyson Jackson was taken last year, so anything is possible. I wouldn't be surprised if they reached for a player.

RWills
03-22-2010, 12:45 PM
Dan Williams - NT's are valued almost as high as Qb's these days, look at the contracts of ones that just signed. If you run a 3-4 you need a NT

FrankGore
03-22-2010, 12:50 PM
Dan Williams - NT's are valued almost as high as Qb's these days, look at the contracts of ones that just signed. If you run a 3-4 you need a NT

I was just going to throw the same thing out there. He's defined himself as the #1 NT in the draft and a definite top 15 value. If it came down to it, given Pioli's history, emphasis on DL and KC's need...we could see Dan Williams in the top 5, or at the very least, in a trade down.

Veeeerrryyy interestinggggg.

Scotty D
03-22-2010, 12:52 PM
Thats actually an interesting idea. Dan Williams this years Tyson Jackson?

mario
03-22-2010, 12:55 PM
I just don't see Dan Williams being a 3-4 NT in the pros...

BlueBandit24
03-22-2010, 01:01 PM
Dan Williams is an interesting idea, but would KC want to make it three straight Top 5 picks of a defensive lineman? That's a lot of money tied up at the position and there are capable NT's available later in the draft. But after Tyson Jackson last year, nothing they do would really surprise me.

Addict
03-22-2010, 01:03 PM
Thats actually an interesting idea. Dan Williams this years Tyson Jackson?

to the same team no less.

if they want a nose tackle wouldn't they be better off trading up a few picks with their second rounder, to get Cody?

RWills
03-22-2010, 01:11 PM
Cody could still go Baltimore or Chargers in round 1

Addict
03-22-2010, 01:14 PM
Cody could still go Baltimore or Chargers in round 1

see what I did there in my post? I said 'trading up'.

http://www.usedbooks.co.nz/images/Book/0156035103.jpg

Splat
03-22-2010, 01:17 PM
If KC wants to trade down to say #7 for an additional 3rd rounder.

I would take that deal in a heart beat move down two spots and pick up an extra 3rd to go along with their two seconds.

KCStud
03-22-2010, 01:17 PM
As a huge Chiefs fan, I can tell you that almost everyone wants Berry. He is this years Aaron Curry. The incredibly hyped up player who is a position of need, but we won't take him.
Pioli believes in building the OL and front 7. Parcells and Belicheck taught him this. Just look at the drafts he helped with in NE. A safety is not worth a top 5 pick to him and I think he is telling the truth when he says that.
KC has made some very good OL additions though. Lilja and Weigmann are starters. I can see Albert being moved to RT being that he doesn't make LT money and he is versatile. IMO Haley and Pioli think Albert is a decent LT, but his fundamentals are lacking.
Why pass up Okung or Bulaga who have very good fundamentals and are outstanding pass defenders?

Honestly I see OT or McClain as the pick. The KC brass had dinner with McClain the night before his pro day and Pioli loves LB's, also the Saban connection is there.
KC also just had a private workout with Kam Chancellor, so I can see a safety being taken with our late 2nd round pick or early 3rd.

Either way I'm trusting Pioli. I think Jackson was a great pick for what we are looking to do and I would take McClain over Curry in a 3-4 defense if I had a choice.

Splat
03-22-2010, 01:20 PM
I would have no problem what so ever with the Chiefs taking Okung at #5 but he is the only OT I feel worth that pick.

Babylon
03-22-2010, 01:30 PM
GMs need to remember 3 name when saying they wouldnt take a safety that early.

Kenny Easley
Ronnie Lott
Sean Taylor

Rosebud
03-22-2010, 01:32 PM
This draft has too many quality NT prospects for KC to shell out top 5 money for yet another defensive lineman. They can try and trade up for Cody in round two or wait for Cam Thomas, Torrell Troup or Linval Joseph.

KCStud
03-22-2010, 01:41 PM
This draft has too many quality NT prospects for KC to shell out top 5 money for yet another defensive lineman. They can try and trade up for Cody in round two or wait for Cam Thomas, Torrell Troup or Linval Joseph.

I agree. They went to visit Torell Troupe and had extensive talks with Cam Thomas at the combine. Romeo Crennel coached Troupe in the East-West Shrine game and loved the kid. I think we draft Troupe.

RaiderNation
03-22-2010, 01:55 PM
Do they have a need for a pass rusher? JPP? Or they got OT with Okung or Bulaga? Dez Bryant?

RealityCheck
03-22-2010, 02:15 PM
So I gues Boolaga will be the pick.

Morton
03-22-2010, 02:18 PM
I guarantee you there is NO way Eric Berry is picked by the Chiefs.

None whatsoever.

I'd bet my life savings on it,

Scotty D
03-22-2010, 02:33 PM
I guarantee you there is NO way Eric Berry is picked by the Chiefs.

None whatsoever.

I'd bet my life savings on it,

Hey, I'll bet $23 as well

T-RICH49
03-22-2010, 02:36 PM
sooner or later once anyway Pioli has to take BPA...and if it works out Berry is BPA who also happens to fill a need then icing on the cake

T-RICH49
03-22-2010, 02:37 PM
So I gues Boolaga will be the pick.


if that's the pick I am breaking something.in no way is Boolaga worth a top 5 pick

Addict
03-22-2010, 02:38 PM
I guarantee you there is NO way Eric Berry is picked by the Chiefs.

None whatsoever.

I'd bet my life savings on it,

Hey, I'll bet $23 as well

I so hope the Chiefs will pick Berry! I'd win 30 dollars! I know it was a joke Scotty, I know

prock
03-22-2010, 02:39 PM
The Chiefs run a 3-4, which means they have 3 defensive linemen, which means if they took Dan Williams this year, that is they have 3 top 5 picks on their defensive line. You can't invest that much into one unit...

T-RICH49
03-22-2010, 02:41 PM
btw we've had meetings scheduled with both Berry and Earl Thomas so who know what is going on...please give me Berry.I am sick of watching Mike Brown and Jon McGraw starting at S

TonyGfortheTD
03-22-2010, 02:49 PM
I'm not guaranteeing Berry will be the pick, but don't believe a single word coming from Peter King.

The draft is exactly a month away. This is pure BS season folks.

E: Also, have already discussed the possibility of Scott mega-reaching for Dan Williams.

vidae
03-22-2010, 02:52 PM
These threads are so hilarious.

It's a month until the draft. You don't decide who you're going to draft a month before the draft. As far as anyone here knows, "you know how I feel about safeties" might be a smokescreen and it might not, but when you people (Morton, lols) guarantees that someone won't be the pick this early? You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

At this point in the process it doesn't even matter and these kinds of things should be taken with a grain of salt. Peter King guaranteed that safety wouldn't be the pick, and he's the biggest joke in sports journalism. Take these things for what they're worth right now: nothing.

And yeah, the Browns can have our 5th overall for their 7th and their 3rd. I'll have the front office contact you immediately.

Morton
03-22-2010, 02:57 PM
I can't wait to bump this thread after the draft. Reminds me of everyone insisting that Tyson Jackson was NEVER going to be the KC pick last year because Curry was clearly the best player available in the draft.

CC.SD
03-22-2010, 02:58 PM
Why is Page not a bigger factor in these discussions? Always seemed like a baller to me. Why blow a top 5 pick on a position where you might already have the answer, especially on a team with clear holes elsewhere?



PS don't take Berry, Chiefs, i hear he has meningitis and AIDS

vidae
03-22-2010, 03:00 PM
I think most think Page would be better suited at SS than FS. Some people think he's overrated, but personally, I'm a fan.

If we draft Berry, I'd throw him at FS and move Page to SS. If he can't handle it, we did draft Dajuan Morgan a few years ago. He looked "okay" in limited action, but he could be plugged into SS as well.

keylime_5
03-22-2010, 03:01 PM
I don't expect Kansas City to take Berry. Safeties like linebackers don't go top 5 very often. Best bet by far I would say is on a tackle - either Okung or Bulaga. Need meets value meets Pioli's mindset to take linemen early.

TonyGfortheTD
03-22-2010, 03:02 PM
I can't wait to bump this thread after the draft. Reminds me of everyone insisting that Tyson Jackson was NEVER going to be the KC pick last year because Curry was clearly the best player available in the draft.

That came out about a day before the draft, not March.

Piolis first intention will likely be trade down. Saw how well that worked out last year though..

MikeTeel
03-22-2010, 03:04 PM
If Clausen is there at 5, maybe they trade back with Buffalo and pick up some extra picks? Dan Williams to the Chiefs at 9, Clausen to Buffalo at 5. You all know how Pioli works though, he likes to keep stuff private, so I'd say this is a smokescreen.

Splat
03-22-2010, 03:05 PM
If the Chiefs can come away with Okung or Berry I for one will be more then happy, if not I'm praying they can trade down.

T-RICH49
03-22-2010, 03:05 PM
If the Chiefs can come away with Okung or Berry I for one will be more then happy, if not I'm praying they can trade down.


this.trade down a few spots and get a McClain...anyone but Bulaga

vidae
03-22-2010, 03:10 PM
Sure, I'd love to trade back with Buffalo! 9 is a good spot to take McClain imo.

Seeing as how enamored that Crennel was with Troup, I'm not so sure that we'd take Dan Williams early, but Pioli makes the decisions, not the defensive coordinator.

That's the thing with Pioli drafts: the pick could literally be anyone.

FrankGore
03-22-2010, 03:14 PM
Some of you guys are saying to not take anything out of this statement from Pioli (Peter King really has nothing to do with the quote), but yet a couple workouts and private visits should be considered heavily? Not to dog you guys, but those are hardly indicators of anything either. Every year, teams bring in guys for visits, are heavily linked to them, etc. then rarely ever end up picking them when the time comes. I see what you're saying in terms of a possible smokescreen, but don't commit the same mistake on the other end...

It's all up for discussion at this point...I don't think anyone should be guaranteeing anything one way or another or shutting down possibilities personally. But I think Pioli showed last year that his thought process is pretty different from most GMs, that he's not afraid to do something out of the ordinary, and that he CAN be read before the draft. So we'll see.

RealityCheck
03-22-2010, 03:20 PM
KC may pull a Browns and trade down to the 20's and take somebody completely unexpected, like Gresham.

Dark Knight01
03-22-2010, 04:10 PM
If KC wants to trade down to say #7 for an additional 3rd rounder, I'd do it;)

I was really surprised last year when Tyson Jackson was taken last year, so anything is possible. I wouldn't be surprised if they reached for a player.







I wouldn't be surprised if they reached again like they did last year with Tyson Jackson....but I doubt they reach that much again this year.

The pick for KC will be either Berry or Bulaga.

Then Cleveland will take Berry or Clausen.

STsACE
03-22-2010, 04:50 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if they reached again like they did last year with Tyson Jackson....but I doubt they reach that much again this year.

The pick for KC will be either Berry or Bulaga.

Then Cleveland will take Berry or Clausen.

Holmgren has publicly stated he does not like Clausen.

I really hope Berry does fall to us. If not, word is Earl Thomas has visited twice. He could be 2nd on our board behind Berry.

bitonti
03-22-2010, 04:52 PM
this comment sounds like smoke screen

Splat
03-22-2010, 04:55 PM
The pick for KC will be either Berry or Bulaga.

Why do people just disregard Okung when it comes to the Chiefs?

If they are going to take an OT and the highest rated OT is on the board why take Bulaga?

Babylon
03-22-2010, 04:55 PM
So I gues Boolaga will be the pick.

We should call him Booyalaga.

ChiefMojo
03-22-2010, 05:06 PM
The assumption now is that Okung will likely be gone by #4. My feeling is if Pioli doesn't want to take Berry at #5, then he will likely take Baluga there unless he trades back. If he trades back then the pick becomes Baluga, Williams, or McClain.

kmartin575
03-22-2010, 10:39 PM
Why do people just disregard Okung when it comes to the Chiefs?

If they are going to take an OT and the highest rated OT is on the board why take Bulaga?

Because Okung really isn't a franchise left tackle and gets pushed back into the QB. Bulaga may not be either but at least he is a blue collar type who isn't going to get pushed around.

SenorGato
03-22-2010, 10:48 PM
Dan Williams - NT's are valued almost as high as Qb's these days, look at the contracts of ones that just signed. If you run a 3-4 you need a NT

Cody is more likely to Tyson Jackson the draft than Williams is IMO.

Splat
03-22-2010, 10:49 PM
If the Chiefs take Cody at #5 I'm just done with them all together.

adschofield
03-22-2010, 10:56 PM
Scott Pioli has my complete trust at this point. We have a lot of needs at this point and if wants to fill one need rather than another at #5, then I'm not going to sit here and complain.

SickwithIt1010
03-22-2010, 11:55 PM
Just thinking...Why dont they trade Dorsey for a draft pick? they might be able to get a first rounder from a 4-3 team.

The guy just doesnt fit in the 3-4.

Kind of a random thought for this thread, but thought id throw it out there.

proshoota25
03-23-2010, 12:02 AM
Just thinking...Why dont they trade Dorsey for a draft pick? they might be able to get a first rounder from a 4-3 team.

The guy just doesnt fit in the 3-4.

Kind of a random thought for this thread, but thought id throw it out there.

he played well at a point last year as a 3-4 end. people dont know what your talking about.

SickwithIt1010
03-23-2010, 12:08 AM
he played well at a point last year as a 3-4 end. people dont know what your talking about.

well i guess i saw the wrong games, i saw games in which Dorsey seemed out of place and not a very good fit. Im sure Chiefs fans would know much better than me though.

Ive also heard lots of criticism about him too, so that may have influenced that last post

PickedOffTwice
03-23-2010, 05:48 AM
Would somebody care to explain why Peter King is "the biggest idiot in sports journalism"?

I think that MMQB is always a good read. Not the Holy Grail of football journalism, mind that, but I enjoy reading it. He has always some good quotes from players and executives, too, that you don't read anywhere else.

KaneMarko
03-23-2010, 08:21 AM
I think most think Page would be better suited at SS than FS. Some people think he's overrated, but personally, I'm a fan.

If we draft Berry, I'd throw him at FS and move Page to SS. If he can't handle it, we did draft Dajuan Morgan a few years ago. He looked "okay" in limited action, but he could be plugged into SS as well.

Page's game is that of a FS. He's more of a ballhawk than a hard-hitting, in the box safety. The big knock on Page coming out of UCLA and to this day is his tackling. His tackling has been the weakest part of his game. COnversely, we've seen Page do a very good job at times playing centerfield and playing the ball. If the Chiefs need a safety, they need a SS. I think Page, assuming he's healthy, can man the FS spot more than the SS spot. IMO.

Brothgar
03-23-2010, 08:23 AM
Mount Cody @5 FTW!!!! ZOMGZZZ!

PickedOffTwice
03-23-2010, 08:35 AM
Is Pioli perhaps engaging teams that aboslutely want to pick Eric Berry to know: "If you want this guy, you can trade up with Kansas City, we will listen. So you can get your guy before either Seattle or Cleveland will."

Not sure if anyone would acutally want to trade up all the way to #5 to grab Eric Berry, just a thought.

KaneMarko
03-23-2010, 08:45 AM
Sure, I'd love to trade back with Buffalo! 9 is a good spot to take McClain imo.

Seeing as how enamored that Crennel was with Troup, I'm not so sure that we'd take Dan Williams early, but Pioli makes the decisions, not the defensive coordinator.

That's the thing with Pioli drafts: the pick could literally be anyone.

And that's what I try to tell folks. Pioli isn't going to select based on who Kiper, Mayock, Scott Wright feel is the BPA at 5. He's going to take the football player that fits their New England/Belichick/Parcell's profile. Last year, Jackson was the anti-BPA. But Pioli picked him anyway because he fit the mold.

I don't think the CHiefs' pick can be "anybody" per se. I personally think, based on history and what I've heard so far, that McClain is at the top of their list. Followed by maybe Bulaga. Pioli had a chance to get a hell on wheels pass rusher last year with Orakpo. Had a chance to get an offensive tackle with Monroe, Andre Smith and Oher still on the board. And still took Jackson.

My advice to anyone trying to pick the Chiefs' pick: Throw out conventional wisdom and start keying in on what prospect fits the New England/Belichick/Parcell's profile. And that player, as we saw last year with Jackson, probably won't be what the "experts" think is the BPA.

Splat
03-23-2010, 09:29 AM
Just thinking...Why dont they trade Dorsey for a draft pick? they might be able to get a first rounder from a 4-3 team.

The guy just doesnt fit in the 3-4.

I just give up...

CC.SD
03-23-2010, 09:56 AM
I just give up...

Poor poor Splat. Why not fit the singing munchkin into the old Dorsey sig?

yourfavestoner
03-23-2010, 10:03 AM
Question to Chiefs fans...

Was the Tyson Jackson pick rationalized by Pioli as a BAP pick or a needs pick?

Bengals78
03-23-2010, 10:03 AM
I just give up...

It is time to bring the Dorsey sig back apparently

Splat
03-23-2010, 10:07 AM
Bengal your sig is to sexy for this site to sexy for this site so sexy it hurts.

Bengals78
03-23-2010, 10:08 AM
Bengal your sig is to sexy for this site to sexy for this site so sexy it hurts.

Its a tough sig to wear. I almost didnt make it to your post. I just stop at the end of mine in a gaze....

nepg
03-23-2010, 10:21 AM
It won't be an OL. I don't know why people continue to think it will be. Less history of Pioli drafting OLs early than safeties. It'll be a DL (Suh, McCoy), Pass Rusher, or McClain.

Splat
03-23-2010, 10:25 AM
It won't be an OL. I don't know why people continue to think it will be. Less history of Pioli drafting OLs early than safeties. It'll be a DL (Suh, McCoy), Pass Rusher, or McClain.

No team is going to wrap up three top five picks on their DL and neither Suh or McCoy are going to be playing NT.

vidae
03-23-2010, 10:40 AM
Question to Chiefs fans...

Was the Tyson Jackson pick rationalized by Pioli as a BAP pick or a needs pick?

I think he was on record saying that it was "a pick that fit this football team" and that's pretty much all they ever say. "Player A or B fit this football team and what we wanted to do".. though if you're a 3-4 team you had Jackson rated higher than non 3-4 teams, so who knows. I definitely don't buy him as BPA with what was on the board, even for a team running the 3-4, but whatevs!

TitanHope
03-23-2010, 10:55 AM
I can't wait to bump this thread after the draft. Reminds me of everyone insisting that Tyson Jackson was NEVER going to be the KC pick last year because Curry was clearly the best player available in the draft.

And if you're wrong, no one will bump this thread. Why? Because no one gives a crap.

Seriously, you're not going out on a limb here, so spare us. You're taking the field instead of Berry as KC's pick. We're all in awe of the set of stones you have on you and the higher plateau of thought you dwell on, especially after all these reports that Scott Pioli doesn't want to take a Safety that early. It's totally appropriate for you to act as if what you're saying is so significant that you would be afforded the opportunity to thump your chest about it in the future. Especially when the community isn't being adamant about Berry being the pick (they may suggest it or approve of it, or even mock it in their draft, but no one's being stubborn since we all know it could very well be Okung, Bulaga, or someone else).

Jamaal Charles for OPOY, amirite?

Question to Chiefs fans...

Was the Tyson Jackson pick rationalized by Pioli as a BAP pick or a needs pick?

x2. I'd like to know this as well.


As for who KC will pick, who knows? It'll depend on how the first 4 picks ahead of them go - mainly if Washington takes Clausen over Okung. Then again, they could still take Bulaga. If they pass on Berry, then so be it. But, I do think the perception of the Safety position has changed. Bob Sanders was a DPOY a few seasons ago, and you have game-changers in guys like Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu. If you've got a stud there, then he can make plays to curb the outcome of the game and help the DEF to be that much better. If a team like KC or Cleveland thinks Eric Berry is going to be that type of Safety, then they gotta take him - especially if they have a hole at the FS or SS spot.

Splat
03-23-2010, 10:56 AM
Tyson Jackson was a need pick plane and simple.

I'm sure the Chiefs would have loved to trade down a few spots and still took him it didn't work out so they just pulled the trigger.

It is how they say what it is.

YotoJets007
03-23-2010, 12:24 PM
as Chiefs poser, he is a freaking idiot. This comment alone will lower the trade value.

Morton
03-23-2010, 12:30 PM
What would it take if a team like, say, the Eagles really had their hearts set on Berry and wanted to negotiate a trade-up with the Chiefs to the #5 spot?

How much would the Eagles have to give up in order to get the #5 pick?

yourfavestoner
03-23-2010, 12:43 PM
What would it take if a team like, say, the Eagles really had their hearts set on Berry and wanted to negotiate a trade-up with the Chiefs to the #5 spot?

How much would the Eagles have to give up in order to get the #5 pick?

I just don't get the feeling that teams are dying to give up multiple draft picks to take a safety...and then paying him twice the amount of what the highest paid safety in the league is currently making.

Morton
03-23-2010, 12:45 PM
I just don't get the feeling that teams are dying to give up multiple draft picks to take a safety...and then paying him twice the amount of what the highest paid safety in the league is currently making.

You're probably right. I was just wondering, *if* a team was really, really high on Berry and wanted to trade up, what it would take.

nepg
03-23-2010, 05:38 PM
What would it take if a team like, say, the Eagles really had their hearts set on Berry and wanted to negotiate a trade-up with the Chiefs to the #5 spot?

How much would the Eagles have to give up in order to get the #5 pick?

The Eagles really don't have anything the Chiefs would want... They run completely different systems on defense, and the Eagles aren't going to give up the insane amount of draft picks it'd take to make it work for the Chiefs.

TonyGfortheTD
03-23-2010, 05:47 PM
Question to Chiefs fans...

Was the Tyson Jackson pick rationalized by Pioli as a BAP pick or a needs pick?
Both.

During the last off-season, it was unknown if the Chiefs had anyone capable of playing 5 technique.

DE was, at least at the time, a very huge need. Pioli drafted for need but did take what was viewed as the best 3-4 DE in the draft.

keylime_5
03-23-2010, 05:47 PM
Question to Chiefs fans...

Was the Tyson Jackson pick rationalized by Pioli as a BAP pick or a needs pick?

to be fair the Browns might've taken Jackson at 5 last year if the Chiefs passed and if they didn't trade down with the Jets. Browns were eyeing him and Sanchez at 5.

no bare feet
03-23-2010, 05:48 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/afcwest/post/_/id/11312/haley-talks-about-the-chiefs-offseason

Todd Haley at the league meetings
wrong thread?

TonyGfortheTD
03-23-2010, 05:49 PM
Todd Haley is very good at revealing almost nothing. Pioli has been training him well.

no bare feet
03-23-2010, 05:51 PM
Todd Haley looks like someone, I cannot figure whom

Splat
03-23-2010, 06:06 PM
Todd Haley looks like someone, I cannot figure whom

Phil Mickelson?

ATLDirtyBirds
03-23-2010, 06:17 PM
Whatever Thomas Dimitroff says should be taken as the gospel. Unless he was trying to deceive you. You're one sly bastard Dimitroff.

LonghornsLegend
03-23-2010, 06:34 PM
You're probably right. I was just wondering, *if* a team was really, really high on Berry and wanted to trade up, what it would take.

If you have some players they could use it always makes it a bit easier to bridge the gap, or if that team is desperate to move down and willing to take a lower offer.


The Jets only had to include their 2nd round pick, and 3 players who were at best average players to secure a top 5 pick.



Jacksonville was alot further out when they moved up. I think they had #26, and it took them 2 3rd's and a 4th rounder. Not that much for a top 10 pick at all.


Both trades were what I think below trade value, but you have to find a team desperate to move down for it to work most of the time. Sucks Harvey hasn't panned out so far, but they at least got to keep their 2nd, and future picks the next year.

CC.SD
03-23-2010, 08:14 PM
Its a tough sig to wear. I almost didnt make it to your post. I just stop at the end of mine in a gaze....

I have this problem all the time.