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RWills
04-07-2010, 11:19 AM
Trying something new here because I am bored at work, here is top 5 and bottom 5 of RB's and WR's with these 3 categories.

1. Explosive / Size ratio (Short Shuttle * 3-Cone * 10-split / vertical = X ; Weight / X = ratio)
2. Lateral (40-yard - Short Shuttle)
3. 2nd Gear (40-yard - 20-split

RB

Top 5 Explosive/Size ratio
1. Montario Hardesty 56.2
2. Ben Tate 55
3. Andre Dixon 18.6
4. Dexter McCluster 15.6
5. Jahvid Best 14.3

Top 5 Lateral
1. Joique Bell 51
2. Pat Paschall 42
3. Dexter McCluster 38
4. Jake Sharpe 37
5. Andre Dixon 37

Top 5 2nd Gear
1. Ben Tate 1.82
2. Lonyae Miller 1.83
3. Jahvid Best 1.84
4. Alfonso Smith 1.85
5. Spiller/Ryan Matthews 1.86

Bottom 5 Explosive/Size
1. Jonathan Dwyer 3.2
2. Charles Scott 3.9
3. LeGarrette Blount 5.8
4. Lonyae Miller 7
5. Joe McKnight 7

Bottom 5 Lateral
1. Jonathan Dwyer -3
2. Lonyae Miller -3
3. Joe McKnight 4
4. Charles Scott 6
5. Karim/ Alfonso Smith 7

Bottom 5 2nd Gear
1. LeGarrette Blount 2.03
2. Joique Bell 2.03
3. Javarris James 2.00
4. Montario Hardesty 1.97
5. James Starks 1.96

WR

Top 5 Explosive/Size ratio
1. Scott Long 230
2. Joe Webb 230
3. Emmanuel Sanders 93
4. Mardy Gilyard 37.4
5. Donald Jones 26.7

Top 5 Lateral
1. Naaman Roosevelt 58
2. Mardy Gilyard 41
3. David Reed 41
4. Dezmon Briscoe 41
5. Joe Webb/Pat Simonds 40

Top 5 2nd Gear
1. Jacoby Ford 1.78
2. Andre Roberts 1.82
3. David Gettis 1.82
4. Carlton Mitchell 1.83
5. Arrelious Benn 1.86

Bottom 5 Explosive/Size ratio
1. Freddie Barnes 2.6
2. Antonio Brown 5
3. Marcus Easley 5
4. Kyle Williams 5.5
5. Golden Tate/ Briscoe 6

Bottom 5 Lateral
1. Jacoby Ford -22
2. Marcus Easley -21
3. David Gettis -2
4. Carlton Mitchell 1
5. Dez Bryant 4

Bottom 5 2nd Gear
1. Freddie Barnes 2.00
2. Alric Arnett 2.00
3. Seyi Ajirotutu 1.99
4. Jordan Shipley 1.98 Tied (Pat Simonds/ Stephen Williams)
5. Marc Mariani 1.97

jnew76
04-07-2010, 11:45 AM
I am a big fan of using this type of analysis to evaluate positions and I have a number of calculations for bigger players as well. I like what you have done and I think it is a good way to compare prospects...

the only difficulty is what 40 time to use. And the fact that some 10 & 20 yard splits cannot be found. Not to mention some don't run the shuttle and 3-cone.

RWills
04-07-2010, 12:02 PM
I use NFL Draft scout, I can post the URL on here, but just google a name along with nfl draft scout and the player profile should pop up



they have pretty much everything, but it is a tricky site, I only click on the postions under the '2010 Draft Scout K Probe title' or else every link will take u to cbs sports, then click on the player, they will give all numbers from combine and pro day, 10's - 20's - 3-cones, everything

Babylon
04-07-2010, 12:52 PM
I use NFL Draft scout, I can post the URL on here, but just google a name along with nfl draft scout and the player profile should pop up



they have pretty much everything, but it is a tricky site, I only click on the postions under the '2010 Draft Scout K Probe title' or else every link will take u to cbs sports, then click on the player, they will give all numbers from combine and pro day, 10's - 20's - 3-cones, everything

Going out on a limb here and assume you dont consider Toby Gerhart a RB.

RWills
04-07-2010, 01:00 PM
Going out on a limb here and assume you dont consider Toby Gerhart a RB.

I do...why would you say that? because he isn't on that list, not my fault he didn't make the list. Those are numbers produced by using the workout numbers and formula's has nothing to do with my actual rankings.

and I have Toby as my #6 RB

Babylon
04-07-2010, 01:28 PM
I do...why would you say that? because he isn't on that list, not my fault he didn't make the list. Those are numbers produced by using the workout numbers and formula's has nothing to do with my actual rankings.

and I have Toby as my #6 RB

I say that because any rational analysis of Gerhart and Dixon would tell one that Gerhart has an advantage. He's 25 lbs bigger than Dixon and his 40 is much better. Add to that he has a better broad jump. I guess we can spin numbers any way we want to make our case.

fear the elf
04-07-2010, 01:41 PM
I say that because any rational analysis of Gerhart and Dixon would tell one that Gerhart has an advantage. He's 25 lbs bigger than Dixon and his 40 is much better. Add to that he has a better broad jump. I guess we can spin numbers any way we want to make our case.

May want to back off a little. Nowhere in the thread did he mention Toby or that this is his ranking system. He just took some measurables and plugged them into an equation and ranked them based on the output. At no point did he claim to be making any sort of case.

RWills
04-07-2010, 01:43 PM
I say that because any rational analysis of Gerhart and Dixon would tell one that Gerhart has an advantage. He's 25 lbs bigger than Dixon and his 40 is much better. Add to that he has a better broad jump. I guess we can spin numbers any way we want to make our case.

That is why I use their weights in the formula

Here is Toby's numbers, this isn't the end-all-be-all, just another view at breaking down prospects.

Explosive/Size ratio - 11.5 (Ryan Matthews is 10.3)
Lateral - 25 (very good for his size)
2nd Gear - 1.94 (not very good)

batsandgats
04-07-2010, 05:49 PM
So what your saying is Toby's 40 yard speed is more initial burst than top end speed. That is what I would want in a big back anyway. Homerun runs rarely happen in the NFL unless you are Chris Johnson. The record for 30+ yard td runs in a season stood at the longest time at 7 with Jim Brown which was set in 1958. It wasn't broken until 2008, 50 years later. For runningbacks the initial 10-20 yard burst is the most important. Id rather have a back 4.5 back who has a faster 10/20 yard split than a 4.4 back who has a slower 10/20 yard split (if they weren't much different on tape). Toby performed at the top for rbs in vertical, shuttle time, and 3 cone drill. His 40 yard time is good for a guy his size, and his 10 and 20 yard splits aren't far off from Ben Tate who is at the top, 1.55 to 1.49, 2.56 to 2.52. His ten yard split would put him in the top 10 for runningbacks. Dwyer and Blount were at the bottom with 1.66 and 1.75

and btw, nfl draft scout isnt the most accurate. Jake Sharp had a 35 inch vertical but it lists it at 25, he also ran in the high 4.3's at his pro day (the slowest times scouts had for him were in the high 4.3's), and many had him timed at 4.34 but it list him as running a 4.43.

MikeTeel
04-07-2010, 05:58 PM
Maybe do this for a previous year to see how accurate it is in finding steals and such.