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View Full Version : Charles Brown vs. Anthony Davis


FrankGore
04-08-2010, 03:04 PM
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Offensive-tackle-fight-night.html

Here's a very interesting analysis of the two.

I think he hit on everything that's been talked about with Davis - the maturity questions are obviously the biggest concern, otherwise he has the ability to be a great tackle on either side.

But Charles Brown...why are people not very high on him? I hear some people saying he's not a 1st round value, but I'm not sure why. The guy projects perfectly to the left side and within a couple years he should be a very complete player at his position. He has a wide frame to accommodate some more mass, which should help him anchor and run block more effectively, and there's no question he excels in pass protection. We've seen guys like Duane Brown, Joe Staley and Sam Baker come out with very similar profiles and they've all had a good deal of success early in their careers.

So, anyone else willing to break the mold and say Brown is actually the 4th best tackle and not Davis?

Mr.Regular
04-08-2010, 03:14 PM
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Offensive-tackle-fight-night.html

Here's a very interesting analysis of the two.

I think he hit on everything that's been talked about with Davis - the maturity questions are obviously the biggest concern, otherwise he has the ability to be a great tackle on either side.

But Charles Brown...why are people not very high on him? I hear some people saying he's not a 1st round value, but I'm not sure why. The guy projects perfectly to the left side and within a couple years he should be a very complete player at his position. He has a wide frame to accommodate some more mass, which should help him anchor and run block more effectively, and there's no question he excels in pass protection. We've seen guys like Duane Brown, Joe Staley and Sam Baker come out with very similar profiles and they've all had a good deal of success early in their careers.

So, anyone else willing to break the mold and say Brown is actually the 4th best tackle and not Davis?
I think Brown is the 3rd best tackle...and Im being a little conservative with that ranking. I like him as much as anyone.
Hate to do this, this is the second time Im quoting my own blog today, but I did a piece on Brown being underrated so I think its appropriate.

Charles Brown is one of my favourite prospects in the draft and I feel is most likely the most underrated prospect regadless of position within the draftnik community. If I was to tell you that there was a 6'5 305 lb LT, who comes from one of the best programs in the country, played in a pro style attack, just completed most likely the best college season of any OT in 2009, and is also probably the best natural pass protector in the draft you would think I'm talking about a top 10 pick. But for some reason Charles Brown has been pushed down draft boards until the end of round 1. Ridiculous. I don't think he's quite on the same level as Russell Okung or probably Bryan Bulaga, but thats because of Browns lack of power running ability. Lucky for Brown, left tackles aren't paid for their power run blocking, they're paid for their pass protection skills. Brown has those. Great feet, quick lateral movement, great use of hands... and he's also fantastic in certain run situations, likely those featured in a zone blocking scheme, such as sweeps and tosses. He also gets to the second level as good as any lineman in this draft. Brown is extremely similar to D'Brickashaw Ferguson the prospect but for some reason doesn't get the same level of respect. If a team needing a LT, such as Green Bay, Arizona, or Indianapolis gets him at the end of round 1, I think we'll be looking at a huge steal.

Browns pass blocking is elite. The best of anyones in the draft. Put him on an island against any pass rusher and you should be fine. His run blocking is very underrated for the record. If he gets into the right scheme he should do very well. He is so good at getting to the second level, and when you move him around laterally in running situations he can really show off his athleticism.
Ive said it before and Ill say it again...Charles Brown is very similar to D'Brickashaw Ferguson as a prospect. Im glad other people are now seeing that comparison. I was laughed at a while back for saying that.

Come on people, theres still room on the Charles Brown bandwagon. Hop on!

V.I.P
04-08-2010, 03:23 PM
MY OT Rankings:

1. Okung
2. Bulaga
3. Williams
4. Davis
5. Brown
6.Campbell

D-Unit
04-08-2010, 03:25 PM
1. Anthony Davis
2. Bryan Bulaga
3. Charles Brown

Okung is highly overrated. He's got bust written all over him.

JFLO
04-08-2010, 03:27 PM
1. Okung
2. Williams
3. Bulaga
4. Davis
5. Brown
6. Saffold
7. Fox
8. Campbell

yeah

K Train
04-08-2010, 03:28 PM
1. Anthony Davis
2. Bryan Bulaga
3. Charles Brown

Okung is highly overrated. He's got bust written all over him.

oddly enough i agree with you...not so much charles brown #3 but about davis and bulaga 1 and 2 and okung being overrated.

i like trent williams over charles brown, even though brown looks to have beefed up just enough to make me have faith in him

scottyboy
04-08-2010, 03:32 PM
Davis is arguably the best and most talented blocker and OT in this draft. his maturity and work ethic questions are scaring people. it's as simple as that. He's inconsistant, but at his age, most players are and that can be taught I feel.

D-Unit
04-08-2010, 03:33 PM
oddly enough i agree with you...not so much charles brown #3 but about davis and bulaga 1 and 2 and okung being overrated.

i like trent williams over charles brown, even though brown looks to have beefed up just enough to make me have faith in him
I still question Trent Williams being a LT. I think the team that drafts him to be a RT will get the best out of him.

D-Unit
04-08-2010, 03:35 PM
Davis is arguably the best and most talented blocker and OT in this draft. his maturity and work ethic questions are scaring people. it's as simple as that. He's inconsistant, but at his age, most players are and that can be taught I feel.
...and the scarier thing is that Davis hasn't even been coached well yet due to the terrible Rutgers program.

hahahahhahahaa Scottyboy!

K Train
04-08-2010, 03:36 PM
I still question Trent Williams being a LT. I think the team that drafts him to be a RT will get the best out of him.

i agree but i think he will be a RT for a year or 2 and be worked onto the left side. hes not a pure RT like a guy like Gosder Cherilus, hes such a good athlete that if he cant handle playing on the left it will be a fail

DiG
04-08-2010, 03:38 PM
1. Anthony Davis
2. Bryan Bulaga
3. Charles Brown

Okung is highly overrated. He's got bust written all over him.

sounds like a dallas fan trying to feel better about skins drafting okung...typical ;)

honestly though its really scheme driven with OL beyond premiere prospects. davis will be ahead of bulaga and brown on some boards and way behind them on others.

eaglesalltheway
04-08-2010, 03:38 PM
...and the scarier thing is that Davis hasn't even been coached well yet due to the terrible Rutgers program.

hahahahhahahaa Scottyboy!

For a while there I thought **** was about to go down, royal rumble style...

D-Unit
04-08-2010, 03:44 PM
sounds like a dallas fan trying to feel better about skins drafting okung...typical ;)

honestly though its really scheme driven with OL beyond premiere prospects. davis will be ahead of bulaga and brown on some boards and way behind them on others.
I'm not new to this party. I've felt this way, way before the Skins were picking in the Top 5 and had their QB issues settled. Plus, as a Hawaii guy, you KNOW I want the best protecting Colt's blindside!!! :p

Just watch Okung play.... The guy lunges at thin air half the damn time. ...I'm exaggerating, but you get the point.

Iamcanadian
04-08-2010, 04:10 PM
It is all character issues with Davis. He doesn't show much passion or motivation for the game and that is going to drop him some come draft day. He a high risk/reward type who could turnout to be the best or a complete flop.

As for Brown, he needs to get a lot stronger but has a solid upside and should go late round 1.

ThePudge
04-08-2010, 04:11 PM
I'm not new to this party. I've felt this way, way before the Skins were picking in the Top 5 and had their QB issues settled. Plus, as a Hawaii guy, you KNOW I want the best protecting Colt's blindside!!! :p

Just watch Okung play.... The guy lunges at thin air half the damn time. ...I'm exaggerating, but you get the point.

Okung moves extremely well downfield, but he'll lunge and miss, you're right. He'll need to work on engaging at the second level in the NFL if he's ever to become an impact Left Tackle. His footwork, length, and ability use his long arms to wall defenders make him one of the class' best pass-blockers & he's not afraid to get beat. In the run game, when engaged, Okung showed tremendous upper body power, a good leg drive, and solid hand placement. ijn the run game. A well-rounded Tackle that should be the safest bet of the bunch to stick on the Left side. Worth the 4th-6th pick or so, I think Detroit would be reaching to select him at 2nd Overall.

As for Charles Brown: you love to look at his athleticism, his build, and his length but I'm surprised no one here has drawn attention to his fatal flaws. His playing temperament leaves something to be desired as he's not mean or physical by any means. He lacks anchor strength and will struggle when bull-rushed in the NFL. He's not for any team that plans to run the ball as he moves well but just isn't very strong or tough. Not a first round value in my opinion, but maybe a first round pick this month. I have him graded more in the Mid-Late 2nd and I consider him as a high upside prospect but right now he's more of a prospect than player to me; I have my doubts about his ability to succeed in the NFL though, especially in certain divisions.

Cicero
04-08-2010, 04:17 PM
1. Anthony Davis
2. Bryan Bulaga
3. Charles Brown

Okung is highly overrated. He's got bust written all over him.

Okung has bust written all over him and Davis doesn't?

GhostDeini
04-08-2010, 04:23 PM
Charles Brown is garbage and will flop in the NFL. Every time I'd watch USC I'd focus in on him and always saw him getting pushed back like a biotch. And thats against Pac10 DL.

Davis is alot better prospect. He is bigger and stronger already and hasn't gotten punked repeatedly like Brown has.

He might end up playing RT in the league but I'd rather have a Vernon Carey at RT than a Winston Justice at LT.

Babylon
04-08-2010, 04:51 PM
It is all character issues with Davis. He doesn't show much passion or motivation for the game and that is going to drop him some come draft day. He a high risk/reward type who could turnout to be the best or a complete flop.

As for Brown, he needs to get a lot stronger but has a solid upside and should go late round 1.

Totally agree with this. Davis to me is worth taking a gamble on despite any issues he might have. I think he could be a Ryan Clady type if he gets his motivation going.

Brown i'm not as high on, he came to SC as a TE and has had trouble adding bulk. In the Pac-10 where there arent but a couple of decent DEs (if that) he was less than spectacular. He got blown up on several occasions against the Oregon ducks and he is going to have to get a lot stronger to be successful. I'd personally rather roll the dice on a Bruce Campbell.

B-Dawk
04-08-2010, 04:54 PM
how does brown compare to former usc LT Sam Baker? Seems like there are a lot of the same concerns, and Baker went higher than most people thought and has played well.

LonghornsLegend
04-08-2010, 04:58 PM
Charles Brown is garbage and will flop in the NFL. Every time I'd watch USC I'd focus in on him and always saw him getting pushed back like a biotch. And thats against Pac10 DL.

Davis is alot better prospect. He is bigger and stronger already and hasn't gotten punked repeatedly like Brown has.

He might end up playing RT in the league but I'd rather have a Vernon Carey at RT than a Winston Justice at LT.



I'd venture to say over 75% of your post are bashing USC or one of their players. Is there anything else that interest you around here?

TheMorningZoo
04-08-2010, 05:01 PM
This batch of O-Line is intriguing to me this year.

Russell Okung is the premier Tackle in this Draft, but is NOT an Elite LT in the mold of a Joe Thomas, Jake Long, D'Brick, etc. I think this class is Solid all the way through, but there is not too big of a gap between a lot of the prospects. Okung I feel has similar stock status to Ryan Clady-we know he will be good, he doesn't have that surefire top 5 status. He really only does because the Redskins or Lions need a LT. By this I mean in any other years Draft if he was a prospect with the above mentioned Tackles he wouldn't sniff #2 or #4 consideration. Still a solid Lineman and top Tackle in this Class.

Bryan Bulaga in my opinion is the Safest bet in this class. He may never turn into a Franchise Bookend Left Tackle, but you know you are getting a hard-working , fundamentally solid technician who can also maul in the run game. You shouldn't have to worry with Bulaga, and can sleep easy at night. He has the ability to play RT or Guard some feel, which add's versatility-short arms are a concern, but I think since he is a hard worker he can refine his technique if that becomes an issue. I can see Bulaga having a Jordan Gross type impact. Yes Jordan Gross is a top tackle in the league, but doesn't always garner consideration with other marquee names floating around.

Trent Williams is an enigma to me. Last year he was regarded as the top Tackle coming into this year, and people talked how he would move over to the Left Side now that Loadholt was gone (ironically is now a RT). Williams was exposed on the Left Side and had a down year. I think he can play both spots obviously in the NFL, he may be a GOOD Left Tackle, but can be a GREAT Right Tackle. Yeah, teams don't spend high money on RT's, but for a team with LT locked down (San Francisco with Staley) it would make sense to go after Williams strongly. Jeff Otah had questions about his game, and he is holding down the Right Side of Carolina's line just fine.

Anthony Davis... Where do I start? Top Prep prospect, had a solid career at Rutgers, but doesn't come off to me at least as someone who is dependable. Yes he is talented and displays good athleticism for such a big man, but he has concerns about his conditioning, character, weight issues, and why would you spend a top 10 pick on someone with all these question marks? Maybe it will take some time to mature, but I just don't see him as a top tackle. He has the talent, but does he have everything else to back it up? I would rather take someone who you don't have to worry about even if their upside is less. That way you don't get burned if all else fails. Boom/Bust in my opinion, Buffalo should be buyer beware.

Bruce Campbell really is only scrutinized because the Raiders hold the #8 pick. If the Raiders had a pick in the 20's to 30's, I don't think he would get as much heat. It's not his fault he is a physical freak and people fall in love with his measureables. I watched some tape, the guy can pass block pretty well and makes some nice plays in the run game. However he is very inconsistent and you are taking a risk drafting him that early. I think talent wise he is a late 1st to mid 2nd pick, but due to the run on tackles and his elite triangle numbers someone is going to bite fast.

Charlie Brown is D'Brick 2.0 as mentioned earlier. Little undersized while at USC, he has put on some bulk and still displays great athleticism. In terms of Pass Blocking I feel he is probably the top Pass Blocker. His game as a whole can use some work though-he does display the athleticism to get to the second level and I am sure pulls with great effectiveness, but going against larger DE's may pose a problem. Not real stout at the point, Charles Brown would best be suited in a ZBS ran by the Seahawks, Houston, etc. I think when we look at this Draft in three years we will agree he is a top pass protector and is a dependable blocker.

and lastly

Jason Fox is my underrated lineman of this Draft. Solid four year starter at the U, very dependable, smart, experienced-but durability is an issue. LT prospect that should have flexibility to play on the right side. Reminds me of Eric Winston, former U Tackle now for the Texans. I think Winston had a better push in the Run game and was more effective , but Fox is probably the better Pass Blocker. Most people view him as a 3rd rounder, but I think will sneak into the middle Second if someone needs a tackle. After that it pretty much dries up

RaiderNation
04-08-2010, 05:13 PM
Bulaga and Davis are my favorites

villagewarrior
04-08-2010, 05:15 PM
Based on what I saw at the Combine, Brown is a smooth athlete while Davis is a little sloppy. Also, I think Brown can play left tackle, and I think Davis may be limited to right tackle. Maturity and work ethic are issues for Davis, I think.

D-Unit
04-08-2010, 05:25 PM
I'd venture to say over 75% of your post are bashing USC or one of their players. Is there anything else that interest you around here?
Haha Delini just got face planted.

villagewarrior, interesting comment about Brown vs Davis. Out of curiosity, who do you think has more upside? Davis or Brown?

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
04-08-2010, 05:26 PM
I think Brown is the 3rd best tackle...and Im being a little conservative with that ranking. I like him as much as anyone.
Hate to do this, this is the second time Im quoting my own blog today, but I did a piece on Brown being underrated so I think its appropriate.



Browns pass blocking is elite. The best of anyones in the draft. Put him on an island against any pass rusher and you should be fine. His run blocking is very underrated for the record. If he gets into the right scheme he should do very well. He is so good at getting to the second level, and when you move him around laterally in running situations he can really show off his athleticism.
Ive said it before and Ill say it again...Charles Brown is very similar to D'Brickashaw Ferguson as a prospect. Im glad other people are now seeing that comparison. I was laughed at a while back for saying that.

Come on people, theres still room on the Charles Brown bandwagon. Hop on!

SHHH Brown needs to fall to the colts but i dont see him getting past the packers

K Train
04-08-2010, 05:33 PM
if davis doesnt end up being a good LT like we all know he CAN be, he will be a great RT or mauling guard imo, brown offers no versatility there

J-Mike88
04-08-2010, 08:45 PM
As for Charles Brown: you love to look at his athleticism, his build, and his length but I'm surprised no one here has drawn attention to his fatal flaws. His playing temperament leaves something to be desired as he's not mean or physical by any means. He lacks anchor strength and will struggle when bull-rushed in the NFL. He's not for any team that plans to run the ball as he moves well but just isn't very strong or tough. Not a first round value in my opinion, but maybe a first round pick this month. I have him graded more in the Mid-Late 2nd and I consider him as a high upside prospect but right now he's more of a prospect than player to me; I have my doubts about his ability to succeed in the NFL though, especially in certain divisions.
Anyone know who the best 3 or 5 bull-rushers, or pass-rushers in general that Brown has faced? I mean not in practice against Matthews and Cushing prior to last year. That was probably his biggest test to date, but who were the best of the Pac-10 and whoever else he faced?

scottyboy
04-08-2010, 09:00 PM
davis has all the talent in the world and his issues never affected rutgers or his play. he's the man.

Babylon
04-09-2010, 11:10 AM
Anyone know who the best 3 or 5 bull-rushers, or pass-rushers in general that Brown has faced? I mean not in practice against Matthews and Cushing prior to last year. That was probably his biggest test to date, but who were the best of the Pac-10 and whoever else he faced?

The best DEs he faced were probably Tyson Alualu, Ricky Elmore, Teo-Nesheim and Heyward of Ohio State. He did good against all of them but i wouldnt say any are great bull rushers, maybe Alualu. The guys he faces in practice as you point out are probably the best he's faced.

killxswitch
04-09-2010, 12:55 PM
I like Charles Brown a lot and have since I heard in early 2010 that he was working hard to bulk up. Players can get stronger at lot easier than they can change who they are. I don't think maturity has much to do with it, becoming more mature doesn't usually mean becoming more aggressive and hungry to play football. Maybe it's because the Colts got burned by Tony Ugoh but I would never want a guy with the kind of motivational questions Davis has.

Brown might not be a barbarian conqueror on the field but he appears dedicated to getting better and being a great LT. He went from the 280ish range to 303 by the combine and it wouldn't surprise me if he's hovering around 310-315 by now. He's a natural pass blocker and his run blocking will improve as he gains NFL strength. If he's there at the 31st pick I hope the Colts would take him.

SKim172
04-09-2010, 03:41 PM
Does Charles Brown ever go by Charlie?

Seriously, I want to know. If I was a GM, I'd put him at kicker and sign a small girl named Lucy as the holder. I don't care how many games I lose - I want to see that happen.

J-Mike88
04-09-2010, 11:32 PM
I like Charles Brown a lot and have since I heard in early 2010 that he was working hard to bulk up. Players can get stronger at lot easier than they can change who they are. I don't think maturity has much to do with it, becoming more mature doesn't usually mean becoming more aggressive and hungry to play football. Maybe it's because the Colts got burned by Tony Ugoh but I would never want a guy with the kind of motivational questions Davis has.

Brown might not be a barbarian conqueror on the field but he appears dedicated to getting better and being a great LT. He went from the 280ish range to 303 by the combine and it wouldn't surprise me if he's hovering around 310-315 by now. He's a natural pass blocker and his run blocking will improve as he gains NFL strength. If he's there at the 31st pick I hope the Colts would take him.

Good stuff killx. That's exactly the kind of stuff I come to this site to read. Well said.
I can see Brown in Green Bay, even though he'd be really standing out on our OL.

BaLLiN
04-10-2010, 12:11 AM
this is why davis is king

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e187/whiteynelson/uncle%20rico/rutgers_3.jpg

(was gunna use a regular symbol, but saw this)

Paranoidmoonduck
04-10-2010, 03:02 AM
The best DEs he faced were probably Tyson Alualu, Ricky Elmore, Teo-Nesheim and Heyward of Ohio State. He did good against all of them but i wouldnt say any are great bull rushers, maybe Alualu. The guys he faces in practice as you point out are probably the best he's faced.

Brown didn't really match up against Alualu. Since Cal runs a 34, Alualu was mostly blocked by the LG in that game and Brown was kicking out to handle the edge rusher.

Babylon
04-10-2010, 11:01 AM
Brown didn't really match up against Alualu. Since Cal runs a 34, Alualu was mostly blocked by the LG in that game and Brown was kicking out to handle the edge rusher.

I thought i saw them move those guys around. I'll take your word for it.

Babylon
04-10-2010, 11:02 AM
this is why davis is king

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e187/whiteynelson/uncle%20rico/rutgers_3.jpg

(was gunna use a regular symbol, but saw this)

Now i see what Scottyboy sees in them.

Brent
04-10-2010, 11:11 AM
Now i see what Scottyboy sees in them.
I see some guido having sex with her.

Malaka
04-10-2010, 11:21 AM
I see some guido having sex with her.

Which is where I come in.