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roscoesdad27
06-05-2010, 05:49 PM
seperated into tiers

q.b.
1) j. locker...washington
2) r. mallet...arkansas

3) a. luck...stanford

4) c. ponder...florida state

5) j. johnson....texas a+m

r.b.
1) m. ingram...alabama
2) r. williams...v.t.

3) n. devine...wvu
4) d. murray...oklahoma

5) j. clay...wisconsin

w.r.
1) a.j. green...georgia

2) j. jones...alabama
3) j. baldwin...pitt
4) m. floyd...n.d.

5) d. brown...s. miss

t.e.
1) k. rudolph...n.d.

2) l. hendricks...wisconsin
3) k. realand...stanford

o.t.
1) g. ciamirir...wisconsin r.t. (can play left in a power run scheme)

2) a. castonozo...b.c. l.t.
3) l. ziemba...auburn l.t.

4) m. reynolds...byu r.t. (can play left in power run scheme)

5) j. barksdale...lsu r.t.

o.g.
1) t. claiborne...b.c.
2) m. pouncey....florida

3) j. moffit...wisconsin

4) a. jackson...fresno state
5) j. wilson...florida

c
1) k. odawd...usc
2) s. wisnieski....penn state

roscoesdad27
06-05-2010, 06:01 PM
4-3 d.e.
1) r. quinn...north carolina

2) g. romeus...pitt
3) a. clayborn...iowa l.e.

4) d. bowers...clemson l.e.
5) j. crawford...penn state

3-4 olb
1) r. quinn...north carolina

2) v. miller...tex a+m

3) j. crawford....penn state

4) c. matthews...s. carolina
5) s. acho....texas

4-3 d.t.
1) m. austin...north carolina

2) j. jenkins...clemson
3) j. powe...ole miss n.t.
4) j. casey...usc u.t.
5) j. crick...nebraska u.t.

3-4 d.e.
1) c. heyward...ohio state

2) m. dareus...alabama
3) a. baily...miami

4) j. crick...nebraska
5) s. paea...oregon state

3-4 n.t.
1) j. powe...ole miss

2) p. taylor...baylor

3) k. ellis...hampton


4-3 olb
1) a. ayers...ucla
2) t. lewis...oklahoma wlb

3) b. carter...north carolina wlb

4) v. miller...texas a+m slb
5) m. herzlich...b.c. slb

4-3 mlb
1) g. jones...michigan state

2) a. ayers...ucla

3) q. sturdivant...north carolina
4) c. mccarthy....miami
5) b. carter...north carolina

3-4 ilb
1) g. jones...michigan state (feature)
2) d. hightower...alabama (thumper)

3) c. gallipo...usc (thumper)
4) a. wujciak...maryland (thumper)
5) a. ayers...ucla (feature)

c.b.
1) p. peterson...lsu

2) a. williams...texas

3) p. amukara...nebraska
4) j. jenkins....florida

5) k. burney...north carolina

S
1) r. sands...wvu s.s.

2) r. moore...ucla f.s.
3) d. mcdaniel...clemson s.s.
4) d. williams...north carolina

5) t. sash....iowa

roscoesdad27
06-05-2010, 06:06 PM
big board
1) r. quinn...d.e. unc
2) j. locker....q.b. buffalo
3) r. mallet....q.b. arkansas
4) p. peterson... c.b. lsu
5) a.j. green...w.r. georgia
6) c. heyward...3-4 d.e. ohio state
7) r. sands...s.s. wvu
8) g. jones...mlb michigan state
9) a. ayers...olb ucla
10) j. jones/m. floyd/j. baldwin....w.r.'s alabama/n.d./pitt

RealityCheck
06-05-2010, 06:21 PM
I don't see Sands as one of the top 7 safeties in this class, let alone one of the 7 top players.

roscoesdad27
06-05-2010, 06:23 PM
I don't see Sands as one of the top 7 safeties in this class, let alone one of the 7 top players.

why not?....i see him as everything taylor mays and william moore was supposed to be.

bce
06-07-2010, 01:36 PM
big board
1) r. quinn...d.e. unc
2) j. locker....q.b. buffalo
3) r. mallet....q.b. arkansas
4) p. peterson... c.b. lsu
5) a.j. green...w.r. georgia
6) c. heyward...3-4 d.e. ohio state
7) r. sands...s.s. wvu
8) g. jones...mlb michigan state
9) a. ayers...olb ucla
10) j. jones/m. floyd/j. baldwin....w.r.'s alabama/n.d./pitt


Youre my hero. Robert sands #7. I cant agree with that lofty rank because i dont believe in taking safeties when your team is picking in the top 10. Sands is great though. Not only is he big fast physical and a great tackler, but i saw a couple of his picks, and he looks like a wr. I only have one safety in my top 32, its robert sands. Sands is a maniac out there with ball skills. he may not be the fastest guy, but i think hes fast enough for safety, i love his ball skills and his hitting and tackling.

I would like to know how you came to put robert sands #7. Other than my rule that i dont draft safeties when my team is bad and im picking top 10, I agree with it. Hes defintely top 7 in the class, theres no one out there who has outperformed robert sands between the white lines at safety. You must be a wvu fan or you saw what i saw, this guy was everywhere all the time.

I cant pick corners in the top 10. I like peterson and all, but when your team is bad chances are you have holes at positions of higher value, picking a corner isnt going to help much. The steelers, colts, giants, and saints have shown us recently that you dont need superstars at that position. You need adequacy of course, but you dont need high picks or deion sanders at that posotion to win nfl championships. You can get adequacy later on.

prock
06-07-2010, 03:20 PM
Youre my hero. Robert sands #7. I cant agree with that lofty rank because i dont believe in taking safeties when your team is picking in the top 10. Sands is great though. Not only is he big fast physical and a great tackler, but i saw a couple of his picks, and he looks like a wr. I only have one safety in my top 32, its robert sands. Sands is a maniac out there with ball skills. he may not be the fastest guy, but i think hes fast enough for safety, i love his ball skills and his hitting and tackling.

I would like to know how you came to put robert sands #7. Other than my rule that i dont draft safeties when my team is bad and im picking top 10, I agree with it. Hes defintely top 7 in the class, theres no one out there who has outperformed robert sands between the white lines at safety. You must be a wvu fan or you saw what i saw, this guy was everywhere all the time.

I cant pick corners in the top 10. I like peterson and all, but when your team is bad chances are you have holes at positions of higher value, picking a corner isnt going to help much. The steelers, colts, giants, and saints have shown us recently that you dont need superstars at that position. You need adequacy of course, but you dont need high picks or deion sanders at that posotion to win nfl championships. You can get adequacy later on.

You can get by with adequacy at any position, just ask the 2000 Ravens and 2002 Bucs. If you are picking in the top 10, you take the top value. Corners and safeties are fine in the top 10. Especially in today's pass happy NFL, the secondary is vital.

Roscoes, I don't hate most of the list. There are some qualms I have, but they are pretty minor, besides Sands being the 7th best prospect in the draft. I just really wish you would make this more readable. You never use capital letters or type whole names. It is a pain in the ass to read and a whole lot more people would read it if you took more time making it, well, readable.

bce
06-07-2010, 04:02 PM
You can get by with adequacy at any position, just ask the 2000 Ravens and 2002 Bucs. If you are picking in the top 10, you take the top value. Corners and safeties are fine in the top 10. Especially in today's pass happy NFL, the secondary is vital.

Roscoes, I don't hate most of the list. There are some qualms I have, but they are pretty minor, besides Sands being the 7th best prospect in the draft. I just really wish you would make this more readable. You never use capital letters or type whole names. It is a pain in the ass to read and a whole lot more people would read it if you took more time making it, well, readable.

Well thats 10 years ago. If youre picking in the top 10, you take a qb if theres one available that looks like they could be a good starter. If no qb available that looks good, you take a pass rusher. If no pass rusher available, or you already have 2 pass rushers, well chances are youre not picking in the top 10, but if by chance you are by some belichick fenegling action, you want to take an immediate return player like a rb , or a lt or nose tackle because of the dearth of humans who have the physical skills to play those positions. The last thing you want to do is take a db, interior lineman or TE.

Theres really only one scenario where you draft a corner that high. If you have two top edge rushers and a qb, and you somehow belichicked your way into the top 10, and the prospect is super, i mean 4.3 speed ball skills etc etc etc. Otherwise its mistake. Passing game is not deterred in the nfl in 2010 by dbs. Passing game in 2010 in the nfl is deterred by pressure

AntoinCD
06-08-2010, 03:01 AM
why not?....i see him as everything taylor mays and william moore was supposed to be.

You do realise that both of those guys were second rounders. Moore should have came out early and suffered from injuries and lack of production as a senior. Taylor Mays was always overhyped because of his athletic ability. If you're going to champion Sands and say he is one of the best players in the class I would maybe think of comparing him to other safeties than those two then

tjsunstein
06-08-2010, 08:13 AM
Robert Sands is not even close to one of the better safeties in this class. Pull up some game tape on him and do it fast.

bce
06-08-2010, 12:01 PM
ok then who is. Ive watched quite a bit of tape on robert sands. Not only is he a physical player, a great tackler, but he also has excellent ball skills. I would bet my life that your number 1 safety is the same as mel kipers. Cause thats how it is isnt it. Whatever they say is right.Well thats wrong, about 2/3 of the time. Your board is their board and board that doesnt look like their board is a wrong board, but truth of the matter is, their board, and the boards of nfl personnel people are wrong historically about 2/3 of the time, so since youre an advocate of their board, youre wrong about 2/3 of the time.


keep up the good work roscoe. get those interior linebackers out of your top ten though. They dont have that type of value and you can get good ones later. It is neither a position of high value nor a position of skill rarity. Meaning other positions are more important, and there are more humans who can play 4-3 or ILB lb than other positions. Theres a greater population sample of 6 2 240 men than just about any other.

prock
06-08-2010, 04:35 PM
Show me a statistic that shows that NFL teams and draft experts are wrong 2/3 of the time. And show me a statistic that you are better.

bce
06-08-2010, 05:04 PM
I dont have any statistics that im better i wish i did but i dont.

Just go to espn.com or whatever and pull up the first round draft history for whatever period of time you want to look back. Then go through the rest of the rounds and find the players that were better than those first rd picks that were not drafted in the first rd. Ive done this, my calculation is that generally 2/3 of rd 1 picks, and 50% of the top 10 historically were mistakes, meaning a better player was drafted in a position after the first rd or the top 10 respectively.

bce
06-08-2010, 05:07 PM
This doesnt even include good players who were the wrong pick. I.e passing on ben roethlisberger to pick larry fitzgerald. Fitz is a great player, but hes not ben roethlisberger as far as value. Thats not even included in those calculations those type things. If you included those type calculations, you could pretty much find that almost every pick was probably the wrong pick, meaning you may have gotten a good player, but you passed on a better one to pick that player

FUNBUNCHER
06-08-2010, 05:30 PM
All teams picking in the top 10 aren't created equal.

Sometimes a team is starting a whole slew of young guys the previous season, or have a new HC or a young QB, and the team's talent just hasn't jelled yet.

If your team has a young QB, a solid to average Oline, and decent personnel in their defensive front 7, there's no problem taking the BPA if he happens to be a CB or a safety.

As a Skins fan, although they didn't lead Washington to that many playoff appearances or wins during their time in D.C., I can't ever say that Sean Taylor or Champ Bailey were bad picks.
Both players had the singular ability to turn a game on one play and often did; IMO those type of players are always worth a top 10 pick.

bce
06-08-2010, 06:34 PM
Do you think if you have all those things you'll be picking in the top 10? I agree with your statements. Generally teams that have good qb play, solid ol and a solid front seven dont pick in the top 10. If thats the case then you can pick a supremely gifted talent like bailey or taylor. 230 lb guys with 4.3 speed and corners with 4.2 speed size and ball skills. But theres not a champ bailey or sean taylor out there every year. Joe haden is not champ bailey. Eric berry is not sean taylor.

But I gotta ask you, wouldnt #7 have sure look good in a redskins uniform? Sean taylor was a great talent, but rip and no disrespect, hes not ben roethlisberger. No matter how good he is, he doesnt have that type value. Bringing sean taylor or champ bailey on to your team isnt going to make you the two time thats right two time super bowl champions.

prock
06-08-2010, 06:45 PM
Big Ben didn't make the Steelers two time champions. He made them one time Super Bowl champions, and the Steelers defense and offensive line made Big Ben a two time, that's right, a two time Super Bowl champion.

If a team is picking in the top ten, and they don't need a pass rusher, left tackle, or quarterback, what would you take? Take the Chiefs for example. They just paid the **** out of a quarterback, didn't feel they needed a left tackle, and there wasn't a pass rusher worth taking. Would you rather have a right tackle, reach like hell for a pass rusher like JPP or Derrick Morgan, or take a defensive game changer like Berry to help fix one of the worst pass defenses in the league? What would you do?

RealityCheck
06-08-2010, 06:48 PM
This doesnt even include good players who were the wrong pick. I.e passing on ben roethlisberger to pick larry fitzgerald. Fitz is a great player, but hes not ben roethlisberger as far as value.
I agree, because I'd much rather have an average QB accused of rape than a physical freak who is one of the best WRs in a dozen of years.

tjsunstein
06-08-2010, 06:53 PM
Interesting that you have Claiborne over Pouncey.

prock
06-08-2010, 07:00 PM
I agree, because I'd much rather have an average QB accused of rape twicethan a physical freak who is one of the best WRs in a dozen of years.

Fixed it for you.

bce
06-08-2010, 07:39 PM
Average qb. Just count the rings baby. Just count the rings. They didnt win any rings till he got there. Had a lot of good teams too, but before him there was barren wasteland. Count the playoff wins and appearances and rings for the washington redskins since that wonderful day in 2004 when the washington redskins inexplicably made a franchise destroying mistake in passing on ben roethlisberger. Then count the rings and playoff appearances and wins for the godsend. Just count the rings for larry fitzgerald, because in the end, thats really all that matters, and without the godsend, there would be no rings, and the world would be a less happy place.

RealityCheck
06-08-2010, 07:44 PM
Ben didn't win the SBs. Their defense did.

bce
06-08-2010, 08:05 PM
They had a great defense for lots of years before ben got there and didnt win anything. Hes the difference maker, the godsend. And the defense certainly didnt win the arizona game for them. That was the godsend out there working the miracles. That was him leading last 2 minute td drives after the defense let down. While "superior" qbs throw pick sixes to lose super bowls for their team, the godsend leads two minute drives and throws passes over the outstretched fingers of three defenders to win them. Such happy memories, such pleasant nostalgia. I guess unless you were a patriots fan you wouldnt know what it feels like to be the two time thats right two time super bowl champions. I know it hurts. I pained for 20 years till god sent me my godsend number 7. The best player in the world, the two time thats right two super bowl champion. When others choke and throw pick sixes to lose super bowls, he finds a way to win them.

Paranoidmoonduck
06-08-2010, 08:18 PM
That was the godsend out there working the miracles.

So true...
“And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, 'Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away. And God will grant rings to the folk of Pittsburgh and instill in their savior the great need to rape and pillage the womenfolk of the realm.'”

FUNBUNCHER
06-08-2010, 08:42 PM
Average qb. Just count the rings baby. Just count the rings. They didnt win any rings till he got there. Had a lot of good teams too, but before him there was barren wasteland. Count the playoff wins and appearances and rings for the washington redskins since that wonderful day in 2004 when the washington redskins inexplicably made a franchise destroying mistake in passing on ben roethlisberger. Then count the rings and playoff appearances and wins for the godsend. Just count the rings for larry fitzgerald, because in the end, thats really all that matters, and without the godsend, there would be no rings, and the world would be a less happy place.


In hindsight, the Skins franchise should have taken Big Ben, and that's not factoring in the shocking murder of Sean Taylor.

I bet 95% of Skins fans feel the same way.

bce
06-08-2010, 09:17 PM
The cost of passing on an elite qb prospect is greater than the cost of that prospect busting.

prock
06-09-2010, 12:51 AM
They had a great defense for lots of years before ben got there and didnt win anything. Hes the difference maker, the godsend. And the defense certainly didnt win the arizona game for them. That was the godsend out there working the miracles. That was him leading last 2 minute td drives after the defense let down. While "superior" qbs throw pick sixes to lose super bowls for their team, the godsend leads two minute drives and throws passes over the outstretched fingers of three defenders to win them. Such happy memories, such pleasant nostalgia. I guess unless you were a patriots fan you wouldnt know what it feels like to be the two time thats right two time super bowl champions. I know it hurts. I pained for 20 years till god sent me my godsend number 7. The best player in the world, the two time thats right two super bowl champion. When others choke and throw pick sixes to lose super bowls, he finds a way to win them.

I shudder to think of who you worship if your godsend is a rapist.

FUNBUNCHER
06-10-2010, 10:54 AM
Besides potentially being released by the Steelers for conduct unbecoming a member of the franchise, what does being a 'rapist' have to do with Roethlisberger's play on the football field??

bce
06-10-2010, 02:30 PM
Football godsend. What his personal issues are I could care less. Just give me my rings. I love my rings. All shiny diamond studded. Everything else is immaterial to me. Unlike the rest of the world, I dont feel privy to be his judge jury and executioner off the field. Thats for the prozac nation who needs to bring others down to make themselves feel of some worth. I could really care less.

prock
06-10-2010, 03:41 PM
Football godsend. What his personal issues are I could care less. Just give me my rings. I love my rings. All shiny diamond studded. Everything else is immaterial to me. Unlike the rest of the world, I dont feel privy to be his judge jury and executioner off the field. Thats for the prozac nation who needs to bring others down to make themselves feel of some worth. I could really care less.

Yes, I am ripping on a rapist to make myself feel better about myself, that's it exactly. Ben is a very good quarterback, but the first Steelers ring this decade could have been won with just about anyone at quarterback. Kyle Orton could have easily managed that team to a title.

bce
06-10-2010, 04:07 PM
Thats exactly what youre doing.

bce
06-10-2010, 04:08 PM
kyle orton couldnt have made that pass at the end of the game to win it. I watch them every week, Ben bailed them out almost every game. Hes the reason they won it, the main reason. Cause hes clutch city.

prock
06-10-2010, 04:36 PM
kyle orton couldnt have made that pass at the end of the game to win it. I watch them every week, Ben bailed them out almost every game. Hes the reason they won it, the main reason. Cause hes clutch city.

Yes Big Ben is the reason they won the 2006 SB. I mean he only went 9-21 with 0 TDs and 2 INTS. He was for sure the reason. Definitely clutch city.

prock
06-10-2010, 04:37 PM
Thats exactly what youre doing.

Yeah I am sorry for hating rapists. My apologies, I am being completely irrational here, hating rapists is out of line.

bce
06-10-2010, 05:06 PM
you dont care about rapists you only care about this particular 'alleged but not charged" one.

Paranoidmoonduck
06-10-2010, 05:25 PM
you dont care about rapists you only care about this particular 'alleged but not charged" one.

And, funnily enough, you seem to only not care about this particular 'alleged by not charged' one. What a coincidence!