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View Full Version : Bradshaw no big fan of Clausen


scpanther22
07-16-2010, 09:45 AM
Let me say what I said before earlier up to the (NFL) draft," Bradshaw began about Clausen. "I didn't like him in college and I don't like him now. I never did like him. I don't like his delivery. I don't like his motion. I think he's too slow.

"Physically, the way he threw the football, I just didn't like him. (There's) way too much shoulder action. (He's) just another guy as far as I'm concerned."
http://www.southbendtribune.com/article/20100716/SPORTS13/7160380/1021/Sports

K Train
07-16-2010, 09:51 AM
i bet he loves tebow and tebow has way worse problems than jimmy

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
07-16-2010, 09:53 AM
Bradshaw went senile a long time ago

descendency
07-16-2010, 10:12 AM
Bradshaw also doesn't like Tom Brady. Why does anyone continue to listen to the 1970s Ben Roethlisberger?

FUNBUNCHER
07-16-2010, 10:13 AM
Did Bradshaw just call Clausen a JAG?? Wow.
I never thought Jimmy had a slow release, and if his throwing mechanics are poor, that is, too much upper body motion and not enough drive from his base, that's an easy problem to fix.

It's too early to close the book on Clausen, I still like him as a prospect.

killxswitch
07-16-2010, 10:21 AM
Bradshaw is the guy everyone refers to when arguing rings vs. stats, as in "Was Terry Bradshaw better than Dan Marino because he has rings?" JC might not work out but I don't care what Bradshaw says.

Anyone remember "GIT-YO-SELF-OUTTA HERE"?

LizardState
07-16-2010, 10:25 AM
i bet he loves tebow and tebow has way worse problems than jimmy

I beg to differ.

Tebow already transformed his throwing motion, footwork, etc. b/c he was desperate to impress scouts in his Pro Day after a substandard sr. yr. He admits he still has a long way to go but I guess Denver drank the hype koolaid & took him way too early.

Clausen is also a work in progress but was considered more NFL-ready, I guess the QB need in Carolina after the Delhomme disaster was greater too.

Bradshaw was right about Clausen, he is too slow, needs a lot of work but is more coachable than Tebow. He's also a better game mgr. & less risky. I think Clausen's performance last season was amplified by the 2 superlative WRs at ND & he looked a lot better than he was. They adjusted to his long passes with their superior ball skills & had freakish RAC yds to pad the passing stats.

If Bradshaw watched any of Tebow's misadventures last yr. & paid attention he would hate him too.

Splat
07-16-2010, 10:39 AM
"(He's) just another guy as far as I'm concerned."

That's pretty much how I have always felt about Bradshaw as a player, it must have been nice playing with arguably the best defense ever.

FUNBUNCHER
07-16-2010, 10:48 AM
Bradshaw is the guy everyone refers to when arguing rings vs. stats, as in "Was Terry Bradshaw better than Dan Marino because he has rings?" JC might not work out but I don't care what Bradshaw says.

Anyone remember "GIT-YO-SELF-OUTTA HERE"?

Not to digress, but other than Staubach, (with a nod to Tarkenton and Stabler), Bradshaw was the best QB of the 1970s, so I'm not gonna diss him like he was some scrub.

zachsaints52
07-16-2010, 11:38 AM
Bradshaw was right about Clausen, he is too slow, needs a lot of work but is more coachable than Tebow.

More coachable then Tebow? You lost me.

LizardState
07-16-2010, 12:40 PM
More coachable then Tebow? You lost me.

Every QB in the last draft is more coachable than Tebow b/c Tebow has some grandiose vision of destiny as a star NFL QB where he's concerned.

IMO he doesn't even remotely accept the idea that he would be better at another position. Didn't McDaniel or some of the Denver FO people say something about how they "drafted him to be a QB," but team reps say literally anything in those sappy PR valentines about their draftees in April b/c they all want everyone to think they have drafted exclusively future superstars.

Of those rookie QBs Tebow is the definition of QB Project, he has the farthest developmental distance to go to be an effective NFL QB.

yourfavestoner
07-16-2010, 12:51 PM
Every QB in the last draft is more coachable than Tebow b/c Tebow has some grandiose vision of destiny as a star NFL QB where he's concerned.

IMO he doesn't even remotely accept the idea that he would be better at another position. Didn't McDaniel or some of the Denver FO people say something about how they "drafted him to be a QB," but team reps say literally anything in those sappy PR valentines about their draftees in April b/c they all want everyone to think they have drafted exclusively future superstars.

Of those rookie QBs Tebow is the definition of QB Project, he has the farthest developmental distance to go to be an effective NFL QB.

If he's not rushed, I can still see Tebow being the most successful of the QBs in this draft. His problem is more footwork that actual delivery. It'll take time, and there will be ugly moments, but if he's coached correctly, he'll eventually get it.

The Florida passing game is pretty much an exact copy of McDaniels' scheme. BB and McDaniels hosted Meyer often during the offseason, and the Patriots designed a lot of their passing game around what Meyer was doing out of the spread at Florida. So the offensive transition isn't going to be nearly as hard as everyone thinks it is.

Everyone knocks the UF spread for being gimmicky, but that really only applies to the run portion of the offense. The route combinations and reads really are still the same that you'll see in most offensive attacks. It's certainly much closer to the pro game than anything that Spurrier ran, which is why I never understood the "UF WIDE RECEIVER BUSTZZZZ" argument for Harvin.

I still maintain that if VY can be half-successful at the NFL level, then Tim Tebow can, too.

Splat
07-16-2010, 12:56 PM
Say what you want about McDaniels but he has a pretty good track record when it comes to QB's, Brady,Cassel and Orton all had statistically their best seasons under him.

ChiFan24
07-16-2010, 02:33 PM
Say what you want about McDaniels but he has a pretty good track record when it comes to QB's, Brady,Cassel and Orton all had statistically their best seasons under him.

Which is why drafting a project in the first round was particularly ******** for Denver.

I agree with Bradshaw though. Clausen might be a starting QB in this league, but I don't see him being a good one. Nothing special about him physically, he does have some mechanical issues, and he does seem like a douche.

Paranoidmoonduck
07-16-2010, 02:40 PM
The concept that blows my mind is that people never go past Tebow's mechanical issues in evaluation. He may be a smart kid, he may be a good leader, and he may be a hard worker, but in terms of reading defenses, doing cross-field progressions, running a timing-based pass attack, and basically all of the stuff required to be a good NFL quarterback, he's the worst 1st round pick I've ever seen.

Clausen has issues. His mechanical issues may have been exacerbated by his foot injury, causing him to get more shoulder into the throw and knocking off his release point, but he wasn't picture perfect before the foot injury. I don't really see the argument that Clausen will fail because his mechanics are a bit wonky (even with the weird release, he's way better than Quinn was leaving Notre Dame). I would buy that Clausen doesn't have the attitude to succeed in the NFL, but I wouldn't buy that from Bradshaw even if that was what Bradshaw was talking about. He's not a talent evaluator in any sense of the word.

PoopSandwich
07-16-2010, 04:19 PM
Apparently alot of teams/scouts/gm's didn't like him considering he had the biggest plummet in NFL draft history. If he was there it would have been 10x worse than Quinn or Rodgers.

umphrey
07-16-2010, 04:39 PM
As a Packer fan, I'd say Clausen feels much more like Brian Brohm than Aaron Rodgers when they were initially drafted. I know that isn't the most in depth analysis but I'll buy into:
-Every team, many twice, including many QB desperate teams passed on him
-He didn't win much in college
-He had receivers and a good coach (maybe) but still underperformed
-Really, what kind of separation is there between him and "just another guy"? Average physical tools and average team.

I'm not trying to throw him under the bus for not carrying his team to a championship. Just saying that there was more hype than substance and if he's going to succeed in the NFL he'll need to have a never quit attitude and have things work out his way. Remember he's not a top 10 prospect anymore he's a second round draft pick.

vidae
07-16-2010, 04:50 PM
This thread, so far, delivers.

FUNBUNCHER
07-16-2010, 04:55 PM
As a Packer fan, I'd say Clausen feels much more like Brian Brohm than Aaron Rodgers when they were initially drafted. I know that isn't the most in depth analysis but I'll buy into:
-Every team, many twice, including many QB desperate teams passed on him
-He didn't win much in college
-He had receivers and a good coach (maybe) but still underperformed
-Really, what kind of separation is there between him and "just another guy"? Average physical tools and average team.

I'm not trying to throw him under the bus for not carrying his team to a championship. Just saying that there was more hype than substance and if he's going to succeed in the NFL he'll need to have a never quit attitude and have things work out his way. Remember he's not a top 10 prospect anymore he's a second round draft pick.

Funny that a Packers fan would say this, considering that I've always felt Aaron Rodgers is the QB to whom Jimmy Clausen most closely profiles as a pro QB, 'another guy' who came into the league with average physical tools and an average arm.

Again, you're blaming Clausen because ND was non-competitive on the defensive side of the football.

Teams passed on him, but I still think Clausen is far from an 'average prospect', and still don't think there's over a 30+ pick difference between Sam Bradford and Jimmy Clausen.

umphrey
07-16-2010, 05:02 PM
Funny that a Packers fan would say this, considering that I've always felt Aaron Rodgers is the QB to whom Jimmy Clausen most closely profiles as a pro QB, 'another guy' who came into the league with average physical tools and an average arm.

Again, you're blaming Clausen because ND was non-competitive on the defensive side of the football.

Teams passed on him, but I still think Clausen is far from an 'average prospect', and still don't think there's over a 30+ pick difference between Sam Bradford and Jimmy Clausen.

See I agree with you on a lot of points like Clausen would have won more games with a decent defense and there isn't a 30 pick difference between Clausen and Bradford. However I think Bradford had no business going #1 overall and that Clausen would have had to lead a more potent offense that made opponents play from behind and also quarterback comeback wins. 1-2 years ago we found out what a hard worker Aaron Rodgers was and how awesome he was at adapting to the pro game but 3-4 years ago I thought he was facing an uphill, against the odds battle to succeed, and that's how I feel about Clausen.

zachsaints52
07-16-2010, 05:09 PM
Every QB in the last draft is more coachable than Tebow b/c Tebow has some grandiose vision of destiny as a star NFL QB where he's concerned.

IMO he doesn't even remotely accept the idea that he would be better at another position. Didn't McDaniel or some of the Denver FO people say something about how they "drafted him to be a QB," but team reps say literally anything in those sappy PR valentines about their draftees in April b/c they all want everyone to think they have drafted exclusively future superstars.

Of those rookie QBs Tebow is the definition of QB Project, he has the farthest developmental distance to go to be an effective NFL QB.

I would love to know where Tebow said he would be a star QB in the NFL. Once you do let me know. And why would Tebow want to change positions, especially when he is good at this position? Say what you want, abotu his delivery and mechanics, but those things are coachable. But you say he is the least coachable guy right? http://www.palmbeachpost.com/sports/gators/tim-tebow-impressing-his-denver-broncos-teammates-with-744029.html Apparently his teammates disagree. But then you don't give reasons to why he is uncoachable, besides saying he has a vision (which he never said) and he is a project QB. People are right, haters gonna hate.

descendency
07-16-2010, 06:41 PM
-He had receivers and a good coach (maybe) but still underperformed.

He had one of the greatest seasons ever in a pro-style offense. It's not his fault his defense couldn't muster even a decent year.

bored of education
07-16-2010, 07:28 PM
I agree with Bradshaw., esp when Hunter Cantwell wins the back up roll and Clausen is traded for a 4th rounder next year after Tony Pike out plays him on ps type ish

RealityCheck
07-17-2010, 09:25 AM
I'm not saying that I agree with him, but... yeah, Clausen sucks big time, and the Panthers were the worst fit possible for him. Specially when there are 3 QBs better than him on the roster.

scpanther22
07-17-2010, 12:52 PM
I'm not saying that I agree with him, but... yeah, Clausen sucks big time, and the Panthers were the worst fit possible for him. Specially when there are 3 QBs better than him on the roster.

you seriously think Tony Pike is better than Jimmy Clausen?

JeffSamardzijaIRISH
07-17-2010, 03:06 PM
And even HUNTER CANTWELL???

BlindSite
07-17-2010, 06:17 PM
Let me start off this post with saying that I wasn't a huge fan of the clausen pick, to be honest I'd have rathered the Panthers picked tate and pinned their hopes and dreams on Moore, however, let me just point out a few things.

Bradshaw is not now, nor has he ever been known for his abilities as a talent evaluator, not once has he pointed out the good facets of a prospect, until they've become a boom in the NFL in an intelligent and insightful manner. In fact he's never done anything in an intelligent and insightful manner.

The Panthers have a very good offensive coaching staff, Rip Scherer and Davidson may heil from Cleveland initially but they got the best years out of Derek Anderson (before buggering off) and come from the Belichick Tree, they've shown more than once in the past they're capable of coaching young QBs to success.

John Fox never supplants veterans for rookies before the end of training camp. If they don't have a job, generally, they're cut, doesn't matter who's behind them, you can't do the job for Fox it's goodbye - that said he's got a lot of loyalty to his vets, which brings us to cantwell.

In training camp Moore is going to be starting with the first team, that's a no brainer, Cantwell is going to be having to run plays for the second team, this means a lot of rookies and guys with less than 2 years NFL experience in carolina, so the team will want a guy with sound knowledge of the playbook. Clausen doesn't have that yet.

This is a move on the depth chart purely for keeping practices flowing, I'd bet the house that Clausen will be number 2 before long but he doesn't know the plays, doesn't know the audibles, Cantwell does.

Finally:
The Panthers draft on very few things other than game tape. They're not like a lot of teams out there who're going to be wow'd in an interview or by triangle numbers and they never have been. This is why they've been pretty successful over the last three years in the draft, the offensive line was entirely drafted by the Panthers, as were the safeties, the linebackers, the running backs, and the corner backs.

Notice something there, the best assets of the panthers are the linebackers, secondary and the line and runningbacks.

They evaluate well, for the most part.

Sure Clausen could be a huge bust, the point is - none of us know, and Bradshaw knows a damnsight lot less than the Panthers scouting department. I'm willing to give them 3 years benefit of the doubt.

RealityCheck
07-17-2010, 09:01 PM
you seriously think Tony Pike is better than Jimmy Clausen?
Yes, yes, yes.

Check my posts from before the draft and you'll see I ranked Clausen as my #5 QB. Yeah, FIVE. Why? He wasn't ready for the NFL at all, came from an overrated team, without many assets.

Scotty D
07-17-2010, 09:03 PM
Yes, yes, yes.

Check my posts from before the draft and you'll see I ranked Clausen as my #5 QB. Yeah, FIVE. Why? He wasn't ready for the NFL at all, came from an overrated team, without many assets.

Without many assets? What does this mean?

JFLO
07-17-2010, 09:09 PM
I only have one thing to say...

http://pics.livejournal.com/rawles/pic/000xh2py

I actually have two things to say...

This world is full of Clausen haters and he'll prove everyone wrong during the next ten years. He was the best quarterback in this class and will prove that the Rams, Bills, Browns and (unfortunately) the Vikings make the wrong decision on passing on him.

Hurricanes25
07-17-2010, 09:26 PM
Yes, yes, yes.

Check my posts from before the draft and you'll see I ranked Clausen as my #5 QB. Yeah, FIVE. Why? He wasn't ready for the NFL at all, came from an overrated team, without many assets.

And Pike is ready for the NFL? He came from a spread offense while Clause came from a pro style offense.

RealityCheck
07-17-2010, 09:27 PM
The thing is: Pike has an NFL body and a NFL arm. And he has produced as well.

Paranoidmoonduck
07-17-2010, 09:29 PM
What? Clausen has the size to play in the NFL, easily has the arm to play in the NFL, and produced very well in college.

He may not have an NFL head, but that's not what you're saying.

Hurricanes25
07-17-2010, 09:31 PM
The thing is: Pike has an NFL body and a NFL arm. And he has produced as well.

A) Pike is tall and thin. He needs to add more weight.
B) His arm is above average, on par with Clausen.

JFLO
07-17-2010, 09:39 PM
Yea RC, I have a better NFL body than Tony Pike lol...he's 6'6" and what like 210? I'm 6'3" 210 and most likely in better shape than Tony Pike, I can say that comfortably...

he's probably a better quarterback than me, but to call his physicality good is bad.

Scotty D
07-17-2010, 09:41 PM
Yes, yes, yes.

Check my posts from before the draft and you'll see I ranked Clausen as my #5 QB. Yeah, FIVE. Why? He wasn't ready for the NFL at all, came from an overrated team, without many assets.

Would you please answer my question about what you mean? Clausen didn't have many assets? Golden Tate, Michael Floyd, and Kyle Rudolph?

RealityCheck
07-17-2010, 09:45 PM
Would you please answer my question about what you mean? Clausen didn't have many assets? Golden Tate, Michael Floyd, and Kyle Rudolph?
Throw in the worst offensive line in the world.

Hurricanes25
07-17-2010, 09:46 PM
Throw in the worst offensive line in the world.

So than that should make Clausen look even better, right?

Scotty D
07-17-2010, 09:46 PM
Throw in the worst offensive line in the world.

Which didn't stop him from putting up good numbers. So what is your point?

dannyz
07-18-2010, 05:24 AM
The QB Class this Year was bad. Tebow getting Picked in the First Round is not even Funny. Clausen will not have the Best Rookie Year. The Panthers have no WR's other than Steve Smith, they have to play the Defending Champs, A Hungry Falcons team and a Rebuliding Tampa Bay, Until they get WR Weapons around him he will not do anyting.

BlindSite
07-18-2010, 06:44 AM
The QB Class this Year was bad. Tebow getting Picked in the First Round is not even Funny. Clausen will not have the Best Rookie Year. The Panthers have no WR's other than Steve Smith, they have to play the Defending Champs, A Hungry Falcons team and a Rebuliding Tampa Bay, Until they get WR Weapons around him he will not do anyting.

You realise the Panthers went 4-2 in the division and also beat Minnesota who started everyone late in the year once they dropped Delhomme?

They did pretty damn well against NO in the first game and only lost because of a late fumble from DeAngelo Williams, a player who has less turnovers in 2 years than Adrian Peterson had in one game.

The Delhomme incident, is why the Panthers were an 8-8 team last year. They'll be well and truly in the mix this year and I'll be wholly surprised if Clausen starts at all this year.

scpanther22
07-18-2010, 11:07 AM
the vid of Bradshaw talking about clausen
http://www.wsbt.com/sports/irish/Bradshaw-rips-Clausen-98549079.html?video=pop&t=a

BlindSite
07-18-2010, 07:14 PM
the vid of Bradshaw talking about clausen
http://www.wsbt.com/sports/irish/Bradshaw-rips-Clausen-98549079.html?video=pop&t=a

His delivery and mechanics have been instilled in a professional style since he was 13. Bradshaw is ridiculously stupid if he thinks there's anything wrong with the way clausen throws a ball. He had to tweak it a little because of his toe, but other than that "the way he thows da bawl" has never been anything close to an issue.

dannyz
07-18-2010, 07:20 PM
You realise the Panthers went 4-2 in the division and also beat Minnesota who started everyone late in the year once they dropped Delhomme?

They did pretty damn well against NO in the first game and only lost because of a late fumble from DeAngelo Williams, a player who has less turnovers in 2 years than Adrian Peterson had in one game.

The Delhomme incident, is why the Panthers were an 8-8 team last year. They'll be well and truly in the mix this year and I'll be wholly surprised if Clausen starts at all this year.

The Loss of Peppers.Harris,Davis will hurt them.

BlindSite
07-19-2010, 02:50 AM
The Loss of Peppers.Harris,Davis will hurt them.

Peppers yes, Harris hell no considering Martin and Godfrey are both better, Davis, it'll hurt a little but James Anderson was more than adequate in his place last year.

A Perfect Score
07-19-2010, 04:03 AM
Yes, yes, yes.

Check my posts from before the draft and you'll see I ranked Clausen as my #5 QB. Yeah, FIVE. Why? He wasn't ready for the NFL at all, came from an overrated team, without many assets.

First off, as much as we as fans like to suggest, scouting departments aren't stupid. There is a legitimate reason that Clausen went in the second and Pike went in the sixth. ***** and whine all you want, but regardless, Im going to trust the Panthers scouting department over you every time. You can make the same argument for me, but...

From everything I've seen, and trust I've seen much more then Im comfortable with (stemming from me having no life between March and August), Clausen is far more ready for the NFL then Pike is. Throwing aside the system argument, which I think is highly overrated in the first place, Clausen has a better arm, his mechanics (and by this I mean motion and footwork) are more sound, and he doesn't have the confidence issues that have always haunted Pike. Say what you will about Clausen, and Im certainly not his biggest fan, but confidence isnt an issue. Hes going to go out and hes going to throw the football and he isnt going to regret making a throw.

Saying Pike is more NFL ready then Clausen is just stupid, and you know it. So don't come kicking around here and suggesting that just because he's got a 6'6 frame and a nice arm that he's the next Joe Flacco or Josh Freeman because he isn't. Pike will be lucky if he compares favorable to a guy like Derek Anderson when its all said and done, whereas Clausen has the chance to be a legitimate player in this league. **** Terry Bradshaw, he starred in a movie with Matthew McConaghey. Nuff Said.

The QB Class this Year was bad. Tebow getting Picked in the First Round is not even Funny. Clausen will not have the Best Rookie Year. The Panthers have no WR's other than Steve Smith, they have to play the Defending Champs, A Hungry Falcons team and a Rebuliding Tampa Bay, Until they get WR Weapons around him he will not do anyting.

And I dont know about you, but Ill take a healthy Steve Smith all by his lonesome over a whole hell of a lot of WR cores in the NFL. That man is a warrior and always has been.