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Mr. Goosemahn
08-01-2010, 01:03 PM
To see previously discussed prospects, click here.
Jake Locker - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2230943
Cameron Heyward - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41890
Marvin Austin - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41892
Adrian Clayborn - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41919
Anthony Castonzo - http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41929
Greg Romeus - http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41940
Von Miller - http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2238637
Mike Pouncey - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41959
Allen Bailey - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41971
Mark Herzlich - http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41993
Prince Amukamara - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42000
Gabe Carimi - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42014
Patrick Peterson - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42030
Terrance Toliver - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42042
Noel Devine - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42053
DeAndre McDaniel - http://draftcountdown.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42063


http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_SO8Y3MIsoP8/SPt3PrRLTTI/AAAAAAAAEo4/dEVKFqPZbo4/s400/AJ+Green+vs+Vanderbilt+diving+TD+catch+awesome+pla y+2008.jpg

WR A.J. Green, Georgia
6'4 - 207 lbs. - Junior

Highlights!

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Awesome WR prospect. Has size, speed, elite ability, great tracking of the ball, gets it with his hands and not his body, should be an early pick if he declares, and so far there's no reason for him not to.

Don Vito
08-01-2010, 01:21 PM
Absolute animal, is my favorite WR in this class. Would love to see him on the Pats to be our future #1.

Texas Homer
08-01-2010, 01:39 PM
STUD.

I'd love to see him on the Texans playing along with AJ at WR.

wicket
08-01-2010, 01:47 PM
best wideout class i can remember by a mile

BeerBaron
08-01-2010, 02:05 PM
Definite top 5 pick imo. If a rookie salary structure gets put into place, he could even be in contention for the top spot depending on the team imo.

Paul
08-01-2010, 02:38 PM
Beasty McBeast Beast.

Love him. Probably my favorite prospect in this upcoming draft.

bce
08-01-2010, 05:05 PM
If hes so studly how come hes been easily outperformed by others, is less physically gifted than others. Wide receiver with the #1 pick. Oh the humanity!

prock
08-01-2010, 05:22 PM
If hes so studly how come hes been easily outperformed by others, is less physically gifted than others.

Is this a question?

He hasn't been easily outperformed. He does NOT lack physical gifts. He is the most polished wide receiver in terms of technique and route running.

wicket
08-01-2010, 05:25 PM
If hes so studly how come hes been easily outperformed by others, is less physically gifted than others. Wide receiver with the #1 pick. Oh the humanity!

because he isnt easily outperformed by other, isnt less physically gifted and nobody claims he ought to bo #1.

And one should remember the quality of the guy throwing him the ball last season.

BeerBaron
08-01-2010, 05:39 PM
I did actually make the assertion a few posts up that, with a rookie salary structure in place, Green possibly being the #1 overall pick is perfectly reasonable imo.

The insane money you have to pay the first overall pick makes it so you can only feasibly take a QB, LT or stud pass rusher with the pick as it is. However, if those salaries are brought within control, I absolutely would not fault a team like the Rams if they took Green #1 overall. Already have franchise QB and LT hopefully, spent a lot of high picks on the d-line prior to that.....no real threat at WR......I'd have absolutely no problem with it if it were to happen that way.

bce
08-01-2010, 06:07 PM
Is this a question?

He hasn't been easily outperformed. He does NOT lack physical gifts. He is the most polished wide receiver in terms of technique and route running.

There it is again "polish" "route running" technique things that cant be measured to compensate for the lack of what can be measured. Im not saing he lacks physical gifts, im saying hes not the most gifted

bce
08-01-2010, 06:09 PM
I did actually make the assertion a few posts up that, with a rookie salary structure in place, Green possibly being the #1 overall pick is perfectly reasonable imo.

The insane money you have to pay the first overall pick makes it so you can only feasibly take a QB, LT or stud pass rusher with the pick as it is. However, if those salaries are brought within control, I absolutely would not fault a team like the Rams if they took Green #1 overall. Already have franchise QB and LT hopefully, spent a lot of high picks on the d-line prior to that.....no real threat at WR......I'd have absolutely no problem with it if it were to happen that way.


Its never reasonable to take a wr with the #1 overall pick. Youre going to catch calvin johnson syndrome. He may be a good player but 0-16 or thereabouts will follow soon after. Especially on a player whos nowhere near that gifted so chances are its not going to help you win many games.

Mr. Goosemahn
08-01-2010, 07:00 PM
There it is again "polish" "route running" technique things that cant be measured to compensate for the lack of what can be measured. Im not saing he lacks physical gifts, im saying hes not the most gifted

Who's the most gifted then? And why?

bce
08-01-2010, 07:11 PM
Baldwin, becuase he makes more big plays, more spectacular catches, is more productive, has 36 inch arms and a 40 inch vert jump, 4.4 speed, more physical 225 lbs so no nfl dbs are going to physically manhandle baldwin, not injury prone, better blocker, from aliquippa, the per capita greatest breeding ground on earth for football players.

Basically, there is nothing about aj green that is better.

FUNBUNCHER
08-01-2010, 07:13 PM
Traditionally, taking a WR #1 is not a good value, but if there's a salary cap like in basketball, where the difference in the contract and guaranteed money between the #1 overall and the #8 pick is minimal, I don't see the hurt in reaching on a guy who's rated a top 10 talent, if he fills a need.

Personally, I don't think AJ Green is that type of player; he's not even 210# and I have to see a confirmed time on his 40 before I believe he's ready to dominate in the pros.

I like everything else about him as a wideout, but I wanna see more info at the end of the season on his measurables.

bce
08-01-2010, 07:23 PM
I cant agree on the #1 overall. Its not just about the money. Its about calvin johnson syndrome. Its about even if he turns out to be a good player its not going to make any difference. Unless your team is absoulutely stacked, not likely if youre picking #1, theres just no way. There has to be a need at a position of higher value if you are bad enough to be picking first. There has to be more of a need than a wr.

Greens just not the most gifted guy out there. hes a good prospect. But hes not the best prospect at his position or in the class in general.

FUNBUNCHER
08-01-2010, 08:18 PM
It all depends, IMO, on why your team is picking #1.

The Lions almost picked #1 again in 2010 because of they were starting a rookie QB, not because they lacked decent talent across their roster.

If Peyton Manning goes down in week 1, odds are high that Indy picks in the top 5. Same goes for the Pats this year if Brady goes out, and without Drew Brees pulling the trigger on that high octane Saints offense they struggle to win six games IMO.

With a salary cap, teams can really focus on BPA and not player value per draft position because the monetary cost is less so than in year's past.

hockey619
08-01-2010, 08:25 PM
There it is again "polish" "route running" technique things that cant be measured to compensate for the lack of what can be measured. Im not saing he lacks physical gifts, im saying hes not the most gifted


How can you say this...


Baldwin, becuase he makes more big plays, more spectacular catches, is more productive, has 36 inch arms and a 40 inch vert jump, 4.4 speed, more physical 225 lbs so no nfl dbs are going to physically manhandle baldwin, not injury prone, better blocker, from aliquippa, the per capita greatest breeding ground on earth for football players.

Basically, there is nothing about aj green that is better.


and then say the first bolded? please then, tell me your measuring technique for spectacular catches.

The second bolded is opinion not based on proven fact yet, thats purely speculation.

brat316
08-01-2010, 08:55 PM
Amazing WR, prospect probably number 1 on a lot of people's boards. Probably not the most gifted WR to come out, but definitely one of the most technically sound Wr to come out in a while.

prock
08-01-2010, 10:51 PM
There it is again "polish" "route running" technique things that cant be measured to compensate for the lack of what can be measured. Im not saing he lacks physical gifts, im saying hes not the most gifted

You can see how good of routes they run and how good their technique is. It isn't statistics and measurables, which are the only things you know.

A Perfect Score
08-01-2010, 11:17 PM
To be fair, he doesn't know statistics and measurables either. In fact, he doesn't know much of anything.

While he isn't my #1 receiver for the upcoming season (that would be a healthy Michael Floyd) A.J Green is a beast and one of the better WR prospects to come along in a while. I think he's every bit the prospect that Crabtree and Bryant were, and I believe he's by far the most polished receiver in the upcoming draft. And anticipating bce's stupidity, yes "polish", ie. route running, ability to generate separation, hand use, and blocking, is a trait recognized by everyone in the football industry and most posters here. Its commonly referred to and everyone besides yourself seems to have a good grasp on what it is.

Big Bird
08-01-2010, 11:45 PM
Someone has a problem with this thread...

http://thematadorsports.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Michael-Floyd.jpghttp://farm3.static.flickr.com/2463/3939811648_a155917df2.jpghttp://nbcsportsmedia1.msnbc.com/j/NBCSports/Sections/College%20Football/Notre%20Dame%20Central/Photos/090912_Floyd_V.widec.jpg

FUNBUNCHER
08-01-2010, 11:54 PM
Subconscious ND bias makes it hard for me to analyze Floyd's game.

Anyway, I thought Golden Tate was the more dynamic WR for the Irish.

dannyz
08-02-2010, 12:08 AM
Where does A.J rank with past WR Prospects? Calvin,Green,Bryant,Crabtree.

A Perfect Score
08-02-2010, 12:12 AM
Hes probably a bit below Calvin and on par with the other two, although I do believe he will be drafted higher then both Bryant and Crabtree.

dannyz
08-02-2010, 12:39 AM
Could he be picked #1? Depending on what team is picking do you think he could be drafted first?

BeerBaron
08-02-2010, 12:46 AM
Could he be picked #1? Depending on what team is picking do you think he could be drafted first?

Assuming there is a rookie salary structure in place that makes the money dished out very reasonable, yes.

Obviously, a lot depends on the team. If it's a team in need of a franchise QB or some other more valuable position than WR, it won't happen. But if were to be a team like the Rams again? I could see for the reasons I pointed out earlier in the thread.

dannyz
08-02-2010, 01:23 AM
Sorry I like these Threads but BCE and others get off topic and I don't read them.

brat316
08-02-2010, 04:41 PM
You think he is the most technically sound WR since Larry Fitz?

bce
08-02-2010, 05:41 PM
How can you say this...





and then say the first bolded? please then, tell me your measuring technique for spectacular catches.

The second bolded is opinion not based on proven fact yet, thats purely speculation.

Thats because he makes more spectacular catches, has 4.4 speed, 36 inch arms
and a 40 inch vert jump. Its not proven at the combine, but people wouldnt be saying it if its not at least somewhat true.

You would think the world would learn from calvin johnson. History doesnt lie with regards to such things as taking a wr #1 overall. Its not the right move, for any reason, under any circumstances. Until you attain the players at the position of highest value, youre going to struggle even if you have calvin johnson, and aj green is nowhere near as gifted as calvin johnson. Few are.



He just makes more plays than aj green does.

hockey619
08-02-2010, 07:17 PM
Thats because he makes more spectacular catches, has 4.4 speed, 36 inch arms
and a 40 inch vert jump. Its not proven at the combine, but people wouldnt be saying it if its not at least somewhat true


This all completely opinion not based on fact.

More spectacular catches? quantify that for me please, since this apparently can be easily measured but route running cannot.

The measurements are hypothetical, everyone has great numbers until they hit the combine, then the ones that actually do come to light. and honestly, none of that stuff really matters too heavily. he gets it done on the field and looks plenty fast enough.

i will give you that taking a wide reciever number one has historyically not worked out well at all. even if hes great, unless you really are set at other positions or have developing talent there, its probably not the best investment unless its an otherworldly talent like moss maybe

DeathbyStat
08-03-2010, 10:54 AM
Absolute animal, is my favorite WR in this class. Would love to see him on the Pats to be our future #1.

I couldn't agree more

georgiafan
08-03-2010, 11:30 AM
Something people might not know is A.J is a first class guy and not a diva WR.

armageddon
08-04-2010, 11:27 PM
He and Bradford could make beautiful music togather for the next 12+ years.

Legend234
08-05-2010, 11:05 PM
I never thought after some of the struggles he went through in his first year, he would become such a big time prospect. He has improved a lot.

703SKINS202
08-06-2010, 11:02 AM
He has freak like ability that reminds me a lot of Randy Moss. Definitely my fap prospect of this years draft. Last time I was this high on a WR was either CJ or my boy Charles Rogers, here's to hoping he doesn't end up like Rogers.

FUNBUNCHER
08-06-2010, 11:09 AM
He has freak like ability that reminds me a lot of Randy Moss. Definitely my fap prospect of this years draft. Last time I was this high on a WR was either CJ or my boy Charles Rogers, here's to hoping he doesn't end up like Rogers.

Except I don't think AJ Green will time under 4.4 predraft.

703SKINS202
08-06-2010, 11:16 AM
Except I don't think AJ Green will time under 4.4 predraft.
Good then he'll drop to the Redskins :):-D

ThePudge
08-09-2010, 07:06 PM
Scouting Report on 2011 Prospect - A.J. Green - WR - Georgia
- Comments, questions, feedback, arguments all encouraged.

http://blogs.ajc.com/mark-bradley-blog/files/2009/09/slideshow_1256396_uga.0913_bs7.JPG

A.J. Green - Georgia
Wide Receiver #1 - Overall #3
6040e 212e - 4.48e

It's not very often that a receiver comes along that is as smooth, dynamic, and as long as A.J. Green. After coming to Georgia as a highly touted recruit, Green paired with 1st Overall pick Matthew Stafford to form an electric 1-2 combination. The Bulldogs weren't shy using him as a Freshman as he was featured in the deep, vertical passing game, across the middle of the field, and working the sidelines beyond the sticks. Though he came to school a bit raw Green has obviously worked hard to become a crisp route-runner, he's developed moves to beat the jam, and he shows the elusiveness after the catch needed to create big plays from next to nothing.

What makes A.J. Green a truly special prospect is his incredible catching radius which ranks second to none at the college level. Green is sudden, he's fluid, and he's gifted in jump-ball situations but where he really shocks you is the type of plays he can make away from his body. Simply put, if you put the ball near his area he's going to to come down with it. He shows exceptional hands, body-control, and awareness all packaged with tremendous natural length at 6'4. Coming into college, Green was a bit slight in stature but it looks as if he's made efforts to add muscle mass and I wouldn't be shocked if he weighed in around 215 by the Combine.

This season Green will be, once again, without much in terms of a supporting cast in Georgia's offense. He can enhance his stock with continued work on his body, more reps running routes, and increased production in the red-zone, an area he should come to dominate. He looks to be the most proven receiver in the class with extreme amounts of talents and very little weakness as a player.

Pros
+ Catching radius is incredible, can catch anything in his area & above his head
+ Can make any play, goes vertical, across the middle, works the sideline
+ Extremely fluid, moves very smoothly, gets in and out of breaks well
+ Top Body Control in the air and one the sideline
+ Shows excellent awareness, very aware in the air, of the DBs, and of his position on the field
+ Tall (6'4) and long-limbed
+ Great concentration, tracks the ball into his hands
+ Good leaper with long arms, can really climb the ladder to bring a ball down
+ Very fast for his size, long-legged, creates separation & isn't caught from behind
+ Elusive after the catch, can make the first defender miss and spring plays
+ Beats the jam with moves, hands, and suddenness
+ Makes tough plays in traffic, will come down with contested balls
+ A matchup nightmare, has given Patrick Peterson all he can handle
+ Greatly improved route runner with experience in an NFL offense
+ Very dedicated, competitive & smart with a desire to be the best
+ Good effort, always plays hard and is a wiling run-blocker
+ Impressive college production against SEC competition

Cons
- Overaged, already 22 years old entering his Junior season
- Needs to continue to add muscle to his frame
- May be looking at finishing college without 1,000 yards or 10 Td's once
- Would benefit from more reps crossing the middle of the field
- Slight injury history, hurt shoulder in November vs Auburn. Missed three games
- May not be blessed with sprinter's speed, needs to continue to develop his complete game

A Perfect Score
08-09-2010, 07:12 PM
Great scouting report as per usual Pudge. Can't say there is anything in there that I disagree with.

bce
08-09-2010, 09:21 PM
Ok so whats the problem with him being GASP! the #1 overall pick.

Doesnt have great production
Not well built physically for the nfl game, questionable whether he can go across the middle take hits, and not get beat up
He's going to be older and likely will not play as long
Does not have elite vertical speed

Those are his statements not mine. Do you think a wr with these flaws is worthy of that high a selection?

georgiafan
08-10-2010, 10:50 AM
Except I don't think AJ Green will time under 4.4 predraft.

From what I gather/read he has been running in the 4.3's. Even though I don't expect him to time under it either at the combine.

ThePudge
08-10-2010, 11:28 AM
Ok so whats the problem with him being GASP! the #1 overall pick.

Doesnt have great production
Not well built physically for the nfl game, questionable whether he can go across the middle take hits, and not get beat up
He's going to be older and likely will not play as long
Does not have elite vertical speed

Those are his statements not mine. Do you think a wr with these flaws is worthy of that high a selection?

His production is pretty great for playing in an average offense with a marginal Quarterback. Also you need to factor in that he missed three games which would hurt anyone's stat-line.

5.3 rec per game 80.8 yds 0.6 Td's.

Stack those numbers against the uber-productive Jonathan Baldwin. 4.4 rec 85.5 yds and 0.6 Tds. Pretty similar numbers despite JB facing softer defenses with a more efficient Quarterback.

He's plenty physically built. He came into college around 200-205 I'd guess and right now I'd say he's around 210, should be 215 by the time he takes his first snap in the league.

He's done great over the middle in college and he's shown a lot of fearlessness in traffic. In high school he wasn't quite as crisp as he is now; he's improved with a strong work-ethic and extra reps. All I mean is that extra reps would benefit Green across the middle getting ready for the NFL. He already crosses the field more than Baldwin, Julio Jones, and probably Michael Floyd as well. What you've got is a near perfect receiver so it's not like I'm identifying that as a weakness of his, it's just something I'd like to see more of.

He doesn't have elite speed in the sense that DeSean Jackson does, but he covers a lot of ground with his stride and is extremely fluid in his motion. His speed is a step above Larry Fitzgerald's on the field. He has more to him than running straight though and has never been one to rely on his speed. You may not understand it, but Green is a technician blessed with excellent height/length/speed.

I didn't say he wouldn't play as long. Carson Palmer was drafted 1st Overall at 24 years old, Byron Leftwich & Kyle Boller were younger and picked later in the Top 10. You tell me who you'd expect to have the longest career there. Green's age is more of an indicator that he will be coming out this season, it obviously doesn't hurt him on the field. You still have a guy in Green that may be capable of playing 15 years in the NFL if he stays healthy. I have more concerns about the longevity of Michael Floyd (durability issues) and Jonathan Baldwin (based purely on speculation and how much of his body he leaves open to big hits.)

If, and only if, a rookie salary structure is put in place (and you have St. Louis at #1 or something like that) I think Green could go as high as there. I think it's more likely he'll be drafted between 3rd & 5th Overall with Cleveland and St. Louis looking like possible suitors.

Last year's #1 pick Sam Bradford had more question marks coming out than A.J. Green. No prospect is flawless and you insult everyone's intelligence by pretending that's the case. It's not as if the player with the least flaws goes 1st Overall.

JHL6719
08-10-2010, 11:51 AM
A.J. Green is immediately better at YAC than Baldwin, that's apparent in all of this film on both players.

Green is also a better route runner.. sinks his hips in and out of his breaks, unlike Baldwin who seems to play more upright, causing him to round off his routes.

I haven't seen Baldwin make a single catch that A.J. Green hasn't made... but I have seen Green do things after the catch that Baldwin just can't do.

ThePudge
08-10-2010, 12:10 PM
A.J. Green is immediately better at YAC than Baldwin, that's apparent in all of this film on both players.

Green is also a better route runner.. sinks his hips in and out of his breaks, unlike Baldwin who seems to play more upright, causing him to round off his routes.

I haven't seen Baldwin make a single catch that A.J. Green hasn't made... but I have seen Green do things after the catch that Baldwin just can't do.

You're right to make that distinction. There's definitely a difference in the way these two get in and out of their breaks; Green sinks his hips and is very sudden while Baldwin is definitely a big stiffer in the hips (height plays a big part there). Green is crisp and fluid where Baldwin tends to round off his routes at the top. I have my doubts about Baldwin's ability to separate crossing the middle of the field and on out-routes to the sideline.

holt_bruce81
08-11-2010, 05:32 PM
I absolutely love AJ Green, I like him more than Bryant and Crabtree coming out, think he'll be a top 5 pick hopefully to the Rams.

bce
08-11-2010, 06:06 PM
His production is pretty great for playing in an average offense with a marginal Quarterback. Also you need to factor in that he missed three games which would hurt anyone's stat-line.

5.3 rec per game 80.8 yds 0.6 Td's.

Stack those numbers against the uber-productive Jonathan Baldwin. 4.4 rec 85.5 yds and 0.6 Tds. Pretty similar numbers despite JB facing softer defenses with a more efficient Quarterback.

He's plenty physically built. He came into college around 200-205 I'd guess and right now I'd say he's around 210, should be 215 by the time he takes his first snap in the league.

He's done great over the middle in college and he's shown a lot of fearlessness in traffic. In high school he wasn't quite as crisp as he is now; he's improved with a strong work-ethic and extra reps. All I mean is that extra reps would benefit Green across the middle getting ready for the NFL. He already crosses the field more than Baldwin, Julio Jones, and probably Michael Floyd as well. What you've got is a near perfect receiver so it's not like I'm identifying that as a weakness of his, it's just something I'd like to see more of.

He doesn't have elite speed in the sense that DeSean Jackson does, but he covers a lot of ground with his stride and is extremely fluid in his motion. His speed is a step above Larry Fitzgerald's on the field. He has more to him than running straight though and has never been one to rely on his speed. You may not understand it, but Green is a technician blessed with excellent height/length/speed.

I didn't say he wouldn't play as long. Carson Palmer was drafted 1st Overall at 24 years old, Byron Leftwich & Kyle Boller were younger and picked later in the Top 10. You tell me who you'd expect to have the longest career there. Green's age is more of an indicator that he will be coming out this season, it obviously doesn't hurt him on the field. You still have a guy in Green that may be capable of playing 15 years in the NFL if he stays healthy. I have more concerns about the longevity of Michael Floyd (durability issues) and Jonathan Baldwin (based purely on speculation and how much of his body he leaves open to big hits.)

If, and only if, a rookie salary structure is put in place (and you have St. Louis at #1 or something like that) I think Green could go as high as there. I think it's more likely he'll be drafted between 3rd & 5th Overall with Cleveland and St. Louis looking like possible suitors.

Last year's #1 pick Sam Bradford had more question marks coming out than A.J. Green. No prospect is flawless and you insult everyone's intelligence by pretending that's the case. It's not as if the player with the least flaws goes 1st Overall.

Sam bradford is a qb, so that argument is immediately by the wayside. There are a lot of non elite characteristics in aj green, if im going to use a high pick on a wr he cant have any holes, thtas the only thing that even warrants the pick, and then, you catch calvin johnson syndrome. Whether he goes #1 overall is immaterial. Whether he should go even in the top 10 is the material question. I dont see anywhere near enough. Baldwin averaged 20 ypc, green averaged 14, so the rac thing i question as well as the production angle and considering green probably had inflated production playing with an nfl starter, which baldwin has never had the luxury of. The big plays are huge dvanntage baldwin. In similar circumstance in 2009, in similar offenses with similar talent throwiing them the ball, baldwin was the far superior. And even if give them an even production grade, which you attempt to do, based on 2 years and limited playing time baldwin got as a frosh, the physically superior talent should be ahead, the non injury prone younger guy should be ahead which is baldwin.

Your scouting report says hes not a near perfect receiver. You detail his multiple holes, and yet you call him a near perfect receiver. Im passing in lieu of more talent and less hype.

bce
08-11-2010, 06:11 PM
plus baldwins from aliquippa and we all know the rule. aliquippa dont miss.

bce
08-11-2010, 06:13 PM
A.J. Green is immediately better at YAC than Baldwin, that's apparent in all of this film on both players.

Green is also a better route runner.. sinks his hips in and out of his breaks, unlike Baldwin who seems to play more upright, causing him to round off his routes.



I haven't seen Baldwin make a single catch that A.J. Green hasn't made... but I have seen Green do things after the catch that Baldwin just can't do.


Considering the larger amount of big plays baldwin makes compared to green, id question the validity of these claims. If green does all these things baldwin cant do, then why is baldwin making so many more huge plays than green?

bce
08-11-2010, 06:20 PM
jonathan baldwin. 9 games with a play of 40+ yards

aj green 2 games with a play of over 40 yards, now how is that happening with the superior RAC guy?

Its all hype and creation with this guy. theres absolutely no reality to the greatness of aj green. Its all faux statemnts about faux route running and faux greatness after the catch and faux fluidity etc etc etc. Nothing that has happened in game warrants this guy a high draft pick. Its all faux justification using things that cant be measured, at least not by the untrained eye without a playbook.

BeerBaron
08-11-2010, 06:22 PM
4 new posts in a row? Seriously?

bce
08-11-2010, 06:40 PM
4 new posts in a row? Seriously?

100 yard receiving games

baldwin 7
green 3 including one i credited him with 99 yards.

FUNBUNCHER
08-11-2010, 11:15 PM
I agree with ya, bce, for what it's worth.
AJ Green looks like a more agile, 'fluid' athlete to me, the way he runs and turns and grabs the football, but that's about it.

LonghornsLegend
08-12-2010, 12:36 AM
Stats.


/conversation

A Perfect Score
08-12-2010, 12:38 AM
Stats.


/conversation

Colt Brennan had significantly better stats then Sam Bradford, therefore he is a much better prospect.

I love bce logic.

prock
08-12-2010, 12:42 AM
There is no point in watching the game. All you need to know is stats and combine numbers. There is no way to tell if a player is quicker, better at cutting and running routes, plays good defense, etc, because you aren't in the playbook.

Paranoidmoonduck
08-12-2010, 12:42 AM
100 yard receiving games

baldwin 7
green 3 including one i credited him with 99 yards.

150-yard receiving games (career):

Green: 2
Baldwin: 0

Aren't circumstantial and meaningless facts fun?

FUNBUNCHER
08-12-2010, 02:51 AM
There is no point in watching the game. All you need to know is stats and combine numbers. There is no way to tell if a player is quicker, better at cutting and running routes, plays good defense, etc, because you aren't in the playbook.

Ouch.........!

JHL6719
08-12-2010, 05:20 AM
Considering the larger amount of big plays baldwin makes compared to green, id question the validity of these claims. If green does all these things baldwin cant do, then why is baldwin making so many more huge plays than green?


He's not... you're using meaningless stats instead of actually watching the film.

Mike Hass owns several Pac-10 receiving records and won the Biletnikoff Award... only to be drafted in the 6th round and has yet to have a pro career. Meanwhile, guys like Greg Jennings and Santonio Holmes were both drafted ahead of Hass in the 1st and 2nd rounds despite not having nearly the production of Hass, and BOTH are better NFL receivers than Hass is ever going to be.

Obviously Baldwin is more talented than Hass... the point is stats can mean anything you want them to mean.



Stop being stubborn and just watch the film.. it's right there.

In the first video of A.J. Green, check out the catch at :17 seconds.... starting at 1:25 pay attention to the 4 catches in a row....

In the second video, check out the catch at :53 seconds,... 1:46... 2:27.... 3:31... 3:45.... 5:57... 6:49.... it's all right there in front of you unless you choose to ignore it.


Now go look at Baldwin's first video... He has a chance to get YAC at 1:27.... again at 2:07... again at 2:17... again at 2:37... next to nothing.


In Baldwin's second video, he has a chance to again at 1:57, doesn't get very much... (although he does have a nice reverse in that video)...

The only time Baldwin can get YAC is if he's already behind the coverage when the ball arrives and there's nobody around...

The third video is basically just a rerun of a couple of the plays I've already pointed out in the first two videos...



The bottom line is this... Jonathan Baldwin is playing athlete...

A.J. Green is playing wide receiver... learn the difference.

AntoinCD
08-12-2010, 05:23 AM
Considering the larger amount of big plays baldwin makes compared to green, id question the validity of these claims. If green does all these things baldwin cant do, then why is baldwin making so many more huge plays than green?

Competition may have a little something to do with it. The SEC boasts some of the best defenses in all of College Football. The Big East...not so much

JHL6719
08-12-2010, 05:54 AM
Competition may have a little something to do with it. The SEC boasts some of the best defenses in all of College Football. The Big East...not so much


The last two years Green has had to look as secondaries that consist of legitimate NFL talent like.... Stephon Gilmore, Chris Culliver, Patrick Peterson, Harry Coleman, Jai Eugene, Eric Berry, Janzen Jackson, Joe Haden, Major Wright, Ahmad Black, Janoris Jenkins, Neiko Thorpe, Zac Etheridge, Kareem Jackson, Javier Arenas, Rashad Johnson, etc...

And that's just in the SEC... not counting OOC games against Oklahoma St. and Arizona St. that featured players like Perrish Cox and Omar Bolden, etc.. and their yearly rivalry game against GT with players like Morgan Burnette and Mario Butler..


That's also not taking into the account the quality of the front fours of all of these teams putting pressure on Joe Cox and Stafford... nor does it take into the account the quality of the coaching that schemes to focus on A.J. Green...

..not to mention Georgia's offensive lineman dropping like flies...


Who has Baldwin faced other than a bunch of no-names in Big-East secondaries and a Notre Dame team that doesn't even know how to spell the word defense...

AntoinCD
08-12-2010, 08:01 AM
The last two years Green has had to look as secondaries that consist of legitimate NFL talent like.... Stephon Gilmore, Chris Culliver, Patrick Peterson, Harry Coleman, Jai Eugene, Eric Berry, Janzen Jackson, Joe Haden, Major Wright, Ahmad Black, Janoris Jenkins, Neiko Thorpe, Zac Etheridge, Kareem Jackson, Javier Arenas, Rashad Johnson, etc...

And that's just in the SEC... not counting OOC games against Oklahoma St. and Arizona St. that featured players like Perrish Cox and Omar Bolden, etc.. and their yearly rivalry game against GT with players like Morgan Burnette and Mario Butler..


That's also not taking into the account the quality of the front fours of all of these teams putting pressure on Joe Cox and Stafford... nor does it take into the account the quality of the coaching that schemes to focus on A.J. Green...

..not to mention Georgia's offensive lineman dropping like flies...


Who has Baldwin faced other than a bunch of no-names in Big-East secondaries and a Notre Dame team that doesn't even know how to spell the word defense...

While I agree with what you are saying I just cant like this post when you call Devin McCourty a no-name. He should be inducted to the Hall of Fame already

bce
08-12-2010, 07:23 PM
He's not... you're using meaningless stats instead of actually watching the film.

Mike Hass owns several Pac-10 receiving records and won the Biletnikoff Award... only to be drafted in the 6th round and has yet to have a pro career. Meanwhile, guys like Greg Jennings and Santonio Holmes were both drafted ahead of Hass in the 1st and 2nd rounds despite not having nearly the production of Hass, and BOTH are better NFL receivers than Hass is ever going to be.

Obviously Baldwin is more talented than Hass... the point is stats can mean anything you want them to mean.



Stop being stubborn and just watch the film.. it's right there.

In the first video of A.J. Green, check out the catch at :17 seconds.... starting at 1:25 pay attention to the 4 catches in a row....

In the second video, check out the catch at :53 seconds,... 1:46... 2:27.... 3:31... 3:45.... 5:57... 6:49.... it's all right there in front of you unless you choose to ignore it.


Now go look at Baldwin's first video... He has a chance to get YAC at 1:27.... again at 2:07... again at 2:17... again at 2:37... next to nothing.


In Baldwin's second video, he has a chance to again at 1:57, doesn't get very much... (although he does have a nice reverse in that video)...

The only time Baldwin can get YAC is if he's already behind the coverage when the ball arrives and there's nobody around...

The third video is basically just a rerun of a couple of the plays I've already pointed out in the first two videos...



The bottom line is this... Jonathan Baldwin is playing athlete...

A.J. Green is playing wide receiver... learn the difference.

I actually watch film too, a lot more than you surely, and on film, baldwin was better, along with having better physical ability, being more productive, less injury prone, and from aliquippa. Theres really no advantage aj green anywhere, except in hype. Youre only saying hes playing athlete because hes a great athlete. If baldwin was a mediocre athlete and still outperforming aj green what would you say then? And even if he is playing athlete, its better than aj green playing "receiver"

The statistics were to refute the better RAC guy statements. They show who is the big play guy and who is the "posession receiver". Im not going to use a high pick on a "posession receiver". You can get posession receivers anywhere. You cant get jonathan baldwin anywhere.

A Perfect Score
08-13-2010, 01:23 AM
But Baldwin wasn't better. Everyone except you knows this. Your inability to properly input what is there on film is astounding. Im convinced you are a functioning ****** at this point.

Halsey
10-02-2010, 08:22 PM
Green is currently in the process of dominating Colorado. Fun to watch if you like elite WRs.

Babylon
10-02-2010, 08:56 PM
Green is currently in the process of dominating Colorado. Fun to watch if you like elite WRs.

He should be well rested. Good for Green to get a tuneup against a cupcake before they get into some tougher SEC opponents.

abaddon41_80
10-02-2010, 09:34 PM
Green is Randy Moss v2 (tough slightly slower and more physical). That catch was amazing

Halsey
10-02-2010, 09:46 PM
This game was Green in a nutshell. He dominates when he's on the field, but for one reason or another is often not able to stay on the field. Hard to say if it's an issue that will follow him to the NFL.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
10-02-2010, 10:16 PM
I cant bring myself to say Randy Moss. I havent seen a lot of AJ but sheesh, theres only one of those. And Green always jumps when hes about to do catch the ball.

Youre really not supposed to do that.

703SKINS202
10-03-2010, 01:48 AM
The best WR prospect since Calvin Johnson. He's number one on my board.

SenorGato
10-03-2010, 02:08 AM
The best WR prospect since Calvin Johnson. He's number one on my board.

I like Bryant better, but Green had a real college career so he'd get the media vote.

Green's still a beast.

shylo3716
10-03-2010, 10:42 AM
I would hate to see him bulked up, he has a nice slender frame that's good for his athleticism. I think if were to get up to 215lbs or so he would lose some of his athleticism. He's MOSS 2.0 IMO he has earned that.

Halsey
10-03-2010, 11:23 AM
Many people will not like that I say this, and think I'm crazy, and I want to emphasize that it's just a theory, but I sometimes wonder if Green is unwilling to play through pain in college. He is obviously an elite NFL prospect and maybe he doesn't want to risk major injury. I don't blame him at all if that's what he wants to do. I might do the same thing. Watching him closely for the past 3 years just makes me wonder sometimes.

Then again, maybe I'm just bitter because I want to see him play more and the Dawgs might have won yesterday if he played the whole game.

katnip
10-03-2010, 11:25 AM
Where does A.J rank with past WR Prospects? Calvin,Green,Bryant,Crabtree.

To me its

Calvin
Bryant
Green
Crabtree

Dez edges Green out because of his size/speed combo

shylo3716
10-03-2010, 11:26 AM
Many people will not like that I say this, and think I'm crazy, and I want to emphasize that it's just a theory, but I sometimes wonder if Green is unwilling to play through pain in college. He is obviously an elite NFL prospect and maybe he doesn't want to risk major injury. I don't blame him at all if that's what he wants to do. I might do the same thing. Watching him closely for the past 3 years just makes me wonder sometimes.

Then again, maybe I'm just bitter because I want to see him play more and the Dawgs might have won yesterday if he played the whole game.

You didn't say nothing wrong, I would love the chance to see him play as much as I can also, before he goes to a losing NFL team then we won't get to see him.

FUNBUNCHER
10-03-2010, 02:53 PM
Many people will not like that I say this, and think I'm crazy, and I want to emphasize that it's just a theory, but I sometimes wonder if Green is unwilling to play through pain in college. He is obviously an elite NFL prospect and maybe he doesn't want to risk major injury. I don't blame him at all if that's what he wants to do. I might do the same thing. Watching him closely for the past 3 years just makes me wonder sometimes.

Then again, maybe I'm just bitter because I want to see him play more and the Dawgs might have won yesterday if he played the whole game.

No, you're right. I see a lot of Charles Rogers in AJ.

Paranoidmoonduck
10-03-2010, 03:02 PM
No, you're right. I see a lot of Charles Rogers in AJ.

That's a bit unfair. I know Rogers was a bust in the NFL, but the guy broke his collarbone in each of his first two seasons and only got to play in 6 of his first 32 games. That's not failing to play through pain, that's having two freak injuries.

703SKINS202
10-03-2010, 04:57 PM
Ah Charles Rogers, my first draft crush. I agree there are some similarities but that doesn't mean AJ is going to be a bust. Like paranoid said Charles had two freak injuries then got into the whole weed thing...ugh

shylo3716
10-04-2010, 11:02 AM
A.J. Green HS highlight tape

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cc9xk33GasI

FUNBUNCHER
10-04-2010, 11:08 AM
That's a bit unfair. I know Rogers was a bust in the NFL, but the guy broke his collarbone in each of his first two seasons and only got to play in 6 of his first 32 games. That's not failing to play through pain, that's having two freak injuries.

LOL!! You caught me!! I was just talking a little **** about AJ.

But I do worry about his durability in the pros.

georgiafan
10-04-2010, 11:23 AM
This game was Green in a nutshell. He dominates when he's on the field, but for one reason or another is often not able to stay on the field. Hard to say if it's an issue that will follow him to the NFL.

i couldnt have said it better myself

LonghornsLegend
10-04-2010, 12:07 PM
That's a bit unfair. I know Rogers was a bust in the NFL, but the guy broke his collarbone in each of his first two seasons and only got to play in 6 of his first 32 games. That's not failing to play through pain, that's having two freak injuries.

And everyone forgets Rogers was really playing well before the injuries. It's not like he sucked, he may not have been an all-pro we will never know but he looked like he was on his way to being pretty good. He was an absolute monster at MSU and I don't fault Det for taking him over Andre Johnson.