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dregolll
09-21-2010, 10:33 PM
Let me just start by saying that I listen to your podcast and it amazed me of the bias attitude your taking between the two QBs. It seems as though you just flat out don't like Mallett for some reason. First of all, you talk about Mallett not being accurate because I'm assuming that the 55% completion rate as a sophmore which is understandable. But you failed to mentioned that Locker also is a 55%-58% completion rate himself. So what does that make him? You guys also mentioned that the guy has yet to make any NFL throws this season!!!! Are you kidding me!! The guy has over 40 completions of 30 or more yards over the past 2 seasons.
I thought that you guys were supposed to be objective in your scouting, it has become quite obvious that you guys are gonna take this Jake Locker hype train to the grave no matter what. It's inexcusable when a suppose #1 overall pick and John Elway and Steve Young clone goes 4/20 and you are saying that you are not impressed with Ryan Mallett against the bulldogs. You fail to give this guy any credit and he threw for 380 yards with no ints. Who cares if the throws were easy, he can not help if the DBs from Georgia can't cover. His job is to get the ball to his playmakers which he has done so well this season.
As I continued to listen to your discussion, you and Shane continued to make excuse after excuse for the guy by saying that his supporting cast is weak and all the other excuses you guys can create. Fact of the matter is the guy is not all cracked up to how you guys are hyping him. Scott it amazes me that you talk about Mallett making bad throws but what are you seeing out of Jake Elway. At least Mallett has shown improvement from a year ago and he is playing in a very tough conference.
I guess the moral of the story is that you guys are very bias and one-sided in your assessment of the 2 QBs that it's becoming quite comical and you may lose the respect of others on this site. By that I mean they may not take your assessment as serious anymore. Ryan Mallett is just a better player that the overhyped Jake Locker and he will go #1 overall. Mr. Locker is a media creation that you guys have bought into for whatever reason. I hope that this post doesn't upset you, but you always looking for constructive criticism, so there you go.

bluebonnet78
09-21-2010, 10:59 PM
the rhetoric is quite eloquent in this argument

tjsunstein
09-21-2010, 11:02 PM
I'm looking forward to a response to this. Get your popcorn ready.

ElectricEye
09-21-2010, 11:03 PM
Itt; box scores.

D-Unit
09-21-2010, 11:06 PM
I don't think they are being bias as much as they are simply pointing out the facts and being opinionated.

Neither Scott or Shane are die hard Arkansas Razorback fans. So I don't see how they are "bias".

wonderbredd24
09-21-2010, 11:07 PM
There were a couple throws from Mallett that bounced right off the hands of Georgia DBs

ChiFan24
09-21-2010, 11:22 PM
This thread title kills me. Somebody change it to biased, it's like my top pet peeve.

Also lolz at the post itself.

Borat
09-21-2010, 11:22 PM
All your bias are belong to us.

RaiderNation
09-21-2010, 11:26 PM
http://www.snarkypants.com/wp-content//ban-hamster.jpg

Crickett
09-21-2010, 11:30 PM
All your bias are belong to us.

Thats why we american football.

prock
09-21-2010, 11:55 PM
I love when people can't even properly capitalize words.

descendency
09-22-2010, 12:26 AM
The OP is right that people are too critical of Mallett but is wrong about Locker. I'd take Mallett over Locker, but both will be in the top 10. If for nothing else, they can play in cold weather cities and run any offense you would want, unlike Colt McCoy - who can't seem to run any offense.

BRAVEHEART
09-22-2010, 12:41 AM
http://dalockerroom.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Len_bias.jpg

BigBanger
09-22-2010, 12:57 AM
I didn't listen to the whole thing and once the podcast became repetitive, I just stopped it, but the OP has a point... to a degree (his mild retardation aside). He, like the podcast, just didn't do a great job of explaining his points.

Basically, all I heard, was 20 minutes of excuses for Locker scattered throughout. Then John Elway was brought up, and I heard one of those, "Well John Elway never had a winning record at Stanford. How was his NFL career?"

Then I heard 20 minutes of Mallet bashing scattered throughout where he was called dumb (his redneck stereotype was then pussyfooted around), his accuracy was brought under speculation and his scheme was questioned. Then he was compared or referenced to JaMarcus Russell and Ryan Leaf.

It's perfectly valid to question the guys ability, but it's juvenile and poorly articulated to just compare one guy to, maybe, the greatest player of all-time and then compare the next guy to two of the biggest busts in NFL history. It's a weak argument for both players.

There were rarely any specifics brought up for both players (unless I fast forwarded over them, which is possible). I heard box scores, box scores and more talk about box scores. I figured with how long the bantar went on for, that specifics would be brought up from each game.

His first INT was just atrocious (it was alluded to in the podcast). It was an awful decision. The next series he had a 3rd & 2. On a bootleg, he had a man wide open in the flat, but because he failed to get rid of the ball in a timely manner, he gave Hagg (defender) the opportunity to close on the ball and break up the pass. If he doesn't make the bad decision, then you can 1 INT away and 1 incompletion. If he has better timing on his 3rd down attempt, then he has another completion, 1 less incompletion and he moves the chains, controls the ball and sustains a drive. I could go on and on. His poise in the pocket is not good. He looked like he was distracted by the pass rush and failed to keep his eyes down field. Maybe I'll just get lazy now and call him Trent Edwards.

Anyway, people are constantly saying, "4-for-20. That was ******* awful."

How about 3-for-19... for 26 yards, 0 TDs, 2 INTs? Because he was a blown coverage away from having those atrocious numbers.

Basically, the guys on the podcast were right to a degree, but, as the OP pointed out, they also failed to pressure, question or critique Locker the same way they did Mallet. Locker deserves some responsibility for the bad game. All of it? No.

Scotty D
09-22-2010, 02:38 AM
Scott is going to defend his guy and point out reasons why he believes Locker is the #1 QB. He should stay with his guy and if Locker goes on to bust in the NFL then we can start threads like this. Would it be smart for Scott to completely re-evaluate Locker off of one game? In the podcast Scott said he would most likely put Mallett in the top ten if he was making a mock today. Its not like he is disrespecting the guy.

Addict
09-22-2010, 02:44 AM
a thread about bias coming from a poster who has literally spent every post since march 2010 knocking on Locker and, wherever possible promoting Mallett and/or Barkley.

this is top quality stuff, people.

wicket
09-22-2010, 02:46 AM
Dude, this is the 6th thread you opened to bash Locker, its getting annoying

Caulibflower
09-22-2010, 04:22 AM
I've preferred Locker to Mallett for a while now, but watching him against Nebraska definitely gave me pause. He really didn't look good at all. I also caught Mallett's game-clinching drive against Georgia. I can't say I'm in love with either of them at this point, but for me, personally, I have to say Mallett's stock is up and Locker's is down.

(I know, I know.... one game for each of them. But Locker was really bad.)

CJSchneider
09-22-2010, 05:40 AM
I'm looking forward to a response to this. Get your popcorn ready.

http://www.3dexport.com/models/7057/8574/popcorn_final.jpg

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 05:57 AM
dregolll,

I don't take offense at all, I love the discussion and can take constructive criticism. The only thing I don't like is the thread title so I am going to change that. Hope you don't mind.

I don't think biased is the right word to use but I absolutely feel Ryan Mallett is overhyped. As I've said before, I don't scout with box scores and neither does the NFL. In this day and age completion percentages are not always indicative of accuracy. Case Keenum puts up ridiculous numbers in Houston's offense but that's because he is only asked to read half of the field and make a lot of short, easy throws. Often times a guy completing 55%-60% of his attempts in a pro style system is more impressive than someone hitting on 75% in a gimmicky spread. There is plenty to like about Mallett as a pro prospect, I have never denied that. However, I honestly don't know how anyone could have watched that Georgia game and not come away with just as many questions as answers.

I don't have a horse in this race. I'm not a Washington or Arkansas fan and even if I was I wouldn't let it affect my evaluation. I am just going by what I've seen from personally watching both Locker and Mallett play on a number of occasions over the course of many years. Perhaps I'll be wrong and perhaps I'll be right, only time will tell. However, I've never been afraid to put my opinion out there and in my eyes Mallett doesn't belong in the same talk as Mallett when it comes to being a pro prospect. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, that is mine.

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 06:08 AM
BigBanger,

First of all I never said or implied that Ryan Mallett is a "redneck". I merely pointed out that there is a lot of chatter in the scouting community questioning Mallett's intangibles and even cited one specific example about how the end of last season was handled. Also, I believe I clearly and emphatically mentioned at least three times that at this point most of it is still rumor and innuendo and that it's something that will have to be vetted leading up to the draft.

As for comparing Mallett to Leaf and Russell, if you listened to the show you'll know I also evoked the names of Drew Bledoe and Ben Roethlisberger.

As for specifics on why I feel Mallett is overrated, I talked about his accuracy and footwork, as I have in the past, and cited examples from the Georgia game where he consistently overthrew open targets. I also noted more than once that Locker did not have a good game and that the first interception was a terrible play on his part. Besides, the gist of the Locker segment wasn't to break down the strengths and weaknesses of his game in an in-depth manner, it was to point out that you can't evaluate him based on a single game.

I appreciate the long post and the interaction but in the end I don't feel any of the points you criticized me on there were valid.

wicket
09-22-2010, 06:28 AM
I agree that Malletts Georgia game was way overrated (check the gameday thread, I thought he looked really sloppy and easily couldve had 2/3 interceptions). But I do have to say, I do love Locker as a prospect and I think he is a great game but I didnt like his performance against Nebraska and I can easily see why it would be a red flag.

AntoinCD
09-22-2010, 06:53 AM
I want to see how Jake Locker responds in his next few games. If he turns it around and has big games against the better Pac-10 defenses then we can mark it down to a poor game against an elite college defense. However if he continues to struggle then serious questions will have to be raised. Both he and Mallett have great physical tools but also have serious question marks. The difference being at the moment is that Mallett has found ways to win whereas Locker hasn't. I understand that Mallett has way better talent around him but it has to go down as a negative against Locker that he is not winning many games.

As of right now im not sold on either. Even last year I thought the Locker hype was getting out of hand based on his improvement from his sophomore season.

dregolll
09-22-2010, 07:05 AM
I don't see how you can say that Mallett is not in the same stratosphere as Locker. I mean before this guy beat USC he was no on the map and then all of a sudden he wins the game and Todd Mcshay hypes the train and everyone is aboard. I know you alluded to him being one of the best prospects since John Elway, but I would have to strongly disagree with you on that statement. Micheal Vick blows Jake Locker out of the water as a prospect and enter the league in 2001.

I would like to clarify a couple things with Jake Locker. First of all, I don't hate him at all, but it's a shame that you and the media have hyped him so much that he can't go anywhere but in decline mode. The guy has yet to get to a "single" bowl game which by the way... I really don't put much emphasis into, but you guys rip QBs like Jimmy Clausen for not winning enough, but Mr. Locker gets a pass. Listen, I think Locker is a nice prospect, but this notion that he is the best propect in years and this talk about going #1 overall is quite frankly "insane".

Halsey
09-22-2010, 07:14 AM
Every QB prospect is supposedly "hyped" by some people on these boards. Last year it was "Bradford hype", the year before it was Stafford and Sanchez, Matt Ryan the year before that. I don't think some of you even know what hype means. It's not hype to say a guy is a good QB prospect if that's what he is. If you think hype has been used for one of the QBs being discussed, please tell us specifically what that hype is instead of just mindlessly typing the word because you think it helps your argument.

BigBanger
09-22-2010, 07:15 AM
BigBanger,

First of all I never said or implied that Ryan Mallett is a "redneck". I merely pointed out that there is a lot of chatter in the scouting community questioning Mallett's intangibles and even cited one specific example about how the end of last season was handled. Also, I believe I clearly and emphatically mentioned at least three times that at this point most of it is still rumor and innuendo and that it's something that will have to be vetted leading up to the draft.

As for comparing Mallett to Leaf and Russell, if you listened to the show you'll know I also evoked the names of Drew Bledoe and Ben Roethlisberger.

I didn't say you did. Someone called into the show and brought up his communication skills. He is a redneck and sounds like a guy with a very low level of intelligence (those are my words). It was never directly said, but if you've ever been down south or if you heard Mallet talk after the game... it's not that hard to connect the dots. I'm not saying there's anything with questioning that or bringing that up. I merely said it was brought up as a question mark that he will have to address as a prospect. I listen to him talk and I'm like: "What the ****!!!" For instance, I would listen to JaMarcus Russell and think there is no way he completed college. I listen to Frank Gore? Oh, my Lord. And dozens more players that speak in broken English. I have no problem with the rumor or bringing that aspect up. I was not saying that's a mistake on your part. It is a perfectly valid point to bring up. I was just giving a quick run down on what I heard and the points that were brought up.

I do recall Big Ben getting mentioned. I'll get to that a little later.

As for specifics on why I feel Mallett is overrated, I talked about his accuracy and footwork, as I have in the past, and cited examples from the Georgia game where he consistently overthrew open targets.
I agree with most points on why Mallet is overrated, but that's not my point. I couldn't care less about the guy. He has a lot to prove in my eyes. I haven't watched the entire Georgia game yet, but I watched most of the second half and I did not see one throw that was remotely impressive or difficult.

I also noted more than once that Locker did not have a good game and that the first interception was a terrible play on his part. Besides, the gist of the Locker segment wasn't to break down the strengths and weaknesses of his game in an in-depth manner, it was to point out that you can't evaluate him based on a single game.
I was more interested in hearing about Jake Locker and the performance against Nebraska. The specifics of that game. I wasn't getting into details really, but Shane was also saying that he was impressed with Locker in the 1st QT, which I found baffling. Pretty much his third throw of the game was terrible, which you did mention, but... that was pretty much it.

I was expecting more critique on Locker instead of passing the buck off and just kinda leaving it at that, but I do understand the purpose of the show. Like I said, it felt repetitive though. I was waiting for you guys to let everyone know it's just one game and it doesn't mean he's a second round QB now. I thought you guys would push the discussion further and talk about his performance, which I don't feel you guys did or even attempted to do. I know you were trying to defend him since he's been getting a pretty big bashing, but that's what the OP was referencing. It came off as if you were making excuses for Locker (which were some valid excuses and one's that I agree with) and then finding everything to bash Mallet on and giving him little to no credit, or when you did, it seemed like a back handed compliment. Referencing JaMarcus Russell one minute and throwing out Big Ben the next... those are polar opposites. You weren't comparing Jake Locker to John Elway one minute, then three minutes later bringing up JP Losman.

Also, there is a huge difference between JaMarcus Russell and Big Ben. Polar opposites. You are going to get hurt straddling that fence. You gotta pick a side. Is he JaMarcus Russell or is he Big Ben? You can't have it both ways. You can't say the guy is massively overhyped, and then end up comparing the guy to a 2-Time Super Bowl Champion and one of the best QBs in the NFL. Or then saying, "Well, I did evoke names like JaMarcus Russell and Ryan Leaf."

I know you are always trying to be (w)right, but don't make it so obvious.

I appreciate the long post and the interaction but in the end I don't feel any of the points you criticized me on there were valid.
The OPer felt as if you had more than enough ammo to critique Jake Locker than you did. And I agree with him. It was more than just a bad day and it was more than just about Nebraska being that good and Washington being that bad. Jake Locker himself was just as bad as the talent he had around him. He had no timing or any anticipation on his throws at all. He was staring down receivers. He was anxious within the pocket and didn't stand tall in the face of pressure. Threw off his back foot quite a bit. He had a 3rd INT that was called back and that was an even dumber decision than his 1st. There was a lot there with Jake Locker's performance to question.

Instead, it was brushed under the rug. It was like, "Well, Mallet is overhyped and here's why. Locker isn't overhyped because his team sucks. He's John Elway."

dregolll
09-22-2010, 07:18 AM
My interpretation of "hype" is when something has been created by someone or people and that product fails "miserably" to deliver the goods. It when someone or something receives unwarranted attention based on doing "nothing". Which by the way is the case with Jake Locker.

Shane P. Hallam
09-22-2010, 07:21 AM
I think the main thing I took from it (and I'm guessing Scott too,) is that we are going to keep waiting and seeing on these guys. Both of us commented, if Locker has another game like this against big time competition, it starts to show that trend. Let's see if it is an aberration or not.

On the other side, if Mallet corrects his issues, beats Alabama with his arm and looks better, then that starts to show a trend. We still need more. 3 games this season (or in Locker's case, one,) is not going to make a whole season last year defunct. Let's see more.

Halsey
09-22-2010, 07:27 AM
I'm the one who brought up communication skills. I know it might sound like nitpicking or something, but it's just something I notice with Mallett. Most top NFL QBs are guys who are good communicators. A person's ability to communicate is important, especially if they are in a leadership position. That's something Mallett needs to work on, based on what I hear and see from him.

And I'm from Georgia, so don't think for a second that I'm biased based on where he's from. There are plenty of good QBs from the south.

HawkEye30
09-22-2010, 07:28 AM
Guys its week 4 of college football, there are currently way to many threads about the same thing, aka the 3 quarterbacks. None of these guys have looked all pro, so i say we give it some time and just watch some football.

Halsey
09-22-2010, 07:38 AM
My interpretation of "hype" is when something has been created by someone or people and that product fails "miserably" to deliver the goods. It when someone or something receives unwarranted attention based on doing "nothing". Which by the way is the case with Jake Locker.

So you're saying Locker has done nothing and the media just randomly decided "Hey, let's hype this guy up for no reason!"

No. He's being talked about as a top QB prospect because he has top physical tools and demonstrates top intangibles. He's also played well in many games, such as vs LSU, USC, Cal, etc last year. He has good size, shows good arm strength and is very mobile. That's not hype.

dregolll
09-22-2010, 07:55 AM
Cam Newton has great physical tools also, but I don't see you guys hyping him to no end. As a matter of fact, Locker can't touch this guy physically and I have yet to hear anything about him being a great future prospect. I guess people are gonna like who they like no matter what.

Halsey
09-22-2010, 08:14 AM
Physical tools are only part of the formula. Cam Newton hasn't played enough to provide scouts with a lot of opportunity to evaluate him. There was also that little arrest thing while he was at Florida. NFL teams pay A LOT of attention to player's off field conduct.

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 08:20 AM
I don't see how you can say that Mallett is not in the same stratosphere as Locker. I mean before this guy beat USC he was no on the map and then all of a sudden he wins the game and Todd McShay hypes the train and everyone is aboard. I know you alluded to him being one of the best prospects since John Elway, but I would have to strongly disagree with you on that statement. Micheal Vick blows Jake Locker out of the water as a prospect and enter the league in 2001.

That could not be further from the truth. NFL scouts have loved Jake Locker's physical tools and intangibles for years. The reason his stock got a major boost last year is because he got an opportunity to play in a pro style system and acclimated himself very well.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
09-22-2010, 08:24 AM
That could not be further from the truth. NFL scouts have loved Jake Locker's physical tools and intangibles for years. The reason his stock got a major boost last year is because he got an opportunity to play in a pro style system and acclimated himself very well.

What did your NFL scouts say about Jimmy Clausen last year? Hard to believe a guy you thought was the top QB prospect tumbled out of the 1st round.

no bare feet
09-22-2010, 08:32 AM
Spread offenses and the usage of 11 personel groupings makes a Petrino offense look a lot less 'gimmicky'. Mallett is overhyped because he fits the prototype of the big arm guy with out the brains. Now he is actually being underrated. He knows how to read a defense and go through progressions. He has a cannon and needs to reel it in at times. Locker is an excellent prospect but he needs more work, but how often does a top 10 talent not need more work?

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 08:47 AM
What did your NFL scouts say about Jimmy Clausen last year? Hard to believe a guy you thought was the top QB prospect tumbled out of the 1st round.

I stand by my evaluation and time will tell who was right on Clausen.

I also had Aaron Rodgers as the best player in the 2005 NFL Draft and he slipped.

Remind me, how has that turned out? :o)

wonderbredd24
09-22-2010, 08:52 AM
I stand by my evaluation and time will tell who was right on Clausen.

I also had Aaron Rodgers as the best player in the 2005 NFL Draft and he slipped.

Remind me, how has that turned out? :o)

Brady Quinn... ouch, that hurt me too :(

Locker to the Browns. Thanks.

K Train
09-22-2010, 08:55 AM
im not very high on mallet, but i dont see what everyone else sees in locker either, well in a way i do because i do love him as a prospect but i think he gets a free pass on a lot of things QB prospects that are first overall or top 5/top 10 material get torn apart for.

i think they are both special, but i think im warming up to luck more than either of them lol

FUNBUNCHER
09-22-2010, 09:07 AM
Mallet is southern and talks like it. If having a southern accent makes one's intelligence come under question, please don't listen to 90% of the coaches in the SEC interview after a game.

What will we all say if Arkansas winds up in the SECCG?? Hm??

ElectricEye
09-22-2010, 09:34 AM
That could not be further from the truth. NFL scouts have loved Jake Locker's physical tools and intangibles for years. The reason his stock got a major boost last year is because he got an opportunity to play in a pro style system and acclimated himself very well.

I think there's a perception out there, partially because Locker plays on the West Coast, that he was some scrub before the USC game. I remember chatter about him going all the way back to 2006 about his fantastic tools and intangibles. He was supposed to be the savior of Washington the second he stepped on campus. That hasn't worked out so well for their program, but I don't think people realize he's been a prospect all along.

Halsey
09-22-2010, 09:40 AM
It's not that Mallett speaks with a southern accent. It's that he's provided reasons to question if he's got what it takes between the ears to be a top NFL QB. His communications skills are one reason, IMO. Most elite QB prospects come across as highly intelligent, mature guys, who can handle pressure with ease. Mallett just doesn't yet demonstrate that at the level an elite prospect should. Things like maturity, communication skills, leadership skills, etc. were a HUGE reason Sam Bradford went #1.

Sniper
09-22-2010, 09:47 AM
Often times a guy completing 55%-60% of his attempts in a pro style system is more impressive than someone hitting on 75% in a gimmicky spread.

Yeah. On the other hand, if you hit on 20 percent of passes in Steve Sarkisian's offense, that easily makes you the top pick in the draft.

There were a couple throws from Mallett that bounced right off the hands of Georgia DBs

The majority of Locker's throws either hit the ground or landed in a Nebraska player's hands.

Michigan
09-22-2010, 10:34 AM
I also had Aaron Rodgers as the best player in the 2005 NFL Draft and he slipped.

Remind me, how has that turned out? :o)

You also had Brady Quinn #2 overall in 2007 and he slipped...

steelersfan43
09-22-2010, 10:48 AM
Yeah. On the other hand, if you hit on 20 percent of passes in Steve Sarkisian's offense, that easily makes you the top pick in the draft.



The majority of Locker's throws either hit the ground or landed in a Nebraska player's hands.


Michigan sucks and they havent played any real opponets and you run a gimmick offense and rich rodriguez cheats the ncaa.

Sniper
09-22-2010, 11:08 AM
Michigan sucks and they havent played any real opponets and you run a gimmick offense and rich rodriguez cheats the ncaa.

Cool story. Tell it at parties or in a thread that's relevant to Michigan.

dregolll
09-22-2010, 11:36 AM
Exactly Sniper, Scott mentioned that if you look at Mallett's game against the bulldogs...Mallet made about 8-10 throws that were horrible, but what about the Nebraska game with Jake. Scott could you please explain this to me.

steelersfan43
09-22-2010, 11:39 AM
Playcalling didnt help either. they run a dive from singleback, then a run out of shotgun, then try to pass on 3rd and 12. every single time.

wonderbredd24
09-22-2010, 11:42 AM
Exactly Sniper, Scott mentioned that if you look at Mallett's game against the bulldogs...Mallet made about 8-10 throws that were horrible, but what about the Nebraska game with Jake. Scott could you please explain this to me.
i8LOLswfTkQ

SenorGato
09-22-2010, 11:56 AM
Mallett is the Big Ben/Joe Flacco of this draft. He'll go in the teens to an organization more ready for a young QB than the top 10 teams and he'll look quite good.

I also think he's a more polished passer than his numbers indicate. Not to say that he's done, but just the fact that he doesn't rocket every throw says he understands something about what's going on.

I don't think any of the QB prospects will inspire any "best QB prospect since the last best QB prospect since guy" conversation, but if I was looking for a QB I'd be quite happy to come away with Locker, Mallett, or Luck.

I hope he goes to the AFC North, the division for Giant QBs. I hope it's to the Browns...they could probably use it...

Shane P. Hallam
09-22-2010, 12:01 PM
Exactly Sniper, Scott mentioned that if you look at Mallett's game against the bulldogs...Mallet made about 8-10 throws that were horrible, but what about the Nebraska game with Jake. Scott could you please explain this to me.

I'd say Locker made 8-10 horrible passes in the Nebraska game as well.

ThePudge
09-22-2010, 12:34 PM
I'd say Locker made 8-10 horrible passes in the Nebraska game as well.

I'd argue that Mallett made more good passes on Saturday than Locker completed passes. I don't think you can compare them based on one day of the year though. I've seen Mallett much sharper, in games that showed his ability far better; likewise, I've never seen Locker play worse.

Going back to last year, Ryan Mallett blew me away with his poise in crunch-time. Mallett should have beaten LSU a year ago late in the game, but his receivers sabotaged his efforts. In the two-minute drill he's been nothing short of superb since late last season. I put value in that, I like a QB who'll go out there and win a game.

The most depressing Jake Locker fact of the year: that after scoring 17 points in the games first half vs BYU, he was unable to get the UW offense going against the Cougars defense. BYU came back, scored 10 points in the second half, and won the game 23-17. BYU's defense is not Nebraska's, the game was on the line for the taking the entire second half, but Locker and UW couldn't take advantage. I'm not saying Jake lost the game for the Huskies, I'm saying he could have won it, but didn't. I had a similar gripe with Jimmy Clausen a year ago, he'd put his team in position to win but often couldn't close games. Blame supporting cast all you want, but when evaluating Quarterbacks I like to look at how they influence the win column; I like to see special efforts from special players.

I do think it's sad that there are some people here that want to turn Locker's 4-20 71 yds 1 Td 2 Int performance into a more impressive outing than a 21-33 outing in which Mallett threw 3 Td's 0 Int's and won a conference game on the road. No one mentioned Mallett as having a flawless performance against the Bulldogs, but apparently to excuse Locker's game even further we need to track Mallett's name through the mud.

Addict
09-22-2010, 12:40 PM
Exactly Sniper, Scott mentioned that if you look at Mallett's game against the bulldogs...Mallet made about 8-10 throws that were horrible, but what about the Nebraska game with Jake. Scott could you please explain this to me.

he already said that Locker didn't have a good game and made a few very poor throws, what more do you want him to say?

seriously, dude, did Jake Locker kick your dog or something?

SchizophrenicBatman
09-22-2010, 01:03 PM
I see people bringing up Roethlisberger's name when referring to Mallett and I'm not sure I see that. One of the biggest things that separates him from other QBs is his insane escapability. I get that since Mallett is also really tall it's an easy comp but I don't think he has the same body mass to just shrug off NFL defenders in the same fashion. Really the only QB I've seen who comes close to Ben with that skill is Josh Freeman

ChiFan24
09-22-2010, 05:07 PM
I could have sworn both of these guys had played before this past week. Like, I was almost certain I had seen them before. Oh well.

FUNBUNCHER
09-22-2010, 05:55 PM
Hope everyone watches Arkansas v. Alabama this weekend, it could be a classic.
IMO Mallett has a chance to really separate himself from the other top QB prospects this weekend and solidify his chances to be taken #1 overall.

P-L
09-22-2010, 06:15 PM
I'd argue that Mallett made more good passes on Saturday than Locker completed passes. I don't think you can compare them based on one day of the year though. I've seen Mallett much sharper, in games that showed his ability far better; likewise, I've never seen Locker play worse.

Going back to last year, Ryan Mallett blew me away with his poise in crunch-time. Mallett should have beaten LSU a year ago late in the game, but his receivers sabotaged his efforts. In the two-minute drill he's been nothing short of superb since late last season. I put value in that, I like a QB who'll go out there and win a game.

The most depressing Jake Locker fact of the year: that after scoring 17 points in the games first half vs BYU, he was unable to get the UW offense going against the Cougars defense. BYU came back, scored 10 points in the second half, and won the game 23-17. BYU's defense is not Nebraska's, the game was on the line for the taking the entire second half, but Locker and UW couldn't take advantage. I'm not saying Jake lost the game for the Huskies, I'm saying he could have won it, but didn't. I had a similar gripe with Jimmy Clausen a year ago, he'd put his team in position to win but often couldn't close games. Blame supporting cast all you want, but when evaluating Quarterbacks I like to look at how they influence the win column; I like to see special efforts from special players.

I do think it's sad that there are some people here that want to turn Locker's 4-20 71 yds 1 Td 2 Int performance into a more impressive outing than a 21-33 outing in which Mallett threw 3 Td's 0 Int's and won a conference game on the road. No one mentioned Mallett as having a flawless performance against the Bulldogs, but apparently to excuse Locker's game even further we need to track Mallett's name through the mud.
You're being hypocritical here. First you praise Mallett because he "should have beaten LSU" but it was all his receivers fault. Then you knock Jake Locker because he didn't beat BYU and later suggest that Washington's poor supporting cast is not a good excuse because he ultimately didn't influence the win column. You can't have it both ways. Why does Mallett get praise for not beating LSU but Locker gets criticized for not beating BYU?

As far as last year's LSU game went, if Mallett wasn't completely and utterly terrible in the first half of that game then he wouldn't have needed his receivers to play well at the end of the game. Sure, I'll give him all the credit for making adjustments at halftime and coming out and playing really well in the second half. However, that doesn't excuse his awful performance in the first half.

BeerBaron
09-22-2010, 06:27 PM
Hope everyone watches Arkansas v. Alabama this weekend, it could be a classic.
IMO Mallett has a chance to really separate himself from the other top QB prospects this weekend and solidify his chances to be taken #1 overall.

Or, potentially, pull a Locker and get dominated vs. a great defense. If that happens, they stay on the same level but Luck could really improve his stock vs. Notre Dame in front of a national audience.

All offseason I was saying I didn't think he would come out, but he has been so damn smooth and polished that he just may come out. Who knows.

Another good weekend to check out the top QBs.

ThePudge
09-22-2010, 06:40 PM
A fairly valid point you bring up here, but ultimately I put more value in the second half of games. That LSU game was Ryan Mallett doing everything in his power to win the game. He regained the lead for his team (after scoring 24 points in the second half) and left 1:18 on the clock. He did play poorly in that first half, but he put his team in position to win the game & really made a lot of big plays when it counted. No doubt you'd rather Locker was quiet in the first half against BYU then came alive in the Second.

I definitely don't consider that LSU game to be one of Ryan Mallett's best; however, he showed an incredible amount of poise on the road as an underdog after an early deficit. I just want to see Jake Locker make big plays in games when it really matters this year (like he did against Arizona & USC a year ago.) The BYU game in which 0 points were scored in the second half was worrisome, as the Huskies don't get the chance to win every game. It's still very early in the season and we all still have a lot to learn about Locker/Mallett/Luck. I'm excited to see what Mallett can make of this matchup against Alabama and I'm eager to see what Andrew Luck can do against Notre Dame this week.

Day One Pick
09-22-2010, 07:43 PM
I think the main thing I took from it (and I'm guessing Scott too,) is that we are going to keep waiting and seeing on these guys. Both of us commented, if Locker has another game like this against big time competition, it starts to show that trend. Let's see if it is an aberration or not.

On the other side, if Mallet corrects his issues, beats Alabama with his arm and looks better, then that starts to show a trend. We still need more. 3 games this season (or in Locker's case, one,) is not going to make a whole season last year defunct. Let's see more.

Does Mallett have to beat Alabama to impress you? What if Mallett goes 4/20 against Alabama?

wonderbredd24
09-22-2010, 08:11 PM
Does Mallett have to beat Alabama to impress you? What if Mallett goes 4/20 against Alabama?

Mallett's inconsistency last year was terrifying. 5 games under 50% is difficult to ignore, while Locker's 1 game, as awful as it might be, looks like an abberation.

ElectricEye
09-22-2010, 08:44 PM
Cam Newton has great physical tools also, but I don't see you guys hyping him to no end. As a matter of fact, Locker can't touch this guy physically and I have yet to hear anything about him being a great future prospect. I guess people are gonna like who they like no matter what.

Think you have that backwards. Locker is both faster and has a bigger arm. Cam Newton could be a prospect, but the only thing he has over Locker is size. Don't see how anyone can say Jake Locker's physical tools can be touched. He's one of the most physically talented quarterbacks in long time. Arm is comparable to Stafford, legs are as good as Donovan McNabb/Steve Young were. Cam Newton is basically Josh Freeman in a different year. He might be a bit more athletic, but similar players overall.

Oh, and speaking of Freeman for all you box score guys, in 2008 he went 7/18 against Nebraska. Their defense that year wasn't anywhere near as good as they were this year either. Granted, nobody was projecting Freeman as a the number one overall pick(some were projecting him as a top ten pick by then though) but that was just looked at as being(for the most part) "Oh, he plays for Kansas State. Of course Nebraska will do that to him." He also went 13 of 28 against Texas Tech earlier in the year, which is even worse. Freeman played in an offense with spread concepts in it as well. So it's not like every talented quarterback has statistically dominant collegian careers.

FUNBUNCHER
09-22-2010, 09:19 PM
Or, potentially, pull a Locker and get dominated vs. a great defense. If that happens, they stay on the same level but Luck could really improve his stock vs. Notre Dame in front of a national audience.

All offseason I was saying I didn't think he would come out, but he has been so damn smooth and polished that he just may come out. Who knows.

Another good weekend to check out the top QBs.

Locker playing well against ND is not the same as Mallett showing well against Alabama.

BeerBaron
09-22-2010, 09:30 PM
Locker playing well against ND is not the same as Mallett showing well against Alabama.

I think you mean Luck....and no, it wouldn't be. If the both play well, and especially if they both win, it definitely says more about Mallett since his competition is significantly better.

However, it will be most people's first time seeing Luck leading the team on his own without Toby Gerhart overshadowing him. So if he plays well, especially if he plays as well as he did against Wake where he literally looked like a man amongst boys, then it's going to make an impact.

ThePudge
09-22-2010, 09:34 PM
I think you mean Luck....and no, it wouldn't be. If the both play well, and especially if they both win, it definitely says more about Mallett since his competition is significantly better.

However, it will be most people's first time seeing Locker leading the team on his own without Toby Gerhart overshadowing him. So if he plays well, especially if he plays as well as he did against Wake where he literally looked like a man amongst boys, then it's going to make an impact.

I just thought this was a little funny.

BeerBaron
09-22-2010, 09:44 PM
I just thought this was a little funny.

Dammit. I guarantee that isn't the last time I do that.....

FUNBUNCHER
09-22-2010, 09:46 PM
Look, if Luck and the Cardinal were to beat Alabama, would you really be arguing it was nearly as impressive as Mallett beating ND??

Let's try to be intellectually honest, people.

The hype train for Mallett will be stratospheric if the Razorbacks pull off the upset over Alabama this weekend, deservedly so.

And I don't really focus that much on Luck because I really doubt he's gonna leave after this season.

ThePudge
09-22-2010, 10:13 PM
Look, if Luck and the Cardinal were to beat Alabama, would you really be arguing it was nearly as impressive as Mallett beating ND??

Let's try to be intellectually honest, people.

The hype train for Mallett will be stratospheric if the Razorbacks pull off the upset over Alabama this weekend, deservedly so.

And I don't really focus that much on Luck because I really doubt he's gonna leave after this season.

I think Luck has a good chance to leave. He's going to file his paperwork and the committee, however conservative they may be, is going to tell him he'll be a first round pick, perhaps high first round pick. A QB with nothing really to gain by staying (already has 2 years starting experience + 3 years learning from coach Harbaugh), but everything to lose (health/bad season.) I think his coach will be vouching for him the way Pete Carroll did with Sanchez, Harbaugh and Luck seem to have such an excellent working relationship. He's a smart kid, he's mature, and if he can make millions & get his NFL career underway then why not.

Don't forget Locker was seen as a bit rawer at the end of last year than Luck may be right now; he was subjected to a pro-style offense for only one year and the panel told him he'd be a second round pick. Jake went back with something to gain, I'm not sure Andrew Luck will feel that same pressure. You don't have to be a 3-4 year starter to be a top pick. Luck will be ready & my guess is he'll make the leap.

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 10:23 PM
Exactly Sniper, Scott mentioned that if you look at Mallett's game against the bulldogs...Mallet made about 8-10 throws that were horrible, but what about the Nebraska game with Jake. Scott could you please explain this to me.

Mallett was missing wide open receivers in a quarterback friendly offense with no pressure. Locker was getting hounded by one of the best defenses in the country.

Scott Wright
09-22-2010, 10:26 PM
Hope everyone watches Arkansas v. Alabama this weekend, it could be a classic.
IMO Mallett has a chance to really separate himself from the other top QB prospects this weekend and solidify his chances to be taken #1 overall.

There is no question in my mind that Mallett is going to put up numbers this week, even against Alabama. He plays in a Bobby Petrino offense so that's a given. However, I encourage everyone to actually watch the game and tell me how he really plays outside of the box score.

ThePudge
09-23-2010, 12:36 AM
There is no question in my mind that Mallett is going to put up numbers this week, even against Alabama. He plays in a Bobby Petrino offense so that's a given. However, I encourage everyone to actually watch the game and tell me how he really plays outside of the box score.


I don't mean to point the finger, but I think your analysis of Ryan Mallett is very related to box scores. His inaccuracy concerns mostly stem from box scores a season ago, where some would chalk poor completion % up to being raw or inaccurate. While he's not Sam Bradford in the accuracy department, Mallett has done a great job at Arkansas getting the ball into receivers' hands. He inherited a young group upon arrival; early in the season their timing wasn't entirely there & drops plagued the team all the way up to their bowl game vs. East Carolina. This season, his receivers look better with Greg Childs & Joe Adams each shaping up to be fairly dynamic players, not to mention Mallett has an exceptional security blanket in the Tight End (Williams.)

Bobby Petrino's offense doesn't require an incredible Quarterback to run it, but it does take a fairly accurate QB (see: Brian Brohm.) There seem to be quite a lot of 10-15 yard & deep comeback routes so timing has to be a factor. I won't say that he takes a lot of shots down the middle of the field, but that's not likely to be his bread-and-butter in the NFL. Mallett's ability to get his throw (height, quick release, good throwing mechanics, & under-appreciated short-distance mobility) and hit the hashes 15 yards downfield is unmatched. He's been hitting out-routes & comeback routes pretty consistently the past two seasons. Sure, he'll miss some, but only the NFL's best don't ever miss on those types of throws. There is plenty NFL scouts/coaches can take out of Mallett's college tape in Petrino's offense. He makes a whole lot of NFL throws, he plays under-center, and there is nothing about the guy physically that will prevent him from playing in the NFL. He's hitting mostly wide-open receivers, maybe not making traditional NFL reads, but with more of an emphasis being placed on 3-4 WR sets & pass-catching TEs in the NFL those reads are becoming quicker and possibly easier.

On his deep throws, down the middle of the field, he'll need to use a bit more touch to avoid trouble. If he's throwing darts out there there's a good chance one sails on him a bit, goes of his receivers' finger tips, & winds up in the hands of the opposition. He needs to continue to improve finding the right velocity. A year ago he'd miss receivers on short routes because he'd throw the ball too hard, but this year it looks as if he's trying to help his receivers get the ball & let them get their yards after the catch. This still needs to improve consistency-wise, as he'll sometimes revert to what his natural instinct appears to be. He is improving in the accuracy department and a lot of it comes down to timing & communication.

On Saturday he missed a few passes, he threw off his back foot a couple times, he may have made a couple risky decisions. I don't know how you can sit there though, taking yourself seriously, and say that Mallett's 12 incompletions (33 passes) were more telling & less-accurate than Locker's 16 incompletions (20 passes.) This is a big-time QB prospect coming into a game against a top defense, with an over-matched OL, but the fact is Locker could have hung in there, he could have hit on more than he did. The truth is, neither Buffalo nor Oakland have a great OL & terrific receivers. Cleveland's talent level isn't on par with AFC North defenses either, so what makes us think he'll be a good guy to get any of those teams out of their jams? If it's acceptable for a QB to play scared in college, why is it so frowned down upon in the NFL?

What stands out about Mallett more-so than Jake Locker & even Andrew Luck (other than the arm strength) is his pocket presence and poise. Since late last season, Mallett has been one of the QBs in the country that simply doesn't get rattled. In the NFL some players go into a shell, some get down on themselves.. Brady Quinn, Matt Leinart, and perhaps even Alex Smith are examples. Mallett never plays afraid, he throws an interception & gets right back in there better than he was before. He plays extremely well under pressure & is capable of running the two-minute drill as well as any college passer I've seen. He just keeps calm, he keeps cool, and all of this is kind of surprising for a guy that has been regarded as so competitive or at times emotional.

It's amazing to me that you seem to flat-out not want to see Ryan Mallett succeed. Before the Alabama game you're already discrediting him & trying to call him a system Quarterback. If he beats the best team in the nation and puts up stellar numbers it can't mean that much because he has good receivers and is a product of Bobby Petrino's offense. I disagree, obviously. I think you have so much pride in your evaluation of Jake Locker that you're beginning to discredit Mallett. It's way to early to discount this season, we saw with Jevan Snead how QBs could breakout then fall on hard times. While I don't think Locker has done that at all, I still think it matters what he makes of the hand he's been dealt this season.

This would be a classic example of the Self-Fulfilling Prophecy, a classic flaw in perception that can be crippling for scouts/yourself/any draft analyst. That theory basically states that the mind sees what it wants to. I could be wrong, but you seem to go into Mallett's games at Arkansas expecting to see inaccuracy. Because that's what you expect, an inaccurate throw will get you more fired up than say, an accurate pass downfield. He threw 12 incompletions Saturday yet you harp on those passes rather than any of his more impressive throws (any one of his 21 completions.) For Locker, you seem content in blaming the forces around him. You expect to see a dazzling display of athleticism and arm strength with surprising polish & will find yourself ecstatic when he rolls out, keeping his eyes downfield, and delivers an accurate pass. When he falters, you are content in blaming his OL, you'll say his receivers are inferior.

Mallett has higher expectations, both statistically & in the standings, as he should. Still, why is it fair that Locker can't be subject to expectations? Can't we expect this elite dual-threat QB prospect to produce (and/or win) when he's supposed to be improved with another year in an NFL system. His cast didn't get worse around him, though it may not have gotten any better. His defense didn't blow the BYU game, Locker could have/should have won that game for the Huskies. One bad game isn't going to hurt his stock much at all, but the fact that in his first 3 games in 2010' he let BYU off the hook and tanked against Nebraska is a bit worrisome. The rest of the season is more important, but if he fails to improve & fails to close games then I really don't see how a struggling franchise can invest a Top 5 pick in him & throw him in behind a shaky OL with a talent deficiency at WR.

I think he may just be better suited for the 8-14 range. Perhaps Minnesota trades up (if they wind up winning this year), maybe Jacksonville picks him up to plug behind Monroe/Britton with Sims-Walker/Mike Thomas and a running game powered by MJD. I don't think Washington/Seattle would be a bad place for him either with high picks recently invested in their OLs. Based on what I've seen though, I don't know how good a fit Locker would be for turning around franchises like Buffalo or Cleveland.

AntoinCD
09-23-2010, 05:26 AM
The one example I can remember from the Georgia Arkansas game that really shows a lack of accuracy for Mallett came in the fourth quarter during the time when Georgia had stopped the Arkansas offense down in their own red zone. On a 3rd down play Mallett took the snap, felt pressure and escaped to his right and had a wide open WR on the sideline. He didn't need to hit him in stride, didn't need to put it to his back shoulder etc, the WR was already passed the first down marker and Mallett overthrew him, thus stalling the drive. That was a throw he simply had to make.

prock
09-23-2010, 08:00 AM
Mallett's inconsistency last year was terrifying. 5 games under 50% is difficult to ignore, while Locker's 1 game, as awful as it might be, looks like an abortion on the field.

I fixed it.

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 08:30 AM
I'm sorry, but anybody who thinks Ryan Mallett doesn't still have accuracy problems did not watch the Arkansas / Georgia game. Or any other games that Mallett has played for that matter. There were 4-6 instances in which he missed WIDE OPEN targets despite little or no pressure. That isn't a self-fulfilling prophecy or me seeing what I want to see. It's a fact. I don't want to see anything. I honestly couldn't care less whether Locker, Luck, Mallett or someone else is the #1 pick or a Top 10 pick, etc. I make my evaluations and sometimes I'm right (Rodgers) and sometimes I'm wrong (Quinn) but at the end of the day I go by what I see.

Also, Petrino's system doesn't necessarily require an accurate quarterback but it can certainly create the illusion of an accurate quarterback.

LonghornsLegend
09-23-2010, 09:35 AM
All offseason I was saying I didn't think he would come out, but he has been so damn smooth and polished that he just may come out. Who knows.
.

Agreed. I really didn't think Luck would come out either, but he has looked like he could, and should be the 1st QB taken in the draft, and that'd be hard to turn down. I really like his game, I'm definately gonna watch him alot more this weekend but he looks like he'll be a stud at the next level, has the smarts and the physical tools you want to see.


Though with that being said, I feel like this weekend all 3 QB's are gonna get extreme opinions one way or another. If Mallett explodes everyone will jock, if he looks terrible everyone will say he's overrated, I can already see this part of the forum now. Everyone is going to be trying to base opinions off of next weekend no matter the outcome.

Shane P. Hallam
09-23-2010, 09:38 AM
Agreed. I really didn't think Luck would come out either, but he has looked like he could, and should be the 1st QB taken in the draft, and that'd be hard to turn down. I really like his game, I'm definately gonna watch him alot more this weekend but he looks like he'll be a stud at the next level, has the smarts and the physical tools you want to see.


Though with that being said, I feel like this weekend all 3 QB's are gonna get extreme opinions one way or another. If Mallett explodes everyone will jock, if he looks terrible everyone will say he's overrated, I can already see this part of the forum now. Everyone is going to be trying to base opinions off of next weekend no matter the outcome.

Well, Washington is on their bye, Mallet has the chance to cement himself as an even bigger fan favorite if he lights up Alabama, and Luck against Notre Dame is a decent test. We'll see what happens. I'm looking forward to watching Bama/Arkansas a few times and ensure my opinions are justified. That is as long as I get power in my house back :P

wonderbredd24
09-23-2010, 09:40 AM
Notre Dame is not a decent test... the ONLY question is if Stanford can win on the road.

Notre Dame sucks

Ozzy
09-23-2010, 09:41 AM
Scott Wright I'm sorry, but anybody who thinks Ryan Mallett doesn't still have accuracy problems did not watch the Arkansas / Georgia game. Or any other games that Mallett has played for that matter. There were 4-6 instances in which he missed WIDE OPEN targets despite little or no pressure. That isn't a self-fulfilling prophecy or me seeing what I want to see. It's a fact. I don't want to see anything. I honestly couldn't care less whether Locker, Luck, Mallett or someone else is the #1 pick or a Top 10 pick, etc. I make my evaluations and sometimes I'm right (Rodgers) and sometimes I'm wrong (Quinn) but at the end of the day I go by what I see.

Also, Petrino's system doesn't necessarily require an accurate quarterback but it can certainly create the illusion of an accurate quarterback.
I agree, he does float passes and does miss wide open receivers at times, his balls do not drop the way most do, they go flying over the heads of the target and sail high on him a lot. People said the same thing about Stafford though, that he was not accurate. I would be far more concerned about his slow long release a times.

However to rip Mallett for throwing some bad balls, but still winning the football game on a late drive in the 4th, when compared to Mr. Locker's outing is a joke. Mallett at this weeks time is not the one to be concerned with his performance. And what is there not to love about such a large strong armed quarterback, has not been one of those that came out for the draft in what seems like forever. And he is not John Navarre here that cannot move, he can move in the pocket a little as well and throws ok on the run at times even.


Will see what happens, everyone has different opinions, same thing happened a few years ago with Sam Bradford and Stafford, and no amount of debate will changes anyones mind, we all have our guys and like our guys and see who is right in the end.

Halsey
09-23-2010, 09:59 AM
Notre Dame is not a decent test... the ONLY question is if Stanford can win on the road.

Notre Dame sucks

It's easy to say they're not a decent test when your'e on a message board. Luck has to actually go out onto the field and play. Scouts don't just limit the tape they watch of QBs to games vs elite defenses. Otherwise, there wouldn't be any QBs in the NFL from non-powerhouse programs.

And it's not like Luck is surrounded by top tier talent.

hockey619
09-23-2010, 10:01 AM
Ok
Ive been a Locker guy since after his freshman year when I made a thread on here asking about him. Hes got wheels to avoid pressure, a big arm (regardless of what the less informed will claim) and seems like a sharp guy from everything you hear.

But his accuracy is inconsistent and ever since he got Sark ive been a little less impressed than everyone else, his throwing motion looks very akward and forced (bothers me a little) but his biggest issue is the staring at targets. He does it, and BAD too. He looks like Kolb out there, and that needs to change starting yesterday. Hes a senior, he should be past that by now.


But thats not my big question. My big thing is this:

HAS A TOP RANKED OR HIGHLY TOUTED PROSPECT EVER LAYED AN EGG LIKE THAT AND THEN STAYED HIGH/TURNED OUT GREAT?

Cutler had a terrible team against the SEC (and their speedzzz) and i dont recall him ever dropping the ball like that. Just an observation, any thoughts on it scott?

wonderbredd24
09-23-2010, 10:06 AM
It's easy to say they're not a decent test when your'e on a message board. Luck has to actually go out onto the field and play. Scouts don't just limit the tape they watch of QBs to games vs elite defenses. Otherwise, there wouldn't be any QBs in the NFL from non-powerhouse programs.

And it's not like Luck is surrounded by top tier talent.
Notre Dame is going to be a 4-6 win team this year.

They suck.

Addict
09-23-2010, 10:09 AM
Also I was thinking about this, and it occurs to me that Scott not liking Mallett makes perfect sense if you look at what he likes in a QB. He's always favoured Locker types over Mallett types. A rundown:

He liked Culter and Leinart more than Young
He liked Quinn more than Russell
He liked Stafford more than Sanchez

So liking Locker over Mallett, in my view, makes perfect sense. The 'why' part is not my place to judge, but this is a pretty clear pattern.

Shane P. Hallam
09-23-2010, 10:10 AM
Ok
Ive been a Locker guy since after his freshman year when I made a thread on here asking about him. Hes got wheels to avoid pressure, a big arm (regardless of what the less informed will claim) and seems like a sharp guy from everything you hear.

But his accuracy is inconsistent and ever since he got Sark ive been a little less impressed than everyone else, his throwing motion looks very akward and forced (bothers me a little) but his biggest issue is the staring at targets. He does it, and BAD too. He looks like Kolb out there, and that needs to change starting yesterday. Hes a senior, he should be past that by now.


But thats not my big question. My big thing is this:

HAS A TOP RANKED OR HIGHLY TOUTED PROSPECT EVER LAYED AN EGG LIKE THAT AND THEN STAYED HIGH/TURNED OUT GREAT?

Cutler had a terrible team against the SEC (and their speedzzz) and i dont recall him ever dropping the ball like that. Just an observation, any thoughts on it scott?

As I mentioned on the Podcast, I've never seen this bad a game from a prospect. Ever. Scott's been doing it longer than me, but it was just that bad. There were still a few positive aspects, but if he reverts to that way of reading defenses and the inaccurate throws, no way can Locker be a top prospect. But, this is uncharacteristic for him as evidenced by last year and the first few games of this year. If it becomes a trend, concern grows HUGE. If it is just a blip on the radar, then it isn't as big of a concern.

This goes both ways. If Mallet goes into Alabama and puts up an egg, I won't be spouting on Tuesday that he is what we thought and this proves it. Same thing, it could just be a blip with the good season he is having so far.

All in all for me it comes down to two things:

1. I still trust Locker to make NFL throws more than Mallet

2. I trust Locker's intangibles and ability to be a leader a tad more than Mallet right now.


We still have a LONG season to go. If people change their tunes on prospects as the season goes along, that is GOOD. The draft evaluation process is very fluid, and I don't particularly like when people feel that is not. Changing your opinion of players as you watch more tape, see more games, etc is perfectly fine and should happen. If it doesn't, you aren't doing your job correctly.

Halsey
09-23-2010, 10:13 AM
Notre Dame is going to be a 4-6 win team this year.

They suck.

I see, so NFL teams only watch tape of a QB if he's taking on a team with at least 7 wins. That's a lot of game film they don't watch...

Halsey
09-23-2010, 10:18 AM
Also I was thinking about this, and it occurs to me that Scott not liking Mallett makes perfect sense if you look at what he likes in a QB. He's always favoured Locker types over Mallett types. A rundown:

He liked Culter and Leinart more than Young
He liked Quinn more than Russell
He liked Stafford more than Sanchez

So liking Locker over Mallett, in my view, makes perfect sense. The 'why' part is not my place to judge, but this is a pretty clear pattern.

Could you provide further explanation of this pattern, because I don't see what you mean.

wonderbredd24
09-23-2010, 10:18 AM
I see, so NFL teams only watch tape of a QB if he's taking on a team with at least 7 wins. That's a lot of game film they don't watch...
They are certainly going to put more emphasis on more difficult match ups than they will on games where the QB just slaughters inferior competition.

Beating the hell out of Notre Dame is what's supposed to happen with Luck. If he doesn't, then that tape becomes more important.

wonderbredd24
09-23-2010, 10:20 AM
Also I was thinking about this, and it occurs to me that Scott not liking Mallett makes perfect sense if you look at what he likes in a QB. He's always favoured Locker types over Mallett types. A rundown:

He liked Culter and Leinart more than Young
He liked Quinn more than Russell
He liked Stafford more than Sanchez

So liking Locker over Mallett, in my view, makes perfect sense. The 'why' part is not my place to judge, but this is a pretty clear pattern.

None of this makes any sense. Vince Young and Mark Sanchez have very little in common with Ryan Mallett short of the fact they play quarterback.

hockey619
09-23-2010, 10:26 AM
Also I was thinking about this, and it occurs to me that Scott not liking Mallett makes perfect sense if you look at what he likes in a QB. He's always favoured Locker types over Mallett types. A rundown:

He liked Culter and Leinart more than Young
He liked Quinn more than Russell
He liked Stafford more than Sanchez

So liking Locker over Mallett, in my view, makes perfect sense. The 'why' part is not my place to judge, but this is a pretty clear pattern.


...He likes the guys with experience in games and that have proven their ability making throws that are more NFL like for a longer time? Russell is the only one who doesnt fit that to a T, and his knock was a very serious and lingering concern about his work ethic and weight.

I certainly hope you werent pointing toward race...cause you know he did like Clausen more than Bradford, so theres more evidence for you. Oh wait, that situation also fits the mold of my previous statement of making tougher throws into NFL style windows. His 1999 top 3 qbs? McNabb, Culpepper, and Akili Smith. Maybe he learned something from backing inexperienced guys or guys in questionable O's (or both in Akili's case.)

There is plenty i think scott is wrong on at times and im certianly not one of the people who take his word as holy and take his side on anything, but this was a bit of an absurd insinuation on your part.


As I mentioned on the Podcast, I've never seen this bad a game from a prospect. Ever. Scott's been doing it longer than me, but it was just that bad. There were still a few positive aspects, but if he reverts to that way of reading defenses and the inaccurate throws, no way can Locker be a top prospect. But, this is uncharacteristic for him as evidenced by last year and the first few games of this year. If it becomes a trend, concern grows HUGE. If it is just a blip on the radar, then it isn't as big of a concern.

This goes both ways. If Mallet goes into Alabama and puts up an egg, I won't be spouting on Tuesday that he is what we thought and this proves it. Same thing, it could just be a blip with the good season he is having so far.

All in all for me it comes down to two things:

1. I still trust Locker to make NFL throws more than Mallet

2. I trust Locker's intangibles and ability to be a leader a tad more than Mallet right now.


We still have a LONG season to go. If people change their tunes on prospects as the season goes along, that is GOOD. The draft evaluation process is very fluid, and I don't particularly like when people feel that is not. Changing your opinion of players as you watch more tape, see more games, etc is perfectly fine and should happen. If it doesn't, you aren't doing your job correctly.


But how many guys who have had really bad performances before became great pros? Idk if thats answerable or proveable and i still like locker but damn that raises some serious questions, just sayin.

Halsey
09-23-2010, 10:28 AM
They are certainly going to put more emphasis on more difficult match ups than they will on games where the QB just slaughters inferior competition.

Beating the hell out of Notre Dame is what's supposed to happen with Luck. If he doesn't, then that tape becomes more important.

Why is it more important if a QB has a bad game than a good one? I actually find this to be flawed logic. If a good player dominates a team, then he's proving he's a good player. Why ignore a good player doing what good players are supposed to do? I doubt scouts ignore dominant performances and pay extra attention to bad performances.

and again, I want to point out, it's Stanford vs Notre Dame, not Stanford vs Nowheresville State.

Addict
09-23-2010, 10:31 AM
Could you provide further explanation of this pattern, because I don't see what you mean.

I guess he likes more cerebral quarterbacks over the physically more gifted ones, maybe has a tendency towards the more traditional guys. Not to say that I don't think he appreciates guys who can run, but I think he prefers pocket passer-types. Also I've noticed he tends to like seniors more than juniors when it comes to quarterbacks.

The most obvious dichitomy where I think his personal preference showed was Quinn/Russell, he liked Quinn, the physically less gifted but well-groomed quarterback over the big, strong-armed and physically far superior Russell. The irony of course is that both failed miserably, but I do think it was examplary for Scott's tastes in quarterback.

wonderbredd24
09-23-2010, 10:35 AM
Why is it more important if a QB has a bad game than a good one? I actually find this to be flawed logic. If a good player dominates a team, then he's proving he's a good player. Why ignore a good player doing what good players are supposed to do? I doubt scouts ignore dominant performances and pay extra attention to bad performances.

and again, I want to point out, it's Stanford vs Notre Dame, not Stanford vs Nowheresville State.

Unexpected results are going to draw more attention than expected results, whether that means struggling against an inferior opponent or playing well against a superior one.

Notre Dame is 1-2, staring 1-3 in the face. Other than the fact they are Notre Dame, they might as well be Nowheresville State, especially on defense where they've got Manti Te'o, the Nose tackle, and virtually nothing else.

Brian Kelly needs to get his guys in there, but the majority of what Weis left him are mediocre at best and it's reflected in their record.

hockey619
09-23-2010, 10:35 AM
...He likes the guys with experience in games and that have proven their ability making throws that are more NFL like for a longer time? Russell is the only one who doesnt fit that to a T, and his knock was a very serious and lingering concern about his work ethic and weight.

I certainly hope you werent pointing toward race...cause you know he did like Clausen more than Bradford, so theres more evidence for you. Oh wait, that situation also fits the mold of my previous statement of making tougher throws into NFL style windows. His 1999 top 3 qbs? McNabb, Culpepper, and Akili Smith. Maybe he learned something from backing inexperienced guys or guys in questionable O's (or both in Akili's case.)

There is plenty i think scott is wrong on at times and im certianly not one of the people who take his word as holy and take his side on anything, but this was a bit of an absurd insinuation on your part.





But how many guys who have had really bad performances before became great pros? Idk if thats answerable or proveable and i still like locker but damn that raises some serious questions, just sayin.

I guess he likes more cerebral quarterbacks over the physically more gifted ones, maybe has a tendency towards the more traditional guys. Not to say that I don't think he appreciates guys who can run, but I think he prefers pocket passer-types. Also I've noticed he tends to like seniors more than juniors when it comes to quarterbacks.

The most obvious dichitomy where I think his personal preference showed was Quinn/Russell, he liked Quinn, the physically less gifted but well-groomed quarterback over the big, strong-armed and physically far superior Russell. The irony of course is that both failed miserably, but I do think it was examplary for Scott's tastes in quarterback.


........................oh

my bad, sorry about that ignore my previous post

Halsey
09-23-2010, 10:39 AM
I guess he likes more cerebral quarterbacks over the physically more gifted ones, maybe has a tendency towards the more traditional guys. Not to say that I don't think he appreciates guys who can run, but I think he prefers pocket passer-types. Also I've noticed he tends to like seniors more than juniors when it comes to quarterbacks.

The most obvious dichitomy where I think his personal preference showed was Quinn/Russell, he liked Quinn, the physically less gifted but well-groomed quarterback over the big, strong-armed and physically far superior Russell. The irony of course is that both failed miserably, but I do think it was examplary for Scott's tastes in quarterback.

The NFL prefers QBs who can pass effectively from the pocket. "Pocket-passer types" are who win in the NFL. If a QB can run, great, but he needs to be able to pass from the pocket to be an effective QB in the NFL.

And while Brady may have been a bust, he's at least in the NFL still. Russell had work ethic and attitude questions before he was ever drafted. Most everyone knew the Raiders were making a bad decision to take him #1.

Addict
09-23-2010, 10:39 AM
........................oh

my bad, sorry about that ignore my previous post

already done.

Addict
09-23-2010, 10:42 AM
The NFL prefers QBs who can pass effectively from the pocket. "Pocket-passer types" are who win in the NFL. If a QB can run, great, but he needs to be able to pass from the pocket to be an effective QB in the NFL.

And while Brady may have been a bust, he's at least in the NFL still. Russell had work ethic and attitude questions before he was ever drafted. Most everyone knew the Raiders were making a bad decision to take him #1.

I just stopped taking you seriously.

as for the rest of your post, I don't question that the NFL likes guys who can be pocket passers, but I can only conclude after seeing what gets drafted that the guys who have some extra athletic ability tend to go higher than their passing skills mandate.

Poz51
09-23-2010, 11:06 AM
Or, potentially, pull a Locker and get dominated vs. a great defense. If that happens, they stay on the same level but Luck could really improve his stock vs. Notre Dame in front of a national audience.

All offseason I was saying I didn't think he would come out, but he has been so damn smooth and polished that he just may come out. Who knows.

Another good weekend to check out the top QBs.

I could not agree more, although, unfortunatly Locker does not have a chance this week to redeem himself. However the next 8 games are against quality competition, and we will learn alot about Mr. Locker. If Luck continues with the momentum he is building, personally I hope he comes out, he even looked good in the game in which he didnt look good...

I encourage everyone to actually watch the game and tell me how he really plays outside of the box score.

One thing I think that is over looked regarding Mallett is his ability to stay calm, cool and collected when the game is on the line. It does however appear that his inaccuracy during the game could be part of the reason that those situations arise, or are the result of. Box scores dont win games (see Thurman Thomas in the 1991 Super Bowl), and reading through this thread "how he plays outside the box score" issues kept coming to mind, my big question is will Mallett play well enough to have a chance to shine in the end, or will his inaccuracy and over throws result in him not having a chance to win? Accuracy is a big issue with him, and I would agree having seen him play several times that is clearly an issue. This is a big week for Mallett...

[QUOTE=Scott Wright;2305729]I make my evaluations and sometimes I'm right (Rodgers) and sometimes I'm wrong (Quinn) but at the end of the day I go by what I see.
QUOTE]

At the end of the day that is all anyone can do. Stick to your opinion based on what you see, and all other ways of getting informoation. Ill agree with Shane on the point that there is still plenty of season left, and when everyones body of work is complete then make a definitive opinion, right now its all who's stock is up or down. Locker could regain the form that gave people such high opinions of him from the past, or he could continue to regress and become another Javan Snead, Mallett could improve his accuracy game in and game out, and prove himself to be the next top QB in the draft, or continue to be inaccurate and see his status plummit... I personally appreciate Scott's ability to stand by his opinion, and hope he continues to stay open and respectful to all, wrong or right. Which is why I spend my limited time babling about this site :-D

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 11:32 AM
However to rip Mallett for throwing some bad balls, but still winning the football game on a late drive in the 4th, when compared to Mr. Locker's outing is a joke.

Whether or not Mallett won the game is, for the most part, irrelevant.

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 11:35 AM
As I mentioned on the Podcast, I've never seen this bad a game from a prospect. Ever. Scott's been doing it longer than me, but it was just that bad.

That might be true, but I also don't if I've ever seen a top prospect with such a massive talent differential either. Jake Locker's situation is very unique in a lot of different ways.

619
09-23-2010, 11:43 AM
This Jake Locker v Ryan Mallett v Andrew Luck debate has the potential to go down as one of the most epic in SWDC history. You betchaa I got my popcorn ready! :D

ThePudge
09-23-2010, 11:54 AM
That might be true, but I also don't if I've ever seen a top prospect with such a massive talent differential either. Jake Locker's situation is very unique in a lot of different ways.

Chop away the supporting cast for a minute & just look at the reads/throws that Jake Locker made on Saturday. He wasn't more accurate than Ryan Mallett (vs UGA.) And I've seen games in which Mallett is completely on-point with his accuracy and that can be scary, i.e. South Carolina in 2009.

I just don't see why Washington is a 1-11/2-10 team without Jake Locker but with him they're only a 2-10/3-9 team. Arkansas doesn't compete in the SEC without Ryan Mallett, it's really that simple. Without Andrew Luck Stanford is in no way a Top 25 team, they'd be lucky to qualify for a Bowl game. So why can't an elite dual-threat QB make really any difference for this team?

It's still early, there's still plenty of time for each of these guys. All of them have their biggest college games in front of them.

Addict
09-23-2010, 11:59 AM
This Jake Locker v Ryan Mallett v Andrew Luck debate has the potential to go down as one of the most epic in SWDC history. You betchaa I got my popcorn ready! :D

I'll have to see if it can live up to the Quinn-Russell civil war we had :D

SchizophrenicBatman
09-23-2010, 12:13 PM
Whether or not Mallett won the game is, for the most part, irrelevant.

I seem to recall a very different tune being sung after Matt Ryan's performance against Virginia Tech a few years back. Not necessarily by you, but I remember a lot of guys on TV went to that final drive completely ignoring the rest of the game

With that said, Mallett's game winning drive wasn't nearly as impressive.

619
09-23-2010, 12:13 PM
Whether or not Mallett won the game is, for the most part, irrelevant.

It's how he won the game, Scott. Being clutch has to account for something, right? I mean, there's even a swagger rating in Madden now, and Mallett has lotssss of swagger. :)

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 12:19 PM
It's how he won the game, Scott. Being clutch has to account for something, right?

Absolutely, I certainly didn't mean to discount it totally.

I'm just saying that win / loss percentage as a whole doesn't mean a lot to me.

If Jake Locker had been playing at Alabama or Florida and not Washington the past few years he would've won a ton of games. I definitely like guys with ice water in their veins and confidence is one of Mallett's most impressive traits.

ThePudge
09-23-2010, 12:31 PM
I seem to recall a very different tune being sung after Matt Ryan's performance against Virginia Tech a few years back. Not necessarily by you, but I remember a lot of guys on TV went to that final drive completely ignoring the rest of the game

With that said, Mallett's game winning drive wasn't nearly as impressive.

That UGA game was nothing like the Va Tech - Boston College game.

If you want to see him poised in a big conference game just check the LSU game last season. Like Matt Ryan, Mallett didn't get off to a good start in the first half, but he came on strong in the 2nd, and made consistently huge plays for his team with under 2 minutes to play with the game on the line. After falling behind at the half, the Razorbacks would go on to score on every single drive in the Second Half (24 points total.) Mallett & Co. punched one in with 1:18 to go in order to tie the game on the road; however, they were ultimately beaten on the next drive by a Field Goal. Still, one of the more remarkable displays of talent & poise I've seen from a Quarterback.

On Saturday Ryan Mallett simply stayed cool and won a game he should have won. I don't think he needs an incredible amount of credit there, but it seems as if he really puts it together when it matters most.

Halsey
09-23-2010, 12:41 PM
Locker, Luck, Mallett kind of reminds me of Stafford, Sanchez, Freeman.

I could see them being picked in similar order, with Luck and Locker going top 5-10 and Mallett going in the teens.

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 01:21 PM
Check out this recent Tweet from my buddy Wes Bunting over at the National Football Post:

I talked to a scout the other day that said "I got stuff on Mallett that nobody knows about" there are a lot of concerns on him personally

Not trying to fan the flames but apparently he is hearing the same rumblings that I am.

Razor
09-23-2010, 02:08 PM
Check out this recent Tweet from my buddy Wes Bunting over at the National Football Post:



Not trying to fan the flames but apparently he is hearing the same rumblings that I am.

Or maybe somebody would like Mallett's stock to drop and give his team a chance to get him. I don't care too much about these kind of stories unless he has something to back it up with. Imo Mallett is the best draft eligible quarterback in the country right now with Luck a close second. I think Locker makes too many mentals mistakes and generally trusts his arm or feet too much. Don't get me wrong, he's a good prospect. Just not in the same league as the other two.

Babylon
09-23-2010, 02:15 PM
It's easy to say they're not a decent test when your'e on a message board. Luck has to actually go out onto the field and play. Scouts don't just limit the tape they watch of QBs to games vs elite defenses. Otherwise, there wouldn't be any QBs in the NFL from non-powerhouse programs.

And it's not like Luck is surrounded by top tier talent.

Luck's offensive line is outstanding, RS soph David DeCastro is potentially the next Steve Hutchinson.

Scott Wright
09-23-2010, 02:20 PM
Luck's offensive line is outstanding, RS soph David DeCastro is potentially the next Steve Hutchinson.

Not to mention Luck currently has two wideouts that will play in the NFL, one of the top senior fullbacks in the country, had Gerhart last year, etc.

A Perfect Score
09-23-2010, 02:20 PM
Or maybe somebody would like Mallett's stock to drop and give his team a chance to get him. I don't care too much about these kind of stories unless he has something to back it up with. Imo Mallett is the best draft eligible quarterback in the country right now with Luck a close second. I think Locker makes too many mentals mistakes and generally trusts his arm or feet too much. Don't get me wrong, he's a good prospect. Just not in the same league as the other two.

This made me laugh. There is no way **** like this is happening this far away from the draft. I realize smokescreens are popular in the NFL, but this is ridiculous.

Anyways, I've refrained from contributing too much to the many QB discussion threads around here because it's pretty clear that some people are Locker fans and some are Mallet fans, and all of a sudden everyone is a Luck fan. Personally, I think Locker is the top guy at the moment and you can call it excuses and you can call it whatever you like, but that Huskies team is downright atrocious and it showed vs Nebraska. We've seen time and time again that there is literally only so much one man can do before you have to ask yourself how much of it is his fault, and while a big heap of blame goes towards him, that entire team was just plain bad.

Everything that I could say about Mallet has been said. The guy can hit a pop can with a football from 60 yards away no sweat, and his physical ability is through the roof. For him, its all about how he matures mentally and game wise.

prock
09-23-2010, 02:24 PM
I laughed at that too, APS. First name I thought of when I read that was bce.

soybean
09-25-2010, 03:53 PM
Alright cmon, this guy sucks. He's the next Kyle Boller. I think Boller might be better though.

I rather have a qb with a decent arm and good accuracy then a qb who can throw 80 yard bombs but cant hit an open receiver 20 yards down the field.

I can't wait to see him fail.

FUNBUNCHER
09-25-2010, 05:51 PM
Alright cmon, this guy sucks. He's the next Kyle Boller. I think Boller might be better though.

I rather have a qb with a decent arm and good accuracy then a qb who can throw 80 yard bombs but cant hit an open receiver 20 yards down the field.

I can't wait to see him fail.

That's an astute, in depth, analytical scouting report.

SchizophrenicBatman
09-25-2010, 06:03 PM
actually im pretty sure most of mallett's hype comes from hitting (wide) open receivers 20 yards down field

descendency
09-25-2010, 06:09 PM
Mallett has no accuracy in the medium to long passes.

Werowance
09-25-2010, 06:10 PM
Scott doesn't like Mallett because Mallett sucks.

Brent
09-25-2010, 06:19 PM
clearly, he's the most clutch player in this draft.

D-Unit
09-25-2010, 06:27 PM
Somebody ought a drop a mallet on his head.

OzTitan
09-25-2010, 06:39 PM
Every QB prospect is supposedly "hyped" by some people on these boards. Last year it was "Bradford hype", the year before it was Stafford and Sanchez, Matt Ryan the year before that. I don't think some of you even know what hype means. It's not hype to say a guy is a good QB prospect if that's what he is. If you think hype has been used for one of the QBs being discussed, please tell us specifically what that hype is instead of just mindlessly typing the word because you think it helps your argument.

+1. Someone please give an example of an early picked QB who wasn't "hyped". If a QB prospect can be considered a good QB prospect then that's what he is. People need to come to terms with the fact every good QB prospect will have strong deniers and strong supporters, but neither should nor does form the consensus.

Werowance
09-25-2010, 06:46 PM
I'd probably take Terrelle Pryor, Cam Newton, Christian Ponder and Nick Foles over Ryan Mallett. And that is excluding players who are obviously better in Andrew Luck and Jake Locker.

EvilNixon
09-25-2010, 07:20 PM
Yeah. On the other hand, if you hit on 20 percent of passes in Steve Sarkisian's offense, that easily makes you the top pick in the draft.

No lie....I lol'd

yourfavestoner
09-25-2010, 07:48 PM
Check out this recent Tweet from my buddy Wes Bunting over at the National Football Post:



Not trying to fan the flames but apparently he is hearing the same rumblings that I am.

Wasn't he generally regarded as an alcoholic idiot in his one season at Michigan?

Werowance
09-25-2010, 07:50 PM
Wasn't he generally regarded as an alcoholic idiot in his one season at Michigan?

I had a guy tell me today that Mallett is said to be really distant from his teammates and that he has temper issues.

descendency
09-25-2010, 07:55 PM
The more people hear about Mallett, the more he looks like Ryan Leaf with Kyle Boller's on field play.

FUNBUNCHER
09-25-2010, 08:10 PM
IMO Mallett was pressing in the 2nd half. I still like him as a prospect, but he's a LONG way from being a franchise, pro bowl QB.

His mistakes in the pocket were directly responsible for Arkansas losing that game, IMO, or at least being in a position to compete for the win.

But let's not pretend that Peyton Manning EVER won a game like this when he was at Tennessee.

FUNBUNCHER
09-25-2010, 08:11 PM
I'd probably take Terrelle Pryor, Cam Newton, Christian Ponder and Nick Foles over Ryan Mallett. And that is excluding players who are obviously better in Andrew Luck and Jake Locker.

You talk like you lost money on that game.lol

LonghornsLegend
09-25-2010, 08:13 PM
But let's not pretend that Peyton Manning EVER won a game like this when he was at Tennessee.

QFT. So while I'm sure Mallett will be analyzed to death over this game, Peyton used to be brutal vs Florida every time they played.

Halsey
09-25-2010, 08:31 PM
Not to mention Luck currently has two wideouts that will play in the NFL, one of the top senior fullbacks in the country, had Gerhart last year, etc.

So you're saying Luck is surrounded by "top tier talent"? I'm talking about this year, so Gerhart isn't helping him. I'm just assuming he's not surrounded by talent that is head and shoulders above a team like Notre Dame. By "top tier" I mean Alabama/Ohio State level talent.

wonderbredd24
09-25-2010, 08:36 PM
So you're saying Luck is surrounded by "top tier talent"? I'm talking about this year, so Gerhart isn't helping him. I'm just assuming he's not surrounded by talent that is head and shoulders above a team like Notre Dame. By "top tier" I mean Alabama/Ohio State level talent.
Michael Floyd and Kyle Rudolf are definitely top tier talent.

Unfortunately, the rest of the team outside of Te'o and their nose are awful, so even when Luck has his worst game of the year, Notre Dame still gets spanked by 3 scores at home.

Shiver
09-25-2010, 08:37 PM
IMO Mallett was pressing in the 2nd half. I still like him as a prospect, but he's a LONG way from being a franchise, pro bowl QB.

His mistakes in the pocket were directly responsible for Arkansas losing that game, IMO, or at least being in a position to compete for the win.

But let's not pretend that Peyton Manning EVER won a game like this when he was at Tennessee.

QFT. So while I'm sure Mallett will be analyzed to death over this game, Peyton used to be brutal vs Florida every time they played.


Very good points I think. The fact that he went up and down the field on Alabama is incredibly impressive. He made all the throws, showed good accuracy.. and then those last two drives came into play. That was pretty brutal to watch. He is still the best QB in this class and probably will be a shoe-in #1 pick.

I don't like Locker as a first round QB, let alone better than Mallet. He was supposedly "Tim Tebow" of the West, only without the winning and intangibles.. yeah. I don't care how badly you thought those Mallet interceptions were, and they were, his game against Alabama is a whole other league from Jake Locker's Nebraskalypse.

I wish I could see Luck play, I haven't caught a Stanford game yet but I hear good things so I reserve judgment.

abaddon41_80
09-25-2010, 09:02 PM
I was flipping back and forth between the Ala/Arkansas and Stanford/ND games today and Mallett was much more impressive than Luck to me. Maybe I missed Luck's high points but he locked on the his receivers and held onto the ball way too long whenever I watched, he also did not look like he had much velocity on his passes. Mallett made a few mistakes but he looked much more natural back there and his arm strength is obviously fantastic. Some people question his accuracy but it looks great to me, though his decision making needs a little work.

Halsey
09-25-2010, 09:04 PM
Mallett looks to me, at this point, like needs to do one of two things: Either stay at Arkansas another year and keep working to develop as a QB, or go to an NFL team that does a good job developing QBs. Right now he looks like a guy that would be completely wasted on the wrong team taking him in the first round. I'd feel much more optimistic about the chances of Luck or Locker with any team in the NFL. Put Mallett on a team like Oakland, Buffalo or Cleveland, and I wouldn't expect him to succeed.

Shiver
09-25-2010, 09:06 PM
Yeah, he probably won't, but another year would do wonders for Mallet. Maybe the NFL's CBA negotiations go badly?

BeerBaron
09-25-2010, 09:07 PM
Mallett looks to me, at this point, like needs to do one of two things: Either stay at Arkansas another year and keep working to develop as a QB, or go to an NFL team that does a good job developing QBs. Right now he looks like a guy that would be completely wasted on the wrong team taking him in the first round. I'd fell mush more optimistic about the chances of Luck or Locker with any team in the NFL. Put Mallett on Buffalo or Cleveland, and I wouldn't expect him to succeed.

Not his call. Looking at all the teams who need QBs and are likely to be picking in the range I expect these top 3 to go, I can't say I really see a great situation for any of them. I think Luck has the highest floor, and would be most likely to succeed without ideal conditions, but none of the three are looking to head into great situations. Very, very few top QB prospects ever do.

Halsey
09-25-2010, 09:11 PM
If Mallett enters the 2011 Draft I would not bet on him being a top 10 pick. That's why I think there's a chance he could go to a good situation. Yes, I know he can't choose, which is really why he should probably just play another year at Arkansas.

wonderbredd24
09-25-2010, 09:13 PM
I just don't think Mallett is going to be any different in another year at Arkansas. He is what he is. A big kid with an enormous arm and he's inconsistent. He needs to go to the NFL and play in a real offense.

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 09:14 PM
Think this game was a perfect barometer of where Mallet is right now. He's a big time talent playing in an offense that doesn't really challenge him to make the throws you have to. When Alabama figured out what Arkansas was doing and the easy stuff wasn't there, he struggled.

soybean
09-25-2010, 09:39 PM
Just curious: What are the teams that does a "good job of developing qbs"?

BeerBaron
09-25-2010, 09:48 PM
Just curious: What are the teams that does a "good job of developing qbs"?

I think it's situational. When you develop one QB pretty well, you don't really need to develop others since you have your's for a decade or better. I think Big Ben stepping into Pittsburgh was ideal for him. Don't make mistakes, complete some short stuff and passes off of play action, and let that run game and defense carry the team.

Flacco going into Baltimore was more of the same. Excellent run game and defense....just don't screw up. Build up your confidence and polish your ability, and after a few seasons, you're golden. Although Flacco has looked rough this year....

I think the best situation upcoming will probably be Minnesota or maybe Arizona. In Minny, you inherit a great RB in Peterson and when healthy, a decent group of targets in Rice, Harvin, and Shiancoe.

In Arizona you'd have a terrific group of receivers and two RBs with potential when healthy.

brat316
09-25-2010, 10:07 PM
What if Luck doesn't come out. 2 full seasons playing, 3 season in college. He still has time to stay and play with those WR no need to leave early.

BeerBaron
09-25-2010, 10:11 PM
What if Luck doesn't come out. 2 full seasons playing, 3 season in college. He still has time to stay and play with those WR no need to leave early.

It's a possibility. Prior to the season, I wasn't including him in my mocks because I was sure he wasn't going to come out....I also thought he'd struggle a bit as he adjusted to being the main man on offense instead of Gerhart's sidekick but he's shown to be pretty damn good.

If he stays and it's down to Locker or Mallett as the top QB.....damn. This board is going to to tear itself apart. Already, you have to watch what you say because pointing out negatives in one automatically makes you a hater and a lover of the other one. I imagine there is going to be a lot of typing up angry posts with my eye twitching like crazy before I decide to delete it and not start a fight in my future, lol.

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 10:21 PM
Out of Luck and Mallet, Luck has the most to gain and the better chance of staying. He struggled at times against Notre Dame today despite the final line. Another year of seasoning and he's indisputably the best quarterback and likely the best player in that draft. He's also said that graduating is very important to him. He just really looks like a guy who isn't in a rush to me. Someone said earlier that Mallet really isn't going to gain much going back the Arkansas, and I kind of agree with that. He needed one more year under his belt last year to work on his footwork and his release. Beyond that, this offense isn't preparing him for the NFL.

Halsey
09-25-2010, 10:29 PM
Maybe Arkansas' offense won't help Mallett develop further, but he isn't completely prevented from improving his stock. Going back to school another year might give him a chance to ease questions about his intangibles, as well as improve on his QB skills. I have hard time believing his mechanics and decision making are as good as they could possibly be in college. There are always ways for any QB to work on those areas.

wonderbredd24
09-25-2010, 10:32 PM
Maybe Arkansas' offense won't help Mallett develop further, but he isn't completely prevented from improving his stock. Going back to school another year might give him a chance to ease questions about his intangibles, as well as improve on his QB skills. I have hard time believing his mechanics and decision making are as good as they could possibly be in college. There are always ways for any QB to work on those areas.
If he has had an eye on the NFL since last year and coaches feel it has hurt him his dedication to this team, it is unlikely that is going to get better. If anything, it stands to reason he's going to be less receptive to coaching and phase them out. Plus, it's natural for a kid with the talents Mallett has to naturally think he's outgrown college coaching.

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 10:33 PM
It does't seem like he would even consider going back. Just has that feel about him in interviews and such. I agree that he could help build up his stock by going back, but it's also very early into this season. He has a lot of easy games left on the schedule, and while that might not prove much, it will help him get back on track a bit stock wise.

brat316
09-25-2010, 10:43 PM
Also give another year to nit pick and push him further down he board.

Xonraider
09-25-2010, 10:53 PM
Ryan Mallett IS Drew Bledsoe, HE IS JUST FOOLING EVERYONE

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 10:54 PM
Ryan Mallett IS Drew Bledsoe, HE IS JUST FOOLING EVERYONE

Haha, that's the comp I've been throwing out for him physically for awhile now.

jrdrylie
09-25-2010, 11:46 PM
Wasn't he generally regarded as an alcoholic idiot in his one season at Michigan?

I used to live in the town that Mallett went to high school in and from what I heard, alcohol would be the least of the team's worry. He may enjoy some of the same things as Matt Jones.

yourfavestoner
09-25-2010, 11:48 PM
Haha, that's the comp I've been throwing out for him physically for awhile now.

Yup, that's the comparison I've been using for him as well.

I used to live in the town that Mallett went to high school in and from what I heard, alcohol would be the least of the team's worry. He may enjoy some of the same things as Matt Jones.

Hm. He's gonna be an intriguing one to watch.

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 11:49 PM
There's a whole lot of that out in the air. Really, really concerning to hear it not only about a guy as young as he is, but multiple times like this.

yourfavestoner
09-25-2010, 11:53 PM
There's a whole lot of that out in the air. Really, really concerning to hear it not only about a guy as young as he is, but multiple times like this.

Yeah, that's not exactly a problem that gets cured with lots of money, either.

ElectricEye
09-25-2010, 11:54 PM
Nope, not at all. You don't want to see that out of ANY player, but with a quarterback it's almost inexcusable. It's rumors and there's nothing confirmed. We do live in a country where you're innocent until proven guilty, but we've heard this so much that you kind of have to wonder.

yourfavestoner
09-25-2010, 11:59 PM
Nope, not at all. You don't want to see that out of ANY player, but with a quarterback it's almost inexcusable. It's rumors and there's nothing confirmed. We do live in a country where you're innocent until proven guilty, but we've heard this so much that you kind of have to wonder.

"If people have been calling you a crackhead for ten years, well, *****, you probably a ****** crackhead"
-Dave Chappelle

Hollywood
09-26-2010, 01:59 AM
What % of NFL players do you people think do coke? What % of NFL Qbs do you think have ever done coke? If the gun is at my head I'd bet on it being over 50% for both questions. This is so ******* dumb. If the kid can throw like he does...it doesn't really matter what he does as a 19 year old in Michigan. Hate stupid 'rumors' like these.

jrdrylie
09-26-2010, 02:04 AM
What % of NFL players do you people think do coke? What % of NFL Qbs do you think have ever done coke? If the gun is at my head I'd bet on it being over 50% for both questions. This is so ******* dumb. If the kid can throw like he does...it doesn't really matter what he does as a 19 year old in Michigan. Hate stupid 'rumors' like these.

You think 50% of NFL players have tried coke? That is ridiculous. This isn't weed we are talking about. And it isn't dumb when your first round pick gets suspended for four games.

Werowance
09-26-2010, 02:06 AM
What % of NFL players do you people think do coke? What % of NFL Qbs do you think have ever done coke? If the gun is at my head I'd bet on it being over 50% for both questions. This is so ******* dumb. If the kid can throw like he does...it doesn't really matter what he does as a 19 year old in Michigan. Hate stupid 'rumors' like these.

Seriously? You think guys like Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers, Jay Cutler, Aaron Rodgers, Alex Smith, Donovan McNabb, Tony Romo, Matt Schaub, Kyle Orton, Carson Palmer, Sam Bradford, Matt Hasselbeck, Joe Flacco etc. etc. have done coke? LOL keep dreaming.

And throw the ball like he does? You mean when he has zero touch, makes awful decisions, plays with no precision, hits wide open receivers, has awful footwork and can't even handle a little bit of pressure? Mallett is awful.

619
09-26-2010, 02:09 AM
The QB situation seems murkier now than it did 24 hours ago. Andrew Luck by default, really. Not that my opinion would've changed even if he had a Jake Locker-esque meltdown this week; he's that far ahead of the pack as it stands. Still, no one is playing themselves into the "can't-miss" category of NFL franchise signal callers.

619
09-26-2010, 02:11 AM
What % of NFL players do you people think do coke? What % of NFL Qbs do you think have ever done coke? If the gun is at my head I'd bet on it being over 50% for both questions. This is so ******* dumb. If the kid can throw like he does...it doesn't really matter what he does as a 19 year old in Michigan. Hate stupid 'rumors' like these.

Who are you, Rick Ross?

San Diego Chicken
09-26-2010, 04:18 AM
I think this is getting to be a bit much. Guy has a good game and he's a superstar, he has a sub par game and he's a bum. Best to just chillax and evaluate the whole body of work at the end of the year for each QB instead of rushing to conclusions after every single game.

Day One Pick
09-26-2010, 04:50 AM
Seriously? You think guys like Peyton Manning, Eli Manning, Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Philip Rivers, Jay Cutler, Aaron Rodgers, Alex Smith, Donovan McNabb, Tony Romo, Matt Schaub, Kyle Orton, Carson Palmer, Sam Bradford, Matt Hasselbeck, Joe Flacco etc. etc. have done coke? LOL keep dreaming.

And throw the ball like he does? You mean when he has zero touch, makes awful decisions, plays with no precision, hits wide open receivers, has awful footwork and can't even handle a little bit of pressure? Mallett is awful.

Dan Marino did. It was what caused him to fall to the 27th pick.

Werowance
09-26-2010, 05:14 AM
Dan Marino did. It was what caused him to fall to the 27th pick.

Great, last time I checked Dan Marino is not 50% of the QBs in the NFL... I'd reckon that about 97% of quarterbacks haven't tried cocaine.

FUNBUNCHER
09-26-2010, 06:36 AM
There's a whole lot of that out in the air. Really, really concerning to hear it not only about a guy as young as he is, but multiple times like this.

Are you guys talking 'youthful indiscretion', or someone who potentially has a budding 'habit'??

After the Jamarcus Russell fiasco, any potential 'red flag' I could see knocking Mallett to the bottom of the 1st round, if not lower.

EDIT: Thing is, you can't look at someone and automatically discern if they've used coke. Housewives, reverends, bankers and bikers all are potential cokeheads.

I just don't like putting something like that on a prospect until I have more to go on.

Addict
09-26-2010, 06:36 AM
Great, last time I checked Dan Marino is not 50% of the QBs in the NFL... I'd reckon that about 97% of quarterbacks haven't tried cocaine.

really? Dude you need to learn how the world works, and I'm not talking about plate tectonics! I'll bet you more than half of all high-profile pro athletes use of have used coke.

Addict
09-26-2010, 07:37 AM
no, this is nfldc: guy has a great game, half the board will find the tiny flaws in what he did to say he still sucks. guy has a bad game, and anyone who thinks he's good is a ******* idiot.

unless, of course, he's a notre dame quarterback. then you can just remove any rational reasons for thinking he is/isn't good.

in either case, let's not assume that more than 1% of this board has any idea how to rationally evaluate any college player.

... we're still cool, right?

Addict
09-26-2010, 08:17 AM
well, yeah.

unless you still like brady quinn for any reason other than a scotty-and-ray-rice-like fascination with his biceps.

Nah I got over quinn when he got his chance and still didn't do anything. Same with Leinart.

Day One Pick
09-26-2010, 08:55 AM
really? Dude you need to learn how the world works, and I'm not talking about plate tectonics! I'll bet you more than half of all high-profile pro athletes use of have used coke.

Yeah, I'm with you. I'm not rich and I've been at a ton of parties where coke was present. I'm not talking parties full of low lifes or junkies either. I'm talking about parties with normal, moderatly successful people. Just immagine how much coke is at a high dollar party. Athletes are always at parties held by other rich and famous people. I'm certain many NFL QB's have atleast tried it. Coke, like any other drug is taboo until you see it with your own eyes and try it. Then it's not such a big deal.

Day One Pick
09-26-2010, 09:04 AM
Everyone seems to be looking for this perfect, can't miss QB prospect. Well, there isn't one and really never is. When you evaluate a college QB you don't look for the guy with the least flaws, you look for the guys who have the abilities that can't be coached. You can't coach arm strength or accuracy (maybe tweak and improve slightly through mechanics), you either wake up in the morning with an NFL arm or you don't. Mallett and Locker both have the intangibles. I can almost guarantee there will be NFL teams who have Luck first on their board, some teams will have Mallett first on their board, and some will have Locker first on their board. This is something people here lose sight of, the fact that there are 32 teams with varying opinions. There never has and never will be a concensus or correct ranking of these prospects.

Addict
09-26-2010, 09:42 AM
Yeah, I'm with you. I'm not rich and I've been at a ton of parties where coke was present. I'm not talking parties full of low lifes or junkies either. I'm talking about parties with normal, moderatly successful people. Just immagine how much coke is at a high dollar party. Athletes are always at parties held by other rich and famous people. I'm certain many NFL QB's have atleast tried it. Coke, like any other drug is taboo until you see it with your own eyes and try it. Then it's not such a big deal.

exactly, I'm not saying athletes are junkies, but they are young, popular and wealthy, I don't think it's such a stretch to assume the overwhelming majority has at some point at least tried cocaine, save the occasional Tim Tebow.

BeerBaron
09-26-2010, 09:50 AM
Everyone seems to be looking for this perfect, can't miss QB prospect. Well, there isn't one and really never is. When you evaluate a college QB you don't look for the guy with the least flaws, you look for the guys who have the abilities that can't be coached. You can't coach arm strength or accuracy (maybe tweak and improve slightly through mechanics), you either wake up in the morning with an NFL arm or you don't. Mallett and Locker both have the intangibles. I can almost guarantee there will be NFL teams who have Luck first on their board, some teams will have Mallett first on their board, and some will have Locker first on their board. This is something people here lose sight of, the fact that there are 32 teams with varying opinions. There never has and never will be a concensus or correct ranking of these prospects.

Unless you count Andrew Luck. ;)

Day One Pick
09-26-2010, 10:16 AM
Even Luck has his question marks. They for the most part differ from the question marks Locker and Mallett have, but they are there. He's less experienced, hasn't played in many "big" games, and hasn't seen alot of great or complex defenses. I also have to question how much of his success is due to Harbaugh managing him and putting him in favorable positions. He plays in a pro style offense with spread option types of reads. I'm not one who puts a lot of stock into how a college QB can read a defense because when they are in the NFL they get stripped of all that knowledge and are taught the NFL way. It just makes me question how much stock can be put into their stats. I think a quarterbacks stats are more relevant in evaluating a prospect than most other positions, but they still have to be viewed objectively. At the end of the day, the prospect who best shows he can be a leader of men will be the first selected out of these 3.

Scott Wright
09-26-2010, 10:59 AM
I wrote a 1,000 word blog entry on Mallett that will run on Monday so watch out for that.

SchizophrenicBatman
09-26-2010, 04:23 PM
im not sure if theres such a thing as a pro style offense with pro reads anymore

619
09-26-2010, 04:28 PM
im not sure if theres such a thing as a pro style offense with pro reads anymore

This is exactly it. People are just nitpicking now.

ElectricEye
09-26-2010, 05:08 PM
I think this is getting to be a bit much. Guy has a good game and he's a superstar, he has a sub par game and he's a bum. Best to just chillax and evaluate the whole body of work at the end of the year for each QB instead of rushing to conclusions after every single game.

Nobody called him a bum. Saying negative things about him is NOT calling him a bum. Believe I was the most vocal person criticizing him last night and I still said he would be a first round pick. I agree completely that we should evaluate his body of work at the end of the year, but there's nothing wrong with taking some insight from him struggling against a defense with NFL talent.

SchizophrenicBatman
09-26-2010, 06:23 PM
This is exactly it. People are just nitpicking now.

i mean i think it's fair to say that jim harbaugh is a great coach and makes his players look good

in fact if I were ranking NFL HC prospects he might be #1 over whoever the Coordinator flavor of the week is, despite all the problems college coaches have had recently

but I don't think you're going to get much better when it comes to pro style systems. Jimmy Clausen played for former NFL OC Charlie Weis and was called "pro ready" but when I look up ND games I see him in shotgun and/or throwing >3 yard passes 80% of the time

Luck has had to make some difficult down field throws into coverage this year. In fact, I'd actually like to see him go through his reads a bit more and find an easier, more open pass. I'm not saying that he doesn't go through progressions, but rather that he is so good that he'll throw to his first or second read when a less talented QB would consider a guy covered. The first pick against ND was an example of this imo

TACKLE
09-26-2010, 09:36 PM
This is exactly it. People are just nitpicking now.

Is it nitpicking if I'm concerned about his inconsistent accuracy?

lencoo12
09-26-2010, 10:33 PM
Itt; box scores.

I don't think they are being bias as much as they are simply pointing out the facts and being opinionated.

Neither Scott or Shane are die hard Arkansas Razorback fans. So I don't see how they are "bias".
__________________
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ChiFan24
09-27-2010, 04:01 AM
I've decided that whichever 6-10 NFC West team gets stuck with the 21st pick should take Mallett or Locker, and a team like the Vikings should take the other. And gun to my head, I watched the entire Alabama game, I still think I'd take Mallett before Locker. Some of the throws he made...there's a list of 5 guys in the NFL, maybe, that can consistently make those throws. He's full of confidence, not afraid to stand in the pocket and I like the way he attacks the field, kind of over the top of the defense with the way he delivers the ball to his receivers, dropping it right into their hands (this is literally the only aspect of him that reminds me of Peyton Manning). I think there's way more there to work with than there was with Jamarcus for example. Of course, there are way too many flaws for him to get picked top 10. And if there's good inside info that he's basically semi-********, or uncoachable or whatever, then I retract everything I just said and wouldn't touch him. But it doesn't seem that severe from what I can see.

Locker...you can see the upside, but he's so much harder for me to project to the NFL than Mallett because of the supporting cast and I question how his athleticism translates to the NFL (he makes a TON of plays with his feet that wouldn't happen in the NFL). The uncertainty alone would take him out of top ten consideration for me. And that's before I look at the tape and see him staring down receivers and failing to look off safeties, basic stuff that I want out of a guy that supposedly knows how to run a pro style offense. Again though, upside considered, I'd take him if I was the Vikings or something picking early 20's.

Also, someone's gonna need to explain Luck to me, because I would love to get on board with those that think he's the top pick. I've seen a decent amount of him, not a whole lot, and I always feel like I'm watching another Jim Harbaugh. Which isn't a bad thing, but I don't know about a top 5 pick. When I see him he doesn't consistently make difficult throws the way Mallett can, he doesn't have jaw dropping arm strength or accuracy (not that he doesn't have plenty of both), and he's not that athletic. He's smart, runs a pro style offense, is calm in the pocket, and makes good decisions. And that's great, he's probably an NFL starter, but I don't know about top 5 pick. Am I wrong about his tools? Is the arm-strength up there with the Stafford's and Carson Palmer's and I'm just missing it? Seriously, someone explain the appeal, so I can watch for it the next time I see him.

Werowance
09-27-2010, 04:27 AM
I've decided that whichever 6-10 NFC West team gets stuck with the 21st pick should take Mallett or Locker, and a team like the Vikings should take the other. And gun to my head, I watched the entire Alabama game, I still think I'd take Mallett before Locker. Some of the throws he made...there's a list of 5 guys in the NFL, maybe, that can consistently make those throws. He's full of confidence, not afraid to stand in the pocket and I like the way he attacks the field, kind of over the top of the defense with the way he delivers the ball to his receivers, dropping it right into their hands (this is literally the only aspect of him that reminds me of Peyton Manning). I think there's way more there to work with than there was with Jamarcus for example. Of course, there are way too many flaws for him to get picked top 10. And if there's good inside info that he's basically semi-********, or uncoachable or whatever, then I retract everything I just said and wouldn't touch him. But it doesn't seem that severe from what I can see.

This guy is a worse prospect than Jamarcus Russell by far, Russell could actually move and was mobile before he turned into a 300 pound whale, Mallett has lead shoes or something, he can't move in the pocket, he can't extend plays and he is just a statue in the pocket. Now that would be much easier to forgive if Mallett could take something off his throws and make half accurate throws in the short and intermediate range to slow down the blitz but he can't. Plus Mallett is a terrible terrible decision maker, when he is in the open field and Petrino's scheme gives him wide open receivers he does fine but when the windows get smaller in the red-zone Mallett makes terrible decisions and he can't make accurate throws into those windows. Plus what did the guy even show on Saturday? Aside from a great pitch and catch from Mallett to Childs I saw hardly, if any NFL caliber throws. Mallett is hitting wide open receivers in Petrino's scheme, the same scheme that made Brian Brohm look great and look how he transitioned to the NFL. Plus his fundamentals are garbage. Any team that drafts Mallett high is going to have a massive bust on their hands, a bigger bust than Russell if he goes #1, he is that bad. He is big and can throw far, that is all he brings to the table, how did that work out for Jamarcus Russell? I see nothing from Mallett in the passing game that I didn't see in Kyle Boller, only Kyle Boller could actually move. Plus when you account for all this off the field stuff that is going to start flooding out during the draft process, Mallett is no good at all.

Shiver
09-27-2010, 04:49 AM
lol.. did he sleep with your sister and mother in a gang-bang or something? kill your dog?

Addict
09-27-2010, 05:18 AM
lol.. did he sleep with your sister and mother in a gang-bang or something? kill your dog?

love makes blind, my good man. All that is not the object of oneīs affection must be diabolical and a recipient of undue praise.

Scott Wright
09-27-2010, 06:08 AM
Just posted a new blog entry dedicated to Mallett:

http://draftcountdown.com/draft-blog/2010/09/why-ryan-mallett-is-overrated/

bruschis4all
09-27-2010, 07:23 AM
I think the on-field comparision is Bledsoe. Drew came from a very good family. And, is a good guy off of the field. So, there weren't any character questions about him. Some people had Mirer rated ahead of him. Don't want to credit the wrong person. I know I've heard Parcells say it. Hard to improve on accuracy. Either the qb has it. Or, he doesn't.

I can also see a little in R.Mallett in guys who flopped too. D.McGwire, T.Couch, Druckenmiller.

619
09-27-2010, 07:49 AM
Is it nitpicking if I'm concerned about his inconsistent accuracy?

I was referring to Luck in response to what Day One Pick said of him playing in a pro style offense with spread option type of reads. You have very much reason to be concerned with Mallett's accuracy - it is a real issue that is not going to go away.

Poz51
09-27-2010, 07:55 AM
Just posted a new blog entry dedicated to Mallett:


Scott, I thought that was a spot on assessment based on the last two games (college career as well) in which I focused on watching him and his fundamentals. Comparing Mallett to Big Ben is laughable, as Ben did the same things at Miami (OH) as he is doing in the pros (watch his last bowl game), and was much more consistant and accurate at this point in his college career. I thought you forgot to mention that he essentially handed the game to Alabama, failing to deliver a knock out blow to the #1 team in the country, and would have really summed up the performance this week, against a young secondary that he should have been able to exploit. I could not agree more, Mallett has plenty to work on, thanks for the good read.

Werowance
09-27-2010, 07:55 AM
it's great that you give away that you've never actually seen him play in one of the first sentences. it makes it much easier when i already know that i shouldn't bother reading another word you say.

Its great that you've never actually seen him play, it makes it much easier when I already know that I shouldn't bother reading another word you say. Ryan Mallett can move in the pocket and extend plays? Umm what QB are you watching?

ElectricEye
09-27-2010, 08:19 AM
Mallet has had much better footwork this year than he had last year. At times in the past, he got heavy footed, so that perception is still out there. I'm not entirely sure that it's not going to be an issue in the NFL where the throws are down the field more than he is used to and he has less time to sit back. I wouldn't say it's as big of a deal as it was last year, but it's something to still watch in my opinion.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 08:26 AM
Its great that you've never actually seen him play, it makes it much easier when I already know that I shouldn't bother reading another word you say. Ryan Mallett can move in the pocket and extend plays? Umm what QB are you watching?

He may not be that fast but Mallett moves around in the pocket very well every time I watch him. Luck tucks the ball and scampers around every time pressure gets close to him, at least every time I watch him.

Addict
09-27-2010, 08:31 AM
he avoided a sack vs. alabama that clearly stands out in my mind. footwork bought him enough time to get a completion. sadly, no one has uploaded that play to youtube. then again, you could just youtube his name, click on the first highlight video you see, and see plenty of movement mixed in with standard throws from the pocket.

but it was cute how you tried to turn that around. still bitter that everyone knows exactly who you used to be?

I'm sorry I totally blanked... who was he?

AntoinCD
09-27-2010, 08:40 AM
he avoided a sack vs. alabama that clearly stands out in my mind. footwork bought him enough time to get a completion. sadly, no one has uploaded that play to youtube. then again, you could just youtube his name, click on the first highlight video you see, and see plenty of movement mixed in with standard throws from the pocket.

but it was cute how you tried to turn that around. still bitter that everyone knows exactly who you used to be?

I think that was the time when there was a free rusher coming from his left and he had to escape to his right and hit his WR on a crossing pattern. The commentators at the time even remarked that it showed his "escapability"

Sniper
09-27-2010, 08:50 AM
I'm sorry I totally blanked... who was he?

RidingKevinKolbsDick, a.k.a Thumper.

FUNBUNCHER
09-27-2010, 09:08 AM
For a 6'6 QB, Mallett moves well enough in the pocket.

Andrew Walter was a big stiff. Mallett is not.

wonderbredd24
09-27-2010, 09:14 AM
For a 6'6 QB, Mallett moves well enough in the pocket.

Andrew Walter was a big stiff. Mallett is not.
I think he's closer to 6'7", but it doesn't matter. He has decent enough feet.

The only thing that concerns me about his height is just how big of a target he is and how big of a target his midsection is against a league with so many 6'1" pass rushers

ElectricEye
09-27-2010, 09:18 AM
I think he's closer to 6'7", but it doesn't matter. He has decent enough feet.

The only thing that concerns me about his height is just how big of a target he is and how big of a target his midsection is against a league with so many 6'1" pass rushers

Yeah, whatever he did in the offseason worked to the end that he's a lot quicker this year.

I do agree with the size of the target thing though. That's not something you can put on a scouting report, but there is a whole lot of him to hit. Let's not pretend his size doesn't work in his favor though.

Ballbright
09-27-2010, 09:52 AM
Its great that you've never actually seen him play, it makes it much easier when I already know that I shouldn't bother reading another word you say. Ryan Mallett can move in the pocket and extend plays? Umm what QB are you watching?

Son, seriously, I don't know what you have against the guy, but its pretty obvious you have no business evaluating QB play.

Mallett's not Michael Vick (or even Ben Roethlisberger), but he's certainly more than proven that the "statue in the pocket" stuff is nonsense.

He has a few issues, namely with touch, and sloppy footwork, but any QB coach worth their salt can coach that out of him at the next level.

bigbluedefense
09-27-2010, 09:59 AM
I don't like him either. I wouldn't touch Ryan Mallet.

He is inaccurate, he has slow cement like feet, bad mechanics, terrible footwork, and a wind up.

He reminds me of poor man's Drew Bledsoe.

He has an arm. That's it. I'm staying away.

I'm far from done with my evaluation of him, but as of right now, I'm off the bandwagon.

Ballbright
09-27-2010, 10:14 AM
Just posted a new blog entry dedicated to Mallett:

http://draftcountdown.com/draft-blog/2010/09/why-ryan-mallett-is-overrated/

I've got to be honest, I initially didn't agree with the OP; but this article lends him a lot of credibility.

Poorly fleshed out points, a lot anecdotal evidence based solely on rumor, and points on negatives that could very easily be applied to the quarterbacks you have ranked higher made that article read like a guy who was writing an article more to justify his opinion, than someone who was objectively trying to present information.

Mallett isn't the top QB on my board, but every source I have (I have worked in the business, and write for a national draft publication) tells me Luck isn't going to declare this season.

I get that you have an opinion that Locker is the better prospect, but it's simply that, your opinion. Locker has a 9-22 career record as a starter... In terms of people who talk about "winners" he's the anti-Tebow. Now, you can go and make points all day about the talent around him, etc...but at the end of the day, he has proven time and again that he lacks the ability to put a team on his shoulders, and win games.

The thing that has/had most people excited about Locker as a prospect were his quick adaptation to the pro scheme installed by Sarkasian, and his 4.3 speed. Well, he's regressed this season, staring down receivers, making poor reads, and generally looking overwhelmed against BYU and Nebraska....and let's not forget how little speed actually matters for a QB at the NFL level.

I'm not saying one is better that the other at this point, but I think you are showing a blatant lack of objectivity, as all I see are redundant criticisms of Mallett's game and anecdotal hints (likely referencing the cocaine rumors of which not one single eye witness or positive drug test has been produced, and believe me I've looked into it) of off field behavior.

I came into this thread expect to read a bitter crackpot's rants, and to some extent got that, I didn't expect him to have a basis in fact, and the more replies and "articles" I read that more I'm finding him to have at least one legitimate gripe.

Addict
09-27-2010, 10:16 AM
RidingKevinKolbsDick, a.k.a Thumper.


.... now that you mention it that does explain it.

AntoinCD
09-27-2010, 10:29 AM
I've got to be honest, I initially didn't agree with the OP; but this article lends him a lot of credibility.

Poorly fleshed out points, a lot anecdotal evidence based solely on rumor, and points on negatives that could very easily be applied to the quarterbacks you have ranked higher made that article read like a guy who was writing an article more to justify his opinion, than someone who was objectively trying to present information.

Mallett isn't the top QB on my board, but every source I have (I have worked in the business, and write for a national draft publication) tells me Luck isn't going to declare this season.

I get that you have an opinion that Locker is the better prospect, but it's simply that, your opinion. Locker has a 9-22 career record as a starter... In terms of people who talk about "winners" he's the anti-Tebow. Now, you can go and make points all day about the talent around him, etc...but at the end of the day, he has proven time and again that he lacks the ability to put a team on his shoulders, and win games.

The thing that has/had most people excited about Locker as a prospect were his quick adaptation to the pro scheme installed by Sarkasian, and his 4.3 speed. Well, he's regressed this season, staring down receivers, making poor reads, and generally looking overwhelmed against BYU and Nebraska....and let's not forget how little speed actually matters for a QB at the NFL level.

I'm not saying one is better that the other at this point, but I think you are showing a blatant lack of objectivity, as all I see are redundant criticisms of Mallett's game and anecdotal hints (likely referencing the cocaine rumors of which not one single eye witness or positive drug test has been produced, and believe me I've looked into it) of off field behavior.

I came into this thread expect to read a bitter crackpot's rants, and to some extent got that, I didn't expect him to have a basis in fact, and the more replies and "articles" I read that more I'm finding him to have at least one legitimate gripe.

The thing with the article that was posted though was it was titled "Why Ryan Mallett is overrated" not "Why Ryan Mallett is overrated and worse than Jake Locker and Andrew Luck and why I hate him".

Why Ryan Mallett is overrated?

He plays in a system which in general is QB friendly and helps pad his stats.
His accuracy is not good enough for a top ranked prospect
He has horrible touch on his short to intermediate passes
He has some off the field concerns

For people who are saying he will be the number one pick, this article is saying why he shouldn't be because obviously Scott doesn't agree with those sentiments. Therefore it appears he was simply stating why he thinks Mallett is overrated.

Halsey
09-27-2010, 10:44 AM
Some people will overreact to Mallett's flaws. Is he an elite QB prospect worth a top 15 pick? He doesn't look like it right now, but at some point in the Draft he'd be worth a gamble.

Babylon
09-27-2010, 11:07 AM
Want to be consistant with trying to evaluate these QBs. Had his defense not been out on their feet at the end of the game and had his receivers not dropped 5 catchable balls Arkansas wins and Mallett looks a whole lot better.

Scott Wright
09-27-2010, 11:20 AM
Want to be consistant with trying to evaluate these QBs. Had his defense not been out on their feet at the end of the game and had his receivers not dropped 5 catchable balls Arkansas wins and Mallett looks a whole lot better.

You're right. You have to look at the total picture.

Still, Mallett looked just as bad in the win against Georgia as he did in the loss against Alabama.

Ballbright
09-27-2010, 12:03 PM
You're right. You have to look at the total picture.

Still, Mallett looked just as bad in the win against Georgia as he did in the loss against Alabama.

See, again... Here you go... There are points where Mallett was inaccurate in both games, there were also points where he was spot on.

If you want to be fair (and honest) Locker has had just as many head scratching moments as Mallett this season. The difference is simply the spotlight Mallet plays under in the SEC being more widely viewed.

Mallett really hasn't throw that many "bad passes" this season. You're over-blowing it. I just finished re-watching both the Georgia and Alabama games, and while I'm noticing the the errors Mallett makes are usually of the glaring variety, they aren't nearly as frequent as supposed. Go back and look at the tape...

I'm sitting here laughing at how this thread has turned me of all people into a Mallett apologist.

SeanTaylorRIP
09-27-2010, 12:34 PM
I’m sure it’s been said 100 times before, but Mallet really has no touch on his pass. Everything is one speed, a Strasburg fast ball. It definitely helps him make some throws like an 18 yard out or a quick slant but it’s also the reason why he’s so damn inaccurate. He has trouble dropping in pretty easy touch passes, and his ball can be pretty damn hard to catch as a receiver. I don’t know how many times he’s made what should be easy completions much harder with his inability to just lay it in easy. Until he finds more pace on his throws he’ll be nothing more than a gun slinging QB with a low completion percentage and plenty of highs and lows.

619
09-27-2010, 12:36 PM
Iím sure itís been said 100 times before, but Mallet really has no touch on his pass. Everything is one speed, a Strasburg fast ball. It definitely helps him make some throws like an 18 yard out or a quick slant but itís also the reason why heís so damn inaccurate. He has trouble dropping in pretty easy touch passes, and his ball can be pretty damn hard to catch as a receiver. I donít know how many times heís made what should be easy completions much harder with his inability to just lay it in easy. Until he finds more pace on his throws heíll be nothing more than a gun slinging QB with a low completion percentage and plenty of highs and lows.

Shades of Russell based on that depiction alone.

RealityCheck
09-27-2010, 12:38 PM
The real thing is... Mallett could be Flacco and Mallett could be JaMarcus, only time will tell.

SeanTaylorRIP
09-27-2010, 12:44 PM
Don't really see the Flacco comparison other than the height and Arm strength. Flacco is a guy who actually can make every necessary throw, his problem is poor pocket prescense and flailing under pressure. Mallet doesn't really have a huge problem in the pocket, he's pretty mobile and has a quick draw, his problems are completely different. You don't worry about Flacco making any throw with any pace, he can make all the throws his problem is if he can make them with pressure, which is what he struggles with now.

bigbluedefense
09-27-2010, 12:47 PM
Flacco has quick feet. Whenever I see Mallett drop back, it looks like he has cement blocks stuck to his.

His feet bother me a lot. I just see him getting killed in the NFL. Whenever I evaluate prospects, I always look at their feet first. And Mallet's feet just don't look good at all to me.

Hurricanes25
09-27-2010, 12:51 PM
His feet bother me a lot. I just see him getting killed in the NFL. Whenever I evaluate prospects, I always look at their feet first. And Mallet's feet just don't look good at all to me.

Now I see where some of your Sanchez love comes from.

bigbluedefense
09-27-2010, 12:55 PM
Now I see where some of your Sanchez love comes from.

That is actually the main reason why I loved Sanchez so much coming out. His footwork was incredible.

And his accuracy. He just had it. I know he was and still is green, but he has it.

Sniper
09-27-2010, 12:58 PM
That is actually the main reason why I loved Sanchez so much coming out. His footwork was incredible.

And his accuracy. He just had it. I know he was and still is green, but he has it.

And his ravishing good looks and dazzling smile. Don't lie.

bigbluedefense
09-27-2010, 12:58 PM
And his ravishing good looks and dazzling smile. Don't lie.

I like his birth marks.

Scotty D
09-27-2010, 01:41 PM
Flacco has quick feet. Whenever I see Mallett drop back, it looks like he has cement blocks stuck to his.

His feet bother me a lot. I just see him getting killed in the NFL. Whenever I evaluate prospects, I always look at their feet first. And Mallet's feet just don't look good at all to me.

I think Mallett has good pocket presence. He isn't going to have any long runs but he can move around pressure.

Babylon
09-27-2010, 01:56 PM
^
I think he moves well enough, at least on the Rivers/Manning level.

I'd also add to a previous post about his "fastballs", pro receivers for the most part can catch the fastballs.

dregolll
09-27-2010, 01:58 PM
It's quite clear that no matter what Malletts does, Scott will not like him. I have come to terms with that notion. I think Scott is just "reaching" for bogus commentary when it comes to Mallett. The guy was carving up a Nick Saban defense, marching up and down the field on the #1 team and the country and according to Scott it doesn't account for anything. Now, lets go back one week ago, Jake Elway completes "four" passes but everything is blamed on his team. Listen Scott, you need to stop being so one-sided in your assessment. It's becoming so obvious, it's as almost if you have some type of personal vendetta against Mallett. You talked about him being the #1 overall pick in 2012 if you can fix his issues that from your perspective make him a second round prospect in 2011.
I think your issue with him stems from you knowing that he will be drafted ahead of the so called best QB prospect in the past 12 years and you seem to have a problem with that. You talk about him not have difficult throws to make but last I check a guy name Sam Bradford made some pretty easy throws but if I can recall you were not bashing him for it. Lets be honest, all QB prospects are gonna display some type of inconsistencies, but that were the coaching on the next level will come in to play.
It seems as though you are going to do everything in your power to try to convince people on this site that Jake Locker is some type of "QB Messiah" by discrediting and pulling down one prospect and that certainly is far from the case. Look, Locker is a nice prospect, nothing more and defitinely not what you are trying to sell to this board. It may work with some people because they probably hinge on to your every word, but for the people who actually watch football and know the game know that Locker is certainly not what you are making him out to be.

prock
09-27-2010, 02:07 PM
I agree with Ballbright here. I agree with the criticisms of Mallet. He has accuracy issues, etc etc etc. But Locker has looked worse this year than Mallet has. I don't think Scott is using the same criteria to judge Locker, whether he is aware of it or not.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 02:13 PM
I'd like to reiterate that I think Mallett's supposed "accuracy" issues are more about decision making than accuracy. He throws one of the most accurate balls in the college game today, imo

FuzzyGopher
09-27-2010, 02:27 PM
I'd like to reiterate that I think Mallett's supposed "accuracy" issues are more about decision making than accuracy. He throws one of the most accurate balls in the college game today, imo

There is more to accuracy than just a complete pass or an incomplete pass. Ball placement is huge, if you hit a receiver in stride he can run after the catch. If the receiver is having to turn around to catch balls or having to jump or catch low passes it's not a good thing.

Babylon
09-27-2010, 02:34 PM
I'd like to reiterate that I think Mallett's supposed "accuracy" issues are more about decision making than accuracy. He throws one of the most accurate balls in the college game today, imo

I think Mallett throws a pretty accurate ball. Someone brought up JaMarcus Russell but i thought he was continuously bailed out by LSU reveivers.

Andrew Luck was even guilty himself of putting a lot of balls either too high or to the wrong shoulder against Notre Dame.

Jake Locker didnt play saturday but i heard he washed his pickup truck. He supposedly missed the soap bucket a few times, i will say it wasnt a very good bucket.
(just kidding Jake).

ChiFan24
09-27-2010, 02:37 PM
There is more to accuracy than just a complete pass or an incomplete pass. Ball placement is huge, if you hit a receiver in stride he can run after the catch. If the receiver is having to turn around to catch balls or having to jump or catch low passes it's not a good thing.

He puts it right on the receiver's hands from what I've seen. He misses the occasional wide open receiver, but I think it's because in those situations he rushes his mechanics. In the NFL receivers aren't ever that wide open anyway. I'm more impressed that he puts the difficult throws right where they need to be, Cutler style.

Babylon
09-27-2010, 02:41 PM
The pace of his throws is probably an issue but a lot of those balls will be caught at the next level.

I still think he goes 3rd among the QBs but i'm not quite as harsh towards him as Scott is. Mallett to me is pretty much where Matthew Stafford was at Georgia, early on didnt have the receivers, struggled some against the better SEC teams and when you needed him to put the team on his back in the closing minutes often couldnt do it.

Scott Wright
09-27-2010, 02:58 PM
I'd like to reiterate that I think Mallett's supposed "accuracy" issues are more about decision making than accuracy. He throws one of the most accurate balls in the college game today, imo

Wow.

Just... Wow.

umphrey
09-27-2010, 03:13 PM
I can see the criticism on Ryan Mallett. His accuracy needs work and he might have to go back to work on the fundamentals.

However, I'd take him with a high first round pick. He's young but mentally he looks like a gamer. IMO he will show up to the NFL ready to work and as long as he goes to a team with decent coaching I think he develops into a top QB.

Bouncing between Michigan and Arkansas couldn't have helped. Once he gets time and consistent coaching I think he makes steady improvements.

hockey619
09-27-2010, 03:51 PM
The pace of his throws is probably an issue but a lot of those balls will be caught at the next level.

I still think he goes 3rd among the QBs but i'm not quite as harsh towards him as Scott is. Mallett to me is pretty much where Matthew Stafford was at Georgia, early on didnt have the receivers, struggled some against the better SEC teams and when you needed him to put the team on his back in the closing minutes often couldnt do it.


This is exactly where ive got him too.

Stafford never really blew up while at Georgia, he had some good games but when you watched he just didnt evoke that feeling in you that you were watching a guy who was gunna take over the game and carry the team. He didnt stir that kind of confidence that the great ones do.

My issue with Stafford is the same as with Mallett: accuracy, in large part due to poor footwork. They both take slower drops and dont always set up right, step into it, etc. Both to me looked to have questionable work ethics and committments with their lack of progress in some basics (like footwork), but to me Stafford played in a system that was much much harder than Malletts.

Richts downfield passing attack requires some really tough throws and Stafford showed the ability to look off the safety to create windows and then sometimes sneak it into the spot right on despite the pocket closing hed often not panic. Mallett has shown that with pressure in his face or even potential pressure, his accuracy goes to hell and if he cant hit guys who are open in stride with any type of consistency, i dont think it matters how tall he is or how hard he can chuck it.

No idea where he goes as far as the draft, but to me hes a guy who will be a tease for a long time (flashes but never more than that) but never really live up to his potential unless the team around him is fantastic.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 04:14 PM
Wow.

Just... Wow.

Thanks. I thought it was a pretty intelligent point as well

San Diego Chicken
09-27-2010, 05:33 PM
Was anyone else not very impressed by Bama's D on Saturday? They left recievers wide open and had some tackling issues. It wasn't a very good simulation of what Mallett would face in the NFL and I know they can play better than that.

Complex
09-27-2010, 05:36 PM
White JaMarcus Russell

ElectricEye
09-27-2010, 05:43 PM
Busy day at the office, huh Scott?

I honestly think that a very large portion of the people talking about Mallet just look at the box scores. They see the 68% completion percentage and the big yardage numbers then combine that with the fact he's 6'7 and has a good arm and just run with it. Evaluating guys is a LOT more complex than that. Anyone who think Mallet throws one of the most accurate balls in the country has not watched Arkansas play a down the past couple years.

Scott Wright
09-27-2010, 05:51 PM
Busy day at the office, huh Scott?

I honestly think that a very large portion of the people talking about Mallet just look at the box scores. They see the 68% completion percentage and the big yardage numbers then combine that with the fact he's 6'7 and has a good arm and just run with it. Evaluating guys is a LOT more complex than that. Anyone who think Mallet throws one of the most accurate balls in the country has not watched Arkansas play a down the past couple years.

Q.F.T. !!!

Halsey
09-27-2010, 05:53 PM
If every potentially available QB entered the 2011 Draft, I'd take Pryor before I took Mallett, at this point.

Babylon
09-27-2010, 05:58 PM
If every potentially available QB entered the 2011 Draft, I'd take Pryor before I took Mallett, at this point.

As long as you arent doing the drafting for the Seahawks i'm with ya.

Halsey
09-27-2010, 06:05 PM
As long as you arent doing the drafting for the Seahawks i'm with ya.

If the Seahawks decide to Draft a QB, they need to go hard after Locker IMO. Even if it means throwing numerous picks at a team to trade up.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 06:07 PM
Busy day at the office, huh Scott?

I honestly think that a very large portion of the people talking about Mallet just look at the box scores. They see the 68% completion percentage and the big yardage numbers then combine that with the fact he's 6'7 and has a good arm and just run with it. Evaluating guys is a LOT more complex than that. Anyone who think Mallet throws one of the most accurate balls in the country has not watched Arkansas play a down the past couple years.

We'll have to agree to disagree. I have watched 7 or 8 Arkansas games over the past two years and I see great accuracy on most of his throws, even if the receiver is wide open. Sometimes he will fail to set his feet and throw a stinker, which I'll admit, but like I said I put that more on his poor decision to not set his feet to begin with.

619
09-27-2010, 06:14 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree. I have watched 7 or 8 Arkansas games over the past two years and I see great accuracy on most of his throws, even if the receiver is wide open. Sometimes he will fail to set his feet and throw a stinker, which I'll admit, but like I said I put that more on his poor decision to not set his feet to begin with.

So now it's his 'decision' not to set his feet? C'mon man.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 06:16 PM
So now it's his 'decision' not to set his feet? C'mon man.

He clearly knows how to set his feet and throw a very accurate pass so, yeah, when he doesn't do that I think that is him thinking that he doesn't need to.

619
09-27-2010, 06:18 PM
He clearly knows how to set his feet and throw a very accurate pass so, yeah, when he doesn't do that I think that is him thinking that he doesn't need to.

He doesn't have great footwork to begin with, so how would I know this is true?

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 06:22 PM
He doesn't have great footwork to begin with, so how would I know this is true?

Because not all of his throws are off of the mark quackers?

619
09-27-2010, 06:30 PM
Because not all of his throws are off of the mark quackers?

And that's attributed to great footwork on those throws? Absolutely not. You can get away with terrible footwork in college when your receivers are running wide open and you are handed over spread option type of reads (even in Petrino's "pro style" offense). His cement shoes aren't going to do him any good in the pros. Because he plays in the SEC we all get to see him play often, so there's nothing to hide here, it's out there in the open for the entire nation to see.

abaddon41_80
09-27-2010, 07:37 PM
And that's attributed to great footwork on those throws? Absolutely not. You can get away with terrible footwork in college when your receivers are running wide open and you are handed over spread option type of reads (even in Petrino's "pro style" offense). His cement shoes aren't going to do him any good in the pros. Because he plays in the SEC we all get to see him play often, so there's nothing to hide here, it's out there in the open for the entire nation to see.

Who said that he had great footwork outside of his bad throws?

IndyColtScout
09-27-2010, 09:15 PM
Mallett is a pretty good prospect possibly even #1 good but my biggest issue with Mallett are

A) he has a top prospect in Love and quite a few other legit mid to late round OL prospects keeping him upright, how good is he going to be with a one of the NFL worst 5 OLines?

B) Inability to manipulate the pocket at the NFL level. He's pretty stiff, not very quick. Good tall player good release but players that can move and reset the pocket are more valuable than a quick release.

C) Not comfortable handling the blitz yet. Duh not many guys are at this age.

619
09-27-2010, 09:34 PM
Who said that he had great footwork outside of his bad throws?

Let me guess this straight, you're saying that he's accurate in spite of inconsistent footwork? Otherwise, you had me lost a while back.

A Perfect Score
09-27-2010, 09:37 PM
I'm watching the Arkansas-Bama game right now, and the biggest concern I've seen with Mallet is that he has a horrible tendency to stare down his receivers. I have yet to see him look off coverage once. I understand that the Petrino system is designed to allow for easier reads and cuts the field in half so the progressions go quicker, but dear God does he need to look off coverage. He can get away with it now because his arm affords him some leeway, but he won't be able to in the pros.

And Scott is right, his footwork is definitely sub-par. But holy **** can he throw a football.

619
09-27-2010, 09:43 PM
I'm watching the Arkansas-Bama game right now, and the biggest concern I've seen with Mallet is that he has a horrible tendency to stare down his receivers. I have yet to see him look off coverage once. I understand that the Petrino system is designed to allow for easier reads and cuts the field in half so the progressions go quicker, but dear God does he need to look off coverage. He can get away with it now because his arm affords him some leeway, but he won't be able to in the pros.

And Scott is right, his footwork is definitely sub-par. But holy **** can he throw a football.

It's called the Jay Cutler Syndrome, and it's not biased, so big armed QBs who do so will throw their share of picks, plenty of them.

yourfavestoner
09-27-2010, 11:07 PM
Well David Garrard's abortions the past two weeks, I'm going to start scouting Luck, Locker, Mallett, and Ponder very intently for the rest of the year.

wordofi
09-27-2010, 11:34 PM
Mallett is a pretty good prospect possibly even #1 good but my biggest issue with Mallett are

A) he has a top prospect in Love and quite a few other legit mid to late round OL prospects keeping him upright, how good is he going to be with a one of the NFL worst 5 OLines?

B) Inability to manipulate the pocket at the NFL level. He's pretty stiff, not very quick. Good tall player good release but players that can move and reset the pocket are more valuable than a quick release.

C) Not comfortable handling the blitz yet. Duh not many guys are at this age.

I'd sacrifice a little bit of arm strength for a little bit of mobility.

descendency
09-28-2010, 12:40 AM
Well David Garrard's abortions the past two weeks, I'm going to start scouting Luck, Locker, Mallett, and Ponder very intently for the rest of the year.

Ponder will be really nice for a place like Jacksonville. Play in domes twice times a year and two southern cities (minimum 11 games a year in no worse than a drizzle). He's a great QB as long as you don't need him to be able to gun it. His arm strength is below average for the NFL though.

Mallett has accuracy issues. He has mechanical issues. He has decision making issues. And (supposedly) he's a terrible leader (the coke rumors are bs, but the personality rumors seem to be gaining momentum).

Locker has like a 50% completion rating on the year. That includes a 4 for 20 game. If you exclude that one, he's 60%... but most #1 picks don't have 60% accuracy when you exclude their worst game. It's usually much higher. 60% is usually the minimum when you include all games (Matt Ryan was sub-60 and he's done fine). Locker scares me.

Luck needs more development time. He has average arm strength. Poor field vision. Over-rated in a lot of aspects of the game. However, there is a massive rumor going around that he is declaring for the draft because he has a top 5 grade (system, production, etc) so he can cash in. If that's true, I'd avoid him.

I really think this class has a ton of potential. Tyrod Taylor, Terrelle Pryor, Nick Foles, and so on. I see a lot of guys who could go from round 3 to round 1 and visa versa. Lots of guys with great physical tools, but their production simply doesn't show it.

iBoldin
09-28-2010, 12:43 AM
Well David Garrard's abortions the past two weeks, I'm going to start scouting Luck, Locker, Mallett, and Ponder very intently for the rest of the year.

I'm not a big fan of Mallett, but I think he could be a decent quarterback in Jacksonville. They have the protection (so it seems), one of the best running backs in the NFL, a growing base at receiver and it's not like Mallett is a mid-round guy.

abaddon41_80
09-28-2010, 06:51 AM
Let me guess this straight, you're saying that he's accurate in spite of inconsistent footwork? Otherwise, you had me lost a while back.

Yeah. His footwork is not perfect and he often does not set his feet before he throws but his passes are still usually accurate. When he throws an awful pass he is usually trying to throw off of his back foot or not stepping into the throw.