PDA

View Full Version : Is the Senior Bowl Outdated?


SchizophrenicBatman
12-31-2010, 11:40 AM
Just wondering if there's any chance someone starts up an all-star game that allows underclassmen soon. So many of the top players are underclassmen now. It's been this way for a while at many positions, but the recent trend of underclass QBs declaring has really reinforced it. I imagine many will decline the invite but not all, and they can still invite seniors as well - the East/West Shrine Bowl has plenty of talent there and with the right amount of monetary investment, this theoretical game could slot right into that #2 slot immediately with the possibility of overtaking the Senior Bowl depending on how many underclassmen accept

Thoughts?

Are the post-season games simply rewards for guys that stayed in school or should someone start a game for all eligible draftees?

MassNole
01-04-2011, 07:37 PM
I think at the very least a RS-Junior who declares should be eligible for the Senior Bowl-esque games.

Master Exploder
01-04-2011, 07:57 PM
IDK, I look at the Senior Bowl as a right for seniors to get their name out there for a last time. I think prospects who declare early typically have already solidified their name out there, and I think it would only offer more incentive to entice kids to leave college early. Something that I don't think either side prefers.

ElectricEye
01-04-2011, 08:01 PM
RS Juniors should be allowed to compete in Mobile. No real difference scholastically. Same graduating class and all.

It would be nice to see underclassmen compete in post-season, but then again, that's sort of one of the advantages they have in terms of draft stock. Less is more sometimes for those guys.

Jimmy
01-04-2011, 08:02 PM
IDK, I look at the Senior Bowl as a right for seniors to get their name out there for a last time. I think prospects who declare early typically have already solidified their name out there, and I think it would only offer more incentive to entice kids to leave college early. Something that I don't think either side prefers.

Goes both ways. If a senior player really wants to reinforce his name and get it out there, he should want to do it against the top junior talent, who as you said, have already solidified their names. Playing well against the top juniors would only make said senior look better.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 08:21 PM
So you guys are saying maybe a better solution to this is to allow guys who have either exhausted their eligibility or have completed their degree to play in the Senior Bowl?

I think that's fair, though I bet NFL scouts would rather get the opportunity to see anyone that has declared

Scott Wright
01-04-2011, 09:42 PM
It really doesn't matter even if they were allowed to play. The top underclassmen come out because their stock is high so they don't need to play in an all-star game. The underclassmen that would be willing to play aren't very good and wouldn't get invited anyway.

toddmlazarchick
01-04-2011, 09:43 PM
Mostly agreed but why not have a JR Bowl or something like that? Or something that evaluates just the JRs and SOs?

Shane P. Hallam
01-04-2011, 09:47 PM
Mostly agreed but why not have a JR Bowl or something like that? Or something that evaluates just the JRs and SOs?

You'd be lucky to have enough who entered the draft and want to play to even perform in it.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 09:49 PM
It really doesn't matter even if they were allowed to play. The top underclassmen come out because their stock is high so they don't need to play in an all-star game. The underclassmen that would be willing to play aren't very good and wouldn't get invited anyway.

so youre telling me Gabbert or Mallett wouldn't show up to try to move up the pecking order? What about a guy like DeAndre Brown?

Shane P. Hallam
01-04-2011, 09:50 PM
so youre telling me Gabbert or Mallett wouldn't show up to try to move up the pecking order? What about a guy like DeAndre Brown?

Brown or Doss or Gurley wouldn't be invited. I don't think Mallett or Gabbert would play.

Scott Wright
01-04-2011, 09:52 PM
so youre telling me Gabbert or Mallett wouldn't show up to try to move up the pecking order? What about a guy like DeAndre Brown?

Mallett or Gabbert? Definitely Not. Maybe a guy like Jevan Snead last year.

Late rounders and borderline prospects like DeAndre Brown might think about it. The problem is even guys like Brown have a higher opinion of their game / stock and probably wouldn't feel as if they needed to prove themselves. All underclassmen think they're going to be a first round pick.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 09:52 PM
i dont see how DeAndre Brown is any worse of a flier than any of the 10 division III guys they invited this year

and I dont say that as a hater of those guys - Brown might be the next Colston/Mike Williams. Or he could be out of the league in a year. Playing in a post-season game would probably help nfl teams figure that out

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 09:57 PM
How about Shane Vereen? I feel like there are plenty of guys who would risk it. Maybe not a ton, but enough

Wrathman
01-04-2011, 10:07 PM
I think it's an over-generalization to say that the underclassmen would skip the Senior Bowl if they were eligible to play in it. If they were as locked in to where they thought they were going to be drafted as implied above, they would skip the combine as well.

I'd change the name from the Senior Bowl to the Declaration Bowl (bonus points with the media and fans for a patriotic name) and allow everyone who declared to be eligible for that year's draft to be selected for that week of instruction and game play.

Scott Wright
01-04-2011, 10:25 PM
I think you guys are vastly underestimating the high opinion most prospects have of themselves.

Wrathman
01-04-2011, 10:50 PM
I think you guys are vastly underestimating the high opinion most prospects have of themselves.

I think there is the opinion of themselves that they present outwardly while talking to the media to show the confidence that they can live up to being selected at any draft spot (likely guided by an agent and/or other over-zealous close to the player) and then there is reality. These kids are told to never sell themselves short publicly because if you don't believe in yourself, why would someone else.

I recently had the opportunity to speak with RB Quentin Hines who is in the process of transferring from the University of Cincinnati to Murray State. He told me that he is a 6th or 7th round draft pick at this point in his career and that he is nationally ranked which is interesting as he has all of two carries as a Bearcat. He was a nice guy to talk to and came across to me as intelligent...other than in his statement about his perceived value to an NFL franchise. His expectation versus his resume suggests someone is in his ear though I didn't press as to why he felt what he felt as nobody with two carries for five yards should be thinking they are NFL ready. However, that would not mean they would not still promote themselves whenever possible.

It's an interesting topic. Is it hype, is it belief, or is it just sales talk? I think that can be difficult to figure out when the only discussion on this topic comes prior to drafts and we rarely look back at drafts to get insight on what these players would say when an NFL contract was no longer on the line.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 11:25 PM
I think you guys are vastly underestimating the high opinion most prospects have of themselves.

fair enough, but what about when those guys are seniors? is the disposition of a guy who declares early THAT much different than guys who stick around? i totally understand this opinion but I feel like their agents should be able to talk them into performing at one of these events if it helps them. fwiw I think the Senior Bowl does more good than harm...I remember way more guys who have stood out there than guys who had their stock tank from a bad performance

xxxxxxxx
01-04-2011, 11:29 PM
I agree with scott. Underclassmen usually only declare if they are predicted to be picked in the top 2 rounds or so. They don't need all-star games.

In some cases where players who aren't that good need to leave for money for there families or some other reason I could see it, but it isn't needed.

Plus, there isn't even underclassmen to field it's own all star game.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2011, 11:32 PM
I'm not talking about their own game. I'm talking about taking the East-West Shrine or Texas v. Nation rosters and adding 5-10 underclassmen to them, then trying to pull some guys from the Senior Bowl. With the right guy behind it I feel it would succeed - provided underclassmen would go. Look at how the Under Armor All America game is competing with the US Army AA game that had a monopoly on the high profile high school showcase market for so long

jballa838
01-04-2011, 11:34 PM
I think you guys are vastly underestimating the high opinion most prospects have of themselves.
exactly. there is a difference between a lack of humility and a lack of confidence. You can never become an elite athlete with the latter.

xxxxxxxx
01-04-2011, 11:36 PM
exactly. there is a difference between a lack of humility and a lack of confidence. You can never become an elite athlete with the latter.

Exactly.

The quality of underclassmen who would play in those games wouldn't be close to the talent that they already have there in the SENIORS who are playing.

They are declaring as underclassmen for a reason.

I understand your question, but it is a pretty simple answer for me.

jballa838
01-04-2011, 11:40 PM
Exactly.

The quality of underclassmen who would play in those games wouldn't be close to the talent that they already have there in the SENIORS who are playing.

They are declaring as underclassmen for a reason.

I understand your question, but it is a pretty simple answer for me.
The adverse could come into play, though. Ryan Williams, who got a round 1-2 grade from the advisory committee, would think about playing in this game to quell some concerns that people have about. He's conscientious about that type of stuff, but he wouldn't go if he knew he was a top 20 pick.

PossibleCabbage
01-04-2011, 11:42 PM
Truly and honestly, I like having guys who play through their senior year having built-in advantages in the process over guys who come out early. So having only seniors being eligible to play in all-star games doesn't bother me at all. I actually prefer it that way.

I like to see guys stay in college and finish a four year tenure. Call me a traditionalist, but I think it's better for both the college game and the NFL game that way.

brat316
01-04-2011, 11:43 PM
UFL should start taking freshmen and up and JC guys. They could vastly improve the talent they have that way.

trojanbrutha
01-05-2011, 10:58 PM
If this post is stepping over any boundaries, please delete...

I just read a post about a new all-star game:
The Eastham Energy game...
http://www.easthamallstargame.com/

Troy RB DuJuan Harris and OLB "Super" Mario Addison may be getting invites...any word on this game yet?

trojanbrutha
01-05-2011, 11:02 PM
***repost***